Latest / Murder Files Unsealed / Horrific New Details Unsealed in University of Idaho Murders Case After Bryan Kohberger's Sentencing

Transcript

Horrific New Details Unsealed in University of Idaho Murders Case After Bryan Kohberger's Sentencing · Murder Files Unsealed

0:00
Speaker 1: Welcome back to the deep dive. Yeah, so today we're
0:02
tackling something pretty heavy, but it feels really necessary. We're
0:06
moving past the arrests, the trial speculation, all of that.
0:10
Speaker 2: Yeah, we're really shifting focus today is about digging into
0:13
what we know now based on the final legal chapter
0:17
in the Idaho college murders case.
0:19
Speaker 1: Exactly. It's been such a closely watched case. Obviously, the
0:23
shockwaves from November twenty twenty two when Kaylee Gonkavs, Madison Mogan, Xanikernodle,
0:28
and Ethan Shapmen were killed.
0:30
Speaker 2: It still felt absolutely and that legal chapter closed really
0:33
with the sentencing of Brian Koberger. That's our jumping off point, right.
0:37
Speaker 1: The sensing itself July twenty third, twenty twenty five in
0:40
eighty County District Court. That was the moment, wasn't it.
0:43
It followed his guilty plea and bam, suddenly all this
0:45
information became public.
0:47
Speaker 2: A huge amount of information. Over three hundred investigative documents
0:50
were unsealed right after police reports, forensic analysis, witness interviews,
0:55
I mean the raw data.
0:56
Speaker 1: So if it was locked down type before because of court.
0:58
Speaker 2: Orders exactly, So now we can actually get into the
1:00
granular details, the specifics, it shifts the whole conversation.
1:04
Speaker 1: So that's what we're doing for you today. We're taking
1:06
these files, this mountain of evidence and moving beyond just
1:09
who did it. We know who did it. Now it's
1:11
about the how, the methodology, and maybe getting closer to
1:14
that really disturbing question of why.
1:16
Speaker 2: Yeah, the why hangs heavy even with all this new information.
1:20
The documents absolutely cement the guilt, there's no question, but
1:23
they also paint this incredibly chilling, detailed picture of the
1:28
crime itself and the killer's detachment.
1:31
Speaker 1: It's start, okay, let's start where the legal process ended,
1:36
the sentencing itself.
1:37
Speaker 2: Right. The context is key here. Coburger he was thirty
1:40
by then, doing his PhD in criminology.
1:42
Speaker 1: Which is just still unbelievable.
1:45
Speaker 2: It is he pleaded guilty back on July second, twenty
1:48
twenty five. And let's be clear, this wasn't some sudden
1:50
attack of conscience.
1:50
Speaker 1: Yeah, not at all. The reporting and the documents confirm this.
1:54
It was purely tactical. It was about avoiding the death penalty.
1:57
Idaho has it, and the prosecution was pushing for its.
2:00
Speaker 2: So the sentencing hearing on July twenty third, down in
2:03
Boise with Judge Stephen Hippler. It wasn't about guilt or
2:06
innocence anymore. That was settled. This was purely about the consequences.
2:09
Speaker 1: And Coberger himself. What was his demeanor like in court?
2:13
According to these.
2:14
Speaker 2: Files, stoic, completely impassive, dressed in the orange jumpsuit, just
2:20
blank expression. The judge even gave him the chance to speak,
2:23
to say anything, he declined, just shook his head silence.
2:27
Speaker 1: Wow, that's silence in a room filled with the victim's families.
2:32
I can only imagine how that landed.
2:34
Speaker 2: It must have been agonizing, and you really feel that
2:36
when you read the transcripts of the victim impact statements.
2:39
They're included in the unsealed files.
2:41
Speaker 1: Yeah, tell us about those. What kind of things were said?
2:44
Speaker 2: Oh? It was. It was incredibly raw, as you'd expect,
2:46
lisceral anger. One relative the record's note, just spat out,
2:50
You're a joke right at him.
2:51
Speaker 1: Just pure fury, understandable completely.
2:53
Speaker 2: But then you also had these moments of profound, almost
2:57
unbelievable grace. Another relative actually said something like, I've forgiven you,
3:02
but that doesn't mean I forget that's extraordinary.
3:04
Speaker 1: Yeah, to find that capacity for forgiveness even without understanding
3:08
why it happened.
3:09
Speaker 2: It really highlights the immense personal struggle, doesn't it, trying
3:12
to find some kind of peace when the why is
3:14
just this gaping hole.
3:16
Speaker 1: So what was the final sentence from Judge Hibbler.
3:18
Speaker 2: He didn't hold back four consecutive life sentences without any
3:23
possibility of parole, one for each murder, plus another ten
3:27
years tacked on for the burglary charge because he broke
3:30
in to commit the crimes.
3:31
Speaker 1: Consecutive life terms, so guaranteed he dies in.
3:34
Speaker 2: Prison, guaranteed isolation. Yes, the judge explicitly called him a
3:38
faceless coward during the sentencing. The condemnation was severe.
3:43
Speaker 1: And the moment that sentence was handed down, that's when
3:45
the floodgates opened on the documents immediately.
3:48
Speaker 2: It seems like it was planned that way. Sentencing concludes boom,
3:52
over three hundred files unsealed. It paints the picture of
3:55
guilt very clearly, even without a full trial. Gives a
3:58
sense of transparency, I suppose.
4:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, transparency After months of legal restrictions.
4:02
Speaker 2: And the Laytech County Prosecutor Bill Thompson, he made a
4:05
statement right after basically saying, Okay, this case is ending.
4:08
Now we know who did this, we know who committed
4:10
these unspeakable acts of evil.
4:12
Speaker 1: Legally it's done, but emotionally, factually reading these documents, the
4:18
horror is just laid bare. It makes closure seem well complicated,
4:23
very complicated. Yeah, before we really get into the mechanics
4:26
of the crime and the investigation. It feels crucial, especially
4:29
with these files, to remember who we're talking about. Kaylee, Maddie,
4:33
Zanna Ethan. They weren't just names in a case.
4:36
Speaker 2: File, absolutely not. They were vibrant young people. These documents,
4:41
amidst all the grim forensic stuff they do contain reminders
4:44
of that. Their majors, their plans, their relationships, futures just
4:48
re race.
4:49
Speaker 1: Let's talk about Kaylee Gonkaves and Madison Mogan. First. They're
4:52
on the third floors, friends, inseparable, friends since like sixth grade.
4:57
I think their reports mentioned. Kaylee was described as a
4:59
real leader, you know, a communications major almost finished planning
5:03
a career in pr Her sister called her the light
5:06
of our lives, just radiated energy. And Maddie Matti Mogan,
5:09
a marketing major known for being really kind, ambitious, to
5:13
just this incredibly close bond with Kaylee. They did everything together.
5:16
The files even include these heartbreakingly normal details about their
5:19
last hours. They had been out, came back around one
5:22
forty five am, Yeah, from.
5:24
Speaker 2: The Corner club downtown, walked home and they'd gotten DoorDash,
5:27
some tacos apparently the food was found later untouched.
5:32
Speaker 1: Just awful. And the forensic details from the third floor.
5:35
The reports are quite graphic, aren't they.
5:37
Speaker 2: They are extremely graphic. They confirm Kaylee and Maddie were
5:41
found together in the same bed. The coroner noted significant
5:45
defensive wounds on both of them. They fought back hard.
5:49
Speaker 1: Against a knife described as a fixed blade type.
5:52
Speaker 2: Yes, and the level of violence it's difficult to talk about,
5:56
but the documents are specific. Maddie, for instance, suffered over
5:59
twenty penetrations. The report used the term mutilation, even describing
6:03
her body as unrecognizable.
6:05
Speaker 1: That level of violence you mentioned overkill earlier. What does
6:07
that typically suggest to investigators when there's no known personal connection.
6:11
Speaker 2: It points towards something deeply internal to the perpetrator. It's
6:15
not efficient killing, it's expressive. It often indicates a tremendous
6:19
amount of pent up rage. A need for domination or
6:22
even a kind of perverse fulfillment derived from the act itself.
6:26
The violence goes far beyond what's needed to end a life.
6:29
It's about the act of violence.
6:32
Speaker 1: Okay, let's move to the second floor. Xana Canodle and
6:35
Ethan Shapin right.
6:36
Speaker 2: Xana was studying elementary education, described as fiercely independent, involved
6:41
in her sorority, recently elected to a leadership role.
6:44
Speaker 1: And Ethan he was younger.
6:45
Speaker 2: Yeah, freshman Ethan Chapin twenty years old, kind of the
6:48
all American kid, high school football captain, popular, well liked
6:51
in his fraternity, Sigma Chi. He and Xana were dating.
6:54
Speaker 1: It had also been out that night at a.
6:56
Speaker 2: Sigma Chi party. Yeah got back to the house around
6:58
the same time and kayleean Maddie about one forty five am.
7:02
Witnesses heard them laughing.
7:03
Speaker 1: And the timeline for Xanna is incredibly precise, chillingly.
7:08
Speaker 2: So it really is. Her phone records are key. They
7:11
show her actively using her phone, ordering from Chipotle at
7:14
four zero one am, just.
7:16
Speaker 1: Minutes before the attack is thought to have started.
7:19
Speaker 2: She was awake, awake, likely in or near the kitchen
7:23
area on the second floor. Ethan the report suggest was
7:27
likely asleep in her room beside her when the attack
7:29
reached them, and the autopsy findings for them similar horrific
7:32
injuries multiple stab wounds to the chest and neck for both.
7:37
The reports also suggest Ethan, who was a big guy
7:40
six foot one, seems to have fought the longest. His
7:43
wounds and body positioning indicated he might have lunged forward,
7:47
maybe trying to shield Xana, a final protective act.
7:50
Speaker 1: God, it's just devastating. Then there are the survivors, Dylan
7:54
Mortensen and Bethany funk Their accounts are.
7:56
Speaker 2: Central, absolutely central. They lived through that night, and the
7:59
unset field statements detail their trauma. Dylan Mortenson's account is
8:03
particularly harrowing.
8:05
Speaker 1: She saw the killer, she did.
8:06
Speaker 2: She was on the second floor, her noises opened her
8:08
door slightly. She described being frozen in fear as she
8:11
saw a figure masked dressed all in black walk past
8:14
her door and exit through the sliding glass door on
8:16
that level. This was around four seventeen am.
8:19
Speaker 1: And Bethany funkin she was on the first floor.
8:22
Speaker 2: Yes, asleep on the first floor. She also heard noises,
8:26
but the files say she told investigators she initially dismissed them,
8:29
thought it was just you know, party sounds or roommates
8:32
moving around, which apparently wasn't unusual for that house.
8:34
Speaker 1: That delay, the realization must have dawned slowly, horrifically. The
8:41
nine to one one call wasn't until nearly noon.
8:43
Speaker 2: Exactly hours later. The transcripts captured that dawning horror and
8:47
panic phrases like there's someone inside, and then the awful
8:51
realization I think my roommates are dead.
8:54
Speaker 1: And the guilt they must carry. Dylan Mortenson's impact statement, you.
8:57
Speaker 2: Mentioned, yeah it was red and court just heartbreak, she
9:00
apparently said, tearfully, you took everything from us. The documents
9:05
really underscore that the survivors are victims too, carrying these deep,
9:08
lasting psychological scars.
9:10
Speaker 1: Okay, So using all these unsealed files, the witness accounts,
9:13
the phone data, the forensics, we could basically piece together
9:16
a timeline of that night, almost minute by minute.
9:19
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a chilling reconstruction. It starts crystallizing around four am.
9:23
The house is still active post party vibes. Zen is
9:27
on her phone ordering food, which puts her near the
9:30
kitchen on the second floor.
9:31
Speaker 1: And near the sliding glass door. Which investigators believe was
9:34
the entry point.
9:35
Speaker 2: It was unlocked, correct, But crucially, at the same time,
9:39
the killer isn't just arriving.
9:41
Speaker 1: He's been there, right, the white Hondai Lantra.
9:43
Speaker 2: Exactly, cell tower data, campus security footage, it all tracks
9:48
Coburger's Lantra circling the neighborhood multiple times just before four am.
9:53
That's not random. That's final surveillance, checking the scene, maybe
9:57
looking for signs of activity.
9:58
Speaker 1: And it wasn't the first time, was it? You meant earlier?
10:00
Speaker 2: No? And this is a critical point from the documents.
10:02
That same Milantra pinged near the King Road house twelve
10:06
separate times in the month leading up to the murders.
10:08
Speaker 1: Twelve times at that methodical stocking. He was watching them,
10:12
He knew the house, the patterns.
10:14
Speaker 2: It strongly suggests targeted surveillance. He chose that house likely
10:19
that time for a reason based on prior observation, he
10:22
knew its vulnerabilities.
10:23
Speaker 1: Then comes a key moment, digitally speaking, Yes.
10:26
Speaker 2: The digital silence at four point four am, Coburger's cell
10:31
phone disconnects from the network, just goes dark.
10:34
Speaker 1: Which someone forensically aware might do intentionally.
10:37
Speaker 2: Precisely it's a common tactic to avoid location tracking during
10:40
the commission of a crime. The phone stayed disconnected for
10:43
forty four minutes. It only reconnects at four four eight am.
10:46
Speaker 1: And where does it reconnect.
10:48
Speaker 2: Significantly, It pings back up near his apartment in Pullman, Washington,
10:51
which is about fifteen sixteen miles away. That forty four
10:55
minute window is the time frame for the entire horrific event. Entry,
11:00
the murders on two floors, the exit, and the drive
11:02
back towards Pullman.
11:03
Speaker 1: So the attack itself, the documents suggest he went upstairs
11:07
first to the third floor.
11:09
Speaker 2: That's the sequence investigator's piece together, entered on the second floor,
11:12
went up to the third attacking Kaylee and Matty first.
11:15
That's where the most intense struggle seems to have occurred.
11:17
Speaker 1: The forensics there were brutal blood on wall floors.
11:20
Speaker 2: A scene of extreme violence. Yes, deep wounds consistent with
11:24
that Kabar style knife. And there's that one uh, truly
11:27
haunting detail from the audio analysis.
11:30
Speaker 1: The whispered words yeah.
11:32
Speaker 2: A nearby phone apparently picked up a faint sound during
11:35
the struggle. Analyzed later, it sounds like a female voice,
11:38
maybe Kaylee's whispering, what the f Just absolute shock and
11:42
terror in that final.
11:43
Speaker 1: Moment, unimaginable. Yeah, then he mows down to the second floor.
11:46
Speaker 2: Down to the second floor where he encounters Xana, who
11:49
we know was awake in.
11:50
Speaker 1: Ethan, and there was clearly a struggle there too.
11:53
Speaker 2: Definitely, Dylan Mortenson's account aligns with the physical evidence here.
11:57
She reported hearing a loud thud around four ten am, and.
12:00
Speaker 1: The scene investigation found.
12:02
Speaker 2: Overturned furniture, some shattered glass in Xana's room, consistent with
12:07
a fall, a struggle, and Xana's hands the defensive wounds
12:11
were significant slashes across her palms, fingers. She was actively
12:15
trying to grab or block the knife, fighting desperately.
12:18
Speaker 1: And then comes the moment Dylan Mortenson actually sees him
12:22
around four seventeen am.
12:24
Speaker 2: Yes, the eyewitness encounter. She peeks at her door and
12:28
sees the figure walking towards the sliding glass door on
12:31
her floor. Her description became crucial.
12:33
Speaker 1: Did she describe.
12:34
Speaker 2: About six feet tall, maybe a bit more athletic build,
12:38
clad entirely in black, and she noted something specific about
12:42
the clothing. She described it as possibly bushnel bushwhacker two
12:46
point zero attire that sounds very specific, like hunting gear exactly.
12:50
It's often marketed as hunting or tactical gear. It suggests
12:54
he wasn't dressed casually. He was a quick for this concealment,
12:57
maybe even dealing with the elements or grimly the aftermath.
13:01
Speaker 1: And he saw her. They made eye contact, she says
13:04
they did.
13:04
Speaker 2: He paused on the landing, looked right at her. She
13:07
described it as lasting seconds that felt like minutes, just frozen.
13:12
Speaker 1: In fear, and he spoke to her.
13:13
Speaker 2: This is one of the most chilling details. According to
13:16
Mortensen's account in the files. He murmured something like, it's okay,
13:19
I'm gonna let you go, and then he just continued
13:21
down the stairs and out the sliding door.
13:23
Speaker 1: Why why say that? Why let her live? Oh?
13:26
Speaker 2: It's baffling, isn't it. It suggests control, He wasn't just frenzied.
13:32
He made a conscious decision in that moment. Maybe he
13:34
didn't perceive her as a threat. Maybe he was a
13:36
part of some psychological script he was playing out. It's
13:39
hard to say, but it points to a very cold,
13:42
deliberate mindset. Even amidst the chaos.
13:45
Speaker 1: And then the mistake, the crucial error.
13:48
Speaker 2: The catastrophic mistake for him. In the midst of all
13:51
this apparent control, he leaves the leather sheath for the
13:54
kabar knife behind. It was found on the bed, reportedly
13:58
under Matti Mogan's body.
14:00
Speaker 1: One piece of evidence changes everything.
14:02
Speaker 2: It becomes the lynchpin of the entire investigation. But even
14:06
with that encounter, the sheer shock meant the alarm wasn't
14:08
raised for hours. Bethany Funk texted Dylan or on four
14:11
to twenty one am, got no reply. Friends eventually came
14:14
over later that morning, concerned they couldn't reach.
14:15
Speaker 1: Anyone, and they made the discovery around eleven.
14:18
Speaker 2: Fifty eight am. They walked into what they described, according
14:21
to the files as a slaughter house, noting smeared handprints.
14:25
Just an absolutely horrific scene. The delay really speaks to
14:28
the paralysis of shock and disbelief.
14:30
Speaker 1: So the scene is discovered, the scale of this it
14:34
must have immediately overwhelmed the Moscow Police Department.
14:37
Speaker 2: Oh, absolutely, Moscow pet hadn't dealt with a homicide in
14:40
something like seven years. This was unprecedented for them. They
14:43
needed help fast. The FBI became heavily involved, State police too,
14:47
and the.
14:48
Speaker 1: Sheer volume of information.
14:49
Speaker 2: Coming in immense the documents mentioned processing over twenty thousand
14:53
tips from the public, plus all the digital evidence, surveillance footage,
14:57
sell data, terabytes of data. It was a massive undertaking.
15:01
Speaker 1: But the key, the thing that broke the case open
15:03
was that knife sheath left behind fund deniably.
15:06
Speaker 2: The crime scene photos, even redacted versions released later, show
15:10
it clearly a tan leather cobar knife sheath found under
15:13
Matty's body on the third floor. It was the smoking
15:16
gun forensically.
15:17
Speaker 1: Speaking, because it had DNA on it.
15:18
Speaker 2: Exactly, not blood, interestingly, but touch DNA, just a tiny
15:22
amount of skin cells transfer from whoever handled it, likely
15:25
on the button snap. And crucially, it was a single
15:28
male profile, no mixture, just one person.
15:30
Speaker 1: Okay, So they had this DNA profile. How do they
15:33
get from that unknown profile to Brian Koberger. This wasn't
15:37
a direct matching code as the standard database right.
15:39
Speaker 2: Correct, His DNA wasn't in the system. This is where
15:43
the investigation took a really cutting edge turn using investigative
15:47
genetic genealogy or IgG.
15:49
Speaker 1: Explain that, how does IgG work?
15:51
Speaker 2: Okay, So they take that unknown DNA profile from the
15:54
sheath and instead of just comparing it to criminal databases.
15:58
They upload it to public or semi public genealogy databases,
16:01
the kind people use to trace their ancestry, like Ancestry
16:05
DNA or twenty three in May, though, investigators typically use
16:08
specific ones accessible to law enforcement, like ge match or family.
16:12
Speaker 1: Tree DNA, so they're looking for relatives.
16:14
Speaker 2: Exactly, They're looking for people who share segments of DNA,
16:17
even distant cousins. Once they find potential relatives, genealogists work
16:22
with investigators to build family trees going backwards and forwards
16:25
in time, trying to identify common ancestors and then narrow
16:29
down the possibilities until they land on a specific family
16:32
or even an individual who could be the source of
16:34
the original sample.
16:35
Speaker 1: That sounds incredibly complex.
16:37
Speaker 2: It is painstaking work, but in this case, it pointed
16:40
investigators towards Coberger's family line that gave them a very
16:44
strong lead, a name to focus on.
16:46
Speaker 1: But they needed more than just a genealogical link, right,
16:49
They needed direct confirmation.
16:50
Speaker 2: Absolutely, the IgG gets them the lead, but they need
16:53
his actual DNA for a direct match. And that's where
16:57
the other evidence streams became critical, particularly the tracking of
17:00
the white Hyundai Lantra, which.
17:02
Speaker 1: We know was linked to him, and scenes circling the house.
17:04
Speaker 2: Right the pre murder surveillance, the twelve pings, then the
17:08
post murder tracking WSU campus cameras catching his car speeding
17:13
away from Moscow towards Pullman right after the four seventeen
17:16
am timeframe, sell data placing his phone near the crime
17:20
scene just before it went dark, and then Bagnar's apartment
17:23
when it turned on again. It all converged on him.
17:25
Speaker 1: And there's that detail about him returning to the area.
17:28
Speaker 2: Yes, this is another really damning piece from the phone data.
17:31
His phone pinged again near the King Roade house around
17:34
nine to twelve am on November thirteenth. That's hours after
17:38
the murders occurred, but before the bodies were discovered.
17:40
Speaker 1: Why would he do that go back?
17:42
Speaker 2: It's classic offender behavior, particularly for more organized types. It
17:46
could be more big curiosity wanting to see the police
17:49
response or lack thereof. It could be a psychological need
17:52
to revisit the scene, a sort of post event confirmation,
17:56
or even cynically checking to see if he'd left anything behind.
17:59
Though he clearly missed the sheath. It speaks volumes about
18:02
his mindset, so they.
18:03
Speaker 1: Have the IgG lead, they have the car, they have
18:06
the phone data. How do they get his confirming DNA
18:09
sample through surveillance?
18:12
Speaker 2: When Coburger drove cross country with his father to his
18:14
family's home in Pennsylvania for the Christmas holidays, the FBI.
18:18
Speaker 1: Was watching and they noticed some interesting behavior.
18:21
Speaker 2: Extremely interesting and highly suspicious given the context. The surveillance
18:26
teams observed him being meticulously careful with his trash. He
18:29
was seen wearing surgical gloves when handling trash bags outside
18:32
the house and carefully putting the family's trash into neighbour's bins,
18:36
sometimes late at.
18:37
Speaker 1: Night, trying to avoid leaving DNA traces. He knew they
18:40
might be looking.
18:41
Speaker 2: It certainly looked like textbook forensic countermeasures, especially for someone
18:46
studying criminology focusing on investigation methods. It raised huge red flags.
18:51
Speaker 1: So they did a trash pull.
18:53
Speaker 2: Yes, standard investigative technique. Once the trash was placed out
18:57
for collection on public property, investigators legally recovered it. They
19:01
sorted through the Coburger family trash and found what they needed.
19:05
Speaker 1: What was it?
19:05
Speaker 2: A used Q tip among other things, But the DNA
19:09
profile obtained from that discarded item was a direct match,
19:13
a paternal match to the DNA found on the knife
19:15
sheath snap that sealed it. That was the final piece.
19:19
It gave them the probable cause for the arrest warrant.
19:21
He was arrested shortly after, in the early morning hours
19:24
of December thirtieth, twenty twenty two, inside his parents' kitchen.
19:27
Speaker 1: And his reaction during the arrest the documents mentioned that too.
19:30
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's quite unsettling. The arresting officers described his demeanor
19:33
as relaxed, almost academic. Apparently he made some small talk,
19:38
asked who they were looking for, and then calmly invoked
19:40
his right to remain silent. No panic, no outburst, just
19:44
this strange, detached.
19:45
Speaker 1: Calm, chilling. But one thing remains missing, right even after
19:51
all this, the.
19:52
Speaker 2: Murder weapon itself. Despite extensive searches, dive teams searching local rivers,
19:56
soil analysis searching his apartment and car, the cobar used
20:00
in the attacks was never recovered.
20:02
Speaker 1: But they know he owned one.
20:03
Speaker 2: Yes, the documents confirm. Amazon purchase records show he bought
20:07
a cob bar knife, a leather sheath matching the one found,
20:10
and even a knife sharpener back in March twenty twenty
20:13
two months before the murders, so they know he possessed
20:16
the type of weapon used. Even if the specific knife
20:19
is still missing. That's a loose end that frankly is
20:22
still unnerving.
20:23
Speaker 1: Okay, so we have the who confirmed. We have a
20:25
detailed how from the timeline and forensics. This brings us
20:28
to the most difficult part, the part the documents illuminate
20:31
but don't fully solve the why. And to understand the why,
20:35
we need to understand Brian Coberger exactly.
20:38
Speaker 2: The unsealed files offer a fragmented but deeply disturbing portrait.
20:42
He's this paradox, a PhD student studying the very thing
20:45
he's accused of, seemingly intelligent, but also profoundly isolated and
20:49
frankly creepy.
20:50
Speaker 1: He was a teaching assistant at Washington State University WSU,
20:54
just across the border from Moscow twenty eight at the
20:57
time of the murders.
20:58
Speaker 2: Right and classmates descriptions noted in the files are consistent.
21:03
Very intelligent, yes, but also selfish, arrogant, socially awkward. He
21:08
seemed to have this need to project control. He was
21:11
a strict vegan, obsessed with fitness, reportedly boasted about one
21:14
hundred mile bike rides.
21:16
Speaker 1: Almost like an extreme physical discipline, mirroring some kind of
21:19
internal rigidity.
21:20
Speaker 2: That's one interpretation. Yeah, a need for absolute control over
21:24
himself and maybe by extension in his environment. But socially
21:27
he seemed to flounder.
21:29
Speaker 1: The documents mentioned interactions like on dating apps.
21:32
Speaker 2: Yes, some women who matched with him on Tinder were interviewed.
21:35
They described him as annoying, socially awkward. He apparently had
21:40
this tendency to lecture, to steer conversations immediately to deep topics,
21:45
often related to true crime or philosophy. It wasn't casual chat.
21:48
It was intense, maybe off putting.
21:51
Speaker 1: In this interest in true crime, it went beyond academic curiosity, it.
21:55
Speaker 2: Seems so, especially with the revelation about the photos found
21:58
on his phone. This came out later during evidence review
22:02
mentioned in the unsealed documents.
22:03
Speaker 1: What photos.
22:04
Speaker 2: A fellow WSU student discovered photos of herself and her
22:07
friends on Coburger's phone. These weren't photos he took. They
22:11
were seemingly scraped from their social media profiles. He apparently
22:14
had them while watching a Dateline episode about the case
22:17
with this student in May twenty twenty five.
22:20
Speaker 1: Wait, he was watching a show about the murders he
22:23
committed with someone whose pictures he'd secretly saved.
22:25
Speaker 2: That's what the documents indicate. It suggests not just obsession,
22:29
but active targeted stalking behavior directed at other young women
22:33
before the King RhoD murders, and a continued morbid interest afterward.
22:37
It's incredibly predatory.
22:39
Speaker 1: And his academic work itself did it reflect this dark interest.
22:43
Speaker 2: The searches of his apartment certainly suggested did. They found
22:46
his criminology textbooks, and significantly they were annotated. He'd made
22:50
notes specifically in sections dealing with the escalation of violence, So.
22:54
Speaker 1: He wasn't just reading, he was actively analyzing the pathway
22:57
to committing violence.
22:59
Speaker 2: It appears that way. And then there's the journal entry
23:02
that's perhaps the most chilling piece of personal.
23:04
Speaker 1: Insight, dated around time of the murders.
23:06
Speaker 2: Yes, November twenty twenty two. A specific entry read something
23:10
like I have felt this before, the need.
23:14
Speaker 1: To act, the need to act. Connecting that to his
23:17
studies on escalation, it sounds almost like he viewed it
23:20
as an experiment.
23:22
Speaker 2: That's the terrifying possibility, isn't it that this wasn't driven
23:25
by personal animosity towards the victims, but by an internal,
23:28
maybe academic or intellectualized compulsion to cross the line to
23:32
apply the theories he was studying, to move from observer
23:35
to participant.
23:36
Speaker 1: And his behavior after arrest in jail did that fit
23:40
this pattern.
23:40
Speaker 2: It seems consistent with that detachment. Reports from cellmates included
23:44
in the files described him as weird. He apparently paced
23:47
constantly muttered to himself about forensic flaws in the prosecution's case.
23:51
One inmate even said Coburger was obsessively sketching crime scene
23:55
diagrams like.
23:56
Speaker 1: He was analyzing his own case as an academic problem.
23:58
Speaker 2: Exactly as if it were a flawed experiment he could critique,
24:02
rather than a horrific crime with real victims. It's a
24:05
profound level of dissociation.
24:06
Speaker 1: Which makes you wonder, if you are so focused on
24:09
forensic flaws, why plead guilty? Why not fight it in court?
24:14
Speaker 2: That's a really good question. Perhaps the DNA evidence from
24:16
the sheath felt insurmountable. Maybe once capture was inevitable, the
24:20
experiment phase was over, and his analytical mind shifted purely
24:24
to damage control, avoiding the death penalty being the only
24:27
variable left he.
24:28
Speaker 1: Could control, which brings us back to the biggest question motive.
24:32
Did the investigation find any link between him and Kaylee, Maddie,
24:36
Xana or Ethan.
24:37
Speaker 2: Nothing that stated clearly in the prosecution summaries within the documents,
24:41
No prior relationship, no known conflict, no communication. It appears
24:45
to have been from the victim's perspective, completely random, but likely.
24:49
Speaker 1: Not random from his perspective, given the stocking. He chose
24:53
that house.
24:53
Speaker 2: He chose that house. One of the lead investigators, Corporal
24:56
Brett Payne, is quoted in the files saying basically that
24:59
the the evidence suggested this house was chosen for a reason.
25:02
What that is we don't know.
25:04
Speaker 1: So speculation based on the profile. Was it the unlocked
25:07
door pure opportunity? Was this something about the resident's popular
25:12
students representing something he resented.
25:14
Speaker 2: It could be any of those or a combination. The
25:17
unlocked door presented the opportunity, but the repeated surveillance suggests
25:20
the desire was already there. Maybe it was the challenge
25:24
a houseful of people testing his ability to execute the
25:26
crime and escape unseen, a lethal criminology experiment. As you
25:31
put it, The ultimate motive might be locked inside his head,
25:34
possibly something even he doesn't fully articulate, just a.
25:37
Speaker 1: Chilling void where the reason should be hashtag tag outro.
25:40
Speaker 2: So when you pull back and look at everything, these
25:42
three hundred plus documents tell us it's incredibly detailed, but
25:45
also leaves you with this deep unease.
25:47
Speaker 1: Yeah, we have the timeline nailed down minute by minute.
25:50
We have the DNA the sheath providing that definitive link.
25:53
We have this disturbing portrait of Coburger, the isolated academic,
25:58
the meticulous planner, the alle ledge stalker.
26:00
Speaker 2: The who and the how are solidified, but the why
26:04
it remains elusive, doesn't it? Even with all this information. Legally,
26:08
the case is closed, Coburger is convicted, sentenced.
26:11
Speaker 1: But closure feels like a different thing entirely. And you
26:14
mentioned there might be even more documents still.
26:16
Speaker 2: In a review, potentially things like fuller journals, complete forensic
26:20
reports that might contain more psychological nuance. Some might eventually
26:23
be released, some might not, So even more details could
26:27
emerge down the line, but whether they'll ever fully explain
26:29
the why is uncertain, and.
26:31
Speaker 1: The impact on Moscow on the community continues. The house
26:35
itself has gone.
26:36
Speaker 2: Now, Yes, the king roadhouse was demolished in twenty twenty four.
26:39
They're planning a memorial garden on the site, trying to
26:43
reclaim that space from tragedy, turn into a place for reflection,
26:47
which is a necessary step for healing.
26:49
Speaker 1: I think it really underscores how evil can just hide
26:53
in plain sights, sometimes behind academic credentials, behind a seemingly normal,
26:58
if awkward exterior.
27:00
Speaker 2: It does, and even though we know who did it,
27:02
that lack of a clear, understandable motive makes it harder
27:05
to process. It forces us from a factual who unit
27:09
into this much darker psychological why unit.
27:12
Speaker 1: Which leads us and you listening with a really difficult thought,
27:15
doesn't it? These documents chart Coberger's obsessive study of violence,
27:20
of criminal methodology, of forensic investigation. How does someone go
27:25
from analyzing that, from studying the flaws.
27:27
Speaker 2: And patterns, to becoming the perpetrator to actively applying those
27:32
theories in the most brutal way imaginable? Where does that
27:36
line get crossed between the detached, academic observer and the cold,
27:40
calculating killer.
27:41
Speaker 1: That question just hangs there, unanswered in all those pages
27:44
of evidence. It's the question that haunts this case even
27:48
now that is legally closed, it really does well.
27:50
Speaker 2: Thank you for digging into this with us today. It's
27:52
heavy material it is.
27:53
Speaker 1: Thank you for joining us on the deep type. We'll
27:54
see you next time.