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Kids Media Club on the Netflix Kids Report · Kids Media Club Podcast

• 0:05
  Well, hello and welcome to Another kids.
• 0:08
  Another Kids Media Club podcast.
• 0:10
  I'm Andy Williams.
• 0:11
  I'm all of Lochter Today.
• 0:14
  I'm Jo Redfern.
• 0:15
  I'm Emily Horgan.
• 0:16
  And yes, we are here on the feast of the Netflix report to talk about Netflix.
• 0:20
  Yes, my favorite time, my favorite time of year.
• 0:25
  I always feel like I am one of those kids at Christmas that has just stumbled upon the Christmas presents early.
• 0:31
  When I get early access to your report.
• 0:33
  Oh, thanks, Joe.
• 0:35
  It's exciting.
• 0:36
  It's been a labor of love, as it always is.
• 0:39
  And I have to say I always find my latest report is always my favorite yet, which this is no exception.
• 0:45
  And it's a really, it remains and it is a really fun and interesting time to be watching what EFEX is doing in terms of what's going on in the bigger landscape.
• 0:54
  So there's no shortage of stuff that I certainly took out of it.
• 0:59
  So I'm probably going to be throwing tons of questions at you.
• 1:01
  Sorry if it feels a little bit like you're in the mastermind chair.
• 1:04
  It's absolutely no problem.
• 1:05
  I've literally been living and breathing this the past few weeks.
• 1:09
  Yeah, no, it's really cool.
• 1:11
  So we've rolled out also live action series analysis for the first time, which has been really interesting and thrown up some interesting findings.
• 1:19
  And also, obviously, creators remain such a key place or a key element of what Netflix are doing right now.
• 1:26
  There's lots of talk around there and then definitely discussion around movies, which we'll get onto in a little while.
• 1:33
  Where do you guys want to start?
• 1:34
  Where do you want to start?
• 1:34
  Like, hit me, hit me.
• 1:35
  I'm going to start.
• 1:36
  Sorry, Andy.
• 1:36
  I'm just jumping just because I'm on the early page and I'm a sucker for a chart and particularly rankings and I'm really enjoying the, the, the rankings of kids.
• 1:52
  Kids performers over time.
• 1:54
  Yeah.
• 1:54
  Because you've, you've tracked those and there's a couple of really interesting movements.
• 1:58
  So without getting too, too deep into it, Cocomelon on the slide.
• 2:04
  Yeah, Cocomelon is, is out of the top 10 for the first time, which is a big, like a big deal.
• 2:11
  Obviously, Cocomelon.
• 2:12
  I feel like Cocomelon was like the first piece of kids content on streaming to really get people's attention.
• 2:19
  So we thank you, gogamellon, for that.
• 2:21
  Like, obviously there was that period during the pandemic and stuff where it hit Netflix and just the potential of what kids content can deliver was really, really clear.
• 2:32
  And to be fair, like, we have Never seen.
• 2:34
  We have never seen it again.
• 2:37
  Like, what it was delivering in terms of engagement during that period was just absolutely astronomical.
• 2:44
  So Cocomelon is out.
• 2:45
  We've a stable.
• 2:47
  In terms of animated series, we have a stable top three for the first time.
• 2:51
  So Paw Patrol, Gabby's Dollhouse and Pet Pig, which are again, household names.
• 2:56
  We all know them, they're all huge.
• 2:58
  I guess what I would say as well is like all of the majority of series on Netflix, even if they are, you know, 20 years old, like Pepa is, they're still doing new things.
• 3:09
  Right.
• 3:09
  They're still bringing new series or activating in new ways, whether it's Windows or whatever.
• 3:15
  So it remains a very, very competitive landscape on Netflix, for sure.
• 3:20
  I mean, what sticks out there for me is Gabby's Dollhouse because it's the one show that's kind of native to Netflix.
• 3:27
  It's a show that was born on Netflix and has managed to thrive within that, whereas everyone else, it feels like they're more legacy brands that pre existed Netflix.
• 3:37
  Yeah.
• 3:37
  So Gabby's Dollhouse continues to hustle the hustle.
• 3:40
  I mean, it is, it is hard.
• 3:42
  They really DreamWorks throw everything at that show.
• 3:44
  Like it's had new seasons, it's had the MO which also hit Netflix in this period.
• 3:50
  And so that's how hard they're having to work to hold the ground, which they're doing successfully and hats off to that.
• 3:56
  But, you know, I think the perception would have been a bit more like, you've got a movie, it's going to go sky high.
• 4:02
  And actually just maintaining the success level that they're at, which is in the highest echelon, is, is.
• 4:08
  Is a challenge.
• 4:09
  The other original I would draw your attention to, which I don't think gets enough sunlight, and I'm going to talk, be talking about a good bit over the next few weeks, is the Creature Cases.
• 4:19
  The Creature Cases is an Epics original, comes from Sony.
• 4:24
  Sony.
• 4:25
  Sony TV Kids.
• 4:27
  It is about, it's about an investor, like an investigative, like an investigative duo.
• 4:35
  It is like preschool.
• 4:36
  But it's, it does skew.
• 4:37
  It skews a good, like, it's, it skews up to, you know, six, seven.
• 4:41
  Six, seven.
• 4:41
  I would say six, seven.
• 4:43
  Sorry.
• 4:46
  That's actually been such an interesting one because I feel like it hasn't gotten the sunlight or the spotlight that Gabby has, but it's continued to grind and grind and grind over the past few years.
• 4:56
  And actually one of the interesting things we see about that one is what we're kind of dubbing Leaky bucket syndrome.
• 5:02
  Right.
• 5:03
  So that when you put a new, when you put a new season of something on all the other seasons kind of leak engagement.
• 5:09
  But Creature Cases has actually managed to keep very, very solid on engagement for all of the seasons.
• 5:15
  So I think that's one kind of a stealth one that people don't talk about enough.
• 5:20
  And again, a Netflix original.
• 5:21
  But it is, it's been around for a number of years.
• 5:23
  I want to say 2021, I think it launched.
• 5:25
  Well, you've been talking about it for a while.
• 5:27
  Yeah.
• 5:27
  Pretty sure if we look back on previous episodes, we'll find several mentions of Creature Cases.
• 5:32
  Yeah, yeah.
• 5:34
  It's just one that it's not top of people's minds, but it's actually just sitting there doing its thing in a really, really convincing way.
• 5:40
  And then other changes.
• 5:41
  So Ms.
• 5:41
  Rachel is.
• 5:42
  Is like the biggest thing to happen to the Netflix kids landscape.
• 5:47
  The biggest series that say, obviously K Pop Demon Hunters aside, in the last year, she came in within the top 10.
• 5:53
  So that's big.
• 5:54
  And then we see the impact of like US Windows.
• 5:57
  So that's the thing about this data.
• 5:59
  Right.
• 5:59
  Like we don't know when it's a legacy show, not a global original.
• 6:03
  Where the content is available is obviously impacts what the engagement is because not.
• 6:08
  Everything is Netflix global.
• 6:10
  Worth pointing out loads of stuff.
• 6:11
  In fact, the majority stuff isn't global.
• 6:13
  Yeah.
• 6:14
  But you can see when these legacy series hit the US and they just go ganglisters.
• 6:21
  So, yeah, most recent example of this is Teen Titans Go, which has shot up that leaderboard.
• 6:27
  Yeah, Jumped.
• 6:28
  Jumped.
• 6:28
  Right.
• 6:30
  And is, you know, in the top 10 now this, this time around.
• 6:33
  And we've seen it before with spongebob as well.
• 6:35
  Spongebob, like when seasons, sorry, spongebob actually is up there without that US Window, which is crazy.
• 6:41
  But we've seen it with other, with other IP before.
• 6:44
  We saw it with Pepper, we saw it with Paw Pat.
• 6:46
  So it just shows that like, you know, there are these great legacy titles from the golden age of kids TV that remain relevant for audiences today.
• 6:56
  And so if anybody's launching a new show, that's who they're competing against.
• 7:01
  Right.
• 7:02
  Yeah.
• 7:02
  I was trying, I was going down.
• 7:03
  I was going down the route of like, it's like a garden, you know, like, these are.
• 7:06
  There's all these trees.
• 7:07
  They're taking up the sunlight.
• 7:08
  So if you're going to take up sunlight from like Teen Titans or from spongebob or Paw Patrol or Gabby's Dollhouse, like, you need to really be very intentional about it.
• 7:17
  Yeah, yeah.
• 7:18
  Tell us also you're.
• 7:20
  I'm struck by, I suppose when, when Netflix first got into.
• 7:25
  Well, Netflix were really kind of commissioning a lot of their own kids content.
• 7:30
  I was wondering whether there would be like a Netflix tone of voice for kids content in the same way that Nickelodeon had a strong tone of voice Cartoon Network Disney did.
• 7:41
  But it feels like they're far more like the Walmart of.
• 7:44
  Of children's content.
• 7:46
  That there'll be a space.
• 7:48
  Nickelodeon, Cartoon Network, Disney content.
• 7:51
  Well, not Disney content, but you know what I mean, where that, that they've.
• 7:54
  Got bunked the series.
• 7:55
  So.
• 7:56
  Yeah, well, that range of content can kind of coexist but there isn't a strong kind of overall brand identity.
• 8:03
  Yeah, Walmart.
• 8:04
  I was trying to think what's the, what's the British equivalent to Walmart?
• 8:09
  John Lewis?
• 8:10
  I don't know, is it Tesco's or.
• 8:12
  Yeah, but Tesco doesn't have all the other, all the third party brands.
• 8:14
  Sorry, I was just saying that was.
• 8:15
  These are thoughts that were going through my head last week.
• 8:17
  Yeah, it is, it's.
• 8:18
  It's.
• 8:18
  It's a shop window.
• 8:19
  Right.
• 8:19
  Like it's.
• 8:20
  I kind of think the way I think about it is like YouTube is free TV and Netflix is basic pay.
• 8:26
  Right.
• 8:27
  So back in the old days.
• 8:28
  And so it means that, you know, when these shows that have awareness or are intentionally being built for awareness, so things like Gabby's Dollhouse, then they manage to cut through.
• 8:42
  Yeah, absolutely.
• 8:43
  So in that kind of sense it sits like a shop window for the biggest IP in the world.
• 8:49
  They definitely, you know, with the exception of K pop team hunters are they.
• 8:54
  Netflix are more renters of IP rather kids IP rather than builders of it.
• 8:59
  And at this stage obviously we can see that really strongly in their YouTube strategy.
• 9:02
  Like they're taking some of the biggest creators from YouTube for families and they're putting them on Netflix and that's working out for them.
• 9:10
  So yeah, it is a big premium shop window.
• 9:15
  Probably the biggest one in the world.
• 9:16
  I would say the biggest premium one in the world, YouTube aside, being like the free TV.
• 9:20
  Well, in terms of.
• 9:23
  And we'll come back to the YouTube and the creator point later because you make a really good observation about that.
• 9:29
  But with that point in mind, talk to us about this sophomore slump because if you are launching, it's great, but then you've got very often a difficult second album.
• 9:43
  Yeah.
• 9:44
  And there's been a lot made in recent weeks of this big gap between season one and season two and big drop offs.
• 9:51
  What's the sophomore slump?
• 9:52
  Yeah, so we did we.
• 9:53
  So there was a.
• 9:54
  There was a whole load of talk around this before the latest Netflix earnings.
• 9:59
  And this is kind of like I was speaking with somebody about this last week.
• 10:01
  This is kind of like the downside of Netflix putting their data out there is that everyone can look at it.
• 10:08
  Everyone can.
• 10:09
  Armchair sports, Armchair sports, punditry about it.
• 10:14
  And you know, a few weeks ago, there was this narrative of like, the sophomore slump, like, season twos aren't doing as well.
• 10:19
  Like, the thing is, season twos would never do as well.
• 10:22
  Right.
• 10:22
  That's the whole point of season two is that, like, whoever's in for season one is in for season, like, then has to reconvert for season two to.
• 10:28
  So it's nothing necessarily new.
• 10:30
  Obviously.
• 10:30
  The problem is Netflix are putting out their, their report.
• 10:34
  You know, they're putting out their numbers for people to grade.
• 10:36
  And so they get graded and it's not always an A.
• 10:40
  And I don't like, that's obviously not.
• 10:41
  They don't love that.
• 10:42
  And you know, I, I do really feel like Netflix is such a straight A student, so they're kind of deeply uncomfortable with it.
• 10:48
  But as, as, as a corporate entity.
• 10:52
  But they.
• 10:53
  Yeah, so there has been this question of like, what is the story with those season two?
• 10:57
  So we ran our analysis around kids and there's a couple of different caveats around kids as well.
• 11:02
  Because obviously kids content is not narrative content, generally speaking.
• 11:06
  Obviously there's a few exceptions, but in the most part, kids can come into a season, pick up any episode and watch it, whatever.
• 11:15
  So there's that thing where it's not necessarily that follow on question is less there.
• 11:20
  The other thing is around how it's served.
• 11:23
  So generally speaking, on the Netflix platform, you are served season one of something first, obviously.
• 11:28
  Right.
• 11:29
  Like that makes sense from an adult consumption point of view, but actually from a kid's point of view, you know that there's more of a question around that.
• 11:37
  Right.
• 11:37
  Like if, for example, Netflix deeply knew my child, they would just serve him whatever has trains in it.
• 11:43
  And if there was an episode of something that had a train in it, they'd serve him that episode because that would be the one thing that would hook him in.
• 11:49
  So, yeah, so season two kind of gets that.
• 11:52
  Season one gets that prioritization.
• 11:55
  But we do kind of see this kind of struggle of diminishing returns when new seasons come on board and that need to kind of keep content coming in a pipeline, keep new news happening for an ip.
• 12:09
  And we have this kind of leaky bucket syndrome that every time something new deposits, everything else starts leaking a little bit more.
• 12:16
  And it is, it's exhausting, but it's, that's the reality of what viewership looks like in streaming.
• 12:21
  And ultimately, you know, you do.
• 12:24
  It's, it's kind of like a YouTube channel strategy, right?
• 12:27
  Like, it's a program.
• 12:28
  You need to keep new things coming for an ip, otherwise it just goes below the fold and nobody finds it.
• 12:35
  So there is this need to kind of keep, keep the, keep the new news happening.
• 12:39
  The one exception we've seen to the leaky bucket syndrome, as I mentioned, was the creature cases, which I think is, you know, that is one that's worth studying, because when you see an exception to something that happening to,
• 12:50
  you know, the hugely, vast majority of every other ip, you kind of go, well, how are they making it work?
• 12:55
  And how is that managing to kind of see a different type of behavior?
• 13:00
  And so that's something we look into a bit more depth in this report.
• 13:03
  But ultimately, like as I said, the sophomore slump is a, it's just a natural part of TV viewing.
• 13:10
  And it's nothing new, but it's just that Netflix are putting their, their papers out to be graded.
• 13:17
  Yeah, well, when you said sophomore slump, I was, I first of all thought you said sofa slump, which is my favorite position to watch Netflix.
• 13:26
  The dad jokes.
• 13:33
  Yes.
• 13:34
  Well, just one thing on the.
• 13:36
  And I'm not sure how relevant it is to kids content, but it's certainly something, an accusation that's thrown at Netflix for their older stuff is that by waiting a year and a half from season one to season two,
• 13:48
  that they lose a lot of viewers and that if they reduce that kind of turnaround, that they'd kind of keep the viewers that they were losing.
• 13:59
  Do you think that, do you, do you think that's persuasive?
• 14:02
  Do you think the, the data backs up?
• 14:04
  I do think that.
• 14:05
  I do.
• 14:05
  I do see what, what the data says there.
• 14:07
  And again, that's what, where I would come back to this question of, you know, there needs to be a pipeline of content, and that goes for kids, too.
• 14:14
  And I have that conversation with clients as well, where it's like, you know, you don't want to rinse all your content if you're going to get it, if you're going to get a window on Netflix, there needs to
• 14:23
  be a plan against it, funnily enough.
• 14:26
  And just being there isn't enough to keep something above the fold.
• 14:30
  Like, there definitely needs to be a plan when any new seasons launch to make sure that they, you know, the audiences are aware of them and that you're able to kind of claw some space into whether that's the
• 14:42
  trending ranking or whatever so that you get that visual real estate.
• 14:46
  And that's kind of one of the real challenges with Netflix versus YouTube.
• 14:50
  Right?
• 14:50
  YouTube.
• 14:51
  You can program your own stuff.
• 14:53
  All the creators program their own stuff.
• 14:55
  They have days of the week where they put out episodes or they put out videos.
• 14:59
  They have different themes and flavors.
• 15:01
  They're able to see the in depth of the data.
• 15:03
  Whereas in premium streaming, you know, it's not ugc.
• 15:06
  So people are, you know, given their giving their live dates, given their license dates and the stuff goes up and, and yeah, we've just, that's been one of the tragedies of, you know, this massive streaming bubble is that
• 15:18
  like there's been loads of great content made that's just kind of fallen below, even though it might have great value and audience might really enjoy it if they found it.
• 15:25
  So yeah, part of that is keeping new stuff coming through.
• 15:28
  Yeah.
• 15:28
  Well, one thing when you were talking about the way that kind of defaults to the start of, you know, episode one, season one is I hadn't thought about this before, but in the kind of pre streaming days, actually
• 15:43
  season one of a show might not be your best introduction to a show.
• 15:47
  I mean, season one of Seinfeld wouldn't be the best place to grab new viewers.
• 15:54
  You would kind of, you would want them to arrive on season halfway through season two, which is where it kind of got its groove and its mojo and never mind YouTube creators.
• 16:03
  Can you imagine if for every YouTube creator you had to go to the very first post that they did?
• 16:09
  Yeah, totally.
• 16:10
  And it's even like think about Friends, right?
• 16:11
  Like, yeah, you know, casual viewer drops into Friends and then just gets sucked into like when Ross and Rachel were at their pinnacle or whatever.
• 16:18
  Right.
• 16:19
  Like it's.
• 16:19
  And then they, and then they come back, you know, rather than it being this kind of like.
• 16:23
  Yeah, like you say, like season one isn't necessarily always the best example of what a show can be.
• 16:28
  So.
• 16:29
  Yeah, definitely.
• 16:30
  Interesting.
• 16:32
  And what about the creator strategy then?
• 16:35
  I mean, we've seen this recently, almost a bit of a tug of war between YouTube and Netflix and who's going to stay where, who's going to be exclusive and who isn't.
• 16:45
  And of course we've seen on Netflix, just in this last period, we've seen Danny go launch, we've seen Jordan and Salish Mata hop over from YouTube to Netflix.
• 16:58
  What's the story there?
• 16:59
  What's really jumped out at you this report?
• 17:01
  So one of the things I will say is it's not just creators, right?
• 17:05
  It's YouTube.
• 17:06
  Yes, it is absolutely creators part of it.
• 17:07
  But we are also seeing some interesting movements in like digital first animation, you know, so things like Sheriff Labrador, which is kind of a show that a lot of people haven't heard of, saw a massive increase in engagement
• 17:21
  and seems to be really sticking very, very well in markets like the US but yes, creators are huge too.
• 17:27
  This was a huge half for them.
• 17:29
  Jordan and Salish matter did phenomenally.
• 17:31
  So did Danny Go, you know, and those two IP do very well globally, you know, and they've dubbed, I think they're dubbed into numerous different languages and so they really have that worldwide appeal and they're getting, making that
• 17:46
  worldwide connection, which I think is really important for obviously when you're trying to work hand in glove with YouTube, which is a global platform, Ms.
• 17:54
  Rachel remains very specific to English language.
• 17:57
  That is her dub, that's her dubbing footprint.
• 17:59
  And also obviously the by nature of what she's teaching, it makes sense.
• 18:04
  But yeah, we're seeing Sheriff Labrador come through in a big way.
• 18:08
  We are seeing another YouTube show called Jose Comelon or Jose Totoy.
• 18:15
  Now we've seen that coming through in trending and the next round of data will validate kind of the similar thing we've seen for Sheriff Labrador.
• 18:22
  So that's all interesting.
• 18:23
  It's a very hot market.
• 18:25
  I guess the real question is like you say Joe around that question around exclusivity.
• 18:32
  Definitely all of the reports I've seen about that YouTube question about exclusivity hasn't mentioned any kids creators.
• 18:39
  And perhaps that's right because obviously kids creators are having such a hard time monetizing properly on YouTube.
• 18:47
  Taking windows on things like Netflix is really important to their bottom line and to how they're able to reach audiences.
• 18:53
  So yeah, and it really, in a way it just, it talks to the different standards of value to each platform in terms of for YouTube, exclusivity of a creator that's got a huge global grown up audience is really
• 19:09
  important to their advertisers.
• 19:11
  Kids less so or kids creators less so to YouTube as we know.
• 19:15
  But as you've said, YouTube is Netflix, sorry, is premium streaming.
• 19:20
  And we know that kids content is super sticky on Netflix.
• 19:25
  It's one of those reasons that you do not cancel your subscription because your kids halfway through the latest season of Sheriff Labrador or creature cases.
• 19:35
  So in a way, thank goodness Netflix has gone hoovering up some of these kids creators because this is one of the outlets that is helping them sustain their businesses.
• 19:47
  Yeah.
• 19:47
  And I think they need to continue to be very intentional about it.
• 19:50
  Like, yeah, I did see some blowback around Jordan and Salish Matter where that's, you know, the nutritional value of that content is maybe less, you know, less all the green bars, if you know what I mean.
• 20:03
  But, you know, parents being like, oh, well, we put our kids on Netflix, so we don't want them on YouTube.
• 20:08
  But ultimately, you know, they have chosen some.
• 20:11
  They've chosen some real, really solid creators to get behind Danny Go, season two of that launched recently.
• 20:17
  It's great to see him back in the saddle after obviously immense personal tragedy on his side earlier this year.
• 20:22
  So, yeah, and like you said, it's back to that shop window point that, like, you know, these folks have followings.
• 20:30
  The other one we're tracking as well, Steven, Maggie in the uk to see if that one cuts through.
• 20:36
  So I think that's a really important part of the strategy for Netflix in a major way.
• 20:50
  Sorry, I lost you guys for a second there.
• 20:53
  Yeah, going and finished the point.
• 20:55
  Yes.
• 20:56
  Well, I mean, I think it sort of shows that YouTube and Netflix, particularly around kids, they sort of need each other.
• 21:05
  Because the impression I get is that within the kids area, Netflix is dominated by either legacy IP that had pre awareness before it came to the platform, or there's kind of the new disruptors, which are the YouTube creators,
• 21:26
  which built their own pre awareness outside of the Netflix platform.
• 21:31
  But apart from Gabby's Dollhouse, it's quite tough to compete within that space if you're an IP that just grew up native to Netflix and originated on Netflix.
• 21:43
  So it feels like Netflix kind of need YouTube for its new content out, Leaving aside the kind of more legacy brands, because you need some way in which you can kind of, you can create that awareness around an
• 21:58
  IP that isn't as easy on the platform.
• 22:02
  I agree with you, but I do kind of think, like, where is the pipeline going for new kids IP?
• 22:08
  Because creature cases and Gabby's daughters are both over 5 years old.
• 22:13
  All the other stuff is legacy creators are now coming through to fill the gap.
• 22:17
  But we know that the floor is kind of rotten underneath YouTube creators as well, that the mom and pop shops of five years ago, it's much more difficult for them to come up.
• 22:27
  So, like, they're kind of rinsing all of the pipelines and there's like, I would have the question of when, where is the next big thing coming from?
• 22:35
  Because structurally, if they're not commissioning it, there's issues with it coming up.
• 22:41
  Like, you know, there's, there's a, there's a weakness to it coming up on YouTube.
• 22:44
  So I think that's going to be an interesting one to keep an eye on.
• 22:47
  Yeah.
• 22:47
  Agree.
• 22:48
  Yeah, I can.
• 22:49
  What about the, the live action side of things?
• 22:53
  Yeah, so we loved it.
• 22:54
  Live action this time around.
• 22:57
  Nickelodeon went away with it like it's, it's phenomenal.
• 23:00
  And again, back to obviously established shows and it comes down to windowing and stuff like that.
• 23:06
  But the Nick catalog is just so valuable.
• 23:10
  Henry Danger, the Thundermans, Victorious, Icardi, Salmon Cat.
• 23:13
  Right.
• 23:13
  Like all these shows that, you know, say we didn't cut, we didn't grow up with them, we professionally grew up with them.
• 23:19
  I kind of feel like I.
• 23:21
  Yeah, so, but these are, they still hold so much value.
• 23:26
  They still cut through with kids today.
• 23:28
  And there's.
• 23:29
  I would say that some of the engagement is probably also driven by Gen Z comfort watching and stuff like that.
• 23:34
  So, you know, they're really, really strong in terms of live.
• 23:38
  Live action.
• 23:39
  And again, we see a similar thing with Netflix where, you know, they don't have a huge pipeline of live action shows coming through.
• 23:46
  Like as in, like, you know, really much of a pipeline to speak.
• 23:49
  To speak of that are kids specific.
• 23:50
  Okay.
• 23:51
  But it teen shows, different case.
• 23:54
  Right.
• 23:54
  But kids specific shows that are available in the kids section.
• 23:57
  You know, they made a few good investments a few years ago, like, you know, back in the golden age.
• 24:01
  They have Fuller House, which was the follow on from Full House and Family Reunion, which did really well.
• 24:07
  The Babysitters Club, Alexa and Katie, which was a really great show that they commissioned back in the day.
• 24:13
  But they're not really having any massive pipeline of live action shows coming through, which is a bit of a weakness, to be honest.
• 24:22
  Is this plugging that weakness though, in terms of they've spotted an opportunity to go and hoover up all of this Netflix Nickelodeon live action content because it kind of plays into what we were saying before about Netflix increasingly
• 24:36
  becoming an aggregator.
• 24:38
  They distributing Tayophane in France.
• 24:41
  You know, is this another play?
• 24:43
  They're going to be the home of Nickelodeon live action shows.
• 24:47
  No.
• 24:48
  Yeah.
• 24:49
  Don't tell Paramount that, Joe Cheekers.
• 24:52
  Yeah, like, and I'm sure Nickelodeon live action shows aren't the number one issue that Paramount is looking to solve right now.
• 24:58
  Obviously they've got humongous legal fish to fry in the merger of Warner.
• 25:03
  But you know, ultimately, like, no, this is a weak.
• 25:07
  Like it is entirely conceivable that Paramount would double down on the licensing footprint of those live action shows.
• 25:14
  Yeah.
• 25:15
  Like Disney did basically.
• 25:18
  Maybe not.
• 25:18
  I don't know.
• 25:19
  Would they take all of them?
• 25:20
  I don't know.
• 25:21
  Like obviously there's still, there's still, you know, there's still value in them, but it's not like they're not like spongebob where there's a franchise, you know, there's a franchise reason for it to be on in the biggest shop
• 25:32
  window of media platforms globally.
• 25:35
  These are all older shows that obviously there's a massive demand for.
• 25:40
  So yeah, I do think it's a weakness.
• 25:43
  Now.
• 25:43
  Netflix have been phenomenal and we don't cover it in the Netflix Kids Report.
• 25:47
  We've looked at it for clients and stuff.
• 25:50
  Their teen offering is really, really, really strong.
• 25:54
  You know, ya shows like Xo Kitty, that kind of thing that really Wednesday, obviously being the hu.
• 26:03
  Like are so kid adjacent.
• 26:06
  It's.
• 26:07
  They're like there's a, there's obviously Venn diagram overlap to, to pull in that audience and they have been phenomenal at developing those types of shows.
• 26:14
  So yeah, I think like this.
• 26:17
  So in that sense they can, you know, they have a pipeline for the audience there, which I think is valid.
• 26:22
  And you know, ultimately I think older kids appreciate, you know, the second we all know the second you label something kids, they don't want to watch it.
• 26:32
  Right.
• 26:33
  So those types of older skewing or maybe more broadly skewing is a better way to put it.
• 26:38
  Live action shows fill that need in, in a more particular way.
• 26:45
  Yeah, it's fascinating.
• 26:47
  I do think that that whole family live action genre is probably going to be hotly contested.
• 26:54
  Like you say Paramount, you know, are they going to pull it back?
• 26:59
  Depends, you know, what value they perceive in having all of that legacy content there.
• 27:04
  Where arguably I'd say it's actually more valuable to Netflix because nearly a billion minutes.
• 27:09
  It's nearly a billion minutes viewed.
• 27:12
  It's hugely valuable to them.
• 27:13
  And like you say they've got a, they've got a viewership that ranges from like 12 to 32.
• 27:21
  Because you've got older viewers and even younger.
• 27:24
  No, like, like eight year olds are watching the Thundermans.
• 27:26
  Like totally.
• 27:27
  Yeah.
• 27:27
  And victorious and iconic.
• 27:29
  It's like the thing that.
• 27:31
  It's warm hug content.
• 27:32
  Right.
• 27:32
  Like it's exactly.
• 27:34
  It's legacy warm hug content that like, you know, Netflix as a new Incumbent can't replicate that.
• 27:40
  Right.
• 27:40
  Like, Disney have the back catalog.
• 27:43
  You know, you can go and put on like, Chippendale Rescue Rangers on Disney and like, okay, some of the episodes might have a few, like, announcements at the start because there's own PC stuff included.
• 27:51
  But like, you know, it's that real.
• 27:53
  Like, you can just go back and like, watch that kind of old stuff.
• 27:56
  Netflix don't have old stuff because they're a new player.
• 27:59
  Right.
• 28:00
  So they don't.
• 28:01
  And also they're.
• 28:03
  They're kind of.
• 28:05
  They're kind of teen stuff or they're kind of.
• 28:09
  That content tends to have areas that are a bit uncomfortable and edgier.
• 28:15
  Yeah.
• 28:16
  So even that isn't kind of like.
• 28:18
  Even their new stuff isn't a warm hug in terms of.
• 28:22
  There'll be some uncomfortable things you'll encounter in that.
• 28:24
  And that's part of what makes those shows enjoyable.
• 28:28
  But they're very.
• 28:29
  It's a very different atmosphere, but there.
• 28:33
  I do think it points to one of the fundamental issues of premium.
• 28:35
  The premium streaming landscape today, which is this kind of focus on 28 days or bust.
• 28:39
  Right.
• 28:39
  Like, if something's not big and, and, and kids content doesn't work that way.
• 28:43
  Preschool content does not work that way.
• 28:44
  But I would also say sitcoms don't work that way.
• 28:47
  Right.
• 28:47
  Like, sitcoms take time to build.
• 28:50
  They're not hot out the gate.
• 28:52
  You need to invest multiple times.
• 28:53
  The biggest new sitcom that's come out in recent years is like Ted Lasso, and again, it was backed by Apple, who afford to just go the.
• 29:00
  Go the distance with things and have chose to go the distance with that, obviously to great success.
• 29:04
  But like sitcoms, you have to sit with them for a while and like new sitcoms coming out, like, it's, it's, you know, they're just not coming out at the, at the rate that they.
• 29:15
  That they were.
• 29:16
  Yeah, there is a lot is interesting one to have a look at in that area, but.
• 29:21
  Yeah, absolutely.
• 29:23
  I think there's a lot to be said as well.
• 29:25
  Just thinking of the psychology of it, and I think I did read it somewhere once that people go back and tuck into those sitcoms.
• 29:31
  You know, when times are tight, the geopolitical situation feels a little bit ye.
• 29:38
  So you go back and you tuck into the Friends.
• 29:42
  You go back and.
• 29:43
  Yeah, tuck into those.
• 29:45
  Because it's that reassurance.
• 29:47
  So, yeah, arguably again, they have their moment and they become at that moment in time more valuable to someone like Netflix.
• 29:55
  Yeah, absolutely.
• 29:56
  Absolutely.
• 29:58
  Okay.
• 29:59
  I couldn't let you go without just touching on gaming because Netflix has had kind of an up and down relationship with its gaming strategy.
• 30:11
  Originally they were going to be producing games, but only 1% of Netflix subscribers were actually navigating to the games section.
• 30:21
  But actually now they've gotten over that and they've started bringing in third party games.
• 30:26
  So they've been, they did some stuff around the World cup with football games and they've got, I mean they just debuted the sneak peek of GTA.
• 30:37
  There was a 30 minute special that went crazy last week.
• 30:41
  Everybody was watching that one.
• 30:43
  But specifically with kids in mind, Netflix Playground.
• 30:46
  Tell us a little bit about that because you've looked into that.
• 30:49
  Yeah, so kids is one of the specific pillars of their gaming strategy.
• 30:53
  And yeah, they've brought out a number of third party games that are accessible via the app.
• 30:59
  But Playground is a standalone, is a standalone offering too, that's got multiple IP in it.
• 31:05
  So it came out in April.
• 31:07
  I mean they seem pretty happy about it.
• 31:08
  They're talking about, you know, their kids gaming multiplier seeing a 600, 600% increase in engagement.
• 31:17
  So you know, obviously they're making headway with this.
• 31:20
  There was a big push behind it.
• 31:22
  It's very young.
• 31:23
  It is very, very young.
• 31:25
  So it's things like, you know, coloring games like Jigsaw games like Match the Pairs, kind of Match the Pairs games and kind of the, the spiciest thing on there might be an Endless Runner.
• 31:36
  And it's got, it's got.
• 31:37
  No, it's, it's got known ip, it's got like Paw Patrol and Gabby's Dollhouse.
• 31:42
  It's got a few lesser known ip, I would say that are on there, I mean potentially just because the right situation worked out or whatever.
• 31:49
  I don't know, I don't know the detail, but things like Bad Dinosaurs, which we've chatted about, which obviously did well for Netflix at a time.
• 31:58
  And so yeah, it's a good offering.
• 32:00
  Very young.
• 32:01
  I mean it doubles down on this notion of trust.
• 32:06
  Right.
• 32:06
  And they're delivering that value for parents seems to be something that's important to them, whether that's through gaming, through safe gaming.
• 32:15
  That's, you know, ad free in app purchase free.
• 32:18
  Right.
• 32:18
  Like it's just, you know, you're able to, you're able to run with it.
• 32:22
  That's the thing, isn't it?
• 32:23
  That ad free experience which is becoming increasingly rare, let's face it, because everywhere else is ad funded.
• 32:30
  And the other interesting thing about Netflix is the last time I checked at the very least, like if you are on an ad tier, they still don't serve ads on kids content at all.
• 32:39
  So they don't go after kids content at all for ads.
• 32:41
  So that is really reassuring from a parent's point of view that that's the kind of experience your kids are having.
• 32:47
  So.
• 32:47
  And again, it also goes to the YouTube creator piece as well where, you know, audiences are able to enjoy that content in an ad free environment too.
• 32:55
  So yeah, Netflix Playground is an interesting one.
• 32:59
  It feels like they've, it feels like they're.
• 33:01
  I always pay attention when I can see like behavior like in a row.
• 33:07
  Right.
• 33:07
  Like if there's momentum there.
• 33:08
  Right.
• 33:09
  Like they're building this.
• 33:09
  It's not just we launch this app and then there we are, it's done.
• 33:13
  It's like they have been doing various different things around this last year and various things around that.
• 33:18
  This, this year they're trying to build it out, make it bigger.
• 33:20
  And I always think that's worth paying attention to.
• 33:23
  Yeah, yeah.
• 33:24
  Agree.
• 33:25
  Yeah.
• 33:25
  I think they're pretty, pretty smart with what they've done with Netflix Playground in terms of.
• 33:31
  Given that we've spoken many a time about how the regulatory screws are tightening on a lot of gaming platforms being unashamedly, I mean, and it's got all of the IP that you'd want on there, a nice variety enough
• 33:44
  to choose from.
• 33:45
  It's ad free and it's safe.
• 33:48
  Again, that's another reason to stick with Netflix if you've got a little one and an iPad.
• 33:53
  Yeah.
• 33:53
  And it's specifically different to YouTube.
• 33:55
  Right.
• 33:55
  Like YouTube are not going after that at all.
• 33:56
  And it's something that, that Netflix can, can, can.
• 33:59
  It's unique to them in that sense.
• 34:02
  Amazing.
• 34:03
  Well, as ever, I feel like my brain has expanded since I got a sneak peek at your Netflix report.
• 34:10
  So thank you.
• 34:11
  Tell us when it, when's it out?
• 34:14
  So it's going to client, it's gone to clients and it's like it'll be available to download once or available to purchase, should I say once this podcast goes out.
• 34:23
  So yeah, it will be.
• 34:25
  We'll be firmly on the track in terms of talking about it.
• 34:27
  So yeah, I will be going on about it all week.
• 34:32
  I always feel like it's the way to become the smartest best friend after you've read the report.
• 34:38
  Yeah.
• 34:38
  So it's great.
• 34:39
  Really good.
• 34:40
  Yeah, it is superb.
• 34:41
  So I hope you guys enjoyed that.
• 34:44
  Please watch and listen wherever you get your podcasts, whether that's Spotify, YouTube, Apple Podcasts, wherever.
• 34:51
  And don't forget to check out our substack where you can get key takeaways from each episode.
• 34:58
  And that's it from us.
• 34:59
  We'll see you all next week.