Latest / Project Geekology / The Rings of Power - Season 2, Part 1

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The Rings of Power - Season 2, Part 1 · Project Geekology

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Welcome to episode 102 of Project Geekology.
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: This week we are going to be covering part one of season two of Rings of Power.
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: This is a little bit of a Rings of Power series that we've been doing.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: I am one half of your host, anthony, and joining me, as always, is Dakota, and Eagles, Uruks and Ents.
• 0:24
  Speaker 2: Oh my, we have so much to talk about yeah, we do uh when it comes to these first four episodes, and I'm super thrilled that we stuck it out and actually made it to season two, because this is the show I wanted.
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: This is the show that I was expecting when season one came out, so I'm happy that we suck it out, rich.
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: I'm happy that you encouraged us to stick it out.
• 0:47
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, rich, you're here too.
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: Hi hi, rich.
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: How are you?
• 0:50
  Speaker 3: hey guys, how you doing.
• 0:51
  Speaker 3: Thanks for having me really excited.
• 0:53
  Speaker 3: You know to, uh, once again represent the rights of all out there and I will be speaking about that later, but no, really, I'm really glad you guys stuck it out.
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: I mean, I had a blast talking about season one with you guys, but like this is the moment I've been waiting for right, like this was.
• 1:09
  Speaker 3: They gave us so much.
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: Yes, yes, so kind of like the last season.
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: Part one is going to cover the first four episodes of the series.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: So we're not going to be talking about the entire season today series.
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: So we're not going to be talking about the entire season today, and then next week we will be talking about the rest of you know, the last four episodes, and then, I guess, maybe the season as a whole.
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: And yeah, there's definitely a lot to talk and unpack, which is like I'm glad that we cut this show in half, because there's no way that, like even just in the first four episodes, that we could have just covered this in like one, a one hour episode, you know, just like the whole season.
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: So I'm really excited about that.
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: What have you been up to, dakota?
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: I know that we usually start the show with what we have been up to, so tell us not a whole lot as far as just consuming entertainment outside of rings of power.
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: But well, actually that's not entirely true, but I I have been playing astrobot oh okay, the game yeah, the game astrobot on playstation 5 nice have you given?
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: Have you given it a chance yet?
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: I?
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: I actually have not, but I heard that it's actually like a really really good like platformer game.
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: I'm super impressed with it.
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: It's basically playstation's mario, you know like it's a super mario game.
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: you kind of think like one of the more recent mario games that have come out and can't kind of like odyssey or galaxy or something like that, where it's like kind of semi-open world even though there's levels to each location.
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: And what's cool about Astro Bot is it's very clearly a love letter to PlayStation games of the past.
• 2:50
  Speaker 2: So there's a good chunk of levels that are themed to games that have been popular.
• 2:57
  Speaker 2: Like we just went through a God of War level where we had to collect certain bots and we found a Kratos and Atreus and we had to go through certain themed locations that were very God of War-esque.
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: But there's a lot of like really creative gameplay mechanics and there's so much within the controller that the PlayStation has like in terms of it produces audio, it accepts different types of movements and stuff that is very uniquely represented in this game, and each level has a different mechanic that you can utilize with the DualShock controller and it's just so cool.
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: Right, what Dakota is talking about is the actual like Astro Bot game.
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: When the PS5 came out, there was this Astro Bot game that came out, but it was more of like a showcase for the PS5.
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: I think it was like Astro's World or something like that.
• 3:56
  Speaker 1: Right, right and so, like it's almost like this.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: That character kind of became a little bit of a mascot for the PS5, just to kind of showcase what you can do with this hardware.
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: And yeah, when that game came out, I saw nothing but rave reviews for it.
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: I had listened to a couple of podcasts that talked about it and pretty much I would say all of them are like yeah, this is like such a good platformer, it's so solid.
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, no, I'm interested in it's also it's a contender for game of the year.
• 4:33
  Speaker 2: I don't know if you've looked at the game of the year list yet, but it's like a really bizarre list like there's.
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: There's a probably rebirth on there yeah, it's final fantasy.
• 4:44
  Speaker 2: 7 rebirth yeah there's the.
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: What's weird is that it's not a full game, it's the dlc.
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: So elden rings latest dlc, is in contention for game of the year, which is bizarre.
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: Um ash astrobot is in contention for game of the year, and I feel like there's a couple more, but I just, I I'm not in that sphere, so I I don't know yeah, there's usually maybe about like five, six yeah but uh, yeah, no, I'm really impressed with it.
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: As far as anything else I've been up to, I was talking to rich right before we started recording.
• 5:23
  Speaker 2: There's a lot of avatar news that has come out in the past two days and some of it is rather spoilery.
• 5:29
  Speaker 2: I don't think I'm gonna talk too much about all that, but if you're interested, there has been a lot of leaks regarding the avatar series.
• 5:39
  Speaker 2: That occurs after the legend of korra, so so this is the next Avatar.
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: The Earth Avatar.
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: So there's been a lot of leaks within the past two days that have come out.
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: The Avatar's name has been released, the premise and the setting, and it's really fascinating, but it's like a huge status quo change.
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: So look at that at your own peril.
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: But as far as stuff that's not so spoilery, avatar studios has you know, on top of all these leaks that have been coming out outside of avi avatar studios, avatar studios released their official timeline of like the of the avatar show and everything, and I'm pleased to announce the, the, the timeline structure, that structure that I came up with last week, where you know, like I mentioned, that Avatar Wan, like when he became the Avatar, is the new Zero period and, like, by the time the second harmonic convergence with Korra comes out, is 10,000 years in the future.
• 6:38
  Speaker 2: That's exactly the layout that they chose.
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: It may not be ER era of Rava and ea era of the avatar, but the numbering system is on par with what I've got going on, so I'm very pleased with that.
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: I I kind of called it, I kind of just wish I had released my avatar timeline earlier so that I could have, like you know, you could have been like hey they copied me, yeah, they copied me, but now I feel like I copied them and it's not the case.
• 7:05
  Speaker 1: But yeah, anyway I anyway I've got it on recording.
• 7:07
  Speaker 2: That's cool it was on our last episode, if you want to check it out.
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I definitely talked about that, so I'm pleased, but also kind of like a little bit upset.
• 7:19
  Speaker 2: Between the first Avatar and Yang Chen, which is the air Avatar in the cycle prior to Aang, there are 90 Avatars.
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: That's the first time that they've ever announced or over.
• 7:34
  Speaker 2: They said over 90 Avatars, which means that we're coming up on 100 total Avatars once the next Avatar comes out.
• 7:42
  Speaker 2: So I'm excited about that.
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: It's really cool.
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: A lot of stuff's coming out.
• 7:46
  Speaker 2: Also, I think we're probably going to have to talk a little bit about this, just in general, just Skeleton Crew.
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: You know, honestly, to tell you the truth, I have not been able to actually sit down and watch the two episodes I went to.
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: Every time I go to sit down to watch it at night, because the past couple of nights I've been like sitting down and watching the this first part of season two by the time I've just been exhausted lately.
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: So by the time I go to sit down and watch it, dude, like I'm knocking out and so like I'm like, ok, I don't want to watch this because I want to watch it without falling asleep.
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: So I really want to watch this because I want to watch it without falling asleep.
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: So I really want to watch it.
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: Like I've seen, like maybe the first, like 20 minutes of the first episode and so far it seems pretty interesting, like it's.
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: I like that.
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: It seems like they're trying to do something different the.
• 8:40
  Speaker 2: There's a certain level of mystery within the show that I'm really excited about rich.
• 8:45
  Speaker 2: I feel like you have something to say about Skeleton Crew.
• 8:47
  Speaker 2: Oh, I absolutely love it.
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: I mean it's kind of like Goonies in space A little bit, yeah, yeah.
• 8:55
  Speaker 2: I mean they kind of give you that suburban lifestyle within the Star Wars universe that we've never seen before.
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's awesome, we've never seen that in 40 something years and that's really cool.
• 9:06
  Speaker 3: It's like we've seen what you know dusty deserts or an overcrowded city, and that's it.
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: Now that you mention it, I did find that kind of interesting that like they are living, the lives that they're living, is very different to than what we were used to in Star Wars.
• 9:25
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's.
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: I think it's really interesting the dynamic shift.
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: But you obviously like, if you think about it, suburbs have to exist somewhere yeah so might as well exist in this show, and I like how the kids are very clearly like from affluent neighborhoods and like they're giving the parents are giving their kids the best possible education that they can, and it kind of just mirrors our personal lives a little bit in the sense that, you know, we've all been to school, we've all had to take tests that, you know, test our aptitude for certain things.
• 9:59
  Speaker 2: So I think it's just a really fun twist on the genre by incorporating a little bit of real life into it.
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: Right and it definitely has like those coming of age elements.
• 10:12
  Speaker 1: You know that that's what's going to be happening in that show and you know something that it kind of reminds me a little bit of is that there is this there's a series that I really like enjoyed in middle school and it was called star wars, galaxy of fear, and it was like it was goosebumps in the star wars universe and it followed these two kids and their uncle and their uncle was like pretty much like a jedi, and so it's kind of reminding me like you've got this group of kids that's, you know, following this like Jedi kind of character.
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: So, like that, it brought that memory to me a little bit.
• 10:56
  Speaker 2: So it's, that's cool.
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I can't wait to actually like dive and watch a little bit more.
• 11:02
  Speaker 3: It was funny.
• 11:03
  Speaker 3: I watched the first episode and then I texted jen and I complained about something, you know, I think.
• 11:09
  Speaker 3: I said I need dakota to make a timeline so that I know what the hell is going on.
• 11:13
  Speaker 3: And then I kind of was like, oh, you just need to be patient, buddy, like you just need to be patient, you know.
• 11:18
  Speaker 3: You want to know the timelines.
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: I could give you a brief little timeline.
• 11:23
  Speaker 2: I there's information that I've already gleaned from the timeline that I think kind of spoils certain aspects of the show, so I don't want to get too deep into it.
• 11:33
  Speaker 2: But it is concurrent to Mandalorian and Boba Fett and all that.
• 11:39
  Speaker 3: Okay, okay, so that's between.
• 11:41
  Speaker 3: That's after episode six, before episode seven yes, so it's about five years after episode six.
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: In that sweet spot.
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: In that sweet sweet spot where there's very little canon stuff that we know about outside of the shows, but what I find really interesting, Anthony, when you eventually sit down to re-watch or watch the episodes for the first time.
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: I guess I'm gonna tackle at least the first episode tonight after recording, because I didn't have enough time to eat before we recorded, so I'm gonna eat after we record and be able to actually sit down and like eat and be able to like watch something.
• 12:20
  Speaker 1: I won't be like laying down and watching something, so I won't be able to fall asleep.
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: In the beginning scene.
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: Notice what the pirate holds when he picks up a New Republic credit.
• 12:31
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 12:31
  Speaker 2: And then, I think, by episode two, notice what one of the kids is holding when they give over their credits, because they're not the same thing and I think that's a big clue as to where they are in the universe, their home planet and all that.
• 12:48
  Speaker 2: And I think you know, if you give it any thought, you can kind of come up with a decent understanding of, like, what is actually going on with these kids, because there's more than meets the eye, because they're not the same credits, the that the pirate finds in the beginning, as well as what the kid is carrying.
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: So really interesting stuff, sweet.
• 13:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll keep an eye out.
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: Anthony, what have you been up to?
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: So the whole reason why we didn't record and get an episode out the previous week, as this comes out, is because I went out of town and I got to spend some time with some family for Thanksgiving, and after that this past weekend I went to Disney, we went to Hollywood Studios.
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: I always like going to Hollywood Studios and so did that.
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: And then I actually yesterday, as a recording recording, on Wednesday, so yesterday, december 3rd, I went to go see Moana 2.
• 13:49
  Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I got to see that as well.
• 13:51
  Speaker 2: Really quick.
• 13:52
  Speaker 2: What are your favorite and least favorite rides in Hollywood Studios?
• 13:56
  Speaker 2: Or you don't have to tell me least favorite.
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: What are your top three?
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: So my top three, I mean, obviously Rise of the Resistance, just because that technology was just it's, it's amazing and they use that same like technology for that Mickey and Minnie ride that they made.
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: So it's a trackless ride, trackless ride, yeah, which I think is amazing that we're like at that point Another one that it's.
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: It's tough because there's a.
• 14:27
  Speaker 1: There's a lot that I do like, but I have to go with the classics like rock and roller coaster, like just the the dark indoor coaster.
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: It's really fun but also kind of scary at the same time, because there's a couple times where you feel like your head's gonna hit something, but like you know, you know that they've like calculated that.
• 14:44
  Speaker 2: But like, of course, you still have that, that like inkling to like wanna kind of like cringe or yeah same with like space mountain, like you can't see anything that's like above or beside you but like, if you like, hold your arms up in this in the air.
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: You're kind of worried that they're just gonna like be hit off dude, exactly so I don't know if you've noticed or I don't know if you know this, but rock and roller coaster is going away in its current state uh, that, so I didn't.
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: I, I mean, I haven't really dug too deep into that, like so I didn't know, but I know that the muppets ride is going away in its current state.
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: That's changing.
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: Yes, so the Muppets 3D show is going away, which a lot of people are really upset about, because that's Jim Henson's last actual film.
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: Was that show for Disney World?
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: So that's supposed to be.
• 15:38
  Speaker 2: They're going to keep that in some form or another.
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: But the Muppets are going to be replacing the aerosmith show in rock and roller coaster, so it's going to be a muppets themed roller coaster instead of aerosmith oh okay, I wonder what.
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: What did they say?
• 15:57
  Speaker 1: The reasoning behind that?
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: I guess because, like aerosmith, they.
• 16:01
  Speaker 3: Aerosmith has fallen out of public consciousness at this point, right Public consciousness.
• 16:08
  Speaker 2: I mean there's been allegations against Steven Tyler that aren't very Disney friendly.
• 16:14
  Speaker 3: Fairly certain he's saying about that, so I don't know why we're surprised.
• 16:17
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but again.
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: Makes sense.
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: Right, it's in the music guys.
• 16:22
  Speaker 2: We also have.
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: They want to incorporate a Monsters Inc land and roller coaster where the Muppets land is currently.
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: So they're going to gut the Muppets land, put all the Monsters Inc stuff there, and then they're going to ship the Muppets somewhere else I don't know, and then also, I really like Tower of Terror.
• 16:41
  Speaker 2: Tower of Terror is fantastic.
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: You know I like the Twilight Zone, I like the Outer Limits, I mean like dude.
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: You know, like as a kid like I loved those really creepy like anthology series that like really tested thinking and stuff, so sure.
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 16:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so so it.
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: It definitely has that vibe and that's one of my favorite rides and and, honestly, that's probably one of the few actual drop rides that I'll go on, because it's not that bad.
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: I will never go on Dr Doom's Fearfall.
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: Never in my life you will never see me even put a toe on that ride.
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: All right, Well you heard it first folks.
• 17:20
  Speaker 1: Tower of Terror.
• 17:21
  Speaker 1: I'll go on there.
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: Tower of Terror is fantastic.
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: It's one of those classic rides that I hope never changes.
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: I know in Disneyland they've already rethemed it to a Guardians of the Galaxy ride and everyone hates it, so I hope they don't do that for Disney World.
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: But anyway, right, right.
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: So yeah, I got to.
• 17:40
  Speaker 1: I was going to visit some family that I hadn't seen in a while.
• 17:43
  Speaker 1: It was good getting out to Disney and seeing Moana and watching this.
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: I got to.
• 17:44
  Speaker 1: I was, you know, going to visit some family that I hadn't seen in a while.
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: It was good.
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: And then you know, getting out to Disney and seeing Moana and watching this.
• 17:48
  Speaker 1: So Rich.
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: What have you been up to?
• 17:53
  Speaker 3: Well, let's see, pokemon has come to a grinding halt where, since I refuse to pay money, I've gotten past the barrier and I'm very displeased.
• 18:02
  Speaker 3: So I past the barrier and I'm very displeased.
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: So I just turned to an old favorite, red dead redemption 2.
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: I think at this point I probably play it once every 18 months or so, like I.
• 18:12
  Speaker 3: I'm just like I've.
• 18:13
  Speaker 3: I've replayed the entire thing.
• 18:15
  Speaker 3: I still get upset at the same moments.
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: I did find out new stuff.
• 18:20
  Speaker 3: Like you don't have to go get micah and help him get back to camp right away.
• 18:25
  Speaker 3: You can just kind of like not have him around, and I hate his character.
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: So I thoroughly enjoyed looking at my map and seeing his name on my map and saying, heck, no, I'm not going to go help you Micah, because I didn't want him around the camp.
• 18:37
  Speaker 3: It's just he annoys the crap out of me.
• 18:40
  Speaker 3: My wife walked in the other day and I was fishing and the fish was very large.
• 18:43
  Speaker 3: It was one of those large fish that you have to put on, put on the back of the horse, so I was very excited.
• 18:48
  Speaker 3: It was a.
• 18:48
  Speaker 3: It was a thrilling back and forth and then I went to go catch another one and she said are you really just gonna keep fishing?
• 18:54
  Speaker 3: And I was like, don't tell me how to play my game, I'll just.
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: I'll just go hunting.
• 18:59
  Speaker 3: I'll play texas hold'em poker in that game with a glass of whiskey, like I'm at a bar, for an hour and a half Just goes by and I refuse to stop playing.
• 19:12
  Speaker 2: That's how you do it, man.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: Speaking of Red Dead Redemption 2, IGN I guess for the 30th anniversary of PlayStation released their top 100 games of the entire PlayStation era and Red red dead redemption 2 was in their top.
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: It was definitely in their top 10.
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: I don't know, I forget if it was a top five game, but it was.
• 19:33
  Speaker 2: It was definitely up there, so it's definitely gotten its recognition from pretty much all sectors it's just there's just so much to do.
• 19:41
  Speaker 3: Like I love the horse riding, you know I try to replace skyrim.
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: The remaster is pretty good.
• 19:46
  Speaker 3: I downloaded that a while ago.
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: But skyrim is another game where I played to level 84 and I I would just kind of go and like I.
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: When my wife found out that there was fast travel, let's just say she was very upset with me because there were times I was like I just gotta travel, I just gotta get to mark off, and she'd be like, oh, all right, how far is that?
• 20:08
  Speaker 3: I show her the map and she's like, okay, and it would be like 25 minutes.
• 20:13
  Speaker 3: And it was because I didn't want to miss anything along the way well, that's.
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: A fun part about skyrim is that there's so many little areas that, like you, can just travel to and unlock on the map.
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: That you know just heightens your gameplay, because as soon as you unlock that, there's either like a little dungeon in there or there's something like a chest within a tower or something.
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: I love skyrim man.
• 20:34
  Speaker 2: I can't wait for elder scrolls to.
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: I just want to poke elder scrolls with a stick and be like do something, come on well, yeah, but that's, that is just they.
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: They had released that little teaser just to like kind of appease the the appetite.
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: But like now people are like definitely hungry for for more elder scrolls.
• 20:53
  Speaker 1: But dude, like red dead redemption by far is like one of the most beautiful games that I have seen in a long time and like I mean outside of square enix and square enix makes some really beautiful games, but like rockstar killed it.
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: Like I mean on like red dead redemption 2 looks better than any of the gta games that they have come out with, any of the other games that they have come out with, like just the landscapes and just the attention to detail and like just a lot of small stuff that they have done.
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: It's been a while since I've revisited Red Dead Redemption 2, but I would definitely go back shoot.
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: But I think that Overwatch 2 might be taking a little bit of a back burner because Rivals is finally releasing tomorrow Marvel Rivals, the Overwatch clone rivals, the, you know, overwatch clone, okay, well, I guess next week let us know how the actual release goes.
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: For, you know, I guess the, the, first week of release, right?
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: yes, well, you know I'll probably shoot, shoot you in text and whatnot, but we'll talk a little bit more about it.
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: Uh, next week in depth so we're entering, we're we're like 27 minutes into our actual recording.
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: By the time that you listen to this, friends, it'll be probably closer to like 24, 25 minutes, but we should probably get into our discussion of the first four episodes of season two of the Lord of the Rings, the Rings of Power, the biggest show on Amazon Prime Video.
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: We have a lot to talk about.
• 22:24
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: So much happens in each episode and I think maybe we should talk a little bit about our expectations going into this season, how they were met, how they weren't, what we were surprised by, before we get into any real big spoilers, because there will be big spoilers in this discussion.
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: Anthony, how about you start the discussion off?
• 22:44
  Speaker 2: What were you expecting going into this second season and how has the first four episodes?
• 22:51
  Speaker 2: How have you accepted the first four episodes?
• 22:54
  Speaker 1: Well, coming into this season, we got that reveal of Sauron at the end of season one and it ends with him arriving to Mordor.
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: So we're like, okay, you know his plans are starting to kind of like come together and so, like I knew that there was a lot, we were going to start seeing a lot more of him being the cunning individual that we started to see towards the end of season one.
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: And you know, obviously we also ended with the three elven rings being made at the end of season one, and so, like I was expecting to see more of the rings and you know kind of like a little bit of like what you talked about that you're like, okay, we got the elven rings and so we're gonna probably start seeing a little bit some of these other rings being made.
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: So, like, my expectations were kind of like that too, and you know it's kind of tracking in that kind of way, and so, yeah, so far, like last season was really good, but like this one has like really been blowing my mind, like it's just blowing a lot out of the water.
• 24:02
  Speaker 1: I feel like there there was a lot that they took from the first season and they learned and then they like, really like, applied to this season rich.
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: How do you feel?
• 24:14
  Speaker 2: I know you feel very vindicated in the fact that we're finally understanding the scope of what this series is capable of what do you feel as far as like getting to these episodes and finally getting to discuss them?
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: I'm just like super excited.
• 24:27
  Speaker 3: You know, the thing is, I think this demonstrates in some way the and I I don't know if there were pratfalls in the first season, right I'm trying to kind of look at this in a way that doesn't kind of punish them if what they are doing is taking creative license to say this is what we wanted to do in the first season and this is how we're going to reveal it in the second season, because there are many storylines that start to develop, that I think characters make more sense.
• 24:58
  Speaker 3: They're less like caricatures.
• 24:59
  Speaker 3: I feel like I'm with people now, right Not like just kind of weird one-note characters.
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: I'm way more invested, I care more, and everything that I learned in season two makes me care more about season one, which is frustrating.
• 25:16
  Speaker 3: You know, but is that just Amazon saying you know or the creators going we know, this is funded.
• 25:21
  Speaker 3: We don't have to worry about pacing the story to make sure that the network continues to fund this, like this is going to happen.
• 25:29
  Speaker 2: Well, that's an interesting thought and I'll stop you there really quickly and I'll just kind of address what my thoughts are on that.
• 25:36
  Speaker 2: As soon as you give characters something else to do and their new task or their new dilemma is kind of built on top of the struggles that they experienced previously and you can feel that tangibly, then they start feeling like real people instead of the caricatures that you have developed a one-note story for.
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: And I felt that with a seal door this season, I felt that with the Stranger this season, nori for sure, pretty much every returning character that has been given a new task this season, I felt stronger for because they have that history that is building up their story.
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: But yeah, no, I totally agree with that.
• 26:21
  Speaker 2: And as far as what you were saying, with season one not necessarily delivering on, you know all the expectations that you felt it should have or whatever you know, and you mentioned three seasons of avatar, but you need that season for the following two seasons to develop into something truly great.
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: It's so maybe, maybe that's the case for rings of power those developmental seasons are really just like tough man, you know.
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: Especially you have a show that's only eight episodes and like.
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: So you only have eight episodes to develop, to introduce characters, show them what they're about and develop at least them somewhat so that you can be invested into that character, to want to even go into a second season.
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: You know yeah.
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: So, and I think that that's kind of where I'm at with these first couple episodes is that I wanted to like the first season a lot more than I did and I finally did.
• 27:32
  Speaker 2: You know, I admitted last episode that I liked where this story was going.
• 27:37
  Speaker 2: By the last couple episodes I think it was by episode six or seven I was just like, finally, I get this.
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: It feels like a fantasy story that I want to be involved with.
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: And get this.
• 27:43
  Speaker 2: It feels like a fantasy story that I want to be involved with and I'm all in.
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: And I'm glad that I stuck with it because I'm all in.
• 27:50
  Speaker 2: The season is what I wanted.
• 27:53
  Speaker 2: You know, it's expanding Middle-earth and the wider realm of Middle-earth in a way that I did not expect.
• 28:02
  Speaker 2: I'm excited with what they're doing with Rune.
• 28:04
  Speaker 2: I'm excited with the.
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: Just, you know, they're giving us Barrow Whites, they're giving us Entwives, they're giving us a whole bunch of stuff that is like key to Tolkien.
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 28:18
  Speaker 2: And I'm super, super stoked, yeah.
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: So I for one, I'm super happy.
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: I like that you had, you know, Spoken about what they're doing with Rune, which I thought was like really cool, Because something that was like introduced or like a group of people that were introduced In the Lord of the Rings films.
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: I don't think that they were really Talked about in the books.
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: I mean I could be wrong, I don't remember.
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: But then, like, after you see them at the Black Gate, you don't see them ever again and so, like here we are in their land.
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: You know we're seeing like the precursor to those Easterlings that we see in the movies.
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: That's a really good point, and they're so cool.
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: I'm like dude, like I'm actually like glad that we're getting to see this land.
• 29:09
  Speaker 1: That is different, like all these different places Like Numenor.
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: You is different like all these different places like numenor.
• 29:18
  Speaker 1: You guys talked about the caricatures.
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: They're still a little they're they're.
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: They're not my favorite, you know they're not my favorite either, still yeah I you know they're still like, very like interested.
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: I'm interested in what's going on over there, but it's not it's not my tea they're kind of they're.
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: They're a bit pretentious, you know, yeah, and there's a lot that's going on.
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: But yeah, I totally agree with what you're saying.
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: I feel like Isildur is definitely.
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: You know, there's definitely growth.
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: I really do like the Stranger.
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: I did pick up the so far.
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: I did pick up that they're trying to figure out a name for him.
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: So I think you and I are right, dakota, I'm pretty sure that that is gonna be gandalf what's interesting?
• 29:59
  Speaker 2: interesting, my, my wife.
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: She noticed something in there, in like the way that they were talking.
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: Whenever they were talking about like the stranger needed a stick, they would call it a gand g-a-n-d, which is the first four letters oh, I, I, I did.
• 30:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, they did say that you're right I didn't.
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: I didn't pick it up the first time I watched it.
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: I re-watched the first two episodes with her the other day and, yeah, she picked it up immediately.
• 30:26
  Speaker 2: So, uh, it's looking more and more like our favorite.
• 30:31
  Speaker 2: You know, ishtar wizard is going to be showing up very soon, or he's already showing up.
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: Rich is in the background like itching, because he probably knows the answer.
• 30:43
  Speaker 3: Oh, he doesn't know anything.
• 30:44
  Speaker 3: Just keep it safe.
• 30:45
  Speaker 3: I mean, you know, it could be.
• 30:47
  Speaker 3: I still think Radagast is a good option.
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah, no, he gets some mushrooms, and maybe he just becomes a different person it's like I mean, yeah, it's possible.
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: I mean, you know, like, for me the biggest thing is just like the personality is like very much so, gandalf, and like now that, like poppy popped back into this season, she, you know, he's just like having so much of this.
• 31:14
  Speaker 1: He's spending so much time with halflings that, like you know, now it, you know, if this is gandalf, I'm gonna understand even more why he likes the halflings.
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: Because, like, because of all this time he's spending, like he start, he sees the courage in their hearts, like hey, look, they might be small, but you know they're, they've got a lot, and I mean honestly, by the end of the lord of the rings, like, let's be real, like a lot of people you know even, like you know, with the whole air going, like you know you bow to no one and they're halflings dude, like come on, man I.
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: I think that might be my favorite scene in any movie.
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: I'm just gonna put it out there you bow to no One, brings me to tears every single time I see it.
• 31:55
  Speaker 2: It's probably the most powerful scene in all of cinema.
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: Just because, you know, just watching this show you see these Harfoots who the rest of the world has no idea even exist.
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: The dwarves don't know, the elves don't know, the humans don't know, and that's basically what the hobbits are, and the hobbits, just kind of like, hold themselves up in a hill and that's their lives for a thousand plus years.
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: But the fact that they become such a huge and incremental or not incremental but instrumental part of the story of middle earth and the third age, it's glorious, it's beautiful.
• 32:30
  Speaker 3: I can't believe you do not consider Evangeline Lilly crying when Feely dies in the Hobbit movie the Desolation of Smaug.
• 32:41
  Speaker 3: I believe that's the one that makes me cry the most in the series.
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: I mean, obviously the Hobbits are very well-made movies.
• 32:49
  Speaker 3: You guys have to agree with that right.
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: I agree that they're well-made.
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: They're not my cup of tea.
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: I'm going to stick with that, right I?
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: I agree that they're well made.
• 32:57
  Speaker 1: They're not my cup of tea.
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: That's.
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: That's how I'm gonna stick to that story.
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you know.
• 32:59
  Speaker 1: You know, dakota, and I have like talked about that before you know.
• 33:02
  Speaker 1: You know, to each their own yeah, I, I don't want to.
• 33:05
  Speaker 2: I do want to give those movies a second chance.
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: We can't cover them too?
• 33:10
  Speaker 2: I mean I don't think that they're bad movies.
• 33:12
  Speaker 2: I I don't think I've ever considered them bad movies.
• 33:14
  Speaker 2: But next to it's like this massive religious text that has, like, withstood this the the test of time and then, uh, you know someone copying it like I.
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: It's, it's, it's a good movie, good series of movies even, but it's just not the original Lord of the Rings by any stretch of the imagination and I think it's for whatever reason.
• 33:40
  Speaker 2: I think the original Lord of the Rings movies were.
• 33:44
  Speaker 2: They captured lightning in a bottle.
• 33:46
  Speaker 2: I don't know how they did it three times in a row, but they did it.
• 33:49
  Speaker 2: And yeah, I can't really put a.
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: I don't know what it is about those movies that makes them for me that much more profound than the original.
• 33:59
  Speaker 2: I guess it's like original Star Wars trilogy fans watching the prequels, maybe.
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and honestly they probably weren't the most like perfect movies.
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: There's things that you could probably nitpick, but I agree.
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: But look, there's a reason why we got movies like the hobbit and then we got this tv show, the rings of power.
• 34:22
  Speaker 1: There's, there's a following there.
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: There's a lot of people that want to see this visual lord of the rings media, you know, like star wars yeah, no 100, and in a couple weeks time we're gonna have another lord of the rings film on our hands the war of the rohirrim which takes place yes like 183 years before the lord of the rings trilogy.
• 34:44
  Speaker 2: So I'm I'm hyped for that.
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: So yeah, I'm just angry that I have to go slight, like we have a a very small movie theater over here by the house and it just, you know, whatever movie we want to see, it plays it.
• 34:57
  Speaker 3: So this is the my first encounter that I'm gonna have to, and it's not a big trip.
• 35:02
  Speaker 3: I mean, I have to go a little bit further to new rochelle, to the, the theater there, but I'm a little upset that it's not in my secret little theater that like only people and basically oh, no, yeah, I think we're used to like maybe max 14 rows, you know, like most of the theaters when we go, yeah, if there are 10 people, like when we go, it's a shock, you know it's.
• 35:27
  Speaker 2: It's like what this is very limited release this one.
• 35:29
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm a little upset because I've been very hyped about it, so I I'm going to try to swing it, as my son's birthday is two days before.
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: So and he's reading the Hobbit, like at nighttime.
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: My wife has been.
• 35:41
  Speaker 3: They've been reading the Hobbit together before bed, so he's watched the entire trilogy.
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: He's reading the Hobbit.
• 35:48
  Speaker 3: I think I can swing being like.
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: You know we got to go see the movie for him.
• 35:52
  Speaker 3: You know it's his birthday.
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: The Hobbit is such a good like book for kids.
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: I I don't know I remember reading it when I was in elementary and then in middle school.
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: It's such a such a great read for that yeah, yeah, that that was my first read before like actually diving into the lord of the rings, because the lord of the rings is like very, very extensive.
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: It's not as heavy as something from brandon sanderson, but still what, what?
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: I would say you know I, we're going off on a crazy tangent yeah what I will say about brandon sanderson versus tolkien is that brandon sanderson is the easier read.
• 36:31
  Speaker 2: It's a larger book but it's the easier read by a long shot.
• 36:34
  Speaker 2: It's just way more consumable.
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: Tolkien is very heavy lore-wise, very heavy in description and making sure you understand minute details.
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: So yeah, there's a little bit of a difference, but let's you know.
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: Yes, yes.
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: Forget War of the Rohirrim, forget the Hobbit, forget Lord of the Rings.
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: Let's talk about Rings of Power.
• 36:56
  Speaker 2: Let's start with we were already talking about Rune.
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: We were already talking about the stranger quote unquote that we think is Gandalf maybe, or Radagast, according to Rich.
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: Let's talk a little bit about that storyline.
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: For the time being, you mentioned that Poppy comes back and she comes back and she basically says something along the lines of you know, you guys haven't really gotten very far.
• 37:22
  Speaker 2: And the stranger that might be Gandalf says well, we've been lost, or something like that.
• 37:28
  Speaker 2: Poppy basically says well, like you won't be for long because, look, if you just follow the lyrics to this song that we've been singing for thousands of years, you'll, you'll, you know, you'll find your way really quickly.
• 37:40
  Speaker 2: And I loved that moment so much because in the first season I think that might be my favorite scene in the entirety of it is the walking song, where Nori sings or I think it's poppy singing the, the walking song as the harfoots travel across the land.
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: It's just such a pleasant tune.
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: It's mixed in with some actual tolkien verses.
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: And now that this show has a second season and it's like incorporated into the plot, we have some like actual reason for it existing and I think that that's awesome yeah, yeah, like it's not random, it's not just some sort of you know nursery rhyme type thing that you know it's not as goofy as it might come off, you know, right off the rip, like there's a reasoning behind it.
• 38:34
  Speaker 3: I agree yeah, and the only thing that for me was a little weird and if you watch it you know if you're like so I re-watched the first season before I started season two again, right, so you have this very emotional right nori, goodbye to, oh, she's leaving everything she knows behind, right.
• 38:51
  Speaker 3: And then it's like okay, so we've got.
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: Oh, okay, so we're back to nori the stranger.
• 38:56
  Speaker 3: Oh, wait a minute, but poppy's back.
• 38:58
  Speaker 3: And I'm like what?
• 38:59
  Speaker 3: And I, I get it and I'm happy, I love that she's there.
• 39:03
  Speaker 3: Right, it's like frodo without his sam, you know, like he needs his sam and nori needs her poppy.
• 39:09
  Speaker 3: But I don't know it.
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: Just it took away from it.
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: There's a couple moments in this second season where I can tell they're rewriting the first season a little bit, or like overriding the ending of the first season to get the characters where they want them.
• 39:25
  Speaker 2: The biggest for me, outside of Poppy, you know, showing up with Nori, is Sauron.
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: At the end of season one we see him go like stroll on into Mordor newly christened Mordor and he's got this smile on his face.
• 39:40
  Speaker 2: At the start of the second season he gets kidnapped and he's just like, actually where I need to be is right where I left at the end of season one.
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: So I got to go right back over there.
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: Guys, I'll be right back.
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: I'm going to tell you all about this guy, sauron, that's come back.
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: So that's obviously like a plot contrivance, in the sense that they probably had to figure out a reason for him to show up to Mordor and then go right back to Celebrimbor.
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: It's a little bit awkward, but it's obviously not something that would naturally happen to a character.
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: You personally wouldn't.
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: I'm going to make a trip to California to start a new life.
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: Actually, now that I'm in California, I forgot I really got to do this one thing that I should have done back home in New York, so I don't look the Harfoots See, here's what I don't get, all right.
• 40:41
  Speaker 3: So, yeah, right before she leaves, they're basically like OK, we don't really do adventures and going outside in the world, but it's clear that somehow you're different, nori, you're meant for this right and it's dangerous.
• 40:57
  Speaker 3: But the Harfoot saying, since he's with her, the stranger Radagast we'll call him Since Radagast is with her, they know that she's going to be okay, right, and that's why they're okay with her leaving with him.
• 41:12
  Speaker 3: What was the conversation?
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: I just need to know.
• 41:15
  Speaker 3: Like back at the Harfoot camp, poppy's like so I'm going to go too.
• 41:18
  Speaker 3: And they're like wait, you're going to leave alone.
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, are you sure about this?
• 41:23
  Speaker 3: Like you're going to travel alone and nobody's going to escort you.
• 41:27
  Speaker 3: We're just going to trust that you'll find them.
• 41:29
  Speaker 3: Like is she a tracker?
• 41:30
  Speaker 3: I'm sorry.
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like, is she a tracker?
• 41:33
  Speaker 2: I'm sorry, yeah, I mean no, no, she hasn't shown any of those skills.
• 41:35
  Speaker 2: I think in the first season, if anything, all the tracking skills were.
• 41:39
  Speaker 2: Nori's and Poppy just kind of bumbled about a little bit during the first season.
• 41:44
  Speaker 2: So it is interesting this new development on her end.
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: But yeah, it's one of those things.
• 41:50
  Speaker 1: Poppy was the one that had that tracking skills all along.
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: She just, you know, we just thought it was Nori, so something that I wanted to talk a little bit about.
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know if you were ready to pivot, but we did get a.
• 42:07
  Speaker 1: We got a recasting At our like one of the big yeah like one of the big bads of this show got recasted?
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: Do we?
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: Do we have a reason why I didn't actually look up?
• 42:22
  Speaker 3: so I did look it up um I don't know you, you can say rich.
• 42:24
  Speaker 3: Oh wait, I think you might.
• 42:25
  Speaker 3: You might be a little fresher.
• 42:26
  Speaker 3: I know that that that was played by the same actor who was benjen stark, and I think he was doing another project, like he got wrapped up in another project, but I might be wrong on that.
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: I just know that I don't think it was anything like somebody did something wrong, but he just, yeah, wasn't available so.
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: So I did look a little bit into it and, yeah, pretty much the gist of it is that he was looking to like kind of expand his horizon and move into other projects.
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: I guess he didn't want to get like lumped up into this long term and, I don't know, get typecasted or whatnot.
• 43:03
  Speaker 1: But I don't know.
• 43:05
  Speaker 1: Like to me, I'd be like okay, I'm doing something that's Lord of the Rings, so unless I die in this first season, I'm gonna be expected to like you.
• 43:15
  Speaker 1: Like to me.
• 43:16
  Speaker 1: Like, if you make that commitment, unless you can't, for whatever reason, you know, I don't know pay discrepancy, life stuff, health family, yeah, health Like actual, like big stuff.
• 43:27
  Speaker 1: Or if you genuinely had a project that, like you're like I'm sorry, but I'm going to be moving on to this.
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: You know, but for me that's like quitting a really good job for like no reason, you know this guy played for whatever it is, you know, I wish, I wish him good fortune, you know.
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: I hope he finds the success that he's looking for, you know, and whatever other projects he wants.
• 43:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't, I don't wish him anything yeah, I don't, oh no, I don't want to be a part of another multi-million dollar franchise that everybody is watching, please.
• 43:59
  Speaker 3: I was already in Game of Thrones.
• 44:00
  Speaker 3: What a terrible experience.
• 44:02
  Speaker 3: But we did get a replacement.
• 44:04
  Speaker 3: I don't even just mean in terms of the actor for Adar, but we got another character, another actor from Game of Thrones, because the Dark wizard is played by none other than mance ray.
• 44:17
  Speaker 3: Mance, what raider?
• 44:18
  Speaker 3: Mance warner?
• 44:20
  Speaker 3: No, mance raider from the king beyond the wall in game of thrones.
• 44:24
  Speaker 3: So we lost one, but we got another one back.
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: Wait a minute and and then like I mean, yeah, I guess, and then in a way there is also You're right.
• 44:46
  Speaker 2: You're right about the whole recasting thing too, because Sauron, he transitions into somebody else too.
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, we're talking about so many different things right now.
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: We got to lock in.
• 44:51
  Speaker 1: Well, I mean no, but we're, in the light of recasting, so we're not talking about anything deep, but yeah, so adar.
• 44:59
  Speaker 2: Adar was definitely a recast.
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: I like this new actor.
• 45:02
  Speaker 2: I do think it is, you know, coming directly off of season one.
• 45:05
  Speaker 2: It is a little bit strange for me, um right.
• 45:09
  Speaker 1: Right, it was a little bit odd, like I was like I don't think that's the same person I'm not sure.
• 45:16
  Speaker 2: At first I thought it was.
• 45:17
  Speaker 2: You know, like this is at our when he's younger, because the scene takes place, like you know, thousands of years, or like a thousand years prior oh yeah that's what happened to me too.
• 45:28
  Speaker 3: I was like why?
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: would they do that?
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: he looks so different, just to stay younger.
• 45:32
  Speaker 3: And then it flashed back and I'm like wait a minute.
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: He looks the flashed back and I'm like wait a minute, he looks the same what's happening?
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: And I'm watching it in a vacuum, like I.
• 45:40
  Speaker 3: I feel like you know, like you just said at one point, because of house of the dragon, people weren't.
• 45:46
  Speaker 3: There was like not a lot of chatter about this show other than negativity.
• 45:49
  Speaker 3: And then season two started and there wasn't a lot of great fanfare.
• 45:56
  Speaker 1: So I'm just sitting there like I don't know what's happening.
• 45:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, like we thought that maybe it was like a cgi de-aging type thing.
• 46:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think I was thinking the same thing.
• 46:05
  Speaker 1: I was like, okay, like I was like why does he look weird?
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: I was like, oh, okay, this is in the past, okay, so maybe he's younger.
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: And then, yeah, like when you flash forward to the future, it's the same person, and you're like, okay, so maybe he's younger.
• 46:14
  Speaker 1: And then, yeah, like when you flash forward to the future, it's the same person, and you're like okay so rich.
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: You mentioned that the actor that played man's raider in game of thrones his name is kieran hines is also the the, the actor that plays the dark wizard in in rune, the new land that we enter in.
• 46:32
  Speaker 2: For me, I recognize this actor first and foremost as playing Julius Caesar in the two season Rome show from HBO.
• 46:40
  Speaker 2: But yeah, no, I'm looking it up.
• 46:42
  Speaker 2: He's definitely a Mance Rayder, that's definitely him.
• 46:43
  Speaker 2: I liked what I saw of the Dark Wizard.
• 46:46
  Speaker 2: We know that he's in search of this Ishtar that's come to earth.
• 46:51
  Speaker 2: He's also in search of Sauron.
• 46:53
  Speaker 2: So he's he's trying to.
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: You know, I don't know what he's trying to do.
• 46:56
  Speaker 2: He's trying to get as much power as possible.
• 46:58
  Speaker 2: We don't know enough about him yet.
• 47:00
  Speaker 2: But what do you, what do you guys think about that character?
• 47:03
  Speaker 3: I think he's really all right.
• 47:05
  Speaker 3: So how do I do this?
• 47:06
  Speaker 3: My initial thought is the the possibility of the blue wizards that we never hear about.
• 47:14
  Speaker 3: Right, those are the wizards that go to the east, is it the?
• 47:20
  Speaker 3: They go to the east and they're not seen from or not heard from again.
• 47:23
  Speaker 2: Correct.
• 47:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I believe it's the east.
• 47:25
  Speaker 2: There's two wizards that are never named in Tolkien lore.
• 47:28
  Speaker 2: That are the blue wizards.
• 47:30
  Speaker 2: We don't know anything about them yet.
• 47:32
  Speaker 2: Lore-wise.
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: I don't know if the show is going to bring that up, or what?
• 47:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, we have no idea, Dude.
• 47:37
  Speaker 1: They just didn't want anything to do with all the malarkey that was happening in Middle-earth.
• 47:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: I'm right with them.
• 47:44
  Speaker 1: They're like man I came down here for this man, I'm out of here.
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: So one of the acolytes that he, the dark wizard, had sent forth to collect the stranger, as we'll call him here, is brought back to life through the power of moths and blood magic.
• 48:06
  Speaker 2: But it's kind of cool seeing a familiar face.
• 48:08
  Speaker 2: I think they made the character less androgynous in the first season it wasn't really clear if it was a male or female character.
• 48:17
  Speaker 2: I think they added a little bit more makeup to make it a more feminine character in this instance, but it's, it's an interesting look for the.
• 48:24
  Speaker 1: I don't know, it's an interesting look, but it's cool seeing that that character who's very creepy back speaking of the stranger, it seems like he's starting to kind of, he's starting to like use his powers a bit more, like he's starting to understand a little bit more.
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: But yeah, he definitely needs his Gens, I guess, to help channel that ability.
• 48:45
  Speaker 2: In his dream.
• 48:46
  Speaker 2: I don't know if you noticed in his dream that he had when he like looking underneath the stars.
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: In Rune he sees a staff that's kind of like just out of reach in terms of like this realm of reality or whatever he's in, but it keeps shifting from one staff to another and it's the curved staff that he picks up by the well that he tries to channel that sandstorm with and it goes totally awry and the staff that he picks up, you know, disintegrates so clearly that isn't the staff that he's meant to have yeah, I like it.
• 49:19
  Speaker 3: It reminds me of a different franchise but just the idea of, like jedi having to make their own lightsabers and get their own kyber crystals, you know, just like the hero having to make to kind of get the right weapon, like legend of zelda and link needing to get the master sword type, even obviously, I guess now king arthur back getting.
• 49:37
  Speaker 3: It's probably the original kind of inspiration, but I love it the stranger meets an interesting character and tom bombadil probably the most interesting character in tolkien lore, tom bombadil.
• 49:52
  Speaker 2: Don't know.
• 49:53
  Speaker 2: I've gone down this rabbit hole trying to figure out who the heck Tom Bombadil is, but he's a literal character who is older than the world itself, basically Like he's existed since the beginning.
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: He's kind of like the firstborn of existence within this physical realm.
• 50:11
  Speaker 2: He has powers of creation and powers over creation that we cannot fathom as viewers and readers.
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: But he's this bumbling guy who just exists and you know he has no real care for the world at large.
• 50:27
  Speaker 2: He doesn't have any stake in the War of the Rings and all that.
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: But, dude, I'm happy that they brought Tom Bombadil in because that's probably the biggest mistake of the Rings and all that.
• 50:35
  Speaker 2: But, dude, I'm happy that they brought Tom Bombadil in Because that's probably the biggest mistake of the Lord of the Rings films Is not trying to tackle that character.
• 50:42
  Speaker 1: There was something interesting that he had said.
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: So the stranger, he's trying to grab this branch and it happens to be a limb to an ant, and so he gets pulled into this tree and then Tom saves him.
• 50:59
  Speaker 1: And something that he says that is very interesting is like you know, you shouldn't be awake.
• 51:04
  Speaker 1: And then he said this line like eat dirt, drink water, something.
• 51:09
  Speaker 1: And I'm like dude Treebeard said that same exact thing.
• 51:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it's cool, it's cool.
• 51:13
  Speaker 2: I was like what I was like dude Treebeard said that same exact thing.
• 51:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it's cool, it's cool.
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: I was like what I was like?
• 51:18
  Speaker 1: Is that just like a saying that Ents say?
• 51:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no, good call.
• 51:22
  Speaker 2: I was thinking that that was very familiar.
• 51:24
  Speaker 2: But yeah, you're totally right.
• 51:25
  Speaker 2: In the extended editions, if you watch the films in the extended editions when Mary is, I think Mary and Pippin are like kind of sucked into those.
• 51:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, trees, tree beard is the one who's like he lets them out and he says that very same line.
• 51:42
  Speaker 2: So very cool.
• 51:43
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a.
• 51:44
  Speaker 1: That's a really good callback yeah, that was a really cool line.
• 51:47
  Speaker 2: I was like man one thing that's worth talking about with tom bombadil is, you know, know, in the book in the Lord of the Rings anyway, he's married to or I don't know if he's married but his significant other is a person called Goldberry.
• 52:01
  Speaker 2: She's supposedly like a serious babe with a golden voice, but in this show, it's interesting they don't really show her, but we hear her voice, you know, we hear her voice in the other room, and when the stranger asks if there's anyone else in the house, tom amado is just like well, you're here, yeah that was funny, so I'm curious about that.
• 52:25
  Speaker 2: And I'm very, very curious about that.
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: Yeah, rich.
• 52:28
  Speaker 3: What are your thoughts on?
• 52:29
  Speaker 3: I mean, I think it was great.
• 52:30
  Speaker 3: You know they had to like, move some things around.
• 52:33
  Speaker 3: I'm kind of going to skip slightly here, but you don't know, you have the later on.
• 52:38
  Speaker 3: You have the barrow whites and tom's actually in the book if I.
• 52:43
  Speaker 3: If I remember correctly, bombadil saves frodo and them from the barrow whites.
• 52:49
  Speaker 2: So they kind of had to piecemeal a little bit some of the stuff he does or but yeah, they introduced stuff from the books that weren't included in the movies in interesting and unique ways for the current plot and I I totally appreciate that.
• 53:03
  Speaker 2: I think that that's a really good way to, you know, tell these new stories that you're trying to tell, while also incorporating tolkien lore that you know you didn't really get with the films.
• 53:13
  Speaker 3: I think what they did really well was it could be really tough to introduce a character and have to kind of like fast exposition them, right.
• 53:22
  Speaker 3: So you know you're talking about how he's like immortal and he doesn't really care.
• 53:28
  Speaker 3: You know, it's just that it's not he doesn't care.
• 53:31
  Speaker 3: It's like us being upset If, like, like an ant, a mole on ant hill gets knocked over.
• 53:36
  Speaker 3: You know, like we just carry on with our day.
• 53:38
  Speaker 3: So I think they managed to really in these four episodes right, really show us like he's just kind of absent-minded.
• 53:47
  Speaker 3: He's like oh yeah, I was here before stars, you know, I was here before the first rate.
• 53:51
  Speaker 3: You like he's.
• 53:52
  Speaker 3: I really love that kind of the way they pulled that off.
• 53:56
  Speaker 3: And I think my favorite thing that they did with him was when he breathed in deeply by the fire and the fire Like it's like he's a bellows-o-moch, he like stoked the fire, like oh, yeah, it was just a little tiny thing, but I think that it went such a long way in demonstrating how powerful he is, because, if not, the other stuff is just words and, to be fair, we heard Halbron say words and he ended up being very tricksy and very false.
• 54:28
  Speaker 3: So they had to kind of do something, and it's nice to actually have them demonstrate that.
• 54:34
  Speaker 3: I thought that was really effective.
• 54:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so let's pivot a little bit.
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: We were talking about recasts.
• 54:40
  Speaker 2: One character that did not get a recast was Bronwyn.
• 54:44
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that was a surprise for me.
• 54:49
  Speaker 2: I did not see that coming, Because at the end of season one and you know even why can't I remember this elf's name every single episode a rondeer uh, yeah, he yeah, a rondeer even says exactly what I was thinking.
• 55:05
  Speaker 2: Bronwyn seemed like she was getting better at the end of season one, and then there's there's a certain foulness to orc arrows that the human flesh doesn't quickly forget.
• 55:18
  Speaker 3: Yes, no, that is the actual line.
• 55:20
  Speaker 3: That's word for word.
• 55:21
  Speaker 3: I was waiting to talk about it because it made me so angry that they just explained it away by like yeah, you know infections, you know how they can be right.
• 55:33
  Speaker 3: Sometimes they get you later on yeah so so she so.
• 55:37
  Speaker 1: So it's kind of like a off-screen death between seasons one and two and like we we come to that with her like already like passed away, and then theo and arandir have, like you know, theo has like he wants nothing to do with arandondeer, like I you know guessing he blames he part, he partially blames a rondeer for his mother's death and I think he blames himself too yeah, I think he blames himself.
• 56:05
  Speaker 3: I mean, there's that part where isildur is revealing his own issues with his mom and theo is like sobbing hysterically, yeah, and you can kind of tell that it's a therapeutic moment for him as well, you know.
• 56:20
  Speaker 3: But again, like him blaming a rondeer to me was a little.
• 56:24
  Speaker 3: I mean, it was just kind of like typical, like the.
• 56:26
  Speaker 3: There's that scene where they're like emptying the pails and a rondeer tries to give him some good advice about kind of the process of grief and he's like you know, the only only person or the only thing that was keeping us together is now ashes, which on the second rewatch I thought he just meant like just generally, like you know the way the mountain went up and everything's gone, but then I was like, oh snap, he's talking about his mom, what?
• 56:52
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 56:52
  Speaker 3: And then he's like he's not, not you know and you're not my father, and I really want to find out.
• 56:58
  Speaker 3: I so badly want him to actually be theo's father, like it would just burn him.
• 57:06
  Speaker 3: I just I don't know, I think I'm wrong, but there's a part of me that just wants to be right yeah, no, you're definitely wrong, but you know, like come on, like why are you so hanging dakota like wow, I mean just like striking this man down like that I, I'm not trying to strike down, but it's just like we.
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: We know what half elves look like we have.
• 57:27
  Speaker 2: We have one in the show with elrond, yeah, but we never say hey, when have you seen theo's ears?
• 57:34
  Speaker 3: show me you know, you got a really good point until that boy's hair is moved just once, I'm gonna stick by this theory all right, all right we'll put a stopper on this theory for now he said in in let's.
• 57:50
  Speaker 2: I want to just I'm still not over the fact that you you know the actress left the show, because I was very confused by it.
• 57:57
  Speaker 2: So I looked it up, the actress her name is Nazanin Bonyadi.
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: I guess she literally just quit acting.
• 58:04
  Speaker 2: It wasn't even just like a, you know, conflict of interest.
• 58:08
  Speaker 2: I guess it was because she wanted to focus more on her activism.
• 58:11
  Speaker 2: I guess.
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I had looked a little bit into that and I think it was something about fighting for rights in Iran or something like that.
• 58:19
  Speaker 1: Right, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 58:21
  Speaker 2: So more power to her.
• 58:23
  Speaker 2: But yeah, I just thought it was a really strange thing and also it's kind of weird that they cast.
• 58:29
  Speaker 2: I guess they can't really.
• 58:31
  Speaker 2: They need Adar, they don't need Bronwyn for the story to keep going.
• 58:37
  Speaker 3: I think it makes.
• 58:38
  Speaker 3: I actually obviously I'm not privy to anything, I don't know if at some point she was going to die later, but I think that especially that scene with Isildur, where he's sitting there sobbing, it doesn't work out the same way.
• 58:54
  Speaker 3: Where he's sitting there sobbing, it doesn't work out the same way, you know.
• 58:57
  Speaker 3: I actually think that it worked really well to their benefit, so that you kind of have now these two motherless, you know oh you're.
• 59:04
  Speaker 2: You're suggesting that because the actress left the show, it made this particular season stronger because of the theme of loss.
• 59:13
  Speaker 2: That's an interesting thought.
• 59:14
  Speaker 2: So you mentioned to seal door.
• 59:15
  Speaker 2: He introduces this concept that we didn't know previously.
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: That and this is this is knowledge that he alone fully comprehends is that he went out to swim.
• 59:27
  Speaker 2: He was caught in a riptide.
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: His mother went out to save him and ended up drowning trying to save him.
• 59:33
  Speaker 2: Nobody knows.
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: Obviously.
• 59:36
  Speaker 2: They know that the mother drowned, but they didn't know that it was his fault that the mother drowned and I thought that was a really interesting little concept there.
• 59:44
  Speaker 2: I I.
• 59:44
  Speaker 3: That was a nice scene from a silver, pretty sure that the reason she drowned was the water in her lungs and not sildor.
• 59:51
  Speaker 3: But that's just.
• 59:53
  Speaker 3: That's just me, you know.
• 59:54
  Speaker 3: I think he's really giving himself a lot of power when he's like you know, it was my fault.
• 59:59
  Speaker 3: No, it's the riptide, it's the water.
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 3: Also, you guys are from numenor, so it's a little sad that your mom wasn't a better swimmer like I.
• 1:00:06
  Speaker 3: They're just you know rich.
• 1:00:09
  Speaker 2: You're totally right.
• 1:00:10
  Speaker 2: I I my mistake.
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you're right.
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 1: Usually water is what drowns people so preaching, preaching to the choir man it's just like if namor the submariner drowned, right you'd be like what?
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 3: but you know you're namor?
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 2: should we touch on numenor or should we finish with that subplot with theo?
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 1: and yeah, let's, let's continue with theo and all that yeah, well, well, there, there's a lot that happens in that, because you know we've got now like the wild people and there is the introduction of what's her name Ingrid.
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 3: No, istredd, ingrid, Istredd, istredd, yeah, right, right, you're literally thinking about Ingrid from Beyond the Wall in Game of Thrones.
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 1: I am.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 2: It's kind of the same character, to be honest.
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 3: I mean mean, excuse me, egret has red hair okay and estrin has black hair okay definitely very different.
• 1:01:02
  Speaker 1: No, yeah, you're right, you're right, you're right, yeah, no, my again, my mistake, it's ridiculously.
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 2: I'm all over the place today.
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry I think that she's supposed to be like the, like the, the strong female character, like for that group of people, in a way, like not really to replace bronwyn, but like to kind of like bring back, I guess, like the female energy to that group.
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 1: But yeah, now, well, she's, but she's like a wild person, though you know, she's part of that group that serves at our and I guess I don't know Like.
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 1: So I mean, from what I'm gathering is that she has, she started to have like a change of heart.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 1: But she said that like a lot of people, uh, or they said that a lot of them like when they get caught, they burn like whatever the mark of Adar so that they, you know they wouldn't be caught, but like now people are kind of like caught up, like oh, this is what they're doing.
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 1: So like, did she do it to hide or did she do it because she has a change of heart?
• 1:02:06
  Speaker 2: That's a really good question and I think, to be honest, I think that her total connection to Adar was survivalist.
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 2: You know, I think maybe she and her fiance, her betrothed, saw that you know to exist in the South as they were.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: They needed to show fealty to the guy in charge and they saw that as Adar and they got the brand, whether or not she is a good or bad person.
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 2: I think, you know, there's always room to debate with that.
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 2: There's always room to repent and change with that.
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: And.
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 2: I think that she makes the right moves in trying to save Isildur and Arandir when they get sucked into that sandpit slash worm monster thing.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, no, yeah, no, no.
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 1: I agree so that they do that while trying they're tracking down theo, because theo gets like kidnapped by ants and you know that that like little prison that they put the, that theo was put in with the other people, that kind of reminded me of like that like trap slash basket that the aliens had in War of the Worlds?
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no way, I was thinking the same thing dude, it was like high up dude, like I, really I cannot believe that we were thinking about literally the exact same thing.
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: That's hilarious.
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: I love the the shot.
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 3: I thought like so, even before we get to see the cage right, the way the episode ends.
• 1:03:38
  Speaker 3: When the end grabs theo, I mean it's so nerd fulfilling right because he doesn't show you the end right, but all you get is a kind of a change in camera angle.
• 1:03:48
  Speaker 3: You get theo's reaction.
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 3: Yes, and then you hear the creaking right like the tree beard walking and you know it's so satisfying, like that's a way to end the show on a cliffhanger.
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 3: That's not a cliffhanger if you're nerdy enough to know the sound and yeah, it's just um, I remember, like I recognize, like I like I recognize sounds of the animals and red dead.
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 3: Now I'm like oh, there's a raccoon and I jump off the horse to go get it and like you know my wife's like how did you learn that?
• 1:04:18
  Speaker 3: And I was like it's a level of nerd dumb that you just when you reach you know it's so fulfilling.
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 1: Well, what would you have done if it cut to the next episode and it was that, like that hill troll?
• 1:04:30
  Speaker 1: Honestly, I would have been so furious because it would have been like wait, say what that sounded like a tree.
• 1:04:38
  Speaker 2: So I think the best word for how Theo is picked up off the ground is not kidnapped, not stolen.
• 1:04:46
  Speaker 2: He was literally absconded.
• 1:04:48
  Speaker 2: He was just like scoop.
• 1:04:52
  Speaker 1: Literally picked up with the rest of like, with those like wild people, because Isildur was trying to save his horse.
• 1:04:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah so yeah and it was interesting like they did that because, like I think, because they saw the weapons and they thought that there were axes yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 1:05:11
  Speaker 2: so even like the swords they assumed were axes Were axes, which I mean honestly like your tree.
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's a sharp looking edge.
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 2: Very cool.
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 2: Speaking of the Ents, we have our first look ever at a live action slash CGI project of an Ent wife.
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:05:30
  Speaker 2: Not just an Ent, but an Ent wife, an ent wife which you know by the time of lord of the rings, several thousand years in the future, they don't.
• 1:05:37
  Speaker 2: Not that they don't exist, but the ants have lost them dude just lost that.
• 1:05:43
  Speaker 1: That one always made me laugh.
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 1: Oh I'm sorry.
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: How did they die?
• 1:05:48
  Speaker 1: We just lost them it's like.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 3: It's like they went to the mall together, right can't find them and they said like oh hey, we're just gonna go to this store for a second, we'll meet you at the other store.
• 1:05:58
  Speaker 2: And you know, they got lost they all went to the bathroom together and you know, by the time we picked up the check they were gone it just also yeah it gives me it.
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 3: It does gives me, like, some questions.
• 1:06:11
  Speaker 3: So do the entss?
• 1:06:13
  Speaker 3: It seems like now they're not together either, right?
• 1:06:16
  Speaker 3: So do the Ent wives and Ents have to travel in separate packs?
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 3: Can they never be together?
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 3: That's a really tough.
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 3: Long-distance relationships I don't know if you guys know are very difficult Extremely, and they can't even talk to each other.
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 2: All right.
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 2: So we've talked about the rune side of things, we've talked about the Southlands slash Mordor.
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 2: So what I thought was really funny was there was a character you know in the humans' camp, you know, like in the camp with Theo and Erandir when they were burning the pyre of bronwyn.
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 2: Shortly thereafter someone says, you know, like someone mentions mordor and I'm thinking I forget if it was estrid or not, but someone mentions mordor and I'm I'm thinking how the heck would anyone in this group know what mordor is?
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 2: Because no one has ever mentioned this out loud before in this show.
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 2: It was previously the southlands until, like, a subtitle on the screen changed from southlands to mordor.
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 2: So, like, how would anyone know that this place is called mordor now?
• 1:07:26
  Speaker 1: I mean, unless they they had a running in with uh orcs that were they probably have.
• 1:07:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah I mean something off screen whoa, listen.
• 1:07:35
  Speaker 3: All right, anthony, I gotta confront you about something.
• 1:07:38
  Speaker 3: Okay, the reason that dar says that he wants to be referred to as eric is because that's the way it's pronounced in the black speech.
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 3: Black speech, all right.
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 3: So it's like you going to mexico city and being like I want, quiero avocado.
• 1:07:54
  Speaker 3: Nope, it's aguacate man, all right.
• 1:07:57
  Speaker 3: So basically, the orcs just don't they, they like, call us by the way.
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 3: We say it all right, we're not chinese type a, we're my mr.
• 1:08:06
  Speaker 1: You know like they want to own their name they like literally refer to themselves as orcs, though yeah, that the the actual.
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah you know, I was at the the the thing.
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 1: It would be valid if, if you know, yeah, if you had like a mexican, I was like avocado instead of avocado.
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 1: But yeah, no it's.
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 1: We didn't.
• 1:08:32
  Speaker 1: Oh, I mean, we kind of glossed over it.
• 1:08:35
  Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know if you're like ready, but like there's the whole sauron and calabrimbor oh yeah, we should definitely talk about that.
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 2: Well, really quickly, I want to talk a little bit about.
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 2: I feel like this is going to be a two-hour episode.
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 1: I'm already looking at it now um, I mean it'll be less, but I mean, like, this is jam-packed so yeah, there's.
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 2: There's a great scene in the beginning where they show, like the, the dawn of the second age, where sauron like first tries to take over the furrow draith, which is like the, the land up north, where the, the orcs like lost their last battle and like they kind of eventually kill him and he turns into like a goop monster oh yeah that's a fascinating scene and I was very confused the first time I watched it.
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 2: I had to watch the second time to understand, like, the time passage between when he was killed and when he came back as Halbrand, because there is a time period of almost a thousand years that passes.
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 2: So one thing that's really clever and you have to really be paying attention is when they show the goop going down into the cave and into that little puddle and then it zooms out and then it shows you what the cave looks like and then it like zooms out and then it's like you know.
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 2: It shows you what the cave looks like and then it fades to black and then it fades, you know, back into the cave and then it zooms back into the goop.
• 1:10:00
  Speaker 2: But if you look at what the cave looks like, zoomed out both times, in the first scene the stalagmites and the stalactites are a lot smaller, and then the second scene, like literally seconds apart, the stalagmites have grown like several feet.
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 2: So it's clear that like many hundreds of years have passed in this cave system that he's just been sitting in this pool of goop.
• 1:10:24
  Speaker 1: I thought that was a really cool feature.
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he was just muck, he was noodles in a pond.
• 1:10:29
  Speaker 2: I thought that was cool, but all right, we should really like move on, let's.
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 2: So he makes his way over to kela brimbor.
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 2: Kela brimbor has been told by galadriel do not treat with this dude, do not let him in, do not have any more dealings with him, especially do not make more rings with this guy.
• 1:10:47
  Speaker 2: And you know he just kind of stands outside for a couple days waiting for Celebrimbor to like show pity on him, blah, blah, blah.
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 2: What I love about Sauron this season is that we find Rich mentioned it last couple episodes his story makes so much more sense going forward because he plays off of everyone that he's with.
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 2: Because he plays off of everyone that he's with, he wants everyone that he's with to feel like they're doing everything that they can for him, and that's such an interesting concept to me.
• 1:11:21
  Speaker 2: When he was with Galadriel he played on the fact that Galadriel needed a savior figure to show up to help take her perceived notion of what Sauron was down in the Southlands.
• 1:11:35
  Speaker 2: He played that character to a T With Celebrimbor.
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 2: I'm fascinated by what he's doing with Celebrimbor Because it's very biblical in the sense that the biblical account refers to the devil figure Satan.
• 1:11:50
  Speaker 2: The biblical account refers to the devil figure, satan as someone who will make themselves into an angel of light to deceive you into believing something or to doing something.
• 1:12:00
  Speaker 2: That's something that the Bible talks about.
• 1:12:03
  Speaker 2: So with Tolkien, who was very biblically minded he was a Catholic, he was very biblically minded he's always thinking about these things.
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 2: No-transcript makes himself out to be this angel of light.
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 2: Basically, he's the Lord of Gifts.
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm helping everyone in Middle Earth, and it's the most amazing twist and it's it's something that I I have been thinking about since I was a kid.
• 1:12:47
  Speaker 2: How did Sauron, who has been bad for well past the creation of the rings, how did he convince the elves, the dwarves, the men, everyone to put rings on his fingers if he was giving them?
• 1:13:00
  Speaker 2: How did the evil guy convince everyone that this is a good thing to put on your finger to fix your people?
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 2: And this totally makes sense.
• 1:13:09
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 1: He plays that angle so well and this totally makes sense, right, he he plays that angle so well and like pretty much the way that, like he's gonna be like kind of playing adar against, like you know, the elves and you know, like he's like really just like playing everybody like a fiddle and you see him like masterminding this stuff over time and it yeah, you're right, it makes so much sense because we're so used to seeing sauron as this, like big kind of hulking in the black armor and the black helmet, like you know, just imposing individual, so to see him as this deceiver, somebody that can actually get along with anybody and deceive them and, yeah, like you said, play to whatever it is that they need.
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 1: Yes, that it makes so much more sense.
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like that he was able to deceive all of these people yeah, I, I'm, I'm really you see, like what he's doing with the dwarves I was blown away.
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 2: I was blown away.
• 1:14:07
  Speaker 2: Oh, let's talk a little bit about the doors, uh, or unless, rich, you had something to say about anatar, and I mean you guys touched most of it.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, I mean it was great to see the way it actually he's, actually his machinations are working out.
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 3: You know, previously I just had to imagine in my head that he went up to them and just played single ladies over and over again until they were like, oh we gotta put.
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 3: You know, I'm gonna put a ring on it.
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 3: So they finally did.
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 3: But now this, and I loved the passage of time, I loved how the ooze took over a rat and came out and then took over a woman in a car, like I just loved the evolution of the entire thing.
• 1:14:44
  Speaker 3: I think the only thing I would say is like, unlike you guys like my confusion, so, but just like at our the recasting, I didn't look it up, so I'm just watching it.
• 1:14:53
  Speaker 3: I'm not, I'm not looking on social media, so I don't know what.
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 3: I'm like what.
• 1:14:57
  Speaker 3: And then bronwyn just being gone, I'm like what.
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 3: So I was a little, I think, when we got to that sauron part, it made me, it kind of stabilized me a little bit because I I was like, okay, I'm getting more backstory on this guy, this is working, and I really I said before, it's kind of just the realization of full people, right, or characters, because of this extra stuff that we're getting.
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 3: So it just makes it so much juicier, totally yeah, yeah, yep, no, I totally agree.
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 2: We have to jump over to the dwarves and their current plight, because something interesting is happening.
• 1:15:35
  Speaker 2: One thing that happened to the elves in the first season was that the light of their trees was fading.
• 1:15:40
  Speaker 2: The leaves were falling from their, their trees that were saplings of the great trees from valinor, and basically the light of the eldar was fading.
• 1:15:49
  Speaker 2: The the eldar being like their literal life force, they needed to go back to Valinor to live out the rest of their days there instead of Middle-earth, because they were losing their ability to do so in Middle-earth with the tree fading.
• 1:16:03
  Speaker 2: I always liked the tree as their almost symbolic representation of their own life.
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 2: But, yeah, so with the rings, their problem was fixed with the, the mithril that was created with one of the powers of the silmarils from like the first age.
• 1:16:23
  Speaker 2: The mithril that was embedded in that mountain was able to, with, in conjunction with the ring and, somehow, saran's power, they were able to fix whatever was going on that was poisoning their trees in the light of the Eldar.
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 2: I like that.
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 2: So, with the creation of Mount Doom now being an active volcano, the seismic activity throughout Middle-earth has increased to a point where the people of Khazad-dum are now in a position where they're receiving aftershocks that are cutting off their light flow and they are no longer able to grow crops for themselves.
• 1:17:01
  Speaker 2: And what I like about this for the first time, they show what happens in Khazad-dum is that we get a little bit of glimpse of how their light system works and how their irrigation and agricultural system works.
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 2: I thought that was really cool and it totally makes sense that without light they can't grow anything.
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 2: You can't grow a plant indoors without light, so yeah, so I thought that that was an interesting concept and even like Disa, who is one of I forget what they call them like mountain singers or something like that I forget the actual term, I feel like that's not the correct one, but she's not capable of reaching some sort of understanding with the mountain.
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 2: Even she makes it worse by trying to connect with it through song and reverberation.
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 2: I thought that was fascinating, and obviously this is another machination of Sauron long in the planning process finally taking shape, and the dwarves now this season need the help of Celebrimbor and his rings.
• 1:17:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 1: So yeah, like now that that's what what I was kind of talking about, like it looks like it's kind of tracking.
• 1:18:07
  Speaker 1: So you know, I'm feeling that by the end of this season we're going to be getting the dwarf rings.
• 1:18:11
  Speaker 1: You know'm feeling that by the end of this season we're gonna be getting the dwarf rings, you know I think, yeah, I think that's gotta be the case, right.
• 1:18:18
  Speaker 2: Well, I mean, I did see it in the trailers too.
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 2: Like they do, the dwarf rings do get made, okay, um, according according to the trailer.
• 1:18:24
  Speaker 2: So, yeah, that's definitely happening.
• 1:18:26
  Speaker 1: So like I'm trying to think I don't.
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of stuff that I that like I don't remember.
• 1:18:32
  Speaker 1: So I know that the so eventually we're going to get to the rings that go to the men, but those nine rings or those nine ring bearers become ringwraiths.
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 1: Right, correct, yeah, what happens?
• 1:18:46
  Speaker 1: I don't.
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 1: I don't think anything really happens to the dwarves or the elves in that kind of sense I think there are.
• 1:18:54
  Speaker 2: So you have to really get into the lore of tolkien to understand, like why they aren't corrupted to the same degree that men are well, I know they say a lot that they're easily corruptible it's, it's throughout the entirety of lore.
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 3: Yeah to be fair, that is galadriel's kind of the recanting of it right, and elves are, as we know, a little snobbish.
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 3: They look down on other races a little bit, so I I'm actually actually that's a really good point.
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 3: Yeah, keep going.
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 3: I want to know like I'm excited.
• 1:19:25
  Speaker 3: You know like, look, we talked about it last week where you thought that it's going to be kind of like elves first season, dwarves second season.
• 1:19:33
  Speaker 3: You know kind of like a layout, like I want to see what happens when the men get the rings.
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 3: You know eventually when that happens the only.
• 1:19:41
  Speaker 2: Thing because, that's.
• 1:19:42
  Speaker 2: That's a huge part of it, you know, like them becoming eventually ringwraiths because they corrupted by them.
• 1:19:48
  Speaker 2: I think that that's a fascinating concept.
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 2: But you mentioned the elves being a little snobbish in their interpretation of men and other races.
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 2: And it's interesting because Elrond seems to be the only one who is not enamored by the rings.
• 1:20:05
  Speaker 2: Everyone who comes in contact with them is, you know, even Círdan, who is like the eldest of the elves on Middle-earth.
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 2: You know he was ready to throw the rings out and get rid of them to a point where they could never be found again until he sees them.
• 1:20:20
  Speaker 2: And he's like you know perfection does not exist solely in Valinor Like he was totally swayed by the creation of these rings by Celebrimbor and Sauron that he was willing to shove one of them on to his middle finger.
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 2: It was interesting.
• 1:20:35
  Speaker 2: They all put it on their middle finger.
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 2: I don't know if that's.
• 1:20:38
  Speaker 3: I did like when they put it on the way it.
• 1:20:40
  Speaker 3: You know the kind of recreation of the original shot Of the movie, I wonder if you know, we do know that Celebrimbor is one of the greatest smiths of you know or kind of of all time.
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 2: But I wonder I like that pronunciation.
• 1:20:54
  Speaker 3: I love, I love the over.
• 1:20:56
  Speaker 1: I'll call it like the super latino pronunciation of all the stuff like I, just anything with an, anything with an r and an e.
• 1:21:05
  Speaker 1: I want to watch it.
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 3: I haven't done this yet and I will do it before next episode.
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 3: I I want to watch Lord of the Rings in Spanish, just to hear if somehow they roll their R slightly differently, you know.
• 1:21:18
  Speaker 2: Like you know, like I just.
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 3: I'm very, very excited.
• 1:21:21
  Speaker 3: But I think I wonder like, does everybody behold these items so much because of Celebrimbor's like skill level, or is it because of the combination with sauron?
• 1:21:37
  Speaker 3: But then, if you kind of think forward, we do know from the lore and if they go by this, that sauron basically forges the ring alone in mount doom, so that one is still that one is so beholden that everybody calls it precious.
• 1:21:56
  Speaker 2: So I don't know.
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 2: That's a really good point.
• 1:21:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah, no.
• 1:21:59
  Speaker 2: So that is something that they need to get right, specifically with the one ring.
• 1:22:04
  Speaker 2: We know that the other rings are created with at least the forge that Celebrimbor is the celery rainbow.
• 1:22:13
  Speaker 3: Yes, so much better.
• 1:22:18
  Speaker 2: What he's got going on, but the one ring needs to be created.
• 1:22:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah so we got a lot going on there.
• 1:22:25
  Speaker 2: So, as of this point, we know that the dwarves have gotten an invitation from Celebrimbor to join them in Eregion to basically create the seven rings for the dwarf lords.
• 1:22:37
  Speaker 2: So very excited to see where that goes.
• 1:22:40
  Speaker 2: And I think the last plot point that we need to like just, I think, briefly talk about is what happens in Númenor, because they have their own little drama going on.
• 1:22:50
  Speaker 2: I'm really starting to not like Isildur's sister.
• 1:22:53
  Speaker 2: I thought she was a cool character in the first season and this season she seems like I didn't know you at all, girl, what's going on?
• 1:23:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, she's causing a lot of drama.
• 1:23:03
  Speaker 1: There's this whole power struggle thing going on with the Queen Regent, and what was her cousin's name?
• 1:23:12
  Speaker 1: Farazan yes yes, farazan, you saw, you saw the whole instance between because I I don't think he knows that, she can't see.
• 1:23:22
  Speaker 2: I think that they've been kind of keeping that under wraps and so I think he kind of picked up some I think, you know, I think when, when that woman slapped her and she didn't react prior to being slapped, like I think, at that point people realize, oh, this is a crippled lady I actually on rewatch.
• 1:23:41
  Speaker 1: I think he was trying to test it though, with the whole dress thing, oh yeah, but I thought that what?
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 2: interesting.
• 1:23:48
  Speaker 3: I know it's silly but I don't know why, on this rewatch, watching her walk down the steps, I just I sat there and I thought to myself how many times did she have to do that to be like OK, 17 steps, ok, three steps, ok, five steps forward, turn left, slightly, acknowledge Farazan who might be standing there, and then, like right, like right, like yeah, I noticed that too, like she.
• 1:24:13
  Speaker 2: There's that one scene where you know in her coronation, where she knows exactly when to turn towards the throne.
• 1:24:22
  Speaker 2: It's impressive.
• 1:24:23
  Speaker 3: That was really interesting that's the, that's the occasion to uh statescraft, you know, statescraft or whatever.
• 1:24:28
  Speaker 3: That to being a leader right Is learning how many steps exactly you got to take.
• 1:24:34
  Speaker 1: Alenio probably helped her with that too.
• 1:24:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah, alenio definitely helped.
• 1:24:38
  Speaker 2: But what's fascinating is that we know that her father, the actual king previously, his coronation was attended by an eagle and that was considered a very auspicious omen.
• 1:24:50
  Speaker 2: You know, like this was the sign of a good king.
• 1:24:53
  Speaker 2: What's funny is that her coronation is also attended by an eagle, but pharazon decides no, it's my eagle.
• 1:25:00
  Speaker 2: Um, and I dude.
• 1:25:04
  Speaker 2: I was so pissed, I was like that guy.
• 1:25:06
  Speaker 2: I wanted the eagle to just like grab him and throw him off like he hijacked that eagle he's so hijacked, he's so deliciously.
• 1:25:18
  Speaker 3: I, I know that he's so, almost one note, but there was a moment where, when the palantir is thrown down and you know he goes, surely that item does not belong to our queen, who would not rely on an elven artifact?
• 1:25:34
  Speaker 3: Right, but he like paused before he said it.
• 1:25:37
  Speaker 3: It's like he processed and he went.
• 1:25:39
  Speaker 3: I'm going to take my shot here.
• 1:25:41
  Speaker 3: Right, I'm going to say this, and if she, she takes ownership, like I've got everyone and I thought I just thought it was kind of a brilliant scheme.
• 1:25:52
  Speaker 3: Right, I've got everyone and I just thought it was kind of a brilliant scheme that he pulled Because he couldn't have known that that was going to go as it did.
• 1:25:58
  Speaker 3: I mean, well, pardon me, that's not right, because when they were in the tavern I can't remember Elendio's daughter's name, but she says I know a secret, and that's when they're interrupted for a second, I think, by Sildor's buddy, whose name also escapes me.
• 1:26:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, to defend the queen.
• 1:26:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I remember that.
• 1:26:18
  Speaker 3: So I think that that machination was.
• 1:26:22
  Speaker 3: So now I have to autocorrect myself.
• 1:26:24
  Speaker 3: My apologies.
• 1:26:25
  Speaker 3: You know what, farazan?
• 1:26:26
  Speaker 3: I don't think you're as cool as I thought you were before, because I thought you were super smart on the spot.
• 1:26:29
  Speaker 3: But now I know you had plotted that line and kind of bet that Muriel had touched the Palantir at some point.
• 1:26:37
  Speaker 2: Guys, I think we should bring our discussion to a close, but before we close out, what are our final thoughts for the first four episodes?
• 1:26:45
  Speaker 2: Rich, go ahead.
• 1:26:47
  Speaker 3: I mean, I couldn't you know, it's this.
• 1:26:54
  Speaker 3: I've never really watched anything where I felt rewarded for sticking around right like I, I feel you know I watched it right away when it came out and I was, you know, into it and obviously re-watching way too many movies that I shouldn't have, just to kind of get more insight into it.
• 1:27:08
  Speaker 3: But it really is something that just got me so excited and you know, I mean we'll, we'll talk about the next four next week, but I, I'm almost, I'm almost sad because I now I want, I want the next, I'm hungry, I want the next part.
• 1:27:24
  Speaker 3: So bad, you're hungry.
• 1:27:26
  Speaker 2: how do you, I guess, if you could leave us with like an idea of, like a feeling for, what we can expect for the coming four episodes, like, do you feel like these four episodes are a good quality indicator for the next four, or are we expected to get something totally different?
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 3: from that.
• 1:27:44
  Speaker 3: I think there's going to be I think we're all going to be big smiles, and I don't know how we keep it under two hours next week.
• 1:27:54
  Speaker 2: I'm going to say that Very interesting, okay, that very interesting okay very interesting, all right okay what do you feel about these first four episodes of season two?
• 1:28:00
  Speaker 1: so far it's been good.
• 1:28:01
  Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to seeing what happens next.
• 1:28:03
  Speaker 1: I know that things are bound to get crazier and, yeah, I'm Excellent.
• 1:28:10
  Speaker 2: I also am stoked.
• 1:28:12
  Speaker 2: I'm excited to see what happens next.
• 1:28:14
  Speaker 2: I'm thrilled by the way that these first four episodes have come together.
• 1:28:19
  Speaker 2: I'm really excited specifically about the Dwarven plotline.
• 1:28:22
  Speaker 2: One thing that we didn't really get to touch on is the continued, I guess chemistry between Prince Durin and his wife.
• 1:28:30
  Speaker 2: I feel like those two characters have such great chemistry together they do hopefully we'll get a lot more opportunity to talk about, like what they have to go through going forward.
• 1:28:39
  Speaker 2: So I'm really excited to talk more about that in the next episode.
• 1:28:42
  Speaker 2: And, guys, thank you so much for listening to us here for our 102nd episode of project geekology.
• 1:28:48
  Speaker 2: Please be sure to find us on all of our socials.
• 1:28:51
  Speaker 2: You'll find that in the show notes down below, and if you'd like to give us a review of your podcast, application, wherever you're listening, allows you to do so, please be sure to give it.
• 1:29:01
  Speaker 2: Wait well, anthony, is it a four?
• 1:29:03
  Speaker 2: No, it's five stars, right.
• 1:29:06
  Speaker 1: Five juicy stars, only juicy.
• 1:29:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you don't want to.
• 1:29:12
  Speaker 2: You don't want to cut into that turkey, and it's just all dry.
• 1:29:15
  Speaker 1: You want a little bit of juice in there.
• 1:29:17
  Speaker 2: You want it to be substantial, so hopefully your review in this case is a juicy five star review.
• 1:29:24
  Speaker 2: Thank you guys for listening.
• 1:29:25
  Speaker 2: I hope you check out our next podcast and we'll see you in the next one.
• 1:29:30
  Speaker 2: Bye y'all, adios.
• 1:29:31
  Speaker 2: No Wolverines today.
• 1:29:33
  Speaker 2: No Wolverines today.