Latest / The ACL Athlete Podcast / 019 | Patient and PT Perspectives - Live Q&A

Transcript

019 | Patient and PT Perspectives - Live Q&A · The ACL Athlete Podcast

• 0:19
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome everyone to the ACL Athlete Podcast.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_01: This is the podcast where we talk about everything related to the ACL, whether that's the injury itself, the rehab process, return support, and more.
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_01: I'm your host, Dr.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_01: Robbie Patel, performance physical therapist and coach.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_01: Between myself and fellow guests and experts, you'll learn through the lens of the FACEC, the healthcare professional, and the coach.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: The goal of this podcast is to equip you, the athletes, with the education to make the best informed decision about your care and your ACL journey.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks for joining.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_01: Now let's dive into today's episode.
• 1:04
  SPEAKER_01: What is up, guys, and welcome back to another episode on the ACL Athlete podcast.
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_01: Today's a special one.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_01: I was invited to be a part of a live QA this past week, and it was hosted by Matt Bobman of the ACL Study Day, and it was moderated by my good friend Jordan Angeli of the ACL Club.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_01: And this was a conversation between six ACL athletes, two who are physical therapists, including myself, who are anywhere from a few months out of ACL reconstruction to anywhere from five to fifteen years out from it.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_01: So you get a wide variety of experiences in this conversation, and we go deep into all things related to the ACL.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_01: The process, the mindset, dealing with setbacks, even hopelessness, uh finding your community, what we've even learned about ourselves through this process.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_01: So there is a lot that we talk about.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_01: You'll hear from one athlete where she has gone through nine surgeries.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I said that right, nine.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_01: But her story is remarkable.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_01: Megan is a true badass, and it will bring you a lot of hope as you're going through this process yourself.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_01: Because if she can do it as a junior in high school, after nine knee surgeries, so can you.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_01: So there's a lot to learn from this.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: Uh you get so many different experiences.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_01: It's really a deep dive into these conversations and ones that we need to be having.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_01: So I was incredibly excited to be a part of it, and I learned so much from this conversation.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_01: So I hope you do too as well.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_01: The audio on this will go in and out sometimes.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_01: Sorry, not sorry, but you know that's technology.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_01: So just know it's not your phone, it's not your device you're listening on, it's just probably the audio on the recording.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_01: Now, sit back, enjoy this episode, soak it all in.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_01: Cheers, guys.
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_07: Welcome everybody.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_07: It's Jordan Angley, founder of the ACL Club, and I am so excited to have you all here, a part of ACL Study Day, in this great QA that we're gonna have and a really meaningful conversation about the patient side of ACL rehab.
• 3:31
  SPEAKER_07: If you guys have been on the ACL Study Day curriculum, you saw me talk about my experience and what I have learned through the process of multiple ACL injuries.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_07: It was a big reason why I started the ACL Club, a big reason why I am a big advocate about what this process is like and how we can get better and grow from it.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_07: And so the cool thing today is I get to be joined by five people, a couple of PTs, um, some going one of them I think currently, Christine, I think you are currently going through ACL rehab.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_07: And Robbie have Robbie has been through it, and the other three are in rehab right now, too, some younger athletes.
• 4:12
  SPEAKER_07: You guys, I'm so excited to have you here.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_07: Um, we I think we have the same order on our screen.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_07: So I'm just gonna have you all introduce yourself.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_07: We're gonna start with Maddie and just give us your name, how old you are, if you play sports or what you do, and um how far out of injury you are and in the process of recovery.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_07: So, Maddie, why don't you go first?
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_04: Hi, I'm Maddie.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_04: I am 17.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_04: I play soccer, and I'm about two months out, I think, from surgery.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_04: So yeah.
• 4:44
  SPEAKER_07: And this is two months from your second ACL.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_07: Yes.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_07: Yes.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_07: So, okay, so been through the process before, and Maddie is now on the venture of the second one, which I think has a lot of cool mental pieces to it.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_07: So we'll dig into that.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_07: Megan, how about you?
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_05: Hi, everyone.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_05: My name is Megan Hebert.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_05: I'm a 17-year-old soccer player, and I'm currently seven months post op for my ninth knee surgery.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, you heard Christine say that.
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_07: Wow.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_07: Um that's a lot.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_07: Uh, and we will talk about just the mentality that it takes to continue to persevere.
• 5:21
  SPEAKER_07: First off, Megan, you're a champ.
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_07: Seriously a champ.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_07: A champ.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_07: Um, okay, Brendan, let's go to you.
• 5:28
  SPEAKER_03: Uh hi, my name's Brendan.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_03: Uh, I'm 20 years old.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I'm two years out from my um or a year and a half from my last knee surgery, but the full reconstruction was two years ago.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_03: Um I play basketball.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_03: Um, yeah.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_07: Yes, I love that.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_07: Gosh, I love those numbers too.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_07: You're you're in the fun stuff where you start to feel like like you again.
• 5:52
  SPEAKER_07: So um congrats on that.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_07: All right, Ravi, you're up.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so my name's Ravi Patel, and my ACL surgeries were 13.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_01: So 13 years ago, my first one, and then my second one was seven years ago.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_01: And now I've shifted the focus to working exclusively with ACL-related patients.
• 6:14
  SPEAKER_01: So that's where I'm at.
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, show us your shirt, Ravi.
• 6:18
  SPEAKER_07: The ACL athlete.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_07: If you guys don't have you're not listening to his podcast, go ahead and check that out too.
• 6:26
  SPEAKER_07: Um, Christine, welcome.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_07: How are you?
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_02: I'm good, how are you?
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I'm Christine.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I'm uh 29 years old, I'm a PT.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I had my surgery in March, so I'm like 10 weeks out.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I used to play uh track and field in college and volleyball, um, but now I don't.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_02: I just work out.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm not trying to return to sport, but I'm trying to return back to everything I was doing before I got injured.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_07: I love that.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_07: I went through multiple ACLs.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_07: So I I told you guys I'm Jordan Angeli.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_07: I had three ACLs.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_07: My last ACL actually, um, this is when you know you're in a good place.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_07: It came and went, and I didn't even think about it.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_07: So that was a really exciting moment for me.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_07: It was 10 years ago.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_07: So I'm happy to be on this side of it and happy to help you guys uh just talk through these things and navigate this continued process of working through trauma, right?
• 7:21
  SPEAKER_07: I think that's really what this all is about and how we can use it and hone it in into making it something that is useful for us in the future.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_07: Um so I think I want to start, I'm gonna start with the the soccer players who've had multiple injuries.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_07: Um what do you guys feel like has been on on the patient side the most difficult part of this process for you mentally?
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_07: And I know this is a broad question, so I think that there are gonna be thing different things that come up.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_07: But why don't we go Maddie and then Megan?
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_07: What what's been most difficult for you mentally, Maddie?
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_04: Um, probably just like staying positive and still like attending things, you know, because watching other people play the sport that you want to play is really difficult.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_04: And just like keeping like that positive mindset that that will be me again one day.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_07: What have you done to help with with that?
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I usually hang out with friends.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_04: I feel like that just like lightens the mood and makes you, especially soccer friends, like want you to come back and be even stronger.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_04: So just like hanging out with friends, and then also I do journaling, which I feel like has really helped.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_07: So does anybody else journal here or use some form of outlet?
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, that yeah, that that's fine.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_07: It doesn't have to be specifically journaling.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_07: Um I I think that just being able to get your thoughts out, whether it's to a friend or a a parent or a physical therapist.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_07: I mean, I'm sure you guys hear a lot of that.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_07: Just the the ability to vent is so big in the healing process.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_07: So um thanks, Maddie.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_07: Megan, how about you?
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_05: Um, I agree with everything Maddie said.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_05: I think just I've had a lot of complications along the way.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_05: And I think just picking yourself up after those complications has been really, really hard.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_05: And like going to like a doctor's appointment and just hearing like, okay, your ACL graph failed.
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_05: Like that sucks.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_05: That's complete devastation.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_05: So just picking yourself up and trying to keep going and trying to stay positive.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_05: It's so difficult.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_07: And I think you can take that as um, you know, that's a big thing over a long period of time.
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_07: But I think that same concept happens all the time in during ACL rehab, and Christine and Ravi, you probably see this a lot, is when patients are progressing and then you either plateau or you regress a little bit.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_07: How how do you guys as physicians help uh or clinicians help patients to know that that's part of the process to deal with these um ups and downs?
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_07: And while always trying saying it's okay to feel emotions, right, Ravi?
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_07: It's okay to feel those emotions, but also it's okay to be positive too and know that it is gonna get better.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: That's a good question.
• 12:28
  SPEAKER_01: One of the things that I start off with, any patients that I'm working with, is huge to set the expectations and knowing just that time frame, right?
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_01: So you know you're gonna be at least like a six, nine month process realistically, and setting the expectations, knowing that it's not just gonna be this perfect, like linear line.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_01: And it's that one, it's that uh saying of like what we think it's gonna happen, and it's that line versus the reality of it, and it's like this up and down process, as long as that trend is going up, is the biggest thing.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's one of the things that I focus on most initially with a lot of my patients.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 13:11
  SPEAKER_07: Christine uh Ravi brings up an uh interesting point here, and I actually probably want I want you, Brendan, to to answer this too, because I think it's interesting from a PT standpoint and an athlete standpoint.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_07: Timelines are hard.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_07: And mentally they can be very, they can be encouraging but also discouraging.
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_07: How do you balance that as a physical therapist saying, okay, I know, you know, now you know what it's like to be a PT and to progress somebody through the process, but you also are in it now and know, okay, well, like Tuesday, I can't do that.
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_07: Like I'm not, I'm not checking that box and moving on.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_07: How do you deal with that um idea of a timeline?
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I think that was like the biggest reality check for me because you're like, especially when you're treating patients, like you always want to make sure your treatment is organized and you're like, okay, I'm hitting this, I'm hitting that.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_02: You want them to feel like they're making progress.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_02: But when it's you and you're feeling it every day, you have to like have a conversation with yourself and just be like, okay, like it's like today I did this, but like, you know what, two days later it didn't feel the same, or like next week it wasn't as good.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_02: But it's like it doesn't mean I'm not gonna ever get better.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_02: It's just like every day is different.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, like focus on the things that you can control and just like don't be so hard on yourself.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_02: The timeline is also like it's not it's a blueprint, it's not always going to be the same for everyone.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_02: And like, because I'm not getting like I'm not a high paid professional athlete, like I'm not in a rush to get back on the field.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm like, no, nobody's losing a contract over what I'm doing.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, like I have a whole year to get it right, just like take my time, like you know, little things, be happy that you're able to do this and just keep like moving forward.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_07: So that's so good.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_07: Even even me as I, you know, I at one point I was a professional athlete and I did need to get back.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_07: And that was my third ACL, and I felt like, wow, I just want to be healthy again.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, right, Megan.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_07: I'm sure you have, yeah, you everybody just nodded their head, right?
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_07: We just want to, I want to feel like me again.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_07: Brendan, for you, you went through you're now a year and a half out of out of surgery, correct?
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_07: And did you feel like what timelines were helpful for you as an athlete?
• 15:26
  SPEAKER_07: Did you feel like knowing, okay, by three months I want to do this, by six months I want to do this.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_07: Did that help you to set those goals?
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_07: Did you feel like they were also detrimental in some ways?
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_07: How did that process work for you?
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_03: Well, yeah, for me personally, like it was more of um, I'm like being athlete, you're competitive and you always want to strive for those goals.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_03: And you can really grind on yourself by trying to accomplish those goals by that set timeline you set yourself.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_03: So I always had to remind myself like last week I wasn't able to do this, but I was able to do it at least once this time.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_03: Maybe let's strive next week, let's go two times, three times, instead of saying, Oh, I did it, I did it once, I can do it every time now.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_03: That's not how things work.
• 16:11
  SPEAKER_03: Like, oh, you it's like it's like just relating to sports, like, oh, you kick a soccer ball into a goal, oh, I can score whenever I want, but then you put a defender there.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_03: That like it's just something different, and you just have to remind yourself about that every time.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I love that.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_07: That's a really good point, and I think something that helps with those ups and downs in that process that Ravi have you guys all seen that video of like how you think or that image of how you think things are gonna go and it's a straight line, then how it actually goes and it's like a cluster of a line.
• 16:45
  SPEAKER_07: Um, it's the same what I think Ravi was talking about, and what you're hitting on there, Brendan, is um that the everything is progress, right?
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_07: Even if you can't do something, you're progressing because maybe I I don't know, Brendan.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_07: Was there a challenging part for you in the rehab process where you kind of felt stuck?
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_07: And and how did you find yourself getting through that feeling of being stuck?
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_03: Um, it was more um just like the like the weakness and the bending, obviously, it with coming back, like when you're starting to do like um body squats and stuff like that, where you're starting to get the full range of motion and you go from one leg to another because you're doing a bunch of single leg stuff.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_03: Um it's just always remind yourself like that was the main tough thing for me, was just like the like um saying, oh, um like the strength difference.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_03: It's just yeah, that was a big thing for me.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but yeah, I mean just realizing that this was an injured leg.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_03: And it was yeah, yeah.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_07: How do you guys talk to your leg?
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_07: That's that I like that you said that because do you guys talk?
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_07: Do you say it's my injured leg?
• 17:58
  SPEAKER_07: Do you say it's my bad knee?
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_07: What what do you guys say?
• 18:03
  SPEAKER_07: I'm just curious.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_02: Um I sometimes call it my bum leg, just like when I'm like, how much my bum knee, but then but then like I'm just joking, but like, but then when I'm like working and it's doing good stuff, I'm like, yes, me, come on.
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_02: Right?
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_02: Or like, yeah, you can sometimes you just like you talk to it when it's like when it's going well, like when I'm like increasing my strength, I'm like, Yeah, like you feel it, you're like, okay, like I'm getting some normal movements, and then other times I'm like, Where are you?
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 18:30
  SPEAKER_01: Similar, I'm similar to Christine, uh bum leg, especially on the days where you're just like, what are you doing?
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_01: Just like looking down, and just for that reason.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_01: Um, with other athletes, I'll try to get away from the bad and good connotation just because mindset, you know, I'm sure we'll talk about this more, but mindset's so big.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_01: So if you continue to allude to it as the bad knee, it'll always be the bad knee.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_01: So instead, maybe injured or like the bum knee for right now is okay, but just those words are yeah.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_07: Megan, I'm curious about you because you've been through a lot of injury, a lot of surgeries on the same leg.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_07: Um, what do you think about your leg?
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_07: What what what comes to your mind?
• 19:13
  SPEAKER_07: Because I'm sure, and it's okay, right?
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_07: It is probably a very difficult thing to think of this knee as a powerful, strong, capable knee because it's been through a lot of things and you've been through a lot.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_05: Um, so this is gonna sound terrible, but my family calls me Peg leg Meg.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_05: My name's Megan.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_05: So that's wonderful.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_05: But I call it my one million dollar knee because I mean, after all the surgeries, I'm sure it adds up to one million dollars.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I like that.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_07: You put a price tag that's like not um unachievable, but it's a high price, right?
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_07: Like this knee has been through a lot and it will be better at some pla place, right?
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_07: Does it does it bother you that your family calls you that?
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_05: Do you think it's used to the the they just joke about it?
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I'm gonna lighten the mood a bit, but right, which is so good, right?
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_07: I think Maddie was talking about hanging out with her friends, right?
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_07: It's so good to lighten the mood and just not think about your knee for a little bit.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_07: Um, but yeah, I think it's important to understand how powerful our words are and how powerful our thoughts are about our knee.
• 20:29
  SPEAKER_07: And I I personally found a big shift in my I I told you guys my last injure recovery.
• 20:36
  SPEAKER_07: I was just like, I'm done with trying to get and produce a timeline.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_07: I'm I'm done with it.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_07: I understand that I should be here.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_07: Like I knew the timeline.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_07: I had been through it two times already, right?
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_07: I knew the markers that I needed to hit, but I was over hitting markers and I wanted to feel like inside my brain and my heart, I wanted to feel like Jordan again.
• 20:58
  SPEAKER_07: I wanted to feel like just healthy.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_07: And so that became my goal.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_07: And um I started talking to my knee differently.
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_07: I kissed my knee too after workouts, which is so weird.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_07: But also it has it has created this appreciation between me and this body part that has been very difficult for me to get through in um life at times to say, hey, I really I appreciate what I've been through and what you've put me through and where we're at now.
• 21:31
  SPEAKER_07: And I understand we're all at different places with our our rehab and maybe don't feel like gosh, I love I love this knee.
• 21:39
  SPEAKER_07: But once I changed the way I talked about my knee and about my leg, I feel like it really did help shift my mentality.
• 21:51
  SPEAKER_07: Um I think when you I'm talking about just the little people that you have had that you feel has aided you in your recovery to find a positive amongst the negatives.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_07: Have you found that at all, Matt Maddie?
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_04: I'm sorry, can you repeat that again?
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_07: I just was um I said, has there been something that you found that you've been able to shift your mentality in a certain way that has really helped you?
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_04: Um, yes.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_04: So I go to Loris with Julie, and this kind of goes back to what we called our knees.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_04: Um at the beginning, I could not look at my cigar one bit.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_04: And Julie just kind of was like, you have to look at it as like a healthy leg.
• 22:39
  SPEAKER_04: And ever since I did that, it just I feel like I feel more strong, you know?
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_04: And I don't know, I feel like that definitely made a big impact because compared to the first one that I had, I always just looked at it as the injured leg.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_04: And I felt like I was always just like it was always an uphill battle, but now it just feels like I don't know, it seems easier.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_07: Right.
• 23:02
  SPEAKER_07: I think Brendan goes to Lars too, don't you?
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_03: I do.
• 23:05
  SPEAKER_07: Do you guys know each other?
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_07: Are you guys ACL buddies?
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_07: Do you work out together ever?
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_03: We've seen each other a couple times, but we haven't we're not buddy buddy, I would say, but we seen well, I feel like that's such a and in the PTs here too, probably have seen that just when you have ACL athletes in clinic, how they support one another.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_07: And they ask, hey, where where are you at?
• 23:33
  SPEAKER_07: What part of the process?
• 23:34
  SPEAKER_07: Oh, I remember that.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_07: I remember being there.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_07: Um how have you seen that community?
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_07: I mean, Robbie, you you work in ACLs primarily.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_07: Um, how do you feel like the community is a big part of it?
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_07: And even just this discussion, like being able to share and and hear each other's how that is in the healing process.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_01: It's huge.
• 23:56
  SPEAKER_01: Um it's really hard to gain the Perspective of someone who has gone through this process.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_01: So being able to talk to other people who have gone through this accused.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_01: So for PTs who are trying to learn that, it's incredibly valuable.
• 24:15
  SPEAKER_01: But the community of being able to see someone, like if you see like a scar for I think we talked about this, but if you see someone and they've got a scar on their knee, you're like, uh I know you, you know, like yeah, so it's really cool to be able to know that there's this community of people and you know how long this process is and how the ups and downs, and there's a lot of internal things that people don't see that you know that someone else who has gone through this process is has shared as well.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
• 24:49
  SPEAKER_07: Um, anybody else with that have had good experiences just talking to somebody else who's been through ACL recovery process that want to share that?
• 24:58
  SPEAKER_05: I think like the post op brace that you see, if you see someone wearing that, you're like, oh, you've had an ACL reconstruction.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, it's a big thing.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, for sure.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, my friend said the same thing.
• 25:10
  SPEAKER_02: My two of my friends had their ACLs done, and they're like, You're gonna see it.
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_02: People are just gonna be waving at you across the street when you're walking around with that brace.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: They're like, Yep, ACL, I've been there.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, everywhere went like, oh my god, that I that was me a year ago.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's gonna get better.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_02: So it's just I know, yeah.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_07: And it's so nice when you're on that side and you're hearing people say that, right?
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_07: Like you just feel I think one of the hardest parts, and maybe why this ACL community, if you see a scar, you don't know at what point in the process that person is, right?
• 25:42
  SPEAKER_07: I felt, and I don't know, maybe one of you three um younger people can can uh talk about this, but I felt like at the beginning when I physically looked like I was injured, I felt more supported because people were like, you know, almost to the point where I was like, okay, this is enough.
• 26:02
  SPEAKER_07: Like, I don't, I don't want your pity.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_07: Not that it was pity, right?
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_07: But like we think we're strong and we don't need help and all these things.
• 26:09
  SPEAKER_07: And then you get to a point where you look normal and you can walk and you can run, and people just forget about it, and you're like, but I'm not there yet.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_07: I'm I'm not even close, and I feel like I don't have people that support me.
• 26:24
  SPEAKER_07: So um, did you guys find Maddie, Megan, and and Brendan?
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_07: We'll go in that order.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_07: Did you guys find the the later stages of how we do more normal maybe more?
• 26:35
  SPEAKER_06: I don't know if the only is the right term, but maybe did you feel less important?
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_06: Did you feel disappointed because you didn't look injured?
• 26:47
  SPEAKER_04: Um, yeah, so I feel like towards the end you're so close that you're like almost too eager, I feel like.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_04: And I don't know, I feel like so much can happen in that little time.
• 27:00
  SPEAKER_04: And if you don't have the support, you kind of like overwork yourself just to like feel, you know, how to be back.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_04: So I just think it's very difficult, and people kind of forget they're like, oh, she's close, she doesn't need the support.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_04: But I feel like the last stages are the most tough mentally too and physically.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_07: How about you, Megan?
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_05: Um, so for me it's kind of opposite because of all the complications I've had.
• 27:27
  SPEAKER_05: One of them was um for moral nerve damage where I couldn't um lift my leg for a whole year.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_05: So I had everyone like saying, When are you gonna be able to lift your leg?
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_05: Like, that's not right, blah, blah, blah.
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_05: And I I was going to school every single day.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_05: So it was really hard for people to be like, Well, when are you getting the brace off?
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_05: Like, when is this gonna happen?
• 27:45
  SPEAKER_05: I'm like, I don't know.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_05: Because the the surgeon told me he's like, You might, we don't know when you'll be able to lift your leg again.
• 27:51
  SPEAKER_05: So that I was like, I don't know when I'm gonna be able to do that.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_05: So that was really hard to like, I didn't have a definite answer.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_07: Wow.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_07: Was that from a nerve block?
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_07: Um, which I think is an important thing to talk about.
• 28:05
  SPEAKER_07: I didn't have a nerve block for a few different uh my surgeries, and then I did in the latter stages, but I think it is important to understand every decision we make is, you know, it is a major surgery and there are consequences.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_07: And um, you know, I'm sure Megan, for you in those in that year, it was really challenging to hear that over and over again from people.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_07: Was there anything that you you did to say, hey, I I'm just I don't know, how did you communicate with people to say, like, I'm in the same boat?
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_07: I don't know, but I can't, I personally can't deal with all these questions.
• 28:42
  SPEAKER_07: Like, that's how I would feel.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_07: I don't know if that is how you feel.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, um, I wouldn't explain to every single person what happened, obviously, but for the people like especially that I was close with, they had a lot of sympathy for me because like it that was really devastating.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_05: Just like something so simple, being able to do a straight leg raise, like was so hard for me.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_05: So I think just explaining that and then just getting some kind of sympathy for it really helped.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_05: But the other people that were like, I there were people like talking behind my back about like how I was like faking it.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_05: I'm like, I've had so many surgeries, I don't think you can fake that.
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_05: But that was it was really hard, but I just I kept going.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_05: That's all you can do for me.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, thank you for sharing that.
• 29:25
  SPEAKER_07: That's you know, I think it is powerful too at certain stages to we all go through this rehab, and one of the things that I think we all can agree that we learn the most is how to communicate.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_07: Not only like everybody's like, mm-hmm, because it's empowering, right, to communicate properly with your your family, with your physicalists, and your trainer and your teammates and your coach.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_07: If you don't have that medication, they you know are gonna be have thoughts of their own and they don't know how to approach you in certain areas.
• 30:06
  SPEAKER_07: And so by just saying, like, hey, this is where I'm at, I can't deal with this right now.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_07: And it's not you, it's me.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_07: I'm I'm going through a lot.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_07: I remember um I remember telling my team, like, I I can't be a I can't, I was a captain, I was like, I can't do this anymore because I am not fully here and I love you guys and I I love your support, but if I continue to do this, I am gonna be detrimental to myself, which therefore isn't helpful to you.
• 30:37
  SPEAKER_07: So just learning to communicate is so empowering and it's uncomfortable at times too, which I think is why it is really empowering.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_07: So um, Brendan, do you have any thoughts on the the last question the girls answered as well?
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I think uh it's nice to have like at Loris, you're working out with uh athletes that are you know in the like they haven't had any injuries or anything like that, but you're also working out with people who have.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_03: And it's always fun because like you always see people like um they see you like kind of mature and grow, you're doing different things, you're actually starting to look like an athlete again, and they'll be um kind of watching you from the sidelines, and every once in a while they'll be like, Hey, you actually kind of look like an athlete now, like before, like you could tell that you weren't like at yourself, but now we can truly truly like see you, and it's just like kind of reassuring.
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_03: I mean, like that was a really positive thing for me personally, was getting it from other people than my family and uh my therapists and stuff like that.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_03: Because they always say that, and you always like in the back of your head, you're always saying, like, they're just saying that to keep me positive, but when you see it from someone else, like a stranger, and they come up and say that it's probably it, it was probably one of the most positive things that happened to me.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_07: I love that is such a good point, and it makes me think of perspective because your perspective, Brendan, was I'm in physical therapy, I'm doing this every single day, and yeah, you can feel growth, right?
• 32:00
  SPEAKER_07: You can feel it, but you don't always see it.
• 32:04
  SPEAKER_07: And so then you pull back and you see this grander perspective from somebody else's point of view that has only seen you at little blips, right?
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_07: Like seen you two weeks ago and then seen you now, and they're like, Go on, Brendan, like you look good, and it is it's cool to have that change of perspective because I think it does get you out of like the grind of every single day.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_07: Um, because we all know that it's a grind.
• 32:33
  SPEAKER_07: Um, you guys, this has been so fun, and we have so many questions.
• 32:37
  SPEAKER_07: I haven't even gotten to any of the questions because I've just been rolling here, but we're gonna get to some of them.
• 32:42
  SPEAKER_07: You guys submitted if you're watching here, you've submitted some questions and they're really, really good.
• 32:48
  SPEAKER_07: Uh, we're gonna start with this one uh about it's to Ravi and Christine here for the PTs.
• 32:54
  SPEAKER_07: Do you guys find it valuable to share your own experiences with ACL injury and rehab?
• 32:59
  SPEAKER_07: Um, we'll start there, and then I think um the the second half is for the other the patients saying, Do you find it valuable when you know your PT has gone through this rehab?
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_07: So, Ravi, why don't you get us going?
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um it's it's huge, I think, to be able to share the perspective, uh, especially going through the process yourself.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um, the relatability, and if we're talking about communication, there's nothing that creates more buy-in than being like, I've been through this process myself.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_01: And even if you're not a PT who has not gone through this process, being able to kind of relate to that aspect is really important to know.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_01: It's not just a typical shoulder pain injury or something like that.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_01: It's just a lit, it's different, and every one of us here can vouch for that.
• 33:51
  SPEAKER_01: And I think sharing, especially if you've gone through it yourself, sharing that and knowing, especially when those times are really low, to be able to show, like, hey, I went through that myself too.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, I agree.
• 34:05
  SPEAKER_02: I definitely think it changed my perspective after getting injured because this is my first ever injury.
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_02: So, like with patients, when you're talking to them, it's like very easy to just go off textbook or just like prior patient experiences.
• 34:17
  SPEAKER_02: But when you're with them and like even if they're not in the same age group, but like they're active and they want to get back to things, just like taking it outside of the clinic.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_02: It's not like, okay, you know, your exercises look great, but like how are you doing in your everyday life?
• 34:29
  SPEAKER_02: Like, how's sleep going?
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_02: Like, how is it like getting in out of the car?
• 34:32
  SPEAKER_02: Like, what is it like when you're with like during social events?
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um, like little things like that.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_02: Because in PT, I feel like we become like we're so focused on functional movements, like with exercises, but like your life is so your movements are so more much more extreme outside of that.
• 34:48
  SPEAKER_02: So, like being able to check in with your patient at like different levels and just communicate and like have those stories resonate with them, I think like makes their experience a lot better, like they trust you more.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 35:00
  SPEAKER_07: I want to get back to that because there's something in there that I think we can dig into a little bit more.
• 35:05
  SPEAKER_07: Um, let me go to the the other three really quick.
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_07: Did you guys have physical therapists who've been through ACL injury or injuries?
• 35:13
  SPEAKER_07: And does it help you as um the person going through it now to have your PT share that information with you?
• 35:20
  SPEAKER_07: Brendan, you want to start and then we'll go we'll go backwards.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_07: Brendan, Megan, Natty.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, um, I don't truly remember if uh my physical therapist uh if she tore her um ACL or not, but um I mean she's dealt with it multiple times.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_03: So I mean, I um she's rehab also many other people.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_03: So I mean it's just more of going off of those, I would guess.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_03: I've I don't know for sure, so it's a tough question for me to uh answer.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, Maddie's shaking her head too.
• 35:51
  SPEAKER_07: I don't know if she knows because you probably you both work with Julie, right?
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_07: Or you worked with Julie.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, and Julie is but Julie's brain for these things is just so incredible.
• 36:01
  SPEAKER_07: And I think one of the things that I love most about physical therapists is their ability to always seek something more and say, okay, what else?
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_07: What do I need to learn?
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_07: What do I need to know that is a way to do this differently or um better as I did last year, or like that constant growth?
• 36:21
  SPEAKER_07: I'm sure that's something that connected you with her.
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 36:26
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 36:27
  SPEAKER_07: Megan, did your physical therapist go through?
• 36:31
  SPEAKER_05: Um, I've had three physical therapists.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_05: I switched three different times, um, just to find like the right PT, especially after having so many complications.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_05: It was really hard to find someone who could cater to what I've been through.
• 36:45
  SPEAKER_05: Um, but my the one that I'm with now in the past two, like no one has been through an ACL surgery, but they've worked with a ton of athletes.
• 36:55
  SPEAKER_05: Um, and especially the one that I'm with now has actually like worked with the Patriots because I live in Massachusetts.
• 37:01
  SPEAKER_05: Um so that's been really cool to go there and be like, oh, you've worked with like Tom Brady or something like that.
• 37:07
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah, that's great.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_07: Um, Megan, I do want to before I go back to Christine, I want to talk to you about that because I switched physicalists uh as well.
• 37:17
  SPEAKER_07: And I feel like it was one of the most difficult conversations that happen to come to terms with like I have to I have to like had this, you know, the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
• 37:32
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I was like, I can't, I have to switch.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_07: And it was, you know, again, it's nothing to do with that PT.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_07: It just didn't, I knew, I knew it didn't serve me.
• 37:43
  SPEAKER_07: How did you personally know that it was the right time to switch to somebody different?
• 37:49
  SPEAKER_07: And how did you go about that conversation?
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_07: Because I think there's gonna be people that um maybe hear this that are PTs that hear this information and feel maybe hurt that that person switched from them.
• 38:00
  SPEAKER_07: But there's also maybe people listening that need to switch and they need to feel like I feel empowered to do what's right for me.
• 38:09
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, so I felt like I was going through a breakup, and that's kind of dramatic.
• 38:14
  SPEAKER_05: But I was like, I can't do it because the my first PT I was with for two years, I want to say.
• 38:22
  SPEAKER_05: They were with me through like surgeries one through five.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_05: But after my ACL reconstruction, where I faced all the complications, um, I could tell they were getting frustrated as much as I was.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_05: And they I I just knew that it was time, it was time to move on.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_05: And I went back and forth every single night for like a good month.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_05: I was like, do I switch?
• 38:45
  SPEAKER_05: Do I not?
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_05: And I think switching and getting a second opinion per se was really um really good for me because that that same that day that I had my second consultation with the new physical therapist, um, I could lift my leg again.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_05: And that was after one year, and I was like, wow, I didn't know I could do this, and just having that was really rewarding.
• 39:10
  SPEAKER_05: And like my that PT at the time was like, You you didn't you couldn't do this before.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_05: So it was like, yeah, like it was so challenging.
• 39:17
  SPEAKER_05: So and I also like creating a bond with the new physical therapist was really, really hard.
• 39:23
  SPEAKER_05: And I had to like trust the process, so yeah.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_07: Oh, I can relate to that so much, and just I think at the end of the day, the thing is we get one life, and nobody knows what our process is like except for us.
• 39:39
  SPEAKER_07: And so if you are if in your gut you're feeling, I need to move, I need to go to somebody else, know that that is a valid feeling, and and listening to yourself and per pursuing whatever is next can actually allow you to maybe break free from something that was holding you back and saying, Okay, I have a hand in this really like a problem that is so hard.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_07: At least I make decisions that make me feel like I am putting myself on the path that feels right to me.
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_07: So I just commend you, Megan.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_07: Like that, I know those conversations are hard and it takes a lot of um communicating with your family and all that stuff to make those decisions, but um I'm glad that we did that for you because at the end of the day, it's your one life you get to live, right?
• 40:36
  SPEAKER_07: You have to stay true to yourself.
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_07: Yep.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_05: I will add um oh go ahead, Meg.
• 40:41
  SPEAKER_05: I will add that the insurance companies, like they will cut you off, they will say no more PT for you.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_05: And I remember that was another factor.
• 40:49
  SPEAKER_05: I um I switched PT clinics in I don't know, I don't know if they're insurance based, but I got approved more visits.
• 40:58
  SPEAKER_05: So at this new place, that was really helpful along the process as well.
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_05: Because I need more PT and I still need PT four years later, but yeah, yeah, that's a really good point.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_07: And I know that um a really difficult thing for me was understanding that I would have to continue to invest in this beyond, you know, unfortunately, beyond my insurance that I had to say, okay, if I am gonna be healthy again, I know that this isn't done because PT says it's done.
• 41:28
  SPEAKER_07: Like I know I needed more, and and that's difficult.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_07: And I know that everybody's life provides different financial um means, but knowing that again, it's an investment in your future and your health and all those things.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_07: Um, so that's a really good point of fit of gosh, I don't want to get into insurance, but it's a good point.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_07: Um, Christine, you mentioned something, and it is something that you wrote into, and I was kind of getting getting to know you guys before this.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_07: This idea of we go to physical therapy and we hit these markers, but no one's like, How do you get in and out of bed?
• 42:06
  SPEAKER_07: Like, how do you go up and down the stairs?
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_07: Um, can you talk through that and how that has changed your approach as a physical therapist?
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_07: And maybe something that can be helpful for the PTs listening, or even the people listening that are going through rehab right now to say, Oh, maybe I should ask about this, or maybe this is a good um exercise to have them do that is working the same muscles, but is a real life almost hack to say, okay, this this will help your life be a little bit better.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I think I definitely noticed it more like because I did prehab before my surgery.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_02: So, like during the prehab, you are progressing way faster because even though your ACL is gone, everything else is intact after the reconstruction.
• 42:53
  SPEAKER_02: Now you've moved things around, and there's like your body's been open, and now you have to heal.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_02: So, like it wasn't just like, okay, now you can do a straight leg raise, you don't have an extension leg.
• 43:03
  SPEAKER_02: Let's just start like walking.
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_02: Then I was like, I'm walking with this crutch, and like I'm walking crazy.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, I'm walking down the stairs and like I'm walking crazy.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_02: And like I had my crutches, and I have like 16 steps to get into my house.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_02: So I would like throw my crutches, like so I could get down if I'm like in a rush, and I'm like, I have to like use like my one arm, and I'm just like nuts.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, I'm gonna like hurt my shoulder or like hurt my hip.
• 43:24
  SPEAKER_02: So like like then I'm in my PT, and my IPT is like, oh wow, you're like getting so much stronger.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, I don't feel strong, I can't do anything.
• 43:31
  SPEAKER_02: And so just like you know, um checking in, like getting out of bed, like I would be like, Okay, how do I feel in the morning?
• 43:38
  SPEAKER_02: Like how I would get out of bed, I'd be like, Okay, let me try not to like keep my leg up in the air.
• 43:44
  SPEAKER_02: Like I would like straighten my leg and lift it and like slide it over.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, okay, that's not how normal people get out of their bed.
• 43:50
  SPEAKER_02: So, like just challenging myself to like bend my knee, like when I could bend it, and then like get up the way I would normally get up, or like you know, redoing things like when I had to get out of a chair, I'm like, okay, am I leaning over to one side, like sit back down, do it five times, like see how it feels, like just testing yourself in those aspects.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_02: Getting out of my car was really big, um, and like walking.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I would practice just walking in my complex, just like had like walk and then stop thinking about it.
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_02: Because it's like when you're teaching someone how to walk, it's so weird, it's so robotic.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, I'm not, I was like, just stop thinking and just walk because it's like you're taking so much time.
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_02: Just like, you know, talking about those things with patients because it's like we always we learn certain cues and we're like, okay, you know, squeeze your quad or like you know, really try and straighten you off.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_02: But it's like when you're in a crowd or when you're in a rush, those things go out the window.
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_02: So just like I think being more specific with what your patients have to do, and then also like kind of like letting them relax, like, don't think about so many things, you're just gonna like make it more complicated than it is.
• 44:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um too.
• 45:01
  SPEAKER_07: Like, we think we're gonna just like away, like, oh, I'll just be winged and it'll be normal.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_07: But if you can flip it down, it helps you feel what it feels like on the other side, so you can almost mirror that on that same side.
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_07: Um, do you guys have any hacks that you've that you've acquired through the process of um things that were really helpful for you in rehab that you're like, oh nobody ever talks to you about this, but you should this is something that's helpful.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_02: Videos.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_02: I think taking using your camera.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_02: I was using my camera to like see but take videos of myself.
• 45:35
  SPEAKER_02: I'm like, let me just see what I look like when I'm walking and I think I'm walking normal.
• 45:38
  SPEAKER_02: I was like, let me see what I look like when I'm getting out, and just like that.
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I love that.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_07: Brendan, did you have anything?
• 45:46
  SPEAKER_03: Um, it would kind of be the same thing as Christine was saying, it's kind of like mirrors too when you're working out, like just going in front of like a mirror when you're like, Oh, you walk by a mirror, like let's see what a squat looks like right now, or something like that, or just kind of like looking at it almost and like I don't know, it's Just little tiny things.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_03: It's not um anything big for me.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_07: I love mirrors.
• 46:09
  SPEAKER_07: You like kind of feel vain at first, but then you're like, no, I look good in these spots.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_07: I'm gonna tell myself I look good because this has been a long process and I need the positivity, right?
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_00: Totally.
• 46:22
  SPEAKER_04: Maddie, how about you?
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I would have to say the same thing as Christine.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_04: Um I had trouble walking because I think I was just like thinking about it too much and I was like breaking down the motion so I looked kind of like a robot type of thing.
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_04: And so watching myself walk, I was like, I look like that.
• 46:40
  SPEAKER_04: It's just like seeing it from like another perspective and being able to then just put the motions together and be fluid with it was a lot easier after I saw myself walking.
• 46:51
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah.
• 46:52
  SPEAKER_05: Megan, okay.
• 46:53
  SPEAKER_05: I think like the videos are very helpful as well looking back because you can see how far you've come along the process.
• 47:00
  SPEAKER_05: And you can even, I I'm planning on making a whole video about everything that I've gone through.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_05: So I'm excited to see uh how much I've progressed.
• 47:10
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I love that.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_07: Ravi, do you have any do you have any hacks?
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_01: Ooh, hacks.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_01: Uh no, probably uh using their crutches, I think, in different ways, whether it's even just like a leg prop, you get the little whole thing.
• 47:25
  SPEAKER_01: People I just found that out.
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_07: I was like, that's amazing.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_07: So smart.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, or even just whenever you're starting off in the initial phases, using your crutches as much as you need, but then because we're trying to get away from them so fast, that like you know, talking about the gate or learning to walk, not trying to ditch it too fast to where we're trying to overrely on our knee at that current moment.
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_01: So using the crutches as much as we need.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_01: And then once that stuff kind of normalizes, we can ditch them.
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_07: My hacks are like at the beginning.
• 48:02
  SPEAKER_07: I think wedge pillows, like buying a wedge pillow and propping your leg up is like something people don't think about.
• 48:09
  SPEAKER_07: Um a shower stool.
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_07: I know, like to put in your shower in a uh a handheld shower thing.
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_07: So you could do something that like is so normal, right?
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_07: I think those are the hardest things, like the normal everyday things that you just can't do.
• 48:25
  SPEAKER_07: I remember crying when I couldn't carry a glass of water from the kitchen to the living room.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_07: I'm like, why are you crying?
• 48:31
  SPEAKER_07: Well, it's just a normal, it's a normal everyday thing that you can do all the time and you can't do it.
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_07: So um, yeah, in the shower stool also, like I feel like helped when I had to go to the bathroom.
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_07: I could like prop my leg up so it wasn't so much pressure on my knee.
• 48:45
  SPEAKER_07: Um I think of like those things that really helped me that are easy, like something to get right at the beginning that make you feel a little bit more comfortable and like you can have control over or over certain things.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_07: Um but that videos here and love such things.
• 49:04
  SPEAKER_07: Um okay, let's get to some of these things.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_07: You guys can tell I can just asking questions off of what you say.
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_07: Um, we had a question about how important is it to still make practices and team meetings throughout the rehab process.
• 49:19
  SPEAKER_07: Um, and I think this will have a variety of different answers.
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_07: So, Maddie, do you want to just start us off there?
• 49:24
  SPEAKER_04: Um, yeah.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_04: So for my first ACL, I like attended everything.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_04: I still went to like a lot of the out-of-town tournaments and I attended practices and I thought it was nice, but um, it was also like just like I don't know, it didn't sit right with me because watching people play just kind of like brought the mood down for me, I guess.
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_04: Like it was nice to see my friends, but going to everything and seeing people play, and I can't do that kind of stuff.
• 49:52
  SPEAKER_04: I don't know.
• 49:52
  SPEAKER_04: I felt like that kind of like hurt me a little bit, and then so the second time around, I've like gone I maybe go to practices once a week and then a couple of games on the weekends, but um I feel like I'm in a way better mindset.
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_04: I I don't know why I but hanging out with the friends and not worrying about the soccer part of it, I feel like just like help me see a positive outlook on it.
• 50:17
  SPEAKER_05: I love that Megan.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_05: Um for me it was it's really hard because everyone would ask me, when are you coming back?
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_05: When are you gonna get back on the field?
• 50:28
  SPEAKER_05: I'm like, um, I don't know.
• 50:30
  SPEAKER_05: Maybe after the next surgery.
• 50:32
  SPEAKER_05: But now that I'm now that I'm like at a place like nine knee surgeries later, I'm really, really missing soccer.
• 50:40
  SPEAKER_05: So I haven't been to a practice or a game in like two years.
• 50:46
  SPEAKER_05: But I kind of want to start going back.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_05: But I I'm at my I'm a junior in high school right now.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_05: So once I I'm gonna try to play soccer for my senior year, hopefully.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_05: Fingers crossed.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_05: Um so I hope that this summer I'll start going back to practices and stuff.
• 51:03
  SPEAKER_07: Okay, good.
• 51:04
  SPEAKER_07: I love that.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_07: Brendan, how about for you?
• 51:07
  SPEAKER_07: I know you're fully are you fully integrated back into playing and you're playing basketball and you're feeling good.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 51:13
  SPEAKER_03: Um like this past year um was when I really felt fully normal.
• 51:19
  SPEAKER_03: But um going to team meetings and stuff like that, I uh um I was in high school when I toured, so it was my senior year.
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_03: So it was really tough because like it's my senior year, you're supposed to be like you're supposed to get like this is like when you're supposed to be your best.
• 51:34
  SPEAKER_03: Like this is when you feel like when you feel like you're the you're like you're the best.
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_03: But like going to practice, I would literally have to read a book at practice.
• 51:43
  SPEAKER_03: I'm just like, I can't watch this, but I want to be here for my team, so I understand that battle.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_03: But that was just something I did where I'd really have to distract myself until I kind of started to become normal with it and kind of like accepting it more.
• 51:54
  SPEAKER_03: Um, but yeah, I I went to everything.
• 51:57
  SPEAKER_03: Um, so uh yeah, it's just a big mental game.
• 52:01
  SPEAKER_03: You kind of have to play with yourself, reminding yourself, like, this is what I love, this is where I want to be, this is where I want to like go, but I'm not there yet.
• 52:09
  SPEAKER_03: So it's just it was one of those things for me.
• 52:13
  SPEAKER_07: I think that you you bring up a good point too.
• 52:16
  SPEAKER_07: It is I talk about the grieving process often because there are stages to this, and like denial is a stage, right?
• 52:23
  SPEAKER_07: Like we all go through that where we're like, no way, why me?
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_07: Why did this happen to me?
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_07: What I don't want to be here, and then we go through anger and we then accept that this is what we have, you know, this is the path that we have, and from there we we feel like we can choose what's next, right?
• 52:45
  SPEAKER_07: We can choose our attitude going into the next thing.
• 52:47
  SPEAKER_07: Not to say our attitude is always perfect, right?
• 52:49
  SPEAKER_07: I think that's the beauty of being a human, is we get to feel these things.
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_07: And if we we constantly suppress the feelings that we have, it makes the healing process a lot different.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_07: Um, did you I'm I'm curious, Brendan, because I I know most of us grow up, I mean we all grew up as athletes, we know we all played intense sports growing up, right?
• 53:13
  SPEAKER_07: And the thing that was really difficult for me is physically, like I could, you know, we can do anything, right?
• 53:21
  SPEAKER_07: We all can look at each other and be like, oh, you tell me to do that, I'm gonna go do it.
• 53:25
  SPEAKER_07: But the mental side, even if we think we're, you know, strong mentally as an athlete, like I can push through that sprint, that sprint progression that we have to do.
• 53:34
  SPEAKER_07: I can be there in the the 90th minute, making a sprint down the field, like all these physical things that we think that's the mental toughness.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_07: I think mental toughness is so different than that.
• 53:46
  SPEAKER_07: Um, did you find, how did you find you grew mentally stronger, Brendan, through this process?
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_07: Because I think as an athlete, we're told like work harder, uh, tough it out, um, you know, man up, you know, all those things that are really, you don't feel like you're strong if you don't feel those things.
• 54:07
  SPEAKER_07: And I think that that's an illusion of strength.
• 54:10
  SPEAKER_07: I think strength is actually all these things put together.
• 54:13
  SPEAKER_07: And I just am curious if you felt that tension of um having to be strong, but at the same time feeling your emotions and saying, all right, it's okay to feel these things.
• 54:24
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I would say I totally agree with that.
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_03: Um it was a big thing that I learned was patience.
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_03: That was the biggest thing I ever like took away from this is being able to be patient with yourself, but also be patient mentally, telling yourself, like, I still have this much to go um in my rehab, but then also being competitive and doing all that stuff and telling yourself the athlete in you to push yourself to.
• 54:50
  SPEAKER_03: So I the main thing I take away is patience.
• 54:52
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, I like that.
• 54:54
  SPEAKER_07: Ravi, I'm gonna go to you next because you have gone through the experience and you're also now helping people through ACL rehab.
• 55:02
  SPEAKER_07: And there are moments where you're like, you can do this, you can.
• 55:07
  SPEAKER_07: And people are scared, you know, it's okay.
• 55:09
  SPEAKER_07: They're fearful of doing something they've never done or saying, Can I do this?
• 55:13
  SPEAKER_07: How do you walk people through that emotion of saying, All right, physically you're there.
• 55:19
  SPEAKER_07: Now we need to work on you believing that you're there.
• 55:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think really trying to frame it in the sense of these small wins as you're working with different athletes and different patients.
• 55:35
  SPEAKER_01: The small wins are big.
• 55:37
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, if you as a PT should have a good gauge of the person of the patient and know what they are capable of and what they're not capable of.
• 55:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um and the biggest thing that I would stress here is knowing the athlete, like knowing the athlete and knowing are they someone who is going to cut themselves and you gotta kind of hold them back a little bit, or is it someone who's gonna kind of overdo it because uh everyone of uh everyone here is is an athlete.
• 56:10
  SPEAKER_01: So usually when you get challenged, you're like, I'm gonna do that, right?
• 56:13
  SPEAKER_01: Like but the thing is as a PT, you gotta know where that it's a it's a fine line.
• 56:20
  SPEAKER_01: And if you know that they're physically there based on the rehab and the training that they're doing, then sometimes you do need to give them that nudge and be like, Look, you can make this happen.
• 56:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I and maybe there's videos, you know, now like using video so much, being like, Look, you've already done all of this, this is just one little step further, yeah, and you can do it.
• 56:43
  SPEAKER_01: So encouraging them that way and knowing where they've come and where they're at now, I think is really big.
• 56:49
  SPEAKER_07: That's good, and it brings in that patience too, that Brendan was talking about patience, small wins.
• 56:55
  SPEAKER_07: I'm a big stickler on small wins.
• 56:57
  SPEAKER_07: I'm like, those little things just add up, and before you know it, right?
• 57:02
  SPEAKER_07: Um I have a a question from someone that a couple of like real mental questions.
• 57:09
  SPEAKER_07: Somebody asked, um, had do you have any had you had or do you have any feelings of hopelessness throughout the process?
• 57:17
  SPEAKER_07: And I think that I'm gonna combine that one with this thought of do you have any tips on the mental side?
• 57:24
  SPEAKER_07: So um if you guys want to answer this question, feel free to just tell me.
• 57:28
  SPEAKER_07: I'm not gonna call on everybody, but I think um I think this is challenging, right?
• 57:34
  SPEAKER_07: This is a hard process to not to to feel, you know, some people go through it and it's it's fine, but some people there is feelings.
• 57:42
  SPEAKER_07: I know I felt hopeless at times and I felt like, man, I'm never I don't see it, like I don't see the light at the end of the tunnel.
• 57:50
  SPEAKER_07: Um, and I can talk about the things that I did to help me on the mental side, but I'm just curious if anybody wants to take that and and talk to that a little bit.
• 58:01
  SPEAKER_07: Brendan, all right.
• 58:05
  SPEAKER_07: Oh, unmute yourself.
• 58:09
  SPEAKER_07: That's right, we've all been there.
• 58:11
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 58:12
  SPEAKER_03: Um, I would say the when I first heard the news that it happened, and like for those first like first weeks to month, like first month area, you really feel like you're on an island, you don't really have um anyone, you have your family around you, but none of them have like know exactly what you're going through.
• 58:29
  SPEAKER_03: Like you might have had an uncle or something that's from the ACL too, because it's very popular, but like every circumstance is different, and you know that.
• 58:38
  SPEAKER_03: And one of the things that I did was kind of like what Maddie does is that you go hang out, you kind of take a step away from it too, and kind of go hang out with friends, like even if they just come over to hang out with you, just having other company and seeing other people is a really big thing, and them also giving you compliments.
• 58:54
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, you're out of the brace now, nice job.
• 58:56
  SPEAKER_03: Like, are you walking?
• 58:57
  SPEAKER_03: Like stuff like that, um, really help me personally.
• 59:01
  SPEAKER_07: So, yeah, I love that.
• 59:03
  SPEAKER_07: So, on the mental, you know, you felt the hopelessness, but being around your friends really helped you mentally to to understand you're still just one of their friends, like you're not any different because you can't play your sport, which I think it makes us feel different, right?
• 59:19
  SPEAKER_07: When we can't participate in what makes us feel so alive, we feel like we're not us anymore.
• 59:24
  SPEAKER_07: And that's not that's not how your friends make you feel.
• 59:27
  SPEAKER_07: And I think that's a really important thing to to recognize.
• 59:31
  SPEAKER_02: I agree.
• 59:32
  SPEAKER_02: I with like the beginning, like when and when you found out, like when I found out, I was like, nah.
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_02: Like when I went to the author the first time and he did the uh lockman stuff, it was him and his resident.
• 59:45
  SPEAKER_02: And the resident was like, Oh, I got an N-feel, and the the doctor was like, No, it's torn.
• 59:50
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, I don't think it is.
• 59:51
  SPEAKER_02: And he goes, We'll see, like on the MRI.
• 59:53
  SPEAKER_02: He's like, I hope it's not.
• 59:54
  SPEAKER_02: And then I got the MRI and he's like, It's a complete dare.
• 59:56
  SPEAKER_02: And I was like, What?
• 59:58
  SPEAKER_02: And so then I kind of was just like going through like, okay, how far can I get without this ACL?
• 1:00:03
  SPEAKER_02: Like, let me like do studies, and like as a PT, I'm like, it does look crazy if I'm like telling people to go get surgery and I don't get surgery.
• 1:00:10
  SPEAKER_02: But I was like, let me see.
• 1:00:12
  SPEAKER_02: I was already had a lot of mobility in my knee before, and then as I was going through the pre-hab, I was like, my knee feels fine.
• 1:00:18
  SPEAKER_02: I literally don't have any pain.
• 1:00:19
  SPEAKER_02: I can jump, I can run.
• 1:00:21
  SPEAKER_02: Um, what if I just don't get the surgery?
• 1:00:24
  SPEAKER_02: And then I think it's like coming to the acceptance like you need it, like later on.
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not gonna be, I'm not gonna be young forever, you know.
• 1:00:30
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I don't want to be in a situation where I can't do something because my knee.
• 1:00:33
  SPEAKER_02: So I think like accepting that like it's okay, like it happens to everybody.
• 1:00:39
  SPEAKER_02: It's not like it's uncurable, and then like figuring out a plan that you feel comfortable with going forward.
• 1:00:44
  SPEAKER_02: Like, I think taking control of the situation for me was made it easier, and then like setting up little goals, like the little wins help a lot.
• 1:00:51
  SPEAKER_02: Like, just like okay, you know, that first week, let's just focus on these things, and you know, just like getting yourself okay with where you are, like accepting that it's like fine, you're gonna be all right.
• 1:01:03
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, yeah.
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_02: Acceptance is so huge.
• 1:01:06
  unknown: Yeah.
• 1:01:06
  SPEAKER_04: Um, yeah, oh, you can go.
• 1:01:08
  SPEAKER_04: Sorry, Maddie.
• 1:01:09
  SPEAKER_07: I'll go.
• 1:01:10
  unknown: Okay.
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_04: Um, so I agree with what Brendan said.
• 1:01:13
  SPEAKER_04: The first week is just like torture, and when you first find out, you're kind of in disbelief going back to that.
• 1:01:20
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but I would also say a part of hopeless that I've when I felt hopeless was probably during like after you get to like the biking in between the biking to the running, just because I'm in that right now and it's all strength training, and I just feel like I'm not getting anywhere, you know?
• 1:01:39
  SPEAKER_04: I'm just doing the same exercises over and over, and it's just it's repetitive.
• 1:01:43
  SPEAKER_04: And I'm like, am I even getting stronger?
• 1:01:46
  SPEAKER_04: So I feel like that's definitely hard, but then um seeing like so I had a physical therapy session on Thursday, and um try just kind of to see the growth between the strength training and kind of thing, and seeing that I felt like really made me finally feel like, oh yeah, I am doing something right, you know?
• 1:02:08
  SPEAKER_04: Yeah.
• 1:02:08
  SPEAKER_07: So yeah, that part of the process is hard.
• 1:02:12
  SPEAKER_07: I would agree with you.
• 1:02:14
  SPEAKER_07: Go ahead, Megan.
• 1:02:15
  SPEAKER_05: So my first ACL tear went misdiagnosed for three months, and I kept going back to the doctor.
• 1:02:22
  SPEAKER_05: I'm like, something's wrong with my knee.
• 1:02:23
  SPEAKER_05: Like there, it's just not it's not supposed to move like this.
• 1:02:26
  SPEAKER_05: And I was kind of brushed off for a while.
• 1:02:28
  SPEAKER_05: Um, but I ended up switching surgeons and I really advocated for myself, and I think that's a big part of the process.
• 1:02:34
  SPEAKER_05: If you feel something's wrong, you have to speak up and advocate for yourself.
• 1:02:40
  SPEAKER_07: Yes, yes, you do.
• 1:02:43
  SPEAKER_07: I love that.
• 1:02:44
  SPEAKER_07: And I I mean, I don't love it.
• 1:02:46
  SPEAKER_07: I hate that that happened to you, but I love that you grew from it, that you said, no, this isn't okay.
• 1:02:52
  SPEAKER_07: I'm not okay.
• 1:02:54
  SPEAKER_07: Um, again, that you're the only one that knows your body.
• 1:02:58
  SPEAKER_07: And I I think both those PTs right here can attest that they probably say that to their their clients all the time and say, You're the only one that knows what it feels like, and you do have to trust, um, build that trust with your PT and with your doctor.
• 1:03:11
  SPEAKER_07: But um, proud of you, Megan, for sticking up for yourself.
• 1:03:13
  SPEAKER_07: Thank you.
• 1:03:15
  SPEAKER_07: Um, can we talk about the return to sport really quick and the idea of working through um that end range?
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_07: I know, Megan or Maddie, you've been there, Brendan, you've been there as well.
• 1:03:26
  SPEAKER_07: And um, how difficult was that for you?
• 1:03:29
  SPEAKER_07: Or did you feel like PT set you up and you felt comfortable where you were at from PT into integration back into sport?
• 1:03:37
  SPEAKER_07: And how did you navigate that?
• 1:03:39
  SPEAKER_07: Because it's not just like I'm cleared from PT, I'm playing like a champ again, right?
• 1:03:44
  SPEAKER_07: It is it is still part of this whole entire growth.
• 1:03:48
  SPEAKER_07: So, how how was that for you, Maddie, the first time going through that?
• 1:03:51
  SPEAKER_04: Um, so the first time I went through many physical therapists.
• 1:03:56
  SPEAKER_04: Um, I had like just like the regular clinic type of physical therapist, and then I finally found Julia in the end.
• 1:04:02
  SPEAKER_04: And I feel like Julia really just like helped set you up because I think she like talked to you more about like the mental side and getting over those hurdles and stuff.
• 1:04:11
  SPEAKER_04: And I feel like she integrated me into the back to play very smoothly.
• 1:04:16
  SPEAKER_07: So can you talk specifically to some of those?
• 1:04:19
  SPEAKER_07: Like, how did she talk to you?
• 1:04:21
  SPEAKER_07: Because there's there's PTs on here right now that are probably like, oh, well, I need to do that.
• 1:04:26
  SPEAKER_07: Like, what what can I use?
• 1:04:28
  SPEAKER_07: Like, what did she say to you that help you feel I feel like you were overcoming those those barriers?
• 1:04:33
  SPEAKER_04: It's just the praises.
• 1:04:35
  SPEAKER_04: And Julie also went to a couple of my games when I first started coming back, like a high school game and stuff, and like her complimenting me, saying, like, oh, you look like an athlete, you look good out there.
• 1:04:45
  SPEAKER_04: I just feel like those little comments just like help boost, even though they're so little, it just helps so much with the confidence.
• 1:04:51
  SPEAKER_04: And I feel like confidence is a big key when coming back to play because you might be ready, but mentally, if you're not, it's just not the same.
• 1:04:59
  SPEAKER_04: Like, you're more likely to like um what's the word, like stutter into something and not be a hundred percent sure, and then you're more likely to hurt yourself again.
• 1:05:09
  SPEAKER_07: So yeah, Robbie was smiling with that, like, yeah, go to their go to their games, give them confidence.
• 1:05:16
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah.
• 1:05:18
  SPEAKER_07: Brendan, was that a difficult part for you?
• 1:05:20
  SPEAKER_07: Go integrating back into sport, or did you feel set up and yeah?
• 1:05:25
  SPEAKER_03: Um, there's always that hurdle of actually starting to actually play.
• 1:05:28
  SPEAKER_03: Like, you can run around, you can jog around and like do warm-ups with everyone and feel kind of normal, but then actually going into con or real live sport, like contact sport is way different.
• 1:05:39
  SPEAKER_03: That's the one thing that I had a little bit of hesitation with because like you don't when you think about cutting in your with your there or like just moving around, you think about like, oh, I gotta like flex this leg, I gotta like really focus on bending it.
• 1:05:52
  SPEAKER_03: But when you play, you're like you're going back to how you thought, like, oh, you're worried about what's going on in front of you instead of worrying about what's going on with your leg.
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_03: So finding that like trust in your knee again is a really big thing, and understanding that um it's there, and you did all this work, you've done nine months on it, like you went through everything that it should be ready to go.
• 1:06:16
  SPEAKER_03: And if it doesn't feel ready, just give it a couple practices and yeah, yeah.
• 1:06:21
  SPEAKER_07: I I think that's so good, and I'm gonna ask Ravi and Christine about that too, how they help.
• 1:06:28
  SPEAKER_07: But um what I found really helpful when I was integrating back into sport, and maybe this is where Ravi and Christine have helped their their athletes, is I would go up to one of my teammates and say, Hey, you know, my first month and a half back, I would pick somebody out and I would say, Hey, Britt, like I just need you every time I make a good pass, I just need you to tell me I made a good pass.
• 1:06:53
  SPEAKER_07: Because all I'm thinking about is how I don't know what I'm doing.
• 1:06:56
  SPEAKER_07: And if somebody is telling me that I'm doing something good, I am going to be reminded that I'm doing something good.
• 1:07:03
  SPEAKER_07: So it's an external factor of uh a reminder that I can say, all right, I am, you know, I'm not doing because how many of us left those first few trainings and we're like, man, can I really play my sport again?
• 1:07:16
  SPEAKER_07: Like, can I do this?
• 1:07:18
  SPEAKER_07: Can I make those decisions on the fly?
• 1:07:20
  SPEAKER_07: And I think if you have somebody, and it doesn't always have to be the same person, but say every time I go into a 50-50 challenge, yes, Jord, go for it.
• 1:07:30
  SPEAKER_07: You know, like just some kind of external encouragement can really help you understand that you are never gonna leave that, you're never gonna leave a PT session, you're never gonna leave um your game, your training perfect.
• 1:07:45
  SPEAKER_07: You will always make a mistake.
• 1:07:47
  SPEAKER_07: And mistakes are good, and mistakes help you grow.
• 1:07:50
  SPEAKER_07: And so understanding that getting back into playing is not gonna be like, oh, I'm back and I know all the decisions to make that are right right now.
• 1:07:59
  SPEAKER_07: Just like the PT process, just like learning our sport in the first place.
• 1:08:03
  SPEAKER_07: Like, It is a growth process.
• 1:08:05
  SPEAKER_07: And to think of it like that, I think is really helpful.
• 1:08:09
  SPEAKER_07: Ravi and Christine, do you guys go and support your athletes when they get back?
• 1:08:13
  SPEAKER_07: And what does that mean to you guys as PTs to see them back playing?
• 1:08:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um, yeah, I think it's good when you're, especially in the clinic, sometimes when the patients are in front of you because they know what you're looking for and you are teaching them, like they know how you cue, put them with someone else who doesn't know what's going on.
• 1:08:32
  SPEAKER_02: Like I will put them with an aide.
• 1:08:34
  SPEAKER_02: When the aide knows that I'm looking for, I'll be like, I just watch this.
• 1:08:37
  SPEAKER_02: Like have them do something, and then I'm not gonna be watching, or I'm watching from a distance, and then like you know, they feel less they're less scared if I'm watching because it like the way you know you're ready to go back is if you're not scared, like if you're scared, you're not ready.
• 1:08:51
  SPEAKER_07: Like, I know right, and you're making like instinctual mo movements, not like, oh, I think Christine's gonna do this next, and then yeah, how about you, Robbie?
• 1:09:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so then they just feel like ready to like they feel more confident that it's like, oh yeah, you did this good or whatever, and then like then you know, like, okay, you could try some other stuff for me.
• 1:09:13
  SPEAKER_01: The seeing the athlete back on the field or on the court is probably the most rewarding part of doing my job of being a PT, and you kind of see that whole process.
• 1:09:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like a lot of people don't see that, but you see that whole process of when they came in and they had surgery or whether they didn't, and they worked so hard to get back to that return to sport process.
• 1:09:38
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the biggest things is connecting the physical to that mental piece.
• 1:09:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, the goal is hopefully they're going together, and the rehab should be uh preparing them for that.
• 1:09:50
  SPEAKER_01: But sometimes that physical comes along and the mental it takes a little bit of time, and especially to that return to sport process.
• 1:09:57
  SPEAKER_01: Because as Brendan said, it's like you can do all these drills, but as soon as you get on the court or on the field, it's the intensity changes, you're around your friends, you're more competitive, all those things change.
• 1:10:10
  SPEAKER_01: So that's where there's a smooth transition, you know, if not really focusing on time, but let's say the athlete is hitting those return to play markers of 90% and all those things, then there's a smooth transition of one-on-ones to more open environments, to more reactive-based uh challenges, to integrating to three on threes or 5v5s, like being able to slowly ramp up that process instead of there's this one day you cross that threshold and it's like your return to play.
• 1:10:45
  SPEAKER_01: It's like, no, it should have been this process all along.
• 1:10:48
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, no, it's so, and I hope everybody hears that if you're going through rehab right now.
• 1:10:55
  SPEAKER_07: Is I I feel like confidence is built in that return to play process of okay, today I got to, you know, I everything I do is soccer.
• 1:11:05
  SPEAKER_07: Like my thought goes soccer first.
• 1:11:07
  SPEAKER_07: Today I got to be a part of our warm-up drill.
• 1:11:09
  SPEAKER_07: Today I got to go into passing.
• 1:11:13
  SPEAKER_07: Now I get to play a neutral player, you know, like those are small steps that are building the confidence.
• 1:11:19
  SPEAKER_07: So, because if you're just thrown back in, you're not nobody's gonna be confident in that because you're like, I just remember feeling like, okay, my brain knows what to do, but my body is not there yet.
• 1:11:29
  SPEAKER_07: Like, my body is not quite there.
• 1:11:32
  SPEAKER_07: Um, so that's a really good point.
• 1:11:35
  SPEAKER_07: We have about nine minutes left now, and there is one more question that I really want to get to because I think that it is so powerful, and I hope that we can all get to it.
• 1:11:44
  SPEAKER_07: Um it is what has been the most rewarding part of recovery for you?
• 1:11:51
  SPEAKER_07: Um, and I think this is, you know, we should look at this as a challenge that we can choose, right?
• 1:11:58
  SPEAKER_07: We get to choose what we get out of it, and it's gonna be difficult, but there is gonna be a reward, uh, you know, an internal reward, a mental reward, an emotional reward, a physical reward.
• 1:12:11
  SPEAKER_07: So um, is anybody ready to share that right away?
• 1:12:17
  SPEAKER_07: Brendan?
• 1:12:18
  SPEAKER_07: Okay.
• 1:12:19
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I I I guess I can go.
• 1:12:21
  SPEAKER_03: I guess one of the things is kind of saying, like, this is one of the one of the toughest things I've done um in my life is coming back from this thing.
• 1:12:30
  SPEAKER_03: And it challenged me in so different, so many different types of ways, like physically but also mentally, and just being able to come out of that and say, I was at probably one of the lowest points, and then I'm all the way back up to returning to play and being feeling back to my normal self and not having second second thoughts about it, is just feeling like a normal person again and feeling like an um athlete again and just feeling normal because you always feel like you're one step behind when you're recovering from these things.
• 1:13:02
  SPEAKER_03: You're always feeling like I'm so close, but I'm so far at the same time.
• 1:13:06
  SPEAKER_03: So I guess just feeling normal is one of the most rewarding things.
• 1:13:10
  SPEAKER_07: Do you feel stronger in any way?
• 1:13:13
  SPEAKER_03: I definitely do, both mentally and physically.
• 1:13:15
  SPEAKER_03: I feel like I could not do anything, but I tell myself I feel I can do anything.
• 1:13:20
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, you can.
• 1:13:22
  SPEAKER_07: Yeah, we believe we believe in you.
• 1:13:26
  SPEAKER_07: Megan, were you ready?
• 1:13:27
  SPEAKER_07: You want to try?
• 1:13:28
  SPEAKER_05: I can go.
• 1:13:29
  SPEAKER_05: Um, I think for me, getting back somewhat or almost near full function of my knee has been really rewarding.
• 1:13:41
  SPEAKER_05: Um, I couldn't bend my knee past like 90 degrees for over a year or like straighten it as like had 15 degrees off extension.
• 1:13:49
  SPEAKER_05: So just being able to have that range of motion, like range of motion.
• 1:13:53
  SPEAKER_05: I never thought that that would be something that I'd look forward to in life.
• 1:13:56
  SPEAKER_05: So just being able to regain that or being able to lift my leg, it's the littlest things that you wouldn't think of that can be the most rewarding.
• 1:14:05
  SPEAKER_07: Can we all just take a second and acknowledge Megan and how strong she is?
• 1:14:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, Megan.
• 1:14:13
  SPEAKER_07: I don't know.
• 1:14:14
  SPEAKER_07: I don't know if I would be that strong.
• 1:14:17
  SPEAKER_07: I don't know.
• 1:14:18
  SPEAKER_07: But like you, nine surgeries, what you went through before surgery, what you went through during it, you my friend, are very strong.
• 1:14:29
  SPEAKER_07: Thank you, and your perseverance is inspiring.
• 1:14:33
  SPEAKER_07: Thank you.
• 1:14:34
  SPEAKER_07: You got a lot of people rooting for you now, so we know you can do this.
• 1:14:38
  SPEAKER_07: I appreciate it.
• 1:14:41
  SPEAKER_07: Of course.
• 1:14:44
  SPEAKER_00: Are you dying?
• 1:14:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you want to go?
• 1:14:47
  SPEAKER_04: Okay.
• 1:14:47
  SPEAKER_04: Um so something that's been really rewarding for me.
• 1:14:50
  SPEAKER_04: I have like the same idea as Brendan.
• 1:14:52
  SPEAKER_04: Um, but just like the physical and mental side of it.
• 1:14:56
  SPEAKER_04: Mentally, I feel like I've become a lot stronger and like being able to like look at the positive things within such a like down low situation, you know.
• 1:15:06
  SPEAKER_04: So I feel like that's something that's very rewarding for me.
• 1:15:11
  SPEAKER_04: I love that.
• 1:15:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um for me, since mine have been 13 and seven years ago, it's been interesting, but the thing, you know, to everyone's point here is what I've taken with me throughout life at this point, it's appreciating the process of it.
• 1:15:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's such a long process, and I've become more focused on how the process is more important than the outcome.
• 1:15:39
  SPEAKER_01: And if you focus on the process itself, the outcome just comes out the way you want it to, usually.
• 1:15:47
  SPEAKER_01: And so that's one of the biggest things, and then just focusing on just getting 1% better every single day, um, taking the small wins and strides, and it's applied to so many other aspects of my life.
• 1:16:00
  SPEAKER_01: And I remember the ACL, my first ACL injury, especially, was one of the lowest points of my life, and I know that if I could have gotten through that, that I can get through the rest of whatever my life is to bring.
• 1:16:13
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah, yeah.
• 1:16:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:16:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I would say like I definitely agree with that.
• 1:16:19
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's like the physical aspect is definitely there.
• 1:16:23
  SPEAKER_02: Like it's definitely rewarding to see your body like change, but I think it's nice to just be like in a spot where you know you're you have the ability to heal.
• 1:16:32
  SPEAKER_02: Like, there's a lot of things that can go wrong with an ACL.
• 1:16:34
  SPEAKER_02: There's a lot of things afterwards, you know, like you know, you could have your um graph fail, you can have other things happen.
• 1:16:40
  SPEAKER_02: Like some people never regain their mobility back.
• 1:16:42
  SPEAKER_02: So I think the most rewarding part is just being able to do like to know that I'm healing and I'm gonna like it's gonna get better.
• 1:16:51
  SPEAKER_02: And like, you know, just like being happy that like I can go back.
• 1:16:55
  SPEAKER_02: It's gonna be time, but like it's better than not being able to do anything.
• 1:17:00
  SPEAKER_07: Oh, so good.
• 1:17:01
  SPEAKER_07: Gratitude, gratitude that our body knows how to heal inside, that we can get better, that we have the ability to have surgery, all these things, you know, I think is so they're so important to our mindset, to our the mental side.
• 1:17:16
  SPEAKER_07: Um, guys, thanks for sharing all that.
• 1:17:18
  SPEAKER_07: I think for me, as we we start to wrap around, wrap this up.
• 1:17:22
  SPEAKER_07: I don't know if you can read this, Robbie, but it says the process.
• 1:17:26
  SPEAKER_07: Cool.
• 1:17:27
  SPEAKER_07: I mean, Robbie, yeah.
• 1:17:28
  SPEAKER_07: I, you guys, I'm I'm very obsessed with the process.
• 1:17:30
  SPEAKER_07: Very, very obsessed with it.
• 1:17:32
  SPEAKER_07: I feel like ACL, what I learned is ACL rehab is a microcosm of what life is, is that things will hit you out of nowhere and they will sweep you off your feet and you will be devastated.
• 1:17:46
  SPEAKER_07: And you get to decide will it define you or it will it refine you?
• 1:17:52
  SPEAKER_07: And I think that we're all choosing for it to refine us, saying, all right, well, I was given this for a reason.
• 1:17:57
  SPEAKER_07: I'm going to choose growth in this.
• 1:18:00
  SPEAKER_07: I am going to choose that I can show up.
• 1:18:03
  SPEAKER_07: And sometimes showing up means balling your eyes out to your PT because I did that multiple times.
• 1:18:09
  SPEAKER_07: Sometimes showing up means sprinting for the first time, kicking the soccer ball, making a three-point jump shot, whatever it may be.
• 1:18:19
  SPEAKER_07: Sometimes that's showing up, but knowing that you're not showing up for anybody else but you, that you can do this, that you can get through this.
• 1:18:27
  SPEAKER_07: And I think that the trust that we've created with um, you know, one of the reasons we're doing this is to talk to physical therapists and to people going through the process right now is say, like communication is key, right?
• 1:18:41
  SPEAKER_07: That's something that I take from all of this.
• 1:18:43
  SPEAKER_07: What you guys said, communication helps build the trust, not only with you and your knee again, but with you and your PT, with you and the people around you.
• 1:18:53
  SPEAKER_07: That um having what I like to call rad activities, random acts of distraction, having those activities, whether it's your friends or it's learning to play the guitar or doing something creative that taps into that endorphin feeling that you get from your sport.
• 1:19:10
  SPEAKER_07: These are really important things to do throughout your recovery because it allows you to understand that you can be empowered in this process.
• 1:19:19
  SPEAKER_07: It allows you to feel like you have a little bit of control, even though we don't have control over a lot of things.
• 1:19:27
  SPEAKER_07: And it gives you tools to help you heal through difficult situations, which we're all gonna face throughout our life, right?
• 1:19:35
  SPEAKER_07: And I think last year we used a lot of those tools to help us get through a difficult season.
• 1:19:40
  SPEAKER_07: So um, gosh, you guys, I just want to say thank you.
• 1:19:45
  SPEAKER_07: Thank you to Matt for putting this on.
• 1:19:47
  SPEAKER_07: Um, ACL study day.
• 1:19:49
  SPEAKER_07: Thank you for bringing us all together.
• 1:19:50
  SPEAKER_07: I learned so much from each and every one of you.
• 1:19:53
  SPEAKER_07: And I appreciate your honesty and vulnerability.
• 1:19:57
  SPEAKER_07: Um, two other very good, important things that we learn in this process, right?
• 1:20:01
  SPEAKER_07: Um, but really just thanks for participating in this.
• 1:20:04
  SPEAKER_07: And I hope everybody watching took as much out of this as I did.
• 1:20:08
  SPEAKER_07: Uh thanks for signing up for ACL Study Day and being a part of this.
• 1:20:11
  SPEAKER_07: That's it for us.
• 1:20:12
  SPEAKER_07: We'll see you guys later.
• 1:20:13
  SPEAKER_07: Bye guys.
• 1:20:15
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, wow, what an amazing conversation.
• 1:20:19
  SPEAKER_01: You get so much insight from different experiences, different age levels, people who are anywhere from right out of surgery to people who are years out.
• 1:20:30
  SPEAKER_01: So I hope you guys were able to take something away from this conversation.
• 1:20:35
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, these people really did make themselves vulnerable in this conversation, and it takes a lot.
• 1:20:41
  SPEAKER_01: But I think it's important for everyone who is listening to this podcast and who's going through this process, understand some of the things that they may have to face and take it from people who have already gone through this process and who have experienced it.
• 1:20:56
  SPEAKER_01: So um go show these people some love.
• 1:20:58
  SPEAKER_01: Their information is in the show notes.
• 1:21:01
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, they were super awesome.
• 1:21:03
  SPEAKER_01: So, thanks to you guys who are on this episode, and thank you guys who are listening because this is exactly why we do it.
• 1:21:12
  SPEAKER_01: So that's it for today, everyone.
• 1:21:14
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you all so much again for listening.
• 1:21:17
  SPEAKER_01: This is your host, Robbie Patel.