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The Leadership Rule That Works at Every Company Size · Speak In Flow

• 0:02
  Melinda Lee: Welcome to the Speak & Flow podcast where we help CEOs strengthen their leadership teams so that they move forward together. Today we are talking about breaking the CEO founder's trap. How do we build the team, the organization, so not everything runs to you. And joining me today is an amazing leader. He's a CEO and
• 0:27
  Melinda Lee: co-founder of Maslow, FinTech for Nonprofits.
• 0:31
  Melinda Lee: And they represent close to 2 million nonprofits around the United States. I am so, so thrilled that he's over here going to share his expertise with us. His name is Kian Alavi. Welcome, Kian.
• 0:45
  Kian Alavi: Thank you. We do not represent 2 million nonprofits. There are approximately 2 million nonprofits across the United States.
• 0:53
  Melinda Lee: Got it.
• 0:53
  Kian Alavi: We serve, we serve many of them, and we actually are serving in, 47, maybe more states right now.
• 0:59
  Melinda Lee: across the United States. So.
• 1:01
  Melinda Lee: It's huge. I mean, what you do is amazing. It's a huge space. And so thank you so much for joining us today. And there's, I'm just going to get right to the first question.
• 1:12
  Kian Alavi: Go ahead.
• 1:13
  Melinda Lee: There's a busy CEO out there or leader who has stopped to listen to this episode. What do you hope would change in the way that they lead and the way that they run their business when they really take into consideration what you're about to share with them?
• 1:28
  Kian Alavi: So, I think every leader, whether you're called a CEO or an executive director, and you might… you don't even… you could be a CEO of a department in your organization, and you're not named a CEO, but… and every leader goes through a journey, and if you're at a more mature company.
• 1:46
  Kian Alavi: the conversation that we would have would be different. If you're at a younger company, the conversation we would have would be different. I'll just share with you generally my experience. So I have worked
• 1:57
  Kian Alavi: at very large organizations and companies, Fortune 500, and I've also worked at, small, and medium-sized nonprofits, and now, I am leading Maslow as the co-founder and CEO.
• 2:09
  Kian Alavi: So, what you'll hear today is my take on the things that are most important when it comes to… sorry, I think that was my computer. But, what's most important when it comes to leading. And I think some of the principles always transcend, regardless of where you are. So, just being a fantastic listener.
• 2:28
  Kian Alavi: Being able to pause and analyze versus reacting, being able to manage your calendar, make time for yourself.
• 2:37
  Kian Alavi: Being able to empower those around you, to lead. There's a lot of principles that are grounded in servant leadership. If you haven't looked at servant leadership, I think that's really important stuff.
• 2:48
  Kian Alavi: So yeah, happy to share what I know.
• 2:51
  Melinda Lee: I love that. Thank you so much for bringing that, because I think that we're constantly striving, pushing, and trying to achieve so many things, and so, like you mentioned, just bringing back the groundedness of pausing.
• 3:04
  Melinda Lee: and serving, I think, you know, it's just so important. And so, can you share more to the audience about what Maslow does?
• 3:13
  Kian Alavi: Yeah, Maslow is a financial platform for nonprofits, so we focus on multi-entity nonprofits, or large nonprofits, typically called fiscal sponsors. We also serve a lot of small nonprofits, so you can come to Maslow.
• 3:27
  Kian Alavi: And we will essentially make your accounting, compliance, and administrative headaches go away with fantastic technology and an amazing customer support team.
• 3:37
  Melinda Lee: And how did you get into this?
• 3:40
  Kian Alavi: So I left corporate America, right around 30, and I took a little time off. And one of my last projects, was in a neighborhood in San Francisco called the Tenderloin.
• 3:52
  Melinda Lee: which.
• 3:53
  Kian Alavi: be considered a pretty tough, tough neighborhood.
• 3:56
  Kian Alavi: And when I was there, I moved my office over there to solve out this work. And every day, I saw amazing children walking these very hard streets every day to school and from school. And so when I took a pause and tried to decide what was next, that idea kept coming back into my mind.
• 4:15
  Melinda Lee: was.
• 4:15
  Kian Alavi: possible. Where are these kids? Who are these kids? Are they safe? Et cetera. And so a Google search led me to volunteering at an after-school program on Eddy Street, if folks are familiar, in the Tenderloin. And then that started a journey of nonprofit and social impact work. So my heart caught a fire for the work.
• 4:34
  Kian Alavi: I ended up starting a nonprofit, doing it all wrong, shutting it down and becoming a fiscally sponsored project of another nonprofit and really learning the ropes of running a nonprofit from amazing mentors and leaders while we scale.
• 4:49
  Melinda Lee: good.
• 4:49
  Kian Alavi: The programmatic work we did. And now going into about.
• 4:54
  Kian Alavi: close to two decades of this work. I followed, so I went from starting a program.
• 5:00
  Kian Alavi: In one spot with, you know, just a little bit of, a couple chessboards and some pencils and stuff.
• 5:06
  Kian Alavi: Mhmm. And then two, we had, you know, multiple locations, and then we had vans, and then we're at schools, and it kept growing, and it still runs today.
• 5:16
  Kian Alavi: And then we merged that project in with our nonprofit sponsor. I went on to become the deputy director there.
• 5:24
  Kian Alavi: I started ripping apart the back office, trying to find some leverage and some efficiency.
• 5:30
  Kian Alavi: I followed the problem out the door, so…
• 5:32
  Melinda Lee: Mmm.
• 5:32
  Kian Alavi: For me, this is more of a mission versus.
• 5:37
  Kian Alavi: build a company.
• 5:38
  Kian Alavi: I'm kind of on a mission from God, if you will, to.
• 5:42
  Melinda Lee: Mmm.
• 5:42
  Kian Alavi: solve this problem and make it easier for nonprofits, the folks across this country.
• 5:48
  Kian Alavi: 10% of our workforce that are caring the most for our communities make it easier for them to run their organizations.
• 5:54
  Melinda Lee: Oh, it just gives me chills. It really does.
• 5:57
  Kian Alavi: Thank you.
• 5:57
  Melinda Lee: Because I really… I do meet with a lot of CEOs, entrepreneurs, leaders, and I… like, you're… the way that you're connected to your mission, and it's so deep from, you know, going so far back, it just gave me the chills.
• 6:10
  Kian Alavi: Thank you.
• 6:11
  Melinda Lee: Yeah. So you've you've worked from ground zero all the way up and scaled, and you've worked with so many different teams and leaders. And I think that, you know, when we're so committed to the work.
• 6:23
  Melinda Lee: We can also find ourselves admitting everything as a CEO and co-founder. It's like, you know, but then it's like, when does it become too much? When does it become, okay, you have to step back and actually see and look at the, you know, look at the vision, look at the what's coming up next versus in the weeds. And so, can you share with us, either for yourself or where you see other leaders falling into that? What is an early warning sign when you're like.
• 6:48
  Melinda Lee: Okay, you're going too deep.
• 6:50
  Kian Alavi: Yeah. I mean, look, I think every leader has challenges and the work is never done, right? And so, and leaders are, when you solve a problem, I learned this once from a great friend, when you solve a problem well, you get a bigger version of that problem to solve.
• 7:08
  Melinda Lee: And.
• 7:09
  Kian Alavi: Well, that problem, well, you even get a bigger version, right?
• 7:11
  Melinda Lee: Okay.
• 7:12
  Kian Alavi: Moving up a leadership ladder, if you will.
• 7:14
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, yeah.
• 7:15
  Kian Alavi: And so you're always going to be climbing a mountain and facing a challenge.
• 7:19
  Kian Alavi: I would say, you know, your your internal operating system really matters. So, what does it mean to be grounded? What does it mean to have space in your life so you can think through these problems versus reacting? You know, what is your operating system? How do you care for yourself? Like that's paramount from inside.
• 7:36
  Kian Alavi: When you move to outside, the people you work with is the company you built.
• 7:45
  Kian Alavi: or the nonprofit you build. And so, a seminal book, if you haven't read it, you should. It's, Jim Collins, Good to Great. I've read that book many times. I try to read it every few years.
• 7:56
  Kian Alavi: But really it, it, it distills down, you know, that people are so important and having the right people around you really matter. And so if you have the right people around you, then you can trust them to solve those problems. And, if you are creating an environment where they can,
• 8:15
  Kian Alavi: test themselves and push themselves forward, that environment has to allow for mistakes and course correction.
• 8:22
  Kian Alavi: And so as a good leader, and I studied under other leaders, and I'm constantly studying to be a better leader, I think you make space for people to be their best selves.
• 8:32
  Kian Alavi: You stay close to them to make sure that you're unpacking and solving problems with them that they're having a tough time with.
• 8:39
  Kian Alavi: And it's okay to fail, right? It's okay to fail. And so, if you can do that and surround yourself with great folks, then…
• 8:46
  Kian Alavi: You don't have to feel the urge to do everything.
• 8:49
  Melinda Lee: the.
• 8:50
  Kian Alavi: And symptomatically, I think something to just kind of look at.
• 8:53
  Kian Alavi: is your inbox.
• 8:55
  Kian Alavi: I mean, can you get through your inbox every day? Does your inbox invoke fear or pain or whatnot? Because I think that's a real sign of, like, okay, I have all these people reaching for me.
• 9:07
  Kian Alavi: That are requiring of me something.
• 9:10
  Kian Alavi: And if I don't get back to them quickly, then, I haven't done my homework for them, and they're.
• 9:15
  Melinda Lee: No.
• 9:15
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 9:16
  Kian Alavi: I think if you have great people around you and you've set up an environment where they can excel at themselves and really lean into their potential, your inbox should be quieter or more manageable.
• 9:28
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, yeah, I like that. That's a good… that's a good early warning sign, is when you're seeing so many requests, so many things come in into the inbox. And then also, I like to, when you started off, you started off with, it started off from yourself. Like, how are you managing your own internal state, or what are you doing that you need?
• 9:46
  Melinda Lee: to… to also, if it's an early warning sign that you're… you're losing that, staying grounded, or whatever that you need to do first, from your… for yourself first, and then what do you do for the external? What are the early warning signs that things are breaking?
• 10:01
  Kian Alavi: that.
• 10:01
  Melinda Lee: are not working well.
• 10:03
  Kian Alavi: Right.
• 10:03
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, yeah. And but why is it then so difficult? So I hear CEOs say, I want to let go. I want to give more delegation. I want them to take more ownership. And they say they want it.
• 10:14
  Melinda Lee: And then… and then also, they… they won't… they'll start to exercise, and then they don't. It's like they're… they're giving up… giving up on it, pretty much.
• 10:24
  Melinda Lee: Why is it that they say they want it, but then they don't end up doing it?
• 10:27
  Kian Alavi: Well, look, I don't know what's going on inside of any leader's head. I can only share what's going on inside of my head.
• 10:34
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 10:35
  Kian Alavi: When… when you are, passionate about something and you lead, it possesses you.
• 10:43
  Melinda Lee: Yes, yes!
• 10:45
  Kian Alavi: It's not something that you clock out on.
• 10:47
  Melinda Lee: Right.
• 10:47
  Kian Alavi: Always there and there's always more to do, and that can lead to like a, a neurotic level of control.
• 10:55
  Kian Alavi: or micromanagement.
• 10:57
  Melinda Lee: Yes.
• 10:57
  Kian Alavi: not gonna get done right unless I do it. Right. But the truth is that,
• 11:03
  Kian Alavi: That's just false.
• 11:05
  Melinda Lee: That's.
• 11:06
  Kian Alavi: is false. If you have great people around you and you're communicating and you're, and, and they're empowering you to do your work and you're empowering them- Yeah … you'll get done better and faster. And so- Yeah … if you can't let go, if, if you can't let go…
• 11:21
  Kian Alavi: Why can't you let go?
• 11:23
  Kian Alavi: I don't trust that person.
• 11:25
  Kian Alavi: I didn't set that person up with the right conditions to be successful.
• 11:30
  Kian Alavi: Right? I don't really know what I'm asking of this person.
• 11:35
  Kian Alavi: And then figure it out myself.
• 11:38
  Kian Alavi: Or,
• 11:39
  Kian Alavi: You know, I was never led that way. And, you know, it's very it has to be an authoritarian chain of command, super hierarchy type thing. Some environments that works and the larger the organization.
• 11:53
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 11:53
  Kian Alavi: It has to be more systematized and kind of top down. But for anyone who's building and for most of the folks that are in medium-sized organizations, especially organizations that serve the community, you know, the flatter, the better.
• 12:07
  Melinda Lee: yeah, yeah.
• 12:09
  Kian Alavi: responsibilities, should be able to run, and should be able to meet the challenges without you. So, and if that's not the case, then I think you need to inspect your process, and just to ask yourself, you know, the question behind the question, why can't I?
• 12:23
  Melinda Lee: Right, right. Yeah, and have you been in an environment where it's purposely set up that… let's say, why can't I? The answer to that is not because I want an authoritarian style or organization. The answer is because I don't… I'm not sure I trust them.
• 12:41
  Melinda Lee: I haven't set up the environment where they could succeed. And so have you been in an organization where it is organized in a way where people know their role or they know how much, can you walk me through how much, you know, decision, what are the decisions I can make? Like how have that been set up in a way that's intentional so that people can thrive and take ownership and move the business forward?
• 13:06
  Melinda Lee: forward.
• 13:07
  Kian Alavi: Yeah, I would start with the inverse. In the environments that I've been in, that everything is extremely systematized.
• 13:14
  Kian Alavi: And you're just kind of a cog in the machine.
• 13:16
  Melinda Lee: it's.
• 13:17
  Kian Alavi: Stifling of creativity.
• 13:18
  Melinda Lee: Right.
• 13:19
  Kian Alavi: Just a ticket taker, you know,
• 13:22
  Kian Alavi: There, there's no…
• 13:23
  Melinda Lee: In and out.
• 13:24
  Kian Alavi: There's no love lost if you're not going to be there.
• 13:27
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 13:27
  Kian Alavi: Your investment in the organization is just enough to get your paycheck, et cetera. Yeah. And so, and I think that's fine for really big, large companies and whatever, but if you're building a company or you're building a nonprofit.
• 13:40
  Melinda Lee: Right.
• 13:41
  Kian Alavi: Or an organization, like, that's the last thing you want.
• 13:44
  Melinda Lee: Right!
• 13:45
  Kian Alavi: What you want is you want people to be creative, and you want them to make an investment of themselves, with their creativity, and that will multiply the outcomes and the effects. And Maslow, for example, we have a small team of 12 dedicated, really just like.
• 14:03
  Kian Alavi: best folks, some of the best folks I've ever worked with.
• 14:06
  Kian Alavi: And what's coming out of this team is insanely amazing, incredible and beautiful because everyone's living their potential out in this product and their.
• 14:17
  Melinda Lee: Hmm.
• 14:17
  Kian Alavi: This platform and this service, and they're invested.
• 14:19
  Kian Alavi: And they really care. So, you know, I think if you are…
• 14:25
  Kian Alavi: You know, you know. As a leader, you know.
• 14:28
  Kian Alavi: You absolutely know. And if you don't know, then you shouldn't be leading.
• 14:32
  Melinda Lee: feel.
• 14:32
  Kian Alavi: If you don't know and you want to be leading, then you need to slow down and figure it out. But you know if people are giving it their best.
• 14:38
  Kian Alavi: This is not 996 BS Silicon Valley culture.
• 14:42
  Kian Alavi: nine to nine every day, six days a week. Like that's like social signaling, like machismo.
• 14:51
  Melinda Lee: I.
• 14:51
  Kian Alavi: A good company has great people that give it all, don't leave things undone, know how to pace themselves, and know that this is a marathon.
• 15:00
  Kian Alavi: Because every day, if they put a little bit more forward, and a little bit more forward, and they do that day after day, incrementally, you build something exponentially beautiful, right? And so you know. You know if somebody's not there, not… doesn't have their heart in it. Yeah. And so then your job is to figure out, can you help them
• 15:17
  Kian Alavi: be creative, get their heart in this work, or help them move on to another job that's better for them, so that you can open that space up, and get the right person in there. And if this is…
• 15:28
  Kian Alavi: you know, I don't… Jamie Dimon's not going to listen to me, if you will.
• 15:33
  Kian Alavi: Because Jamie Dimon's done Jamie Dimon's work, and has, you know, hundreds of maybe thousands of people working for Jamie Dimon, and that system is a system that works. But if you're building, and you're a small to medium-sized
• 15:45
  Kian Alavi: Startup, nonprofit, or company, you want creative people who are invested, and if that's not the case, you need to figure out why.
• 15:54
  Melinda Lee: How do you, how did you, did you purposely create, I love what you said earlier when your people, you sounded like you've hired the right people. And then now they're turning their expression outward. Are there things that you do within Maslow to set that up, that type of environment? Yeah.
• 16:13
  Kian Alavi: We're a very open organization, we're very transparent, we communicate, we have… Excuse me.
• 16:22
  Kian Alavi: Forgive me, I'm just, I got what was going around recently.
• 16:25
  Melinda Lee: I know, I got it, I had it too.
• 16:27
  Kian Alavi: It's back in school, and the bugs.
• 16:28
  Melinda Lee: if.
• 16:29
  Kian Alavi: running around, you know, and, this organization has been shaped by everyone that has been in it.
• 16:37
  Kian Alavi: And the culture of the organization is the people of the organization. So we demand transparency of each other. We're very plain spoken. We can have difficult conversations, all the things that you would want in a great environment.
• 16:53
  Kian Alavi: And I think my part is,
• 16:57
  Kian Alavi: Ensuring that we select the right folks.
• 17:00
  Kian Alavi: And then when it doesn't work out, ensuring we move quickly to help that those folks move on to the next thing. So.
• 17:07
  Melinda Lee: Week.
• 17:07
  Kian Alavi: Make space and get the right people on the team.
• 17:11
  Kian Alavi: I think one of the things that leaders get stuck with is like.
• 17:14
  Kian Alavi: oh, it's going to take so much to replace this person, or oh, I don't know if I can deal with that right now.
• 17:20
  Melinda Lee: But.
• 17:21
  Kian Alavi: I would say that that's… That becomes your company.
• 17:25
  Kian Alavi: I don't know if we can get that done. I don't know if we can deal with that right now. Like, that's not just a people problem.
• 17:30
  Melinda Lee: company.
• 17:30
  Kian Alavi: any problems.
• 17:31
  Melinda Lee: So.
• 17:32
  Kian Alavi: I would say it, it just really matters,
• 17:35
  Kian Alavi: to…
• 17:36
  Kian Alavi: Create the space, make sure the right people there, and then help those people that aren't supposed to be there, you know, go in the right direction. And hopefully you get better and better at that as you go.
• 17:47
  Kian Alavi: less and less mishires, if you will.
• 17:49
  Melinda Lee: Right. Right. No, good for you, because it can be challenging to have those conversations when it's not right, and the person's not right for the job, and so to really address that quickly and swiftly, because you know it's not just that the team or the one person, it's the whole organization that's impacted.
• 18:08
  Kian Alavi: The team sees it.
• 18:09
  Melinda Lee: understand.
• 18:09
  Kian Alavi: And the team's living it too. If you don't do that, you're not doing it for your team.
• 18:14
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 18:15
  Kian Alavi: communicating.
• 18:16
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 18:17
  Kian Alavi: Communicating that ill-fitting person, they might be a great person. They might not just, maybe the job has changed, maybe the company's changed, maybe the job has altered and their skills haven't caught up. Maybe they're really focused on this one thing and that's what they need to do elsewhere.
• 18:36
  Melinda Lee: I don't know.
• 18:37
  Kian Alavi: It's not always like it's a bad person or a bad.
• 18:39
  Melinda Lee: Right.
• 18:39
  Kian Alavi: Not the call. But if…
• 18:42
  Kian Alavi: Sorry, it's a it's a bad person, therefore it's a bad fit. It could be a great person and a bad fit, or a not so good fit. And so if you're not getting out in front of that, you know, what are you telling your team and and who you know who do you become as an organization?
• 18:59
  Melinda Lee: organization.
• 19:01
  Kian Alavi: I think the CEO's job is to be fierce.
• 19:05
  Kian Alavi: and defend and protect their team.
• 19:08
  Kian Alavi: Make sure they get the best talent they can.
• 19:10
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 19:11
  Kian Alavi: organization.
• 19:11
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, I love that. I love that. You know, and it's so important to have the right talent, to get the right talent and, and.
• 19:18
  Melinda Lee: And it's challenging, but once you have them, you can see the progress and all the…
• 19:23
  Melinda Lee: the good that it does as a team together. It's really amazing what people can do together. And so, can you share with us the little nuanced way of the difference between delegating to one of your key people, or, like, really, you see that they're owning it?
• 19:43
  Melinda Lee: You know, you could delegate a task, but then how… what's the difference between… is there a slight in the way that you lead? How do you help someone take ownership versus just delegate the task?
• 19:55
  Kian Alavi: Yeah.
• 19:58
  Kian Alavi: Delegation can be a tricky word, right? If you're not careful, it just sounds like you're shipping your work to other people.
• 20:07
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 20:07
  Kian Alavi: I think if you're,
• 20:09
  Kian Alavi: If you're delegating appropriately, you're actually shipping their work to them.
• 20:14
  Melinda Lee: Right.
• 20:15
  Kian Alavi: So, hey, you are leading product. This is what your space is. This very important thing came into my purview. Maybe I was talking with a customer or whatever. It's one thing to say, go build this.
• 20:27
  Melinda Lee: Because.
• 20:27
  Kian Alavi: I said so, and I'm delegating this task to you. It's another thing to say, hey, this came forward.
• 20:34
  Kian Alavi: Seems very important. What are your thoughts?
• 20:37
  Kian Alavi: where you are. And sometimes it'll be like, hey, we've already been working on that. Other times it'll be like, hey, that's really important. Let's start working on that. And other times it'll be like, hey, we just haven't heard that come up from enough people for that to be the case, right? And so, you know, when we think about delegation, you should be delegating with intention and purpose.
• 20:57
  Kian Alavi: The other thing is, is that lots of things
• 21:01
  Kian Alavi: That come into your task list.
• 21:03
  Kian Alavi: Don't need to get done.
• 21:05
  Kian Alavi: Right. You're tracking everything and there's a bajillion tasks. And if you look back at your hindsight, you know, hindsight, you're like, I always end up prioritizing what gets done and some other things that I thought were important.
• 21:17
  Melinda Lee: the.
• 21:18
  Kian Alavi: becoming important and I put them in an icebox, right?
• 21:21
  Kian Alavi: So, you wanna be careful about delegation. You wanna make sure that you're shipping over to your colleagues what matters to them and what supports their work.
• 21:30
  Melinda Lee: versus.
• 21:30
  Kian Alavi: Drowning them in, you know, I don't know, unnecessary or mundane tasks.
• 21:35
  Melinda Lee: and when do you see it that they really take ownership of it?
• 21:40
  Melinda Lee: of the… Yeah.
• 21:42
  Kian Alavi: I mean, look, if they don't take ownership of it, they're not going to do it well, and it's not going to get done quickly.
• 21:48
  Melinda Lee: Right.
• 21:49
  Kian Alavi: And if they take ownership of it, it gets done well, it gets done quickly, and you never have to follow up on it.
• 21:54
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, right.
• 21:55
  Kian Alavi: If you have to follow up on it, maybe there's a bigger problem.
• 21:58
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 21:59
  Kian Alavi: The problem is there's a misalignment between you and them. Maybe it's you that got out of alignment, right? Maybe not just them, right? So I don't like to think of this as top down or maybe, you know, they're drowning in work.
• 22:12
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 22:12
  Kian Alavi: You're not seeing them.
• 22:14
  Melinda Lee: Yeah.
• 22:14
  Kian Alavi: Skipping them tasks and they can't get caught up, or maybe they're going through something and they need a little grace. So, I think if you have the right people on the team, then usually the reason why tasks don't get done or ownership doesn't take place.
• 22:29
  Kian Alavi: It's not because you need to motivate your team, it's probably because there's misalignment or something else there.
• 22:35
  Kian Alavi: Yeah. I think probably the hardest thing to do is to stay aligned with your team.
• 22:41
  Melinda Lee: Yes.
• 22:42
  Kian Alavi: It's been said over and over, the CEO's job is a lonely job. Yes. And there's a reason for that, right? All the responsibility, falls on you at some point, and then you have to deal with all of the really hard pain.
• 22:54
  Kian Alavi: Right. And then when your team wins and your company wins, you should be shining the light on everyone else, right? I mean, that's that's again, you need to be fierce for your team.
• 23:03
  Kian Alavi: To stand in your authority for your team.
• 23:06
  Melinda Lee: and.
• 23:06
  Kian Alavi: And make sure that you're doing everything you can to support them.
• 23:10
  Melinda Lee: So.
• 23:10
  Kian Alavi: If… if you're shipping a task.
• 23:15
  Kian Alavi: And they're not doing the task.
• 23:17
  Kian Alavi: something's not aligned.
• 23:19
  Kian Alavi: Either they're not equipped, they're drowning, or they're not they don't agree with what you're saying.
• 23:25
  Kian Alavi: And you could be isolated as a CEO.
• 23:28
  Melinda Lee: Right.
• 23:28
  Kian Alavi: And you are, and you get out of enlightenment.
• 23:31
  Melinda Lee: Right, right.
• 23:32
  Kian Alavi: Staying aligned with your team is probably the most important thing.
• 23:34
  Melinda Lee: Right.
• 23:35
  Kian Alavi: And make sure that everybody's okay.
• 23:38
  Kian Alavi: Again, servant leadership, so that you know that you're clearing away any obstacles that would stop them from being their best and doing the work they came to do.
• 23:46
  Melinda Lee: Yes. Yeah. And so as as Maslow continues to grow, how do you plan to stay aligned with your teams? How do you see what are you excited about as Maslow continues to grow?
• 23:58
  Kian Alavi: You know, we've, we've continually modified how we communicate internally, you know, from monthly to weekly, different types of standups and things.
• 24:07
  Melinda Lee: the.
• 24:07
  Kian Alavi: We're not married to any meeting on the calendar. I'm constantly trying to get people to wipe meetings off their calendars and not let meeting bloat just kind of stick in there. So what am I excited about Maslow as we move forward? We're solving a huge problem.
• 24:27
  Kian Alavi: Right now, it's incumbent upon all of us who are working in this space to grow this space as quickly as possible. Today is October 2nd, the jobs numbers aren't good, right? People are struggling. This is a really tough economy, and that means there's going to be more and more folks with needs out there, already are.
• 24:47
  Kian Alavi: That are straining our systems and that are.
• 24:50
  Kian Alavi: hurting in our communities. So to build technology that gives nonprofits the ability to move faster.
• 24:57
  Melinda Lee: the.
• 24:57
  Kian Alavi: And to cost less to run their back office and to deal with their compliance and their books and their administrative work is like, this is amazing stuff that we get to do and every one of us gets to know that.
• 25:09
  Melinda Lee: Sounds complicated.
• 25:11
  Kian Alavi: super jacked. We love what we do.
• 25:14
  Melinda Lee: Wow.
• 25:14
  Kian Alavi: And everybody works their butts off to get it done. We have an amazing base of customers whom we love and whom loves us.
• 25:22
  Melinda Lee: great.
• 25:23
  Kian Alavi: for that. And they guide us and they tell us when we mess up. They have sharp elbows.
• 25:27
  Melinda Lee: Yes.
• 25:28
  Kian Alavi: And so, I'm just very excited about this work, and to continue this work. We won't slowly grow this team like we have. I think there's a lot of leverage now for folks to build more.
• 25:41
  Kian Alavi: Build faster without having to build a larger team. And I think the future of this work means smaller teams, which means closer teams and faster.
• 25:52
  Kian Alavi: moving team. So I'm I'm just generally excited about this moment in time and to have this challenge.
• 25:59
  Melinda Lee: Oh, wow, thank you so much for doing that. Thank you so much for getting, yeah, the funds to the people that really need it. And so, who are you looking to connect? If there is somebody that's out there that you're looking to connect, how can they get ahold of you?
• 26:12
  Kian Alavi: If you're a nonprofit leader and you just want to jam on administrative, accounting, finance, fundraising, anything that matters that you want to jam on, please look me up. I'm on LinkedIn.
• 26:25
  Kian Alavi: We have some YouTube channels out there. You can find us at Maslow, M-A-Z-L-O.com, and that will link you to everything. We're here to hear from you, we're here to serve you and support you, and thank you for all you do.
• 26:39
  Melinda Lee: Wonderful. And what is the one last takeaway that you want the listener to have?
• 26:46
  Kian Alavi: What is if the listener is the CEO, find a way to be happy and to be the same you every day.
• 26:54
  Melinda Lee: moment.
• 26:55
  Kian Alavi: You gotta be the same you every day. And if you can't be the same you every day, that means your team is constantly trying to figure out who you are each day. And that's gonna be really hard for them to be great in their role if they're Yeah.
• 27:08
  Kian Alavi: if they're not sure of who you are. So for the CEO listener or the leader listener, that kind of starts with the inside. It's been a long journey to figure it out for myself. Everybody's got their own routine, but find a way.
• 27:21
  Kian Alavi: Excuse me, find a way to be the same you every day.
• 27:24
  Melinda Lee: get.
• 27:25
  Kian Alavi: It can't be the same you every day. Take a breather. Take a breather. Don't bring it to your team, right? Because they got other things to worry about. For the leaders in the nonprofit space, if you took anything from this, I appreciate it because I spent the time in nonprofit work. But for those folks, please find some time to rest because I know that.
• 27:45
  Kian Alavi: They're all working really hard right now.
• 27:47
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, and then sometimes we're so overwhelmed, and then we have to be somebody that we're not, and then…
• 27:54
  Melinda Lee: You become somebody else over time if it lasts too long, right? So that, that, that break is so important. And then I love what you said too about if you can't be yourself, then your team members, people around you won't know who, and they're gonna spend their time trying to figure it out. And so, and I think that when we are who we are, then there's more grace they have, they can see that they know that you're not perfect, and that actually allows them to connect with you and want to be able to serve you.
• 28:19
  Melinda Lee: you and be, you know, a part of the team and the mission even more so.
• 28:23
  Kian Alavi: Totally. Be you, be vulnerable as it makes sense. Be emotionally available as it makes sense.
• 28:28
  Melinda Lee: Right, right.
• 28:29
  Kian Alavi: How to say sorry in your in the context of leadership and work.
• 28:33
  Kian Alavi: Make it OK for others to do that, you know, show up and be the best you every day and be the same you every day.
• 28:38
  Melinda Lee: Yeah. Oh, thank you so much, Kian. I think that that's super, that was a really fabulous tip and I, I, I concur. So thank you so much for your time. I had a great conversation today.
• 28:48
  Kian Alavi: Appreciate it, keep up the great work.
• 28:50
  Melinda Lee: Yeah, thank you so much, and thank you, listeners, for being here. Thank you, and remember, anytime you have a chance to communicate, communicate what matters, communicate it often, so your people move forward together and do good in the world. Take care. Bye-bye.
• 29:05
  Melinda Lee: Bye, Kian.
• 29:06
  Kian Alavi: Thank you so much, Melinda. Take care.
• 29:08
  Melinda Lee: you.