Latest / Age Defiantly with Mark Young / [Ep 15] Can This Device Help You Age Better? | Dr. Rowena Gates

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[Ep 15] Can This Device Help You Age Better? | Dr. Rowena Gates · Age Defiantly with Mark Young

0:00
Welcome to Performance Driven Living, the podcast where we question everything.
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We don't tip to around tough topics, we walk right into them, not to provoke, but to
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get closer to what's real.
0:13
You might not agree with everything you hear, and that's okay.
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The show isn't about being right, it's about being real.
0:20
These conversations are meant to stretch your thinking, challenge assumptions, and spark
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something deeper.
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The views shared are those of our guests and may not reflect those of the host or team.
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And while we dive deep into health, performance, and transformation, this is not medical advice.
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Talk to your doctor before making changes to your health or lifestyle.
0:42
Take what lands, leave what doesn't, but whatever you do, don't stop questioning.
0:56
If you hear back on the Performance Driven Living podcast, and I know I say this a lot
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when I say that I have the honor of being joined by a guest, but literally today I am
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honored to be joined by my friend and in smarter than anybody I know guest, Rowena Gates.
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And I say that mostly because it makes her uncomfortable.
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Yeah, but and it's not true.
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Usually he's very honest.
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I am.
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If you've ever heard Rowena speak and had the pleasure of hearing Rowena speak, it's
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just like she's able to take complex scientific things and break it down into ways that I think
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people can digest, which that is actually your gift, in my opinion, is that you're able
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to take super complex things and deliver it in a way that people actually wrap their heads
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around it.
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And to me, that's a big it.
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That's a huge gift.
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Geniuses and simplicity, not complex.
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Wow.
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From you, that's a compliment, and I'm not going to argue, I just, I'm going to like it.
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Well, she accused me of having cheat notes, but now she gets to learn why.
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And that is my team puts together these intros, and I'm going to tell you, they write these
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better than I could ever actually deliver them.
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So I always read this intro Rowena because it's going to do you so much more justice
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than I ever could.
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So I am joined here today with a brilliant mind in cellular health and regenerative wellness
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Dr. Rowena Gates.
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As the senior vice president of the N3 corporation, Rowena is at the forefront of NANOV technology
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helping people support their body's natural repair mechanisms.
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If you missed our first episode with Rowena, I encourage you to go back and listen.
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But today, we're having the conversation and going a little bit deeper, exploring performance,
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longevity, and where recovery meets innovation.
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Isn't that a great intro?
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That's a great intro.
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I know, seriously, right?
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Well guys, Rowena, this is, this is my interest in what Rowena does.
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And that is, she runs, she's senior VP and her husband Hans Eng, who is one of the most
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charming people that you'll ever meet.
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I love Hans.
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They actually own NANOV, which is the ANG3 corporation, is the official title on that.
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But NANOV is a technology that, if anybody listened to our other episode, it actually
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uses, it actually supports, I'm going to make sure I, Rowena, is your water.
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See, I told you, you had to bring your water on camera.
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Excuse me.
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That's a terrible tip.
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So NANOV actually uses ordered water, strangely enough, to support protein function and protein
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folding.
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And we've talked about this before.
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But today, Rowena, you've got some new science that's out about this.
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So when you learn that we were all in the same place again, you were like, oh, I need
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a part two.
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Yeah.
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And I'm excited for that, because one, I love you.
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But second, I want to, I want to know what this part to is, because you know that I love
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your science.
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And for our audience, I don't think most people in the general population even understand
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the importance of protein function.
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We take it for granted.
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And I always say when people think protein, they think lean chicken.
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And fair enough, because that's a protein.
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Because it's protein, right?
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But the word protein kind of gets thrown around a little bit more than you would expect.
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Well, there's almost two types.
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There's the type you eat and then the proteins in your body and the proteins in your body
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not only make up almost everything in the body, they do all the work in the body.
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So if we're talking about those proteins rather than the ones you eat, which you need
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to eat to get, you know, feed this whole system, right?
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You're eating the protein to create proteins in your body to accurately function.
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So basically the short story is your body, when you eat the salmon or the chicken, your
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body shreds that down to the individual amino acids, which can then be built back up
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into whichever proteins the body needs.
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And it's doing this constantly on the fly.
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Super rapid.
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There can be 10,000 proteins in each cell.
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So there's just massive amount of activity that's protein activity.
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But it didn't really thought about that before ruining it.
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But it's like when you're taking in protein to your diet, obviously those proteins are
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being broken down into amino acids, which are then rebuilding into proteins.
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But there's no specific rebuild your body decides what it needs, which is the intelligence.
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One thing I know about Mark is he likes peptides, and peptides are just small proteins.
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If it's less than 50 amino acids, they'll call it a peptide.
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Peptides are kind of the smaller ones, are sort of unique in the fact that they don't
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necessarily have to be completely shredded to individual amino acids, that your body can
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sometimes utilize that sequence that's the peptide and just shove it in where it's needed.
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So kind of like you're breaking down the protein into amino acids to rebuild.
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And when you're taking peptides, you're actually starting with the amino acid, it's
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step two.
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Correct.
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It's already partially assembled.
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Not necessarily all of them, but there's certainly that can happen with peptides.
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And so when you shorten that cycle and you go directly to where it's needed, then you
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can notice those benefits of peptides.
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I love that.
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Go ahead.
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The peptides like the proteins, they'll have to function once they're in there.
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And even if you put a peptide in, there's probably going to be a multitude of protein functions
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that are necessary for all the biochemical processes that actually turns that into work
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or tissue and what has to get done in the body.
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Let me ask you.
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And teach me, like the goal of this podcast is for me to always be learning things because
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as you know, like I just have this weird curious mind that wants to know everything I possibly
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can.
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And then the minute I learn something, I realize how many other things I don't know.
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So we eat protein that protein breaks down into the smallest form that it possibly
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can.
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It's reduced down into amino acids and then the body uses its incumbent intelligence
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to decide what we need to build.
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When we take a peptide, whether that's topically through an injection orally whatever, when
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we inject a peptide, it's a partially assembled strand, obviously, right?
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So it's a short chain, so not all the way down to an individual amino acid, but a partially
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assembled amino acid, but not so much so that it's already a protein, right?
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Is that kind of bypassing the body's intelligence by telling the body what we want that amino acid
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to rebuild as?
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Does it make sense?
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I think that if you were, you're maybe kind of bypassing part of the machinery, but
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not overriding it, because if you're, it's just going to get shredded if your body doesn't
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need it.
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Oh, that's interesting.
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There's water down there for you, too.
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Oh, man.
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So, let me ask, like, so NanoV is the technology that that Rowena specializes in, and this
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is the idea of every cell in the body exists in a, I'm going to call it a water capsule,
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because water surrounds that cell, and in essence kind of holds it together and supports
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the cellular membrane, and then proteins obviously function within that, but we had a conversation.
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I actually had a conversation this week, if you met John Hacker, he's with a company
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called Zenbud, and particularly when you came in today, before we recorded, I'd actually
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done a podcast with him earlier today, he runs a company called Zenbud, which actually
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uses ultrasound technology to stimulate vagal tone and actually reduce obviously sympathetic
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nervous system response, which is leading to a phenomenal increase in HRV.
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Now, the first thing that came out of your mouth when I saw you this morning and said,
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I understand we've got new clinical information about what NanoV does.
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What is it?
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Like, what is this?
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And you went, well, specifically, not just performance, but related to HRV.
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And I'm like, wow, I say, there's no coincidences, right?
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You're coming in to talk about HRV.
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Can you actually unpack what HRV is for our audience, for someone who may not have listened
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to that episode?
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But the heart rate variability is the beat to beat difference.
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And excuse me, you don't want to really, you don't want it to be exactly the same time
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between each heart beat.
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You want some variation, that's the variability.
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And that shows your systems resilient and it can respond to changes.
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So when you increase that, you're increasing resilience.
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And there's lots of ways to improve heart rate variability.
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To some extent, meditation, breathing, walking in nature, there's ways to calm your autonomic
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nervous system.
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But people tend to be overstressed, we tend to be bombarded.
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So often it helps to get some extra help in bringing people out of stress mode.
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And so then there's various ways to do that.
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And it sounds like Zen Buds found something effective.
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Well, the way that I, typically, and that's exactly what HRV is, so I'm not disagreeing
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with you on that.
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The way that I kind of explain it, because I'm always trying to take a page from the
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Ruina Gates playbook and make complex things simple, and that is, HRV to me, it is heart
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rate variability, obviously, but it's the ability of your body to flip from sympathetic to
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parasympathetic nervous system easily, which is when you get in a heightened state, how
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fast do you calm down?
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Correct.
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And not getting into a heightened state when it's appropriate.
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Exactly.
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Exactly.
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Just because somebody, you know, made a loud nose over there doesn't mean there's a tiger
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attacking you, and you have to go off the chart with your stress hormone.
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And one of the conversations I was talking about was every time my phone dings, doesn't
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mean that someone died, right?
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Sometimes it's a good news test message, and we get conditioned into these alerts that
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our phone gives us, and these dopamine hits that we're getting all the time are keeping
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us in this sympathetic nervous system, and we live in a high anxiety society from it.
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One of the ways that I explain that HRV is that if you and I were to go run down the
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street a half mile, you may do it in four minutes, I may do it in five minutes, but that
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doesn't mean you're in better shape than me, measuring who's in better shape is who
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recovered from that sprint faster.
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Correct.
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That if, after a five minute sprint, I was back to normal in 30 seconds, and after a four
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minute sprint, you were still panting, I'm in better shape.
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Yes, and we have a study of really older study that was done on athletes.
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For that very reason, they're watching HRV very closely with high performance athletes,
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and this was done by an elite trainer on these high performance athletes, to show how
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the anatomy device influenced their HRV, and those were impressive results, where these
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guys that are highly tuned could still benefit a lot from using the device, and then what
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happens if they see HRV dropping when they're training, they're going to put them into
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a recovery mode and take them out of the stress mode so that they don't overstress the
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athletes.
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So they watch that.
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And there's a lot of sports, and I'll say high performance athletes, yes, because I'm
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going to use a couple of different examples there, and I know you work with a lot of big
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name athletes with Nanol V for that reason, because they understand the science, and they
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understand how it actually works, because they've used it.
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But I'll give the example of an American football player, you run down the field and you
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may have this sprint, but then you get all this time off while we change to the next
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down.
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So you get a recovery period between every play, that's just the way football is played.
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But you put a bunch of guys in, say, European or non-American football, soccer, they don't
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get the same type of breaks all the time, like you're sprinting all the way down the
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field and you may stop for a second, but you may be sprinting back to the other side
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of the field.
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Like, there needs to be fast recovery between plays, because you don't get the downtime
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between plays.
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Correct.
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And they have a lactate issue, if they're doing the whole distance at full tilt, you know,
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it's that build up a lactate that's going to slow them down in the last 10 yards.
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Correct.
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And it's the body's ability to actually remove that.
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Correct.
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And that process now, now specifically then, so taking that football versus football example,
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when a soccer player is running like that, lactate build ups, obviously going to lead to them
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slowing down in the last 10 yards, which is probably the most important 10 yards of the
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game.
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Exactly.
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Because that's where you're going to the goal.
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Obviously, they want to perform there, but also to my point, there's a lot of back and
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forth in a game like that, or a basketball game where they're running back and forth, or
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where I know you have a lot of chops in auto racing.
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Yeah.
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You don't get time off, but you don't park the car for a couple of minutes to get a break.
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Like, you're going sometimes for hours.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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Like, how does the body recover during hours of flow state from training in advance?
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The race car drivers use it like in the pits before they get in the car, but it's the
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training.
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They've honed their bodies, their mind, and their body to these really high levels.
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And then they're managing, and they're monitored too.
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So if their heart rate speeds up and somebody might come over and tell them, hey, take it
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easy there because they can see what's happening to them physiologically, and some states are
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not sustainable.
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So you, one of the things I love about NanoVee is that one of my favorite topics is oxidative
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stress.
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And you know this.
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Like, I love the topic of oxidative stress because I don't think it's understood enough.
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And yet, literally, I call it the opposite of longevity.
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I totally agree with that.
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It's also the opposite of performance.
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Fair.
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So oxidative stress is the opposite of performance, is the opposite of longevity.
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Probably it's the bad to anything that we would compare it to as good, but this idea that
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longevity is literally, you know, you're going to run longer as long as you're not rusting
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along the way.
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And oxidative stress is kind of the rust that, that tin man symptom syndrome that starts
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to happen over time.
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And I always say that our body knows how to clean some of that up, like our body understands
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a topology.
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Our body understands how to get rid of oxidative stress and repair and we can eat 10,000 blueberries
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and we can take all of our supplements that will help with oxidative repair.
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But we're in an aging state all the time, right?
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And aging is, I say it's oxidative stress, like it's oxidative stress build up on the
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body.
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Now, NanoVee, and this is what I love about this is because it's such an almost counterintuitive
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science that I just breathe in vapor and my oxidative load goes down.
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And I know you wouldn't say that because you're far too, or far more worried about what FDA
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would say about some words, but you're actually helping support your body's ability to remove
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that oxidative stress.
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Right.
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And there's lots of ways you can see that.
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There's indicators that there's less oxidative stress on the system.
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And that includes inflammatory markers or even skin.
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There's lots of indicators of that.
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What we can say for sure is that when you damage proteins, which by oxidation, they recover
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faster and better, you have viable proteins after damage when a real device has been
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used instead of a placebo device or a sham device.
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Right.
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And that's about more than four times as many viable proteins when they're damaged with
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oxidation and treated after.
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There's four and a half times as many viable proteins when the NanoVee device is used
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before the damage.
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Now, I want to say just to unpack the word viable protein, what you're saying is undamaged.
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Correct.
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So, there's a sample and they damage it usually down to only 10% down to about 7% are still
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functioning after damage.
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And then they see what happens if they use a real device or a sham device which has been
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turned off inside, but you still get exactly the same.
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Right.
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So, when you look at that comparison and you think, okay, my proteins are going to get
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damaged with oxidative stress.
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That's where most of the damage is because proteins are all over the place.
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As our mitochondria, which are creating the oxidative damage, then if you can have four
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and a half times more of those proteins recover after that damage, that's profound.
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That's a huge benefit in terms of oxidative damage.
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And I'm going to have used this example quite a bit, that is the idea from an oxidative
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stress standpoint, I want to say like your body only has so much energy, right?
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And it's almost, I always use it like a Wi-Fi type signal, right?
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That it has to make decisions as to how it's going to use the energy that it has and it's
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only going to use it in so many different areas and it's going to allocate its energy to
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different systems in the body, right?
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This amount needs to be allocated towards digestive.
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This amount is going to be allocated towards the brain function and when any system in the
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body requires more energy, that energy goes away from another system, right?
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Like some other system suffers, it's not as if your body does all of this and then increases
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it on here that there's a limited bandwidth and that energy is going to come from somewhere.
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When you've got that much damaged protein and maybe I'm asking a weird question here,
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but when we end up with that much damaged protein in a particular area, it makes me think
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of secondary infection that is when you've got so much damage from whatever's happening,
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whatever's causing this oxidative stress, in order for your body to heal and support
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the area that has all of the damage, would it be true that every other system is paying
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the price for that?
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I think it depends, yes, and I'd say yes and no in a way, because the damage is kind
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of ubiquitous, oxidative damage, it's everywhere in the body.
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If you're acutely injured, absolutely, you're going to reallocate to that side and it's
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one of the reasons to not go out and stay awake all night and really trash yourself because
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you're going to bring every system down and sure enough, you end up getting sick because
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your immune system was taken down, but I would say we can up level that whole system and
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you asked me about new results, well, we can show better oxygen utilization.
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So now you, instead of having, you've gotten more overall to divide up, you're still going
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to have to divide it across systems in the body, but we've just increased the whole pie,
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so you have more energy to work with, so you are the rising tide that's lifting all
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exactly, exactly, that's what you want to do, you want to increase in that, we show with
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oxygen utilization, so now your mitochondria is using just the oxygen in the air, but it's
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usually utilizing 11% more, that kind of thing, or it improves your volume of oxygen,
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I exhaled unused, you increased utilization, so now you've increased your energy supply,
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your mitochondria, and so now your body can do more, and it's going to do repair and regeneration
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as a priority. More efficiently too. And that's called anti-aging. But that's amazing, you just
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used said something there that made me think and that is when we breathe, people think I breathe
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in oxygen, I breathe out carbon dioxide, and well that's true, and we learn that in junior high,
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you know, biology class, it doesn't mean we're not also exhaling oxygen.
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Correct, because we're bringing in oxygen and also exhaling to oxygen.
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It's just not utilized, so you can be breathing and never converting, and the extent at which we're
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able to utilize the oxygen we're bringing in is really what matters.
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I believe that, and yes, we can push more oxygen into the system,
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but wouldn't it just be better to utilize it? What's already there? That's a more natural
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approach rather than kind of overriding it with the excess.
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Well, and that's interesting, you say that because HBOT for instance is such a big topic,
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I think, in the longevity space right now in the use of oxygen therapies, but the reality is
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your body still needs to be able to process that oxygen. And, you know, if you're going to use HBOT,
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hyperbarics, love it, do both. Do both. Absolutely do both. And any hyperbaric center,
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you know, put the nanophy after it. Yeah. Because it's got all that regenerative ability,
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and if you're helping with the utilization of all the oxygen just pushed in there,
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then you get a double win out of the hyperbaric session, which is kind of brilliant.
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Well, yeah, I mean, the idea that you're actually, you're helping the efficiency of using that,
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it's kind of like you don't, you can use a lower octane fuel, is that one is you have a better running
23:43
engine. Exactly. You're, you're just making the whole thing work better. Yeah. And now I want to
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segue because you are so interested in things and we just keep moving, but you asked about new
23:54
study results. And one of them relates to this, which I'm fascinated by, it's a month-long study,
24:02
and it was done on people that are 60 or older because they tend to be, you know, poor metabolic
24:09
function and so on. And there's a whole bunch of components to it, but what I think you're
24:14
going to find really interesting is oxygen utilization in the, in the prefrontal cortex,
24:22
the frontal lobe of the brain. And the improvement that people had, first of all,
24:29
all of these people were low, like below where you would want to be. And all of them improved.
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And it was also super interesting that they balanced the, the utilization between the different
24:44
sides of the brain, they tended to be uneven. And during the course of the month, that also even
24:50
out. So the brain is functioning better in a more systematic way. And so I thought you'd like
24:58
that result as it relates to oxygen utilization. Well, one of the things that fascinates me,
25:05
and the brain included with NanoVee, and I'll say that, you know, we're here at the Dave Asprey
25:10
Biohacking Conference this week, which is always like, you know, the hall of fame for everything
25:14
that's going on in, in the longevity and wellness world. So it's always fun to just walk around
25:20
and see what's going on. And I, I see products like deliverance, which are specifically supporting
25:25
liver function, or I see products like Zona that are specifically supporting cardiovascular
25:30
function, or I see a skincare line in this. And what's always interesting to me is each of them
25:36
have a very, an amazing niche and are incredibly powerful at what they do. And by the way,
25:44
I did my liver scan. And he said, my liver was just showing off. And I was like, Oh, well,
25:48
look at that. I can increase my alcohol and I'm kidding. But the, but going to each of these
25:54
have very specific deliverables, right? Like if they're doing clinical trials, they're doing
25:59
clinical trials on the liver. You know, as you know, Zona is an FDA trials. Why? Because it's proving
26:04
the lowering of blood pressure. It's a very specific indication. But what's always fascinated me about
26:11
NanoVee is you say like we popcorn around because we're interested. But the truth of the matter is
26:15
is there is no system in the body that you're specifically supporting. I love that metaphor of
26:22
you're the rising tides that's lifting all ships. Like better oxygen performance is you're saying
26:29
just the utilization of the oxygen that you're bringing in and the functioning of proteins
26:33
will help your liver. And it will help your cardiovascular system. And it helps your skin care.
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Like all of this gets lifted because you're literally you're taking out the oxidative burden
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that's happening just from pipe truthfully. Right. And I want to, I want to just mention something
26:50
because you said earlier or something about these, you know, these proteins just get, you know,
26:54
they get formed. But what if people want to understand your point of how fundamental this is,
27:01
the way the proteins get formed is your DNA is the blueprint for proteins.
27:07
You don't that's that's the role of the DNA. And we all know how important DNA is. But we don't
27:13
really think about it's only job is to build proteins. Yeah. And so it's that fundamental
27:20
of where we operate. You can't get much more fundamentals than that. And so that's why it has
27:28
this sort of crazy benefit all over the map. And it actually makes it difficult from a research
27:34
perspective because you just you can get excited about all kinds of things. We do not go after
27:40
medical claims. We don't go after specific diseases. It's been used for, I've counted over 50
27:47
different chronic illnesses. Right. But we don't actually study the illnesses because that's the
27:52
little silo. That's the piece. That's the liver or the, you know, that whatever that piece is,
27:58
we just are looking at the whole system. So we're looking at things like oxidative stress,
28:03
oxidative utilization, heart rate variability. And those are things, energy production,
28:11
metabolic function is huge for every single thing. And probably all of those 50 chronic diseases
28:18
is metabolic dysfunction. And that's your energy production and how well things are running.
28:24
And so we're just staying at that level. And then you can kind of extrapolate the rest for
28:30
what that means for performance or healthy aging or recovering from illness or injury.
28:37
Have you ever done a podcast with Benazotti? No, but I just, I just had a good conversation with him
28:44
yesterday. And he's very interested in, we'll have an ANOV and he's such a metabolic guide
28:50
that he's perfect for an ANOV. Yes. I would, I mean, if you've got his number,
28:55
else I'll group text you and put you in there. I do have his number. Ben's awesome. And he's
29:00
so normal. Such a nice guy. He's so normal. But like literally in his book, Metabolic Freedom,
29:08
just went New York Times bestseller. Like he's doing such good work in the Metabolic space. And I
29:13
think you're a natural synergy. Like so much. I know. I wish, I wish I'd met him a year ago before
29:19
the book came out. But the truth of the matter is is I want to go back to the systemic support thing
29:26
because I don't think that that gets talked about enough that that systemic support. And it kind
29:32
of puts you behind a weird situation. Like you said, like you're talking about over 50 chronic
29:38
illnesses that you support. But you don't want to put yourself one from a compliance standpoint.
29:42
You obviously from a regulatory position, you don't want to say what you're doing with a
29:47
specific illness just for liability purposes. But you also don't want to niche yourself into one
29:52
field either because you can't put yourself in one space because you're doing overall support,
29:58
which by the way is a terrible way to market. And like, I don't want people thinking about one
30:04
thing. I want them to think about, you know, overall Ben's point of improve your overall style.
30:12
You know, do the things and a lot of them are free, right? Now to be is not free.
30:18
It's wonderful. But there's so many, you know, exercise,
30:23
yeah, severe meditation. I'm walking in nature. You know, it's like anything that you can do to
30:31
reduce the amount of oxidative stress that's happening in your life. And even if you do all those
30:35
things, I understand that you can still need help because our environment is really challenging.
30:42
This is stress inducing at a level that our bodies not, you know, hasn't kind of evolved to cope with.
30:50
And so helping it out makes perfect sense to me. I couldn't agree with you more. I mean,
30:55
the helping out the body with the oxidative stress. And I think the thing, and I know we've
31:00
talked about this. I'm certain that most of our listeners would know this as well. But oxidative stress,
31:05
you know, I laugh because Hans, Hans, I've never gotten over this. One day we were talking about,
31:11
you know, eliminating oxidative stress out of your life and so on. And he's like, you know,
31:14
hair dye does that too. And I was like, hey, you know what? I don't worry about it because it's
31:21
mostly like glitling peroxides and things. I mean, peroxides. You just made me feel better. Yeah.
31:27
But I had to laugh because like Hans got one on me. Funny. And if people don't know Hans, he is the
31:32
German engineer behind this device. And even though his last name is Ang, which sounds more Asian,
31:38
he's a big German guy. He's a very big German guy. And he deserves all the credit for
31:45
the for developing this technology. Brilliant scientists, brilliant and super dry sense of
31:50
humor, which I enjoy. But this idea of oxidative stress, though, it's like, it's, and we don't even
31:56
need to get into the science of EMF and environmental toxins and stuff. Like oxidative stress is coming
32:01
through the food we eat. And it's not eating bad food, eating good food will even cause oxidative
32:07
stress on the body because oxidative stress is just the rust when your body's working.
32:11
And one thing about, I want to just mention one of those. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Does tie in some more
32:15
studies. One thing is oxidative stress isn't just happening. It only happens when your
32:28
antioxidant capacity is exceeded. So otherwise, it's going to be mitigated and it doesn't build up
32:37
and become oxidative stress. But what's happening is we don't have, we don't have enough
32:45
protection to prevent it. And so then it accumulates. And one of the reasons it accumulates is when
32:54
we don't sleep well because that's the chance your body has to address it, get rid of it, repair
33:00
on the fly, then it doesn't accumulate. So it's always sitting there, but it doesn't actually have
33:05
to show up as the rust. Well, and it's like a cell phone charger, right? Like if you don't let it
33:11
charge for enough time. Correct. You're going to burn battery faster the next day. Exactly. And that
33:16
was another aspect of the research that's going to come out is just how significantly the nanoV
33:24
device improved all these aspects of sleep, deep sleep latency of sleep, how rested they felt,
33:34
how much daytime, because they're over 60s, we all need to nap when we're over 60.
33:41
No. But how many, how they felt during the day if they still had energy, if they took
33:46
naps and so on. And all of those things were dramatically improved over the month course of that
33:52
study. I love what you're saying there because I want to, we talk about the longevity space
33:58
specifically. We think of longevity. And I think the first thing that comes into people's mind is
34:03
living a long time. But living a long time is irrelevant if it's not a quality of life for a long
34:09
time as well. And you're supporting the longevity of time, but you're more importantly supporting
34:14
longevity of quality. That this is actually systems are functioning better. I want to go back to
34:21
something that you said because you were talking about DNA and how DNA is the blueprint for all of
34:30
it, right? And I thought you were going in a direction that you didn't, but I kind of want to go
34:34
there for just a quick second. When DNA replicates, and I want you to always correct my science,
34:40
because sometimes I make it so simple that it doesn't even make sense anymore, that when, when
34:45
DNA replicates, it's almost like that photocopy, that the first copy I see, it looks identical to
34:50
the second, the second paper looks identical to the first, and then the third one looks identical.
34:55
But then once I've made a copy of a copy of a copy of a copy, eventually it doesn't look exactly
35:01
like the original. It's huge. You're talking about all of epigenetics, because it's that,
35:06
is there's the transcription, and that's like having a personal assistant that went and rewrote
35:12
the directions, and there might be little errors introduced, or there might be a decision to change
35:17
something a little bit. And then it's translated into the protein and the ribosome is going to build
35:22
the protein. But at anywhere along there, adjustments are made, but it's perfect because that's
35:28
your epigenetics. So on the fly, things can be tweaked to meet the current needs, which are always
35:34
changing, but it's easy to also have with oxidative damage, and you're going to introduce glitches
35:42
that are from not to your advantage. They're not what your body needs, and now you've got something
35:48
that's going to be an unfolded protein that can't get folded, or it misfolds, and so on, so you can
35:56
end up with these, the output is not what you want. It's like a DNA game, a TEML of telephone,
36:02
right? Yeah. Stuff gets passed from one to the next to the next to the next. And the brilliance
36:07
of that is that epigenetic piece is where you can improve. Don't worry if your DNA is not great.
36:14
This is the part you can control, and this is where you can really improve things. So take away
36:20
the stressors and the toxins, and do as many good things as you can, and whatever that DNA said that
36:27
was not nice will never happen because it actually doesn't get built. In the DNA, like, I'll say,
36:36
I always like it to kind of like a jello mold, right? You're pouring in all these amino acids,
36:41
and it's coming out the shape of the DNA, because that's you, that is your genetic expression,
36:46
right? Like the proteins are coming out in the way that they were stamped by the DNA. I know
36:52
probably too simple for you. But the idea is that they're shaped identical, but over time those
36:57
things can start to have problems, right? And we talk about, you know. But when they're shaped
37:03
identical, even that can get changed on the fly, so it might be blue or pink in the same shape,
37:09
but this one's got its arm up, or whatever, little things can be done kind of on the fly either
37:15
or bad. Correct. That's why you don't want oxidative stress in their damaging thing. Because the
37:22
oxidative stress is what makes the bad changes. Exactly. Performance is what makes the good
37:26
changeless that we're able to epigenetically make that change, which is my point. Now my question to
37:31
you is that if you're doing things to offset oxidative damage in the first place, now we talked about
37:39
the amount of bandwidth the body needs to be able to repair proteins or to discard them and build
37:48
new ones in most cases, right? Like if there's too much damage, the body just needs to get rid of
37:53
the damaged cells, you know, autophagy or whatever gets rid of the damaged cells, but then it's got
37:57
to put bandwidth towards rebuilding them because the body needs those proteins. The more you're rebuilding
38:03
a protein in that respect, particularly if you're under a large oxidative burden,
38:08
is there just a greater likelihood that all the new proteins you're building are more damaged
38:13
than the ones they were replacing? It depends on the system. Because athletes build a lot of
38:19
proteins. When you really stress, there's this urgent need, but a healthy athlete can pull that
38:27
off, even though it's a high quantity because the system is tuned up for that. And so that's a key
38:34
factor. But for people who aren't in position or peak performance, somebody who's challenged
38:42
then they can go down there. So it's almost like the tough get tougher and the weak get
38:49
harder. And in part of that is the misfolded or unfolded proteins. If they're not getting taken
38:55
care of and resolved, then they can do damage in the system. And so on a weaker system, maybe can't
39:03
process those new those proteins that are getting created correctly or can't repair the damage
39:10
because proteins are going to get damaged and repaired all the time. And the repair to the protein
39:17
is a protein function. It's just different functions come in and fix it. And so when that's off,
39:23
then you can get protein sticking together. They can end up like plaques and tangles. And
39:31
that's where we really where we see it most acutely is in neurodegenerative diseases.
39:37
I was going to say I know you don't want to go there, but I will say that's in those types of
39:41
tangles is where you do end up with things like like Alzheimer's and dementia. You do end up
39:46
in cancers. You do end up with these types of things that all relate to as you mentioned,
39:50
neurodegenerative disease, which can be things like ALS or muscular sclerosis or any of these things
39:57
that are leaking cellular energy. Yeah. And it does seem like whether it's just more Parkinson's
40:04
and there's more of these things. And I think that's because systems are more challenged than
40:10
ever before in history. They're just decaying. And what I love is like you're kind of like rust
40:14
repair. Like you're just repairing the rust that's going on in the body. Can you do me a favor? I want
40:19
to make sure, you know, before we wrap, I want to make sure that you get enough time to explain
40:24
you talked about the brain and the studies and the imbalance that was taking place hemispherically
40:30
in the prefrontal cortex of the brain. What does that mean? I mean, how does that actually literally
40:37
translate to a person's cognitive function? Because when we talk about the brain, it only means
40:42
something if I actually notice a performance difference. Right. And you mentioned 60 plus people
40:47
were the ones that we were doing this on. Like is this restoring cognitive function?
40:52
The better oxygen utilization in the brain is absolutely an indicator that the brain is
40:59
functioning better. It's coming more online. And that's things like neuronal communication,
41:07
the neuroplasticity, things like that, that it has to be working better to use that extra oxygen.
41:18
So you'd say it's an indicator of it. So my stepmother has recently been struggling with,
41:24
I would say, she would say cognitive issues, right? And she recently did a brain scan. She
41:32
and my dad had both went and had a scan done. He's fine. But she says you would imagine. Of course,
41:39
he's fine. I know this man. But she actually is actually on the scan. Actually came back and had
41:46
a certain amount of atrophy in certain areas. And their areas that actually would relate to
41:53
short term memory, fast cognition. And when I say fast cognition, I mean, you know a lot of people
42:02
that are like, you know what I mean, right? Like that kind of that kind of thinking where the
42:07
communication just doesn't flow. And it can often come across as language issues because they'll
42:13
forget a word. And then we'll trip up the next sentence because the word that they were looking
42:19
for was missing. And I always tell, you know, she's like, oh, it's just so frustrating. I'm like,
42:24
no, I'm like, all you need to do is anytime that happens, just say, what is the word in English?
42:28
Like, because then people will actually just think you're bilingual and it's not a problem.
42:31
But the reality is is like, she's noticing those things. And she's really struggling with it.
42:37
And for people, my grandmother's doing the same thing right now at 85. And she's like, oh, honey,
42:43
I just can't think. And I'm going to say that it actually becomes a point of shame.
42:48
Oh, sure. Like they're embarrassed by it, especially high performers.
42:52
Yes. And they're the ones who've really used their brain a lot and
42:56
burned a lot of oxygen in their brain. So would you say that, you know, this better oxygen
43:02
utilization in the brain, particularly, you know, as it relates to oxygen use and protein
43:07
function and whatnot, like, is that? Would you notice? I know you said things like neuroplexity
43:14
and better oxygen utilization. Do they notice the difference that words come more quickly?
43:20
And gods are easier to form. I don't have the data on the tip of my tongue. They definitely
43:28
report feeling moods better, feeling, you know, more well-being and so on. I don't know specifically
43:37
about memory and recall processing speeds. And actually, those are probably things you want to
43:44
measure in separate measurements because there are ways to test that pretty directly.
43:50
So I think you'd want to base that information. It'd be interesting if you did like a memory test
43:55
or something like that. And actually do before and after it's on memory tests. That would be
43:59
interesting. Or just, yeah, the response tests because those will show up. And that's one thing
44:06
that Dave Asprey does at 40 years of Zen. They do testing and they do brain training and they can show
44:13
a significant improvement when they do the brain training with the NanoV versus without it.
44:18
They can get people to much higher levels. And so at 40 years of Zen, they've used them both.
44:25
When you do the cap training, which by the way, it's not the fun part of 40 years of Zen,
44:29
I think the food is the fun part of 40 years of Zen. I've not done 40 years of Zen yet.
44:34
But it's a wonderful experience. But I think that it's very measurable with the cap training is
44:42
what I'm saying. And that's how you want to measure that performance. Yeah, yeah. No, I love that.
44:47
And I love the idea that, you know, this type of stuff is there is that rising tides lifting
44:52
all ships, like all systems benefit from systemic support. Right. And and the necessity of having
44:58
that into everybody's, I'll say the quiver, right? They're not even separate. If your stepmother
45:05
slept way better, she might find she has better recall on things. Agreed. And so on. You know,
45:11
this is all one system in that you just, as you say, you want to lift the whole system
45:16
overall upgrade. And I think that makes complete sense. And like I said, like with that, with people
45:22
that are doing that support, I'm a person I always talk about the holistic picture of a person,
45:27
right? Like we can improve one system, we can improve one, what I'll call the dimensions of
45:31
wellness. You know, we can improve our physiology, but how is our physiology improving our social
45:38
engagement? And how is our physiology improving our spiritual engagement? And how is our physiology
45:43
improving our economic status? Like, and the truth matters is with a holistic support biologically,
45:51
all of these things improve. Right. But it's not just about improving the way the body functions,
45:57
because when the body is functioning better, every aspect of life functions better, like
46:02
oxidative support will actually increase brain function. It increases sleep. Well, the better you
46:07
sleep, the better you are socially the next day. Like, okay, let me just riff off of that for example,
46:12
because you asked a little while ago about the oxygen utilization about from the brain and the
46:18
difference left and right. And that, that plays in here because when somebody is dominantly
46:24
right brained or dominantly left brain, they don't necessarily have that flow that ease. It might
46:31
affect their mood, for example, how they interact with people because they're just driving too hard
46:37
on one side of their brain and you want it more balanced. And that will play out in what you're
46:42
saying. Yeah. In these aspects of life that are a little less tangible, but super important,
46:49
how does what's your relationship like with your family or how, you know, do you get grumpy or
46:56
angry or whatever, all of these different things come into play. And that's really essential
47:02
in quality of life. Exactly. And that's, and that's when I think of this, like we can dive deep
47:08
into into the protein function and unfolding proteins properly to make sure that metabolic
47:14
function is working the way it should and all this other kind of stuff. But the reality is is
47:18
people want to know what that means in terms of how my quality of life functions. And some people
47:22
want to go down that rabbit trail and get into, you know, my DNA just produced pink versus blue
47:28
type conversations. And the reality is is the way I just came home and kicked the dog is a better
47:33
indicator of how life value is going. Right. And that's why part of our research, some of it's very
47:38
analytical and measurements of the physiology. But we have really incorporated these quality of
47:44
life surveys. Let people report back. Let's see what they have to say and what they experience.
47:51
And I think it's that combination that's the most potent. You know, let's not forget this is a
47:57
person with with values and priorities and and and things that we want to understand if we're
48:05
helping them in that regard versus their, you know, their A1C went down or say, I mean, who cares
48:12
if you live to be 120 year old hermit because you can't even get along with people, right? Like
48:16
the reality is is when I'm always looking at why am I doing what am I doing? Like, and it's like
48:22
sure I can take a handful of supplements every day and I can eat right and I can use an ANOV
48:28
and I can introduce all these other modalities in life. But the real result is not in a methylation
48:36
test. The real result is how much of am I enjoying my day? Am I worried about my health so much
48:43
that I'm becoming detached from social engagement? Yeah. And that's biohacker issue actually,
48:49
especially the the measurement if if it's a burdensome with all these different metrics and
48:55
measures you have to keep up with. You're causing an accidentive stress worrying about it.
49:00
And the other thing that I really backed off on because I felt like I want to be tuned into my
49:07
own body on my own. I don't want the ring to tell me how I slept. I need to keep in touch with my
49:14
body and know how I slept. Yes. And I think we can separate ourselves from, you know, what we're
49:22
meant to do, which is feel it ourselves. If we allocate it to a device. So I think there's
49:30
some issues there with a biohacking to find that balance. I mean, since we're at a biohacking conference,
49:37
find that balance between getting indicators but also staying in touch and in tune with with
49:43
yourself without the metrics. I'm going to tell you this. I love that and I love that rising
49:49
tides is lifting all of it kind of support that NanoV provides because supporting all systems
49:54
in the body ends up supporting all dimensions of well-being, not just physiological. And that to
50:00
me is the most important thing is how do we live a holistic life and not a life in a biohack box.
50:07
I actually was talking with Dave a couple weeks ago and one of the things I said like Dave right
50:13
now is in a healthier place than I've seen Dave in a long time. And I don't mean because of, you
50:19
know, life situations or anything else. But I mean, writing his new book heavily meditated
50:24
has I believe shifted the way that he just seems very at peace, which is unusual for a biohacker.
50:34
Like biohackers and these people that are out for like high-end performance and stuff like that,
50:39
like they tend to be aggressive overachiever, move the needle, move the needle type people.
50:45
And I love the fact that that, you know, again, I'll say NanoV, but any modality that's able to
50:51
lower your sympathetic nervous system response and just support you being in a healthy state.
50:58
Like relationships aren't built in sympathetic, right?
51:02
Or not good ones. Not good ones. Yeah, fair, fair, not good ones anyways.
51:07
But relationship itself is not built in a sympathetic response, right? You may be able to build
51:12
some finances in a sympathetic response if you're, you know, that guy, but not sustainable
51:19
stuff. Like the aggressive people aren't the ones that win in the market. It's the patient people
51:22
that win in the market. It's the ones who know how to play the long game. That exact,
51:27
careers aren't built in sympathetic. Maybe some spikes are one because of those on the field moments.
51:35
But a life of sustainability is built in that parasympathetic, everything getting its right
51:41
allocation of energy. A real life is built that way. And I think that's what I love about what
51:48
you're talking about because we're not talking about one particular modality and how it affects
51:52
this one niche area. You're just overall support, right? Which is a terrible marketing message.
51:58
I know. But it is the one we all need. No, it is this overall boost and the things built to last
52:03
a lifetime. So seriously, right. The device is going to be around for as long as you are. So no big deal.
52:09
Ruina, I always love talking to you. So that's always exciting for me. I'm going to tell anybody
52:14
here, please go check out the NanoV. You're going to want to do that. Go to eng3.com. That's
52:20
eng3.com. Everything will be down in the show notes. Please check out Ruina and anything you want to
52:26
learn about her. If you can chat GPT her, it'll come up with complete bios about her. Last time I did
52:31
it, if you remember, it was quite a while ago. And it like you won like an Olympic gold medal or
52:35
something. I don't remember. Congratulations on that. I know how to train chat GPT. There you go.
52:43
But I do encourage you go check that out. Again, the goal of a life well lived is a life that you
52:49
actually get to enjoy. Absolutely. And I love Bobby Kennedy uses the quote that a man who has one
52:56
problem has zero dreams. But a man who doesn't have that problem has 100 dreams. I'm sure I'm
53:02
misquoting that. But our lives are meant to be lived with purpose. But if I'm sick, I only have one
53:09
purpose. And we don't show up in the world in a way that makes everything around us better if
53:14
we're so focused on our own well-being. We need to show up as whole people. And I believe we're
53:20
meant to be of service. We're meant to contribute. And that's a responsibility. So that responsibility
53:26
is then to keep yourself in good shape. In every aspect of health, not just your physiology,
53:33
but your mood, your emotion, whatever spiritual practice is show up as the best version of
53:41
yourself. And then you can contribute and really have a meaningful life. I was just talking with
53:49
JJ Virgin yesterday and I love JJ. And we were going through this whole thing about when her
53:55
son got into the accident and so on. And she was telling the story about how when that happened
54:01
to him is when she was like, first of all, I do hard things. I was already in a physical and
54:07
mental place that when that happened, I was prepared for a crisis because everything was already
54:13
functioning high. And she's like, and I had to make the decision that, you know, I'm probably
54:18
misquoting. But she really said and she goes, I knew that when he was in a coma, in an ER,
54:24
in an ICU for so long, and she's like, I owed him keeping myself in top physical performance
54:32
because I couldn't get sick because then I couldn't be of benefit to him. And she says,
54:37
and I worked out every day. And I took every supplement that I take every day. And I worked
54:44
every day from a hospital. She's like, because letting me go didn't benefit him. She said,
54:50
for the length of time that he was in that hospital and through his entire recovery,
54:54
she goes, I so much as didn't even get a cold. She's like, because I kept myself in top
54:59
performance the entire time because that's the only way that I was going to be of service.
55:05
Wow. And I was like, she is remarkable. Right. I was like, what a way to show up in the world.
55:10
Yeah. Yeah. And it's an inspiring message though. And I was like, I want to show up in the
55:15
world every day at my top performance and and forgive myself when I don't. But I want to show
55:21
up in that top performance way because that's the way that we have impact in the world. Yes.
55:26
I love that. And I think you're doing pretty well. So congratulations on that.
55:31
Are you two? Guys, thank you so much for tuning in to performance driven living with my guest,
55:36
Rowena Gates, one of my favorite humans. And I hope that you'll tune in next time. And if you
55:42
didn't get a chance to watch our prior interview with Rowena, I strongly encourage you scroll back
55:46
on the channel and find the other interview where we talk about a lot of similar things. But
55:50
some other stuff. This was actually kind of an addendum to that last conversation. So check
55:55
them both out and go check out the NanoV at eng3eng3.com link in the show notes.