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201. 9 Steps to Effectively Change Jobs For More Money in Software Development · DevQuestions with Tim Corey

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to the Dev Questions Podcast with Tim Corey.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_00: Join us each episode as we tackle the questions you are asking about a career in software development, understanding the industry, and new technology.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_00: If you're just starting out or you want to grow stronger as a developer, this is the place to get your questions answered.
• 0:19
  SPEAKER_00: Now, here's your host, expert developer and online educator, Tim Corey.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_02: How do I change jobs to get a raise?
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_02: And if I do change jobs, is it going to hurt my resume?
• 0:33
  SPEAKER_02: These are the questions we're going to talk about in today's episode of DevQuestions.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_02: Now, if you have a question, go to suggestions.iamtimcorey.com and ask it there.
• 0:42
  SPEAKER_02: Hopefully, you'll see your question answered in a future episode of DevQuestions.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_02: So let's talk about switching jobs to get a raise and is it going to hurt you?
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_02: Now, job hopping can absolutely hurt your chances of getting another job.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_02: However, it can also give you a significant raise over what you're currently making.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_02: So there's a balance, right?
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_02: It depends, is the right answer.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_02: So let's talk about the steps, the nine steps to effectively change jobs to get a raise.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_02: So if you're saying, hey, you know what, I'm just not getting paid what I think I'm worth in my current position.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_02: And I really think that if I went out in the job market, I could get 25-30% more than if I stay here, that might be a good time to change jobs.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_02: So let's talk about the steps.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_02: And along the way, and any of these steps, you can say, you know what?
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_02: I'm going to not continue.
• 1:45
  SPEAKER_02: Because maybe you find out the job market's not that great.
• 1:48
  SPEAKER_02: Or maybe the jobs that are 25% better paying aren't the jobs you want to do or aren't qualified for.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_02: So let's talk through those nine steps.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_02: Step number one is get prepared.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_02: Whenever you're thinking about moving jobs, you need to be prepared.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_02: This doesn't matter if you already have an offer or if you're just thinking about putting your resume out there.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_02: You need to be prepared first.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_02: What that means is most likely updating your resume, getting your portfolio together and making sure your portfolio has current items in it that can really show off what you can do.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_02: Now, if you are already being offered something, maybe you don't need those, but we're going to talk about why you probably still do.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_02: Next up is to do market research.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_02: So when you're looking to move, you shouldn't just say, hey, they offered me more money, let's go there.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_02: It's kind of like when you put something up for sale and someone immediately buys it for asking price without haggling at all.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_02: You start to wonder, could I have gotten more?
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe I should have raised the price even more than I sold it for initially.
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_02: And you might end up with seller's remorse where you go, oh no, you know, I asked for 25% more or offer 25% more, but I could have gotten 50% more.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_02: So you don't want to get in that situation.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_02: So do your research first.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_02: Now, this is going to mean that you need to build step number two, build a realistic monetary worth.
• 3:29
  SPEAKER_02: So the key word here is realistic, because often people say, well, you know, software developers at Google get paid$300,000.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_02: Therefore, I should be able to get$300,000.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_02: Well, no, not unless you're applying to Google at that same level.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_02: So what's realistic for you?
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_02: Well, look in your area or wherever you're applying.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_02: Look for who is currently getting paid and what they're getting paid.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_02: Now, that might mean going to glassdoor.com, or it might mean talking to your contacts and saying, hey, what's the pay like in this area?
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_02: Or hey, can you give me a ballpark range of what you get paid and so on to figure out and build a realistic picture of what people are being paid?
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_02: That can be difficult.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_02: This is why having good contact is helpful.
• 4:25
  SPEAKER_02: Being in a user group or knowing a number of people in the development field will be really helpful in reaching out for a new job or figuring out what the pay rate should be for you and for your skills.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_02: So another part of that realistic is realistically evaluating what you can do as a developer.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe you think that you're really good as a developer, but if you look at your skills and look what people are asking for, you realize maybe you're more like a mid-level developer instead of a senior developer.
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_02: So being realistic will help you set realistic monetary worth, which means you can then know, is it right to move on, or am I being paid fairly?
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_02: So if you find out, hey, I could probably make three, five percent more money somewhere else, it might be better to stay where you're at.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_02: And that means building your portfolio, learning more things, growing as a developer.
• 5:25
  SPEAKER_02: So when you look again, maybe in the same market, you could command 15 or 20% more.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_02: So it may be time at step two to say, I'm gonna halt this process.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_02: Because if you can't get paid more, then why are you looking around?
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_02: Now, step number three is to ask for a reasonable raise to get you close.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_02: Now, this is optional because sometimes your boss just isn't the kind of boss that is okay with you asking for a raise.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_02: They should be, but this is optional.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_02: So, if at all possible though, go to your boss and give them the opportunity to give you a reasonable raise.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_02: And this is where the information from step number two can be really helpful.
• 6:13
  SPEAKER_02: Because if you can say realistically that people in your area at your skill level are getting paid 25% more than you are, then you can bring that to your boss and say, hey, on average, people are getting paid 25% more to do the same job that I'm currently doing.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_02: Can you offer me 22%?
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_02: And I would encourage you to put it a little below the average.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_02: Give it a little bit of buffer there.
• 6:45
  SPEAKER_02: Because yes, it'd be great to have as much money as possible.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_02: It'd be great if your boss offer you 30%.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_02: But if you put it at or below, especially below what is reasonable for your position, it's more likely your boss will say yes.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_02: Now, bosses don't like to pay more money.
• 7:04
  SPEAKER_02: They want to get you for as cheap as possible, and they may say, you know what?
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_02: No, I want you to work for the current rate that you're being assigned, or there's just no room in the budget at this time, which is a really common phrase.
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_02: So if they say that, okay, move on from step three.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_02: But if they say, yes, we'll give you a 19% pay raise, well, you know what?
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_02: That's probably good enough.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: If you could potentially get 25% by changing jobs or stay and get 19%, well, yes, that's 6%.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_02: And 6% feels like a lot, but you don't have to change jobs.
• 7:40
  SPEAKER_02: You don't have to go through that hassle.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_02: You don't have to relearn a system.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_02: You don't have to step into a new environment where you might not like it.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_02: So if you're relatively comfortable at your current job, take the money and run.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_02: So stop at step three.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_02: But if your boss doesn't give you a raise, if your boss thinks that, you know what, no, I want you to stay where you're at, well, then you could continue to step four.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_02: And maybe you don't want to.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe you just want to try the first three steps and go, okay, I've tried.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_02: That's all I can do.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_02: But if you feel like, no, I really want to get more money, then step number four is to target the companies you want to work for.
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_02: There may be specific companies in your area, or maybe you want to work remotely.
• 8:26
  SPEAKER_02: You can target specific companies and see if they have any interest in hiring you.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_02: That may mean putting your resume out to five, 10, 15 companies, or it may mean calling your contacts and saying, hey, are there any openings at your company?
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_02: Targeting companies, especially ones you have a relationship with in some way, is a whole lot easier of a process than just sending your resume out.
• 8:51
  SPEAKER_02: So I'd start there.
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_02: And if that doesn't work, well, then step five is apply in a wider area.
• 8:58
  SPEAKER_02: So if you're not getting the responses you want, or you don't have a targeted list of companies that you want to work for, well, then send your application to a wider area.
• 9:08
  SPEAKER_02: Now, step number six is when you interview, talk to the team if possible.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_02: I hear this a lot.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_02: I switched jobs and it's a better paying job, but the company atmosphere is just miserable, or I really hate the job, or I'm working on this technology I don't want to work on.
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that those are things that you should try to discover in the discovery process, in the hiring process.
• 9:34
  SPEAKER_02: The hiring process is not just about the company figuring out if you fit with them.
• 9:40
  SPEAKER_02: It's also about if you fit with the company.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_02: So do your research, try and talk to the team.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_02: That might not be possible in the interview process, but you can try to step outside of the interview process.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_02: If you are connected with anybody on that team directly, talk to them.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_02: If you're connected with anybody who's connected with that team directly, talk to that person, try to get an introduction.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_02: Try to figure out a way to know what that position is about.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_02: And if all else fails, just tell the interviewer: listen, I need to know these things.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_02: I need to know what technology you use, what the team dynamic is like.
• 10:20
  SPEAKER_02: I need to figure out if this is a good fit for me.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_02: So that's step number six.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_02: Or now, step number seven is research any company that shows an interest in you.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_02: You should know a lot about the company before you get into that final negotiation period.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_02: You should know what that company does and how that company operates and what the company's life cycle is like or yearly schedule is like, what the vacation time is like, what the sick time is like, what the benefits are, all these things about not just the position, but the company itself, so you know you can be comfortable at this company.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_02: Now, step number eight, and this is optional.
• 11:04
  SPEAKER_02: If you get an offer, ask your current boss to match the offer.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_02: So this is optional for a really important reason, because this is almost a point of no return.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_02: Because if you ask your boss and say, hey, I've got this offer for 25% more, will you match it?
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_02: And your boss says, no, then you're committed to that other company because you're kind of in a spot where your boss goes, oh, they're looking for a job.
• 11:33
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, they're kind of have one foot out.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not gonna give them any more raises.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_02: I'm gonna, you know, not count on them, and you're kind of off the track for advancement.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_02: So I would encourage you only do this if you feel comfortable doing it and if you think it is a possibility.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_02: But if it's possible, then talk to your current boss and see if they'll match that offer.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_02: Now, some people don't like doing this just because you've already asked your boss once and they said no.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_02: So if you ask now, they go, oh yeah, sure.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_02: Well, we've got the money all of a sudden.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_02: Well, why didn't you have the money originally?
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_02: Because if I ask for it now, you all of a sudden have it, well, then you really had it all along.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_02: You just didn't value me enough to give it to me.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_02: So, what's going to happen with the next raise and the next?
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_02: So this is why it's an optional step.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_02: Now, step number nine, and this is a really important one.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_02: Stay in the role for at least two to three years.
• 12:29
  SPEAKER_02: And you may, you may clench up at that.
• 12:32
  SPEAKER_02: You may say, Tim, that's that's that's too long.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe I find another offer that's giving me even better options.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_02: Hold off.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, and I'm gonna tell you why.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_02: So this is what your resume says about you if you switch jobs often.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_02: One of these is probably going to be true.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_02: Number one, you don't stay in the job I'm offered.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_02: You're not gonna stay in the job I offer you.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_02: So if I offer you this job, but I see that you switch jobs every, you know, six to eighteen months, well, then I can expect six to 18 months from you.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_02: And that's not enough.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_02: I want a long-term employee.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm nervous as the hiring employee employer thinking, you know what?
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want a person who's gonna leave really quickly.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_02: So therefore, it tells me you don't, you're not gonna stay in my job.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_02: And that makes me nervous.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_02: That's one possibility.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_02: Next possibility is that you've got bad judgment when it comes to evaluating employers.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_02: Why would you skip out on a job if it was a great opportunity that you went to?
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_02: Well, sometimes we make a bad decision or things were hidden from us or or whatever.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_02: But if it keeps happening, well, what's the common denominator?
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_02: Well, it's you.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_02: So maybe you're a bad judge of evaluating employers.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_02: And as an employer trying to hire you, if you are a bad judge of what I'm offering you, well, then again, you're going to probably leave because what I'm offering you may not be what you're expecting because you're a bad judge of employers.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_02: Or number three, you're not a great employee.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_02: No one's tried to retain you.
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_02: So if you bounce around from job to job to job, either you're a bad evaluator of employers, you're a bad employee, or you're just not going to stick around in my job.
• 14:28
  SPEAKER_02: Any of those three are bad news.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_02: And so as an employer, I'm going to avoid those types of resumes.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_02: Now, you can do your best if you already have those resumes to explain why, or explain why you expect to be long-term at the new position.
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_02: But I'd really highlight that because your resume is not going to look great if you have a bunch of jobs one after the other.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_02: So try to stick in your new position for two to three years if possible.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_02: Now, obviously, if it's a really bad position, get out while you can, but be careful your next position.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_02: Okay?
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_02: So those are the nine steps that I would say you should do when looking to change jobs in order to get that raise.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_02: Don't do it too often, but if you follow steps, you should be able to get the pay rate that you deserve in your area, and you should be able to advance your career really well doing so.
• 15:31
  SPEAKER_02: All right, thanks for listening.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_02: As always, I am Tim Corey.
• 15:35
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for joining us for this episode of Def Questions.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_01: Tim is committed to making it easier for you to become a developer.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_01: If you would like to help make more content like this possible, please like, subscribe, rate, and share Dev Questions.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_01: You can also send your questions to questions at IamTimcorey.com.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_01: Until next time, remember, you are too smart and your time too valuable to waste it making all the mistakes Tim did.
• 16:01
  SPEAKER_01: When you're ready to learn to think and code like a professional developer, head over to imtimcore.com and enroll in a course.