Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Obsessed female staffer murders glamorous lady senator & orders hit on victim's hubby?

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Obsessed female staffer murders glamorous lady senator & orders hit on victim's hubby? · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:06
Speaker 1: How does a gorgeous young state senator end up dead
0:12
Speaker 1: wrapped in a carpet? Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. I'm
0:30
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for being
0:33
Speaker 1: with us here at Fox Nation and Serious X one eleven.
0:38
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friends at TGV eleven. Jordan
0:41
Speaker 1: Hollington he Randolph County Sheriff's Office responded to the scene
0:45
Speaker 1: that around five forty five PM and immediately began securing
0:49
Speaker 1: the crime scene. Deputies, joined by Arkansas State Police's Criminal
0:53
Speaker 1: Investigation Team. A sea of investigators spotted coming through the
0:57
Speaker 1: former state senator's property. Neighbors living around the crime scene
1:00
Speaker 1: chose not to go on camera because they said they're
1:03
Speaker 1: scared to speak out, but they said, this whole ordeal
1:06
Speaker 1: is like a mystery. Colin Smith's home located right off
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Speaker 1: Highway ninety in the Edgewood neighborhood, one that people here
1:13
Speaker 1: told us off camera is typically quiet. You can see
1:17
Speaker 1: the vehicles behind the crime scene tape. Neighbors told us
1:20
Speaker 1: the red truck belongs to the former senator. That's the
1:23
Speaker 1: vehicle she was spotted driving in about two weeks ago,
1:26
Speaker 1: and the others. We are told belonged to her father
1:29
Speaker 1: and son. As investigators arrived, neighbors said those vehicles were
1:33
Speaker 1: left on the property. The body found outside the home
1:36
Speaker 1: has since been taken to the state crime lab. The
1:39
Speaker 1: condition of the body prevented any immediate positive identification. Okay,
1:44
Speaker 1: that's not good when they can't look at you and
1:47
Speaker 1: tell make an identification of your body. We are talking
1:51
Speaker 1: about a gorgeous young Arkansas senator found dead wrapped in
1:57
Speaker 1: a carpet with me an all star panel judge and
2:01
Speaker 1: trial lawyer, Court TV anchor Ashley Wilcott. For now, it's psychoan.
2:05
Speaker 1: Let's joining me out of Beverly Hills. Doctor Bethany Marshall,
2:08
Speaker 1: Cloyd Steiger thirty six. Here's Seattle PD twenty two of
2:11
Speaker 1: that in homicide. Author of Seattle's Forgotten serial Killer, Gary
2:15
Speaker 1: Jane Grant, Professor Forensics Jacksonville State University and author of
2:19
Speaker 1: Blood Beneath My Feet Death investigator Joseph Scott Morgan. But
2:24
Speaker 1: to Levi Page Crime online dot Com investigative reporter, I
2:29
Speaker 1: want to talk about the victim, Linda Collins Smith, stunning
2:35
Speaker 1: successful Arkansas senator. But let me ask you this, what
2:41
Speaker 1: was the state of her marriage, she had been divorced. Nancy,
2:44
Speaker 1: she was married to a judge and had been divorced.
2:48
Speaker 1: You know what to you, Ashley Walcott, you're a judge
2:51
Speaker 1: and a trial lawyer, court TV anchor. When you mix
2:55
Speaker 1: a judge with politics, I mean, what did they talk
2:59
Speaker 1: about it? Can you imagine? Yeah? Yeah, No you can't
3:04
Speaker 1: because you're gonna argue. I mean that's what I think.
3:06
Speaker 1: It's going to end up an argument unless you say
3:09
Speaker 1: we're not going to discuss at the home, in which
3:11
Speaker 1: case you have nothing to say to each other. So,
3:13
Speaker 1: first of all, as you know, when a death occurs,
3:17
Speaker 1: when a murder, of course, this is such a murder.
3:19
Speaker 1: They can't even identify her body. You immediately look at
3:22
Speaker 1: the spouse. But let's talk about in the fact that
3:24
Speaker 1: they cannot identify Linda Colin Smith's body talking about an
3:30
Speaker 1: Arkansas senator to Joseph Scott, Morgan death investigator and professor forensics,
3:36
Speaker 1: what does that tell you right off the bad Joe Scott,
3:39
Speaker 1: they can't even identify that it's her. Yes, it's near
3:42
Speaker 1: her home. Yes, she's wrapped in a carpet. I believe
3:45
Speaker 1: came out of her home. But they can't identify her.
3:49
Speaker 1: That's not good, Joe Scott. No, it's not Nancy. And
3:53
Speaker 1: here's the problem. She's been down or deceased long enough
3:58
Speaker 1: where decomposition has advanced to the point where she's not recognizable.
4:03
Speaker 1: You can't look at her body and say this is her.
4:08
Speaker 1: That means that they're going to have to go to
4:10
Speaker 1: greater scientific links in order to try to get her identified.
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Speaker 1: In One troubling part to all of this is the
4:17
Speaker 1: fact where she been. You've got her wrapped in a
4:20
Speaker 1: carpet and she's found on the property, But where has
4:23
Speaker 1: she been all of this period of time so that
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Speaker 1: she could get to this point of advanced decomposition where
4:29
Speaker 1: they can't identify her. And as as an investigator, that
4:33
Speaker 1: tells me a lot. That means that somebody had possession
4:36
Speaker 1: of her, that they had sequestered her or hidding her
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Speaker 1: away at some point in time, and that that's going
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Speaker 1: to hiding her, hiding her dead body. And she's see
4:46
Speaker 1: what I hear that the body was in such a
4:49
Speaker 1: bad state there could be no visual identification made. I
4:53
Speaker 1: just assume that somebody used a shotgun and blasted her
4:56
Speaker 1: face off. But you're thinking it was because of position. Yeah,
5:01
Speaker 1: that's the first thing that I'm thinking of, that she's
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Speaker 1: been down that long and and that they can't they
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Speaker 1: can't identify it. Now, if she was disfigured as a
5:10
Speaker 1: result of some type of trauma, that's only going to
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Speaker 1: add another level to this as far as getting her identified.
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Speaker 1: You know what, Joe Scott Morgan, It's always a treat
5:21
Speaker 1: to talk to you, because now I get to think
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Speaker 1: about who would hold her dead body and keep it?
5:27
Speaker 1: What at the dinner table? What do you do with
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Speaker 1: a dead body as it decomposes and you keep it
5:34
Speaker 1: for that long? Now this is Joseph Scott Morgan's theory,
5:37
Speaker 1: but I mean, we definitely need a shrink to doctor
5:41
Speaker 1: Bethany Marshall keeping a dead body as it decomposes, And
5:47
Speaker 1: that's a whole other mindset right there. You know, people
5:51
Speaker 1: who keep a dead body while it decomposes, I think
5:55
Speaker 1: fall into one of two categories. One category is that
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Speaker 1: they're great mostly mentally ill, schizophrenic, something like that, they
6:04
Speaker 1: have a paranoid delusion, they kill a family member, then
6:08
Speaker 1: they're too low functioning to dispose of the body. But
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Speaker 1: I don't suspect that was the case in this particular incident.
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Speaker 1: The second category is somebody who kills the victim, in
6:19
Speaker 1: this case the senator, but has not sought in advance
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Speaker 1: to prepare a dump fight for the body, has not
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Speaker 1: thought about what they're going to do with the body.
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Speaker 1: And as we've discussed repeatedly on this show, it takes
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Speaker 1: an enormous amount of energy to get rid of a
6:34
Speaker 1: dead body. I mean, some people will cut the body
6:38
Speaker 1: into pieces, put it into a suitcase, drop it into
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Speaker 1: the river. But whoever the perpetrator the killer was in
6:44
Speaker 1: this particular instance, did not think it through to the end.
6:48
Speaker 1: So those are the two choices you're giving me someone
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Speaker 1: who's so low functioning they can't figure out how to
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Speaker 1: get rid of a dead body. Or two? Well, well,
6:58
Speaker 1: what's the second one? Two? Two? Well, the second one
7:01
Speaker 1: would be somebody who's angry and murderous enough to kill her,
7:05
Speaker 1: but they have not a thrill. I got another category
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Speaker 1: for you. Let me just call it the Ted Bundy category,
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Speaker 1: where you kill the victim, yea, but then you keep
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Speaker 1: the body for fun. Remember how he would then continue
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Speaker 1: to molest the dead body, He would bathe the dead body,
7:26
Speaker 1: he would apply makeup and do the dead body's hair.
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Speaker 1: That is not somebody a low functioning, That is not
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Speaker 1: somebody that hasn't planned. That is a freak. I don't
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Speaker 1: know what you call him, doctor Bethany. I'm sure some
7:42
Speaker 1: really long word. Go ahead, hit me with the long word. Well, well,
7:46
Speaker 1: this would be like the woman that the young woman
7:47
Speaker 1: that went missing from the coffee kiosk in Seattle and
7:52
Speaker 1: the killer who took her. Then Samantha Konig, Amantha Konig
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Speaker 1: Bene her body was frozen. He moved it to him.
8:00
Speaker 1: Keys is the real keys sewed her eyes shut, put
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Speaker 1: her up, didn't he get her eyes open, sewed them open,
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Speaker 1: and pictures of her, applied makeup, braided her hair, took
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Speaker 1: pictures of her. Yes, that's the third category. There's a
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Speaker 1: lot of gross apparently, I mean not to tell you
8:20
Speaker 1: your business. Beverly Hills psychoanalyst. I'm always impressed with that.
8:25
Speaker 1: But I guess you don't see a whole lot of
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Speaker 1: bodies with her eyes sewn open out on Rodeo Drive.
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Speaker 1: So that gives me a whole other category of who
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Speaker 1: would keep this body? And again this has just got
8:38
Speaker 1: Morgan's working theory that the body was kept. Crime stories
8:56
Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. We are talking about the death the
9:01
Speaker 1: murder a gorgeous young Arkansas State senator. Take a listen
9:09
Speaker 1: to our friends at ka ARK four. This is Tyler Thomason.
9:14
Speaker 1: When the former senator was found outside her Pocahona's home,
9:17
Speaker 1: authorities say she was unrecognizable. Less than twenty four hours later,
9:21
Speaker 1: a judge sealed all documents pertaining to the case, and
9:25
Speaker 1: detectives remained tight lipped about the ongoing investigation. Crime scene
9:31
Speaker 1: tape covers every corner of Linda Collins Smith's home Wednesday,
9:35
Speaker 1: outlining the beginning stages of a murder investigation. Police say
9:40
Speaker 1: a woman was found dead outside the home Tuesday. The
9:43
Speaker 1: Randolph County Sheriff's Office responded to the scene that around
9:47
Speaker 1: five forty five pm. Condition of the body prevented any
9:50
Speaker 1: immediate positive identification. Authorities have stopped short of confirming whether
9:56
Speaker 1: the victim is the former state senator, but sources say
10:00
Speaker 1: it was her, indicating that she was found shot to death.
10:03
Speaker 1: As far as what happened, investigators haven't said much else
10:07
Speaker 1: and don't plan to anytime soon. Third Judicial District Circuit
10:12
Speaker 1: Judge Harold Irwin has issued a sealed an order sealing
10:17
Speaker 1: the documents and statements ordered are obtained by the police
10:21
Speaker 1: during this investigation. Okay, let me go to you. Cloy Styker,
10:25
Speaker 1: thirty six years Seattle PD twenty two of that homicide
10:29
Speaker 1: and author of Seattle's Aregotten serial killer Gary Jane Grant, Cloyd,
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Speaker 1: why would a judge seal the investigative files? Yeah, you know,
10:38
Speaker 1: that's a really unusual thing. Usually some high profile case,
10:42
Speaker 1: which is obviously is but there have to be something
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Speaker 1: there that is that the prosecutor and the detectives do
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Speaker 1: not want released right away that they think will happen
10:51
Speaker 1: their investigation. That's the only reason that would ever happen.
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Speaker 1: You know. What else is interesting, Cloyd, is that under
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Speaker 1: Joe Scott Joseph Scott Morgan's theory, the body was kept
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Speaker 1: for a period of time until it went into advanced decomposition.
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Speaker 1: But yet it's brought back to the home and wrapped
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Speaker 1: in a rug when it's found. That's odd. Why do
11:16
Speaker 1: you what do you make of someone wrapping the body
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Speaker 1: in a rug, Cloyd Steiger, Well, wrapping a body in
11:22
Speaker 1: a rug is relatively common because there's there's rugs on
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Speaker 1: the floor. You just roll the person in it, but
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Speaker 1: I'm not sure if the body was transported away and
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Speaker 1: transported back, but that takes a lot of work. It's very,
11:35
Speaker 1: very difficult to do. And again, why would you bring
11:38
Speaker 1: it back in the house. So, I mean it's just
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Speaker 1: they're trying to conceal the body obviously, and wrapping it
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Speaker 1: in the carpet will actually wrapping in anything will accelerate
11:49
Speaker 1: the decomposition. And so she's probably a mess with the
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Speaker 1: open Yeah. And you know another thing Cloyd Steiger with
11:55
Speaker 1: me thirty six years Seattle, PD twenty two with that homicide.
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Speaker 1: Another thing we cannot discount is when it's a random killing.
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Speaker 1: Let's just say some burglar broke in to steal stuff,
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Speaker 1: they see her, and they shoot her. They don't usually
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Speaker 1: stick around to conceal the body. Yeah, they don't. Random killings.
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Speaker 1: You don't even just wrapping the body in a rug.
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Speaker 1: There would be no reason you don't see that when reason.
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Speaker 1: The other thing is, first of all, burglars when they
12:26
Speaker 1: get interrupted run they don't shoot people or kill people that.
12:30
Speaker 1: You know, a lot of people try to use that
12:31
Speaker 1: when they're staging has seen it must have been a
12:33
Speaker 1: burglary interrupted, but that almost never happened, the person runs,
12:38
Speaker 1: unless the reason for the burglary in the first place
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Speaker 1: was to kill, a rape or something like that. You're
12:43
Speaker 1: absolutely right. Random burglars, random killers do not take the time.
12:50
Speaker 1: They may shoot and go and leave. They're gone, they
12:53
Speaker 1: want out of there, and they don't take time to
12:56
Speaker 1: stage the scene. To you, Joseph Scott Morgan, you're the
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Speaker 1: death an investigator, what does it tell you that she
13:04
Speaker 1: Senator Linda Collins Smith was wrapped up in a carpet. Well,
13:10
Speaker 1: I think that, as was pointed out earlier, if I recall,
13:13
Speaker 1: the carpet originated from within that very residence, and so
13:17
Speaker 1: that gives us some kind of connection between the perpetrator
13:22
Speaker 1: or whoever was it wrapped her up and deposited her there.
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Speaker 1: That means that they were within the interior of that
13:30
Speaker 1: residence at some point time and grab that carpet wrapped
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Speaker 1: her body up in it. Another big thing here is
13:38
Speaker 1: also why would you go to the trouble of wrapping Well,
13:42
Speaker 1: I think that you want to contain if she's been traumatized,
13:46
Speaker 1: which obviously she has, you want to contain the blood.
13:50
Speaker 1: But also does this go to an issue of maybe
13:52
Speaker 1: like face covering which is something that we see where
13:57
Speaker 1: people that are intimately involved with an individual, well shoot
14:01
Speaker 1: an individual or kill an individual, and then covered their
14:04
Speaker 1: face because literally, and this is more in doctor Bethany's area,
14:09
Speaker 1: but literally, they can't abide having that person's face in
14:14
Speaker 1: their field of view because they have an intimate relationship
14:17
Speaker 1: with them. And we'll see this acted out periodically in
14:21
Speaker 1: these cases of intimate violence where you know you don't
14:24
Speaker 1: want to see the person's face that you've just literally slaughtered. Now,
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Speaker 1: I's thinking about a case where a young woman twenty
14:33
Speaker 1: one ish accused of murdering her mother put a wicker
14:39
Speaker 1: trash basket over her mother's head. Wait, wait, we see
14:45
Speaker 1: it all the time. I don't necessarily understand it, but
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Speaker 1: I'm with Joe Scott Morgan on this. There's something about
14:52
Speaker 1: seeing your murder victim's face. You can't stand. What is that,
14:57
Speaker 1: Doctor Bethany, He's right, this is your promise. Well, it
15:00
Speaker 1: could either be that you it's a final superficial act
15:04
Speaker 1: of kindness you want to provide some covering. But I
15:09
Speaker 1: think most off, I would think the trash can over
15:16
Speaker 1: the head is you don't want the victim looking at you.
15:19
Speaker 1: You don't want them to see what you've done, which
15:21
Speaker 1: I think is often why victims are shot in the
15:24
Speaker 1: back of the head. It is because the perpetrator wants
15:28
Speaker 1: not only an element of surprise, but they don't want
15:31
Speaker 1: that person to know what they're going to do. They
15:33
Speaker 1: don't want to be seen, even in death. They don't
15:37
Speaker 1: want recognition on the other person's face. But you know,
15:40
Speaker 1: in this case, Nancy, she was wrapped in a blanket
15:44
Speaker 1: under a tarp at the end of her driveway. And
15:48
Speaker 1: I'm not a death investigator, but I know human behavior,
15:52
Speaker 1: and somehow it seems that whoever did this to the
15:56
Speaker 1: senator did at some point decide they were going to
16:00
Speaker 1: get rid of the body, but they only made it
16:03
Speaker 1: as far at the end of the driveway. So I
16:06
Speaker 1: also wonder, you know, who cliff carried a body in
16:09
Speaker 1: a tarp, you know, wrapped in a rug to the
16:13
Speaker 1: end of a driveway. Why deposit it there? Most surely
16:16
Speaker 1: it's going to be found. There was this person trying
16:19
Speaker 1: to make a hasty getaway and then just thought thought, oh,
16:23
Speaker 1: screw it, I'm just going to leave her there, and
16:24
Speaker 1: then they just drove off or did they stage the
16:28
Speaker 1: body at the end of the driveway because they wanted
16:31
Speaker 1: everyone to know that they had killed her. I mean
16:33
Speaker 1: that to me is a very curious part of this
16:36
Speaker 1: crime scene. Nancy. I gotta say one more thing, and
16:40
Speaker 1: you know, relative to what Bessanie was just commenting on,
16:43
Speaker 1: and maybe this is really far afield, but what else
16:46
Speaker 1: did we put at the end of our driveway, those
16:48
Speaker 1: of us that live in neighborhoods, And maybe yeah, we
16:52
Speaker 1: put trash at the end of the driveway. And so
16:55
Speaker 1: if you continue with that logic, did this individual that
16:59
Speaker 1: had taking this poor woman's life, did she view her
17:02
Speaker 1: as something that can just be tossed away just like
17:05
Speaker 1: a piece of debris, or could it have been to
17:09
Speaker 1: Cloyd Stiger joining me thirty six years Seattle PD, just
17:12
Speaker 1: go with me for a moment, because Joe Scott just
17:15
Speaker 1: gave me an idea. Could the killer have possibly thought
17:20
Speaker 1: that the body would be picked up by the trash
17:23
Speaker 1: and disposed of without realizing what it was? Kloyd, maybe
17:28
Speaker 1: you have much more, much more like well success in
17:30
Speaker 1: that if you're in a garbage can or a machine
17:33
Speaker 1: picks it up. But if some person has to pick
17:35
Speaker 1: that up, they're going to go what the hecks are
17:37
Speaker 1: wrong with this, and it's going to be much more
17:39
Speaker 1: heavy than I rolled up a carpet should be. But
17:43
Speaker 1: Joe Scott and Bethne were both right. I've been to
17:46
Speaker 1: many scenes where the face was covered or turned on
17:50
Speaker 1: a murder victim and it ended up being it's either
17:54
Speaker 1: someone the person knows intimately or someone who kind of
17:59
Speaker 1: displays a person I know intimately with that victim or
18:03
Speaker 1: that person represents. And so that's really really common. Haven't
18:07
Speaker 1: thought of that symbolic transference of hatred and homicidal intent,
18:14
Speaker 1: that you know the victim or the victimsty placing someone
18:19
Speaker 1: in your mind that you want to kill. Crime stories
18:34
Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace, a beautiful young Arkansas Senator Linda Collins
18:40
Speaker 1: Smith dead, rolled up in a carpet, blanket, tarp and
18:45
Speaker 1: her body vastly decomposed, then left on the senator's own
18:53
Speaker 1: property well immediately the investigation starts. Take a listen to
18:57
Speaker 1: ka r K four Tyler Thomas. Court documents revealed the
19:01
Speaker 1: former senator was in the process of divorcing her husband,
19:05
Speaker 1: retired Judge Philip Smith. Hearing in that case was scheduled
19:09
Speaker 1: later this month, and according to documented testimony the couple
19:12
Speaker 1: were at odds over money after selling a local hotel
19:16
Speaker 1: for more than a million dollars. The x lawmaker's former
19:19
Speaker 1: spokesperson tells us the divorce quote was not pleasant. He
19:23
Speaker 1: also says Collins Smith remained active on social media, but
19:27
Speaker 1: appeared to go silent more than a week ago. An
19:30
Speaker 1: old campaign sign sits just beyond the police tape, marking
19:34
Speaker 1: a time when constituents looked to Linda for answers. Now
19:38
Speaker 1: they look elsewhere for answers in her death. The sheriff says,
19:42
Speaker 1: at state police are leading this homicide investigation. Okay, out
19:46
Speaker 1: to you Crime online dot Com investigative reporter Levi Page, Levi,
19:51
Speaker 1: you told me the divorce was over. I didn't know
19:53
Speaker 1: they were finding over a million dollars sale of a
19:56
Speaker 1: local hotel, your Craig, Nancy, that was the business she
20:00
Speaker 1: owned with her Spanky Spanky, Yes, that was the business
20:04
Speaker 1: that she owned with her. EXE got married right after
20:08
Speaker 1: she passed away. The divorce was finalized after that. Whoa
20:12
Speaker 1: wait a minute, wait wait wait, wait, wait stop. Right
20:17
Speaker 1: after his former wife, the senator the one rolled up
20:23
Speaker 1: in the blank at the carpet at the end of
20:25
Speaker 1: the driveway with the traps the Dixie dumpster. Yes, how
20:29
Speaker 1: soon after that did he remarry immediately? It sounded like
20:32
Speaker 1: he was with her while the divorce was ongoing, and
20:35
Speaker 1: then when she died, the divorce obviously is finalized, so
20:39
Speaker 1: he remarried very quickly. Well, I guess that's one way
20:42
Speaker 1: of finalizing and divorces for your wife to end up
20:44
Speaker 1: in a tarpet the end of the driveway. Money money,
20:48
Speaker 1: you know. Another thing. Whenever I hear of a police
20:52
Speaker 1: officer or an investigator. We just covered a female cop
20:56
Speaker 1: I believe in Long Island planning to kill her husband
21:00
Speaker 1: and her boyfriend's daughter, I think, wait, how did they
21:06
Speaker 1: suddenly end up on the wrong side of the law.
21:09
Speaker 1: Floyd Siger, thirty six year SEATTLEPD. Do you think sometimes
21:13
Speaker 1: that cops, investigators DA's are around criminals so much? I mean,
21:20
Speaker 1: can you walk through them, even if you're wearing hip mates,
21:22
Speaker 1: walk through the mud every day and not check sometime
21:25
Speaker 1: to the living room carpet? I mean, well, yeah, that's
21:27
Speaker 1: part of it. You know, they see this stuff and
21:29
Speaker 1: some of them may think I can get away with this.
21:31
Speaker 1: But also police departments are made up of humans. To
21:34
Speaker 1: have human emotions just like everybody else, and sometimes those
21:36
Speaker 1: emotions go haywire and they do stupid stuff like this, Nancy, Nancy,
21:42
Speaker 1: there's actually robust research that indicates that sociopaths and psychopaths
21:48
Speaker 1: gravitate towards positions of power. So they want to become cops,
21:52
Speaker 1: they want to become death investigators. They want to carry
21:55
Speaker 1: a gun and have handcuffs and all of that. And
21:58
Speaker 1: that's why there's very sific psych testing that police officers
22:02
Speaker 1: have to go through before they before they can get
22:05
Speaker 1: a job within a police department, is to screen out
22:08
Speaker 1: these kinds of unsavory characters. I have a colleague that
22:11
Speaker 1: does testing for police departments here in Los Angeles, and
22:15
Speaker 1: so she does fitness for duty reviews, and she says
22:19
Speaker 1: that there are a fair number of cadets who come
22:22
Speaker 1: into her office and will all of a sudden start
22:25
Speaker 1: talking about guns and how they love guns and they
22:28
Speaker 1: have a stash of guns and they've been fascinated with
22:31
Speaker 1: guns since they were little kids. And she will write
22:33
Speaker 1: a letter to the police department and say, denied, don't
22:36
Speaker 1: hire this person. Jay Scott just say, you know, you
22:39
Speaker 1: definitely heard her mentioned death investigators. Okay, so I think
22:42
Speaker 1: that's pretty much aimed right at You. Eticed that because
22:48
Speaker 1: I remember and all the years that I prosecuted, I
22:52
Speaker 1: would come across the cop and I would visualize I
22:57
Speaker 1: could actually see them committing a murder. There was just
23:01
Speaker 1: something snaps. And all the years they're devoted to crime
23:06
Speaker 1: fighting and doing the right thing, they've been around criminals.
23:10
Speaker 1: I sought a lot with defense attorneys. I'd be trying
23:12
Speaker 1: to reach a defense attorney about a trial on Monday.
23:14
Speaker 1: I'm like, where is he. Oh, he's down at Magic City,
23:18
Speaker 1: this trip club with some of his clients. I'm like, okay,
23:22
Speaker 1: not judging, but some of his cocaine clients at this
23:27
Speaker 1: trip club. So my point is, when you start hanging
23:31
Speaker 1: around with criminals, somehow, at first you're shocked. Then somehow
23:35
Speaker 1: you become desensitized to it, and then after a while,
23:39
Speaker 1: maybe to some people, it doesn't seem like such a
23:41
Speaker 1: bad idea. Ashley, Yeah, I was gonna say, Nancy, I
23:44
Speaker 1: see it often, unfortunately, and they do become immune to
23:47
Speaker 1: it because they're absorbed into a world. But it first
23:50
Speaker 1: is shocking and criminal, and then they're absorbed into a
23:53
Speaker 1: think of well, this is the norm, this is what
23:56
Speaker 1: I know of criminal defense attorney who only represents criminals
24:00
Speaker 1: does become a little bit immune to and it's like,
24:03
Speaker 1: this is the world I live in, and this is
24:05
Speaker 1: what it is. It's quote unquote normal. And I do
24:08
Speaker 1: think the same happens to officers law enforcement. No, it
24:11
Speaker 1: doesn't mean they become criminal, but it does mean that
24:14
Speaker 1: they live in an underbelly of a world that's very
24:18
Speaker 1: different than the rest of us live in. And if
24:20
Speaker 1: they have any predisposition, or if they have any not
24:25
Speaker 1: good morals, that's really good English. I know I just used.
24:27
Speaker 1: But if their morals are not good, then they can
24:31
Speaker 1: cross that line and become the criminal themselves. And I've
24:33
Speaker 1: seen it in court with criminal defendants. And another issue
24:37
Speaker 1: to crime online got com investigate a reporter leave by page.
24:40
Speaker 1: I mean the husband who rushed down the marriage aisle
24:43
Speaker 1: as soon as his ex is found dead down with
24:46
Speaker 1: the trash jumpster at the end of the driveway. He's
24:49
Speaker 1: a judge or a former judge, and I assume that
24:54
Speaker 1: police handled him with kid gloves because having been on
24:59
Speaker 1: the bench. Asked Nancy. He was questioned immediately after Linda
25:03
Speaker 1: Collins was found murdered that he was not considered a suspect.
25:07
Speaker 1: You know it's ironic. As a senator, Colin Smith introduced
25:12
Speaker 1: multiple bills to expand the places where concealed weapons could
25:17
Speaker 1: be carried, and then ends up dead by gunshot wound.
25:22
Speaker 1: You know, Joseph's got more guilty? Can I correct something? Yeah?
25:25
Speaker 1: Jump in So earlier reports said that she was shot,
25:29
Speaker 1: but in aff the davids that were released, it turned
25:32
Speaker 1: out that she was not actually shot. She was actually
25:34
Speaker 1: stabbed that multiple time. Yeah, for some reason, for some reason,
25:39
Speaker 1: doctor Bethany, A stabbing seems so much more violent than
25:45
Speaker 1: a shooting. What is that? I mean both ways you
25:48
Speaker 1: end up dead. Well, stabbing is so intimate. I mean
25:51
Speaker 1: when you stabbed somebody, you don't just want them dead,
25:55
Speaker 1: say as a drive by shooting, where you want to
25:58
Speaker 1: see your victim dropped to the ground. But there's nothing
26:02
Speaker 1: personal in it other than that. When you use a knife,
26:05
Speaker 1: it's extremely personal. And also you've gotten close enough if
26:10
Speaker 1: you're in the victim's home to gain that person's trust.
26:14
Speaker 1: You have to be close. If there was no sign
26:17
Speaker 1: of a break in or a home invasion, This person
26:20
Speaker 1: was in her home, this person knew her, This person
26:24
Speaker 1: used a knife, and this person had intimate homicidal rage.
26:29
Speaker 1: I know the husband was ruled out as a suspect,
26:31
Speaker 1: but I think whoever did this did know her. And
26:34
Speaker 1: as you know, the preponderance of murders are are committed
26:38
Speaker 1: by our intimates, not by strangers, because it's in the
26:42
Speaker 1: context of our most intimate relationships. As we often talk
26:45
Speaker 1: about that humans experienced envy, rage, jealousy, rejection. And if
26:51
Speaker 1: you look at her picture, Nancy, she's gorgeous, she's powerful,
26:56
Speaker 1: she's at the peak of society. She's pasty, legislator, legislation
27:02
Speaker 1: and bill. So there are a lot of people who
27:05
Speaker 1: could envy her, admire her, stock her, or want a
27:08
Speaker 1: piece of her, want to get close to her, want
27:10
Speaker 1: to be intimate with her. It seems like there's a pool,
27:13
Speaker 1: endless pool of people who either knew her because she
27:16
Speaker 1: was powerful in society, or imagine they knew her and
27:19
Speaker 1: wanted to be up close and personal in some way
27:22
Speaker 1: Nancy relative to kind of Dovetailing with what Bethany said
27:28
Speaker 1: regarding the knife trauma and how this is almost a
27:33
Speaker 1: ripping to shreds of this individual, this gives us an
27:35
Speaker 1: indication as to what condition the body was in when
27:39
Speaker 1: a medical examiner does an initial assessment, or the police,
27:43
Speaker 1: for instance, if that's who it was at the scene,
27:45
Speaker 1: when they cannot differentiate between a gunshot wound and a
27:49
Speaker 1: sharp force injury, that gives you an indication that they're
27:53
Speaker 1: looking at something that's very muddled. It can either be
27:55
Speaker 1: muddled by severe trauma or it can be muddled by decomposition,
27:59
Speaker 1: where you have to give the body into a position
28:01
Speaker 1: where you can examine it in very intense circumstances. They
28:05
Speaker 1: like back at the problem. Bottom line, they stabbing was
28:09
Speaker 1: so bad at first they thought it was a gunshot wound.
28:25
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Guys, I want you to
28:31
Speaker 1: listen now. We're talking about the murder of a gorgeous
28:34
Speaker 1: young state senator. Take a listen to t J. Holmes
28:39
Speaker 1: on GMA. A shocking mystery that turned heads news of
28:43
Speaker 1: Arkansas police investigating a cold blooded killing of a former
28:47
Speaker 1: state senator, Linda Colin Smith, who was found wrapped in
28:50
Speaker 1: a blanket outside her home on June fourth. Police remained
28:54
Speaker 1: tight lipped for days, but later they say they found
28:57
Speaker 1: the suspect friend and former colleague Becky Lynn o'donald, who
29:01
Speaker 1: was now facing charges of capital murder, abuse of Colin
29:05
Speaker 1: Smith's body, and tampering with physical evidence. She is sad
29:09
Speaker 1: that this is hurting her family, but she's angry and
29:14
Speaker 1: she's strong. Who she met at whoever arrested her in
29:17
Speaker 1: WHA o'donald is spending a second week in jail, and
29:21
Speaker 1: her fiance, Tim Logan's claims police have made a huge
29:25
Speaker 1: and inexplicable error. She has been arrested now for capital
29:29
Speaker 1: murder and you and Becky don't have any idea why,
29:35
Speaker 1: none whatsoever. Login says he was the one to break
29:38
Speaker 1: the news to o'donald. I just told her they found
29:41
Speaker 1: Linda dead and she collapsed. You are hearing our friends
29:45
Speaker 1: at GMA, and speaking is the senator's aid, her right
29:53
Speaker 1: hand fiance. That's who you're here speaking O'Donnell, her right arm,
30:02
Speaker 1: Rebecca Lynn. O'Donnell had been this close to her for
30:07
Speaker 1: so long, and now she's arrested for the senator's murderer.
30:14
Speaker 1: Take a listen again to t J. Holmes. After O'Donnell's arrest,
30:18
Speaker 1: Colin Smith's family was stunned, releasing a statement saying we
30:21
Speaker 1: are sickened and upset that someone so close to Linda
30:24
Speaker 1: would be involved in such a terrible, heartless crime. But
30:28
Speaker 1: Logins is asking for help to clear his fiance's name,
30:31
Speaker 1: saying he believes the real killer is still out there.
30:34
Speaker 1: Has it crossed your mind for a moment, just in
30:37
Speaker 1: some late night alone, were you questioned, well, maybe Becky
30:45
Speaker 1: is capable of this. Becky's not capable of this. You
30:48
Speaker 1: haven't had every question at all. No, I mean either
30:52
Speaker 1: she is a best actress in the world and a
30:56
Speaker 1: sociopath and completely fooled me. Well, there's not a chance
31:02
Speaker 1: she did this, straight out to Levi page Clime online
31:05
Speaker 1: dot Com investigative reporter Levi, who is Becky O'Donnell? So,
31:10
Speaker 1: Rebecca Linn O'Donnell is Linda Collins friend and business manager
31:15
Speaker 1: for her business, and she was the last person to
31:20
Speaker 1: see Linda Collins alive. She dropped food lunched off at
31:25
Speaker 1: her home May twenty eight, and security cameras set up
31:29
Speaker 1: in the home captured her on the security camera and
31:33
Speaker 1: it also captured her taking down security cameras in the
31:38
Speaker 1: home as well. Wow. Okay cooy Siger thirty six years
31:41
Speaker 1: Seattle PD twenty two of that on homicide. Why would
31:45
Speaker 1: you go into a home and take down the video
31:47
Speaker 1: recording cameras unless it was for a nefarious reason. Yeah,
31:51
Speaker 1: in my business, we call that a clue, right. I mean,
31:55
Speaker 1: it's obviously she didn't want to be paid inside the house.
31:59
Speaker 1: And you know, I would also look at she was
32:02
Speaker 1: her business manager. Maybe she was feeling from the business
32:07
Speaker 1: and got caught and that's what started this whole thing.
32:10
Speaker 1: I don't know, but that's that's interesting. I hadn't heard
32:12
Speaker 1: that she was a business manager. And she's a friend
32:14
Speaker 1: and yeah, me too, Doctor Bethany Marshall, do you remember
32:19
Speaker 1: Selena up I was just looking at that beautiful, gorgeous
32:23
Speaker 1: to Hannah Singer who was murdered by her number one
32:27
Speaker 1: obsessive fan. Yes. Here, Rebecca Lena O'Donnell was all up
32:33
Speaker 1: in Linda Collins Smith's business. Yes, and now she's charged
32:36
Speaker 1: with murder. Yeah. So I think what we saw with
32:39
Speaker 1: the head of the fan club for Selena's and what
32:43
Speaker 1: we might be seeing with Rebecca Linn O'Donnell is Rebecca
32:48
Speaker 1: might have been one of these kinds of women who
32:51
Speaker 1: wanted to be the senator, admired the Senator, wanted to
32:56
Speaker 1: gain proximity to Linda Collins Smith m put her on
33:00
Speaker 1: a pedestal, idealized her, but then envied her all at
33:04
Speaker 1: the same time. And in my field, we feel that
33:08
Speaker 1: envy is the belief that if you have something good,
33:11
Speaker 1: I have to destroy it because I don't believe that
33:14
Speaker 1: you can have something good and I can have something
33:17
Speaker 1: good and we can collaborate and create something good together.
33:20
Speaker 1: So people who are envious always want to destroy the
33:24
Speaker 1: object of their envy. And in this case, O'Donnell may
33:27
Speaker 1: have has taken it to a murderous pathological level. But Nancy,
33:32
Speaker 1: we don't think of females as being stalkers in this
33:35
Speaker 1: kind of way. But it could be that this so
33:37
Speaker 1: called business manager was putting her tentacles in everywhere, like
33:41
Speaker 1: hoiz koid Steiger mentioned, Perhaps she was embezzling. Perhaps she
33:46
Speaker 1: was thinking, Oh, you don't deserve this money after the
33:48
Speaker 1: sale of this motel. This should be my money. I'm
33:51
Speaker 1: the one who's done all this work for you. Why
33:54
Speaker 1: are you benefiting? You shouldn't be in Congress, you shouldn't
33:57
Speaker 1: be a senator. I should be there. I am the
34:00
Speaker 1: more beautiful one, I'm the smarter one. So in a
34:02
Speaker 1: way she has to block the senator out because she
34:06
Speaker 1: can't stand the senator's success. No one in the inner
34:09
Speaker 1: circle seems to believe that Becky O'Donnell could murder State
34:14
Speaker 1: Senator Linda Collins Smith. Take a listen to ABC needs
34:17
Speaker 1: correspondent Marcy Gonzalez new insight into the connection between a
34:22
Speaker 1: former Arkansas state senator killed at her home and her
34:26
Speaker 1: former campaign staff are arrested in connection. It comes as
34:31
Speaker 1: a shock. Linda Collins Smith was found shot to death
34:34
Speaker 1: on June fourth. Days later, Rebecca Lynn O'Donnell updated her
34:38
Speaker 1: Facebook profile picture to this smiling image of them together.
34:43
Speaker 1: Than Friday, without explanation, police took O'Donnell into custody. The
34:47
Speaker 1: investigation is presently at a critical juncture and no further
34:52
Speaker 1: informational way released at this time. ABC News Station KAI
34:56
Speaker 1: reporting that O'Donnell recently appeared as a corroborating witness and
35:00
Speaker 1: Colin Smith's divorce case. And we're told the two were
35:03
Speaker 1: good friends. They were all fighters for the Second Amendment,
35:07
Speaker 1: and so they would you know, you'd see them at events,
35:10
Speaker 1: travel together. This weekend, family, friends and colleagues gathered for
35:14
Speaker 1: Colin Smith's funeral, remembering her as a loving mother and
35:18
Speaker 1: tough legislator. She was courageous, she was undaunted. I mean
35:23
Speaker 1: a lot of the behind the scenes things and politics
35:25
Speaker 1: that was so bad and quite frankly brutal. She would
35:28
Speaker 1: keep fighting. But I don't understand is motive to leave
35:32
Speaker 1: ipage Crime online dot Com investigative reporter. What do we
35:35
Speaker 1: know about potential motive? Well, Nancy, a lot of people
35:38
Speaker 1: think that money. Then maybe the motive here because Rebecca
35:42
Speaker 1: Linn O'Donnell managed the business of that hotel where it
35:45
Speaker 1: was sold as part of the divorce. And also, Nancy,
35:49
Speaker 1: what we haven't mentioned is you played the audio of
35:52
Speaker 1: Rebecca O'Donnell's fiance, Tim Logans. He actually was the power
35:57
Speaker 1: of attorney for the murder victim, Linda Colin Smith. Guys,
36:01
Speaker 1: when you don't know a horse, look at her track
36:04
Speaker 1: record for those people. Steel insisting that Rebecca Lenn O'Donnell
36:09
Speaker 1: aka Becky O'Donnell is innocent. Well, it ain't over yet.
36:15
Speaker 1: Listen to this. I hope you're sitting down. Here's KLRT
36:19
Speaker 1: Fox sixteen Mandy Noel. She's accused this morning of trying
36:23
Speaker 1: to set up a murder from behind bars Rebecca O'Donnell
36:26
Speaker 1: is in jail, now charged with murdering Linda Collins. On
36:30
Speaker 1: top of the capital murder charge, Rebecca O'Donnell is now
36:33
Speaker 1: facing two counts of solicitation to commit capital murder and
36:37
Speaker 1: tampering with physical evidence. The new charges were filed in
36:40
Speaker 1: Jackson County's Circuit Court. We're told four inmates say O'Donnell
36:46
Speaker 1: talked to them about killing Collins's former husband and making
36:49
Speaker 1: it look like a suicide. Investigators say O'Donnell wanted the
36:53
Speaker 1: man's current wife to be killed too. Court documents claimed
36:57
Speaker 1: she offered to pay the inmates in gold and over all.
37:01
Speaker 1: This is happening from inside the Jackson County jail. Pay
37:03
Speaker 1: them in gold and silver. You know, I always watched
37:07
Speaker 1: those commercials on TV about getting gold instead of you know,
37:12
Speaker 1: having a checking account. Where are you gonna bury it
37:14
Speaker 1: in the backyard. She's gonna pay these people with gold
37:17
Speaker 1: and silver. Okay, that's a whole other cannon worm spet
37:21
Speaker 1: in a nut. I was Judas hyscarian, didn't Judas yes?
37:25
Speaker 1: Leave page? Now she wants the ex husband and the
37:30
Speaker 1: wife did yes, Nancy. So this started when she was
37:33
Speaker 1: behind bars and she was talking to fellow inmate and
37:37
Speaker 1: allegedly she was devising this plot to have Linda Collins
37:41
Speaker 1: ex husband Bill Smith, a former judge, killed, and she said,
37:45
Speaker 1: I want him to be killed, and I want you
37:47
Speaker 1: to leave a suicide note behind, and I also want
37:51
Speaker 1: you to kill his current wife to make it look
37:54
Speaker 1: like a murder suicide. And they, she said, in their
37:59
Speaker 1: home they have gold and silver worth about thirty grand.
38:03
Speaker 1: Take that and that would be your reward. Well, you
38:06
Speaker 1: know what, I guess one dead body was not enough
38:08
Speaker 1: for her. We wait as justice unfalls. Nancy Grace climbs story,
38:14
Speaker 1: signing off Goodbye friend,