Latest / 3 Guys, 6 Balls NFL Podcast / EP 17: Steelers/Dolphins Trade, Overrated Or Underrated?, Where Does C.J. Stroud Rank Among QBs?, & Top 5 WR Duos

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EP 17: Steelers/Dolphins Trade, Overrated Or Underrated?, Where Does C.J. Stroud Rank Among QBs?, & Top 5 WR Duos · 3 Guys, 6 Balls NFL Podcast

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3 lifelong friends, 6 trusty balls and endless NFL takes.
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Welcome to Three guys 6 Balls NFL Podcast.
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Welcome to episode 17 of Three guys 6 balls NFL podcast.
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There's been some breaking news in the NFL.
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The Pittsburgh Steelers have traded Minka Fitzpatrick to the
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Miami Dolphins in exchange for Jalen Ramsey and Jonnu Smith.
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So I want to hear you guys thoughts on this.
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What do you guys think? Who do you think won this trade?
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And we also tried to fit in the 7th right.
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The Steelers gave up a fifth for the Dolphin 7th, which those
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picks don't mean nothing, but essentially they're they're
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nothing. Although fifth round gets you
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should do a Sanders. So there's that.
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I love this trade for the Steelers.
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They appear to be going all in right now.
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They got Aaron Rodgers. He's pretty much said that this
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is his last year. So he's done after this one.
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So I mean, it's pretty much we don't care about the money.
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We're just going to do it for one year and see what we can get
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out of it. So maybe maybe this is Mike
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Carmen swan song too. Maybe he's going to take this
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winner right off into the sunset and his best shot it's.
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Going to be fun to watch Mike Tomlin right off into the sunset
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losing out after the first playoff game.
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That's just what the Steelers do.
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They haven't won a playoff game in nine years.
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Oh, I like the trade. I want to say I like it for both
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teams. Just switching it up.
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I think that, especially coming to the last year of a contract,
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think that the Steelers got the better end.
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I really like Jonny Smith. You don't hear much about him or
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I just don't hear much about him, but I think he's really
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good. He's a really good talent, and I
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think that Galen Ramsey is a better defensive back than Minka
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Fitzpatrick. So I think the Steelers got the
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better end of the deal, but I think neither team got fleeced.
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If you think about it, they got rid of George Pickens, so you've
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got one solid right receiver, Cyrano run one right receiver, 2
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tight ends, and you've got Jalen Warren in the backfield, right?
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He's still back there. So they're kind of committing to
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the run. Aaron Rodgers kind of always
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been that way. He's a run first, old school
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kind of guy, run first play action over the top.
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So one, I see we're two tight end and you're running back back
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there. It's it's going to, I would not
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be surprised if you saw, I don't know, I can't even think of a
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good fullback that would be on the move.
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But I would not be surprised to see them bringing another
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running back or some other smaller guy to to go alongside
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DK Metcalf. I just I think they're
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committing to more of an Aaron Rodgers play style.
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That's what The Jets didn't do. They wanted him to be the full
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spread option guy and the full not spread option itself, but
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this spread formation guy into sling the ball everywhere.
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And he's at the point of his career where he just can't do
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that as much. He has to has to hand the ball
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off. He has to dump off the tight
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ends. He has to do all of those sorts
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of things. And so they're they're adjusting
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for it. I'm kind of excited to see what
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the Steelers do. We could be some legitimate old
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school football at this point. It is exciting to see Aaron
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Rodgers. I mean, because I think isn't he
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said that this is his last year, Yeah.
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Or like hinted at it, at least. I think it's nice that it's
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like, hey. Apparently.
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Yeah, because that's, I mean, he could do a little Brett Farb
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action there if he's going to the Steelers and they obviously
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knew he was going to go. I think at that point you kind
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of have to just center your team around him being there.
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Otherwise it's just a wash of a year.
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It's like, why bring on this like this quarterback in the
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tail end of the twilight of his career if you're not going to,
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you know, make it work with him. So I think if he's kind of
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calling some shots, I won't say calling shots, but at least has
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a little bit more of control over the personnel, I think
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that's solid, at least for Aaron Rodgers, especially I.
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Don't know if he had like control over the personnel
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necessarily, but I think that just regardless of if Aaron
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Rodgers was their quarterback or not, they had to get some sort
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of other weapon on offense because you got firemouth and
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you have DK Metcalf, but outside of that, you've got like Calvin
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Austin. So they had to get somebody else
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on offense. And Jonnu Smith, even though
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he's listed as a tight end, I think they're actually going to
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use him kind of as like a tight end, wide receiver, hybrid type
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of guy. Use him in the slot because he's
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kind of a smaller tight end. So he's he doesn't fit the
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traditional tight end mold. So I think they're going to use
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him in that hybrid role a little bit.
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Last season he had 88 catches for 884 yards and eight
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touchdowns. So he has a good offensive
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weapon. I think they won this trade.
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I like aspects of it for the Dolphins, but I think the
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Steelers overall won this trade. Everybody can't believe that
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they traded Mika Fitzpatrick and they're saying, like, you know,
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why would you trade one of the best safeties in the league?
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I think he's extremely overrated.
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He is very good at run defense. He's a guy who's willing to meet
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those bigger backs in the in the hole, make the tackle.
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He's very good run defender, but he is extremely overrated when
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it comes to coverage. I watched a highlight video and
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I don't know if you guys watched it, I sent it to you, but I
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watched this highlight video of Mika Fitzpatrick's interceptions
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from the seasons where he had like 5 or 6 interceptions.
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Almost all of them are off of tip balls, dropped passes, or
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were the quarterbacks just overthrowing the receiver
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because it was just a terrible pass.
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Most of his interceptions are not because he's actually good
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at coverage. He's like the Chicharito of
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football, even though I guess Chicharito does play football,
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but soccer. He's a Mexican player and
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everyone says that. I'll ask it.
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I'll ask people. This is back when I was in
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Mexico. It was like 10 years ago and I
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asked cuz everyone is wearing his jersey.
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I'm like, is he a good player? And I'm like, yeah, he's got to
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getting the ball in the goal. I'm like, so he's good, right?
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Like yeah, he gets the ball in the goal.
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And you watch, after I got back, I watched highlights and he's
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just happens to be in the right spot all the time.
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And so it's like you could say it's like he's lucky.
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You could also say he's in has great positioning in foresight.
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But either way, he's not a great player, but he does score a lot
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of goals. So see the kind of the same way
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here where it's like, yeah, I mean, if you can keep this lock
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up where everyone's tipping balls to you like you're great.
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But otherwise you're never out there heat seeking these balls.
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Yeah, but he, he hasn't had an inner or he's had one
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interception in the last two seasons, but just a couple
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seasons before that he had 6 interceptions and I think the
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season before that he had five. So he just happened to be in the
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right spot at the right time just because receivers couldn't
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catch or a defender on the defensive line tipped the ball
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up in the air and he just was in the back, was in the back and
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just ran up and and picked it off.
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So I don't think he's actually that good of a coverage player.
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So the the Steelers were eighth worst in passing yards allowed
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last season. And so they had to get better at
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defending the pass. And so this offseason they went
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and got Darius Slay and now they traded for Jalen Ramsey.
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And neither of those corners are in their prime, but they're
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definitely going to be better than what they were last season
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defending the pass. So I think the Steelers won this
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trade both because of their defensive move and because of
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their offensive move. I mean, yeah, I agree.
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I think the the player I was thinking about was they also
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have Robert Woods and like you said, they don't have a good
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like good other options at at wide receiver.
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You said Calvin Austin, they've got Robert Woods they brought in
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notably, they also picked up and you undrafted free agency pool.
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They picked up a full back DJ Thomas Jones.
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They picked up a full back as an undrafted free agent, which is
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kind of feeding into more of the narratives.
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Obviously we don't know if he's going to make the team or not,
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but it feeds into more of the narrative of like, well, you're
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going to you're going to buckle down and commit to old Jerome
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Bettis style Pittsburgh Steeler football.
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And they dropped to Taylor Johnson out of Iowa, right?
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I mean, he's used to carrying an offense.
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That's basically what he did at Iowa.
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He was the only good player. You cannot, you cannot call Iowa
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having an offense. He was the offense.
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He was the offense, but like. Even he was the best player on
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the team. Yes, he was my fault.
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Well that punter has argument there.
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He got the most U sets for sure. That doesn't mean he's the best
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though. Well.
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He's a football player. You're right.
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He's the guy who plays football. He's a.
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Player who plays football. He got recruited and now he's in
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the NF. Li can't wait till the next
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draft season so we can say that again.
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Let's not wish for next offseason already, OK?
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We're in this offseason. We've been through it.
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We all know we haven't even gotten to a season yet.
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We all know what's going to happen.
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The Cowboys are going to suck, and if they do make the
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playoffs, they're losing the first round and somehow the
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Chiefs are going to be in the Super Bowl.
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We might as well just skip the next offseason already.
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Nope. I'm going to be honest, I hope
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they either just win and you guys just enjoy it along the way
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or they don't get anywhere. But I don't want to hear you
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guys. Oh, well, they're going to lose
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the next game. Oh, they're going to lose the
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next game all the way to the Super Bowl.
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Well, this is going to be embarrassing because now we got
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to lose in the Super Bowl. So we're gonna hear February and
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then you win. It's like, well, they're
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probably just going to trade away all they're good players.
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If we make it to the Super Bowl, I'll be excited until they lose
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the Super Bowl and then you'll hear about it.
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Let me tell you that's. What I'm saying?
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I will be I will be real about the Cowboys all season long.
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I will be rooting along with them and telling my heartbreak
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stories along the way. I have no issues with the
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Cowboys doing well, but I have no expectations for them to do
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well. But if they end up doing well,
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I'm not going to be like, well, this is just by cheers.
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No way. But I can I can commend them for
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doing well. You guys did great, good job.
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I can be positive. I don't like to, but I can be.
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It takes a lot of energy. Being Cowboys fan really sucks
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the lifeout of you. As you're wearing Steelers
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jersey. Why do you think I'm wearing it?
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All right, so we're going to get on to our next segment.
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We're going to play a little game.
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We're going to play a game of overrated or underrated.
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So I got a couple guys here for you.
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Before we do that though, I want to give a shout out to Cheese
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Heads and the Bear podcasts because this is where I got the
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idea to do these games. They do these games all the
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time, so shout out to them. And also shout out to the
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Honolulu Cheese Podcast because they just did a full show on
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overrated or underrated. So just wanted to give them a
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quick shout out also. That's a lot of player
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knowledge, good for them. It is, yeah.
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It wasn't just players, though. There was certain things like
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going to a game in person versus watching it on the TV at home,
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that kind of thing. So it was a good episode.
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That's that's a fun. We should talk about that one
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day. Let's talk about that in the
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middle of November after we've after we've gone to the one.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah. There it is.
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Put on, put on your spreadsheet. It's a lot of show notes.
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So I've got two players here for you guys.
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So the first one is Packers quarterback Jordan Love.
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Is he overrated or underrated? I really like Jordan Love.
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I think that he came in with next to no expectations
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following Aaron Rodgers. He's the guy that pissed Aaron
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Rodgers off and pushed him out of out of Green Bay.
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He's the guy that came in and Drake dropped him in the first
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round, although nobody really knew why and he didn't have all
10:27
of high expectations coming out of College in my opinion as not
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a real Packers fan. And so he's done nothing but
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perform. I would say above expecting,
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above expected in my opinion. I would actually say he's
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underrated. I have him.
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I had him listed on my top 10 quarterbacks list.
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I really like Jordan Love. I think he's made the best out
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of a terrible situation. I think that he is underrated in
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the grand scheme quarterbacks. What do you think, Avery?
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I don't. I hesitate to say either.
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I don't think he's necessarily underrated.
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I definitely don't think he's on.
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He's overrated. I guess I would have to say
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underrated. I think he's produced a lot or
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how little people give him credit might just be because of
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the team's overall performance. But I mean, I'm not a huge fan
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of him. But at the same time I've seen
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what he can produce and I'm thinking like, all right, maybe
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he's one of these guys that just breaks out.
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But I could also kind of see him being like one of those Kirk
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Cousins guys, like that little bit of the journey, man.
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Whereas like, you know, he'll have some little flashes in some
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places but never really come onto the scene.
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As far as I don't know, I guess I don't ever see him becoming
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any top five or like top 8 quarterback.
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I would agree with that. I think I would personally put
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him like like you said, like he's not really underrated, but
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he's not really overrated. But if I had to choose one, I
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would go with overrated actually.
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And the reason why is because just regardless of his stats,
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he's made the playoffs. He's got a one and two record in
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the playoffs, but his one playoff win is against the
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Cowboys, which basically means you haven't won a playoff game
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as an overall starter. He's 18 and 15.
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So that's middle of the pack like that's that's a mid
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quarterback and then against. One of those games is just worth
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a year I made. True, OK, but.
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Yeah, you're right. You're right.
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You're right. And then against the NFC North,
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he's five and seven. He can't win games in his
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division. I know he can still make the
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playoffs without winning games in his division, but in his
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division, he's got a losing record.
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And the other reason I think that he's a little bit overrated
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is because I do talk to a lot of Packers fans and it's kind of
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the same thing as how I feel about like, Caleb Williams with
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Bears fans. They just over hype this guy
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like like an insane amount. I'm a Cowboys fan and I have I
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don't think I've ever said Dak Prescott is a top quarterback.
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Even when he was second in MVP voting, I would I don't think I
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ever was like, you know, Dak Prescott is that guy.
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And I just feel like Packers fans do that a lot with Jordan
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Love, even though he hasn't done anything except for beat the
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Cowboys, which again, basically doesn't count when it comes
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it's. Just going to happen.
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It is. It's a.
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Good it is actually. Doesn't matter who the
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quarterback is, who the players are, who the coaches, If the
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team's even there, they're still going to beat the Cowboys
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somehow. Exactly.
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Yeah, especially if you can moderately run the ball.
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He had a bit of a drop off last year versus 20.
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So he's he's totally started for two years now 2023-2024 and last
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year he didn't miss two games to take that into account, but he
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had a bit of a drop off. He threw 4100 yards and 23.
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He threw 3300 yards, almost 3400 yards and 24.
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He threw 8 less touchdowns last year, the year before, but the
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same interceptions. So I mean, his, his touchdown
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percentage went down 25 and 11 versus 32 and 11 because I've
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played two less games. What you don't like to see is
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your technically four year veteran.
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I guess you want to call him two year starter already missing
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time, but you're getting hurt. Especially a guy who's not, he's
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not really a runner, but he he's a, he's more of a pocket passer,
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which is honestly kind of why I like him.
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Man, rushing yards in his career, he's got 356 not what I
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would call a lot, especially nowadays for quarterbacks.
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So he's definitely trying to stand in the pocket and throw
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the ball more. I don't know.
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I like him and if you're not in Green Bay, you don't have to
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hear about him all the time. I couldn't imagine being a non
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Packers fan in the Wisconsin area.
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I bet you hate Jordan Love, but everywhere else you never have
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to hear about him. So I think he's underrated.
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It's a good. Point.
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It's all kind of a matter of perspective.
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Right. That's why I don't like the
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49ers or the Seahawks. I'm neither one of their fans
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that live in the Northwest and so I just have to hear all the
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time. I don't think any of us like the
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49ers or Seahawks. I hate them more than.
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He doesn't like anybody. I've been kind of the Broncos
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have been kind of growing on me. It's probably just because of.
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Just because of Bow and Nicks, and it's just like you with Drew
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Brees and the Saints. Yeah, I like Sean Payton.
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I'm a Big Sean Payton guy. Yeah, it's common denominator
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right there. I'm.
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Excited to watch them, all right?
14:41
So next guy Commanders wide receiver Debo Samuel, Overrated
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or underrated? Maybe I'll let you go first this
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time, all right? So I can sit, I'm going to go
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ahead and say overrated one because I has nothing to do with
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the Commanders. I just don't like the 49ers and
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that's where he's been his whole career.
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However, that has really little to do with this.
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I just think his production is kind of dropped off.
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You could say maybe it's just the team situation.
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I do see I see quarterback stats as kind of the most consistent.
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Then I see maybe running backs, then wide receivers, then some
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like defensive players as an example, like interceptions.
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Interceptions aren't a great indicator of how well you do.
15:21
You know, if you're you're a great, great corner, they just
15:24
never throw to you. Like you're just not going to
15:25
get much. And it's kind of the same deal
15:27
with like, wide receivers. Like Tyreek Hill isn't a bad
15:30
receiver. He had bad numbers last year.
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It's because his quarterback was gone.
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And so, like, sometimes there's just personnel issues that get
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in the way of production, especially if you're a receiver
15:39
that's dependent on so many other things in order to
15:42
produce. That being said, I don't care.
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And I still think he's overrated.
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I like it. What do you think Will?
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I heard they were here. I think that he is also
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overrated. It's probably because he was on
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the 49ers and I don't like 49ers, but I also am a big
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fantasy football guy and he underperforms the fantasy
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football every single year. He was on my team last year and
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I was extremely frustrated with him.
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Yeah, and that's not fair to judge a player by that.
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That's not fair to anybody. But that's the way life works
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when you're a football fan. You're going to judge people
16:13
based off of their financial performance.
16:15
So get over it, pal. I don't know.
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I just don't. I don't think his production is
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as good as his mouth is loud and maybe that's the wrong way to
16:23
word that. But for sure, I think that
16:28
people like Jamar Chase are allowed to be loud, obnoxious,
16:32
and people like Justin Jefferson are allowed to and even at one
16:37
point in his career, Aaron Rodgers are.
16:39
They're allowed to put up a stink about things because Aaron
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Rodgers is a full time MVP. Like not in.
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I don't think all of them were in a row, but at least multiple
16:48
of them were in a row. And I think that's when you are
16:50
going to be that good. You are allowed to have that
16:54
much attitude and he has not been that good to have that much
16:58
attitude. Yeah, he's not hot enough.
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To be that crazy, you have to be hot.
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You're right. You are absolutely right.
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I mean it's. No one likes a likes A6 with an
17:08
attitude. It's it's bad.
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It's a bad look. You're not wrong in. 20/21 he
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was a nine with an attitude and it was like, I don't like the
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49ers, but like, you put up, you know, 1400 yards as a receiver.
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Like, all right, you can talk a little bit, but 600, so up 700
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yards, yeah. That was his one good season of
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his career. He's had one truly good season
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of his career. I would agree with you guys.
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I think Devo Samuel is one of the most overrated players.
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He's only had 1000 yard season his whole career.
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If you combined it with his rushing yards, he's had more
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than that but 1000 yard receiving.
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Sure, we're going to talk scrimmage yards, Sure.
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But if you count scrimmage yards, somebody had 2000 yard
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seasons. If you roll over some of his
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high school yards, he had. Really good stats.
17:56
I bet he did, but see he also sorry.
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You go I, you go. That's kind of the reason why I
18:02
think Debo Samuel is extremely overrated.
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In 2024, he had 670 receiving yards and he had 136 rushing
18:10
yards. Debo Samuel is apparently this
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great offensive weapon with those numbers.
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But let's say that you have a running back who has 670 rushing
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yards and 136 receiving yards. Is he a great offensive weapon
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or is he just the mid running back?
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That's just the backup running back.
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Right. He also had four total
18:28
touchdowns and 15 games and two fumbles.
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Let's not act like he's out here being a touchdown machine or
18:36
well, he's a he's a red zone weapon.
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He's not. I don't know.
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I just, I've never really looked into his stats in depth until
18:44
this and I I, I am not AD, but I don't want him on any fantasy
18:49
team ever again. He's hanging his head on that
18:52
one season. Like we said, we're at 1700
18:54
scrimmage yards, 14 touchdowns. That's a great season, but your
18:59
whole career can't be made out of one season.
19:01
Doesn't work. That way you guys, both of you
19:03
guys, and this might be a spreadsheet question now that
19:06
he's with Jayden Daniels, how do you think his stats will look
19:09
this upcoming? Season probably about the same
19:11
as last year. I actually disagree with. 603
19:13
touchdowns. I think they go up actually,
19:15
because he's no longer the number one target.
19:17
Now he may not have been a true #1 target in San Francisco, but
19:21
I, you had significant attitude problems.
19:24
You covered George Kettle with a safety.
19:25
Christian McCaffrey you cover with a Gurney because he's going
19:28
to be on in the hospital anyway. So you put, you put one of your
19:35
best corners on Debo and, and there it is.
19:37
But in, in Washington, you can't do that.
19:39
Your best guy has to go on. Terry McCord has to He's going
19:42
to reap the benefit of being the number 2.
19:44
Receiver. It's not going to be Luke
19:46
McCaffrey, no. I don't even know how to say
19:50
that no. No, to go back to Debo Samuel's
19:55
stats, if you take his 2023 stats where he had 892 receiving
19:59
yards and 225 rushing yards, if you reverse that and you put a
20:03
running back in where he has 892 rushing yards and 225 receiving
20:07
yards, that's just an average running back.
20:09
There's literally no difference between Debo Samuel and an
20:12
average player at a different position.
20:13
It's kind of like Travis. Hunter honestly, like I
20:15
personally feel like Travis Hunter is being overhyped
20:18
because he can play two different positions.
20:19
It's the same thing with Debo Samuel because he can play two
20:22
different positions because he can play wide receiver and take
20:25
snaps out of the backfield. He has this great offensive
20:27
weapon. But if you get a player who can
20:29
play running back and he he catches passes because that's
20:33
what running backs do, he's just an average running back.
20:35
If he puts up the same amount of stat, like same amount of yards.
20:38
I personally think Debo Samuel is one of the most overhyped
20:41
players in the NFLI actually put out a poll in our sports
20:45
podcasters group on Instagram. And here's here's the question
20:48
is I said would you rather have a wide receiver with 700
20:51
receiving yards and 200 rushing yards, have a running back with
20:54
700 rushing yards or 200 receiving yards?
20:57
Or does it not matter because it's both the same production?
20:59
I just put it out yesterday so I didn't get as many votes as I
21:01
would have liked to, but I got 10 total votes. 5 people said it
21:05
doesn't matter because it's the same.
21:06
Four people said they'd rather have the running back and one
21:09
person said they'd rather have the receiver, which just proved
21:11
my point that Debo Samuel is way over hype just because he can
21:15
play two different positions and because he can get rushing yards
21:18
as a receiver. Yeah, it mean it'd be like if
21:20
you worked at a company and you worked 6 people's job but still
21:24
only output the amount of one person.
21:27
It's like, cool, so you're doing a portion of all these six jobs.
21:30
That doesn't mean you should get paid for six people.
21:32
I mean, some people should. I do know some people that
21:33
should. But like you can't do both at
21:36
the same time. Are you one of those people?
21:38
I do a lot of jobs. Effectively.
21:42
I do, yeah. Some of them.
21:43
Some of them better than other people.
21:47
All right, let's get, let's move on to our next segment.
21:50
We're going to talk a little bit about CJ Stroud.
21:52
What do you think of CJ Stroud? Like where would you rank CJ
21:55
Stroud as a quarterback? Coleridge Bernard Stroud Huh?
21:59
Yes, and it says actual. No, this is actual name.
22:04
Yeah, what's? Wait, what's what's worse?
22:06
What's worse, that name or Patrick Mahomes middle name of
22:09
Levon? Oh, Coleridge Bernard is worse
22:11
than Patrick Levon. Patrick Levon can have a career
22:16
in the adult industry if you catch my my drift and do a
22:20
little. Coleridge, Bernard.
22:22
R&B. Oh, you're right, Patrick Levon,
22:27
you are right. Well, you want to know pal, What
22:29
do? You think of him, where would
22:30
you rank him? Go ahead, Avery.
22:32
Where would you rank CJ Stroud as a quarterback?
22:33
14. That's why I had him 14.
22:35
No way. Really.
22:36
Yeah. 14. Oh, me too guys.
22:38
Wow, crazy. We're so cool.
22:40
Together expand on why I decided to place him at 14.
22:43
Well, if you mean give you some stats, sure, I'd love to.
22:46
OK, so this is a similar stats of the one I mentioned with
22:49
Jordan Love. So in his career, CJ Stroud is
22:51
19 and 13 as a starter, which is better than Jordan Love's
22:54
record. However, he's 8 and three
22:57
against the AFC South, so against the Jaguars, Colts and
22:59
Titans, which is one of the worst.
23:00
Way worst division. Thank you.
23:02
One of the worst divisions in football against everyone else,
23:06
he's 11 and 10. So he has a winning.
23:08
I mean, he has a winning record both, but like he's 8 and three
23:12
against one of the worst divisions in the league.
23:14
And then against everybody else he's 11 and 10.
23:17
He's a extremely average winner against everyone else aside from
23:22
against his division. Extremely average.
23:25
He's extremely average. He can't win against other teams
23:28
that are in in his division, so that's why I would rank him at
23:31
14 that. Kind of goes, I mean, that's
23:33
basically yeah, it's just middle of the pack.
23:35
I I, I, I do like that he's been able to produce.
23:38
It's not like he's some liability quarterback.
23:40
I just think that I mean he's on the text and so I think they've
23:43
just got a lot of other things to sort out.
23:45
It would I don't think I wouldn't say that he's kind of
23:48
doomed to stay that middle of the road.
23:50
I think a different situation, a different kind of, I mean an
23:53
entirely different situation could prove to be something
23:56
really good for him. If he goes to a place that's got
23:58
some good weapons and it allows him to kind of, you know, relax
24:02
a little bit more. Not saying he's not relaxed, but
24:05
I think it could change. I'm just, I don't, I'm not
24:07
saying he's a bad quarterback or that he's just doesn't, he has a
24:10
low ceiling. I just don't know how high see
24:12
that that ceiling goes. But right now, he's just right
24:14
in the middle. When everybody talks about the
24:15
sophomore slump, how he did worse last year, but really he
24:19
played two more games, so you have to say Titanic account and
24:22
he threw for when is that 400 less yards.
24:25
We're also playing 2 less games, so there's there's some
24:29
extrapolation games, two more, two more games.
24:31
Excuse me, thank you. He also threw for less
24:33
touchdowns and more interceptions, but a lot of that
24:36
comes from maybe it's sacked. 54 times.
24:40
Well, yeah, maybe it's just an excuse, but his rookie year, two
24:43
years ago, his rookie year, nobody had any actual film on
24:45
him. And then by the time his
24:47
sophomore year comes around, everybody has film on him.
24:49
They know they they know what he's going to do theoretically.
24:52
They know his tendencies. You you micro analyze every part
24:56
of his game and so you're able to just pick it up parties here.
25:00
So I think there's a little bit of that going on to where he's
25:03
trying to figure out how to overcome them overcoming him.
25:08
I expect the same thing to Jayden Daniels this year.
25:10
People are going to get his tendency to figure out how to
25:12
stop him. I'd I legitimately expect him to
25:14
have a slump because he's still learning to become a
25:16
professional. And so your first year, nobody
25:19
has any idea you're this hot shot All Star.
25:21
Your second year. You can do a slump in your third
25:23
year, you learn how to be a professional, and you learn how
25:26
to outplay the game Airplane. No one cares what you think.
25:29
Will now he cut off, so it's my turn.
25:34
No, I, I think CJ Stroud, I, I think he's basically reiterating
25:37
what I was saying before, but basically he's not in a great
25:40
division, but it's still not an excuse to not be performing
25:43
better against the other teams. And when you're 11 and 10,
25:46
you're not really going anywhere.
25:47
It's the same deal with teams that aren't making the playoffs
25:49
and aren't also getting any high draft picks, where you're just
25:52
kind of stuck in that middle spot.
25:54
I feel like if I was a Texans fan, I would just want their
25:58
whole I, I would just want to shake the whole thing up because
26:01
it feels like we're just kind of stuck.
26:02
We feels like they're kind of stuck in this extreme mediocrity
26:07
where they can't really get out there.
26:08
Never the bottom of the barrel. They're never really any like
26:12
real contender. I think they made the playoffs
26:14
recently, but even then just nothing serious.
26:17
So average. One thing I do want to say about
26:20
CJ Stroud to kind of put a positive note in here about him
26:23
is he has let his team do the playoffs in both of his seasons
26:26
and he's won a playoff game in both of those seasons.
26:29
So he's at least been able to win a playoff game when he's
26:33
made the playoffs in both years. So just something positive to
26:36
say about CJ Stroud is that he's been able to lead his team there
26:39
and he's been able to win a playoff game each year.
26:41
But I still just think that he is an average quarterback and to
26:45
go back back to the sacks thing, he was sacked 54 times last
26:49
year. But you look at other
26:50
quarterbacks like Joe Burrow who still performed when he was
26:53
sacked 48 times, Jane Daniels was sacked 50 times, Jalen Hurts
26:56
was sacked 45 times. They were all sacked a lot and
26:59
they still performed. I just don't feel like that's, I
27:02
mean, it is kind of an excuse, but it's not really an excuse.
27:05
Right. I, I kind of pay you back off
27:07
that and kind of go into an Avery set as well.
27:10
I think it's almost a negative. I mean, not making the playoffs
27:13
is never really a negative. He's made the playoffs two of
27:17
his two years in the NFL, but he's almost hindering himself,
27:20
right? That team's going to get better
27:22
slowly because they keep making the playoffs.
27:25
They don't get a high draft pick and not to the high draft pick
27:27
guarantees your team getting better.
27:29
But if you're stuck in the first round or round card and you're
27:32
out make the playoffs, host a game and you're losing the wild
27:35
card round or you go on the road or whatever.
27:38
If you're, if you're winning one or two playoff games or one or
27:41
zero playoff games a year, you're picking in the 20 to 25
27:45
range, 20 to 20 to 28 range. And it's just not, you're just
27:49
you're going to get better slower and that's just going to
27:52
be a problem overall. I do like the pieces they've put
27:55
around him at receiver, but like, I'm questioning their
27:58
offensive line a little bit. There's a high chance that that
28:01
could be worse. This.
28:02
Season well, yeah, they they gave away Laramie Tunsil and
28:06
well, I think somebody else, I don't remember who, but their
28:08
their offensive line did not get better over the offseason.
28:10
I agree. So we'll, we'll see how it goes
28:12
for CJ Stroud in year 3, but as of right now, I ranked him 14,
28:16
Avery ranked him 14. And Will where do where would
28:18
you rank him, Will? Well, clearly, clearly 14.
28:22
Obviously you. Better not disagree with this
28:24
on. This He's the 14th best
28:25
quarterback in the NFL. Let's just leave it at that.
28:27
Yeah, let's go with that. On average, obviously.
28:30
All right, so on to our last segment of the show.
28:33
We've all put together our list of top five wide receiver duos
28:37
heading into this season. And so will let's start with you
28:41
before, where your camera cuts out for the 10th time of this
28:44
episode. Yeah, if it cuts out, we're just
28:46
going to keep rolling and you'll just see a black picture of me
28:49
and I'm sorry, everybody, just remember.
28:51
What he looks like. Remember this face?
28:53
So yeah, give us your list and then Avery and I will chime in
28:56
if we have anything to say as you're going through your list
28:58
here. So in order, I've got first and
29:01
foremost Jamar Chase and T Higgins and I think they need to
29:04
be first because they have proven themselves right.
29:08
They are a proven duo. There it goes.
29:11
I'm still moving, we're still going here.
29:13
They regardless of how bad that defense gets, that offense
29:16
continues to produce and and used to do well.
29:18
So I've got them by #1 number two, I've got Almond Rock St.
29:22
Brown and Jameson Williams. That Lions offense is incredibly
29:25
high-powered and those two guys are somehow they're making Jared
29:30
Daffler an absolute All Star. And it is, it is wonderful.
29:33
I like watching most of them play #3 I've got A.J.
29:36
Brown and Devonta Smith, I think those two now Super Bowl
29:40
winners. And they had to do it a lot more
29:42
than people were thinking because the Chief shut down
29:45
Saquon Barkley in the Super Bowl and they made Joan Hertz throw
29:48
the ball. And that's what he did.
29:49
He threw the ball and he made it work.
29:50
I like those two as a pair, this four and five here.
29:54
And again, those three are all proven pairs.
29:56
They've done it consistently and there's no, no signs of them not
29:59
continuing to do it. So I think that they are proven
30:02
pairs that are going to, can you work well, one pair that I'm
30:05
excited for more than anything else.
30:07
And this is where my Cowboys bias comes in as CD Lamb and
30:10
George Pickens, I am truly excited for what they have.
30:13
I wanted to rank them higher. It was hard to rank them over
30:16
proven sets of receivers who have shown out year after year
30:19
at this point and at #5 I've got Mike Evans and Chris Godwin.
30:23
It doesn't seem to matter who's quarterback there, whether it
30:25
was, oh, what's the guy eating the Dubs, Jameis Winston or
30:30
Baker Mayfield? They are about Tom Brady.
30:33
You're right. I did forget about Tom Brady.
30:35
There was a guy in between them, Tom Brady, those two, he's.
30:38
Forgettable. Yeah, you know, he's pretty
30:41
mediocre. Pretty CJ stride very mid #14 or
30:44
so. I mean, Mike Evans has what, 10
30:48
straight 1000 yard seasons? 11.
30:50
Excuse me, I love, don't mean to shortchange the guy, but more so
30:54
people talk about, especially fantasy wise, they talk about
30:57
Chris Godwin. Chris Godwin, he's this, that
30:59
and the other. And and so when you've got two
31:01
guys in your team, they're consistently putting up high
31:03
financing numbers like that, there's nowhere not to write
31:05
some of the top five to me. Wait, so did you leave Justin
31:08
Jefferson and Jordan Addison off?
31:10
I did. They didn't even make my
31:12
honorable mention list. Oh, that's probably wrong with
31:14
me, but I don't think of Jordan Addison as, I mean, he's a great
31:19
#2 there's no way to deny it. I just don't.
31:22
I don't view him the same as I view the others.
31:24
Maybe I'm wrong. How do you view Justin Jefferson
31:27
though? Like where would you rank I
31:28
think. I mean, he's #2 arcs here in the
31:31
league, in my opinion, and he goes and he goes Jamar Chase,
31:34
Judgment, Jefferson. That's fair, I guess.
31:36
Thanks for validating my. Opinion.
31:39
All right, Avery, give us your top five wide receiver duos.
31:43
All right, to start it off, you got to go with Jamar Chase, T
31:47
Higgins. I got 1.
31:48
Nice Jamar Chase won the Triple Crown.
31:51
The receivers, most receptions, most yards, most touchdowns,
31:54
just already right there. Whoever he's paired with, that's
31:57
got to be one in my opinion. I don't think I have to say too
32:00
much more about that. I think #2 A.J.
32:02
Brown, Devonta Smith won the Super Bowl, crazy good
32:05
receivers. I think you got to put him in
32:07
there. They actually met the season
32:10
goal unlike any other receivers. 3 Justin Jefferson, Jordan
32:16
Addison. I think those three honestly in
32:19
my opinion maybe a shuffle around based on what your
32:22
criteria is, but I think those 3 duos are up there.
32:25
My next ones are a little different #4 Tyree Kill and
32:30
Jalen Waddle. I like that.
32:32
I do like that. Now, they did not have a good
32:36
season last year and I think we all know why.
32:39
I know why because I had to watch it every single week of
32:42
Tyree Kale not being thrown the ball.
32:44
But I am separating that. I am separating the quarterback.
32:47
We're not talking about a trio here. 2 wide receivers,
32:49
Quarterback talking about two wide receivers.
32:51
You put them on any team with a functioning quarterback, they're
32:54
going to crush it. Yeah, that's my opinion.
32:57
They are just insanely fast. I think they're all just, I
33:00
think both of them are still prime.
33:02
I don't know about Tyreke is much, he might be a little bit
33:04
over the hill, but he's still very effective.
33:06
And my 5th is Drake London and Darnell Mooney.
33:11
You're kidding. Nope, that's who I have at 5:00.
33:13
Shut up. I thought, I thought you were
33:16
going to get on me for saying that.
33:17
I thought you were going to get on me being like, seriously?
33:19
That's who. I thought you were going to do
33:21
the same thing to me. That's my #5 wild.
33:25
The reason? Well, I'm sure you have an
33:27
actual reasoning based in, you know, reality and planet Earth
33:31
and everything. For me.
33:34
All that stuff. I was playing Madden.
33:37
I moved my quarterback from college football 25 over to
33:40
Madden and got drafted by the Falcons and dude, Drake London
33:45
crushing it, man, crushing it so and then I was looking up Dardan
33:49
Mooney, like who's he with anyway?
33:51
I think they are fantastic. I think they're both very young,
33:54
so I think it ages even better too.
33:56
I know when we weren't really talking about potential
33:58
necessarily, but I think these guys are stellar.
34:01
There might be better wide receivers out there.
34:03
I'm there probably are, but I like them as a duo a lot.
34:06
All right, I like it. My list.
34:08
I already give you my 5:00, but I'll get into the reason why
34:10
they're my 5 when I get to my #5 S.
34:13
Same with you guys, with my #1 Jamar Chase and T Higgins.
34:17
I mean, you got to put them first.
34:18
There's I don't think there's any really debate about that.
34:21
You got to put them at #1 #2 I have Justin Jefferson and Jordan
34:25
Addison #3 I have same Brown and Williams from the Lions and then
34:31
#4 I have CD Lamb and George Pickens.
34:34
Same as Will. The reason I have that I wanted
34:36
to put them higher, but the reason I have them at 4 is
34:39
because I had to put CD Lamb in there because I think he's the
34:42
third best receiver in the NFL. So I can agree with that.
34:46
And George Pickens was a number one on his team and he's coming
34:49
over to Dallas to play with the third best receiver in the NFL.
34:53
Now, I put him at 4:00 and I didn't put him higher than that
34:55
because they haven't played together.
34:57
We haven't seen what they can do together.
35:00
And so I want to see what they can do together before I put him
35:02
higher than that. But for me personally, I had to
35:04
put CD Lamb on here with George Pickens because the Cowboys now
35:08
have two number one wide receivers #5 Drake London and
35:12
Darnell Mooney. This is based off of stats.
35:14
My list is kind of stat base as pretty much everything else that
35:17
I do is. So Drake London was one of eight
35:20
receivers in the NFL last year who had 100 or more catches.
35:23
He was 4th and receiving yards. He had 9 touchdowns.
35:26
And then total in the NFL, there were 24 players who had 1000
35:30
receiving yards. Three of those were tight ends.
35:33
SO21 wide receivers had 1000 yards.
35:35
The next guy down, so the first guy who didn't have 1000 yards
35:40
is Darnell Mooney. He had 992.
35:44
And so the stats speak for themselves.
35:46
I know a lot of people are probably like, probably don't
35:49
think that they should be in the top five.
35:50
A lot of people are going to put Puku Nakua and Devante Adams in
35:54
there. I'm actually surprised that
35:55
neither of you guys said them. They're on my honorable mention
35:57
list. I had him at six.
36:00
I also have the mistakes. I'd put Devonta Adams in the
36:03
overrated category. I think he's declining.
36:06
I think he's got very little shelf life.
36:08
I can agree with that. Yeah, I'm, I'm not going to.
36:10
That was my reason at least for not considering.
36:12
Him, I'm not going to disagree with that.
36:13
So yeah, I just think they're a very underrated pair of
36:16
receivers. And, you know, a lot of people
36:19
could say like, oh, well, you know, the Falcons were always
36:21
losing, so they had to throw the ball a lot, so of course their
36:24
stats are going to be elevated. You could say the same thing
36:26
about Jamar Chase and T Higgins, right?
36:28
Yes, yes, yes, sorry. Yes, absolutely you can.
36:31
You could say the exact same thing and so I.
36:33
Was nodding there, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
36:38
I've actually taken all my clothes off, so that camera
36:41
better not come back on. Comes back.
36:44
On the camera just comes back on right at that moment.
36:48
Oh man, I hope not. So yeah, the stats speak for
36:54
themselves. They're a great pair of
36:56
receivers and I feel like nobody really talks about them, but I
36:59
think they deserve to be on this list.
37:00
One other thing I want to say with just to go back to Saint
37:04
Brown and Williams for the Lions, there was only one team
37:08
that had two wide receivers have 1000 yards and it was Alliance.
37:12
The Raiders had two pass catchers to have 1000 yards, but
37:15
one of them was a tight end. So there's only one team to have
37:18
two wide receivers have 1000 yards, so that I had to put them
37:21
on my list because of that. That's honestly such a flex
37:24
though. Only one other team had two
37:26
receivers in 1000. Another team had a receiver and
37:29
a tight end have 1000. With.
37:31
Garbage quarterback. Play, Yeah, really just says
37:33
more about Brock Bowers than anything.
37:35
Brock Bowers is what the Falcons wanted Kyle Pitts to be, and he
37:38
just never was. Was Kyle Pitts going to be on
37:40
your list because he's overrated?
37:43
Definitely overrated, we know that, yeah.
37:47
Dude I didn't realize he was the highest ever tight end to be
37:50
drafted. The highest tight end ever to
37:52
be, he got. Drafted crazy high he.
37:54
Was like third or fourth. Yeah, he had.
37:56
A He had a pretty good, he had a pretty good rookie season.
37:59
He had over 1000 yards. One fun stat here about Kyle
38:02
Pitts. In each season he's played, he's
38:04
increased his touchdown numbers by 1.
38:06
So he had one touchdown his rookie year, 2 the next year,
38:09
three the next year and four last year.
38:11
Dude, I just can't get the end zone.
38:13
This year he's gonna have 5. It might be worth drafting.
38:16
Not enough for me to draft him in fantasy, but that's.
38:18
Cool, maybe. Yeah, just know if you have him
38:22
in fantasy, he's gonna have 5 touchdowns the whole season.
38:25
Yeah, scores those first in the first two weeks.
38:28
Drop him, get someone else. He's about to have a season
38:31
ending injury. All right.
38:33
So one question I want to ask you guys to end here.
38:36
I did not put A.J. Brown or Devante Smith in my top
38:39
five. What do you guys think about
38:41
that? I think you're a cowboy.
38:42
You're a fan, idiot. No, I, I, I mean, it's fair,
38:49
right? It's a fair assessment.
38:51
It's because he doesn't like. Small guys like Devonta.
38:54
I don't know. I didn't put, I didn't put
38:56
Justin Jefferson or Jordan Anderson in my top five, so.
38:59
I just felt like the Eagles are more of a rushing team.
39:02
Like it was more about their style of offense for me versus
39:05
like who they are as receivers because I think they're good
39:07
receivers. And just for me, like the way
39:10
that my mind works in this with the statistics and all that is
39:13
just more about like the style of offense that they play.
39:15
Here's the thing, you put any of these guys that we've named and
39:19
you put a quarterback like Tom Brady that I say on their team,
39:22
they're gonna win the Super Bowl, as we saw by Mike Adams
39:25
and Chris Godwood. Like like you just you give an
39:28
incredibly competent quarterback any of these pairs that we've
39:31
named on from any team. You've been competent
39:34
quarterback. Even Drake London and and
39:37
Darnell Moody crush that by the way, got both their names.
39:40
Right. And you can't even see, dude,
39:42
you're blind. You can't even see.
39:44
Yeah, I turned all the lights off in this room.
39:46
That's actually what happened. I turned all my lights.
39:47
On. Camera slide.
39:50
No, I even the two young guys, you give them a competent
39:53
quarterback, like like a Tom Brady type, they're going to do
39:56
well. Like if not Sam Bradford, good
39:59
golly, Matt Stafford, if he went to the, if he went to the
40:03
Falcons and took those two youngins and taught them up, I
40:08
think that would be exceptional. I I just think that they're,
40:11
they're limited by quarterback play.
40:12
Yeah, that's definitely a fair argument.
40:13
All right, well there you have our top five wide receiver duos.
40:18
I think I'm going to try and post those on social media and
40:20
have everybody rank them and we'll we'll see what they say.
40:23
So that's all we have time for this week.
40:25
But stay tuned for more NFL talk next week.
40:28
We're going to talk a little bit about The Jets and Justin Fields
40:31
and if The Jets are better off with Justin Fields than they
40:35
were with Aaron Rodgers. So stay tuned for that.
40:38
And as always, don't forget to keep your balls played with.
40:41
We'll see you next time. Also, Mark Davidson's haircut
40:43
still sucks.