Latest / Rusty's Garage / Will Davison | Part 1 - history lessons and a single seater return

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Will Davison | Part 1 - history lessons and a single seater return · Rusty's Garage

• 0:02
  A listener production.
• 0:14
  I'm automotive commentator and journalist Greg Rust and this is Rusty's Garage.
• 0:26
  For this episode, I'm in Taupo, Taupo as us Aussies sometimes call it, where Supercars has one of its New Zealand rounds each year.
• 0:34
  It is a great place.
• 0:36
  You've got to come and visit at some stage if you haven't.
• 0:38
  That's not me being a tourism ambassador.
• 0:41
  It's a huge 600 square kilometre lake that is perfect for all sorts of water sports.
• 0:46
  You can ski a mountain nearby during winter, there's skydiving, bungee and lots of
• 0:51
  fantastic sights to take in.
• 0:53
  It's a bit of an adventure playground, really.
• 0:55
  It's also home to one of Tony Quinn's racetracks, Topor International Motorsport Park, where I'm working on the coverage of the third round of this summer's Next Gen NZ Championship, the premier Kiwi circuit racing series.
• 1:08
  My colleague and friend, Rihanna Crean, who works on the Supercars TV broadcast, as most of you know, is here along with her husband, Will Davison.
• 1:16
  Rhi is doing a ripper job, as she always does in the broadcasts.
• 1:21
  At night, we've all had the chance to kind of sit around and talk motorsport while we've been on the road.
• 1:25
  So after Hampton Downs last week, I thought I've got to get the mics and the recorder out and chat about Will's career.
• 1:32
  He's just finished his second stint with Dick Johnson Racing and is set for a bit of a change of pace into a co-driver role at Grove Racing this year that will also see him tackle some GT or sports car races for the squad, including the Bathurst 12-hour.
• 1:46
  Now, I'm not sure why, but we've never actually done a feature ep with Will until now.
• 1:52
  But I'm so pleased that we did.
• 1:53
  He's in great form and in a great frame of mind, as you'll hear, almost philosophical at times, with a wonderful photographic memory for things way back in the early part of his career.
• 2:04
  We talk about the rich racing history in his family or the lineage around racing and the deep appreciation that he has for it.
• 2:11
  He knows it and understands it in some detail.
• 2:14
  His time in Formula Ford, racing in Europe against some big names.
• 2:19
  Supercars, of course, including stints with the gun outfits in pit lane and some smaller squads too.
• 2:25
  There are Bathurst wins and some against the odds moments or results that he recalls with great satisfaction because he sort of did it when the chips were down, almost using it as a motivator.
• 2:37
  you get a sense that he's starting to enjoy the purity of driving again.
• 2:41
  And that is certainly evident over the summer here.
• 2:44
  I seem to recall Rihanna ringing me a few years ago, having listened to the candid pod chat that I'd had with their friend, Will Power, the IndyCar champion and Indy 500 winner, who you can find in our garage library.
• 2:56
  That's for later.
• 2:57
  This chat...
• 2:58
  is every bit as good as Will Powers.
• 3:01
  It is hard to play favourites with these interviews, but you'll quickly come to understand why I feel this way when you listen to this ep.
• 3:09
  It is one of our very best, like Powers.
• 3:12
  I found it captivating during the record, and I hope it's the same for you as you listen along to The Convo.
• 3:22
  We've not done one.
• 3:23
  Have we even done – we might have done a short cast.
• 3:27
  Have we done a long – we certainly haven't done a long-form one.
• 3:29
  Yeah, I think a short one.
• 3:30
  Yeah, maybe a short one at some point.
• 3:32
  We were maybe here for the supercars last year.
• 3:33
  Yeah, that sounds right.
• 3:34
  That could be right.
• 3:36
  Anyway, here we are, Lakeside, Topor, here for a summer of racing.
• 3:41
  Rihanna, your wife's doing an amazing job, mate, in the broadcast.
• 3:44
  I think she does a stellar job.
• 3:45
  But I joked with you, I know, in the coverage, but you did bring a helmet and a race suit.
• 3:49
  And it has turned into here at least, we don't know if it's going to be a race tomorrow, but it's at least turned into a drive so far of a single seater again.
• 3:57
  And that's great, isn't it?
• 3:58
  It is.
• 3:59
  Hey, Rusty.
• 3:59
  No, it's awesome to chat to you, awesome to be here and in a really different...
• 4:04
  uh, frame of mind, which, um, I'm glad I'm in, I mean, I'm sort of in semi holiday mode, but we're getting into race season again, obviously.
• 4:12
  Um, so this is uncharted territory for me for 20 years.
• 4:17
  Um, something I suppose I've,
• 4:19
  feared for many years as to where's my head going to be at, you know, when it's all said and done.
• 4:25
  Yeah, I do feel good.
• 4:26
  I mean, the season hasn't started yet, but bit by bit, I think once you close the chapter, it was all a little bit unexpected, not quite the way I wanted things to go down, but I quickly...
• 4:41
  you know, realized it, accepted it.
• 4:44
  And I'm still, yeah, it's all new to me, but bit by bit, you know, I'm starting to feel good, like a weight's off my shoulders in a way.
• 4:52
  I'm here for my wife.
• 4:53
  I'm here being dad.
• 4:55
  And we're still sort of coming out of holiday mode.
• 4:57
  It's normally about now, it's like, right, you light the jets, you start prepping for the year.
• 5:02
  So that's different.
• 5:04
  But I'm here at a great series with great people in the land, and I'm here at a great series.
• 5:09
  over here, which does motorsport so well.
• 5:11
  So it's really refreshing.
• 5:13
  I feel like a fan again.
• 5:15
  And that's something I really want to get back to.
• 5:16
  And I've always wondered when I...
• 5:19
  pull the chute and I'm not full time, will I get that young kid enthusiasm back?
• 5:26
  Because I haven't felt it in a while.
• 5:27
  Like I love driving and racing, but it's just been like blinkers on immense pressure.
• 5:33
  And I haven't felt myself.
• 5:35
  And I mean, it's worried me because I'm a student of this game and I love it.
• 5:39
  I love it.
• 5:39
  I want to feel like a kid again.
• 5:41
  And I'm already feeling that energy and love for the sport now.
• 5:44
  in other ways coming back.
• 5:46
  I love that.
• 5:46
  It's cool.
• 5:47
  I love that.
• 5:47
  I'm so pleased to hear you say that.
• 5:49
  We can talk Groves and other stuff later, but the essence of what you've just covered, the fact, I mean, your family has such a rich history around motor racing.
• 5:57
  I would hate to think that after the grind of 20 plus years, that that had impacted you.
• 6:03
  I'm so pleased that you feel like race fan again.
• 6:05
  That's bloody awesome.
• 6:07
  And my little, a little pump up.
• 6:10
  I, I,
• 6:11
  have had the chance in recent days when we're off air to see you a little bit as a dad and as someone who's got, you know, teenage daughter.
• 6:19
  Dad bods out in Lake, we do.
• 6:21
  Mine is a terrible dad bod, yours is not.
• 6:24
  But, you know, to see you in kind of dad mode and both of you as parents has been a joy, mate.
• 6:30
  You clearly, you're lacking a bit of time on that side too, are you?
• 6:33
  Yeah, I am.
• 6:34
  It puts everything in perspective, being a dad, and it's probably come at a great time in my life where I still get very serious the last couple of years with him around at the races, trying to separate that.
• 6:47
  But what it's meant is when you have a tough time in racing, coming home, and if you bring that energy home, I haven't liked that.
• 6:57
  In the past, you can come home and be grumpy and angry and
• 7:01
  you know, get back to the grind.
• 7:04
  But it doesn't sit well with me if I come back in that sort of a frame of mind because I feel selfish, you know, and I'm happy to have been selfish for 20-odd years as a racing driver.
• 7:17
  But bringing negative energy home, and I've figured at times this year I have done that, and...
• 7:24
  Yeah, I don't rate that at all because my son is so much more important.
• 7:29
  You know, family is so much more important.
• 7:31
  And I shouldn't say driving in circles because I know how important motorsport is and how much it means to me.
• 7:36
  But ultimately, that's what it is.
• 7:39
  So I've given it my heart and soul and I'm happy to...
• 7:43
  you know, realise that there's a lot more important stuff in life and try and find that balance, which is what this next phase will be for me.
• 7:49
  Respect, mate.
• 7:50
  Respect.
• 7:51
  Still with the ultimate love of it, which is great, but seemingly with your head in the right place, which I think is just mega.
• 7:58
  Can I come to the fact that the early part of your career...
• 8:02
  has a single-seated component, and the last 20-plus has been kind of supercars.
• 8:06
  You getting to drive that Rolt this weekend, and I saw the smile on your face when you got out of that car yesterday, and you even have a few little battle scars to show for it too, don't you?
• 8:14
  There's a little bruise on your right leg there.
• 8:16
  Yeah, it's a good one, isn't it?
• 8:18
  And a mark on your right hand, I think, from the gear shifting and so on.
• 8:21
  So good to get behind the wheel of an Atlantic car.
• 8:24
  Yeah, it is.
• 8:25
  It was fantastic, particularly unexpected.
• 8:28
  I mean, any true race driver will always travel with helmet.
• 8:32
  But I had to dust off some 2020 race gear, which did make me giggle a little bit.
• 8:38
  and also i'm probably not as trim as 2020 trying to fit it on um but um yeah that was it was it was cool um to be here and i'm here for my wife i honestly am uh this is all about her and her work and i'm trying my hardest to not get in the way like i'm really here to be dad and support her um
• 9:00
  And even at the track, there's obviously a lot of enthusiasts that want to chat to me, and I'm trying to do a few laps in this Atlantic, but I'm also trying to mind my little boy, and I don't want to let that interfere with Rihanna's work and what I'm here for, but truly appreciative for it.
• 9:17
  The NextGen team has just been amazingly accommodating to me when I was honestly just wanting to be in the background.
• 9:24
  But I'm loving it, building new relationships, and, yeah, that Atlantic car –
• 9:29
  I honestly strapped into it because I'm so underdone with it.
• 9:34
  I've had no real preparation.
• 9:35
  I've just squeezed into Murph's seat, and they've just pushed me down to the dummy grid, and I've never felt so underprepared in my life.
• 9:42
  And when they strapped me in, it was a weird feeling because I consider myself still an open-wheeler driver, but it's been a long time, and the sensation of being strapped in, although I did all that Minardi two-seater stuff, it was a bit...
• 9:58
  Yeah, it was a really bizarre feeling, just go and H-pattern.
• 10:02
  And I was actually second guessing myself for a moment, feeling really out of my comfort zone.
• 10:06
  I mean, I got two corners in and it all came back to me.
• 10:09
  Sweet thing, though, sweet thing, yeah.
• 10:10
  Oh, magic little car, super nimble.
• 10:12
  The way it produces, it's downforce.
• 10:14
  But when it snaps into a slide, you know, all of a sudden it let go and, you know, I just had it, you know, it felt pretty comfortable straight away, getting up through the box, you know, straight away, looking at the analog gauges.
• 10:26
  I mean, I haven't done that in a while.
• 10:27
  while but I was looking at that 9,000, 9,2, it was all coming back to me with ease and just banging it down through the little H pattern, hearing the engine note on the heel and toe.
• 10:38
  It was a great little car and then I started leaning on the downforce a bit more at the end and
• 10:43
  I was like, oh, I could get used to this.
• 10:45
  This is cool.
• 10:45
  I mean, it's a fast little open wheeler, but it's not like anything I've driven in a while.
• 10:51
  Like it's raw.
• 10:53
  It's very raw.
• 10:55
  And I tell you, some of those kids getting around today in the –
• 11:00
  Toyota series, it'd be a different game throwing them all in Atlantic cars because you're working hard and that'll pick it up, but there's a lot more mental work going on, just generally getting through the gearbox and whatnot to just flick and paddle.
• 11:15
  Well, I mean, that's a great point you make because there's been a generational change.
• 11:20
  Many of the top names that we now see and love in Formula One have never...
• 11:26
  other than getting the chance to drive maybe something historic in the Williams, McLaren, whatever, you know, museums or heritage.
• 11:35
  I mean, they don't get the chance to do that now, do they?
• 11:39
  We discussed this yesterday, didn't we, Rusty?
• 11:41
  And listen, I'm...
• 11:42
  Please, I'm in the middle here.
• 11:44
  Like, I'm a middle ground, an 82 baby, where I love the old school.
• 11:50
  But I've also been around the sport so long where I appreciate the talent and skill of the kids of today in Formula 1 and 3, which not a lot of people do.
• 11:58
  You know, I'm caught in the middle where everyone's like, not like the old days, you know.
• 12:03
  They've got it easy these days, even the supercar guys or the Formula 1 guys.
• 12:08
  In a way, yes.
• 12:09
  Yeah.
• 12:10
  But the skill of these kids now through simulation, through training, the level, the depth –
• 12:16
  the way they're driving technically is unbelievable, all of them.
• 12:20
  Yes, the cars are easier.
• 12:22
  So that means it's easier to get within three or four tenths, but still to get that last tenth too is very difficult.
• 12:31
  But I think it's much easier to get within half a second of the pace than it was many years ago in a touring car, a Formula 1 car, if you were within a second and a half 20 years ago or 25 years ago.
• 12:42
  That was like probably a tenth and a half today because the cars were brutal, but the fields were, you know, much greater spread out.
• 12:48
  So I am in the middle of that and I like to accommodate how good the kids are today, but also getting back to what we were just saying, seeing these legends of today jump in these beautiful museum pieces and trying to listen to them get through the H-Patton gearbox, it makes my blood boil.
• 13:07
  Yeah.
• 13:08
  There's no heel and toe.
• 13:09
  There's dogs clashing.
• 13:10
  They don't even shift up the gears.
• 13:12
  You don't even hear the beautiful, you know, Honda V10 in Senna's car or, you know, whatever it may well be.
• 13:18
  You hear running around, you know, mid-80s turbo Williams cars.
• 13:23
  They're just in two gears and they're just not even shifting gears.
• 13:26
  And I can't watch it.
• 13:28
  You're even wincing now, aren't you?
• 13:29
  I think it was even Leclerc at Monaco.
• 13:31
  in one of the Villeneuve or Lauda Ferraris, and he was actually pushing pretty hard.
• 13:35
  But every downshift, I tried to watch it.
• 13:37
  I'm like, this will be good.
• 13:38
  It was compression locks everywhere.
• 13:40
  It was horrible, to be honest.
• 13:42
  So when I got in yesterday, I'm like, nah, I'm going to be an old school racer.
• 13:45
  I'm going to make sure I'm blipping nice and I'm getting down through this H-pattern box beautifully.
• 13:50
  So I think I managed to do that.
• 13:51
  Are you, when you're not away at race meetings, a glued...
• 13:56
  Saturday night qualifying, Sunday night F1 race, you're as passionate about watching that stuff as ever?
• 14:03
  Yeah, I still am with a little man that's in bed early.
• 14:09
  And also I stick to my Queensland now around our life where early rises, early training.
• 14:16
  But the beauty of today's telecast is you can –
• 14:20
  You can watch it, you know, on a rerun the next morning.
• 14:24
  And I make sure, though, if we get up at 5 a.m., go training.
• 14:27
  Rihanna's straight on her phone.
• 14:29
  I'm like, do not, and I will not pick up that phone until 10 because I'll be home at 7 a.m. and breakfast, coffee.
• 14:36
  No spoilers.
• 14:37
  I love it.
• 14:38
  I'm just first thing the next morning.
• 14:40
  I won't sit up and sit up till midnight watching these days, but I'll be up even if it's 4, 5, and watching it without knowing the results.
• 14:47
  I love that.
• 14:48
  Awesome, mate.
• 14:49
  When I was at Channel 10 many, many years ago, I can recall Mark Howard.
• 14:55
  doing this story on uh you know the kind of um lineage of the davison family in motor racing and it and it tapped into a world war ii spitfire pilot and then the grand prix racing or international racing that followed the lines of the family tree and and who did what and so on are you you know are you equally as as proud and as passionate of that stuff too
• 15:21
  Yeah, it's been interesting even here this weekend, obviously spending a lot of time with Tony Quinn and even someone I met today that's just recently been over to Goodwood.
• 15:31
  And all of a sudden, Quinny's been to Goodwood.
• 15:33
  We were discussing some of his tales.
• 15:36
  And just a lot of people probably not quite, yeah, recognising obviously my grandfather Lex.
• 15:41
  I was at Pookie the other day and only a few weeks before he passed in the 1965 New Zealand Grand Prix, which we're over here celebrating, watching some of the vision and the telecast that you're a part of, Rusty, for this weekend.
• 15:53
  I watched today as part of the stream and the vision on Sky over here.
• 15:58
  you know, the, the, the wonderful tribute to the New Zealand Grand Prix through the decades.
• 16:02
  And there's that remarkable vision, um, at, at Pukakoe.
• 16:06
  And there's, I think a particular shot over and over, which is of the 65 start and Lex is on the front row with Jim Clark and, and Graham Hill.
• 16:15
  Amazing.
• 16:15
  Um, that was only a few weeks before he passed, but, um,
• 16:20
  I suppose it's led me to not only when I was here on my own paying my own little tribute to Pukekohe going out there on my own.
• 16:27
  Is that why you went?
• 16:28
  You went and I know you took photos and socials and stuff.
• 16:31
  Yeah, I did it every year anyway.
• 16:32
  Like I used to annoy my teams on track walk because I'd be stopped at turn one midway through and I'm like –
• 16:39
  this used to hook hard left here somewhere and it was all the support pits and that road's all still there.
• 16:44
  Yes, it is.
• 16:44
  Making out the old circuit.
• 16:46
  And I used to bring up a shot of Lex.
• 16:47
  He was running second behind Graham Hill and I'd literally find the identical spot of this photo and I'd be like trying to mirror up buildings and trees and landscape.
• 16:57
  I was obsessed with all that stuff, grandstand in the background.
• 17:00
  And I do the same wherever I can with old circuits.
• 17:03
  So that's why I get sad to see bit by bit, you know,
• 17:08
  Ghosts of the past, or the ghosts will always be there, but circuits of the past slowly disappearing, which I also appreciate the history when it is there.
• 17:16
  And you sense a lot of that over here, actually, in general.
• 17:20
  But, yeah, so there was that side of things with Lex.
• 17:22
  Yeah.
• 17:24
  And yeah, more and more as I get older, I appreciate that.
• 17:28
  But then, you know, obviously Tony Gaze, my step-grandfather, after Lex passed, you know, married my grandmother some 10 years later and Lex and Tony were actually great mates.
• 17:39
  You know, Tony bought out, he did Australia's first Formula One Grand Prix in the Ascari Ferrari and he ended up selling that to Lex in Australia who won the Australian Grand Prix in 58 in the ex-Ascari Ferrari.
• 17:53
  Ferrari, which was Tony's car, which Tony got from Enzo.
• 17:57
  That's another story which Tony actually told me eye to eye the day he was trying to qualify for the Italian Grand Prix.
• 18:05
  But I believe the story's probably a bit out of whack, but the engine configs, Enzo would never let sort of customers have the exact configuration.
• 18:16
  So this particular Ferrari and...
• 18:20
  You could see where the engine was modified, the cylinders or whatnot, which Tony told me at 90 years of age when we eventually got this car back to Australia, because it sits in the Wheatcroft Museum now in Donington.
• 18:32
  But the owners only many decades later realized it was a car that won the Australian Grand Prix and had this story back in Australia.
• 18:39
  So it came back in 2012, I believe.
• 18:42
  And I was with Tony, who was pointing out still world marks and modifications that were
• 18:47
  he knew of.
• 18:48
  But there was this story where he was trying to draft...
• 18:51
  a scurry uh at monza and tony's had a big lose or something at a turn one and nearly wiped him out and he tells this story where he had a scurry coming up to him with a cup of tea thinking he was about to tear his head off um but tony talks you know by the needle i was sitting there at you know 6850 rpm i didn't have speed back then it was all rpm and trying to get this extra speed mate so he had a photographic memory and tony guys
• 19:18
  But, yeah, so that Ferrari, you know, he sold to Lex.
• 19:22
  But then Tony's story, obviously one of the three founders of Goodwood.
• 19:26
  So his relationship there, which, again, I don't know the story too well, but it was effectively, you know, after World War where, you know, he was a Spitfire pilot, three DFCs in Australia.
• 19:36
  And incredible, you know, his World War antics far outweigh his Formula One and racing antics.
• 19:43
  But, you know, it was effectively said –
• 19:47
  you know, this would be a great place for a motor race.
• 19:49
  And it was whatever the link was with the Lord March or his father or was Tony's mate.
• 19:54
  I don't know the exact link, but that's how Goodwood was formed.
• 19:59
  So Tony is interned at Goodwood in the Memorial Garden, the Tony Gaze building, and I believe Bruce McLaren's there.
• 20:08
  And I've never had the chance to go.
• 20:10
  You must.
• 20:11
  And my dad went last year for the first time and took up the offer.
• 20:14
  Oh, lovely.
• 20:14
  And just couldn't, one, believe how well he was treated.
• 20:17
  He felt very uncomfortable, just the Lord March and whatnot.
• 20:21
  But more just, you know, we adore Tony as our step-grandfather.
• 20:24
  I grew up with him in Australia and...
• 20:27
  but just the enormous respect and the stories and tales that he has on the other side of the world, you know, grown men in tears that know of his World War antics and racing antics and just dad was just blown away by just him being connected to Tony as his stepfather, just how well he was looked after at Goodwood.
• 20:47
  That is awesome, mate.
• 20:47
  So sharing these stories out here and it's something I want to do.
• 20:50
  These are things I haven't been able to do for years is get over there.
• 20:53
  Yeah.
• 20:54
  um and these are all things that are on the on the bucket list now but uh sharing these old school stories i feel prouder more than anything now because probably a lot of people just don't know don't you know join the dots um and there's so many more stories i could talk about oh i'm so pleased that you've even just touched on that and you spoke about it so uh so passionately thank you it leads me to your dad and his own kind of racing career and he's still he's still
• 21:19
  You know, when he gets the chance to jump behind the wheel of something, he's still as gung-ho as ever, mate.
• 21:23
  Oh, incredible.
• 21:24
  He's so competitive.
• 21:26
  He's texting me all day today and even yesterday.
• 21:29
  You know, it's, how'd you go?
• 21:31
  How was it?
• 21:31
  What are your times compared to Murph?
• 21:33
  I don't even know.
• 21:36
  I was busy getting through the gearbox.
• 21:38
  But he loves it.
• 21:39
  Yeah, I think he's just...
• 21:42
  just loving the connection of me being an Atlantic car, the car that he was so passionate about in his day.
• 21:49
  He's already just through a few tales that I'm sharing with him.
• 21:53
  I can see...
• 21:55
  is envious of, I think, the way the Kiwis are doing things over here.
• 21:59
  That's right.
• 22:00
  Thinks we should be doing it better in Australia.
• 22:02
  Mm-hmm.
• 22:02
  That's nothing new.
• 22:03
  I mean, I think we're taking it to another level here.
• 22:05
  Mm-hmm.
• 22:06
  But I think the culture, the attitude, the passion in general, I think us supercar drivers feel it when we race here.
• 22:12
  Yep.
• 22:13
  And you know from years back, the way that the drivers, they breed over here, going back to Scott Dixon, all the young fellas that come through.
• 22:23
  Obviously, we've got the supercar legends in Murph and Scotty Mack and Shane.
• 22:28
  But, you know, the open wheel stars just forever, you know, Mitch Evans, Marcus Armstrong.
• 22:32
  I mean, they're just everywhere.
• 22:33
  Brendan Hartley.
• 22:35
  Sorry if I've missed anyone, but they're doing a very good job over here for such a small country.
• 22:40
  And you feel it here.
• 22:41
  It's just pure.
• 22:42
  Everyone's pushing in the same direction.
• 22:44
  This series, this summer series over here.
• 22:47
  There's a lot we could learn back home and I love it.
• 22:49
  It's really refreshing and I think Dad's in capturing that now and that's because, you know, Ecure Australia was Lex's dream before he was killed.
• 22:59
  It was the team he ran under.
• 23:02
  And I've seen as of recently just some of the plans and the budgets Lex had in place.
• 23:09
  for 65 or 66, where he had on order two Grand Prix cars, the budget, there was sponsorship from Repco.
• 23:15
  I've seen what it cost for the transporter, two Grand Prix cars to bring in a protege to run the New Zealand Grand Prix, Australian Grand Prix.
• 23:26
  And then there was...
• 23:27
  two other let's call them touring cars where he was going to turn the team into what he called touring car saloon racing which was now the bathurst 1000 yeah the 500 and the whole budget was together um and in the space of two weeks you know lex lost his life at sandown and
• 23:46
  And his young protege, their next door neighbor in Melbourne, Rocky Tresise, who'd been driving Lex's Formula 2 car, Cooper Climax, was killed at Longford two weeks later when, you know, two of dad's brothers were there mechanicing the car, Lex's crew chief.
• 24:03
  And it was kind of a tribute to Lex to go there and do it because he'd want to.
• 24:08
  Um, and then in an instant, Eckery Australia was, was, was gone.
• 24:12
  Um, and obviously the sons, you know, John and Chris and my dad, you know, they've always been passionate about it, but you know, my dad and Chris in the historic scene have brought this on in a bit of a fun way.
• 24:22
  Um, but they're, they're passionate.
• 24:25
  They've tried to help some kids get over to the Walter Hage trophy, the Formula Ford festival.
• 24:30
  Um, and they're, they're big on, um, you know, trying to help.
• 24:34
  you know, the next generation and do it the right way in Formula Ford.
• 24:37
  So, yeah, there's some really interesting tales on that front and what Lex was wanting to do.
• 24:44
  And I think, you know, he sees a bit of that going on here in New Zealand and what we could do better on that front.
• 24:50
  That's deeply ingrained this stuff in you.
• 24:52
  At what age did you start latching onto that?
• 24:55
  Was it something around your dad and his racing?
• 24:58
  When did you become aware of, you know, how...
• 25:03
  and what the family had done, you know, either in Australia or even in the UK?
• 25:08
  When did you realise the significance of all of that?
• 25:11
  I mean, I always knew, I mean, I suppose when you're young and naive and, you know, in your own world, which you are as a racing driver for many years, you're just focused on race wins and Grand Prixs and trophies.
• 25:22
  You get a bit older as a human, you develop, and I suppose you appreciate more and more
• 25:27
  the man, you know, instead of just the myth.
• 25:30
  Yes.
• 25:31
  And I just so, I mean, I had an amazing relationship with all my grandparents and my family.
• 25:37
  But gosh, like all of us, what you'd wish to...
• 25:40
  have Di and Tony back again now, but they lived great lives, full lives.
• 25:45
  I swore to myself I'd always milk every moment, every conversation, but it's not enough.
• 25:50
  You grow another decade or 15 years and yeah.
• 25:55
  But fortunately that lives on through my dad, but I see him at 70 years of age now doing the same thing.
• 26:01
  You know, you get deeper, you get more sentimental, you want to know more because you don't want it to ever go.
• 26:06
  You don't want any of this information.
• 26:07
  You want it to go through.
• 26:09
  Sorry, generations.
• 26:13
  So there's a lot more I want to know, you know.
• 26:16
  But, you know, there were seven kids and, yeah, it's – yeah, there's some amazing stuff there.
• 26:22
  But, you know, yeah, I don't know how to answer that actually.
• 26:26
  Dad's doing some racing now.
• 26:28
  He's doing well.
• 26:29
  He loves it.
• 26:30
  Too competitive.
• 26:31
  But, you know, I think now is more than ever I think it's a time as a family to really harness all this stuff and make sure it lives on.
• 26:38
  But it's not just the memories.
• 26:39
  What I think you've just latched onto in that incredible story of the team and then, you know, a protege and touring cars and whatever else, you clearly kept some things as well.
• 26:48
  I don't know what you looked at, whether it was like a ledger or a balance sheet or something or other, but you've obviously got stuff where you go, wow, here's the budget for what they were actually planning.
• 26:57
  Yeah, my dad dug that out somewhere, actually very recently, let's say in the last 12 months.
• 27:02
  Yep.
• 27:03
  It was fascinating.
• 27:04
  I mean, with that, we've got the tele...
• 27:08
  Sorry, the... Not the fax.
• 27:11
  What am I saying?
• 27:11
  The telescript or the... Like a telegram.
• 27:14
  Telegram.
• 27:15
  Goodness me.
• 27:16
  Sorry, trusty.
• 27:17
  The telegram from Enzo Ferrari when Lex won the Australian Grand Prix in 58.
• 27:23
  That's framed.
• 27:24
  I've seen that.
• 27:25
  I mean, there's some remarkable stuff across the family.
• 27:30
  John's got a lot of it, a lot of it.
• 27:32
  And I'm intrigued by it now.
• 27:33
  I nearly want to ring John.
• 27:34
  I mean, he's down in Flinders these days.
• 27:37
  You know, I'm close with his son, James, who's over in the States.
• 27:42
  But, you know, I do believe, I often ask Dad, you know, where's this of Lex's and where's that?
• 27:47
  Like some morbid stuff even.
• 27:49
  And I believe John's got an incredible...
• 27:54
  um, Lex collection down at his house, which I'd love to see.
• 27:57
  So I believe a lot of it's been stored and looked after incredibly well.
• 28:01
  Dad's got some remarkable stuff at, you know, at his property, his farm, um, you know, some of the old trophies and, um, uh,
• 28:09
  you know, even parts of the, you know, the Ferrari symbol from his old trailer, which actually at Longford you see a shot of Lexus Ferrari with the trailer and the big Ferrari signage.
• 28:20
  I believe John's got one.
• 28:21
  I think Dad's got the other.
• 28:23
  But, I mean, there's a massive amount of stuff around.
• 28:27
  But seeing some of his old cars still getting around, you know, as his Cooper from the 61 Australian Grand Prix.
• 28:34
  I know Alex drove that in a demo at Albert Park a few years back.
• 28:40
  Yeah, these little old Alfa, which was his car all of his life, which I actually in my lifetime was still in the family.
• 28:48
  But now that's, you know, proudly driven by...
• 28:50
  a guy in the historics, which still pays enormous tribute to Lex.
• 28:54
  So I've sat in that.
• 28:56
  And obviously the Ferrari that he won the Grand Prix and he's in Donington.
• 28:59
  God, I wish we kept that in the family.
• 29:01
  Ascari, two-time world championship winning Ferrari.
• 29:03
  Ferrari, yeah, yeah.
• 29:04
  Lex, why'd you sell that?
• 29:05
  But even from his businesses, you know, I learned more and more about, you know, in Melbourne in those,
• 29:11
  times the estate he owned and i mean it was a small city back then and some of the land you know in the city around flinders street and fed square and you know you hear all these stories that um you know how things would have been different but everyone's got those stories but it's it's it's remarkable
• 29:37
  At what point as a young kind of maybe primary school kid or whatever, when does the light switch go on?
• 29:44
  Dad, I want to go racing.
• 29:46
  Were you a good school student or were you just this obsessed kid with motorsport?
• 29:52
  Yeah, I think I was just an obsessed kid with motorsport.
• 29:57
  But I think I, believe it or not, I was an obsessed kid.
• 30:00
  Yeah.
• 30:02
  I've always loved stats, numbers, helmets, whether that's the footy with my grandparents at the G, obviously touring car racing, Formula 1 racing.
• 30:10
  You're a great mate of Aaron Noonan's.
• 30:11
  This makes sense to me now.
• 30:12
  He knows, but I could reel off, you know, the...
• 30:16
  Actually, I was impressed by Ronan Murphy the other day yesterday.
• 30:18
  We were going through some bizarre stories from the early 90s and all these things I thought I was only silly enough to know.
• 30:24
  No, he's like that.
• 30:25
  He's very like that.
• 30:26
  Very good.
• 30:26
  But I go through, we're looking at the Swift, I think Caleb was driving and it was Beard O's 91 New Zealand Grand Prix winning car.
• 30:36
  But I'm like, that's the 96 Arrows.
• 30:40
  of Ricardo Rosse and maybe Jos Verstappen anyway.
• 30:45
  And it was.
• 30:46
  I don't think anyone even knew that.
• 30:47
  But then I start reeling off all the helmets and drivers.
• 30:50
  I mean, I knew everyone through that era as a kid.
• 30:53
  But, yeah, I mean, my brother went go-karting.
• 30:57
  I gave it a go, super fast.
• 31:00
  And I don't really recall this, but I stopped after a year.
• 31:03
  I used to get too nervous.
• 31:06
  Unless I could see my dad in the middle of the track, he still says it to this day.
• 31:10
  Like I'd be going around going as fast as anyone, but unless...
• 31:13
  But you kind of wound yourself up into a bit of nerves or something.
• 31:15
  Oh, badly, yeah.
• 31:16
  But dad said, unless I could see him in the middle of the track with the stopwatch, I'd like it.
• 31:22
  Wow.
• 31:23
  Have a meltdown and get too scared.
• 31:25
  So I stopped for a few years and I started doing some other – I loved my other sports.
• 31:28
  But then about 11, 10 or 11, 12 years of age, I came back to it.
• 31:32
  And I used to walk around the house in dad's helmets and suits and sit in front of the Grand Prix watching Senna, you know, in his helmet.
• 31:40
  And then I just –
• 31:42
  I actually remember this night and I, it was a switch and he didn't believe me.
• 31:47
  He said, well, you got to prove it to me, you know?
• 31:50
  And, um, I remember we bought a little rookie cart and went testing at Geelong.
• 31:54
  It was the first day, um, with my brother.
• 31:57
  And from that day on, I've got a photo of that day, but I just, it was like, um,
• 32:01
  It was just another person and I went and raced on my P's from the back of the grid to open meetings.
• 32:07
  I won like every meeting.
• 32:09
  The P's you have to start last.
• 32:10
  I was going from like 15th to first and I was just driving over people like I was just carved through the field.
• 32:18
  From that moment on, I just never, ever looked back.
• 32:21
  It was then Jamie Winkup had been dominating rookies for years because I remember years back at the Eastern Lines Cart Club, Winkup was in rookies and I knew him and...
• 32:31
  Um, that was sort of the families we grew up with the lounges, Frank Lowndes, who had a, he's a mechanical shop in the same street as dad's business.
• 32:39
  And Craig was just finishing in carts.
• 32:40
  That's how we actually got invited to our first ever cart race at Whittlesey.
• 32:44
  Okay.
• 32:44
  And I'm there as a kid, um, in dad's Giacattalo.
• 32:48
  At the last corner at Whittlesea and Lowndes come up, I think with his mullet and his LaRousse suit, the LaRousse Formula One suit, which I still to this day go, Lowndes, you're in a LaRousse F1 suit.
• 33:00
  So then he went to Formula Ford and I'm watching this guy I knew in Formula Ford and I thought he was a Formula One driver.
• 33:06
  Wow.
• 33:07
  And then, yeah, we knew the wing cups and that's sort of how we progressed.
• 33:09
  Yeah.
• 33:11
  Ended up, Winkup was dominating everything.
• 33:12
  But by, you know, my fourth, fifth event, it was me and Jamie won two at all the big events in my first rookie season.
• 33:18
  And it was like, yeah, it was, yeah, from that moment on, it was all on.
• 33:23
  It was all on, all we did.
• 33:24
  That could have become a, I mean, you were kids, but it could have become a rivalry.
• 33:30
  Instead, it became a good friendship, a really, really good friendship, to the point where I think you, correct me if I don't get this wrong, but he leased the Formula Ford,
• 33:38
  that you had had success in the year before, and he competed in that with equal success as well, didn't he?
• 33:44
  He wanted it back.
• 33:45
  You've kept it, though, haven't you?
• 33:46
  That's right.
• 33:47
  It's nearly ready, too.
• 33:48
  It's nearly fully restored.
• 33:50
  Mick Ritter's had it for a little while.
• 33:51
  Good stuff.
• 33:52
  And, you know, we've got such incredible stories with Mick and that journey, which is another story.
• 33:58
  But...
• 33:59
  Yeah, the Winkup and I all the way through karts, we were rivals for sure, but really good mates.
• 34:07
  We had some big incidents, big run-ins in karts, but really good mates.
• 34:12
  And then actually, I suppose best mates from probably 15, 16.
• 34:16
  Okay.
• 34:17
  And then the step to Formula Ford.
• 34:19
  We actually debuted on the same day at the same track, the Island Magic 1999 November.
• 34:27
  The same day, but he didn't race.
• 34:28
  He rode his car off over Lukey Heights, which was the Red Rabbit, the 94 Van Demon.
• 34:33
  I think it was the ex-Steven Richards championship winning car.
• 34:36
  And I was in the 95 Van Demon, which was the Garth Tander championship winning car, which was Alex's car from 1998.
• 34:44
  Sonic, well-prepared.
• 34:46
  You know what I've figured as you go through in life, we all tell our story like it's the right way.
• 34:51
  I mean, I respectfully tell stuff as I remember it and everyone's got – it's amazing how you start – I listen to a Will Power podcast or you listen to a –
• 35:02
  Jamie Winkup podcast and you hear about your championship battle and it's sort of similar that everyone's got.
• 35:09
  But through their eyes.
• 35:09
  Through their eyes.
• 35:10
  Through their eyes.
• 35:11
  And you don't clash.
• 35:11
  There's no right or wrong.
• 35:12
  As you get older, you start realizing that's not how it is.
• 35:15
  You take things personally.
• 35:17
  It's not.
• 35:18
  But let's just say I didn't do in carding.
• 35:21
  We didn't spend really any money.
• 35:23
  It was my dad, my brother.
• 35:25
  We did sort of...
• 35:28
  We worked hard.
• 35:29
  We drove around the country, did club and style racing, all the nationals, open meetings, won a lot of stuff.
• 35:34
  But I never went into the CIK, sticky tires, big budget karting stuff.
• 35:40
  Instead, we had a great time karting, but kept it very modest.
• 35:44
  Went into Formula Ford early.
• 35:46
  and was quick from day one and i suppose michael ridder can verify this my dad but i took to it like a duck to water we had dune buggies on the farm at 12 13 and manual and i mean i'd be 12 hour days at tony gay's dies property in um the gambi um but i mean i was just gone i mean crazy stuff the tracks i would make and
• 36:09
  I think it prepared me for Formula Ford so well because I spent four or five years as a 13, 14 year old just going sideways and jumping.
• 36:16
  I used to love that gym buggy.
• 36:18
  But it took Formula Ford really well.
• 36:20
  I think I had a great car.
• 36:22
  Amazing.
• 36:23
  Like my start to my motorsport career, I think I was incredibly spoiled.
• 36:29
  And I've learned even as years have gone on with flashy budgets and flashy garages and shiny garage walls, very few cars.
• 36:38
  do it as well as one person that started my whole career at Sonic Road Racing with Michael Ritter and the time and energy and effort into preparing those race cars.
• 36:49
  And that's just how it begun for me.
• 36:51
  And listen, I think I was very good in Formula Ford.
• 36:55
  I dominated everything I ever did.
• 36:57
  But I also, I think I had amazing support behind me.
• 37:00
  Around you.
• 37:01
  But anyway, to my story, that first year or so with Wing Cup, imagine he just...
• 37:06
  he was just one everything in go-karts and we were mates.
• 37:09
  Um, but you know, effectively I, I sort of smoked him in that first year.
• 37:14
  I was just winning and he was, maybe his car was no good.
• 37:18
  I remember talking stories with him.
• 37:19
  He's like, yeah, I'm flat through turn one at Phillip Island.
• 37:22
  And I'm like, I'm not, but I'm like a second and a half quicker.
• 37:25
  And I'm sort of thinking, what's the setup in your thing?
• 37:27
  I'm thinking like a go-kart's too soft.
• 37:30
  It's bogging down.
• 37:31
  And I remember, you know, but I didn't really know much different, but, um,
• 37:34
  You know, I sort of just progressed very quick and won.
• 37:38
  The year I won the National Series of Will Power, we battled it out.
• 37:42
  Jamie was third that year and they progressed into a McGale, the Luke Youlden Championship winning cast.
• 37:47
  Good equipment, modern equipment.
• 37:49
  They ran it themselves.
• 37:50
  Mm-hmm.
• 37:51
  And I was Jamie's biggest fan.
• 37:53
  I always knew what a star he was.
• 37:55
  Absolute freak at everything he's ever done, which has now been proven.
• 37:58
  Proven, yes.
• 37:58
  But even back then, I'm winning.
• 38:00
  I'm beating him a long way, but I'm like, hmm, this is interesting.
• 38:04
  Sure enough, I went to Europe.
• 38:05
  They said, we're going to lease your car, the Davison car.
• 38:09
  Ran it under Ritter.
• 38:10
  dominated the O2 series, which was cool.
• 38:13
  I was stoked for him.
• 38:14
  I'm glad I didn't have to race him in the same car.
• 38:16
  And actually, it would have been great because I back myself and Formula Ford any day of the week against anyone in the world anyway.
• 38:22
  GT, I think, would have been probably too tight.
• 38:24
  I think he wanted to get it back at some stage.
• 38:26
  Jamie's had a crack at trying to get it back.
• 38:28
  But the little footnote to this story around Sonic and River and stuff.
• 38:33
  I said to him the other day, your little boy who just had a run at...
• 38:37
  Wanneroo in the 91 Van Diemen.
• 38:41
  And did you see that photo Garth put up?
• 38:43
  I did.
• 38:43
  The comparison.
• 38:44
  And Garth actually said to me, I actually think it's the same chassis, like the same school car.
• 38:49
  Is that right?
• 38:50
  I said, it's the same 91.
• 38:51
  He said, I think it's the same car, which I love that.
• 38:53
  Yeah.
• 38:54
  Although that is fantastic.
• 38:55
  And then I actually said, we're going to get your little boy in our 95 for a run.
• 39:00
  You know, just nostalgic stuff.
• 39:02
  In terms of the nostalgia, you are restoring it.
• 39:04
  I mean, Mick's had it for a while, but you're putting it back to exactly the way that it was.
• 39:09
  Is that right?
• 39:09
  Yeah.
• 39:10
  And the beauty is it didn't really race much after Wink-Up.
• 39:13
  Okay.
• 39:14
  So it was a beautiful car, Wink-Up 102 in it, so two championships.
• 39:20
  Michael Trimble ran it in 03.
• 39:22
  Yes.
• 39:24
  He did win a round of the National Series.
• 39:25
  He's pretty hard on himself, Trimbley.
• 39:27
  He's always like, I just ruined any bit of history that car had.
• 39:30
  I think he tore a few corners off it.
• 39:33
  Still did a good job.
• 39:34
  He was competitive, but never, ever, ever, ever driven since.
• 39:38
  Okay.
• 39:39
  So, yeah, it's got a pretty amazing pedigree.
• 39:43
  Yep.
• 39:44
  But Mick's, I think Mick's got so much pride in that car.
• 39:46
  I remember when we got it in a box.
• 39:47
  I remember the night the container arrived.
• 39:50
  from the uk um and just you know the the build of that was uh was yeah we're so excited and it was his first national title and um so i think he's yeah we didn't want to let anyone else touch that car what's become apparent to me here in this this half hour of 40 minutes in the first part of the pod here sorry mate i'm
• 40:09
  No, no, no.
• 40:10
  I love it.
• 40:11
  I love the detail, the passion made, and that you have all these stories embedded in there, I think, and it's so vivid in the way you recount them, which is excellent.
• 40:22
  It's weird because I literally can't remember what I had for dinner last night.
• 40:26
  But this stuff you remember in such detail, mate, which is impressive.
• 40:30
  Where I'm going with this is that has life made you a bit more, not philosophical, that's not the right word for it, but do you know what I mean?
• 40:40
  Here's an example.
• 40:40
  In the pod that you did with Noons, which was pre-pandemic, it's an excellent chat, as is always the case with him, but you spoke about...
• 40:50
  willpower and racing against him.
• 40:53
  And in the very early days of his career, and you were almost like kind of blinkers off.
• 40:57
  Others might've been a bit worried that he was either a bit too aggressive or ragged or something or other, but you were like, no, no, no.
• 41:03
  This kid's got it.
• 41:04
  He's quick.
• 41:05
  You made an observation about him around his talent even very early on.
• 41:10
  I thought that was, you know, even for your young age at that stage, obviously, that was pretty impressive, mate.
• 41:14
  Yeah, and I think I had it stored in the memory break for a long time.
• 41:17
  You'd never dare say it until you get further on in life.
• 41:21
  And you do become a little bit more philosophical.
• 41:26
  I think in reflection now, my biggest weakness has actually been my biggest strength.
• 41:33
  But I don't care.
• 41:35
  People think I'm too honest.
• 41:37
  There's all these head games in our sport.
• 41:39
  And there's a point you've got to play it.
• 41:40
  But there's a point where also, once your helmet's on, you're in your car, no matter what you say or do, just get on.
• 41:46
  I've just always been happy to be open, honest, hard on myself, talk...
• 41:51
  Just be open and honest.
• 41:54
  I've got more philosophical over time, I think, only because I think the sports kicked me down a lot and grounded me a lot.
• 42:00
  I've always been incredibly hard on myself.
• 42:02
  But there's a point where... Are you only like that in motor racing or in all things in life?
• 42:07
  I'm pretty hard on myself in everything else in life.
• 42:11
  The motorsport thing was something I used to be so confident in, to the point where you want to see when you're dominating early or...
• 42:19
  you know, times in supercars, you see young guys now that are winning.
• 42:24
  Yeah.
• 42:24
  You, you feel on top of the world and you think you are on top of the world.
• 42:28
  No one can touch you.
• 42:29
  It's a great feeling, but I've, I've been kicked down a lot as well.
• 42:33
  Um, I'm pretty thick skinned.
• 42:35
  Um, I suppose I like to hold my morals in high regard, but sometimes I've, you know, my strength is I'm quite headstrong because I just, I don't sugar coat.
• 42:45
  I sort of, I, I,
• 42:49
  I talk myself down or I state the facts.
• 42:52
  I'm happy to be hard on myself, be upfront, and look at things from all angles, from other people's shoes because you find yourself sometimes me, me, me.
• 43:04
  Yes.
• 43:04
  And then there's a point where you're like, hang on, you've got to look at things differently.
• 43:08
  And I suppose I've tried to confront that more and more, which can look like a weakness because you can't say that.
• 43:16
  You're showing your vulnerability.
• 43:18
  Yeah, yeah.
• 43:18
  But I'm like, I can?
• 43:20
  Why can't I?
• 43:20
  You're probably all thinking the same.
• 43:22
  You're just not saying it.
• 43:23
  Yes.
• 43:23
  So I've found over time, if I'm open and honest to engineers or whatnot about your weaknesses, if you just all accept it, it's actually a good thing.
• 43:33
  But others judge you on it straight away.
• 43:36
  So you're like, okay.
• 43:37
  which if you're young, what you do is you come in and just always act, which is a key to life, always act like you know what you're doing, even if you don't.
• 43:47
  But there's a point where that carries you so far, and I have been like that in my life, don't get me wrong.
• 43:52
  There's a point where that's all bullshit.
• 43:56
  It actually takes you down the wrong path.
• 43:58
  If you find the right person that believes in you and you get on the right roll, just being completely open and honest and saying I'm not good here and I'm not good there and I need help there...
• 44:07
  it's actually not a bad thing.
• 44:08
  You could still be winning the race, but people just go, oh, he's got no confidence.
• 44:13
  And then they just run with it.
• 44:14
  And you notice the guy with no confidence.
• 44:17
  So, you know, I think I've always used that.
• 44:20
  It's a weakness probably, but as well at times, a strength.
• 44:23
  It's a strength.
• 44:24
  And I've been able to channel a lot of stuff mentally and be really headstrong, which is probably why I'm a bit of a, you know, a bit of a weird story because I've been written off like,
• 44:34
  hopeless and then i've just been then i've just come and dominated races and won the pole position award at 40 years of art you know a couple of years ago with nine poles and in 2012 so i've had like incredible runs in the sport and then real lows and that that that's hurt me a lot trust me over the years some of my bad years you try and how do you bounce from that well i think i have but it's still it's taken a toll on me has it but i think i've used every time it's happened
• 45:02
  I've used that as a strength because I've always bounced back.
• 45:07
  That's why I'm a bit gutted it's been cut short now because this year's been one of them where it's just you're too old.
• 45:13
  Maybe I am.
• 45:13
  But I've had rounds this year when everything clicked.
• 45:16
  I was driving as well as ever, and there was a lot of stuff that I went through in my last year which totally motorsport 101 –
• 45:24
  incompetence where I'm on the receiving end of it, where it's made me look horrible.
• 45:28
  And that's happened to a lot of amazing drivers that have had their career cut very early.
• 45:32
  It's just motorsport.
• 45:33
  But it happened to me this year, last year, and I haven't finally...
• 45:38
  and I've just had to accept it, I don't have the chance to right the wrong.
• 45:42
  And I've just had to accept that.
• 45:43
  You know what?
• 45:44
  Turn a page, mate.
• 45:45
  It's a new chapter.
• 45:46
  You're with a new outfit.
• 45:47
  You're going to get to tick some of these.
• 45:48
  I can still in that front.
• 45:49
  Good.
• 45:50
  But in terms of full time, I've always been out, even when I lost my drive 2020, I didn't lose it.
• 45:55
  23 Red pulled out when I just got back to, I think, the form of my career.
• 46:00
  And I didn't think I'd ever get back there.
• 46:02
  I'd made a decision many years ago.
• 46:04
  You know, when I left FPR, I was challenging for the championship years straight, winning races.
• 46:09
  I was in peak negotiating power.
• 46:11
  I made my decision to go to Betty and Erebus, which, again –
• 46:16
  could say certain things in hindsight i regret but i don't regret other things i've made great relationships there experienced some wonderful things um as well in that chapter um dug myself back to a single car outfit techno probably no one quite appreciates that that was six full-time people we had good hardware but very low budget but i got myself back top five in the championship one bathurst one races
• 46:41
  but then single car life again, trying to stay in the sport.
• 46:44
  I got Phil Monday with single car, so let's get back to Tickford.
• 46:48
  I found myself back in that fold.
• 46:50
  I'm like, wow, full circle, but you're the fourth customer car.
• 46:53
  I'm like, no, I've got good people here.
• 46:55
  I know this.
• 46:56
  And 19, we were pretty strong again.
• 46:59
  Some really amazing races where I was getting back to my best.
• 47:02
  And 2020, we started the year as the top four dog.
• 47:06
  Everything was clicking for me.
• 47:08
  taken away from me but i i was always going to make wrong that right and uh you know i was able to get back into the the shell v-power racing team in the gen 2 car get back to um you know some pretty amazing form in 22 again so um anyway i'm proud of the way i've always bounced back from my bad times my weaknesses
• 47:29
  how hard I've been on myself, how much I then refocus to prove people wrong and get back.
• 47:36
  And that's what I'm actually proud of is my rollercoaster ride.
• 47:38
  You must take great satisfaction in that, mate, when you come out of those tough times and you've earned that success again through this hard-fought determination.
• 47:51
  And it must, I assume, just re-cement it for you.
• 47:55
  I knew that.
• 47:56
  I knew that I could...
• 47:57
  do that or, you know what I mean?
• 47:59
  Does that make sense?
• 47:59
  Yeah, and I'd like to put this one.
• 48:00
  I'm actually, it's my new chapter and I want to, you know, I think I've got a lot to offer because I'm very deep in the way I think of things, overthink.
• 48:11
  I'm a big overthinker, overanalyzer, but they're going to strengthen a weakness because at times that's put me in good stead.
• 48:18
  And I think I've got so much info that maybe a lot of people don't look into so much is some of the detail and some of the things that go on behind me.
• 48:27
  that maybe some people won't acknowledge.
• 48:29
  It's actually right there in front of you.
• 48:30
  Sometimes some of the really simple stuff that's done wrong and is overlooked.
• 48:36
  Yep.
• 48:37
  But you can pass that on to young kids about to go through it all now.
• 48:41
  Maybe things I'd do different again, but some things to not take personally because there's a lot of things that can make you look really bad and they can destroy you.
• 48:49
  And it nearly did many times in my career, but I got through them and that's what – I'm not a champion.
• 48:54
  I failed.
• 48:55
  Rob, have you won Bathursts and things like that?
• 48:56
  No, I've done great things.
• 48:58
  I got very close.
• 48:59
  I know, you know, circumstances.
• 49:02
  I was at many times driving at the level to be the champion.
• 49:08
  But, you know, I've got weaknesses too.
• 49:10
  I know that.
• 49:10
  I was so hard on myself as a driver.
• 49:12
  Even when I knew I'd won and then I sucked.
• 49:15
  Oh, God, how hard I was on myself.
• 49:19
  And I still do the last day, just no confidence.
• 49:21
  But then I'd come back because I'd use that.
• 49:24
  that feeling of having no confidence and being so hard on myself to focus so hard.
• 49:30
  So then when things clicked, I got in the right car, I was so focused.
• 49:33
  And I'd get to this level that was – even I recognize it sometimes – was so good.
• 49:40
  Like even 2022, I had eight poles.
• 49:43
  And I've still – it's not appreciated because we had a lot of stuff-ups that year in terms of not car speed, just –
• 49:49
  pit stop errors and I lost like three wins just in pits and a few mechanical things.
• 49:54
  But I was driving so well that year.
• 49:57
  And even me, who's hard on myself, like I had like four qualifying lap records, not by a tenth.
• 50:01
  Some of them were like three, four tenths of a second over the whole field.
• 50:06
  And the car was just phenomenal.
• 50:08
  I was so glad at 40 years of age, I say it to Rich Harris still to this day, I'm so glad at 40 or 41, 40, I was able to just feel that once more and prove to myself again that I
• 50:21
  You know, when things are right, that's where I can be.
• 50:25
  Maybe why couldn't I get there more often?
• 50:27
  Maybe that's on me.
• 50:28
  But I know when things were right, the level I could get to, and I'm proud of that.
• 50:31
  You should be.
• 50:32
  This is not the place to, you know, necessarily share what you might want to impart for a young racer.
• 50:39
  But there's a little takeaway here for young racers that are listening.
• 50:42
  And I think if I was to try and sum up what you just so beautifully talked about...
• 50:46
  That is, spend your energy wisely in the right places.
• 50:50
  And is that kind of part of the advice that you might offer to some of these people?
• 50:53
  Yeah, exactly.
• 50:55
  I think I was telling someone this morning about it.
• 50:59
  Yeah, I've wasted a lot of energy.
• 51:01
  It's hard not to in motorsport because all energy, good and bad, is energy.
• 51:08
  um, can be used well because it means you care.
• 51:10
  Yes.
• 51:11
  Um, it means you care and, um, negative energy is very unhealthy, but as long as you put, if you have it for a brief moment, um, as long as you make sure you put it on paper, what's negative and why, and what you're going to do to fix it.
• 51:27
  And that might then lead to a solution, right?
• 51:31
  Is that ring this person, speak about this, get help on that.
• 51:36
  Um,
• 51:37
  and then put it to bed.
• 51:38
  Mm-hmm.
• 51:39
  Um, and that's, but if you keep dwelling on negative energy, it makes you a negative person.
• 51:45
  Yes.
• 51:45
  And it just deflates you, completely deflates you.
• 51:48
  You've got to let some things go, and then you start, as you get more successful, um,
• 51:53
  and I was chatting to Matty Payne about it today, I said, you know, you're at that point now, kids come in full of everything, enthusiasm, energy, yes to everything.
• 52:04
  You're just so glad to be there.
• 52:06
  And then there's a point you start being successful, start winning a bit, you win a Bathurst.
• 52:11
  Next thing the demands get higher and higher, the expectations over get higher and higher.
• 52:15
  And then you can start resenting doing stuff.
• 52:17
  That's where you've got to be careful.
• 52:18
  You've got to be good with your time management.
• 52:20
  You've got to start not let it make you negative.
• 52:22
  And I've seen so many young guys, young teammates that I met them when they were young.
• 52:26
  They came in, it was all energy, no pressure, the underdog.
• 52:29
  Everyone's telling them how good they are as a young kid.
• 52:32
  Three or four years later, you see them start sort of demanding this, demanding that.
• 52:37
  I'm not doing that.
• 52:38
  It's a natural.
• 52:38
  I've been there.
• 52:39
  A byproduct of all that.
• 52:40
  But then you can start getting caught up in that negative energy at race weekends and
• 52:45
  So that's where you sort of need good management and apply yourself in the right areas, not letting certain things get you down.
• 52:53
  And yeah, everyone will go through it.
• 52:55
  Every sportsman I see in Formula One, you know, kids at mid-20s, late-20s, they get successful.
• 53:00
  You see the dive in...
• 53:02
  results people just say it's age it's not it's it's sort of burnout and then if you can then find a way around that um you can be competitive for many more years it's just having that energy in the right areas great stuff mate i'm thoroughly enjoying this let's pause here we'll go and have dinner for tonight we'll do a part two after tomorrow's racing here in topo because
• 53:24
  We talked willpower before.
• 53:25
  I'd love to tap into a little bit of that.
• 53:26
  I'd love to talk F3 and more in the UK where people like Lewis Hamilton and many other great names were a part of your journey, mate.
• 53:34
  We haven't even really tapped into supercars.
• 53:36
  And importantly, I want to know about how excited you are around Grove and the potential to do maybe a little bit of international stuff with them and things that might still to be ticked off on that bucket list.
• 53:45
  But thank you.
• 53:46
  This first part's been amazing.
• 53:47
  Thank you.
• 53:48
  Awesome.
• 53:48
  Thanks, Rusty.
• 53:57
  That part two is all done and already in our Rusty's Garage library.
• 54:01
  Head over and fire it up whenever you're ready.
• 54:03
  I promise that you will love it just as much as this first instalment.