Latest / BOB DOLE : 1995 Clinton's Comeback / Episode 443 BOB DOLE The Life That Brought Him There (Part 24) The 1980 Republican Presidential Primary

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Episode 443 BOB DOLE The Life That Brought Him There (Part 24) The 1980 Republican Presidential Primary · BOB DOLE : 1995 Clinton's Comeback

• 0:25
  SPEAKER_39: Did you get the bug?
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_39: I mean as a result of that campaign, I mean w when did you first think about 80?
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_27: About yourself in in terms of the I don't know when it was, but I probably shouldn't have done it.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_27: I shouldn't it was probably a good thought, but should have been just left that way of thought.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_27: But you think well that I got a little name recognition, da da da But if you just somebody just said, you know, you know, Ronald Reagan's been working on this thing for four years.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_27: And it happened, and it's I got to be chairman of the finance committee, so that's a pretty good consolation price.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_27: Uh May 23rd uh through May 27 in the nation's capital in Washington, D.C.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_27: Of course, we've been working a great deal with the Kansas group.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_27: Uh there'll be uh eight delegates, uh eight alternates, sixteen altogether.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_27: In our neighboring state of Missouri, there'll be uh thirty-two participating in the conference.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_27: Uh we've had uh more than eight hundred participate in the forums out in our state trying to draft recommendations.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_27: And I'm very excited about the White House conference.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_27: I think they're great possibilities and great potential.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_27: Uh Jack, give us a few uh inside looks on what may happen.
• 2:25
  SPEAKER_23: Senator, we're excited about it too.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_23: And uh, of course, we appreciate your involvement it in the long term in the area of the handicapped and helping to establish the uh legislation for this conference and your interest ongoing.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_23: And of course, you're a member of our National Planning and Advisory Council, so uh you're also responsible there.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_23: We've made a what we feel is a great national assessment with conferences in every state and territory, and they have truly assessed not only the problems of the handicapped uh individuals, but the potentials.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_23: And we've made a great national assessment and a national awareness now throughout the uh state conferences and now with a national conference.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_23: Our job is one to prioritize what are the important issues and recommendations, and then make a report to the President and Congress for future action.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_23: We think it's going to move the handicapped ahead in terms of services, really uh light years ahead.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_23: And of course, uh one of the pressing concerns is the area of attitudes, because truly attitudes affects the problems of housing and transportation, education, employment.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_23: How do you see, Senator, that we can break down some of these attitudinal barriers that really separate people from people and people from things?
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_27: Well, I think you put your finger on it, Jack.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_27: Uh I think we can we can remove architectural barriers.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_27: We make it possible you get in with your wheelchair, we can do a lot of things that to help people with handicaps, uh regardless of their age and economic status.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_27: Uh but there's still an attitude out there.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_27: We're sort of a minority group that uh we've sort of been pushed in the background and we're coming to the front.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_27: Legislation is making it possible.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_27: We have affirmative action plans that are going to be implemented now.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_27: We're gonna I don't say force people to understand the problem, but at least we're gonna there's gonna be a new awareness about the handicapped and about their problems and about jobs, and uh uh they're wanting to be part of the mainstream.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_27: They're very bright, intelligent people for the most part, and they want to have a part of the action, a piece of the action.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_23: As you know, better than 50 percent of the delegates coming to the conference will be themselves disabled.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_23: Twenty-five will represent individuals who really can't speak for themselves, and then twenty-five percent from the public and private sector.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_27: We think the conference will bring the handicapped into greater independence, dignity, and full participation in all areas of the they're not looking for pity, they're not looking for a government uh dole of some kind or government handout.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_27: Uh they're looking for a a part of the action which uh they properly should have.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_27: And I think it's going to be an exciting conference.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_27: I'm pleased the President will participate and Mrs.
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_27: Carter, it's gonna be a top-level conference uh trying to right some wrongs that have been a long time coming.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_23: Senator, I thank you very much for meeting with me today, and we look forward to your participation in the first White House conference ever held May 23rd to the 27th here in Washington.
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_23: Thank you.
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_38: Thank you.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_38: Hello, everybody, this is Randall Wallace, and you were listening to Bob Dole talking about the conference on the handicapped that would be the first one held at the White House uh uh under the Jimmy Carter presidential uh administration.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_38: And um Carter uh Dole was really active in that and and b and President Carter and Mrs.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_38: Carter uh would host it, and and so I d you know, you get a sense that there was not a bad relationship between uh Bob Dole and President Carter.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_38: Uh and this, of course, obviously is an issue that was near and dear to Bob Dole's heart.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_38: And this episode is gonna really look at not the 1980 presidential election uh and the primary that Bob Dole entered.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_38: Now he was trying to do something that's really difficult to do.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_38: He's gonna run for two jobs at once.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_38: You know, he got in the primary uh uh to run for president, but he was also running again uh for Senate from Kansas.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_38: Now in 1980 is not 1974, but Dole's in a much stronger position and token opposition in 1980.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_38: Uh and so he gets into this uh Republican primary uh for president, and and I think he's still trying to shake this image that he had of being, you know, the Republican hatchet man.
• 6:35
  SPEAKER_20: In 1976, when Jerry Ford had to choose a man to stand a heartbeat away from the presidency, a man capable of running the greatest nation on earth, he chose Bob Dole.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_20: Because Bob Dole had the integrity, experience, toughness, and leadership ability necessary to get the job done.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_20: Today, Bob Dole is running for the presidency.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_20: His qualifications are even stronger.
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_20: 19 years in Congress have proven Bob Dole a winner and a strong leader.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_20: Vote for Bob Dole, a man who can make the tough decision.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_20: President Bob Dole, decision maker for America.
• 7:08
  SPEAKER_27: This is home for me.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_27: My family, people I grew up with and worked with, people who helped me get back on my feet again after the war.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_27: I owe them a lot.
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_27: That's why I'm so proud to be their United States Senator, voicing their hopes and dreams for their family, for their community, their nation.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_27: It's a great job working for Kansas every day.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_27: Bob Dole is our senator.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_46: Um he was uh he the perception of Democrats of Bob Dole has changed dramatically in in the last uh 40 years.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_46: Um when he came to the Senate, he was viewed as a firebrand, he was viewed as a hardcore partisan, he was the chairman of his party, and uh and even up to including uh that time when he ran as the vice president, he was kind of viewed as uh as the attack dog.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_46: And um but then something happened, and um even though he was viewed in that way, and uh in my view, rightfully so oftentimes, he um he became much more Bob Dole, the pragmatist, the deal maker, the the the person comfortable in working with George McGovern on child nutrition and uh with Tom Harkin on on the Americans with Disabilities Act.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_46: I mean, monumental pieces of legislation that could have never occurred were it not for the fact that uh somebody with his Republican credentials could come together with someone with equally as strong Democratic credentials and fashion this remarkable compromise legislatively.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_46: And I think he got so much fulfillment from those accomplishments that it probably led him to understand that if these were were good things, that there's a lot more that could be done in that regard.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_46: And so by the time he and I developed our relationship, he had well understood and acquired that feeling.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_46: And so I was the beneficiary of that evolution, and I I uh I think it's true today.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_46: I've heard actually heard him say in in um speeches around the country that uh uh some of his proudest accomplishments were ones where he worked across the aisle with others uh who were not of his philosophy or of his his political uh persuasion.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_46: So um but I think that's really uh that happened in the you know about halfway or two-thirds of the way through his career, and uh he's viewed by virtually every Democrat as a pragmatic, moderate who um people would jump at the chance to work with at almost anything he wanted to do.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_39: And ironically, for that very reason, is pilloried by many in his own party.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_39: Exactly.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_39: Particularly on the right, exactly for whom consensus is a dirty word.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_38: So as we go into 1980, Bob Dole's not the giant figure that he will eventually become by the time we get to 1996, even though he's a pretty big figure anyway, but um this person that Dashell's describing uh that evolved into uh the leader of the Senate uh in 1980 was still seen as that hatchet man.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_38: And he's gonna get into a race with some pretty strong figures um in 1980.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_38: There is uh uh Phil Crane, Howard Baker, who had been the major who was the majority leader at the time, um George H.W.
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_38: Bush, John Connolly, John Anderson, who a lot of people don't might not remember now, but he was a representative from Illinois who would stay in this race and run as an independent as we get close uh later on, uh rather than just give the field over to Ronald Reagan, which was a mistake most likely, but uh and then Ronald Reagan himself.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_38: Uh and so the the field is is is as strong as any I've ever I can remember.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_38: And as a kid, this is the first election that I was really drawn into.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_38: We also had a congressional race here that involved our congressman John Generett and a friend of mine who wrote the forward of my book, John Napier, who would go on to be the congressman.
• 11:41
  SPEAKER_38: So this is a a strong field of candidates.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_38: But it's clear to me at least, and I think a lot of people that Bob Dole really was um the real thing, that he was a a player.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_38: And and Ronald Reagan later on, uh even in 1976, admired Dole a lot.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_27: And Mr.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_27: Dole?
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_27: I hadn't normally gotten around the issues yet.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_27: I was hoping that would come up before the campaign ended.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_27: Whether they're single issues, uh I hear is talk about momentum.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_27: I don't know whether momentum's an issue, but uh I hear talk about little mo and big mo, and I don't know who's who's who.
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_27: But whatever the issues are, I think it's time we address them.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_27: Certainly abortion, certainly gun control, certainly energy and inflation.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_27: That's a responsibility we have, and it's not too late for the people in this state to find out what we know about the issues.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_27: It would be refreshing if somebody asked me about an issue instead of a poll.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_27: It also in my case would be very helpful.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_14: You're not supposed to laugh, but we can't forbid it.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_44: So you mentioned to me um that following the 76 uh campaign, he be you had the strong sense he began to set his sights on a presidential run of his own in 80, and that's when he began to take interest in a much broader spectrum of issues.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_44: So talk a little bit about it.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_04: Particularly on the national level.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_04: Prior to that, he he had been the junior senator from Kansas, and the responsibility of a junior senator from any state is to take care of their constituents.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_04: But the 76th campaign, his selection uh to run as President Ford's uh running mate, really catapulted him to a level of of um uh uh public awareness.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_04: Uh gave him a public profile, which he had not had up to that point, and he recognized the potential for that.
• 13:45
  SPEAKER_04: And I still recall so well uh when he came back to the office after uh the disappointing defeat in November 76, that he told the staff um that he wanted to stake out a position on every single legislative issue that came before the Senate from that point forward.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_04: And that was something that he had never shown an inclination for, to my uh awareness, prior to the 76 campaign.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_04: And the other thing was uh I remember that um he he told the staff that he wanted to position himself as an accommodator.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_04: Um, you know, on any given issue that comes before Congress, there are ideological and partisan uh divisiveness.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_04: Uh and I think it really bothered the senator that during the 76 campaign he had been given the the name Hatchet Man by the news media.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_04: That came out of that famous television debate with Walter Mondale, the Democrat Wars, etc., etc.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_04: And he was he was uh uh stuck with the name Hatchet Man.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_04: And uh, you know, that was not the senator.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_04: He he had a razor sharp wit, and he certainly knew how to put down people with inflated egos, but he was not a hatchet man.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_04: So coming back to my point, I think uh that was the reason that he he he told the staff, I want to become known henceforth as the accommodator.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_04: I want to be the senator who comes up with the the middle ground, the compromise solution that will bring the extremes, the ideologues on both both wings.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_04: And the Democrats and the Republicans bring brings them together uh on a on a compromise that will allow us to actually produce policy of benefit to the American people.
• 15:57
  SPEAKER_04: He wanted to be known as the great accommodator.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_04: Um it seems to me in retrospect that it was a very worthy ambition.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_04: Uh he certainly had his sights set clearly.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_04: He wanted to broaden his base in preparation for the 1980 presidential campaign.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_04: What what um what uh ran afoul of that uh was the emergence of Ronald Reagan and the surging right wing influence on the Republican Party after the 76 uh defeat.
• 16:35
  SPEAKER_04: Uh Ronald Reagan, clearly early in 77, was the man that Dole, I think, felt was his chief competition for the nomination in 1980.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_04: And so, in order to keep up with Reagan in terms of an appeal to the right wing of the Republican Party, he could not, in in many respects, he could not afford to be the great accommodator that he really wanted to be.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_04: He was pulled to the right in order to try to stay abreast of the Reagan juggernaut, which was picking up speed very quickly on issues like the Panama Canal Treaty and Korea and uh uh Taiwan, China, all of these foreign policy issues which began to emerge very large in 77 and 78, which Reagan took a very early profile uh with, and the senator had to uh could not afford the alienation of the right wing of the Republican Party on issues like that.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_04: So to a certain extent, he was pulled back towards right of center because he wanted that nomination in 1980.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_39: Um when do you think of Dole as a national candidate?
• 18:01
  SPEAKER_15: I mean, I very early on.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_15: I mean, of course he'd he'd already run for vice president.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_39: Uh well he would in 76.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_15: Yeah.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_15: Yeah.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_15: Um but just to me, he was just a natural leader.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_15: Tart tongue.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_15: And most of us enjoyed it.
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_15: On occasion, it could cut the wrong way.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_15: And so in 96, I guess he was just told to shut up and not and and then then you didn't see the real Bob Doole.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_15: Yeah.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_15: But I you know This is one of those where you can have nine outrageously funny things and the tenth one bombs, and the nine are forgotten.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_15: The bomb is remembered.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_39: Would Democrat wars uh fit in the uh the the the category of things you wish you could take back?
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_15: Oh yes.
• 18:51
  SPEAKER_15: Oh yeah, every every war in this century?
• 18:53
  SPEAKER_15: Oh yeah.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_15: Yeah.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_15: I mean, first, when you're talking about World War One, you know, who knows?
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_15: Yeah.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_15: When you're talking about Korea, ever everybody knew.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_15: But I don't I don't think they really blamed it on Harry Truman for say we did in 1952.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_15: Uh but I just by by and large, the public is pretty supportive.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_15: By that time, we're out of Vietnam.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_15: The public is pretty supportive of America when it's in war.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_15: And I don't think they do kindly to that kind of a remark.
• 19:30
  SPEAKER_22: Thank you very much.
• 19:31
  SPEAKER_22: Leadership is equality the American people are demanding from a president.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_22: Many Americans feel that we're not receiving the climate effect of leadership that America should be.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_22: How would you define leadership?
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_27: How do you define leadership uh as uh confidence commitment compassion and I think uh beyond those descriptive words must be uh the quality of uh being able to work with uh with your colleagues, whether it's in your business or in your school or or in politics.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_27: I mean in my case, uh am I an effective senator if I've been an effective uh leader in the Senate of the United States the past twelve years?
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_27: Can I work with my colleagues, uh Democrats, Republicans, Liberals, Conservatives?
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_27: I think this uh is the real major of leadership, and uh I would suggest it would be a strength that I would have uh when I become president.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_22: To help further clarify your position, who would you consider to be the three most effective leaders in history and why would you choose those three people?
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_27: Well, I haven't thought a great deal about uh and I don't want to just stick to Republicans being a Republican, but I would say that uh maybe it's because I'm recording this on Lincoln's birthday, but uh certainly uh President Lincoln kept this uh kept the union together, uh provided great leadership for the nation, provided leadership for for the Republican Party.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_27: I think probably a more current uh leader would be uh General Eisenhower.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_27: I think in a recent poll taken just the past couple of weeks, uh the American people were asked uh uh in effect uh who would you like to see uh the leader of this country?
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_27: And the answer came out uh Dwight Eisenhower.
• 21:30
  SPEAKER_27: Certainly, uh he was a war hero.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_27: He served his country in in time of war, in time of peace.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_27: He was uh just what the country needed after World War II, a steady leader, honest, decent, uh doubling with leadership and enthusiasm for America.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_27: And I think even on uh a more current note, and someone who's uh alive and well, history will record that uh General Ford was uh a great leader in this country.
• 21:59
  SPEAKER_27: You know, you look at uh President Ford coming into the presidency after the departure of President Nixon the first time that it happened in our history, sort of putting the country back together again.
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_27: Uh here he was a Republican president dealing with a Democratic Congress, uh not only bringing back decency in the White House and dignity in the White House, but having the having the skill and the wisdom uh to work with the congress uh to bring down inflation to get country get our country moving again when his when the history is written in twenty thirty fifty a hundred years we'll find the name of uh Gerald Ford uh high on the list I'd like to move into the present situation with those questions or maybe some past aspects at least as far as your career is concerned.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_27: What decisions have you made in your past that would best reflect your effectiveness as a leader well I think first of all uh maybe it's not a decision but uh I think maybe it's uh competitive uh it's back to commitment to competition uh decisions that I made uh in my early years in high school uh as far as uh competition in sports and uh and in the classroom uh being an achiever in that sense uh the decision to go on to college uh I didn't have the money but I was able to borrow as I remember three hundred dollars and waited on tables and uh in my fraternity house so I made that decision.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_27: I guess uh the decision to enlist in World War II though I must confess that had I not enlisted the the draft board might have gotten me but I but I made that decision on my own and I spent uh five and a half years in the Army 39 months in army hospitals because of wounds and then again the decision uh uh to seek public office I mean I think all these decisions uh are are somewhat the measure of the man.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_27: Uh I I've I've tried to be an achiever I've never uh had uh wealth or position uh nor did my family but by making the right decisions and with uh a certain amount of luck and a lot of support from good friends uh in my state uh I was elected to Congress and then uh in 68 elected to the United States Senate and then a decision I didn't make but one that President Ford made I was privileged to run with him in 76 as his running mate.
• 24:37
  SPEAKER_27: These decisions as far as the public uh you know as far as the public life are I I think have been important I've made many legislative decisions.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_27: Of course you make those on a daily basis but it would seem to me as I look back over my lifetime and look at the key decisions I made that became building blocks and uh in a career that uh I hope has been a useful one and one which I've been able to display leadership and compassion and commitment and competence uh are based on the way I was raised by my mother and father.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_27: The fact that I work for nearly everything I have and uh it's been uh I believe to some measure a success story.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_22: What I'd like to do now is uh speculate a little bit.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_22: Today America is confronted with a crisis situation that Americans are faced with a constant recurrence of inflation and re and recession a high uh rise in food prices rising fuel prices rising unemployment because of the enigma itself the energy crisis these are the kinds of problems that you would be confronted on a daily basis of elected president.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_22: What what kinds of plans or proposals or ideas do you have to resolve these problems?
• 25:57
  SPEAKER_27: And please be specific right that's a tough one now if I say if I say one elected to president uh the first uh thing I'll do after the inauguration is to convene uh informally of course uh a meeting with the leaders of Congress whether they be Democrats uh Republicans the fact they'll all be there leaders of both parties to sit down and discuss on the very first day on the very first act of my presidency the very issues you talked about inflation energy consumer prices price of heating oil uh health care and see if we can't work out an agenda for the eighties uh in a bipartisan spirit it would be my first uh uh day of a four-year term it would uh immediately dis diffuse uh any political overtones it would seem to me that rather than to say well I have this energy plan and that inflation plan and this plan the first thing you must lay is the groundwork and I look back uh frankly at some of President Carter's problem it's been because he never fully understood the Congress.
• 27:08
  SPEAKER_27: He it's hard to believe that uh that Hamilton Jordan, the key man in the White House had never really met Tip O'Neill in 30 months, the Speaker of the House had never had a conversation with Robert Burt, the Democratic majority leader.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_27: So first you lay the groundwork.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_27: You do that in the spirit of cooperation and you ask for cooperation you ask for guidance.
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_27: Then I would just suggest we turn to the the private sector we unshackle the private sector whether it's in the field of energy whether it's in the field of productivity we look to the private sector for capital formation the creation of jobs and we give the private sector the incentive they need.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_27: Maybe it's going to be tax credits.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_27: But at the same time we look at the the so calm so-called person in the middle the middle American man the middle American woman who just pay and pay and pay there has to be some uh you know some immediate effort to recognize their problems whether it's tax credits for education uh whether it's indexing the tax system so that when they receive a pay raise they won't be tossed into a higher tax bracket.
• 28:14
  SPEAKER_27: And it's a combination of these things that I believe will uh will bring us energy independence which will slow down inflation.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_27: We need to do it we need to produce it I just can't believe that we can adopt a no growth policy in this country and we seem to be on that track.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_27: We're going to have to go out and tell the producers in this country we're behind you, we're gonna help you, we're gonna take care of low-income Americans but we're gonna make certain in the process that we don't bring other people into that category by continued regulation, higher and higher taxes and more and more government.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_27: Senator Dole, thank you for being with us on election eighty Paul thank you and I thank uh those who made this uh program possible it's a service to all of us and I would just say this uh you know I have a preference I think the people ought to be for me but the important thing is that the those who view this program are taking an active role in politics you have a big responsibility in the State of New Hampshire you could well decide who the next president of the United States will be.
• 29:14
  SPEAKER_38: Thank you as you can hear in that interview Bob Dole's getting ready for New Hampshire uh doing that interview going and doing the interviews and the in the debates there and trying to make a move on it but he had one big hurdle to clear before he got to New Hampshire and that was neighboring Iowa which is a neighbor of Kansas and he needed to do extremely well there and that's been true of all of his presidential runs because there it kind of appears to be a home state and that put him locking horns with George Bush because Ronald Reagan had a big lead and so you everybody was positioning to be that person to take on Ronald Reagan in Iowa and this was one of many times that these two men uh found themselves pitted each at each other going back to the replacement of Bob Dole by George H.W.
• 30:13
  SPEAKER_38: Bush at the Republican National Committee 1980 um is it fair to say you and George Bush you certainly were very different.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_39: You certainly came out of very different backgrounds.
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_39: Did did you rub each other a little the wrong way I mean at that point was it uh in the 80s.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_27: Yeah I mean particularly today in the in 7980 when you were both interested in running I mean you'd have to be even though earlier you know when I when went on this journey to New York just asking me one to be chairman when it was already the deal had already been made I mean I was just wasting my time mixing or somebody said well you ought to go up and talk to Bush of course Bush wanted to be number one somewhere and then they were going to make him number two at defense or number three and so they find it off in the chairmanship and I remember going up to UN to see if he was interested I the deal was already made just a tool I guess but uh I remember him being introducing him when he first meeting I said here they come dragging the new chairman in other words he went very anxious not the job he wanted but but we got along pretty well then and it was really after the 88 election I think that a lot of distrust but uh did you remember the uh the night in the actual the debate with uh Reagan and Bush and oh that was fun all of us had fun of course we probably weren't contenders but we we got to ban on it and we were all we were all sort of Reagan you know uh so we didn't get to participate and Reagan I pay for this what was it I pay for this mic that was a great moment in politics I mean it really changed funding for this program has been provided in part by the Corporation for Public Broadcasting tonight a public affairs special from Manchester New Hampshire election 80 the Republican Presidential Candidate Forum here is correspondent Kathleen Campion Good evening next Tuesday the people of New Hampshire go to the polls to vote in the nation's first state presidential primary in the 1980 election year.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_00: Tonight seven Republican candidates for the presidential nomination are at the Practical Arts Auditorium in Manchester, New Hampshire in just a few moments they'll begin what is being billed as the Republican Presidential Candidates Forum sponsored by the League of Women Voters.
• 33:37
  SPEAKER_00: Tonight's debate will have three sections questions will be asked by a panel of journalists and then by members of the audience after that each candidate will be allowed a one minute closing statement.
• 33:46
  SPEAKER_00: The panel consists of the Washington stars Eileen Shanahan syndicated political columnist Joseph Kraft and tonight's moderator Howard K.
• 33:55
  SPEAKER_01: Smith public with nonpartisan election information about issues and about candidates tonight here in Manchester in New Hampshire we proudly continue in that tradition by presenting the first in our series of 1980 presidential forums our moderator and chief panelist is that distinguished television correspondent Mr Howard K.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_14: Smith Thank you Mrs.
• 34:25
  SPEAKER_14: Heinerfeld and good evening the League of Women Voters is pleased to welcome seven candidates for the Republican presidential nomination.
• 34:33
  SPEAKER_14: The candidates are seated on the stage in a sequence that has been determined by a random draw.
• 34:39
  SPEAKER_14: They are from your left to your right Congressman John Anderson of Illinois former Governor John Connolly of Texas Congressman Philip Crane of Illinois former Congressman George Bush of Texas United States Senator Howard Baker of Tennessee Robert Dole, the senior U.S.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_14: Senator from Kansas, former Governor Ronald Reagan of California.
• 35:04
  SPEAKER_14: Joining me in questioning the candidates tonight are two distinguished journalists on my right Eileen Shanahan, the Senior Assistant Managing Editor of the Washington Star, and on my left and your right Joseph Kraft, the nationally syndicated columnist.
• 35:18
  SPEAKER_14: The first part of tonight's program will consist of questions from this panel to the candidates.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_14: In the first part of the forum the candidate to whom a question is addressed will have two minutes to respond.
• 35:28
  SPEAKER_14: The other six candidates will then each have one minute to comment or to react in any way.
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_14: Later in the forum the candidates will answer questions from the audience.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_14: We would like to ask the auditorium audience not to applaud or to react in any way to questions or to answers or to comments.
• 35:45
  SPEAKER_14: We would like to note also that the same forum opportunities have been offered to the uh candidates for the Democratic party's nomination but so far they have not seemed fit to accept and I would like to ask these candidates who are present uh to um if any questions sound hostile they are not they are meant to provoke responses we think the public needs to hear.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_33: The first question I believe is my own to Congressman John Anderson of Illinois.
• 36:13
  SPEAKER_33: Congressman Anderson most Republicans now want us to be firm in dealing with the Russians yet in Des Moines all the candidates but you have opposed cutting off grain to Russia you join the others in opposing consideration of a draft and you especially have opposed defense spending increases.
• 36:33
  SPEAKER_33: How can we impress the Russians with our firmness when candidates for the presidency adopt attitudes like those well first of all Mr.
• 36:40
  SPEAKER_35: Smith on the question of defense spending of course I have consistently supported the pledge that was made by the president at the Bond conference in 1978 that there be a 3% increase in real terms.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_35: It was when I think in an effort uh to secure votes in the Senate for SALT II that he began to talk in terms of percentages of five and five and a half percent without relating those to what I conceived to be really rational programs adding to the defense of the country that I drew the line.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_35: But to answer the broader part of of your question I think it is important that we use the kind of economic countermeasures the cutoff of sales of grain of high technology that we stop our participation in the Olympics to notify the Soviet Union of our intention to resist any further adventurism on their part.
• 37:29
  SPEAKER_35: There's another part of the equation though that I think is terribly important and that is that we demonstrate a capacity to deal with our problems here at home.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_35: I firmly believe that there is a certain inner strength of America that has to come to the fore in times like these are times piled high with difficulty and if you read the president's economic report the number one problem confronting the nation is not Southwest Asia even though he once described that as the most dangerous crisis since World War II, he said that it was inflation that was the nation's number one problem.
• 38:07
  SPEAKER_35: Now to be sure that was a domestic report on the economy.
• 38:10
  SPEAKER_35: But I think to the extent that we do not deal effectively with inflation with lagging productivity and all of these other problems that uh make up this whole complex of an economy to that today I think is performing far worse than it was uh three years ago when Mr.
• 38:28
  SPEAKER_35: Carter took office to the extent that we do not deal with those problems, I think we undermine the real strength, the real security of this country.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_33: Governor Connolly any comment or reaction?
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_32: Well first I think uh the Russians are going to be impressed uh by things that they treasure and that's strength.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_32: And until we're prepared to rebuild the military strength of this country I don't think we're gonna impress them very much with anything.
• 38:57
  SPEAKER_32: I certainly uh think we should use whatever leverage we have economic leverage we have to try to bring the Russians uh to their senses I think uh we should use whatever influence we have in the world to turn the world against the Russians when they move in an aggressive manner as they have against Afghanistan.
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_32: But the thing that's gonna be most impressive to the Russians is whether or not we restore some of the support for military capabilities in this country which we permitted to deteriorate over the years.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_32: 1970 7.4 percent of our GNP went to the military last year 4.5 percent that's not going to impress the Russians and it won't impress them next time.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_32: And I think we have no choice but to make a very very substantial increase in military appropriations for this nation.
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_30: Mr.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_30: Crane a syndicated colonist Charlie Reese recently observed that we shouldn't be unduly apprehensive about the Soviets taking over Middle Eastern oil because obviously there's more than they can use so presumably they would sell the surplus to us.
• 40:00
  SPEAKER_30: And if you don't believe that then there are some logical questions we ought to ask ourselves about defense and that is why is it that we're building truck plants for the Soviet Union?
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_30: Why do we give them sophisticated ball bearing technology?
• 40:14
  SPEAKER_30: Why did we give them computer technology?
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_30: Why are we giving them wide-bodied jet technology and so forth?
• 40:21
  SPEAKER_30: We've got a schizophrenic policy in effect and I think it jeopardizes our national security interest.
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_30: If you're going to embargo grain, for goodness sakes, let's embargo everything against the Soviets is a means of driving a lesson home to them.
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_30: And I think we should keep in mind that George Washington gave us the soundest counsel and it's been counsel handed down since the ancient Greeks that those who desire peace should prepare for war.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_30: And this nation better rebuild its defense capabilities so as to guarantee the security of the United States and peace and freedom worldwide.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_30: Mr.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_37: Bush well I believe that we should strengthen our defense I believe that the Soviet Union at this time doesn't want war.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_37: I think they're confused by our president.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_37: I think they saw him fulfilling a campaign pledge about too many generals, too much defense coming in, cutting way back on the Ford budget and then waking up three years into his presidency and saying hey we can't trust the Soviet Union.
• 41:23
  SPEAKER_37: My feeling is we need to restore many of the cuts that he made add carefully to them and I believe that strength will deter Soviet aggression keep this country strong and we can have two decades of peace.
• 41:41
  SPEAKER_37: Senator Baker?
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_31: Mr Smith I don't like the Russians are confused.
• 41:45
  SPEAKER_31: I think they have the idea that they've had since World War II and that is that Uncle Sam's a patsy and I think that the recent actions by President Carter and cutting the B-1 bomber and delaying the development of the MX missile by reducing by 50% the size of the commitment to the modern American Navy that they have the impression that we're flirting with some sort of unilateral disarmament.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_31: It is my opinion that if we're going to prosper in this world, we've got to do what Teddy Roosevelt said walk softly and carry a big stick.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_31: But President Carter's cut most of that stick in two and it's time that we focused on weapon systems and not just a percentage increase in the defense budget.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_31: And that's what I would propose to do.
• 42:29
  SPEAKER_31: Senator Dole.
• 42:31
  SPEAKER_27: Well I think first of all we must recognize that these were symbolic acts I haven't seen any F F Soviets leave Afghanistan since all this was announced in December.
• 42:41
  SPEAKER_27: I think beyond that we need to be very realistic.
• 42:44
  SPEAKER_27: Since January 1977 up until January of 1980 we've we've reduced the so called Ford budgets by about sixty billion dollars insofar as defense is concerned.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_27: It seems to me the obligation is very clear.
• 42:58
  SPEAKER_27: The American people demand it and the Congress will do it and I just believe the Republicans have an opportunity this is our opportunity.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_27: President Carter is fiddling away and despite all the talk about more defense spending we've got to keep our eye on one other thing and that's a meaningful arms limitation agreement.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_27: We've got to continue talking to the Soviets because the thought of nuclear war itself is unthinkable.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_36: Governor Reagan Abraham Lincoln once said those who criticize must have the heart to help and I think that the Republican Party has now found the moment when they must come to the aid of this country I agree with much of what has been said here.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_36: I myself disapproved of the embargo on grain not because I don't think we should embargo the Soviet Union keep things from them that will be of help to them but because it was a kind of a symbol and I think it was for domestic consumption.
• 43:56
  SPEAKER_36: It actually hurt the American farmer more than it hurt the Soviet Union.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_36: And I believe that just stating a figure for armament is not the answer to our problem.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_36: We've got to send some signals to the Soviet Union that there could be a confrontation down the road if they continue.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_36: And one of those I would think could be building what has to be built in weaponry to once again be in a position where the Soviet Union would not dare lift a hand against the United States.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_33: Thank you, gentlemen.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_33: The second question from Ms.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_33: Shanahan to Governor Connolly.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_03: Mr.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_03: Connolly, many well-informed people in this country believe that what we are actually going to face next from the Russians in the Middle East and Asia is not a clear-cut invasion, but rather a program of systematic infiltration, subversion, attempt at toppling some of the shaky governments in that area, Iran, Pakistan, maybe Saudi Arabia.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_03: How would you, as president, deal with that threat?
• 45:03
  SPEAKER_03: Will the increased military spending you're talking about really deal with that?
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_32: I think actually that might well be the way the Soviets move.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_32: They clearly indicated that they were going to move in the Middle East in April of 1978, when they installed Mohammed Taraki as the first puppet head of the Afghan government.
• 45:29
  SPEAKER_32: I think Afghanistan is a way station on their way and their march to the Persian Gulf and the Indian Ocean.
• 45:37
  SPEAKER_32: I think they have uh their people in Iran right today.
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_32: I have always thought that uh Gatsade was probably uh a KGB agent.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_32: If not, he was at least a Marxist.
• 45:52
  SPEAKER_32: I think they clearly had a hand, and some of the South Yemenites uh who went into the city of Mecca and uh caused the disturbance and occupied the holy shrine there for two weeks.
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_32: I think they're clearly stirring up trouble all over the Middle East.
• 46:08
  SPEAKER_32: I think we have to do two things.
• 46:11
  SPEAKER_32: I recommended this on October the 11th uh of last year, a month before our embassy was occupied in Tehran.
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_32: I think we have to establish a very strong military presence in the Middle East.
• 46:23
  SPEAKER_32: I think we need a permanent navy, hopefully in the island of Al-Massira off the coast of Oman to guard the Straits of Harmas.
• 46:31
  SPEAKER_32: I think we need to put major components of the Air Force in the Middle East and the Sinai or other fields in the Middle East so that we have a capacity to provide the military stability and the security for all of the Middle East.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_32: In addition to that, I think we need to forge a new alliance in the Middle East with uh Israel, the modern Arab states, uh, Japan, the countries of Western Europe who have a vital interest, as vital as our own, as well as the United States being a party uh to that alliance.
• 47:04
  SPEAKER_32: I don't think there's any question, but what that is the most vital, the most volatile, and the most vulnerable part of the world today.
• 47:10
  SPEAKER_32: And I think we have to use every resource we have uh to try to bring about uh the stability uh of that region or the deterioration is going to be disastrous for us.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_30: Thank you, Governor.
• 47:23
  SPEAKER_30: Uh Mr.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_30: Crane, do you have a comment?
• 47:25
  SPEAKER_30: Yes, I think the first thing the United States must re-establish is its credibility as a reliable and trustworthy ally.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_30: The fact of the matter is, during this Carter administration, we have betrayed friends.
• 47:39
  SPEAKER_30: Uh, whether you refer to Taiwan, where the President unilaterally broke a solemn treaty commitment and sent a telegraph message to every small country that was an ally of the United States at that time, uh, to pulling the rug out from under the Shah.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_30: And I'm not making any brief in defense of the Shah, but I'll tell you the world is a vastly more dangerous place, and there's a greater risk of an international confrontation because the Shah is gone than when the Shah was in control and providing a buffer against Soviet penetration, providing oil to the United States and to Israel during the Middle Eastern conflicts, and simultaneously guaranteeing us vital, critically important listening posts on the Soviet border.
• 48:23
  SPEAKER_30: I think in addition to that, we should develop a third fleet to patrol the Indian Ocean so we can maintain a strong and powerful presence in the area.
• 48:32
  SPEAKER_30: Mr.
• 48:33
  SPEAKER_30: Bush.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_37: Well, my view is that short-range, we should be supporting Pakistan.
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_37: Uh we should be working with China.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_37: China looks at this as a part of an encirclement of them.
• 48:47
  SPEAKER_37: I look at it as though the Soviet Union, with an energy shortfall in the 80s, is trying to get down to the to the oil fields.
• 48:56
  SPEAKER_37: But I think the bottom line is this you do not build a foreign policy on broken commitments or on vacillation.
• 49:05
  SPEAKER_37: And so we have to turn it around, not short run, but longer run, so that opposition forces, particularly the Soviet Union, knows we're going to keep our word.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_37: And that means we're going to have to strengthen militarily.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_37: It means we're going to have to go with the concept of a three-ocean Navy.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_37: I don't favor permanent basing of U.S.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_37: forces in the Middle East.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_37: I do favor utilization of ports that have been offered for reasons of projecting, if necessary, U.S.
• 49:40
  SPEAKER_37: force.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_31: Senator Baker?
• 49:43
  SPEAKER_31: Ms.
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_31: Shanahan, I think it's entirely possible that we'll see Soviet infiltration in that region following on after Afghanistan.
• 49:52
  SPEAKER_31: But I think there may be a greater danger, really, and that is the possibility that you're going to see a Soviet peace offensive this spring, this summer, and that America may once again be lulled into a false sense of security.
• 50:05
  SPEAKER_31: And many may look back and say, well, you know, it really wasn't as bad as we thought.
• 50:09
  SPEAKER_31: So let's abandon all those commitments we made to a stronger Navy and a stronger Air Force and the like.
• 50:14
  SPEAKER_31: That is the danger I perceive.
• 50:17
  SPEAKER_31: I hope that we will remember today that the Soviets have always oscillated between offensive thrusts and retreat into a peace offensive.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_31: I think that we've got to show a foreign policy and a national defense commitment that is characterized by constancy.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_31: I think the Carter administration has shown that they flip-flop on foreign policy, and I think that they have led us into a position where the Russians believe they can push on Uncle Sam and he'll never push back.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_31: Mr.
• 50:45
  SPEAKER_31: Dole.
• 50:47
  SPEAKER_27: Well, first I think our foreign policy must be bipartisan.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_27: We take a look at the past few years.
• 50:53
  SPEAKER_27: We we find about 12 countries who are now sort of alienated from the West.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_27: They're tilted toward the Soviets.
• 50:59
  SPEAKER_27: We find uh Cuban proxy forces in four other countries.
• 51:03
  SPEAKER_27: We find uh three countries solidly in the Russian camp in the past uh three to four years.
• 51:09
  SPEAKER_27: We're talking about countries with uh men under arms two and a half million or more.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_27: So it poses a real threat.
• 51:16
  SPEAKER_27: I believe we ought to have a presence in Pakistan.
• 51:20
  SPEAKER_27: We ought to draw the line, say this is as far as you go, and it ought to be done on a bipartisan basis.
• 51:26
  SPEAKER_27: We haven't had a bipartisan foreign policy in this country for a number of years.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_27: It's in our interest.
• 51:31
  SPEAKER_27: It's in the interest of the people of New Hampshire, in my state of Kansas.
• 51:35
  SPEAKER_27: You know, the the stakes are very high.
• 51:38
  SPEAKER_27: And whoever is elected in January has that responsibility, and we can meet it as Republicans.
• 51:45
  SPEAKER_36: Mr.
• 51:45
  SPEAKER_36: Reagan.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_36: Well, I believe that one of the first things this country has to do if we are to preserve freedom and our leadership of the free world is to have a grand strategy, a plan for the decade of the eighties and for beyond, that serves our interests and that gives us contingency plans when things like Afghanistan happen.
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_36: The president destroyed our credibility to a great extent when he told the Soviet Union with their troops massed on the Afghanistan border that we would take serious notice and there would be serious consequences if they crossed into Afghanistan.
• 52:21
  SPEAKER_36: Well, they crossed into Afghanistan.
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_36: And we haven't done anything about it, frankly, because we didn't have the means to do anything about it.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_36: My own belief is that in addition to showing the flag there in the Middle East to indicate that they might face a confrontation with us, we should have in a plan, and I don't say this option is based on or is the only one, but we should have a plan of touching them on soft spots.
• 52:46
  SPEAKER_36: As for example, the suggestion I've made about blockading Cuba.
• 52:52
  SPEAKER_33: Governor, your time's up, I'm afraid.
• 52:54
  SPEAKER_33: I just stopped.
• 53:00
  SPEAKER_35: Mr.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_35: Smith, if if indeed we have to fear further penetration and infiltration by the Soviets of Saudi Arabia and Iran, we ought to first stop and think why it is.
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_35: Why has that become such an attractive target?
• 53:13
  SPEAKER_35: It is because of our dependence on oil coming from the Persian Gulf, 1.7 million barrels a day.
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_35: If we want to reduce tensions, therefore it seems to me logically we ought to first address that problem and try to reduce our dependence.
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_35: Then secondly, that would make it much easier for us to secure the cooperation of the Japanese, of the West Germans, of the French, of the other nations in the Western world and Japan that also have a vital interest in the Persian Gulf and the Middle East.
• 53:44
  SPEAKER_35: We ought to be busy working with them right now to create the network of collective security arrangements that would be needed to present a united front to show some solidarity against any further Soviet expansion.
• 54:00
  SPEAKER_33: Thank you, gentlemen.
• 54:01
  SPEAKER_33: Now for the next question from Mr.
• 54:03
  SPEAKER_33: Kraft to Congressman Crane.
• 54:06
  SPEAKER_17: Mr.
• 54:07
  SPEAKER_17: Crane, uh, you're known as the Conservatives Conservative, and you've talked extensively on such issues as gun control and abortion and prayer in schools.
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_17: Uh why do you think voters should choose a president on those relatively narrow issues rather than on such major matters as inflation, energy, and foreign policy?
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_30: Well, first of all, those have not been the issues that I have focused disproportionate attention on.
• 54:37
  SPEAKER_30: Rather, they are part of a package in an attempt to restore an emphasis on some very traditional and basic values.
• 54:46
  SPEAKER_30: I have, as a matter of fact, campaigned first and foremost on the issue of inflation from the very first time I ran for Congress in 69 right down to the present day, because it is still the overriding issue, which, if left unresolved, will lead to the destruction of our economy.
• 55:03
  SPEAKER_30: And if that occurs, God forbid, the potential destruction of our political institutions as well.
• 55:09
  SPEAKER_30: But I think those other issues are important moral values that provide the underpinnings that guarantees the survival of a humane and free and compassionate society, and I have indeed put stress on them.
• 55:26
  SPEAKER_30: But I have not been the only one who's put stress on them.
• 55:29
  SPEAKER_30: As you know, Governor Ed King defeated Michael Dukakis, who had impeccable liberal credentials in the neighboring state of Massachusetts on precisely those issues.
• 55:39
  SPEAKER_30: And Massachusetts, the only state that went for George McGovern in 1972, is a state that has most recently restored prayer in the schools.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_30: It's a state also that has a very strong feeling that was manifested in that gubernatorial election on such questions as abortion.
• 55:59
  SPEAKER_30: And it is a state that is right now seeking to restore capital punishment.
• 56:04
  SPEAKER_30: I think those are issues that are troubling many Americans, and I think we must focus attention on those just as surely as we concentrate on the question of getting our economy back onto a sound, robust growth track, just as we concentrate simultaneously on beefing up our defense capability to guarantee the security of the United States, and just as we once more assume responsibility for providing critically important leadership during these troubled times to promote our ideals of peace and freedom worldwide.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_30: Mr.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_30: Bush, do you have a comment?
• 56:37
  SPEAKER_37: Well, my comment is it's understandable that there's great interest in these issues.
• 56:41
  SPEAKER_37: We're all speaking out on them.
• 56:43
  SPEAKER_37: People say we haven't taken position on issues.
• 56:46
  SPEAKER_37: Here's issue papers, not on these particular subjects, although we have shorter ones on those.
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_37: But it seems to me that people are looking for something not a single issue candidate.
• 56:57
  SPEAKER_37: They're looking for something more reasonable, looking for strong leadership in the eighties.
• 57:02
  SPEAKER_37: The big issues are inflation, energy, and the restoration of respect for this country around the world.
• 57:12
  SPEAKER_37: And yes, it's appropriate people ask questions on these single issues.
• 57:16
  SPEAKER_37: But those issues aren't the issues that are going to decide who is elected president of the United States to lead this country for eight years in the eighties.
• 57:25
  SPEAKER_31: Mr.
• 57:25
  SPEAKER_31: Baker.
• 57:27
  unknown: Mr.
• 57:27
  SPEAKER_31: Kraft, I think I understand why those issues are important, because that's sort of the stuff that presidential campaigns are made out of.
• 57:35
  SPEAKER_31: That is to test the point of view of individual candidates on matters of concern to the American public.
• 57:41
  SPEAKER_31: In my opinion, there are three aspects of a presidential campaign.
• 57:45
  SPEAKER_31: One, what a candidate thinks about the issues that the country is concerned about at the moment.
• 57:50
  SPEAKER_31: Two, what a candidate has to say about what he would do for the country in the future, the new issues that haven't yet emerged.
• 57:57
  SPEAKER_13: And three, what makes him tick?
• 57:59
  SPEAKER_13: What kind of president would he be?
• 58:00
  SPEAKER_13: How would he approach the problems of the future?
• 58:02
  SPEAKER_13: Does he believe in a strong staff, a strong national defense?
• 58:06
  SPEAKER_13: Does he believe in the principality of the role of the chief of state?
• 58:11
  SPEAKER_13: These are the things that make up a presidential campaign and make it useful to the American people.
• 58:15
  SPEAKER_13: So I try to address each one of these issues, and some of them are very, very difficult, but they're the stuff that presidential campaigns are made of.
• 58:22
  SPEAKER_13: And Mr.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_13: Dole?
• 58:24
  SPEAKER_13: Well, I hadn't known we'd gotten around to issues yet.
• 58:26
  SPEAKER_13: I was hoping that would come up before the campaign ended.
• 58:29
  SPEAKER_27: Whether they're single issues, uh, all I hear is talk about momentum.
• 58:33
  SPEAKER_27: I don't know that momentum's an issue, but uh I hear talk about little Mo and Big Moe, and I don't know who's who's who.
• 58:40
  SPEAKER_27: But whatever the issues are, I think it's time we address them.
• 58:44
  SPEAKER_27: Certainly abortion, certainly gun control, certainly energy and inflation.
• 58:50
  SPEAKER_27: That's a responsibility we have, and it's not too late for the people in this state to find out what we know about the issues.
• 58:55
  SPEAKER_27: It would be refreshing if somebody asked me about an issue instead of a poll.
• 58:59
  SPEAKER_27: It also, in my case, would be very helpful.
• 59:05
  SPEAKER_14: You're not supposed to laugh, but we can't forget it.
• 59:08
  SPEAKER_21: Mr.
• 59:08
  SPEAKER_21: Reagan.
• 59:09
  SPEAKER_21: Well, there isn't much left by the time you get to the end of the line here to be said about something of this kind, except that is it possible that those so-called single issues, to graph, are an expression of a discontent on the part of the people, a feeling that the old traditional values upon which our civilization is built are fading away, that our moral standards are declining.
• 59:35
  SPEAKER_36: I happen to be one who believes that interrupting a pregnancy means taking a human life.
• 59:41
  SPEAKER_36: And when I think that a million four hundred thousand of those lives were taken last year, legalized.
• 59:47
  SPEAKER_36: And I think the people out here sense this and are hungry for a kind of spiritual revival.
• 59:53
  SPEAKER_36: I think our worry about the family and the family unit and its decline is because more and more we've seen a big intrusive government at the national level that has interfered more and more in the family itself coming between child and parent.
• 1:00:12
  SPEAKER_35: Mr.
• 1:00:13
  SPEAKER_35: Anderson?
• 1:00:14
  SPEAKER_35: Well, obviously, I would hope that in this campaign we would avoid single-issue politics, but three specific issues were mentioned in the question to Mr.
• 1:00:21
  SPEAKER_35: Crane.
• 1:00:22
  SPEAKER_35: So rather than wave our position papers around, why don't we declare what our positions are?
• 1:00:27
  SPEAKER_35: On abortion, I am for freedom of choice.
• 1:00:30
  SPEAKER_35: On the question of gun control, I am for the licensing of concealable hand weapons.
• 1:00:35
  SPEAKER_35: On the question of prayer in schools, I believe that when Mother sends Johnny and Susie off to the classroom in the morning, she ought to whisper in their ear and tell them, Now be sure and say a prayer before you begin your school day.
• 1:00:49
  SPEAKER_35: But I certainly don't want the state writing and composing that prayer for Johnny and Susie to recite.
• 1:00:56
  SPEAKER_35: But I agree, these are issues that ought to be discussed and positions ought to be taken.
• 1:01:01
  SPEAKER_35: But the overriding question has to be what where does a candidate stand really on fundamental economic issues?
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_35: What is his program really for defending and securing the future of this country?
• 1:01:14
  SPEAKER_35: Mr.
• 1:01:15
  SPEAKER_35: Connolly.
• 1:01:17
  SPEAKER_32: Ms.
• 1:01:17
  SPEAKER_32: Smith, I've tried to talk about issues since this campaign first started.
• 1:01:22
  SPEAKER_32: And to draw the issue clearly with uh the distinguished gentleman on my right, uh, I'm against abortions, and I'm against federal funding of abortions, and I am against gun control, and I am for prayers and steel, and I am for development of an energy policy in this country, including greater utilization of coal, and building of more nuclear power plants.
• 1:01:42
  SPEAKER_32: Uh I am for doing something about inflation, and that means stopping and slowing the rate of federal spending, stop deficit spending.
• 1:01:50
  SPEAKER_32: I am for doing something about jobs and increasing savings in this country and providing an incentive to do it and increasing productivity of re-establishing the family units, but frankly, I don't get any questions about that from the press.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_32: I'm like Bob Dole.
• 1:02:04
  SPEAKER_32: All I get is what poll they last saw and what uh newspaper composed of 14 people that they interviewed somewhere in the country.
• 1:02:12
  SPEAKER_32: And I'd like for the press to concern itself with some of the issues that are fundamental to this country, because we have some fundamental issues and some governmental power.
• 1:02:23
  SPEAKER_33: Um the next question is mine, and it's uh you've anticipated it, Governor Connolly.
• 1:02:29
  SPEAKER_33: It's to Mr.
• 1:02:30
  SPEAKER_33: Bush.
• 1:02:31
  SPEAKER_33: It's an enduring question, and that's why I have to ask it again.
• 1:02:34
  SPEAKER_33: The public is manifestly distressed by the failure of everything we try to do something about inflation.
• 1:02:41
  SPEAKER_33: The guidelines don't work, the Fed's high interest rates haven't worked, even if you cut or balance the federal uh budget, the Congressional Budget Office says a balanced budget would reduce inflation very little.
• 1:02:54
  SPEAKER_33: Uh, what would you do that's not being done to succeed as well as the Japanese have in cutting inflation?
• 1:03:00
  SPEAKER_37: I would disagree about whether a balanced budget would not help towards breaking the back of inflation.
• 1:03:08
  SPEAKER_37: But it's how you get in balance that counts.
• 1:03:11
  SPEAKER_37: If you get there by shoving people into higher brackets, higher and higher tax brackets, that's not gonna do it.
• 1:03:18
  SPEAKER_37: If you get there through two other methods, it will hold the growth of spending less than the rate of inflation.
• 1:03:28
  SPEAKER_37: That's the first thing.
• 1:03:29
  SPEAKER_37: The second thing is you need to stimulate production, investment, risk taking, savings by a tax cut that is not going to risk making the deficit worse, but is gonna stimulate jobs, jobs in the private sector.
• 1:03:49
  SPEAKER_37: Now, if you do those two things and couple them with some kind of regulatory relief, that means carefully drawn legislation so the regulators don't have more to say about it, that means sunset laws, that means grading federal programs, like my late friend Billy Steiger proposed.
• 1:04:09
  SPEAKER_37: If you do those three things, we don't need to be pessimistic about the question of inflation.
• 1:04:17
  SPEAKER_37: And you can get in balance, you can provide for the defense.
• 1:04:21
  SPEAKER_37: The balance may take a year or two to get into it, but once you're there, if you do that and then start indexation, I believe we can do what other countries have done.
• 1:04:32
  SPEAKER_37: We can break the back of inflation and we can increase employment.
• 1:04:37
  SPEAKER_37: We are pessimistic.
• 1:04:38
  SPEAKER_37: When President Ford came into office, inflation was 12%.
• 1:04:43
  SPEAKER_37: He vetoed legislation that broke his budget.
• 1:04:46
  SPEAKER_37: And you know what it was when he left?
• 1:04:48
  SPEAKER_37: 4.8%.
• 1:04:50
  SPEAKER_37: And we are wringing our hands saying that we can't break the back of inflation.
• 1:04:55
  SPEAKER_37: I don't believe it.
• 1:04:57
  SPEAKER_37: I believe this investment-oriented or supply-side economics will do it.
• 1:05:02
  SPEAKER_37: I believe if we can turn around and get more Republicans in Congress, we can do something about too much regulation.
• 1:05:09
  SPEAKER_37: We can do it.
• 1:05:10
  SPEAKER_37: We can solve these problems in the 80s.
• 1:05:12
  SPEAKER_31: Mr.
• 1:05:12
  SPEAKER_31: Bush, that's the end of your time, I'm afraid.
• 1:05:14
  SPEAKER_31: Mr.
• 1:05:14
  SPEAKER_31: Baker?
• 1:05:16
  SPEAKER_31: Well, I think George and I disagree on two elements of his statement just now.
• 1:05:20
  SPEAKER_31: One is the indexing of the tax rate.
• 1:05:22
  SPEAKER_31: You know, the Constitution says that the Congress shall set the taxes, shall lay and collect taxes.
• 1:05:28
  SPEAKER_31: I was in Brazil once a couple of years ago, and I asked them, would you do it again if you could do it over?
• 1:05:32
  SPEAKER_31: And they said no, because inflation feeds on itself when you index the tax rate.
• 1:05:37
  SPEAKER_31: The Congress ought to do that.
• 1:05:39
  SPEAKER_31: And George didn't speak to it, but I understand he is opposed to a constitutional amendment that would make it more difficult to spend in deficit.
• 1:05:47
  SPEAKER_31: I support an amendment that would do that.
• 1:05:49
  SPEAKER_31: In particular, I support the Luger Amendment.
• 1:05:52
  SPEAKER_31: I believe that a combination of fiscal restraint by the Administrative Department, tax relief through the Kangers, not including the indexing of tax rates, and a constitutional amendment will produce that result, and I do not think it's an impossible task.
• 1:06:07
  SPEAKER_31: Mr.
• 1:06:08
  SPEAKER_31: Dole.
• 1:06:09
  SPEAKER_27: Well, I think the first thing we have to go beyond the simplistic uh solutions that Republicans do from time to time, particularly when we're out of power.
• 1:06:17
  SPEAKER_27: You know, somebody here may get elected.
• 1:06:19
  SPEAKER_27: And so we better uh take a look at what we're gonna have to do.
• 1:06:23
  SPEAKER_27: I would say first.
• 1:06:25
  SPEAKER_27: Of all that uh we don't want a value added tax.
• 1:06:27
  SPEAKER_27: Somebody's trying to promote that in the Congress.
• 1:06:30
  SPEAKER_27: We do want indexing.
• 1:06:32
  SPEAKER_27: Howard Baker is mistaken there, but he's right on a lot of things.
• 1:06:35
  SPEAKER_27: We we want to index the tax system.
• 1:06:37
  SPEAKER_27: We also want tax credits to increase productivity.
• 1:06:41
  SPEAKER_27: We want to restrain the growth of federal programs, not end federal programs, not to cut social programs.
• 1:06:47
  SPEAKER_27: We need some capital formation in America.
• 1:06:50
  SPEAKER_27: We gotta put people to work.
• 1:06:52
  SPEAKER_27: We're gonna do that through the private sector.
• 1:06:54
  SPEAKER_27: That's the Republican side through the private sector.
• 1:06:57
  SPEAKER_27: And I would share the view that we need a constitutional amendment for a balanced budget.
• 1:07:01
  SPEAKER_36: Mr.
• 1:07:02
  SPEAKER_36: Reagan.
• 1:07:03
  SPEAKER_36: Government causes inflation, government can end inflation.
• 1:07:07
  SPEAKER_36: I would, as I the first day as president, put a freeze in the hiring of federal employees.
• 1:07:13
  SPEAKER_36: I would then start seeking a tax reduction in the income tax rates across the board over a three-year period to reduce them by at least 30% in an effort to create jobs.
• 1:07:24
  SPEAKER_36: Every time unemployment goes up one percent, it costs the government twenty billion dollars more.
• 1:07:30
  SPEAKER_36: If you could make it go down two percent, there wouldn't be a deficit, there'd even be a surplus.
• 1:07:35
  SPEAKER_36: I would, in addition to that, take the punitive taxes and regulations and remove them from the back of industry so that we bec could become more productive.
• 1:07:43
  SPEAKER_36: And thus we wouldn't have to grind out that printing press imitation money that's destroying the value of our savings, our insurance, and our pensions.
• 1:07:51
  SPEAKER_36: All of these things I think can be done or must be done.
• 1:07:54
  SPEAKER_36: But the president right now is suggesting an anti-inflation fight in which he is going to allow unemployment to increase$40 billion worth.
• 1:08:05
  SPEAKER_36: Mr.
• 1:08:05
  SPEAKER_36: Um you've stopped the game.
• 1:08:07
  SPEAKER_35: Uh Mr.
• 1:08:08
  SPEAKER_35: Anderson.
• 1:08:09
  SPEAKER_35: Mr.
• 1:08:09
  SPEAKER_35: Smith, the guidelines indeed have not worked.
• 1:08:13
  SPEAKER_35: And one reason they haven't worked is because the ink was no sooner dry on the Dunlop uh pay advisory board standards of seven and a half to nine and a half percent before you had a union come in with uh a 12 percent increase.
• 1:08:25
  SPEAKER_35: And I heard not one word of protest from the administration about that fact.
• 1:08:30
  SPEAKER_35: I think we've had, as the late George Meany said, merely wish-boning from the administration on any guidelines.
• 1:08:37
  SPEAKER_35: What we need is a president courageous enough not to simply leave Mr.
• 1:08:41
  SPEAKER_35: Volcker standing there like a little Dutch boy with his finger plugging the hole in the dike and depending solely on high interest rates, uh, and instead we ought to have a president courageous enough to deal with the kind of budget policy, fiscal policy that is going to be needed to restrain demand.
• 1:08:59
  SPEAKER_35: You've got to have complementary budget policy, not simply rely on monetary policy alone.
• 1:09:05
  SPEAKER_35: And then I agree with the growth measures for the economy recommended by Senator Dole.
• 1:09:10
  SPEAKER_32: Mr.
• 1:09:10
  SPEAKER_32: Connolly, first, I would recommend the creation of an Est Egg account so that we don't tax savings.
• 1:09:17
  SPEAKER_32: Anyone that can save up to$10,000 in this country, if they'll put it in a bank savings loan, a common stock or a bond, leave the income there along with the principal.
• 1:09:26
  SPEAKER_32: They can leave it there for five or ten years with no uh income tax on it whatsoever.
• 1:09:31
  SPEAKER_32: All taxes would be deferred.
• 1:09:33
  SPEAKER_32: That would that would generate savings in this country and capital which we desperately need.
• 1:09:38
  SPEAKER_32: I recommend the change in the depreciation schedule in this country so that any new building of any kind or character for industrial or commercial purposes would bear a ten-year depreciation schedule, any equipment five years, any rolling stock three years, and any government dict dictated installation one year.
• 1:09:55
  SPEAKER_32: I think we can cure inflation.
• 1:09:57
  SPEAKER_32: The two principal causes are energy, government spending.
• 1:10:00
  SPEAKER_32: I'm against the indexing of taxes.
• 1:10:03
  SPEAKER_32: When you start indexing salaries, indexing taxes, you give it up on the fighting inflation.
• 1:10:12
  SPEAKER_38: That's just a little taste.
• 1:10:13
  SPEAKER_38: Probably one of the strongest, if not the strongest, field in my lifetime of Republican candidates running for president.
• 1:10:19
  SPEAKER_38: Um and Iowa Bob Dole just never caught fire.
• 1:10:25
  SPEAKER_38: And the race really became one of Ronald Reagan versus George H.
• 1:10:33
  SPEAKER_38: W.
• 1:10:33
  SPEAKER_38: Bush.
• 1:10:34
  SPEAKER_38: And Bush floored him in Iowa and emerged as a front runner, and Bob Dole would draw.
• 1:12:08
  SPEAKER_07: He had been supposedly director of the CIA, but I didn't really know anything about him.
• 1:12:12
  SPEAKER_07: And it was George H.
• 1:12:13
  SPEAKER_07: W.
• 1:12:13
  SPEAKER_07: Bush.
• 1:12:14
  SPEAKER_07: He calls me up personally.
• 1:12:15
  SPEAKER_07: And I called a radio station, KDTH of Dubuque, and tried to call some other stations too to try to get them to come.
• 1:12:21
  SPEAKER_07: And only one radio station with a little reporter came to with a little tape recorder to interview George H.
• 1:12:28
  SPEAKER_07: W.
• 1:12:28
  SPEAKER_07: Bush.
• 1:12:29
  SPEAKER_07: And I still remember him.
• 1:12:30
  SPEAKER_07: He sat there with his legs crossed like this, and he had socks that had no elastic in it.
• 1:12:34
  SPEAKER_07: They're all down around his feet.
• 1:12:35
  SPEAKER_07: I saw his old legs, and I go, What?
• 1:12:37
  SPEAKER_07: Who is this guy?
• 1:12:40
  SPEAKER_07: But he had obviously made a commitment at that point to run for president, so he wanted to get to Iowa.
• 1:12:46
  SPEAKER_37: Best crackerjack cracks grassroots organization, and that's how I'm gonna win.
• 1:12:50
  SPEAKER_37: Do you think that Ronald Reagan is the front runner right now where you see the country running?
• 1:12:54
  SPEAKER_37: Because I'll pick up a poll and uh any of these newspapers that you all represent, and and and I would say I'd go with whatever it says uh in uh April or May, but that's not when the election's gonna be.
• 1:13:05
  SPEAKER_21: I had a pitch on the way to the plate.
• 1:13:09
  SPEAKER_21: There was only one thing you can do that doesn't get in the scorebook.
• 1:13:12
  SPEAKER_21: I had him foul it off.
• 1:13:15
  SPEAKER_34: Former California Governor Ronald Reagan had Midwestern roots dating back to his time as a Des Moines radio announcer.
• 1:13:23
  SPEAKER_34: Years in advance of the 1980 race, Republican activists believed Iowa was ripe for Reagan to begin a march to the nomination.
• 1:13:30
  SPEAKER_34: But his campaign had an alternative strategy.
• 1:13:43
  SPEAKER_42: Politicians and political observers are so anxious to find out who will win, they are grasping at straws.
• 1:13:49
  SPEAKER_42: Or in this case, a straw poll, taken by the Iowa Daily Press Association at Saturday night's fundraiser in Ames.
• 1:13:56
  SPEAKER_42: Fifteen hundred of the Republican donors filled them out.
• 1:13:59
  SPEAKER_42: The top vote getter, George Bush, who has built up organizational support in Iowa this year, and who has been most active with the balloons and bobbles of campaigning.
• 1:14:08
  SPEAKER_42: Fellow Texan John Connolly was a distant second.
• 1:14:10
  SPEAKER_42: Just behind him, Robert Dole.
• 1:14:12
  SPEAKER_42: The night's holdout, Ronald Reagan, pulled fourth.
• 1:14:15
  SPEAKER_42: Some observers say his absence from the Ames fundraiser will hurt him among Republican politicos.
• 1:14:21
  SPEAKER_43: Where you have organization or you don't have organization.
• 1:14:27
  SPEAKER_42: And by that measure, George Bush has Iowa's inside track.
• 1:14:40
  SPEAKER_12: Field organizer Ed Priola said today from a newly opened campaign office in Cedar Rapids that the delay is by design.
• 1:14:46
  SPEAKER_12: That Reagan's campaign begins in earnest with his official announcement tonight.
• 1:15:31
  SPEAKER_09: I just wanted to be a good host.
• 1:15:34
  SPEAKER_09: But obviously, my heart was with Reagan, and I kept calling John Sears and I said, You're gonna blow this.
• 1:15:41
  SPEAKER_09: You think you can just do one rally for congressional district?
• 1:15:44
  SPEAKER_09: Uh the Bush campaign's going everywhere.
• 1:15:48
  SPEAKER_09: And I couldn't get him to return my phone calls, and they didn't change their strategy.
• 1:15:53
  SPEAKER_07: If you knew John Sears is a pretty arrogant guy, and he just decided he he didn't need to deal with Iowa because they had Iowa in the bag, and he was just gonna win New Hampshire and it'd be over with the federal government shall do only those things specifically called the.
• 1:17:20
  SPEAKER_27: And I want to say to Governor Reagan, wherever you are, I hope you're having fun tonight, because we are.
• 1:17:28
  SPEAKER_27: And if you're looking for a younger Ronald Reagan with experience, I'm here.
• 1:17:42
  SPEAKER_05: Well, Robin, I think I would write no winners, but perhaps a loser in the absentee, Mr.
• 1:17:49
  SPEAKER_05: Reagan.
• 1:17:50
  SPEAKER_24: Iowa public television reporter Dean Borg in the lobby of the Civic Center.
• 1:17:54
  SPEAKER_24: Dean?
• 1:17:55
  SPEAKER_24: James Baker, who heads the Bush campaign.
• 1:17:58
  SPEAKER_45: What did you accomplish here tonight in setting your man apart from the man who is acknowledged to be the front runner?
• 1:18:03
  SPEAKER_08: Well, Dean, I'd be very happy to accept the uh analysis that uh Hugh and John, uh your uh commentators just uh uh put on the whole program.
• 1:18:11
  SPEAKER_08: I think uh the fact that uh Governor Reagan was not here uh will uh will hurt him uh in Iowa and perhaps elsewhere in the country.
• 1:18:19
  SPEAKER_08: We're happy, uh any opportunity we have to appear on the same platform with any of our competitors.
• 1:18:24
  SPEAKER_26: We were focused on was not so much what Reagan's strategy or lack of strategy was.
• 1:18:29
  SPEAKER_26: After all, he was a hugely prohibitive favorite.
• 1:18:32
  SPEAKER_26: Uh he was bigger than life, uh, the 800-pound gorilla in the race.
• 1:18:36
  SPEAKER_26: We were focused more on what we were trying to do than what Reagan was or was not doing.
• 1:18:42
  SPEAKER_26: But I do uh but it it is true that we noticed that he was not as uh not as uh detailed as as we were in in uh Iowa, and probab but but we also felt he probably didn't have to be, as it turned out he did have to be.
• 1:18:58
  SPEAKER_37: Uh and we beat him.
• 1:19:00
  SPEAKER_37: I know there's some risk in saying this, but now the American people understand it.
• 1:19:05
  SPEAKER_37: We have got to strengthen rather than weaken the intelligence community of this country.
• 1:19:13
  SPEAKER_16: I was in Iowa in 1980, covering it when I was on radio.
• 1:19:18
  SPEAKER_16: And uh I was at that downtown hotel where Bush was staying.
• 1:19:21
  SPEAKER_16: Bush grew out on the elevator and the day that morning, and he said, I've got the big Mo.
• 1:19:28
  SPEAKER_16: The big momentum.
• 1:19:34
  SPEAKER_45: Nearly half of Iowa's Republican caucuses are held in private homes.
• 1:19:39
  SPEAKER_45: This one a mile and a half east of Elkhart, in Nancy Huxford's kitchen.
• 1:19:43
  SPEAKER_46: I kind of like Bill Reagan, but I think he's too old.
• 1:19:47
  SPEAKER_34: As the 1980 caucus vote began compiling at the Republican Party of Iowa headquarters, Bush took an early lead and declared victory.
• 1:19:56
  SPEAKER_02: The impossible dream, the asterisk on all these polls just four months ago.
• 1:20:03
  SPEAKER_45: Bush, 110.
• 1:20:05
  SPEAKER_45: Reagan, 38.
• 1:20:07
  SPEAKER_45: So George Bush is clearly the favorite here among these Republicans.
• 1:20:11
  SPEAKER_34: Reagan was in California, downplain, Iowa.
• 1:20:17
  SPEAKER_25: Uh necessarily represent.
• 1:20:19
  SPEAKER_16: I talked to my friend Sears, who was an old friend of mine from Nixon days.
• 1:20:23
  SPEAKER_16: I said, John, what happened?
• 1:20:25
  SPEAKER_16: He said, We got as many votes as we expected.
• 1:20:27
  SPEAKER_16: He just got more than we did.
• 1:20:29
  SPEAKER_18: One of the interesting things the Reagan people will tell you about 1980 is they think they got cheated in Iowa.
• 1:20:35
  SPEAKER_34: The Republican Party of Iowa reporting system was built on brand new computer technology designed to compile data phoned in from urban and rural corners of Iowa.
• 1:20:46
  SPEAKER_43: We did it to an effort to give a fast response to the many people who wanted to know what happened in 2,531 different meetings or what the strength was.
• 1:20:56
  SPEAKER_43: And uh a day or two later wasn't fast enough, and this was the fastest way we could come up with.
• 1:21:02
  SPEAKER_34: Despite the best intentions of reliability, the system ultimately failed on caucus night.
• 1:21:14
  SPEAKER_18: Bush took out an early lead just as the that late vote started to come in, the computers crashed.
• 1:21:21
  SPEAKER_18: And no real hope of getting them started again.
• 1:21:24
  SPEAKER_18: And reporters are, I gotta write a lead.
• 1:21:27
  SPEAKER_18: Bush won.
• 1:21:28
  SPEAKER_07: Without them stopping the counting in some of these rural counties in 1980, we wouldn't have had the president.
• 1:21:37
  SPEAKER_07: W would likely not have been president.
• 1:21:39
  SPEAKER_18: Think how different American history would be had Reagan won the Iowa caucuses in 1980.
• 1:21:44
  SPEAKER_18: I mean, the whole Bush dynasty never would have started.
• 1:21:49
  SPEAKER_34: Reagan had overplayed his hand, and he would later write the Iowa caucuses were among the darkest days of the entire 1980 campaign.
• 1:21:57
  SPEAKER_34: He would fire campaign manager John Sears only days later and triumph in New Hampshire.
• 1:22:14
  SPEAKER_34: James Baker, a campaign opponent, would become President Reagan's chief of staff.
• 1:22:24
  SPEAKER_34: Their challenger in four years would begin his quest for the presidency in the same place.
• 1:22:40
  SPEAKER_39: You're up again.
• 1:22:42
  SPEAKER_39: And um it's a Republican year.
• 1:22:45
  SPEAKER_39: Were you surprised uh that you were gonna be in the majority?
• 1:22:49
  SPEAKER_15: Absolutely.
• 1:22:49
  SPEAKER_15: I could see a chance to get there, but I didn't think it would happen in 1980.
• 1:22:54
  SPEAKER_15: 1980 was the reverse of last November.
• 1:22:57
  SPEAKER_15: We won every close race.
• 1:23:01
  SPEAKER_15: Uh in November last night, we lost every close race.
• 1:23:03
  SPEAKER_39: Which also meant that you you brought in some fairly weak.
• 1:23:07
  SPEAKER_15: Oh God.
• 1:23:07
  SPEAKER_15: I mean you talk about you talk about Roger Jepsen and and Admiral Denton and Paula Hawkins.
• 1:23:13
  SPEAKER_15: Oh God.
• 1:23:16
  SPEAKER_15: One term wonders.
• 1:23:20
  SPEAKER_15: That's the same that's the same year.
• 1:23:22
  SPEAKER_15: I think that I think that Steve Sims came in.
• 1:23:25
  SPEAKER_15: Yes.
• 1:23:25
  SPEAKER_15: Beat Frank Church.
• 1:23:27
  SPEAKER_15: Yeah.
• 1:23:27
  SPEAKER_15: But he you know Sims was amazing.
• 1:23:29
  SPEAKER_39: Well, and and Larry Pressworth.
• 1:23:31
  unknown: Didn't he?
• 1:23:32
  SPEAKER_15: Yes, he beat George McGovern.
• 1:23:35
  SPEAKER_15: No, Jim Abner.
• 1:23:36
  SPEAKER_15: Oh, that's right.
• 1:23:37
  SPEAKER_15: Another weak one.
• 1:23:37
  SPEAKER_15: I mean, but Sims.
• 1:23:40
  SPEAKER_15: He was a funny guy.
• 1:23:42
  SPEAKER_15: Idaho only has two congressmen, and Idaho's is really divided North and South.
• 1:23:46
  SPEAKER_15: The North is Anaconda mining union tough.
• 1:23:51
  SPEAKER_15: The South is Mormon, boisey, gentle, conservative.
• 1:23:55
  SPEAKER_15: But anybody who knows those hard rock union miners, these are hardly liberal people.
• 1:24:01
  SPEAKER_15: They may vote Democrat, but you mean are they liberal?
• 1:24:04
  SPEAKER_15: The answer is no.
• 1:24:05
  SPEAKER_15: Sims is a congressman from that district, from this tough district.
• 1:24:09
  SPEAKER_15: And in 1980, he's running against church.
• 1:24:12
  SPEAKER_15: And you know, one of the one of the issues in Idaho is always guns.
• 1:24:17
  SPEAKER_15: And one of Steve's slogans was America was made great by three boxes.
• 1:24:22
  SPEAKER_15: The jury box, the ballot box, and the cartridge box.
• 1:24:27
  SPEAKER_15: And he says, and if the first two fail, you should use the third.
• 1:24:32
  SPEAKER_15: Idaho loved it.
• 1:24:38
  SPEAKER_15: And Sims won in 86, and I remember what happened.
• 1:24:42
  SPEAKER_15: It's another we're in session until maybe mid-October, 86.
• 1:24:45
  SPEAKER_15: We got all these weak candidates that are there.
• 1:24:48
  SPEAKER_15: Steve Sims goes home at Labor Day and he says to Bob, You need me send a plane.
• 1:24:52
  SPEAKER_15: I'm going home to campaign.
• 1:24:54
  SPEAKER_15: He got re-elected.
• 1:24:56
  SPEAKER_28: Well, one name that has not been mentioned tonight.
• 1:24:59
  SPEAKER_28: The name of the uh last Republican who ran for president, and one.
• 1:25:03
  SPEAKER_28: Richard Nixon.
• 1:25:05
  SPEAKER_28: Now it has been mentioned.
• 1:25:06
  SPEAKER_28: And he has reacted to uh the events tonight, and we have some video of the former president.
• 1:26:02
  SPEAKER_19: No president, President Eisenhower.
• 1:26:14
  SPEAKER_28: And uh that has not happened since uh the first two years of the Eisenhower uh first term back in uh 1952 to 54.
• 1:26:23
  SPEAKER_39: That night.
• 1:26:24
  SPEAKER_39: I guess I mean it dawns on all of you, I mean, beginning with Howard Baker, that you're gonna be in the majority.
• 1:26:30
  SPEAKER_39: Um you were surprised?
• 1:26:33
  SPEAKER_39: Oh gosh, yes.
• 1:26:35
  SPEAKER_15: It just you know, you could start to see some numbers, and you thought, you know, we we could get pretty close to majority, but we I don't think any of us thought, and all of us professional politicians, that we could win every close race.
• 1:26:48
  SPEAKER_15: And we did.
• 1:26:50
  SPEAKER_39: What was your relationship like with President Carter?
• 1:26:54
  SPEAKER_39: Uh Carter, it was it was okay.
• 1:26:56
  SPEAKER_27: I mean, we didn't really have much contact.
• 1:27:01
  SPEAKER_27: You know, I've been to the White House and I don't think he ever said an any bad I don't you know.
• 1:27:12
  SPEAKER_27: I think I referred to him once as Southern Fried McGovern, but other than that, I was very nice.
• 1:27:19
  SPEAKER_39: But did he wobby you on the Panama Canal Freddie?
• 1:27:23
  SPEAKER_27: I don't think so because he knew I was pretty close to Laxol on the issue.
• 1:27:29
  SPEAKER_27: And I told Howard Baker said, Howard, I just you know, I you may be doing the right thing, but I did.
• 1:27:39
  SPEAKER_27: And he probably did do the right thing, you know.
• 1:27:42
  SPEAKER_27: That's one of those boji.
• 1:27:47
  SPEAKER_27: Probably wasn't that important look back on it.
• 1:27:50
  SPEAKER_39: What do you think were Carter's strengths and uh and weaknesses?
• 1:27:54
  SPEAKER_39: It it you know it I mean obviously Kim David a code is something that he you know helped me remember.
• 1:28:00
  SPEAKER_39: Yeah.
• 1:28:02
  SPEAKER_27: Yeah, I remember being at the White House when they shook hands and all of the Israelis.
• 1:28:14
  SPEAKER_27: And that was a great day.
• 1:28:15
  SPEAKER_27: I mean everybody was upbeat about boy we're finally gonna get it done in the Mideast.
• 1:28:25
  SPEAKER_27: Worked hard at it, didn't have that much experience.
• 1:28:29
  SPEAKER_27: Uh see who do you have as Secretary of State?
• 1:28:31
  SPEAKER_27: Was it Warren Christopher?
• 1:28:33
  SPEAKER_39: No, that would be uh no, we had Cy Vance, original Cy Vance, then he quit.
• 1:28:38
  SPEAKER_39: And and he quit and Ed Muskie.
• 1:28:41
  SPEAKER_27: Yeah.
• 1:28:41
  SPEAKER_27: Well Vance was Ed Muskie's a great guy, but I don't I don't know about his qualification for.
• 1:28:48
  SPEAKER_27: But Vance was apparently top top quality.
• 1:28:53
  SPEAKER_27: But he quit over a principle.
• 1:28:55
  SPEAKER_39: Some something people don't do very often in this town.
• 1:28:58
  SPEAKER_27: Not in this town, no.
• 1:29:00
  SPEAKER_27: I want more principal and interest.
• 1:29:08
  SPEAKER_06: That's gotta be it.
• 1:29:12
  SPEAKER_45: That's gonna be must see you again because I have to go home pretty soon.
• 1:29:22
  SPEAKER_40: I won't see you.
• 1:29:23
  SPEAKER_40: I'll just double A Blue Moon.
• 1:29:25
  SPEAKER_45: You can see my house.
• 1:29:26
  SPEAKER_40: I hope so.
• 1:29:27
  SPEAKER_40: I'm gonna be the best.
• 1:29:29
  SPEAKER_05: I won't see you.
• 1:29:30
  SPEAKER_40: Okay, but I'll see you when I get back.
• 1:30:07
  SPEAKER_41: All three were emotional, but they weren't sad.
• 1:30:10
  SPEAKER_41: Every single one of them, including coming back to Georgia, is a happy experience for me, and I thank God for it.