Latest / Hurdle with Emily Abbate / Episode 61: Adam Ross & Michael Pollak, Co-Founders Heyday

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Episode 61: Adam Ross & Michael Pollak, Co-Founders Heyday · Hurdle with Emily Abbate

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: What is going on Hurdler's You are listening to episode
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: sixty one of Hurdle, a boat gust that talks to
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: everyone from entrepreneurs to CEOs and athletes about how they
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: got through tough times hurdles of sorts by leaning into wellness.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: Emily a body here. I am fresh back from Dundon, Colorado.
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: Let me tell you it might be one of the
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: most stunning places on the planet. I was out there
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: with Eddie Bauer. We were doing all the things from
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: hiking to mountain biking to fly fishing, and I just
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: want to report that I am now a skilled outdoorsman.
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: Today on the podcast, I'm gonna be chatting with Adam
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: Ross and Michael Pollock. They are the co founders of Heyday.
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: And if you don't know what Heyday is, well, here
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: in for a treat and maybe some clearer skin.
• 0:51
  Speaker 2: We'll get to that in just a second.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: First, a quick shout out to my sponsor, Athletic Greens
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  Speaker 1: com slash hurdle again, that's Athleticgreens dot Com slash hurdle
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: to get yours today. All right, now, let's talk about
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: these two guys. I have a confession. First, I didn't
• 1:31
  Speaker 1: know a thing about skincare, and so give or take
• 1:35
  Speaker 1: age thirty.
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: I know, I'm a little embarrassed in at that. I
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: just was never the kind of person who thought.
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: That pricey facials and all of these products were worth
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: the money. But Michael and Adam made Heyday, which is
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: a more affordable home for quick skincare treatments from facials
• 1:51
  Speaker 1: to chemical PILs, you name it for people like me.
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: They were hoping to pretty much take the facial out
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: of the spot to demystify all of the unknown about skincare.
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: Leading up to their first New York City location in
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: twenty fifteen, Ross hung up his business suits in a
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: hurdle moment of sorts, leaving behind a super lucrative job
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: in finance that just wasn't making him happy in his
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: personal life, and that's where we met Michael, and then
• 2:17
  Speaker 1: he realized they had an amazing chemistry till here today
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: and that they could build something great together, and well, the.
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: Rest is history.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: In today's episode, we have a blast chatting about everything
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: from the two essentials all movies must do for their
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: face to Pollock's biggest learning of starting a business from
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: scratch and fyi his sewing skills helped in the process.
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: Plus, Ross offers up a must.
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: Know diagram technique for being more productive throughout your day.
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: Trust me, this might just change everything you know that
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: Drell hurdlers at Emily a body at Hurdle podcast.
• 2:53
  Speaker 3: If you have a.
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: Hurdle moment of your own or just want to say hi,
• 2:56
  Speaker 1: my email it's Emily at hurdle dot us. And again,
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: let's let's share the podcast this week with a friend.
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: When you're listening, make sure to tag me tag at
• 3:05
  Speaker 1: Heyday Skincare. That's h e y Day Skincare, and let's
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: get the conversation going with that. Let's get to hurdling.
• 3:23
  Speaker 2: Today.
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: I'm sitting here with the co founders of Heyday. I've
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: got Adam Ross and Michael Pollock in the studio. Hey guys,
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: Hi morning, Thanks for coming in.
• 3:31
  Speaker 3: Of course, happy to be here.
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: Oh my god, I feel it's been a while since
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: I've done two people at the state, like a podcast
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: with three people total in the room, which is fun.
• 3:41
  Speaker 1: The last time I did this was with the two
• 3:43
  Speaker 1: ladies behind Sakara Life, Whitney and Danielle, and we had
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: a blast.
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: So I'm excited to be doing it with the two
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: of you. I'm also excited because skincare.
• 3:51
  Speaker 3: Like, because skincare, because skincare everybody.
• 3:54
  Speaker 1: I mean, we talk about health and fitness and wellness
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: and all of its aspects on Hurdle all the time.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: But I feel like skincare is something that a lot
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: of people constantly overlook For me myself, it wasn't something
• 4:08
  Speaker 1: I really took into drastic consideration until admittedly, like within
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: the last two years, and I'm in my thirties.
• 4:14
  Speaker 3: It's interesting people hit I think that it's either a
• 4:17
  Speaker 3: problem that you're dealing with, or it's sometime in your
• 4:21
  Speaker 3: like late twenties, early thirties, you wake up and you're like,
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: I'm supposed to pay attention to this thing. Yet there's
• 4:26
  Speaker 3: all this sort of world of health and wellness, and
• 4:28
  Speaker 3: skin is the largest organ in the body, and sort
• 4:31
  Speaker 3: of how we take care of ourselves shows up on
• 4:33
  Speaker 3: our skin, and yet it's sort of treated as this
• 4:35
  Speaker 3: very separate thing.
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: Totally separate thing. I mean, I'm going to start out
• 4:38
  Speaker 1: with the obvious. Here, your two guys, Adam, your backgrounds
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: in finance, so not exactly what I would think are
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: the guys that's going to start my skincare situation. So first,
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: first off, let's talk about what Heyday is, and then
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: let's talk about how we got to where we are today.
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: So first off, what's hey They give me the right down.
• 5:01
  Speaker 4: Sure, well we started and I guess actually coming up
• 5:04
  Speaker 4: to our four year anniversary June Verse twenty fifteen, I
• 5:08
  Speaker 4: think Heyday was the genesis for Heyday was. I think
• 5:12
  Speaker 4: when you look at the importance of skin health and
• 5:15
  Speaker 4: the fact that skin is the largest organ in the body,
• 5:17
  Speaker 4: there was no there was no way for clients to
• 5:21
  Speaker 4: engage with skin care, and everything comes down to these
• 5:23
  Speaker 4: friction points of time, cost, and convenience, And I think
• 5:26
  Speaker 4: for us it was important when you see people today
• 5:30
  Speaker 4: that want to be the best version of themselves, creating
• 5:34
  Speaker 4: the democratization or accessibility for somebody to engage in skin care,
• 5:37
  Speaker 4: and the fact that I think professional facials are such
• 5:40
  Speaker 4: a core pillar of ultimate skin health. And I think
• 5:43
  Speaker 4: for us or anyone else out there, when you hear
• 5:46
  Speaker 4: the word spa, you know soving air quotes, it connotes
• 5:49
  Speaker 4: this beauty, pampering, indulgence perception, and there's nothing wrong with that,
• 5:53
  Speaker 4: but I think for us, there needed to be a
• 5:55
  Speaker 4: fundamental repositioning of the facial because it's how you define
• 5:59
  Speaker 4: it broadly around sort of health and wellness or more
• 6:01
  Speaker 4: specifically self care. This is something that people think about
• 6:05
  Speaker 4: like their Equinox monthly memberships, like this is something that
• 6:08
  Speaker 4: I think the importance of looking and feeling great as
• 6:11
  Speaker 4: part of your overall mandate to yourself to be the
• 6:13
  Speaker 4: best version of yourself. We wanted to create the platform
• 6:17
  Speaker 4: for that to exist.
• 6:18
  Speaker 2: Got it?
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: So talk to me a little bit about where you
• 6:20
  Speaker 1: were then before heyday, because it's so not heyday.
• 6:25
  Speaker 4: What am I doing here?
• 6:27
  Speaker 2: What are you doing? How do you? First off, how
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: do you even get here?
• 6:31
  Speaker 4: How does a guy with a funny accent get to
• 6:33
  Speaker 4: New York City?
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: Of course?
• 6:35
  Speaker 4: I yeah, So I used to be investment banking and
• 6:37
  Speaker 4: focused specifically around mergers and acquisitions. I was sort of
• 6:42
  Speaker 4: within sort of a sector consumer products in retail, but
• 6:44
  Speaker 4: more specifically within that, beauty was one of my areas
• 6:48
  Speaker 4: of focus. So I did a lot of investment banking
• 6:50
  Speaker 4: transactions with the big bad guys of the industry, Revlon Avon,
• 6:55
  Speaker 4: you know, Laureal Gillette, so certainly sawed parts of the
• 6:59
  Speaker 4: skincare industry from that side of the business. But I
• 7:02
  Speaker 4: think when I'm also just out in my daily life,
• 7:04
  Speaker 4: and I sort of had this light bulb moment when
• 7:07
  Speaker 4: I was at brunch with some girlfriends who were just
• 7:10
  Speaker 4: all complaining about like how difficult it was to look
• 7:12
  Speaker 4: after their skin. So there's a disconnect here between how
• 7:16
  Speaker 4: the market's structure and what customers actually want. So then
• 7:21
  Speaker 4: the work began.
• 7:22
  Speaker 1: Then I was like, man, I should probably stop banking
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: and start figuring out this bigger problem that we have here.
• 7:28
  Speaker 4: Kind of but we probably get into it. But I
• 7:30
  Speaker 4: think banking for me incredibly fantastic platform on growth and
• 7:34
  Speaker 4: development and how you think about businesses more broadly. But
• 7:37
  Speaker 4: you know, you get to the stage where that's either
• 7:40
  Speaker 4: something you want to do or for me, it was
• 7:41
  Speaker 4: more just the chance to sit on the other side
• 7:43
  Speaker 4: of the table and be involved in in I think,
• 7:46
  Speaker 4: building a building, a brand that customers delight and engage
• 7:50
  Speaker 4: with totally.
• 7:51
  Speaker 2: And then what about you, Where were you hanging out?
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: I was an architecture and interiors before this, and then
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: I studied hospitality, so I kind of had this weird
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: mixed bag of a resume, but it was always around
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: I love experiences. I love sort of curating creating experiences
• 8:06
  Speaker 3: for people, and so when I sort of met Adam
• 8:10
  Speaker 3: and he had the idea on paper for this, I
• 8:12
  Speaker 3: immediately saw it and I sort of connected it to
• 8:14
  Speaker 3: my own skincare story. But the you know, being in
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: that sort of client work or consulting work, there was
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: always a conclusion there, and I think to the point
• 8:22
  Speaker 3: of hurdles if there's hurdles in a project, like you're
• 8:24
  Speaker 3: just like, okay, deadline's coming up. When we were done
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: with that, it's over and you're done. And there was
• 8:29
  Speaker 3: a lot of satisfaction with learning through doing a lot
• 8:32
  Speaker 3: and touching a lot of businesses, but you always handed
• 8:34
  Speaker 3: the baby over for someone else to raise. And I
• 8:36
  Speaker 3: always knew I loved painting the big picture something as
• 8:40
  Speaker 3: well as obsessing over the little details and to be
• 8:42
  Speaker 3: able to build something from scratches when you really get
• 8:44
  Speaker 3: to do that. In terms of my own skincare story
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: with it, I you know, struggled with acne in high
• 8:51
  Speaker 3: school as many teenagers do, and took acutane and you know,
• 8:54
  Speaker 3: went through all the dermatologists stuff, which is sort of
• 8:56
  Speaker 3: like a hammer to the you know, to the to
• 9:00
  Speaker 3: the face. And no one had ever brought out the
• 9:03
  Speaker 3: idea of seeing an esthetician. I didn't even know what
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: that was, and I think broadly speaking, in this country,
• 9:07
  Speaker 3: that's not a thing, So, you know, I see the
• 9:10
  Speaker 3: opportunity in Heyday is to create a platform for that too,
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: to let people know there's actually somebody who goes to
• 9:15
  Speaker 3: school for taking care of skin every day, not treating
• 9:18
  Speaker 3: it all like a disease, not treating it like a
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: you know, something to shop your way through, but actually
• 9:23
  Speaker 3: teaching you how to take care of it and finding
• 9:24
  Speaker 3: an expert. I think a lot of hurdles can be
• 9:26
  Speaker 3: crossed by finding the right expertise. And for us for Heyday,
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: it's connecting clients who we're looking for that advice with
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: a human who's trained to help you do that.
• 9:35
  Speaker 1: I guess the next obvious question then is then how
• 9:37
  Speaker 1: do you two cross Because you're an architect, you're in banking.
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: How did the two of you meet?
• 9:43
  Speaker 3: We actually, the consulting from I worked for has like
• 9:48
  Speaker 3: a deep connection with Aussie's and Kiwis, and so I
• 9:52
  Speaker 3: always knew of Adham. I think he knew of me,
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: and we sort of were like just in overlapping circles.
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: And I actually met him when I was at my
• 10:00
  Speaker 3: last firm, and you know, he was we were sitting
• 10:04
  Speaker 3: across from the table and he was pitching the idea
• 10:06
  Speaker 3: and I immediately kind of saw it, and I remember
• 10:10
  Speaker 3: I was kind of like, you should find someone internally,
• 10:12
  Speaker 3: like I can pitch you as the agency how to
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: do this, but you should find someone internally to like
• 10:15
  Speaker 3: help help with the parts of the business that you're
• 10:17
  Speaker 3: that you're looking for, and was not looking to pitch myself.
• 10:21
  Speaker 3: But then it's sort of it happened.
• 10:23
  Speaker 2: It happened.
• 10:24
  Speaker 4: I sort of heard through the grapevine. You weren't entirely happy.
• 10:27
  Speaker 4: So we schedule the mix mating outside of the office,
• 10:30
  Speaker 4: and here.
• 10:32
  Speaker 3: We are, here, we are, here, we are.
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: It's interesting.
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: I mean, I feel as though when you're thinking about
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: the people that you want to do business with. It's
• 10:39
  Speaker 1: kind of like the person that you think about spending
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: your life with, and you think about what qualities this
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: person's going to have that would make them your ideal
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: partner when you when you look at him today, do
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: you feel like he has all of those qualities that
• 10:53
  Speaker 1: you were looking for and someone to create this business
• 10:55
  Speaker 1: with from the ground up.
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: I'm waiting for the dough. I'd look at him.
• 11:00
  Speaker 4: No, I mean, I mean yes. I mean I think
• 11:04
  Speaker 4: it's very difficult today to start a business on your own.
• 11:07
  Speaker 4: You need a ying to your yang. Michael's experience, I
• 11:11
  Speaker 4: think around sort of architecture and hospitality has just been
• 11:16
  Speaker 4: incredibly helpful in terms of sort of defining the in
• 11:18
  Speaker 4: store experience and the hospitality touch points and what we
• 11:21
  Speaker 4: want clients to experience every time they go through the doors.
• 11:25
  Speaker 4: I mean, for me, I'm much more around sort of
• 11:27
  Speaker 4: like the strategy to finance the operations. So I think
• 11:32
  Speaker 4: it's just great. I think advice for anyone that's actually
• 11:34
  Speaker 4: looking to start a business is find somebody that actually
• 11:36
  Speaker 4: has the skill sets and attributes that you don't have,
• 11:40
  Speaker 4: and you just get to a place where one plus
• 11:41
  Speaker 4: one equals more than two. And it's sort of interesting
• 11:44
  Speaker 4: because even last week and as interesting as we sort
• 11:48
  Speaker 4: of onboard new people to the company, I get excited.
• 11:51
  Speaker 4: I talk faster, I sort of get frothy at the
• 11:53
  Speaker 4: mouth when I've got these ideas and sort of strategic
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: insights about the business, and new people sort of look
• 11:58
  Speaker 4: at me like I've got two heads, and Michael's like,
• 12:01
  Speaker 4: I know where you're going with that. Leave it with me.
• 12:03
  Speaker 4: You can package it up and execute it. So you
• 12:05
  Speaker 4: just want somebody that can that can support you, and
• 12:09
  Speaker 4: you sort of get to the stage now where you
• 12:11
  Speaker 4: can kind of almost finish eah other's sentences.
• 12:14
  Speaker 3: And that was advice I think I got that stuck
• 12:16
  Speaker 3: with me. At a consulting from that I left, the
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: CEO said I know you're going to start something someday.
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: Just I want you to go back to your desk
• 12:22
  Speaker 3: and make a list of the top three skills that
• 12:24
  Speaker 3: you either don't have or don't care to learn, or
• 12:26
  Speaker 3: don't want to better yourself in because someone else can
• 12:29
  Speaker 3: do it better, and just make sure that in a
• 12:30
  Speaker 3: co founder, whether it's a friend or something a little
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: bit more kind of arranged, that you find that because
• 12:35
  Speaker 3: I think often people do make sometimes the mistake of
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: going to a business with a friend and then you realize, hey,
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: we have all of exact same skills and we're kind
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: of we're gapped in some way.
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: I mean, just that note about your strength as a whole.
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: I think a lot of the time you go down
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: a certain path, and to go down that path, there
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: are things or skills that are considered to be really
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: great assets, and you might get to a point where
• 12:57
  Speaker 1: you realize, like, Okay, for example, I'm a writer and
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: an edit in my in my every day, I'm also
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: a podcaster, and I do all these things. But I
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: have come to an understanding that I don't love editing
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: as much as I love writing, like I love putting
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: things to paper. And so for me, when I realized
• 13:14
  Speaker 1: that I didn't enjoy editing as much as I enjoyed writing,
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: I kind of had a moment where I was like, shoot,
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: am I doing something wrong? Should I be reevaluating? Should
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: I be working on this editing thing? More so, I'm
• 13:23
  Speaker 1: so I'm better or doing it differently or what the
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: case is. But the reality is is that it's okay,
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: Like it's okay to pivot, it's okay to learn, it's
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: okay to reformulate your strategy.
• 13:32
  Speaker 3: And and just to delegate that to somebody.
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: Exactly well, I mean that's a whole other different conversation,
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: don't you think, Yes, the whole idea of delegating things
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: that you don't love to do yourself. And also because
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: if you don't love to do them, then you're probably
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: not going to do them super well, which means that
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: someone else could like it and do it a lot.
• 13:48
  Speaker 2: Better than you.
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, or I think I think for me personally, and
• 13:52
  Speaker 3: this is this has definitely been a hurdle. Is I
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: think a lot of a lot of entrepreneurs are people who, again,
• 13:58
  Speaker 3: you see everything, you see the big picture, you want
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: to have your hand in, you know, all the pies
• 14:02
  Speaker 3: or fingers and all the pies. And there's a point
• 14:06
  Speaker 3: where that is a really valuable skill, and there's a
• 14:09
  Speaker 3: point of a company where you can't be an individual
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: contributor and to fulfill the vision that you have, you
• 14:15
  Speaker 3: have to empower a team to do that, and that
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: means giving up some of the work, giving up some
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: of the control, and that is a really tough, tough
• 14:22
  Speaker 3: hurdle to get through and I mean that's certainly one
• 14:25
  Speaker 3: of my own, you know, personal things I've worked through
• 14:27
  Speaker 3: and seen and been able to reflect on through heyday
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: is how do I continue to do that, to focus
• 14:32
  Speaker 3: on the things that I think I uniquely can do
• 14:34
  Speaker 3: for the company and the things that even if I
• 14:36
  Speaker 3: love to do, I need to let someone else kind
• 14:38
  Speaker 3: of kind of pick that up and run with it.
• 14:40
  Speaker 4: There's almost an extra layer to that though, because even
• 14:43
  Speaker 4: if you are the best person to be doing something
• 14:46
  Speaker 4: also doesn't necessarily mean that you should be doing it
• 14:48
  Speaker 4: exactly because you've got you've got to have this ruthless
• 14:51
  Speaker 4: prioritization in terms of where is your role amplified in
• 14:56
  Speaker 4: a way that does the right thing by you know, yourself,
• 14:59
  Speaker 4: your team and the Bug business, and that changes a
• 15:01
  Speaker 4: different sort of chapters within the company. But I think
• 15:03
  Speaker 4: that's sort of interesting because when we look at the
• 15:06
  Speaker 4: stage of where we almost define the business today, we're
• 15:10
  Speaker 4: in that sort of teen adolescent phase, so so much
• 15:14
  Speaker 4: is changing. It's sort of crazy, and you know, you
• 15:16
  Speaker 4: can't even have a point of view on something one
• 15:18
  Speaker 4: week and then you find yourself a month later doing
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: a fundamental one to eighty turn on something where with
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: new information that comes to light, it's like, well, now
• 15:26
  Speaker 4: we're thinking about it this way.
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: I know, it's like that sentence, like well, this is
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: how it's always been done. They're like, noreneurs entrepreneurs are
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: not about that sentence. They're like, no, we're about to
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: change it completely. And I mean again, that plays into
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: the whole background of Heyday, right, because when you went
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: into this, you were thinking, Okay, well, spas skincare it's
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: always been something that's been at such an insane price point.
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: I mean, it's a reason why so many people don't
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: even think twice about taking the opportunity to do something
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: for their skin or nevertheless other body work. And that
• 15:58
  Speaker 1: was a big pillar behind what you guys wanted to
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: do p day.
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I think, and it guides so many decisions that
• 16:03
  Speaker 4: we make today. And I think that's what's that's what's
• 16:06
  Speaker 4: so fun and energizing about what we're doing. It's where
• 16:09
  Speaker 4: are a few things we should be doing that rightly
• 16:10
  Speaker 4: anchoring industry conventions and where are a few things that
• 16:13
  Speaker 4: we want to fundamentally break away and do things so
• 16:16
  Speaker 4: so differently. And I think to our mind, we think,
• 16:19
  Speaker 4: you know, Historically the SPA industry, it's it's been very
• 16:24
  Speaker 4: sort of mom and pop in how it's operated. It's
• 16:25
  Speaker 4: been very fragmented. It's increasingly targeting this demographic that has
• 16:30
  Speaker 4: time and money and then sort of increasingly older. And
• 16:33
  Speaker 4: I think for us, there was this big white space
• 16:36
  Speaker 4: opportunity of clients today that I mean, they want to
• 16:41
  Speaker 4: learn more about skincare, and there's a proliferation of products,
• 16:44
  Speaker 4: there's contradictory advice, it's an unregulated market by the FDA, Like,
• 16:48
  Speaker 4: how do we bring this together? So I think what's
• 16:50
  Speaker 4: also interesting about our business is we're not just looking
• 16:54
  Speaker 4: at it from a client perspective, where we're creating this
• 16:56
  Speaker 4: sort of marketplace where we're matching supply and demand and
• 17:00
  Speaker 4: something to Michael's earlier points, what's interesting about We call
• 17:04
  Speaker 4: them skin therapists sort of the industry term for estheticians.
• 17:07
  Speaker 4: But there's such a i mean reasonably unknown but certainly
• 17:11
  Speaker 4: underappreciated employment class across the US. I mean there's around
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: like three hundred and fifty thousand qualified estheticians.
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: Wow, and you've.
• 17:19
  Speaker 4: Got millions of people that are just so confused in
• 17:21
  Speaker 4: this industry that is so large. It's so generic, it's
• 17:23
  Speaker 4: growing and there's no trusted source for skincare. There's no
• 17:28
  Speaker 4: go to, there's no sort of expert that's around, and
• 17:32
  Speaker 4: people have got their own like home remedies or recommendations
• 17:35
  Speaker 4: or this influencer on YouTube, and skincare is one where
• 17:38
  Speaker 4: like everyone has a point of view, but you know, skincare,
• 17:42
  Speaker 4: skincare is people's number one daily routine and they just
• 17:45
  Speaker 4: don't feel in control of it. So and there's nothing
• 17:48
  Speaker 4: like having a human being, you know, totally.
• 17:50
  Speaker 3: Touch figuratively physically another human being when it comes to skincare.
• 17:54
  Speaker 3: I think it's the trust that's built there and that's
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: that's been I think that's the most been rewarding thing
• 17:58
  Speaker 3: to see come to life day to day follow up questions.
• 18:01
  Speaker 2: First of all, what's your starting price point?
• 18:04
  Speaker 3: Our thirty minute facial is sixty five dollars okay, and
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: our most popular is the fifty minute facial, which is
• 18:09
  Speaker 3: ninety five got it?
• 18:10
  Speaker 2: And you can do things like add on to those.
• 18:13
  Speaker 3: Experience feels or microdermibration and we got some other cool
• 18:16
  Speaker 3: stuff coming down the pike, coming down the pipe exactly.
• 18:19
  Speaker 3: But the whole idea is to simplify it. I think also,
• 18:22
  Speaker 3: if you look at the traditional spa landscape, I think
• 18:26
  Speaker 3: one of the aside from time and cost, one of
• 18:29
  Speaker 3: the other reasons people don't engage is it feels intimidating
• 18:31
  Speaker 3: or complicated. You open up that threefold brochure and there's
• 18:34
  Speaker 3: like eighteen things you don't know what you you don't
• 18:36
  Speaker 3: know what you don't know. Yet the expert behind the
• 18:38
  Speaker 3: chair knows everything in the sense that they're asking you
• 18:41
  Speaker 3: the questions, they're listening to your goals, they're seeing literally
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: what's on your skin and can help you come up
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: with a plan. So why why is the choice in
• 18:50
  Speaker 3: the customer's hands to make all those decisions as opposed
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: to simplifying it and having somebody make it for you.
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: And I definitely think that, yes, like the price point
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: is a lot more accessible than it would be to
• 18:59
  Speaker 1: go to some other like more Uh, what's the word
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: I'm trying to look for here, rarefy, Yeah, I mean
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: spa she experiences.
• 19:07
  Speaker 3: Not to say that I love those, I mean, yeah.
• 19:10
  Speaker 2: I mean you're very chic.
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: I thank you, But I still think that some people
• 19:13
  Speaker 1: even are like, oh my god, sixty five dollars for
• 19:16
  Speaker 1: thirty minutes like should I do this? And and I'm
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: sure you probably have people that come in that want
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: to do it like once or twice and hopefully learn
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: so many things that they're like, Okay, I got this.
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: That's a good point generally with wellness. I think it is.
• 19:29
  Speaker 3: It is something that is still coming to fruition, and
• 19:33
  Speaker 3: I think I in our team, you never forget that.
• 19:36
  Speaker 3: It's still a privilege to engage with that. It's a
• 19:38
  Speaker 3: privilege to be able to spend the time to think
• 19:40
  Speaker 3: about that, even things like you know, mental health and therapy.
• 19:42
  Speaker 3: It's a privilege to be able to engage with that.
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: I wish that stuff was more democratized, and I think
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: that as a brand, as we grow, we want to
• 19:49
  Speaker 3: figure out how to unpack that for others. If you
• 19:52
  Speaker 3: can't come in for facial for ninety five, you should
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: still be able to come online and get advice from
• 19:56
  Speaker 3: somebody if you have questions, if you're that teenager struggling
• 19:58
  Speaker 3: with acne, it's just you know, reading a great article
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: or connecting with an estetician on chat. Those are the
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: things we envision because I think that's how you start
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: to spread that. It is to spread that out a bit.
• 20:08
  Speaker 1: That idea is like so valuable again talking to the
• 20:11
  Speaker 1: bigger wellness industry as a whole, people talk about the
• 20:15
  Speaker 1: cost of things like equinoxygen memberships and other super ritzy
• 20:19
  Speaker 1: you know, offerings in the category, and then you do
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: have smaller opportunities which won't give you an eucalyptus towel,
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: but you'll have the opportunity to still work out something
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: like an Aptive membership. I think my mom just got
• 20:31
  Speaker 1: a year of Aptive for I want to say it
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: was under twenty dollars. I mean maybe that was. Maybe
• 20:35
  Speaker 1: that's a generous estimate. I've had Ethan on the show.
• 20:38
  Speaker 1: He's a good friend. I just it's amazing now that
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: there are people in the category, brands in the category
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: that are willing to kind of democratize wellness for the
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: consumer that can't afford.
• 20:52
  Speaker 3: It, and it should be right. Like if wellness to you,
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: if a component of wellness is a twelve dollars juice
• 20:57
  Speaker 3: and you can do that, that's great. If component of
• 20:59
  Speaker 3: wellness to you is like taking a deep breath and meditating,
• 21:03
  Speaker 3: like that's free.
• 21:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I love that.
• 21:05
  Speaker 3: That's taught in schools and like that that's I think
• 21:08
  Speaker 3: that's the where the wellness conversation needs to evolve to.
• 21:10
  Speaker 3: That's a whole other topic.
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: Well other topic.
• 21:12
  Speaker 1: I'd like to backtrack for just a second and go
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: back to what life was like for you, Adam, when
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: you were working a much more not even I would
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: say hectic, because I'm sure life is still pretty hectic
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: these days, but a completely different industry before coming into Hayden.
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: What did your self care of regimen even look like
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: at that time?
• 21:29
  Speaker 4: Wasn't good? I think that's that's that's the short of it.
• 21:33
  Speaker 4: I think for me, and again, banking was an incredible
• 21:36
  Speaker 4: stepping stone, but I think over time for me there
• 21:40
  Speaker 4: was this like internal conflict that was increasing because I
• 21:43
  Speaker 4: think you found I found myself acting in a manner
• 21:45
  Speaker 4: that was just more and more inconsistent or different from
• 21:49
  Speaker 4: my core beliefs. And I think that just relates to
• 21:52
  Speaker 4: how you spend your time, how you look after yourself.
• 21:54
  Speaker 4: So to some extent, it was almost this I think,
• 21:57
  Speaker 4: sort of death by a thousand carts and it gets
• 21:58
  Speaker 4: to a stage where it's sod it then like really
• 22:01
  Speaker 4: crystallizes the need for action, and for me that was
• 22:05
  Speaker 4: that was a new chapter. And you know, to your
• 22:06
  Speaker 4: point issue wasn't around not working hard, but I think
• 22:09
  Speaker 4: when you can do it on your schedule and you're
• 22:12
  Speaker 4: sort of directly impacting, you know, whether it's sort of
• 22:15
  Speaker 4: your contribution to something, you know, so of your net worth,
• 22:18
  Speaker 4: the employment you're creating for others. To my mind, it
• 22:21
  Speaker 4: was just a moment to be much more sort of
• 22:23
  Speaker 4: proactive and a defining moment to I think, just take
• 22:26
  Speaker 4: more control over my life. And that was both both
• 22:29
  Speaker 4: professional and personal.
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: Was there anything specific kind of in that time, Perre
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: that was like a red flag for you that you
• 22:35
  Speaker 1: were like, wow, I probably need to take a step back.
• 22:38
  Speaker 4: I had to actually over July fourth weekend where I'd
• 22:42
  Speaker 4: planned a treat with a few friends down in Mexico
• 22:44
  Speaker 4: and had to cancel it for you know, a fortune
• 22:47
  Speaker 4: one hundred emergency on something that had come up for
• 22:49
  Speaker 4: a board meeting, and you know, I called my friends
• 22:52
  Speaker 4: to sort of say, I can't make this, and the
• 22:55
  Speaker 4: response was yep, we knew that was going to happen.
• 22:58
  Speaker 4: And I think it was just that was just so's
• 23:00
  Speaker 4: a shitty moment for me, and I think when I
• 23:04
  Speaker 4: look back, I sort of measure it, you know, some
• 23:05
  Speaker 4: of the phone calls from friends and text like you're
• 23:08
  Speaker 4: getting fewer advice just because people knew you weren't going
• 23:12
  Speaker 4: to respond. And for me, it was just like this,
• 23:14
  Speaker 4: Oh my god, what am I doing? And I think
• 23:16
  Speaker 4: with banking, there's a lot of people in the industry
• 23:18
  Speaker 4: that aren't happy. And you manage it in your twenties
• 23:21
  Speaker 4: because they throw more money at you. That's fine. In
• 23:23
  Speaker 4: your twenties, you just get to a point where it's like,
• 23:26
  Speaker 4: this isn't about the money. This is about fulfillment. This
• 23:28
  Speaker 4: is about gratification. And the last thing I want to
• 23:31
  Speaker 4: be doing is have this truckload of money and not
• 23:35
  Speaker 4: the life that I want to be living.
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think you actually bring up a really
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: interesting point, which is that when you are spread so thin,
• 23:43
  Speaker 1: your relationships totally suffer. And so I'd be interested to
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: know how you kind of look at your relationships today,
• 23:50
  Speaker 1: because would you say that you're still the person at
• 23:52
  Speaker 1: people text us.
• 23:55
  Speaker 4: Getting I'm not much better today, but but I'm also
• 23:58
  Speaker 4: one of those people you know, introverted, And for me, it's,
• 24:02
  Speaker 4: you know, success is sort of my friendships. It's it's
• 24:05
  Speaker 4: fewer people, like deeper, better relationships, so I'm more likely
• 24:08
  Speaker 4: to have a dinner party with with twelve or sixteen
• 24:11
  Speaker 4: of my dearest friends than throwing a Shindi for two
• 24:14
  Speaker 4: hundred people that are more acquaintance, you know, than friends.
• 24:17
  Speaker 4: So I think, you know, you need to do a
• 24:19
  Speaker 4: bit of a friend's cleanse over over over the years.
• 24:22
  Speaker 4: But for me, it's I've done a much better job
• 24:25
  Speaker 4: of reconnecting with with people. And again, I think when
• 24:28
  Speaker 4: you're you're a little more in charge of your own destiny.
• 24:30
  Speaker 4: With with Heyday, you've got flexibility to sort of like
• 24:34
  Speaker 4: manage your schedule and have a better sense of what's
• 24:36
  Speaker 4: negotiable and what isn't.
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: Mikeel, have you done the friends cleans?
• 24:40
  Speaker 4: I was just thinking so hard the friends break you
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: have to.
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: I've had friends breakups. I think some of it.
• 24:46
  Speaker 3: Sure, I think that happens naturally over time as people
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: move in different directions and lives and you know, have
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: kids and move under different businesses. That definitely is a tough,
• 24:55
  Speaker 3: I think, a tough balance to strike and I think
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: I share that with Adam. I'm a little more introverted
• 24:59
  Speaker 3: in the sense that I, you know, I like connecting
• 25:01
  Speaker 3: more one on one and it's just about making time
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: for that quality time with your partner, with your friends.
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: I have a dog. Now. I think that those those moments,
• 25:11
  Speaker 3: I think are are good in the sense of you
• 25:14
  Speaker 3: never want to get to the place where you totally
• 25:16
  Speaker 3: take that for granted and it's and it's gone because
• 25:20
  Speaker 3: those things are tough to rebuild.
• 25:22
  Speaker 1: So obviously pretty hard to maintain relationships while building a
• 25:25
  Speaker 1: company from the ground up. So let's kind of then
• 25:28
  Speaker 1: now we're back in this era of heyday, you guys
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: have met, You're about to build something great. Do you
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: even understand at the beginning when you're talking to each other,
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: like what you're hoping to get out of this?
• 25:39
  Speaker 3: It's that's a great question. And I think when I
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: I've reflected a lot about this, and I think in
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: the beginning I jumped right in because I was like, yes,
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: this is the ultimate project to manage. It brings together
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: all the things that I'm excited to work on, and
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: we you know, put you as like finding the space,
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: the website, the brand and naming it and beginning to
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: build the initial team and the vision. And then it's
• 26:01
  Speaker 3: sort of you got to the opening day, and which
• 26:06
  Speaker 3: I forget that it was raining. Adam always remembers that
• 26:08
  Speaker 3: detail and whoring, and I think that was the moment
• 26:13
  Speaker 3: that really hit for me what we were about to
• 26:16
  Speaker 3: do when we met the first you know, twenty people
• 26:20
  Speaker 3: that took a chance on basically a PowerPoint deck for
• 26:23
  Speaker 3: their job, and seeing those humans walk into the space
• 26:27
  Speaker 3: who have now been you know, many many of them
• 26:29
  Speaker 3: with us for four years, was just incredible. That that
• 26:32
  Speaker 3: was a big turning point for me that this was
• 26:34
  Speaker 3: no longer consulting, This was no longer a project, but
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: there was a sense of responsibility that we were creating
• 26:41
  Speaker 3: a world for our team and our clients and that
• 26:43
  Speaker 3: was only going to continue to grow.
• 26:51
  Speaker 1: Taking a quick break from today's episode to give my sponsor,
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• 27:56
  Speaker 2: Let's get back to it.
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: How long were the two of you kind of working
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: behind the scenes on hey Day before it opened in
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: twenty fifteen.
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: It's close to eighteen months, yeah, and you were noodling
• 28:14
  Speaker 3: before that. I think between us it was about a year.
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: And did you know from the get god, I mean,
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: how many locations does Heyday have right now?
• 28:20
  Speaker 3: With seven? Now? If five in New York and two
• 28:22
  Speaker 3: in Los Angeles?
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: Okay, And what's like the I mean, where do we
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: want to go from here looks at each other wondering
• 28:30
  Speaker 1: what we should say into the world.
• 28:31
  Speaker 4: Beyond world domination. No, No, I think for us it's
• 28:37
  Speaker 4: I mean, there was such a large opportunity. I think
• 28:39
  Speaker 4: we don't know and we don't want to be arbitrary
• 28:42
  Speaker 4: in terms of like X number of doors in this
• 28:43
  Speaker 4: period of time. I think we've got something incredibly special.
• 28:48
  Speaker 4: There is this huge opportunity to democratize skin care and
• 28:52
  Speaker 4: create this platform for people that want to have great
• 28:54
  Speaker 4: skin and it's not female centric, it's skinny skin. So
• 28:58
  Speaker 4: I think for us, there's there's so many pockets of
• 29:00
  Speaker 4: growth and opportunities. We're excited. There's an incredibly long runway
• 29:04
  Speaker 4: in front of us, and we'll do it at the
• 29:07
  Speaker 4: right pace, I think, where we continue to execute with excellence.
• 29:11
  Speaker 4: And that doesn't mean that's not going to be hurtle
• 29:12
  Speaker 4: moments along the way, but you know, it's how you
• 29:16
  Speaker 4: You know, we're going to keep learning. When you keep growing,
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: we're going to keep making mistakes. But I think if
• 29:19
  Speaker 4: you just you're smart and how you sort of do
• 29:22
  Speaker 4: those that contributes to the right foundation you need. That's
• 29:25
  Speaker 4: going to again not just sort of scale for scale's sake,
• 29:28
  Speaker 4: but We've got something that's so experiential and so high
• 29:31
  Speaker 4: touch in this one on one and you know you're
• 29:33
  Speaker 4: vulnerable when you're getting a facial. It's a very personalized experience.
• 29:36
  Speaker 4: So I think for us, you know, that's that's the
• 29:39
  Speaker 4: challenge and the opportunity, and we'll do that at the
• 29:42
  Speaker 4: pace that makes sense. And I think again, does the
• 29:44
  Speaker 4: right thing for our team and our business.
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: Where are they in LA?
• 29:48
  Speaker 3: We are in Brentwood and Beverly and Beverly Boulevard and
• 29:52
  Speaker 3: Librea got it, and we're you know, we're going to
• 29:53
  Speaker 3: continue to expound in LA and continue in New York
• 29:56
  Speaker 3: and then obviously we've got our Ayes and some other cities.
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: But I mean, what underscore what Adam says. I think
• 30:02
  Speaker 3: when we started Heyday, we sort of agreed. We knew
• 30:04
  Speaker 3: this thing would scale if we did it right. But
• 30:07
  Speaker 3: we said, we're going to treat the first locations like
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: family restaurants. In the way that you're there, you learn,
• 30:12
  Speaker 3: you understand what happens every day. And I think that's
• 30:15
  Speaker 3: so so important, and you know, we are in that
• 30:18
  Speaker 3: sort of teenage phase and going back to like the acne,
• 30:21
  Speaker 3: there's some zits and like you have to work through it.
• 30:23
  Speaker 3: And I think this has been such the sort of
• 30:26
  Speaker 3: past year, and what's ahead of us is really about
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: almost re solidifying really important foundations so that you can
• 30:31
  Speaker 3: grow thoughtfully. I really believe that we since day one,
• 30:34
  Speaker 3: have delivered something really high quality for our team and
• 30:37
  Speaker 3: our clients, and that is what excites me. When that
• 30:39
  Speaker 3: feels really good, It's like you don't fear stepping on
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: the gas pedal in the right way.
• 30:43
  Speaker 1: During those first few months, when you're constantly in the space,
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: you're helping as much as you can, doing everything that
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: you can. You have the opportunity to learn a lot
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: during that time period, both as co founders, but then
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: also I'm sure, like about skincare, about things that you
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: never even knew before. So I'm interested to know during
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: that initial period, what were some of the biggest takeaways
• 31:04
  Speaker 1: that you guys had.
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: That's a great question. You know, I worked in hospitality,
• 31:09
  Speaker 3: so I understood, and that's why I was attracted to hospitality.
• 31:12
  Speaker 3: You're creating this experience, but it is probably the most complex,
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: one of the most complex businesses out there. It involves
• 31:17
  Speaker 3: you know, real estate of physical space, it involves people,
• 31:20
  Speaker 3: it involves service, it involves products, it's kind of got everything.
• 31:23
  Speaker 3: It's a complicated it's a complicated beast and how it
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: all comes together. So I think seeing that in motion
• 31:29
  Speaker 3: and just paying attention to all of it because the
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: littlest things can make or break somebody's day. Who's who's
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: you know, in whatever role that they're in. I think
• 31:37
  Speaker 3: in terms of learning, you we spent those first months
• 31:41
  Speaker 3: really listening to the team and the client because you're tweaking.
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: You know, you're tweaking. You need to tweak what you're
• 31:47
  Speaker 3: offering to make sure it fits the bill on both sides.
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: And so you know, we learn tons every day from
• 31:53
  Speaker 3: our team about skincare and you know, neither of us
• 31:55
  Speaker 3: are our skincare experts or licensed estheticians. But I think
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: you just need to listen to your team so that
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: you're solving the right problems. And that continues today when
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: they were not in the shops every single day. I
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: wish I was there more, and you know, need to
• 32:08
  Speaker 3: need to do that, but you just need to listen
• 32:10
  Speaker 3: to the folks are who are the experts, and you know,
• 32:13
  Speaker 3: continue to create the rate world so that they can
• 32:15
  Speaker 3: deliver for you know, for your stakeholders.
• 32:18
  Speaker 4: You know, I think one of the one of the
• 32:20
  Speaker 4: scariest things for us before we opened was this seems
• 32:25
  Speaker 4: so obvious, but it doesn't exist, So what are we missing?
• 32:30
  Speaker 4: And it was always interesting because when we're sort of
• 32:31
  Speaker 4: pitching the concept to investors to you know, sort of
• 32:34
  Speaker 4: raise some capital before we open our first units, and
• 32:38
  Speaker 4: these are sort of predominantly men in their fifties and
• 32:40
  Speaker 4: sixties that didn't even know what a facial was. And
• 32:43
  Speaker 4: you know, one of their questions is like, where are
• 32:45
  Speaker 4: you taking from the category? And we're like, we'll take
• 32:48
  Speaker 4: a bit from the category, but we're going to create
• 32:50
  Speaker 4: a new category. We're going to change behavior, we're going
• 32:52
  Speaker 4: to change habits, and that's a very difficult thing to do.
• 32:55
  Speaker 4: And I think for us that was also so interesting
• 32:58
  Speaker 4: because just you know, to Michael's point, I've spent far
• 33:01
  Speaker 4: too many hours in my career sitting around a boardroom
• 33:04
  Speaker 4: table arguing about what we think the client wants. We're
• 33:07
  Speaker 4: in this environment with heyday where we touch faces and
• 33:11
  Speaker 4: skin and the team every day, so you can actually
• 33:13
  Speaker 4: get feedback. So it's you know, how you learn, how
• 33:15
  Speaker 4: you grow, how you react to not just what they
• 33:18
  Speaker 4: want today, but what they want tomorrow has been incredibly
• 33:21
  Speaker 4: informative for how we think about the experience. And you know,
• 33:24
  Speaker 4: I think what was interesting for us, you know when
• 33:26
  Speaker 4: you look sort of a few months in and the
• 33:29
  Speaker 4: statistics still hold today. We have a little under one
• 33:32
  Speaker 4: third of clients that come to Heyday that have never
• 33:34
  Speaker 4: had a facial before. So we're bringing people into the category.
• 33:38
  Speaker 4: We have these, you know, sixty percent that check the
• 33:40
  Speaker 4: once a year box that I think is generally let
• 33:43
  Speaker 4: me get a facial as a treat to myself in
• 33:45
  Speaker 4: the city or where I'm on vacation, and they're jumping
• 33:48
  Speaker 4: into the sort of the Heyday ecosystem with those new
• 33:51
  Speaker 4: to the category. And I mean we've got around one
• 33:53
  Speaker 4: third of our clients that come monthly and then these
• 33:55
  Speaker 4: sort of cascading effects down So I think that was
• 33:59
  Speaker 4: one where it's like, how can we be And we're
• 34:01
  Speaker 4: like in the in the in the basement of the
• 34:03
  Speaker 4: first shop for the first twelve months, you know, we're
• 34:05
  Speaker 4: folding towels, we're speaking to clients, we're with the team,
• 34:08
  Speaker 4: and it's just it's how do you learn and how
• 34:11
  Speaker 4: do you how do you rethink or you know, evolve
• 34:15
  Speaker 4: the value proposition in a way that hasn't been done before.
• 34:18
  Speaker 4: And I think that's that's great because you've got this
• 34:20
  Speaker 4: huge white canvas in front of you. You know, it's
• 34:23
  Speaker 4: also you know, it's scary, so you go through this
• 34:26
  Speaker 4: whole emotional rollercoaster that goes from sort of like nerves
• 34:29
  Speaker 4: to excitement to petrify it. So it's like my every
• 34:33
  Speaker 4: day Yeah, you're never betting the ranch, Like what's the
• 34:36
  Speaker 4: worst that can happen? It doesn't work, and that in
• 34:38
  Speaker 4: itself is is a validated learning. So great, good to know.
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: Check it off, Let's do something different.
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: I love that.
• 34:44
  Speaker 1: I have to kind of home in on this one
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: detail that you were talking about, which was pitching Heyday
• 34:48
  Speaker 1: to investors, and I think it must have been really
• 34:50
  Speaker 1: funny because although it probably did work to your advantage
• 34:54
  Speaker 1: that you are two guys coming in to pitch a
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: skincare business to a bunch of other guys, I know,
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: the constant story for women that are going in to
• 35:01
  Speaker 1: pitch these like female centric things which could be viewed
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: as something similar to Heyday or whatever they're trying to
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: trying to do. I know, like the classic example is
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: with Spinks and she goes into talk to guys about
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: why this thing is so valuable for so many women,
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: like you need to understand their life, and the guys
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: are like, oh, let me talk to my wife about it.
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: Do you feel like you were at an advantage being
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: two guys going in to talk to some other guys
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: or like, how did that.
• 35:24
  Speaker 2: Go for you?
• 35:25
  Speaker 4: I'd say, if anything, it was a disadvantage because females
• 35:30
  Speaker 4: in that sort of twenty five to forty year old
• 35:32
  Speaker 4: demographic was that that was our prime client.
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: We had a lot of champions. I think at some
• 35:37
  Speaker 3: of the you know, the the investment investment firms you
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: were talking to, and it was a lot of times
• 35:42
  Speaker 3: the female associated it was like yep, this is a
• 35:44
  Speaker 3: big business, and the others be like I don't get it.
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: I don't get it. Let me talk to my wife.
• 35:49
  Speaker 4: I just what's a facial? What would somebody get at once?
• 35:52
  Speaker 4: And that doesn't make any sense to you, you know.
• 35:54
  Speaker 3: I think it's also you know, we're not uh, you know,
• 35:57
  Speaker 3: we're enabled by tech, but we're not a tech company too,
• 36:00
  Speaker 3: And I think that plays into it a little bit.
• 36:01
  Speaker 3: It's a brick and mortar business. It's you know, it's
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: human touch. And I used to always make this joke,
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: but it just so so true with investors, and like,
• 36:08
  Speaker 3: our business is pretty simple. If you get the people
• 36:10
  Speaker 3: thing right and you get the laundry thing right, you're
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: good to go. And so right, way to warm up
• 36:16
  Speaker 3: the boardroom. But it actually is really damn true, and
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: that's that's what our business is at the end of
• 36:21
  Speaker 3: the day.
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: I love that pivoting a little bit.
• 36:23
  Speaker 1: I love what you said Michael before you walked in
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: here talking about that this life of a hurdler and
• 36:29
  Speaker 1: like an event of running a race, and that we
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: don't all like a hurdler doesn't get on the track
• 36:34
  Speaker 1: and jump over one hurdler and that's it. And what
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: really happens in actuality is there's a bunch of hurdles
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: and they come in like really rapid succession, and it's
• 36:41
  Speaker 1: super stressful and like you just need to keep jumping
• 36:44
  Speaker 1: because you have no other option. When you look at
• 36:48
  Speaker 1: the creation of this business over the last four years,
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: are there any moments that truly stand out as like wow,
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: like I really thought I just got over this big
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: thing and then this other thing just completely blindsided me
• 37:01
  Speaker 1: when I wasn't expecting it.
• 37:02
  Speaker 3: I think similar to the hurdling analogy, where you know
• 37:06
  Speaker 3: it's just sort of quick and in rapid succession. I
• 37:08
  Speaker 3: think when you think of that too, there's a reason
• 37:09
  Speaker 3: why they run like four heats. It's not just one
• 37:12
  Speaker 3: and done and you can clip the top and still
• 37:15
  Speaker 3: win or still you know, still get a medal. I
• 37:18
  Speaker 3: think it's a series of a lot of things. I
• 37:20
  Speaker 3: don't think there was any sort of one moment that
• 37:22
  Speaker 3: was going to say like make or break or kill,
• 37:25
  Speaker 3: but it's just listening to a lot of those little
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: moments to make sure you know. I think. I think
• 37:30
  Speaker 3: for me, one of the personal qualities I've always had
• 37:32
  Speaker 3: is a lot of empathy and like really good antenna
• 37:35
  Speaker 3: for what's going on. And that doesn't mean I know
• 37:36
  Speaker 3: how to solve everything. And I think as that as
• 37:39
  Speaker 3: the company has grown, ironically you can almost feel a
• 37:44
  Speaker 3: little more lonely because you can't wrap your hands around
• 37:46
  Speaker 3: at all. You can't take care of absolutely everything, and
• 37:49
  Speaker 3: you need to delegate, a need to bring experts on
• 37:51
  Speaker 3: and for me, actually I think that is probably the
• 37:53
  Speaker 3: biggest hurdle is is flipping the mindset to you know,
• 37:57
  Speaker 3: how do you create an entire team that's solving the
• 37:59
  Speaker 3: right problems as opposed to taking absolutely everything on your shoulders. Ultimately,
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: the responsibility is ours to create the right structure to
• 38:05
  Speaker 3: create that world. But you need you need many more
• 38:09
  Speaker 3: people in there to be moving the whole vessel together.
• 38:12
  Speaker 3: It's like the you know, a rowing analogy. If we
• 38:14
  Speaker 3: make that, it's like you need everybody to be moving
• 38:16
  Speaker 3: in the right direction that we that we kind of
• 38:17
  Speaker 3: all share. And I think that, you know, as a
• 38:19
  Speaker 3: company grows, that is the job of the leaders is
• 38:22
  Speaker 3: to paint that picture and have everybody moving in that direction.
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: Do you guys remember what it was like to I mean,
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: I'm sure there were times before your first location opened
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: that you like went into the location and you were
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: just like standing there, like, what the hell are we doing?
• 38:34
  Speaker 4: I think, I think when we're both painting different parts
• 38:36
  Speaker 4: of the forehead hours before we.
• 38:39
  Speaker 3: The last time I you know, when I post college,
• 38:43
  Speaker 3: when I was working, and you know, my job wasn't
• 38:45
  Speaker 3: as stressful. I took I was really inspired by a
• 38:47
  Speaker 3: project runway and took sewing classes, not to make clothing.
• 38:50
  Speaker 3: I just thought it was a good skill to learn.
• 38:52
  Speaker 3: And the last time I really busted out the sewing
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: machine was to hem all the curtains at our first location,
• 38:57
  Speaker 3: so like forty eight hours beforehand, I think the there's
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: still the curtains there. I literally handed all of those gurdaens.
• 39:04
  Speaker 3: You know, there's trash everywhere, construction debris, and that was
• 39:06
  Speaker 3: one of those moments, I think. And then literally two
• 39:08
  Speaker 3: days later you had people in there getting facials and
• 39:11
  Speaker 3: it was you know, it's a little it's a little surreal.
• 39:13
  Speaker 3: And I think there's still moments where you know, you're
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: across the street and you know, you see the headay
• 39:20
  Speaker 3: the window and it's you know, dusk, and the lights
• 39:23
  Speaker 3: are on and people are in there moving around, and
• 39:24
  Speaker 3: that is a very it's still a very bizarre yet fulfilling,
• 39:28
  Speaker 3: fulfilling thing.
• 39:29
  Speaker 4: How do you feel, No, No, I sort of I
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: echo what what Michael says. I think one thing though,
• 39:35
  Speaker 4: that that's interesting about the hurdle moments along the way
• 39:38
  Speaker 4: is arguably the more successful you become as a company,
• 39:42
  Speaker 4: or you change the trajectory of your growth path, you're
• 39:46
  Speaker 4: always creating more hurdle moments for yourself in the future.
• 39:49
  Speaker 4: So I think whether a company is ultimately going to
• 39:51
  Speaker 4: be growing, you know, really upwards into the right, or
• 39:55
  Speaker 4: you've got other issues around sort of product, market fit
• 39:57
  Speaker 4: or whatever it is. You're always going to have hurdles.
• 40:00
  Speaker 4: And you know, somebody had said something to me recently
• 40:02
  Speaker 4: which was, you know, success is different problems. So I
• 40:04
  Speaker 4: think it's you know, these little moments are going to come.
• 40:07
  Speaker 4: I think it's how you train and work with the
• 40:09
  Speaker 4: team and the company knowing they're going to happen, Like, yes,
• 40:12
  Speaker 4: you can maybe do a better job at being more
• 40:14
  Speaker 4: agile or thinking about them in advance so you can
• 40:17
  Speaker 4: possibly mitigate them. Others others unforeseen. So it's like these
• 40:21
  Speaker 4: are going to happen, and this is going to be
• 40:23
  Speaker 4: part of our daily existence. How do we adapt to
• 40:26
  Speaker 4: the problems when they do occur.
• 40:29
  Speaker 1: I'd actually love to kind of buzz a little bit
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: on something that Michael said about being lonely. I think
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: that that's actually something that a lot of people building
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: a business feel very often because there's so much going
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: on and you have to be on constantly to handle
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: all of these different hurdles.
• 40:49
  Speaker 3: I think when you feel lonely, you have to remember,
• 40:53
  Speaker 3: especially as the company's grown, you know, we have about
• 40:55
  Speaker 3: three hundred people total now, people have joined this thing,
• 41:00
  Speaker 3: be for a multitude of reasons, but above all because
• 41:03
  Speaker 3: they believe in what you're doing. And the way that
• 41:07
  Speaker 3: I find to sort of refill when I feel lonely
• 41:09
  Speaker 3: is to just to touch that. Whether it's clients and
• 41:12
  Speaker 3: seeing the you know, the results and the feelings they
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: have from being really confident about the skin that they're in.
• 41:17
  Speaker 3: For team members who you know, whether they've just joined
• 41:20
  Speaker 3: us or have been there for a while and are fulfilled,
• 41:24
  Speaker 3: those are the moments that I think start to remind
• 41:27
  Speaker 3: you that you're not alone and that you've you've created
• 41:30
  Speaker 3: this this vessel and there's you know, there's people in it.
• 41:34
  Speaker 4: There's people, and I think there's also I think again,
• 41:37
  Speaker 4: just as you get bigger and we've now got like
• 41:39
  Speaker 4: I said, in the first twelve months, our office was
• 41:41
  Speaker 4: in the basement of our first shop, so you know,
• 41:44
  Speaker 4: communication was everyone was talking to everybody all the time.
• 41:47
  Speaker 4: I think now we've got our our support office, you know,
• 41:51
  Speaker 4: in Soho and its sort of separate from the shops.
• 41:54
  Speaker 4: It's it's it's lonely sometimes I think, to the extent
• 41:57
  Speaker 4: that there's so much work that we're also doing behind
• 41:59
  Speaker 4: this means to support the team and do what they
• 42:03
  Speaker 4: need to do, and sometimes if you're not communicating the
• 42:06
  Speaker 4: right way or they don't sort of see that, there's
• 42:10
  Speaker 4: sort of this perception not feeling heard or understood, and
• 42:14
  Speaker 4: it can create sort of moments where again there's sort
• 42:17
  Speaker 4: of this disconnect and it's certainly frustrating for me as
• 42:19
  Speaker 4: a leader because it's like the thought and the intention
• 42:21
  Speaker 4: of so much work is happening, and sometimes it's all
• 42:24
  Speaker 4: the right work you need to be doing. If you
• 42:25
  Speaker 4: don't communicate it, it can also just sort of fall
• 42:28
  Speaker 4: short of how you need to be thinking about it.
• 42:29
  Speaker 4: And I think for us, they're just sort of moments
• 42:32
  Speaker 4: that we're trying to navigate as we go through this
• 42:36
  Speaker 4: stage of the business, and I think how you communicate
• 42:38
  Speaker 4: and you don't need to sort of share everything every
• 42:40
  Speaker 4: moment of the day, but I think I sort of
• 42:42
  Speaker 4: struggled or felt sort of frustrated where it's like if
• 42:47
  Speaker 4: you knew what I knew, you wouldn't feel as frustrated
• 42:49
  Speaker 4: as you feel. And that's just that's one that's you know,
• 42:53
  Speaker 4: it's tough at times.
• 42:54
  Speaker 3: And we're actually going in through the process right now
• 42:56
  Speaker 3: of kind of redefining our company. Values. You know, four
• 42:59
  Speaker 3: years O, things think shift and it's important to revisit those.
• 43:03
  Speaker 3: And I think that Adam's touching exactly on the first
• 43:05
  Speaker 3: one that when we're all sitting around the table is
• 43:07
  Speaker 3: very clear and it's communicating with the why. I think
• 43:09
  Speaker 3: that is what we ask our team to do with clients.
• 43:11
  Speaker 3: That's when clients have questions about it. Why are you
• 43:13
  Speaker 3: putting this on my skin? What is it going to
• 43:14
  Speaker 3: do for me? It's like telling them really why it matters?
• 43:18
  Speaker 3: And that I think that is exactly the as a
• 43:21
  Speaker 3: company grows too, making sure you're communicating and letting people
• 43:24
  Speaker 3: know the reasons behind things that just it puts so
• 43:26
  Speaker 3: much I think unnecessary hurdles to rest.
• 43:29
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I mean just that buzzword again of values.
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: I think a lot of people go through there every
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: day and they're trying to figure things out and you
• 43:37
  Speaker 1: feel a little bit lost. But to take that time,
• 43:40
  Speaker 1: as you guys are doing, to step back and identify
• 43:43
  Speaker 1: what your values are, then it makes decision making abiding
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: by these values just so much easier, so much and
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: the people that you interact with and what you want
• 43:53
  Speaker 1: to get done, and you know, exactly a winding road
• 43:56
  Speaker 1: like that, I.
• 43:56
  Speaker 4: Mean the cool lit mistaste for a lot of these
• 43:58
  Speaker 4: as well. He is, when people don't act that way,
• 44:01
  Speaker 4: you can still you can bring it back behaviorally in
• 44:03
  Speaker 4: terms of, you know, are you acting in a manner
• 44:06
  Speaker 4: that's consistent without value. So I think as you're onboarding
• 44:09
  Speaker 4: people in and of itself, it's incredibly helpful because you
• 44:13
  Speaker 4: crystallize this upfront, and you also filter out those that
• 44:16
  Speaker 4: don't want to be part of the culture you're creating.
• 44:18
  Speaker 4: But I think it also it makes it more tangible
• 44:21
  Speaker 4: in terms of what that sort of code of conduct
• 44:24
  Speaker 4: looks like. And you can never sort of entirely define it.
• 44:26
  Speaker 4: You know, culture is one hundred different things, one hundred
• 44:28
  Speaker 4: different ways. But I think for us it's with the
• 44:32
  Speaker 4: team growing, we're sort of bicoastal now it's a sort
• 44:35
  Speaker 4: of a right inflection point to revisit that and always
• 44:39
  Speaker 4: sort of be the litmus test in terms of are
• 44:42
  Speaker 4: we acting the right way?
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: Obviously a lot has changed since you guys were working
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: in the basement of your first store. So what and
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: maybe just briefly, like, what does like a quote unquote
• 44:52
  Speaker 1: typical day look like for the two of you now,
• 44:55
  Speaker 1: my ideal day or the typical.
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: Day, maybe one day that you know, my deal day
• 45:01
  Speaker 3: is actually close. Yeah, let me go. I'll go with that.
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: I think.
• 45:05
  Speaker 3: I mean, the first thing I need to get back
• 45:07
  Speaker 3: to is more fitness. I used to I was a
• 45:09
  Speaker 3: fitness instructor. I taught spin classes for ten years and
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: used to actually and I used to break out on
• 45:15
  Speaker 3: the forehead a lot, and I couldn't figure it out.
• 45:16
  Speaker 3: And it wasn't until I got my first facial that
• 45:19
  Speaker 3: my esthetician, who was you know, on our on our
• 45:21
  Speaker 3: founding team, was like, I know why you're not washing
• 45:25
  Speaker 3: your skin properly after classes. So I'm gonna give you
• 45:27
  Speaker 3: this and we're going to solve it. And it was
• 45:28
  Speaker 3: totally fixed, which is awesome. That's what estheticians do see.
• 45:33
  Speaker 2: But like I hear that, and then I'm like, shouldn't
• 45:35
  Speaker 2: that be common sense?
• 45:36
  Speaker 4: Yes?
• 45:36
  Speaker 3: Exactly, No event, where do you get that advice? Would
• 45:38
  Speaker 3: I would I've gotten that at Sephora from a salesperson?
• 45:41
  Speaker 3: Would I have gotten that from my dermatologies and they'd
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: be like, here's a prescription and it's going to like
• 45:45
  Speaker 3: murder your forehead. So that's that's totally an example of
• 45:50
  Speaker 3: why we should exist. But to my to my day.
• 45:53
  Speaker 3: I would wake up, have a really good workout, and
• 45:55
  Speaker 3: I use this app called Future, where I sort of
• 45:57
  Speaker 3: have a trainer who puts workouts together for me. He
• 45:59
  Speaker 3: texted me this morning, I have not done my workouts
• 46:01
  Speaker 3: this week, so I'd get a great workout end, which
• 46:04
  Speaker 3: really energizes me for the day and starts things off right.
• 46:07
  Speaker 3: I think it would be a mix of being in
• 46:11
  Speaker 3: meetings and seeing great work come to fruition from the team,
• 46:15
  Speaker 3: and being there to just guide and add advice, but
• 46:18
  Speaker 3: seeing really awesome things come to life, which we're seeing
• 46:20
  Speaker 3: from our team, and it's just it's that is so rewarding.
• 46:24
  Speaker 3: And then it's some time in the shops to see
• 46:27
  Speaker 3: people to you know, spread the vision and the positivity
• 46:32
  Speaker 3: that I see for our company and what's forward. I
• 46:34
  Speaker 3: think that would be a great day. And then go home,
• 46:37
  Speaker 3: spend time with my partner the dog, and get a
• 46:40
  Speaker 3: really good night's sleep, which I don't get but I
• 46:44
  Speaker 3: would die for that.
• 46:45
  Speaker 2: I mean, amen, all right, What about you?
• 46:48
  Speaker 4: So I'm I'm an early riser and I generally wake
• 46:52
  Speaker 4: up coffee in hand. I'll spend sort of two or
• 46:54
  Speaker 4: three hours at home work.
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: How do you make that magic happen with the coffee
• 46:58
  Speaker 1: in your hand when you're in bed already, because like
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: if you could share that with me and the hurdlers.
• 47:02
  Speaker 4: There is a place that opens at seven am.
• 47:05
  Speaker 3: Actually to get out of that.
• 47:06
  Speaker 4: For it, I'm out of bed. I'm literally they're waiting
• 47:08
  Speaker 4: for the person to open in the morning.
• 47:10
  Speaker 2: I know you're a soho guy.
• 47:11
  Speaker 1: I don't want to spoil I don't want people to
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: stock you, but I kind of want to know what
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: your coffee.
• 47:15
  Speaker 3: Please just look for the guy with sweatpants.
• 47:18
  Speaker 2: That's a very generic absolute with jaggers.
• 47:24
  Speaker 4: No, I think it's it's sort of interesting because it's
• 47:26
  Speaker 4: I think, as I've done a better job of getting
• 47:28
  Speaker 4: the balance I need. When I sort of think about
• 47:30
  Speaker 4: my day or my week, of my month or anything,
• 47:32
  Speaker 4: I sort of think about it with three concentric circles,
• 47:35
  Speaker 4: and the inner one is around sort of things I
• 47:38
  Speaker 4: can directly control and influence, and then there's sort of
• 47:41
  Speaker 4: a second circle, which is things I have some influence over.
• 47:44
  Speaker 4: And then the third concentric circle is no control, no influence.
• 47:48
  Speaker 4: And I think, if I when I think about the
• 47:50
  Speaker 4: first few hours of the day at home, these are
• 47:52
  Speaker 4: things where not going through an email. I'm in some
• 47:56
  Speaker 4: cases like paper pencil, pencil sharp, not old school. Let
• 48:00
  Speaker 4: me actually like think and like filter out all the
• 48:02
  Speaker 4: noise with the distractions that you know inevitably happen throughout
• 48:05
  Speaker 4: the day. Gives me time to do that, and in
• 48:08
  Speaker 4: those sort of two or three hours, that's where I'm
• 48:10
  Speaker 4: adding the most value in my role to the business.
• 48:13
  Speaker 4: Then get into the you know, the office around ten o'clock,
• 48:15
  Speaker 4: do a couple more hours in the office, and then
• 48:17
  Speaker 4: I try to afternoon on is where I schedule calls, meetings,
• 48:22
  Speaker 4: things like that. That's just generally less productive time for me.
• 48:26
  Speaker 4: Five six o'clock, break it up with the workout, and
• 48:28
  Speaker 4: then dinner, dinner with friends, girlfriends, you know, sort of
• 48:32
  Speaker 4: enjoy the night and good night's sleep.
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: First of all, the circle diagram is money.
• 48:38
  Speaker 3: It really is. And I actually think because it's not
• 48:41
  Speaker 3: only for your own focus, but as a company grows.
• 48:43
  Speaker 3: I think for me, the biggest challenges you can take
• 48:47
  Speaker 3: on the emotional lever of the whole thing, and there
• 48:51
  Speaker 3: are you can control only so much. You can't control
• 48:54
  Speaker 3: how people feel. And I think that that's something I've
• 48:57
  Speaker 3: learned through therapy and through.
• 48:58
  Speaker 2: Just it's funny yourself and takeaway, but you.
• 49:02
  Speaker 3: Can control what you put out. But ultimately there's a
• 49:05
  Speaker 3: there's a line where you can't control everything, and I
• 49:07
  Speaker 3: think understanding where that is is so important so that
• 49:10
  Speaker 3: you don't take on too much to the point where
• 49:13
  Speaker 3: you reach a point where you're not productive and you
• 49:15
  Speaker 3: can't move what what you can really move forward?
• 49:17
  Speaker 2: Forward?
• 49:18
  Speaker 1: That makes sense, No, it totally makes sense. We're winding
• 49:21
  Speaker 1: down a few last questions. I know we talked that
• 49:25
  Speaker 1: we're not going to put a number on like where
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: we're going or anything, but is there anything you can
• 49:29
  Speaker 1: tell me about what's next for Heyday?
• 49:32
  Speaker 3: My vision is a platform for estheticians. I think the
• 49:37
  Speaker 3: coolest thing about our concept is that we have product
• 49:41
  Speaker 3: market fit in the sense that when people come in,
• 49:44
  Speaker 3: they want our services and they want more of it.
• 49:46
  Speaker 3: And that's what gives me the you know, the comfort
• 49:50
  Speaker 3: of expanding. But it really is to build a platform
• 49:53
  Speaker 3: that allows our team who has this incredible passion around
• 49:57
  Speaker 3: skincare and giving people that knowledge and empowerment, and then
• 49:59
  Speaker 3: you get a whole bunch of customers that are looking
• 50:01
  Speaker 3: for that. So how do we build something where we
• 50:04
  Speaker 3: connect those two things? Together, and for me, the platform
• 50:07
  Speaker 3: is how do you do that in more shops and
• 50:09
  Speaker 3: more cities, But it's also how do you do that online?
• 50:11
  Speaker 3: How do I take my team who maybe after four
• 50:14
  Speaker 3: years of doing facials is a little tired of the
• 50:16
  Speaker 3: physical part of the work, but the advice that they
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: give to people holistically is so valuable. So how do
• 50:23
  Speaker 3: I build a way for somebody in Chicago, where maybe
• 50:27
  Speaker 3: we're not going to be in the next twelve months,
• 50:28
  Speaker 3: to connect with a skin therapist who, you know, after
• 50:31
  Speaker 3: taking a quiz on our website, we can say you're
• 50:33
  Speaker 3: like seven percent of our customers that we've seen in
• 50:35
  Speaker 3: the two hundred thousand facials we've done. By the way,
• 50:38
  Speaker 3: you're also, you know, have the same concerns that Jenna
• 50:42
  Speaker 3: really loves treating. So let's get you guys talking and
• 50:44
  Speaker 3: she can help you shop your way, you know, build
• 50:47
  Speaker 3: a routine together and really connect the dots for people
• 50:50
  Speaker 3: between facials. I think skincare isn't a once a month thing.
• 50:54
  Speaker 3: You're touching your face twice a day. We're there at
• 50:56
  Speaker 3: best once a month, So what happens in those others
• 50:58
  Speaker 3: sixty ninety times a month? You're paying attention to your skin,
• 51:01
  Speaker 3: and we want to be there more in a really
• 51:02
  Speaker 3: helpful way.
• 51:03
  Speaker 1: I know you guys aren't licensed aestheticians, but if someone
• 51:07
  Speaker 1: should do like just one or two things at home,
• 51:09
  Speaker 1: what should they be doing.
• 51:11
  Speaker 4: I think if they're going to be sort of two things,
• 51:12
  Speaker 4: it's you know, you want to sort of like cleanse
• 51:15
  Speaker 4: your face every day. I think you know, environments like
• 51:18
  Speaker 4: New York and LA are particularly challenging on the skin,
• 51:21
  Speaker 4: and it's a very difficult environment. And then in some
• 51:24
  Speaker 4: form of moisturizing SPF, I mean, sunscreen is so so critical.
• 51:30
  Speaker 3: I'm going to give two pieces of advice that I've
• 51:32
  Speaker 3: picked up from our team number one and this sounds
• 51:35
  Speaker 3: really like a little woo woo, but be kind to
• 51:37
  Speaker 3: your skin. So many people treat their skin as this
• 51:41
  Speaker 3: thing that they have no control over, and that can
• 51:44
  Speaker 3: be a feeling you wake up in the morning, You're like,
• 51:46
  Speaker 3: why I have a big day to day? Why is
• 51:49
  Speaker 3: this big thing popping up next to my nose. Being
• 51:51
  Speaker 3: kind to your skin, it is a part of you.
• 51:53
  Speaker 3: I think one of our astheticians described it as like
• 51:55
  Speaker 3: people treat it like this misbehaving puppy. But it's definitely
• 51:59
  Speaker 3: a part of you and treating it kindness and understanding
• 52:01
  Speaker 3: it is actually like a mental flip that affects that
• 52:04
  Speaker 3: affects your skin. And I think the second thing is
• 52:07
  Speaker 3: we all love products. They're so fun to try. People
• 52:10
  Speaker 3: use too much stuff, and it takes me back to
• 52:13
  Speaker 3: like science experiments in high school when you learned about
• 52:15
  Speaker 3: the control variable, and like you need to keep some
• 52:18
  Speaker 3: things constant to understand if something's making a difference. And
• 52:21
  Speaker 3: if you are using seven serums and have some ten
• 52:24
  Speaker 3: step routine and or trying things all the time, it
• 52:26
  Speaker 3: can be really tough to understand what's going on. So
• 52:29
  Speaker 3: a lot of what we do is help people simplify
• 52:31
  Speaker 3: and say go back to the basics. We're not taking
• 52:33
  Speaker 3: away your toys, but let's like pare it down to
• 52:36
  Speaker 3: run your own experiment to see what works. And I
• 52:39
  Speaker 3: think that's that's a really important thing for people to learn.
• 52:43
  Speaker 1: Best piece of advice that you have been offered while
• 52:46
  Speaker 1: building your business dun dunn.
• 52:50
  Speaker 3: Oh, that's good. You know. There's something that's one of
• 52:54
  Speaker 3: our board members said that has always really stuck with me,
• 52:57
  Speaker 3: and it is get credit for everything you do. It's
• 53:01
  Speaker 3: awesome because and amplify it. Companies do so much good stuff,
• 53:07
  Speaker 3: and I always joke like, this is a total joke.
• 53:09
  Speaker 3: I would never do this. But if I could put
• 53:11
  Speaker 3: a microphone in every treatment room, that's what I would amplify.
• 53:13
  Speaker 3: The conversations. The connection that happens there is the core
• 53:18
  Speaker 3: of our business, but everything from the events that we
• 53:21
  Speaker 3: do to the advice that our team gives, like how
• 53:24
  Speaker 3: do we get more and more credit for what we do?
• 53:26
  Speaker 3: Because it's so much good stuff that I think is
• 53:30
  Speaker 3: important for anyone to remember.
• 53:33
  Speaker 4: I think for me, it's just it's all about how
• 53:35
  Speaker 4: you you know, how you adapt and learn and grow.
• 53:38
  Speaker 4: I think the only constant in today's world is change,
• 53:42
  Speaker 4: and the rate of growth of that change is just
• 53:44
  Speaker 4: going to continue to accelerate. So I think the more
• 53:45
  Speaker 4: you put yourself in uncomfortable situations, the more you grow,
• 53:50
  Speaker 4: the more you learn, and the better you are, whether
• 53:52
  Speaker 4: that's sort of personally or professionally. So I think it's
• 53:56
  Speaker 4: how you challenge yourself and surround yourself with the right
• 53:58
  Speaker 4: people that don't necessary really need to be the most
• 54:00
  Speaker 4: successful people, because you can learn arguably a follo up
• 54:03
  Speaker 4: more from people that have actually tried businesses that have
• 54:05
  Speaker 4: been absolute, absolute train break. So I think it's just
• 54:09
  Speaker 4: for me. It's where you get these little nuggets that
• 54:13
  Speaker 4: let me let me sort of extract something new every day.
• 54:17
  Speaker 2: Extra was that a pun?
• 54:18
  Speaker 4: Was I was looking for re action from Michael?
• 54:22
  Speaker 1: Final question, You have an opportunity right now to offer
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: yourself a piece of advice looking back on a time
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: when things were really challenging for you. So maybe it's
• 54:31
  Speaker 1: when you're telling the guys that you can't go on
• 54:34
  Speaker 1: the trip. What kind of advice do you offer to
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: yourself during tough times like that, during those hurdle moments.
• 54:38
  Speaker 3: I would say it's two connected things for me. I
• 54:40
  Speaker 3: think number one, it's go easy on yourself. You can
• 54:44
  Speaker 3: take things really hard and personally and in a big
• 54:48
  Speaker 3: way when it's something that you've created, and that doesn't
• 54:50
  Speaker 3: I think going easy on yourself does not mean lessening
• 54:54
  Speaker 3: your standards, and that's an important thing to remember for me.
• 54:58
  Speaker 3: And the second thing is to reach out for help,
• 55:00
  Speaker 3: to reach out to experts or others on your team
• 55:03
  Speaker 3: to do the work with you that you can't take
• 55:07
  Speaker 3: it all, aren't alone. So I think those are the
• 55:09
  Speaker 3: two big lessons that I carry with me every day,
• 55:12
  Speaker 3: and I think for.
• 55:12
  Speaker 4: Me, it just comes back to you've got to focus
• 55:15
  Speaker 4: on what you can control. We've spoken about the control circle.
• 55:19
  Speaker 4: There's another one that I've got that I think helps me.
• 55:21
  Speaker 4: And you can do this on a quadrant. I do
• 55:23
  Speaker 4: it sort of on circles, but again inside looking out.
• 55:26
  Speaker 4: When I think about different things, it's important and not
• 55:29
  Speaker 4: urgent in the first there is then you know, important
• 55:34
  Speaker 4: and urgent. Second circle, there is urgent but not important
• 55:38
  Speaker 4: on the third, and there is not important, not urgent
• 55:41
  Speaker 4: on the fourth. And I think when push comes to
• 55:43
  Speaker 4: shove on so many things you do, I think people
• 55:46
  Speaker 4: and whether that's sort of like email, like other like
• 55:48
  Speaker 4: little bits and bobs. So many people put themselves in
• 55:51
  Speaker 4: these sort of like out of two circles, and for me,
• 55:54
  Speaker 4: there's just this zone and fulfillment that is the bullseye around.
• 55:57
  Speaker 4: The more I focus my time within those sort of
• 56:00
  Speaker 4: first one or two circles, there's always going to be
• 56:02
  Speaker 4: things that come up that are important and urgent and
• 56:04
  Speaker 4: we can't we can't predict that. The more time I
• 56:07
  Speaker 4: spend there and how I prioritize there, the rest just
• 56:11
  Speaker 4: you know, the rest just sort of falls away because
• 56:13
  Speaker 4: doing something unimportant efficiently doesn't make it as a matter.
• 56:18
  Speaker 3: I like I like that one as a four quadrant
• 56:20
  Speaker 3: because it's like.
• 56:20
  Speaker 2: Four quadrant because the redesigning the method.
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: The top rate's where he packages this is that he
• 56:27
  Speaker 3: takes it, has pencils in the ninth package. The top
• 56:30
  Speaker 3: rate is like, yeah, you're urgent, important, do now because
• 56:32
  Speaker 3: you uniquely are the one that can make the biggest impact.
• 56:35
  Speaker 3: And then you know the lower left is like delegate
• 56:37
  Speaker 3: it out or don't do it, delete the email or
• 56:39
  Speaker 3: move it on to somebody else who can.
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: If you guys want to add in like a like
• 56:43
  Speaker 1: a standing meeting once a week to talk through this
• 56:45
  Speaker 1: kind of stuff, like I'm there, you tell me what
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: I want a week diagram, I'm so there, weekly one
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: on one Oudam Michael, thank you so much for giving
• 56:52
  Speaker 1: me your time today.
• 56:53
  Speaker 2: I feel I appreciate it.
• 56:55
  Speaker 4: Thank you.
• 56:56
  Speaker 1: Please take a moment and leave a quick review by
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: clicking the link with the description into this episode, we
• 57:01
  Speaker 1: all face multiple hurdles in life. I want to hear
• 57:03
  Speaker 1: about yours. Reach out to me at Emily at hurdle
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: dot us. Connect with the podcast on Instagram and Twitter
• 57:09
  Speaker 1: at Hurdle podcast. Guys, where do they find you, where
• 57:12
  Speaker 1: do they find Heyday give you and.
• 57:14
  Speaker 3: Find it out Heydayskincare dot com. That's h E Y
• 57:18
  Speaker 3: d A Y And if you're in New York, you
• 57:20
  Speaker 3: can find us on the Upper east Side, Upper west Side, Nomad, NoHo,
• 57:24
  Speaker 3: or Tribeca. And in Los Angeles you can find us
• 57:27
  Speaker 3: in Brentwood or on Beverly Boulevard near the Grove.
• 57:31
  Speaker 2: Any personal dats Can I follow you on Instagram?
• 57:34
  Speaker 3: You can follow me on Instagram. I'm kind of boring
• 57:37
  Speaker 3: no social media. To the right, he spies on social
• 57:40
  Speaker 3: but he's not really on it. You're totally and all
• 57:42
  Speaker 3: all I do is take pictures of like.
• 57:44
  Speaker 2: What's your upstair?
• 57:45
  Speaker 3: It's Heyday Skincare Michael p. Lk if you really want
• 57:51
  Speaker 3: to follow me, but I'm not that interesting.
• 57:53
  Speaker 1: I am at Emily Abodi. Another hurdle conquered. Catch you
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: guys next time.