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SMNTY Classics: What is the Cult of New Domesticity? · Stuff Mom Never Told You

• 0:05
  Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. I don't like from
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: the stuff. Would never told you production of I Heart Radio.
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: So Samantha, well, you recently did an episode I'm Blogging,
• 0:22
  Speaker 1: and you said you used to have a blog on
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: the side. I've never heard of Zenga. Yes, yes, yes,
• 0:29
  Speaker 1: and you said it was unfortunately or maybe fortunately defunct,
• 0:35
  Speaker 1: but you didn't say what was on there other than
• 0:38
  Speaker 1: vague prompts. As it was very angsty, it might not
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: have been politically correct. Well, I don't really know, because
• 0:46
  Speaker 1: there's really no telling what had written, but I do
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: remember some sad poems mh and thoughts. And then also
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: it was really really hard on into the Christian world,
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: so I'm sure there was a lot of religiou us
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: ideas and thought processes, but that's all I can remember.
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: Did you engage with the audience at all? Commenters? Of course,
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: so I was also very picky in general and cautious
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: about who knew what sight I had. I did have
• 1:16
  Speaker 1: some lookie lose cooking through and found me I did.
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: That happened a couple of times. I remember that, and
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: maybe hannicking like oh no, because all I had was
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: a user name, which makes no sense because it's just
• 1:29
  Speaker 1: like made up from my entire full name, so just
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: a bunch of letters put together essentially, and then yeah,
• 1:36
  Speaker 1: that's it. That's all I had there. And it was
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: public though, but if someone commented on it, typically they
• 1:41
  Speaker 1: were all very nice comments. I would respond, M, there's
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: a couple of I had conversations, but again, there were
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: a majority of the friends that I would see on
• 1:49
  Speaker 1: a dating basis, and we as a group all had
• 1:52
  Speaker 1: Sanga community. Oh did you ever regular update schedule or
• 1:58
  Speaker 1: was it just whenever for know? Yeah, and whenever I
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: don't like it? Mm hmmmm. Well, I believe I've only
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: posted to a blog once, and it was a blog
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: that was run by an organization I was a part
• 2:12
  Speaker 1: of when I was in college called i SEC, which
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: is kind of like an international travel blog, and I
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: published once like a guest post about when I had
• 2:23
  Speaker 1: gone to China, and it was on a base on Tumbler.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: I believe I did have to design a website and
• 2:28
  Speaker 1: I can't remember where I hosted that, but that was
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: also like a final project I had to do with
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: one of my college classes. I will say we talked
• 2:36
  Speaker 1: about this in our blog episode where the similarities between
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: fan fiction and blogging. And I did post fan fiction,
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: and I did have a regular update schedule, and I
• 2:44
  Speaker 1: would if people reviewed, I would respond to the reviews
• 2:48
  Speaker 1: because I was so flattered. I was so terrified that
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: they were all going to being and they were almost
• 2:53
  Speaker 1: always nice, and I would respond. But it's a very
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: stressful experience, really is I feel that way about social
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: media today. I'm like, I see a lot of alerts like,
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: oh my god, what have I done? Yep, Yeah, I
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: am the exact same way, but it's almost always nice.
• 3:09
  Speaker 1: But you get those nerves. Um yeah, every time, for sure,
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: for sure. But since we did recently do kind of
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: an updated episode on a look at women and blogging,
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: we wanted to bring back this classic on the mommy
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: blog or mom blog in particular, So please enjoy Welcome
• 3:32
  Speaker 1: to Stuff Mom Never Told You from how Stuff Works
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: dot com. Hello, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Kristen
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: and I'm Caroline and Caroline. Today we have a special
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: podcast episode because I got to chat with Emily Matcher,
• 3:55
  Speaker 1: who is the author of the upcoming book Homeward Bound
• 3:59
  Speaker 1: The New Cult of Domesticity, and it is coming out.
• 4:02
  Speaker 1: It's slated to come out in May, so right around
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: the corner. But you can check out her blogging over
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: at New New domesticity dot com. And the reason why
• 4:14
  Speaker 1: we wanted to talk to match her about new domesticity
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: is because it ties into a lot of things that
• 4:21
  Speaker 1: we talked about on the podcast and I feel like
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: a lot of interests that podcast listeners have. Yeah, she's
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: match is a really interesting woman. This whole idea of
• 4:31
  Speaker 1: new domesticity being something that a lot of women are
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: being attracted to. And there's this very interesting debate that
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: that we've kind of been keeping tabs on about is
• 4:42
  Speaker 1: this something that helps women or is this somehow sending
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: women back to the stone age and oppressing them. So
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: there's a lot of arguments on both sides. Yeah, and um,
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  Speaker 1: in our chat with Emily Matcher, she'll give us more
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: details about what new domesticity is, but just for a
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: general idea we're talking of out the revival of things
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: like knitting and handcrafts. Etsy is a great online source
• 5:07
  Speaker 1: just for a glimpse of new domesticity and even more intensive,
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: time intensive things like backyard chicken keeping, canning, preserving. Uh,
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: really a return to I guess lost domestic arts that
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: were replaced by more convenient appliances or techniques or just
• 5:28
  Speaker 1: TV dinners, TV dinners, things like that, and she she
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: does talk about how there's this return um from what
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: our mothers and grandmothers were doing, which is maybe relying
• 5:39
  Speaker 1: on those TV dinners, maybe not cooking those homemade pies
• 5:42
  Speaker 1: or knitting sweaters as you know, as much as our
• 5:45
  Speaker 1: predecessors were. Yeah, and we first noticed Emily's work over
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: at Salon when we were researching our episode on Pinterest
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: and she she wrote about the why I Can't stop
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: reading Mormon housewife blogs and it's a great post so
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: where she talks about um, Mormon mommy bloggers and sort
• 6:07
  Speaker 1: of the this Pinterest perfect life it seems like a
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: lot of them are living, and how that ties into
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: new domesticity and her fascination with that in comparison to
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: how she lives her own day to day life in
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  Speaker 1: a much less Pinterest perfect way, which I think you know,
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: you and I Caroline can probably both relate to very strongly. Um. So, so, yeah,
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: we chatted with Emily. She is living currently in China,
• 6:34
  Speaker 1: so we had an international conversation with her, and I
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: guess why don't we listen to what Emily had to
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: say about New Domesticity, her book that's coming out. What
• 6:45
  Speaker 1: New Domesticity is, how men play a role in this
• 6:49
  Speaker 1: stuff as well, and some other things. And uh so,
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: why don't we kick off my interview with Emily with
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: the question I asked her of what got her interested
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: in new domesticity and if she could offer some more
• 7:04
  Speaker 1: insight into what exactly that is. So, ladies and gents,
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: please enjoy our conversation with Emily Matcher. So New Domesticity
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  Speaker 1: is just the title that I'm sort of throwing at
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  Speaker 1: a variety of interrelated things, um, but generally speaking, the
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: sort of the resurgence of interest in old fashioned domestic stuff,
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: you know. And this is everything from the you know, knitting,
• 7:37
  Speaker 1: the crafting revival. You know, we've seen knitting and Etsy
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: and crocheting and all this stuff is hip again, you know, um,
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: and the foodie movement and people being really into food
• 7:47
  Speaker 1: and home cooking all the way through to sort of
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: neo homesteading, um, you know, people raising chickens in their
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: backyard and uh and wanting to get back to me
• 7:57
  Speaker 1: six and that whole thing. And so I sort of
• 8:00
  Speaker 1: look at it as part of you know, one larger
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: phenomenon that's what I'm calling new domesticity. UM. And yeah,
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  Speaker 1: I got interested in it because as UM, as a
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  Speaker 1: writer who writes a lot about about food and culture,
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: I kept meeting people who were like really into canning
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: jam you know. But it wasn't just it wasn't just
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: you know, a hobby. It was sort of part of
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: a lifestyle and UM. You know, I'd meet meet you know,
• 8:30
  Speaker 1: women that were into attachment parenting, who homeschooled their kids
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: and baked all their own bread and raised goats, and
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: and I began to see that this was sort of
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: it was a larger lifestyle movement, that these things were
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: sort of pieces of UM. And that's when I got
• 8:47
  Speaker 1: I got sort of curious about it as UM as
• 8:50
  Speaker 1: a bigger thing, you know, wondering where it came from
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: and what it meant. Well, you mentioned on the website
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: one of the blog posts when you you'd worked out
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: the working title for the book, and how it UM
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: is a nod to the Victorian era cult of domesticity,
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: which has, like those the four cardinal virtues of piety, purity, submission,
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  Speaker 1: and domesticity. So I wanted to get your thoughts on
• 9:15
  Speaker 1: what might be the cardinal virtues of the cult of
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  Speaker 1: New domesticity. I think the cardinal virtue UM would probably
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: be d I Y do it yourself UM, and MIS
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  Speaker 1: takes a lot of forms. I think there's a there's
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  Speaker 1: a real impetus in this movement to to do things yourself,
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  Speaker 1: you know, MISS could be cooking from a scratch, or
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  Speaker 1: selling your own clothes, or growing your own veggies, you know,
• 9:46
  Speaker 1: all the way through homeschooling your own children. It's very
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: much about sort of you know, going outside the system
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: and UM and and doing things yourself. So I would
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: say that's the the cardinal virtue. Although things like UM
• 10:04
  Speaker 1: you certainly see sort of an interest in purity when
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  Speaker 1: it comes to food and things like that, which which
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  Speaker 1: definitely have parallels with the nineteenth century cult of domesticity,
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  Speaker 1: and and generally sort of the I think the idea,
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  Speaker 1: even if it's not spoken, UM, that by doing this
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: stuff you are a better person, a better woman, a
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: better mother. Uh. Well, I think it's really interesting in
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: reading about UM sort of what is driving a lot
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  Speaker 1: of this A lot of the resurgence for these UM
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: you know, sort of crafts from a slower time, and uh,
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: and you talk about how it's linked a lot of
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: times to a disfaction, dissatisfaction. Excuse me with you know,
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: the idea of you know, the nine to five world
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: sitting in a cubicle being a weekend warrior and uh
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  Speaker 1: is it? Are we just looking back to, you know,
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  Speaker 1: wanting a bygone era of a slower and even like
• 11:04
  Speaker 1: less convenient time, even though you know, the lifestyle that
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: we have now is supposed to be, um, you know,
• 11:10
  Speaker 1: faster and easier and and all of that. You know,
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  Speaker 1: I think there's a real nostalgia for what people perceive
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: as a sort of simpler and more wholesome time. And
• 11:20
  Speaker 1: I think a lot of that has to do with, um,
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: you know, we live in a super high tech society,
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: and you know, just on a very basic level, um,
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: you know, when you work at a computer all day,
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: I think we have you know, humans have a pretty
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: you know, natural urge. We like to do things with
• 11:35
  Speaker 1: their hands, right, you know, And so I think when
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: you're when you're sort of separated from that, when you're
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: in an office, when you're you know, living in this
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: high tech world, people have a craving for for you know,
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: tactile connection. And so I think a lot of stuff,
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: like you know, crafting and cooking has to do with
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: people wanting to reclaim that connection, being be able to
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: work with their hands. Um. And then you know, people,
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: this is the We're living in a in a pretty
• 12:05
  Speaker 1: anxious era for a lot of reasons, you know, the
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: economy and the environment and political instability and war and
• 12:13
  Speaker 1: all these things that make people people anxious. I think
• 12:17
  Speaker 1: people crave what they perceive is a more simple and
• 12:22
  Speaker 1: stable time. You know, this idea that oh, you know,
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: back in the day when you know are in our
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: great grandparents era, you worked on the farm and you
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: made your own things, and you you know, didn't have
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: to go work this horrible nine job that you hate
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: that you could lose any day anyway. Um. And I
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: think that creates a sort of powerful urge to get
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: back to what people perceive as the basics. Um. Well,
• 12:47
  Speaker 1: can you talk a little bit about the role of
• 12:50
  Speaker 1: the Internet and being wired and how that relates to
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: new domesticity, because it seems like on the one hand, yet, um,
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: you know, our constant connection via the Internet and social
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: media and just the fast pace that comes along with
• 13:06
  Speaker 1: that maybe fuel some of that anxiety that you're talking
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: about that makes us want to you know, slow things
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: down and uh feel that nostalgia. But at the same
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: time too, it seems like the Internet is also facilitated
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: all of these communities and platforms things like Etsy. Uh.
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: So I was just wondering what what your take on
• 13:27
  Speaker 1: how how the Internet Internet relates to all of this
• 13:31
  Speaker 1: would be, Well, I think you you totally hit on it.
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: I think, um, the Internet both drives new dust domesticity,
• 13:39
  Speaker 1: and new domesticity is also a reaction against the Internet
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: culture to some degree. I definitely do not think that
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: new domesticity would exist at all without the Internet. I think, um,
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: you know, like you said, it has facilitated, um, the
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: revival of a lot of this stuff. You know, the
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: crafting movement really came out of, um, out of websites
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: dedicated to crafting. And now we have stuff like at
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: sea and um and Ravelry, which is a knitting website, UM,
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: and you know, Pinterest or people share crafts and ideas UM.
• 14:15
  Speaker 1: And then there's the whole world of blogs, you know,
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: and food blogs and people sharing recipes and these have
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: created like these real communities and I think really driven
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: interest and stuff like you know, do it yourself and
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: from scratch cooking and um and and and you know,
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: created these communities and created you know, a sort of
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: sense of of aspiration. If you look at these you know,
• 14:40
  Speaker 1: neo domestic blogs, they're so beautiful and you know, everything's
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: photographed so nicely, and you look at them, and even
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: if you're not at all like domestic or interested in
• 14:50
  Speaker 1: cooking or crafty, it's kind of hard not to look
• 14:53
  Speaker 1: at some of these you know, lifestyle blogs and go, oh,
• 14:57
  Speaker 1: you know, I want that. Um and uh and I
• 15:02
  Speaker 1: think yeah. On on the flip side of that, there's
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: just the fact of the Internet being this, you know,
• 15:10
  Speaker 1: seven technological invasion of your home that I think a
• 15:13
  Speaker 1: lot of people want to escape from when they're you know,
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: going back to basics. Like you know, when you're spending
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: your time doing something tactile like cooking or or knitting
• 15:25
  Speaker 1: or you know, growing veggies in your backyard, you're making
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: a deliberate choice to step away from Internet culture. Yeah,
• 15:33
  Speaker 1: do you think that? Um And this is just kind
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: of on a side note that because I feel like
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: the rise of the quote unquote mommy bloggers almost I
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: predated the popularity of Etsy and Ravelry and these other
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: like larger communities. And do you think that maybe mom
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: bloggers in a way sort of and having that platform, Uh,
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: I don't know, showed the value of housework in a
• 16:01
  Speaker 1: way that maybe it had been dismissed for a little
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: while is just you know, oh, you're just to stay
• 16:07
  Speaker 1: at home mom, But now you can actually see all
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: of these things that they're doing, this incredible food that
• 16:13
  Speaker 1: they're making and uh, their home designer however they're doing it.
• 16:17
  Speaker 1: If that makes sense, No, yeah, I think you you
• 16:21
  Speaker 1: totally hit it on the head. Um. I think there
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: has been a movement for for a while, and probably
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: a little bit predating the Internet. Um, you know, maybe
• 16:29
  Speaker 1: sort of starting in the nineties, to to reclaim you know,
• 16:34
  Speaker 1: old fashioned women's work, like um, like crafts. I think
• 16:38
  Speaker 1: there's a big crafting revival that started with sort of
• 16:41
  Speaker 1: the punk rock riot girl movement in the nineties, with
• 16:44
  Speaker 1: you know, women saying hey, like it's cool and punk
• 16:46
  Speaker 1: rock to do uh crocheting and make your own clothes
• 16:49
  Speaker 1: and stuff like that, and that sort of grew into
• 16:53
  Speaker 1: a whole movement to to reclaim the domestic, to reclaim
• 16:56
  Speaker 1: respect for roum for old fashioned women's work, which you know,
• 17:00
  Speaker 1: had been very denigrated over the years. If you look
• 17:03
  Speaker 1: at you know, like Bust magazine, is this you know,
• 17:06
  Speaker 1: sort of third wave feminist magazine that started um you know,
• 17:12
  Speaker 1: running these sort of kitchy pictures of housewives and you know,
• 17:16
  Speaker 1: how to cleaning articles like in the late nineties, early
• 17:19
  Speaker 1: two thousand's as sort of this big you know, this
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: this movement to um to sort of reclaim, reclaim women's
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: work as something of value. And I think the mom
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: blogging ended up being part a big part of that
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: because a lot of I think a lot of the
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: reason that women's work has been historically devalued is because
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: it's invisible. You don't you know, you don't know what
• 17:49
  Speaker 1: your neighbors dinner looks like. You don't see her folding
• 17:52
  Speaker 1: her laundry, you don't see any of that stuff. And
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: so I think that's one of the reasons it was
• 17:56
  Speaker 1: very hard to be a housewife was because you didn't
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: get any external validation. And especially you know, once women
• 18:03
  Speaker 1: started getting educations and started having experience in the workforce
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: and got used to the external validation of you know,
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: being in a workplace or getting grades in school. I
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: think a lot of people found it very hard to
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: not get that anymore. And I think mom blogs um
• 18:21
  Speaker 1: uh unintentionally ended up becoming this venue for people to
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: show off there um what they did in the home
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: and thereby gaining some some validation for it. You know,
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: like you might cook dinner every night and uh, you know,
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: maybe your husband and your kids say thank you, maybe
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: they don't. But if you photograph your dinner and you
• 18:42
  Speaker 1: put the recipe online, people are going to go, hey,
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: oh awesome, you know, great recipe, and you're going to
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: get You're going to get validation. And I think that's
• 18:52
  Speaker 1: actually this pretty like phenomenal important effective um of mom
• 19:00
  Speaker 1: blogs and lifestyle blogs because all of a sudden, you know,
• 19:03
  Speaker 1: this women's work that's been invisible for you know, since
• 19:06
  Speaker 1: the dawn of time, all of a sudden has this
• 19:09
  Speaker 1: very public platform. You know. Well, it's interesting, like there was.
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: It reminds me too of of a post that you
• 19:17
  Speaker 1: had on the website about um, whether or not we're
• 19:20
  Speaker 1: almost going overboard, like you know, I think you were
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: talking something about going on apartment therapy and wondering whether
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: or not you should like put curtains up. But then
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: you didn't even want to ask, because it's like, now
• 19:33
  Speaker 1: we're almost to the point where everything you know looks
• 19:36
  Speaker 1: so perfect online and we have these like aspirational blogs
• 19:41
  Speaker 1: that we look like look at and pinterest in all
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: of this. Um so, I wonder if are is there
• 19:46
  Speaker 1: a danger and especially in talking about this within the
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: framework of feminism, is there a danger in exalting this
• 19:56
  Speaker 1: quote unquote women's work too much to where we're back
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: in the same place we were where, you know, back
• 20:03
  Speaker 1: to something along the lines of the you know, the
• 20:06
  Speaker 1: Victorian cult of domesticity, where a woman's worth is found
• 20:09
  Speaker 1: in and what her home looks like. Well, that's exactly
• 20:14
  Speaker 1: exactly the problem. You know. On the one hand, of course,
• 20:17
  Speaker 1: you know, people should be validated for the work they do.
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: On the other hand, the sort of um, the all
• 20:25
  Speaker 1: the sharing of of domesticity online does create a sense
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: of competition and does there is a sense in which
• 20:34
  Speaker 1: it raises the bar on a on what it takes
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: to be a good um, a good housekeeper, good a
• 20:43
  Speaker 1: good mother, a good woman. You know, because before the internet,
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: like you know, the housework wasn't visible. You didn't know
• 20:49
  Speaker 1: what your neighbor's closet looked like. You didn't know what
• 20:52
  Speaker 1: your neighbor's dinner looks like. And now you can go online.
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: You can look at blogs. You can see, you know,
• 20:58
  Speaker 1: what the strangers are cooking and eating, and what their
• 21:03
  Speaker 1: kids are wearing, and the cute craft projects they did.
• 21:06
  Speaker 1: And you know, of course this isn't the full view
• 21:11
  Speaker 1: of their lives, you know, naturally, it's this completely edited,
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: mediated view of their life that's put on the blog
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: for public consumption. But I think people have a hard
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: time reading between the lines there, you know, because blogs
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: are supposed to be this very authentic, you know, very
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: personal medium, and there becomes we get this really you know,
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: uncomfortable gray area where um, you know a lot of
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: bloggers are sort of semi professionals taking sort of semi
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: professional pictures of their semi professional cooking and decorating, and
• 21:46
  Speaker 1: you know, regular people go, oh, you know, now I
• 21:49
  Speaker 1: feel bad about myself. Why doesn't my food look like that?
• 21:52
  Speaker 1: Why doesn't my living room look like that? Um? And
• 21:55
  Speaker 1: it does create a culture in which, you know, be
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: the whole. You know, thousands of women are deaning this
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: validation for being good housekeepers, which is sort of, in
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: my mind, uncomfortably close to the whole cult of domesticity.
• 22:15
  Speaker 1: You know, Um, people are gaining validation from having you know,
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: the cutest living rooms or the the nicest looking dinner.
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: So um. So Yeah. On the one hand, I think that,
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: you know, it's great that people can be validated for
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: the hard work they do in the home. On the
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: other hand, I do worry that the whole culture of
• 22:34
  Speaker 1: lifestyle blogs, you know, raises the bar for ordinary women
• 22:38
  Speaker 1: who spend a lot of time looking at semi professional
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: blogs and feeling bad about themselves and feeling like their
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: self worth is really tied up and in how well
• 22:47
  Speaker 1: they keep their home. Yeah, because it also seems to
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: add another wrinkle to the whole debate that about about
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: whether or not women can have it all. You know,
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: we be because for so long it's been something that's
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: more just you know, looking for career success in the
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: workplace and yes, childcare and managing all of that. But
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: now there's sort of a new, um, a new aspect
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: to it as well, and I'm just wondering, like, when,
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: you know, can we have the career success in the
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: corner office and also have our own canned jam that
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: we can bring into office parties, you know what I mean,
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: Like it seems like there's so there's so much now
• 23:32
  Speaker 1: Like it's a good thing that uh, women's work is
• 23:35
  Speaker 1: being validated in a lot of ways, like in terms
• 23:37
  Speaker 1: of the domestic sphere. But where does this square with
• 23:41
  Speaker 1: work outside of the home? Right right? Well? Um, you know,
• 23:48
  Speaker 1: I think one of the big problems is that you know,
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: in in New domesticity sort of as a movement, um,
• 23:55
  Speaker 1: a lot of the stuff gets sort of very moralized
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: because it's tied up with um, you know, questions of
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: consumerism and questions of environmentalism, and questions of what kind
• 24:05
  Speaker 1: of food is good and safe to eat? Right. So
• 24:08
  Speaker 1: you know it's easy enough when somebody is just knitting
• 24:11
  Speaker 1: for a hobby, but um, you know, you get it's
• 24:16
  Speaker 1: much more complicated than that. You get. Um, you know
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: a lot of talk about well, you know, you should
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: be cooking from scratch because that's the way, that's the
• 24:26
  Speaker 1: only way that it's healthy for your family. And you know,
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: you should be knowing your farmer and going to the
• 24:31
  Speaker 1: farmer's market. You should be buying organic and you should
• 24:35
  Speaker 1: be you know, growing your own veggies, and you know,
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: soaking your grains and doing all these things because it's
• 24:42
  Speaker 1: the right thing to do for your children's health, and
• 24:45
  Speaker 1: it's the right thing to do for the environment and
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: for your local community. And um, you know, oh you
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: should be you know, making your own cleaning solutions out
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: of vinegar because you know it's good for the environment.
• 24:57
  Speaker 1: And don't take lazy shortcuts because that's bad for the environment.
• 25:00
  Speaker 1: And oh, you know, if you go out and buy
• 25:03
  Speaker 1: things or higher you know, babysitters to go to the movies,
• 25:06
  Speaker 1: you know that sort of consumerists. I think, um, I
• 25:11
  Speaker 1: think there's this there's this huge sort of moralization of
• 25:16
  Speaker 1: the domestic realm, this idea that your domestic choices can
• 25:19
  Speaker 1: have these huge impacts on the world. Like of course
• 25:23
  Speaker 1: people are going to feel like they're never doing it right,
• 25:27
  Speaker 1: you know. Um, so I think that makes it. You know, women,
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: like you said, already have a hard enough time trying
• 25:35
  Speaker 1: to keep things together in terms of job and childcare.
• 25:38
  Speaker 1: And now there's also this sense that you know, well
• 25:42
  Speaker 1: you can't just take a shortcut by you know, buying
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: you know, pre made meals or dropping your kids off
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: at daycare, because that's somehow you know, immoral, wrong and
• 25:55
  Speaker 1: and and bad for your children, and bad for the world,
• 25:58
  Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Um, and that puts a
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: uge amount of pressure on women. UM. Well, I'm also
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: really curious about the people that you've met through this
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: new domesticity research and wondering. I mean, obviously there's the
• 26:12
  Speaker 1: cornerstone d I y ethic and UM, you know, the
• 26:16
  Speaker 1: embrace of going more natural and slower in a way. Uh,
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: but have you noticed certain hallmarks of people who are
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: really drawn and very invested in Um, these kinds of
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: of new domesticity, Look what they have in common with
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: each other? Yeah, if there are any like I don't know,
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: any certain types of personality traits I feel like, like,
• 26:40
  Speaker 1: for instance, like people that I know who are incredibly
• 26:44
  Speaker 1: crafty are just like very organized and very creative and
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: and things like that. So I was just wondering, Uh,
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: if you had noticed certain I don't know, shared traits
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: or anything like that. Well, I'll say that there's a
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: huge variety of people doing this, and obviously it's not
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: all women. And I did interview um for my for
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: my blogging from my book, UM, plenty of men, and
• 27:08
  Speaker 1: that there are people in different socio economic groups and
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: and different um sort of political beliefs too. You get
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: a lot of you know, sort of very conservative Christian
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: women embracing d I y and natural parenting and that
• 27:19
  Speaker 1: whole thing, um, as well as sort of your stereotypical
• 27:22
  Speaker 1: crunchy liberals. But I will say, um, I think I
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: think one of the thing is that a lot, though
• 27:31
  Speaker 1: not all of um of women that are very into
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: new domesticity have in common is that they are very smart,
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: generally educated, and really creative, but for one reason or
• 27:44
  Speaker 1: the other, have not connected with a career. And this
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: is this doesn't mean they don't have one, you know,
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: but they might not find it totally satisfying, or it
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: might be part time, or they might have you know,
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: left in after their children were born. UM. And I think,
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: you know, being creative and um and educated and engaged,
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: they find you know, engaging a new domesticity a way
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: of um, you know, a way of using their energies
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: and and using their creativity um in the absence of
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: a job or the absence of a really satisfying job.
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: You know. So if you're doing a lot of super
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: intensive domestic stuff all the time, you know, you're say
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: you're homeschooling your kids, or you're just, um, you have
• 28:35
  Speaker 1: a huge garden that you're in every day, or you're
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: sewing your own clothes, or you're you know, you're raising chickens.
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: That sort of becomes like a career in a sense
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: for some people, and even people who don't take it
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: that far. I think, you know, um, even just being
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: very invested in something like cooking from scratch takes a
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: lot of time and energy and creativity. UM that maybe
• 28:58
  Speaker 1: you're not using on the job job because you are
• 29:03
  Speaker 1: because you don't have a job, or because you um,
• 29:06
  Speaker 1: you know, you have a job that's not fully engaging
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: you for whatever reason. And I think this is even
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: for for younger women who don't have kids, and for
• 29:14
  Speaker 1: men and everybody. I think dissatisfaction with the job definitely
• 29:19
  Speaker 1: leads to, um, wanting to do more creative stuff. So
• 29:23
  Speaker 1: if you're sort of bored in your job, like lots
• 29:25
  Speaker 1: of us are, you know, especially with the recession and
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: people maybe not having their dream job, like, yeah, you
• 29:31
  Speaker 1: want to come home and you want to you know,
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: do something that you're engaged with and passionate about. And
• 29:36
  Speaker 1: that's where you know, raising your bees on the rooftop,
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: and you know, and crocheting, that's where that kind of
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: stuff comes in to still that to still that gap. Well,
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: speaking of raising bees on rooftops, it was very curious
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: about maybe some of the more extreme or just intriguing
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: examples of new domesticity, like you know, like someone washing
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: laundering their own clothes with you know, an old school washboard,
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: or grinding their own flower or anything like that. I
• 30:06
  Speaker 1: did not actually meet anyone who used an old fashioned washboard.
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: That would be so much work, oh my gosh, but
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: you know what, I'm sure somebody's doing it. I did
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: meet lots of people who you know, who hung their
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: clothes to dry. Um. But I met let's see, I
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: met a woman in Brooklyn who was raising rabbits and
• 30:23
  Speaker 1: chickens and bees in her Brooklyn backyard that was like,
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: you know, the size of a postage stamp. Um. I
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: met a woman who had been a web designer and
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: had decided to just go off grid on our own
• 30:36
  Speaker 1: when was living in like very rural up state New
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: York trying to raise sheep. Um. I met you know,
• 30:45
  Speaker 1: women that were very into natural mothering, who you know,
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: had six kids before they were thirty and we're homeschooling
• 30:54
  Speaker 1: all of them. Um. So yeah, and people who people
• 30:59
  Speaker 1: who were trying really hard to grow all their own food. Um,
• 31:02
  Speaker 1: some people who sewed all their families clothes. So yeah,
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: I mean you can you can see how a few,
• 31:09
  Speaker 1: know you are really into new domesticity is like an
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: entire lifestyle. Um, it's a it's quite time and energy consuming. Yeah,
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: I can help me imagine. Um. Well you also you
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: mentioned a few minutes ago that you also spoke to
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: some men about new domestics new domesticity, and I just
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: wanted to know where they fit into it, because you know,
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: it makes sense that a lot of the conversation is
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: framed around women, mothers who are very invested in this
• 31:40
  Speaker 1: kind of housekeeping and and crafting and stuff. But obviously
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: men are are getting in on this as well. So
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: what what are they doing in terms of new domesticity. Yeah,
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: I mean a lot of a lot of the same
• 31:55
  Speaker 1: things really, Um, you know, I mean women have historically
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: UM stronger and a complicated relationship with um, with the
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: domestic sphere, but that's that's changing. And a lot of men,
• 32:07
  Speaker 1: especially young men, are you know, are also interested in
• 32:11
  Speaker 1: in d I y domesticity. I mean tons of men
• 32:15
  Speaker 1: are you know, really interested in cooking and you know,
• 32:19
  Speaker 1: curing their own bacon and uh making stuff from scratch
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: and pickling and all that stuff in the kitchen. Um,
• 32:27
  Speaker 1: you know. I mean I think men are definitely behind
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: when it comes to uh, you know, traditional crafts um,
• 32:33
  Speaker 1: which has been very very female dominated over the years.
• 32:35
  Speaker 1: But plenty of guys are are into other d I
• 32:41
  Speaker 1: y type stuff. I mean, there are there are some
• 32:43
  Speaker 1: guys that are into knitting. I did interview u, um
• 32:47
  Speaker 1: a male quilster um and uh. But you know, guys
• 32:52
  Speaker 1: doing things like you know, fixing their own bikes and
• 32:55
  Speaker 1: other sorts of of do it yourself building things around
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: the house than guys who wanted to build their own
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: houses um and uh and yeah. When it comes to parenting,
• 33:05
  Speaker 1: I mean that the whole natural parenting movement does tend
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: to be very mother centric, but there are men I
• 33:13
  Speaker 1: talked to who were involved in and stuff like like
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: home schooling their kids um and yeah. And then the
• 33:22
  Speaker 1: whole home studying movement. UM, A lot of men are
• 33:25
  Speaker 1: into that and a lot of the people I talked to,
• 33:27
  Speaker 1: UM they would be couples and both partners would be
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: involved in the homesteading to some degree, which you know,
• 33:33
  Speaker 1: if you're going to be doing something as time consuming
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: is raising animals, you know, in a suburban backyard, it's
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: a good thing of both of you are are invested
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: in it. Is there anything that we didn't touch on
• 33:44
  Speaker 1: about new domesticity or anything related to that that you
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: would like our listeners to know about. I mean, I
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: guess I just think, um, new domesticity can mean a
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: lot of different different things and for some people, you know,
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: some people are just you know, maybe involved and you know,
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: they just happen to like to knit or craft and
• 34:05
  Speaker 1: it doesn't have any larger meaning than that. But I
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: think when you take all these things together, I think
• 34:10
  Speaker 1: it's definitely a movement to you know, to reclaim you know,
• 34:17
  Speaker 1: some slower ways of living and uh and live in
• 34:21
  Speaker 1: a more sustainable way. And it's a reaction to the
• 34:24
  Speaker 1: bad and you know, um economy and people dissatisfaction with
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: jobs and just sort of a general unhappiness with the
• 34:31
  Speaker 1: status quo. Um that's leading people to be interested in
• 34:35
  Speaker 1: everything from making their own clothes to growing their own
• 34:38
  Speaker 1: food to you know, homeschool and their kids. So I
• 34:43
  Speaker 1: think Um, it's a it's a lot of different things
• 34:46
  Speaker 1: that it means different things for different people. Yeah, it's
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: definitely interesting. It's it's very interesting to see how, like
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: you you had said, it touches like so many different
• 34:57
  Speaker 1: people with different political affiliation or might be religious motivations
• 35:02
  Speaker 1: or more secular motivations. It's just it's kind of fascinating
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: to see how it appeals to such a broad and
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: diverse group of people. Um. Yeah, Well, in my book,
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: I have a whole chapter on the I'm the sort
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: of bizarre bedfellows of new domesticity. How you get stuff
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: like you know, the Amish and you know, bearded Brooklyn
• 35:26
  Speaker 1: hipsters who are you know, swapping tips about you know,
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: seeds and growing tomatoes, and you get you know, very
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: very conservative religious Christian women that are into natural mothering
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: because it appeals to their sort of idea, you know,
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: of of you know, god given motherly instinct. And they're
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: doing things like home birthing and home schooling, um, cloth
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: diapering and that whole thing, just like the superliberal countrywomen
• 35:53
  Speaker 1: of Berkeley who are doing it for completely different reasons.
• 35:56
  Speaker 1: Um So I think I think that's really be fascinating
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: this sort of that, you know, red state and blue
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: state how would come together on the domestic front in
• 36:07
  Speaker 1: this way. So I'd like to go ahead and just
• 36:12
  Speaker 1: thank Emily so much for talking to us. It was
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: a really interesting interview. And I do think this whole
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: concept of new domesticity is fascinating just simply, I mean,
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: like taking all the rest of it out, just simply
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: for the fact that so many different types of people
• 36:27
  Speaker 1: subscribe to this philosophy of I'm going to make things
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: at home. I'm going to make things myself. I'm going
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: to you know, provide for my family and myself, uh
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: by making things with my own hands. Yeah. And it's
• 36:39
  Speaker 1: really fascinating to me too what what she hits on
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: in terms of how it's often fueled. It seems like
• 36:47
  Speaker 1: by a general angst over the pace of our day
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: to day life and needing to take time away from
• 36:55
  Speaker 1: the hustle and bustle of twenty one century living, to
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: to slow down and actually make things that we can
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: hold and that we can eat, and that we can
• 37:05
  Speaker 1: take pictures of and put on Pinterest. You know. That's
• 37:09
  Speaker 1: the funny part of it. It's that tension between wanting
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: to get away from it and yet the Internet fueling
• 37:15
  Speaker 1: it at the same time. So UM, I can't wait
• 37:18
  Speaker 1: to hear from folks out there who are knitters and
• 37:22
  Speaker 1: canners and cooks and chicken raizors New domesticity folks, I'm
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: sure you know who you are. And again, um, you
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: can find Emily Matcher's writing all over the Internet at
• 37:36
  Speaker 1: places like The Washington Post, Salon, Men's Journal, the BBC,
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: The Hairpin and other sites as well, and she also
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: blogs at New Domesticity dot com. And again, Emily Matcher's book,
• 37:48
  Speaker 1: which is coming out in May, is called Homeward Bound,
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: The New Cult of Domesticity. It's coming out from Simon
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: and Schuster, So keep an eye out for that. And
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: thanks so much to Emily. And for folks who want
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: to send us your thoughts on New Domesticity and what
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: you thought about what Emily had to say, you can
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: send us an email. Mom Stuff at Discovery dot com
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: is our address. Here is a letter from jos Kristen.
• 38:22
  Speaker 1: She wrote in about our dieting and Feminism is episode
• 38:25
  Speaker 1: and was a little disappointed, oh man. She says she's
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: disappointed that neither of us mentioned the idea of health
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: at every size or h a e S well not
• 38:35
  Speaker 1: directly related to feminism. Health at Every Size is a
• 38:38
  Speaker 1: concept that many fat activists have been advocating. My understanding
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: of Health at Every Size is that it questions a
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: lot of commonly health belief surrounding obesity and health, such
• 38:48
  Speaker 1: as the supposed link between obesity and diabetes. Supporters of
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: h a e S advocate for eating a balanced diet
• 38:54
  Speaker 1: and exercising regardless of how much weight loss it may
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: or may not cause. Linda Bacon's book Help at Every Size,
• 39:00
  Speaker 1: The Surprising Truth about Your Weight is a good place
• 39:03
  Speaker 1: to start if you're new to the idea. There's quite
• 39:05
  Speaker 1: a lot to be said about h a e S
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: and perhaps worth doing an entire episode on. Yeah, fat
• 39:11
  Speaker 1: activism is um something that we do need to talk
• 39:15
  Speaker 1: about at some point, So thanks for the point, Jos. Yeah. Absolutely.
• 39:19
  Speaker 1: And I've got another email here in response to our
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: episode on whether dating is a feminist issue, and this
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: is from Kendra and she writes, I was appropriately enough
• 39:28
  Speaker 1: working out in the gym when I listened to your
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: podcast on dieting and feminism, and I got so excited
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: that I scooted my tush off the elliptical just to
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: give my opinion on the issue. She says, as a
• 39:38
  Speaker 1: recovering interrexic, I spent most of high school dieting myself
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: to a very unhealthy b M. I I was able
• 39:45
  Speaker 1: to break away from the disease in part by making
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: dieting a feminist issue in my own life. Every time
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: I saw a calorie count go above six hundred in
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: a day, I justified it by using the battle cry,
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: and I will take out the explutive here, screw the patriarchy.
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: A few years have passed, and I finally feel secure
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: enough with myself to be able to look at diet
• 40:06
  Speaker 1: and exercise a bit more objectively. While I still refuse
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: to diet for weight loss, I find that daily exercise
• 40:11
  Speaker 1: helps me in a number of ways beyond making me
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: fit into my skinny jeans. I feel more relaxed, to
• 40:16
  Speaker 1: have better sleep, and even have clearer skin when I
• 40:18
  Speaker 1: work out for even just thirty minutes a day. Besides,
• 40:21
  Speaker 1: it gives me a great opportunity to listen to folks
• 40:24
  Speaker 1: like you on a regular basis. So in summery, while
• 40:26
  Speaker 1: I tend to disapprove of women dieting just to get skinny,
• 40:30
  Speaker 1: because I worry about them slipping down the same rabbit
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: hole that I did. I think that women one and
• 40:34
  Speaker 1: all should always do whatever makes them feel like the
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: best version of themselves here here, indeed, so thank you
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: Kendra and John and everyone else who has written into us.
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: Moms Stuff at Discovery dot com is where you can
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: send your letters, or you can head over to Facebook
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: and start a conversation there and like us. While you're
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: at it, You can tweet us at Mom's Stuff podcast,
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: and you can also tumble with us on Tumbler Stuff
• 40:58
  Speaker 1: Mom Never Told You dot tumbler dot com. And again,
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: huge thanks to Emily Matcher for taking the time to
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: chat with us about New Domesticity and her new book,
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: Homeward Bound. Please check it out, and as always, if
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: you would like to get a little smarter this week,
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: you can head over to our website, it is how
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: stuff works dot com. For more on this and thousands
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: of other topics, visit how stuff Works dot com.