Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / MURDER Charges Loom for Alex Murdaugh in Shooting Deaths of Wife, Son

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MURDER Charges Loom for Alex Murdaugh in Shooting Deaths of Wife, Son · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Greece Bombshell. In the case of
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Speaker 1: legal superstar Alex Murdog out of South Carolina, we expect
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Speaker 1: a grand jury indictment, not on embezzling money, not on
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Speaker 1: his usual flam flam scams on one client after the next,
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Speaker 1: to the tune of millions of dollars and bazzling from
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Speaker 1: his law firm, doing drugs. The list goes on and on.
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Speaker 1: I'm talking about an indictment for murder and not just murder,
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Speaker 1: double murder. Before we kicked back and say what took
0:47
Speaker 1: so long? I think I know what took so long?
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Speaker 1: As we wait for the grand jury to hand down
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Speaker 1: that bill of indictment with a true bill as it
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Speaker 1: is called, let's go to the experts, I mean, grace
1:00
Speaker 1: this Scribe Stories. Thank you for being with us here
1:03
Speaker 1: at Fox Nation in series one eleven. But first of all,
1:06
Speaker 1: take a listen to our friends at w j CL.
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Speaker 1: Murdoch murder charges. According to reports, Elik Murdoch will be
1:14
Speaker 1: charged for the deaths of his wife and son. This
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Speaker 1: comes as he is now also officially disbarred in South Carolina.
1:22
Speaker 1: It's been thirteen months since Elik found Maggie and Paul
1:25
Speaker 1: Murdoch shot and killed on their Collaton County property. Now,
1:30
Speaker 1: according to Elik's attorney, the South Carolina Law Enforcement Division
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Speaker 1: notified the Murdoch family about these charges this morning. According
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Speaker 1: to the latest reports, SLED will present evidence to a
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Speaker 1: grand jury this Thursday. However, reports did not say what
1:46
Speaker 1: that evidence is. I wouldn't think that the South Carolina
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Speaker 1: Law Enforcement Division would put something before a great state
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Speaker 1: grand jury if they didn't believe that they had had ample.
2:00
Speaker 1: You darn right. You don't go to a grand jury
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Speaker 1: unless you are locked and loaded. Again, thanks for being
2:05
Speaker 1: with us here at Fox Nation and Crime Stories. We've
2:08
Speaker 1: been on the case from the very beginning with me
2:10
Speaker 1: an all star panelm But first I'm going to go
2:11
Speaker 1: straight out to Matt Harris. He is there in South Carolina,
2:16
Speaker 1: he said, morning show host of The Matt Ramona Show
2:18
Speaker 1: at wl n K, and he is the creator and
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Speaker 1: star of podcast The Murdoch Family Murders. Impact of Influence.
2:27
Speaker 1: Matt Harris dis bar smith spar don't care. Have the
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Speaker 1: lawyers in the bar or stinkers anyway? I wouldn't trust
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Speaker 1: one as far as I could throw them. I learned
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Speaker 1: that when I was a lobbyist at the Georgia State Assembly.
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Speaker 1: I want to hear about the murder charges. I mean,
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Speaker 1: Maggie and Paul murdog were murdered well over a year ago.
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Speaker 1: How many dead bodies does it take connected to that
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Speaker 1: one family for there to be a single criminal and die,
3:00
Speaker 1: but such as murder, what's happening? Well, I think that
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Speaker 1: sled South Carolina Law Enforcement Division really wanted to make
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Speaker 1: sure that they had everything in place to bring this
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Speaker 1: indictment in front of the grand jury, probably at College
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Speaker 1: in County where the murders were committed, to the Moselle property,
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Speaker 1: and the fact that Elik has been in jail since
3:24
Speaker 1: I think October November gave them some time that they
3:29
Speaker 1: didn't have people saying why is this guy walking around?
3:31
Speaker 1: Why does this guy walking around? So they I think
3:33
Speaker 1: I bought them some time with all the white collar
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Speaker 1: crimes of the had been committing to make sure that
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Speaker 1: this very influential, very powerful family did not interfere with
3:46
Speaker 1: their investigation, and they got everything in place they needed to.
3:48
Speaker 1: They got people to talk. Maybe you wouldn't have talked,
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Speaker 1: so it's it's it's huge. The grand jury is being
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Speaker 1: tomorrow we understand didn't interfere with the investigation. Okay, hold on,
4:04
Speaker 1: of course, I think they're interfering with the investigation. And
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Speaker 1: you darn right, Matt Harris. They did all of this
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Speaker 1: legwork while Alex Vernock is still behind bars. Now he's
4:16
Speaker 1: tried to get out on a bond, he hasn't been
4:18
Speaker 1: able to do it, and we've had one charge after
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Speaker 1: the next. It's all about embezzling money. And why that
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Speaker 1: law firm had their nose and the ground and their
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Speaker 1: tail in the air. I don't know, because he has
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Speaker 1: apparently embezzled millions of dollars from the firm from clients.
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Speaker 1: And what do they do sit back and have a
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Speaker 1: cup of hot tea at the country club. I don't
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Speaker 1: know what's going on with that law firm, but as
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Speaker 1: far as this family not trying to interfere with the investigation, Jackie,
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Speaker 1: please play cut seventy two. This is Anne Emerson at
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Speaker 1: ABC News four. On October twenty twenty one, Alec Murdoch
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Speaker 1: called his brother, John Marvin Murdock and his son Buster.
5:01
Speaker 1: They were on a trip to Nevada, now made notorious
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Speaker 1: by this photo of John Marvin and Buster at a
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Speaker 1: Las Vegas casino table. It ended up as an exhibit
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Speaker 1: in court against Alec Murdoc. Alec called his family to
5:15
Speaker 1: warn them in court the other day. They made a
5:17
Speaker 1: big deal about think they're going to be moving to
5:20
Speaker 1: trying to prevent us from selling stuff. Right, we need
5:24
Speaker 1: to get as much as we can completed on the call,
5:28
Speaker 1: John Marvin suggests selling some of the farm equipment to
5:32
Speaker 1: pay off some of Alex Detts, but says it must
5:34
Speaker 1: be done on the up and up. You might speak
5:37
Speaker 1: to Jim if you get a chance, just to grin
5:39
Speaker 1: out what kind of time frame he thinks before they
5:42
Speaker 1: get any kind of order preventing us from doing anything? Okay,
5:47
Speaker 1: And I mean, well, I'm I'm just doing doing everything
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Speaker 1: by the book. And on board a lank whig squirreling
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Speaker 1: it away is going to pay bank stuff, Well, it
5:56
Speaker 1: go to the unsecured note, so so everything else something
6:00
Speaker 1: securing it. So it makes six insecured items would go
6:03
Speaker 1: to an unsecured notice by the book. My rear end,
6:07
Speaker 1: this guy's not worried about by the book. Here he
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Speaker 1: is behind bars and his wife and his son cold
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Speaker 1: in the great and he is trying to manipulate assets
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Speaker 1: and it'll be Matt Harris. How can you even say
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Speaker 1: that this family has not been interfering with the investigation
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Speaker 1: b s. That is not true. I guaranteem to you
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Speaker 1: that because if he is behind bars trying to move
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Speaker 1: his money around, you know he's behind bars trying to
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Speaker 1: manipulate evidence and witnesses to save his own skin. I
6:45
Speaker 1: say they're they're going to try to do it, and
6:47
Speaker 1: I think Sled is being very careful not to let
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Speaker 1: them do it, and they don't have to to listen
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Speaker 1: to the pressure of anybody. Is the fact that Lex
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Speaker 1: already behind bars, he was walking around, would maybe to
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Speaker 1: hurry the investigation. And you know you don't want anything,
7:05
Speaker 1: as you know NaNs, you don't anything that could talk
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Speaker 1: give you used an appeal, So you want to make
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Speaker 1: sure you got this locked down and give you more time.
7:11
Speaker 1: When the guys in Fred Fine, I agree. I don't
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Speaker 1: want to boomerang to hit me in the neck in
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Speaker 1: court or on appeal, but to suggest this family it
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Speaker 1: isn't interfering. That's all they do and it's all about money.
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Speaker 1: Let me go to Joe Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics, jacksonall
7:26
Speaker 1: State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet, host of
7:29
Speaker 1: a brand new series It's a hit on. iHeart body
7:32
Speaker 1: backs of Joe Scott Morgan, Joe Scott just a moment. Okay,
7:37
Speaker 1: to this day after my fiance's murder. To this day,
7:42
Speaker 1: I still have nightmares about his murder, about the same
7:46
Speaker 1: things happening to my family and my children. It never
7:50
Speaker 1: goes away, the tiniest threat or no threat. It's a
7:55
Speaker 1: big deal to me. I see danger behind every tree
7:58
Speaker 1: and every white van that goes by. And here this
8:03
Speaker 1: guy is. His wife and son are dead, dead by
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Speaker 1: gunshot wounds to the torso and face, and he's worried
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Speaker 1: about moving money around. I just I'm so mad I
8:17
Speaker 1: could stick at you and nail and half. Yeah. There
8:20
Speaker 1: there's a level of callousness that comes along with this case.
8:23
Speaker 1: That's a nice way to put it here. He is
8:25
Speaker 1: looking at murder charges and he's trying to move money around, right,
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Speaker 1: And you know, it's like these people are the angel
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Speaker 1: of death, Nancy. It's not just his wife and son
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Speaker 1: that are dead, it's like everywhere they go, people drop
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Speaker 1: over dead. You know, we're thinking about you know, Gloria
8:41
Speaker 1: Sadderfield for instance. We don't know that they're connected with that,
8:45
Speaker 1: but they're they're gonna, they're gonna exhume her body. We've
8:49
Speaker 1: got this young man found dead in the road. Did
8:51
Speaker 1: you kind of just stop you for one moment? Sure?
8:54
Speaker 1: They might as well have just pushed her down the stairs.
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Speaker 1: And I'll tell you why I say that, because isn't
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Speaker 1: it true Matt Harris saw a star of the Murdlock
9:02
Speaker 1: Family Murders podcast. Isn't it true that after miss Saderfield
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Speaker 1: fell down the steps outside their home because of their
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Speaker 1: dogs apparently? And we had this cool, calm collected phone
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Speaker 1: call by Maggie and the Sun with nine one wait
9:19
Speaker 1: go with me on this. Then Murdog goes to her
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Speaker 1: family and he says, hey, sue me. I'll handle the case.
9:30
Speaker 1: My law firm will handle the case. Sue me because
9:32
Speaker 1: I want you to be compensated. My insurance is going
9:35
Speaker 1: to cover it. You don't feel like you're taking it
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Speaker 1: out of my pocket. Sue me. I'd be mad if
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Speaker 1: you didn't. And then they do sue him. He arranges
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Speaker 1: the whole lawsuit and then he steals the money. He
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Speaker 1: steals the money from his housekeeper's family and On top
9:55
Speaker 1: of that, the dog story was something I think he
9:58
Speaker 1: created to be hones with you. He beat the paramedics there,
10:03
Speaker 1: and he was thinking on his feet. That's how his
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Speaker 1: sick mind worked. He immediately said, oh, she told me
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Speaker 1: the dogs knocked her over. Well, she'd never had consciousness.
10:14
Speaker 1: As far as we know, no one else has heard
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Speaker 1: her say anything. No one else said she was conscious.
10:18
Speaker 1: But he started this story immediately about the dogs changes
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Speaker 1: the whole insurance thing. I'm so glad you said that,
10:24
Speaker 1: and feel free to interrupt me right back. Okay, this
10:26
Speaker 1: is a free for all. Okay, this ain't no tea
10:28
Speaker 1: party at Higrave. Higrams all like to say, that's exactly
10:32
Speaker 1: what happened in the murders of Maggie and Paul Man.
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Speaker 1: If I were trying this case, i'd put that estate's
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Speaker 1: theory number one. Similar transaction over and over. He takes
10:44
Speaker 1: control of the narrative and spins it out like Rumple's stills,
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Speaker 1: because in that case he started spinning out the narrative
10:51
Speaker 1: that she fell on the dog, the dogs caused her
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Speaker 1: to fall, and this narrative he gets there again at
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Speaker 1: a double murder and spinning his tale take a listen
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Speaker 1: oar Cut sixty eight w y f F. The bodies
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Speaker 1: of Maggie and Paul Murdoch were found on June seventh
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Speaker 1: of twenty twenty one at home on the family's land
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Speaker 1: in Colleton County. The corner says they were both shot
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Speaker 1: several times, and in the months that followed, sled said
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Speaker 1: it found evidence of other crimes surrounding the Murdoch family.
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Speaker 1: Alec Murdoch was charged with dozens of fraud related crimes
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Speaker 1: after authorities say he stole millions of dollars from his
11:29
Speaker 1: clients and from the family of his former housekeeper, Gloria Sadderfield.
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Speaker 1: She died after a fall at the Murdoch home. Murdoch
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Speaker 1: and a former client, Curtis Smith, were also charged in
11:40
Speaker 1: a botched attempted suicide plot. I mean, at the very beginning,
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Speaker 1: Susan Williams jump in. Whoever that is jump in. I
11:50
Speaker 1: think it's Matt Harris. The ability for him, as you said,
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Speaker 1: to quickly get in the narrative, the Gloria Sadderfield thing.
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Speaker 1: Ban he's at the dogs, he goes to town. He
12:02
Speaker 1: also introduces his best friend to the sado Field family,
12:05
Speaker 1: Corey Fleming, who he says, your health, Tay carry you,
12:08
Speaker 1: and they work together to steal money from the sado fields.
12:11
Speaker 1: He spends the story on the Labor Day attempted suicide
12:16
Speaker 1: shooting on the side of the road with cousin Eddie.
12:21
Speaker 1: He's right on that story and this is how it happened.
12:23
Speaker 1: But it's not just that. Remember Mallory Beach and the
12:27
Speaker 1: boating accident. He was at the hospital. Oh wait, is
12:30
Speaker 1: this Darctor Dupre, Yes, it is. Let me just introduce
12:33
Speaker 1: you with me is doctor Michelle Dupree, and she's very
12:36
Speaker 1: critical today. She is joining us from this location. I've
12:40
Speaker 1: met with her there there in South Carolina. She is
12:44
Speaker 1: a forensic pathologist, she is a medical examiner, she has
12:48
Speaker 1: been a law enforcement and she is the author of
12:51
Speaker 1: the Homicide Investigation Field Guide. You're right, doctor Dupree, because
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Speaker 1: even in that case, same m O. He's like a
13:00
Speaker 1: ghoul standing over bedsides at the hospital trying to spin
13:06
Speaker 1: out what really happened to this teen girl, nineteen year
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Speaker 1: old Mallory Beach, who was thrown off his boat because
13:15
Speaker 1: his son was drunk as a skunk, high as a kite.
13:19
Speaker 1: And we had been to the location and looked at
13:22
Speaker 1: it ourselves where he crashed, crashed into pilings and said,
13:28
Speaker 1: this girl flying flying off his boat. She floated in
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Speaker 1: that water for three days before rescue could find her.
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Speaker 1: Go ahead, doctor Dupree, and state what you were saying.
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Speaker 1: I was just saying that he was at the hospital
13:41
Speaker 1: trying to interfere with the doctors and the nurses treating
13:44
Speaker 1: those children, and he was trying to corner their story
13:48
Speaker 1: and try to get them to not say anything and
13:50
Speaker 1: let him architect that whole story that they were about
13:53
Speaker 1: to tell. And he did the same thing with the
13:55
Speaker 1: Stephen Smith case. He approached the family and tried to
13:59
Speaker 1: get try to be benevolent to them. Why is that?
14:03
Speaker 1: Why does he try to do these things? Time Stories
14:18
Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace Susan E. Williams, South Carolina, high profile
14:24
Speaker 1: defense attorney, former prosecutor. You can find her at Carolina
14:30
Speaker 1: Lady Lawyer, Susan. She's right. I forgot for a moment
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Speaker 1: about the very first body that we know of, the
14:39
Speaker 1: teen boy found out in the road. Murdog was sniffing
14:44
Speaker 1: around all the witnesses on that case too. We just
14:48
Speaker 1: passed the one the anniversary of Stephen Smith's passing it's
14:52
Speaker 1: my understanding according to sources that the South Carolina Law
14:56
Speaker 1: Enforcement Division has opened an investigation regarding that death. Well,
15:01
Speaker 1: they said yes, a matter of fact, they opened that
15:03
Speaker 1: case based on something they found during this murder investigation.
15:06
Speaker 1: So that'll be interesting to see what they learned during
15:10
Speaker 1: this investigation. Joe Scott, I want you to hear this
15:13
Speaker 1: about him spinning out the story and it starts. You
15:16
Speaker 1: heard our friend Matt Harris, morning show hostbe ellen k
15:20
Speaker 1: and star of MURDERI Family Murders podcast state that he
15:25
Speaker 1: shows up on all these scenes. You know, that reminds
15:29
Speaker 1: me of Wayne Williams. Remember him. He murdered many of
15:34
Speaker 1: the missing and murdered Atlanta young boys and men. I
15:39
Speaker 1: don't know if he did all of them, but he
15:41
Speaker 1: did a lot of them. He would show up. He
15:43
Speaker 1: was a stringer, he was an amateur newscaster. He would
15:50
Speaker 1: show up sometimes before the cops even showed up at
15:54
Speaker 1: these scenes where they would find the dead bodies. Wow,
15:57
Speaker 1: what a coincidence, right, But Wayne Williams aside, listen to
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Speaker 1: Alex Mordog now, Jackie, this is our cut twenty seven
16:05
Speaker 1: when we covered Alex Morlot at the very beginning it's
16:09
Speaker 1: cut twenty seven, and UM, I want you to hear goss.
16:15
Speaker 1: There's so many nine on one called to pick from. Um, yep,
16:21
Speaker 1: let's hear that one. Okay. What is her name? Maggie,
16:29
Speaker 1: Maggie and Paul Maggie. Yes, ma'am. Okay, please hurry. We're
16:38
Speaker 1: getting somebody out there to you asking you these questions.
16:41
Speaker 1: Don't flow them down? Okay? Are you sure they're not breathing?
16:53
Speaker 1: Is he moving? Now? Your son? I know you said
16:55
Speaker 1: that she was shot, but what about your son? Nobody,
17:01
Speaker 1: they're not the one. What is your telephone number? And
17:17
Speaker 1: does anything look out of place? Ma'am? Not not particularly really, no, ma'am. Okay.
17:32
Speaker 1: You know doctor Sherry Schwartz joining me, forensic psychologists and
17:35
Speaker 1: author of Criminal Behavior and Where Law and Psychology Intersect,
17:41
Speaker 1: Doctor Sherry. I'd be very curious if when the cops
17:44
Speaker 1: in the MTS got there, if he was actually shedding
17:47
Speaker 1: tears or if he was just doing the whole thing
17:51
Speaker 1: to pretend he's crying. And he also says I only
17:56
Speaker 1: touched them to see if they were alive. So much
18:01
Speaker 1: of what he is saying is calculated, and he's already
18:04
Speaker 1: spinning out his story. Even then, what behavior would you
18:09
Speaker 1: look for if you had been the cop or the
18:13
Speaker 1: MT that first arrived on the same Doctor Schwartz, Well,
18:17
Speaker 1: one of the first things that I would look for is,
18:20
Speaker 1: as you mentioned, the presence of true emotion, Right, is
18:24
Speaker 1: there really true grief? Here? Is their fear? Because that's
18:28
Speaker 1: a primary response anytime you're going to see somebody, especially
18:33
Speaker 1: your loved ones who are deceased and they've clearly been murdered, Right,
18:37
Speaker 1: You're going to be fearful. You're going to want to
18:41
Speaker 1: be cooperative, and you're certainly not going to be trying
18:45
Speaker 1: to make excuses for why you touch certain things. This
18:48
Speaker 1: is going to be further from your mind. Oh I'm
18:50
Speaker 1: glad you said that, doctor Sherry, because I was just
18:54
Speaker 1: thinking back as you were talking about when my fiancee Keith,
18:58
Speaker 1: was murdered, and when I stayed with my father after
19:02
Speaker 1: he died and waited for them to come get his body.
19:05
Speaker 1: Everybody left it. I just couldn't leave them alone. And
19:08
Speaker 1: I wish that I hadn't seen what I did see
19:12
Speaker 1: of my father. I mean, Joe Scott Morgan, that sticks
19:15
Speaker 1: with you the rest of your life. And I'm glad
19:19
Speaker 1: I did not see my fiance's open casket. I'm glad
19:24
Speaker 1: I didn't see that, But imagine Joe Scott coming and
19:28
Speaker 1: finding your wife shot. Wasn't she shot in the face
19:33
Speaker 1: in the head? Well? What we do know, and this
19:35
Speaker 1: is per our friends at FIT News. They've talked about
19:39
Speaker 1: how they know that she was or it has been
19:42
Speaker 1: stated to them that she was shot execution style while
19:46
Speaker 1: laying on the ground. And that's kind of interesting when
19:49
Speaker 1: you think about it from a forensic standpoint because based
19:53
Speaker 1: upon that, and we think that she was shot with
19:55
Speaker 1: probably some type of military style platform weapon. Remembered the
20:00
Speaker 1: shot with the shot right the sun was shot with
20:03
Speaker 1: a shot gun. Now you know what they would have
20:04
Speaker 1: had to have done in order to validate this at
20:07
Speaker 1: the scene once her body was removed. These are probably
20:11
Speaker 1: through through gunshot wounds. You're talking about a high velocity rifle.
20:14
Speaker 1: They would have gone over the area where her body
20:16
Speaker 1: was found and with a metal detector and recovered those
20:19
Speaker 1: rounds that were in the ground, and that's going to
20:21
Speaker 1: be an indicative of the fact that she was lying
20:24
Speaker 1: flat on the ground and she and it says Nancy
20:27
Speaker 1: that she shot multiple times. They don't really say how
20:31
Speaker 1: many times, but we know that she was shot in
20:33
Speaker 1: multiple times, and of course the sun was hit by
20:36
Speaker 1: two shotgun blasts. And Matt Harris joining me any morning
20:38
Speaker 1: show of Matt Ramona wl n K and star of
20:42
Speaker 1: Murdoch Family murders. First of all, several things coming to mind.
20:47
Speaker 1: What were the two weapons used? We know at least
20:50
Speaker 1: one was a Murdoch family weapon. Gee, I wonder who
20:54
Speaker 1: got ahold of that. But to hear him articular late
21:00
Speaker 1: all of that on the nine one one call, I mean,
21:04
Speaker 1: I know I'm projecting, but I could hardly speak after
21:09
Speaker 1: Keith Smarterer. This was particularly brutal. The word is with
21:15
Speaker 1: the AR fifteen, especially at that closive range. Maggie, his
21:19
Speaker 1: wife was decapitated, or very close to being decapitated. That's
21:24
Speaker 1: not awful. I mean, that's just beyond gruesome. And then
21:29
Speaker 1: you see your son also, who is blasted in the
21:32
Speaker 1: face with a buckshot and bird shot. So it is
21:39
Speaker 1: hard to imagine, even talking on the phone, seeing your
21:44
Speaker 1: wife in that kind of shape and your son, Matt.
21:48
Speaker 1: How do you theorize the use of two weapons. A
21:52
Speaker 1: lot of people automatically say, wow, it must have been
21:56
Speaker 1: too perps. Not true. I think the I don't. The
22:00
Speaker 1: big question is who was shot first. But with the
22:05
Speaker 1: if you use the shotgun, probably only has the bird
22:08
Speaker 1: shot and the buckshot in it, and you're not going
22:12
Speaker 1: to load it again. That's gonna take forever. You're on
22:15
Speaker 1: a hunting area, there the AR fifteen and the guns.
22:21
Speaker 1: The guns are all there. Sometimes they're on the back
22:24
Speaker 1: of some of the gaiters and things they drive around,
22:27
Speaker 1: so you give easy access. So it's not a big
22:29
Speaker 1: deal really to think about shooting one and picking up
22:32
Speaker 1: another gun. It's only a few feet away. It's not
22:35
Speaker 1: Everybody went to the right away, and including me that
22:36
Speaker 1: there had to be two people. But when you have
22:38
Speaker 1: access to guns that quickly, it's easy to go from
22:42
Speaker 1: one gun to the other. Okay, so one was a shotgun,
22:45
Speaker 1: one was an AR fifteen, correct. Yeah, And saying that
22:49
Speaker 1: she was lying down and shot execution style on the head,
22:52
Speaker 1: I don't know that I agree with that, but I'm
22:54
Speaker 1: not privy dotr D free to all of the autopsy
22:58
Speaker 1: findings yet we will be. But I don't see why
23:02
Speaker 1: she couldn't have been shot and the torso and then
23:04
Speaker 1: after she felt shot in the head to finish it, off,
23:06
Speaker 1: and that is more likely. I believe what happened. My
23:09
Speaker 1: sources have actually told me that Maggie was lured there,
23:13
Speaker 1: that Paul was there first, and that Maggie was lord
23:16
Speaker 1: there a bit later. So whether that's true or not
23:19
Speaker 1: I don't know, but that sources that I have have
23:21
Speaker 1: actually told me that, how do you think she was
23:23
Speaker 1: lord there? Anybody jump in, This is matt from impact
23:26
Speaker 1: of Influence. Yes, she We talked to John Marvin alex
23:32
Speaker 1: younger brother, and he indeed said Maggie was in Edistove.
23:36
Speaker 1: It was called to come to Moselle because they were
23:40
Speaker 1: going to go see the father who was in the hospital.
23:44
Speaker 1: Paul came from work in John Marvin's truck. They were
23:50
Speaker 1: there prior to him leaving to go to see his mother,
23:56
Speaker 1: which is a weird timeline. We get it out if
23:58
Speaker 1: you want. But yes, she was called have a family dinner.
24:01
Speaker 1: And that raises some questions too, like who made the
24:05
Speaker 1: dinner because John Marvin said he didn't know if Blanca,
24:08
Speaker 1: who was there their housekeeper cook at the time, when
24:11
Speaker 1: Moiselle or Maggie made the dinner. Well, wait a minute,
24:14
Speaker 1: how do we know they even had dinner? Oh? Well,
24:16
Speaker 1: they were supposed to have dinner. Okay, do you know
24:18
Speaker 1: that that was the that was the plan, because I
24:20
Speaker 1: think we would have had evidence where they went out
24:23
Speaker 1: to dinner or where they ate in the home that
24:26
Speaker 1: they dishwasher was still running something like that. Yeah, we
24:29
Speaker 1: don't know any that yet. That'll have to come out,
24:31
Speaker 1: but that was the plan anyway, to have them to
24:35
Speaker 1: have dinner. Yes, and then we very I don't know
24:40
Speaker 1: if that the person, the Blanca who was working there,
24:44
Speaker 1: if she knows something. We haven't heard much of her.
24:46
Speaker 1: We know that Elick on the jail house tapes has
24:50
Speaker 1: mentioned her a couple of times, having talked to Blanco,
24:52
Speaker 1: where's Blanca house, Blanka doing blah blah blah. So I'm
24:54
Speaker 1: interested to find out that she has any insight into
24:57
Speaker 1: this and where she is and what's going on. We
24:59
Speaker 1: haven't heard much. Also, there is there are sources that
25:01
Speaker 1: have suggested to me that they were both killed a
25:05
Speaker 1: good bit earlier than what has been stated, that they
25:08
Speaker 1: were actually killed before Alex went to visit his father,
25:12
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, in the hospital, and that was to set
25:15
Speaker 1: up an alibi. So my question is I want to
25:19
Speaker 1: know from that crime scene tell me about the blood.
25:22
Speaker 1: How dried is it? You know what this interesting, doctor Dupree.
25:26
Speaker 1: I went round and round with you and meeting you, specifically,
25:31
Speaker 1: doctor Michelle Dupree, immediately after the shootings, about this very
25:36
Speaker 1: thing about whether the blood was dried, had the body
25:40
Speaker 1: temperature decreased to any significant amount so we could tell
25:46
Speaker 1: how long he had been how long they had been dead,
25:49
Speaker 1: to verify or destroy his timeline, Remember that we went
25:55
Speaker 1: over it and over it and over it. And we
25:57
Speaker 1: don't know that because we don't know what the coroner
26:01
Speaker 1: made to make those determinations. It's simply his word, but
26:04
Speaker 1: how did he make those determinations? And we just don't know.
26:07
Speaker 1: I want to know how dry was it? For those
26:09
Speaker 1: of you just joining us, bombshell an indictment we believe
26:13
Speaker 1: will be handed down Thursday by a grand jury. In
26:17
Speaker 1: many jurisdictions, grand juries meet on specific days. In my
26:21
Speaker 1: old jurisdiction, it was every Tuesday and Thursday, and it
26:26
Speaker 1: would go for hours and hours. And when you're a
26:28
Speaker 1: young lawyer, you're sent to grand jury, you present evidence,
26:33
Speaker 1: there is no cross examination. You may have only one witness,
26:37
Speaker 1: like a lead detective in a case, and the grand
26:40
Speaker 1: jury can ask questions. There's normally about forty people in
26:43
Speaker 1: there taking off the voter registration logs, and they have
26:48
Speaker 1: a free fraud with the witness if they want to.
26:50
Speaker 1: If not, the witness leaves and the district attorney puts
26:55
Speaker 1: it to them. True bill or no bill. It's pretty
27:00
Speaker 1: and dride. Take a listen to our cut sixty nine.
27:03
Speaker 1: Our friends at ABC needs four. John Marvin Murdoch says
27:06
Speaker 1: SLED paid him a courtesy visit this morning, exactly four
27:10
Speaker 1: hundred days after his nephew and sister in law were killed.
27:15
Speaker 1: John Marvin Murdoch says SLED told him they planned to
27:19
Speaker 1: charge his brother Alec, in connection with the murders of
27:22
Speaker 1: his wife Maggie and son Paul Murdoch. John Marvin says
27:26
Speaker 1: SLED came to tell him the news today because they
27:29
Speaker 1: did not want the Murdoch family or Maggie's family, the
27:32
Speaker 1: brand Setters, learning about the charges through the media. I
27:37
Speaker 1: asked John Marvin how the family reacted to the news.
27:40
Speaker 1: He was very straightforward. He said, I don't know if
27:43
Speaker 1: SLED has it right or not. I don't know if
27:46
Speaker 1: law enforcement has the answers. We want the truth. I'd
27:50
Speaker 1: be willing to put money if I were a betting
27:52
Speaker 1: woman on the fact that sled South Carolina Law Enforcement
27:55
Speaker 1: Division has taken this long to bring murder charges for
27:58
Speaker 1: a very important reason. They got their ducks in a
28:02
Speaker 1: row because Susan Williams, high profile lawyer out of South Carolina.
28:06
Speaker 1: The minute they hand down an indictment, the defense Murdog
28:11
Speaker 1: can slap a speedy demand for speedy trial on the
28:14
Speaker 1: state and that means they got to go to trial
28:17
Speaker 1: within about six months, two grand jury sessions following the indictment.
28:22
Speaker 1: Isn't that true? It's true. They better be ready, that's correct.
28:25
Speaker 1: One thing I'm wanted to bring up talking about just
28:28
Speaker 1: going from the body zoom being exoomed of Gloria Siderfield,
28:35
Speaker 1: two bodies that won't be exoomed. We absolutely know or
28:39
Speaker 1: Paul Murdo and Maggie Murdof because their bodies were cremated.
28:43
Speaker 1: You know what, I'm so glad you said that. I
28:45
Speaker 1: completely forgot about that, And to you, Matt Harris joining
28:50
Speaker 1: us a podcast star of Impact of Influence, I guess
28:53
Speaker 1: that was Murdog's decision to cremate the bodies. I would
28:57
Speaker 1: have to think there was his decision, and that is
29:01
Speaker 1: and I mean, we still haven't seen Maggie's death certificate.
29:04
Speaker 1: Interestingly enough, we saw Paul's false death certificate says put
29:08
Speaker 1: the time of death at nine, but we have not
29:10
Speaker 1: seen Maggie's death certificate. And the college in County Corner
29:14
Speaker 1: put the time of the burners between nine and nine thirty.
29:17
Speaker 1: And just one clarification, Elik was not visiting his dad
29:21
Speaker 1: in the hospital that night. He was visiting his mom,
29:24
Speaker 1: which is twenty minute about a twenty minute drive. I
29:26
Speaker 1: thought he did both that evening. I thought he saw
29:29
Speaker 1: his father and his mother. He did his father earlier
29:32
Speaker 1: the day we believe he was. His lawyer said, from
29:35
Speaker 1: nine to nine thirty he was watching a game show
29:39
Speaker 1: with his mother in her house, which is about a
29:42
Speaker 1: twenty minute drive from Mozelle Man. This guy as so
29:47
Speaker 1: many people money. Maggie murdog was starting to bounce chicks
29:51
Speaker 1: at her charity events. That's not a good look. She
29:55
Speaker 1: had been seeing divorce lawyers. It was in the middle
29:58
Speaker 1: of divorce. All of his finance Anchell Shennan against in
30:01
Speaker 1: other words, embezzling to the teen and millions would have
30:04
Speaker 1: come out. He could not let that happen. And here
30:07
Speaker 1: he is with a money mode of twenty minutes away
30:10
Speaker 1: from the double murder of his wife and son, crime
30:26
Speaker 1: stories with Nancy Grace and now finally Thursday morning indictment
30:38
Speaker 1: is expected to happen. Let's take a listen to an
30:41
Speaker 1: Emerson ABC News four. John Marvin tells me he hasn't
30:45
Speaker 1: seen the evidence against his brother. However, Alec Murdock was
30:49
Speaker 1: first identified by his own attorneys as a person of
30:52
Speaker 1: interest in the murders back in the fall of twenty
30:55
Speaker 1: twenty one. But I also texted with Alec Murdock's lawyer,
30:58
Speaker 1: Jim Griffin today. Interestingly enough, he says we have not
31:03
Speaker 1: been advised by anyone associated with law enforcement or the
31:06
Speaker 1: Attorney General's office that Alec will be charged with murder.
31:10
Speaker 1: Griffin said, I am aware that's led advise the family
31:14
Speaker 1: that the intend to seek murder indictments from a grand
31:16
Speaker 1: jury later this week. We won't have any comment until
31:20
Speaker 1: charges are actually brought against Alec. Now, Alec is still
31:25
Speaker 1: behind bars on eighty one state grand jury charges, not
31:29
Speaker 1: for the murders. So far, the disgraced Hampton lawyer is
31:33
Speaker 1: only formally accused with various financial crimes, theft, fraud, and
31:38
Speaker 1: money laundering. There's also a drug trafficking allegations as well,
31:43
Speaker 1: and Murdock's bond is now set at seven million dollars.
31:46
Speaker 1: Back to you, Matt Harris joining us a star of
31:48
Speaker 1: the Murdock family murders. Impact of influence? Why now? What
31:53
Speaker 1: do you think hasn't it been I believe four hundred
31:55
Speaker 1: days since the murders? Is that the right count? Yeah? Yes,
32:00
Speaker 1: zackly livery a year, I think, as you have said,
32:04
Speaker 1: And then you know, through going through this, if you're
32:06
Speaker 1: going to indict somebody who's a high profiled figure, especially
32:13
Speaker 1: in that case, and especially a family of attorneys and
32:16
Speaker 1: he's got some of the best attorneys in the state
32:18
Speaker 1: working for him. At this point, you want to make
32:20
Speaker 1: sure every single thing is in a row. You also
32:23
Speaker 1: are getting possibly more and more people to talk like
32:27
Speaker 1: what his cousin Eddie saying, what is Chris the Chris
32:31
Speaker 1: Wilson phone calls that came out? Well, but what do
32:34
Speaker 1: you mean Chris Wilson's phone calls came out with Chris
32:37
Speaker 1: Wilson as an attorney friend of Alex, who Alex said,
32:43
Speaker 1: and it came out that Chris and Alec talked two
32:46
Speaker 1: times on the way from Moselle to Barneville, where his
32:50
Speaker 1: mother lives, and two times driving back from Barneville to Moselle.
32:54
Speaker 1: Those are what Aleck would probably be using as this ley.
32:58
Speaker 1: I couldn't have done it. I was, I was on
32:59
Speaker 1: the phone that it was with my mom. But if
33:02
Speaker 1: they find out, you know, through technology, were those phone
33:06
Speaker 1: calls actually made on the road or were they made
33:10
Speaker 1: from the murgency question? You said Alex Mardod was on
33:15
Speaker 1: the phone with an attorney friend, Chris Wilson, from Moselle
33:20
Speaker 1: the scene of the murders to his mother, and then
33:24
Speaker 1: from his mother's back to Moseelle. Correct, right, Which seems
33:29
Speaker 1: like a lot of phone calls to one guy. Okay,
33:31
Speaker 1: wait a minute, what a co inkiedink Joe Scott Morgan
33:36
Speaker 1: that he is at Moselle, their hunting lodge where the
33:39
Speaker 1: two murders go down. He leaves to visit his mother
33:43
Speaker 1: for one game show and they're murdered in the small
33:48
Speaker 1: window of time between then and him coming back to
33:52
Speaker 1: Moselle to call nine one one. I don't believe in
33:55
Speaker 1: coincidences in criminal law, Joe Scott Morgan. No, I don't either.
34:00
Speaker 1: And the fact that he is, you know, he kind
34:02
Speaker 1: of hovers over all of these cases where he's kind
34:05
Speaker 1: of moving in and out. He just happens to be
34:07
Speaker 1: at these specific locations. And again this goes back to
34:11
Speaker 1: this trail of bodies that are kind of connected throughout
34:15
Speaker 1: this entire story, Nancy, where he happens to be on
34:19
Speaker 1: the scene and enters in and enters out. And one
34:23
Speaker 1: quick point back to Gloria's Saderfield that is amazing to me.
34:27
Speaker 1: In this particular case, when she was essentially declared dead
34:32
Speaker 1: at the hospital and released, I find it very very
34:37
Speaker 1: fascinating that the corner where she died was never notified
34:43
Speaker 1: of her death. And Nancy, this is a traumatically related death.
34:48
Speaker 1: When she rolled into that hospital with this diagnosis of
34:52
Speaker 1: severe head injury, I mean it's severe too. She's treated
34:57
Speaker 1: by the staff that physician should have known better. He
35:00
Speaker 1: wound up, actually the attending actually wound up signing her
35:03
Speaker 1: death certificate. And with all of this pathology that she had,
35:08
Speaker 1: this head trauma, he still listed her manner of death. Remember,
35:12
Speaker 1: there's natural as a natural death, Nancy as a natural death.
35:16
Speaker 1: I mean, it's so deep that the wrongdoing is so
35:22
Speaker 1: intertwined throughout that area. Back to you, Matt, question Matt
35:27
Speaker 1: Harris joining me. So why are charges expected now after
35:33
Speaker 1: four hundred days? You said more people are talking. I
35:36
Speaker 1: think cell po data has been obtained. I wonder if
35:40
Speaker 1: there's not any video data such as ring doorbells, traffic stoplight.
35:47
Speaker 1: I don't know what. But what do you think brought
35:49
Speaker 1: about the charges now? Um? Well, I think it's those
35:54
Speaker 1: things that we talked about, and especially this the timeline
35:57
Speaker 1: being so tight you mentioned, you know that is so dark.
36:00
Speaker 1: Take there's murders between nine and nine thirty twenty minute
36:03
Speaker 1: drive to his mom's house, right, and how long was
36:06
Speaker 1: he in the mother's About thirty minutes? Yeah, not very long,
36:11
Speaker 1: you know. And they had to carefully coordinate and analyze
36:16
Speaker 1: the phone calls to the friend Chris Wilson with the
36:22
Speaker 1: game show he watched with his mother that he can
36:24
Speaker 1: so accurately remember, and the condition of the bodies, how
36:30
Speaker 1: long they had been dead, what else they could tell?
36:33
Speaker 1: Maybe what come? Do you know what kind of car
36:35
Speaker 1: he was driving? I? No, no, I'm not sure. Wh
36:38
Speaker 1: wasn't that big one he was driving when he got
36:40
Speaker 1: shot in the head. He was driving at that Mercedes. Um,
36:46
Speaker 1: I think they had two different Mercedes, but I think
36:48
Speaker 1: you know a lot of them are the law firms.
36:51
Speaker 1: But I think it's White had one and he had one.
36:53
Speaker 1: He was just trying to figure out if they had
36:54
Speaker 1: a NAV system. Minute and that takes a minute to
36:56
Speaker 1: get that information. Little known fact he had all new cars. Good.
37:00
Speaker 1: Good to hear because now they've got the NAV system.
37:02
Speaker 1: So there's so many things they had to assemble. So
37:05
Speaker 1: that's why the charges are coming. Now we believe. Do
37:08
Speaker 1: you think it will be difficult to charge a single
37:11
Speaker 1: defendant when there are two weapons used? Everybody on the
37:15
Speaker 1: panel jumping if you've got a thought, absolutely not. Hold on,
37:19
Speaker 1: I hear doctor dupree, Go ahead, doctor dupres Absolutely not.
37:23
Speaker 1: That is a forensic countermeasure. A minute, you're talking like
37:29
Speaker 1: an expert. What do you mean a forensic countermeasure. It's
37:33
Speaker 1: something that is used to throw the police off two guns.
37:36
Speaker 1: You automatically assume that there are two different perpetrators. So
37:40
Speaker 1: if a single person uses two guns, that's simus logical conclusion.
37:44
Speaker 1: But we call that a forensic countermeasure, so that we
37:47
Speaker 1: are not thrown off the case by some trick like
37:50
Speaker 1: that anybody else, well's not. Let's not forget that Elik
37:53
Speaker 1: Murdoch was a part time solicitor and his family had
37:58
Speaker 1: been solicitors for one hundred years, that he has been
38:02
Speaker 1: a part of many murder trials, whether be him or
38:06
Speaker 1: his father, or his grandfather or his great grandfather. The
38:10
Speaker 1: kind of guy. The guy is kind of aware of
38:11
Speaker 1: what you know, could throw people off as she is
38:14
Speaker 1: implying right there, or what needs to be done, or
38:17
Speaker 1: timelines or this, or that he's schooled in the whole thing.
38:19
Speaker 1: Oh very well, put you want to shop in on that.
38:23
Speaker 1: Just Scott Morgan about will it be difficult to prove
38:25
Speaker 1: a case against one person with two weapons have been used.
38:28
Speaker 1: I don't think it will. Well, it probably won't be,
38:31
Speaker 1: as I think the biggest the biggest problem they're going
38:34
Speaker 1: to have. I think that the defense is probably going
38:36
Speaker 1: to exploit in this is the fact that these are
38:38
Speaker 1: two shoulder fired arms. And that's always been my contention
38:41
Speaker 1: that you've got a shotgun which is a long arm,
38:44
Speaker 1: and you've also got this ar platform weapon that's a
38:47
Speaker 1: long arm, shoulder fired. It always seemed to make more
38:50
Speaker 1: sense to me that if you were, you know, in
38:52
Speaker 1: from a military and police perspective, you carry the aar
38:56
Speaker 1: and then you have a side arm a pistol, and
38:59
Speaker 1: it's just it's an odd it's an odd point data
39:03
Speaker 1: point along the way that you've got two shoulder fired arms.
39:06
Speaker 1: And granted, yes, this guy has got access two weapons,
39:09
Speaker 1: it's his property. But again I go back, there seems
39:13
Speaker 1: to be a lot of involvement with other parties. Are
39:16
Speaker 1: I'm trying to say he got somebody to help shie
39:20
Speaker 1: his wife and son with him, because I think it
39:22
Speaker 1: was just him. Well perhaps, And as doctor Dupree had
39:26
Speaker 1: rightly pointed out earlier per her sources, where she had
39:30
Speaker 1: stated that she that one had been lured there and
39:33
Speaker 1: that seems that seems logical. And then you bring the
39:36
Speaker 1: other one in. Oh my god, look, Maggie, our son
39:38
Speaker 1: is deceased now and she you know, immediately falls to
39:41
Speaker 1: the ground. She's crying, she's screaming and carrying on. The
39:44
Speaker 1: next thing, you know, she's to see Yep, it's news
39:47
Speaker 1: reported that it was there was a blood spatter on
39:50
Speaker 1: his shirt. Maybe And I forget which one of your
39:53
Speaker 1: experts I had on my show talking about it, he
39:55
Speaker 1: mentioned the long arm rifles. If you were using those,
39:58
Speaker 1: he thought it would unlikely you would get a spatter.
40:02
Speaker 1: So there's a little bit of a might be an
40:05
Speaker 1: issue there. I believe they went overboard to say it
40:08
Speaker 1: was a impact spatter, but they wouldn't say it was blood.
40:11
Speaker 1: But it had to be some type of bodily fluid
40:14
Speaker 1: because that's what causes impact spatter. Hey, Matt, let me
40:17
Speaker 1: ask you one more question. What evidence do they have
40:20
Speaker 1: on all the financial related charges about I can only
40:26
Speaker 1: guess to the teen and millions of dollars what evans?
40:28
Speaker 1: Do they have a paper trail? Oh? Yeah, they haven't
40:31
Speaker 1: got a huge, huge paper trail. They've got who have
40:34
Speaker 1: checks out to cousin Eddie who does not appear to
40:38
Speaker 1: have any money. And don't forget there's also the drug
40:41
Speaker 1: trafficking charges that just popped up a week ago or
40:44
Speaker 1: so with cousin Eddie and him and Alec and he
40:49
Speaker 1: had a fake account Forge, which was very close to
40:53
Speaker 1: a real company called Forge Take account. Yeah, kind of
40:56
Speaker 1: a mitigation and closely resemble the name of a mitigation firm, right, yeah, yes,
41:01
Speaker 1: And so they got tons of people were instead of
41:03
Speaker 1: like j C Pennies. Jacket says something like um C
41:08
Speaker 1: J Pennies or J D Pennies, some configuration like that
41:13
Speaker 1: to trick the court and everyone else to think clients
41:17
Speaker 1: money upon settlement from let's just saying insurance company would
41:21
Speaker 1: be funneled into this mitigation firm, but it was actually
41:24
Speaker 1: his accounts. I mean, there's a trail a mile wide.
41:29
Speaker 1: Plus you got a lot of clients that were never paid.
41:32
Speaker 1: You know. I just don't understand why this law firm
41:36
Speaker 1: didn't notice it until there were how many dead bodies
41:39
Speaker 1: let's see one, two, three, four or five dead bodies.
41:42
Speaker 1: But hey, that's on them. We wait as the grand
41:46
Speaker 1: jury hands down a true bill of indictment on double
41:51
Speaker 1: murder against Legal Air Alex Murdog Nancy Grace Crime Story,
41:58
Speaker 1: signing off goodbye, D three