Latest / Under the Docs / Fear as a Business Model: Bowling for Columbine Revisited (2002) | Under the Docs 014

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Fear as a Business Model: Bowling for Columbine Revisited (2002) | Under the Docs 014 · Under the Docs

0:00
Speaker 1: What could be the factor that caused this violent outburst
0:03
Speaker 1: and Columbine And if you just go by the last
0:06
Speaker 1: thing that the kids did, if that was the thing
0:08
Speaker 1: that made them snap, well, the last thing they did
0:10
Speaker 1: was they went to bowling class.
0:19
Speaker 2: Under the dukes.
0:21
Speaker 3: Yeah, under the docks, very Brad your looks fund? Could
0:28
Speaker 3: they original shots the.
0:32
Speaker 4: Under the ducks, under the ducks? Yeah, under the dox,
0:51
Speaker 4: under the ducks.
1:02
Speaker 1: This is under the Docks. Paranoid American Sean cris Killed
1:05
Speaker 1: the Mockingbirds podcast. This is Michael Moore Month, where we're
1:09
Speaker 1: putting ourselves through absolute torture and watching three different Michael
1:13
Speaker 1: Moore documentaries. The second one is Bowling for Columbines from
1:18
Speaker 1: two thousand and two. Again, like all of his movies,
1:21
Speaker 1: written and directed by Michael Moore, and this one is
1:25
Speaker 1: sort of a landmark. I don't know, I didn't know
1:27
Speaker 1: this before watching this, but this is the number one
1:31
Speaker 1: most profitable documentary ever released. This this thing made somewhere around
1:38
Speaker 1: two hundred million dollars, which would be impressive for even
1:41
Speaker 1: a Disney movie coming out let alone a documentary. So
1:45
Speaker 1: absolutely not just put Michael Moore on the map, but
1:48
Speaker 1: documentaries themselves.
1:50
Speaker 5: And the basic premise of this.
1:52
Speaker 1: Movie is that Michael Moore investigates the cause of gun
1:56
Speaker 1: violence in America, and this is set against the night
2:00
Speaker 1: teen ninety nine Columbine High School massacre, and he kind
2:03
Speaker 1: of uses this particular event to explain something really unique
2:07
Speaker 1: about America, which is our fear and our view on guns.
2:11
Speaker 5: Who knew.
2:13
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's pretty much guns are bad. That's a huge
2:17
Speaker 6: premise of this movie, and that like pretty much not
2:21
Speaker 6: just guns are bad, but Americans plus guns equal bad.
2:33
Speaker 1: Plotting the course of this particular documentary, I actually want
2:36
Speaker 1: to jump directly into one of the key claims, piggybacking
2:40
Speaker 1: off what you just said, the whole guns are bad thing,
2:43
Speaker 1: because one of the things that Michael Moore does in
2:45
Speaker 1: this he's like, look, look, look, look, I'm one of you.
2:48
Speaker 1: I grew up around guns. In fact, he shows a
2:52
Speaker 1: picture of him and he's holding the certificate and he says,
2:55
Speaker 1: I even won the Marksman's Award from the NRA. But
2:59
Speaker 1: the way that it's phrasing this movie, at least the
3:01
Speaker 1: way I'm watching it, he's almost implying as though it
3:04
Speaker 1: was some kind of competitive national thing, like I won
3:07
Speaker 1: this national something award for marksmanship training. And really this
3:12
Speaker 1: is a safety course that the NRA puts on specifically
3:15
Speaker 1: for new shooters or younger shooters, and it just kind
3:19
Speaker 1: of proves that you respect guns safety, you know, and
3:24
Speaker 1: once you can do that, and once you can hit
3:28
Speaker 1: a target from certain different locations, and there's a couple
3:31
Speaker 1: of requirements for it. But the point being is that
3:33
Speaker 1: thousands and thousands of kids get this certificate every single year.
3:37
Speaker 5: By the NRA.
3:39
Speaker 1: Now that doesn't take away from what he was saying.
3:41
Speaker 1: It doesn't necessarily lie or imply that it's bigger than
3:45
Speaker 1: it is. But the way that it's edited in here,
3:48
Speaker 1: and you understand the reason. The reason is so that
3:51
Speaker 1: when you watch this you don't think, oh, here's just
3:54
Speaker 1: another typical anti gun liberal.
3:56
Speaker 5: He's hated guns his whole life.
3:57
Speaker 1: He's making this point that he himself grew up in
4:01
Speaker 1: this area, grew up with guns, knows at least well
4:05
Speaker 1: enough about how to use a gun that he can
4:08
Speaker 1: get an award from the NRA, whatever that actually means,
4:12
Speaker 1: but that he's not an absolute outsider. He didn't just
4:15
Speaker 1: fly in from San Francisco and his Birkenstocks and just
4:18
Speaker 1: pointing the finger everywhere. So that's I think that's the
4:21
Speaker 1: reason that he brings that up. But it's sort of
4:23
Speaker 1: a claim that's worth poking at a little bit.
4:27
Speaker 6: Definitely, And throughout the film he makes a lot of
4:30
Speaker 6: claims like you said, where he kind of wants to
4:32
Speaker 6: be the average joe, like, man, I'm just a Michigan
4:35
Speaker 6: guy and Flint we go hitting, hunting, fishing, and he
4:38
Speaker 6: makes it seem like he's just an average joe to
4:41
Speaker 6: kind of go away from because at this point he's
4:44
Speaker 6: already been a Hollywood eliteist for a while, right, Roger
4:48
Speaker 6: and Me has come out almost over almost twenty years
4:51
Speaker 6: to this point, about around like fifteen years or whatever,
4:54
Speaker 6: and he wants to get back to like his roots,
4:57
Speaker 6: and he's even like in his hometown constantly a lint
5:00
Speaker 6: trying to like show people, hey, man, I'm just an
5:02
Speaker 6: average joe just like you.
5:05
Speaker 1: Yeah, nothing really would make me think that he's one
5:09
Speaker 1: of them. He doesn't really talk, walk, or like, he
5:12
Speaker 1: doesn't look like a duck, right, but you got I
5:15
Speaker 1: won't take that away. He's got the credentials that, yeah,
5:17
Speaker 1: he was familiar with guns enough to get an NRA award.
5:21
Speaker 1: The other one of the other major claims that he
5:24
Speaker 1: makes in this movie is that he's joking because it's
5:28
Speaker 1: a Michael Moore and sarcastic, but that the accessibility of
5:32
Speaker 1: guns is somehow part of this or are adding to
5:38
Speaker 1: the issue of gun violence in America. And the particular
5:41
Speaker 1: scene that he expresses this, there's a bank that's giving
5:45
Speaker 1: out a free shotgun or a free rifle if you
5:48
Speaker 1: open up an account with them. And the premise, of course,
5:51
Speaker 1: is that look at how crazy Americans are. You just
5:54
Speaker 1: walk into a bank and get a free gun and
5:56
Speaker 1: walk back out and even ask the guy that comes
5:59
Speaker 1: out to show him catalog of all the different guns.
6:02
Speaker 1: He says, is it dangerous to be handing out guns
6:05
Speaker 1: in a bank? And the implication is what that someone
6:09
Speaker 1: comes in, they sit down, they fill out, they give
6:11
Speaker 1: all of your qualified information, Here's where I live, here's
6:14
Speaker 1: where I work, and then they do a background check
6:17
Speaker 1: on you. They actually writ they showed him doing the
6:19
Speaker 1: background check. They hand over the gun. What's the guy
6:22
Speaker 1: gonna pull out ammo and load it and then just
6:24
Speaker 1: start going crazy in the bank now that they've got
6:26
Speaker 1: all of his And I mean, it's sort of a
6:28
Speaker 1: silly premise, and the question itself is also silly, where no,
6:33
Speaker 1: it's it's not dangerous to be handing out a gun
6:36
Speaker 1: in the bank. But you could see how an anti
6:38
Speaker 1: gun person that that would be this gotcha question, like
6:43
Speaker 1: what are you gonna give out a gun in a bank?
6:45
Speaker 5: Like, I don't know?
6:46
Speaker 1: So that was that was the claim, and I could
6:48
Speaker 1: see that that was him establishing bias really early on
6:51
Speaker 1: and maybe this is my bias coming out.
6:53
Speaker 6: No, I think you're absolutely right, because it's like one
6:56
Speaker 6: of the first scenes. It's in the beginning of the movie,
6:58
Speaker 6: and he does all that just like kind of like
7:01
Speaker 6: messing around while he's getting it, like huh, what does
7:03
Speaker 6: it mean by this mental health thing? Like, well, I
7:05
Speaker 6: haven't been locked up in a mental health facility and
7:07
Speaker 6: they're like, oh, then you're fine, kind of making it
7:10
Speaker 6: seem like, see they're not checking you. And then all
7:12
Speaker 6: of this is for his gotcha question at the end
7:15
Speaker 6: where he points to Raflesa, now do you think it's
7:17
Speaker 6: great to be handing out guns in a bank or
7:20
Speaker 6: something along that line. That's the exact quote, but you
7:23
Speaker 6: could tell that whole scene was for him to make
7:25
Speaker 6: that point so he can go to the next scene
7:28
Speaker 6: right like he wanted to let it, like, look, how
7:30
Speaker 6: crazy Americans are. They just hand you a rifle right
7:33
Speaker 6: out a bank and you can go shoot anybody up.
7:36
Speaker 1: And I hear that and I think, hell yeah, like
7:38
Speaker 1: that that is American exceptionalism, one of the few good
7:42
Speaker 1: parts of it. But again this is very biased, and
7:45
Speaker 1: to point out in that particular scene, if you go
7:48
Speaker 1: back and watch it, Michael Moore has the worst trigger
7:51
Speaker 1: discipline that you could imagine because even as he's holding
7:55
Speaker 1: this up and like posing and making his point, that
7:57
Speaker 1: finger is right on that trigger.
7:58
Speaker 5: Boy, like he doesn't have enough.
8:00
Speaker 1: So to me, that almost disqualified like all the credit
8:04
Speaker 1: that he was Like, look, I was a marksman as
8:06
Speaker 1: a kid. Here's my NRA award. That went out the
8:10
Speaker 1: window when I saw his trigger discipline. So anyways, the
8:14
Speaker 1: next claim, this is where it's gonna start getting into
8:18
Speaker 1: like classic Michael Moore just making stuff up there atry,
8:21
Speaker 1: But there's an animated sequence that makes a cup A
8:25
Speaker 1: lot of claims, some that we don't even have enough
8:27
Speaker 1: time to even get into. One of them is that
8:30
Speaker 1: America got all of its wealth in the eighteenth and
8:33
Speaker 1: early nineteenth century from slavery directly and that without I'm
8:38
Speaker 1: not gonna touch that one, okay, because that's an whole
8:40
Speaker 1: extra sue. Maybe next year when we go back into
8:43
Speaker 1: like the George Floyd and Tramon Martin stuff, he can
8:45
Speaker 1: get into that. But he makes another one right on
8:48
Speaker 1: the back of that claim that the KKK turns into
8:53
Speaker 1: the NRA and that somehow these two different entities are
8:57
Speaker 1: one and the same or they share the same DNA.
9:00
Speaker 1: None of that really matches up whatsoever if you just
9:04
Speaker 1: do the slightest amount of research into that topic. They
9:08
Speaker 1: weren't founded around so I mean, KKK had like two
9:12
Speaker 1: or three different resurgences. It was founded in eighteen sixty five.
9:16
Speaker 1: The NRA was founded in eighteen seventy one. So the
9:20
Speaker 1: claim that he's alluding to, and he doesn't bring up
9:23
Speaker 1: any dates or anything beyond this little cartoon claim, but
9:27
Speaker 1: that six years after the KKK was founded, that they
9:30
Speaker 1: had to go back in the hiding and they just
9:32
Speaker 1: re emerged as the NRA.
9:33
Speaker 5: Again.
9:34
Speaker 1: There's even people that hate the NRA can't necessarily back
9:37
Speaker 1: up this particular claim. And this takes up a good
9:40
Speaker 1: portion of the movie where it just goes Hey, we're
9:43
Speaker 1: going to talk about gun rights and gun and violent
9:47
Speaker 1: culture in America. But here, here's a quick cartoon about
9:50
Speaker 1: how slavery created this country. And here's another one about
9:53
Speaker 1: how the KKK founded the NRA, and then it goes
9:56
Speaker 1: back into Columbine again. So if it were me, I
9:59
Speaker 1: would have just clipped the this entire section out put
10:01
Speaker 1: it in whatever other documentary he was clearly working on
10:04
Speaker 1: at the time that never got panned out. But that
10:06
Speaker 1: was one of the major claims that he makes.
10:10
Speaker 6: And I'm with you, a false claim of it's two
10:13
Speaker 6: different organizations and he's just trying to This is where
10:17
Speaker 6: his influentialness kind of gets into play because of the
10:20
Speaker 6: slavery thing and the gun narrative and the KKK and
10:23
Speaker 6: the NRA. He tied this whole thread together of white
10:27
Speaker 6: supremacy and guns. So this kind of has been super
10:32
Speaker 6: influential in the whole left movement right like of like, oh,
10:35
Speaker 6: white supremacy equal gun owner.
10:37
Speaker 7: And I think that he's the one that planted those seeds.
10:41
Speaker 1: He definitely didn't do anything to prevent those from getting spread.
10:45
Speaker 1: This movie again being the most commercially successful documentary in history.
10:51
Speaker 1: I do think there's a lot to that that maybe
10:53
Speaker 1: Michael Moore is inadvertently behind some of like current wochus
10:58
Speaker 1: hum against gun rights and clain that it's all just
11:01
Speaker 1: a bunch of you know, white nationalist nut jobs. But
11:05
Speaker 1: he also he does this a few different times. Another
11:07
Speaker 1: way that he does this is he goes and he
11:09
Speaker 1: interviews someone working at a Lockheed Martin plant, and he's
11:14
Speaker 1: Michael Moore. Again, he'sn't saying this directly to the camera,
11:17
Speaker 1: but he's implying that these kids that grew up around Columbine,
11:22
Speaker 1: Lockheed Martin is in that vicinity and they're one of
11:25
Speaker 1: the biggest employers. Kind of like GM was, Lockheed Martin
11:28
Speaker 1: also fueled entire industries around there. And that the fact
11:33
Speaker 1: that a kid sees his dad going off to work
11:36
Speaker 1: at Lockheed Martin and knowing that Lockheed Martin is making
11:39
Speaker 1: missiles and these weapons of warfare, that now somehow that
11:43
Speaker 1: kid is like, oh, well, violence is okay, and you know,
11:46
Speaker 1: horrible school shootings are okay because my dad works for
11:49
Speaker 1: Lockheed Martin.
11:50
Speaker 5: He makes missiles.
11:52
Speaker 1: It's a very weak connection, but it takes up a
11:54
Speaker 1: large portion of this movie. They keep cutting back to
11:58
Speaker 1: this Lockheed Martin plant. And then he sort of is
12:03
Speaker 1: interviewing this guy and the guy makes a point because
12:05
Speaker 1: he actually says that to the guy he's interviewing. And
12:09
Speaker 1: the guy says, well, we make missiles for defense, and
12:13
Speaker 1: our missiles aren't used for doing aggressive acts. These are
12:17
Speaker 1: mainly for self defensive acts. And Michael Moore immediately just
12:21
Speaker 1: cuts to this huge montage and I'll go over this
12:24
Speaker 1: in our Hidden Treasure segment, but he goes into a
12:26
Speaker 1: whole montage of all these violent CIA overthrows and government coups.
12:30
Speaker 1: And so, I mean, it was a good gotcha question.
12:33
Speaker 1: He edits it well together, but it was almost non
12:36
Speaker 1: sequitur the point if the point is being made that
12:40
Speaker 1: you work close to a Lockheed Martin plant. So of
12:42
Speaker 1: course the school shooting was going to happen. I just
12:45
Speaker 1: I couldn't get from A to B the way that
12:46
Speaker 1: he was presenting it.
12:48
Speaker 6: Yeah, he wanted to show that the American imperialism and
12:53
Speaker 6: the military industrial complex is the cause of like these
12:56
Speaker 6: school shootings and the violence of a man Americans. And
13:00
Speaker 6: like he even goes as far as to like go
13:02
Speaker 6: to Canada because obviously Michigan is right next to Canada
13:06
Speaker 6: and like, hey, man, what do you think of these
13:08
Speaker 6: wacky Americans just shooting people all crazy?
13:10
Speaker 7: Just like they're like, yeah, you guys just murder people
13:13
Speaker 7: all the time.
13:13
Speaker 6: And then like goes to a small town in Canada
13:16
Speaker 6: and they go, oh, how many people have been.
13:17
Speaker 7: Murdering He's like wow, man, was there murder in your lifetime?
13:20
Speaker 6: He's like, well, yeah, in my lifetime like one, fifteen,
13:24
Speaker 6: twenty years ago, Like you know what I mean. They
13:26
Speaker 6: trying to hammer this point that like pretty much we're
13:29
Speaker 6: the only violent country.
13:32
Speaker 7: In the world.
13:33
Speaker 6: Like they even go through the statistics of the of
13:36
Speaker 6: eleven thousand people are killed by guns in nineteen ninety
13:40
Speaker 6: nine or something at that point in America, and then
13:44
Speaker 6: they're like Canada like one hundred, and then it's like
13:46
Speaker 6: the United Kingdom is sixty eight. But then they don't
13:50
Speaker 6: like kind of like go into the detail of like
13:52
Speaker 6: what do you mean by a gun death right? But
13:55
Speaker 6: the way that he narrates it is like either they're
13:57
Speaker 6: shooting up bang bang, or it's like just kids guns
14:00
Speaker 6: just laying around, kids picking them up and just shooting
14:03
Speaker 6: themselves or somebody else, and that like almost that we
14:06
Speaker 6: have an abundance of guns, that like, we just have
14:09
Speaker 6: piles of guns in our houses that is not being
14:12
Speaker 6: watched over, and that anybody could just come and get
14:15
Speaker 6: them and shoot you. Like, that's the narrative in the
14:17
Speaker 6: field that I get through this out this movie.
14:20
Speaker 7: Like I said in the previous episode, I do.
14:22
Speaker 6: Enjoy Michael Moore's way of putting films together, but his
14:26
Speaker 6: bias can get pretty tough to deal with throughout the
14:30
Speaker 6: movie and.
14:31
Speaker 1: See, and I actually do think that that was one
14:34
Speaker 1: of the better outcomes of this movie. One of the
14:38
Speaker 1: questions that is Bill worth thinking about, and he never
14:42
Speaker 1: really presents a good answer. He presents some of his examples,
14:46
Speaker 1: but the question being that if it's not accessibility to guns,
14:52
Speaker 1: because you could get for example, you could get guns
14:55
Speaker 1: by mail order in the forties, fifties, sixties, you have
14:58
Speaker 1: to go into a retail stores, so technically they were
15:01
Speaker 1: more accessible before the Columbine or some of the other
15:06
Speaker 1: recent events had happened. Also, if you look at the statistics,
15:11
Speaker 1: there are less gun owners in ninety nine than there
15:15
Speaker 1: were in forty nine. For example, there's more guns, but
15:18
Speaker 1: now it's because people went from owning like their one
15:21
Speaker 1: gun to now maybe they got two or three, maybe
15:23
Speaker 1: they got five, maybe they got fifty if you're really cool,
15:27
Speaker 1: But the actual number of people per capita of their
15:30
Speaker 1: own guns was going down. So some of the claims
15:32
Speaker 1: that he makes, he doesn't mention these ones directly. I
15:35
Speaker 1: just looked these ones up because they would have kind
15:38
Speaker 1: of gone counter to the narrative. The narrative being that
15:41
Speaker 1: they're all over the place. They're so easy to get,
15:43
Speaker 1: they're cheap, they're advertised, they're in movies. Now if you
15:46
Speaker 1: look back, they've always been in movies. They've always been,
15:49
Speaker 1: you know, readily available a lot of people. If anything,
15:51
Speaker 1: they're harder to get now than they were at any
15:54
Speaker 1: other point in history, at least in America. Although it'll
15:58
Speaker 1: go back into that racism thing again where you'll claim
16:00
Speaker 1: that the NRA was formed specifically to keep black people
16:04
Speaker 1: from owning guns, and that it plays He kind of
16:07
Speaker 1: dances around and he jumps around a whole lot in
16:09
Speaker 1: this movie, so it's not necessarily just about the Bowling
16:13
Speaker 1: for Columbine stuff.
16:15
Speaker 6: Yeah, that's part of the thing about this movie is
16:17
Speaker 6: that he kind of has his segments.
16:20
Speaker 7: It's almost like, I liked what you said earlier.
16:22
Speaker 6: It's almost like he's working on a few films at
16:25
Speaker 6: a time and then he's like, oh, it's a really
16:26
Speaker 6: good scene.
16:27
Speaker 7: I really like this.
16:28
Speaker 6: Because at one point he even goes to Compton, California,
16:31
Speaker 6: and like he's just like kind of like, oh, man,
16:34
Speaker 6: you know the violence here, and they're like, well, it's
16:36
Speaker 6: not as violin, you know, he because he is now
16:38
Speaker 6: some of the points he makes is great, like where
16:39
Speaker 6: he's making the point of like the media fear mongering, right,
16:43
Speaker 6: which we all know is true. The fear mongering of
16:45
Speaker 6: the media has been a thing forever, and he points
16:48
Speaker 6: this out. But at one point he's talking to a
16:50
Speaker 6: cop because he like they're like, well, you know, what
16:53
Speaker 6: would you go after? Lo, he's actually I think the
16:55
Speaker 6: news person he's talking to he goes if there was
16:57
Speaker 6: a kid.
16:57
Speaker 7: Drownding or a shooting, which one would you go to?
17:00
Speaker 7: And he's like, probably the shooting.
17:02
Speaker 6: And then he's talking about this is funny to me,
17:04
Speaker 6: pre climate change stuff, right, and he's talking about like, yeah,
17:07
Speaker 6: you know, we can't even see the Hollywood sign because
17:10
Speaker 6: all the smog, And he goes up to a cop
17:11
Speaker 6: and he's like, can we arrest someone for this, can
17:14
Speaker 6: we arrest somebody this smog?
17:17
Speaker 7: And I'm like, come on, man, what does this have
17:18
Speaker 7: to do with the film.
17:20
Speaker 6: And it seems like a theme that he does in
17:23
Speaker 6: his films a lot is like it's supposedly about one thing,
17:28
Speaker 6: but he doesn't focus on it, and he's all ower it.
17:30
Speaker 7: He's almost eighty HD about it, right, He's like.
17:33
Speaker 6: Ooh, look at that squirrel, Ooh, look at that quarter
17:35
Speaker 6: over there, this shiny thing, and he just gets so
17:38
Speaker 6: distracted and he lee leaves the point.
17:42
Speaker 1: We could do a fan edit of Bowling for Columbine
17:45
Speaker 1: and it would be like a forty minute documentary and
17:49
Speaker 1: you could cut out anything that had anything to do
17:51
Speaker 1: with Columbine or gun violence. You would put it in.
17:54
Speaker 1: You'd watch an entire forty minute documentary and be like,
17:56
Speaker 1: that's weird. He talked about climate change and racism the
17:59
Speaker 1: KKK and but nothing about Columbine. And inversely, if you
18:03
Speaker 1: edit it to just the Columbine stuff, this movie would
18:06
Speaker 1: go by so quickly. But so the lead. The lasting
18:12
Speaker 1: point there though, is it really is an interesting question
18:15
Speaker 1: that if there's other places in the world that have
18:18
Speaker 1: as many people that own guns, that have the same
18:21
Speaker 1: media consumption that we do. If everything else is exactly
18:25
Speaker 1: the same, why is it that America has like ten
18:29
Speaker 1: times the amount of violent gun crimes versus anywhere else
18:34
Speaker 1: in the world. And it's again, it's not just the accessibility.
18:38
Speaker 1: It's not just one or two different things. He doesn't
18:41
Speaker 1: make a really good claim.
18:43
Speaker 5: As to why.
18:44
Speaker 1: I'll put forth some of mine as we get to
18:45
Speaker 1: the end of this one, but yeah, those are those
18:48
Speaker 1: are some of the key claim. Is there anything else
18:49
Speaker 1: that I missed on that one?
18:51
Speaker 6: No, this like because he gets off in the weeds
18:54
Speaker 6: for a bit, so I don't want to get too
18:55
Speaker 6: much into the weeds.
19:03
Speaker 5: Hidden treasures overboard moments. What are yours? What are your
19:08
Speaker 5: hidden treasures in this movie?
19:09
Speaker 8: Well?
19:09
Speaker 6: I have one major one for me, and it's actually
19:13
Speaker 6: when they are talking about callumbying, there's a news reporter
19:16
Speaker 6: that is briefly it's very brief, right, but he's saying,
19:20
Speaker 6: like about Eric Harris's diary, and he talks about how
19:25
Speaker 6: Eric Harris in his diary was riding about hijacking planes
19:30
Speaker 6: and crashing them into New York City. And I thought
19:34
Speaker 6: that this was fascinating to me because this is in
19:37
Speaker 6: nineteen ninety nine, remember like, and for me, my conspiratorial
19:41
Speaker 6: mind and the thing that I connect stuff with is
19:43
Speaker 6: I was like, okay, if they're talking about this at
19:46
Speaker 6: that time, and then when you see the connection that
19:49
Speaker 6: you know on the FBI radar and is this some
19:52
Speaker 6: Manchurian candidate? It was just very brief and I know
19:57
Speaker 6: that like you'll miss it, like you can literally miss it.
19:59
Speaker 6: That's how if it was is three to five seconds.
20:01
Speaker 6: But for me it stood out like a sore thumb
20:04
Speaker 6: right that I just seen the flag plant. I'm like,
20:06
Speaker 6: oh my god, I forgot about this because when I
20:09
Speaker 6: originally saw you know, there's so much documentaries I'm watching
20:13
Speaker 6: like I did, it just didn't stand out. But because
20:15
Speaker 6: I came back to it, it jumped out the screen.
20:18
Speaker 6: I was literally doing something like, you know, walking around
20:21
Speaker 6: cleaning while I watching it, and I'm like, what did
20:22
Speaker 6: he say?
20:23
Speaker 7: And I was like, let me rewind that.
20:26
Speaker 6: And so when you get into their diaries and stuff,
20:30
Speaker 6: and it makes me think like, was these some of
20:33
Speaker 6: like the precursors, well not even precursors, because we just
20:37
Speaker 6: watched a Noble lie.
20:38
Speaker 7: It kind of reminded me of that Timothy McVeigh.
20:40
Speaker 6: It kind of reminds me of like all the stuff
20:42
Speaker 6: we talked about and what we've been getting into of
20:46
Speaker 6: like what is this, Like why is that in the film,
20:49
Speaker 6: and why does he not explore that more? It was
20:51
Speaker 6: so it's like a hit and gem, but also a
20:53
Speaker 6: frustration for me. I'm like, oh, you're just gonna throw
20:56
Speaker 6: this out here and be like, no, biggie. And when
20:58
Speaker 6: he put the movie out, it's sort of two thousand
21:00
Speaker 6: and two, right nine to eleven already happened, So I
21:04
Speaker 6: don't know why he didn't go further on it.
21:06
Speaker 7: But I for me, that was my major.
21:08
Speaker 6: Hitting gem, hidden treasure of this whole documentary because for me,
21:13
Speaker 6: I was like, oh my god, it got me down
21:15
Speaker 6: a rabbit hole, and I've been already.
21:16
Speaker 7: Researching a lot of stuff on it.
21:18
Speaker 6: Now I want to do an episode about that one
21:20
Speaker 6: day I killed the Balky Birds because I'm like, oh
21:23
Speaker 6: my god.
21:24
Speaker 5: Not just that.
21:25
Speaker 1: The Diaries specifically was about flying an airplane into a
21:30
Speaker 1: building in New York, and then the news reporter almost prophetically,
21:36
Speaker 1: it was like, of course, you know, these ideas were
21:39
Speaker 1: pure fantasy, Like, clearly this has happened before the actual
21:43
Speaker 1: nine to eleven happened, but it was we had that
21:45
Speaker 1: three to five second clip I kind of stopped what
21:48
Speaker 1: I was doing and paid attention to. And it's wild
21:51
Speaker 1: that you mentioned a noble lie too and getting into
21:54
Speaker 1: this conspiratorial Manchurian candidate, because also in Boland for Columbine,
21:59
Speaker 1: Michael Moore tracks down and interviews Terry Nichols's brother, James Nichols,
22:05
Speaker 1: and even gets footage of him putting a loaded forty
22:08
Speaker 1: four to his head and like being completely, like acting
22:12
Speaker 1: kind of crazy about it. It was why I was
22:15
Speaker 1: not expecting and I don't even remember after having watched
22:19
Speaker 1: this in the past that he had an interview with
22:22
Speaker 1: Terry Nichols's brother and it was this Again, there could
22:25
Speaker 1: have been three other documentaries inside of this Bowling for Columbine.
22:31
Speaker 1: It never really finds it it's perfect groove, but it
22:34
Speaker 1: has a whole lot of these wild moments. I think
22:36
Speaker 1: my number one hidden treasure of this movie though, is
22:41
Speaker 1: and it's not for me, it's for other people watching it.
22:45
Speaker 1: But I just imagine, if this is the most commercially
22:47
Speaker 1: successful documentary of all time, you've got a lot of
22:51
Speaker 1: normies that are walking into this not knowing what they're
22:54
Speaker 1: gonna get into. They don't have no idea what And
22:57
Speaker 1: for a good I want to say, like five ten minutes,
23:01
Speaker 1: he just throws this collage of all these CIA and
23:04
Speaker 1: military coups. So I'm just gonna mention the heavy hitters
23:08
Speaker 1: that he mentions. But just imagine your mom, your grandma,
23:11
Speaker 1: your aunt, whatever, like, goes to see this movie because
23:13
Speaker 1: everyone's seeing it, everyone's recommending it, and they come out
23:16
Speaker 1: and they're like, oh, I never heard about the nineteen
23:19
Speaker 1: fifty four Mozaedec of Iran getting replaced with the Shah
23:22
Speaker 1: by the CIA, or the fifty four overthrow of the
23:26
Speaker 1: president of Guatemala where two hundred civilians were killed, or
23:30
Speaker 1: the sixty three assassination of the Vietnamese president, or the
23:34
Speaker 1: September eleventh, nineteen seventy three coups in Chile where they
23:40
Speaker 1: assassinate Allende and put In Pinochet nineteen seventy seven. El
23:44
Speaker 1: Salvador nineteen eighty. They're training Osama bin Laden eighty one.
23:50
Speaker 1: He mentions the Iran Contra scandal nineteen eighty two. Billions
23:54
Speaker 1: are sent to Saddam Hussein eighty three. During that time,
23:58
Speaker 1: the White House then gives weapons to Iran, the people
24:01
Speaker 1: that are fighting Iraq. Eighty nine, the CIA agent Noriega,
24:06
Speaker 1: which they say disobeyed CIA orders causing them to invade
24:10
Speaker 1: Panava and remove him. Ninety one Iraq War ninety eight.
24:14
Speaker 1: He calls out Bill Clinton for bombing aspirin facilities and
24:19
Speaker 1: calling it you know, these these acts of war two thousand,
24:22
Speaker 1: the two thousand and one giving the Taliban two hundred
24:25
Speaker 1: and forty five million, and then in two thousand and
24:27
Speaker 1: one the CIA training bin Laden and that the bin
24:31
Speaker 1: Laden uses this to cause nine to eleven. I mean,
24:35
Speaker 1: I have seen all of these claims a whole bunch
24:37
Speaker 1: of other places over But again, your grandma, your or
24:40
Speaker 1: like your piano teacher, go and see this movie. And
24:43
Speaker 1: they walked out and they just got an info dumb
24:45
Speaker 1: about CIA coups. I couldn't have been happier like that.
24:49
Speaker 1: That scored so many points with me that at least
24:52
Speaker 1: someone went into this thinking it was going to be
24:54
Speaker 1: about gun rights and they walk around me and like, man,
24:56
Speaker 1: maybe we should fight back against this tyrannical government.
25:00
Speaker 6: No, and like you said it perfectly, it's not some
25:04
Speaker 6: fringe documentary.
25:05
Speaker 7: We're like, hey, you know, you got to go dig
25:07
Speaker 7: for it.
25:07
Speaker 6: Or your your uncle's uncles, a friend that like, you know,
25:11
Speaker 6: smokes and stuff like, hey, man, you want to check it.
25:13
Speaker 6: It's actually being told by like major news networks. It's
25:17
Speaker 6: being winning awards, making so much money and being suggested
25:21
Speaker 6: by soccer moms right like, oh, you should check out
25:24
Speaker 6: this because it's an anti gun and that he does have
25:26
Speaker 6: a lot of like things that we would agree with.
25:30
Speaker 6: That's where I'm like, hey, he's kind of he has
25:32
Speaker 6: some Alex Jones in him. As much as he probably
25:34
Speaker 6: can't stand Alex Jones.
25:36
Speaker 7: He has some of it.
25:38
Speaker 6: He's like the opposite end of the spectrum, right like,
25:42
Speaker 6: but Alex Jones, that's what he does is he's like
25:44
Speaker 6: boo boo boo boo boom.
25:45
Speaker 7: Here's all this information.
25:47
Speaker 6: And they even have a similar style of how they
25:49
Speaker 6: like Hit Street in interviews.
25:51
Speaker 7: And I would love to see them do a documentary
25:54
Speaker 7: together one day.
25:55
Speaker 1: Well do you think that Michael Moore would be more
25:59
Speaker 1: at home infiltrating Bohemian Grove or getting invited to Bohemian Grove?
26:05
Speaker 7: Oh? Man, I gotta say he's got it.
26:07
Speaker 6: He had to be there, right, What about that would
26:10
Speaker 6: have been great if Alex had like caught on camera
26:13
Speaker 6: Michael Moore part.
26:14
Speaker 1: Of the in Bohemian Grove. It might be too republican,
26:19
Speaker 1: but it does.
26:19
Speaker 5: I don't know. It feels like a Hollywood insider kind
26:22
Speaker 5: of thing. I don't know.
26:23
Speaker 1: It's it's a good question, good thought experiment. The other
26:27
Speaker 1: I guess hidden treasures for me. Aside from that list
26:30
Speaker 1: of Cia overthrows, there's this one clip is one of
26:33
Speaker 1: my favorite video clips of all time for all the
26:36
Speaker 1: wrong reasons. Let me just be clear, but it's one
26:38
Speaker 1: of these safety videos they show about schools, and it's
26:42
Speaker 1: this kid that can't be older than twelve years old,
26:45
Speaker 1: and he pulls out like twenty different guns from his jeans.
26:48
Speaker 1: He's got sawed off, he's got like an ouzy, He's
26:50
Speaker 1: got every gun you can think of in his jeans,
26:54
Speaker 1: and he will He's just walking around with a baggy
26:56
Speaker 1: shirt and baggy jeans, and the teacher or whoever is repper,
27:00
Speaker 1: he's ending this this like security concern is talking about
27:04
Speaker 1: and this is why our school district does not allow
27:06
Speaker 1: baggy jeans, and everyone has to has their shirts tucked in.
27:09
Speaker 1: And it leads into the one cohesive narrative that I
27:13
Speaker 1: think that you can probably point your finger at in
27:16
Speaker 1: this entire movie, and that's about this rise of fear
27:21
Speaker 1: in the media and that Alex Jones style that Michael
27:25
Speaker 1: Moore is now get like, he's leaning into the same
27:28
Speaker 1: kind of style. You could even imply like some inside
27:32
Speaker 1: knowledge type stuff. We'll get into that in the next
27:33
Speaker 1: one too, But Michael Moore in particular in this one,
27:37
Speaker 1: he's talking about maybe and I'm gonna paraphrase this because
27:41
Speaker 1: he's weasley, he doesn't put his stamp on things, but
27:43
Speaker 1: that maybe it's the media inciting fear. And he gets
27:47
Speaker 1: into a whole other little tangent about all these reports
27:50
Speaker 1: on black mails and how blackmails are scary. And then
27:54
Speaker 1: there was a shooting that was nearby Flint, Michigan, that
27:59
Speaker 1: happened with like a young black kid shot this little
28:02
Speaker 1: white girl and that was in his class, the youngest
28:05
Speaker 1: school shooting either of all time or maybe just at
28:08
Speaker 1: that time. And he uses that he shoehorns in that
28:12
Speaker 1: particular story to paint this picture of that this is
28:15
Speaker 1: what makes us unique. Here, here's the answer, and why
28:19
Speaker 1: it's happening in America nowhere else because everyone's terrified by
28:22
Speaker 1: the news, and there's some good clip editing. He shows
28:25
Speaker 1: one that it ends with you know, night at nine,
28:30
Speaker 1: what you don't know might kill you, And that's just
28:32
Speaker 1: the whole segment into this news clip, and he's talking
28:36
Speaker 1: to one of the either a news reporter or a cop,
28:39
Speaker 1: and they make this claim that will technically violent crime
28:43
Speaker 1: went down by twenty percent from last year, but the
28:46
Speaker 1: reporting of violent crime went up by six hundred percent.
28:50
Speaker 1: So the I guess the implication there is that everyone
28:54
Speaker 1: is just so terrified that now they're buying up guns
28:57
Speaker 1: constantly to protect themselves from all these new perceived threats
29:00
Speaker 1: that might not even be real, and that maybe that's
29:03
Speaker 1: the cause for you know, the Columbine shooting.
29:06
Speaker 5: I guess again, it's.
29:07
Speaker 7: A hard hular bees.
29:10
Speaker 1: Well, bro, so let's let's get into the overboard moments,
29:14
Speaker 1: because that's WHORDS is going to devolve into anyways, And
29:17
Speaker 1: that's where I want to start at it too, is
29:19
Speaker 1: right after he gets done making this point about white
29:22
Speaker 1: people are getting riled up by the media by these
29:25
Speaker 1: you know, black mails, and that they're violent and you
29:27
Speaker 1: need to arm yourselves, he juxtaposes this with all these
29:31
Speaker 1: Africanized killer bees, like even even the bees from Africa
29:35
Speaker 1: are more violent, Like that's sort of the premise that's
29:38
Speaker 1: getting pushed out through the media, and I mean we
29:40
Speaker 1: live through that. I think even Wu Tang kind of
29:42
Speaker 1: made fun of that with like the Wu Tang killer bees, right,
29:46
Speaker 1: it was like these Africanized bees that were coming in
29:49
Speaker 1: and wreaking havoc in the country.
29:51
Speaker 7: Yeah, and he leaned into it.
29:52
Speaker 6: And that's one thing of his bias too, is he's
29:55
Speaker 6: one of these liberal guys that's out of touch, that's
29:58
Speaker 6: not been around place for a long time. And yes,
30:02
Speaker 6: at that time, you know, you did see a lot
30:04
Speaker 6: of reports, you know, in the nineties especially of like hey, blackmail,
30:08
Speaker 6: and like there was probably heavier stuff, you know, kind
30:10
Speaker 6: of going after like different races. But he literally leans
30:14
Speaker 6: in and he's like, look, the regular bees are fine,
30:17
Speaker 6: but these African killer bees.
30:19
Speaker 7: And he just couldn't let it go.
30:21
Speaker 6: And this whole race baiting part that he doesn't in
30:25
Speaker 6: all of his films. It does get a little bit
30:28
Speaker 6: annoying to me at the time. You're like, oh my god,
30:30
Speaker 6: another thing you're gonna compare oh, because white people are afraid.
30:34
Speaker 6: That's kind of like what I got out of these
30:36
Speaker 6: white supremacist nationalists are afraid, and they already have a.
30:41
Speaker 7: Ton of guns, so they just start shooting people up.
30:45
Speaker 1: There's my list of things that we can criticize about
30:49
Speaker 1: this movie would keep us here for like another hour
30:51
Speaker 1: or two.
30:51
Speaker 5: So the other main one that really bugged.
30:54
Speaker 1: Me on this one is that he clearly, when we're
30:58
Speaker 1: talking to all the Canadians and like the Canadian governors
31:02
Speaker 1: and stuff, whatever the hell they call them in Canada,
31:05
Speaker 1: that oh, well, maybe it's poverty, and it's kind of
31:08
Speaker 1: like false. You know, it's not poverty, because look, here's
31:10
Speaker 1: this impoverished area in Canada that has roughly the same
31:14
Speaker 1: or more of gun owners. They're consume in the same
31:17
Speaker 1: media everything, and that's not it. It's not just a poverty thing.
31:21
Speaker 1: But then later on, because you're gonna learn in every
31:24
Speaker 1: Michael Moore documentary, he shoehorns in Flint, Michigan, and he
31:28
Speaker 1: returns to Flint, Michigan for some reason or another, and
31:32
Speaker 1: it's talking about that tragic story where that kid brought
31:35
Speaker 1: the gun to school and shot this girl, the youngest
31:38
Speaker 1: shooting in history, and he goes on to basically imply
31:41
Speaker 1: that it was caused by poverty, that the GM plant
31:45
Speaker 1: shutting down from his previous movie caused this economic you know,
31:49
Speaker 1: backspin and destroyed this community. And now because that community
31:54
Speaker 1: is in shambles, that poverty led to this other school.
31:59
Speaker 1: None of it makes sense because it directly contradicts the
32:02
Speaker 1: exact thing that he just went out of his way
32:04
Speaker 1: to say, this is not the factor, but then he
32:07
Speaker 1: leverages it once it's convenient for the bias that he's
32:10
Speaker 1: getting into. And even more than that is that when
32:14
Speaker 1: this shooting happens, he goes to that community and he
32:17
Speaker 1: talks to the lady that places the nine to one
32:20
Speaker 1: one call and he's showing the memorial. He goes to
32:24
Speaker 1: Charlton Hestenson's house and has an interview with Charlton Heston
32:29
Speaker 1: and talks about this girl that gets taken out. And
32:32
Speaker 1: he's talking to Charlton Heston and he's like, you know, implying,
32:37
Speaker 1: aren't you embarrassed or don't you feel bad about going
32:39
Speaker 1: to these tragedies like going to Columbine after this tragedy
32:43
Speaker 1: occurred and using that for promotion, And it's like, my dude,
32:47
Speaker 1: you didn't you literally just show yourself inserting Michael Moore
32:52
Speaker 1: into that tragic story, and now you're part of this thing,
32:56
Speaker 1: and you're criticizing Carlton Heston for just being on the
32:59
Speaker 1: literal other end of that same you know, exploiting a
33:03
Speaker 1: tragedy and exploiting these kids. And and he kind of
33:06
Speaker 1: takes that a step further where he goes and he
33:08
Speaker 1: finds two of the survivors from Columbine that got shot.
33:12
Speaker 1: One of them is paralyzed, the other one still has
33:15
Speaker 1: a bullet lodged between his spine and his aorta, and
33:18
Speaker 1: he brings them to the kmart headquarters and he kind
33:21
Speaker 1: of like demands that they they first, He's like, we
33:24
Speaker 1: want to return these bullets, like they're inside these people's bodies.
33:29
Speaker 1: And when that doesn't work, they go to the same
33:31
Speaker 1: kmart in Columbine where the bullets were purchased. They buy
33:35
Speaker 1: out all the bullets and then bring those back. And
33:38
Speaker 1: this actually has a national effect. This is crazy that
33:42
Speaker 1: Michael Moore inserting himself into this documentary actually changed the
33:47
Speaker 1: course of Kmart's entire corporate future.
33:51
Speaker 7: Isn't that wild? He kind of like threw it off,
33:55
Speaker 7: but I liked it.
33:55
Speaker 6: You brought the Charleston Hessen thing up because this is
33:58
Speaker 6: something me and my friend have been made making fun
34:00
Speaker 6: up since we saw this originally when he's like has
34:03
Speaker 6: the picture.
34:04
Speaker 7: Look at her? Look at her?
34:08
Speaker 9: Like, So we used to do that all the time,
34:10
Speaker 9: like because we thought it was so hilarious, like, dude,
34:14
Speaker 9: you're so over the top, like theatrical, because he makes
34:18
Speaker 9: arguments that like, look at these people are just playing
34:20
Speaker 9: theater and they're just trying to get people on their side,
34:23
Speaker 9: and they're using this to you know, kind of change
34:26
Speaker 9: the narrative, and you're like, you're doing the same exact thing.
34:30
Speaker 5: Did.
34:30
Speaker 1: The Trolton Heston interview is now somewhat infamous, not just
34:34
Speaker 1: for that scene that you talked about, h and Trolton
34:37
Speaker 1: Heston did not do himself or the NRA any favors
34:41
Speaker 1: in this because Michael Moore asks maybe the most poignant
34:46
Speaker 1: question this entire documentary, and he asked Trolton Heston, why
34:49
Speaker 1: do you think it is that in other areas that
34:51
Speaker 1: have the same accessibility, the same amount of gun out
34:54
Speaker 1: like when all other things seem to be the same,
34:57
Speaker 1: America has these higher gun deaths. After he asked Tarlton
35:00
Speaker 1: Hessen enough times out of frustration and maybe just being
35:05
Speaker 1: old Trelton Heston kind of utters maybe it's the ethnicity,
35:09
Speaker 1: Like he kind of makes this and there's really no
35:12
Speaker 1: coming back from that, especially in the context of this
35:15
Speaker 1: Michael Moore movie, Like he sort of reproves and almost
35:19
Speaker 1: justifies the false claims of the Kiki can Nra and
35:23
Speaker 1: the cartoon about slavery and all this Tarlton Heston not
35:26
Speaker 1: knowing about any of that just plays right into it.
35:29
Speaker 1: So this this becomes one of the biggest gotcha interviews
35:32
Speaker 1: in the entire movie for sure. Ripples and waves of
35:42
Speaker 1: this movie. Again, this one has one of the biggest
35:46
Speaker 1: cultural impacts for so many different reasons. The first one
35:50
Speaker 1: being that he gets two hundred million profit from this movie,
35:55
Speaker 1: which makes it the most commercially successful movie of all time.
35:59
Speaker 1: It also makes it so that political documentaries kind of
36:03
Speaker 1: become in vogue for the next decade or so, right
36:07
Speaker 1: on the tales of this is Inconvenient Truth by al Gore,
36:10
Speaker 1: followed by the network that al Gore put together to
36:13
Speaker 1: kind of promote political documentaries. I think that's where Vice
36:16
Speaker 1: News originally came from. A lot of this stuff came
36:20
Speaker 1: in the wake of this particular documentary, and I think
36:24
Speaker 1: The biggest cultural impact is that this documentary and the
36:29
Speaker 1: events that we see happen in the movie itself actually
36:33
Speaker 1: cause Kmart to stop selling ammunition across the board because
36:37
Speaker 1: of the antics when he shows up with these Columbine kids.
36:40
Speaker 1: It's such a pr nightmare for Kmart. They don't have
36:43
Speaker 1: any other option but to just stop selling ammunition because
36:47
Speaker 1: of all this. I mean, I would know of the
36:50
Speaker 1: other movies that we have seen have ever made a
36:53
Speaker 1: global or at least like a national conglomerate have to
36:57
Speaker 1: change their entire marketing strategy and the products they offer
37:00
Speaker 1: because of the result of this. We might get into
37:02
Speaker 1: like a c world one later in the future, but
37:05
Speaker 1: this is the only one that's actually had fits much
37:07
Speaker 1: of an impact.
37:09
Speaker 6: And as I was saying earlier, I think like politically,
37:12
Speaker 6: or at least like politically of the people where you're
37:16
Speaker 6: hearing a lot of this narrative, not just the anti
37:19
Speaker 6: gun stuff, but a lot of like gun equal white nationalists.
37:25
Speaker 6: That's a white supremacist and they go hand in hand.
37:28
Speaker 6: And I think that all started with this film with
37:31
Speaker 6: their claim of oh KKK in the NRA is the
37:34
Speaker 6: same organization. So I think your point earlier was really
37:39
Speaker 6: influential to all of these.
37:41
Speaker 5: Movements Europe first Sink or Swim.
37:48
Speaker 7: I gotta sync on this one.
37:50
Speaker 6: I mean I was showing love for the previous one
37:53
Speaker 6: because I do like his style of film, right, Like,
37:56
Speaker 6: I think he's good at what he does, not necessarily
37:58
Speaker 6: telling the story, but I'm talking about editing and spicing
38:01
Speaker 6: it up and making it entertaining. But again, it's this
38:05
Speaker 6: carrot on stick thing where we're just roaming around and
38:07
Speaker 6: it's like it says bowling for Columbine and we don't
38:10
Speaker 6: have any resolution of what's going on in Columbine. We're
38:13
Speaker 6: here talking to Terry Nichol's brother. We're all over in
38:18
Speaker 6: Flint talking to some random kids, and some kids like, yeah,
38:21
Speaker 6: I got the Anarchist.
38:22
Speaker 7: Cookbook, you know what I mean?
38:23
Speaker 6: I was number two and claiming that I might blow
38:27
Speaker 6: up to school or something, right Like, he has so
38:30
Speaker 6: much stuff. It's entertaining and it's still something I think
38:33
Speaker 6: people would enjoy watching. But just on the premise of
38:38
Speaker 6: are you gonna follow the storyline of bowling to Columbine?
38:41
Speaker 7: Are we gonna go with Columbine?
38:43
Speaker 6: And the only reason it's called Bowling for Columbine is
38:45
Speaker 6: because at six am before they shot up the school,
38:49
Speaker 6: they went bowling or had a bowling class. So yeah,
38:51
Speaker 6: I'm gonna have to give it a sink. I think
38:53
Speaker 6: it's still worth watching. But he hits he misses again
38:57
Speaker 6: where he can't stick on topic.
39:01
Speaker 1: I might I might have to vary on this one again, man,
39:04
Speaker 1: But again it was like a thin hair. But I'm
39:08
Speaker 1: I think I'd give this one a swim for a
39:10
Speaker 1: few different specific reasons.
39:13
Speaker 5: A like, the bias is absolutely there.
39:15
Speaker 1: You have to go into this, but I almost see
39:18
Speaker 1: it as an entry level litmus test even for yourself
39:22
Speaker 1: if you think that you're either pro gun or anti
39:25
Speaker 1: gun or whatever side of school shootings.
39:27
Speaker 5: I hope you're anti school shooting.
39:29
Speaker 1: But whatever side you are on all these topics to
39:31
Speaker 1: come up in this documentary, I feel like this would
39:34
Speaker 1: be a good way to challenge what some of your
39:37
Speaker 1: preconceived notions are. Because he does a very admirable job
39:41
Speaker 1: of saying, is it Satanism?
39:43
Speaker 4: Is it?
39:44
Speaker 5: Music?
39:44
Speaker 1: Is it culture? Is it movies and TV and music?
39:48
Speaker 1: Is it accessibility to guns? Is it because there's a
39:50
Speaker 1: lockkey Martin plant like? He actually does present a whole
39:54
Speaker 1: bunch of these questions and factors. Even if Michael Moore
39:58
Speaker 1: himself contrad immediately afterwards he'll say like, oh, it's just
40:03
Speaker 1: about exploiting people and generating fear. And then he goes
40:06
Speaker 1: and exploits people and generates fear, even though he himself
40:09
Speaker 1: partakes and the things he's criticizing. It does open up
40:14
Speaker 1: this really fascinating question.
40:15
Speaker 5: Of what is it?
40:17
Speaker 1: What is the one thing that is somehow making us
40:21
Speaker 1: different than every other country when it comes to these
40:24
Speaker 1: like gun violence. So I do think that that alone,
40:28
Speaker 1: he explores it in enough angles that even if you
40:31
Speaker 1: go in with a different bias or your own bias,
40:34
Speaker 1: it'll make you consider way more factors than maybe you
40:37
Speaker 1: do going into it. So for that reason alone, I
40:40
Speaker 1: think that it's worth watching on the horizon. The last
40:52
Speaker 1: Michael Moore movie that we're gonna do for this month,
40:55
Speaker 1: Fahrenheit nine to eleven. And if you don't know what
40:59
Speaker 1: that titled mean, actually we should explain to a bowling for.
41:02
Speaker 5: Columbine means you kind of hinted at it. The premise
41:05
Speaker 5: was that.
41:07
Speaker 1: What could be the factor that caused this violent outburst
41:10
Speaker 1: and Columbine And if you just go by the last
41:13
Speaker 1: thing that the kids did. If that was the thing
41:15
Speaker 1: that made them snap, well, the last thing they did
41:17
Speaker 1: was they went to bowling class and then they went
41:20
Speaker 1: on their shooting rampage. So the bowling for Columbine was
41:24
Speaker 1: this play on words or this play on a topic
41:27
Speaker 1: that well maybe it was the bowling that did it.
41:28
Speaker 1: How can we don't try and regulate bowling? Which I
41:31
Speaker 1: actually think is a good pro second Amendment, you know
41:35
Speaker 1: argument where it's like, clearly it's not anyways. The next one,
41:38
Speaker 1: Fahrenheit nine to eleven, is based on the name of
41:41
Speaker 1: the book Fahrenheit four or five, one about people burning books.
41:46
Speaker 1: Even though it doesn't really get into the censorship aspect.
41:49
Speaker 1: It is all about Bush.
41:52
Speaker 6: Yeah, and it has one of my favorite clips, I
41:54
Speaker 6: mean of Bush of all time.
41:56
Speaker 5: The watch this drive.
41:58
Speaker 6: Yeah that way mine is that the boomy once.
42:04
Speaker 7: Fool me, you're not gonna fool me again. That's my
42:07
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42:15
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42:21
Speaker 3: breaking the locks. Funny you couldn't they rise all the
42:25
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42:32
Speaker 2: Under the docks, under the Dogs.
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44:42
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45:27
Speaker 7: You welcome.
45:28
Speaker 9: They ain't ever.
45:28
Speaker 11: Had a deal.
45:29
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45:32
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45:34
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