Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Protecting your children at parks and playgrounds. 'Don't Be A Victim'

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Protecting your children at parks and playgrounds. 'Don't Be A Victim' · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. I will never forget the
0:12
Speaker 1: first time I had the twins at a playground and
0:17
Speaker 1: they wanted a bottle of water. We had been out
0:20
Speaker 1: there's really hot, and I could see them from the car,
0:26
Speaker 1: so it may have been fifty feet. So they're at
0:30
Speaker 1: the top of a jungle gym and I mean way
0:33
Speaker 1: up there, and they're going to get on a slide.
0:38
Speaker 1: So I walked to the car, grab the bottle of
0:40
Speaker 1: water and turn around and see a stranger talking to John,
0:46
Speaker 1: David and Lucy. They're about three years old. You know
0:51
Speaker 1: this tall at the time. Well, I took off running
0:55
Speaker 1: with two bottles of water, I mean running straight were
1:00
Speaker 1: the guy straight for him, And just as I was
1:03
Speaker 1: about to jump like they do on TV like that,
1:06
Speaker 1: the guy turned around and it was a friend of
1:10
Speaker 1: ours from church, and he said, hey, I didn't see you.
1:14
Speaker 1: So I thought I'd stand here and watch them till
1:16
Speaker 1: he got back. He was that close to two black
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Speaker 1: eyes and a bloody nose. Why because children go missing
1:28
Speaker 1: from playgrounds, ballparks, malls, amusement parks. Why in this day
1:37
Speaker 1: and age, Why and what can we do to stop it?
1:49
Speaker 1: Let's start with the true story of Gabrielic Gabby Doling
1:54
Speaker 1: listen and her little brand came back Gunner and she said, Amy,
1:59
Speaker 1: have you saw Gabby? I can't find her. Gabby Doolan's
2:02
Speaker 1: older brother was playing football when she went missing from
2:05
Speaker 1: the campus of Allen County Scottsville High School. The game stopped,
2:09
Speaker 1: and everyone, including her father, searched high and low for
2:13
Speaker 1: the seven year old. Brian says he saw a lot
2:16
Speaker 1: of people during that search, but one face sticks out
2:19
Speaker 1: in particular. I saw him walking up the fence for
2:22
Speaker 1: it was dark and could tell who it was of
2:24
Speaker 1: originaland and I hollered, and I was asking a lot
2:27
Speaker 1: of people who they were. I mean, yeah, I thought
2:31
Speaker 1: he was helping me search. You're hearing our friend Monique
2:34
Speaker 1: Blair at Fox fifty six Lexington with me an All
2:38
Speaker 1: Star panel to try to break it down and put
2:40
Speaker 1: it back together. What happened to Gabby? What happens to
2:45
Speaker 1: so many children at playgrounds, parks, ballparks. Gabby Doolan a
2:51
Speaker 1: little seven year old girl with her parents. They're watching
2:55
Speaker 1: her older brother play ball, and just after the action start,
3:00
Speaker 1: it's Gabby's missing with me, As I said an All
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Speaker 1: Star panel Lark Class, the father of Polly Class, who
3:09
Speaker 1: goes missing from her own home. Mark Class, the founder
3:12
Speaker 1: of Class Kids Foundation. Wendy Patrick, California prosecutor, author, Red
3:17
Speaker 1: Flag host Live with Doctor Wendy, KCBQ Radio. Karen Stark,
3:22
Speaker 1: renowned psychologists joining us out of Manhattane Karen Stark dot com.
3:27
Speaker 1: Joseph Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics, Jacksonville State, author of Blood
3:31
Speaker 1: Beneath My Feet and the star of Poisonous Liaisons, levipagecrimal
3:36
Speaker 1: Line dot com investigator reporter and thirty six years Seattle, PD.
3:41
Speaker 1: Author of Seattle's Forgotten serial Killer, Gary gen Grant, Cloyd
3:45
Speaker 1: Steiger at Cloyd Steiger dot com. Joe Sky Morgan. Right there,
3:51
Speaker 1: a crowded football game, a lot of young children like
3:57
Speaker 1: between one and and let's just say twelve years old.
4:02
Speaker 1: A lot of them in uniform and cheerleading uniforms are
4:05
Speaker 1: all looking alike, crowded stands. What do you do when
4:11
Speaker 1: you hear Yabby's missing? It goes into a complete panic
4:16
Speaker 1: at that moment in time, because you know that you
4:19
Speaker 1: know there's parents out there, they know that feeling, that
4:22
Speaker 1: kind of feeling down deep in your gut where you know,
4:26
Speaker 1: that sinking feeling that something is wrong. You can hear
4:29
Speaker 1: the stress in their voice. So everything goes chaotic in
4:32
Speaker 1: that moment because you're trying to find this little lost child.
4:35
Speaker 1: You can hear it. It's building like this even before this, Nancy,
4:39
Speaker 1: everybody's attention is probably on the ballfield. They're not watching
4:43
Speaker 1: everything else. And where there's families, there's smaller children. They
4:47
Speaker 1: come to see their brothers and sisters play ball in
4:49
Speaker 1: sports and this sort of thing. So not all the
4:52
Speaker 1: time or the parents focused on the kids, And unfortunately
4:55
Speaker 1: that's what happened in this case, and in just minutes.
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Speaker 1: Isn't it true? Straight up? Do you leave my page?
5:01
Speaker 1: Crime online dot Com investigative reporter that the team had
5:05
Speaker 1: hardly started playing before Gabby went missing. Do I have
5:09
Speaker 1: my timing right? Yes, Nancy, you're correct. It's seven forty
5:13
Speaker 1: pm November fourteenth, twenty fifteen, and Gabby was playing with
5:18
Speaker 1: her friends around the bleachers. They were playing Item seek.
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Speaker 1: Started out very normal, and then she vanishes. Her friends
5:26
Speaker 1: approached her mother and say, we can't find Gabby. In
5:29
Speaker 1: a search ensues, you know, and how common is that?
5:33
Speaker 1: Cloyd Steiger thirty six years Seattle PD, including homicide and
5:38
Speaker 1: author Cloyd Steiger. How many times do you let your
5:42
Speaker 1: children go play with their friends and you look away?
5:46
Speaker 1: I even knowing this lull myself into false's complacency, and
5:51
Speaker 1: I've done it. Yeah, you do, you know. Fortunately, it's
5:54
Speaker 1: actually very rare about I mean, when it happens, there's
5:56
Speaker 1: nothing worse. It's every parents worst nightmare. And you gotta
5:59
Speaker 1: you know, I have small children, I have grandchildren now,
6:02
Speaker 1: and I'm always constantly trying to see where they are
6:05
Speaker 1: when one of these events, like I said, it's every
6:07
Speaker 1: parents worst night er. What do you do? What do
6:10
Speaker 1: you do in this case? What do you do when
6:12
Speaker 1: you realize you can't find your child? Well, you have
6:14
Speaker 1: to start searching immediately, and you know you have to go.
6:18
Speaker 1: You know, it depends on what, again, where you're at.
6:20
Speaker 1: If you're a store, obviously you tell somebody in the
6:22
Speaker 1: store they can lot. This case, you're at a football
6:26
Speaker 1: game has just started and you heard Leavi Page say
6:32
Speaker 1: it was seven something pm. It's dark or just getting dark,
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Speaker 1: And that adds a whole other complexity mark class to
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Speaker 1: finding the baby. Well, Nascy, what I would do, I mean,
6:45
Speaker 1: given a little time to reflect on. This is number one.
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Speaker 1: You would want to send somebody out to the parking
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Speaker 1: lot to check on any cards that may be leaving
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Speaker 1: at the beginning of the game. That might be a
6:56
Speaker 1: tell right there. But the high tech solution is you
6:59
Speaker 1: you arm your child with some kind of tracking gear. Now,
7:04
Speaker 1: that could be something as simple as a smartphone. You
7:08
Speaker 1: can track smartphones very easily and very clearly, So you
7:11
Speaker 1: could have your young daughter with a little backpack and
7:14
Speaker 1: a smartphone in the backpack. And there are a lot
7:16
Speaker 1: of other types of devices that are made specifically to
7:19
Speaker 1: be able to track young children. So I think that
7:22
Speaker 1: that is something that people should definitely consider because it
7:25
Speaker 1: has been pointed out there is no way on earth
7:28
Speaker 1: you can keep your eye on a child twenty four seven,
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Speaker 1: particularly when you're in the middle of a rambunctious kind
7:36
Speaker 1: of an event like a football game, where you've got
7:38
Speaker 1: a child on the field, you've got a child in
7:40
Speaker 1: the bleacher clime stories with Nancy Grace, guys were talking
7:56
Speaker 1: about the disappearance of a little girl at a football game,
8:00
Speaker 1: Gabby Dueling. Her brother's playing football, Gabby's playing with her
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Speaker 1: little friends around the bleachers where her parents are and
8:07
Speaker 1: suddenly a child says, where's Gabby? And then all h
8:11
Speaker 1: eble l breaks loose. Mark Klass, What I was saying
8:14
Speaker 1: is I want to tell you a true story. And
8:16
Speaker 1: I may or may not have told you this before,
8:19
Speaker 1: but John, David and Lucy were ten and a half
8:24
Speaker 1: and I took them to their first high school football game.
8:28
Speaker 1: A friend of ours had a son has a son
8:32
Speaker 1: in the high school band, and that's what we went
8:35
Speaker 1: to go see that this is not our school. Well,
8:39
Speaker 1: I let them run around with their friends, and they
8:42
Speaker 1: were supposed to report back every twenty minutes, and they
8:44
Speaker 1: were doing that and then suddenly they didn't do it.
8:50
Speaker 1: Twenty minutes passed, then thirty. When it got to forty
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Speaker 1: and they missed two check ins. I thought two words,
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Speaker 1: Gabby dueling, Gabby dooling. I took off down those bleachers
9:05
Speaker 1: like a bat out of hell. And it scared me
9:08
Speaker 1: to death because behind the stadium at this high school game,
9:14
Speaker 1: all these parents were like they were telegating at a
9:17
Speaker 1: professional football game, drinking and cooking out. Hey, party on
9:22
Speaker 1: all you want to, but that is not an appropriate
9:25
Speaker 1: setting for children. Telle Well. I started screaming, calling them
9:33
Speaker 1: looking Randy got my husband and he said, what's wrong.
9:36
Speaker 1: I said, Gabby Dooling, that's what's wrong. Start looking. All
9:40
Speaker 1: our friends emptied the stands. We were all looking. I
9:43
Speaker 1: was standing in the middle of nowhere, about to start crying,
9:46
Speaker 1: and somebody tapped me on the shoulder. It was Lucy.
9:50
Speaker 1: Then I got attacked and it was John David. She
9:54
Speaker 1: had been getting her face painted, and I guess she
9:56
Speaker 1: started right after I started looking, because I went there.
10:00
Speaker 1: Long story short, that night, I decided they were getting
10:04
Speaker 1: a cell phone way earlier than I wanted them to
10:07
Speaker 1: have one. For the reason you just said, mark class.
10:13
Speaker 1: Now I got it loaded up with Life three sixty
10:15
Speaker 1: track or find my iPhone the works. Guys, take a
10:20
Speaker 1: listen to our friend Phil Pendleton Fox fifty six. Gabby
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Speaker 1: Doolin's father wanted his son Alec to tell us what
10:29
Speaker 1: his seven year old sister meant to him. Are you
10:32
Speaker 1: gonna miss those of you? Was always so happy, bet everything,
10:36
Speaker 1: No matter what we'll be going on, she was always happy.
10:42
Speaker 1: They might everybody feel better. The little girl was at
10:45
Speaker 1: alex little league football game Saturday night. Would Belie say
10:48
Speaker 1: she disappeared from sight Thirty minutes later she was found
10:52
Speaker 1: murdered near a creek in a wooded area behind the
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Speaker 1: high school. She loved the killer, she loved read. Since
10:59
Speaker 1: her death, her community has flooded the family with support.
11:03
Speaker 1: I go fund me page and already raised thousands of
11:06
Speaker 1: dollars by Monday. It means everything. We appreciate them, but
11:12
Speaker 1: I'll give anything to help a baby bath. Isn't it true?
11:15
Speaker 1: To leave ipage crime online dot com investigative reporter that
11:19
Speaker 1: within thirty minutes of her disappearing she was dead. Yes.
11:24
Speaker 1: So she was reported missing at seven forty pm and
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Speaker 1: at eight o five pm she was discovered dead, face
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Speaker 1: down in a creek in a wooded area behind the
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Speaker 1: high school, and she was raped and strangled. Seven year
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Speaker 1: old little girl to Mark Class, father of Polyclass, founder
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Speaker 1: of Class Kids Foundation, what is the statistic regarding the
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Speaker 1: hours that pass once the child is kidnapped? Well, three
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Speaker 1: hours patch Within three hours a child is going to
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Speaker 1: be murdered as a result of a kidnapping. We'll be
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Speaker 1: dead within seventy six of children that are murdered as
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Speaker 1: a result of a kidnapping will be dead within the
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Speaker 1: first three hours. So there is absolutely no time to lose,
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Speaker 1: not one second. Gabby Doolan was a huge inspiration when
12:19
Speaker 1: I was writing this chapter in our new book, Don't
12:24
Speaker 1: Be a Victim Fighting Back against America's Crime Wave. Proceeds
12:30
Speaker 1: are going to help finding missing children. We take all
12:37
Speaker 1: the cases I ever investigated or tried, prosecuted, all the
12:43
Speaker 1: cases I've covered to create a list for you life
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Speaker 1: saving tips to help you you that have children that
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Speaker 1: you want to protect. And in the very first chapter,
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Speaker 1: I talk about protecting your child at playgrounds, parks, amusement parks,
13:07
Speaker 1: lall's ball fields. Take a listen to this. Less than
13:12
Speaker 1: a week later, Madden was arrested and charged with murder, rape, sodomy,
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Speaker 1: and kidnapping. The Duelan say, Timothy had a daughter that
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Speaker 1: cheered with Gabby. She'd been around him, you know, with
13:24
Speaker 1: all the practices in the games, she would have trusted
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Speaker 1: him just enough. Now, not only does a bedroom lay empty,
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Speaker 1: so does a piece of a family's heart. Oh we'll
13:35
Speaker 1: get the hug and kiss her again. I Noah, well,
13:38
Speaker 1: don't don't have no doubt, but I'm missing man. No.
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Speaker 1: Investigators say they have DNA evidence linking Timothy Madden to
13:51
Speaker 1: Gabby Duelan's death. Too, Jice Scott Morgan. You were just
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Speaker 1: hearing our friend Monique Blair at Fox fifty six Lexington.
14:00
Speaker 1: What forensics led them to the father of a little
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Speaker 1: girl that was a cheerleader with Gabby Doolan. I know, Nancy,
14:09
Speaker 1: we're talking about that stuff that is the basis for
14:11
Speaker 1: all of life. That's DNA, and so that is a
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Speaker 1: fingerprint that's left behind. And Nancy, he left this fingerprint
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Speaker 1: of DNA behind on her person in the twinkling of
14:22
Speaker 1: an eye. That's how quickly this happened. She was raped, sodomized,
14:26
Speaker 1: she was actually strangled, and on top of that, Nancy,
14:29
Speaker 1: they found water in her lung. She was drowned. She
14:31
Speaker 1: was held face down under the water. And that's how
14:34
Speaker 1: quickly it happened. He deposited his DNA on her, and
14:39
Speaker 1: there is some source of her left upon him, and
14:42
Speaker 1: this is a transfer of evidence. But the more important
14:45
Speaker 1: thing is this happened so quickly, and he completely destroyed
14:48
Speaker 1: this family's life, completely destroyed the family from then on.
14:54
Speaker 1: The family is still destroyed, and Gabby is by far
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Speaker 1: the only one to You aren't class ballparks, amusement parks, playgrounds.
15:05
Speaker 1: It's a predator's play ten Well, evil exists, Nancy, and
15:10
Speaker 1: individuals with proclivities to do harm to young children are
15:15
Speaker 1: going to gravitate to places where young children are going
15:18
Speaker 1: to be, and more importantly, where young children are going
15:21
Speaker 1: to be unsupervised, and they're going to pounce upon the
15:24
Speaker 1: first opportunity they have to engage their evil intention. So again,
15:32
Speaker 1: you know, there should be maybe off duty police officers.
15:36
Speaker 1: There should be some kind of protection at these games
15:39
Speaker 1: so that children have an ability to play and run
15:44
Speaker 1: around without being concerned that they're going to be the
15:50
Speaker 1: victim of some kind of a horrendous crime. But in
15:55
Speaker 1: the event that there aren't off duty cops, in the
15:58
Speaker 1: event there is no surveillance, what can you as a
16:02
Speaker 1: parent do to protect your child? I lay out pages
16:06
Speaker 1: and pages of tips to help you protect your child.
16:09
Speaker 1: Listen to Chris Conti wtv F. So what does justice
16:14
Speaker 1: feel like knowing that Timothy Madden is away for life
16:18
Speaker 1: for taking this little girl's life? I want to say,
16:21
Speaker 1: you know that there was some kind of miraculous change,
16:27
Speaker 1: but no, I mean in here the heart still better.
16:34
Speaker 1: If losing Gabby was the hardest day of their lives,
16:37
Speaker 1: yesterday came in a close second, as Amy finally got
16:40
Speaker 1: to speak to Timothy Madden face to face. Because of you,
16:45
Speaker 1: we lost our baby girl, Our boys lost their sister.
16:50
Speaker 1: And when Timothy Madden turned his attention away, Well, Amy
16:53
Speaker 1: doesn't fault Gabby's dad for this. You can let him
16:56
Speaker 1: listen to what she's got to say. Do you understand me?
16:59
Speaker 1: Do you? We couldn't even get enough respect to be heard.
17:07
Speaker 1: So yeah, he got really he got really angry. But
17:11
Speaker 1: I don't think anybody can blame him for getting upset
17:15
Speaker 1: the way that he did. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace,
17:30
Speaker 1: guys were talking about a little girl who goes missing
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Speaker 1: at a junior league football game. Gabby dueling, how can
17:38
Speaker 1: we stop this ever happening again? And don't be a victim?
17:44
Speaker 1: Fighting back against America's crime waves proceeds going to help
17:49
Speaker 1: find missing children. Pages and pages of tips are laid
17:54
Speaker 1: out for you. For instance, tell your children Mommy and
17:59
Speaker 1: daddy never need help outside the family. That's a common ploy. Hey,
18:05
Speaker 1: your mom says I was to come to get you.
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Speaker 1: She needs you right now. Come with me. No, never
18:11
Speaker 1: go with anyone else. Mommy and Daddy don't need help.
18:15
Speaker 1: Predators at playgrounds games, parks, listen and watch carefully. If
18:20
Speaker 1: they hear you call your child's name, they will use
18:24
Speaker 1: that as ammunition to try and get your child. Have
18:28
Speaker 1: a plan in case you get separated at one of
18:33
Speaker 1: these ballparks or parks. Don't talk to or help strangers. Hey, Gabby,
18:39
Speaker 1: I can't find my little girl. Can you help me?
18:42
Speaker 1: You know she cheerleads with you. No. And what's so
18:45
Speaker 1: bizarre withy Patrick, California prosecutor. The guy that murdered Gabby
18:51
Speaker 1: was the father of another little cheerleader. They knew him,
18:55
Speaker 1: that's right, And as Mark class only knows too well.
18:57
Speaker 1: Sometimes it's an inside job. Sometimes go missing not only
19:01
Speaker 1: from inside the house, but at common areas where there
19:04
Speaker 1: are relatives, friends, associates, people that know the kids. And
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Speaker 1: that is what's so scary about these stadiums, these sporting events.
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Speaker 1: You know, we talked about neighborhood watch. We should have
19:15
Speaker 1: unofficial stadium watch where parents look out for each other's kids,
19:19
Speaker 1: especially if they know them. Because large sporting events, as
19:22
Speaker 1: you point out, Nancy, playgrounds for criminals who take advantage
19:26
Speaker 1: of diversion and distraction, two elements you have present at
19:30
Speaker 1: these events where everybody's looking at the field or whatever
19:33
Speaker 1: else is going on, whatever kind of gathering it is,
19:36
Speaker 1: or God forbid, as you share, if they're tricking behind
19:38
Speaker 1: the bleachers, but they're not paying the kind of attention
19:41
Speaker 1: they should, because it is often done and perpetrated by
19:44
Speaker 1: somebody known or at least recognized by the child. Often
19:48
Speaker 1: these disappearances take place when you are at a park
19:54
Speaker 1: or a playground. The book goes on to advise try
19:58
Speaker 1: to take a playground that has a single entry or exit,
20:02
Speaker 1: especially one that may have a fence around it, because
20:05
Speaker 1: what perp is going to grab your child and carry
20:08
Speaker 1: them over a fence. Although it has happened, never let
20:12
Speaker 1: the sight line between you and your child be obstructed.
20:16
Speaker 1: If possible, pick playgrounds and parks that are fenced in
20:21
Speaker 1: or contained. Try to pick play areas or areas where
20:25
Speaker 1: you can easily see who is approaching. Another issue to you,
20:29
Speaker 1: Karen Stark as you've got to instruct your child. It's
20:33
Speaker 1: not rude to say no, I'm not going with you
20:37
Speaker 1: to your car, No I'm not going to go to
20:39
Speaker 1: the concession stand with you, or just playing out. No.
20:43
Speaker 1: Especially in the South, children are taught to be polite
20:47
Speaker 1: but you've got to train your child to scream, yell, kick, fight. No. Unfortunately, Nancy,
20:55
Speaker 1: it's a very strong no. And children have to be
20:59
Speaker 1: taught very literally. If somebody is offering you a candy,
21:04
Speaker 1: if they have a toy, if they say the dog.
21:07
Speaker 1: I mean, you have to give specific examples. And the
21:10
Speaker 1: other thing is that parents need to watch if children
21:14
Speaker 1: are playing together, because there's a false sense of security
21:19
Speaker 1: that they're playing tag. Hi didn't seek They're in each
21:22
Speaker 1: other's faces. No, that's not okay. You have to keep
21:26
Speaker 1: your eye on your child. Unfortunately, that's just the way
21:30
Speaker 1: the world is. Here's another case that I investigated to right,
21:36
Speaker 1: don't be a victim? Does this name ring a Belle
21:40
Speaker 1: Morgan Nick take a listen to our friends at ko
21:43
Speaker 1: Artie Fox sixteen Little Rock. June nineteen ninety five, six
21:49
Speaker 1: year old Morgan Nick was at an Alma Little League ballpark.
21:52
Speaker 1: She went to the parking lot with two friends to
21:55
Speaker 1: chase fireflies. When she didn't come back, her friends say
21:59
Speaker 1: they saw her talking to a bearded man next to
22:01
Speaker 1: a red camper. That man was never identified. Morgan was
22:06
Speaker 1: last seen emptying sand out of her shoes near her
22:09
Speaker 1: mother's car. I thought when the police got there, I
22:13
Speaker 1: thought that they would know what to do, that they
22:16
Speaker 1: would figure this out, that we would have Morgan back
22:18
Speaker 1: right away. It never crossed my mind that we would
22:24
Speaker 1: be here even a day later. It's a night that
22:26
Speaker 1: shook our Kansans to the core, so many in the
22:29
Speaker 1: state searching, praying and hoping for any answer to bring
22:33
Speaker 1: Morgan home. And to Dennis Farina of Unsolved Mysteries, listen,
22:40
Speaker 1: I went over to the car, looked around the outside
22:42
Speaker 1: of the car, opened the doors, looked inside the car,
22:45
Speaker 1: thinking she had gotten in, even at one point look
22:48
Speaker 1: under the car, just thinking she has to be here somewhere,
22:52
Speaker 1: And within a couple of minutes, all the people and
22:54
Speaker 1: most of the cars were gone, and it was very
22:56
Speaker 1: clear that Morgan wasn't there. Yeah, who calmed down? Where
23:01
Speaker 1: was the last place you sor? One of the coaches questions,
23:04
Speaker 1: the girls look at me when you were in the field?
23:08
Speaker 1: Were you there alone? They remembered seeing a man whom
23:11
Speaker 1: they describe as creepy talking to Morgan out in the field.
23:17
Speaker 1: One of the coaches had a cell phone and made
23:19
Speaker 1: the initial nine one one call to law enforcement. They
23:22
Speaker 1: arrived within six minutes and began an immediate and massive
23:26
Speaker 1: search for Morgan that night, but they found no trace
23:30
Speaker 1: of Morgan. The media was alerted and flyers were posted.
23:34
Speaker 1: Weeks stretched them to months, and finally years with no
23:39
Speaker 1: sign of Morgan Nick. Two special guests Leavipage climb online
23:45
Speaker 1: dot com investigative reporter. How did Morgan Knicks go missing? So?
23:50
Speaker 1: Nancy Morgan Knicks was seven years old and she was
23:53
Speaker 1: abducted in nineteen ninety six at a little league game
23:57
Speaker 1: in Alma, Arkansas. And Alma, Arkansas was in northwest Arkansas, Nancy,
24:02
Speaker 1: It's in the Ozark Mountains, a very quiet small town
24:06
Speaker 1: population of about five thousand people. And she was at
24:12
Speaker 1: a game with her family, a little league game, and
24:15
Speaker 1: at ten thirty pm, she asked her mom, Hey, can
24:17
Speaker 1: I go catch lightning bugs with my friends? Her mom
24:21
Speaker 1: said yeah, go ahead. So she was doing that with
24:23
Speaker 1: her friends and at ten forty five, fifteen minutes later,
24:28
Speaker 1: she was seen by her friends emptying sand out of
24:31
Speaker 1: her shoes and talking to a person that her friends
24:37
Speaker 1: described as a creepy man driving a red truck with
24:41
Speaker 1: a white camper. And that was the last time that
24:43
Speaker 1: she was ever seen. Time stories with Nancy Grace. Guys,
25:00
Speaker 1: you can listen to our friend Dennis Farina Alma, Arkansas.
25:04
Speaker 1: On a summer night, Colleen Nick took her six year
25:07
Speaker 1: old daughter Morgan to a little league page choice to go.
25:12
Speaker 1: We'd made the choice to go just Morgan and I
25:14
Speaker 1: just to have girls night out and it was just
25:17
Speaker 1: such a warm, close, um fun night. Says to catching fireflies. Well,
25:25
Speaker 1: I don't know if my MoMA lay. Two local girls
25:27
Speaker 1: asked Morgan to come and play with them. Mom, can
25:31
Speaker 1: me and my friends go catch fireflies? Oh? I don't
25:33
Speaker 1: think so, honey, I are you sure safe? Finally, against
25:40
Speaker 1: my better judgment, I told her that she could go
25:42
Speaker 1: and play, and she threw her arms around my neck
25:45
Speaker 1: gave me a big hug. Stay where I can see you.
25:51
Speaker 1: We could see them very clearly, and then the last
25:54
Speaker 1: time that I turned to look, Morgan was thrownning back
25:56
Speaker 1: and forth the planet. But when the game ended, the
26:02
Speaker 1: two girls return to the field without girls girls, where's Morgan? By? Okay?
26:09
Speaker 1: Getting the sand out of her shoe, which card I
26:12
Speaker 1: don't know, years I guess. Can you imagine the feeling
26:16
Speaker 1: that mom had when she realized Morgan is gone? The
26:21
Speaker 1: purpose of this is not to scare you at all.
26:25
Speaker 1: The purpose is to arm you. In a world when
26:29
Speaker 1: everything seems like it's upside down between crime statistics and
26:34
Speaker 1: protests and COVID, that feeling of helplessness, of not being
26:39
Speaker 1: able to do anything to make a difference can be overwhelming.
26:44
Speaker 1: This book, Don't Be a Victim is full of information
26:50
Speaker 1: to arm you to protect yourself and your family. We
26:56
Speaker 1: were just telling you about the case of Morgan. Next,
27:01
Speaker 1: an entire chapter is devoted to cases just like this,
27:05
Speaker 1: true cases. Not to exploit the cases, but to determine what,
27:11
Speaker 1: if anything, can we learn. How can we use this
27:16
Speaker 1: knowledge so another child doesn't go missing, another child isn't
27:21
Speaker 1: harmed or killed. Take a listen to this. It was
27:26
Speaker 1: an unseasonably warm Monday, February thirteenth, twenty seventeen. There was
27:30
Speaker 1: no school that day, and thirteen year old Abbey Williams
27:33
Speaker 1: had spent the night with her best friend, fourteen year
27:35
Speaker 1: old Libby German. The teens decided to hike on the
27:38
Speaker 1: popular Heritage trails east of Delphi. Libby's older sister, Kelsey German,
27:43
Speaker 1: drops them off at one thirty five pm with plans
27:45
Speaker 1: to meet later. To be picked up. German leaves them
27:48
Speaker 1: at the trail near the Scenic monin high Bridge. It's
27:50
Speaker 1: an abandoned railroad bridge over Deer Creek. At two or
27:54
Speaker 1: seven pm, Libby posts aphoted a snapchat of Abbey walking
27:57
Speaker 1: across the bridge. When the girls fail to show up
27:59
Speaker 1: at the appointed time and place and family can't find them,
28:02
Speaker 1: they are reported missing. Carroll County Sheriff Toby Leasonby organized
28:05
Speaker 1: the search parties, which continue until just before midnight. Leasonby
28:09
Speaker 1: then issues a news release saying there's no reason to
28:12
Speaker 1: suspect foul play or to believe the girls are in
28:14
Speaker 1: immediate danger. You know, to you Mark Class, father of
28:18
Speaker 1: Polly Class and Victims Right's champion, he has devoted his
28:23
Speaker 1: life to helping find missing people, especially children, after his
28:27
Speaker 1: daughter Polly was kidnapped from her own home. You know,
28:32
Speaker 1: Mark Class, why do we lull ourselves into a false
28:36
Speaker 1: sense of complacency? Because you heard the Morgan Nick's story.
28:40
Speaker 1: It was mom and daughter adigant little league game and
28:43
Speaker 1: she was right by the bleachers catching fireflies. And the
28:48
Speaker 1: Delphi case. Abby and Libby are just walking a trail.
28:53
Speaker 1: There are plenty of people around. It's a very small town,
28:56
Speaker 1: very low crime rate. Polly was at a little sleepover.
29:01
Speaker 1: She's got a little sleepover in her own home when
29:04
Speaker 1: she went missing. Why do we think it won't happen
29:08
Speaker 1: to us? Yeah, that's a spectacular question. You know. Coley
29:13
Speaker 1: Nick is a dear friend of mine. She became she
29:15
Speaker 1: has also become a fierce advocate for missing children, and
29:20
Speaker 1: in fact, the Amber Alert in Arkansas is named after
29:25
Speaker 1: a little Morgan Nick. We all, it happens to all
29:31
Speaker 1: of us, Nancy. I mean, we look at the stories
29:34
Speaker 1: that we're talking about and Wenna go, oh my goodness, Well,
29:37
Speaker 1: at least I've told my child about stranger danger, so
29:40
Speaker 1: that certainly is never going to happen to me. And
29:43
Speaker 1: it's really really important to teach your children about the
29:46
Speaker 1: child lords and teach your children about the strangers. But
29:50
Speaker 1: it has been pointed out as often as not, in fact,
29:52
Speaker 1: much more often than not, as somebody that is known
29:55
Speaker 1: within the family. And I think it's a mistake to
29:58
Speaker 1: put the whole burden of child say on the shoulders
30:01
Speaker 1: of the children. They're little kids. They definitely have to
30:04
Speaker 1: know the rules, they definitely have to be aware of
30:07
Speaker 1: what's going on around them, but nonetheless, they are children.
30:11
Speaker 1: They're eat more easily deceived than adults are. So we
30:14
Speaker 1: have to create strategies that are going to work at
30:17
Speaker 1: the adult level to be able to protect the children.
30:20
Speaker 1: And I think we've discussed a lot of those this evening,
30:23
Speaker 1: because so many of these little kids, unfortunately, do fall
30:26
Speaker 1: through the cracks. So we have to be vigilant on
30:29
Speaker 1: every level. We have to talk to the children, but
30:32
Speaker 1: we also have to take responsibility on our own shoulders
30:36
Speaker 1: as adults to ensure that our children are going to
30:39
Speaker 1: be safe from the potential predators that might be on
30:42
Speaker 1: the streets. Again, I'm not trying to scare you, trying
30:47
Speaker 1: to help you and arm you with information. You know,
30:52
Speaker 1: I'm trying to figure out, Karen Stark, you're the psychologists,
30:56
Speaker 1: you're the high profile shrink joining us at in Manhattan.
31:01
Speaker 1: Why do we choose, including me, choose to live very
31:07
Speaker 1: often incomplacency. I mean, you know, I didn't realize I
31:11
Speaker 1: was going to share the story with you because it
31:12
Speaker 1: just happened last night. But Lucy looked at me and
31:16
Speaker 1: she said, did you put a chip in me? Mom?
31:20
Speaker 1: I said, what she says, do I have a chip?
31:23
Speaker 1: So you can find me if I go missing, Like
31:26
Speaker 1: is in my tooth? Did I swallow it? What? I'm like, Lucy,
31:31
Speaker 1: why would you think you've got a chip in you?
31:33
Speaker 1: And she goes, well, I don't know. I just you know,
31:35
Speaker 1: I think you put a chip in me because you're
31:36
Speaker 1: so worried about me all the time. I don't want
31:39
Speaker 1: them to be scared here. And it's just, you know,
31:41
Speaker 1: it's hard to live in a state of fear and
31:45
Speaker 1: readiness all the time. Is that why we let ourselves,
31:50
Speaker 1: you know, slip into complacency? I mean, that's too Nancy.
31:54
Speaker 1: They didn't do anything wrong, and it would be terrible
31:57
Speaker 1: if we blame the parents in this situation. And the
32:01
Speaker 1: problem is not the parents or the children. It's that
32:04
Speaker 1: the world contains feevil people. That this exists, and you
32:10
Speaker 1: have to alert your children and you really have to
32:14
Speaker 1: be vigilant, and there's nothing we can do about that.
32:17
Speaker 1: It's yes, they might be worried about it and they
32:20
Speaker 1: think that you're overdoing it, like Lucy, maybe she thinks
32:23
Speaker 1: she has a chip. But the truth of the matter
32:25
Speaker 1: is children need to be prepared. Parents need to be prepared.
32:31
Speaker 1: If you can't help it, you have to say it's
32:35
Speaker 1: not okay. You have to give them a little bit
32:37
Speaker 1: of fear because you don't want them to trust strangers.
32:41
Speaker 1: That's just not all right with me. Thirty three years Seattle, PD,
32:48
Speaker 1: author of Seattle's Forgotten serial Killer, Gary Jane Grant. You
32:52
Speaker 1: can find them at Cloyd Steiger dot com. Cloyd Steiger,
32:56
Speaker 1: I want you to take a listen to what Libby's mother,
33:00
Speaker 1: Becky told me. When did you realize something was not
33:05
Speaker 1: right at all? Well, our whole family was out there looking.
33:09
Speaker 1: We all left Tara, my daughter went straight over there.
33:14
Speaker 1: Derek was there. My other son come pulling in as
33:18
Speaker 1: I was leaving, and he said, what are you doing.
33:20
Speaker 1: I said, We're gonna go look for the girls. So
33:22
Speaker 1: he jumped in the car with me. We drove. If
33:26
Speaker 1: they would have decided to walk home, we drove both
33:28
Speaker 1: directions that they would have gone, both routes. We got there.
33:31
Speaker 1: We had six cars there. We were taking over everything.
33:35
Speaker 1: We split up. We walked all the trails. Cody and
33:41
Speaker 1: Kelsey went across the bridge. They went. They went across
33:43
Speaker 1: and up to the road and up to the houses
33:45
Speaker 1: up there were the sheriffs there yet not yet by
33:48
Speaker 1: this time it was a little after five. Was it
33:50
Speaker 1: getting dark? Not yet? It wasn't, but I knew it
33:52
Speaker 1: was going And I was on the phone most of
33:54
Speaker 1: the time with AT and T trying to get them
33:56
Speaker 1: to ping her phone. And they won't. They won't do it.
34:00
Speaker 1: Why is it that the cell phone companies will not
34:03
Speaker 1: paying when the parent calls and ask them too? Well,
34:08
Speaker 1: you know that's it's an issue that comes up a
34:11
Speaker 1: lot normally now. If the police call and it declared
34:15
Speaker 1: an emergency, most cell phone companies will paying the phone.
34:19
Speaker 1: But you know there's some complicated if you are the
34:21
Speaker 1: owner of the phone. I don't know why the cell
34:24
Speaker 1: phone company won't pay it for you that it's ridiculous.
34:26
Speaker 1: It's just a policy that they have, but they have.
34:28
Speaker 1: It's red tape, and looking back, I don't know if
34:34
Speaker 1: it would have helped in this case, but there are
34:36
Speaker 1: cases that it does help in. And Cloyd, I want
34:39
Speaker 1: you to take a listen to something else. The family
34:42
Speaker 1: told me they were dropped off Monday by a family member.
34:46
Speaker 1: They had a plan, they were supposed to meet that
34:48
Speaker 1: family member a few hours later. They had a time,
34:51
Speaker 1: they had a location where they were supposed to meet,
34:54
Speaker 1: and those rules never showed up, and that family member
34:57
Speaker 1: immediately alerted authorities, and the search efforts were underway. And
35:02
Speaker 1: when we say search efforts, we mean hundreds of people
35:04
Speaker 1: were out in that wooded area looking for these girls,
35:08
Speaker 1: gouring the area for any clue. Social media took off.
35:12
Speaker 1: Pictures of these girls were circulating social media. Anyone who
35:16
Speaker 1: knew anything, they were just begging them to come forward
35:19
Speaker 1: to call police. And I think everyone went to sleep
35:23
Speaker 1: Monday night keeping their finger response that there was maybe
35:25
Speaker 1: some kind of miscommunication or the girls were going to
35:28
Speaker 1: be hanging out somewhere else. We automatically try our mind
35:33
Speaker 1: goes to innocent explanations as to why something horrible has happened.
35:38
Speaker 1: But Cloyd, very often victims' families has told me they
35:42
Speaker 1: knew immediately that something horrible had happened. Have you ever
35:46
Speaker 1: heard that, Cloyd, I have, you know, And I think
35:49
Speaker 1: it's an innate sense that a parent has that is
35:53
Speaker 1: not just you know, worry and let me let me add.
35:57
Speaker 1: I think it's a huge mistake for that sheriff to
35:59
Speaker 1: make an announcement. And we don't suspect foul play, you
36:01
Speaker 1: don't know, leave it open, just say we're doing everything
36:04
Speaker 1: we can to find your squirls. But don't go out
36:06
Speaker 1: there and say we don't suspect foul play, because then
36:08
Speaker 1: everybody else's, oh, that it's nothing. They just ran away
36:10
Speaker 1: or something and they're not alert, So that was really
36:13
Speaker 1: a bad move. Guys. Abby and Limby's bodies were found
36:19
Speaker 1: just below the Trustle Bridge where they were taking pictures
36:24
Speaker 1: that they posted dead Again, these true fact scenarios are
36:32
Speaker 1: not to scare you. They are to arm you with
36:36
Speaker 1: information that may one day save your child, your grandchild,
36:42
Speaker 1: a child you love. Don't be a victim. Fight back
36:47
Speaker 1: against America's crime way. Nancy Grace Crime's Stories, signing off
36:53
Speaker 1: Goodbye friend,