Latest / 360 with Katie Woolf / Shadow Minister for Health Bill Yan says the new legislation around CHO powers for Covid-19 management "waters down" the reporting requirements for decisions made

Transcript

Shadow Minister for Health Bill Yan says the new legislation around CHO powers for Covid-19 management "waters down" the reporting requirements for decisions made · 360 with Katie Woolf

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  Speaker 1: The Minister for Health, Natasha Fhiles, has introduced the controversial
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  Speaker 1: new laws in Parliament which would give the Chief Health
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  Speaker 1: Officer extensive powers for two years. The government previously flagged
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  Speaker 1: that once the pandemic State of Emergency declaration comes to
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  Speaker 1: an end in May, it would legislate to provide doctor
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  Speaker 1: q Hegey with these transitional powers. But under these amendments,
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  Speaker 1: authorized officers of the Chief Health Officer would also retain
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  Speaker 1: the ability to search home seize documents without needing a warrant.
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  Speaker 1: It would also mean that doctor Hegey could continue to
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  Speaker 1: enforce those check in apps, the mask mandates, vaccine mandates
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  Speaker 1: and other health decisions now. When introducing this legislation in
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  Speaker 1: Parliament on Wednesday, Natasha Philes said that the proposed changes
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  Speaker 1: would provide the Chow with transitional powers.
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  Speaker 2: Like I said, I.
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  Speaker 1: Think the problem here is that there's no real reporting
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  Speaker 1: back from the Chow to the Parliament. And we also
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  Speaker 1: know that the Chow, no matter who is in that role,
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  Speaker 1: is an unelected official. Look joining me on the line
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  Speaker 1: right now to let us know a little bit more
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  Speaker 1: about their perspective is the COLP the Shadow Minister for
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  Speaker 1: Health Bill Yan Good morning, to you, Bill.
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  Speaker 3: Good morning Katie, and good morning to your listeners.
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  Speaker 1: Bill.
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  Speaker 2: Why are these changes so concerning?
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  Speaker 3: Well, at the face, Duk, this new legislation goes much
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  Speaker 3: further than I think anyone ever expected, and it's certainly
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  Speaker 3: a little bit more than transitional powers. And the powers
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  Speaker 3: that are being given to the chain one of this
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  Speaker 3: used legislation are expanded powers to the less oversight. The
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  Speaker 3: previous legislation had government renewing it every ninety days, and
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  Speaker 3: of course then they had to provide reasons for that
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  Speaker 3: renewal and the public actually under that act got had
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  Speaker 3: some say about what went on. The public could challenge
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  Speaker 3: via applications of Supreme Court. Now these changes mean that
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  Speaker 3: they're going to give these powers to the Chief Health
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  Speaker 3: Officer for two years without that oversight. And of course
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  Speaker 3: the most concerning thing I believe is there's no reporting
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  Speaker 3: that they've actually watered down the reporter requirements for the show.
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  Speaker 3: At the end of a health emergency, the show had
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  Speaker 3: to provide a detailed report back to Parliament within three months,
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  Speaker 3: and of course then that is provided to territories via
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  Speaker 3: the public record. The changes now have the show only
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  Speaker 3: providing a summary of his or her actions for the
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  Speaker 3: period of the emergency, which is now two years and
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  Speaker 3: also now at the end of the two year transitional period.
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  Speaker 3: Again it's only a summary. It just it doesn't Washcadie.
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  Speaker 3: It's it's less oversight and less transparency on the governor
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  Speaker 3: and what they're actually doing.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think this is the thing that I've been
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  Speaker 1: most surprised by, and I think that a lot of
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  Speaker 1: our listeners are going to be quite surprised by as well,
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  Speaker 1: is that it was really sold to territorians as being
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  Speaker 1: these transitional powers. So these powers that would you know,
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  Speaker 1: that would sort of see us ease our of any
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  Speaker 1: COVID issues over the next two years. But the reality
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  Speaker 1: from what I'm then seeing is that it's not going
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  Speaker 1: to necessarily mean that the show has less powers or
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  Speaker 1: more scrutiny. It's going to mean that things like mask bandates,
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  Speaker 1: mandates in general, and lockdowns can be implemented as the
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  Speaker 1: show sees fit. Still, is there going to be any
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  Speaker 1: scrutiny on those decisions than being made Bill.
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  Speaker 3: Well, and that's the thing, Katie, there's not You said
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  Speaker 3: that there actually was like transitioning out of COVID, so
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  Speaker 3: wine back of the powers and that control and overside reporting. Well,
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  Speaker 3: this is absolutely the opposite. This is providing the same
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  Speaker 3: or more powers to the Chief Health Officer and this
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  Speaker 3: new legislation with less transparency, less reporting back through government.
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  Speaker 3: It's just it's unbelievable to think that government would expand
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  Speaker 3: the powers of the Chow over what they've currently got
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  Speaker 3: under the current emergency health legislation. So it just certainly
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  Speaker 3: doesn't make any sense. Okay, this is why the build
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  Speaker 3: of the CORP introduced yesterday is so important. This is
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  Speaker 3: about having the decisions of the show is making that
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  Speaker 3: affect territories on a day to day basis being provided
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  Speaker 3: in a written report back to Parliament, so territorians get
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  Speaker 3: to see the decision making process around things that affect
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  Speaker 3: them every day. It's actually quite.
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  Speaker 1: Simple just going back to what the government has introduced, though,
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  Speaker 1: is there going to be any ability here for scrutiny
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  Speaker 1: from what you can gather, like when from the legislation
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  Speaker 1: that's been introduced, when is the CHOE going to have
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  Speaker 1: to provide any information to the Minister or to the Parliament.
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  Speaker 3: Well, at the end of the health emergency, the CHOW
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  Speaker 3: under the current legislation would have to provide a detailed
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  Speaker 3: report back to Parliment. Now, the changes of the governor
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  Speaker 3: introducing means the Show only has to provide a summary.
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  Speaker 3: It's not a detailed report. It is just a summary
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  Speaker 3: of the actions.
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  Speaker 1: So hang on, just repeat that for me, Bill, So currently,
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  Speaker 1: under the current legislation he has to provide a detailed report.
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  Speaker 1: But under what's being proposed here, it doesn't need to
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  Speaker 1: be a detailed report.
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  Speaker 2: It just needs to be a summary.
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  Speaker 3: That's correct. So under the current legislation as it stands
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  Speaker 3: right now today, at the end of the public health emergency,
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  Speaker 3: the Show is required to provide a detailed report on
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  Speaker 3: the actions that they've taken and the outcomes of those
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  Speaker 3: actions to Parliament. The changes mean the now only has
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  Speaker 3: to provide a summary. It's not a detailed report. Furthermore
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  Speaker 3: to that, Katie, is at the end of the two
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  Speaker 3: you transitional period when you would be expecting at least
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  Speaker 3: another detailed report about the actions that are taken and
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  Speaker 3: the effects and the outcomes they've had on territories. Again,
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  Speaker 3: it's only a summary. There is no reference to a
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  Speaker 3: detailed report on the decisions and actually governmentary, what would.
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  Speaker 2: That mean to you?
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  Speaker 3: Interesting here Katie, What's the most interesting thing about this
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  Speaker 3: is by the time the show has to provide that
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  Speaker 3: report or now only a summary, it will be after
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  Speaker 3: the twenty twenty four all this election.
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  Speaker 1: Wow, I think a lot of people are going to
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  Speaker 1: be quite surprised and dismayed to hear that bill. Look,
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  Speaker 1: I know that there will be some people listening this
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  Speaker 1: morning who will be thinking, you know, this is fair enough.
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  Speaker 2: There is still issues.
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  Speaker 1: With COVID, and we do still need the Chief Health
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  Speaker 1: Officer to be able to make decisions quickly if required
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  Speaker 1: if we do end up with a serious, more serious
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  Speaker 1: strain of COVID in the community. I mean to play
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  Speaker 1: Devil's advocate here. Do you accept that the chow does
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  Speaker 1: still need to have some powers?
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  Speaker 3: Well, certainly absolutely ca COVID is still here and we
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  Speaker 3: don't know what bearing is going to pop up around
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  Speaker 3: the corner. Hoping we always hope for the best of
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  Speaker 3: plan for the worst. I suppose we hope that there's
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  Speaker 3: no more new variants or worse variants or deadly variance
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  Speaker 3: a COVID to pop up. And yes, the show needs
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  Speaker 3: the ability to be able to make some of those decisions,
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  Speaker 3: But whose decisions need to be done through our elected official,
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  Speaker 3: through due process, with some accountability and transparency over why
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  Speaker 3: those decisions are being made.
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  Speaker 1: So Bell, can I just put this really bluntly, I
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  Speaker 1: suppose for our listeners, are you saying that they have
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  Speaker 1: watered down the chose reporting requirements or this new legislation
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  Speaker 1: waters it down, but he's still going to be retaining
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  Speaker 1: those powers no matter who's in that chow position.
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  Speaker 3: Correct, doesn't matter who's in the chow position today. Tomorrow,
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  Speaker 3: if doctor Heavy stands down and we have another joke,
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  Speaker 3: they will have exactly the same powers. And the reporting
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  Speaker 3: requirements in the new changes do not require the choke
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  Speaker 3: to provide details with detailed reports back to Parliament, only
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  Speaker 3: summaries their actions and communication back to Parliament, as the
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  Speaker 3: Healthy Minister mentioned yesterday, doesn't even have to be in
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  Speaker 3: writing and be a phone call. So where's the detailed
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  Speaker 3: recording of the justifications for the decisions that the Chow
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  Speaker 3: is making. It's not accountable, it's not transparent, and there
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  Speaker 3: will be things being done which will be a very
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  Speaker 3: very little record of and of course then there's no
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  Speaker 3: information coming through the public of the territory as to
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  Speaker 3: what those decisions are based on where is the science
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  Speaker 3: around those decisions and so people don't get the ability
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  Speaker 3: to understand what's taking place.
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  Speaker 1: So Bell obviously, this legislation has been introduced into the
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  Speaker 1: Parliament yesterday. What is the process now, how soon is
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  Speaker 1: it going to pass? And do Territorians have any option
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  Speaker 1: here to have their voices heard?
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  Speaker 3: Well, terri Trians can make their voices heard in a
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  Speaker 3: number of ways catie of living in a democracy. That's
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  Speaker 3: for sure. The legislation will come up in May's parliamentary sittings.
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  Speaker 3: We have requested a briefing, at detailed briefing on what
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  Speaker 3: these changes are actually going to mean, and will go
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  Speaker 3: through those line by line and certainly give it the
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  Speaker 3: scrutiny that it deserves on face value. The new powers
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  Speaker 3: that they're providing to the show, or sorry, the powers
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  Speaker 3: that they're moving across to the show said provides. I
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  Speaker 3: suppose a level of power that hasn't been seen given
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  Speaker 3: to a public servant previous that I'm aware of. This
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  Speaker 3: power normally sits with an elected official, and it sits
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  Speaker 3: with a parliamentary and government cross. To give this level
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  Speaker 3: of power to one particular public servant is certainly unheard of.
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  Speaker 3: And I said, we need to scrutinize that and make
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  Speaker 3: sure that the checks and balances are there to make
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  Speaker 3: sure that Territorians not getting hoodwinked.
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  Speaker 1: Bill. We are fast running out of time, but I
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  Speaker 1: do want to ask you, very quickly a couple more questions.
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  Speaker 1: One of those, do you have any idea if other
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  Speaker 1: states and territories are doing the same thing. From what
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  Speaker 1: I can see, it seems as though most other states
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  Speaker 1: and territories are moving away from giving more power to
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  Speaker 1: the chow or extending public health Emergency declaration and are
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  Speaker 1: moving more towards that phasing back.
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  Speaker 3: That's right, Katie, most other states and territories are moving
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  Speaker 3: into the endemic stage, scaling back the powers that governed
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  Speaker 3: are using to make those decisions. Of course, they still
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  Speaker 3: sit there if they should need to enact them again.
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  Speaker 3: But the only state that I'm aware of that's gone
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  Speaker 3: down this path is Victoria. And the public backlash against
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  Speaker 3: the Victorian government was absolutely huge, because it's like the
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  Speaker 3: Victorian government overstepping their powers and control over the community.
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  Speaker 3: So it'll be interest to see how the public reacted
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  Speaker 3: to the announcement yesterday by the Health Minister and what
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  Speaker 3: the new powers bestowed upon the show. Are going to
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  Speaker 3: meet the territory now.
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  Speaker 2: Before I let you go. Bill.
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  Speaker 1: Parliament certainly got pretty fired up yesterday. The Opposition leader
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  Speaker 1: thrown out twice. Why was she chucked out?
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  Speaker 3: I'm still trying to figure that one out, Katie. I'm
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  Speaker 3: sitting right behind Lena and listening and taking notice of
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  Speaker 3: what was going on. I said the first one said
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  Speaker 3: the Health Minister was on a rant criticizing the Cealpe Party,
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  Speaker 3: our president stepping down at all sorts of bits of peace.
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  Speaker 3: We actually asked a question about the Health miniss involvement
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  Speaker 3: in the role case. And when Leah stood up just
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  Speaker 3: to bring that point of order to say, this is
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  Speaker 3: not about the celp's man management, It's about a question
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  Speaker 3: provided to the minister, she was injected for an hour
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  Speaker 3: or else. Quite taken aback. Leia was quite respectful in
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  Speaker 3: her questioning and the way that she went about it,
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  Speaker 3: but she was removed for now and then, and then
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  Speaker 3: later when she asked another question later in the day,
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  Speaker 3: she was removed again. I've started to feel a bit
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  Speaker 3: left out, Katie. I haven't been training out yet.
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  Speaker 1: Well, look, don't try and get yourself thrown out, Bill.
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  Speaker 1: I think all anyone wants is for the opposition to
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  Speaker 1: do their best to try and hold the government to account,
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  Speaker 1: and I know that they certainly want the government to
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  Speaker 1: you to be part of all of those debates and
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  Speaker 1: to answer questions as well about issues which are important
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  Speaker 1: to them. Bill.
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  Speaker 2: Do you think that the government's got a problem with.
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  Speaker 3: Scrutiny, Absolutely, Katie. It's been really evident this way you said,
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  Speaker 3: we're going with asked very simple straightforward questions that territories
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  Speaker 3: are coming to us with and they deserve very simple,
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  Speaker 3: straightforward answers. But this government does everything that possibly can
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  Speaker 3: not to answer those questions. Even to the point yesterday
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  Speaker 3: we had our motion about crime and a public meeting
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  Speaker 3: in Alo Springs. The government can't even have our emotions
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  Speaker 3: on the table. They choose every time to change our emotions.
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  Speaker 3: They take our motion and change it to something else
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  Speaker 3: so they can stand up and pat themselves on the
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  Speaker 3: back and tell the world all the great things that
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  Speaker 3: they're seem to be not doing. Particularly for Central Australia.
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  Speaker 3: It's really it's really quite embarrassing I think for government
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  Speaker 3: are the fact that that they can't actually take criticism.
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  Speaker 3: They don't like scrutiny. And I'll tell you what, Cadie,
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  Speaker 3: the lab the Government are certainly transparent because we can
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  Speaker 3: all see straight through them.
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  Speaker 1: Well, I tell you what, Bill, I know that you know,
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  Speaker 1: I had a crack at you guys last time parliament
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  Speaker 1: sick sack, because I felt that you should have been
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  Speaker 1: focusing on things that you know, that were important to Territorians.
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  Speaker 1: So I'll have certainly happy to have a crack at
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  Speaker 1: the government this time around because I do think that
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  Speaker 1: they need to answer some of these questions that are
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  Speaker 1: incredibly important to Territorians.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's for sure, Territorians. It's not as if we
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  Speaker 3: sit around and we make these questions up. These are
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  Speaker 3: questions coming to us from people on the ground, from business,
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  Speaker 3: from everyday Territorians. So where they're representing them and the
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  Speaker 3: government should be answering these very very simple, straightforward questions
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  Speaker 3: because these are the questions that Territorians want the answers to.
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  Speaker 3: The government do not want to provide those answers. They
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  Speaker 3: want to dance and hide and avoid any reference to
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  Speaker 3: anything that they may not be doing for Territorians, that's
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  Speaker 3: for sure.
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  Speaker 1: Well, Billyan, the Opposition spokesperson for Health We always appreciate
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  Speaker 1: your time.
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  Speaker 2: Thanks very much for speaking with us this
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  Speaker 3: Morning, sarrisk do you have a great date