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From 9–5 to Founder: Going All In on Your Business with God With Georgina Dukes-Harris · The Her Promise Circle Podcast

• speaker-0: you think of nine to five you tired. speaker-1: you know, I was just in the club yesterday, it felt like. your girl was. A video mixing. Okay. speaker-0: I was making the most money I ever made in my life? then you get this disruption in your spirit, like you're so unsettled. speaker-1: because internalized shame will have you perceiving people perceiving you that aren't even perceiving you. speaker-0: Mm-mm, they don't even care. if I have to battle Goliath, I'm gonna come back with the head of a giant. is it me or you? And it's gonna speaker-1: know you didn't favor me like that from where I come from. for me to be without When I know you gave me this, speaker-0: that's why we are probably getting this call to be the new generation of leaders, because think about the leaders we had to work for. speaker-1: It's always been there, but I could not perceive it because I wasn't her speaker-0: my CTO had a wreck, nearly lost her life coming from that pitch competition. Like everyone is getting attacked, speaker-1: This is my very first season of burning the bridges. And what I mean by that is not having a plan B. speaker-0: the devil cannot block you from going through But what he can do is try to trick you. speaker-1: God might not come through, so I'm gonna go back to this job. no, you could quit and God really could do it this time. speaker-0: God come too close to eleven fifty-nine for me. speaker-1: it's eleven fifty nine, fifty-seven seconds. speaker-0: you ain't got no other choice. And it's like but he comes. And y that is your source. Michal Carlock: You are called to something big and this is the episode for you. Welcome back to the Her Promise Circle podcast. I am your host, Mikhail. I'm also the founder and executive director here at Her Promise Circle Foundation. These conversations I'm bringing you, baby, are discussing what we have normalized and bringing you the second opinion on them. Because a lot of things we talk about in faith, health, and purpose deserve fuller discussions, things that people are afraid to say. And today I am bringing you one of my favorite founders. Miss Georgina, she is the CEO over at Swishfo and also the creator. We are gonna talk about the weight that comes with it, the responsibilities, the roles, the spiritual transformation, Because my girly is about to be a reverend, okay? And we're gonna talk about how when God leads you to this place, how you are able to equip yourself to walk, how you're able to become the woman before the stuff starts coming in, how you're able to walk in the actions that are required, and How to be strong enough to not go crazy while doing it. Okay, so we're gonna get into it. It's time for you to burn your bridges, no plan B's, time for you to take that leap of faith, and we're gonna tell you how we took ours. See you soon. speaker-1: it's so funny, like it was our first time meeting, but I literally wasn't like, my god, it's your first time in Georgina. Just like our literally first conversation, I was like, This, where have you been? Yeah. Like honestly, like, and this is truly the first season where God is letting me meet other founders. Like Sabrina, first of all, and then she connected us. And I just felt so like alone before our conversation. Like I'm not even gonna lie to you. It was so profound. I was telling all my friends about you and then that's why I made that video that I was like, I'm obsessed with Georgina. Like just so everyone knows, I'm so happy I met her. Like because it really did feel like, people around you are proud of you, right? Because they're like, yeah, you're doing something crazy. Like you want to invest best. Like, my God, I'm so proud of you. But I just don't think people really understand. Behind the highlight. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: And like that pressure. And like I without even telling you, like you already knew behind. all the things I was telling you that were like highlights. Because you're like, okay, well to get to that point, I know it had to be some something. Plus the Lord. Okay. That's another thing. It's like you do meet founders, but they don't always understand the faith behind it. And I'm just grateful to know you. Like you just have to know that. Like it's ritual. I'm literally a fangirl. Like I don't care. but I want you to tell the people who you are and how Swishbo, like why? How? Because it's a huge profound thing. speaker-0: Well first I wanna say thank you so much for inviting me here. Like I have that kindred spirit feeling when I first met you. Yeah. Like you are a powerhouse. You have such a powerful calling on your life and you understand things on a completely different level than I've ever seen any founder that I've spoken to. And so I'm just so grateful for you. You know I'm like you text me and I'm like, girl, I don't know, we're gonna get back to this, but we gonna come back and connect, okay? So I just wanna say thank you so much. I just feel a sense of like powerfulness, even just in your presence. That is just something that is not even can be described in this lifetime. So I just I'm so grateful for this opportunity with you. and I think this is gonna be a great episode. So speaker-1: But probably that's what you are, but no, but truly okay, this is off topic, but when you say when you are around me, you feel the powerfulness. I I have heard that so much just in this past month. And I I keep asking God, because everyone I've met knew in the past month, and it's been a lot of people, has Commented, even if they don't have the language for it, on how they feel when they get around me. And I'm still kind of figuring that out. And so when you said that, I'm just like, every single person in this season, like despite me being like flustered or whatever is happening, it doesn't matter. Like what they feel from me is like something real. And I'm still kind of just like speaker-0: You accepting it. Like what does that mean? speaker-1: Yeah, like what is that? But same. So thank you for acknowledging that. We'll have I don't know. Maybe I'll do a substack on it, but I need to really figure out what the what's going on here. It's speaker-0: Cause it's there. It's there. speaker-1: tangible. Like it's like, wow, okay, Lord. Okay, let me own it. Mm-hmm. give us the moment right before. You're like, okay, swishable. Is it always like speaker-0: always like you're trying to run from this call that's over your life. So for me, I know and I had a calling to heal, like this is something that has been heavy on me since I was a child. Like there is a thing that I have been called to do in my community and that is heal. But I knew I did not want to deal with blood or be a clinician That was not my ministry. and so I was public health. Like that was my background, like in undergrad and I will say lived experience has a way of just really coming in and rocking your world. So while I was a student at Clemson, I got pregnant out of wet like the whole thing. So you can just imagine what that meant for my faith background and all of that. And I end up having to have an emergency C section, all the things that could go wrong went wrong to bring my son into this world. And when I returned to school, so I had him in December 2011. When I returned to school in January 2012, my professors who are public health professors were asking me, well, how was it? Like, you know, maternal health is huge here in the United States. And when I described what my experience was, they were appalled. They were shocked. They were like, how how can this be in the nation, one of the greatest nations, some of these professors were international professors too. They were like, you didn't do a lactation consultant? Why aren't breastfeeding? Why you didn't try acupuncture? They named all these things. I'm like, look, I'm on medicating. All they told me to do was go see an OBGYN. And when the more I educated myself through that semester, I ended up writing the business plan for Swishville. Right then, 15 years ago, I wrote the business plan to say, how do we better understand non-Western practices that can help us heal better when it comes to maternal care? But didn't have the confidence to pursue it then. Fifteen years ago, did not have the confidence, wrote the business plan to help me get into grad school, and I just sat in the back and said, I got a baby, I got mouths to feed, let me just do the safest option and continue my career in hospital administration. I was at Medical University of South Carolina, I was at Duke Health for almost five years. and then I was recruited to a tech startup and I was like, Whoa, this is really cool because like everything that I learned in the hospital, so everything that I'm passionate about, I can just do. You know, you get to see founders building their dream and it just does something to you and you have this skill set to help them build their dream. speaker-1: it makes it normal, like exposure. It's true. You have to see it. You have to see it. speaker-0: And that that exposed me to what could be these founders who had no experience in health care was able to build a mul a multibillion dollar company in five years and all they did was say, I have an idea, let me put my thought out there and try. And so that experience helping them build for five years from seed stage to Series C, So the day I put in my notice was the day I found the old business plan. It was in a box. I wrote it out. I used it to get into grad school. So I found it, I dusted it off, I applied to get into like a incubator accelerator program, got accepted, and they had me go out and interview customers and kind of rebuild it. And I start pitching in pitch competitions, and that's what really helped me. Like the winning my first pitch competition, it was $20,000. It was by Black Girl Ventures and Kroger Foundation and MBA Foundation. And it was like that was what I needed to say, this is something. This is something. speaker-1: This that first like yes. Like that first someone's like, this is something and it's like, Like it's like I knew it was I knew it was something, because otherwise you wouldn't have even exactly. So you know it's something, you have faith, but like that I know they say don't seek external validation, but there is something about someone who is a big entity that you know has been a monster and Honestly, out of your league at up to that point says yes. Yes. Something really I I know, because I'm experiencing that and it's imposter syndrome like crazy. But it's like when someone finally sees it and validates it, it gave me a different level of, like, y'all think I'm for real, huh? Okay. speaker-0: It's like you see me, you I'm not like crazy because you can't get the the thing is when you start becoming a founder and really pursuing a business idea that you have, the people who have traditionally supported you and things they're not gonna understand it. I don't care how loving that your parents are not gonna understand it, your family, your friend, they're not gonna understand this. So you gotta get some kind of support that typically exists outside of that that will understand Okay, you are taking a bit lead. This is not a normal thing. There's only like what is it, less than one percent of the population really can be successful in in this type of work. Mm-hmm. So yeah. speaker-1: So when did you burn the bridges, would you say? Like you're like, okay, switch bow or die? speaker-0: I mean it was twenty twenty twenty four. I would say the beginning of twenty twenty four. After I left that the first startup that I helped scale, I went to another startup and it like I I just wanted to learn. I was going to these startups to learn from different founders because the first startup was two white men and I'm like I learned as much as I could from them but also I know I don't look like them. I know I can't just walk in a room and get a check written out like they can. And so I tried to learn from a woman of color. But she was also a physician. So you get what I'm saying? I just kept I like, you know, at this point it was with January twenty twenty four. I'm like, I'm betting on myself. It's do or die. I've learned everything I could and it's switchful. So I actually added it to my LinkedIn January twenty twenty four. Like I'm the founder of Switch O and I was so scared. I wasn't I didn't even want to press I didn't speaker-1: Thank you for being. speaker-0: even want to press share because I'm like people are gonna think I'm so crazy and it took my son, my son, he was like, speaker-1: enough. speaker-0: He's fit he'll be fifteen this year. speaker-1: Fifteen year old. speaker-0: Girl, he's starting high school next week. speaker-1: Are you serious? This time is time literally fli like it goes so slow and then like you look up and you're like speaker-0: Yes, you have a almost fifteen year old starting high school in Atlanta, which is a whole different speaker-1: Baby. God will keep you strong. Okay. speaker-0: So speaker-1: 'Cause you're in a space. In a place He will. Y'all been favored. Yeah. But yeah, I understand what you mean because okay, so HBC started in twenty twenty one after I gave my life fully gave my life to Christ. during my breakdown where I was like, didn't know if I wanted to live or die, literally. And That's why I always say I think my reverence for God was always there, but the surrender to God wasn't. I have my own plan. I'm a model and an actress, okay? Don't make me a pastor. I'm not interested in being ministry. I grew up in it. I don't wanna do it. Okay? Don't ask me, I'm gonna be nobody's first lady. Leave me alone. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: Grip me up. I'm like, okay, well, I'm still not doing ministry, but I hear that I hear you and I know you have something for me. Right. We're Pentecostals, so I had words spoken over my life for I mean, you know, every service. The the pastor, bring Mickey to the front. And I'm like eight. I love God so much I was like, I couldn't wait to fall out in the spirit and all that. I'm serious. You know how they put the blank it's speaker-0: Yes, yes. speaker-1: gonna be me one day. Like these are my aspirations as a eight girl. Like so that should tell you something. But I'm like tithing my allowance and everything. And I remember going up to the front several times and they're like, You are gonna be on stages. You, your daughter's voice is anointed. She's gonna be on stages, she's gonna meet the masses. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: There is something on her life where she is going to be seen. Now, me who was in high school, in performance school, I've always been this like character, right? Yeah. It made sense for me to be an actress. I was good at it. Mm-hmm. And I thought that was how. And I really think it still could be, because I am a creative. But that's the only way I the only way I knew how I was going to reach a lot of people. So like even if I was not fully surrendered to a full purpose to look like the way I thought God wanted it to look like, I knew I was supposed to be seen and that's what always kept me going. Right. Cause I was doing auditions at 3 AM, get the agent, all that kind of thing. I was doing it, doing it girl. I was on my way. Okay. And that's when yanked up out of it. And it's in twenty twenty one. speaker-0: Is this in twenty twenty one? When you got So you were here in Atlanta like really exploring I moved here. speaker-1: Here to act. speaker-0: I did not know this. Okay, continue. speaker-1: baby, this my story, babe. So yeah, I moved here to act. I literally took a travel assignment as an RT, w went to Virginia. That was the only thing that was open. I was like, I'm gonna stay there and save up enough money to move to Atlanta eventually. Each you good. Each contract is 13 weeks. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: So I'm like, maybe I'll do like two or three and like save up enough and do it. The very last day of the first 13 weeks assignment, because mind you, I drove myself to Virginia, rented furniture, worked there. The second to last day of my assignment, this girl comes up to me who I only saw her a few times while I was working, but she saw me online looking at Atlanta, like apartments or something like that. And she's like, you know, my mom just opened our guest bedroom. Like if you wanted to come to Atlanta now and stay with us, like I'll do it for you for like, you know, it's not that much. And then you can like figure it out from there. And I'm like, now this is BC. So this is before I'm surrendered, but I'm like, you know what? Why not? For some reason now that I'm surrendered, I'm not like that anymore. I overthink everything. Like I and for some reason I was like, you know what? Okay, let's do it. I throw my blanket, my lamp, and my clothes in my Ultima with a hundred thousand miles on it, and drove to Atlanta to this girl's house. And within the first 20 days, because I only had enough to pay her for like that month, I got two jobs as an RT. And I was like, okay, moved into my first apartment. Yeah, it it was crazy. and quickly, I had a bad breakup, went into the mental health crisis, and then back to God. speaker-0: Whoa. speaker-1: after that, I like had to lock myself in the house for like three months and truly like purge everything that I thought was gonna be and kind of grieve it in a way. And it opened me up to see he gave me the name and everything, her promise circle, but I was like, okay, a faceless Instagram account where I'm posting some Christian stuff. speaker-0: Now girl, you already know what I'm about to say about that. Why you why you hiding? Why you hiding? speaker-1: I wanted it to be a faceless Instagram account where sometimes I post some devotionals and it turned into me pulling in like four of my friends and we did I made them come. I was like, where y'all at? Turned into recording Bible study and then it turned into the podcast, which I'm recording on my iPhone. No video. The first year. I'm not being As speaker-0: In this space with the speaker-1: you know, I was just in the club yesterday, it felt like. And I feel like I was just I was modeling. When I say modeling, I'm gonna show you after this, but your girl was. A video mixing. Okay. speaker-0: I that post that you said, but it's like why can we talk about that though? we can why was there a feeling that you your face couldn't be seen because of this? Like what cause I have dealt with that too, but I just want to hear your story. Like why was it that I shouldn't be seen? I'm not worth because I'm doing this thing, right? speaker-1: Yeah. speaker-0: I just wanna hear your perspective. speaker-1: I think also be like all my followers came from that for one. So they was not interested in what I had to say. One. Two, I think it was also like some internalized shame of like, and you see my post, I'm literally like preaching. and it's like so this this girl is now like preaching. Like it was a lot of perception from myself and also others that it was just like, well, give me a minute. Like, let me just ease that because this is a whole new identity. I mean, like, living boyfriends, drinking, like these are my normal day-to-day things. And now I'm fully like not doing those things to numb. I'm now facing pain. I'm talking about it. I'm open with my faith in God and how He saved me and all that. And I think it was just it was such a quick jump that like I was like, how is P are How are people gonna see? Like, I really didn't know. And I did post some every once in a while and I would stop and and some. I'm just now posting consistently, like this year. speaker-0: Well yeah we thought yeah. speaker-1: And this is five years later. And that's one thing when we were talking, like we literally were like prophesying and like revealing things to each other because that's genuinely what was going on. Like the first time ever. That I like am like, okay, I can be seen as this and it's okay. Of course, I get those comments like you saw, right? And I'm I usually stopped after that. But this is the first time I'm I I'm still going. Cause you just saw that was like what, a week ago? And even then, that was a week before I actually posted it. Cause I was like, it's gonna cause dissension and contention and people are gonna see. And I was like, I'm gonna just move anyway. And this is the first time I'm still moving. And the doors are opening. But yeah, I think it was internalized shame. Yeah. speaker-0: And I I I can see that too for myself. And literally I just met with my spiritual director yesterday and she was just saying, like, when did you feel the most connected with the source, right? Like your most connection with God. And when was your introduction to that connection? I was telling her about like how I used to praise dance. Like growing up praise dancing. That was like my connection. Like everything would go black and all I would feel is a light. I couldn't tell you who was dancing around me, did they hit their moves or not? That was my connection. But when I got pregnant out of wedlock, I had to sit down, right? I was told like, hey, how can you be an example to these younger women, right? Pregnant. Like you you like and so there was so much shame that came with that that still to this day, if I hear a gospel song, I'm like still. Like I can't like I can't move. And I just feel this need to hide, to close, like to and and one of and again my mentor, she was like, You need to start posting more of you in the collar. Like I need to see you and it 'cause you need to embrace it. There should no longer be shame associated just because of a choice or something that happened, it was still God in that choice or whatever. So all that to say I'm just sharing that with you because I think we share that same sense of shame that we have made choices out of survival, out of trying to interpret the dreams and calling that God has put on us, and maybe we interpret it the wrong way. But we did it and it ended up being helping us be a it was a vehicle to help us get to where we needed to go. But we still got those little like haters that just pop up and it's like, Remember when you should do this and it's like and I think that was a man that commented on you. How he gonna tell speaker-1: Baby, in the video he's talking about, I literally have on a romper that is covering everybody part. Okay? Except my legs and my arms. It is 109 here. I don't know how much more modest I can possibly be. And that is why I was trying to show the contrast. So he's calling me out for a romper that had me fully covered. Something I would never have worn in 2018, 2019 when I was doing this because I put that picture up there because I wasn't even I had a broad underwear on and I was like that Online publicly. So for you to judge me in this moment where God has brought me out of that and tell me I'm not modest enough still, is like you are you're missing the opportunity to see how far I truly have come. And for you to say that I need to be a better example to young women, I've literally built a nonprofit and talked to women every week of my life, is just, and I just think the church does that. speaker-0: It does that. It does that. And but that is church. That is not godly. That is not godlike. He had to yeah. speaker-1: He was like, I the people who hurt you misrepresented me. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Mm. speaker-1: And you're treating me like the people who hurt you when that's not me. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: And that alone helped me be like, okay, you want me. I get it. But even in those moments then, I was still being tugged on and pulled. Like even in those moments then I could recognize him. From young I recognized the presence of God and I was still being pulled. I remember being drunk, like praying, like super drunk, like on some nights, just like Lord please. speaker-0: Ha speaker-1: I know I I know I'm not redoing this, but here I am, like, and then the next day, you know, you got another plan. But it was like that for years, him pulling at me. And I knew I was quote unquote sinning or not living in that way, but that's the only thing that helped the pain that I was already going through. Right. And I had no other tools for it. And so in that in that I can give young me grace. And I feel like I really draw women who deal with shame deeply. Brene Brown. Yes. Have you recommended speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. speaker-1: I recommend it to everyone because internalized shame will have you perceiving people perceiving you that aren't even perceiving you. speaker-0: Mm-mm, they don't even care. speaker-1: Baby, they're not thinking about you like you think yet. speaker-0: I literally my mentor is telling me that with grenade. She was like, Girl, nobody going to bed and waking up thinking about you speaker-1: I wonder what Georgina doing. She calls you know. speaker-0: I will go, I will spiral like my god, I did this, I said this, I posted this and they don't care. speaker-1: That's why on your comment I was like you are so right because you're the only one who was like I recognize what this is because that is a fear of mine already, it was like real because we saw the comment that literally was saying what out my biggest fear. The reason I haven't been posting was that. I tell people all the time, my fear is not the world. I don't they're not gonna understand me anyway. But the thing is most of them love it, how I talk about it, how I express it, because I'm myself. And I'm not, even if I feel shame, even if I feel fear, it feels more uncomfortable not doing it. speaker-0: Right. And so it but all that what you're just saying, all the love that people have shown, it was that one comment that realized it that was like, my gosh, the shame is loud. Like you said, you had to sit with it for a week and then you posted that one comment, but now how do you feel on the other side of it? Now you have the that fear of someone bringing up your pastor someone just saying that you're not good enough, you're not a role model enough. Now that that has come out How do you feel now about posting? Cause like you said in the beginning you would just stop and be like they're right. But now you addressed it, you posted about it. Do you feel like that would like, let's go now? Or what what is it feeling like? speaker-1: Think, burn the bridges, right? This is my very first season of burning the bridges. And what I mean by that is not having a plan B. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: Because in 2022, so a year after I started the Bible studies, NHPC started growing because I was posting it on TikTok going, hey, come to our Bible study in the smallest text, girl. speaker-0: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. speaker-1: They still came, they still found your girl, and so every week they're showing up a bunch of them and then we turned it into the app and then resources and then I got my health coaching certification. Now I'll do I put the health all together. Like it turned into this big thing. But in twenty twenty two I was like, you know what? I'm not going back to work because I just ended COVID and I just saw mass people dying. Like I was going through truly like speaker-0: Respiratory yeah. And you're a respiratory therapist, yeah. speaker-1: Families are not allowed in and I had to hold up tablets of people saying goodbye to their family who weren't allowed to come say goodbye to them. speaker-0: Mm. speaker-1: So I'm the last person like hundreds of people have seen. And that does something to a person. And I realized like during a code, like a few of them, I was like just not present and I hated that I wasn't being reverent of a life being lost because I was like, whoa, I think I'm in full compassion fatigue. Because I'm also doing her promise circle. Pouring, pouring, pouring, going to work in COVID, like pouring, COVID, pouring. speaker-0: Hmm. speaker-1: No. So I took off like six weeks of work and had the money to do it. I built my house and everything. So I'm like, you know what? H E C do or die. Let's do it. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: I went back to work three months later. speaker-0: Same, I was about to say, we get to that twenty twenty-four. I went back to I di I quit, I had a baby, and then I went straight back where I'm like, y'all playing out here. speaker-1: I was like, I'm a boss, CEO, entrepreneur. God gave me this vision. Let's go. Went right back to work. Quit my job in May, because I told it was like Joan and the whale. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: Everybody's life was falling apart at work. I have never had issues at work. I was down to part time. I thought that was me being obedient. I was like, Lord, I'm not full time no more. I'm just doing two days a week. But I that meant I had no off days. Mm-hmm. So our respiratory, respiratory, Sunday, somewhat off, but I have to sleep for the day because I work nights, because it's 12 hour shifts. And then Monday through Thursday, HPC here every day. So I hadn't haven't had days off in like four years or something. no weekend, nothing. And I thought that was me creating balance, but it was me still scared. speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. speaker-1: And God had to make it so uncomfortable, because I love everyone there, that's why I stay, that I left. Like fully was like, I physically can't be here. okay. This chaplain came up to me and she's like, this your exodus. One of the nurses came to me and she said, you know you're glowing, this is your season. Just random stuff was happening to me like that. speaker-0: And what was your response to that? speaker-1: Baby, I looked at her like she's crazy. But I was just like, how do you how do you know that I'm tussling with this? speaker-0: They don't you just getting the message. But you don't believe that. You believe the speaker-1: He had to bring people. Okay, I mean I need a sign. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: He had to bring send the send the people to talk. Okay, because I was like, quit. Like, do you under quit? And so it was really leaving wilderness mindset into Promised Land. Because in the promised land, you're not getting manna that comes paycheck, paycheck. You're tilling the land with what he's given you. speaker-0: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. speaker-1: Massive grapes exist. Giants do exist and this is giants, baby. I'm facing like my fear of vulnerability, fear of being seen. I'm facing all the giants. And it's mostly internal. But learning that he is my provider, I think all of us with jobs and a calling go through this phase where we literally don't know how to make money outside of that. Because that was the dream. The dream was to get a job. Yeah. Get a job. speaker-0: Pays well? Girl, how do you let that job that pay I was making the most money I ever made in my life? My bills were on auto pay. Do you know how I was like I don't even know how much they cost to auto pay? Hey, speaker-1: Gina girl keep talking about speaker-0: my life is good. But then you get this this this disruption in your spirit, like you're so unsettled. speaker-1: I every shift was miserable. I was getting lied on, girl. I was getting things that that never happened to me while I was there in five years were happening. It was like I said, Jonah Well, they were like, throw Mickey off the boat or y'all no one's getting peace. Because I was like, Lord, I will. Give me like two get out or you're gonna literally suffer here. And I was. So in May I like truly jumped and and burnt the bridge and I know that I didn't that that first time because I was always like, you can always go back. And even now my friends and people around me were like, well, you can always go back. Everyone keeps saying that around me, but like I know that's not an option. I can't go back. speaker-0: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. speaker-1: Five years I've been doing this cycle loop, no sleep, whatever. So do I quit HBC and be a respiratory therapist where I'm comfortable? Because I can't do both now. No. It's too big now. It requires more and more. I don't have time to do both. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: Yeah. So am I a respiratory therapist or am I the executive director and founder of her promise circle? Which one am I? And I was like I was living in between so long that I was like, okay, I know I'm not a respiratory therapist. Going in this building makes me want to throw up. I literally can't even be here. speaker-0: You know it. You know it. speaker-1: So I chose for the first time and that's when I got speaking and doors opening, the the formal partnerships and just in this past since I met you. Since I met you, so much has happened that never happened, but I've been doing this for five years. speaker-0: Because you had to come into alignment, right? Like you had and you had to be obedient. It's obedience. Like the first time you were like still thinking of this as like, I'm gonna do it and I need money. And it's a hobby, but I need money. But when you're now like I it's all or nothing, I'm all in like these giants that I am literally the the That are like tackling me in life. It's like you have to have this mindset. I just wrote a prayer about this. Like, if I have to battle Goliath, I'm gonna come back with the head of a giant. Like you have to say, I'm going up against this giant, this li but is it me or you? And it's gonna be me. speaker-1: Cause this is the only way. That's literally how feel. This is it. I'm gonna just keep showing up. And I know who you are and I know you better not let this mortgage lapse because I didn't build my house the first one in our entire family to build a home. My mom's the only one who owns her home and I'm the first one to build one, right? So she stepped up out of her nine siblings and she's very favored, it's obvious, but then I came from that and first degree for I'm the first of everything. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: And so I know you didn't favor me like that from where I come from. The addiction below the poverty line. Like we are so set apart in my family for me to be without all of a sudden. When I know you gave me this, I know you don't want me to quit this. This is it. Doors are opening. This is it. speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: I burn the bridges and so it's like God is my source. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. That's the thing. He has to strip for you to realize that that he's your source. You have to strip all he has to strip all those pieces that you kind of were idolizing away. And I I feel the same way for my journey. It's like once I was stripped from all that where it was just him, like it was so I saw a pop meme too saying, like, God come too close to eleven fifty-nine for me. It was eleven fifty lay in. speaker-1: He loves the midnight hour. He said it's eleven fifty nine, fifty-seven seconds. Okay, night speaker-0: Like you ain't got no other choice. And it's like but he comes. And y that is your source. Now you know who your true provider, your protector is, and there's no way for any of these other idols to interject now. Like that's when it speaker-1: I have never been without. speaker-0: Yeah. Never. speaker-1: We always do this in the season where it seems like less or a different place. But really, it's just transition and the uncomfortability of what's what's to come. Like the Israelites looped for what was supposed to be what seven to eleven day journey? 40 years because they could only believe God for basic needs. And I think us, especially as African Americans, because of our history, we are so reliant on manna and just enough. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: That survival and we're trapped in seeing comfort. We're not exposed to new that's why I think you when you saw the build the peop them building, he put you in that so you could see, hey, it's possible. Because that opens your vision to see I could do this. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: But unless you're exposed to it, because out of all my brothers, like I said, yesterday, there's seven of us. But I'm the only one that went to the PWI and saw the the traditional family units and all my friends had millionaire parents. And I saw it and I was there. And so I knew it was possible. But most of my family hasn't even been on planes or anything like that. So I knew that I was exposed early for something. And this tussle with God lately has been, Lord, we're done with manna. Okay. I need to see the Amos 913 God yesterday. Okay. Are you part of the Red Sea? So this is this is chump change to you. Okay. So the you that I'm willing to see now is not the the sustainer in wilderness. The you I wanna see now is the one who has done exceedingly and abundantly beyond what I've asked or thought because I have never seen this, but I'm doing it. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: So it's gotta be you. Yeah. And that's the first time I think I was convicted in the fact that. in my identity. And as soon as your identity is like single, I think all your thoughts can align and then the doors are like, it is you. Like this has your name on it. speaker-0: Yes, yes. speaker-1: This doesn't have the RT's name on it. This has f so you can't even perceive it. Behold, I'm doing a new thing. Do you not perceive it? And if he's doing something new and your provision no longer is a paycheck, you can't even perceive these doors because these are not new doors. Right. My partnership came from someone I knew for five years when I started HP. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: It's always been there, but I could not perceive it because I wasn't her baby speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: and showing up every day as her. That's why I say I got that dog in me. Okay. I know I'm willing to do a lot of things that people are not willing to sit in. Uncomfortability. People he showed me how to idol of certainty. I made certainty an idol. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. Yes, that's it. That's the idol. Yeah. speaker-1: Even if I had to make up a negative that I can believe for sure was gonna happen, I wanted certainty that bad versus he could blow your mind. I speaker-0: Yeah. speaker-1: was like, why are you telling me this? Cause this is literally ruining my life. Like because that's really what we do. You you try to you try to prepare for the worst case scenario and expect the negative and say, well, God might not come through, so I'm gonna go back to this job. because he might not come through or I'll keep it in the back pocket. Versus, no, you could quit and God really could do it this time. Mm-hmm. That's never been my perspective perspective of him until now. speaker-0: Mm. And it just took you being a like what was that catalyst then in May that you felt like it was speaker-1: I literally was physically ill going to work. speaker-0: Yeah, yeah. It and all the chaos that was happening at the job. Yeah. speaker-1: I had no peace. I had no time to rest or recover to be effective for the girls. speaker-0: Mm. speaker-1: And that's where I feel the most alive, aligned, and fulfilled. So speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: if I can't do this and work here, I'm either going to just work here or do this. And I had to choose. Cause it was stealing my peace. And you can't have my peace. I mean at 35, God or not, you want your peace. speaker-0: You do. You really do. The speaker-1: You are n I'm sorry, but speaker-0: age where you're like, hold on, like I'm halfway, I'm not a child no more. I'm like about to be homegrown. Like I cannot. speaker-1: You it's you or or me at this point. Do or die. And I think a lot of people I've been seeing on TikTok millennials are hating their nine to fives right now, but I think a lot of people are missing that that uncomfortability is not normal. You sh you are probably not meant to be an employee. speaker-0: Mm, I like that the way you said it. I never thought about it that way. Like I you know, one thing about founding a company and building a team, I was like, I want people to love to come to work, to look for it to Mondays. That's what I want for my employees, my team. Like I want them to feel like I'm not gonna be toxic, like this is a family, no. Y'all got your own families, y'all trying to go home to. But we are a team and we're gonna win a championship. But I need you to look in order to do that, you gotta love what we're doing. And you're right, like I'm looking at social and so many people are miserable. That's why I'm always checking in on my team and our one-on-ones. Like, are you happy? What do you need to find? What is bringing you joy and work? Most of the time they're saying means in social media, which is fun. It's fun. But it's like you have to constantly check on that. But I think the leader, that's why we are probably getting this call to be the new generation of leaders, because think about the leaders we had to work for. They are not. speaker-1: Baby, nothing that I needed. speaker-0: Like, yeah, I'm like, who trade like what is the leadership like? What just cause you were good at your job, they just put you in a leadership position? I'm like, this doesn't make any sense. And I think those same leaders are h are like managing the ones that we're seeing that are disgusted with their nine to five. But even maybe they are meant to be entrepreneurs, but even if they're not meant to be entrepreneurs, they need to find a better situation. speaker-1: You're not in alignment. Yeah. You can be in a job, but maybe you are supposed to go get the d different degree. May and maybe you had the dream, but you were like, well, this schooling will be easier. You're just not in alignment. Yeah. Discomfort, like all the time showing up to something that feels mundane to you, or you're moving in on autopilot on, you're you have to be challenged. Our brains need to be challenged. And if you are so comfortable, but now you're uncomfortable, all of a sudden, pay attention to that. Yeah. Because you usually are moving on autopilot. Like you live in for the weekend. Living for the paycheck. But when God starts to disrupt you, the brook dries up, the brook of cherub dries up. Okay. When that's done, it's time to move. Somewhere. I don't speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. speaker-1: know if you're supposed to be a founder because this this takes a special kind of person. But you're not in alignment. You have to pay attention to that. And I just think God is doing that in a big way with a lot of people. Cause I know a lot of people who feel it, then ignore it, feel it, then ignore it. And that was me for so long. but let's talk about the the loneliness that comes with being at the top. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: And I'm not talking about winning or succeeding, because yes, it's lonely at the top, they say. But like you ever find like a disconnection. of telling someone who you know cares about you, loves you, about this or and they're just like, I'm so proud of you, this is great. Like, but you can tell that they don't really understand what it took for you even to be in that position. Like they're saying the the accolades, but If you tell them like, I'm tired or like they don't understand that type of exhaustion that you're expressing. Yeah. And I find that like when I talk to another founder, like I don't have to explain it. And there's some sort of weight that's lifted when I am around like you or Sabrina talking to you about like the tiredness. Cause it's like I'm great. People are like, well, be grateful. This happened. I am. This is what you're not understanding. I am. I am. I am. But you have to understand, I see the big vision, but also, this is me five years in. I'm tired. speaker-0: Tired, exhausted. speaker-1: And it's a different kind of weight speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: and and exhaust it it's our adjectives are different than I think other people can comprehend unless you're doing it. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. speaker-1: So have you found it's hard to connect with other women or new people in a way that not founders or your friends, family, and explain to them this and felt misunderstood in some way or just not getting the emotional support that you need? speaker-0: Yeah, I I feel that really much so in this season. Because like I would say family like my husband he's just you know, he's always like, You got that dog in you. He's so supportive and I think he gets it, but like that's about that's about it in my circle. Like and I can't put that on him because we are partners trying to raise our household. So I thought that I could go to like you know, I'm in seminary school too on the side. So I had this group, I joined this group called the formation communities, and it was like basically like connecting with other faith leaders and praying once a week with them. And I just know we used to do spiritual direction and I would come in and explain like certain things that I was it going through, but they couldn't connect. Like I'm literally saying I'm asked Out here battling, like talking to investors or trying to get this partnership and they're like, Girl, you better be glad they met with you and I'm like, Again, my attitude is a spirit of gratitude. Yes. But speaker-1: You don't understand speaker-0: like speaker-1: what went into like that feeling before you walked in the room. The feeling that that the weight of like okay if this don't go through, then I gotta find the next one. And it's just like that constant like okay, there's more after this. I still gotta go. speaker-0: Go, go, go. It's never slows down. Never. And then just what you said, the feeling before you go in the room, every single room, especially the ones, there are the rooms where you're the only one. I'm the only one in the room. I I we had the drive to pitch in a different state for rural health funding. When I say we were the only ones in the room and like talking to all of these people, none of these people look like you. And you're not trying to explain their calling and your mission and they're trying to poke and pick at every single answer you get. Like that's what you have to walk into. And then you walk into rooms where it's all of us but it's like the I don't know, the the a different version of all of us, like you're still not good enough. Yes. So it's like you're constantly being like played with mentally speaker-1: And then and looked over and and and then it's just like it's just a wait. And then it's like you do the one you get in the room and you know how much it took you to do that and then like you're like, I gotta do this again tomorrow. speaker-0: And tomorrow and the day after that. And the day after that. And you can't have time off. Like that's what I'm like. People glorify entrepreneurship. I'm like, dude, that's what I'm saying. It's not you think of nine to five you tired. I was up one to five AM doing like coding in our software. Like you are on the clock. All you are the business. People, you go in the grocery store, you are wearing I'm wearing switchboard across my forehead. You're wearing her prom it like literally speaker-1: Fires gotta be put out by you. The the decision gotta be made by you ultimately. You don't have nobody to be like, well what are you? It's you. You. It's you and you. speaker-0: And that so that's why that exhaustion pals on and no one can no one really can understand I think unless they're like living with you or in it. But I think that's why I thank God for this kind of relationship because you have never I have tried to make friends like especially through threads. I don't know if you tried threads like I've tried to meet with people in person and then they get upset because like I don't respond as quickly. Like I went to this like black girl Marvel, I love Marvel and Side Spider Man's coming out. and speaker-1: makes a of speaker-0: I went to a Black Girls Marvel meetup and they were upset that I wasn't responding and I was like, Wait, like I'm I'm literally building a billion dollar business. Like I'm and I'm in seminary school. I just got ordained as a ready. And I'm a mom of three. A fifty year old and two under two. And I have a hood like so if I don't respond that same I don't speaker-1: Take it person. speaker-0: take it personally and you have been like one of the first people that I have met that get it. You're like, hey, and I'm gonna follow up with you. yeah. speaker-1: I'm texting you back. You're texting me back. Literally like, hey Jordina, two days go by. speaker-0: Yeah, like like we felt judgment with that. And so I just think when we can find people that have that connection and that understanding in this journey, those are the people like that are for you. speaker-1: One hundred percent. It's like I can be me and not feel apologetic about it. speaker-0: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. speaker-1: And anyone who meets you and I haven't known you very long, but like I feel like I know you're wrong. But if you know your s your spirit, if you have good discernment, 'cause that's all I do, your spirit is not like that, where it's like, I'm ignoring you, Gaba. That's not even in your character. So for someone to n to feel that way from you, I just don't think they even let your spirit penetrate them. Right. In a way that was like genuine. Do you genuinely believe the unnatural warfare of the comments with me? And also just our meeting still has yet to happen, but like when we sat there in that moment of talking about what we're both doing and building and like how it's literally what the world needs. Like, and it's something we've both been building for years and the unifying, do you Do you think that warfare and delay is confirmation that it's close? speaker-0: yes, girl. I've been talking about this. Just you were so aligned with me right now. I've been telling everyone spiritual warfare because. People who I am associated with, and I start to feel like it's me, like I'm putting bad vibes on everyone. People that I come in contact with, even my team has been under attack this last month. Like my CTO had a wreck, nearly lost her life coming from that pitch competition. My chief of staff, grandmother just got diagnosed with cancer. My head of growth, his daughter had emergency surgery. My son had like a psychosis episode and we were in the hospital. Like everyone is getting attacked, and now you're telling me what you know you are going through like it and and I feel like this is something that I've just been praying about, reading about in the scripture. It's like when you are at that door, like God clearly has put a vision in your mind of where you're supposed to be. When you are close to that door, that the devil cannot block you from going through the door. It is yours. He cannot stop you from turning the knob and walking through. But what he can do is try to trick you. And my husband always says if you let the devil trick you out your spot Don't listen to it because he's right there at that door saying, You ain't gonna do it. I'm gonna put this in the way. I'm gonna do that. He gonna try to do everything he can to stop you from turning that knob or walking through. So you're right there. speaker-1: First Corinthians sixteen nine. Yeah. speaker-0: Yes, come on. speaker-1: Listen, cause I'll start sh but a great and effectual door is open unto me and there are many adversary and a great effectual door is certain open unto me you and for you and and there are many adversaries because people think well I didn't get this I didn't get that okay well I'm gonna go back to work no no no no and it comes together And conjunctive and it comes together. speaker-0: Yes. They ganging up. So you gotta be able to pull up speaker-1: Yeah, for real. speaker-0: and like can you handle that? Are you built for that? That's the thing you have to be built spiritually for this. Like when I say go into battle, like I don't care. There's nothing you can do to take me out. But that it's gonna pause. It's gonna try to slow speaker-1: baby, yeah. speaker-0: it down. Because like, woo, that just knocked me off my what happened with the sun. Like Jesus Christ. speaker-1: my god. speaker-0: But like right there, I'm like, I'm I'm still. speaker-1: We're literally. We are literally we're here. speaker-0: Here. speaker-1: We have arrived. My one friend, she was like, When do you finally let yourself arrive? I think as a founder, because we keep pushing every day, we're like, every tomorrow I gotta do it. But we're here. We're doing what founders do. So we are founders. We are successful. We're helping many people every day. Like we are here. Like we have arrived. And I know that every time some of these like my power going out. It's it's just we're here. speaker-0: Mm-hmm. And he's sending them and but you pushing through you like episode goes on anyway. speaker-1: You can't tell me nothing. I'm Jesus asleep on the boat. Disciples around me, my God, this happened. that's fine. I'm asleep. Okay. Wake me up when when we cross. Right. I'm here. I'm not getting distracted by the storm. speaker-0: You're not gonna razzle me. You're not gonna do any of that. I'm ready to go. Let's go. You know? speaker-1: Well, thank you for doing this. I just feel like we need a whole series at this point because like Jesus, there's so much to talk about. But I think this is a blessing to people who feel that disruption and misalignment and can move into what God has called them to. And this will bless y'all. I know it is. I already know it's gonna bless y'all. So tell the people how to find you. speaker-0: Yes, you can follow me at Joy Deuce on Instagram or you can follow Swishvo, my company, at Join Swishvo or www.swishvo.com. speaker-1: Perfect. And you know, it's your girl Mikkel, McKel dot Renee and Mikkelrene.com and then her promisecircle.org if you want to join us for health-based Bible studies, prayer calls, the health coaching that helps you with stress regulation. We do a lot of stuff. but preventative care all day. because we should not have to end up in crisis before people pay attention to us. Yes. Especially as women, especially as black women. Absolutely. Yeah, between her and and me, y'all should be set. Y'all should be good. thank you for joining us and we will see you next episode.