Latest / Brian Thomas / Tech Friday w/ Dave Hatter - Sponsored by Intrust IT - 10/16/2026

Transcript

Tech Friday w/ Dave Hatter - Sponsored by Intrust IT - 10/16/2026 · Brian Thomas

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Station.
• 0:03
  Speaker 2: 631-55-KRCD talk station. InTrustIT.com. If you're a business owner, I
• 0:08
  Speaker 2: bet you have computers and I bet you need best
• 0:10
  Speaker 2: practices put in place to avoid all of the pitfalls
• 0:13
  Speaker 2: and landmines that you encounter online and connected to the world. InTrustIT.com.
• 0:18
  Speaker 2: The business curses, they are the best in the business.
• 0:20
  Speaker 2: That would be Dave Hatter's company. Employee owned. They got
• 0:23
  Speaker 2: great folks working for you. Dave Hatter, thank you so
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: much for sponsoring the segment here on the 55K morning show.
• 0:27
  Speaker 2: We'd like to call Tech Friday with you, Dave Hatter.
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: Always my pleasure, Brian. Happy to be here.
• 0:33
  Speaker 2: Not sure if you were listening. I'm not mad if
• 0:35
  Speaker 2: you weren't, but the first article you want to talk about,
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: the artificial intelligence refrigerator, led me to get a list
• 0:41
  Speaker 2: of some of the dumbest Internet of Things devices you
• 0:43
  Speaker 2: could ever find, including an Internet-controlled salt shaker. Of course,
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: it's hooked up to an app. You can get an
• 0:53
  Speaker 2: Icon smart condom, wearable smart device that tracks and measures
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: all kinds of metrics of the bedroom activity. It's I
• 1:01
  Speaker 2: just couldn't believe this stuff existed. You talk about it
• 1:03
  Speaker 2: all the time. So let's pivot back over to the story.
• 1:06
  Speaker 2: You wanted to talk about a smart refrigerator. Just open
• 1:09
  Speaker 2: the door and look and see what you need, for
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: God's sake.
• 1:12
  Speaker 1: I'm glad you brought that up, Brian. I couldn't agree
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: with you more because more and more we're talking about
• 1:18
  Speaker 1: Internet of Things devices, a.k.a. smart devices. People listening can't
• 1:22
  Speaker 1: see me doing the air quotes around that. This stuff
• 1:25
  Speaker 1: is a privacy and security dumpster fire, as I keep saying,
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: and we just have more and more examples. So I'm
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: glad you looked that up, and no, I did not
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: hear that.
• 1:34
  Speaker 2: How about a $ 50 egg tray, Wi-Fi connected to count
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: your eggs?
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: Well, I want to come back to that. I'm glad
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: you brought that up. On my Substack, davehatter.substack.com. This is
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: just a blogging site. One of the things I have
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: blogged on is why the Internet of Things, so-called smart devices,
• 1:57
  Speaker 1: are a privacy and security dumpster fire, and why you
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: should get rid of all this garbage. Just some high-level stuff,
• 2:02
  Speaker 1: including links to books like Mick of Opponents, If It's Smart,
• 2:05
  Speaker 1: It's Vulnerable, where he meant anything, including the election system,
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: by the way, is vulnerable. And then Bruce Schneier's book,
• 2:14
  Speaker 1: Click Here to Kill Everyone. Now, Bruce Schneier is a
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: very well-known cryptography expert. He knows more about this than
• 2:20
  Speaker 1: I could ever hope to know. And he wrote a
• 2:22
  Speaker 1: book called Click Here to Kill Everyone. So you tell me, Brian.
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: But my point is, on that sub stack, every time
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: I find a story like this, I add it. So
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: you don't have to just see what I'm saying about it.
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: You don't have to see what other experts are saying
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: about it. I am now creating a compendium of these stories.
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: I encourage all your listeners. I'll put it in today's
• 2:41
  Speaker 1: show notes. Just go see for yourself. It's one after
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: another after another of these things. It's your car. It's everything, right?
• 2:50
  Speaker 1: But this really brings us to a finer point, especially
• 2:52
  Speaker 1: in light of the story that came out of France.
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: And forget about AI at this point. Does your device
• 2:59
  Speaker 1: have software in it? And does it need software? Is
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: it connected to the internet using that software? And ask yourself, why?
• 3:06
  Speaker 1: To your point, why do I need to have an
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: egg tray for 50 bucks when I could get probably
• 3:10
  Speaker 1: a 50 cent egg tray and I can look in
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: the refrigerator and count the eggs myself?
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: Not to mention- Just keep them in the damn carton
• 3:16
  Speaker 2: you bought them in.
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: Even better. Even better, Brian. That's what I do because
• 3:20
  Speaker 1: I am cheap, as my wife will tell you. But
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: imagine this for a second. Even without the issue of
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: the security and usability issue this brings up, Do you
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: really think it's going to be helpful to you when
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: your insurance company strikes a deal with your smart refrigerator
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: company and they surreptitiously buy your data because you signed
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: a terms of service that's 80 pages long? It's a
• 3:42
  Speaker 1: confusopoly of legal and technical mumbo jumbo that you can't understand.
• 3:46
  Speaker 1: And they're buying your data and they suddenly see that
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: you eat 15 pounds of bacon a week. You have
• 3:52
  Speaker 1: 30 jars of mayonnaise. You drink 42 gallons of Diet
• 3:57
  Speaker 1: Coke and three gallons of vodka. Do you think that
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: is going to be helpful to you in your insurance premiums? So,
• 4:04
  Speaker 1: but anyhow, back to this particular story. And this is
• 4:07
  Speaker 1: not a new concept. Brian, year after year after year,
• 4:11
  Speaker 1: for all the years we've been doing this, you hear
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: people like me, including me, saying software updates. You've got
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: to install the software updates. If you didn't catch it, Brian,
• 4:19
  Speaker 1: this past Patch Tuesday, you know, Microsoft releases their updates
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: once a month. They fixed 1,413 bugs. 1,413. That is
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: an all-time record after last month's Patch Tuesday record of
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: almost 1,000. So you've got these devices that used to
• 4:36
  Speaker 1: just work, used to keep your drinks cold, used to
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: make ice cubes without any of this software, no internet connections.
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: They just work. Well, now you got to worry about
• 4:45
  Speaker 1: these patches. And now add to it, well, you hear
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: me say, install the patches. The patches break your refrigerator.
• 4:52
  Speaker 1: You come home from work, Right after it dropped the
• 4:55
  Speaker 1: dime on you, the insurance company, it updates itself, stops working,
• 4:59
  Speaker 1: and ruins all your food.
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: It reminds me of the 737 MAX update that resulted
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: in pilots crashing planes in the ground because they weren't
• 5:06
  Speaker 2: advised about the software update, Dave.
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: Did you see the story out of France? It's kind
• 5:11
  Speaker 1: of related but on a commercial side, right? Because this
• 5:13
  Speaker 1: consumer stuff is terrible garbage. But now we're ruining everything
• 5:18
  Speaker 1: in industry with this kind of thing as well. Commercial
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: refrigeration units in many supermarkets, I think possibly as many
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: as 1,000 in France, this headline just came out this week,
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: were attacked by hackers because, of course, they have software
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: in them now and they're connected to the internet. They
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: were attacked by hackers. They were made to overheat. Yep.
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: Millions of pounds of food were ruined, and in some
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: cases they caught on fire. So even better, you come home,
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: your refrigerator has not only ruined your food, no longer works,
• 5:47
  Speaker 1: but it's burned your house down because of a bad
• 5:49
  Speaker 1: software update or hackers found it online using Shodan and
• 5:53
  Speaker 1: burned your house down.
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: Food for thought on that, Dave.
• 5:56
  Speaker 1: I know this sounds crazy to people, Brian. How can it?
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: That's partially why I started building this.
• 6:01
  Speaker 2: I know, but how can it sound crazy? You don't
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: come on the program to lie, Dave. You just pass
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: along the information.
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: Go look at the list I put together. It will
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: be mind-blowing to you folks. It will be mind-blowing how
• 6:12
  Speaker 1: these stories keep cropping up and they get worse and
• 6:14
  Speaker 1: worse and worse and worse. It's not just your privacy,
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: which is a huge problem in and of itself. It's
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: now these things that are connected in the physical world
• 6:23
  Speaker 1: can be manipulated and potentially hacked and weaponized. That's where
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: we're at. Stop buying this garbage.
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: DaveHatter.substack.com, intrustit.com, and of course LinkedIn. In.com is where you
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: can find Dave, and he also posts the articles there.
• 6:37
  Speaker 1: Pause.
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: We'll come back, and we'll talk about how it's, well,
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: it's hooked up to the Internet. Problems can happen.
• 6:41
  Speaker 1: Talk Station.
• 6:44
  Speaker 2: It's 642-55-KCB Talk Station, pivoting away from artificial intelligence, refrigerators,
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: and salt shakers. Oh, I forgot to mention Dave Hatter,
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: interestit.com's Dave Hatter. The salt shaker, in addition to having
• 6:55
  Speaker 2: an app, also is hooked up to Alexa, so it's
• 6:57
  Speaker 2: got a microphone and speaker.
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: What could go wrong, Brian?
• 7:01
  Speaker 2: Nothing. Absolutely nothing.
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: All right.
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: What happened over in Northern California where we had a
• 7:05
  Speaker 2: problem with malware?
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: Well, this is all part of the same problem. Software
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: and everything now, everything connected to the internet, all these interdependencies.
• 7:15
  Speaker 1: And Brian, we've talked about the concept of this many
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: times because this is one of the things that really
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: keeps me up at night. And you know me pretty well, Brian.
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: And people who don't know me that well often don't
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: realize that sometimes when I'm being hyperbolic, I'm being facetious
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: and other times I'm not. And Maybe I don't always
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: do the best job. Maybe I don't always do the
• 7:35
  Speaker 1: best job of helping you understand when I'm serious and
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: when I'm not. But this topic, as we used to
• 7:41
  Speaker 1: say back in the 80s when I was a kid,
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: serious is a heart attack, Brian. You know, I bet
• 7:46
  Speaker 1: you remember that one.
• 7:47
  Speaker 2: Oh, yeah. My dad used to say that all the time.
• 7:50
  Speaker 1: So critical infrastructure.
• 7:52
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: I keep bringing this up. I talk about this all
• 7:55
  Speaker 1: the time. We talk about it on your show. FBI
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: has defined 16 critical infrastructure sectors. We have seen increasing
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: attacks on the critical infrastructure sector as it becomes more automated,
• 8:07
  Speaker 1: as it becomes more interconnected, as we rely on it
• 8:09
  Speaker 1: more and more. All of this technology, and clearly I'm
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: not against technology. I made a whole career out of this.
• 8:17
  Speaker 1: What I'm increasingly concerned about the speed with which things
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: are being automated, the hard to understand, if not unknown
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: dependencies of this thing connected to that thing connected to
• 8:26
  Speaker 1: this thing over here creates In fact, I'm giving a
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: talk about this today at NKU at their cybersecurity conference.
• 8:32
  Speaker 1: But here's yet another example. You know, you and I
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: have talked 12 states over 100 water plants hacked. Yep.
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: You can't live long without water. Well, here's an example
• 8:42
  Speaker 1: of a 911 system that was knocked off a line. OK,
• 8:45
  Speaker 1: after a cyber attack. And it's not just the cyber
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: attacks that are the problem, Brian. One of the things
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: that got me out of the software engineering business and
• 8:54
  Speaker 1: focused exclusively on cybersecurity really was an article in The
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: Atlantic over 10 years ago called The Coming Software Apocalypse.
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: TMIT professors warning long before all, I mean, IoT was
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: a thing then. Smart devices were a thing, but not
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: like they are now. Warning that as we keep adding
• 9:11
  Speaker 1: software into things that probably don't really need software and
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: we create dependencies that are hard to understand because your
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: software is uses my software library, which calls some API,
• 9:21
  Speaker 1: which uses some other thing. You can't even know how
• 9:24
  Speaker 1: it works. And we're starting to see this come to
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: bear now. whether it's cyber attacks that bring these things
• 9:30
  Speaker 1: down or just faulty software. Like, you know, the Samsung
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: thing we just talked about wasn't a cyber attack. You
• 9:36
  Speaker 1: could argue it's a denial of service attack created by
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: the vendor because they denied service to the device by
• 9:42
  Speaker 1: bad software. It was a mistake. Brian, do you remember CrowdStrike,
• 9:45
  Speaker 1: the CrowdStrike thing a couple of years ago when this
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: CrowdStrike antivirus rolled out an update and it bricked like
• 9:50
  Speaker 1: 10 million Windows computers? Delta was down for a while.
• 9:55
  Speaker 1: So it's not even cyber attacks. We're trying to rush
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: this stuff without thinking about security and robustness and privacy
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: and resilience. And here's an example where, again, this could
• 10:08
  Speaker 1: have been a software update that knocked this system offline.
• 10:11
  Speaker 1: You're having a heart attack. You call 911. No ambulance
• 10:14
  Speaker 1: shows up because the system's down. But in this case,
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: it was a cyber attack. Again, I want people to
• 10:21
  Speaker 1: get in their minds. It's not just cyber attacks. It's
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: who in your audience has not had a problem with software,
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: has not installed some software update, and their device stopped working, a.k.a.
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: was bricked. Ford just recently recalled 254,000 SUVs. Because a
• 10:40
  Speaker 1: software update impacted some of the safety capabilities. Look this up, folks.
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: It's on my substack, by the way, Brian, as is
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: this story. And I have a different substack where I'm
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: just listing all of the local government attacks like this
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: that I can find. Because local governments are frequently not
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: understanding the risks to their constituents about these things. So, again,
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: we're talking about a real-world situation, not some wacky software stuff.
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: I lost my photos. I had all my money stolen.
• 11:11
  Speaker 1: I'm having a heart attack. My kid got hit by
• 11:13
  Speaker 1: a car. My mom's having a stroke. I dial 911
• 11:17
  Speaker 1: to get the life-saving services that I expect and deserve
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: and paid for. They don't come because the system is down.
• 11:24
  Speaker 1: That's where we're at, folks. We are. That's where we're at.
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: Well, and you know what? That's even a lesser scenario
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: than the electricity being shut off by remote control. Dave?
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: I hate to be the doom guy, Brian, but we
• 11:36
  Speaker 1: have got to wake people up. We've got to slow
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: this stuff down. We've got to make sure that it
• 11:41
  Speaker 1: is focused on security and resilience first. Not speed to market,
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: not market share, not ease of use, not making money,
• 11:49
  Speaker 1: not collecting your data to make even more money. protecting
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: our society because it is increasingly at risk because of
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: this stuff.
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: OpenAI just got sued by eight states because they rushed
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: to get chat GPT out the door without maybe taking
• 12:04
  Speaker 2: its time and dealing with the errors that apparently they
• 12:07
  Speaker 2: were aware of when they rolled it out. Dave, don't
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: go away because you're going to talk about one of
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: my favorite subjects. The Talk Station. 652-55-KERCY The Talk Station.
• 12:16
  Speaker 2: Brian Thomas with intrustit.com's Dave Hatter. Thank you, Intrust IT,
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: for sponsoring it. And Dave Hatter, for providing all this very,
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: very useful information. And when can I get rid of
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: the idea of a connected car? Dave, you're talking about
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: software updates. Nothing really irks me more. Well, that's a
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: bold statement.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: The idea that.
• 12:36
  Speaker 2: Your car comes with the equipment to, let's say, have
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: your seats heated, but you've got to pay a monthly
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: service to have it activated. I mean, I would not
• 12:46
  Speaker 2: consider a car that has that obligation. But then again,
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: if I had an option to buy a car that
• 12:51
  Speaker 2: isn't hooked up to the Internet at all, that's the
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: car I'd want to buy.
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm thinking I need a 78 Dodge Power Wagon
• 12:58
  Speaker 1: like on Simon & Simon.
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: Try to find one.
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Where A, it doesn't have any software in it,
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: and B, you can't EMP it because it doesn't have
• 13:07
  Speaker 1: any chips either.
• 13:08
  Speaker 2: And those are all the rage these days. The prices
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: of those cars have gone through the roof. I mentioned
• 13:12
  Speaker 2: a 70s Ford Bronco earlier. I think those are like
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: collector car level prices these days.
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: So, Brian, yeah, I agree with you wholeheartedly. And again, folks,
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: I was a software engineer for 25 years. It's how
• 13:25
  Speaker 1: I made a living. This is what I did. So
• 13:28
  Speaker 1: I'm not against this stuff. I'm against the way it's
• 13:32
  Speaker 1: being done. I'm against the lack of focus on security
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: and privacy and the risk that it creates to each
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: of us and our entire society. So, yeah, your car
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: is basically a rolling computer now. And I've brought this
• 13:44
  Speaker 1: up before on my Substack. I've written articles about this.
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: Let me give you a headline here before we dive
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: into this specific topic. OK, Mozilla, the people that make
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: the Firefox web browser. By the way, you should stop
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: using everything from Google, including Chrome, and use a privacy
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: friendly browser like Firefox or Brave or Safari if you're
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: Apple exclusive. OK, these people know what they're talking about.
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: They have a website called Privacy Not Included. I bring
• 14:11
  Speaker 1: it up occasionally. They just review all of these sorts
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: of Internet of Things devices and show you how bad
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: they are for you as a consumer. They did an
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: expose on cars a few years ago. This is the headline.
• 14:25
  Speaker 1: All 25 car brands we researched earned our privacy not
• 14:28
  Speaker 1: included warning label, making cars the official worst category of
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: products for privacy that we have ever reviewed. Geez. Now, again,
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: these are technical people. They make software. They know what
• 14:42
  Speaker 1: they're talking about. Now, it was a couple years ago.
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: All modern cars are loaded with this garbage. Ford filed
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: a patent. that would allow their cars to eavesdrop on
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: you and sell you ads to your car. Also a
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: patent to recall your car autonomously when you don't pay.
• 14:58
  Speaker 1: You may recall GM had a big scandal because they
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: were selling your data that they're collecting from all this
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: garbage in your car to insurance companies. I try to
• 15:06
  Speaker 1: tell people, you know, if I drove to Columbus this
• 15:09
  Speaker 1: week to speak at an event, And do you think
• 15:11
  Speaker 1: if I accelerated really hard three times and braked really
• 15:14
  Speaker 1: hard four times, my insurance company might not like to
• 15:17
  Speaker 1: know that and might decide that if that's a pattern,
• 15:20
  Speaker 1: that maybe they should raise my rates and I would
• 15:22
  Speaker 1: never know why they went up. It's because my car
• 15:24
  Speaker 1: is dropping a dime on me. But back to this thing, yeah,
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: connected cars. It's not just the surveillance. Right. It's the well,
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: everything has software it now. It has the capability to
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: sell you subscriptions to use certain functions. Oh, we're going
• 15:41
  Speaker 1: to give you the heated steering wheel for three months
• 15:43
  Speaker 1: if you want it in month four. You got to
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: pay or heated seats or hey, you know, maybe you
• 15:50
  Speaker 1: can only set the air conditioner down to 72 unless
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: you pay a subscription as you make things smart, quote unquote.
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: You add the capability for external actors to control them,
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: to surveil you, to hack them and potentially weaponize them.
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: You may recall over the years, we've talked about this before,
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: over the years, there have been increasing concerns by people
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: in the business about vehicle security. All the way up
• 16:20
  Speaker 1: from tankers and so forth and airplanes, you mentioned the
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: Boeing thing. down to, you know, Mack trucks and cars.
• 16:27
  Speaker 1: Because imagine if I'm a hacker, a nation state adversarial hacker,
• 16:32
  Speaker 1: and I want to cause chaos. If I could hack,
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: and I'm just going to throw out a brand. I
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: don't want to slight any particular brand. Let's say Peterbilt trucks.
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: If every Peterbilt tractor out there that was hauling something,
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: including let's say 80,000 gallons of gasoline, could somehow be
• 16:50
  Speaker 1: weaponized so that the brakes stop working, Or you couldn't
• 16:54
  Speaker 1: stop it from accelerating. And even better, you could feed
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: into it certain coordinates through the GPS. And you could like, hey,
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: there's a nice local Duke power substation right over here.
• 17:05
  Speaker 1: Imagine what 80,000 gallons of gasoline exploding at the local
• 17:09
  Speaker 1: Duke substation would do to the power.
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: We could come up with scenarios for hours about how
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: bad this.
• 17:13
  Speaker 1: Could be, Dave. And I know this is crazy to people.
• 17:17
  Speaker 1: Don't take my word for it. Go look this stuff up. right?
• 17:22
  Speaker 1: But we just keep adding more and more. You only
• 17:26
  Speaker 1: hear people talking about the convenience and the awesomeness of
• 17:28
  Speaker 1: all of this. You never hear people talking about things
• 17:31
  Speaker 1: like right to repair, you know, and the fact that
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: you can't fix your own truck now because it has
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: software in it, and they claim intellectual property.
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: Since we're out of time, Dave, I'll just remind people,
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: that's why we have you here, to remind people of
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: the downside risk and to heed Dave's warning. Well-respected in
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: the tech community, Dave Hatter is, intrustit.com for