Latest / From the Coach's Mouth / Episode 53: Doug Gillis

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Episode 53: Doug Gillis · From the Coach's Mouth

• 0:00
  It's either you call it every time or you call it 0.
• 0:05
  If you got a airborne drag slash leaper, you gonna big the big
• 0:10
  cheese like I'm an umpire, I'm in charge.
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  I can call it, Oh, that's better.
• 0:16
  I can institute my authority when I want and not what I want,
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  but when they crow hop it's either it's either you got to
• 0:26
  call everyone or you call none of them.
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  Welcome to the From the Coach's Mouth podcast with your hosts,
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  Jay Bolden and Ken Krause. Hello everyone, and welcome to
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  the From the Coach's Mouth podcast.
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  This is Ken here as always with that incredible man, the man you
• 1:19
  always want to talk to, Mr. Jay Bolden.
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  Jay, how you doing today? I'm actually doing pretty good,
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  Ken. I appreciate all those props.
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  But yeah, I don't know if anybody wants to talk to me.
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  It's even sometimes my wife doesn't want to talk to me.
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  So I think those are, you know what you said there's a little
• 1:34
  bit off key there, but how you been doing everything good?
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  Yeah, everything's good with me. You know, the weather's been up
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  and down, as you know, here in the Chicago area.
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  We had 70° and then a few days later we had a big influx of
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  snow, but now it's all melting and looks like it's going to be
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  a little bit nicer for weekend softball.
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  Yeah, I'm hoping that the weather stays, you know, nice
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  we're we start our conference play this this week and weekend
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  and and looking forward to that. And it's crazy how fast the
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  season always goes. But once we hit end of March
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  here, it's all conference play and then into the conference
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  tournament in early May. So it's exciting to to get going
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  and hopefully the weather cooperates this year.
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  So it's exciting and ready to go for conference play.
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  Good. Are you guys at home this
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  weekend? So the conference kind of
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  changed. They're doing a three-game
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  series now. So we either play one away and
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  then two at home or it's vice versa of that.
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  So we're actually away 1st and then home on on this weekend.
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  So yeah, that's kind of how they change our conference a little
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  bit. So it's a three-game series now
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  instead of just two. So yeah, we will play both away
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  and home this week and most weeks like that now going
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  forward. Nice.
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  Well a good luck to you guys. Hope everything goes well and
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  you know, we'll see what happens.
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  Yeah, thanks. I appreciate that.
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  So hey, I I want to get into our guest right away today, if you
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  don't mind. I'm excited to talk to this
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  person has probably forgotten more about pitching than I think
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  I'll ever know. So I really want to make sure
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  that we can get to him right away, give some people some
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  information about this amazing guest we have today, Ken.
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  All righty. Well, he's definitely a VIP in
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  the softball world, so we don't want to keep him waiting too
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  long. So today we feel honored to be
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  speaking with the true fast pitch softball pitching legend,
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  both as a player himself in the men's game and as a pitching
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  coach in collegiate and international play.
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  As a player, he spent more than 30 years competing at the
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  highest level in the world as one of the top pitchers in the
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  world. During that time, he was a six
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  time member of USA Softball's Men's National Team where he
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  played all across the globe including the US, Canada, New
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  Zealand, the Dominican Republic, the Cayman Islands, the
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  Netherlands, Guatemala and the Czech Republic.
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  During that time, his teams won the gold medal in the 2002 Pan
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  American Championships as well as a gold medal in the 1999 US
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  Olympic Festival. He was also the only American
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  selected to the All ISC team in 2010 in national competition.
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  He was a two time member of the USA Softball Major level
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  National Championship teams while personally earning 6 USA
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  Softball Major level All American Awards.
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  His resume as a coach is equally impressive.
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  Our guest began his collegiate coaching career in 2009 after
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  joining the staff at the University of Missouri as
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  Director of Pitching. In 2015, he was promoted to Head
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  Pitching Coach. From there, he became the head
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  pitching coach and assistant coach at Kennesaw State, and in
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  2019 joined the staff at Virginia Tech in the same
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  capacity. During his time there, the
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  Hokies won the ACC Championship in 2019 and 2022 and advanced to
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  the NCAA Super Regionals in 2021 and 2022.
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  He later went on to serve as director of pitching Development
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  at Liberty University in 2024 before joining the staff of the
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  University of Evansville in 2025.
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  He's the only pitching coach to ever develop the Pitcher of the
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  Year in all four of the major conferences, including two in
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  the Big 12, three in the ACC and one in the SEC.
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  He also has 20 All Americans to his credit.
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  Throughout that time, our guest was also the owner of the
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  largest pitching Academy in the country.
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  Of course, we can only be talking about one man.
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  Ladies and gentlemen, please welcome the one and only Doug
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  Gillis to the From the Coaches Mouth podcast.
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  Oh, I, I got a lot of to live up to there so yeah, yeah, I'm
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  happy to be here so. Yeah, yeah, we're definitely
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  happy to have you on here. It's really exciting.
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  You know, you're kind of Jerry and I talked about some of the
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  people have been influences on us.
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  You're certainly one of them. But you've also been an
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  influence on some of the people have been an influence on us.
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  So really, you know, kind of the top of the coaching tree.
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  Yeah. Thank you very much.
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  All right, so, Doug, let's get into it right away here.
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  Yeah, how? How did you first get involved
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  with fast pitch? Like where did it all start for
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  Doug? My dad was a player, so I bought
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  him play and then the game was bigger back then.
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  You know, it's a dying the men's game is dying right now and it's
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  a bigger game back then. So, you know, my dad was good at
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  judging talent and took me where the best pitches in the world,
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  you know, to see, you know, he just introduced me to the game
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  and, you know, show me the high level of play.
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  And I I liked it. And, you know, the game was
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  bigger that than I was a bad boy.
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  And I kind of started pitching and, you know, through my dad
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  and through my family. Yeah.
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  When did you start pitching, how old were you and how did you
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  learn it? I was about 9-8 or nine and once
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  again my dad taught me. And then at that time there
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  were, you know, there were leagues for boys.
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  But then we had a competition. We always played and in Saginaw,
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  MI with another town in Ontario, OK, Cambridge, ON and then the
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  once a year they did this, it caught a can American Games and
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  so there was a three-game series.
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  There was there was a 12 another team 1400 team and they always
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  put it together. Men's fastpitch was pretty big
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  in Canada at that time, so they put together the boys team, you
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  know, and we played once a year there.
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  So that's my introduction in the playing.
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  So I learned to pitch on my own. My dad taught me and trial and
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  error and watching them how the best do it and trying to copy
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  them. Doug, who are some of the men's
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  fast pitch teams that you played for throughout your career?
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  You can just give us a few. I know you know a lot of times
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  guys are moving from team to team or subbing for team to
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  teams, but just give us some of the some of the teams that you
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  played for back in the day to. Finish up my last question.
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  My dad sponsored the team, too, and I was bad boy.
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  And he brought it all with some of the best pitches in the
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  world. So he brought over Kevin Harley.
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  He over offered, but he also brought all for Michael White.
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  OK, so Michael White is a head coach at Texas.
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  So Michael White lived with me for a year in my bedroom.
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  OK. All right.
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  He came over. I was 15.
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  He was 18. And now suddenly he, when he's
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  interviewed, he's younger than me.
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  I don't know how that happened. OK, All right.
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  So. All right.
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  So he was, you know, he was a up and coming young stud pitcher
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  who turned down to be one of the top five pitchers of all time.
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  We lived together too, OK. And my dad brought him over.
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  And so I got exposure that way. You know, I was a bad boy.
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  I was lucky. I was, you know, as a bad boy
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  for some of the best pitchers of all time.
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  So when I copied them, I was, you know, I I didn't know any
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  better. I was just copying the motion of
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  the best in the world. So I learned by default.
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  So I was, I was really lucky in that manner as a young, you
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  know, pitcher growing up. Were you able to ask them
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  questions kind of, you know, if you were having trouble picking
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  up something they were doing? Yes, yes, yes, yes.
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  I, I did a lot. I was a nosy young kid, you know
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  what I mean? So I did that a lot.
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  Yeah, Yeah. And then and so and I didn't
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  know till you we got older that your privilege to say, hey, this
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  is the best pictures in the world and I'm bad boy for him.
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  And they're ranked one and two of all time.
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  And I got to know him and I got to train with them and all that
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  stuff, you know? So I I was quite lucky, yeah.
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  Kind of like kind of like being a young basketball player and
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  having your roommates be the Bulls from the 80s.
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  Yeah, that's right, right, right.
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  And learning from them yes but the the the do Jays questions
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  the teams I played for Orlando and then then it went to Ashland
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  and I went to Seattle and Seattle was the a great team and
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  then played for Bloomington, IL and then I played over Decatur
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  IL pride which is another powerhouse and then I went back
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  home and played for Midland for 10 years I played a couple years
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  in Aurora too. OK, yeah, and that's my club
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  teams, so let's just a lot of variety around the country.
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  But that's how the men's game wants back then.
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  When and how did you get involved with the national team?
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  You know, was it they saw you playing in the, you know, in the
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  national games, you know, the here in the US and then you, you
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  know, get picked for the national team?
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  Or is that something you had to pursue?
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  How'd that happen? Yeah.
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  So at that time there was a thing called the United Psych
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  Olympic Festival and it was a very big event and I think it
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  got so big they it was so expensive they couldn't handle
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  it anymore. Like the Olympic Committee had
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  the US Olympic Festival and they had it three years every three
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  years, not Olympic year. So you know, they it's Olympics
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  and then Olympic festival, Olympic festival, Olympic
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  festival, then Olympics. So the Olympic festival was
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  Olympic thing inside the US only and that's what they used to
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  train and pick teams with. So at that time I was invited
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  because we had a N SE and West team. 60 players got invited and
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  I did pretty well at them. So that got you on the map.
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  That got you on the map as far as getting attention.
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  And then one year I played for Decatur and we won the national
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  championship and I had a good performance in the national
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  championship as I was the although I was the number two
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  pitcher, Chubb Changroa was the main pitcher.
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  But I pitched in the big game in the winners bracket and I did
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  pretty well and so I got more attention.
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  So, you know, then I got invited to the national team tryouts and
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  then I made it. And once you make it and you get
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  better and better, you're in a good position. 95 to 2005 was
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  the prime arrived career and I I made it a lot of those years.
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  But yeah, you just work your way into it and, and then you have
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  to do well in the men's major championship and Olympic
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  festival. And then it got me on the map.
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  And then once you're in the the players pool, you have to play
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  your way out of it or you, you have to fall off the map.
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  You know what I mean? Yeah, What you do when you get
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  old. So, yeah, yeah.
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  Yeah, yeah, I can see that. So, any favorite experiences or
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  anything that you care to share? I could write a book on the
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  things I've seen, but there's one time there's like not a lot
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  of people know this. USA Softball or the ASA at the
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  time sent 5 pictures for a month long tour to the Dominican
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  Republic. I was one of the five and they
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  put us all on separate teams. So we're there to train their
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  national team, pitch, batting practice to them, but they put
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  us all on separate club teams or like county, and they're like
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  county teams or statewide teams. And so we stayed at the
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  Dominican Republic for a month. We had our own driver.
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  I mean, they're really treated us nice, you know, and we can do
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  anything. We want to go anywhere on the
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  beaches and all that stuff. And we played their national
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  championship, which is like a three-week long tournament.
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  So I was on one team and whatever, and our team was in
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  the finals, but the finals got rained out.
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  So they rescheduled the final for a few days later at the city
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  I was playing in at Santiago, we're in Santa Domingo.
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  So they reschedule it in the town I was playing for Santiago,
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  which is like 3 hours away. OK, so we didn't know.
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  We just got on the bus, we go to three hour trip and we're just
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  expecting to go to the field and play the national finals and and
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  play in front of 50 people. You know, I mean, because the
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  crowds there were small and big and you didn't know what you're
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  going to get. You know, you just out of this,
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  you know, out of the country, you didn't know where you're
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  going to get. So we showed up in Santiago and
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  there were thousands of people. There's thousands and I was what
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  the hell is this? And all of a sudden, and we were
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  the favorite. So we're pitching and the people
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  are showing up, showing up, showing up.
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  And there's very little stands. OK, so they're just all the way
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  around the the home run. France was all brick.
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  So there are seated, you know, like just sitting on the brick
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  all around the home run fronts, your legs hanging and play.
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  And I, I was on the mound. I took a look at the home run
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  fence and there was not a vacant spot.
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  There's people like side by side all the way from foul pole to
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  foul pole and beyond. And then they started coming
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  over the side fences. OK, so they're started coming
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  into the park. So all the umpires could do was
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  push their people beyond the foul lines.
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  They were inside the fence. They're all in foul territories.
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  There's 1000 people in foul territory.
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  But all they could do was push the people back beyond the
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  baseline. OK, so in, in in the in the
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  grass, now the infield, but in the grass.
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  And then because they were all excited their team is going to
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  win the national championship. Maybe you know what I mean.
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  If I don't blow it, you're right.
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  Right. So all right, so now we're
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  heading 1. Nothing and it's exciting.
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  I didn't expect this, but I got pumped up because there's
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  probably 3 or 4000 people there total.
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  So we're head one to nothing after the 6th inning and we all
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  got to go out in front of the dugout after the 6th inning and
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  take the national championship picture.
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  I said what are we doing? Yeah, it's. 1.
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  To nothing, right? Yeah.
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  And I said, and he goes, well, they got to get it on the news
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  and they need the picture because they're going to place
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  it on the news. You know, it was that time of
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  night. Whatever I said, it's one
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  nothing to the 6th. The game's not over, right?
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  And and I'm sure and the field. Was, I'm sure, like any ball.
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  Player You were superstitious too, Yeah.
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  You can't take the national championship picture in the
• 16:37
  middle of the game. So.
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  We we, yeah, we took the picture.
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  I go back and dugout, it's one month of lead.
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  I said, man, I get I got it. I meant to mess up this lead.
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  And we're playing on playing a good team.
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  And the field was only 235 feet fence.
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  That was a really short home run fence for men's ball.
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  And all of a sudden I walked the lead off hitter OK in the 7th
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  after taking the national championship, they.
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  Bun. Him over, but they throw to
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  second base and we got the force, you know, he and the the
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  runner didn't slide, which is bad news.
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  And we forced him out and was a close play.
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  They couldn't cut him safe, but it was you know, and then I got
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  the next two outs and whatever, you know, so we won one.
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  But The thing is there's people on the the field and you know,
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  people on the field in follow territory, they couldn't get
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  involved. And we took the championship
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  photo in the middle of the game in the 6th inning.
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  You know what I mean? It was a really weird stuff,
• 17:43
  but. It all worked.
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  Out fine we yeah we won one to nothing and I got out of it and
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  everyone is happy you know what I mean but it was like I was
• 17:52
  like you're taking the national championship picture and put it
• 17:54
  on the news in the middle of the game you know I mean that the.
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  Game's not over. I mean, most ball players.
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  That's one of the most unique things I've ever experienced
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  playing. I mean most ball.
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  Players will wear the same socks when they're on a win streak or
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  they won't step on the chalk lines.
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  And here you're taking a national championship picture.
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  Yeah, that has to be insane. You know, everybody's got to be
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  going crazy with that and. We're we're we're not headed 7
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  nothing. It was 1 nothing right in the
• 18:23
  6th inning because they had the news truck anything could.
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  Happen at that point. Well, yeah, it's funny too when
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  you're talking about, you know, all of the people lying along
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  the sides. That's like the Bartman Ball
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  times 2 or 3000, yes. Yes, it's like if the if it was
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  3000 people were a couple thousand people, but putting the
• 18:41
  the wall and the and the base line or, you know, and on the
• 18:45
  field, you know, and that there weren't no stands in the
• 18:48
  outfield in the bound, you know, it just stands where only by the
• 18:51
  Heim home, you know, so there's not enough people, but then all
• 18:54
  of a sudden they just flow over the fence and sat on the field.
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  You know, we're standing on the field.
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  It's a little different. In the Dr. Really new unique.
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  Yeah, yeah, for sure. So, Doug?
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  Doug, I want to switch gears a little bit with you here and get
• 19:09
  into a little bit about your about lessons.
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  Like when did you first start giving lessons and were you
• 19:14
  giving it to men's helping the men's fast pitch players too or
• 19:19
  or females or was it both when you first started doing lessons?
• 19:22
  It was both. Was mostly females because
• 19:24
  females like more take training in high school ball and all that
• 19:28
  stuff, you know what I mean? So I was like 21 when I started,
• 19:32
  and the women's game is much better than the men's game.
• 19:36
  OK, I know I say this. The women's game is much bigger
• 19:38
  than men's men's game, but the men's game is like 30 years
• 19:42
  ahead of the women's game. Things you see now we saw 30
• 19:47
  years ago in women's ball or like in men's ball.
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  Can you give us an example? Yeah, but, but it's it's but
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  it's out. It's 1000 times bigger.
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  You know what I mean? It's 1000 times bigger.
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  I was the one of seeing this stuff before.
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  It happens now, you know, and it's it's happening now in the
• 20:04
  women's game too. But I talked, you know, over the
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  years I talked. I don't know.
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  I trained about 20 to 30 guys, not much.
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  You know what I mean? All right.
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  And, and, and sometimes younger guy pitchers doing some ISC
• 20:21
  clinic or whatever, you know, So I had done a handful of those.
• 20:26
  But, you know, 99% of the time it's young girl pitchers or lady
• 20:31
  pitchers in high school and college and all that stuff.
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  Yeah, but I was 21 when I started.
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  Yeah. Was it different?
• 20:37
  Training the females versus the males, yes.
• 20:41
  Yes, I think you always got this stereotype like, and it's kind
• 20:48
  of true, the girls are more culturable than the guys, but
• 20:52
  they also listen to any anybody. Like sometimes girls listen to
• 20:57
  bad information and just do and and the guy would say that's
• 21:02
  stupid. I'm not going to do that.
• 21:04
  Like I always this exaggerated example, an 18 year old freshman
• 21:09
  in college and if it's it's a baseball coach and a baseball
• 21:13
  pitcher and he told him to do the most insane thing, stupidest
• 21:17
  thing ever. The guy would look at him as
• 21:20
  man, screw you, I'm not going to do that.
• 21:21
  Your name, the 18 year old freshman girl sometimes.
• 21:27
  And if you told them to do something really stupid or
• 21:30
  whatever, they'll do it. You know what I mean?
• 21:32
  Right. So yeah, so.
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  But that that door swings both ways.
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  And two, I think guys learn more by imitating gay.
• 21:41
  Like I see I, I copy, hey, they do it like this, I'm going to
• 21:46
  copy them. That's all I learned, you know,
• 21:49
  and that's, I think that's the biggest difference that they see
• 21:53
  it, they visualize it and they copy it more for the guys and
• 21:57
  some of the girls we do I give lessons to or more step by step.
• 22:02
  Some of them can fill in the blanks and some of them can't.
• 22:05
  Some of you got to break the motion down into six parts and
• 22:08
  some of the only two parts because maybe break it down into
• 22:12
  two parts that you you got an athlete that can fill in the
• 22:15
  blanks. And sometimes you don't have
• 22:17
  that type of athlete that can fill in the blanks.
• 22:19
  And that's not nothing criticized because those
• 22:21
  sometimes those people turn out to be real good.
• 22:24
  Yeah, I want to. Doug, I want to just recognize.
• 22:27
  The athlete I I. Want to I want to say something
• 22:30
  or ask you something too, because I feel like sometimes
• 22:32
  that's kind of like the missing link between some of these kids
• 22:36
  that that I'll work with, right? Is like, OK, you're, you know,
• 22:41
  you talked about imitation. Like, you know, you kind of
• 22:43
  tried to like, imitate what the best men's pitchers were doing.
• 22:47
  And I'll have a kid that'll come in and I'll say, OK, like,
• 22:50
  you're doing this how? And I always ask them like, how
• 22:54
  many kids do you see that are currently pitching in the in
• 22:58
  Division One level or, or any level, most levels for this fact
• 23:02
  are doing that. And the answer will be like
• 23:04
  none. And I'm like, OK, so why are we
• 23:06
  doing that then, right. If, if I'm going to use one of
• 23:09
  your, your former players, Keely Rashard, somebody told me.
• 23:12
  Yeah, somebody told me to do it. Yeah.
• 23:15
  I'll show a video of Keely Rashard, right?
• 23:18
  And I'll show, hey, this is where she is on release.
• 23:20
  But look at where you are on release.
• 23:22
  Look at where your hand is on release.
• 23:24
  If we're not, if we're not trying to copy that, we're never
• 23:28
  going to get to that spot. Because again, I know people can
• 23:31
  do it differently. But however, these people have
• 23:34
  given us a road map. The the best pictures that you
• 23:37
  talked about pitched were the best because of what they were
• 23:40
  doing with their bodies and their mechanics, right?
• 23:42
  And I think, but you, Ken and I talked about this all time.
• 23:45
  You'll go on Instagram or these crazy social media things and
• 23:48
  you'll see people yanking their bodies left and right, jumping
• 23:51
  up and down like putting their foot here and there.
• 23:53
  And it's like, whoa, what is going on?
• 23:54
  Who, who is even doing that at a, at the highest level?
• 23:57
  So do you feel like that's like we need to spend more time like
• 24:01
  trying to not imitate, but like copy what we see with these
• 24:05
  elite movers and these elite pictures that we see on TV?
• 24:08
  Yes. Yes, because the thing I talked
• 24:11
  about all my time in my clinics and what I learned just as a
• 24:15
  young kid when I saw all these elite movers or elite pitchers,
• 24:20
  they look different than the guys who were playing City
• 24:23
  League ball or Class A ball, right?
• 24:26
  So and and was like, yeah, but they're they're rhythms like
• 24:29
  this. They got read a rhythm, they got
• 24:31
  better, you know, they got a better finish, they got better
• 24:35
  angles that they don't look the same.
• 24:37
  I didn't know any better. I was 15 years old.
• 24:39
  But it was like, man, they don't look the same, you know?
• 24:42
  So I want to be like that, right?
• 24:44
  But this is the thing I like to tell league young college
• 24:49
  pitchers sometimes, I always tell them I never took a lesson,
• 24:54
  but I learned through impersonating people like you
• 24:57
  were talking about, right? Amen.
• 24:59
  So. So when I was a kid, because I
• 25:02
  was, you know, a little kid, I was, I, I would do like 5 or 6
• 25:08
  guys impersonating them and then and then I, I do it and people
• 25:13
  got a kick out of it. I'm going to do my Kevin Hurley.
• 25:16
  I'm going to give my old Walford.
• 25:18
  I'm going to do my Thai stuff with it.
• 25:20
  I'm going to do my Chuck DRC, blah, blah, blah.
• 25:23
  I'm going to do my Peter Meredith.
• 25:25
  Whatever, right. But if you do impersonations, in
• 25:30
  my case, those six people, you take bits of pieces from all of
• 25:35
  them and that fit you right? And, and, and it goes, hey, I
• 25:40
  like that part of his emotion. I like that part of that, this
• 25:43
  guy's motion. I like that part of this guy's
• 25:46
  motion. So you learn that way, You learn
• 25:48
  how how to move your body through just imitating.
• 25:52
  You don't have to do all those imitations and games.
• 25:55
  It's not the point. You just learn how to move your
• 25:57
  body. So I have this thing I do when I
• 26:01
  was coaching college and I said, you guys don't know how this
• 26:06
  portness is. And it's going to be like, it's
• 26:08
  a like a fun day, but it was a fun day.
• 26:11
  But it was like, you guys don't know what how important this is.
• 26:13
  So we're going to play a game. I'm going to stand on the mound,
• 26:18
  pick a picture on staff. Oh, Keely Richard, OK, here's
• 26:22
  how she looks. Emma Lemley, totally different
• 26:24
  wind up. Here's how she looks.
• 26:27
  And they're they're like jaw-dropping, like, how do you
• 26:31
  do that? Here's so and so this is so and
• 26:34
  so. So they think I'm making fun of
• 26:36
  them, but I'm really imitating them in front of them, right?
• 26:40
  And here's you and OK, and then how do you do that?
• 26:44
  And I was like, that's not the problem.
• 26:46
  You do the same thing, Emma. You pitched like Keely Richard
• 26:51
  from the Globe. No backswing, no overhead wind
• 26:54
  up, blah blah blah, short finish, blah, blah, blah.
• 26:56
  You know what I mean, Keely? You pitch like Emma.
• 27:01
  So and so pitch like this. You copy her.
• 27:04
  So they need to copy the other four people on the staff and
• 27:07
  impersonations. Some people can do it and some
• 27:11
  people make the same motion all the time.
• 27:15
  And it was like, are are you? You don't.
• 27:18
  And this is what I get on them about.
• 27:21
  I said, you see this pitcher pitch every day.
• 27:25
  She's your teammate and you don't know that she goes over
• 27:29
  her head and has a like a little backswing, like a short
• 27:34
  backswing, but she goes overhead and you know what I mean?
• 27:38
  So I'm saying you you go stand there and pitch like her and
• 27:42
  they pitch like themselves and not even close.
• 27:45
  And that dumb phones me like, you don't know what?
• 27:51
  You know what I mean? You, you don't you don't even
• 27:53
  know. She goes over her head and then
• 27:56
  comes down and you see her pitch every day.
• 27:59
  And I was like, holy, that's the person who does more what
• 28:03
  they're told. But and then what?
• 28:05
  Then by what they see. Yeah.
• 28:07
  And I think we're in a. Crazy time too, Doug.
• 28:09
  Like, I, I will talk to kids when they come in for a pitching
• 28:12
  lesson and I'll say, hey, who's your favorite pitcher right now?
• 28:15
  And they'll be like, well, I don't have one.
• 28:17
  So you're not watching Geordie Frahm pitch.
• 28:20
  You're not watching Najeri pitch or anybody.
• 28:24
  Like maybe you are a fan of Virginia Tech.
• 28:26
  Who's the best pitcher on Virginia Tech?
• 28:28
  Why aren't you watching that pitcher so that you can emulate
• 28:32
  some of the movements that she's doing.
• 28:34
  And I think these kids are they just, they show up and they,
• 28:36
  they're like robots. And I'm like, that's not how
• 28:38
  it's supposed to be. If we want to be good, we've got
• 28:41
  to kind of do that. And they don't even know it.
• 28:42
  I'll talk about, hey, do you know who Jackie Train is?
• 28:45
  Like who? Even the dance who I'm like,
• 28:47
  guys, if we want to get serious about pitching, we've got to
• 28:50
  study pitching. We've got to get into it.
• 28:52
  We've got to learn what these pitchers did to be successful at
• 28:54
  that level. And these kids nowadays, I don't
• 28:57
  think they're even paying attention to what's on TV.
• 29:00
  It's crazy to me. Yeah.
• 29:01
  So. They what?
• 29:03
  They do this in all positions too, not just pictures, right?
• 29:06
  They don't idolize. Not, not idolize.
• 29:08
  But who's your idol? Who do you want to copy?
• 29:12
  And they don't have an answer. Yeah, you know what I mean.
• 29:15
  And it can be anybody and it would I want to be like, I want
• 29:19
  to move like Derek Jeter playing shortstop or Edgar might genius
• 29:24
  at a right-handed swing or whatever, right.
• 29:26
  And whatever. And they they don't they don't
• 29:29
  have no people they looked up to and try to mimic their game
• 29:33
  after. And that's what's missing even
• 29:36
  one person. Hey, I want to be like them
• 29:38
  someday. So I'm copying them now.
• 29:41
  A good story I've got. I have one 8 year old I'm
• 29:45
  working with in Chicago and I look forward to working with her
• 29:49
  every time I see her. She was a beginner 4 months ago
• 29:54
  or like 6 months ago, but now she watches college softball
• 29:59
  every weekend and she and I get such a kick out of her because
• 30:04
  she's like the story I told you when I was a bad boy.
• 30:08
  She comes in, let me show you the oh, I forget her name, but
• 30:13
  the the tall girl that pitches for Tennessee Carlin Pickens.
• 30:18
  Carlin. Pickens, let me show you my
• 30:20
  Carlin Pickens motion, Let me show you this guy.
• 30:22
  There's Girls motion. Let me show you my Georgie Ball
• 30:25
  motion. Right, right.
• 30:26
  And she's pretty good at them for beating 8 1/2 years old.
• 30:30
  And I said, Oh my God, I got a student who watches and copies
• 30:37
  and idolizes those girls. And I got one girl I'm working
• 30:42
  with that's throws at Beecher High School and she's going to
• 30:47
  Florida State next year. She's going to bring freshman to
• 30:50
  Forest State. She's really good.
• 30:53
  She comes sometimes after the 8 year old OK, And she's really
• 30:58
  good, OK, She's really good. The, the picture I'm talking
• 31:02
  about from Beecher, who's going to Florida State and she sits
• 31:06
  and watches her, you know what I mean?
• 31:09
  And, and, and other students just like, oh, I'm done with a
• 31:13
  lesson. They walk out of the building
• 31:14
  and that's fine. And that's, you know, that's
• 31:16
  fine. They got lives too.
• 31:17
  Yeah. But it was, it's funny, though.
• 31:20
  She just, it's almost like she doesn't listen to me because
• 31:24
  she's watching her, you know, which is a good thing, you know,
• 31:28
  a good thing. So people learn multiple ways.
• 31:31
  But that's enlightening for me because it's a young kid who and
• 31:36
  and but, but I got some good high school students who you
• 31:41
  asked them the same pitch. They have a short shelf life.
• 31:44
  So you say like, oh, what's a girl you name for Alabama that
• 31:49
  won the national championship? Jackie Trainer, right?
• 31:52
  Yeah, right. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 31:54
  I, I, I got girls at college girls last year.
• 31:59
  And I said you ever heard of or watched Keely Richard?
• 32:03
  Now Queely Richard was four years ago.
• 32:06
  So they were 14. That's like me and you, you guys
• 32:10
  talking about Wilt Chamberlain. You know what I mean?
• 32:14
  Like, it's not, Yeah, they they it's like, it's like, oh, we
• 32:18
  never saw him play. We never saw him play.
• 32:20
  We don't know much about them. And they think they're 50 years
• 32:24
  old, you know what I mean? Because the, the short light,
• 32:27
  the, the, the shelf life on those.
• 32:29
  Yes, right. And you're going to be able to,
• 32:34
  if you do lessons in five years and you're a 16 year old, right.
• 32:39
  Or 17 year old in five years. You remember the Carlin Pickens
• 32:45
  or into this or whatever, the girl from Texas Tech?
• 32:49
  No, I never saw him. You know what I mean?
• 32:51
  Yeah. They the shelf.
• 32:53
  Yeah. So it's, it's not immediate in
• 32:56
  their world. They don't copy it, you know,
• 32:59
  and, or that's, but, but it's just like, yeah, it's they are
• 33:04
  replaced so quick and they don't Yeah.
• 33:08
  And then and then and then the combination of that.
• 33:11
  And they don't imitate a lot of times is the problem too.
• 33:16
  Yeah, or. Sometimes when they imitate,
• 33:17
  they imitate the surface stuff. Like I can't remember who the
• 33:21
  pitcher was. You know, the one that first
• 33:23
  started turning to her left before she'd start.
• 33:26
  All of a sudden you'd see a bunch of girls doing that
• 33:28
  because, you know, they kind of picked up.
• 33:29
  They thought, oh, that looks cool.
• 33:31
  And then you hear the story later on that the reason that
• 33:34
  that 1 turned to the left was that she was having trouble
• 33:36
  hiding her grip. So she would turn to the left.
• 33:39
  She didn't get her grip. It had nothing to do with her
• 33:41
  pitching. It was just a kind of a defect
• 33:43
  in the way she held the ball. But they were all picking up on
• 33:46
  that like it was some secret sauce.
• 33:48
  Yeah, right. Right, right.
• 33:49
  Yeah, And then and that's part of imitation too, but at least
• 33:52
  you know that. At least you know that I'm I'm
• 33:55
  seeing girls like they talking about in college that don't even
• 33:59
  can't imitate that, even though it's like it's not it's part
• 34:03
  part of the motion. It's just polishing up stuff
• 34:05
  for, you know, like a pre motion stuff.
• 34:08
  But yeah, so at least if they know that though, at least they
• 34:12
  can learn to move. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 34:16
  So that's what I see a lot. Hey, Jay.
• 34:22
  On a scale of 1 to 10, how important do you think brush
• 34:24
  contact is for pictures? It's pretty high up there Ken,
• 34:28
  probably attend since it's hard to get maximum speed and or
• 34:32
  accuracy without it. Yeah, I agree.
• 34:34
  But have you ever had a student who struggled to get good light
• 34:37
  brush contact? Sure.
• 34:39
  All the time, in fact, especially when they've been
• 34:43
  taught hello elbow and are trying to throw around their
• 34:45
  hips, or they're sliding their hips out of the way doing that
• 34:48
  crazy ninja move. So what do?
• 34:50
  You do when you run. Run into this situation, keep
• 34:53
  railing on them until they get it right.
• 34:55
  I used to. Do that a lot.
• 34:57
  But then I learned about a product called Pitch Squeak,
• 34:59
  Ken, Pitch Squeak. What's that?
• 35:02
  It's a cool. Little armband with a squeaker
• 35:04
  inside of it like a dog. Toy.
• 35:07
  Yeah, kinda. So how does it?
• 35:09
  Work well. You slip the armband onto the
• 35:12
  pitcher's forearm and you set it so the squeaker is where the
• 35:15
  brush contact should happen. Then when the pitcher goes into
• 35:19
  release, she tries to get it to squeak like this.
• 35:23
  If she makes it happen, she got brush.
• 35:26
  If there's no sound, she knows immediately and can make a
• 35:29
  correction. Wow.
• 35:30
  Cool, so she gets immediate audible as well as tactile
• 35:34
  feedback. Oh.
• 35:35
  There you go again, showing off with those big and technical
• 35:39
  words again. But yeah, she can feel it and
• 35:42
  hear it. Does it really?
• 35:43
  Work you. Bet it does.
• 35:45
  I use it with my students all the time and it helps them learn
• 35:49
  how to get brush contact pretty quickly if they practice with
• 35:52
  it. Sounds neat.
• 35:54
  Where can I get one? It's easy.
• 35:56
  Ken, just e-mail support@pitchsqueak.com and
• 36:01
  Jason, the inventor of it and a Poly Girl certified pitching
• 36:04
  coach himself, will ask you how many you want and send them
• 36:08
  right out. I'll do that.
• 36:09
  Today, Thanks, Jay. What's that address again?
• 36:13
  You. Bet Ken it's support at pitch.
• 36:16
  Squeak dot com one more time for those of you who are listening,
• 36:20
  support@pitchsqueak.com and don't forget to mention in the
• 36:25
  e-mail that you heard about it right here on From the Coach's
• 36:28
  Mouth podcast and you'll receive 10% off.
• 36:35
  I want to switch. Gears a little bit with you.
• 36:37
  We know you're passionate about a few things and I want to talk
• 36:40
  to you about some of the changes to the pitching rules.
• 36:44
  That was kind of how we got connected to begin with.
• 36:47
  Talking a little bit offline about it, What do you think
• 36:49
  about save like the leaping rule?
• 36:51
  What's going on with that and how people are approaching it
• 36:55
  these days? The real.
• 36:57
  Reason they allowed leaping it was they were not calling the
• 37:01
  rule right in the past. The leaping has no advantage.
• 37:08
  It leaks their stride. Not at all because the leap is 1
• 37:14
  push, one extension of your push leg.
• 37:17
  OK and and a leap is like a dragging motion.
• 37:23
  Athletically A dragging motion, but you can do it through the
• 37:27
  air. If your push off foot turns over
• 37:33
  and goes in the air an inch when it turns over in the lands of
• 37:37
  the leather, so be it. You know, All right, so we
• 37:42
  talked about before that people getting confused with the crow.
• 37:46
  But I think allowing leaping is fine because the leaping is a
• 37:52
  kind of a made-up term. There's step with old mechanics,
• 37:56
  there's drag and there's hop. A leap is kind of a like a
• 38:00
  garbage term. It's a catch all term.
• 38:04
  It's like shin splints. Shin splints can be one of five
• 38:07
  things. You know what I mean?
• 38:09
  So the bad thing is the invention, the word, you know
• 38:12
  what I mean? So.
• 38:14
  But the leaping is at the same athletic principle as a drag.
• 38:18
  But your back foot doesn't have to stand on the ground, which is
• 38:22
  makes no advantage to the pitcher.
• 38:24
  Yeah. And personally, I think, you
• 38:26
  know, I think it was a good thing that they changed that
• 38:28
  part of the rule that they, you know, yes, because you.
• 38:32
  Were just getting. Ticky tacky calls.
• 38:33
  You were getting a lot of coach just complaining, especially at
• 38:36
  the younger levels, that, oh, her foot's leaving the ground.
• 38:39
  It's like, well, coach, don't worry about that.
• 38:40
  Teach your kids how to hit and it won't be a problem, right?
• 38:43
  Right. Right.
• 38:44
  And I, I was involved in the one of the biggest reasons like
• 38:49
  episodes of it in coaching. OK, I.
• 38:52
  Remember that one we. I know that was a great dog.
• 38:57
  That was great. She's a freshman.
• 38:59
  She's so unwell and we're facing Florida and I have an old speech
• 39:05
  about this. I'm not going to give it a
• 39:06
  speech, but I'm going to give it the, the, the keynotes.
• 39:10
  And she was pitching against Florida and the Super regionals
• 39:14
  and she was pushed and dragged and it's sometime her foot came
• 39:19
  off the ground as she turned the shoe over.
• 39:23
  So she's laid it on the leather and the shoelaces every pitch.
• 39:26
  OK. And sometimes it was higher than
• 39:28
  others. But in no country, no country,
• 39:32
  no division, anything, whether that be called a leap or
• 39:36
  anything in any part of the world that would not be called
• 39:40
  anything illegal. And so she had problems that
• 39:44
  year getting calls and then she 3 weeks and nothing.
• 39:47
  And all the sudden they pick and choose when they call it, right,
• 39:50
  OK. And you can debate what the rule
• 39:53
  was at that time, blah blah blah.
• 39:56
  The thing about it is the girl that was pitching against her at
• 40:03
  the same time for Florida had a giant grow up.
• 40:11
  And a. Grow up is definitely an
• 40:14
  advantage. Yes, it is.
• 40:17
  And OK, so I always say a crow hop is like, I mean, I'm just
• 40:22
  saying this for discussion. You know, the crow hop is like
• 40:26
  doing 85 and a 55 and what Emma Lemley was doing is doing a 56
• 40:34
  in a 55, right, Right, right. Barely doing anything.
• 40:38
  So, and I was the the reason that people got tossed and all
• 40:44
  that stuff. We happened in the regional too,
• 40:47
  but we won that. But their head coach got tossed
• 40:50
  and we had to finish the game and all that stuff, right?
• 40:53
  The reason that happened, and this is really bad, but it's the
• 40:56
  truth. If you got a crow hopper, it's
• 41:00
  either you call it every time or you call it 0.
• 41:05
  If you got a airborne drag slash leaper, you can big the big
• 41:10
  cheese like I'm an umpire, I'm in charge, I can call it, oh,
• 41:15
  that's better. I can institute my authority
• 41:19
  when I want and not what I want. But when they grow up, it's
• 41:24
  either it's either you got to call everyone or you call none
• 41:28
  of them. So when the pitcher is so
• 41:31
  illegal, they can't change your mechanics in the middle of the
• 41:35
  game, which they probably couldn't.
• 41:37
  OK, so you don't call the letter medium anyway.
• 41:41
  So I brought that up to a couple people, like the guy in charge
• 41:45
  of the umpiring for the SEC. When you guys see people so
• 41:49
  illegal, they just say, I mean, almost saying screw you, I'm
• 41:55
  going to pitch the way I want. And they dare you to call me.
• 41:58
  And they're so illegal. You don't call them because
• 42:02
  they're so illegal. Every pitch, they they really
• 42:05
  can't pitch. And one of those girls and you,
• 42:08
  you may know like a lot of them, but you remember the girl from
• 42:12
  Florida, Kelly Barnhill. Oh yeah.
• 42:14
  Kelly Barnhill. Was an out and out giant man
• 42:17
  sized crow hop. Yep.
• 42:20
  And what are you going to do with her?
• 42:21
  You going to call straight arm, put your arm out and call a
• 42:25
  legal 100 pitch in a row or are you just going to let her pitch?
• 42:29
  So if you completely don't follow the rules and you
• 42:34
  completely break the rules, you never called.
• 42:38
  But if your ticky tack, like you said earlier, I said, Ken, if
• 42:42
  your ticky tack calls and this and that, they will call you
• 42:45
  once in a while. And that's was my, you know,
• 42:49
  they don't see that on TV. But that was my giant complaint
• 42:53
  about that. You would call it Emily Lumley
• 42:56
  for this airborne drag and the pitchers gets pitching in the
• 43:00
  relief against her for Florida has a giant man sized crow hop
• 43:04
  and you just look the other way because you know, you can't do
• 43:08
  anything about it. Yep.
• 43:10
  And that's what's my that. So that's the good reason they
• 43:14
  changed the rule. You you mentioned Ken.
• 43:16
  Yes, right, right. Yeah, yeah.
• 43:18
  So anyway, but that doesn't it, it doesn't link their stride and
• 43:22
  all that stuff. And you know, and so but the the
• 43:25
  crow hop and I think you you you're leading to that.
• 43:31
  You know the crow hop, a leap is 1 extension in the back leg.
• 43:36
  The crow hop is a double extension, the back leg because
• 43:38
  you extend the back leg and you land on your push off leg and
• 43:44
  you extend it again. Yep, Yep.
• 43:46
  And and so the difference is easy to tell.
• 43:49
  Not for some umpires and some college coaches, but if you
• 43:53
  taunt what it is, the difference is easy to tell.
• 43:57
  So and then I know. You've mentioned before.
• 44:01
  Like the way? That they did.
• 44:02
  They're defining the Crow Hop now about, you know, the sole of
• 44:05
  the shoe coming down or something.
• 44:07
  I know you've mentioned that that's not the way that it
• 44:09
  should be defined. What do you think?
• 44:11
  Right, that's down we got. Should be.
• 44:12
  Yeah, we got called. For that two or three times and
• 44:14
  the kid was on her foot. And then when it's, it's, it's
• 44:17
  still a very, it's still a very confusing thing right now.
• 44:21
  Yeah, yeah. So leap is the leap or a drag
• 44:25
  because it's the same mechanical thing.
• 44:27
  It's 1 push of your drivelet you know, push off leg and when you
• 44:31
  and you push and then you call your back leg and land on the
• 44:35
  same leg you push off. So like any weight transfer on
• 44:40
  the leaper drag is right, left. If you're right-handed, push up
• 44:44
  your right, land on your left. A crow hop is push off your
• 44:47
  right, land in your right and then the left it's right, right,
• 44:50
  left, right, right, left and the drag is right, left.
• 44:54
  And that's, it's rhythmically how it plays out too.
• 44:57
  It's a different rhythm, right, right, left, right, right, left
• 45:00
  or right left. So it's very easy.
• 45:03
  So, and I, my complaint, I think we talked about this before as
• 45:09
  when you have an umpire get in the low stance and examine the
• 45:14
  ground and all that stuff. And I said, what are you doing?
• 45:17
  You don't need to examine the ground and act like you're
• 45:20
  staring at it. I mean, you can see a crow
• 45:23
  hopper drag in the 20th row, you know, I mean, you, you can't,
• 45:28
  you don't need to be right there.
• 45:29
  Yeah, right. So I think though people are
• 45:32
  confusing him and they're starting to teach Crow Hop.
• 45:36
  Look at the biggest thing, and I'm getting ahead of myself
• 45:40
  here, but if I have many of my kids through body control and
• 45:47
  learning how to use their body, not the rules, I don't really
• 45:52
  give a crap about the rules. I want them to learn how to work
• 45:56
  their body. So if I always tell this story,
• 46:00
  if I do a group clinic, and I did one in Dayton a couple
• 46:05
  months ago and there was like 50 people there, I'm going to show
• 46:09
  you a drag. Boom.
• 46:11
  I'm showing a drag full speed. I'm going to show you a step how
• 46:15
  they used to do it way back when.
• 46:18
  I'm going to show you a crow hop.
• 46:20
  So I show you that. I said, well, OK, that's because
• 46:24
  I can control what my legs do. So I said I want you to do that.
• 46:29
  I want you to stand up. You're a 9th grader.
• 46:31
  I want you to stand up. You should be able to stand up
• 46:34
  in front of 50 people. And so here's what a drag looks
• 46:38
  like. Here's what a crow hop looks
• 46:40
  like. Here's what a step looks like or
• 46:43
  whatever, right? Just for the sheer fact, not to
• 46:46
  confuse you, not to say you're going to pitch different ways in
• 46:49
  the games. I'm not talking about being
• 46:51
  tricky like that, just so they have an idea of what they're
• 46:57
  doing with their body. So all these coaches at coaches
• 47:02
  clinics, I always get this question.
• 47:05
  I get this kid crow hopping and I can't stop.
• 47:08
  How do I stop them? The answer is make them crow hop
• 47:12
  on purpose. Is she doing a crow hop by
• 47:17
  accident? And you got to film her and she
• 47:20
  goes, oh, I didn't even know she was I was doing that.
• 47:24
  Then there's a problem. So if you crow hop on purpose,
• 47:29
  you can drag on purpose. The accidental crow hop, if the
• 47:35
  girl who doesn't even know she's doing it is a bigger problem
• 47:40
  than the rules. She has no idea what her lower
• 47:43
  body was doing. That makes sense.
• 47:46
  You guys. That makes saying that, right?
• 47:47
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 47:48
  Yes. Absolutely.
• 47:49
  Yes. Yeah.
• 47:51
  So I always say make a crow hunter on purpose.
• 47:53
  Why? Because if she's going up on
• 47:55
  purpose, she has control of her body, then you can make her drag
• 47:59
  on purpose. And this and that.
• 48:01
  The accident of crow hop that they don't know what they're
• 48:05
  they didn't know what they're doing is a problem because they
• 48:09
  because they have no feel of what their legs are doing.
• 48:12
  So I'm not saying being tricky, but I I some, some of my
• 48:15
  pictures, not all of them, you know, a handful.
• 48:18
  I said you should be able to crow ham drag and this and that
• 48:21
  just to feel your legs maneuver. Now you're going to pitch and
• 48:25
  drag and follow the rules and all that stuff.
• 48:28
  But it's not one style for the this.
• 48:31
  It's if you're coordinated with your legs, you should be able to
• 48:35
  do all of them. You know, not that you could do
• 48:38
  all of them in games, but I'm just saying just because there's
• 48:42
  different strengths and principles to that, you know,
• 48:45
  there's the advantage to the dragon, it's advantage to grow
• 48:48
  hop and they're different. You know pros and cons of each
• 48:51
  of them are the opposite you know?
• 48:53
  Well well. Doug, sometimes when I've got a
• 48:55
  girl who's kind of, you know, using her left leg, she's
• 48:57
  running right past her right leg and it's just kind of dead and
• 49:01
  being, you know, dragged behind and not contributing anything.
• 49:04
  I'll have her crow hop on purpose.
• 49:05
  I'll tell her, look, this is illegal.
• 49:07
  We're not going to do this as a regular thing, but see if you
• 49:10
  can hop. Get in here, take a stop onto
• 49:12
  your right foot if they're right-handed, and then jump
• 49:15
  forward and land on your right foot.
• 49:17
  And it's amazing how many of them can't do it without a few
• 49:20
  practice tries. Oh yeah.
• 49:23
  Yeah, yeah. Because it's a it's, it's a
• 49:26
  rhythm thing. It's more of a rhythm thing with
• 49:28
  the arm. The arms move and when you do
• 49:31
  it, it's. So it's more of a rhythm thing
• 49:33
  than is a leg drive thing at all.
• 49:35
  And it's more of a rhythm thing is a lot of people don't know
• 49:40
  this. If you do discussion about oh OK
• 49:43
  I'm going to show you 3 strokes rights, the old fashioned step,
• 49:47
  a drag and a crow hop. Which one is harder on the body?
• 49:53
  Which one requires more leg drive?
• 49:56
  You know what I mean. And most 90% of the people say
• 50:00
  crow hop and said no, crow hopping is easy.
• 50:04
  Crow hopping is a lazy man, short stride, you just skip, you
• 50:08
  know what I mean? You skip forward in pitch,
• 50:11
  right? OK, when you push and drag,
• 50:14
  that's takes athletic ability and all that stuff.
• 50:17
  So and, and dragging, it's much more harder to do right than a
• 50:24
  lazy crow hop. But when you said you have
• 50:26
  something, your students do that.
• 50:28
  So the crow hop builds rhythm, you know what I mean?
• 50:32
  So like, hey, I'm going to do this little hop and rhythm thing
• 50:35
  like you talked about with your kids that builds rhythm.
• 50:40
  OK, yeah. And it's not so much is like
• 50:43
  it's hard to push. It's a rhythmic thing.
• 50:46
  It's like a learning a dance step or whatever, you know, kind
• 50:49
  of activating. It's a rhythm thing.
• 50:51
  Yes, yes, it's it's like it learning a rhythm thing.
• 50:55
  But The thing is, the crow hop, and I think we talked about this
• 50:59
  before, it doesn't necessarily increase your stride.
• 51:02
  It can OK, elite doesn't create your stride leg at all, but the
• 51:07
  the crow hop doesn't necessarily increase your stride length.
• 51:11
  But the crow hoppers are better at body rotation because they
• 51:16
  have more time to rotate their body.
• 51:18
  They're worse at direction, but better at body rotation.
• 51:22
  And they tend to be better Landers.
• 51:24
  Better posture on Landers, draggers have better direction,
• 51:28
  better stride angles, and I'm saying overall worse at landing
• 51:37
  and worse at body rotation. There's the opposite.
• 51:39
  The pros and cons are the opposite.
• 51:41
  So I don't know if you guys remember this girl, but she was
• 51:44
  really good. She was on the USA team and
• 51:48
  first team All American for Missouri, I think three years in
• 51:51
  a row. Chelsea Thomas, OK, if you
• 51:54
  remember her, Chelsea Thomas, right.
• 51:57
  And she was like, pitching dragon all the time, right?
• 52:00
  She used to do crow hopping drills and practice all the
• 52:02
  time. Yeah, I may hear crow hop and
• 52:04
  practice and rhythm. And she had to get more body
• 52:07
  rotation, got more rhythm. Yeah.
• 52:09
  You never saw in games, you know me.
• 52:12
  But she knew how to do it. She knew how to do it for the
• 52:16
  this side effects. There's positive side effects
• 52:19
  with crow hopping that you can learn even though you don't do
• 52:23
  that in games. Doug, I want to I.
• 52:25
  Want to talk to you a little bit about the the Holy Grail of
• 52:28
  pitching is still speed, right? How hard you can Chuck it?
• 52:31
  In your experience, what do you think the biggest contributors
• 52:34
  are to speed with pitching mechanics?
• 52:37
  Speed. Comes from elasticity.
• 52:40
  Some people, the easy way to explain elasticity, their
• 52:45
  muscles are like giant rubber bands, you know, I mean, some
• 52:49
  people that rubber band muscles, they really elastic.
• 52:53
  And so if they're elastic and strength and rhythm is the
• 53:00
  that's the word people throw hard because you have and
• 53:04
  strength angles, which is hard to explain on audio, but
• 53:09
  elasticity, they're Willie Whippy.
• 53:12
  Strength and rhythm, timing and kinematic sequence is now the
• 53:17
  buzz term, but that's old news game.
• 53:19
  So it's rhythm so that that's how people, because you can see
• 53:24
  some people like in the weight room are really strong and can't
• 53:29
  throw hard and you can see someone who weak and can throw
• 53:32
  hard and there's a reason for that.
• 53:34
  So, Doug, I want to. Ask you a question real quick
• 53:36
  here too. You do a drill that I've I've
• 53:39
  seen and I use it sometimes too as well, where you have kind of
• 53:43
  like a three-step where you crossover with your right or
• 53:45
  excuse me, crossover with your left, crossover with your right,
• 53:48
  and then crossover the power line with your stride leg again.
• 53:51
  Can you explain why you teach that drill and like what it's
• 53:55
  what the purpose is behind it? Okay, so.
• 54:02
  There's explanations at various levels, so I'm going to give you
• 54:07
  the beginner on up. Okay, all right, so power line,
• 54:11
  blah, blah blah, power line is a healthy thing, but it's not
• 54:14
  absolute. So not all great pitchers are on
• 54:17
  the power line, but the but it's not meaning the power line's a
• 54:20
  bunch of BS OK, but most kids, 80% of kids, maybe 90% of kids
• 54:27
  miss their power line to their glove side, their their glove
• 54:31
  side. OK.
• 54:33
  And the only reason they learn how to power line is the they
• 54:39
  don't do that on a purpose, but they miss to the if I'm
• 54:43
  right-handed. So if they miss to the left on
• 54:46
  purpose or by accident, well, if you put them on the mat with a
• 54:51
  line or on a board, you're not correcting them.
• 54:54
  You're just treating the symptom and you put them on the board or
• 54:58
  this and that. Now you're looking straight.
• 55:00
  Now they don't know what straight is.
• 55:02
  So they have the miss on the left by accident, which they do.
• 55:08
  Then you make them short step and overcorrect miss on the
• 55:13
  other side on purpose. If you miss to the left by
• 55:19
  accident, which they all do, and then you miss to the right of
• 55:23
  the power line on purpose, then you can find the middle.
• 55:27
  That's a beginner, as you know the beginner explanation that
• 55:32
  makes sense. So you overcorrect at half
• 55:34
  speed. Anything the overcorrect at half
• 55:38
  speed, you got a chance of doing full speed.
• 55:42
  So if you overcorrect at half speed, by logic, you have a
• 55:47
  chance of doing it right full speed.
• 55:49
  So that's the initiative of the three steps as it walks.
• 55:53
  Then you break it in two and then two.
• 55:57
  Now, if you've stride to full speed and cross your power line,
• 56:02
  and this is what freaks me out as instructor the most, like
• 56:06
  coaches and all that stuff, and then the full speed cross the
• 56:10
  power line, like Monica Abbott, she's left-handed, but she
• 56:13
  crossed her power line for 7 to 9 inches.
• 56:16
  She's never even close, OK, She doesn't even close to step into
• 56:20
  the catcher. She crosses it right and just
• 56:22
  she's good, right? So, OK, so, so when you do that,
• 56:28
  OK. And if you try to cross your
• 56:31
  power line and you fail, fail's a strong word.
• 56:39
  But if you fail and you land on the rope, OK, you try to cross
• 56:46
  the rope. So you land on the rope and you
• 56:49
  fail, you know what? You are straight to the catcher.
• 56:52
  Yeah. Straight on the power line.
• 56:53
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 56:54
  You better than you were 20 minutes ago, stepping 20° to the
• 56:59
  left. Now, if you cross the power
• 57:02
  line, you on a leverage angle. So I always told those kids, I
• 57:08
  said, and there's it's, it's a hip angle thing.
• 57:11
  It's kind of hard to explain. OK, so I'm not going to go
• 57:14
  there. That's the the really hip angle
• 57:16
  thing is the the real reason they do with this most advances
• 57:20
  reason we do it but anyway, but the ordinary explanation is this
• 57:26
  so you, you, you on the line and you cross it or you're on the
• 57:31
  line and you're on the glove side.
• 57:34
  So I always put those feet and those, this is where you used to
• 57:39
  be stepping on the glove side and more open to the catcher.
• 57:46
  Then I'm going to put you on the other side more close to the
• 57:51
  catcher. Like you cross the power line by
• 57:53
  3 or 4 inches, whatever. And I make him stand there in
• 57:57
  both positions. And I said this is a dorky
• 58:01
  example, but just love when you say it.
• 58:04
  If you're playing tug of war with your catcher, she threw a
• 58:09
  big rope and you played tug of war with your catcher, which
• 58:13
  position you you were standing. Oh, the new one, yes.
• 58:18
  OK, that makes sense to you guys.
• 58:20
  Yes, you're a little bit over the power line and then and then
• 58:23
  I throw your rope, you play tug of war.
• 58:26
  If you step open and you play tug of war, you can't pull them
• 58:29
  and they're going to pull you on your face.
• 58:30
  So I said that's your old stride angle.
• 58:33
  This is your new strang angle. If you hit a punching bag, which
• 58:37
  will you hit it from the new angle and you throw softball,
• 58:40
  The yes and then two and you open and close, which I don't
• 58:45
  use those terms, but it's not a bunch of BS, but open and close,
• 58:48
  whatever their old terms, but it's it's it's relevant.
• 58:52
  What's smoother on your open and close When you stride on this
• 58:55
  angle, it's right. This angle, it's people stride
• 58:58
  the left have to jerk their opening around.
• 59:01
  They're not smooth. People cross the power line
• 59:04
  naturally open by a way they're stride, they're smoother.
• 59:08
  And it's risk free to try it because if you fail at it,
• 59:15
  you're better than you were before.
• 59:18
  So it really matters how you introduce it, how you coach it
• 59:24
  and how you present it. You know, it's not like a new
• 59:28
  thing, old thing. It's it's, it's, it's a very,
• 59:32
  you know what I mean? And that's how you present that.
• 59:34
  Yeah, it sounds like. And the thing it's risk free
• 59:37
  because if they fail there, there, there's better stride
• 59:40
  alignment than they were in the past.
• 59:42
  Sounds like I'm going to. Have to throw a rope in my bag
• 59:44
  now. Yeah, yeah.
• 59:49
  And I'll say this to like I say this in coaching feelings all
• 59:52
  the time. If I have 100 kids and they
• 59:56
  don't all do that drill because they don't all need it.
• 59:58
  But it's a it's a simple warm up drill.
• 1:00:00
  That's what we use as simple warm up drill.
• 1:00:02
  But you present it. If you do that presentation and
• 1:00:07
  I and I'd cut half of it out on my explanation, but it and if
• 1:00:10
  you do it and you do the rope and all that stuff and you do it
• 1:00:15
  for 100 kids, you will do it 100 different ways because certain
• 1:00:19
  kids have a different problem. You know what I mean?
• 1:00:21
  Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:00:22
  So it's not, it's not a cut and dry of my explanation, Right.
• 1:00:27
  So that now the kid, he needs to hear this.
• 1:00:29
  This kid needs to hear this. This kid needs to hear this.
• 1:00:33
  They're still individual coaching within a unitary drill.
• 1:00:38
  Doug, I have. A question for you and this this
• 1:00:41
  is kind of it's more of a health and safety type of thing.
• 1:00:44
  You've been around the game a long time, seen a lot of things.
• 1:00:47
  You know, there's a lot more research being done and you
• 1:00:50
  know, there's been suggestions of pitch counts for fast pitch
• 1:00:53
  pitchers, especially at the youth level.
• 1:00:55
  I mean, you know, you've got coaches that are, are well,
• 1:00:58
  teams that are playing 678 games in a weekend and coaches that
• 1:01:02
  are trying to ride a single pitcher with it.
• 1:01:04
  I mean, do you think that we should have pitch counts or do
• 1:01:07
  you not think it's an issue? No.
• 1:01:09
  Because I think playing year round hurts pitchers.
• 1:01:15
  They're too much playing year round.
• 1:01:18
  I can imagine being younger and playing year round, you, you
• 1:01:23
  hate the game by now. You know pitch counts.
• 1:01:27
  No, because individually it's how you feel.
• 1:01:31
  It's how good your arm feels that day.
• 1:01:33
  There's all kinds of things I can poke hose in.
• 1:01:37
  OK, so some people, not all people, when they throw a rise,
• 1:01:41
  that's like hard work for them. Even a good rise, not a fake
• 1:01:46
  rise, but a good rise. And there is a lot more labor to
• 1:01:50
  that. And when you throw nice and easy
• 1:01:54
  drops, there's not as much. And I was that way and facing a
• 1:01:59
  good team or facing the bad team, right.
• 1:02:01
  So you can count a rise ball as a pitch in half for some people
• 1:02:06
  and and a drop off for eight tenths of the pitch.
• 1:02:11
  And. Yeah.
• 1:02:11
  Are you counting change UPS? Mine was erratic at my change,
• 1:02:15
  but I threw a lot of change up. I got tired, you know, and
• 1:02:19
  people, you're going to sound a change, you're going to come
• 1:02:21
  mine. Mine's worth too.
• 1:02:23
  You know what I mean? Because IA lot of Labor.
• 1:02:27
  Yeah. Yeah, I'm a lot.
• 1:02:28
  Yeah. And some people are not like
• 1:02:30
  that. So it depends how aggressive are
• 1:02:34
  you throwing pitches that are Dick of difficult on your body
• 1:02:38
  or easy on your body? There's so many factors that
• 1:02:42
  people don't talk about. So in general, I at the limit
• 1:02:48
  like health, right? You got to take one month a year
• 1:02:53
  without a softball in your hand, one month a year.
• 1:02:58
  And that's like easy for me when I was growing up, but it's hard
• 1:03:01
  nowadays for these kids. And you have to take a minimum
• 1:03:06
  of one month a year without a softball on your hands and one
• 1:03:10
  day a week without a softball on your hands.
• 1:03:13
  And you can still overthrow, but the rules, right?
• 1:03:17
  And and then I know you're not asking the question, but you're
• 1:03:20
  leaning to it. Or maybe the best pitchers I
• 1:03:25
  ever worked with are multiple sport athletes.
• 1:03:29
  Yeah, you know what I mean. They they they play other
• 1:03:32
  things. They're basketball, volleyball,
• 1:03:35
  track and field. It's not pick a sport when
• 1:03:39
  you're 10 years old and you play it the rest of your life and
• 1:03:42
  hate it when you're 18. And that is a big part of it,
• 1:03:46
  too. And two, you go extreme.
• 1:03:51
  I once pitched 8 games in one day when I, I was 18.
• 1:03:57
  Now I felt it. That's the only time I was like,
• 1:04:02
  I can't pick my, my arm, you know what I mean?
• 1:04:05
  I, I didn't pick up a ball for a week.
• 1:04:08
  You're right. Eight games in one day, right?
• 1:04:11
  But I was 18 and there's you, you can go.
• 1:04:16
  And how hard are they working? Are they got a smooth stride?
• 1:04:22
  Have they got a easy like a smooth stride or a difficult
• 1:04:26
  stride? If I I go push and drag hard as
• 1:04:29
  I can, I'm going to wear out really fast.
• 1:04:32
  I do a lazy crow hop or step and stride.
• 1:04:35
  I can through all day. As of now.
• 1:04:37
  It's it's it's not the same, you know, I mean, so there's really
• 1:04:41
  factors. So I border in the how do you
• 1:04:45
  feel? Are you doing it right?
• 1:04:48
  When you get sloppy because you're getting tired, you know
• 1:04:52
  it's not benefit. You do it more and one month of
• 1:04:56
  the year, one week day, a week off, you know, so I born in on
• 1:05:01
  that because pitch counts are you count good pitches, bad
• 1:05:05
  pitches, this, you know, I mean, there's so many variables there.
• 1:05:08
  Yeah. Yeah, it's just funny when you
• 1:05:10
  said that about being 18. There's a lot of things you can
• 1:05:13
  do when you're 18 that you can go pretty.
• 1:05:16
  Hard in a lot of. Aspects, right?
• 1:05:19
  Right. And this is a 2 story and I'm
• 1:05:22
  telling you and then this is what's the step era?
• 1:05:25
  And this guy was Kevin Hurley, which is like top 2 pitches in
• 1:05:29
  the world, maybe the best pitch in the world at the time.
• 1:05:31
  I was bad boy. I was not a long time ago.
• 1:05:34
  And it was for my dad's team and they won the International
• 1:05:38
  Softball Conference, you know, world championship and in
• 1:05:42
  Saginaw. And I don't know their actual
• 1:05:46
  record, but it was like 87 and 8 or 87, seven.
• 1:05:53
  Was this seasons of record over that and they?
• 1:05:58
  Couldn't figure out how they lost 8.
• 1:06:00
  Yeah, yeah, no, no, they can figure out.
• 1:06:03
  But anyway, because there's other teams in the league that
• 1:06:06
  were really good and all that stuff.
• 1:06:08
  So anyway, but they won the ISC World Championship.
• 1:06:12
  The story that blows people's mind was Kevin Hurley with his
• 1:06:16
  main pitcher, right? And everybody knew that, right?
• 1:06:19
  He pitch every inning of the season.
• 1:06:25
  Wow. No.
• 1:06:27
  One threw another pitch and he was very good.
• 1:06:31
  He was a king of putting it on cruise.
• 1:06:34
  When you face a Wednesday night team who was average, he just
• 1:06:39
  played catch, you know what I mean?
• 1:06:40
  He just in his world, he's just playing catch and they can't hit
• 1:06:45
  him. And they stepped it up to the
• 1:06:47
  competition needed lowered it and stepped it up.
• 1:06:49
  But he never let him score. He didn't like get beat around,
• 1:06:53
  but he he didn't work hard when he didn't have to.
• 1:06:55
  He was like a cat. He just just as high as Nick.
• 1:06:58
  You know what I mean? That's a great analysis.
• 1:07:00
  And he was like. That and he was really good.
• 1:07:02
  He threw really hard and then you tell that story today, the
• 1:07:06
  kids and like what? That's no way you can do that.
• 1:07:09
  Yes, it's been done. And he never had any of our
• 1:07:11
  problems, you know, So there's there's more factors than that.
• 1:07:16
  But it's harder nowadays because the scores are higher.
• 1:07:19
  The balls are liver this and that.
• 1:07:21
  So you can't do that. It costs 5. $100 Yeah, that was
• 1:07:24
  the. Extreme example yes, yes so Doug
• 1:07:28
  we. Told you to be about an hour.
• 1:07:30
  We've had you a little bit over, so we appreciate your time.
• 1:07:32
  Ken, do you have any other questions for Doug?
• 1:07:34
  I'll do the last one today because I'm going to kind of
• 1:07:36
  change it up. But do you have another question
• 1:07:37
  for Doug or no? Yeah, I just have one other one
• 1:07:41
  and this is I'm just interested in in kind of how you feel about
• 1:07:45
  this. But what gives you more
• 1:07:46
  satisfaction when you working with, you know, some high level
• 1:07:50
  kid that you know is elite and you know it's going to be AP4
• 1:07:53
  type of kid? Or maybe some kid who maybe
• 1:07:57
  she's not as blessed with ability, not as athletic, but
• 1:08:01
  you get her to a point where she becomes a really good pitcher,
• 1:08:06
  I'm going to say. Both and.
• 1:08:07
  Here's why. If you're a good coach, you can
• 1:08:11
  make everybody better. So that's what I say to Heist
• 1:08:16
  college coaches all the time. I told I'm not going to tell
• 1:08:20
  their names, but I just big time college coaches.
• 1:08:24
  I say to them if you're pitching coaches good, they all get
• 1:08:27
  better. Even the kid who never pitches
• 1:08:29
  on TV, even the kid who is number 4 or five, they get
• 1:08:34
  better. Don't hang your hat on the stud
• 1:08:37
  student. And you, you, you guys see
• 1:08:40
  people to do that? Like they have a stud student
• 1:08:43
  and they promote it and then promote it.
• 1:08:46
  I work with her, I work with her, I work with her.
• 1:08:48
  And yeah, what about the other 80 kids you work with?
• 1:08:51
  How are they? You know what I mean?
• 1:08:53
  Yeah, that's OK, right? And they promote it and promote
• 1:08:57
  it to promote it to no end. So I always say to these these
• 1:09:04
  big time college coaches, if you got a good pitching coach, they
• 1:09:07
  all get better. Your ace gets better and your
• 1:09:10
  number 5, who you don't really don't care about who's never
• 1:09:13
  going to pitch in the big game, they get better also.
• 1:09:17
  So if you every pitcher on your staff gets better, your pitching
• 1:09:22
  coach is doing a good job. If only one gets better because
• 1:09:26
  they're naturally are better. It has nothing to do with your
• 1:09:29
  pitching coach, you know, But if you're a pitching coach makes
• 1:09:34
  the bad pitcher average that's good and and the great pitcher
• 1:09:39
  better, that's good. So the answer to you, and I'm
• 1:09:43
  not trying to be waffly on the answer, no, it's everybody.
• 1:09:47
  Because if you can coach, you can make everybody better.
• 1:09:49
  Yeah. Jane and I talk about that all
• 1:09:51
  the time, you know, where we look at it and say that, you
• 1:09:54
  know, if my best pictures, if it was me that was doing it, all my
• 1:09:59
  students would be that good. And they're not, you know, they,
• 1:10:02
  they all vary based on their ability, their dedication and a
• 1:10:05
  whole lot of other factors that go into it.
• 1:10:08
  Yeah, we also, we also say too, it's the ones that don't get it
• 1:10:11
  that keep us up at night like that, try to help them get it.
• 1:10:14
  Like we got to take more time. You know, there's kids.
• 1:10:16
  I'm working. I'm like, man, you're the reason
• 1:10:18
  I have no hair. I got to figure you out, man.
• 1:10:20
  We got to get you where you need to be.
• 1:10:22
  So. So.
• 1:10:23
  OK, Doug, one last question. One last question for you.
• 1:10:27
  We we usually ask like if you had any hidden talents, but
• 1:10:30
  that's not where I want to go with this one today, just
• 1:10:32
  because I know you're a little bit of a music junkie.
• 1:10:35
  I want you if you can, then we'll put you on the spot here.
• 1:10:38
  Top three concerts you've ever been to.
• 1:10:41
  Wow, How do you? Find.
• 1:10:42
  How do you find that out? I'm.
• 1:10:45
  I'm more interested in how you find that out.
• 1:10:48
  Again, you. That's good.
• 1:10:49
  That's not like you've been a. Mentor to me, you don't even,
• 1:10:52
  you don't know, Like I, I played men's fast pitch.
• 1:10:54
  I was a sub. I played a little bit for Dolan.
• 1:10:56
  And Murphy back in the day as a. Sub here and there and played in
• 1:10:59
  the church league and looked up to you.
• 1:11:01
  I got to see you pitch in the in the 2000s and you're just
• 1:11:05
  amazing. I use your your rise grip.
• 1:11:07
  So for me, this is a this is a great, a great thing.
• 1:11:10
  We've never met personally. I've seen you, we've crossed
• 1:11:12
  paths, all that good stuff. That's.
• 1:11:14
  How you knew? Yeah, so.
• 1:11:16
  So yeah, you probably know some. Dumb things I did too well we.
• 1:11:20
  Ought to get into that stuff go. Ahead.
• 1:11:21
  Yeah, yeah, yeah. So oh man, that's a tough one.
• 1:11:26
  I painted a lot. Yeah, that's a good question
• 1:11:29
  though, because I'm trying to do the hidden talent question.
• 1:11:32
  You say, I don't know, have a habitat.
• 1:11:34
  So the most unusual I saw Prince at the United Center, OK.
• 1:11:40
  And Prince's was a perfectionist purple one.
• 1:11:44
  And he got a good. Show the day before, the power
• 1:11:48
  went out at the United Center the day before, he did two
• 1:11:52
  shows, and I wasn't that that one he was had to finish his
• 1:11:57
  show late. He wasn't happy.
• 1:11:59
  So the downtown, oh, there's a Blues club.
• 1:12:06
  What's it called? Buddy, Guys, Legends.
• 1:12:08
  There's one in new. Orleans One House of Blues, OK.
• 1:12:12
  Yeah, House of. Blues in downtown Chicago,
• 1:12:15
  right, With apartments on top, right?
• 1:12:17
  Yeah, right. House of Blues, Right, right.
• 1:12:19
  OK. The Bob Newhart apartment's on
• 1:12:22
  top, right. So yeah, if you.
• 1:12:24
  Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Down by Marine.
• 1:12:27
  Marina City. Yep.
• 1:12:29
  And then so the House of Blues, right, He was supposed to show
• 1:12:33
  up and just make an appearance there like after the concert.
• 1:12:39
  So it's 12:30 and I go there and it's a Tuesday and it's half
• 1:12:46
  full. It's not packed.
• 1:12:47
  And it was 75 bucks to get in. It was a Prince after party.
• 1:12:52
  And I said it's Prince going to really come here and just say hi
• 1:12:55
  and not shake hands, but but just say hi and leave, you know?
• 1:13:00
  But he's but he was what? Well, and the bouncer told me he
• 1:13:04
  was supposed to do it last night.
• 1:13:06
  But because of the power outage at the United Center, he didn't
• 1:13:11
  get here to 4:00 AM or like 3:00 AM.
• 1:13:14
  And he just walked on stage. He's high.
• 1:13:16
  And he left. He kind of pissed off, right?
• 1:13:18
  So he didn't do anything for the people in an after party.
• 1:13:21
  And I don't expect that he should.
• 1:13:23
  Right, right, right. So right.
• 1:13:25
  So I'm in the House of Blues. There's like 100 people there.
• 1:13:29
  Only 100 people. He shows up at 12:30.
• 1:13:34
  He brought two of his the band mates with him and.
• 1:13:41
  Oh, what's the Hudson girl? Kate Hudson.
• 1:13:44
  She's got ATV show. No.
• 1:13:46
  What's the name? Kate Hudson.
• 1:13:48
  Yeah, the famous. Is it Kate Hudson?
• 1:13:50
  No, no, no. Kate Hudson.
• 1:13:51
  Yeah. But anyway, I forget her name.
• 1:13:54
  Jennifer. Jennifer Hudson.
• 1:13:56
  Jennifer. Hudson Yes, there is, yes.
• 1:13:58
  Yes, yes. So there's here Jennifer Hudson
• 1:14:02
  on stage and two and then two band mates, right?
• 1:14:06
  And he's pulling out his little keyboard and guitar and all that
• 1:14:11
  stuff right now. And they're they're playing,
• 1:14:15
  they're playing like two or three songs.
• 1:14:20
  Just, you know, he is making them up.
• 1:14:23
  You know, they're not famous songs.
• 1:14:24
  He just making them up, right? And I was like, this is really
• 1:14:27
  incredible, right? He's just like playing and it's
• 1:14:31
  like he got a flashback that we he wasn't famous, you know what
• 1:14:35
  I mean? It was it's like he got a
• 1:14:37
  flashback. So he goes to the guy and the
• 1:14:42
  sound board and the people wanted the thing.
• 1:14:46
  He turned around and sends lights off and then what?
• 1:14:51
  I said lights. He said lights off and they
• 1:14:57
  turned down the lights and he turned around and said I said I
• 1:15:01
  said lights off. So the whole place went dark,
• 1:15:06
  right? And this is so nobody can film.
• 1:15:11
  That's why he did it and aft and that you can see two inches from
• 1:15:16
  your hand, but you know how your eyes would go after you stay
• 1:15:20
  there for a while, your eyes are dead.
• 1:15:22
  And it was fun. 5 minutes later you can look around and whatever
• 1:15:26
  he played and he was, you know he was not.
• 1:15:30
  He was not. His hair was not fancy, you know
• 1:15:35
  what I mean. His collar was not up.
• 1:15:39
  He didn't wear the high heel shoes.
• 1:15:42
  He was just dressed like a little guy, you know what I
• 1:15:44
  mean? He wasn't all fancy what he was
• 1:15:47
  and will, you know what I mean? Right.
• 1:15:50
  And he played for another two hours.
• 1:15:52
  Wow, that's. Awesome.
• 1:15:54
  Yeah, yeah. And it is fun of nobody.
• 1:15:57
  And it's like he got a flashback to what?
• 1:15:59
  He wasn't famous. And I'm not dressed up.
• 1:16:03
  My hair looks normal. My collar's down.
• 1:16:06
  I have tennis shoes on and, and, and, and, and that's why he did
• 1:16:11
  the known lights, because he didn't want any film.
• 1:16:13
  He's big on that. Nobody films anything, right?
• 1:16:16
  And, and he and he did and he didn't do anything the night
• 1:16:19
  before. So maybe he thought he owed it
• 1:16:22
  to him. But I said you just played.
• 1:16:23
  I mean, I'm just thinking out loud.
• 1:16:25
  You just played two hours on the United Center.
• 1:16:27
  You were 9 to 11. You were 9:00 to 11:00.
• 1:16:30
  You got here at 12:31 and, and all of a sudden it's 3333545.
• 1:16:37
  And yeah, he played, he's played it like a 2 1/2 hours, you know,
• 1:16:43
  and he's making up songs and this and that and he plays every
• 1:16:46
  instrument. And it was like, remarkable
• 1:16:48
  because that's a new most unusual thing I looked into.
• 1:16:52
  So that's a good one. Yeah.
• 1:16:54
  Awesome. You know?
• 1:16:55
  Yeah. And I saw Bruce Springsteen at
• 1:16:58
  the United Center three years ago and that was the big thing
• 1:17:03
  because it was Bruce and it was at the United Center, right?
• 1:17:06
  And he is now he's touring again.
• 1:17:08
  And Bruce Springsteen is going to play at the United Center in
• 1:17:11
  mid-May this May on a sun Saturday.
• 1:17:15
  And I'm thinking about going again, just not the United
• 1:17:18
  Center, the Medicine and Square Garden.
• 1:17:20
  Sorry. Medicine and Square Garden in
• 1:17:22
  New York. So I went there three years ago.
• 1:17:24
  But it goes to the Madison Square, and it's Bruce.
• 1:17:27
  And, you know, all the combinationals, too.
• 1:17:29
  It's pretty cool. Yeah.
• 1:17:31
  Yeah. I saw Bruce.
• 1:17:32
  Back in the day when he was at, well, at that time, the Rosemont
• 1:17:35
  Horizon, now the Allstate Arena, I saw him there around the
• 1:17:39
  Darkness on the Edge of Town album release.
• 1:17:42
  And it was just an amazing show. And I remember, yeah, it was
• 1:17:47
  just funny. I'm going to share this real
• 1:17:48
  quick with there are, you know, he gets up after the
• 1:17:51
  intermission and, you know, he gets up and he's holding this
• 1:17:53
  little card in his hand. And he said that he got this
• 1:17:55
  card from someone that said that they were getting married in,
• 1:17:59
  you know, like four months. And, you know, he's got a great
• 1:18:03
  career going on right now. But music is fickle and you
• 1:18:05
  never know. So maybe he'd like to take this
• 1:18:08
  gig play in the guy's wedding. Yeah, it's just a really, really
• 1:18:14
  funny. Story I'm.
• 1:18:15
  I'm sure he did that at every concert, but yeah.
• 1:18:18
  And then he played Little little girl, I want to marry you.
• 1:18:21
  Yeah. That's quite the performer.
• 1:18:22
  That's good. Yeah, but I know you have extra
• 1:18:26
  questions, but my expositions for so long you couldn't ask.
• 1:18:29
  It's all to me. Appreciate your time, man.
• 1:18:32
  That's OK. That's OK.
• 1:18:34
  But I, I would say this to one of the questions I think you had
• 1:18:39
  was all, all the crazy drolls that are on the Internet now or
• 1:18:44
  whatever, you know what I mean? And I always tell my people
• 1:18:48
  like, don't watch the Internet for pitching droves.
• 1:18:53
  It's just off the wall crazy, you know what I mean?
• 1:18:57
  And if you get a good one once in a while, you're lucky.
• 1:19:01
  And the good ones once in a while are things that we known
• 1:19:04
  for years. So there's a lot of people doing
• 1:19:09
  crazy stuff on the Internet to get clicks.
• 1:19:13
  And. Attention and not helping
• 1:19:15
  people. And I know a few of them and I
• 1:19:18
  know a few of them. One played for me, one I like.
• 1:19:25
  I love a great person OK and I'm not going to mention her name
• 1:19:32
  guy, but a great person. She played for us not very
• 1:19:36
  talented pitcher not at all. OK.
• 1:19:39
  She was the worst pitcher on the team and she's big on the
• 1:19:43
  Internet on doing lessons and, and she text me like once a
• 1:19:49
  year, 2 * a year and that's that.
• 1:19:52
  And I, I don't want to tell her this because I like her so much.
• 1:19:56
  99% of the things that come out of her mouth are garbage.
• 1:20:01
  You know what I mean? And, and she only played for
• 1:20:04
  earth one year and she got better.
• 1:20:07
  She was our fifth best pitcher. She got better, but she was
• 1:20:10
  never really good and she was a really nice person.
• 1:20:14
  And I'm, I'm saying like. You're doing drills that don't
• 1:20:18
  make any sense at all just to be excited about, you know what I
• 1:20:22
  mean? And she's good with helping
• 1:20:24
  little kids and she's good at helping little 10 year olds.
• 1:20:27
  But after that, she's no good, you know what I mean?
• 1:20:30
  But she's has it. And this is the thing, I think I
• 1:20:34
  told you this once can when we're talking a month ago or so
• 1:20:39
  when you I used to have that big an Academy and there was a time
• 1:20:44
  when my worst instructor had the most students time because they
• 1:20:50
  like her. They just like her.
• 1:20:53
  Yeah. And that's reminds me of this
• 1:20:56
  girl. They just she's a likable
• 1:20:59
  person. She's a bad pitching coach and a
• 1:21:01
  likable person. You know what I mean?
• 1:21:03
  And and she's good with younger kids.
• 1:21:06
  Yep. And I said, no, don't say that.
• 1:21:08
  Oh, I see her on the Internet and.
• 1:21:10
  Oh, don't say that. No, no, that's not as this.
• 1:21:13
  It doesn't apply to everybody. You can't say that.
• 1:21:15
  You know, every every picture she'd be doing this and every
• 1:21:19
  picture she's doing this. I said no, don't say that.
• 1:21:22
  You know what I mean? But, you know, she's likable and
• 1:21:24
  this and that. So I always tell my pitching
• 1:21:27
  parents and, and students don't, don't watch Facebook or social
• 1:21:33
  media. And, and for pitching girls,
• 1:21:36
  you'll, you'll drive yourself nuts.
• 1:21:39
  Yeah. Doug, thank you so much for
• 1:21:42
  spending so much time with us. We're probably going to have to
• 1:21:45
  do this again just to get to some of the other questions just
• 1:21:47
  because Jay and I are interested in your answers.
• 1:21:50
  You know, hopefully the rest of the audience is, too, But yeah,
• 1:21:52
  that we wanna do that again. Jay, before we go, do you wanna
• 1:21:55
  mention about our promotion? Yeah.
• 1:21:59
  Really quickly what we're gonna be doing with from the coaches
• 1:22:02
  mouth is we are the podcast we are going to.
• 1:22:05
  We have got some T-shirts made. So if you can show us that you
• 1:22:10
  have given us a follow on Spotify or wherever you can find
• 1:22:14
  this Apple podcast and then also share an episode, this would be
• 1:22:17
  a great episode to share because it's Doug Gillis.
• 1:22:19
  I mean, come on, if you can show us you doing those two things,
• 1:22:23
  please show it to us. And Ken and I are an e-mail and
• 1:22:26
  we will send you out a T-shirt. We have limited supply, so it's
• 1:22:29
  going to be first come, first serve.
• 1:22:31
  And if you can help get the word out about this awesome podcast,
• 1:22:33
  we're growing. We just want to keep the girls
• 1:22:35
  going and we want to thank some of the people who are who are
• 1:22:38
  following us. So again, click follow on
• 1:22:40
  Spotify or Apple podcast. Also share an episode.
• 1:22:43
  It doesn't have to be this one, but this one would be great.
• 1:22:46
  Show us that either a video or a little picture of it and send
• 1:22:49
  Ken and I are in e-mail and we will absolutely send you out a
• 1:22:53
  T-shirt. All right.
• 1:22:54
  Thanks, Jay. OK, that's it for us this week.
• 1:22:56
  Thanks to all of you for listening and the kind words
• 1:22:59
  you've been sharing with us. If you like what you're hearing,
• 1:23:01
  Please remember to give us a like, leave a comment and share
• 1:23:04
  this podcast on your social media channels.
• 1:23:06
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• 1:23:09
  by following us on your favorite podcast platform.
• 1:23:13
  If you're so inclined, you can also leave us a great review on
• 1:23:16
  Apple Podcasts to help more people find us.
• 1:23:19
  On behalf of the From the Coaches Mouth podcast, have a
• 1:23:21
  great rest of your week and weekend.