Latest / #Divorce: Support before, during and after with Sarah-Jane / Season 4 : episode #10 Reclaiming Self-Image & Self-Esteem After Separation or Divorce with Joanna

Transcript

Season 4 : episode #10 Reclaiming Self-Image & Self-Esteem After Separation or Divorce with Joanna · #Divorce: Support before, during and after with Sarah-Jane

0:01
Welcome to Hashtag Divorce Support before, during and after
0:06
the podcast for anyone going through separation or divorce,
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whether you're thinking about it, you're in the middle of it,
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or you're navigating what's coming next.
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I'm Sarah Jane Taster, a French family lawyer, family mediator,
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and lawyer supervisor. In this podcast, we talk about
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much more than just the law. We explore well-being,
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relationships, parenting, finances, and the often
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invisible emotional realities of divorce.
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Each episode is designed as a space of support to help you
0:44
understand your emotions yourself.
0:47
Get through this chapter without feeling alone.
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My goal is to offer hope, a reminder that divorce isn't just
0:55
an ending, but a life transition.
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And with the right information and the right support, a calmer,
1:01
more confident outcome is absolutely possible.
1:08
After separation or divorce, many people tell me they don't
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just lose a relationship, they lose a sense of who they are.
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Confidence shift, self esteem wobbles, and the way we see
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ourselves both inside and out can change profoundly.
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Today's conversation is about that in between space, between
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who we were and who you're becoming, and how reconnecting
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with your body, your image and your sense of self can really
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support healing. So I'm delighted to be joined by
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Joanna Briley, A photographer, make up artist and Tropic
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ambassador based just outside First in North Yorkshire.
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Joanna works with women who have been through life challenges
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including separation, divorce and trauma, helping them
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reconnect with their confidence and in a way that feels safe,
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gentle and deeply human. You're originally from Poland
2:15
and you bring a beautiful sense of warmth, hospitality and care
2:21
in your studio. A space that you describe not
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just that, somewhere to take photos, but as a sanctuary where
2:30
women feel seen, supported and celebrated.
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As a single mum yourself, you understand how easy it is to put
2:39
yourself last and how transformative it can be to
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pause, be looked after and rediscover the woman behind all
2:48
the roles you carry. In this episode, we will be
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talking about self-image and self esteem after separation or
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divorce, why so many women struggle to recognize themselves
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during this time, and how being see through a compassionate lens
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can be helpful to rebuild confidence from the inside.
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So Joanna, thank you so much for being here.
3:15
I'm really looking forward to this conversation.
3:19
Can you start by telling us a little bit about yourself and
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your journey? I'm so excited for this
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conversation as well. It's so nice that you asked me
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to pop to your podcast. It's quite interesting because
3:33
you said all those things about women losing themselves and then
3:37
trying to rebuild themselves after divorce, and that's
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exactly what happened to me. So in 2018 I became a single mom
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with literally nothing. I didn't work because I was stay
3:53
at home mom. So my qualification, everything,
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what I gained in Poland and in UK meant nothing.
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When I went to Job Centre, basically they said that I had
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two big breaks, so to apply for jobs which I wanted to, it was
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pointless. That lowered myself esteem.
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All my hard work meant nothing. It was extremely hard.
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However, I was very, very lucky. A lady in Job Centre had a
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proper conversation with me and asked about my interests and
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what what I would like to do. And I've mentioned to her that
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through my sadly toxic relationship I was trying to
4:42
hold on to something. And since kids being little, I
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started to take a lot of pictures and started online
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Academy learn how to take better photos basically.
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And she was so kind and said why don't you try we will support
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you and that's what I've done. So I sort of don't like a hobby
5:07
part of the photography. Then it led to a business and
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because I also been doing a lot of make up throughout my life at
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university, all the girls when they've been getting ready for
5:25
the party, they've been coming to me.
5:27
So I thought why don't mix that? And because I was so down in
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myself, I felt ugly. I felt not wanted.
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I felt that something is wrong with me.
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When my ex-husband left, I wanted to rebuild myself and my
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shield was makeup. I always made sure that I look
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presentable. It was sort of like a mask, but
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it was also comfort for me and I thought why not share it Because
6:00
of my story. I'd attracted women who've
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struggled with self esteem, who've struggled with the break
6:09
or with illness. So the business starts picking
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up from actually being built on divorce, of on loss and very low
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self esteem. It was a long and hard journey.
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I remember my first networking meetings coming from a house
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where you only talk baby talk. You don't talk to adults.
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Even if you're meeting all the mums to talk about diapers,
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throwing up temperature. There is nothing about building
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business. There is nothing about gaining
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confidence. Literally your world are your
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children. For me, going from singing the
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nursery rhymes to a networking meeting where I have to sell
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myself. Basically it was like a mountain
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which I thought I will never climb.
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My first networking meeting was me standing in a corner and if
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the lady who organized it wouldn't come to me, I think I
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would stay in that corner. So yes, I had to rebuild myself
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from scratch. I needed to find my myself.
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And I've done it not only for myself, I've done it for my
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children because I knew they they need mum who hold things
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together. They need somebody to make sure
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that they are heard, seen, understood, but also safe.
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It's so important and I think a lot of women listening to us
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will understand wouldn't have been through what you've been
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through or are still at that stage.
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You've touched upon your journey.
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How does your personal experience and professional
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experience shape the way you work with women today?
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Because I went through that moment where I didn't believe
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I'm worthy. I think I am more, I can
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understand more and I have more patience.
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You, we are funny as human beings, we usually have more
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patience to other people than to ourselves.
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So I think because I needed to learn to be patient with me.
8:34
The journey to get confident, the journey to come from the
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person who didn't believe it's worthy to a person who is
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building a business. You know, it's not easy.
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People are looking at your social media or looking at your
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appearance and thinking, oh, it's easy for her, but it's
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actually not. It's consistency.
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Step back, step forward. The most important thing is to
9:01
never give up. Even if you have step back, you
9:04
need to remember it's just the moment and you just need to go
9:10
through it. You've asked how my experience
9:14
help women, how I can help women.
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I think because I've went through it, women feel safer
9:22
with me and more understood because they know that I I did
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feel ugly. I did not accept my body, but
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I've done something to gain it back.
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And there is a lot of different steps I took.
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I really, truly didn't believe that I'm good enough.
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So one of the things I've done around my house, and I've done
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it with my daughter because the divorce really hit her.
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She blamed herself on every single mirror.
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And we have quite a few. We've bought.
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I am enough every day. When you went to the bathroom,
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it was in your face. And I actually have a tattoo
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because I was so desperate to believe it.
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Every woman who went through a divorce, who went through a
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relationship as well, where she was meant to believe that she's
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worthless, will understand what I'm trying to say.
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It's not easy. And like I've mentioned at the
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beginning of this sentence, it's a very it it might sound really
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funny for somebody. Oh, you needed a tattoo to
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believe. But actually I did.
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I, I did wanted to grab to something to believe.
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I can do it. I can do it for myself.
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I can do it for my children. And I think this is also very
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important to mention. You think your children are
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fine, they are resilience, but they watch you.
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So if you're not fine, they're not fine.
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People do what you do, not what you say.
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For me, you need to hold yourself, put that makeup, put
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that smile, Everything will be fine for my children.
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You know that's all concept in the aeroplane when they are
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saying for mums put the mask on yourself first, then on your
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kids. Why?
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Because if you cannot breathe, your child will not have the
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person to look after them. So this is exactly the same.
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I always say to my customers, look after you, your kids copy
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what you do. So it's important to start
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looking after ourselves. Then things will click into
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place. Thank you, It's really the start
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of everything, isn't it? Something you talk a lot about
12:05
is creating a safe, cosy space. Can you tell us why safety is
12:12
such an important starting point for your clients when they come
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to your studio? If you've been in a relationship
12:18
where everything was on the edge, you suddenly feel like you
12:27
need to protect yourself all the time.
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So going to a new place might feel unsafe, might feel
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dangerous. Although there is nothing wrong
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with the place, it's just automatic.
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As a human beings, we protect ourselves.
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We are still animals. So if somebody will, you know,
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raise a voice for example, automatically, we are like
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tense, like a dog stud, you know.
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So I think making sure that the place feel soft, warm, cosy,
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that's very important in the Polish culture.
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We are quite hospital. So making sure that they have a
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cup of tea and nice conversation before we start anything.
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I think it's very important. I do remember I had a beautiful
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mum to be. She came for maternity photo
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shoot. Lady went through hell.
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I will not go through the details because it's
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confidential. And she came in and she stood in
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a corner head down and didn't really talk.
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So if I would just say to her undress you need to stand like
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this, she will not experience anything.
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She would be thinking like, oh, you know, I, I don't know how to
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pose, I don't know how to feel. However we've done it completely
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different. I had a team of gorgeous girl
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back then and they've done her makeup, they've done her hair.
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And from a lady who literally stood in a corner who tried on
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few dresses, I encouraged her to show her belly without any extra
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materials. So basically we wrapped her
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breasts and cover her underwear with fabric and she was fine.
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I want women to feel beautiful. I want them to feel hurt.
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I want them to feel seen. And the most important, accept
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them for who they are and how they are right now today.
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Not yesterday, not in the future.
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If you start loving yourself now, everything will fall into
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place. You will gain confidence, you
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will feel better in yourself because life is unpredictable.
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Very often you will find women who are common and saying I'm
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too fat, I'm too slim, I have too many wrinkles.
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There is always, always something which they will find
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that it's wrong with them. However, tomorrow you might be
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dead. So enjoy yourself today.
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Tomorrow you might get an illness who will make you feel
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even worse. So why not loving yourself now?
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And there is another thing which I, I struggle, but I've, I can
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do it now with a smile and it's standing in front of my room
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every morning looking into yourself's eyes and say I love
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you. So after divorce, each time I
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stood and literally burst into tears.
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I could not say it to my son. I could say it to my children,
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my family, but not to my son. I felt down, unworthy, not
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enough. I could not say it.
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But again, consistency, trying, practising and showing your body
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as well that you're worthy. Like this story about the lady.
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We looked after her, we showed her she's worthy.
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We've showed her she's beautiful.
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We've done WAVY hair, a bit of makeup and she after finishing
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the photo shoot, rang her partner and said, you taking now
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for a dinner. That says it all for me.
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I've done my job properly. It's a really powerful story.
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Thank you. Do you see common patterns like
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guilt, shame, exhaustion, loss of confidence when people come
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and see you, when they decide, oh, I'm going to treat myself to
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a photo shoot or to a make up session, Is it something that
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their partner will offer them as a gift or is it something that
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women have the power to say even if they're tired and all that,
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oh, I'll do that. There is a pattern.
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Women who come to me are not women who have a high self
17:16
belief, who extremely confident, who are outgoing.
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Women who come to me are ready to do the next step of building
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that self belief. They want to feel beautiful,
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they want to accept their body, They want to challenge
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themselves and come out from a comfort zone because they want
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to believe they are good enough. Women who are outgoing, taking
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lots of selfies and know exactly which profile they like.
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Very often when they come to my studio, they come out unhappy.
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Wow, that's interesting. Yeah.
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And why is that? Because they've built the image
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in the head exactly how they want to look and be seen, and
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that's it. And what I do, I am showing a
18:20
woman how I see her, so her beauty inside out.
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And you can see it on my in my photos.
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Those are not models. Those are real women who went
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through something or a milestone or they just want to celebrate
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themselves. I have a lot of ladies who went
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through something and decided, you know what, I'm worthy and
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will celebrate myself with a photo.
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It's really interesting, just saying, especially in a time
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where social media is about appearance and being in control
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of the image you give to people. Everyone can take a picture
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right now, but for me it's not about a picture, it for me
19:09
coming to my studio. It's about experience, where you
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start liking and accepting yourself.
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I always laugh because I compliment a lot during photo
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shoots and sometimes women cry because they never heard so many
19:27
positive things about them. They're.
19:29
Not used to it so it's overwhelming.
19:31
No. And it's very important to
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remember if somebody is giving you a compliment, it's like
19:36
giving you a gift. You don't give back the gift.
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If somebody will say, oh, you have a beautiful lipstick and
19:42
you would say, oh, I have it 10 years now, you just say thank
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you because it's a gift. That's that's something I've
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learned recently. I'm not very good with taking
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compliments and now I make myself say thank you.
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It's the first step, isn't it? It's so important.
20:01
Programmed for years and years that our role is to nurture the
20:08
house but not ourselves. No, to everybody else, but not
20:13
ourselves. It's hard to come out from this
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program, isn't it? That takes me to my next
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question. Many women tell themselves I'll
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take care of myself when things settle down, when I have time,
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when I've looked after everybody.
20:30
Why do you think self-care is the first thing that goes?
20:33
Because we don't think we are worthy.
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No matter how much time you have, you will fill it not to do
20:39
it. So I help women also to build
20:43
beauty routine. Because very often I found that
20:46
ladies, that's why my hat. Tropic hat.
20:52
Can you just tell us what Tropic is for those who don't know?
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OK. So Tropic Tropic is a company
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who make natural cruelty free vegan beauty products and I'm
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very lucky to be a Tropic skin care ambassador.
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And it's really ties into what I do with my photography because
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when you have a beautiful skin, you feel beautiful.
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So you know, when people are tired they don't feel very
21:24
attractive. So start with simple beauty
21:28
routines, you will get your glow back.
21:31
And the next step is enhancing beauty with makeup because I
21:34
believe that makeup is not there to mask, it's to enhance.
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And then obviously the cherry on top is the photo.
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But going back to me helping with building the beauty
21:44
routine, I always say put things where you already do something.
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So for example, if you don't have a beauty routine and you
21:54
want to start, put a face cream next to a toothbrush.
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And that is a reminder. After brushing my teeth, I will
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put a face cream on. Or after washing my face, I will
22:05
put the face cream. It's a little step day by day.
22:09
It might be slow, but some people are like, OK, I will do
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this, this, this, this very quickly.
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But if you are not used to, it's hard to build a new habit.
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But there are ways to make it easier.
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Once it gets into a routine, you don't have to think about it.
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Like brushing teeth. It's all about helping women
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rebuild their self esteem. I don't have like having my
22:33
photo taken when I see a photographer.
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It needs to be someone that makes me feel comfortable.
22:40
How do you make those women feel comfortable when they come to
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see you for a photo shoot? Because that's a tough one,
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isn't it? This is a tough one and everyone
22:51
is different. Some people are extremely
22:53
nervous as well, but I think because I combine the makeup,
22:58
the hair, it's easier because while you're doing the makeup,
23:02
while you're doing the hair, the conversation starts.
23:07
Then you are finding out. We do free consultation over
23:10
over the phone, but those 3 consultations are usually about
23:14
what sort of photos people want, what they want to wear, what
23:20
sort of make up, things like that.
23:21
But when they come to the studio, the conversations start
23:25
about who they are, what they do, why did they decided to do
23:31
things. And that helps me to understand
23:34
the person and what they need. Because I've went through what
23:40
I've went, it's easier for me to catch things which make them
23:45
feel more at ease. We also talk about how they like
23:51
to look, how they like to be seen.
23:55
Because although everyone say, oh, I don't know, I don't know
24:01
what I want, deep inside all the answers are in US.
24:06
We just never allow them to come out because I need to do a
24:10
laundry for my child. Oh, I need to do the washing.
24:14
We never allow ourselves to think about ourselves because
24:17
we've been taught it strong. But it's not.
24:20
We need to think about ourselves.
24:22
We need to give ourselves some time.
24:25
We need to give ourselves some love to be able to receive the
24:30
love we actually deserves. So I think during those
24:35
conversations I can understand the person more, guide them in a
24:42
way they feel safe, heard and understood and it's something
24:47
feel uncomfortable. I can help with it.
24:50
Something which many people struggle as well when they come
24:55
to the studio is I don't know how to pose.
25:00
Let me tell you how I work. It's nothing about proper
25:04
posing. If you will put a person who
25:07
watch all the tik toks and youtubes or whatever they
25:12
watching with the poses. If you will put the person who
25:16
never posed, who don't accept their body in a pose, it will
25:21
look extremely not natural. They will actually look
25:29
uncomfortable and you can see it on the photo.
25:31
So I always try to help with that with saying touch your
25:38
body. I know it might sound silly, but
25:42
did you ever touch your face like you would tickle a loved
25:47
one? But did you do it to yourself?
25:49
So it's like gentle strokes and then suddenly those gentle
25:54
strokes look like a pose, but it's not a pose, but it's about
25:59
how you touch your body, which part you like.
26:03
So, you know, even stroke in the hand, it's, it's suddenly a
26:08
pose, but it's not a pose, but it looks so much more natural
26:12
that situation. Obviously, that if somebody feel
26:15
very conscious about certain parts of the body, we can make
26:20
sure that part of the body looks good, not enhance.
26:26
But it's more about starting to feel your body, starting to
26:32
understand that you have only one body.
26:36
You need to look after it for the rest of your life.
26:39
So loving it, showing it love, it's quite important.
26:46
We've talked about how you help those women feel more confident
26:50
being able to have their photo taken and feel good about it at
26:55
the routines that you can help them with.
26:59
Can you talk about how photography can be so
27:03
empowering, especially, you know, for somebody who's been
27:07
through a divorce? I know you've touched about
27:09
about, but often women feel invisible, like you say, not
27:15
enough. So how do you help them just
27:18
with photos being? Maybe just being able to have
27:23
their photo taken is enough, but how does it work?
27:28
I think when they see the actual photo, after all the experience,
27:34
when they see the photos, usually like 97% the words
27:42
coming out from the mouth is, is that really me?
27:46
I think because we are programmed that I'm just a
27:50
housewife or I'm just a mother. Suddenly you're going somewhere,
27:56
trying something which you usually don't have even in the
28:00
house. Because a lot of ladies who come
28:02
to me maybe have one dress in the wardrobe or maybe not.
28:08
Suddenly I will be saying just try, just try and see if you
28:13
will not feel comfortable. We will change it.
28:17
And suddenly they are becoming somebody who may be deep inside.
28:21
They always want to because you tell me which woman doesn't want
28:26
the beautiful? I don't know one.
28:29
Everyone wants to feel wanted, desired, feminine, sexy, but
28:35
because of life we don't have many opportunities.
28:39
As a mum wife, you always do lots of different things.
28:43
It's not just oh, I'm just a mum because you are a taxi, a
28:47
doctor, a chef, a cleaner. Many women wear comfortable
28:54
everyday clothes because that's comfortable to go somewhere and
29:00
try something else, feel glamorous, feel like a goddess.
29:05
It's just completely different experience.
29:10
And I think that's why they suddenly feel like, wow, I can't
29:14
do it. I can be beautiful and it's
29:17
empowering. And if, if they will print the
29:21
photo and put it on the wall, that's a reminder every day.
29:26
I am capable. I am good enough.
29:29
I am stunning. One other problem for women is
29:36
that they might feel guilty of taking the time off to do a
29:40
photo shoot and take care of themselves, and they feel guilty
29:45
about spending the money. What can you tell them about
29:48
that? I've been there.
29:51
After divorce I was jobless, money less.
29:56
I needed to start from scratch, start small.
30:00
It doesn't need to be a photo shoot straight away, but it can
30:03
be a lipstick, it can be the face cream and how to deal with
30:09
guilt. Remember your kids watching.
30:13
There is something very important which I didn't say and
30:17
I think it will help many women. I've went through a seminar and
30:23
one of the things we needed to do is imagine what will happen
30:29
if you will not change. So if a person is struggling
30:35
with guilt, with spending money on themselves, imagine it's not
30:40
you. Imagine it's your daughter.
30:43
We always think for others, You know, I don't want my daughter
30:47
to end up like that. I don't want to feel her, to
30:50
feel unworthy. Imagine it's your daughter.
30:52
Unconsciously, we don't know it's happening.
30:55
Your child is programmed to be like you, so everything, what is
30:59
happening, it's in her mind and eventually maybe if she's a
31:03
baby, a child or a teenager, she doesn't think about it.
31:07
But when you're an adult, it hits you and it hits your heart.
31:11
So it's important to be the leader to show them I'm worthy.
31:16
It doesn't need to be dramatic. You can start with a face cream,
31:21
the cleanse and lipstick and gradually build it.
31:26
Instead of going for coffee every week, go every two weeks
31:29
and put that £5 in a jar and at the end of the month buy
31:34
yourself something. It's important to allocate that.
31:39
For yourself. Yeah, because we, you know, if
31:43
your child will come to you and say, Mum, I need new shoes, you
31:48
will. Even if you don't have money,
31:51
you will make it happen. But we don't do that to
31:55
ourselves. And I think very often women are
31:59
programmed that there is not enough money for me.
32:04
But there is. And that's another thing which I
32:07
am aiming to do this year to help women to understand that
32:11
you can afford stuff. And in this part, the Tropic
32:17
thing came very handy because I, thanks to Tropic, I can help
32:22
women save money to get extra income, to be able to afford
32:27
the, the beauty products, the makeup, the photo shoot.
32:31
You know, there is loads of possibilities.
32:34
But sometimes because we are stuck in a grief, stuck in the
32:38
guilt, stuck in the mindset that everyone else is more important,
32:43
we cannot see the other solution.
32:45
So if somebody from outside come and say, but actually you could
32:48
do this or save on that, it's very helpful.
32:54
So Joanna, can you tell us for women who are listening, how do
32:59
they contact you? How does it actually work?
33:03
Just to explain what they can do with you.
33:05
It depends what you want to do, but the contact is the same.
33:09
You can call me on my telephone number.
33:11
I'll. Put everything in the podcast
33:14
notes. You can find me on Google as
33:18
Joanna's touch. You can find me on Instagram,
33:23
Facebook, even TikTok. I've been trying that recently.
33:28
And when it comes to how can I help?
33:32
So there is few different options.
33:35
There is the beauty part where I can help you build beauty
33:40
routine with Tropic, I can help you with the makeup.
33:46
So Ioffer makeup for special occasion, Ioffer makeup lessons
33:52
1 to 1 and a groups. And I also offer parties.
33:57
So if somebody's doing a Hindu or just want to get together a
34:01
few girls, I do like a group makeup class.
34:06
And then obviously it's the photography I do, the makeup,
34:11
the hair and a bit of styling. You can bring your own clothes,
34:17
but you are very welcome also to use my studio wardrobe.
34:22
And that's the makeover photo shoot.
34:24
I do also offer family photo shoots and branding and
34:28
portraits and head. However, we are talking about
34:33
Empower to mention about the makeover.
34:38
But it's important because women who are going through a divorce,
34:41
etcetera, may need also professional photos.
34:46
So if you do both, it's it's it's it's good to know.
34:49
Yeah. Yeah, yes, many women reborn
34:53
after the divorce and starting the new businesses.
34:56
So yes, definitely. One last question.
35:01
The listeners would leave with one message about self worth
35:05
after divorce or separation. What would it be?
35:09
One message, Oh, my goodness gracious.
35:11
That's a message. Be kind to yourself.
35:19
I think so because we, we can be so kind to everybody else.
35:23
You know, during the divorce or after what you always think
35:28
first, you always think my children, I need to make sure
35:34
that they are OK. I need to make sure that they
35:38
don't feel unloved because they have two houses or sometimes 1.
35:45
And I think we need to start thinking about us as well
35:51
because if something will happen to us, what will happen to our
35:55
child? If you went in a toxic
35:57
relationship and the other half is not very kind, they will go
36:02
to him. Do you want that to happen?
36:04
Start being kind to yourself and look after yourself like in that
36:10
aeroplane, which we've said put a put a air mask on yourself
36:15
and, and everything will come into place.
36:18
Kids, our mirrors. From my own experience, I can
36:22
see things I didn't realise happening, especially now seven
36:27
years after splitting, but my boy still comes out with certain
36:33
things which I didn't even think of.
36:36
So they are observing you think that they don't, but they do.
36:42
So it's important to change your mindset that you are a leader.
36:47
If you don't want to think, oh I love myself, I need to start
36:50
change your mindset. I'm a leader.
36:52
I need to lead my children to a better life.
36:57
How can women remind themselves that this chapter, however
37:01
painful, is not the end of their story?
37:05
Oh, there is a lot of things which they can do because there
37:12
is a lot of things out there to read, to watch if you will.
37:21
Again, be kind to yourself and give that moment to yourself to
37:24
just sit and think. You might find books about women
37:29
coming out from the darkness. You can also start writing
37:34
yourself. I journal every day.
37:36
That helped me a lot. What also helped me is gratitude
37:45
helped me massively. So maybe do something like that.
37:49
Write 5 things you are grateful for, especially when you are
37:52
feeling like everything is falling apart, you know bills
37:56
are piling, kids are screaming, you feel like you hitting the
38:02
rock bottom. Start doing a gratitude because
38:06
that really shifts the perspective and sometimes we
38:10
think behind. I don't have anything to be
38:12
grateful for. Actually you do.
38:14
You can be grateful that you are still here.
38:16
You have electricity can take kids to school, so there is
38:21
always something to look for another reminder.
38:25
Maybe try what I've done put on every mirror.
38:29
I am enough. Start telling yourselves you
38:33
love yourself. This moment will pass.
38:36
If you don't believe, think about rain.
38:40
It stops and the sun comes out. It's.
38:42
Future fault, but you know, a powerful image.
38:49
Thank you. Thank you so much for this
38:53
conversation, Joanna. Enlightening.
38:58
What really comes through. It's when you talk about
39:00
rebuilding yourself, it's not about fixing.
39:04
It's about reconnecting with yourself, remembering who you
39:09
are and that you're enough. Yeah.
39:11
And that's really, really important.
39:14
Everything you said really resonate whether you're going
39:17
through a break up, separation or not.
39:19
I mean, every women go through those phases, even if they're in
39:23
a in a happy relationship. We tend to lose ourselves anyway
39:28
looking after children. It's something every women
39:31
resonates with. Maybe what we can take from this
39:34
episode, this being kinder to oneself and remember that you
39:41
can grow back confidence with the advice you've given us today
39:46
by sharing with us what you've been through.
39:49
And we've got a lovely example of how you can get out of that
39:53
difficult time when when you think, oh, it's the end of my
39:56
life basically. Thank you for talking with us
40:00
with care and humanity. It's so important and we see
40:05
that in your work. So thank you so much for sharing
40:07
that journey with us. And for helping women on a daily
40:12
basis. Thank you for having me.
40:13
If I may add, confidence is like a muscle.
40:18
You need to exercise it. Confidence is not something
40:22
you're born with. You know, there is a very
40:26
powerful sentence which I've heard recently from Suzima, who
40:29
is the founder of Tropic Skin Care.
40:31
Courage before confidence because you need courage to step
40:37
out from your comfort zone and start building that confidence.
40:41
It's small steps, but it's doable.
40:44
It's definitely doable. I'm the life example of it if I
40:50
stood in a corner and now I'm in a podcast.
40:55
Exactly. Women listening need to keep
40:59
that that image. When they're doubting
41:02
themselves, they can do it. It's just courage, you know, and
41:07
it can be a little thing like if you stuck in the house and
41:11
drowning yourself in worries, maybe send a text to a friend
41:15
and say let's meet with coffee and get out from the house.
41:19
Very often I repeat it to myself, if you are in your head,
41:22
you are dead. Because we can't talk ourselves
41:25
of out of things, we can talk ourselves into feeling very bad
41:30
about ourselves. It's very important.
41:34
To practice that positive mindset, gratitude, and little
41:39
steps every day. Thank you, Joanna.
41:43
Thank you so much for having me, it was such a joy.