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The World's Weirdest Sports, Part Two: Literal Murderball · Ridiculous History

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Ridiculous Histories, a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to the show,
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so much for tuning in.
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: Let's hear, let's hear some some boo and some kashi.
• 0:37
  Speaker 2: I was gonna say, bosh, you know, I remember ally
• 0:40
  Speaker 2: g he'd say.
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: I'd love to introduce our super producer, mister Max Williams.
• 0:48
  Speaker 3: Fresh off on Magnificent Recovery. I am just between these episodes,
• 0:52
  Speaker 3: gotten from sick to completely healthy.
• 0:54
  Speaker 2: He bounced back like some sort of whiffle ball or
• 0:57
  Speaker 2: a tether ball, perhaps still having the audition.
• 1:01
  Speaker 1: Wish you the best, Max. Please Ridiculous Historians, allow me
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: to reintroduce myself. My name is Ben. He joined by
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: as always the number one, the myth, the man, the legend,
• 1:15
  Speaker 1: mister Noel.
• 1:16
  Speaker 4: Brown aka nove. Yeah.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: We are coming to you live and direct as we record.
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: It is Tuesday, November fifth, here in the just another
• 1:33
  Speaker 1: day here in the United States of America, a bold,
• 1:39
  Speaker 1: if imperfect experiment. We as you're hearing this, a couple
• 1:45
  Speaker 1: of other things may have changed. We we don't know
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: how everything's gonna work out, and we are not, you know,
• 1:53
  Speaker 1: a polemical show. No We are, however, very interested in
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: ridiculous things. And I gotta say, I don't know how
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: this will age you guys, but uh, politics is.
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  Speaker 2: Kind of a sport, oh boy, is it? Ever it's
• 2:11
  Speaker 2: a love sports. Yeah, you know, it's funny. I actually
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: saw I can't remember who posted this. It was a tweeter.
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: Maybe it was even a tweet referencing something that somebody said,
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: but no, anywal it was. It was my buddy, Jason Pargin.
• 2:22
  Speaker 2: I don't actually know, but I really love his content
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: a lot. Yeah, writer John dies in the end, Yeah, exactly.
• 2:28
  Speaker 2: Regular guests on Daily Zeitgeist, as are yourself, as is yourself? Then,
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: but he said something to the effect of, like politics
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: has gotten this point where it's not even about actually
• 2:38
  Speaker 2: being informed. It's just another kind of reality show ask
• 2:41
  Speaker 2: sort of like pissing contest in a way of being
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: the quote unquote winner. And you know, I've certainly been
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: looking in the last few days for intensely non political
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: things to listen to. So we would like to be
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: that thing for you today, for sure. But I'm with
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: you one hundred percent.
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  Speaker 4: Then.
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  Speaker 5: Yeah.
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: The reason we're making that sports comparison in the first
• 3:02
  Speaker 1: place is because this, this episode, folks, started as a
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: an artifact of curiosity, right, and we thought it would
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: be a one part, one and done, you know, to
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: quote our friend Dan Harmon from Rick and Morty, we
• 3:22
  Speaker 1: thought it would be like a classic in and out,
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: you know, not affecting the mythos. But we got in
• 3:29
  Speaker 1: a bit over our heads when we started looking at
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: the world's weirdest sports. We struck a chord with one
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: another and hopefully with you. We spent the entire first
• 3:44
  Speaker 1: episode just talking about buzkashi, which, by the way, I'm
• 3:49
  Speaker 1: still super bullish on those.
• 3:54
  Speaker 4: So are you the goat? Are you goated?
• 3:56
  Speaker 2: If you are the best at snatching the goat?
• 4:06
  Speaker 1: I learned so much more to just going into this
• 4:10
  Speaker 1: like I. So we cut a lot of the philosophical
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: and geopolitical implications of buzkashi, the national sport of Afghanistan.
• 4:23
  Speaker 1: We cut a lot of it because we thought we
• 4:26
  Speaker 1: were gonna have a one and done episode. And then
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: I think we reached the point together as a triumvirate
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: where we said hang on and hang on a tick,
• 4:39
  Speaker 1: I go on a tck. We did have some good
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: cartoonish British accents in there, too.
• 4:43
  Speaker 4: Oh, of course that's the best part of the show.
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: And just as by way of a quick reminder of
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: muskashi being the national sport of Afghanistan, we're in individuals
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: a top horseback by quite aggressively for a goat skin,
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: a goat sort of carcass type floppy thing in more
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: recent years has been replaced by maybe a more vegan alternative.
• 5:08
  Speaker 2: But yeah, there's a giant sort of fish bowl thing
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  Speaker 2: in the middle, I guess, more of like a dog bowl,
• 5:13
  Speaker 2: and that is the goal and people are often throwing
• 5:15
  Speaker 2: themselves into it along with the goat skin, and it's
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  Speaker 2: pretty wild.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, and you made the excellent comparison to polo. You
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: also you also noted something I was listening back to
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: and I loved this you you noted, Hey, in US
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  Speaker 1: football people throw around a pig skin.
• 5:37
  Speaker 4: Right.
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  Speaker 1: So one of the notes that we landed on in
• 5:43
  Speaker 1: our previous exploration concerned the idea of perspective, the importance
• 5:50
  Speaker 1: of having empathy, having the ability to realize that something
• 5:57
  Speaker 1: may seem odd or even disturbing to an outside observer.
• 6:03
  Speaker 1: It might seem weird, like cough cough going to a
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  Speaker 1: cricket game and not knowing what's going on.
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  Speaker 4: Cough cough.
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  Speaker 1: But but all right, all right, it's illegal for you
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: to ask me that. It is not illegal to ask
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: me that because I told you I'm a rule breaker. Yeah. Man. Also,
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  Speaker 1: I have no idea what's going off with cricket. I
• 6:28
  Speaker 1: watch it and I clap like the distant relative adder reunion.
• 6:33
  Speaker 1: There's a wicket and a bowler, a sticky wicket.
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  Speaker 2: Well, that's different, and that's sort of like a conundrum,
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: which is what many of us might find ourselves in today.
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  Speaker 2: But yeah, the wicket is the bat is the flat
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: bat also probably good for the people down The thing
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  Speaker 2: that get the bat is what you use to hit
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  Speaker 2: the wicket.
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  Speaker 4: Oh, the wicket is like the t ball stand.
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  Speaker 1: The wickets like the croquet goal.
• 6:57
  Speaker 4: Got it.
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  Speaker 2: For all these years thought that the wicket would the
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  Speaker 2: bat the beasts the beat, and the bowler is like
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  Speaker 2: the pitcher.
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  Speaker 4: Right, okay, okay, one thing.
• 7:08
  Speaker 1: You nailed it, guys. Also, cricket is tremendously popular and
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: may seem confusing to people unfamiliar. Also, to be honest,
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: baseball is probably confusing to people who are not from
• 7:25
  Speaker 1: the West or Japan.
• 7:27
  Speaker 4: I agree.
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  Speaker 2: I will say, though, as a non sporto, I do.
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: Maybe it's just because it was the sport that my
• 7:33
  Speaker 2: mom really enjoyed. I have always found it to be
• 7:35
  Speaker 2: a little more understandable than football as many times, and
• 7:39
  Speaker 2: I do understand football, but it just isn't as intuitive
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: to me. Baseball, I think is probably partly why it's
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: so popular. Is a little bit more simple, you know.
• 7:47
  Speaker 2: I mean, once again, the stats, that's different, but the
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  Speaker 2: actual rules not too hard to wrap your head around.
• 7:51
  Speaker 3: You hit the ball, you run the basis, you try
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  Speaker 3: to get all around the bases. Football there's a lot
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  Speaker 3: of minutia, minutia, intricacies, pedantics, trench warfare.
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  Speaker 4: You've got to be a real head to get into
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  Speaker 4: the weeds.
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  Speaker 3: Do you get into the trenches with the newest of
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  Speaker 3: like the big sports in America, Like, it's a pretty
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  Speaker 3: recent invention, late eighteen hundreds, so it's.
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  Speaker 1: Been great for commercials. And yeah, you really have to
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  Speaker 1: get your head in the game and hote traumatic brain injuries,
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: get a concussion.
• 8:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
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  Speaker 1: And so we will not say we are judging weird sports,
• 8:28
  Speaker 1: will say instead that we acknowledge things can look different
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: from the outside and some of these endeavors that people
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: participate in may seem odd because you have not played
• 8:43
  Speaker 1: the game right, just just like any other recreational endeavor.
• 8:50
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and also anytime we kind of dig through the
• 8:53
  Speaker 2: annals of history and look at you know, cultural differences
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  Speaker 2: and things that may not have aged well over time,
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  Speaker 2: and maybe you're no longer you know, practiced, it's important
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  Speaker 2: not to judge, you know, something too harshly for the
• 9:07
  Speaker 2: era that it was taking place in, and also for
• 9:09
  Speaker 2: you know, the part of the world, the way that
• 9:11
  Speaker 2: it was separated from maybe other cultures, and the way
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  Speaker 2: things kind of develop in a vacuum sometimes, especially in
• 9:16
  Speaker 2: the in the distant past.
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  Speaker 1: Heck, yeah, brother, let's go to meso America. Back in
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: the day, we proudly present to you a different sort
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  Speaker 1: of ballgame loosely called the ball game.
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  Speaker 2: I know it well, I mean we talked to I
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  Speaker 2: can't remember it was it stuff that I want you
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  Speaker 2: to know. It must have been recently where we were
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  Speaker 2: talking about just how intuitive it is for a human
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  Speaker 2: to see a stick on the ground and a round
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  Speaker 2: object and just be like, how can I make this
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  Speaker 2: into a competition, Because when we look at it now
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  Speaker 2: and see sports as this Titanic industry, generating gazillions of dollars.
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  Speaker 2: It's easy to lose sight of the fact that most
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  Speaker 2: of it is based on very simple kind of parallel
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  Speaker 2: thinking act of human beings, where it's like, I see
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  Speaker 2: that thing, and I see that thing. Let's put them
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  Speaker 2: together and figure out a way that we can play.
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  Speaker 1: Shout out by the way to everyone who is listening
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  Speaker 1: to this. On a walk and just saw a good stick.
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  Speaker 1: That's a stick right there, man, that's a good stick
• 10:16
  Speaker 1: right there. You've got to pick it up, all right,
• 10:18
  Speaker 1: do the Gandalf thing? Oh man. This game, loosely called
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  Speaker 1: the ballgame, was played by every Mesoamerican civilization as far
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  Speaker 1: as we can tell. It was invented sometime in like
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  Speaker 1: twenty five hundred to one hundred BCE, So this game
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  Speaker 1: predates the story of Jesus Christ.
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  Speaker 4: It's crazy.
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  Speaker 2: I also, I think it's one of those things where, again,
• 10:44
  Speaker 2: because of the parallel thinking, those numbers may vary. There's
• 10:47
  Speaker 2: a really great article on Alice Obscura that dates it
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  Speaker 2: back to the Olmec around fifteen hundred BC in the
• 10:55
  Speaker 2: central Gulf coast of.
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: Mexico, right, yeah, And the so it's tricky to understand
• 11:02
  Speaker 1: how BC works. The lower number on BC is closer
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: to the modern day, so twenty five hundred to the
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  Speaker 1: Olmec period to one our BCE still very very old.
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  Speaker 1: This was so popular. This was like the on the
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: level of soccer today or football for the rest of
• 11:25
  Speaker 1: the world. We don't know a ton about it, but
• 11:29
  Speaker 1: we do know people were super into it and it
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  Speaker 1: was super disturbing. The rules of the game are still
• 11:38
  Speaker 1: something scholars will argue about, but it was probably kind
• 11:44
  Speaker 1: of like racquetball, like you had to keep the ball
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: in play. We do know, to your point, Noal, that
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: these courts where this game was played, whatever it was called,
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: they became similar to stadiums that you would see in
• 12:04
  Speaker 1: major US cities today. They were a feature of the
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: urban landscape. And if we look at how people tried
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: to play the game, then we have to look at
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: the descendant of the game, something called ulama. We do
• 12:23
  Speaker 1: know these players would strike the ball with their hips,
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: they may have used four arms. Occasionally, they might have bats,
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: and they were always trying to get the ball, whatever
• 12:39
  Speaker 1: it was, through a stone circle placed on either side
• 12:44
  Speaker 1: of the court. Pretty difficult, but I think it'll remind
• 12:49
  Speaker 1: a lot of us of basketball if you died when
• 12:52
  Speaker 1: you lost, or.
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: Quidditch, if you're Harry Potter, I believe they weren't they
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: tossing those things through like a square, circlegular kind of
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: goal target.
• 13:02
  Speaker 1: What's what's the thing you have to get in quidditch?
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  Speaker 2: The snitch, the golden snitch it yeah, it is, Yeah,
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  Speaker 2: that's the the sneach. I think it's the snitch. It's
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: like a weird little bug thing that they release and
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  Speaker 2: that's part of the game. But then you also have
• 13:15
  Speaker 2: like a ball, it's more like a rugby ball that
• 13:17
  Speaker 2: they did, you know, on the broom top to these
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: circular goals.
• 13:22
  Speaker 1: In the ballgame throughout ancient meso America or early meso America. Uh,
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  Speaker 1: the ball was solid rubber and could weigh as much
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: as nine pounds. Yeah, so people are beefy four arms
• 13:38
  Speaker 1: for them, yeah, or broken four arms people are people
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: are fighting. The The only real thing, the only real
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: consistent rule we know is that the two teams had
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: to fight each other to get the ball through one
• 13:55
  Speaker 1: of the rings on the court. And if someone got
• 13:59
  Speaker 1: an a goal broken, if someone you know, knocked their
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: forearm or got hit in the head, didn't matter.
• 14:10
  Speaker 4: I mean, you might argue that was a feature, not
• 14:12
  Speaker 4: a bug, you know.
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: I mean, this really is tantamount to the kind of
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: blood sport we see with gladiator battles. Not to mention
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: the religious implications of this band. You found some really
• 14:25
  Speaker 2: cool stuff about how this was part of lore, like
• 14:29
  Speaker 2: the idea of this sport being played between members of
• 14:34
  Speaker 2: you know, the human race and like lords of the underworld.
• 14:38
  Speaker 1: Ah, yes, this is true. In Mesoamerican mythology, the ballgame
• 14:44
  Speaker 1: functioned as an important socio religious ritual. Like you were saying, Noel,
• 14:54
  Speaker 1: it's the story of the hero twins Hondapuh and vocal
• 15:00
  Speaker 1: on the pull. The part of my pronunciation, guy is
• 15:03
  Speaker 1: my key chase pretty loose these days. This is a
• 15:08
  Speaker 1: pair of awesome dudes who super pissed off Shibbalba, which
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: is the underworld and the god thereof.
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: This is in Mayan culture, to my understanding, and it
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: comes for you can read a lot of this if
• 15:23
  Speaker 2: you want to go a little deeper. I think you
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: can find this sort of creation myth in a tome
• 15:29
  Speaker 2: called the popol Vu, which is also a really interesting
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: kind of gothy post punk band. I always really liked
• 15:35
  Speaker 2: this name and did not know where it came from.
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: And it is a band called popole Vu.
• 15:40
  Speaker 1: Way No Way. I got to tell you man. You know,
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: I had a life before the podcasting stuff, and I
• 15:47
  Speaker 1: lived in Central America for a time, and the culture,
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: the ancient culture there still persist. I have never watched
• 15:59
  Speaker 1: the game in person. But as as you note, there
• 16:04
  Speaker 1: is religious significance to this. Uh, there is social significance
• 16:09
  Speaker 1: to this if you if you follow the mythology. These
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: two brothers, Haun and the club who were you know
• 16:18
  Speaker 1: again heroes. Uh, they were tricked into descending toward the
• 16:24
  Speaker 1: underworld and then they had to play this game. And
• 16:28
  Speaker 1: because one of the hero twins lost the game, he
• 16:33
  Speaker 1: had his head cut off.
• 16:35
  Speaker 4: The ultimate penalty.
• 16:36
  Speaker 1: Oh.
• 16:36
  Speaker 4: It is to backtrack really quickly to a previous tangent.
• 16:39
  Speaker 4: Popol Vu.
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: The band is actually more of like an electronic German
• 16:42
  Speaker 2: kraft rock band, which is not a term of derision.
• 16:46
  Speaker 2: It is a genre and the folks in that part
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: of the world were it proudly bands like Craftwork and
• 16:52
  Speaker 2: NOI so do check out popol Vu. I actually am
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: going to make a note to myself. This is one
• 16:55
  Speaker 2: that I'm not super very well versed in.
• 16:57
  Speaker 1: Also, while we're at it, everybody look forward to our
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: future two part episode on women in electronic.
• 17:07
  Speaker 4: Thanks Ben, Yeah, I'm working on that one.
• 17:09
  Speaker 2: It's a very near and dear topic to me, so
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: we should have that one out in a week or two.
• 17:13
  Speaker 2: But sorry, Ben, decapitation. We're bearing the lead here, or
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: maybe we're not. I just derailed the lead. But this
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: was a common penalty for being the loser. And then
• 17:24
  Speaker 2: I got to follow up question, was this a team sport?
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: Were there entire teams that were executed as the results
• 17:31
  Speaker 2: of losing?
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: Yes, there were teams. They were not always consenting participants.
• 17:46
  Speaker 4: Ah, because like the Gladiator connection.
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: So imagine if you're playing racquetball with a team, right,
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: and you have to you have to try to get
• 17:58
  Speaker 1: this heavy rubber ball through this stone goal, and you
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: know that if you don't accomplish the win, you might
• 18:09
  Speaker 1: be sacrificed. In at least a few instances, the ballgame
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: was a proxy for war, like warring kingdoms would say, hey,
• 18:23
  Speaker 1: let's settle this on the court.
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: That could be in issues of succession, It could be
• 18:30
  Speaker 2: issues of territory, you know, disputes over territory and oftentimes
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: to your point about non consensual, you know, participation in
• 18:38
  Speaker 2: this game really serious connection to the gladiator thing, because
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: oftentimes slaves or captives, prisoners of war were forced to
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: fight for their lives in this competitive sport.
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: Yes, and shout out to everybody who just immediately thought
• 18:55
  Speaker 1: of Apocalypto. Do you remember that film? I think you know.
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: I never saw it because I think Mel Gibson's an asshole.
• 19:02
  Speaker 2: But I heard it's really good and that it actually
• 19:05
  Speaker 2: is pretty interesting, and I don't know is it problematic.
• 19:09
  Speaker 4: I don't remember hearing that aspect about it.
• 19:11
  Speaker 2: I know he's done some problematic things in terms of
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: his depictions of indigenous people.
• 19:15
  Speaker 4: But did you enjoy the film?
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: I did. There is no instance of the ballgame in it,
• 19:23
  Speaker 1: but there is an instance of like will we see
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: a depiction of trafficking, of human kidnapping and the gamification
• 19:35
  Speaker 1: of prisoners of war and refugees, So there is. I
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: don't think this will spoil it. There is a scene
• 19:43
  Speaker 1: wherein some prisoners are cut free and they're allowed to
• 19:49
  Speaker 1: run for their freedom while the guys who captured them
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: sort of gamble on whether or not they can shoot
• 19:59
  Speaker 1: them in the back. Oh yeah, brutal stuff. Yeah.
• 20:03
  Speaker 2: And moving to a little bit of a different culture,
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: we have the Aztecs as well, who carried on this
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: tradition very very very similarly. There are reports and there
• 20:13
  Speaker 2: is historical evidence that they would actually sometimes use the
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: decapitated heads of the losers of certain of these bouts
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: as stand ins for a ball instead ballgame.
• 20:28
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 20:28
  Speaker 1: Just imagine, right, the ballgame is at its height of popularity,
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: you get captured by some enemy force and they say, hey,
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: we're not going to kill you just yet, but if
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: you want to stay alive, you have to play this game,
• 20:46
  Speaker 1: and then they toss you a decapitated.
• 20:52
  Speaker 2: And the article that I referenced earlier by Monica Petriz
• 20:55
  Speaker 2: from Atlas Obscura does mention that the main historical evidence
• 20:59
  Speaker 2: we have this or in like etchings and imagery on
• 21:03
  Speaker 2: vases and different pieces of pottery like that. So you know,
• 21:07
  Speaker 2: it's kind of it leaves a bit up to the
• 21:09
  Speaker 2: imagination whether these were meant to be like metaphorical depictions
• 21:13
  Speaker 2: or whatever creative liberties were being taken, but it's not
• 21:16
  Speaker 2: out of the question that this actually did happen. And
• 21:18
  Speaker 2: Spanish conquerors or Spanish. I guess explorers have reported watching
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: this game being played and at the very least described
• 21:27
  Speaker 2: absolutely brutal injuries, including just just decimated bones that have
• 21:33
  Speaker 2: to be injuries that have to be lanced, and some
• 21:35
  Speaker 2: people that didn't even survive.
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean again, you're fighting for your life. I
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: don't know if we want to I don't know if
• 21:43
  Speaker 1: we want to queue up that that al Pacino's speech
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: from any given Sunday. Do you remember that one? Gosh,
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: what was the what's the big?
• 21:52
  Speaker 4: The big? The tagle?
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: It's like how you have to fight for every inch?
• 21:55
  Speaker 4: Okay, yeah, it's a good movie. I like that Oliver
• 21:58
  Speaker 4: Stone movie.
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: I'm not even really big sports movie fan, but was
• 22:01
  Speaker 2: a big Oliver Stone fan back in the day. He
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: sort of had some stinkers in there, but he's got
• 22:05
  Speaker 2: some good ones too.
• 22:06
  Speaker 1: Wait what stinkers did he f?
• 22:09
  Speaker 4: You know he had uh.
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: Oh Kona the Barbarian.
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: Well, I think he was a producer on that. I
• 22:22
  Speaker 2: don't think he directed that, he routed.
• 22:24
  Speaker 4: He did, He did have something to do with writing it.
• 22:26
  Speaker 2: He was more of like a kind of a schlocky,
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: you know, Hollywood scribe.
• 22:30
  Speaker 4: But you know, a lot of people really hate natural
• 22:32
  Speaker 4: born killers. I like it a lot.
• 22:33
  Speaker 2: I guess what I'm thinking of stinkers. I was thinking
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: of maybe I don't know Nixon. And then some of it,
• 22:39
  Speaker 2: like w you know, World Trade Center he did that
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: was a little distasteful. The sequel to Wall Street Money
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: Never Sleeps not regarded particularly highly. And also Savages I
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: remember being not great, but man some of his early stuff.
• 22:53
  Speaker 2: I think Platoon is up there for me with some
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: of the best boar films ever, although some people rank it.
• 22:58
  Speaker 4: A little lower.
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: Well canonical very much as also would love to see Oliver,
• 23:05
  Speaker 1: if you're listening, would love to see your depiction of
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: the ballgame courts. So the ballgame courts were part of
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: a city's holy precinct. This is what This is our
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: number one clue indicating that this game was more than
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: a game for the people involved at the time. I
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: want to correct one of the things we said earlier.
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: Each of the walls had a large vertical stone ring,
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: and it was set high up enough that you couldn't
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: touch it with your hand right, You'd have to you'd
• 23:45
  Speaker 1: have to jump. And we know that the court itself
• 23:51
  Speaker 1: was kind of in the shape of a capital letter
• 23:54
  Speaker 1: I English. So if you picture that, it's like with
• 24:00
  Speaker 1: like sort of walls barriers on each side and then
• 24:03
  Speaker 1: a long kind of I guess field of play connecting
• 24:07
  Speaker 1: those two like a yeah, my old school stuff makes
• 24:13
  Speaker 1: me think of it as a kill space, like I
• 24:17
  Speaker 1: would not want to be in. You you never want
• 24:20
  Speaker 1: to be in that part of the capital.
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: I I'm sure you don't, and I bet you. There
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: was plenty of blood on the on the sand or
• 24:27
  Speaker 2: on the turf or whatever. And by the way, the
• 24:29
  Speaker 2: most famous Oliver Stone stinker was Alexander Fortune. Favors The
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: Bold starring Val Kilmer and what's his face, Colin Farrell.
• 24:38
  Speaker 2: I haven't seen it, but it is it is universally
• 24:41
  Speaker 2: despised by even by the.
• 24:43
  Speaker 4: People that were in it. So that's the one I
• 24:44
  Speaker 4: was thinking.
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: Colin Ferrell's been doing some pretty impressive stuff right now.
• 24:48
  Speaker 4: I love this.
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: Oh it's so good. And I just I really, I
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: really liked that show Sugar that he was in. It's
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: sort of some people didn't care for it, but he
• 24:56
  Speaker 2: plays sort of like a hard boiled.
• 24:58
  Speaker 4: Kind of Raymond Chandler type of tech with a secret.
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: I enjoyed him on Apple TV check out if you
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: haven't seen it didn't really get much love, Like a
• 25:05
  Speaker 2: lot of those Apple TV shows, kind of seemed.
• 25:07
  Speaker 4: To not be promoted at all. I don't understand it.
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: Like slow horses, y'all, don't sleep on slow horses. That's
• 25:13
  Speaker 2: at least fabulous.
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: Did you know Gary Oldman is in that?
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, he looks This is one of the rare Gary
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: Oldmans where he pretty much looks like Gary Oldman, but
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: he looks like he looks like gutter old Men in
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: this one.
• 25:30
  Speaker 1: That's true, But we we digress. We want you to know, uh,
• 25:37
  Speaker 1: there was immense religious and social significance to the idea
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: of the ball game. If you look at Maya sites
• 25:48
  Speaker 1: in particular, you will see some researchers arguing that to
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: the audience, the ball was symbolically the sun, and the
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: court itself was the underworld. So can we save daylight
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: from the dark. That's a very powerful thing for an audience.
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: It's the ultimate battle, you know, the battle between light
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: and dark, good and evil. And we always talk about
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: in those days, how much sense it makes that there
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: was all of this worship of deities in the hopes
• 26:25
  Speaker 2: that they would, you know, turn the sun on again
• 26:27
  Speaker 2: the next day.
• 26:28
  Speaker 4: You know, it would be cool if you guys could
• 26:29
  Speaker 4: maybe do that.
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: But there were also back to the Olmecs, massive stone
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: sculptures of various versions of depictions of the game.
• 26:38
  Speaker 4: But some of the ones that I think are the
• 26:39
  Speaker 4: most interesting are.
• 26:40
  Speaker 2: These heads that are found oftentimes near the homes of
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: the chiefs.
• 26:46
  Speaker 4: You know, because this was like a massive cultural thing.
• 26:49
  Speaker 1: Check me on this. I don't know the Olmec stuff. Well,
• 26:52
  Speaker 1: I believe in Maya it would be a hatcha a
• 26:56
  Speaker 1: representation of the human head.
• 26:57
  Speaker 4: I think that's right.
• 26:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, particular an Omec head as found in a parquet
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: Musso la Venta in Mexico, and it depicts this person
• 27:08
  Speaker 2: with really dope stretched lobes, but also with something resembling
• 27:13
  Speaker 2: what we would think of as a helmet, like like
• 27:16
  Speaker 2: one of the you're going to be what is it
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: leathernecks about like old school football, And they used to
• 27:21
  Speaker 2: have those literal kind of leather little caps on, very
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: much looking like that, but probably didn't save them too
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: much from like having their bones splintered into powder.
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, they got their role rocked. As we used
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: to say. Another question we might have if we are
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: playing the ballgame, or if we have to participate in
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: it is not just what happens if I lose, it's
• 27:47
  Speaker 1: what happens if I win. You don't just save your life.
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: You apparently receive trophies. One of those trophies would be,
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: like we were talking about just a second ago, nol
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: a hotch a representation of a human head with a
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: handle on it, and you could use it. Is it cool?
• 28:09
  Speaker 4: I mean, is it cool? What do you mean?
• 28:11
  Speaker 1: Like?
• 28:11
  Speaker 2: It's that you carry it around as a flex like
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: a like a handbag.
• 28:15
  Speaker 4: Sees it seems a little unwieldy, isn't it.
• 28:17
  Speaker 5: So?
• 28:18
  Speaker 1: Imagine you were kidnapped by some aggressive, bellicose civilization. You
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: are a prisoner of war, a refugee. They throw you
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: into this court with people you don't know from a
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: can of paint, and they say you have to play
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: this game or we will kill you. And they give
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: you a human.
• 28:41
  Speaker 4: Head to play with.
• 28:43
  Speaker 1: Right and then, because you didn't die, right as your
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: shins are broken and you're laying there on the ground,
• 28:51
  Speaker 1: they say, you won, and we got you a treat.
• 28:55
  Speaker 1: And here it is. It's a carved version of a
• 28:59
  Speaker 1: human head.
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: See you're saying it might be a little triggering to
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: the people who've been freshly traumatized.
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: I think it wouldn't be the best day.
• 29:07
  Speaker 4: I guess maybe not, but I don't know.
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: But you got to imagine too, that they would have
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: kind of ringers, you know, like the top players, you know,
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: who were known, and they would make sure just like
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: in the gladiator battles, you would have your you know,
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: like decked out mad Max looking fellows that would absolutely
• 29:25
  Speaker 2: obliterate the lesser armed, you know, slaves or captives who
• 29:30
  Speaker 2: were thrown into the ring. I just have to imagine
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: that there maybe was a culture of like, you know,
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: top players the way we think of celebrity athletes here
• 29:39
  Speaker 2: in the United States or around the world.
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: And so we find ourselves, yet again on a continuing journey.
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: The ball game as we know it is not currently
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: practiced officially today currently and officially or doing a lot
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: of work in that sentence.
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: But in Meso America, you know, in this part of
• 30:10
  Speaker 2: the world, soccer is king of course, yes, huge, I
• 30:16
  Speaker 2: mean it's absolutely you know, a huge, hugely influential and
• 30:20
  Speaker 2: popular sports. So I mean, in my mind, I always
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: pictured this game from the little I knew about it
• 30:25
  Speaker 2: before doing this episode as resembling soccer more closely. So
• 30:30
  Speaker 2: it's interesting to see that, you know, when when you're
• 30:32
  Speaker 2: talking about using your hips or your elbows, I'm also
• 30:35
  Speaker 2: picturing the way soccer players can like pass a ball
• 30:38
  Speaker 2: between their feet, you know, or juggle a ball kind
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: of or your head do move with their heads. So
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: maybe there were some things that it had in common
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: with soccer.
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: You also have to be very careful with your lower
• 30:50
  Speaker 1: limbs considering the weight and the speed of that rubber
• 30:56
  Speaker 1: ball we would rubber.
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: Interestingly, by the way, I don't think we mentioned that
• 31:00
  Speaker 2: this part of the world is where rubber plants. A
• 31:05
  Speaker 2: lot of rubber imports come from things like latex, you know,
• 31:08
  Speaker 2: from naturally occurring trees, So they would have had access
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: to this raw material and used it to make these
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: balls that would, you know, kind of have a little
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: bit of give you when you kicked him around or
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: batted him around.
• 31:19
  Speaker 1: And then later Henry Ford got so pissed off about
• 31:24
  Speaker 1: pay for rubber Cat's right he started his own ill
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: fated town in Brazil called ford Landia.
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: Oh my gosh, Ben I do remember this vaguely either
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: from an episode of this podcast or our sister podcast
• 31:39
  Speaker 2: stuff that.
• 31:40
  Speaker 4: I want you to know, But can you kind of
• 31:41
  Speaker 4: remind us how that all went down.
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: It's a true story, and perhaps not one the Jedi
• 31:46
  Speaker 1: will tell you. Ford ford Landia was to be confused
• 31:50
  Speaker 1: with Portlandia, not to be confused. Yeah, and that's a
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: great note. Ford Landia was created in nineteen twenty eight
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: by Henry Ford, wherein he tried to make a Norman
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: Rockwell painting come to life and spoiler he failed.
• 32:11
  Speaker 4: I mean, you can't win them all, Henry four.
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, town is still around if you want to visit there.
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: It's not super big. There are like three thousand people
• 32:22
  Speaker 1: there as of twenty eighteen or so.
• 32:25
  Speaker 4: Got it?
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: Okay, maybe we should schedule a ridiculous field trip.
• 32:28
  Speaker 4: One of these days. I would love to check it out.
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: Seems like it might be a little Sultan Sea esque,
• 32:34
  Speaker 2: maybe a little like an abandoned ghost kind of vibes.
• 32:38
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I did.
• 32:38
  Speaker 2: I did want to maybe wrap with just one more
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: interesting legend. A famous bout of ballgame took place at
• 32:47
  Speaker 2: the Aztec Capitol and I'm gonna do my best here
• 32:50
  Speaker 2: of Tanaktatslam. I think that's right between the Aztec king.
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: Here's where I'm going to feel miserably march Chozoma, Motechkozoma,
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: Zukoosko yeah x o c O y o t z
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: and against the King of Text Coco, the King of
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: text Coco had predicted. We mentioned this, but another use of.
• 33:19
  Speaker 4: This was as a way of predicting the future.
• 33:21
  Speaker 2: The King of text Toto had predicted that motuck Zoma's
• 33:26
  Speaker 2: kingdom would fall, and the game was essentially a way
• 33:30
  Speaker 2: of testing him on his prophecy. Kind of interesting, sort
• 33:35
  Speaker 2: of makes it a self fulfilling prophecy in.
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: A way, right, Yeah, it's like trial by ordeal, yes,
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: in parts of that try combat of course combat.
• 33:45
  Speaker 2: Yeah, you mean my champion, then if I was, if
• 33:48
  Speaker 2: I was called to trial by combat, thanks, Bud, I
• 33:52
  Speaker 2: do the same for you. And it is recorded here.
• 33:54
  Speaker 2: It's part of the official record. So you can't know
• 33:57
  Speaker 2: take these back seats. Are you in a situation now yet?
• 34:00
  Speaker 4: Ben?
• 34:01
  Speaker 2: But you never know, You never know what could happen,
• 34:03
  Speaker 2: especially given you know, potential changes in regime.
• 34:07
  Speaker 4: Oh geez.
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah. As ever, we also we also have to acknowledge
• 34:14
  Speaker 1: this proves a larger This proves a larger philosophical point
• 34:20
  Speaker 1: about the nature of sports even today in many sporting areas. God,
• 34:28
  Speaker 1: I sound like the old uncle at the reunion.
• 34:32
  Speaker 2: Come children enjoined us in the sporting area for a
• 34:35
  Speaker 2: friendly for a friendly contest.
• 34:38
  Speaker 5: Hello, fellow children. I understand there is a pig skin,
• 34:43
  Speaker 5: which is a matter of debate. Yes, yeah, So what
• 34:47
  Speaker 5: we see though, is that the nature of sport, the
• 34:52
  Speaker 5: nature of play, and I love the word you mentioned
• 34:55
  Speaker 5: in our previous episode, the nature of sportso is really
• 35:02
  Speaker 5: more than just messing around.
• 35:05
  Speaker 1: It is meant to carry certain sociological or cultural mores,
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: Like we're talking about religion, we're talking about divination, we're
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: talking about human death. Also, even now, any sports fan
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: can tell you supporting your favorite team becomes a lot
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: like having a religion.
• 35:31
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 35:32
  Speaker 2: Do you know the comedian Kyle Oh geez, what the
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: heck is his last name? He was the weird SNL
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: guy Moony. Kyle Mooney has this incredible sketch from his
• 35:42
  Speaker 2: early YouTube days where he's just this dude wearing a
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: jacket that has all of the different types of sports
• 35:47
  Speaker 2: balls on it and he's just.
• 35:48
  Speaker 6: Talking about it's my team, we gotta support our team,
• 35:53
  Speaker 6: and the guy his roommate's like, what are you talking
• 35:56
  Speaker 6: What team are you talking about which, and then he's
• 35:59
  Speaker 6: describing these very amorphous rules and he's just talking about Bengels.
• 36:03
  Speaker 4: It was a bad call, Bengels. You gotta win the game.
• 36:06
  Speaker 4: They call the points anyway, It's very fun.
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: Let's also point this out speaking of points. Look, a
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: lot of the stuff we understand about the ballgame now
• 36:20
  Speaker 1: comes from the Spaniards who encroached into the area.
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: They're the ones who described some of the horrific injuries
• 36:29
  Speaker 2: that could take place.
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: And indeed attempted to vilify and dehumanize the civilizations that
• 36:38
  Speaker 1: they encountered. So we have to remember that. To our
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: earlier point, we also wanted to give you a dope
• 36:46
  Speaker 1: beat the step two. There are more weird sports or
• 36:52
  Speaker 1: ridiculous sports that we will explore together in future episodes.
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: One that I thought would be super fun for us
• 37:03
  Speaker 1: to try is fishermen jousting. But that's it was. It
• 37:10
  Speaker 1: was a real thing in the Nile in ancient Egypt. Dude,
• 37:13
  Speaker 1: I'm telling you, uh, you would have.
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: And I think you're in denial about the existence of
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: this sport.
• 37:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, uh so, uh, these two teams of boatmen
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: would squeaar off. They would have their hands and feet
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: in play. The idea was you knocked the other team
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: off balance. Two boats going together and you're pushing each other,
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: you're smacking each other. The issue was, you know that
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: hippos and crocodiles are in the nile, so if you
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: if your boat got pushed, you might get at no
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: way at by a croc Yes way to.
• 37:59
  Speaker 4: Sound like fine, I'll take a pass on that one.
• 38:03
  Speaker 1: So I think just more, I think we can agree
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: that sports in general historically are a little more violent
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: than the sports we see today.
• 38:14
  Speaker 4: Yeah, well yeah, I mean, like you know, we.
• 38:15
  Speaker 2: Talked about gramatic brain injuries and issues. You know, of
• 38:18
  Speaker 2: course there's some brutal sports like boxing and UFC fighting
• 38:22
  Speaker 2: and all of that that are kind of holdovers in
• 38:24
  Speaker 2: a way or remnants, but they're still, by the standards
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: that we're talking about, pretty sanitized. These boats, by the way,
• 38:31
  Speaker 2: Ben and Fisherman and jousting, were they made of like
• 38:34
  Speaker 2: papyrus as it seemed like the best of material to
• 38:37
  Speaker 2: build a seafaring vessel out of.
• 38:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, make it interesting, I guess, so sort of like.
• 38:43
  Speaker 2: The pot was it the pumpkin giant pumpkin kayaking.
• 38:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, how long is that.
• 38:47
  Speaker 2: Thing gonna flow? That is I mean, that's the one
• 38:49
  Speaker 2: more charming, probably not as violent.
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: But a little less dangerous, fewer hippopotamus involved.
• 38:55
  Speaker 4: But can we end on a really silly one?
• 38:57
  Speaker 2: I just just the name alone, for some reason makes
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: me think of futurama. I don't know why the idea
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: of worm charming like this, It seems so low stakes.
• 39:08
  Speaker 2: I love it very much. It's competitive worm charming possible.
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: I love that you mentioned this because it's it's like dowsing,
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: but for worms. So instead of finding water, worm charming
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: is the method of somehow summoning earthworms from the ground
• 39:32
  Speaker 2: and then.
• 39:32
  Speaker 4: A hypnotizing them correct.
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: Maybe like steak charming. Okay, okay, you know it's also
• 39:38
  Speaker 1: called worm grunting or worm fifth lanes.
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: You've heard I've heard of wormunt. I have heard of
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: worm grunt, yes, sir, I certainly have. That is actually
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: what I heard it referred to as initially. But it
• 39:50
  Speaker 2: is very popular in the UK. I think it started
• 39:54
  Speaker 2: pretty recently nineteen eighty in Williston, Cheshire, and the world
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: record I believe, as in the hand of a woman
• 40:01
  Speaker 2: named Sophie Smith, a ten year old, a young woman.
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: How many worms did she charm?
• 40:08
  Speaker 3: Yeah?
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: Also why did she make it competitive, folks? Just for funzies.
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: There is some science though to worm charming. It evolves
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: a vibration of the soil. Oh, okay, and I'll answer
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: my own question.
• 40:23
  Speaker 2: It was five hundred and sixty seven worms that young
• 40:26
  Speaker 2: Sophie Smith.
• 40:27
  Speaker 1: That's at summons.
• 40:28
  Speaker 2: That's a lot of worms to summon from the earth.
• 40:31
  Speaker 2: I'm impressed, young Sophie Smith. A job, Sophie. Indeed, we
• 40:35
  Speaker 2: talked about hobbyhorsing already last time, which was a delight.
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: But yeah, Ben, I think I think we're probably at
• 40:41
  Speaker 2: the end of our second part on History's Oddest Sports.
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: Yes, and we continue our exploration, folks. Thanks so much
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: for tuning in. Big thanks to our super producer mister
• 40:55
  Speaker 1: Max Williams. If you are wondering why are you guys
• 40:59
  Speaker 1: not taking about more Western sports in the modern day,
• 41:04
  Speaker 1: Well get thee to your podcast platform of choice. Subscribe.
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: Oh what am I supposed to say? Like from the
• 41:12
  Speaker 1: YouTube days, Smash that like button and subscribe because we
• 41:16
  Speaker 1: have an amazing episode coming up for you, all about
• 41:21
  Speaker 1: weird stuff that happened on baseball fields.
• 41:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and some major malfunctions involving retractable roofs. Tune in,
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: folks in the meantime. Huge thanks to super producer Max
• 41:32
  Speaker 2: Williams and Alex Williams who composed this theme.
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: Big big thanks to our number one commissioner of the
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: Mesoamerican Ballgame, Jonathan Strickland aka the Quist. Big big thanks
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: to aj Bahamas Jacobs, who is just gosh, just the
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: coolest cucumber, you know what I mean.
• 41:55
  Speaker 4: Indeed, that's why he's like a Bahama breeze. There it
• 41:58
  Speaker 4: is there.
• 41:59
  Speaker 2: Take sure him in a hammock at all times.
• 42:01
  Speaker 4: I think he mentioned that as well.
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: Gabe Luzier, Christopher hasiotis Eve's Jeff Coates here in spirit?
• 42:08
  Speaker 1: Who else?
• 42:08
  Speaker 4: Who else?
• 42:09
  Speaker 1: Who?
• 42:09
  Speaker 4: Jeez?
• 42:10
  Speaker 2: I sure love to thank you, Ben, my warm charmer
• 42:15
  Speaker 2: whatever that means.
• 42:16
  Speaker 4: Do with that, wis you will?
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: I'd call it dhr Man.
• 42:20
  Speaker 4: We'll see you next time, folks.
• 42:28
  Speaker 2: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,
• 42:32
  Speaker 2: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.