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What happens if you change your mind after creating a trust? · The Legal Exchange

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  Speaker 1: This is the Legal Exchange with Todd Lutsky from the
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  Speaker 1: law firm of Cushing and Dolan and Susan Powers of
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  Speaker 1: the Armstrong Advisory Group. Each week, Todd and Susan will
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  Speaker 1: discuss many topics including estate planning, how to avoid probate,
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  Speaker 1: and protecting your money from a nursing home. If you
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  Speaker 1: Here are your hosts, Todd Lutsky and Susan Powers.
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  Speaker 2: Welcome into Legal Exchange with Todd Lutsky. I'm Susan Powers
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  Speaker 2: of Financial Advice with the Armstrong Advisory Group and I'm
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  Speaker 2: joined by Todd Lutsky, a partner with a law firm
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  Speaker 2: of Cushing and Dolan with a master's in taxation. Welcome Todd.
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  Speaker 2: How are you today?
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  Speaker 3: I'm never better? How are you?
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  Speaker 2: I'm great? Thank you? And what do you have for
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  Speaker 2: us this week?
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  Speaker 3: Well? Look the new month as we kick it off,
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  Speaker 3: I've got I go to Maryland. We have a case
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  Speaker 3: there where the question is, you know, a testamentary beneficiary
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  Speaker 3: versus a third party beneficiary, which is very confusing, but
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  Speaker 3: at the end of the day, it talks about whether
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  Speaker 3: or not. So in this case, Pauline Bennett created a
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  Speaker 3: living trust and then she had Tom prepare the trust.
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  Speaker 3: He's this attorney, and then she allocated property to certain children.
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  Speaker 3: Then later on she revised her trust, but did she
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  Speaker 3: really revise her trust? And I mean, it really gets
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  Speaker 3: into a situation where she did planning, but always be
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  Speaker 3: very careful as you go through your planning process that
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  Speaker 3: everything is done. So I will clear up all of
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  Speaker 3: that for you, and then we're going to go over
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  Speaker 3: to Florida and we're going to talk about in this case,
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  Speaker 3: the how critical trust funding is and how in this
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  Speaker 3: case a poor over will kind of was that safety
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  Speaker 3: net that we always talk about it being and how
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  Speaker 3: it worked here. So I will explain to you how
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  Speaker 3: this trust was created, what was in it, what wasn't
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  Speaker 3: in it, and how things got in it later, and
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  Speaker 3: then I'll just talk in general about how to fund
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  Speaker 3: of trust because folks, it's so important. Interestingly enough, it
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  Speaker 3: is a new month, there is a new guide, and
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  Speaker 3: it is called Demystifying the Top seven estate planning trusts.
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  Speaker 2: Is it your favorite? It's up you got to call
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: you on. They're like all your children, They're all your favorites.
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  Speaker 3: It's up there on the list. It's up there on
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  Speaker 3: the list. So it's important because look at these two cases,
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  Speaker 3: both of which are dealing with trust. Whether they're funded,
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  Speaker 3: how they work, are they created? Are they drafted right? Folks?
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  Speaker 3: This has got seven of them in there. From Nominee
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  Speaker 3: realty trusts, which I'm not really sure really is a trust,
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  Speaker 3: even though it has the word in it. It's got
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  Speaker 3: revocable trusts, irrevocable trust, sole benefit trust, your for your
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  Speaker 3: special needs situations. It's got life insurance trusts. Not sure
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  Speaker 3: where you are in your planning process, but I'll bet
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  Speaker 3: you there's a trust in here that you might need.
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  Speaker 3: Not sure which which one. Get the guide learn how
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  Speaker 3: they work and whether they're right for you. Eight six
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  Speaker 3: six eight four eight five six ninety nine or Legal
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  Speaker 3: exchange Show dot com Brand New Guide for the Month
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  Speaker 3: eight six six eight four eight five six ninety nine
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  Speaker 3: or Legal Exchange Show dot com. Let's go back to Maryland,
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  Speaker 3: shall we.
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  Speaker 4: So?
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  Speaker 3: In this case, Pauline. Let's get the fact straight. Pauline
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  Speaker 3: created the Pauline Bennett Living Trust in twenty fifteen in
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  Speaker 3: October attorning Tom. Somebody prepared it, we'll call him Tom.
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  Speaker 3: He prepared the trust. She told in the trust she
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  Speaker 3: was supposed to utilize all the property for her benefit
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  Speaker 3: except this one wis Can Avenue property which was held
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  Speaker 3: for the benefit of the daughter, and her name was Audrey,
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  Speaker 3: and it was going to be distributed to Audrey. Up
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  Speaker 3: on Pauline dies, that was earmarked for Audrey. The remaining
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  Speaker 3: property was to go equally to the three kids. Query
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  Speaker 3: whether Audrey was included twice wants to get a piece
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  Speaker 3: of property and as part of equally to the three kids.
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  Speaker 3: That doesn't matter. But that's how it was broken down. Well,
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  Speaker 3: daughter Marrill Madeleine excuse me, it becomes the successor trustee
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  Speaker 3: after Pauline dies. Well, Pauline didn't die yet, but in
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  Speaker 3: twenty seventeen, remember twenty fifteen now or twenty seventeen. Twenty seventeen,
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  Speaker 3: she revises the trust goes back to attorney Tom, who
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  Speaker 3: really did not change the property disposition language in the trust.
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  Speaker 3: The Wiscan Avenue property was still supposed to go where
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  Speaker 3: it was supposed to go. Didn't really change any of that,
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  Speaker 3: but other changes were made well. In twenty nineteen, Pauline
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  Speaker 3: learned that Audrey was withdrawing money from her bank account,
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  Speaker 3: mismanaging her money, and using credit cards without her permission.
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  Speaker 3: So she wasn't thrilled with that, but she didn't take
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  Speaker 3: it any further. Later in twenty nineteen, expressed to Attorney
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  Speaker 3: Tom that she's concerned that she's going to have to
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  Speaker 3: sell the WISCN Avenue property because she doesn't have enough
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  Speaker 3: money to pay for the nursing home. M hm. Scratching
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  Speaker 3: my head already saying well, why didn't you do an
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  Speaker 3: irrevocable trust. But we'll leave that as a side note
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  Speaker 3: for now, so that's all he makes that comment. Then
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  Speaker 3: in November twentieth, twenty nineteen, a new trust is prepared,
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  Speaker 3: removing the language giving the property to Audrey.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, yeah.
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  Speaker 3: December thirty first, twenty nineteen, Pauline dies, that's pretty close. However,
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  Speaker 3: Audrey says, oh no, no, I get the property because
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  Speaker 3: in November of twenty nineteen, about when she was doing
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  Speaker 3: the trust, there was a deed prepared giving the property
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  Speaker 3: directly to Pauline, but not to Pauline. But Pauline asked
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  Speaker 3: Tom not to deliver the deed to Audrey. Giving the
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  Speaker 3: deed to Audrey but said, don't deliver the deed to Audrey. Well,
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  Speaker 3: in most states, if you don't have delivery, you don't
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  Speaker 3: have legal title. Transferring went to trial court, lots of litigation,
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  Speaker 3: After lots of litigation, it turned out that the twenty
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  Speaker 3: nineteen changes to the trust never really changed the disposition
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  Speaker 3: of the twenty seventeen trust at all, so the property
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  Speaker 3: still really goes to Audrey. Of course, then they sued
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  Speaker 3: the attorney for malpractice, but that's not why we're here.
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  Speaker 3: So okay, So wow, there's a lot going on here.
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  Speaker 3: I mean, it sounds like they tried to do a trust,
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  Speaker 3: which they did, and then they tried changing the trust.
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  Speaker 3: Successful or not isn't really the issue, but you can
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  Speaker 3: change it. But I think what we take away from this,
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  Speaker 3: what lessons do we learn here is trust planning really works.
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  Speaker 3: It does what the trust says is going to get done. Here,
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  Speaker 3: it avoided probate. We weren't in probate court. Yeah right,
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  Speaker 3: She controlled this all during her own life. Pauline was
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  Speaker 3: the donor. Pauline was the trustee. She controlled her wishes
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  Speaker 3: throughout the whole process. Using this trust, it enabled her
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  Speaker 3: to leave specific assets to specific children. Right, beautiful, She
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  Speaker 3: controlled it. She can say how and when the real
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  Speaker 3: estate got where it was supposed to go, and can
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  Speaker 3: possibly pass it down to multiple generations. So folks, trusts work, yep,
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  Speaker 3: and in this case it worked just fine for her. Now,
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  Speaker 3: the court here basically said that the deed, remember there
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  Speaker 3: was a deed prepared, and couple that with the fact
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  Speaker 3: that the trust was unchanged. Looks like Audrey gets that property.
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  Speaker 3: But you know what, that may have been Mom's intent anyway.
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  Speaker 3: She might have been mad that Audrey's mismanaging her money,
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  Speaker 3: but she was never mad enough to disinherit, to actually
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  Speaker 3: take it to the next step and disinherit her. But again,
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  Speaker 3: careful drafting is the key here, right, read everything before
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  Speaker 3: you sign it. Right. Maybe there was a problem when
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  Speaker 3: the drafting, and there clearly was. This is why we
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  Speaker 3: read the documents to you in English. We give it
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  Speaker 3: to you in advance to read on your own. Then
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  Speaker 3: we read it to you and god speed before you
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  Speaker 3: sign it to try and help, you know, but it's okay.
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  Speaker 3: And in this case, you know, we don't know if
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  Speaker 3: she was unequally treating the daughters or not. I don't
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  Speaker 3: know whether or not Audrey gets that property plus shares
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  Speaker 3: and all the rest of the property. And it's okay.
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  Speaker 3: If that's what you want to do, the trust can
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  Speaker 3: do that.
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  Speaker 2: It's your ability to do that what I.
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  Speaker 3: Really think was the problem here, And there was a
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  Speaker 3: little notation to that. You got to make sure you
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  Speaker 3: have the right kind of trust right, which again leads
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  Speaker 3: me back to this guy demystifying the top seven estate
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  Speaker 3: planning trusts. There's seven here, There's so many more. How
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  Speaker 3: do I know which one is right for me?
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  Speaker 4: Here?
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  Speaker 3: I say, you know, she's worried about selling that wis
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  Speaker 3: Cann Avenue property because she has to pay for the
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  Speaker 3: nursing home. Remember she said that, Well, if you were
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  Speaker 3: worried about nursing homes, if you were concerned that Audrey
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  Speaker 3: actually get this property, that you want to protect this
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  Speaker 3: property for Audrey because she needs it, then the type
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  Speaker 3: of trust you be talking to Tom not about the
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  Speaker 3: malpractice that he screwed up in the drafting. Maybe he
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  Speaker 3: didn't recommend the right trust to begin with. Maybe they
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  Speaker 3: should have been talking about an irrevocable trust, an irrevocable
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  Speaker 3: medicaid trust, which would have avoided the probate and provided
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  Speaker 3: the disposition the way she wanted it, but also protected.
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  Speaker 2: It because she started that whole process more than five
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  Speaker 2: years like when she originally did her trust place. Yeah,
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  Speaker 2: so she could have completely protected that and not have
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  Speaker 2: to worry about selling.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, twenty fifteen. By twenty nineteen, she was worried about it.
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  Speaker 3: She's almost there, so I mean that clock could have
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  Speaker 3: been running. So, folks, getting your trust in order, getting
• 10:03
  Speaker 3: the right trust for you is also important. This guide
• 10:07
  Speaker 3: will do that for you. It explains seven of the
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: guides or seven of the trusts. Excuse me, get it.
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: Figure out which one's right for you. Eight sixty six
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  Speaker 3: eight four eight five six nine nine or Legal Exchange
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  Speaker 3: show dot com.
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: You've been listening to Todd Lutsky, a partner with the
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  Speaker 2: law firm of Cushing and Dolan. I'm Susan Power as
• 10:27
  Speaker 2: a financial advisor with the Armstrong Advisory Group. We've got
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  Speaker 2: much more to come when we return to the Legal
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  Speaker 2: Exchange with Todd Lutsky.
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  Speaker 2: Welcome back into the Legal Exchange with Toddltsky. I'm Susan
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  Speaker 2: Power as a financial advisor with the Armstrong Advisory Group,
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  Speaker 2: and I'm joined by Todd Lutsky, a partner with the
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  Speaker 2: law firm of Cushing and Dolan with a master's in taxation.
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  Speaker 2: Where are we headed now, Todd, Florida.
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  Speaker 3: Let's go south.
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: Still warm in Florida, folks.
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  Speaker 3: This whole situation is about poor over wills as a
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: safety net. We use them all the time.
• 14:49
  Speaker 2: M hm.
• 14:50
  Speaker 3: But more importantly, trust funding so critical. Don't fund your trust.
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  Speaker 3: You're not getting any help, no benefits, So let's talk
• 15:00
  Speaker 3: about it. Dorothea owned two annuities among other assets, obviously,
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  Speaker 3: but the two annuities were what's that issue? And until
• 15:10
  Speaker 3: August of twenty twenty one, her husband was the primary
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: beneficiary on the annuity. That makes sense. On August fifth,
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: twenty twenty one, a Florida notary completed a beneficiary change
• 15:23
  Speaker 3: form on Dorothea's behalf and named Sondra and Lisa as
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: primary beneficiaries. Who are Sondra and Lisa? Well, they are
• 15:32
  Speaker 3: the caregivers for the last three years of Dorothea's life
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: and the notary, by the way, can sign such a
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: form if certain criteria is met. Again, I don't know
• 15:46
  Speaker 3: if this is state specific. It could be, so be careful.
• 15:50
  Speaker 3: You need to have an attestation page that says why
• 15:53
  Speaker 3: the individual cannot do it on her own.
• 15:56
  Speaker 2: So Dorothea didn't even sign.
• 15:58
  Speaker 3: No, but Dorothea directed it, and she had impaired vision
• 16:02
  Speaker 3: and cannot see, and so there was a reason the
• 16:05
  Speaker 3: aceitation clause was there, and you need two witnesses will.
• 16:08
  Speaker 3: Sondra and Lisa signed as the two witnesses. So this
• 16:12
  Speaker 3: took place while Dorothea died in February twenty twenty two
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: and Walter, her husband, died eight days later. So we
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  Speaker 3: don't really have Walter worrying about why he's not the
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: beneficiary anymore? Right, and there was a poor overwill in place.
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  Speaker 3: Ah more information in this will. It directed that any
• 16:33
  Speaker 3: assets in their name alone, the residuary of the estate
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  Speaker 3: would go to the revocable trust that they had in place.
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: Oh good for them, safety net, poor overwill. They have
• 16:44
  Speaker 3: a revocable trust in place. I love it sounds like
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  Speaker 3: this person did planning and just didn't you know, just
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: was changing one or two items. Nothing wrong with this. Well,
• 16:55
  Speaker 3: the pr of the estate and Lisa and Sandra, well
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  Speaker 3: they have a dispute of course over who will these annuities?
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  Speaker 3: Was that done correctly? Do the Lisa and Sondra get
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: the money from the annuities or does the estate get
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: the annuities. Well, the pr of Walter's estate believes that
• 17:13
  Speaker 3: the estate gets the annuities because the designated beneficiary form
• 17:16
  Speaker 3: was done improperly, so therefore it's void. It's like void. Well,
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: they went to court and the trial court said that,
• 17:27
  Speaker 3: you know what, a notary can sign the forms if
• 17:31
  Speaker 3: a person with the disability directs it, which we can
• 17:35
  Speaker 3: assume that took place to be done. The form itself
• 17:39
  Speaker 3: states the nature of the disability of Dorothea, why she
• 17:43
  Speaker 3: couldn't do it herself, and she was she's blind, vision impaired, whatnot.
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  Speaker 3: And it's signed by two disinterested witnesses.
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  Speaker 2: Not so disinterested, they're the beneficiary.
• 17:56
  Speaker 3: Thanks for following along. Here comes the problem, right right, Well,
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  Speaker 3: and Lisa signed that, but they certainly are not disinterested
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  Speaker 3: witnesses since they are the actual beneficiaries of the Well,
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  Speaker 3: so there you go. Walter's the state gets the money
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  Speaker 3: and those two caregivers, as sad as this might be,
• 18:15
  Speaker 3: don't get it. And again they probably earned it and
• 18:18
  Speaker 3: they probably should get it, so I feel bad for them.
• 18:23
  Speaker 3: Got you gotta do your planning right from top to bottom. Right,
• 18:28
  Speaker 3: that's what this is all about. You gotta learn how
• 18:32
  Speaker 3: these things work and do your planning correct not only drafting,
• 18:37
  Speaker 3: but funding the trust and folks. To do your planning correctly,
• 18:42
  Speaker 3: you got to figure out which trust is right for you. You
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: don't know if you want to revocable and irrevocable? Are
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: you making gifts? Do you want a gifting trust? Do
• 18:48
  Speaker 3: you want a life insurance trust? Do you have disabled children?
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: I don't know? Sole benefit trusts, those are all kinds
• 18:56
  Speaker 3: of trust that everyday people might need. This guide explains
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: those top seven trusts for you. They explain how they work,
• 19:09
  Speaker 3: the tax savings, the operation benefits, on and on. They
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: go call and get the guide. Figure out what trust
• 19:17
  Speaker 3: is right for you so that you can begin your
• 19:19
  Speaker 3: estate planning. If you have not eight sixty six eight
• 19:23
  Speaker 3: four eight five six nine nine or Legal Exchange Show
• 19:27
  Speaker 3: dot com Brand New Guide for the Month eight six
• 19:30
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• 19:35
  Speaker 3: Exchange Show dot Com.
• 19:37
  Speaker 2: I have questions, you have questions, that's great, go ahead.
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: I always I always have to think worst case scenario
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: when I hear stories like this that Walter wasn't involved
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: in this, and there are they hired caregivers because if
• 19:50
  Speaker 2: they were children or something, they would be getting it
• 19:53
  Speaker 2: from Walter's estate. That's true, It just sounds suspect to me.
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: Well maybe, I mean Walter could have been not able
• 19:59
  Speaker 3: to care for himself either. They both could have needed care.
• 20:01
  Speaker 3: He might not have been able to care for her,
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: so they had caregivers. Maybe the caregivers were providing for
• 20:05
  Speaker 3: both of them. So I don't know that I see
• 20:07
  Speaker 3: the suspectness here, but it could be. But it's possible.
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: But I mean, it's very possible that you have both
• 20:14
  Speaker 3: elderly people and they need care, and who knows where
• 20:17
  Speaker 3: the kids are. They're not always preparing or providing your care.
• 20:21
  Speaker 2: After they're looking now looking for the money.
• 20:24
  Speaker 3: So fair, fair comment, Susan. Just we just don't know.
• 20:28
  Speaker 3: So what I'm going to do is explain to you
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: funding a trust, what happens when you don't fund it,
• 20:34
  Speaker 3: why it's important to fund it, and how to fund it.
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: We're going to learn from this. Excuse me. First of all,
• 20:41
  Speaker 3: it's important to fund the trust. Let's talk about a
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: revocable trust for the moment. If it's revocable and you
• 20:47
  Speaker 3: don't fund it, it's not going to avoid probate. It's
• 20:50
  Speaker 3: not going to reduce your estate taxes if it's not funded,
• 20:52
  Speaker 3: because the buckets can't get funded. It's not going to
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: provide the bloodline planning for your family the way you
• 20:56
  Speaker 3: want it to. It might just end up going with
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: a beneficiary designate or through the probate process. Who knows. Okay,
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: so all bad things. What about a Medicaid irrevocable trust.
• 21:09
  Speaker 3: What if you don't fund one of those, Well, you're
• 21:11
  Speaker 3: gonna have all the same problems. Not gonna avoid probate,
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: You're not going to reduce the state taxes, You're not
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: going to provide the bloodline planning.
• 21:17
  Speaker 2: But wait, there's more.
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: But there's a bigger problem. Right, So with the Medicaid trust,
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: not only do you have all the same problems when
• 21:24
  Speaker 3: it's not funded as you do with a revocable trust,
• 21:28
  Speaker 3: you also do not start the five year waiting period
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: running ever on the assets. I mean, you come into
• 21:36
  Speaker 3: the office and you say, oh, mom's in the nursing home.
• 21:39
  Speaker 3: We did an irrevocable trust. We're all protected, and I
• 21:41
  Speaker 3: find out nothing's in it, right, I gotta tell you you're
• 21:44
  Speaker 3: not protected. So that's very, very important to understand that.
• 21:50
  Speaker 3: So that's that. Now let's talk about funding it. All
• 21:54
  Speaker 3: of you listening or some of you listening, might have
• 21:56
  Speaker 3: these trusts done. You might have a revocable, you might
• 21:59
  Speaker 3: have a medicaid us, you might have a gifting trust.
• 22:02
  Speaker 3: How do you know what's in it? Well, a couple
• 22:05
  Speaker 3: of ways. One, let's take talk about real estate for
• 22:09
  Speaker 3: a minute. Look at the deed, well, deeds record it
• 22:13
  Speaker 3: all right, Well, look at the real estate tax bill.
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: If the real estate tax bill shows your name individually, probably.
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: It's not in there, but it takes a little time.
• 22:23
  Speaker 3: Takes a little time, not guaranteed if you just did it,
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: give it a year to show up at the town, right,
• 22:27
  Speaker 3: But generally that's a good first step. If it has
• 22:32
  Speaker 3: the name of the trust on the real estate tax bill,
• 22:35
  Speaker 3: wipe your brow.
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: It's in there, in the trust or the trustee.
• 22:37
  Speaker 3: Right might because it might not all fit. It'll say
• 22:40
  Speaker 3: the name of the trustee, and then you'll be like,
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: it won't all fit. Life insurance. Make the designated beneficiary
• 22:48
  Speaker 3: the trust so that it doesn't pass to the spouse,
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: so that it doesn't avoid it would avoid probate passing
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: to the spouse, but would also avoid getting in the
• 22:57
  Speaker 3: trust to be sheltered for a state taxes.
• 22:59
  Speaker 2: You well know right away if that's been done, because
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: you're going to get a confirmation letter from the insurance
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: company as soon as it takes effect.
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: And if you don't know, call them, say send me
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: a copy of the designated beneficiary form so that I
• 23:10
  Speaker 3: can see that I've named my trust as the beneficiary
• 23:14
  Speaker 3: on life insurance and not the spouse brokerage accounts. Well,
• 23:17
  Speaker 3: here we're not doing beneficiaries. Here, we're changing owners. Change
• 23:22
  Speaker 3: the owner title to the property the trust. The trust
• 23:26
  Speaker 3: will dictate where the assets go.
• 23:27
  Speaker 2: We'll see that right on your statement.
• 23:29
  Speaker 3: Annuities as well, they're a little more tricky sometimes, like
• 23:32
  Speaker 3: here you can name an individual, you can name the
• 23:35
  Speaker 3: trust as a beneficiary. Be careful if you're doing a
• 23:37
  Speaker 3: medicaid trust though, because with a medicaid trust sometimes putting
• 23:41
  Speaker 3: the annuity in triggers a taxable event. But it doesn't.
• 23:45
  Speaker 3: You just have to fight it. So little comment there. So, folks,
• 23:48
  Speaker 3: that's a little bit on funding these trusts, whether it's
• 23:51
  Speaker 3: a revocable or irrevocable, make sure you get your stuff
• 23:55
  Speaker 3: in there. Learn how these trusts work. The Top seven
• 23:59
  Speaker 3: Medica Up seven estate Planning Trusts eight sixty six, eight four, eight, five, six,
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: nine nine or Legal Exchange show dot com.
• 24:09
  Speaker 2: You've been listening to Todd Lutsky, a partner with the
• 24:11
  Speaker 2: law firm of Cushing and Dolan. I'm Susan Powers, a
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: financial advisor with the Armstrong Advisory Group. Todd will be
• 24:18
  Speaker 2: answering your questions when we return to the Legal Exchange
• 24:22
  Speaker 2: with Todd Lutsky.
• 24:23
  Speaker 1: Cushing and Dolan are experts in elder life planning and taxation.
• 24:27
  Speaker 1: They know that every family is unique and that every
• 24:29
  Speaker 1: estate plan must be different. Early planning is crucial if
• 24:32
  Speaker 1: you want to stress free your retirement and trusts are
• 24:34
  Speaker 1: oftentimes the document of choice to help protect your assets,
• 24:38
  Speaker 1: but with so many kinds of trusts, you need to
• 24:40
  Speaker 1: learn about which one is right for your plan. Revocable
• 24:43
  Speaker 1: and irrevocable trusts are most common, but there are several differences,
• 24:46
  Speaker 1: as well as numerous tax implications with each. If you're
• 24:49
  Speaker 1: ready to start your planning or need are a fresh
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: and existing plan, call Cushing and Dolan and ask for
• 24:54
  Speaker 1: their new guide called Demistifying the Top seven estate Planning Trusts.
• 24:58
  Speaker 1: Learn how to protect your assets and potentially eliminate your
• 25:01
  Speaker 1: estate taxes. Call eight six six eight four eight five
• 25:04
  Speaker 1: six ninety nine right now and ask for your guide today.
• 25:07
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• 25:10
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• 25:13
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• 25:15
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• 25:17
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• 25:20
  Speaker 1: Cushing and Dolan and Armstrong Advisory do not endorse each
• 25:22
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• 25:24
  Speaker 6: Saving money in an IRA or a four to oh
• 25:26
  Speaker 6: one K can provide tax advantages and are excellent ways
• 25:29
  Speaker 6: to help make sure you're financially prepared for retirement. Hy
• 25:31
  Speaker 6: This is Mike Armstrong from the Armstrong Advisory Group and
• 25:33
  Speaker 6: if you're nearing retirement, you need to be aware of
• 25:36
  Speaker 6: the federal regulations regarding required minimum distributions. Once you reach
• 25:40
  Speaker 6: a certain age, you must begin withdrawing money from these accounts.
• 25:43
  Speaker 6: Rmds can influence which accounts to withdraw from first and
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  Speaker 6: That number again, eight hundred thirty nine three four zero
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• 26:11
  Speaker 1: The proceeding was paid for by Armstrong Advisory Group, a
• 26:13
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• 26:15
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• 26:18
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• 26:23
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• 26:24
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• 26:25
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• 26:55
  Speaker 1: Trusts are essential documents that can help protect your assets
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: from the nursing home. Call Cushing and Dolman right now
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: eight six six, eight four, eight, five, six, ninet nine
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: and get their free guide called Demistifying the Top seven
• 27:04
  Speaker 1: estate Planning Trusts. Let them help determine which is right
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: for you. That's eight six six eight four, eight five,
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: six nine nine, or request the guide online by visiting
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: their website at Legal Exchange show dot com. The proceeding
• 27:14
  Speaker 1: was paid for in The views expressed are solely those
• 27:16
  Speaker 1: of Cushing and Dolan. Cushing and Dolan and or Armstrong
• 27:18
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• 27:21
  Speaker 1: and Dolan and Armstrong Advisory do not endorse each other
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: and are not affiliated. You're listening to the Legal Exchange
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: and it's time for Ask Todd, the segment where Todd
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: will answer your questions about anything and everything that's included
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: in the estate planning process. Once again, here's Todd, Lutsky
• 27:38
  Speaker 1: and Susan Powers.
• 27:41
  Speaker 2: Welcome back, Todd. We have a few questions from listeners.
• 27:44
  Speaker 2: First question comes from Chris and Charlton mass And Chris writes,
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: my father transferred his home to me and my sister,
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: and he has a life estate. Okay, I've been living
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: with him for the last eight years while caring for him.
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: He is now going into a new home. Will the
• 28:01
  Speaker 2: property be at risk for the nursing home? My sister
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: is trying to get me to move out so she
• 28:07
  Speaker 2: can sell it. Is this legal?
• 28:10
  Speaker 3: Wow? Okay, Well, here's the whole thing. We've talked a
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: lot about life estates in the past, pros and cons
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: of life estates. Do I love this arrangement?
• 28:23
  Speaker 1: No?
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: I don't love this arrangement. I mean, I think he
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: should have used a trust. In my opinion, I think
• 28:29
  Speaker 3: you would have prevented some of these issues with the trust.
• 28:32
  Speaker 3: But let's just play out the string. So with the
• 28:36
  Speaker 3: life estate arrangement, since I'm assuming it was done more
• 28:39
  Speaker 3: than five years. Eight years, yeah, eight years, because she
• 28:42
  Speaker 3: was providing care right, So we have a couple of
• 28:45
  Speaker 3: things going on here. We actually probably have a caretaker
• 28:47
  Speaker 3: child exception, not that we need it, but I think
• 28:49
  Speaker 3: you kind of have that as a belt and suspend
• 28:51
  Speaker 3: her argument. So I think right here we have the
• 28:54
  Speaker 3: ability the fact that this house was transferred more than
• 28:57
  Speaker 3: five years ago, and he reserve the right to live there.
• 29:01
  Speaker 3: So in English that means there's a little nugget of
• 29:03
  Speaker 3: ownership that he keeps. That's called the present right to
• 29:07
  Speaker 3: live in the house. He's entitled to live there. He's
• 29:10
  Speaker 3: the present owner, and he gets to pay all the
• 29:12
  Speaker 3: bills and he collects all the income that the trust
• 29:15
  Speaker 3: would generate. So good for him. He has, at that
• 29:21
  Speaker 3: moment eight years ago, made a completed gift of the
• 29:26
  Speaker 3: remainder interest to the staughters. So two daughters now own it,
• 29:33
  Speaker 3: so they have a vested, completed gift of a remainder
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: interest made. Technically, he should have filed a gift tax return.
• 29:40
  Speaker 3: There may or may not have been any gift tax too,
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: because we're under the thirteen million dollars today a gift
• 29:47
  Speaker 3: tax exemption. Even back then eight years ago it was
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: still pretty high, so likely no gift tax. But nevertheless,
• 29:54
  Speaker 3: that's how it's set up. So what do the kids own.
• 29:57
  Speaker 3: They don't they really own a vested future interest in
• 30:01
  Speaker 3: the property because he's still alive. He's still to right.
• 30:05
  Speaker 3: So now the question is, you know they is it
• 30:08
  Speaker 3: protected from the nursing home. We can answer that now stop, Yes, okay,
• 30:11
  Speaker 3: it's protected from nurs so there's a benefit here. The
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: benefit here is that it is protected from the nursing
• 30:17
  Speaker 3: home and it's been done more than five years ago.
• 30:22
  Speaker 3: They will put a lean on his piece, his nugget,
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: but it won't matter because if you don't sell it.
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: Why there's there's some important information here about the sisters
• 30:37
  Speaker 3: saying I'm trying to sell it. Well, maybe selling it
• 30:39
  Speaker 3: is not a good idea, right, he's going into the
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: nursing home. If we don't sell it, they'll put a
• 30:43
  Speaker 3: lien on it. But if he dies with the life estate,
• 30:46
  Speaker 3: the life estate vanishes when you die along with the lean,
• 30:52
  Speaker 3: and it avoids probate, so there's no way for the
• 30:56
  Speaker 3: an at death lean to be attached because of it's probate.
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: So now it would pass free of probate, free of leans,
• 31:04
  Speaker 3: to the children with a brand new step up in
• 31:08
  Speaker 3: basis because it would have been included in his estate
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: on the date of death, full value, but not probate
• 31:15
  Speaker 3: and not subject to the nursing home lean anymore. Lifetime
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: that's why. So if you sell it during life, what
• 31:21
  Speaker 3: would happen? A portion depending you have to look at
• 31:24
  Speaker 3: his age, and then you have to go to an
• 31:26
  Speaker 3: irs table and that will tell you what percentage of
• 31:31
  Speaker 3: the proceeds goes to the life tenant. So I don't
• 31:36
  Speaker 3: know how old he is, but let's say let's say
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: he's eighty, he could get twenty percent of the proceeds,
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: maybe maybe twenty five percentage.
• 31:44
  Speaker 2: Think he gets you know, it's a good house, and
• 31:47
  Speaker 2: it's you know, it's he gets two and a grand.
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean if he gets, if it's a decent
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: sized value, he could end up with a big chunk
• 31:54
  Speaker 3: of money. Well, now he's got money that the nursing
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: home is going to take. Why would you do that?
• 31:58
  Speaker 3: Why would you convert this? He's going in the nursing home.
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: We can get him on Medicaid. Why would we sell
• 32:03
  Speaker 3: it and convert it to get money when we would
• 32:05
  Speaker 3: screw up his Medicaid eligibility. Not to mention the fact
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: there'll be a capital gains tax that likely will be paid,
• 32:11
  Speaker 3: because now we've got a big problem that only a
• 32:14
  Speaker 3: small portion went to him, which is his primary residence. Arguably,
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: so he would get a deduct, he would get an exclusion.
• 32:21
  Speaker 3: But if the kids don't live there, they're going to
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: get a bigger chunk of the money, I e. Early inheritance,
• 32:26
  Speaker 3: which I don't love about life estates. But if they
• 32:30
  Speaker 3: don't live there, the portion of the money that goes
• 32:32
  Speaker 3: to them is going to be subject capital gains tax.
• 32:36
  Speaker 2: Where if they just wait, hold your horses, sister, go.
• 32:39
  Speaker 3: On medicaid, rent the house if you want to. If
• 32:42
  Speaker 3: you don't want to maintain it, that's fine, or just
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: maintain it when Dad dies. You will get it with
• 32:49
  Speaker 3: a full step up in basis no probate. You could
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: sell it the next day, have zero capital gains tax
• 32:58
  Speaker 3: and pocket all the money. So, folks, there's a lot
• 33:01
  Speaker 3: to think about here, and don't just sell it. So
• 33:06
  Speaker 3: I hope that helps folks better than this. If this
• 33:11
  Speaker 3: was just put in a Medicaid irrevocable trust, you wouldn't
• 33:13
  Speaker 3: have had any of these problems. Right, You still have
• 33:15
  Speaker 3: the questions, but the trust provides so much more control.
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: If you sell it during life, you have no capital
• 33:21
  Speaker 3: gains tax because it's a grant to our trust. Folks,
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: there's way more control for you as the creator of
• 33:28
  Speaker 3: the trust. With an irrevocable Medicaid trust, then you'll ever
• 33:32
  Speaker 3: have with this life estate arrangement. So I don't love this,
• 33:35
  Speaker 3: but for you, medicaid planning might not be right. There's
• 33:39
  Speaker 3: seven trusts in this guide. If you haven't started your
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: estate plan, call and get this guide. Learn which trust
• 33:46
  Speaker 3: is right for you so that you can start your
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: estate planning eight six six eight four eight five six
• 33:54
  Speaker 3: ninety nine or Legal Exchange Show dot com again eight
• 33:58
  Speaker 3: six six eight four eight five six ninety nine or
• 34:02
  Speaker 3: Legal Exchange Show dot com.
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: Our last question comes from Renee in Worcester. My mother
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: passed away recently and named me as the executor. In
• 34:11
  Speaker 2: reviewing her account statements, it appears she gave a lot
• 34:14
  Speaker 2: of money to my brother over the past year. Can
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: we deduct this amount from his portion of his inheritance?
• 34:20
  Speaker 2: I don't think my mother fully understood what she was
• 34:22
  Speaker 2: doing before she died, and I think he may have
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: taken advantage of that.
• 34:27
  Speaker 3: Well, so can you Well, first of all, it doesn't
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: sound like there's any trust involved here, is there? Beflus,
• 34:33
  Speaker 3: she's gone, she passed away, she died, so it's kind
• 34:35
  Speaker 3: of hard to change anything after you've died, very hard, right,
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: So in this case, you know, can you deduct what
• 34:45
  Speaker 3: you think the brother got sounds like through undue influence.
• 34:52
  Speaker 2: That's what she's in inferring here.
• 34:54
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I hear that sort of in the back of
• 34:56
  Speaker 3: my mind based on what she's saying. So quick answer,
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: can you deduct it? No, not automatically. It's you got
• 35:04
  Speaker 3: to follow whatever the estate planning language is that's in
• 35:08
  Speaker 3: place on the date of her death. You know, if
• 35:10
  Speaker 3: it's a will, it's a will. If there's a trust
• 35:12
  Speaker 3: and it has language, then you've got to follow the trust.
• 35:15
  Speaker 3: That's it. But can always sue. It's not pretty, but
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: because she died and this is how things were left,
• 35:26
  Speaker 3: that might be all you're left with. So it's not pretty,
• 35:30
  Speaker 3: it's ugly, it's expensive, and you're not going to talk
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: to each other anymore. But if you're willing to go
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: through all of that, if this is enough money to
• 35:39
  Speaker 3: make that lawsuit worth it, then what you have to
• 35:42
  Speaker 3: do is you're going to have to bring an action
• 35:45
  Speaker 3: against this We'll bring it through the estate, I suppose,
• 35:48
  Speaker 3: but against this person, saying this person unduly influenced her
• 35:56
  Speaker 3: and therefore these assets should not have gone to him,
• 36:00
  Speaker 3: and you're going to have to bring some kind of
• 36:02
  Speaker 3: an action to force that to be adjusted.
• 36:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, what about those folks todd that have lent money
• 36:08
  Speaker 2: to their children and it's a legitimate loan, which you know,
• 36:13
  Speaker 2: lend money to your kids. You have to assume you're not
• 36:14
  Speaker 2: going to get back. But can they forgive that in
• 36:18
  Speaker 2: their documents? Like if they have a loan that's outstanding,
• 36:20
  Speaker 2: can they say, Okay, if it is not paid back
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: by the time I die, that's part of your inheritance
• 36:26
  Speaker 2: and you don't have to pay it back.
• 36:28
  Speaker 3: Absolutely so. In fact, there's two ways of doing this,
• 36:32
  Speaker 3: you know. One you see people make loans during their
• 36:34
  Speaker 3: life and then they're supposed to be these monthly payments,
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: and sometimes you see them forgiving monthly payment after monthly payment. Yeah,
• 36:42
  Speaker 3: and if you do, you're allowed to do that their
• 36:45
  Speaker 3: gifts every time you forgive it. But you can put
• 36:47
  Speaker 3: language in your document that says, with regard to promisory
• 36:51
  Speaker 3: note XYZ, I forgive the outstanding balance, but treat it
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: as an advancement, so it offsets whatever that amount is.
• 36:59
  Speaker 3: We give that amount to the other kids first.
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: Gosh.
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: So there you go. Folks. Learn how these trusts work.
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: They can do so many things for you. Eight sixty
• 37:06
  Speaker 3: six eight, four, eight, five, six, nine nine, or Legal
• 37:10
  Speaker 3: Exchange Show dot com.
• 37:12
  Speaker 2: If you have a question you would like to ask Todd,
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: visit his website Legal Exchange Show dot com and click
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: on the ask Tod tab. Maybe I'll be able to
• 37:21
  Speaker 2: read your question on the air, and hopefully his answer
• 37:23
  Speaker 2: will stop you from becoming one of his next real
• 37:26
  Speaker 2: life stories. You've been listening to Todd Lutsky, a partner
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: with the law firm of Cushing and Dolan. I'm Susan Powers,
• 37:33
  Speaker 2: a financial advisor with the Armstrong Advisory Group. We'll be
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: back in just a few minutes on the Legal Exchange
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: with Todd Lutsky.
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: Cushing and Dolan are experts in elder life planning and taxation.
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: They know that every family is unique and that every
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: estate plan must be different. Early planning is crucial if
• 37:50
  Speaker 1: you want to stress for your retirement, and trust are
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: oftentimes the document of choice to help protect your assets,
• 37:55
  Speaker 1: but with so many kinds of trusts, you need to
• 37:57
  Speaker 1: learn about which one is right for your plan. Revocable
• 38:00
  Speaker 1: and irrevocable trusts are most common, but there are several differences,
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: as well as numerous tax implications with each. If you
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: are ready to start your planning or need are a
• 38:08
  Speaker 1: fresh and existing plan, Call Cushing and Dolan and ask
• 38:11
  Speaker 1: for their new guide called Dmistifying the Top seven Estate
• 38:14
  Speaker 1: Planning Trusts. Learn how to protect your assets and potentially
• 38:17
  Speaker 1: eliminate your estate taxes. Call eight six six eight four
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: eight five six ninety nine right now and ask for
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: your guide today. That's eight six six eight four eight
• 38:26
  Speaker 1: five six nine nine, or request it online at Legal
• 38:29
  Speaker 1: exchange show dot com. The proceeding was paid four and
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: the views expressed are solely those of Cushing and Dolan.
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: Cushing and Dolan and or Armstrong Advisory may contact you
• 38:36
  Speaker 1: offering legal or investment services. Cushing and Dolan and Armstrong
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: Advisory do not endorse each other and are not affiliated.
• 38:41
  Speaker 4: Last year we introduced you to Mark Fodder, CEO of
• 38:44
  Speaker 4: Veterans Development Corporation. Mark is a career military man and
• 38:47
  Speaker 4: we're proud to have him back as the presenting sponsor
• 38:49
  Speaker 4: of the twenty twenty four EAV five K Boston.
• 38:52
  Speaker 8: I joined the Marine Corps when I was eighteen and
• 38:54
  Speaker 8: serve probably from nineteen eighty one to nineteen eighty four
• 38:57
  Speaker 8: as CEO of Veterans Development Corporate. My goal is to
• 39:01
  Speaker 8: give back to the veteran community, many of whom are
• 39:03
  Speaker 8: employees of this company. This is one of the reasons
• 39:06
  Speaker 8: I am so excited to be partnering with the Disabled
• 39:08
  Speaker 8: American Veterans Department of Massachusetts on this year's DAV five
• 39:12
  Speaker 8: k Boston. The DAV works tiresly to support many of
• 39:16
  Speaker 8: our disabled veterans and provide them access to critical services
• 39:20
  Speaker 8: that help them live comfortably every day. I hope to
• 39:22
  Speaker 8: be part of many more success stories of our vets
• 39:25
  Speaker 8: being able to achieve their goals and dreams when their
• 39:27
  Speaker 8: service ends.
• 39:28
  Speaker 4: Veterans Development Corporation is proud to be the presenting sponsor
• 39:31
  Speaker 4: of this year's DAV five k, taking place on Saturday,
• 39:34
  Speaker 4: November ninth at Fort Independence in South Boston. To register
• 39:38
  Speaker 4: for this year's race, visit DAV five k dot Boston.
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: Summer is coming to an end, so it's time to
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: take out your planner and book a spectacular vacation in
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: the US Virgin Islands, America's Caribbean paradise. Saint Croix, Saint
• 39:50
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• 39:53
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• 39:56
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• 39:59
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• 40:01
  Speaker 1: all the information you need to book a trip that
• 40:03
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• 40:06
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• 40:09
  Speaker 1: Croix Crucian Festival from December twenty sixth through January fourth.
• 40:12
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• 40:16
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• 40:18
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• 40:21
  Speaker 1: is simple and your stay will be hassle free. Because
• 40:24
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• 40:27
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• 40:30
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• 40:34
  Speaker 1: Go to visit USVII dot com and make your plans today.
• 40:37
  Speaker 1: That's visit USVII dot com. Your tune to the legal
• 40:43
  Speaker 1: Exchange with Todd Lutsky. If you are a loved one
• 40:46
  Speaker 1: needs a nursing homestay, call Todd right now at eight
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: six six eight four eight five six nine nine and
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: let him make sure your assets are protected. That's eight
• 40:54
  Speaker 1: six six eight four eight five six nine nine, or
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: visit him online at Legal Exchange show dot com.
• 41:02
  Speaker 2: Welcome back into the Legal Exchange with Todd Lutsky. I'm
• 41:05
  Speaker 2: Susan Powers, a financial advisors with the Armstrong Advisory Group,
• 41:10
  Speaker 2: and I'm joined, of course by Todd Lutsky, a partner
• 41:12
  Speaker 2: with a law firm of Cushing and Dolan with a
• 41:15
  Speaker 2: master's in taxation. So, Todd, when you started this show today,
• 41:19
  Speaker 2: you were talking about the different types of trusts that
• 41:22
  Speaker 2: are in your guide, and you made a comment about
• 41:25
  Speaker 2: the nominee reality trust. You said, I don't even think
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: that's really a trust. What do you mean by that?
• 41:32
  Speaker 3: What does that mean? And then if it's not a trust,
• 41:33
  Speaker 3: how come the word trust is in the name?
• 41:35
  Speaker 2: Oh, because it's written by an attorney and it depends.
• 41:40
  Speaker 3: I know it is. It's it's it's an old it's
• 41:42
  Speaker 3: really a New England kind of Massachusetts thing. It's not
• 41:46
  Speaker 3: even used in every state, but it it's something that
• 41:51
  Speaker 3: when I say it's not a trust, it's it's really
• 41:53
  Speaker 3: a principal agency relationship. It's really That's why the word
• 41:56
  Speaker 3: nominee is in there. Right, So what does it mean,
• 41:59
  Speaker 3: and why is it not a true trust? The creator
• 42:03
  Speaker 3: of the trust, right, So let's say is you, and
• 42:07
  Speaker 3: let's say you are also the set low you are
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: also the trustee of the trust. But then you read
• 42:13
  Speaker 3: through it and it says that the beneficiaries of the
• 42:15
  Speaker 3: trust are the people listed in the schedule of beneficial
• 42:19
  Speaker 3: interest attached, okay, which also can be changed over time.
• 42:24
  Speaker 3: And then if you read through a little further, you're
• 42:26
  Speaker 3: going to find little language in the document that says,
• 42:28
  Speaker 3: and this is the most important language. This is the
• 42:30
  Speaker 3: language how you know, So if you have a Nominee
• 42:33
  Speaker 3: realty trust, you'll know if it's actually a Nominee realty
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: trust or not. This language. You read down a little
• 42:40
  Speaker 3: further and it says, oh, trustee powers. The trustee shall
• 42:45
  Speaker 3: have no power to deal with the trust property unless
• 42:52
  Speaker 3: directed by all the beneficiaries.
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: So if I put my house into a Nominee reality trust, yes,
• 42:58
  Speaker 2: and my kids are listed in the beneficiaries.
• 43:01
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 43:02
  Speaker 2: That sounds like they have way more control than I
• 43:06
  Speaker 2: would like them.
• 43:07
  Speaker 3: So if you wanted to sell this property, they would
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: have to instruct you to sell the property so that
• 43:13
  Speaker 3: you don't get to decide.
• 43:14
  Speaker 2: That's permission, and I'm not dead yet, So why are
• 43:17
  Speaker 2: they the beneficiaries already the owners?
• 43:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and so I think you've just now crossed another bridge.
• 43:23
  Speaker 3: So one you were talking about control, which they have
• 43:27
  Speaker 3: clearly and I don't. But in reality they are really
• 43:31
  Speaker 3: also the beneficial owner currently of the property. Legal title,
• 43:36
  Speaker 3: I guess is in the realty trust, but beneficial ownership
• 43:41
  Speaker 3: transfers immediately to the people listed in the beneficiary. Now
• 43:45
  Speaker 3: why is this important? Not only have I not really
• 43:49
  Speaker 3: kept control over the item that I put in here,
• 43:53
  Speaker 3: depending on who the beneficiary is, but I also have
• 43:57
  Speaker 3: made it maybe have made a completed gift. I mean,
• 44:00
  Speaker 3: you're not thinking about this, but if you put property
• 44:02
  Speaker 3: into this Nominee realty trust and the beneficiaries are all
• 44:05
  Speaker 3: the kids, well then arguably they own the property right now,
• 44:09
  Speaker 3: and you've made a completed gift. So you've got to
• 44:12
  Speaker 3: be very careful that of who you list. Now, lots
• 44:15
  Speaker 3: of times you'll find that these Nominee realty trusts are
• 44:19
  Speaker 3: set up. You know, mom and dad put it in
• 44:22
  Speaker 3: and mom and dad are the beneficiaries. Well that's less
• 44:26
  Speaker 3: bad because.
• 44:27
  Speaker 2: It's a big old boomerang, isn't it Just a circle.
• 44:30
  Speaker 3: Right, you just took the house and from your name,
• 44:32
  Speaker 3: put it in the trust, put it right back in
• 44:33
  Speaker 3: your name. It's not really doing anything. It's not avoiding
• 44:36
  Speaker 3: a state tax, it's not really avoiding probate, and it's
• 44:38
  Speaker 3: not really helping at all. It didn't hurt, but it's
• 44:41
  Speaker 3: not helping. So but be careful, go ahead.
• 44:46
  Speaker 2: What's the point?
• 44:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Well, normally how are they used?
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: That's a great quation, like why would you even use these?
• 44:52
  Speaker 3: So normally how they're used and why they're used is
• 44:56
  Speaker 3: there's a sense of privacy with them. Right If, in fact,
• 44:59
  Speaker 3: I put it in to a nominee realty trust and
• 45:01
  Speaker 3: the schedule of beneficiaries is my family revocable trust, Well
• 45:06
  Speaker 3: that's okay. Because I'm trustee of my trust, I still
• 45:09
  Speaker 3: control it and it's now in an estate planning vehicle
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: and at the registry nobody knows who the beneficiaries are
• 45:16
  Speaker 3: of these realty trusts. The realty trust gets recorded, but
• 45:19
  Speaker 3: not the beneficiary schedule, so nobody really knows who owns
• 45:23
  Speaker 3: the property.
• 45:24
  Speaker 2: Privacy.
• 45:24
  Speaker 3: It's a little privacy thing, and sometimes that could work,
• 45:27
  Speaker 3: but I don't love these. They can create way more
• 45:29
  Speaker 3: problems than good. So, folks, it is the number one
• 45:34
  Speaker 3: item listed in the Top seven Estate Planning Trust guide
• 45:37
  Speaker 3: that we're giving away brand new for this month, and
• 45:40
  Speaker 3: it really needs to be understood. All seven of these
• 45:43
  Speaker 3: trusts explains how the taxes work, explains who the trustees are,
• 45:48
  Speaker 3: the beneficiaries, It explains operationally how they work during the
• 45:52
  Speaker 3: day during your lifetime. Rather, so, learn how all these
• 45:57
  Speaker 3: trusts work help you decide which trust is right for you,
• 46:03
  Speaker 3: so you can then begin your estate planning eight sixty
• 46:06
  Speaker 3: six eight four eight five six ninety nine or Legal
• 46:11
  Speaker 3: exchange Show dot com. You can download it there again
• 46:14
  Speaker 3: eight six six eight four eight five six nine nine
• 46:19
  Speaker 3: Legal exchange Show dot Com.
• 46:22
  Speaker 2: So let's say I did this and my kids are
• 46:24
  Speaker 2: listed as beneficiaries. What if I want to sell my house?
• 46:28
  Speaker 2: How do I do that?
• 46:29
  Speaker 3: Well, I think I think you're gonna you're gonna need
• 46:32
  Speaker 3: and you're gonna need the children to authorize the sale,
• 46:38
  Speaker 3: right authorize and direct the trustee. So it's called an
• 46:41
  Speaker 3: authorization and direction of beneficiaries, and they authorize the trustee
• 46:47
  Speaker 3: to either transfer the property, so lots of times you'll
• 46:50
  Speaker 3: see them change the schedule of beneficiaries or hey, I
• 46:53
  Speaker 3: want to take it and transfer the property out, and
• 46:55
  Speaker 3: then the trustee files a trustee certificate saying at the
• 46:59
  Speaker 3: red saying I've been told by all the beneficiaries and
• 47:04
  Speaker 3: they've consented to this particular transfer, and then you can
• 47:08
  Speaker 3: do it, okay, and then it's followed by actual deed work.
• 47:12
  Speaker 2: Okay. So if you've got someone who's listening right now
• 47:16
  Speaker 2: and they're saying, uh uh, I don't want this, can
• 47:19
  Speaker 2: it be undone? Maybe they didn't understand what they were doing.
• 47:23
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah, I think it can be. I mean, it's
• 47:26
  Speaker 3: just a simple matter of saying I want to change
• 47:28
  Speaker 3: the schedule of beneficiaries. Remember this is technically a revocable trust.
• 47:33
  Speaker 3: This trust is revocable, amendable, changeable. In fact, the schedule
• 47:38
  Speaker 3: of beneficiaries are allowed to be changed during life anytime,
• 47:41
  Speaker 3: at the direction of the beneficiaries. So at this point
• 47:45
  Speaker 3: you can say that the beneficiaries can direct that we
• 47:49
  Speaker 3: do a change to the beneficiary schedule and say, now
• 47:53
  Speaker 3: we authorize and direct the beneficiaries to be changed too.
• 47:57
  Speaker 3: Mom and dad. Yeah, so now it goes back to
• 48:00
  Speaker 3: mom and dad, And mind you, we have never reached
• 48:04
  Speaker 3: we never did anything with the deed right, and that's
• 48:06
  Speaker 3: why a lot of people like this. You can technically
• 48:09
  Speaker 3: change ownership of the property amongst the beneficiaries without ever
• 48:15
  Speaker 3: changing or refiling a deed. It just stays in the
• 48:18
  Speaker 3: Nominee Realty Trust and you keep changing who the beneficiaries are,
• 48:22
  Speaker 3: which means those are the new owners of the property.
• 48:25
  Speaker 3: And so, yes, that can be done, but I think
• 48:27
  Speaker 3: you're going to need a little cooperation.
• 48:29
  Speaker 2: If you get along.
• 48:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, but hopefully I don't know what people have put
• 48:34
  Speaker 3: in here. Sometimes generally it's real estate, but sometimes people
• 48:39
  Speaker 3: use it to put brokerage accounts in which could be
• 48:42
  Speaker 3: done so, but if not, you know, you would hope
• 48:45
  Speaker 3: that there's a lot of other assets that you could threaten,
• 48:47
  Speaker 3: what disinheritance if they don't cooperate.
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: You have to be able to have that threat.
• 48:52
  Speaker 3: You gotta keep control. You all, my clients need to
• 48:56
  Speaker 3: be in what I like to call a position of
• 48:58
  Speaker 3: strength during their.
• 48:59
  Speaker 2: Life over the kids, no doubt. So let me ask
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: you this because I m vision, Okay, you're filing the
• 49:07
  Speaker 2: Nominee Reality Trust. You're recording it right, but not recording
• 49:12
  Speaker 2: the schedule of beneficiaries.
• 49:13
  Speaker 3: Correct, absolutely correct.
• 49:15
  Speaker 2: These two documents could be separated.
• 49:18
  Speaker 3: They are separated.
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: What do you do if you can't put your hand
• 49:22
  Speaker 2: on that beneficiary schedule? What happens?
• 49:24
  Speaker 1: Then?
• 49:24
  Speaker 3: Well, Susan, you're asking the question that happens ninety nine
• 49:27
  Speaker 3: percent of the time. I would swear when I ask.
• 49:30
  Speaker 3: When I meet the clients and they bring in their
• 49:33
  Speaker 3: existing estate plan and they show me, I always say, oh, okay,
• 49:35
  Speaker 3: you got a nominie real tay stress, Okay, that's great.
• 49:37
  Speaker 3: Can you tell me who the beneficiaries are? And they
• 49:39
  Speaker 3: frantically flip to the back of the thing and they go,
• 49:41
  Speaker 3: it's not here, No, what's never there? And I can
• 49:44
  Speaker 3: almost never find it. So what you need to do
• 49:47
  Speaker 3: then is just have a heart to heart conversation with
• 49:50
  Speaker 3: the client. Say, when you set this up, what did
• 49:53
  Speaker 3: you intend? What was your you know wish? Did you
• 49:58
  Speaker 3: want to give this to your children? Oh no, no,
• 50:00
  Speaker 3: we never did that. It must have been us as
• 50:02
  Speaker 3: the beneficiaries. Then do a confirmatory schedule of beneficiaries. Perfectly
• 50:07
  Speaker 3: allowed to be done. Yeah, it's being confirmed by the
• 50:11
  Speaker 3: donors that this is their wish. They can't find the original,
• 50:16
  Speaker 3: so the original is what they remember it to be.
• 50:20
  Speaker 3: And I think that's what you have to do. You
• 50:22
  Speaker 3: have to fix it that way. Folks. Top seven estate
• 50:27
  Speaker 3: planning trusts out there. You've never done your estate plan
• 50:32
  Speaker 3: learn which one of these trusts is right for you.
• 50:35
  Speaker 3: This describes it so you can start your estate planning
• 50:38
  Speaker 3: off on the right foot eight six six eight four
• 50:41
  Speaker 3: eight five six nine nine or Legal Exchange show dot Com.
• 50:47
  Speaker 2: Todd Letske from the law firm of Cushing and Dolan,
• 50:49
  Speaker 2: thank you so much.
• 50:50
  Speaker 3: Thank you, Susan, always a pleasure.
• 50:52
  Speaker 2: I'm Susan Power as a financial advisor with the Armstrong
• 50:55
  Speaker 2: Advisory Group. We thank you for joining us today and
• 50:57
  Speaker 2: we'll be back again next week on the Legal Exchange
• 51:00
  Speaker 2: with Todd Lutsky.
• 51:02
  Speaker 1: Cushing and Dolan are experts in elder life planning and taxation.
• 51:05
  Speaker 1: They know that every family is unique and that every
• 51:08
  Speaker 1: estate plan must be different. Early planning is crucial if
• 51:11
  Speaker 1: you want to stress for your retirement, and trusts are
• 51:13
  Speaker 1: oftentimes the document of choice to help protect your assets.
• 51:16
  Speaker 1: But with so many kinds of trusts, you need to
• 51:19
  Speaker 1: learn about which one is right for your plan. Revocable
• 51:21
  Speaker 1: and irrevocable trusts are most common, but there are several
• 51:24
  Speaker 1: differences as well. As numerous tax implications with each. If
• 51:28
  Speaker 1: you are ready to start your planning or need are a
• 51:30
  Speaker 1: fresh and existing plan, call Cushing and Dolan and ask
• 51:32
  Speaker 1: for their new guide called Dmistifying the Top seven Estate
• 51:35
  Speaker 1: Planning Trusts. Learn how to protect your assets and potentially
• 51:38
  Speaker 1: eliminate your estate taxes. Call eight six six eight four
• 51:42
  Speaker 1: eight five six ninety nine right now and ask for
• 51:45
  Speaker 1: your guide today. That's eight six six eight four eight
• 51:47
  Speaker 1: five six nine nine, or request it online at legal
• 51:50
  Speaker 1: exchange show dot com. The proceeding was paid for and
• 51:53
  Speaker 1: the views expressed are solely those of Cushing and Dolan.
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: Cushing and Dolan and or Armstrong Advisory may contact you
• 51:57
  Speaker 1: offering legal or investment services. Cushing and Dolan and are
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: Strong Advisory do not endorse each other and are not affiliated.
• 52:02
  Speaker 6: Saving money in an IRA or a four to oh
• 52:04
  Speaker 6: one K can provide tax advantages and are excellent ways
• 52:07
  Speaker 6: to help make sure you're financially prepared for retirement. Ay
• 52:10
  Speaker 6: this is Mike Armstrong from the Armstrong Advisory Group, and
• 52:12
  Speaker 6: if you're nearing retirement, you need to be aware of
• 52:14
  Speaker 6: the federal regulations regarding required minimum distributions once you reach
• 52:19
  Speaker 6: a certain age you must begin withdrawing money from these accounts.
• 52:22
  Speaker 6: Rm ds can influence which accounts to withdraw from first,
• 52:25
  Speaker 6: and how much you'll owe in taxes during retirement. If
• 52:27
  Speaker 6: you need information regarding the rules related to rmds, call
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