Latest / TFTC: A Bitcoin Podcast / #737: Preparing For Post Quantum Era with Pubkey

Transcript

#737: Preparing For Post Quantum Era with Pubkey · TFTC: A Bitcoin Podcast

• 0:00
  I think college football is is still fine college basketball decimated college football as long as
• 0:05
  you are the richest athletic department in the country is still cool which happens to be my
• 0:10
  preferred university University Texas um high school football will never die um as long as
• 0:17
  you're in Texas so that's fine but the nil right was yeah like yeah this is atrocious and the
• 0:23
  transfer window it's so funny that the president is talking about this just make them a minor league
• 0:27
  i mean that's i think that it's going to like a farm system type thing i was we were talking
• 0:31
  about that earlier actually um about how like you know smaller schools are you have to adjust and
• 0:36
  find a niche it's like hey our role is going to be we're going to take the backups from penn state
• 0:42
  that didn't get any playing time we're talking about wrestling in particular they're going to
• 0:46
  come here they're going to have a great year we're going to pay them 10 grand and then they're going
• 0:49
  to make half a million bucks um you know somewhere else that's going to make our program like the
• 0:54
  program that you got to come to it's totally different from what college sports have always
• 0:57
  been but i think we're going to figure it out i think this is like kind of problematic for bitcoiners
• 1:02
  in particular because like you want bitcoin to be at least somewhat relatable to like normcore
• 1:07
  and like sports ball is a big part of that but like when you look into the way tax dollars are
• 1:13
  deployed to support all college but also like new stadiums and like the non-profit status of the nfl
• 1:20
  it's like it's pretty antithetical i would say to bitcoiners ethos to be into sports
• 1:26
  it's fucking bad why am i good to sports college across yeah
• 1:31
  listen libby don though you know it do be having uh benefits
• 1:38
  he's really good yeah insane the like the that's what i was the one for a sport like i do i actually
• 1:45
  coincidentally enough the next day the parade is when satoshi launched a white paper no shit
• 1:55
  yeah so i was running around broad street as a 17 year old not knowing that satoshi was going
• 2:00
  to change my life wow i used to be horribly horribly addicted to baseball i love baseball
• 2:04
  the yankees completely broke my heart with the new stadium it's it's a very complicated
• 2:09
  relationship now like they absolutely just decimated my like favorite thing citizens
• 2:15
  bank park one of the best stadiums in all the stadium uh pirates it's a great one too pirate
• 2:20
  stadium is amazing does that make it more or less likely that satoshi was as a philadelphian and i
• 2:26
  mean freedom obviously yeah freedom but like would he have been too hung over to launch bitcoin he
• 2:31
  was talking about trying a lot maybe maybe yeah but go back to the bitcoin talk.org early days
• 2:37
  there was trank brought up uh quite a bit kidding we're working on that time we're working um yeah i
• 2:45
  Similarly, growing up, diehard Rangers fan,
• 2:48
  watched 60-plus games a year with my dad.
• 2:52
  Is this Texas or New York?
• 2:54
  Texas Rangers.
• 2:55
  Okay, the lesser Rangers.
• 2:56
  Yes.
• 2:57
  Broke my heart in 2011, 2012,
• 3:00
  those back-to-back World Series that they lost in Game 7.
• 3:03
  Yeah.
• 3:05
  And I just haven't been able to.
• 3:06
  Was CJ on the team back then?
• 3:07
  I think he was a couple years before then.
• 3:09
  But yeah, that was.
• 3:10
  He was Angels?
• 3:11
  It still just blows my mind.
• 3:12
  He was Angels and Rangers.
• 3:13
  He was like a friend of mine.
• 3:14
  yeah because i was like i remember like watching cj on tv and i remember we went to pull those at
• 3:18
  one time i sat down i was sitting next to cj wilson i was like holy fuck is this cj wilson
• 3:21
  he was a golden glove or one yeah i was like oh my god yeah you're here and you're cool and
• 3:27
  can i get a lease we're getting into a subject that uh what are your thoughts on on sports ball
• 3:34
  you're all uh you're all in this just extended daycare universe
• 3:46
  mental daycare
• 3:49
  what sports do i watch thank you for asking uh olympic rowing
• 3:58
  twins yeah wingle boss twins yeah last sporting event i cared they were they were good you knew
• 4:06
  their splits their senior year at harvard dude they they actually founded the rival rowing club
• 4:12
  to my rowing club mainly because my rowing club was too was too jank for them philly's great philly's
• 4:19
  great rowing city i've rode there many a time the schuylkill thomas akins really the american
• 4:24
  realist painter uh one of the greatest american artists his subjects were nearly
• 4:31
  well i would say they were predominated by rowers yeah uh
• 4:36
  everybody's cracking up in the background if you if you don't know thomas akins the joke is on you
• 4:43
  yeah you're on culture you're you're unironically unaware of american art if you don't know thomas
• 4:49
  taken Christian's parents you know what I found out that's right you know what I found out uh my
• 4:54
  boys go to a Catholic school in the area and it's probably got a docks where they go to school so
• 4:58
  maybe I shouldn't but like Norman Rockwell used to work out of it Rockwell man I thought he was
• 5:04
  Chicago I think he I think he traveled a lot but yeah yeah he had uh he had that awesome oh he's
• 5:11
  got the meme the man standing up standing up yeah yeah very brave yeah what's a Norman Rockwell
• 5:16
  feeling that you have right now about the world well actually if you guys uh look at the thumbnails
• 5:20
  on tftc every prompt i put in the mid journey is an oil painting in the style of norman rockwell
• 5:25
  so if you that is the sort of basis for all of our i'm sorry i have not been consuming every
• 5:31
  scrap of ai slop you've thrown my way do you do you do you write the bent anymore
• 5:37
  the bent yes you just click print every day you haven't cheated once with ai for a bent
• 5:46
  no that's impressive for the bent no i'm not sure i believe it but keep going no that is that is
• 5:52
  artisanal writing there that is from the hands i respect that that's man can we i would i would
• 5:57
  be interested to see a histogram of bent topics we can actually do that um someone someone crunched
• 6:05
  numbers we talked about last night the first band ever was a uh mentions mold mold bug please really
• 6:10
  it was on uh bitcoin is money money is a bubble money is a bubble bitcoin is money or i heard he's
• 6:15
  satoshi actually so um i wrote a weekly blog when i was at fidelity for for a while i was writing a
• 6:23
  weekly blog that was like a network update like a market update and then some stuff and i uh i
• 6:30
  I still am a big fan of, uh, great man.
• 6:32
  Mercy.
• 6:33
  Yeah.
• 6:34
  Trilemma.
• 6:35
  Um, but a very difficult blog to, um, uh, look through when you're at work because 80% of it is just on like it's long format blog posts of like obscure, like hardcore porn.
• 6:47
  And it was a randomizer.
• 6:49
  So I'm like looking for something that he wrote on like Bitcoin, a specific like blog post that I remember.
• 6:53
  And you have to like go through it and it's like Brazilian fart porn.
• 6:56
  it's like you know Taiwanese feet like all this stuff and uh one day I got I got called by IT it's
• 7:03
  just like you need to fucking stop it do you think he's dead huh do you think he's dead I hope not I
• 7:09
  don't think so I think that it could be so it could be a self-canceling I've surfed that beachy
• 7:13
  quote-unquote died on Playa Hermosa and Haco Costa Rica and I've probably surfed there four or five
• 7:19
  times and it's like well known in the area like it's a heavy short break like you don't go in
• 7:23
  dangerous he died surfing yeah is the story no i thought he i thought he was frolicking in the
• 7:28
  waves with a bunch of women no no he was surfing was he yeah okay that's more plausible and i think
• 7:32
  that he was learning to surf i don't think that yeah that's not where you want to learn to surf
• 7:35
  i will say rest in peace i do have a an unironic chad friend late late chad who uh joined the
• 7:45
  marines and did die surfing and he was you know he was strapped yeah it's a sport what's the what's
• 7:54
  the what's the what i believe it was in uh believe it was in galveston it was also dirt
• 7:59
  isn't this yeah it was in texas well known for surfing well it was texas well it was it was
• 8:06
  during it was during her it wasn't it wasn't what was the hurricane of 21 not not saying irene yeah
• 8:16
  it was irene came up here harvey harvey was the one i think where it just like dumped water well
• 8:22
  i i believe and i i apologize if i'm if i'm uh if i'm speaking falsehood on his name but i i think
• 8:33
  he tried to surf the hurricane and uh perished yeah that's when the waves get best times you eat
• 8:39
  the bar that's the one the waves get best in jersey the hurricane i almost died hurricane uh
• 8:45
  dennis 2009 yeah peak condition man coming off my senior year of lacrosse summer of surfing but
• 8:51
  uh i ride a longboard it's like nine foot oh did is that what is was that your saving grace
• 8:57
  no because uh i was sir i mean keita you're laughing but you know how big the waves can
• 9:04
  get september when a hurricane swell comes i i was like two hours into a session just caught
• 9:08
  a wave it was like i got one more in me um started paddling out rubber arms clean up set
• 9:14
  comes i'm on my 90 climbing the peak crest over me land on the water 200 yards out on my backboard
• 9:21
  on top leash snaps that's like butterfly paddle in bro like uh almost drowned the board was the loss
• 9:29
  it just went to the the shore who's there okay yeah yeah if i were a surfer i would simply not
• 9:36
  surf during a hurricane it's fun dude dude if you live if you lived on a if you live next to a
• 9:43
  uh a pretty low stakes beach you you might you might be tempted galveston galveston
• 9:49
  avoiding vietnamese shrimp boats
• 9:52
  good grief that's san antonio the six the six foot swells should we uh should we talk about
• 10:02
  bitcoin at all or we just have yeah we could do that why are we here we're here uh yeah wait but
• 10:06
  we've got back to galveston the best thing about bitcoin is it's fucking boring and dead it's over
• 10:11
  it's great i'm the most like at peace with the world dude bitcoin is just like an
• 10:19
  NGO topic it's like freedom tech now it's over uh the spice is coming back though we're here
• 10:29
  for the op next we're at pub key the uh big topic of the day institutions saying that we're going to
• 10:36
  be quantum prepared by 2029 they're going to make sure dude i heard that brian i was sitting next to
• 10:41
  you in there what were your thoughts shut the fuck up you know i'm gonna i'm gonna try and give uh
• 10:48
  an honest charitable interpretation.
• 10:51
  You know, there are some gentlemen from, you know,
• 10:53
  various serious financial institutions.
• 10:55
  You can name them.
• 10:55
  It was a live stream.
• 10:57
  Yeah, it was like a guy from Coinbase, a guy from Anchorage.
• 11:00
  This is the serious one.
• 11:01
  A guy from BlackRock.
• 11:02
  So they were sitting up there and they were talking about like,
• 11:04
  hey, like our, you know, the whole trade for Bitcoin
• 11:08
  for these institutions, for institutional investors
• 11:10
  has been like the asymmetric upside with like, you know,
• 11:13
  very little downside.
• 11:13
  And I remember one of my favorite quotes of all time
• 11:15
  about Bitcoin came from Ross Stevens.
• 11:18
  talking about how he's like, look, if you have an exponential return profile for this asset
• 11:24
  and you eliminate the chance it goes to zero, like your mean, your average expected return just
• 11:30
  explodes, right? If the zero is gone, all of a sudden it's, you know, your mean, your mean average
• 11:35
  return is just enormous. And so I think it is fair for these investors to becoming these institutions
• 11:42
  and be like, hey, like if this quantum thing takes Bitcoin to zero, like all of a sudden my math on
• 11:47
  on where I think it's going to go, like totally changes. Now, like, it's not like this is a new
• 11:52
  topic, right? This is, this has been baked in. I do not think quantum computers are going to take
• 11:57
  Bitcoin to zero. So I think it's like a little silly to be worried about, but I do see the
• 12:01
  argument. And so from these institutions perspective, they're like, Hey, I need something
• 12:06
  to tell these investors who are, you know, getting a little worried about this, like Bitcoiners,
• 12:12
  give me a plan. What's the roadmap. Solana's figuring it out. Like, you know, right. But
• 12:16
  But it's like they don't understand how open source works.
• 12:21
  They don't understand how Bitcoin works.
• 12:24
  They're not able to parse through like the various proposals that have come up and see that like there's activity happening and people care about this.
• 12:36
  They instead are just kind of falling prey to the FUD of like Bitcoin doomed and it never going to happen which is just the same old crypto story that we been facing forever did you catch the inglorious bastards three uh
• 12:49
  three mistake that was made on stage no i didn't the coinbase guy number one he was like coinbase
• 12:54
  is like part of this community we were like we would never attack bitcoin it's like all right
• 12:58
  and he was referencing the block size wars he's like we've been in this for years like well
• 13:02
  where what were you guys doing back then and then he was uh talking about bit 361 but he kept
• 13:07
  referencing it he's like yeah we got bip 361 it was like ah it's like inglorious bastards like yeah
• 13:17
  so i mean yeah that was you know it's one of those things where it's like
• 13:23
  i don't i don't i don't envy their job in trying to calm down panicky investors who are like
• 13:29
  realizing that this they're like what what do i do and you know like that might be a little bit
• 13:34
  tough to be like you should just calm down and like let the bitcoin community figure it out like
• 13:38
  they're just as invested as you are uh and and this is all going to be fine and like there are
• 13:44
  things happening but chenco's gonna figure it out yeah like of course like chenco's gonna figure it
• 13:49
  out they they have it all written down right roast beef you know wrote a post about it recently you
• 13:53
  know um don't really know how i feel about lops proposal but you know there's stuff happening and
• 13:59
  And that's the groundwork for something eventually getting merged in if it's necessary.
• 14:07
  Yeah.
• 14:08
  Got the best cryptographers in the world working on Bitcoin.
• 14:10
  They're going to figure it out.
• 14:11
  Are they going to fire the devs, though?
• 14:13
  That's, yeah.
• 14:13
  That was a...
• 14:14
  If they've never employed the devs to begin with, can they fire them?
• 14:17
  I don't know.
• 14:18
  I don't know.
• 14:19
  This is my panel at the conference.
• 14:22
  It's me.
• 14:22
  You're reading it, right?
• 14:23
  Yeah, I'm moderating.
• 14:24
  It's me, Eric Foskel, John Attack, and Eric Lombroso.
• 14:29
  uh it's gonna be um it'll be fun what do you think Foscule's gonna say about this
• 14:35
  you know exactly what he's gonna say about this um John attacks actually really interesting
• 14:40
  obviously he was a big you know core contributor for a long time like in the the core community
• 14:46
  Eric's always been an outsider um and I think Eric and John are gonna be the most interesting ones
• 14:53
  to sort of shed a little bit of light on how things have changed I would say in the last like
• 14:58
  or six years as far as like core capital c core is concerned um it'll be interesting i'm probably
• 15:06
  not going to make a ton of friends uh with that panel but it'll be it'll be fine what's herbert's
• 15:10
  view on this does erbert have a view do you have post-death views or opinions uh yeah erbert
• 15:20
  cryptography uh we we we write our own over at urbit um go get one of the books can you pass me
• 15:29
  one of the urban yeah give me the urbit systems technical journal on top of the pac-man machine
• 15:34
  see a cocktail table see how many times quantum is in the index there uh is it in there we'll find
• 15:41
  out we'll find out thank you uh no it's it's it systems technical journal by uh christian yardley
• 15:53
  it's no it's a shame uh it's a shame jake isn't here he is a jake's a great dude jake jake's a
• 16:00
  lot of fun conversations erbit tends to try to uh figure things out from first principles and
• 16:08
  implement them as as quickly as possible um i don't think erbit uses elliptic
• 16:14
  cryptography as far as i'm aware so it's not precisely an erbit concern um the thing i like
• 16:22
  the most about erbit is they are the smartest people on the planet that are also really good
• 16:28
  natured with how hard you control the fuck out of them for like abject failures and mismanagement
• 16:34
  of the entire like project but like there's like a level of intelligence that's just like yeah i
• 16:39
  understand and you're right um however i'm way smarter than you and i'm gonna keep doing this
• 16:47
  project nevertheless she persisted
• 16:51
  it's a great i love her but uh you know we're gonna we're gonna keep showing up
• 17:00
  we're older than bitcoin don't forget that i just don't understand where the money comes from
• 17:05
  and and and then and groundwire is uh even slashing slashing the last remaining
• 17:14
  grift that erbit had which is we've you know soft forked the identity layer to include
• 17:22
  bitcoin now so you don't have to rely on ethereum and the scarce ethereum namespace is no longer
• 17:30
  you know the the motivating monetization for the for the project so we'll be running on donations
• 17:38
  from here on out and goodwill toward men that's pretty cool that's wild that's how bitcoin works
• 17:45
  curtis yarvin is the erbit guy right yes and he's appeared in like a totally different context
• 17:51
  over the last couple years he's he'll be at the conference he's speaking he has many hats i'm
• 17:55
  speaking yes he'll be what's he you know what he's talking about this conference yeah vegas
• 17:59
  yeah oh vegas i was like he's here kirby no no he actually comes through here he he did a
• 18:05
  he did a show of peter four hour four hour marathon with peter mccormick and then he went out to uh
• 18:12
  london for like a part two as well and it was another four hour marathon that's why peter's
• 18:16
  been so radicalized in the recent i think that peter's getting really into uh really into curtis
• 18:22
  as one does when you start.
• 18:24
  It's Curtis Yarvin's top guy.
• 18:25
  It's Curtis Yarvin's top guy.
• 18:28
  Curtis is great.
• 18:29
  He comes through a bunch.
• 18:30
  I'd like to do something with him here.
• 18:31
  Maybe we'll have him at Hostile Takeover.
• 18:34
  Oh, that would be fun.
• 18:36
  That would be really great.
• 18:37
  That would be fun.
• 18:38
  Potentially.
• 18:38
  Curtis, if you're listening,
• 18:39
  I'll shoot you a minute.
• 18:40
  Speaking of which,
• 18:41
  if you haven't gotten your tickets yet,
• 18:42
  what is it, 27th?
• 18:44
  Hostile Takeover.
• 18:45
  Are you selling additional tickets?
• 18:47
  What?
• 18:48
  We haven't even tranched out.
• 18:49
  Are you selling tickets?
• 18:51
  no we did the thing where you raise the prices with each tranche we just didn't tell people are
• 18:55
  you gonna do that are you are you did it in the past and we're just like oh people should expect
• 18:59
  this yeah you're you're grifting on top of the grift there's enough there's a new tranche
• 19:04
  grift deception at higher premium prices get your premium tickets to sit are you doing the school
• 19:11
  bus again no we're not doing the school bus we're taking over town nightclub which is the greatest
• 19:16
  dive barn um james o'brien is going to be djing on like one of the best sound systems in the
• 19:22
  country dang uh it's going to be it's going to be weird but he won't play blade like so the story
• 19:28
  behind the story behind uh every time i make a request he loves he loves when i go up during his
• 19:35
  set and request track by blade the story behind hostile takeover it started during the bitcoin
• 19:42
  conference in nashville and well i think you got to go back i think the max club deuce party was
• 19:47
  like the precursor to the very first thing that pub key ever did was with marty and tftc we hosted
• 19:53
  uh a pop-up at mac club deuce which is the oldest dive bar in miami and the capacity there is about
• 19:59
  80 people it's a very small dive bar uh it's amazing cigarettes and can smoke cigarettes
• 20:04
  inside you got a two-for-one special from 6 a.m until like 2 p.m uh it's a shady place for sunny
• 20:12
  people. And it's just like one of my favorite bars on the planet. But we did this thing, we had
• 20:19
  matches, the original pub key matches, and it had like a cat on it. These are collector's items at
• 20:24
  this point. And, you know, Marty and I were handing out matchbooks during the Bitcoin conference,
• 20:29
  and we're doing what? And at beefsteak? Yeah, that's right. And we're like, yeah, we're doing
• 20:35
  like a pub key pop up, you know, swing through. Nobody was really there. And a good friend of
• 20:41
  mine came in um uh shah and he was early and it was empty and he was really nervous because the
• 20:48
  bouncer didn't know anything about that he like presented he's not American he like presented his
• 20:53
  like matchbook uh and he's just what the fuck is that like yeah go inside like Thomas the bouncer
• 20:58
  does not know about the matchbooks because we were telling people this is how you get in you
• 21:02
  have to show the matchbook we started laughing fast forward a couple of hours and the line we
• 21:07
  had like 400 people on a line all the way to like washington it's on colin's place and it like
• 21:13
  wrapped around the block and the bouncer comes over he's like thomas like you know we got like
• 21:17
  a lot of people here what do you want me to do it's like yeah great like let him in he's like
• 21:20
  no you don't understand like come here like look at this line i was like oh yeah um only let people
• 21:25
  in with the matchbox it was like full circle but it started there and then we did hot style takeover
• 21:32
  and if you say it fast enough it sounds like a hostile takeover and in our third year the joke
• 21:36
  is paying off because the bitcoin conference wants it to be part of the conference so it'll be at the
• 21:41
  venetian at town nightclub monday uh april 27th from 1 to 6 p.m which gives you more than enough
• 21:49
  time to get to beefsteak at 6 30 afterwards so and if we haven't if we have critical mass that
• 21:54
  have tickets to both we'll probably get like a a party bus with stripper poles no strippers though
• 22:01
  smart yeah family man yeah you know strippers but if you want to strip
• 22:06
  like you can and we're going for what we're going for a medieval vibe with that a medieval vibe this
• 22:10
  uh this house i'll take it yeah there's gonna be a medieval theme um we got a lot of jerk what do we
• 22:15
  got there's a knight there's a knight night medieval helmets okay yeah any battle axes
• 22:26
  weapons are hard shields yeah defensive only yeah chainmail christian iconography very crusades
• 22:34
  I love that.
• 22:36
  What else do we have?
• 22:38
  A bagpiper.
• 22:39
  There's a bagpiper.
• 22:40
  There's a bagpiper.
• 22:42
  We got comedians.
• 22:48
  Comedians.
• 22:48
  We got music.
• 22:49
  We're going to have the rotating couch.
• 22:53
  This year, it's PubKey, RHR on stage.
• 22:58
  There'll be chairs.
• 22:59
  We can find a couch.
• 23:01
  We'll take a bunch of chairs together.
• 23:03
  And then the bugle boys are going to be like the old critics in the Muppets.
• 23:10
  And they'll be mic'd up just heckling like the rotation of guests that we have.
• 23:15
  And, you know, obviously Matt, Marty and I, we've been trying to get the bugle to focus on Marty and I because it doesn't work so well with Matt.
• 23:22
  He takes it personally.
• 23:24
  No, let's take us back to Nashville two years ago.
• 23:26
  You hired a roast comedian and then hid on the other side of the stage and we got roasted.
• 23:33
  uh while you were sitting behind behind him matt did that to himself if you show a roast comedian
• 23:39
  that you are angry or hurt by anything they're saying they're going to show you become the guy
• 23:44
  what did he call me like a red barber bush barbara bush yeah look at this barber i was actually i
• 23:50
  think i was wearing the shirt on stage you were you did turn into a lobster though yeah it was
• 23:55
  uh stressful and that year it was sponsored by hrf uh he uh he came out he goes good afternoon
• 24:02
  bitcoin f words uh there was a child in the in the and it's like brought to you by hrf in the
• 24:08
  background i was just like fuck but yeah that happened it happened it was fun
• 24:16
  the series continues that's a great venue i mean the uh the towel compared to that
• 24:23
  is gonna be very different very different we usually do it in dive bars um i don't love vegas
• 24:28
  It's really hard to book stuff and pull off these parties in Vegas
• 24:31
  because you got unions.
• 24:33
  You got lots of different things that make Vegas difficult.
• 24:37
  But I'm super optimistic on Tao.
• 24:38
  I think this is going in the right direction.
• 24:40
  They want their pound of flesh on everything.
• 24:41
  Yeah, a lot of middlemen.
• 24:43
  Yeah.
• 24:43
  A lot of middlemen in Vegas.
• 24:46
  I've heard there are rumors that it's the last year in Vegas.
• 24:49
  Coming back to New York.
• 24:50
  But I don't know where they're going.
• 24:54
  Hey, speaking of Solana, did Joe McCann kill that girl?
• 24:58
  wow yeah that's been what a story yeah I don't know what are what are our theories I I don't know
• 25:05
  he's clearly being extorted okay I heard this thing hello we can bribe the police constable
• 25:12
  for about you know what did Arthur Hayes say bushel of coconuts oh man that was an all-time quote
• 25:19
  yeah no the seychelles yeah but yeah this is this is tanzania though like let you know i don know if it totally different yeah it does look pretty strange his profile picture
• 25:32
  yeah i did see i will he there was like a tweet about it and he flipped it immediately so he's
• 25:38
  paying attention yeah um to the twitter noise i don't know he has his phone i thought he's in jail
• 25:43
  i have no he's not no idea what's where'd you hear that i don't know i haven't been following
• 25:49
  that closely i i don't think he's in jail at all has dan held commented on this yet wasn't he a
• 25:55
  partner at asymmetric what is what does dan have to do with this yeah or or he's a partner at
• 25:59
  asymmetric i think he raised like a defi fund with them with him we might have to cut this part
• 26:05
  speculation we don't cut here speculation yeah joe dan ashley if you're listening come on the pod
• 26:19
  come to hot style take it is terrible for you like not to make light of this but it is it is a crypto
• 26:24
  saga uh and i hope that it is an extortion scheme uh because that would probably be the best outcome
• 26:31
  here yes no favorite saga of all time that would be less i mean it's up there like what is your
• 26:37
  favorite less than murder what is my favorite crypto song that's such a good question who is
• 26:43
  the one when was he was he a solana diversity ethereum dev or he said uh the cia my girlfriend's
• 26:49
  like a spook and she ratted this oh it's the maker dow finder maker the guy who then like
• 26:54
  yeah like they're running a petto island down here like well i'm not i'm not nikolai was his
• 26:59
  name i forget what it was but yeah he like he like tweeted like my girlfriend is a is a spook
• 27:04
  they're on to me like oh yeah and he was like you know building like a you know decentralized stable
• 27:09
  coin yeah he died like 24 hours later yeah is swalwell done who swalwell the eric california
• 27:17
  guy yeah is he dead no is he done yeah yeah he resigned he is yeah but is he you know near to
• 27:25
  return oh he'll land on like a private equity board or something oh yes um how many favorite
• 27:32
  My favorite crypto saga, one of my favorite stories ever is how Steve Bannon created Ethereum.
• 27:39
  It is one of my all-time favorites.
• 27:42
  So Steve Bannon, Brock Pierce, before Bitcoin, had a World of Warcraft mining operation.
• 27:48
  And that caused Blizzard Activision to brick the in-game economy and fix it because it was really bastardizing everything.
• 27:55
  If you remember, Vitalik was in college and his account got bricked and he got really into Bitcoin because of that.
• 28:00
  um he nerd raged because they nerfed his like sort of Excalibur or something like that
• 28:05
  and he found a bitcoin magazine right after that for sure for sure but do you see the Bannon uh
• 28:10
  Epstein fit pick no no it's really good Bannon's my fashion uh fashion icon by the way it is
• 28:20
  pretty awesome he's really into utility utility pockets like cargo pants
• 28:25
  favorite i feel like there's so many and i'm i'm it's been you know crypto sagas it's like
• 28:33
  there's a new one every month big verne that was a big one cryptic verne was insane oh the guy that
• 28:39
  faked his death in india because he got diarrhea he had he had crohn's or whatever yeah the canadian
• 28:44
  quadriga yeah that was a good one that's a really that was a really good one so racist i have
• 28:50
  Crohn's disease and I went to India and pooped myself to death and then like the Bitcoin just
• 28:56
  kind of subtly moved didn't they and I was like what happened here that was a crazy one um I mean
• 29:02
  newer ones the uh the government contracting the security of the strategic reserve to some
• 29:07
  contractor and the sun just like ran off with what like 40 million in wallets was that a wig
• 29:14
  he was wearing when they took him in where the servers was who was that oh yeah the the professor
• 29:20
  lie that's like uh whatever his name is it's gone viral on youtube that jang yeah he's like the
• 29:25
  thing about bitcoin is like who's running the servers like i'm running a server like you're
• 29:30
  running you know what you got us dude yeah hands up hand up nobody's ever asked that in 15 years
• 29:35
  who can you believe because like that guy's i mean hand up guilty like i've shared some of the stuff
• 29:39
  like oh this guy's making a lot of sense and you hear something like that you're like oh this is
• 29:42
  completely what's the what's the laws of like jail man amnesia yeah jail man amnesia i know there's
• 29:46
  too much stuff like that i see that a lot i'm sorry what is gentleman amnesia when you read
• 29:51
  something in a paper that you're like an expert on some journalist is writing about and you're
• 29:54
  like this is completely wrong and then you flip the page and you read another story you're like
• 29:57
  oh well this is a good story yeah something i have that i have that so often i haven't heard
• 30:03
  working with claude with working with ai where it's like look we're doing like stuff that's not
• 30:08
  my area of expertise like man this sounds like you're really on top of it and then it comes to
• 30:11
  like a lightning thing or something where I'm like an expert.
• 30:13
  And it's like, well, you're like 80% of the way there.
• 30:17
  There's some like really,
• 30:18
  really crucial misunderstandings that are fucking up this whole response.
• 30:22
  I mean, this is important.
• 30:23
  Maybe I should get the booster.
• 30:28
  Didn't get the first two, but the booster.
• 30:30
  Why not?
• 30:31
  Good point in the conversation to warn people out there about AI psychosis.
• 30:34
  These things are tools meant to help you do things.
• 30:37
  Do not try to befriend them and have them be your life coach
• 30:40
  or help you discover breakthroughs in quantum physics churches and pubs yeah long churches and
• 30:47
  pubs everybody's gonna get that's what we're gonna do like one-on-one that's what we want to talk
• 30:51
  about like yeah the uh growth of the trend of in-person connection yeah growing moving forward
• 30:58
  so important for sure third places third places those things they are really important it's easy
• 31:05
  to make fun of it because it has become sort of just like a talking point in a deck in a pub key
• 31:10
  deck as we go out to raise more financing um you're instrumentalizing and redditifying just
• 31:18
  normal human relations everything lindy everything pure you're perverting it
• 31:25
  to sell it to your investors not everybody can just go like to the woods and work on an art
• 31:32
  project repent repent dude dude you have no idea the type of art projects that i work on
• 31:38
  the world of senior art i was i mean you have a very famous piece i was i was milling a i was
• 31:47
  milling a large oak tree the other day what are you milling it down to what are you uh
• 31:53
  into into oak trees slabs oak oak slabs nice are you gonna sell those on essay no i'm gonna make
• 32:02
  my wife a patio table oh that's nice nice it's very thoughtful because i'm trad yeah
• 32:08
  are you gonna lacquer it no no no raw oak no i i don't rock with lacquer i like uh i like tongue
• 32:19
  oil what's tongue oil from what kind of tongue t-u-n-g it's a nut uh okay t-i-l nut called tongue
• 32:30
  what books do you read to learn about milling down an oak tree dude you know it's
• 32:35
  it's the worst question you could have asked man the amish have spilled a lot of ink about
• 32:42
  woodworking man have you seen the meme about uh the amish and the mormons uh dude they're
• 32:48
  becoming majority population of the u.s i know we're we're gonna have to figure that one out
• 32:53
  are you not a big fan of mennonites or the land of day saints last line of defense this is the
• 32:58
  counterbalance yeah we need them my goodness
• 33:02
  yeah as a pennsylvanian i love the amish you know you got a writing terminal
• 33:08
  they're they come with their with their goods they're you know you know you know
• 33:12
  orbit systems technical journal is published by a mormon so okay that's good so you're in there
• 33:18
  he's gonna give me with the amish he's gonna give me a you know a lockheed martin jet pack
• 33:22
  it's gonna be awesome how do we get the mormons into bitcoin though they have like a aren't they
• 33:26
  they have a trillion dollar sovereign wealth how is salt lake sorry amish how do we get the
• 33:31
  yeah they don't like electricity so wait hold on no how is salt lake city not the biggest orbit
• 33:36
  meetup uh what was that i didn't know that the more i'm not the amish have a trillion dollar
• 33:41
  sovereign well no the more mormons right what is is they own like 10 of florida seriously yes
• 33:48
  i'm asking what what is the salt lake meetup scene no idea how is it not the biggest meetup
• 33:56
  in the country could you imagine a pub key salt lake city it would be the worst you'd have to
• 34:00
  sell dirty sodas three two beer yeah i was just out in park city which is lovely like it's it's
• 34:08
  nice no they're very strict out there like so my wife and i just parked at um uh high west distillery
• 34:15
  and we just like are peppering the bartender with questions and like how everything works and
• 34:20
  all the rules and everything they have to go through they're okay because they don't really
• 34:24
  get poppins they make so much money but like a normal bar and like the amount of shit that they
• 34:29
  have to deal with with you know the lds like you know rules and regulations they have like they have
• 34:34
  the things on the bottles that like limit oh yeah 100 everything's measured poor yeah yeah we do
• 34:39
  free pour here in new york city oh there's a limiter yes in the in the bottle pour yeah wow
• 34:46
  in college we called those the sigep caps sigep oh sigep was very uh responsible about what they
• 34:52
  just kind of weenies you know just a little lame i've heard the term weenies in a while it's it's
• 34:57
  accurate for them it's apropos yeah that makes it sound like they they raped someone one time and
• 35:05
  got told by the administration they had to put those things on that's a that's a that is an
• 35:12
  interpretation i don't know if it's most people's interpretation of that comment i mean the
• 35:17
  can't publish any of this oh yeah we are we're all prepared
• 35:23
  i feel like what what frat would voluntarily impose that on themselves exactly except by
• 35:32
  the administration no it's just like no no they just like we're kind of weenies and they're like
• 35:36
  really candle their booze or maybe they were maybe they're they didn't have a lot of dues
• 35:41
  maybe they were trying to run lean you know no they save on cost so a fun story about texas sig
• 35:46
  SIGEP is their, everybody's familiar with Enron, right? So the Enron chief accounting officer
• 35:53
  at one point was the president of Texas SIGEP. And it just so happened that during his tenure
• 36:00
  as presidency, the SIGEP house burned to the ground and they got a big insurance payout
• 36:05
  and built a beautiful new mansion in West Campus that like vaulted them up a tier to like the tops
• 36:12
  of the fraternity leagues.
• 36:14
  And, you know, whatever, like 20 years later,
• 36:16
  the guy's in federal prison for, you know,
• 36:18
  the Enron Ponzi scheme.
• 36:20
  So he got out of the fire.
• 36:22
  Sigip got that good insurance money before they fell.
• 36:25
  They did.
• 36:25
  Did he get a pardon?
• 36:27
  Nobody knows.
• 36:28
  Nobody knows.
• 36:29
  Well, I don't know.
• 36:30
  I mean, this was like pre-internet.
• 36:32
  So, you know, something happened and it was just kind of like.
• 36:34
  Is there an Enron?
• 36:35
  What was the name?
• 36:36
  What was what name?
• 36:37
  The accountant.
• 36:38
  I don't know.
• 36:39
  You can Google it.
• 36:40
  Arthur Anderson?
• 36:41
  Yeah.
• 36:42
  yes skilling i think skilling was the ceo he definitely got a pardon i think it was w
• 36:49
  yeah yeah who's the enron of bitcoin enter on bitcoin
• 36:55
  is stretch a ponzi scheme i don't think so i don't really like i i really don't because
• 37:03
  it's so over collateralized coffee zilla just did a thing it's a ponzi scheme
• 37:07
  is it the swan ron what i mean i think it was i think it was ftx like i think we already had it
• 37:13
  and ron because ftx was like deliberately like they were taking people's bitcoin not counting
• 37:18
  as bitcoin selling it for solana and you know using customer deposits could you imagine how
• 37:23
  pissed off spf in jail is in jail right now oh my god he had seven percent of anthropic so
• 37:28
  it's like all you had it was almost crime season it was almost what it was almost crime season yeah
• 37:35
  He just had to stay alive for like six more months.
• 37:38
  Yeah.
• 37:39
  Where are the three arrows guys?
• 37:41
  No, they'd sold in the bankruptcy.
• 37:43
  You know, like I think.
• 37:44
  Offloaded it.
• 37:46
  It was Kyle and.
• 37:49
  Kyle went a little crazy.
• 37:50
  Kyle tried to make a free appearance.
• 37:52
  It was a little.
• 37:53
  Yeah, he was like.
• 37:54
  Shout out Philips Academy.
• 37:59
  Him and Tobacco.
• 38:01
  Sam Tobacco.
• 38:01
  Tobacco.
• 38:02
  Yeah.
• 38:02
  He skated.
• 38:03
  yeah he three got out yeah the entire like bought his boat and just i don i don maybe well i think the speculation was that he was the guy like he flipped informant first yeah and so that why he got out certainly
• 38:16
  looks like it certainly looks like it yeah because it's like on the boat he was he was the guy doing
• 38:20
  i think most of the trades so he was you would imagine probably aware of all of the crime and
• 38:26
  he wasn't very humble about it like on boats yeah what became of the tungsten cube i'm still waiting
• 38:31
  for the auction oh the the like massive one the 14 incher um this is still in a shipping container
• 38:40
  presumably somewhere we'd have to we'd have to ask nick carter that he he's probably the one
• 38:45
  that i i think i spoke to nick about this recently i don't i don't think he knows how
• 38:53
  heavy is a 14 inch tungsten cute dude it unironically i think wait i think it weighs two
• 38:58
  tons i think what i think it like weighs or half half a ton i think it weighs almost as much as a
• 39:04
  like a car unironically that's my favorite part of that story is how they just went to margaritaville
• 39:12
  and like that was their hangout yeah they ate like 10 pounds of shrimp every night or something
• 39:18
  like that what are you what are you having against the tiki aesthetic huh i don't have anything i
• 39:22
  just think it's really funny that they were to like margaritaville and in the bahamas and that
• 39:27
  was their like local hang that like there were a couple of times where there you have like a
• 39:31
  tourist or somebody that's just like what is happening here why are they making out of the
• 39:35
  bar on it that means yeah what are those patches on their back what do you think pub key is
• 39:39
  not that hopefully
• 39:41
  huh yeah like i said a small car all right there we go like a uh what is it a fit a fit
• 39:53
  it's probably heavier than a fit is it a honda fit honda fit is 1700 pounds
• 39:58
  will will stancil's car by the way
• 40:01
  man what a what a just profile encourage that fit that guy is i mean the will stancil show is one of
• 40:10
  the funniest things it's one of the funniest things to watch it is i mean all the ai i mean
• 40:15
  you're talking about ai slop dude that's not slop unironically ai ai generated content is a
• 40:22
  renaissance right now okay it is the there's there's nothing better i mean what you're gonna
• 40:32
  you're gonna pretend like anything made by hbo or netflix right now
• 40:37
  dude the iran lake passes surpasses the average anon ai slot oh dude the chud video the psyop
• 40:45
  anime psyop anime oh psyop anime is incredible who's making somebody's making like the chud
• 40:52
  series with the gab ai the most recent one where uh the waifu like brings him into the comic book
• 40:58
  and they run he saves her life that was a good one dude ai ron like the lego rap i mean ai ai
• 41:04
  has geopolitical ai generated shit talk it's completely saved it's it saved the canon frankly
• 41:13
  yeah i would say so canon with one n
• 41:16
  well i guess two n's instead of three the canon of the west love it yeah the canon of the western
• 41:26
  canon the city of new york city new york shout out noel cooman it feels good to be back
• 41:33
  back in new york thank you for uh having this bar it's been it's always fun coming here
• 41:37
  third place uh i i had two places for so long and i didn't know where else to go
• 41:44
  i need something more
• 41:50
  the place that's not working bartenders it's not not work it's not home something between
• 41:58
  you know it's a place where socioeconomic barriers melt away
• 42:03
  where you can have somebody that works in sanitation
• 42:05
  next to a private equity fund manager.
• 42:07
  It doesn't matter.
• 42:08
  They're going to talk about something.
• 42:09
  Instead of sports ball, we talk about Bitcoin here.
• 42:11
  It's really fun.
• 42:12
  It's really fun.
• 42:12
  How's it going to DC?
• 42:13
  What's the conversation?
• 42:14
  Didn't you ban Mr. G?
• 42:16
  No, I love Mr. G.
• 42:18
  What are you kidding?
• 42:18
  He was like one of our very first supporters.
• 42:22
  I thought someone named Mr. G got banned.
• 42:25
  No, of course not.
• 42:26
  Mr. G's the best.
• 42:27
  That's fake news.
• 42:29
  He's going really well.
• 42:30
  We're pretty fast out of the gate.
• 42:33
  down there i would say that pubkey is legitimately cool in dc which is kind of a low bar because dc
• 42:39
  uh very popular with the kato and stick fish little pond yeah that's like we have we have a
• 42:44
  really cool spot it's it's a it's a palace uh it's six times the size of pubkey nyc so we're about
• 42:51
  2 000 square feet here it's like 12 000 in dc um and it's not like we're not like super high touch
• 43:01
  with like reservations there's no minimum if you book a big group and stuff like that which causes
• 43:06
  a lot of people to use a space like that in the neighborhood that we're in like that that doesn't
• 43:11
  really exist so that's cultivated a lot of really cool just like folks that come out when's the
• 43:16
  restaurant opening restaurants opening soon restaurant was temporarily tabled for um reasons
• 43:23
  uh in early january that we're not going to get into on this podcast um but we were able to i
• 43:29
  I would say mitigate the fallout from that event pretty quickly because DC has been fast out of the gate, thankfully.
• 43:38
  And it's back on the table, the dimly lit chop house.
• 43:41
  Don't worry.
• 43:41
  They flash froze all the rats that they found.
• 43:45
  Well, the rats were a different story.
• 43:46
  We're not going to let the rats go to waste.
• 43:49
  Don't worry.
• 43:51
  Just a little rat.
• 43:52
  Just a little rat.
• 43:54
  Punky hot dogs.
• 43:54
  No rat.
• 43:55
  All right.
• 43:55
  Maybe a little rat.
• 43:58
  He's kidding.
• 43:59
  The flavor.
• 43:59
  you gotta have something to set yourself what's gonna have what's gonna happen in november when uh
• 44:02
  when the republicans lose lose majority you're gonna be look it's gonna be really interesting
• 44:07
  like we have i i rocked with elizabeth warren she said she said uh keep the irs direct direct pay
• 44:14
  open okay that's it that that's what it takes to buy you off like you you need to be able to just
• 44:21
  interface directly with your with your government the fact that it's intermediated by intuit is uh
• 44:28
  something that should be that's that's a whole bent and a half right there did you see uh
• 44:33
  bespacin came out and was like recommending the people yeah change your withholding yeah yeah
• 44:37
  stop withholding i don't really know what that means you're gonna get a you're gonna get a pay
• 44:40
  what did he mean by this i don't know but people are gonna do that and they're gonna get their tax
• 44:44
  bill next year and they're not gonna have the cash get whomped yeah like the worst right oh i
• 44:49
  listened to the treasury sector tree fuck they want 30k i don't have that no that's true you
• 44:55
  have more access you could show up at the white house and like wait to talk to the president like
• 44:59
  you know as soon as like teddy roosevelt finished like boxing his wife in the basement like you
• 45:04
  could actually just like talk to him about some like dispute you're having with a neighboring
• 45:08
  farmer or something that that's that's america don't you that's america yep don't you go acting
• 45:16
  funny about muscular christianity dude i love teddy big teddy roosevelt my favorite inder
• 45:23
  jackson guy he's it's one of the all one of the all times like he was great i mean but he was he
• 45:29
  was like no you're absolutely not fucking having a central bank on my watch yeah like what the man
• 45:34
  dude no right two of the best i ran into like his early life for the first time uh insane person
• 45:40
  who andrew jackson's yeah his like mom died early and then he went to the civil war like 14
• 45:44
  old hickory yeah that was his nickname yeah the uh battle of louisiana or new orleans
• 45:51
  led that was that the one that continued like the war was over but it continued for another like day
• 45:56
  or two he had a bullet in his lung his the latter half of his life and he dueled are we bringing
• 46:04
  duels back teddy roosevelt got hit too in a speech during during the speech and he finished
• 46:09
  his speech because he was high on cocaine really how much cocaine were they doing back then so that
• 46:15
  was the treatment for asthma he had very very bad asthma from a child um same and uh they used
• 46:22
  to treat it with cocaine and he got through that speech for a reason you can get shot in the chest
• 46:27
  and you can finish it's a miracle it still works that way all right there we go greg finishes on
• 46:36
  cocaine all the time uh bringing back duels would be interesting yeah it would be interesting
• 46:48
  particularly in congress although i feel like you know that's when we learned that like aoc is a
• 46:53
  super quick draw just like unstoppable yeah pistolera well for being um that is equality
• 47:03
  yeah it's a handgun that's true equality yeah yeah everybody's the same yeah behind the barrel
• 47:11
  yeah we get off the rails here thomas and i originally we're going to talk
• 47:14
  yeah you didn't you didn't have aoc's draw capability now that we're talking about it
• 47:22
  like i'm actually curious like i mean what do you think about that women's suffrage you know
• 47:28
  what's that what do you think about that
• 47:31
  how often do you talk about the longhouse theory on tfc so i hear a lot like explain the longhouse
• 47:39
  people you can't do that i mean look early in america most most of the men of letters
• 47:52
  were trying to actually trump up their native letters like people that can read people who
• 47:59
  are online okay the people who are online back then they they they were all they were all
• 48:05
  endeavoring to inflate their uh their native american indian heritage they were all boasting
• 48:13
  that they had you know one one quarter like they elizabeth warren lindy hello uh you know she she
• 48:21
  gets it they they were they were trying to do this and so one of the one of the features of
• 48:29
  that culture is that there were two places where people lived in their in their villages there was
• 48:36
  the hut where the warrior men lived and there was the longhouse that housed everyone else so
• 48:42
  are you saying the longhouse was the third place the long it was the political concentration of
• 48:48
  power the the long house was the cathedral to use to use the mold buggy and term to to trans
• 48:55
  to trans uh transmogrify the term there uh
• 49:01
  what does that answer your question sure
• 49:08
  so so in the long house so in the long house it's it's the rule of the women it's the rule
• 49:18
  of the old uh it's the rule of the you know the the non the non high t male warrior male
• 49:28
  so it's you you can be ruled by one or the other yeah and so that's the meme the longhouse meme
• 49:36
  that's that's that's the longhouse meme this is uh this is the the product so when so when thomas
• 49:42
  says something that's so utterly longhouse i just sometimes i'm taken aback
• 49:47
  i live with a lot of women
• 49:50
  um yeah and but you also have sort of like weak men in government that uh you know uh
• 50:02
  created a lot of testosterone's in free fall you have a lot of wars you have world war one
• 50:08
  world war two that these these desert storm can't forget that one people forget about that one the
• 50:16
  The other wars.
• 50:19
  Jesus.
• 50:21
  This really went off the rails.
• 50:23
  Was there anything else you wanted to hear?
• 50:24
  No, this has been perfect.
• 50:26
  This is a real palate cleanser for the timeline.
• 50:29
  Exactly.
• 50:30
  You know, if you just wanted to tune in to a podcast
• 50:33
  and just hear what the boys are buzzing about.
• 50:35
  This is the one.
• 50:37
  Welcome to PubKey.
• 50:40
  This is what's happening at PubKey on a Thursday afternoon.
• 50:44
  after I'm actually pretty on brand for us.
• 50:47
  This is kind of mostly like
• 50:48
  wide range of views.
• 50:52
  Thank you, gentlemen.
• 50:53
  Peace and love.