Latest / The Scene Projects / Moshe Mikanovsky on Startup Success, Creativity, and Continuous Learning

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Moshe Mikanovsky on Startup Success, Creativity, and Continuous Learning · The Scene Projects

• 0:12
  Welcome in to another exciting episode of Real Biz.
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  I am your host, Bubba Starts.
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  And with me today from Products for Good, my friend Moshe Mikanovsky.
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  Moshe, welcome to the show.
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  Nice being here.
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  You for having me, Bubba.
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  Yeah.
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  Absolute pleasure.
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  Really excited for our conversation today.
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  And, we're gonna talk a little bit about educating founders and and a a lot of great
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  stuff.
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  But off the top here, I really just wanna give you an opportunity.
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  Give us a little bit of your back story, and then we'll pick up the conversation from there.
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  Yeah.
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  Absolutely.
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  So I started my career as a software developer many, many years ago.
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  I've been doing building digital products for thirty five years now.
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  So I've seen how technology have changed, how we evolve over time, emerging technologies,
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  etcetera.
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  The first 20 about 20 of my career, I was in the software engineering end of things.
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  And then, I moved to product management.
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  And product management is the area where you kind of the bridge between the business and the
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  clients and the users to the technology, to the engineers, and the designers that are building
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  the product.
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  I've been doing it for the past fifteen years.
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  In the last three years, I've done a lot of consulting, mentorship, coaching in product
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  management areas.
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  Mostly recently, in the past year or or so with my company, Products for Good, focusing on
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  startup founders, early stage startup founders with many accelerators and incubators.
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  I live in Toronto, and I also teach.
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  I love teaching, so I'm teaching at a business school here.
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  It's called the Schulich School of Business at York University.
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  Incredible.
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  Well and, you know, not just educating our youth, but you're also educating a lot of your
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  clients and educating new potential clients into why they would need someone in your
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  position for their, you know, product or service that they're starting.
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  I think that's maybe a a great point to to dive into is, you know, what specifically, I I
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  guess, do do you do for founders in your consulting with with products for good?
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  Yes.
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  So most founders, as I've seen and I meet hundreds of them every year, they are either
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  coming from technology background or they're coming from business background.
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  They they don't have, most of the time, a lot of experience with building products that
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  actually solve a problem and going to market with that product.
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  With all of my experience, I've seen many different problems.
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  I've experienced many different problems and learned them the hard way, whether it is
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  security issues, whether it is not thinking about all the different users that will
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  actually use the product, issues like, not thinking about the people that will pay for the
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  product and what they need, so all the different stakeholders around it.
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  And that's what I'm trying to solve, and help founders to learn from, you know, the
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  experience that I have and many other people like me have out there from product management
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  discipline and bring it to founders so they don't have to go through these problems on
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  their own.
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  It helps them with defining what their minimum viable product is, an MVP.
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  It help them define what the road map is going to look like.
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  It help them define how do they reach product market fit and all those good stuff that they
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  do without spending a lot of, time and money on doing the wrong things.
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  Yeah.
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  That's so excellent.
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  And as someone who, you know, probably ran out there in the world with a less than minimum
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  viable product with our platform and have just been constantly learning as I go, I'm in a very
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  low impact and a very low investment business.
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  Right?
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  I I can afford to make mistakes and to have those companies that are investing hundreds of
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  thousands or millions of dollars into their product don't have that.
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  They can't afford to do that financially or in the time because especially in the technology
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  sector, things are moving so fast.
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  Delays can cost you big time in the long run because your competitors are out there and
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  maybe working further ahead.
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  You may have started out with a a large head start, but especially with AI now that, things
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  move very, very fast, especially in the technology world.
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  So you have to be able to avoid pitfalls and setbacks, And I feel like that's where you find
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  yourself is bringing all of this experience, you know, three decades of working in, you
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  know, software and then the project management to the to the clients and to say, hey.
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  I've seen this book before.
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  I've read this one.
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  Let me let me guide you through this process and maybe shine a light where you're not
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  looking because we can't all we can't all see every situation from every angle.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah.
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  Absolutely.
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  There there are different problems and challenges that founders are facing in each
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  phase of their company and each phase of their product.
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  So early on, when they are very early, they don't have the money to spend.
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  They are bootstrapping or they're trying to raise funds.
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  So they're very short on funds, but they still spend what they do have many times on the wrong
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  things.
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  They spend on building things that users don't really need.
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  They spend on the obvious things that that users will use, but not on the core thing
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  they're trying to solve.
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  They're spending on ads on, you know, Google and other type of ads.
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  Lots of money.
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  I spoke recently with the founder that he spent $60,000 on ads, and the only return he got on
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  it was, $2,000.
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  Only after he did that and he spent all of that money, he realized, you know, how mistaken he
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  was.
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  And when we dived into what the product is doing, how it's built, and does he have proof
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  that it actually works for the users, we got into a few type of experiments that he could do
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  without spending so much money.
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  And first, really seeing that it solved the problem.
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  So early founders do chase a lot of the time after the money, from investors.
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  But before they actually get real traction, and real traction is real users find value in your
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  product, willing to pay you for it, etcetera, it's very hard to get that money.
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  And that's actually why I also opened my community.
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  I call the community the product traction accelerator, where the traction is all about
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  the product itself and actually making sure that the product solve a real problem and
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  people are coming back to use it.
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  And, another founder I I spoke with recently, she also spent a lot of money.
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  I don't know how how much exactly, but she used the developer development, company to to build
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  the product.
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  And, she didn't know how many people are actually using it, not just once, but on a
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  regular basis, coming back to it.
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  She had no idea.
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  So things like that are very obvious to me from all of my experience, but they're not very
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  obvious to a lot of founders, and that's really what I'm trying to put in front of them.
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  There are way better ways to do things.
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  They are just out there.
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  You just have to ask the right person.
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  Well and there's different ways of doing them as well.
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  Every company and every problem that you're trying to solve for the end user and see, I can
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  tell that you're a podcaster as well, and we may cover your podcast a little bit in our
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  conversation, but you answered my question before I had it, is, you know, does everything
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  really start with the user and the problem that you're trying to solve?
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  And is that kind of the starting point?
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  And I feel like a lot of people miss that.
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  Some people come in, you know, with, like, the branding and all the things first, and it's
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  like, are so secondary or tertiary or so much farther down the list from that.
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  Are people actually gonna use the product and not just use it once, but is it going to change
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  their lives?
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  And I I think that the most successful companies in the world have developed something
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  like that, that is changing the way that they live, it becomes a part of their everyday life.
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  Yes.
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  You know, no matter the scale of that, we don't all need billions of users to be successful.
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  You know, in the artist world, they say a thousand true fans can make a successful career
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  for you.
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  So in the business world, it's really focusing in on what is that end user experience, what
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  are the problems that you're trying to solve for them is really the starting point that I
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  think most founders just completely overlook.
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  Yeah.
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  Absolutely.
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  The there are a few problems there that founders are facing.
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  Many times, it will be a personal problem that they will try to solve, which is great.
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  Having a problem that is personal for you, you have passion for it.
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  You want to solve it.
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  It doesn't mean that other people have the same problem, or it doesn't mean that other people
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  face the problem in the same way.
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  And the solution that you you find valuable does not mean it's valuable to other people.
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  So it's a lot about validating the problem is real and there is enough market out there for
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  the problem and validating that the solution that you're finding.
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  Because at the end of the day, even if you think the first thing that you come up with
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  will solve it, it's usually not it.
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  It's usually there is iterations after that.
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  And because there are many reasons for that.
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  People are different.
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  The problem is not exactly, as you thought it is.
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  You know, there is millions of reasons why it will be different.
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  And, and that's that's many times, founders are missing that, and it's painful to see.
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  And because it's painful to see, I really I have this passion to to help them.
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  I'm still trying to figure out what the right solution for that.
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  You know?
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  How do I help early stage startup founders in the right way that will, of course, be
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  beneficial for everyone?
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  Well and I think that you're on the right path with your community and being able to not just
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  educate founders, but to connect them with each other because you don't necessarily have all
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  the answers either.
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  Right?
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  Now your your wealth of experience, from working with so many different companies and so
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  many different facets that you've kind of worked around add to that.
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  But there's blind spots for yourself as well, and I think you would be someone who admits
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  that.
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  But you have what a lot of people don't have in the the figure it out ness.
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  Right?
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  Like, I I I don't have that answer right now, but I'm going to go investigate, and I'm going
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  to find that answer for you.
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  Mhmm.
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  And I think that's probably what sets you apart from a lot of other people working inside of
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  that space where a lot of consultants or, you know, coaches and mentors and and and that that
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  space to me is all kind of, you know, one pool with a lot of different people swimming in it
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  that a lot of people bring a, like, a one size fits all method or system to every founder.
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  And I just don't think that it works because every founder is different, every product is
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  different, every company is different.
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  Even if they're creating a very similar product, the challenges that they're facing
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  internally can be completely different.
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  Yeah.
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  Absolutely.
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  That's absolutely right.
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  It's interesting how every time I speak with the different founders, there are many common
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  things, among them, but then you dive into things and you're like, okay.
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  So let's see where you are right now exactly, and what you need to know, what you don't know,
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  and what challenges you have.
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  I do have a lot of frameworks.
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  There are a lot of frameworks out there that we use, in product management discipline in the
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  industry.
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  And product management is a huge thing for organizations that are already, established,
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  also with startups.
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  But in many, places, they don't invest into it right up front.
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  A good company will have a good sense, a good founder that either already did product
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  management in the past.
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  So they will utilize this knowledge to do that, or they have a good sense internally what does
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  that even means.
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  They might make mistakes, maybe less mistakes, or they've done the mistakes already in the
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  past, and this is not their first startup.
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  So many times you will see that happen as well.
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  But you're absolutely right.
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  Everyone is different.
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  Every problem even if you're trying to solve the same problem and I've seen, you know,
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  multiple founders trying to solve the same problems.
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  But because they are in different locations in the world or they have different backgrounds or
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  they have their communities different.
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  I'm in Toronto.
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  So here we have lots of immigrants, and it's a very multinational, community.
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  Almost everyone I work with here is an immigrant from somewhere in the world, and they
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  have their own community and reach out to people that they can here and back home and
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  stuff like that.
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  And it creates a very different, situation for them even trying to solve the same problem.
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  So it's absolutely, right that it's all different.
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  Yeah.
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  Cultural differences, I think, are something that a lot of founders don't think about.
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  You you think about your end user as being one thing, and that's just not true.
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  And it's really I I'm sure that your founders and your clients that you work with are are
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  extremely grateful, to you for this this very wide angle view, this very 10,000 foot view
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  that you can bring, to help them.
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  And and like I said, really sets you apart from a lot of other people that are working out in
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  that space.
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  Now do you feel, because I know that you've written you've written a book, a book of
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  fiction, not something that's on the business and product management world, and you're also a
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  podcaster like I mentioned before.
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  Do you feel like your ability to kinda use that creative side of your brain but still being a
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  very, I would say, a very analytical person, do you feel like that's an advantage to you
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  especially given this space of the consulting world?
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  Yeah.
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  I think it is.
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  Part of it is I might think about things in a bit different way because of that.
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  It's a good question.
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  I I don't know if I ever thought about it specifically like that.
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  But when I started my, development career, I always wanted to be before I started that
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  before I started as a developer, I wanted to be in something creative.
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  My career path when I was a kid was actually to be an architect because this is, like, part
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  engineering, part design of buildings and interiors and stuff like that.
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  And then kind of life took me to software development, but I found a lot of creativity
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  there because I had to be really creative about how I structure the software, how I develop,
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  the the interface to the users.
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  How different form of architecture.
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  Right, Moshe?
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  Exactly.
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  So I still felt very creative.
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  And, I'm also very, very curious.
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  So I I love to learn new things.
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  So I, all the time, love to learn, different, different things, and that's also why I like to
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  play with the new products and how people are building them and find what doesn't work in
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  them and stuff like that.
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  And I I think that creative side probably is is, is not bad to have.
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  No.
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  And and the reason that the question comes to me is because, and you know this from
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  following, you know, me and what I do, but most of what I do with the scene projects is with
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  the creators and the creatives.
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  And now this new platform, a real biz, I I've been working with people that are more
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  analytical in their brain and how much differently we think.
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  But I find that the most successful people are the ones who can activate both sides of their
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  brain in that way, and they are really the problem solvers of the world.
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  And I hope that, in some way, I am one of those people as well and, not just, you know, using
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  one side or the other, but able to fire all points of the brain.
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  But that's also, you know, why people, you know, kinda have blinders on when they're
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  building their business is they're only you know, some people are only able to look at the
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  bottom line and not seeing how the the creative problem solving side can can change their
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  business for good.
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  Yeah.
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  So I I just I I love it.
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  My experience has been growing, and I hope that one day I can educate people the way that you
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  are.
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  Speaking of education, you mentioned that you're you're teaching some college courses and
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  doing that.
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  Do you find it easier to teach a 20 or to a founder in their, you know, forties?
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  Oh, that's a that's a really good question there.
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  I I I'm not really sure.
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  I mean, the 20 and I've also been to older students as well because I'm also teaching MBA
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  courses.
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  But they are very eager to succeed, and they are eager to learn and to build their career.
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  So I find them very eager to learn and and understand and and and maybe apply it as well,
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  hopefully.
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  But in the confined of the university, it's a bit harder sometimes.
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  So when I, have some of them follow-up on me even after their studies and they want more
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  advice or things like that.
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  I really I love that.
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  I I love helping them, and I love seeing how they can move, you know, with their career.
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  With the founders, you know, founders are really all of all ages.
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  I have founders that are students even in, undergrad or even high school.
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  I had a few.
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  And then I have founders that are, you know, much older.
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  So I think over there, it's really more personality than anything.
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  They definitely are, eager to succeed because it's very risky to to be a startup founder.
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  There is a lot on on the stake over there.
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  On the other end, you know, they have other priorities sometimes.
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  Culture, like we mentioned before, also impact that.
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  Sometimes I do wonder about some of them if they are, you know, really into it because I
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  but this is a bit of my personality and my background.
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  I'm originally from Israel, and, you know, Israel is a a startup nation with a lot of
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  startup stuff going on over there.
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  And one of the things that drive us over there is just that we have a push to to be
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  successful.
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  So, it is sometime to our determined, you know, because we we one of the reasons my wife
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  doesn't want to go back to Israel is because she said I will be at work all the time.
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  It's, like, twenty four seven.
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  But, that that's that's really, very much, about personality and about, culture and about
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  many other things going on.
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  And at the end of the day, I I found that both the young people and the older, they they want
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  to learn.
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  How much time they have or how much passion they have to actually implement it, that might
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  be the main difference.
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  Yeah.
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  It seems like to put it in, architecture construction terms that with a younger student
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  or founder, you're building a foundation.
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  You're you're providing something to the first time where with someone who's been in business
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  and whether it's their first startup or their tenth, that it's more like a remodel.
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  Right?
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  That you're coming in.
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  They have an existing framework of how they think the world works, and you're having to go,
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  well, yes, you're right, but also there's this side of it and these facets.
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  And, yeah, touching on cultural stereotypes, some of them are stereotypes for a reason
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  because they're very true.
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  Yes.
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  But but hardworking and there's nothing wrong with being motivated and being financially
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  successful, obviously, think is important to all of us on some facet where it lands on the
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  priority list.
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  I think it's different in cultures as well.
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  So absolutely love it.
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  I I love how curious you are and how you've been able to build now your own business with
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  that curiosity and driving you.
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  And and to be successful in that, I think is incredibly, admirable to to find a way in there
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  to, you know, create a business and and and create a living for yourself by helping others
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  and by educating them.
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  But, also, I'm sure daily, you feel like you're getting a little bit of an education as well
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  working with new companies and new, you know, new products and sometimes new industries
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  completely.
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  Yeah.
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  Absolutely.
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  It's it's, exciting.
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  I I love doing it.
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  It's very challenging for me as well to be, a founder on on my own, more on the service side
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  of things than on a product.
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  And, I'm learning from this on a daily basis as well.
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  Moshe, awesome conversation, man.
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  How can people, find you, get ahold of you, find the community?
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  I definitely get some more people in there for you.
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  I I know that's a passion of yours right now.
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  How can we find out more?
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  Yes.
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  Definitely.
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  For so first of all, on LinkedIn, you can look for me, Moshe Mikanovsky.
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  I probably am the only one there.
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  And my website is productsforgood.co.
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  I have lots of resources over there, that I I'm sharing there.
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  Also, the community is on school, on the Skool platform.
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  So if you are not familiar with that, it's Skool with a k, s k o o l, and it's called
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  product traction accelerator.
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  And you can always, you know, reach out to me on LinkedIn, link to connect with me, DM me,
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  and I can share much more.
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  Awesome, Moshe.
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  I I really appreciate your time today.
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  I I wish you all the luck with your community and your business, and thank you for being part
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  of the scene.
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  Thank you so much, Bubba.
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  This was a pleasure, and I love what you're doing.