Latest / Bulletproof Screenwriting™ Podcast / BPS 494: Do You Really Need Film School to Become a Filmmaker with Miranda Sajdak

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BPS 494: Do You Really Need Film School to Become a Filmmaker with Miranda Sajdak · Bulletproof Screenwriting™ Podcast

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: You are listening to the IFH Podcast Network.
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  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, episode number 494. Assumptions
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: allow the best in life to pass you by. John Sayles.
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  Speaker 2: Broadcasting from a dark, windowless room in Hollywood, when we
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  Speaker 2: really should be working on that next draft. It's the
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  Speaker 2: Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast, showing you the craft and business of
• 0:32
  Speaker 2: screenwriting while teaching you how to make your screenplay bulletproof.
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: And here's your host, Alex Ferrari. Welcome, welcome to another
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  Speaker 1: episode of the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast. I am your humble host,
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  Speaker 1: Alex Ferrari. Now, today's show is sponsored by Bulletproof Script Coverage. Now,
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  Speaker 1: unlike other script coverage services, Bulletproof Script Coverage actually focuses
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  Speaker 1: down by three categories, micro-budget, indie film market, and studio film.
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  Speaker 1: on over to CoverMyScreenplay.com. Enjoy today's episode with guest host,
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  Speaker 1: Dave Bullis.
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  Speaker 3: On this episode, we have Miranda Sajak. Miranda Sajak is
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  Speaker 3: a film writer and producer and currently living in Los Angeles.
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  Speaker 3: And she recently joined with producer Sandra Levington to co-found
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  Speaker 3: Script Chicks and Under the Stairs Entertainment. And she currently
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  Speaker 3: has a GoFundMe campaign to raise money for her next project.
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  Speaker 3: So without further ado, Miranda, how are you?
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  Speaker 4: I'm good. How are you doing?
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  Speaker 3: Good, thank you. So everyone, this is the first test
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  Speaker 3: of the new board. So if something sounds funky, it's
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  Speaker 3: completely my fault. But I'm going to try my best
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  Speaker 3: to blame everybody else. So Miranda, just to get started,
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  Speaker 3: the same question I always ask everybody is, you know,
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  Speaker 3: how did you get started in the film industry?
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  Speaker 4: That is a great question. So when I was a kid,
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  Speaker 4: my mom took me to see the movies and the
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  Speaker 4: first live action film other than like, you know, your
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  Speaker 4: sort of standard Disney animation that all kids see, that
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  Speaker 4: she took me to see was A League of Their Own, which,
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  Speaker 4: you know, is the sort of baseball movie about women
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  Speaker 4: in the 40s becoming baseball players when the men went
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  Speaker 4: overseas to fight in World War II. So stars like
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  Speaker 4: Geena Davis and Rosie O'Donnell and Madonna and Tom Hanks.
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  Speaker 4: And if you haven't seen it, it's really amazing. But
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  Speaker 4: that movie just totally inspired me. And I left the
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  Speaker 4: theater saying, I want to make movies. I want to
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  Speaker 4: be a filmmaker. That's what I want to do with
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  Speaker 4: my life. And literally has not changed since then. I've
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  Speaker 4: certainly gone through various stages where I've been a writer
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  Speaker 4: and a director and a producer. And I've worked in
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  Speaker 4: pretty much every set department there is. But it was
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  Speaker 4: that moment that said to me, this is the industry
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  Speaker 4: I want to be in. And this is why.
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  Speaker 3: So now I wanted to ask, did you go to
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  Speaker 3: film school? I did.
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  Speaker 4: I went to Columbia undergrad.
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  Speaker 3: So now, now this is the million dollar question, Miranda.
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  Speaker 3: I've always asked this to people who've gone to film school.
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  Speaker 3: You know, do you think it is necessary to go
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  Speaker 3: to be in the film industry and And this is
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  Speaker 3: an open-ended question. I mean, in any capacity, do you
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  Speaker 3: feel it's necessary to go to film school?
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  Speaker 4: I am right down the middle with that. And there's
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  Speaker 4: a couple of reasons. I think it's very dependent on
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  Speaker 4: what you want to do. in film and what your
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  Speaker 4: ultimate end goals are. And the reason I say that
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  Speaker 4: is because I think that there are things that can
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  Speaker 4: be very useful about film school. One of those things is,
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  Speaker 4: you know, just the basic networking of having a lot
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  Speaker 4: of people on your level who you can connect with
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  Speaker 4: and then later work with. I think that's useful. I
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  Speaker 4: think that's a big reason why a lot of people
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  Speaker 4: end up going to And then, of course, the resources
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  Speaker 4: of any film school to later connect you with jobs
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  Speaker 4: or internships or, you know, the kind of work that
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  Speaker 4: you may want in the industry. Additionally, I think that
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  Speaker 4: there is certainly used to be apprenticeship function of film school,
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  Speaker 4: whether that is, you know, learning how to use a camera,
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  Speaker 4: learning set etiquette, learning, you know, even just studying films
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  Speaker 4: so that you know the history of film or, you know,
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  Speaker 4: you understand film theory or, you know, sort of the
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  Speaker 4: literature behind it all. I think there is definitely used
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  Speaker 4: to those things. And I think that those are things
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  Speaker 4: that you could learn on your own and that a
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  Speaker 4: lot of people do learn on their own without going
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  Speaker 4: to film school. I think for me, what was most
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  Speaker 4: beneficial was really having teachers who were, or professors really,
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  Speaker 4: who were really culling down the massive amounts of literature
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  Speaker 4: and films out there into, what they felt were important
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  Speaker 4: pieces of information to have processed and understand in order
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  Speaker 4: to go into the industry. And then also really learning
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  Speaker 4: set etiquette and learning the different jobs on set and
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  Speaker 4: how they work and kind of knowing all of that
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  Speaker 4: stuff before going into the industry. So for example, while
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  Speaker 4: I was undergrad at Columbia, I worked on a lot
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  Speaker 4: of graduate student films as anything from a PA to
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  Speaker 4: an AD. And then I went on and was able
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  Speaker 4: to take all of those skills to PA on Bourne
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  Speaker 4: Ultimatum and Cloverfield and a number of big films that
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  Speaker 4: were shooting in LA or in New York at the time.
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  Speaker 4: And I wouldn't have been able to do that with
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  Speaker 4: those same level of skills if I hadn't had that training.
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  Speaker 4: So I think there is certainly a benefit. On the
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  Speaker 4: other hand, to play my own devil's advocate, I recognize
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  Speaker 4: that it is not a necessity for every job. And
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  Speaker 4: I don't think that it is a necessity in general.
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  Speaker 4: I've certainly known any number of people who have not
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  Speaker 4: gone through film school who are doing perfectly fine in
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  Speaker 4: the industry and any number of people who just learn
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  Speaker 4: on the job. And it very much depends on what
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  Speaker 4: you want to do and how your path is and
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  Speaker 4: how you want your path to be. And I would
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  Speaker 4: never say that it is a necessity, but I would
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  Speaker 4: also say that it can be useful for some people.
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  Speaker 3: There's one thing I always ask some of my guests is,
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  Speaker 3: it's about film school because some people feel very strongly
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  Speaker 3: about it on the one hand. And on the other hand,
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  Speaker 3: some people say, you know, if I could go back,
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  Speaker 3: I may just have just started off as a PA.
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  Speaker 3: You know what I mean? Like meaning just from high school,
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  Speaker 3: go right into the film industry and go on to
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  Speaker 3: wherever I had to, to just apply to be a PA.
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  Speaker 2: Exactly.
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  Speaker 3: And then just work my way up and then just
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  Speaker 3: sort of from a, being a PA, just sort of
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  Speaker 3: find out what I want to do and go that way.
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  Speaker 3: And then sort of, you know, sort of balances itself out.
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  Speaker 3: Cause that way I can learn set etiquette while I'm
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  Speaker 3: doing and things like that. But I agree with you though.
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  Speaker 3: It is a good way to network. Um, you know,
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  Speaker 3: it is, it does actually teach you set etiquette, which
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  Speaker 3: if you want to set, if you go on a
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  Speaker 3: set for the first time, you know what I mean?
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  Speaker 3: Like it could be a culture shock for some people
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  Speaker 3: because they're not used to it. Um, but yeah, I mean, there,
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  Speaker 3: there's pros and cons and I, and it's always just a,
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  Speaker 3: a good, uh, you know, food for thought question. I
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  Speaker 3: like to ask. Yeah.
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  Speaker 4: I think it's a great question. And I think it's
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  Speaker 4: a question I'm not sure that we'll ever fully answer.
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  Speaker 4: because I really do think it is an individual basis.
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  Speaker 4: I think, you know, there are people who it works
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  Speaker 4: amazingly for, you know, Dee Reese at NYU and, you know,
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  Speaker 4: then getting Pariah and Bessie and she's just kind of
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  Speaker 4: had an amazing career based on her connections that she
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  Speaker 4: made there, you know, versus, you know, like a Spielberg or,
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  Speaker 4: you know, somebody kind of starting out in the early days,
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  Speaker 4: like an Orson Welles or whatever, when there wasn't film
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  Speaker 4: school and yet he still made Citizen Kane, you know,
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  Speaker 4: so I think, It's not a necessity, but I certainly
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  Speaker 4: think that there are times when it can be useful
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  Speaker 4: for sure.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, definitely. And I mean, you mentioned your PA work,
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  Speaker 3: which I wanted to ask about. You got to be
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  Speaker 3: a PA on Cloverfield and the Bourne Ultimatum. So how
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  Speaker 3: were you able to get a job as a PA
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  Speaker 3: on those sets?
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  Speaker 4: That was back when I was in New York. So
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  Speaker 4: that would have been right around the time I graduated
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  Speaker 4: from college. And That was either networking. So I think
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  Speaker 4: one of them was a referral from maybe the other
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  Speaker 4: one or from something I'd done similarly. And then one
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  Speaker 4: of them, I think I applied either through the production
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  Speaker 4: office or through a job posting. But I think I
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  Speaker 4: applied through the production office because I know at the time,
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  Speaker 4: and I'm not sure if they still do this. I
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  Speaker 4: haven't lived in New York for a lot of years.
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  Speaker 4: But at the time, the mayor's office of the film
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  Speaker 4: would kind of release a list of job openings and
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  Speaker 4: then you'd sort of have your standard list of like
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  Speaker 4: what productions are shooting in town right now. And you
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  Speaker 4: could essentially message the production office and just say like, hey,
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  Speaker 4: I'm around. Do you guys need PAs kind of thing?
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  Speaker 4: And I think that's how I got the first one
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  Speaker 4: of those. And then the second one, I think, was
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  Speaker 4: just a referral. So a lot of jobs in the
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  Speaker 4: industry are really just networking and who you know.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, that is something that, you know, doing this podcast,
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  Speaker 3: a lot of guests have said as well. They've it's
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  Speaker 3: all about who you know. And there's a quote that
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: I always screw up, but I think it is, your
• 9:32
  Speaker 3: net worth is your net worth.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, absolutely.
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  Speaker 3: So what are some of the things that you learned
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  Speaker 3: while being a PA? I mean, obviously those two movies,
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  Speaker 3: the budget for the Bourne Ultimatum was probably, you know,
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  Speaker 3: 20 to 30 million. Cloverfield, I'm going to guess, you know,
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  Speaker 3: 20 to 30 million as well. So, you know, it
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  Speaker 3: was obviously much bigger than an independent shoot. So, you know,
• 9:52
  Speaker 3: we're getting to, you know, pretty big scale here.
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: And now back to the show.
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  Speaker 3: So what are some of the things that you've learned,
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  Speaker 3: you know, being a part of a, of a crew
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  Speaker 3: that size?
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  Speaker 4: Um, you know, it's interesting because I pretty much have
• 10:13
  Speaker 4: always been working with simultaneously on independent projects and studio
• 10:19
  Speaker 4: projects to an extent like I've sort of kind of
• 10:22
  Speaker 4: kept that up even moving to LA in the development
• 10:25
  Speaker 4: world so you know I think what I find really
• 10:28
  Speaker 4: fascinating and what's what I love kind of about both
• 10:32
  Speaker 4: of them is that you know they're both doing essentially
• 10:35
  Speaker 4: the same thing but often in slightly different ways for
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  Speaker 4: instance I like a Cloverfield or a Bourne Ultimatum or
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  Speaker 4: a studio project, you know, it's going to be a
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  Speaker 4: union project. It's going to have much bigger departments, much
• 10:50
  Speaker 4: more people in each department. You know, you're going to
• 10:53
  Speaker 4: have days where you're spending a lot more time on
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  Speaker 4: a certain shot, whereas an independent film, you may have
• 10:59
  Speaker 4: to steal a shot. You know, you'll sometimes see a
• 11:02
  Speaker 4: director or a producer moving a light, which, you know,
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  Speaker 4: would never happen on a union film. Just, you know,
• 11:07
  Speaker 4: union rules and everything else just sort of requiring that
• 11:12
  Speaker 4: You know, G & E kind of takes care of that.
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  Speaker 4: So it's sort of it's just it's doing things on
• 11:19
  Speaker 4: a different scale, I think. And I think that one
• 11:22
  Speaker 4: of the things I love about independent film is the
• 11:25
  Speaker 4: ability to really be hands on and be involved in
• 11:28
  Speaker 4: every department and, you know, have that sort of tactile
• 11:32
  Speaker 4: ability to really be involved in like literally everything. But
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  Speaker 4: I will also say there's a definite benefit, obviously, to
• 11:40
  Speaker 4: the studio feature. just budgetary elements where you can kind
• 11:45
  Speaker 4: of say, hey, you know, makeup department, deal with this.
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  Speaker 4: And you don't have to worry about, you know, having
• 11:52
  Speaker 4: a makeup kit yourself that you're applying to your actor
• 11:55
  Speaker 4: while you're trying to direct them. So, you know, I
• 11:57
  Speaker 4: think that there's good and bad elements to both. But
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  Speaker 4: I would definitely say that, you know, the studio project's
• 12:06
  Speaker 4: are able to do a lot more. You know, even
• 12:09
  Speaker 4: though today in the digital space, indie projects are catching
• 12:12
  Speaker 4: up very rapidly.
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  Speaker 3: You mentioned the unions. That is one thing that I,
• 12:18
  Speaker 3: from doing like student projects, by the way, just to
• 12:20
  Speaker 3: let you know, I never went to film school. I
• 12:22
  Speaker 3: went to, I chose the weirder path. I went to
• 12:25
  Speaker 3: business school. So some people, I mean, that's good.
• 12:30
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 12:30
  Speaker 3: Some people are like, well, that's a good thing. And
• 12:31
  Speaker 3: I'm like, you know, it was like, I had my own,
• 12:34
  Speaker 3: my own weird way of getting there. And some of
• 12:36
  Speaker 3: the weird stories I have about going to business school,
• 12:38
  Speaker 3: but that is one thing. When I was in business school,
• 12:41
  Speaker 3: I was doing student films and stuff like that, and
• 12:44
  Speaker 3: I was helping friends out. And then when I finally
• 12:46
  Speaker 3: did my first professional film that was mine, not going
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: on anybody else's set, that's the first thing I was like, okay,
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: introduction to how to deal with the unions. And I
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: don't mean that in a bad way, because I know
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: that sounded kind of negative, but okay, this is, you know,
• 13:00
  Speaker 3: you have to have this many breaks, this, this. It
• 13:03
  Speaker 3: was actually because we did a SAG new media agreement
• 13:07
  Speaker 3: for the actors. And that was actually pretty easy to get,
• 13:10
  Speaker 3: you know, to just to get. And, you know, there
• 13:12
  Speaker 3: wasn't really a lot of hoops we had to jump through.
• 13:14
  Speaker 3: And then just, you know, a couple of things here
• 13:16
  Speaker 3: and there. So it was actually a pretty easy time
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: on our end. But, you know, but going on to
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: the other sets, you know, you see all these different
• 13:23
  Speaker 3: unions doing different things. And I think a lot of
• 13:26
  Speaker 3: times that that sort of blows people's minds who aren't
• 13:29
  Speaker 3: used to sets like that. Yeah.
• 13:30
  Speaker 4: And there's, you know, meal penalties and there are certain
• 13:33
  Speaker 4: rules that unions impose upon the set. And then, of course, there's,
• 13:37
  Speaker 4: you know, even just from a budgetary standpoint, there's the
• 13:40
  Speaker 4: extra money that goes into hiring a union crew for
• 13:44
  Speaker 4: fringes and benefits and pensions and all of that stuff
• 13:47
  Speaker 4: that you kind of have to pay on top of
• 13:49
  Speaker 4: just the salary, which doesn't always come into play on
• 13:53
  Speaker 4: an independent set. So, yeah, I mean, it's a different
• 13:56
  Speaker 4: world and it's a different scale, but it's essentially doing
• 13:59
  Speaker 4: the same thing. It's working towards the same kind of goal.
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: Talking about your career, you know, from, you know, being
• 14:05
  Speaker 3: a PA and, you know, doing all sorts of different work,
• 14:08
  Speaker 3: you know, you ended up becoming a writer's assistant.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 14:11
  Speaker 3: And you got to be a writer's assistant on a
• 14:13
  Speaker 3: show I really enjoy, China, Illinois.
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 14:18
  Speaker 3: So, you know, how did you get to be a
• 14:20
  Speaker 3: writer's assistant on China, Illinois?
• 14:21
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, the writer's assistant stuff started a few
• 14:25
  Speaker 4: years before that. The first writer's assistant job, or I
• 14:29
  Speaker 4: guess it was a showrunner's assistant job I had was
• 14:31
  Speaker 4: on Huge, which was an ABC family show, which was
• 14:37
  Speaker 4: created by Savannah Julian, Winnie Holzman, who created My So-Called
• 14:41
  Speaker 4: Life and wrote the script for Wicked and is currently
• 14:44
  Speaker 4: working on the Wicked Musical and is doing a lot
• 14:46
  Speaker 4: of other fun stuff. So that was sort of my
• 14:48
  Speaker 4: first writer's assistant job. And that was another one of those,
• 14:51
  Speaker 4: you know, your network is your net worth kind of
• 14:53
  Speaker 4: things where I was already friends with Savannah and then
• 14:57
  Speaker 4: I knew Winnie through her. So that was sort of
• 15:00
  Speaker 4: how I got that job. And then the China, Illinois
• 15:02
  Speaker 4: job was just a job application. It was posted on
• 15:08
  Speaker 4: a site that they were looking for a script coordinator
• 15:10
  Speaker 4: and I was sort of in between gigs and kind
• 15:14
  Speaker 4: of hadn't really done something like that in a little while.
• 15:17
  Speaker 4: So it was one of those, sure, I'll shoot over
• 15:20
  Speaker 4: my resume and see what happens. And something like a
• 15:23
  Speaker 4: few days later, they called me in and I got
• 15:26
  Speaker 4: the job the same day I interviewed. So that was
• 15:28
  Speaker 4: a pretty fast process. And they were, I think, in
• 15:32
  Speaker 4: the middle of their second season. So I was sort
• 15:34
  Speaker 4: of coming on in the middle of things. And that
• 15:38
  Speaker 4: was really a a really great learning experience. Everybody on
• 15:42
  Speaker 4: that team is amazing. They're so funny, and they're so smart. And,
• 15:46
  Speaker 4: you know, they have a really unique tone to their show.
• 15:50
  Speaker 4: I mean, you know, as a fan, that they're very
• 15:53
  Speaker 4: specific with what they do and with their jokes. And,
• 15:56
  Speaker 4: and I hadn't really worked heavily in comedy before. So
• 16:00
  Speaker 4: that was really enjoyable to be able to step both
• 16:04
  Speaker 4: into animation and comedy at the same time, which I
• 16:06
  Speaker 4: hadn't really had the chance to do. So Um, yeah,
• 16:09
  Speaker 4: I mean, it was a totally, it's, it's very different
• 16:12
  Speaker 4: from working in live action, but I actually really enjoyed it, uh,
• 16:15
  Speaker 4: actually a lot more than I thought I would to
• 16:17
  Speaker 4: begin with. So, I mean, I love all those guys.
• 16:20
  Speaker 4: It's a great show and I hope it has many,
• 16:22
  Speaker 4: many more years to go. Cause it's just really, really
• 16:25
  Speaker 4: unique storytelling.
• 16:26
  Speaker 3: You know, sadly, Miranda, I actually think they've decided to
• 16:30
  Speaker 3: not do any more seasons. Oh no. Yeah. I remember their.
• 16:35
  Speaker 4: Actors are also busy right now. So that probably has
• 16:37
  Speaker 4: a lot to do with it.
• 16:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember reading an article about it, and they
• 16:41
  Speaker 3: actually basically said they think this was it the past season.
• 16:45
  Speaker 3: By the way, anyone who hasn't seen China, Illinois, it's
• 16:48
  Speaker 3: basically about the worst college ever. And basically, Hulk Hogan
• 16:52
  Speaker 3: is the dean of the school, and he voices the
• 16:57
  Speaker 3: dean of the school, but he basically is playing himself
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: in a way. The show is hilarious.
• 17:03
  Speaker 4: Yeah, it's ridiculous. The humor is just bananas.
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 17:07
  Speaker 4: You know, you never see the joke coming like Brad Neely,
• 17:10
  Speaker 4: who's the creator is he's like, I genuinely think that
• 17:13
  Speaker 4: he's a genius. And I absolutely think that he's the
• 17:15
  Speaker 4: comedic genius for sure.
• 17:17
  Speaker 3: So what are some of the things that, you know,
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: you learned about writing? So, you know, you're a writer, too, obviously. So,
• 17:23
  Speaker 3: you know, what are some of the things that you
• 17:24
  Speaker 3: learn from the show that you try to put into
• 17:26
  Speaker 3: your own writing? Or maybe some of the things that
• 17:28
  Speaker 3: you've learned just from any of the writers in the show.
• 17:30
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, that's a great question. You know, on China,
• 17:34
  Speaker 4: I kind of came on after the writer's room was
• 17:36
  Speaker 4: sort of over. So most of the learning process was
• 17:40
  Speaker 4: really from Brad himself. And then prior to that, on Huge,
• 17:45
  Speaker 4: I was working directly with both Winnie and Savannah, who
• 17:48
  Speaker 4: were writing and then was familiar with their writer's room. So,
• 17:53
  Speaker 4: you know, I mean, it's tough. It's sort of every
• 17:55
  Speaker 4: show has... has their own style and has their own
• 17:59
  Speaker 4: different things that they like to do. So, you know,
• 18:02
  Speaker 4: I think, um, I, I, I suppose the things that
• 18:06
  Speaker 4: I've learned have been more, um, more about, you know, the,
• 18:14
  Speaker 4: I guess the, dealing with like networks and studios and
• 18:17
  Speaker 4: sort of the business side of the writing, I suppose,
• 18:20
  Speaker 4: has sort of been more what I've learned from those
• 18:23
  Speaker 4: experiences because a lot of the time, and as a
• 18:26
  Speaker 4: writer too, you know, a lot of the time writing
• 18:30
  Speaker 4: tends to be done in isolation. So you sort of
• 18:32
  Speaker 4: are in a room with a computer creating your story
• 18:35
  Speaker 4: or your idea or your characters. And you're not really
• 18:40
  Speaker 4: engaging with people in a big way. So I wasn't like,
• 18:44
  Speaker 4: in the room while, um, you know, Brad was writing
• 18:48
  Speaker 4: a script, you know, I was, I was there when
• 18:50
  Speaker 4: some ideas were being spitballed around, but I wasn't really
• 18:53
  Speaker 4: necessarily there like while he was sitting there typing out
• 18:56
  Speaker 4: his next line of dialogue or whatever. Um, so for me,
• 19:01
  Speaker 4: it was a lot of learning about, you know, working
• 19:03
  Speaker 4: with networks, working with studios, um, you know, taking notes, um,
• 19:07
  Speaker 4: learning how to do that in a, in a respectful and, um,
• 19:11
  Speaker 4: appreciative manner which I think is really important as a
• 19:14
  Speaker 4: writer because even though the writing process is done in
• 19:17
  Speaker 4: isolation really nothing else in the industry is like pretty
• 19:21
  Speaker 4: much everything else in the industry requires other people and
• 19:24
  Speaker 4: their input and collaboration and so for writers you know
• 19:29
  Speaker 4: a big thing that I talk to the writers that
• 19:31
  Speaker 4: I give notes to about and a big thing that
• 19:33
  Speaker 4: I sort of try and train myself to do is
• 19:35
  Speaker 4: to just not have a really big ego about it
• 19:37
  Speaker 4: because I At the end of the day, there will
• 19:40
  Speaker 4: be rewrites. There will be a lot of rewrites. You'll
• 19:42
  Speaker 4: have to change things. You can't get too attached to
• 19:46
  Speaker 4: any one line or any one character or any one
• 19:48
  Speaker 4: scene because it's going to change.
• 19:52
  Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 19:58
  Speaker 1: and now back to the show.
• 20:01
  Speaker 4: And so I think that's really maybe the biggest lesson
• 20:04
  Speaker 4: that I took away from it was really just having
• 20:07
  Speaker 4: that kind of humility when you go into these kinds
• 20:10
  Speaker 4: of bigger meetings or, you know, recognizing that the job
• 20:15
  Speaker 4: of it all is sort of under the auspices of
• 20:17
  Speaker 4: somebody else. And that kind of at any moment, like
• 20:19
  Speaker 4: that job could go away and it's pretty much up
• 20:22
  Speaker 4: to them to tell you notes and it's up to
• 20:23
  Speaker 4: you to take them. So as a writer and even
• 20:27
  Speaker 4: as a showrunner, you're really definitely still taking under the
• 20:31
  Speaker 4: control of the network and or studio. Um, so that's
• 20:35
  Speaker 4: definitely a big thing that I learned from, from both
• 20:37
  Speaker 4: of those writers assistant jobs.
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: Using your own projects as an example, you know, um, you, uh,
• 20:43
  Speaker 3: you know, I'm looking at your IMDB actually right now. Um,
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: you know, so, uh, uh, you know, you did snapshot
• 20:49
  Speaker 3: and you did Santa baby in 2010, you know, um, was,
• 20:53
  Speaker 3: was there any sort of, I mean, both of those
• 20:55
  Speaker 3: are short films, by the way, uh, to, to people listening. Um,
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: So was there any major changes you had to do
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: with those? I mean, granted, you had more control, but
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: as we all know, things change at the spur of
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: the moment. Totally.
• 21:08
  Speaker 4: I'm trying to think with, you know, there actually weren't
• 21:14
  Speaker 4: both of those projects. Snapshot was a co-write with Savannah Dooley,
• 21:18
  Speaker 4: who I later went on to assist on huge. And,
• 21:23
  Speaker 4: you know, I sort of did the first vomit draft
• 21:25
  Speaker 4: and then she came in and really polished it up
• 21:28
  Speaker 4: and made it really fantastic. She's just an amazing writer.
• 21:33
  Speaker 4: So that was like the biggest change was really her
• 21:36
  Speaker 4: kind of second draft pass. And then we kind of
• 21:39
  Speaker 4: just went from there. And then Santa Baby, I wrote
• 21:42
  Speaker 4: myself and ended up winning like second prize in like
• 21:46
  Speaker 4: a Las Vegas script contest, which is very exciting at
• 21:52
  Speaker 4: the time. And then That one didn't really change either,
• 21:55
  Speaker 4: come to think of it. I think that sort of,
• 21:58
  Speaker 4: you know, both of those scripts sort of kept their
• 22:02
  Speaker 4: storytelling pretty much the same as they were in their
• 22:05
  Speaker 4: first or second drafts. But I think a lot of
• 22:07
  Speaker 4: that came down to me either directing or producing or,
• 22:12
  Speaker 4: you know, having oversight on those areas as well. And
• 22:17
  Speaker 4: it's pretty rare for a writer to also be their
• 22:19
  Speaker 4: own producer.
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: So....
• 22:22
  Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, I think for those projects, there actually
• 22:26
  Speaker 4: weren't that many rewrites. And yeah, Snapshot did actually pretty
• 22:30
  Speaker 4: well at festivals considering that we didn't actually even do
• 22:33
  Speaker 4: that many rewrites. But yeah, I mean, we were pretty
• 22:36
  Speaker 4: excited about that one. But no, there weren't actually. It's
• 22:39
  Speaker 4: sort of funny to think about that now because I
• 22:42
  Speaker 4: am in the midst of rewrites on a bunch of
• 22:43
  Speaker 4: my projects that are longer. But for the short film
• 22:47
  Speaker 4: side of things, I haven't actually experienced too much of that.
• 22:51
  Speaker 3: Just to piggyback on that question then, you know, you've
• 22:54
  Speaker 3: produced some other movies as well. And, you know, what
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: are some of the things that have, you know, has
• 23:00
  Speaker 3: there ever been something that has happened on set that
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: has made you have to change? Like, you know, a
• 23:05
  Speaker 3: location fell through at the last minute or it started
• 23:07
  Speaker 3: to rain. You know, is there anything that while, you know,
• 23:10
  Speaker 3: you were wearing your producer hat that something sort of
• 23:13
  Speaker 3: catastrophic happened?
• 23:14
  Speaker 4: Yes. I can talk about it. I'll talk about it
• 23:18
  Speaker 4: without naming the movie because I don't want to call
• 23:20
  Speaker 4: anybody out. So shortly after I graduated from Columbia, I
• 23:25
  Speaker 4: was working on a project that was shooting in upstate
• 23:29
  Speaker 4: New York in the winter. And it was in like
• 23:33
  Speaker 4: the middle of like blizzard conditions, like it was snowing
• 23:36
  Speaker 4: every day and it was icy and it was cold. And,
• 23:39
  Speaker 4: you know, the central climactic moment of that particular movie
• 23:43
  Speaker 4: was a like 14 year old girl helping a horse
• 23:49
  Speaker 4: to give birth. And we sort of learned over the
• 23:53
  Speaker 4: course of the week while we were shooting and we
• 23:55
  Speaker 4: were actually shooting on a horse farm that belonged to
• 23:58
  Speaker 4: a family member of the director. But we learned during
• 24:03
  Speaker 4: that week something which I didn't know, which is that
• 24:05
  Speaker 4: you kind of can't predict when horses are going to
• 24:07
  Speaker 4: give birth. Like it just sort of happens. So, you know,
• 24:10
  Speaker 4: there were pregnant horses on the farm and they could
• 24:13
  Speaker 4: have given birth that week. But as we got farther
• 24:16
  Speaker 4: into the week, we learned that they actually weren't going to.
• 24:18
  Speaker 4: Like the vet was basically like, we don't think that
• 24:22
  Speaker 4: this is going to happen this week. So you sort
• 24:25
  Speaker 4: of get your like 20 minutes of warning and then
• 24:27
  Speaker 4: it happens. But like, otherwise you're sort of like going
• 24:30
  Speaker 4: by a lot of guesswork. And, um, we basically learned
• 24:34
  Speaker 4: on like day four out of seven or something that like,
• 24:38
  Speaker 4: it wasn't going to happen. And there was supposed to
• 24:41
  Speaker 4: be a day off for the crew and the cast, um,
• 24:45
  Speaker 4: on day five, essentially. And, um, instead of a day off, um,
• 24:51
  Speaker 4: basically I had to find a horse farm in the
• 24:55
  Speaker 4: area that had another horse that looked like the main
• 24:58
  Speaker 4: horse that we had been working with the whole time
• 25:00
  Speaker 4: that was pregnant that we knew would give birth that day. Um,
• 25:06
  Speaker 4: and send the crew there essentially, and hope that the
• 25:08
  Speaker 4: locations looked similar enough that it would match. Um, cause
• 25:13
  Speaker 4: we couldn't do a location scout or anything. Uh, and
• 25:17
  Speaker 4: we did it. I mean, we found a horse that
• 25:20
  Speaker 4: was going to give birth and the 14 year old
• 25:24
  Speaker 4: girl who was our lead, or she might've been a 15,
• 25:26
  Speaker 4: she was young. Um, but our lead, uh, helped the
• 25:30
  Speaker 4: horse give birth, um, that night. So we, we did
• 25:32
  Speaker 4: manage to make it work in the midst of a
• 25:35
  Speaker 4: blizzard in New York in the middle of winter. And
• 25:38
  Speaker 4: it was insane and probably the hardest shoot I've ever
• 25:41
  Speaker 4: been on. Um, but, uh, Yeah, I would say that
• 25:44
  Speaker 4: that was pretty catastrophic when I learned that that horse
• 25:48
  Speaker 4: was not going to give birth and that I had
• 25:49
  Speaker 4: to find a horse.
• 25:52
  Speaker 3: So how long did it take you to find a
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: similar horse?
• 25:57
  Speaker 4: Shockingly, not as long as you would think. We were
• 26:00
  Speaker 4: actually in horse country, but this was sort of like pre,
• 26:04
  Speaker 4: I'm going to like date myself right now, but this
• 26:06
  Speaker 4: was sort of like pre like internet days. Like there
• 26:10
  Speaker 4: wasn't like a lot of internet access where we were
• 26:12
  Speaker 4: and like, we didn't have like cell phones or the
• 26:14
  Speaker 4: wifi or anything. Um, so I like had to use
• 26:17
  Speaker 4: like the landline, um, to like call. And I was
• 26:21
  Speaker 4: using like the yellow pages to like call like horse
• 26:24
  Speaker 4: farms in the area. And like, there were actually a
• 26:26
  Speaker 4: lot of horse breeding, um, facilities in the area because
• 26:29
  Speaker 4: we were right near, I think Saratoga Springs, which is
• 26:34
  Speaker 4: pretty well known for, um, horse racing and horse tracks
• 26:37
  Speaker 4: and stuff. So, there were actually a lot of breeders
• 26:40
  Speaker 4: and farms in the area. And we ended up having
• 26:42
  Speaker 4: the option of two different places by the time I
• 26:45
  Speaker 4: got done with my phone calls after about, you know,
• 26:49
  Speaker 4: an hour of phone calling around. So it actually didn't
• 26:51
  Speaker 4: take that long. It just was, you know, one of
• 26:56
  Speaker 4: those moments where your heart just drops and you're like,
• 26:58
  Speaker 4: I don't know anything about horses. Like, I don't know
• 27:02
  Speaker 4: what to ask. I don't know who to talk to
• 27:04
  Speaker 4: about this. Like, I know nothing. So that for me was,
• 27:09
  Speaker 4: You know, it's sort of, they say, like, you know,
• 27:11
  Speaker 4: don't do movies with, like, animals and children, basically, especially
• 27:15
  Speaker 4: if you don't have, like, a giant budget. And that
• 27:17
  Speaker 4: was definitely one of those moments where I just, you know,
• 27:21
  Speaker 4: your heart just dropped. You think, you know, all right, well,
• 27:23
  Speaker 4: we're not going to get this movie made. But we did. Yeah,
• 27:27
  Speaker 4: it made. It looked great. I mean, you know, the
• 27:30
  Speaker 4: birth was fantastic, and it was real, and it was
• 27:33
  Speaker 4: shot on. And we were shooting on film, so we
• 27:35
  Speaker 4: didn't have the... option to like do a lot of
• 27:39
  Speaker 4: retakes or, you know, anything. So it was just, yeah,
• 27:43
  Speaker 4: it was, it was pretty wild.
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 27:45
  Speaker 3: You know, those pre-internet days, uh, I remember, you know,
• 27:49
  Speaker 3: filming some of my projects, you know, pre-internet days. Uh,
• 27:52
  Speaker 3: and I, I mean, this was like 2007, 2008. And
• 27:57
  Speaker 3: even then, I mean, like that's when cell phones were
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: starting to come, become big.
• 28:02
  Speaker 4: But like, you still had to like pay a lot
• 28:04
  Speaker 4: for like five minutes.
• 28:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 28:06
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and they were like the big candy bar phones,
• 28:08
  Speaker 3: like the Razor, the Crazer.
• 28:10
  Speaker 4: There was no service anywhere, so you had to be
• 28:14
  Speaker 4: in like a city for anything to work.
• 28:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and it just, you know, trying to find different
• 28:19
  Speaker 3: stuff was harder. Now, you know, it's like going on eBay,
• 28:23
  Speaker 3: for instance. I can find, obviously I can't find a horse,
• 28:25
  Speaker 3: but I mean, you can find.
• 28:27
  Speaker 4: Yeah, most of the props you can like get for
• 28:29
  Speaker 4: like a dollar.
• 28:30
  Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. Or, you know, I can find where the latest,
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: you know, one place I always tell people to shop
• 28:35
  Speaker 3: for props. I don't think it's... It's probably not that
• 28:39
  Speaker 3: good anymore because apparently they've caught on to this. But
• 28:42
  Speaker 3: the Goodwill stores.
• 28:43
  Speaker 4: Oh, totally.
• 28:44
  Speaker 3: Because... But, like, I hear now what they do is
• 28:47
  Speaker 3: they have a person who's back there and they put
• 28:50
  Speaker 3: all the good things... They save them so they can
• 28:54
  Speaker 3: put them on the online store.
• 28:55
  Speaker 4: Yeah, that sucks.
• 28:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah, so... I, you know, but I could still find
• 29:00
  Speaker 3: like different props for almost nothing. Like, you know, like
• 29:02
  Speaker 3: I need a statue that we don't mind if it
• 29:05
  Speaker 3: gets broken. Oh, here's one for two dollars.
• 29:07
  Speaker 1: All right.
• 29:08
  Speaker 4: Yeah, exactly.
• 29:09
  Speaker 3: Exactly. Yeah.
• 29:09
  Speaker 4: I mean, there's a lot of there's so many tricks
• 29:12
  Speaker 4: that you end up using, especially as a producer that
• 29:15
  Speaker 4: just kind of come into play over and over and
• 29:17
  Speaker 4: over again. And that's one of them for sure. Yeah.
• 29:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah. I find the best skill for a producer is
• 29:24
  Speaker 3: besides but besides having a network and Um, which is
• 29:28
  Speaker 3: a skill in itself that I found, but also being
• 29:30
  Speaker 3: as resourceful as possible because, uh, you know, I've worked
• 29:34
  Speaker 3: with some producers who I am in all of who,
• 29:37
  Speaker 3: some of the things that they got, I mean, one
• 29:38
  Speaker 3: producer I know. got a porsche uh i think it
• 29:42
  Speaker 3: was porsche or lamborghini one of those companies to airdrop
• 29:46
  Speaker 3: a brand new porsche or lamborghini to the set for
• 29:50
  Speaker 3: a shoot they needed and they and and they actually
• 29:52
  Speaker 3: paid for it.
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor
• 30:00
  Speaker 1: And now back to the show.
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: Meaning Lamborghini or Porsche actually repainted and had it airdropped.
• 30:08
  Speaker 3: And I was like, my God, how did you finagle this?
• 30:12
  Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, I mean, some people I've just worked with,
• 30:15
  Speaker 3: I've just, you know, I can do it all. And
• 30:17
  Speaker 3: then we all have stories of working with bad producers, too,
• 30:20
  Speaker 3: who just sort of, yeah.
• 30:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 30:23
  Speaker 3: I have one person who I'm hoping to have on.
• 30:25
  Speaker 3: He has one of the worst producer stories I've ever heard.
• 30:28
  Speaker 3: He'll be on probably, gosh, months from now. But anyways,
• 30:30
  Speaker 3: back to you, Miranda. Sorry, I have a tendency to
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: go off on other topics. I wanted to ask you,
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: you started Script Chicks with Sandra Levitin. I wanted to ask,
• 30:41
  Speaker 3: what are some of the reasons that you started your
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: own company and what are some of the services that
• 30:45
  Speaker 3: you offer?
• 30:46
  Speaker 4: Yeah, totally. So Script Chicks... We started about three years ago,
• 30:51
  Speaker 4: and I think we're probably going to actually be wrapping
• 30:55
  Speaker 4: it up pretty soon. But we both still do coverage
• 30:58
  Speaker 4: on the side, so we're still kind of like open
• 31:01
  Speaker 4: for business, but like technically. But essentially, the main reason
• 31:05
  Speaker 4: we started it was we had both walked away from
• 31:09
  Speaker 4: our jobs at the time. I was working as a
• 31:11
  Speaker 4: coordinator at an indie film company, and she was working
• 31:15
  Speaker 4: at a coordinator level in television business. And we essentially
• 31:20
  Speaker 4: both left those jobs to go out on our own
• 31:22
  Speaker 4: and produce. And we were sort of saying, you know,
• 31:26
  Speaker 4: all right, well, what are we going to do that
• 31:29
  Speaker 4: we can pay the bills and keep the lights on
• 31:32
  Speaker 4: while we're producing? You know, because obviously, especially when you're
• 31:36
  Speaker 4: producing indie projects and when you're starting at the short level,
• 31:40
  Speaker 4: which is where we were starting, you know, nobody's going
• 31:43
  Speaker 4: to hand you a check for that, really. Like you
• 31:45
  Speaker 4: kind of have to hustle yourself, you know, and generally, like,
• 31:51
  Speaker 4: even with crowdfunding, you know, as a producer, if it's
• 31:54
  Speaker 4: your own project, or as a director, if it's your
• 31:56
  Speaker 4: own project, you usually will crowdfund, but you will rarely
• 31:59
  Speaker 4: include a salary for yourself, because you recognize that, like,
• 32:03
  Speaker 4: that's your passion project, and you kind of have to
• 32:06
  Speaker 4: pay everybody else to be there. But like, you often
• 32:09
  Speaker 4: don't get paid. We put our own money into our
• 32:12
  Speaker 4: last project and we weren't getting paid on it. And
• 32:15
  Speaker 4: it's sort of the same with my next project that
• 32:16
  Speaker 4: I'm doing. So essentially, we knew that this was going
• 32:20
  Speaker 4: to be a few years of hustling really hard. And
• 32:25
  Speaker 4: we needed something that we could do on a freelance
• 32:28
  Speaker 4: basis that would permit us to still be producing and
• 32:33
  Speaker 4: be writing and be directing. So ScriptChix was kind of
• 32:37
  Speaker 4: formed based out of all of that and wanting to
• 32:40
  Speaker 4: be able to provide a service to writers because we'd
• 32:43
  Speaker 4: both worked in development for about a decade apiece. So
• 32:47
  Speaker 4: we combined about 20 years in the business of development
• 32:50
  Speaker 4: and reading scripts. And we knew that we could provide
• 32:54
  Speaker 4: that service and provide it well. You know, we had
• 32:57
  Speaker 4: clients who have gone on to sell shows to the
• 32:59
  Speaker 4: CW and ABC and Hulu and um, ABC family and
• 33:06
  Speaker 4: dimension and, you know, James Wan and like any number
• 33:09
  Speaker 4: of people in places. So like, we've had a lot
• 33:11
  Speaker 4: of clients that have gone on to do very big things.
• 33:14
  Speaker 4: So we, we knew that like, you know, should you
• 33:18
  Speaker 4: follow our notes and execute well, like you have a
• 33:21
  Speaker 4: pretty good shot of doing well and getting signed and,
• 33:24
  Speaker 4: you know, being, being pretty good. So, um, That was
• 33:28
  Speaker 4: something that we sort of all, you know, together felt
• 33:31
  Speaker 4: that we were going to be doing it on our
• 33:32
  Speaker 4: own and we sort of joined forces to do it together.
• 33:35
  Speaker 4: So that's sort of how Script Chicks was born, was
• 33:38
  Speaker 4: that sort of need to keep the lights on and
• 33:41
  Speaker 4: keep working and keep active in the industry, but also
• 33:44
  Speaker 4: be able to produce and direct and write on the side.
• 33:47
  Speaker 3: That's great, you know, because you always have to have
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: that stream of income. And then when you're, you know,
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: you're a producer or, you know, anything, when you're doing
• 33:54
  Speaker 3: it full time, you have to have multiple streams of income. Actually,
• 33:58
  Speaker 3: I took a course one time and this speaker kept
• 34:02
  Speaker 3: saying that every millionaire that he's ever worked with had
• 34:07
  Speaker 3: seven streams of income.
• 34:08
  Speaker 4: Wow.
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: And he kept harping on that because that was sort
• 34:12
  Speaker 3: of like the minimum number of how they get to
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: be millionaires. Well, they have seven streams of income.
• 34:18
  Speaker 4: All right.
• 34:22
  Speaker 3: And he said like the first one, Wasn't like the first,
• 34:25
  Speaker 3: the top three weren't their job. It was, um, it
• 34:27
  Speaker 3: was like number four or five or six was like
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: their full-time job, but the rest was like from different investments. Yeah.
• 34:34
  Speaker 4: Yeah, totally. And that's sort of the, you know, that's
• 34:37
  Speaker 4: the thing. It's like, how do you get the passive income?
• 34:39
  Speaker 4: So that's definitely, you know, the, that's the end goal,
• 34:42
  Speaker 4: I think for a lot of us in the, in
• 34:44
  Speaker 4: the business, especially, um, above the line is to really
• 34:46
  Speaker 4: figure out how to get those residuals coming in.
• 34:50
  Speaker 3: Yes. And, uh, you know, speaking of which, you know,
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: you currently have a GoFundMe campaign to, you know, sort
• 34:55
  Speaker 3: of fund your next project. So, you know, could you
• 34:57
  Speaker 3: talk a little bit about your GoFundMe campaign?
• 34:59
  Speaker 4: Yeah, sure. Um, so I'm doing a GoFundMe right now. Um, I,
• 35:03
  Speaker 4: you know, like I said, sort of at the beginning
• 35:05
  Speaker 4: of the podcast, um, really got into this to be
• 35:07
  Speaker 4: a director. That was sort of the end goal, big dream,
• 35:11
  Speaker 4: you know, um, beyond the writing and producing side of things,
• 35:14
  Speaker 4: which I love to do, but, um, which weren't, you know,
• 35:17
  Speaker 4: the passion from when I was quite young. Um, And
• 35:20
  Speaker 4: the last project that I directed, it probably thinks that
• 35:25
  Speaker 4: it was Santa Baby, but I think it was actually Snapshot.
• 35:28
  Speaker 4: But that project did actually pretty well in festivals and
• 35:30
  Speaker 4: it went to Outfest and we went to Palm Springs
• 35:33
  Speaker 4: and we went to a number of festivals around the world.
• 35:37
  Speaker 4: And we're very excited about that one. And then shortly
• 35:42
  Speaker 4: after that, I ended up sort of in the world
• 35:44
  Speaker 4: of full-time work and then founding script checks and working
• 35:48
  Speaker 4: on producing. And so I realized sort of in the
• 35:51
  Speaker 4: middle of last year that it had been a little
• 35:53
  Speaker 4: while since I'd actually directed anything, despite the fact that
• 35:57
  Speaker 4: that was sort of, you know, the primary goal of
• 35:59
  Speaker 4: me getting into the business to begin with. So I
• 36:03
  Speaker 4: wrote a short in November that got really positive feedback from,
• 36:10
  Speaker 4: you know, my very trusted readers, because, you know, like
• 36:13
  Speaker 4: I tell all my writer friends, you know, get a
• 36:15
  Speaker 4: reader and I have a few who I trust implicitly
• 36:18
  Speaker 4: to give me good notes because I don't want yes men.
• 36:21
  Speaker 4: I want people who are going to tell me, like,
• 36:23
  Speaker 4: fix this. So I did a script back then, and
• 36:27
  Speaker 4: I've gotten really great responses from pretty much everybody who's
• 36:31
  Speaker 4: read it. It's an action piece that follows a female
• 36:35
  Speaker 4: undercover cop who robs a bank for the mob but
• 36:40
  Speaker 4: then finds herself on the run from her former partner's.
• 36:43
  Speaker 4: So it's got some interesting twists and turns and it's
• 36:48
  Speaker 4: definitely action-packed. And I essentially started the process before I'd
• 36:55
  Speaker 4: even started crowdfunding by sending it out to my friend,
• 37:02
  Speaker 4: James Kyson, who played Ando on Heroes. And then he
• 37:06
  Speaker 4: was really interested in the project. And then I sent
• 37:11
  Speaker 4: it out to another friend, Pia Shaw, who was just
• 37:14
  Speaker 4: on Grey's Anatomy and has done Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. and
• 37:18
  Speaker 4: a few other semi-recognizable, you know, TV shows and films.
• 37:22
  Speaker 4: And she's just an amazing actress and they're both just
• 37:25
  Speaker 4: so talented. So, you know, for me, the project has
• 37:30
  Speaker 4: five characters and I've now officially cast two of them.
• 37:34
  Speaker 4: I have a hopeful third waiting in the wings. And
• 37:38
  Speaker 4: I'm really just excited to Do something action based. You know,
• 37:43
  Speaker 4: a big thing for me is diversity and women in
• 37:46
  Speaker 4: the industry because the numbers are really low and they're
• 37:48
  Speaker 4: really bad right now. And we've been hearing a lot
• 37:51
  Speaker 4: of that in the media. Obviously, you know, the New
• 37:53
  Speaker 4: York Times has covered it and there's investigations by the
• 37:57
  Speaker 4: Equal Employment Commission. And, you know, pretty much there's a
• 38:01
  Speaker 4: lot of stuff going on about women directors and minority representation. And,
• 38:05
  Speaker 4: you know, with Oscars so white, that's obviously an issue
• 38:08
  Speaker 4: as well. So it's something that has been close to
• 38:11
  Speaker 4: my heart for a lot of years. And it's something
• 38:13
  Speaker 4: that I think this project is going to allow me
• 38:15
  Speaker 4: to sort of take head on in that I will
• 38:19
  Speaker 4: be doing a project with I think the majority of
• 38:22
  Speaker 4: cast will be people of color. And, you know, obviously,
• 38:26
  Speaker 4: as a woman, I will be behind the camera. So
• 38:29
  Speaker 4: it's pretty exciting to be doing something that is really
• 38:34
  Speaker 4: just a flat out fun action thriller. Like there isn't
• 38:39
  Speaker 4: some secret hidden social message within the movie. Like it's not,
• 38:43
  Speaker 4: you know, trying to challenge the status quo from the inside.
• 38:46
  Speaker 4: It's literally just a really fun action movie that just
• 38:51
  Speaker 4: so happens to also be really diverse. So that's sort
• 38:56
  Speaker 4: of always been kind of like my way of addressing
• 39:01
  Speaker 4: political situations is that I I don't want to preach
• 39:04
  Speaker 4: to anybody. I don't want to tell anybody how they
• 39:06
  Speaker 4: should think or what they should do. But I really
• 39:09
  Speaker 4: just want to make entertaining product that promotes diversity, you know,
• 39:14
  Speaker 4: behind and in front of the camera. So that's sort
• 39:16
  Speaker 4: of been always my message. And I think that this
• 39:19
  Speaker 4: project is going to really be able to do that.
• 39:21
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I remember, you know, uh, reading in your GoFundMe
• 39:24
  Speaker 3: page that you were, uh, hoping to create something like
• 39:27
  Speaker 3: the raid. Um, and I was like, wow, that's awesome. Um,
• 39:31
  Speaker 3: because the raid is an awesome movie. If you haven't
• 39:33
  Speaker 3: seen it, anyone listening to this.
• 39:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 39:35
  Speaker 4: I'm, I'm a huge action fan. Like I will go
• 39:37
  Speaker 4: see pretty much any action movie on like opening weekends.
• 39:40
  Speaker 4: So whether it's like white house down or the raid
• 39:44
  Speaker 4: or all of business fallen or San Andreas, like you'll
• 39:47
  Speaker 4: see me there on opening weekend.
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: Um, We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.
• 39:57
  Speaker 1: And now back to the show.
• 39:59
  Speaker 4: I'm just an action junkie. So those kinds of movies
• 40:03
  Speaker 4: have always been something that I've loved. And this one
• 40:06
  Speaker 4: definitely is taking inspiration from those for sure.
• 40:11
  Speaker 3: Miranda, we've been talking for about, you know, like 30,
• 40:14
  Speaker 3: almost 40 minutes now. So in closing, is there anything
• 40:18
  Speaker 3: you wanted to maybe add or anything you sort of
• 40:20
  Speaker 3: wanted to say to sort of close out this entire conversation?
• 40:24
  Speaker 4: You know, yeah, I mean, I think that it's just
• 40:27
  Speaker 4: it's really exciting. First of all, thank you for having me.
• 40:29
  Speaker 4: So it's great to be able to talk to you.
• 40:31
  Speaker 4: You know, you meet a lot of people on Twitter,
• 40:33
  Speaker 4: but don't always get to actually speak to them. So
• 40:35
  Speaker 4: that's fantastic. And I love your podcast. So I'm really
• 40:38
  Speaker 4: excited to be doing it. But yeah, I mean, I think,
• 40:41
  Speaker 4: you know, I would hope that anybody listening would get
• 40:46
  Speaker 4: something beneficial from this. Um, you know, we've had some
• 40:48
  Speaker 4: good discussion about the film industry and what's going on
• 40:51
  Speaker 4: behind the scenes and in front of the camera. And, um,
• 40:54
  Speaker 4: you know, if anybody wants to hit me up, it's
• 40:56
  Speaker 4: easy to find on Twitter. I'm, um, at Miranda Sajak
• 41:00
  Speaker 4: and Sajak is spelled as it should be, um, S-A-J-D-A-K. Um,
• 41:05
  Speaker 4: and then, uh, yeah, I mean, my crowdfund is gofundme.com
• 41:09
  Speaker 4: slash Miranda directs and, um, I think those are it.
• 41:13
  Speaker 4: I mean, that's sort of, you know, the gist of
• 41:15
  Speaker 4: it all. But I'm always happy to answer questions about
• 41:18
  Speaker 4: screenplays and the industry and what it's like and my projects.
• 41:22
  Speaker 4: And I love hearing what other people are working on.
• 41:25
  Speaker 4: So I'm pretty open to just having a chat.
• 41:28
  Speaker 3: And everyone, I will link to all of those links
• 41:32
  Speaker 3: in the show notes. I follow Miranda on Twitter and
• 41:36
  Speaker 3: we're big Twitter pals, right? Oh, yeah. Yeah. But yeah,
• 41:40
  Speaker 3: I meet so many people on Twitter and I really
• 41:44
  Speaker 3: try to engage on Twitter. I mean, that's sort of
• 41:47
  Speaker 3: like my favorite social media site. Yeah, me too. And
• 41:50
  Speaker 3: I always try to talk to everyone I can who's
• 41:53
  Speaker 3: not like a spam bot or some kind of porn bot.
• 41:56
  Speaker 3: I get those a lot too. I get those too.
• 41:57
  Speaker 4: What's that about? They're showing up suddenly. I don't know.
• 42:01
  Speaker 3: They come in waves. Yeah, they do.
• 42:03
  Speaker 4: I'll get like four at a time. I'll be like, whoa.
• 42:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and sometimes, though, it's hard to decipher between the
• 42:09
  Speaker 3: two because one was just, like, this girl. She had
• 42:12
  Speaker 3: a normal name. She was, like, she said she was
• 42:14
  Speaker 3: a social media ninja and all this other stuff.
• 42:16
  Speaker 4: Yes, I think I have her, one of those.
• 42:19
  Speaker 3: There's probably one of her. Yeah, and then all of
• 42:21
  Speaker 3: a sudden, she's, like, DMing me, like, hey, go here
• 42:23
  Speaker 3: and we can date. I'm like, what? I know.
• 42:26
  Speaker 4: Like, the I'm a cam girl, like, click here. And
• 42:28
  Speaker 4: I'm like, really, though? Like, are you?
• 42:31
  Speaker 3: Okay, yep. Miranda, it has been great talking to you. Everyone,
• 42:36
  Speaker 3: you can find me at DaveBullis.com. Twitter, it's at Dave
• 42:39
  Speaker 3: underscore Bullis. You can follow me even if you're a
• 42:41
  Speaker 3: porn bot, as we were just saying. Miranda, I want
• 42:43
  Speaker 3: to say thank you and I want to wish you
• 42:45
  Speaker 3: the best of luck with your GoFundMe campaign and, you know,
• 42:48
  Speaker 3: with all your future projects.
• 42:49
  Speaker 4: Thank you so much, Dave. Thanks for having me on.
• 42:51
  Speaker 3: Oh, my pleasure. And I look forward to having you
• 42:53
  Speaker 3: back on sometime.
• 42:54
  Speaker 4: Oh, yeah, absolutely.
• 42:55
  Speaker 3: When you finally finish this movie, when you get everything raised,
• 42:57
  Speaker 3: I want you to come back on and you can
• 42:58
  Speaker 3: talk about the project. Awesome. All right, great. All right, Miranda,
• 43:01
  Speaker 3: I want to say thanks again and, uh, Have a
• 43:04
  Speaker 3: great weekend. Thank you.
• 43:05
  Speaker 4: You too.
• 43:05
  Speaker 3: Take care. Bye-bye.
• 43:08
  Speaker 1: I want to thank Dave so much for doing such
• 43:10
  Speaker 1: a great job on this episode. If you want to
• 43:11
  Speaker 1: get links to anything we spoke about in this episode,
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: head over to the show notes at bulletproofscreenwriting.tv forward slash 494.
• 43:19
  Speaker 3: Thank you so much for listening, guys.
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: As always, keep on writing no matter what. I'll talk
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: to you soon.
• 43:24
  Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the Bulletproof Screenwriting Podcast at bulletproofscreenwriting.tv.