Latest / Love Conquers Fear / #54: (Part 1) Human-Led AI: Building a Future That Prioritizes People and Purpose — Sol Rashidi

Transcript

#54: (Part 1) Human-Led AI: Building a Future That Prioritizes People and Purpose — Sol Rashidi · Love Conquers Fear

0:00
My entire existence and mission has to be focused on security,
0:03
securing the future workforce so that there is a symbiotic
0:06
balance in the future. Because AI is here, the genie is
0:09
out of the bottle. It's not going away, but it
0:10
can't be AI LED and human supported.
0:13
I do fundamentally believe it should be human LED and AI
0:16
supported. And I know a lot of techno
0:17
evangelist believe differently. But so much of what we do and
0:21
our purpose is tagged to what we do, right, wrong or indifferent.
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That if we take away our jobs and our work and just the labor
0:27
itself, we lose a big part of ourselves.
0:29
I see my children, children, I see the young adults.
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I don't ever want to give that up.
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I feel like we all need to have a purpose and that AI should
0:35
happen with us and not to us. Welcome back everybody to the
0:43
Love Conquer Spear podcast. I hoped you loved episode 53
0:48
with Brian Hubbard from the Americans for I Began
0:50
Initiative. He's become a very good friend
0:53
and he actually recommended a book on that episode by Michael
0:58
Gillian called Believing is Seen and I did dive into that book
1:05
for his recommendation. It is really well done.
1:09
Michael Gillian was a famous or is a famous ABC News reporter
1:15
for a long time on science and has been on the front lines
1:20
reporting all types of scientific breakthroughs.
1:23
Has a deep background in science himself.
1:26
He's a self professed science nerd and he really goes deep on
1:33
mathematics and physics and why they're actually acts of faith
1:38
too. That doesn't mean that there are
1:42
many aspects of science that are truths and obviously the world
1:47
has been greatly improved because of science.
1:51
All this this podcast and the way we're filming right now are
1:58
because of scientific breakthroughs.
2:00
The fact that it's reaching you via the Internet or on your
2:04
mobile phone with your podcast app, you know, all of those are
2:08
incredible scientific breakthroughs.
2:10
But he really breaks down with different scientific fields,
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what parts of them are based on acts of faith that are just kind
2:20
of assumed postulates, but really are acts of faith.
2:25
And it's a really fun read. I I will be upfront that I
2:31
didn't love the last arc of the book.
2:35
The last arc of the book tends to be his belief on why
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Christianity is the way that unifies science and
2:46
spirituality. And in my own explorations I've
2:50
found a lot to love about Hinduism, about Buddhism.
2:56
I'm Jewish, I love Judaism. Also, with the Kabbalah, you
3:02
know, the Quran and all of the sign, all of the faith-based
3:07
based traditions really unify with this common root that our
3:14
purpose here is to allow love, to conquer fear within ourselves
3:19
and then help others manifest that within themselves.
3:23
And then humanity rises and that is the metaphorical merger of
3:27
heaven and earth. I understand how he got there.
3:29
And I think if you are a devout Christian, I think you'll really
3:34
appreciate how he got there. But I will say that the other
3:39
faith traditions, you can get to the same place.
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You can really unify science and spirituality with those
3:47
traditions as well, and you can look for the common route
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between them all. But overall, I love the book and
3:53
I really appreciate the recommendation from Brian
3:57
Hubbard. And he told me up front, he
3:59
said, hey, you're going to love it there.
4:02
There are aspects of it which go deep into Christianity, but he
4:06
said you're going to love like most of the book.
4:09
And he's right. I do love most of the book.
4:11
The other book that I finished recently is shout out to Gabby
4:15
Polar, who recommended this. She was the lead fundraiser for
4:21
the Psychedelics Research Center at the Dell Medical School, and
4:26
she's been really laboring to stand up consciousness studies
4:31
and a consciousness center at UT Austin.
4:33
So I've been doing some collaboration with her on that.
4:35
She's a beautiful soul and she recommended this book to me by
4:39
Joe Taffer and it's called Medicine Song.
4:43
And Joe Taffer has this really improbable background.
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He grows up in, you know, very humble beginning, I think, I
4:51
think he ended up growing up in LA, but he has a near death
4:56
experience, which really shakes him to his core in terms of his
5:00
understanding of what a reality is.
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I, I've mentioned multiple times on this podcast, I've had now 12
5:06
friends open up to me on their near death experiences, which
5:10
we're transcendent for them, really defined what our reality
5:15
is for them. And I had Evan Alexander on the
5:18
podcast that was episode 46. He's the author proof of Heaven
5:22
and the map of Heaven, two of my favorite books.
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And we go very deep on his near death experience in that
5:27
episode. So definitely check that out.
5:30
But Joe ends up growing up with this understanding beyond the
5:36
veil and ultimately becomes on ayahuascaara, meaning he goes
5:42
and studies ayahuasca. It allows him to have a
5:46
communion with the divine. He then helps other people get
5:50
there and he eventually founds a church called the Eagle and the
5:56
Condor. And it talks about the arc that
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humanity is on and how the Condor is coming more into being
6:05
right now. And the Condor you can think of
6:08
is the mystical and the ancient traditions in his spiritual
6:14
regions are that the Condor is now coming into being and the
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eagle is the ego and that we've been really focused on science
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and, and the rise of the rational mind.
6:29
And now the eagle in the Condor are coming together and that
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this is actually prophecy to happen at this time.
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And so if you're starting to see more disclosure overall, that's
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part of the reason why it's happening.
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So it's a really fascinating read.
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His life story is amazing. I learned a lot about how you
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how you sat for people that that are using plant based medicine
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with, with ayahuasca. Ayahuasca is nothing I've tried
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yet. I'm not anti ayahuasca, but but
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it was fascinating to learn from his traditions and I look
7:06
forward to having him on the podcast.
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Gabby's introduced me and and we're going to set that up.
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So today I'm really, really excited to announce that I have
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Soul Rashidi with me and Soul is a very good friend that we
7:21
actually got together in Necker last year around this time,
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thanks to Alexander Makovan, who was on episode 19 of this
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podcast. Alexander is the CEO of Liberty
7:36
Ventures and has this annual event there.
7:40
And we were very honored to be there with Extremely Conscious
7:44
Capitalist and it was just a amazing time and here we are.
7:48
So it's such a pleasure to be here with you.
7:51
Who knew, right? It's been, what, a year now?
7:53
A little over a year since we were together at Necker Island.
7:55
Yeah, what a what an honor. Honor's all mine.
7:58
It was 1. Not only a great group, but I
8:00
think you and I have been tangentially in the same circles
8:03
in the same space. It was just great to finally sit
8:06
down. Yeah, you actually were on the
8:09
catalog and Cocktails podcast as well.
8:11
That's right for. Dated out world.
8:13
So shout out to Juan Cicada and Tim Gasper who to but to make
8:18
sure that I said hello to you from them.
8:22
And yeah, that that trip in Necker that was that was an
8:26
amazing trip for me. It was really part of the
8:31
beginning of the love conquer sphere journey.
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That was that was the first time where I publicly really opened
8:37
up about spirituality and this AI moment that we're in this
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exponential of exponential curves and and how I really
8:46
believe that the the divine is working through us as well.
8:50
And two things can be true at the same time.
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And it was at that time that I had started my journey, if you
8:56
will. And there was this awakening of,
8:58
wait a minute, there is a way to be a good human being, be
9:02
spiritually grounded and rooted, being connected to something
9:05
that's bigger than us, while for all intents and purposes, still
9:09
being a successful person, having a successful company.
9:13
And so that titling of conscious capitalism, I absolutely fell
9:17
deep into him. Like, there is a way to do both.
9:20
It doesn't have to be if or there is a way to be good and be
9:24
successful at the same time. Yeah.
9:26
Yeah. And, you know, shout out to to
9:28
Nancy Fetchnay to who she was the one that first came out to
9:33
me. And she's like you and Seoul
9:35
need to talk like the mission you're all.
9:38
Nancy's coming tomorrow. Oh, cool, yeah.
9:40
Yeah, because I told her I'm here.
9:42
So she's actually going to come for our keynote tomorrow.
9:44
Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, she, she and I did huffer
9:47
boards together in the middle of the lake.
9:50
Yeah. We're doing, you know, tomorrow
9:53
at the Kolchurati Conference, which I've been involved with
9:55
since the beginning with Eugene Sepulveda.
9:59
It's a. Beautiful.
10:00
So 11 years now you've been with them.
10:01
Yeah, that's amazing. Yeah.
10:03
I mean, with them, not like I'm on the board or anything, right?
10:06
I don't even know if there is a board, but but the the the idea
10:10
for the conference actually came from Eugene Sepulveda and I over
10:15
breakfast with him saying I think this would be a good idea
10:20
and I think we could make it a global conference.
10:22
And so, yeah, I don't think I've missed a culturality yet.
10:25
That's amazing. It's really, it's fantastic and
10:28
people fly in from all over the world for it.
10:30
It's really the definitive company culture conference at
10:33
this point. So you and I will be on stage
10:35
tomorrow. That's right.
10:37
That's right. And more than ever, boy, do we
10:38
need more and more conferences, summits, workshops, gatherings
10:42
like that. More and more.
10:43
Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah, yeah.
10:45
There's nothing like the face to face human experience.
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That's part of the reason why do the podcast in person as well.
10:53
I don't care how digitally connected we are and there's a
10:56
lot of convenience associated with doing things on Zoom.
10:59
Nothing beats the human to human experience.
11:03
You know, I was talking to one of my I used to run small,
11:07
large, medium sized teams long, long time ago.
11:09
And I remember there was a early career individual on my team and
11:12
his name was Brayden. And Brayden just wanted to do
11:15
everything via Slack and Zoom. And I was like, I asked him a
11:20
status on one of the features we were building and a product we
11:22
were releasing. I was like, hey, Braden, what's
11:24
going on with this? He's like, I don't know.
11:25
I asked Mike. I haven't heard from him.
11:27
I was like, when did you ask Mike?
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And he was like, oh, last week. And I was like, he's like, I
11:32
sent him a slack. I'm like, Mike, who sits across
11:34
from you. Like you couldn't just stand up
11:36
and walk around or hey, buddy, I'm like, you know, it's OK to
11:41
converse with them. You know, it's OK to ask for a
11:43
quick update. And I was like, listen, I know
11:46
you may be uncomfortable or maybe it's just not something
11:48
you've been taught. But when you build that
11:50
relationship with Mike, next time you ask for a favor, next
11:53
time you're in a committee together, that familiarity is
11:57
going to go a long way because that's the start of building a
11:59
relationship. And that's just how things get
12:02
done in this world still. I don't care how digitally
12:05
engaged we are, things still get done by other individuals who
12:09
either have some connection or relationship with you.
12:12
So instead of shooting a slack over to Mike last week and
12:14
waiting for a response, why don't you stand up and go, Hey
12:17
buddy? And it's just funny that you
12:19
have to teach that nowadays. And so I'm glad we waited.
12:23
We got to do this in person and we didn't skim on it.
12:25
Yeah, absolutely. You know, there's actually, you
12:29
know, I don't know if you know this, but the first book I wrote
12:31
is called The Entrepreneurs Essentials, really codifies what
12:35
I've learned and founding and, and growing six companies with,
12:39
with amazing teams, you know, including having over a billion
12:42
dollar IPO. And then my wife and I are
12:45
investors in 150 startups and 50 VC funds.
12:49
And so it's, it's the pattern recognition of what worked all
12:54
the time. You know what, what was the most
12:56
durable lessons. And one of the chapters, I think
12:58
it's chapter 17 is called Action Oriented Communication.
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And it actually is exactly this point.
13:05
Yeah, I've been making that point since the beginning of
13:09
Bizarre Voice, which which I started in 2006.
13:14
That's a great name. I love that.
13:15
Bizarre boys. Really.
13:17
Yeah. Voice of the marketplace, you
13:19
know, really popularized customer reviews all over the
13:22
world. Oh, that's fantastic.
13:23
Yeah, let's talk about, you know, what you're doing now and
13:27
how did you get there. You know, what's the arc?
13:30
You know, as as you look, as you look at the beginning of your
13:34
life, growing up, etcetera. Why do you think you're doing
13:37
what you're doing today? You know, I've tried retracing
13:39
my steps. What was that one decision point
13:42
that changed everything? And I couldn't have planned my
13:46
life or career or even thought this big.
13:49
As the eldest child of immigrant parents, when a revolution
13:52
happened, you know, you think about 1978, the Iranian
13:55
Revolution happened. My parents had just gotten
13:58
married and they came over and accidentally they were forced to
14:02
stay because they couldn't go back.
14:04
And so they didn't know the language, they didn't know the
14:06
ways, and they had to completely re establish themselves.
14:09
My father was an analyst, my mom was a travel agent.
14:13
He was driving taxi cabs because that didn't really require
14:15
knowing a language too much. It was more a matter of knowing
14:18
the streets. And my mother started working in
14:20
a daycare, changing diapers because you didn't need language
14:22
skills to do that. And so for them, the pathway was
14:26
very clear. Go to school, get good grades,
14:29
go to college and have a job for 30 years, retire, and then rinse
14:33
and repeat for every generation after that.
14:36
Because they grew up during a time of instability, so they
14:39
wanted to give us stability. And that was just the formula.
14:43
And I thought that was a formula.
14:45
And that's what I did. I was the eldest, so I had very
14:48
strict rules. I wasn't the best student
14:51
meaning I tried really hard but I was just wasn't natural.
14:55
It like I had to work at everything.
14:57
It was a struggle, but luckily. This is completely surprising
15:01
knowing you. That's The funny thing.
15:03
Well, of course, she's like a straight A student.
15:06
No, just the opposite. I had to study more than anyone
15:09
else to pull off a bee. And like at Berkeley it was a
15:12
totally different story. But even my acceptance to
15:14
Berkeley was a bit of a fluke. Like so I was very much the fat,
15:19
pudgy, awkward, I don't know, immigrant kid if you will.
15:25
I grew up in Orange County, California because my parents
15:27
left LA when crime was going up. They want a better education for
15:30
us so we moved to Orange County of all places.
15:32
Like I was still considered the color girl until about 9th grade
15:36
because Orange County was the OC truly.
15:39
And everyone was a little bit more cookie cutter and we broke
15:41
the mold. But luckily my my father picked
15:44
up a craft. It made money.
15:46
It afforded us to buy a house in a community like that and we got
15:49
great education. So like part of their dreams
15:51
were coming true. But I had a lot of awkward
15:54
years. I've just never skinny.
15:56
I was the first to develop. And I remember like I think it
16:00
was freshman year in high school, my mother's like, you're
16:02
getting fat. You need to join a sports team
16:04
because immigrant Middle Eastern parents aren't woke, right?
16:08
The the, the term of like trauma just does not exist in the
16:11
vocabulary. They're going to say nowadays.
16:13
And my mom's like, you're getting fat.
16:14
You need to play sports. I'm like, I don't know how to
16:16
play sports. She's like, well, try swimming.
16:18
I was like, I don't know how to swim.
16:20
She was like, it's easy. Don't sink like that, was the.
16:23
Don't. Sink.
16:25
I was like, OK. That's so funny.
16:27
I feel the book coming on. So.
16:32
It's like. Freshman year, actually, that's
16:35
a good point. Don't sink, right?
16:38
So it's freshman year and like I'm in my Kmart swimsuit that's
16:42
2 sizes too large. Because again, they're immigrant
16:45
parents. You don't buy what you fit, you
16:47
buy into what you can grow into. So the darn thing, whether it's
16:50
pyjamas or jeans, last you for 2-3 years, right?
16:53
Even our shoes from Payless shoe stores, right?
16:55
The bootleg like Swoosh Nike, that wasn't the Nike.
16:58
So we always got sizes too big anyway.
17:00
I'm on the diving board and it's like higher than I'm used to.
17:03
I'm in a Kmart swimsuit that's 2 sizes too big.
17:05
I don't have goggles. I think I'm wearing a scrunchie
17:08
at the time and I'm supposed to go and swim 25 yards.
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Needless to say, I jump in feet first.
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The hair comes out of the scrunchie.
17:15
I'm flailing away. People had already done the 50
17:18
yards and I think I maybe about 10 yards into it and the coach
17:22
just blows the whistle and bless her, she was a tough coach.
17:26
And she's like, what are you doing?
17:28
And I'm like, I don't know. She's like, why are you trying
17:31
out for this swim team? And she's and I'm like, because
17:34
my mom says I'm fat and I need to work out.
17:37
She looks something like WTF? But bless her heart.
17:41
She says, listen, there's no way you're joining the swim team,
17:43
but I will teach you 30 minutes. I will dedicate 30 minutes to
17:48
teaching you how to swim after I'm done with.
17:50
So you guys sit here and if you're willing to sit here for
17:53
an hour and a half or two, then I will teach you.
17:54
I was like, OK, well, I got nothing else to do.
17:56
I had no friends. So that's what I did.
17:59
I was doing homework while they were swimming and then I had to
18:01
get in the water for 30 minutes. It got to a point where I was
18:04
able to swim really well and I went to state for butterfly and
18:09
but like sheer stubbornness and will, but there's nothing else.
18:13
I had nothing else to do, so why not swim?
18:15
But then I had this like bug. I saw the sport of water polo
18:19
and it was amazing because I was like wait a minute.
18:21
So now we don't swim for the sake of swimming, which by the
18:24
way, it's a very mental sport because you're always in your
18:26
head when you're doing these repetitive lap laps.
18:28
But there's teaming, their strategy, their skill, and I
18:32
wanted a shot at water polo, but there wasn't a girls team.
18:35
Now this was all before Title 9 and the rule was if there wasn't
18:39
a women's team, you could join a men's team.
18:42
So I ended up playing water polo on a guy's team for about 3
18:45
years. Talk about an experience.
18:48
I deck changed with the guys. I had to learn how to do that.
18:51
That was a little bit sensitive. I was swimming with the guys, I
18:54
was lifting with the guys. I practically looked like a guy
18:57
by the end of like my senior year because I just had to work
19:01
extra to be able to be mediocre at that level and were.
19:04
You the only girl on the team. Or it was me and another girl,
19:07
but the other girl was about 6 inches taller and she was just a
19:10
beast of an athlete. The coach did not mind her on
19:13
the team. The coach looked at me like I
19:16
was a waste of space every single day and I think that's
19:18
just what drove me. Perhaps trying to prove it wrong
19:21
or I am worth something. Long story short he hated me and
19:26
he would throw chairs at me because back then you could
19:28
there wasn't like these things of like oh that's toxic or
19:31
that's bad for my mental health or trauma.
19:33
I was getting metal chairs or what do you do when you idiot?
19:38
But by senior year I, I'll never forget this.
19:40
He actually nominated me as a Scholar athlete award.
19:43
Wow. Never told me, didn't say a
19:45
word, but I knew he was the one that submitted me.
19:48
And when I got my trophy, we just looked at each other and it
19:52
was just like a quick nod and that was it.
19:54
But it was the videos of me playing on a guy's team that
19:57
actually got me into Berkeley because they were recruiting a
20:00
Cal for women water polo players.
20:03
And then I went to Berkeley and it was amazing.
20:06
But then I got my ass handed to me.
20:07
There I was studying chemistry. Why?
20:11
Because it was the subject that I was the most horrific at in
20:14
high school. And I was like, well, if I don't
20:15
know what I'm going to study, what better way to get better
20:18
some at better at something. And I completely suck at it.
20:22
I had no idea about the College of Chemistry and that the
20:25
Unibomber was born there and that how competitive it was.
20:29
So I would study relentlessly to get AC plus B minus.
20:32
I just couldn't keep up. And I was the girl highlighting
20:35
color coding. And there were brilliant people
20:38
there who didn't even show up to class and they would always set
20:40
the curve for the class. And same with water polo.
20:43
I was the shortest by about 7 inches.
20:45
And sophomore year, my coach was like, soul, what are you doing?
20:48
I'm like, it's a good point. I don't know.
20:51
She's like, listen, I love your work ethic.
20:53
I love your tenacity. No one could ever, ever talk
20:56
down about your work ethic, but you're never going to be on the
21:00
A string. You're going to be second string
21:02
to second string at best. And you have a choice to make.
21:06
Keep practicing 6 hours a day and be OK with this or you try
21:10
something else. And I remember my father when I
21:13
talked to him about he's like, listen, you can quit or you can
21:15
fail. I prefer you failing because
21:18
that means you tried till the very end.
21:19
But if you quit once, you'll get in the habit of quitting again,
21:25
then again, and then it becomes easier.
21:27
And so I would rather you fail because you'll learn something
21:29
from it. And so I was trying to take into
21:32
that principle, But halfway through sophomore year, I'm
21:35
like, my grades are sliding. I'm not doing well.
21:37
Like, it was just ego slam after ego slam after ego slam.
21:42
And so I quit. I quit water polo.
21:44
And two weeks later, though, a coach discovered me and asked me
21:48
what sport I played. I said, well, up until two weeks
21:50
ago, water polo. Now imagine I'm 53 on a good
21:52
day, but I'm about 45 lbs heavier when I was playing
21:57
sports than I am now. She's like, have you ever tried
22:00
rugby? What on earth is rugby?
22:03
Oh my gosh. And so she described to me,
22:04
she's like, well, it's like football without pads.
22:06
I'm like, why would anyone play football without pads?
22:08
I'm like, wait, why would women play?
22:10
Like, we're just not. We can get hurt.
22:13
She's like, I think you'll be natural at it.
22:15
And I looked at her in a smarky calm.
22:16
I was like, why? Because I'm short and stout.
22:18
She's like, exactly. I was like, oh, crap.
22:20
But it turns out I did try out my 53, which was a disadvantage
22:26
in water polo, was a tremendous advantage in rugby.
22:28
Lower center of gravity, harder to tackle the ball.
22:31
Handling skills I developed for water polo because you're
22:34
treading on ground. Amazing.
22:37
And I was a natural edit. And so in three months I made
22:40
captain. I played for the US team.
22:43
Wow, in three months? It was just natural.
22:46
Every everything I had trained for just carried over.
22:50
Now I had to learn how to tackle.
22:51
I had to learn about the fold. I had to be smart about when I
22:54
was being tackled and rugged and I got hurt.
22:57
Like, you know, my my eyebrows, parts of it are tattooed in
22:59
because I got a lot of busted eyebrows along the way.
23:03
And sometimes I joke I had to play rugby and voluntarily get
23:06
tackled to prepare me for this career.
23:07
But I thought I was going to play sports my whole life.
23:10
And then there was a rude awakening.
23:11
You get older and things just don't recover as fast and you
23:14
realize futons and ramen noodles just don't agree with the body.
23:17
And I was like, I got to get a real job.
23:20
And so the first job I ever got accepted into was a data analyst
23:23
slash data engineer. I love the work, but I wasn't
23:27
good at it. So you can see a theme, just not
23:31
good at stuff, but like sheer resilience and stubbornness.
23:33
I was like, OK, I'll figure this out.
23:36
But it turns out I was better as a business analyst than a data
23:38
analyst because I had this weird ability to understand what the
23:45
business needed and translated over into technical terms.
23:49
And so I was like a glorified translator.
23:52
And I was like, great, I don't belong in the business world.
23:54
I don't belong in the technical world.
23:56
I'm just this weird person in the middle.
23:58
Well, turns out it was like the perfect Venn diagram overlap.
24:01
And that was a skill set that was needed.
24:03
And so through rejection, I found a home and I became this
24:06
glorified translator between the two worlds.
24:09
So. What we call data storytellers
24:11
at data dot world. Well, data storytellers, yes.
24:14
Translators, data stewards, sometimes they've had that
24:18
evolution. Very.
24:19
Valuable skill set actually. But you would never have known.
24:24
And so, Long story short, became a project manager and took a few
24:27
jobs. I was even like in sales for
24:29
once. And I was like, EW, I was good
24:30
at it. I wanted nothing to do with it
24:32
because you're only as good as your last numbers.
24:34
And it was horrific. And I was making decisions that
24:37
were more driven by the Commission versus what was right
24:39
by the customer. That felt achy.
24:42
So I immediately pulled myself out.
24:44
And then I randomly fell into the space of master data
24:47
management of all places. What on earth is MDM?
24:51
And the way it happened was in my sales position, I was working
24:55
for a consulting firm in LA at the time and it was US against
25:00
Accenture. No, they were, they weren't
25:03
called Accenture. They were called Arthur Andersen
25:05
back then. This was pre Enron days.
25:07
And then Enron happened and they rebranded.
25:09
But it was US against Arthur Andersen, a very big customer
25:13
based in Orange County, California.
25:14
And there were millions at stake.
25:16
Now, my CEO had a relationship with their CIO and so we thought
25:19
we were going to get the business, but the CIO then
25:21
approaches my CEO and says it's not going to happen.
25:24
And Robert was like, why? He's like, listen, I got to go
25:27
with the big guys. You guys are a small boutique
25:29
firm and I would love to give you a sliver of the business,
25:31
but there isn't anything differentiating or unique that
25:35
you bring to the table right now.
25:37
It's par for par. And so it's just less risky to
25:40
go with the big guys. However, he did mention the one
25:43
thing that we cannot find is an MDM expert.
25:45
And Robert's like, what's an MDM expert?
25:47
He's like, I don't know, but apparently it's needed for SAP,
25:50
like migrations. So he looks at me and he's like,
25:53
so you're the most technical person we have.
25:55
I'm like, Robert, I'm not technical.
25:56
He's like, yeah, you are. You're the most technical person
25:58
we have. You're going to go to Texas.
26:01
You're going to go to Dallas, TX for two months.
26:03
You're going to get SAPMDM certified.
26:05
You better pass the test or you're not going to have a job.
26:08
I was like, OK, so it was me in a classroom with individuals who
26:12
had H1B visas, like very technical individuals.
26:15
And I was like, I don't even know how many Hail Marys I
26:17
threw. Studied really hard.
26:19
Somehow I passed and I became one of 11 that was nationally
26:22
certified in MDM that took off. I went from an individual
26:27
contributor. You're a category creator.
26:29
In a weird, weird way. Totally accidental again.
26:32
And then IBM recruited me. SAP was a big thing.
26:36
MDM became a big thing. If anyone remembers the Sapphire
26:39
conferences, it was like spring break for adults, and I was one
26:43
of 11. So I went from being an
26:44
individual contributor to managing a team and then
26:47
ultimately to the primary liaison to the business.
26:49
They always wanted me to connect the dots for them.
26:53
And then I became an associate partner and then a partner.
26:55
And then something remarkable happened.
26:58
Watson beat Ken Jennings in a game of Jeopardy that was
27:01
televised. And Jennie Rimetti had just made
27:05
CEO, so first female CEO artificial.
27:08
The early version of artificial intelligence was introduced to
27:10
the workforce. It was like for me, the golden
27:13
year in 2011 and I was partner. So my skip level by two, Jay
27:20
went over to Watson and I was like, coach let me in.
27:23
I want this. I didn't know why I didn't know
27:25
how. Same reason why I didn't know
27:26
why or how with water polo go down this route.
27:30
And for four months I gracefully kind of begged Jay.
27:32
I was like, Jay, you can't do AI without data.
27:35
Totally made that up. Had no idea if it was true and
27:37
like a no one knows this space better than I did.
27:40
So finally I got in and for five years I got to travel the world,
27:44
help companies back then with their AI strategies and AI use
27:46
cases and with developments and deployments.
27:49
And you don't know until you know.
27:51
And like you just kind of stumble upon all the mistakes
27:53
and assumptions. And then after Watson's brand
27:58
was a little bit tarnished with some few, like few failed
28:02
implementations, I wouldn't say because of the technology.
28:06
Again, first to Mark it's very difficult at that scale.
28:09
Then I became a partner at Ernst and Young and help them build
28:11
their digital practice. And then my client Royal
28:14
Caribbean hired me as their Chief data and AI officer back
28:16
in 2016 and it was amazing. In 20/16/2016 and that was the
28:21
first time that title was a title, right?
28:25
Chief AI officer and or chief data officer.
28:29
And it was remarkable because, well, the disadvantage was there
28:33
was no job description. That was a time when everyone
28:36
knew data was an asset, a digital asset, and digital
28:39
transformation had just started percolating to the top and it
28:43
started becoming a strategic initiative.
28:46
But how do you enable digital transformation again through
28:49
data? And so for me, I was a kidney
28:52
candy store because I got to build, I got to experiment, I
28:56
got to try and do all the things that I love.
28:57
That was both an amalgamation of business and technical.
29:01
But because the job description wasn't vetted or written, I was
29:05
writing it in real time. And I quickly learned that folks
29:09
don't know what they necessarily want, but they can immediately
29:13
spot what they don't want. So I became the source of all
29:18
the things that folks didn't want.
29:19
And it was like, OK, so you don't want this, we'll try it a
29:21
different way. No, no, no, I don't want that.
29:23
But I do kind of like this. OK, we'll try it a different
29:25
way. So it was just writing the rules
29:28
of engagement and the role of what does ACDO really do and the
29:31
difference between an offensive CDO and a defensive CDO.
29:35
What is the role of a chief AI officer?
29:37
Do they really own all of artificial intelligence with an
29:40
enterprise Oregon? Is it more of a maestro managing
29:43
an orchestra where everyone's playing a different instrument?
29:46
Like those are the things that I got to uncover along the way,
29:49
granted through many frictionful experiences, but that went on to
29:54
other roles. One of the funnest was at Sony
29:58
Music. I was your executive vice
29:59
president and CDOI got to do shots with Harry Styles and get
30:02
a private concert with Alicia Keys.
30:06
Then COVID hit and I joined Merck Pharmaceuticals.
30:09
And then after that, I would say the best perk was at Estee
30:11
Lauder, 3040% off of like, I mean, I'm a gal, right?
30:15
Like Lemur and Tom Ford and all the amazing makeup and stuff.
30:19
That was a lot of fun. I work for the Lauder family.
30:21
You know, you know, with a bizarre voice.
30:23
They were a customer of ours and we would actually get that
30:25
discount too, which which benefited.
30:28
Oh, did Deborah good for her. And I loved it because it was
30:32
products that people tangibly connected with.
30:35
And that's when I first understood how much experience
30:38
and marketing are interconnected.
30:41
But then in 2023, I two things happened that changed the course
30:46
of my career. I burnt out and there was a
30:51
micro Iranian revolution. There was a lot of millennials
30:55
and just years that were dying. They were protesting the hijab
30:59
movement. I remember that there was a ton
31:02
of oppression and suppression that they were just experiencing
31:05
and just so many young beautiful adults dying and a few my family
31:11
members were caught in that turmoil and I couldn't help but
31:15
be bifurcated in thinking and my purpose.
31:19
Here I am living a life of luxury and I was accidentally
31:23
born in the states, but everyone blood related was in Iran and
31:28
that's what what we saw the government and like what's
31:30
happening right now like thankfully it's happening
31:33
because that's not the culture right at at all like music and
31:38
food and people and dancing and we're.
31:41
It's the beginning of mathematics.
31:42
I mean, it's, it's one of the greatest.
31:44
Cultures, architecture. Like.
31:46
If you think about historically, yes, but just the people in
31:49
general, can we be a bit too much at times?
31:51
Yes, we can be over the top. But like it is about love and
31:54
food and experiences. Like the Persian home is always
31:58
ready to host. Like that's just fundamental,
32:02
like in our DNA. And then to see what the country
32:05
was going through. So part of me was there, but
32:07
then the other part was I was completely burned out.
32:10
I had bosses telling me, so I need you to play small a little
32:14
so others can play feel big around you.
32:19
You're just trying to do your job.
32:21
You don't know how to take it. So I tried playing small and I
32:24
felt I was spending more energy and containing my energy than
32:27
actually just doing good by the company, by the individuals.
32:32
I had one peer say, so why do you keep talking tech?
32:37
Leave that up to the guys. And I paused and I said, well,
32:43
they did. You didn't do your job.
32:44
So they hired me to fix it. But don't worry, I'll give you
32:47
the credit anyway. Like in that was a one-on-one.
32:50
But like these are things that were top of mind because I was a
32:53
bit of a threat and it was a new role, but it was a threat to
32:56
pre-existing rules. So like it was always you're too
33:00
much place smaller, you're thinking too big, be more
33:02
conservative. But they always hired me as the
33:04
change agent. And so the containment of energy
33:07
and the go, go, go, go. I would wake up at 5, catch up
33:10
on work, do 10-12 hours of Zoom calls because I was global.
33:15
So I had to take the India, China calls in the morning and
33:17
then my calls would run into evening.
33:19
I had two kids. In the process, my mother
33:21
started to live with me. I crashed and burned.
33:24
And it was one of those things where it didn't matter how many
33:27
drink, like cups of coffee I would drink, there is no impact.
33:31
And by 132, all I wanted to do was sleep for two hours and
33:35
eventually my adrenal glands were shot.
33:37
Like it was officially diagnosed.
33:39
And I was like, something has to change.
33:41
So for the betterment of my health and seeing if I can help
33:43
my family in Iran, I gave my notice and took nine months off.
33:48
But in that nine months, I wrote the book.
33:51
And in that nine months, I was advising and consulting.
33:54
And and Brett, I don't know if you feel this way, I'd love your
33:56
viewpoint on it, but I got bored with advising and consulting
33:59
because I wasn't building, I wasn't doing, I was just
34:04
advising and whether they take it or not as completely at their
34:07
discretion. And I wanted to be in the
34:08
middle. Of it, well, it's actually why I
34:11
became an entrepreneur. I mean, I don't know if you know
34:13
this about my background, but I helped a guy when I was very
34:17
young, I think I was 10. I helped him set up a bulletin
34:20
board system, you know, which it was modem to modem communication
34:24
and you have chat rooms and downloads and, you know, play
34:28
online games together and all types of things.
34:30
And I had one of the most popular BB s s in Austin.
34:33
So I helped helped this guy Eric out and he called me when when I
34:39
was at UT Austin, I think it was my sophomore year, where he gave
34:43
me a call and he said, Hey, this is Eric.
34:46
Do you Remember Me? And I was like, oh, of course I
34:48
do. He's like, do you still program?
34:50
I was like, it's all I do. You know, I've been doing it
34:52
since I was 7 years old. And he's like, well, I've got a
34:57
job for you if you want it. It's at this place called
35:00
Anderson Consulting. And it was.
35:03
Well, talk about full circle. And, you know, prior to
35:07
becoming, you know, becoming known as Accenture, which I
35:10
always thought was interesting, name change it means.
35:12
It's better than Monday. It was better than Monday.
35:14
That was their original. Exactly and so I actually worked
35:19
full time while I was a junior and senior at UT Austin getting
35:25
my undergraduate degree in management information systems.
35:28
You know my my BBA lot of people think I'm ACS major but when I
35:33
was. CSA thing.
35:35
Oh yeah. Computer life is.
35:36
Definitely a thing, but the, but the final project when I was at
35:40
UT, if you were ACS major was creating like printer drivers.
35:45
And I was like, no, I'm not doing that.
35:48
All, all the software I've created like I know how people
35:51
are using. And so it was actually karma
35:54
that got me in there. And you've had lots of karma
35:58
working on your side in terms of all the category creation.
36:02
But, but it was, but it was working actually at, at, at
36:05
Anderson Consulting and really wanting to start my own
36:09
business, but not feeling yet ready to do so.
36:13
And then going to Deloitte Consulting after graduating from
36:18
UT. They, they were very
36:21
competitively trying to get me to go there.
36:24
And I went there and that's what got me into the introduction to
36:30
MBA programs. And I got into the Warden school
36:33
and they were going to pay for it.
36:35
But I, I started my first businesses at Warden because of
36:40
what you said, like when you're a consultant, you're not
36:43
actually creating, creating the business.
36:47
You can give all types of advice and it's, and it's, you know,
36:50
it's important that you, you have that benefit of being
36:54
objective, you know, going in and seeing the situation for
36:57
what it is. People do get they they, they
37:01
lose their ability to see. Now did your parents open up the
37:06
doors and you discovered the world of developing and coding
37:09
at 7:00? Or was it something you
37:10
accidentally stumbled upon but your parents support?
37:13
Oh gosh, what now you're asking me one of my favorite questions
37:15
because I get to brag about my mom.
37:18
My mom learned how to program with me when I was 7.
37:22
No. Oh I love.
37:24
That yeah. Yeah, my blog.
37:26
You discovered. It.
37:28
And she supported it. Well, she was the one that
37:31
introduced me to it. She bought me a pawn when I was
37:34
four years old, and I was the kid that was trying to take it
37:39
apart and figure out how it worked.
37:41
And she thought that was very unusual.
37:43
And so she bought me my first computer at age 7 and learned
37:46
how to program with me. And the thing she did that was
37:49
like super mom, like superhero mom is she then let me do that
37:54
over 40 hours a week for my entire childhood.
37:57
And so instead of like you've got to do this and that and she
38:01
just let me exercise my passion, which turned out to be an
38:07
amazing. Career.
38:10
And I didn't realize how much of A superpower that was until we
38:15
had kids ourselves and how important it is to expose your
38:20
kids to lots of things and see what it is that they're
38:23
passionate about. Yeah.
38:25
And. And then let them do that.
38:28
Yeah. So.
38:29
It was incredible. And I think this is where I know
38:32
there's nature versus nurture and kids are kind of pre wired
38:35
when they come out like same parents, but you could have
38:38
totally opposite siblings. But I think this is where
38:42
they're nurturing really helps cultivate the path that you go
38:45
down. Mine were immigrant parents.
38:47
They didn't know the world of coding and computer science.
38:49
They were like, whatever it takes to get a job for 30 years
38:51
and then retire. Like that was the only path that
38:54
they knew. I had no idea about computer.
38:57
I mean, the I remember in high school, I got an Apple 2 E and I
39:01
loved playing the typing game, but that was about it.
39:03
Like, that's as far as I went. Again, just a very fat, awkward
39:07
girl trying to survive, not necessarily knowing what I was
39:11
going to do. I was still putting sun in in my
39:14
hair, thinking I was going to be blonde like the other girls,
39:16
only to turn out like Oompa Loompa because my hair went
39:19
orange. Because I'm Middle Eastern, of
39:20
course I'm going to get brassy. But so the advising and
39:24
consulting, which I think you and I both can relate to, I'm a
39:27
builder. I love creating.
39:29
I'm a change agent. And I didn't realize that those
39:31
were titles. I just knew that I was getting
39:33
rejected from everywhere I was for different reasons, and I
39:36
couldn't understand it. And I thought something was
39:39
wrong with me. And the more I tried to make it
39:44
better, actually, the worse it got.
39:47
And that's like kind of the first in a weird way.
39:50
We talk about being in alignment, right in the
39:53
spiritual world. We talk about the divine
39:56
connection, intuition, gut. Like I thought these were random
40:01
incidences, haphazard ways of just bumping into this bumper
40:04
car and then going into another bumper car and the career
40:07
pivoting. When I was about 43 ish, yeah,
40:13
44 ish, 43 ish, I couldn't explain up versus down.
40:17
I just felt defeated. And I was like, I have worked
40:20
too hard in my life. Like everything I've had to work
40:23
hard for, nothing comes naturally.
40:26
What is going on? And so it was like a identity
40:29
moment. I was like who am I going to be?
40:31
What am I going to do? And when the book was launched,
40:34
it was great. But you know, books, writing
40:36
books and publishing books and getting it out there is very
40:39
difficult, especially nowadays where everyone can self publish.
40:42
The market is saturated. But I bumped into one person who
40:45
introduced me to another person. And to this day, Vanessa
40:49
Browsers has been my coach and guide.
40:51
And I learned for the first time words like agency, sovereignty,
40:56
divine connection, pilgrimages, deities, alignment.
41:04
I didn't even know I was like 44 learning and studying these
41:07
things. And I just went down this rabbit
41:09
hole of like, wait, I can say no to things, wait, I'm allowed to
41:13
say no to things? Wait.
41:15
I'm not meant to play small because my energy naturally is
41:18
just large. It started making more and more
41:22
sense, but it didn't explain the career thing.
41:25
And then I accidentally stumbled upon an opportunity where AWS
41:28
wanted to recruit me as their head of technology for North
41:31
America managing their startups business.
41:34
There was a head of business development and then there was a
41:36
head of the solution architects. So eyes oversaw the solution
41:38
architects, Perplexity, Anthropic.
41:41
They were our customers amongst many other MLAI native
41:45
companies. And it was really fun and I
41:47
loved everyone I work for. Data dot world was too.
41:49
That's right. That's right.
41:51
And somehow it came to me of like my entire existence and
41:55
mission has to be focused on security, securing the future
41:59
workforce so that there is a symbiotic balance in the future.
42:03
Because AI is here, the genie is out of the bottle.
42:04
It's not going away, but it can't be AI LED and human
42:08
supported. I do fundamentally believe it
42:11
should be human LED and AI supported.
42:13
And I know a lot of techno evangelists believe differently,
42:16
but so much of what we do and our purposes tagged to what we
42:21
do right, wrong or indifferent, that if we take away our jobs
42:24
and our work and just the labor itself, we lose a big part of
42:27
ourselves. And I see my children, I see the
42:30
young adults, I don't ever want to give that up.
42:33
I feel like we all need to have a purpose.
42:36
And then securing these massive ecosystems that are being built
42:40
because right now everyone's running with scissors for the
42:44
first time in all the technological disruptions that
42:47
have actually occurred over centuries, we're security and
42:50
governance, we're always protocols that ran in parallel.
42:53
We are being told to go run with scissors because of this FOMO
42:57
that's kicked in of do AI or become obsolete, do AI or die.
43:02
And so executives, boards are feeling the pressure and we've
43:05
got many narratives around VCs and big tech and there's this
43:09
swarm of activity happening, but we don't have the proper
43:13
security protocols. We don't for IT regulations.
43:16
I'm not even talking about that. I'm like, agents can
43:19
hallucinate, LLMS are hallucinating, and we're doing a
43:24
good job of sweeping the no nose and the mistakes and the
43:26
whoopsies under the rug and just highlighting the glamorous
43:28
aspects of it. And it's really unfortunate.
43:31
So for me, it was driven by my kids.
43:34
I love the path, as frustrating as it was and as relentless as
43:38
it was, I want my children to have a future.
43:40
I want their children to have a future, but also privacy,
43:45
security. And where spirituality kicks in
43:48
is when I learned the words of agency and sovereignty and
43:53
protection and safety, things that as a woman and the tech
43:57
space and as an executive, I didn't always feel it all just
44:01
came together. People should have a choice
44:04
always. And that AI should happen with
44:06
us and not to us. And there are conscious
44:10
decisions that we can make to ensure that we can both grow.
44:14
Yes, the business exponentially, but also human capacity and
44:19
human love and human abilities and just unleash, to your point,
44:23
abundance. I just don't think we're making
44:26
some of the best decisions to support that future just yet.
44:29
So everything I do is focused on that right now.
44:31
That's that's awesome. And don't you think that that
44:35
God is working through us to get us to make the decision to allow
44:40
love to conquer fear? If I'm not dropping into my
44:43
heart and I'm speaking with my mind, part of me overanalyzes
44:47
the fact that we have gone through centuries after
44:50
centuries after centuries of power, greed, classism, racism.
44:57
Like if God was living through US, why would he allow such
45:01
massive genocides and massacres, right?
45:06
But if I short circuited the brain and go into my heart, I'm
45:09
like, maybe this is A reckoning. Maybe this is the time we are
45:13
flawed as creatures. There is good and bad.
45:16
There is masculine and feminine. We are always going to operate
45:19
in the 50 Shades of grey. Nothing is ever black or white.
45:21
There are reasons and things beyond what we can predict with
45:25
science that just fundamentally occur around us if we're willing
45:28
to pay attention and wake up. And there is synchronicity
45:32
involved. And maybe this is the point, the
45:40
bend in the curve, the bend in the river, as you so eloquently
45:44
put that the consciousness. Of.
45:48
Course, of course, I got first private preview.
45:52
Why on earth would I not? But I hope this is the bend in
45:55
the river where consciousness is raised.
45:59
There's so much desperation for attachment and connection in the
46:02
digital world that we live in that this becomes a path that
46:06
people choose to get back to realignment and as a result, we
46:12
start making better decisions. That's what I've been shown.
46:14
I mean, you know, it came to me in a in a journey where God is
46:19
working through us. And this is the fateful choice.
46:23
And when we allow love to conquer fear and use the
46:29
technology for its greatest good, then humanity will ascend
46:36
and will create heaven on earth. And that, you know, in the book,
46:39
as you know, I personify it with an Uber driver from from Chad.
46:43
You know, Chad has AGDP at $660 a person versus our 86,000 here
46:49
in America. And I was like, what?
46:53
You know, he, he and I are this having this amazing divine
46:56
connection. It's just where this, you know,
46:58
you can tell we're meant to meant to meet each other.
47:01
And as I'm learning more and more about what is it like to
47:05
live in a country with $660.00 of GDP, a person you have very
47:10
in stable electricity, running water, not really much of a
47:15
thing, you know, rampant disease, you know, very, you
47:21
know, very bad food availability, healthcare
47:24
availability, etcetera. And we have to get to a point
47:28
where there's such a decline in cost because of so much
47:32
abundance that financially it makes sense because capitalism
47:39
kind of is one of the one of the big rulers that humanity is
47:42
prioritized where it makes sense to go into a country like that
47:47
and create abundance, you know, create the healthcare they need
47:50
and everything else. And, and, you know, it is, it
47:55
is, I, I mean, the way I see the world in so many ways is 2
47:58
things can be true at the same time.
48:00
It's one of my favorite sayings. You know, we can both have like
48:05
these potential dystopian outcomes with AI.
48:08
And certainly there's bad uses of it today.
48:11
And, and some of the people running it, you know, are not,
48:16
not doing the best job at bringing out the best of it.
48:19
But at this, on the flip side of that it, it is the path to
48:27
abundance and, and technology has always been the path.
48:30
You know, when we discovered fire, we could use it to warm
48:34
our caves back then cook our food or use it for great
48:38
destruction. And humanity did use it for
48:40
both. But scale plays a big role in
48:43
that access plays a big role in. That for sure.
48:45
Because I think with abundance at this date and time, I'm not
48:51
sure we would know what to do with it and make the right
48:53
decisions because we could use that lever to narrow the great
48:58
digital divide that exists between the modern technocentric
49:03
industries in the world's and countries with those that are at
49:07
a disadvantage. But we haven't done that yet
49:09
because if you look at the efficiencies that we've been
49:11
able to hit with compute, with storage, with water, with
49:15
energy, we are tenfold more efficient now than we were 20
49:20
years ago. But that same issue still exists
49:23
even with healthcare, viruses, diseases, and just medicine.
49:29
Well, the technology has allowed us to discover new medicines
49:32
that can treat like fundamentally fatal diseases,
49:36
but still it's reserved for the select few and not those that
49:40
are in need. So even with the abundance of
49:42
access with medicine, biotech, pharma and the abundance of
49:47
capabilities with energy consumption, it is not carried
49:51
over. And so I think the optimistic
49:54
view is, yes, in the age of abundance, we could solve some
49:57
of these fundamental issues, but there has to be this divine
50:00
intervention where everyone is collectively working towards
50:05
that. And right now, I don't see
50:09
signals yet that everyone is collectively working towards
50:12
that. Everyone's just surviving in
50:14
their own world. And with this technology, I
50:17
would love nothing more than to think that it is enhancing our
50:21
abilities because we now have data that's democratized and
50:24
accessible by us all. Like it's unbelievable what we
50:27
can get to some of these frontier models.
50:29
But the flip side is, you know, as a society, we prefer
50:34
convenience over comprehension. We prefer speed over substance.
50:42
We are preferring motion right over sitting still and just
50:46
letting some magic happen through our stillness and
50:48
silence. And so we're we're programmed
50:51
that way. So how do you deprogram or
50:52
unprogram? That's where I think this divine
50:56
intervention has to happen because in order for us to pivot
50:59
and use tech for good and not for bad, to narrow the digital
51:03
divide that's happening, to be able to access all the assets we
51:08
gained to the age of abundance, to be able to spill over into
51:12
the fundamental like challenges are that we're being faced with
51:15
day-to-day. There has to be that collective
51:18
consciousness, and I don't see it in everyone now.
51:22
I'm very blessed that I met you, even though we've been in the
51:24
same world in person at Necker. And with you came others and
51:29
with those others came others. And I'm like, Oh my God, there's
51:31
a movement. I'm like, wait a minute, It's
51:33
not that there's a movement. It's like I'm finding other like
51:35
minded individuals. That's the law of synchronicity.
51:39
So. But there is also a movement I I
51:41
do think. There's you do feel there's.
51:42
Awakening. Oh yeah, yeah, I think, I think
51:44
that there's a consciousness awakening going on.
51:47
Like when you go to the AI conferences, when you're hearing
51:50
the CE OS of the Mag Sevens, when you're listening to the VCs
51:54
and their podcasts, do you hear that consciousness come out in
51:59
their discussions? You, you, you usually don't hear
52:03
it on stage that you hear it in private conversations.
52:08
And there's, there's glimpses of it.
52:10
Like, you know, Dario Modi's adolescence of technology piece
52:15
is, is really, really, it's beautifully done.
52:18
Very beautifully done. And what he just did with the US
52:21
government, I have literally in the past three weeks, and even
52:25
though this cost me hours that I did not have, have literally
52:29
transitioned all my projects and work from open AI to anthropic,
52:33
like just fundamentally because of the stance that he took on
52:37
privacy. And yes, and here are the things
52:40
that you just can't do with it, because that's just not what we
52:42
stand for, right? We need more.
52:45
So you're absolutely right. Ari is a great example of just
52:49
that consciousness that's going into this because he understands
52:52
the power this holds. And I'll give you another
52:54
example. I'll give you Dimmis of this.
52:57
So you know, I go to I go to the Ted conference every year.
53:00
It's coming up, it's amazing. And two years ago at Ted, Chris
53:08
Anderson was really pressing him and saying, you know, Dimas,
53:11
like, why are you doing this? What's driving you?
53:13
Like what, what do you, what do you really want to learn?
53:16
And he starts talking about the tree of knowledge and that he
53:21
wants to understand the reality of the universe at the Planck
53:27
scale resolution. And that there was just a, there
53:32
was just a, a post on X that he put out and Elon Musk commented
53:40
on. And I'm not a huge fan of X.
53:43
So this is not like AX promotion.
53:45
I think X is like Ground Zero for for algorithmic manipulation
53:51
in terms of like trying to hijack our amygdala and keep us
53:54
enraged. So not meta X.
53:56
Well, I mean, a lot of them are programmed this way to try to
54:01
try to hijack our amygdala and keep keep us enraged to keep us
54:05
engaged, right? But but this was an amazing
54:09
post. And in his post was doubling
54:12
down on how what keeps him awake at night is this deep yearning,
54:19
this deep search for what is this reality that we're living
54:22
in. And that to me, tells him, tells
54:26
me that he's having a consciousness awakening.
54:30
And Elon Musk commenting on it, basically double down on that
54:34
himself. And so I, I, I do think that you
54:39
can see glimpses of it. And there's this deep yearning
54:43
in humanity for prioritizing AGI so that we can understand our
54:50
reality. Now, I, I do think that two
54:55
things can be true at the same time.
54:57
There are some people that are just looking at it from a kind
55:00
of a hardcore capitalist perspective to say, like, can we
55:05
get more efficiency? Because, you know, you know what
55:08
it's like working at a big company.
55:09
And I've served lots of big companies as an entrepreneur, a
55:12
good year at the office for a really big company as they
55:15
increase margins by like 1%. Yeah.
55:18
One basis point. Amazing.
55:19
Yeah, one basis point would be right.
55:21
Yeah, that would be amazing year, right?
55:23
Everybody's getting big bonuses and everything else.
55:27
So it is true that AI can be an ultimate automation machine, but
55:35
I think the smartest companies are going to use AI to create a
55:42
massive uplift in their creativity.
55:45
Like which markets we always wanted to go into that we've
55:48
never gone into, which products have we always wanted to create
55:51
that we've ever created? I think the laziest way to think
55:54
about the application of AI if you're a big company is cost
55:59
cutting. That's that's a very.
56:01
Which is a very narrow quarterly short term point of view.
56:05
But you know to quote Charlie Munger, give me the incentives
56:08
and I'll show you the behavior. And so I do think that if we
56:12
pivot and we should pivot, we need to start course correcting
56:15
now because I do think this is the last big mistake we get to
56:18
make. A few things need to fall in
56:22
line. And I think part of this is
56:23
also, I'm knee deep in the research because I'm a senior
56:26
fellow at Harvard and part of my research is what does Workforce
56:30
4.0 look like? What does the future look like?
56:32
And I'm not talking about AI displacing jobs.
56:35
It's like, OK, fine, but every technological transformation has
56:39
created a short term deficit window only to give birth to new
56:43
channels, new products, new avenues, new companies.
56:47
Can this mimic the prior transformations and the research
56:53
and just the conversations I'm happening have led to a few
56:56
things. We as individuals, I'm not even
56:59
talking about a corporate citizen, you, me, mother,
57:02
father, community member. When leveraging AI, we have to
57:07
outsource tasks and we cannot outsource our thinking because
57:11
the brain is a muscle. You use it or you lose it and
57:14
there will be intellectual atrophy.
57:17
If we're constantly using artificial intelligence to do
57:20
the thinking for us, which I don't blame anyone because we're
57:24
so busy we can't keep up with our to do's.
57:26
It's so easy to just outsource a question, outsource a thought.
57:30
But the way we've built codependency on GPS and we've
57:32
lost our ability to just understand our surroundings and
57:35
navigate our way home, we will develop a codependency and use
57:39
artificial intelligence to start thinking for us.
57:42
But we cannot, we have to always outsource tasks, ideation,
57:47
brainstorming, but preserve critical thinking, discernment
57:52
and the ability to think autonomously, independently for
57:56
us. There's in my humble opinion,
57:59
there's no exceptions. So if we could do that, that's
58:01
great. I think the second thing is, is,
58:04
yeah, maybe artificial intelligence will create a short
58:06
term displacement of the labor market because executives are
58:11
being incentivized of like the few basis points.
58:16
But if you want the real returns, you want the
58:18
compounding returns. It's not a game of replacement,
58:21
it's a game of augmentation. Because this notion in this
58:24
weird operating model of do more with less just mathematically,
58:28
statistically doesn't work because our growth expectations
58:31
aren't linear and nor are they incremental.
58:35
They are exponential. So the hockey stick curve.
58:37
And as a result, you can't do this.
58:39
While doing this, you create this massive divide and skill
58:43
sets, domain expertise, context. And so maybe you could stay the
58:47
same with less Dr. efficiency. Maybe you could linearly grow
58:51
with the same. But if your expectations are
58:54
exponential, you have no choice but to evolve with new talent,
58:58
with hybrid talent, with the evolution of talent.
59:02
So mathematically, that equation just doesn't work.
59:05
And I think that myth needs to go away.
59:08
But the two other things that came about specifically related
59:11
to the research. Our entire governance model of
59:16
these ecosystems rely on human experts in the loop.
59:22
Sounds great. Well, in five to 10 years, when
59:27
the experts are retiring, who's going to take their place?
59:33
When early career workers are the first ones and knowledge
59:36
workers, white collar workers are the first ones to being
59:39
displaced by artificial intelligence.
59:41
Because if you take a look at college graduates or someone
59:43
who's in their first, second or third year, what is their
59:46
primary job? Data analysis, aggregation,
59:49
summarization, research, the groundwork, the grunt work.
59:53
But they give some contextual knowledge and through the time
59:55
they start understanding patterns, recognitions, and they
59:59
can make Better Business decisions as a result.
1:00:01
This didn't work that time because XYZ, but this can work
1:00:03
now because of ABC. But if we are no longer hiring
1:00:08
college graduates? If we are no longer offering
1:00:11
opportunities for early career adults.
1:00:15
Who's growing into becoming the experts of the future that are
1:00:18
going to govern these AI ecosystems?
1:00:20
We are fundamentally dislodging and removing the pathway that we
1:00:25
are depending on in the future for governance.
1:00:27
So there's going to be a massive gap.
1:00:29
And I think the second finding is, wait a minute, laws of
1:00:34
supply and demand. If we have no supply, then those
1:00:39
that exist are the only ones that can be hired.
1:00:42
Which now means I've got 30 plus years in my career.
1:00:47
So in four years when someone needs an expert, they're not
1:00:50
going to hire a mid level person at the cost of $200,000 a head.
1:00:54
They're going to need an expert who's been in the field 1520
1:00:58
thirty years. I'm in demand now.
1:01:00
I'm going to charge a premium. So instead of my salary being
1:01:03
400,000, I can charge a million now.
1:01:05
Because guess what? What used to be 100 of us now is
1:01:08
only 10 of us. So the cost per unit of talent
1:01:12
will actually go up if we don't have the supply to support it.
1:01:15
Because yes, the AI capabilities, the agents will
1:01:20
take over data processing and aggregation and analysis in the
1:01:24
early career stuff. But then who's going to govern
1:01:28
it and where the experts are going to come from that are
1:01:31
going to manage these cockpits of agents moving forward if we
1:01:34
don't have it? So we're actually reducing the
1:01:37
supply with the increased demand of experts.
1:01:40
And it's going to be a disservice because yes, maybe
1:01:43
the executive at hand right now is going to get paid based off
1:01:45
their quarter yearly bonuses, right?
1:01:47
But the executive that has to manage these ecosystems in eight
1:01:50
years screwed unless they're willing to pay 3, five times the
1:01:53
amount that they used to pay. So the total cost of ownership
1:01:57
will actually go up. So how?
1:01:59
How are you advising these companies then in terms of what
1:02:03
are you telling them you know, that they should be doing
1:02:05
because because they're kind of caught in this?
1:02:08
This web. Yeah.
1:02:09
It's, it's like on one hand it's, you know, you're, you're
1:02:14
as a company very incentivized to use the latest Productivity
1:02:17
Tools because that keeps you competitive.
1:02:22
Yeah, On the other hand, like, you know, you care a lot about
1:02:27
the company culture and about continuity and, and, and So
1:02:32
what, how, how are you telling them to kind of, yeah, is it a
1:02:37
balance or what it what are you, what are you advising them?
1:02:40
I'm very pragmatic. I understand the enterprise
1:02:44
landscape. I worked in enterprise my entire
1:02:46
career. This is the first time I
1:02:48
actually get to step away and kind of see the world, the view
1:02:52
of what's happening. And there's a few legs in that
1:02:56
stool. I'm trying to and you know, I'm
1:02:59
a mother of two, my 8 and 10 year old mommy has to travel 3-4
1:03:03
days a week. And I'm killing myself and
1:03:05
purposely sacrificing time at home with my children for this
1:03:09
mission and this message because I have to teach the executives
1:03:13
and I have to teach the business leaders a new way of approaching
1:03:17
this. It's a lot healthier for them
1:03:19
and the future workforce and for humanity in general.
1:03:23
And I can't go in with woo woo spirituality talk like people
1:03:27
just aren't there yet. So I have to take a very
1:03:29
pragmatic in business lens. The first thing and I teach is
1:03:33
outsource tasks and not critical thinking.
1:03:35
And I give a few analogies. The second thing I say is,
1:03:39
listen, we're so focused on productivity and efficiency
1:03:41
gains, but So what if we're doing more of the wrong things
1:03:45
and making more of the wrong decisions?
1:03:47
You're technically more productive.
1:03:49
There's a new metric you have to measure and that's
1:03:51
effectiveness. Are we being more effective to
1:03:54
our customers? Are we being more effective to
1:03:57
our bottom line? Are we being more effective to
1:03:59
the growth of our workforce that's going to sustain and meet
1:04:02
the demands of these exponential expectations that we have upon
1:04:05
us? So the name of the game is to
1:04:07
pivot from just productivity and efficiency gains, which are very
1:04:10
short sighted but achievable, into effectiveness because there
1:04:14
is a way to grow your business and grow the strength of your
1:04:17
workforce. So when they converge, you've
1:04:20
created this multiplication impact and you've created force
1:04:25
multipliers within. That's how you meet the demands
1:04:27
of today, not by running in a bunch of agents and letting go
1:04:30
13,000 people. The third ultimately is just a
1:04:36
different lens of you're not making decisions for you right
1:04:41
now in the next quarter. The decisions you make now will
1:04:44
have ripple effects for 2345 years down the line.
1:04:48
And I know it's so hard to conceive that when you can
1:04:51
barely keep up with last week's to do, you haven't even tackled
1:04:54
this week's to do. And we are so exhausted in the
1:04:57
rat race. But I'm trying to teach them
1:05:00
that the way we used to manage business in the past cannot be
1:05:04
carried forward in the way we manage business of today.
1:05:07
And sometimes in my education or the keynotes of the speech is
1:05:10
like, listen, let's just take one simple fact into play.
1:05:13
A 100 years ago, 1900s information would replicate
1:05:19
every 100 years, very uncommon. Printing press changed that.
1:05:24
So by the mid 1900s, information was doubling every 25 years.
1:05:28
Now, from the time you have dinner to your second cup of
1:05:32
coffee, the entire World Wide Web has replicated itself.
1:05:35
So it's every nine hours and it's getting faster.
1:05:39
We were not meant to keep up with the volume, the variety and
1:05:42
the velocity at which not only is data being generated, but at
1:05:45
which information is being fed to us.
1:05:48
Not to mention 52% of that data is actually AI generated.
1:05:51
So there's a lot of AI slop in the mix as well.
1:05:53
And well, if AI is feeding off a data on the web, but it's
1:05:56
creating the data on the web, there's an also an element of
1:05:59
cannibalism. So my running joke is, you know,
1:06:02
generative AI is actually becoming generic AI.
1:06:05
We're hidden drift everywhere. So again, critical thinking,
1:06:08
personal voice, personalization, all very, very important
1:06:11
factors. So helping them rethink that.
1:06:14
Your biggest asset right now is an executive and as a leaders
1:06:17
one looking past the quarter, but into the health of the
1:06:20
business and your health, not repeating the way you've done
1:06:23
business because you can't keep pace.
1:06:25
But more than ever, your biggest traits are going to be around
1:06:28
critical thinking and discernment because the name of
1:06:30
the game is extraction of signal from the massive noise that we
1:06:35
are being bombarded with. And you've got to teach the
1:06:38
folks that you lead. You've got to teach your kids
1:06:41
that the whole is greater. There is more to achieve
1:06:48
collectively than just this one individual thing that you have
1:06:52
to do. And it's so hard because we're
1:06:54
all so busy, but that you have to be better at thinking
1:06:58
collectively, not individualistically.
1:07:01
You have to take time to mentor younger generations and become
1:07:04
AI fluent because you managing a bunch of agents and AI native
1:07:08
young talent just isn't going to sustain you in the future.
1:07:12
It's the quickest way to becoming irrelevant.
1:07:15
But teaching them principles that worked in the past of
1:07:17
relationships still matter. Technology can scale efficiency,
1:07:21
but relationships are what open up opportunities, right?
1:07:24
And you can't skip out on those because before the sci-fi world
1:07:28
of the future comes true, if it does come true and we're all run
1:07:31
over by robots, humans are still running the show and those
1:07:34
relationships are going to matter more than anything else
1:07:36
and you have to double down. I'm not teaching my kids algebra
1:07:39
and geometry. I'm teaching them critical
1:07:41
thinking, common sense, spatial awareness, basic survival skills
1:07:46
that we took for granted because we were told to go play outside
1:07:49
and don't come home till the sunsets.
1:07:51
Now I have to bribe my children to go outside and don't come
1:07:53
home until you've played two hours.
1:07:55
And I will, we will. Like there's it inside.
1:07:58
Like, are you sitting here? But go feel what it's like to be
1:08:03
free and liberated and not attached to the devices.
1:08:07
Let your left and right brain work.
1:08:09
Let your frontal cortex and back cortex develop so that as we
1:08:13
step into this future, we could really achieve abundance because
1:08:16
there will be a convergence. So in my happy place, we're
1:08:20
going to go from the narrative of AI and job replacement into
1:08:25
AI being a major force multiplier and a massive
1:08:29
augmentation mechanism, and then into convergence.
1:08:33
But we have to master human first, AI supported first before
1:08:38
we can get to that utopia. I think, I think that's so well
1:08:40
said. And you know, our kids are a
1:08:43
little bit older, right? 21 and 16.
1:08:46
And our 16 year old, she when she was 14 was just super into
1:08:54
AI, coding, creating. She really wow.
1:08:57
She is her father's daughter. Well, but but it's interesting
1:09:00
now, and this is, this is like really surprising, but it's
1:09:04
incredibly wise. Like I, I, I'm really, really
1:09:07
impressed that she's doing this. She is saying, Dad, I don't want
1:09:14
to default to using AI first. I want to learn how to do art
1:09:21
myself. I want to learn how to write
1:09:26
code myself. And then I'll be so much better
1:09:31
at using AI because I'll have developed the skill set.
1:09:36
She's 16 and she picked up on that at. 16 and she picked up on
1:09:39
that now she was, she was 14, she was all in on AI, just no,
1:09:44
no guardrails, just, you know, having like even at even at age
1:09:48
14, I think it was age 14, maybe it was 14 1/2 She already had
1:09:53
six open source large language models on her computer and was
1:09:58
just all in. Vote her for president.
1:10:00
Yeah, it's, it's, it's incredible.
1:10:02
That's amazing. But she, she now is in this
1:10:08
generation, I don't know if she's representative of this
1:10:11
generation or not, or if she's just a major outlier that she's
1:10:15
in this generation saying no, I need to be able to do these
1:10:18
things and really understand what it takes to do these things
1:10:22
as a human being. And then I'll be so great with
1:10:25
the tool set because I'll under, you know, I'll understand how to
1:10:28
do it, like versus just defaulting to do everything with
1:10:33
AI. By the way, as those words come
1:10:35
out of my mouth, I could just see someone like Marc Andreessen
1:10:38
or someone watching this being like, you are absolutely doing a
1:10:42
horrible job raising them because they should just be
1:10:45
using AI first in every single thing.
1:10:48
But I don't think that that's that's true.
1:10:50
Like I do think that she is wise way beyond her years in, in
1:10:57
saying this is the best way to prep me.
1:11:00
You know her in this case for this future of working alongside
1:11:07
the machines versus defaulting and like you would say,
1:11:12
outsourcing your brain like not even knowing how to think.
1:11:15
Yeah, you go now. Now I mean she don't design your
1:11:17
mode. She doesn't even know you, but
1:11:19
she's proud. She But it's amazing that at
1:11:21
least within your home, there's that element of consciousness
1:11:24
and spirituality and connection that she's able to, whether it's
1:11:28
through osmosis or it's through lived practice and experience.
1:11:31
She's sophisticated enough to pick that up.
1:11:33
And I would hope, I would hope that we get to a point where
1:11:37
they all do that because I love the movement where quite
1:11:40
frankly, even if you take a look at Gen.
1:11:42
ZR's, like alcohol consumption has gone down.
1:11:45
Yep, that's right. Like, yeah, social media, this
1:11:48
is starting to go down, too. Social media is starting to go
1:11:50
down, which is phenomenal because we've become Dum Dums.
1:11:53
As a result of it and the neon, the matrix, they're like, we're
1:11:56
not going to, we're not going to take this.
1:11:57
So there is a micro revolt that's happening.
1:12:00
I'm just wondering, can this micro turn into a macro revolt
1:12:05
and saying that there is beauty in the things that we've created
1:12:08
and so we don't want to default to this grid or this mode
1:12:11
because it takes the beauty and the struggle and as a result the
1:12:14
satisfaction out of just being. So I hope there's more
1:12:19
consciousness, but I'm thinking about the single working mother
1:12:24
who's exhausted and the kids on the device all day long because
1:12:28
she has no other choice. She doesn't have any support.
1:12:31
I'm thinking about the parents who are barely making ends meet
1:12:34
and maybe they weren't educated and so the child has liberties
1:12:39
and they're glued to their device.
1:12:41
I live in Miami, you know, I did career day for both my kids and
1:12:45
it's amazing to see the extremes.
1:12:47
Some of the kids are self regulating, the others are like
1:12:50
I'm on the computer 7 hours a day playing Roblox and Minecraft
1:12:54
and I'm like. So I think parenting has a lot
1:12:57
to do with it. The environment has a lot to do
1:13:00
with it. But I I do hope the micro revolt
1:13:03
becomes into a macro consciousness does it in we
1:13:06
start making better decisions and we do realize it.
1:13:10
Again, AI is here. But more than ever, and in my
1:13:13
heart, I want it to happen with us and not to us because a few
1:13:17
dudes want to become trillionaires.
1:13:20
So, so on the front of a few dudes becoming trillionaires,
1:13:26
you know, one one thing that I think will rebuff that even
1:13:33
desire is that if that is actually the way it plays out in
1:13:41
the world, like let's just go there for a second and kind of
1:13:44
envision that. Few dudes who are trillionaires
1:13:46
with bunkers in case things go wrong that control the data, the
1:13:50
algorithms. OK, so and.
1:13:52
Everyone's usage. My, my, my counter on that is
1:13:57
there's no market and and by the way, there's no human
1:14:03
flourishing if that's the case. And so OK, now you're sitting on
1:14:09
a trillion dollars, but you've created a dystopia.
1:14:15
So I just don't think it will play out that way.
1:14:18
And I think that I think that the reason why is there a
1:14:21
guardrails at a macro societal level, because what would
1:14:27
actually happen in that scenario is there would be massive
1:14:31
revolt. You know, it's kind of like,
1:14:33
it's kind of like envisioning India when it was under the rule
1:14:40
rule of the British prior to Gandhi.
1:14:42
Like I think there would be some of these younger people that
1:14:46
would step up like Neon, the matrix and be like, this is not
1:14:50
the world we want. Like, and we're talking about
1:14:54
abundance that is unimaginable. Like, you know, if you and I
1:14:58
could jump into a time traveling, you know, machine and
1:15:04
go 100 years from now, we wouldn't recognize it.
1:15:07
I don't think. I don't think we could even
1:15:09
recognize like what society's like 100 years from now.
1:15:12
I mean, we're, we're in such an exponential curve that every
1:15:16
week is like a year of tech progressed 10 years ago.
1:15:21
And you know, I've been at this for a long time and, and try to
1:15:25
imagine like 10 years from now, is it going to be like an hour
1:15:28
or two is like a week today is like so.
1:15:33
We're living Moore's Law in real time right now.
1:15:35
Yeah, so, so I, I, I really believe that this is the divine
1:15:41
working through us. It is, it is what I've seen
1:15:45
through journeys. But I, but I deeply believe it
1:15:47
because it's creating that forcing function for humanity to
1:15:52
say like, are we just going to worship, you know, capitalism,
1:15:57
which I'm a big fan of capitalism in so many ways.
1:16:01
I mean, capitalism is lifted billions of people out of
1:16:03
starvation and poverty all around the world and eradicated
1:16:08
all types of diseases. We still have a lot.
1:16:11
I mean, the very center that we're going to the campus, like
1:16:14
Austin was built by capitalism to service public teachers and
1:16:20
the education system and they can go to a beautiful campus and
1:16:23
just think like. Thanks to the HEB family, which
1:16:27
is one of the best grocery stores in the country.
1:16:30
I mean, the way they handled the supply chain during the COVID
1:16:34
pandemic was a case. Remarkable.
1:16:36
So there there is a world for both to exist.
1:16:39
I wholeheartedly. Agree.
1:16:40
So I think I think that it is going to force us to say, like,
1:16:45
hey, the thing you worship, which is external materialism is
1:16:53
not the thing that's going to make you happy.
1:16:55
And I'm going to prove it to you because if you try to do that,
1:17:01
you're going to see like what kind of destruction you create.
1:17:05
And so I think the natural guardrails are societal in terms
1:17:10
of US moving together to make sure that the stability of
1:17:16
markets and the stability of society at large moves in
1:17:21
concert. And I think that is the
1:17:24
consciousness awakening. And it's, it's, it's going to, I
1:17:29
mean, it's going to be, you know, I'm doing this for, for
1:17:32
our kids too. Like, you know, you're doing
1:17:34
what you're doing for your kids. I'm doing this out of a deep
1:17:37
love for all of humanity and wanting, wanting us to get to
1:17:44
abundance. And abundance in my definition
1:17:49
is not just abundance of like, you know, healthcare and, and
1:17:55
energy, it's abundance of love. It's, it's, it's us realizing
1:17:59
that we're 99.9% genetically identical across this planet and
1:18:04
that the power games that we've been playing in all aspects of
1:18:09
society, whether it's religion. And you know, you and I were
1:18:12
talking about the Bhagavad Gita before we before we went on air
1:18:15
here. And I love the Bhagavad Gita,
1:18:18
but it has the caste system in it.
1:18:19
I mean, come on, seriously like that?
1:18:22
You know, yet another Power Games.
1:18:24
Elements of hypocrisy. Like, yeah.
1:18:26
For sure. And that's, that's part of, you
1:18:28
know, that's part of religion. That's not the spiritual route
1:18:30
where we're all unified. That's the dogma that gets
1:18:34
attached for command and control.
1:18:36
And these games have been played all over the place.
1:18:38
I mean, yes, social media, like in The Social Dilemma Tristan
1:18:42
Harris described, it's both a utopia and a dystopia.
1:18:45
That is true. It's algorithm.
1:18:47
Two things can be true. Right, right.
1:18:50
So. At any given time.
1:18:51
But I think this is the penultimate moment where that
1:18:54
exponential of exponential curve, you know, which is just
1:18:57
going to continue to slow straight up and to the right,
1:19:01
forces us to wake U. An that waking U is, I think,
1:19:06
the divine getting us to realize and unmask like, you know, and
1:19:13
and I think that's why Dario Modi and and people like that
1:19:16
are writing these pieces. I really do.
1:19:18
I. Mean because they have the
1:19:19
voice, they have the influence, yeah.
1:19:21
As you and I are recording this, the AI documentary is in the
1:19:24
theaters. I don't know if you've watched
1:19:26
it yet. Oh, I posted that everyone like
1:19:28
go see this because you have to understand for the mere mortals
1:19:31
that aren't in our space, they have to understand what's
1:19:34
happening right now. And like, that's a perfect way
1:19:36
of doing it. And the director started it
1:19:38
because his wife was six months pregnant.
1:19:40
And he wants to know, what kind of world is my child going to be
1:19:42
born into? And there are parts of that
1:19:45
documentary where he, like, takes a stamp.
1:19:47
He's like, what? Like AI researchers not knowing
1:19:51
if their kids are going to make it past 6 or 12 years old if we
1:19:53
continue down this pace. It's just crazy.
1:19:55
Like, that's pretty grim. So in my heart and in my being,
1:20:03
I want your version to be our version.
1:20:07
I think that is the best possible way because not only
1:20:09
will it course correct the way we're going down humanity, but
1:20:12
we fundamentally get need to just get reconnected and
1:20:17
realigned with what matters. I think the side of me that just
1:20:22
still sometimes kicks in is well, we've never learned our
1:20:27
lesson that buying more things makes doesn't make us happier.
1:20:31
We're still thinking more is better.
1:20:33
Not always. And there isn't a single story
1:20:37
I've ever heard from a billionaire, a millionaire, even
1:20:39
my life where the happiest moments were when they were the
1:20:41
simplest moments. It was an apartment with very
1:20:44
little thing, but they had purpose, and that's what drove.
1:20:48
And it was simple and it was happy and it was purpose LED.
1:20:53
So we haven't learned the big scientific truth that more does
1:20:57
not make us happier. As a matter of fact, less
1:21:00
actually makes us happier. Happiness is only found on the
1:21:03
inside. That's right, 100%.
1:21:07
And the less you have, the less distractions you have and you
1:21:09
can actually sit still and reflect and appreciate and be
1:21:13
grateful for what you have. But when you're just chasing,
1:21:15
chasing the bigger house, the better car, the the meeting up
1:21:18
with the Joneses persona like it's the rat races we all know.
1:21:23
So I want your version to be truth.
1:21:25
But knowing that, I do think that for us to get to that path
1:21:30
that you and I think and I think we know is going to happen, I
1:21:34
actually think there has to be a few catastrophic incidences that
1:21:38
snaps people up. They won't consciously necessary
1:21:41
do it through divine flow or meditation or consciousness or
1:21:46
the greater good. I think there has to be a few
1:21:49
catastrophic incidences that says, whoa, whoa, whoa, wait a
1:21:54
minute. This isn't all it's cracked up
1:21:56
to be. There's a positive and a
1:21:59
negative charge at the same time.
1:22:01
And we've created this electromagnetic force around us
1:22:05
where, wait a minute, I'm being pulled in multiple directions.
1:22:08
So whether it's a few companies lose billions as a result of
1:22:12
agents and AI going wrong, whether it's, we fundamentally
1:22:15
never catch up when it comes to energy resources.
1:22:17
So we can't scale this thing as fast as the VCs and the big tech
1:22:20
companies want to, whether it's leaders start making better
1:22:25
choices around workforce preservation, because they know
1:22:27
that maybe not the next quarter of the year's growth is
1:22:31
important, but they're going to be measured by 2-3 five years
1:22:34
from now. So they need to make decisions
1:22:36
on the overall effectiveness of both the business and the
1:22:38
workforce. But I do think it's going to
1:22:41
take a few rude awakenings to jolt us into reality and go,
1:22:46
there's more than meets the eye here.
1:22:48
In addition to a collective consciousness, people getting
1:22:51
reconnected, the younger generations making decisions
1:22:56
around drinking and learning things the analog way because
1:23:00
humans love to struggle. That's where part of our
1:23:01
satisfaction comes from. So that when they use these
1:23:04
technologies, they become force multipliers and they recognize
1:23:09
and understand that. I just think somehow that's just
1:23:13
going to be the the reality of it.
1:23:15
But both paths lead to the end result.
1:23:18
There is a reckoning and a pivot and a course correction.
1:23:22
It needs to happen. I have many friends, I mean
1:23:24
you're 1 of many that believes that we have to face really
1:23:29
severe darkness for the light to come.
1:23:32
I mean, in terms of the catastrophic events and I, I
1:23:38
really hope that that's not true.
1:23:41
I really hope that that's not true, because.
1:23:43
I like your version, like choose your adventure.
1:23:45
We were talking about that. I want to choose your adventure
1:23:47
over this adventure. Well, I mean, the reason I wrote
1:23:49
the lattice was to give humanity a positive way of how it could
1:23:54
happen, how we could all unite as a mob was a was a great
1:23:58
sci-fi writer that really wrote about positive visions.
1:24:02
You know, I've heard you say on another podcast, you want the
1:24:05
Star Trek future. I also want the Star Trek
1:24:07
future. I mean, the lattice actually is
1:24:10
the Star Trek future. Once we unite, you know, we
1:24:13
conquer faster and lightspeed travel.
1:24:14
We actually get to the point where we very intelligently and
1:24:21
thoughtfully work with this alien race to create a universe.
1:24:25
And and that's it's, it's AI won't get into all the details
1:24:30
of the book, but but that was a really fun arc of that story to
1:24:34
be with. Humans are messy, and we're in
1:24:37
the messy middle right now. And I love it.
1:24:41
I think it's beautiful. I don't want to be anywhere else
1:24:43
in my life. And Brett, you and I are of an
1:24:45
age where since the late 90s, we've seen more transformations
1:24:51
in our generation than any other prior generation before.
1:24:55
You know, whether it is the.com boom, whether it's social chats,
1:25:00
mobile phones, mobile apps, big data, Hadoop ecosystems,
1:25:05
advanced analytics, data science, blockchain, metaverse,
1:25:09
web 3 point O applied AI. Wait, Nope.
1:25:12
Generative AI. Wait, Nope.
1:25:13
Agentic AI in 20. What do we in 27 years, right?
1:25:19
Like since Mosaic came out like 2728 years we've seen this wave.
1:25:27
And by the way, the, the kind of we are the first generation to
1:25:31
see XYZ that you realize that statement's going to be true
1:25:36
like every year for the next, you know, 10 years and then it's
1:25:39
going to be like every six months like.
1:25:41
But we're the hybrid, but we're the hybrid generation.
1:25:44
We are because we were there during analog pivot to digital,
1:25:48
pivot to AI. So I do think we get to witness
1:25:51
things in a very, very different way because baby boomers for the
1:25:56
most part analog and they made some fit fits and using cell
1:25:59
phones. But my mother still struggles
1:26:00
and she thinks I'm desktop support.
1:26:02
Like they, they're not totally digitally native, but they know
1:26:05
how to push some buttons. My kids will be AI native and
1:26:11
they're digitally fluent, right? They're geniuses, but I would
1:26:13
say they're geniuses as long as there's Wi-Fi.
1:26:16
They can turn into Ding dongs when there's no Wi-Fi.
1:26:18
And so I'm trying to teach them to with or without Wi-Fi.
1:26:21
Or you can be geniuses and brilliant in your own rights.
1:26:24
But we are that generation that's hybrid.
1:26:26
We've gotten to witness. And knock on wood, the way you
1:26:30
and I treat our our bodies and the path we're going, we're
1:26:33
going to get to see another 50-60 years.
1:26:36
So we get to see the hyper movement going forward as well.
1:26:39
And then we'll be telling the stories of, remember when mobile
1:26:43
phones, mobile apps, oh, and generative AI came out?
1:26:46
How silly was that? It would create images of dogs
1:26:49
and cats and things like that. There's no doubt you and I are
1:26:52
going to look back 10 years from now on this conversation today
1:26:56
and be like, Can you believe where we were at, like?
1:26:59
Our predictions were so on point or they were so off.
1:27:02
Right, right. Yeah, I mean it's.
1:27:04
Well, that's why I love your podcast, though.
1:27:05
I think you're really extracting unique points of view.
1:27:09
I think you are raising the consciousness.
1:27:11
If there's a way to raise the IQ of society, you're raising the
1:27:13
consciousness of society. And you've had some remarkable
1:27:16
speakers. And I think as a successful
1:27:19
entrepreneur and as someone who's been in tech for a really
1:27:21
long time, just thank you. Well.
1:27:24
Thank you. Right, that means a lot to me
1:27:26
coming from you in in terms of spirituality, like how do you
1:27:30
how do you keep yourself centered and what it what are
1:27:34
what are your thoughts on what this reality is that we're in?
1:27:38
You know, I don't know if it's because of my awakening or if
1:27:44
it's because I burned out and I was forced into a different path
1:27:48
or I'm just getting old and I'm going back to the ways.
1:27:54
But more than ever, I have these rituals and habits that are non
1:27:58
negotiables now. I need to spend time outdoors.
1:28:02
Like I will go for runs without my headphone.
1:28:05
I need to hear the ocean. I need to hear the birds.
1:28:08
I need to hear laughter. I need to reconnect myself back
1:28:14
just to the world around us. I can't tell you how important
1:28:20
it is, because I can. I can almost.
1:28:21
I'm I'm with you. Be in my brain too much and get
1:28:24
overly cerebral. And then you know how it is in
1:28:27
our space. Like you're always trying to
1:28:29
catch up. And as soon as you're caught up,
1:28:30
you're like, wait a minute, what just changed?
1:28:32
What just happened? It can be a full time job just
1:28:34
trying to stay on top of everything.
1:28:36
So reconnecting with nature the second.
1:28:38
You know that the younger generation, they have the same
1:28:40
touch grass. Yeah, You know about that?
1:28:43
Yeah. Well, that's the whole grounding
1:28:44
movement. It's like, right?
1:28:46
What was so obvious? From the younger generation,
1:28:48
that's not coming from us, which is.
1:28:50
Great. Which I love.
1:28:51
Yeah. Because hundreds of years ago,
1:28:53
ancient civilization, ancient cultures, they lived in nature.
1:28:57
They were outdoors. They didn't have to actively
1:28:59
touch grass because they were living in grass.
1:29:02
So we're so far removed in our like cement walls and stuff.
1:29:04
We have to actively go out and touch grass, walk barefoot.
1:29:08
I even teach my kids and it's like, oh, I need to wear shoes.
1:29:10
I'm like, don't wear shoes. Go out.
1:29:11
Wait, mom, are you OK? My feet are going to get, I'm
1:29:13
like, go out. You're fine.
1:29:15
Like I'm teaching them to reconnect.
1:29:17
So part of me is just, it sounds so silly.
1:29:20
I'm not, as I haven't gone from as far down as hugging a tree,
1:29:23
but I do need to be outdoors, be barefoot.
1:29:26
I've hugged some trees. You hug some trees.
1:29:28
Yeah, I have here. I love it.
1:29:31
My morning rituals where I wake up, I make tea and I do.
1:29:35
Whether it's prayer, meditation, call it whatever you want.
1:29:39
It's just sitting in stillness and gratitude, reconnecting back
1:29:43
to something that's bigger than you.
1:29:44
Whether it's expression, gratefulness, whether it's
1:29:48
asking for protection and prayer, whether it's you're
1:29:51
trying to see something but she's not coming to you.
1:29:54
And so you're asking for symbols and signs and images and
1:29:57
synchronicity, like just support, right?
1:30:00
So that can vary. But I also sit in silence for an
1:30:04
hour and I just read putts around.
1:30:08
I have this weird love affair now with gemstones and crystals
1:30:12
and plants. Like I have Hobbit habits
1:30:14
galore. I make my own teas now because I
1:30:17
believe in plant medicine as a way of healing the natural body
1:30:21
and essential oils. I've just gotten more.
1:30:24
I didn't know you. Were making teas, yeah.
1:30:26
Oh yeah, When I travel, because I'm on the road 3-4 days a week,
1:30:29
that does a lot of harm on the body.
1:30:31
You know, I'm pushing 48 this year.
1:30:33
Like I'm like, and some days my body really feels it.
1:30:36
Another 48. I know.
1:30:37
So over the hill. I mean, seriously, I'm 54.
1:30:41
Well, but then you can get away with it.
1:30:43
With women, we're definitely over the hill.
1:30:46
You, you look amazing like. Thank you, thank you.
1:30:49
Maybe it's my little Hobbit habits and tea tinctures.
1:30:51
I think, I think you're taking good care of yourself.
1:30:52
But like, I have an apothecary essentially of different herbs.
1:30:55
And so when I travel, I have my morning Ziploc bag of my own tea
1:30:59
that I make that I brew every morning.
1:31:01
And it could be nettles, lavender, lemon balm, echinacea,
1:31:06
like cat's claw, like mixed with either a green or black tea.
1:31:11
My mother makes fun of me. She's like, what are you like?
1:31:15
And I'm like, leave my apothecary alone.
1:31:16
It's totally fine. My kids get sick.
1:31:19
I'm not medicine. It's like, hold on.
1:31:21
I have a few herbs for you. There I'm seeing a souls, a
1:31:23
pocket, a pocket there in the future.
1:31:26
So like the spirituality for me isn't everyone has a different
1:31:31
interpretation. And I'm studying Kabbalah, I'm
1:31:35
studying different deities like Kwan Yang, you know, she's, I'm
1:31:38
wearing her right now. I will go through different
1:31:41
pilgrimages once or twice a year where I just get out of my
1:31:44
environment and go visit really historic sites.
1:31:49
So my version of spirituality is I've reconnected back to the
1:31:54
ancient ways of self healing and the ancient ways of prayer and
1:32:01
meditation, if that makes. Sense, you know, with you, with
1:32:03
you wearing a Quan Yin necklace, you're you're probably one of
1:32:07
the best people I can ask as a friend to do this.
1:32:09
Like what is your what is your understanding of Quan Yin and
1:32:12
Quan Yin's role for humanity? So her story is she had a very
1:32:18
abusive and toxic father, so much so that he was trying to
1:32:24
force a bunch of things on her, including a marriage and she
1:32:28
just didn't want anything to do with it.
1:32:29
So she said listen, I'm not going to be a pain to you
1:32:31
anymore. Instead of giving you
1:32:33
grievances, I'm just going to remove myself out of the
1:32:36
equation. And off she goes.
1:32:38
But her father continued to pester and like just in
1:32:42
different ways try and abuse her rights and her sovereignty.
1:32:46
Long story short, he's on his deathbed.
1:32:49
She comes back and essentially gives him so much love and mercy
1:32:55
and compassion that the father was like, my daughter is so full
1:33:00
of love. He's so remorseful of all the
1:33:03
things that he was pushing upon her that eventually when he
1:33:06
dies, he dies in peace knowing that his daughter had tremendous
1:33:11
compassion and mercy. So the reason why Kwan Yang for
1:33:15
me is important is it's a reminder of compassion.
1:33:17
You have to understand the version of me five years ago is
1:33:20
not the version of me right now. I was very result oriented.
1:33:24
I still AM, but I do more with heart and I shouldn't say less
1:33:28
with head. I'm more balanced with heart and
1:33:30
mind. But if you think about the
1:33:32
physical self, the soul self, the mind self and the heart
1:33:36
self, I overindexed on mind, mind, mind like and I, I pissed
1:33:43
a lot of people off and I didn't like the version that I was
1:33:45
becoming whatsoever. And I realized that it wasn't a
1:33:49
matter of having the power to influence, the power to command,
1:33:53
the power to motivate. For me, actually the greatest
1:33:58
gift I could have is the power of compassion and understanding
1:34:01
what people are going through and why they're giving you
1:34:04
resistance, why they're being threatened.
1:34:07
And so Kuan Yang was one of the major deities of like, listen,
1:34:11
even if they're giving you snake oil, even if they're giving you
1:34:14
BS, even if they're resisting and pushing and just making your
1:34:17
life hard, have compassion and understand what they're going
1:34:20
through. I'll give you a weird example.
1:34:22
I was on an American Airlines flight.
1:34:24
Now I'm a Delta person, but recently I've had to switch to
1:34:26
American because out of Miami, they just have more directs than
1:34:28
Delta. Now, most flight attendants go
1:34:32
about their job and they do an OK job.
1:34:33
But this one day, the person in front of me got up so harshly.
1:34:37
The hot tea that I was given spilled all over me.
1:34:40
And I had a white wool jacket, a white shirt and white jeans.
1:34:43
Not only did it get stained, but my skin was turning red.
1:34:45
And so I had to, like, take off the jacket, pull up the shirt,
1:34:48
unbutton my buttons, just to give my skin some space to
1:34:51
breathe. And the flight attendant who had
1:34:54
given me the drink looked at me and gave me one napkin as if he
1:34:56
was like serving me Coke. And that was the way to solve
1:34:59
this. And then he goes on.
1:35:01
But another flight attendant brought me some ice, took care
1:35:03
of me when the flag, when we were all, like, disembarking.
1:35:07
I looked at the flight intendant, and his name was Tov.
1:35:10
And I said, listen, you could have helped me out more there.
1:35:14
He's like, well, I tried. I did what I could.
1:35:16
And I looked at him. I said, but did you?
1:35:18
I said, I don't know if you don't like your job or maybe
1:35:21
you've been doing it too long and your heart's not into it,
1:35:24
but just know that we're picking up what you're putting out,
1:35:28
right? So you did what you did.
1:35:32
It's fine. Alexander came to my rescue.
1:35:34
I said, but I think you need, I think you need a minute.
1:35:37
Is this what you really want to do?
1:35:39
And he teared up and he said, I'm just so tired now, the old
1:35:44
self, like WTF? I'm writing a complaint to
1:35:47
American Airlines this and this and this and that.
1:35:50
But she's a great reminder of, listen, everyone's going through
1:35:53
their own trenches and most likely don't take things
1:35:56
personal, although that's still hard.
1:35:58
But I'm practicing to you will be taken care of as long as you
1:36:01
have this connection to something that's bigger than
1:36:03
you. And I've seen miracles happen in
1:36:05
my life. Like we talked about
1:36:07
manifestation and asking for things to happen.
1:36:09
The doors that are opening up in my life, Brett, I couldn't even
1:36:12
dream that. Yeah, yeah, likewise.
1:36:14
You know, you don't, you don't even realize this, I don't
1:36:17
think. But one of the people that that
1:36:20
you and I, you know, went with to Necker was John Mackey.
1:36:24
And you know, John, the founder of Whole Foods, was on episode
1:36:28
30 of this podcast. And one of the books that he had
1:36:31
recommended for me to read prior to that episode is Love is
1:36:35
Letting Go of Fear by Jerry Jampolsky, which is derivative
1:36:40
of A Course in Miracles, a book. I haven't read that book, but
1:36:44
John's a big practitioner of that in study groups.
1:36:48
And one of the examples Jerry gives in the Book of Love is
1:36:53
Letting Go of Fear. Literally is what you just said.
1:36:57
Which part? It's, it's the part where
1:37:00
there's a lawyer that's super rude to him and he could, he can
1:37:05
choose in that moment to be like everybody else that's ever
1:37:09
interacted with that lawyer and just be super rude back or, you
1:37:15
know, filed A complaint or whatever else.
1:37:17
But instead he, he paused and he did what you did and acts with
1:37:23
compassion to that lawyer. And then the next day, Jerry's
1:37:28
given a seminar in that city in three rows away from the front
1:37:35
is that lawyer. And he locks eyes with him.
1:37:38
And afterwards he's like, you know, hey, it's it's good to see
1:37:42
you here. And he's like, well, the way you
1:37:44
reacted was so different that I just want to see what you were
1:37:48
all about. And today they're still friends.
1:37:51
You're kidding. It changed that lawyer's whole
1:37:52
life. So, so literally, you could have
1:37:54
changed Todd's life, but it, it's just a beautiful
1:37:58
synchronicity where we just, you know, where, where Necker's tied
1:38:02
in and love is letting go of fear.
1:38:05
That's right. It's probably a perfect way to
1:38:07
conclude this amazing discussion.
1:38:11
I'm really looking forward to being with you tonight over
1:38:14
dinner and, and really introducing you to the
1:38:17
culturality community and and then being on stage with you
1:38:20
tomorrow for the closing keynote.
1:38:22
That'll be so much fun to. Do it is such an honor, such an
1:38:25
honor? I mean.
1:38:26
The way you've LED, I just hope others lead the same way.
1:38:32
We'll be in a much better. Place right back at you sister.
1:38:35
I mean, honestly, like, like what what you're doing out
1:38:38
there, your post on LinkedIn, like how you're, you are a part
1:38:42
of the consciousness awakening and you're really, you're
1:38:46
putting it all out there for for us to make it.
1:38:48
And in conclusion, it's interesting because when you had
1:38:53
introduced the Culturati conference and then made a few
1:38:57
other introductions as I'm going deeper into this world, I had
1:39:01
done just one of my, because I travel once or twice alone
1:39:05
outside of business just to get out of my headspace.
1:39:09
And in that I had met someone who I was told is is connected
1:39:15
and has messages and downloads, etcetera.
1:39:18
And what I had told him, I said, I feel the pressure and the
1:39:24
weight of the world on my shoulders because I don't know
1:39:28
if I'm enough to course correct, pivot and teach others that
1:39:34
there's another way of going about this.
1:39:37
And I'm killing myself and I'm tired and I don't know if I'm
1:39:40
doing enough. And there was a moment and his
1:39:44
eyes were closed and he said, you are ship within a fleet.
1:39:50
There are others doing what you were doing.
1:39:53
Get a lot of catch up. Yeah, that was exactly what I
1:39:55
was thinking is that you're, you know, we are ships.
1:39:58
We are not alone. There is, there isn't, there is
1:40:02
an awakening underway. And I'm seeing signs of it all
1:40:06
over the place. And I don't just think it's
1:40:08
selection bias. It's, it's happening and it's
1:40:11
happening more and more because we're being forced to make that
1:40:15
fateful choice. It is a forcing function moment.
1:40:19
Well, I can't wait till we all do it, yeah.
1:40:21
Thank you. Thank.
1:40:22
You. So much, really really
1:40:24
appreciative of our friendship and just absolutely love your
1:40:27
heart. Same.
1:40:28
Thank you, Brad. Thank.
1:40:29
You. Yeah.
1:40:30
Thank you. Thanks everybody for tuning in
1:40:32
to another episode of Love Conquers Fear.
1:40:35
Wow, Soul is amazing. I'm just so honored to be with
1:40:39
her and have her as a friend. And we're going to have a great
1:40:43
time at the Culture Audio conference tonight.
1:40:46
We will air Part 2 of this conversation, which will be she
1:40:52
and I on stage as the closing keynotes for it.
1:40:55
It'll be a live episode of Love Conquers Fear.
1:40:59
And thank you again for all the shares, all the heart you're
1:41:03
putting out there. I had an amazing day just two
1:41:07
days ago where two people reached out to me and really
1:41:13
told me how much love conquers fear has shifted them and
1:41:18
introduced them to lots of books, lots of different ways to
1:41:24
process, you know, this exponential curve that we're in.
1:41:28
And they just want to reach out and sincerely thank me.
1:41:31
And I can't tell you how much that means to me.
1:41:34
Keep it coming. This is completely self
1:41:37
financed. There's no ads on here as you
1:41:39
all know, and my goal here is to help humanity have the heart
1:41:45
shift that we need to make it to that beautiful age of abundance
1:41:48
for all. Thank you.