Latest / Kenny Wallace Media / Carson Hocevar Wins & Cleetus McFarland Shines | The Burnout With Matt Weaver & Ryan Larkin

Transcript

Carson Hocevar Wins & Cleetus McFarland Shines | The Burnout With Matt Weaver & Ryan Larkin · Kenny Wallace Media

0:00
What is up everyone? Welcome to the burnout.
0:03
I am Ryan Larkin with me as always from his home, well
0:07
rested as Matt Weaver. We have a lot of fun things to
0:10
talk about. Matt's probably more interested
0:13
in talking WrestleMania than than racing.
0:15
Maybe right now he's got done watching the main event and and
0:19
everything. But Matt weekend off, stayed at
0:22
home, didn't go to Kansas. Don't blame me.
0:24
There's probably not a whole lot to do out there anyways.
0:26
How you feeling and what what do you real?
0:28
Fast. I'm so excited that I've got to,
0:30
I've got to hijack the show. It's late.
0:34
It's 10:15. This is around the time that we
0:36
normally do these shows and you know, we are always super tired.
0:42
It's super late. We're exhausted.
0:43
I've been writing. I've got other things going on.
0:46
I'm traversing the country. Last week I was going from
0:49
Bristol to Nashville, Bristol to Nashville and this show needs to
0:53
pick me up. You need to pick me up.
0:56
I'm here to tell you this is my favorite coffee and it's yours
1:01
too. And we should have this on the
1:03
air. We should stop talking about
1:05
racing and NASCAR, and we should talk about how much that, you
1:09
know, Starbucks Holiday Blend, not an ad, is my favorite coffee
1:13
in the world. This coffee is made specifically
1:16
for the holidays, thus red and green and all the holiday stuff.
1:19
It's it's the best coffee ever. What do you think?
1:22
What does everyone think? Let's not talk about the race.
1:25
Let's talk about my favorite coffee.
1:26
Not an ad. I don't really like coffee.
1:32
This is clearly, if you can't tell, this is a a reference to
1:37
Clint Boyer hijacking the show with what whichever, you know,
1:42
BBQ brand that was that was a a partner or it it had a a booth
1:48
downstairs according to a picture.
1:50
Completely weird. I mean it, I get it.
1:53
You got to do business. I own companies, I've got to do
1:56
business, but that was strange and I just felt compelled to let
1:59
the world know what is actually my favorite, not an ad coffee.
2:03
I don't even know if that's actually Clint's favorite Kansas
2:05
City BBQ. It would be really, really
2:08
unfortunate if you know the the native Kansas City area
2:15
individual that Clint is, had to hawk a BBQ brand that was not
2:19
actually his favorite, but told Kevin and Mike that it was his
2:24
favorite or whatever that was anyway.
2:26
That was weird. So yeah.
2:31
Well, OK, cool. Yes, that was that was very
2:34
weird. I've had.
2:36
I've had too much coffee actually I'm I'm over served.
2:39
I think I'm on 3 or 4 cups today and I'm so excited to talk about
2:44
Kansas. I've got a cat clawing at my
2:46
back right now, yeah. I think I like you better when
2:51
you're run down and tired. See see this is what happens
2:56
when I don't go on the road. I actually get rest.
2:58
I get overly caffeinated I'm not that wore out.
3:01
I'm not that tired I'm full of energy, I'm full of life.
3:04
I'm not that deep down. I didn't travel, you know, back
3:06
and forth, you know, 200 miles over and over again for
3:11
nonsensical reasons. I've got energy.
3:13
We can go till 2:00 or 3:00 in the morning if we need to.
3:16
No, no, Sir. Yeah, no.
3:19
The the Fox broadcast continues to suck.
3:22
I don't know if we brought this up on the show.
3:24
I'm. Not going to say it sucks, it's
3:26
just it's very distracting. I don't have to see it ever.
3:29
So I'll say it. Although technically I, I, I see
3:33
Boyer often because we live very close to each other and like he
3:36
goes to where my wife works. He, my wife works in a dental
3:39
office. That's where he goes.
3:41
So there's connections. I can maybe get a word out to
3:43
him like hey, don't be obnoxious.
3:45
But I, I, I was watching Martinsville a couple weeks ago
3:50
and they stopped all the talk about racing and spent 3 minutes
3:55
talking about trains. This is just what they do.
4:00
That's a cat. I I haven't turned on the chat
4:07
yet, so I don't know what's happening on the chat.
4:09
I'm sure I don't know what people are going to think about
4:12
the chat, but this is a cat. This is my cat.
4:15
This is Kamari I called. I guess in the chat, let us know
4:18
what you think about Matt's cat. I, I don't know we're we're
4:22
we're way off the rails here. Yeah, I'll, I'll be serious now.
4:27
I I wanted to bring you a little bit of levity.
4:28
People said, here's the thing. People said they were bored by
4:31
one of the most pure, you know, night again, 1998 Winston Cups
4:35
style races. That's what that was until the
4:37
end. And we had green, white checker
4:40
and and kind of chaos, but not really chaos.
4:44
But people said they were bored by what I thought was a really
4:46
compelling race. I just wanted to bring them a
4:49
little level of excitement and energy and cats and coffee.
4:54
Cats and coffee. Coffee and cats.
4:58
Yeah, it it it was a good race to me.
5:00
I don't know what everyone else is watching.
5:01
That's what racing should be in, in a lot of lot of respect.
5:05
So let's get right into it. Cal Reddick is just light in the
5:10
world on fire. I don't even know what to make
5:12
of it at this point. Obviously he wasn't in the
5:15
middle of the race. He certainly wasn't the best
5:17
car, but that last run he was. And when it mattered, he was the
5:20
best car. Almost gave it away when when he
5:23
ran out of fuel. But he he was a deserving
5:25
winner. But the path that we got there
5:28
was unfortunate, disappointing, frustrating, and it brings back
5:34
another conversation that I feel like has kind of been on the
5:36
tips of everyone's tongues lately, which is, you know,
5:39
overtime. Do we need it doesn't need to
5:41
exist in in in NASCAR. I love, I don't know if you've
5:45
had a chance to see it, but EMP EMP Lemon YouTube made a 90
5:49
minute video on Austin Dillon be a creator of chaos and parlayed
5:54
that into how the playoffs and stage racing, like all the
5:59
unique weirdness, BS chaos that the France family created, you
6:04
know, over the past decade or so.
6:06
He tied it all back to Austin Dillon.
6:07
It was really well done and one of the things he was he was like
6:10
NASCAR is not a timed event. How is something in overtime
6:13
right? Like he's like it just doesn't
6:14
make any sense, but we get it overtime race after not a single
6:18
natural caution throughout the entire event.
6:20
The only cautions were the stage cautions, which, you know, take
6:23
the place of debris cautions, which is a whole nother gimmick
6:26
within a gimmick. What do you make of the last
6:29
five laps? What transpired the running out
6:31
of field, potentially switching to, you know the backup and then
6:35
you know the the Cody Ware 6 laps down, spinning, bring out
6:38
the caution and then getting a different winner than Danny
6:40
Hamill. Well, all I can tell you is what
6:44
I was thinking watching the race again from home this weekend is
6:49
I don't play favorites like I I've always said that I root for
6:53
people who are objectively good to me, who give me good quotes.
6:57
You don't give me a hard time. And really, that's practically
7:02
everyone in the garage. There's only a handful that I
7:04
don't have that kind of relationship with.
7:06
So if you look at like Seabel and Reddick and Larson and
7:11
Denny, even Chase Briscoe coming up on new tires, to me, it's not
7:17
a matter of like, well, I objectively like this person and
7:20
I don't like this person. So I don't want anyone to
7:23
interpret what I'm about to say as being biased or favoritism.
7:27
But what I thought after the way the the race was turned upside
7:32
down by the Cody Weir spin, which is a flat tire.
7:36
It's unfortunate. It sucks.
7:37
I don't I don't hold any like negativity towards.
7:41
It's unfortunate that it's the car running P last and Bob laps
7:45
down that sucks. It's unfortunate from a
7:47
narrative standpoint. But I'll tell you when when
7:49
Larson took the lead one, I thought badass restart.
7:53
That's why Kyle Larson does. So I'm not taking anything away
7:55
from his racecraft, but I was, I was rooting for Reddick to get
8:00
back to him and pass him because I thought that on merit that
8:05
race should have been won by either the 11 or the 45.
8:08
That race was decided amongst them to their strategy, their
8:12
tires, their decision making. And so I, I really wanted to see
8:17
the the rightful winner of the race be rewarded.
8:22
And to me that was either the 11 or the 45.
8:24
And so I was, I was OK with seeing Reddick, even though I'm
8:27
sure people are getting annoyed and sick of the dominance.
8:32
It's interesting to me to hear you say that.
8:36
You know, maybe it's time to talk about green light checkers
8:40
because I didn't realize I, I agree with you.
8:43
Like I, I think this is a conversation I've always been
8:46
fond of having. Every year we go to the
8:49
Indianapolis 500 and those races are frequently up until recently
8:55
decided by a late caution and the race is over to me and I'm
8:59
I'm getting a little off the plantation now because there's
9:01
so much to get to here. I think that no green white
9:06
checkers is actually more dramatic than overtime and green
9:11
white checkers because to me, you, you get to like 10 laps to
9:15
go for a race like Kansas. And let's just say there was no
9:18
overtime. You know that if you're Denning
9:22
trying to chase back down Tyler or your Tyler initially trying
9:26
to chase down Denny, you've got to go right now.
9:28
There is nothing to say to you if the caution comes out with
9:32
543 laps to go. That's the race and the drama
9:36
and intensity that you get the the adrenaline rush you get from
9:42
a green white checker you would get every week knowing 10 laps
9:47
to go. The race could end at any moment
9:49
and it's pure and I think it's more dramatic.
9:52
And so I would be very curious to to read in the comments.
9:55
So please drop us comments. So I want to know what you think
9:58
if this is a prevailing fan sentiment because I don't think
10:02
the fan base is quite ready to go there yet.
10:05
We see it in ARCA before they change some of their overtime
10:09
rules that it was unacceptable to them when races would end or
10:12
under caution or various short track sanctioning bodies that
10:16
have races and under caution. Fans don't seem to like that,
10:20
but I I think that it would be, it would be both more pure and
10:24
more dramatic. So I would love to see what the
10:26
narrative is on that. Yeah.
10:28
So for me, my personal experience as you know, a guy in
10:32
the outside my most liked tweet of all time and and I don't get
10:37
like I'm not really big into getting like, oh look, I got 100
10:41
likes. Like that's just not the count.
10:43
I am like I don't get a lot of activity like that was a tweet
10:46
about getting rid of green white checkers, like it is the most
10:50
white thing. It it blew up and it got a lot
10:52
of like everyone's yes, this is the most accent.
10:54
I think now that was within the fan base that saw my message
10:57
right. But it it was I was being kind
11:00
of a smart ass when I sent it and the response I got was like,
11:03
yes, absolutely. We want to get rid of it.
11:06
I I don't think we need it. I don't think it adds anything
11:09
other than shenanigans. The moment that costume fell
11:11
today, I was like, great, what kind of shenanigans are going to
11:15
really disrupt this right now? At the end of the day,
11:17
Christopher Bell's race got ruined.
11:19
So there was a little bit, but it wasn't like, oh wow, we had
11:22
three costumes afterwards and a bunch of cards being wrecked.
11:24
It for the most part it was pretty tame, but what it.
11:28
Was good. It was compelling.
11:30
It was, but what what was really added to the product other than
11:33
the Bell's day got ruined and we got a cool.
11:36
I don't feel like it it. I don't know it.
11:38
It just feels like it's an unnecessary thing.
11:41
I completely agree with what you're saying where when you
11:43
know like lap 8, if a caution or 8 to go, the caution comes out.
11:46
That could be the end of the show, but I don't know.
11:50
That was just, you know, side topic.
11:51
We got on to. I I wanted your opinion of it.
11:54
Obviously I always. We have a superstar in the chat,
11:59
Team 54 Zach, who got his flowers on on Saturday,
12:03
yesterday, friend of mine, social media friend of mine.
12:07
I appreciate the enthusiasm and the passion.
12:09
Super cool to see you in the chat, especially given that that
12:12
Gluck gave you your flowers on Saturday, blew you up.
12:15
You're now a social media sensation, so that's cool.
12:17
I also want you to know I read the chat every single, you know,
12:22
criticism or comment or whatever.
12:24
I see it all, so don't be too mean.
12:27
Perfect. Well, I'm very unaware because I
12:30
check out on social media, but that's cool.
12:31
Obviously, if you're a a Ty Gibbs fan, you probably had a
12:36
pretty good week, right? So I'm sure it was surrounding
12:39
that. Yeah, Kylo Reddick wins fifth
12:44
time this year. Toyota dominant again.
12:48
Larson was kind of a factor, but for the most part it was a
12:50
Toyota show. That hasn't changed since race
12:53
one. They have been the team to beat
12:55
the the I say team. The BBS 2311 and Joe Goods
12:58
Racing are one team in my mind. You know, really in terms of
13:01
competition, speed wise, the amount of information sharing,
13:03
they are like 1 entity for me. They're just dominant at this
13:07
point. And I don't know at what point
13:09
they're going to be caught. I don't know if it's just
13:11
something we should expect all year.
13:13
But one thing I I was thinking about before we did the show is
13:16
that and the most wins in a single next Gen. year is 6 and
13:20
it's happened three different times.
13:22
And our entire argument with the next Gen. car, I mean, dominance
13:26
is not possible. You're never going to see a guy
13:28
win 10 races. You're never going to see what
13:30
Kyle Larson did in 2021, which is like just kick everyone's ass
13:33
and it's not even close. And it's his year, what Harvick
13:35
did in 2020, even though he didn't get the title, but like
13:37
he was so clear and far better than everyone.
13:40
We didn't expect to see that type of year.
13:42
But we're only 1/4 of the way through the season, exactly 25%
13:46
through the season and he has five.
13:48
Do we think this continues? How at what point does the glass
13:53
slipper come off and and things start changing for Tyler Reddit?
13:57
Well, you know, it's funny because like, to me, I feel like
14:00
mission accomplished by NASCAR in the sense that I feel right
14:05
back to some of my earliest years covering the sport, which
14:09
was, you know, 9 and 10. And I started to regularly
14:12
attend races in 2011. And so we were fully in the, the
14:16
Chase era back then. And I, I find myself flexing,
14:21
you know, theological theoretical muscles,
14:25
hypothetical muscles that I've never, I haven't flexed in like
14:29
a decade because we've been in playoff mode.
14:32
And I remember in, in those seasons, somebody would
14:35
inevitably get off to a hot start.
14:37
And this is before, you know, the spec car era.
14:41
And I haven't looked at a season or thought about a season in
14:46
this context before the the theory was always, you know, if
14:49
Jimmy Johnson gets also a good starter or Jeff Gordon or Mark
14:53
Martin and O 9, the narrative always became, Oh yeah, but you
14:58
don't want to peek before the chase.
15:00
You you want to make sure that if you have a swoon, do it
15:03
before the chase starts. And you know, I haven't thought
15:07
about a season in those terms. And then literally over a decade
15:12
and then so it's just, it's, it's interesting to me to think
15:15
about Reddick's season in those terms because we talked about
15:20
it, his last win. Where was his last win?
15:22
It was. They've got so many now they all
15:24
run together. Was it Darlington?
15:27
It was Darlington, yeah, I think we had this conversation before
15:31
Darlington, which was it's kind of unfortunate now that, you
15:34
know, he he wins five of nine and he is the presumptive
15:38
regular season champion front runner.
15:43
And the best he can do is 25 points.
15:45
He could win next week and the best he could do is 25 points.
15:49
He could win four more races before the regular season ends
15:53
and it's still just 25 point advantage.
15:55
And so that's one thing that I think the old system did better
15:59
than than the Chase. And two, to bring it full circle
16:03
and to answer your question, I don't know, it's, it's weird
16:07
because like you never want to turn off the faucet and just be
16:09
like, OK, we're going to stop trying to win now because we
16:12
want to make sure our stuff is good.
16:14
And things are way different now with the next Gen. car than it
16:19
was, you know, with the the Gen. 5, Gen. 6 era version of the
16:24
Chase for the Championship in that you really can't R&D like
16:28
with the old car. If you got off to a hot start
16:30
and you knew you would be a top five Chase for the championship
16:34
seed, you would maybe go into the summer races and try some
16:38
stuff just to see what you could learn for the final ten.
16:43
And there's not really a lot of things you can learn like you're
16:46
not developing parts and pieces. It's a spec car.
16:49
You're doing everything through SEM.
16:51
And so all of this to say, I don't know.
16:53
I don't, I don't know what any of this means.
16:56
Each win is cool for him on a personal level.
17:00
I don't think he's signed a new contract yet.
17:02
So, you know, we saw the million.
17:03
Dollars for every win, right? That's right.
17:05
We saw the stern number, which I've heard a little bit too,
17:08
that that $7,000,000 range is what I've heard even going into
17:12
this season when he won the Daytona 500.
17:17
Every win might add, add another million to it, right?
17:19
So I don't, I don't, I don't know if he can get to 10.
17:23
That was always like the the the mark of excellence, right?
17:27
Harvick in 20 was pursuing 10. I think he got to 9.
17:31
Larson and 21 got to 10. With the advent of the NextGen
17:38
car, you weren't supposed to do that anymore.
17:40
And so I think the one really cool if you're just a fan of
17:44
racing and not a fan of a driver who's not Tyler Reddick thing to
17:48
me is that can he get to 10 if you're not going to be R&D ING
17:52
parts and throwing away races to try to get better for the Chase?
17:56
Gosh, as good as they are right now, you know, former winner of
17:59
Talladega, Texas and Kansas are not apples to apples, but gosh,
18:06
the speed of Kansas might portend something later this
18:09
summer for Joliet. They don't have a lot of
18:13
weaknesses right now, I guess is where I'm getting at the short
18:16
tracks. And even then they're still in
18:17
the ballpark. It's a really, really incredible
18:20
start to their season. Yeah.
18:22
And you know, I feel like in recent years, going to
18:26
intermediates, Larson was such a big factor for them to beat,
18:30
right. Obviously he's got a like 1000
18:32
lives out of Kansas or whatever it is.
18:34
And this year, the Toyota's Reddick Hamlin, who have always
18:39
been like second or third to Larson to a degree.
18:41
And Hamlin's one of his fair share.
18:43
So I don't want to say second to Larson, but always felt like
18:46
Reddick was third or fourth in the group.
18:48
Right now it feels like he's migrated the first in that
18:50
group. So when we do go to Darlington
18:52
again, when we go to Chicago, like you mentioned, it feels
18:55
like he should be the odds on favorite to win those races.
18:57
And if this speed edge continues, there is a good
19:01
chance he can rack up 8 ninths and wins, which is great.
19:03
But like you said, what does it really matter once you get to a
19:06
certain point? Does it really do anything other
19:08
than a cool trophy in the cabinet?
19:10
So you know, I, I still want season long points.
19:14
I still think that's the best path.
19:16
But you're right, it it does kind of suck that OK, he gets 25
19:20
points, but what else? What should we reward winning
19:24
even more in the regular season? And it's probably a whole nother
19:27
conversation. We don't need to get into 9
19:29
races into the new format, But it's interesting.
19:32
It's an interesting topic. I'm interested to see how this
19:35
continues for him. Obviously the front runner for
19:38
regular season champion. The only big news off the off
19:41
the track, I don't know if there's anything you you remind
19:43
me if there's something else was Daniel Suarez against track
19:46
house, which he just seems every week to have a comment and and
19:51
some sort of remark that's throwing shade at his old team.
19:54
Obviously, after he said those things, they came out and had
19:56
the worst race in the organization's history.
19:59
So today was abysmal for track house.
20:01
So I want to talk about track house as a whole and the
20:04
struggles that we're seeing. I mean, they were one of the
20:06
best teams in 2022 and have migrated to one of the I mean,
20:10
let's call a spade a spade, one of the worst teams.
20:12
Four years later, they. Are.
20:14
So I want to talk about that, but I also want to talk about
20:16
Dennis Suarez is going out there and just not giving a damn and
20:18
throwing shade at his former team.
20:21
Well, I'll tell you, to me, it was kind of a slow week from a
20:25
new standpoint, rightly. I feel like the the Kyle Busch,
20:29
Denny Hamlin thing only got so much traction because we didn't
20:32
have a lot of, you know, buzzy stories to talk about.
20:35
So I think us in the media, you know, it was kind of a slow week
20:39
on the, the Gibbs Gabe Hart front, although there was a A
20:44
and a hilariously written declaration from Jeff Dickerson.
20:47
I don't know if you want to talk about that a little bit too, but
20:49
it was funny. I, I too go to races and put on
20:53
a headset, but I am not a competition director.
20:58
We, we can get into that one later, though.
21:00
So I think we're looking for for rivalries.
21:03
We're looking for a little bit of tension and bad blood.
21:07
That's, that's who we are as a sport, right?
21:09
We, we are a, we are a, a sport built on interpersonal rivalries
21:15
and interpersonal conflict. And it's funny, I just watched
21:18
Wrestle Mania. I feel like there are a lot of
21:21
analogies between pro wrestling and, and, and Motorsports.
21:25
You know, you have brightly colored outfits, brightly
21:27
colored cars, big personalities, promos are basically the
21:31
interviews and then the media sessions.
21:33
Cowboys cut a promo on, on, on Denny Hamlin.
21:36
And so we got to talk. About that.
21:38
You got to talk about that. And so for, for Daniel Suarez to
21:42
embrace his inner luchador, instead of saying pro wrestler,
21:46
I'll say his his inner luchador lucha libre and to kind of cut a
21:50
promo on track house. Every chance he gets one, it's
21:54
earned. Daniel was super adamant that
21:59
track House was going the wrong direction and that he was being
22:03
set up to, to, to fail and was going to be a fall guy with SVG
22:09
and Zilich coming in. And I will tell you, I think
22:12
anyone in the chat and you and I both have been in situations in
22:17
our life where we felt like we had a chip on our shoulder,
22:20
something to prove someone was not recognizing our
22:24
contributions or, or our maximum potential.
22:27
And everyone around you looked at you and was like, they're
22:30
right, you're wrong. And when you get out of that
22:33
situation and you go somewhere where you can validate who you
22:37
think you are, have the swagger it's earned.
22:41
And so all of this to say, you know, it's not like the seven
22:46
team is, you know, running rampant over everyone.
22:50
They're they're still trying to find wins too.
22:53
But Suarez was struggling to be a top 30 guy in cup and he's a
22:58
chase contender and he's on the fringe of, you know, in the
23:02
right circumstance could challenge for a win.
23:05
I don't think he's there for a win yet.
23:08
And that's got to feel awfully satisfying.
23:10
And so good for him for saying it.
23:13
Track house, man, it's tough. Like, I don't know, I'll say
23:17
this, too. I'm so long winded today and I
23:18
think it's my my coffee because I've just got a lot going on.
23:21
He's energized. I've got a lot going on.
23:24
Ross Chastain kind of signaled this too.
23:27
Before the weekend even started, Ross kind of said, this is what
23:31
we've got. This is before, you know, they
23:33
dropped the rag today. Ross kind of indicated that
23:36
where we are right now, there's no, there's no Evo package.
23:40
There's no, you know, there's no thing in the SIM that's being
23:45
developed to save them right now that they're going to be in it
23:48
until they're not. And I don't know how in this era
23:55
with this car, once you get buried, how you get out of it.
24:01
Yeah. It's like the old Roush thing,
24:03
right? Like Roush put 5 of 10 cars in
24:06
the Chase back in the day. What was that?
24:08
O 506-0505, I think. Yeah, they were on top of the
24:13
world and they'd just come off some championships with Kenseth
24:16
and Bush. And, you know, they fall off a
24:20
little bit and and, and then Carl is struggling to win races
24:25
and Matt is struggling to win races.
24:27
And Carl and Matt go to to to JGR and they kind of remind the
24:33
NASCAR world that they're still great, just the other team is
24:36
not right now. And and it just Roush never
24:39
recovered. And in fact, it took moving to
24:42
the Next Gen. car to even see a glimmer of a path forward to
24:47
what was Roush racing. And once you get buried and
24:50
you're behind and you're constantly playing catch up, I
24:52
just, I struggle to to see how Track House finds a way out of
24:57
this. So my question is, it obviously
25:02
a very, very rough start, but we're going to Watkins Glen in
25:07
three weeks. Talladega, I just don't really
25:08
pay much attention to, you know, super superior race it, it can
25:11
go wherever I'm going to Watkins Glen in three weeks.
25:14
Obviously, we expect SVG and Zilla to be really good there.
25:18
Then we go to Charlotte. Rochester won there last year, I
25:22
believe. I'm, I'm trying to remember.
25:25
And then we're going to Nashville the week after that
25:27
where I believe Ross won two years ago as well.
25:30
It feels like all actuality, they should be kind of coming
25:34
into their stride. How much do you think?
25:37
And now I'm wondering this as as a fan, how much of their success
25:42
at those tracks like Charlotte and Nashville and the speed they
25:45
showed in the past will still be there when they go there this
25:47
year? Have they actually fallen behind
25:49
enough to where they're going to become a mid pack car at the
25:52
track that they won on a year ago?
25:55
Well, I'll say this. I think that, you know, the,
25:58
the, the credit to give Ross is that there are places
26:03
historically that Ross Chastain carries them.
26:08
I know his numbers are not great, but Ross is probably
26:11
still carrying them. And it's just that in, in ways
26:14
that you don't see, you know, Ross is a great, you know,
26:17
leader within the team communicator.
26:21
And, you know, in this next genera, if you just hit the
26:24
setup right and you give Ross something that's close and you
26:28
give him track position, clean air, he'll get you there.
26:33
And I'm guessing that again, in this next genera, when you're
26:39
really off, you're really not that far off.
26:41
We're talking like milliseconds. Yeah.
26:45
And so I think that if you if you nail the setup right at any
26:48
any given track, I still think Ross wins at some point before
26:51
the regular season ends or at least serving for the year ends
26:54
because they're going to give Ross something that's close.
26:57
And every year there's that one race where, you know, you gave
27:00
him something close and he wins. SPGI think is going to win his
27:04
fair share of, you know, road or street course races too.
27:06
And so that's good for the company.
27:08
Don't know if Connor's going to be there yet on roads and
27:11
streets. I'd be very curious to see what
27:13
he is in this car. The story with with Shane is
27:16
obviously this platform is so drastically similar to what he
27:21
was driving back in the day. So it's not all bleak for track
27:24
house, right? Like this is actually a credit
27:26
to to Justin and and then Ty Norris and what they what they
27:31
had built over there together and that they had this vision
27:36
for for Shane to be able to be so elite at one type of track
27:42
that, you know, if the rest of the company and the rest of the,
27:47
you know, the performance is not there, he'll get you some wins
27:49
too. And so it's not all bleak.
27:52
And I still think that there there's a pathway forward and I
27:55
think there's chances for certainly Shane and for Ross to
27:59
win races. It's just going to be tough.
28:03
I know we talked about this a lot when it comes to the Spire
28:06
gave heart thing, but when you do fall behind, it seems like
28:10
the best path would be to bring in outside minds, bringing guys
28:13
that work with other organizations.
28:17
How I don't know the funding situation with track house.
28:21
I don't know how much money they have comparatively to the other
28:24
teams, but how do they dig themselves out of this hole if
28:28
they can't do it through the talent they have in house
28:31
already? It feels like, you know, the
28:34
other teams around them are just getting stronger.
28:36
The fire is just continuing to, to get better year over year,
28:41
right? And, and I, I feel like in the
28:43
current state of, of cup racing, there's not actually a clear
28:47
path for them to ever recover. And then again, I think I asked
28:51
this two or three weeks ago, at what point does Ross Chastain
28:53
just say, you know what, this is not my future.
28:55
He is outside of Atlanta. His best finish this year is 16.
29:00
And that, that doesn't cut it. He is a top ten guy period.
29:05
And he is not getting it done right now.
29:06
So at what point does he pull the plug?
29:09
And then how do they get better? If he, if they're going to
29:11
promise him something to say, how does that work?
29:13
Where? Where do they get that that
29:15
speed from? Well, you know, it's a similar,
29:18
it's a similar conversation conceptually to the one that
29:23
we're having with Tyler Raddick in his future.
29:26
The difference being the 2311 is actually competitive, right?
29:29
You know, I've, I've said this on the, on the show many times
29:32
that one of the more interesting dynamics in the sport right now
29:36
is that there are three teams that control the information
29:41
flow for their respective OEMs, right?
29:44
Chevrolet is Hendrick and vice versa.
29:47
Gibbs is Toyota and vice versa. Penske is Ford and vice versa.
29:52
The, the difference in Toyota is that there's a cohesion between
29:58
2311 and Gibbs and they operate as if they're a, you know, 7 car
30:03
team. And I, I think that's the reason
30:05
why, I mean, people keep wondering why is there so much
30:07
success? I just think that Tyler and
30:10
Billy are executing at the highest level.
30:13
You know, it's not like there's a big difference in speed
30:15
between, you know, Denny and Tyler.
30:18
We saw that today. It just comes down to execution
30:21
and how you read the data. And so as this pertains to track
30:25
House, you know, their relationship is, is different at
30:30
Chevrolet. And I think their path forward
30:33
is just dependent on what they get from Chevrolet and how they
30:36
can interpret that data from Chevrolet.
30:38
And if they feel like they have the same tools and resources.
30:43
And the answer is no, but at least enough.
30:46
I, I always wonder, like, I, I think about this a lot with RFK
30:49
too. And I'm, I'm having a lot of
30:50
nebulous thoughts here today. And it's probably again, the
30:53
coffee. But I think about RFK too,
30:56
right? Like I think what Brad has built
30:57
over there is really impressive. But how does RFK ever get over
31:03
that hump of we still only get what Team Penske not, not not
31:09
that we only get what Team Penske gives us, but our
31:12
direction is based on where Team Penske points us.
31:15
They're the captains of the Ford ship.
31:18
And so track house is, is not the captain of the Chevrolet
31:23
ship. And so they're, they're stuck
31:25
with what whatever the other captains are going and what
31:28
Hendrick, what Hendrick is looking for right now.
31:31
And the direction they're pointing the ship is not the
31:34
direction the track house needs the ship pointed because they're
31:38
in a completely different place in the in the ocean.
31:41
And so I just don't know. That's a big complicated,
31:45
nebulous way of answering that. I don't know how they get out of
31:49
it. Is the answer Dodge I?
31:54
Maybe. Where are we with that?
31:57
Are they still planning on next year?
31:59
I haven't heard a single rumbling.
32:00
Still planning to go a couple. Of next year, I think that's a
32:03
little premature. I actually, I checked in with
32:06
Chris Rice at Bristol colleague and I just said, hey, listen, I
32:11
don't know about the timing yet, but I want to sit down with
32:14
everyone. I want to sit down with you and,
32:16
and, and your executives and I want to sit down with, you know,
32:21
the, the stalantis dodge and and ram people and work on this kind
32:25
of big picture. Where are we story.
32:28
They're building a, a simulator with with Pratt Miller.
32:32
I'm curious what is the, the status of the Pratt Miller
32:36
simulator? I don't have the answers there
32:39
because we need to coordinate. But all of this to say that I I
32:43
share your questions and the the best way to to to get questions
32:48
asked or answered is to ask them if I haven't yet.
32:52
Fair enough. Hamlin.
32:54
Kyle Bush. So Denny Hamlin historically has
32:58
been super nice about Kyle Bush. I mean honest.
33:02
The cat The cat jumped behind my computer and I was afraid he was
33:05
going to knock everything over. We have enough technical
33:08
difficulties without the cat anymore.
33:09
This. Would have been a new one.
33:11
Yes, so Hamlin's always been super kind about his former
33:15
teammate, like as kind as you can be on this podcast, whenever
33:18
I've listened, always saying how Bush races as clean as anyone
33:21
out there, I question that always says he's the best of
33:25
generation, one of the best. You know, like he's never said a
33:27
bad word about Cowboy. So I ever remember.
33:29
I don't even know what he said this week was necessarily bad
33:32
it. Certainly wasn't bashing.
33:35
Is this just Kyle Bush being defensive because of the
33:39
situation? And by the way, he was battling
33:41
Cody Ware for 35th all race. So it went from OK, you're
33:45
struggling to just like you, you aren't even in the same ballpark
33:49
anymore. I know in the past I said I
33:51
didn't like the crew chief addition to that team.
33:54
I don't like the vibes of the team.
33:55
I don't like the way he's acting.
33:57
And then Austin Dillon ran top 20 all day.
33:59
So, you know, is within the own organization.
34:02
There's still somewhat of competency and speed or
34:04
something to to run mediocre. You know, 16th, 17th place
34:08
finish isn't great, but it's competitive.
34:10
Kyle Bush wasn't competitive today.
34:12
So break down the the Bush being upset aspect because I don't get
34:16
that. And then do you?
34:17
Think Kyle actually listened to? This year, what the Hell's up
34:20
with Bush Man? Yeah.
34:21
Do you think Kyle actually listened to what Denny said or
34:24
do you think he saw a clip or he maybe like read some of the
34:30
quotes or was told? Because I, I don't think his
34:32
reaction was one where it, it indicated he'd listen to it.
34:38
Because if you listen to the original clip and I listen to
34:40
every podcast every day. I'm, I'm on bike rides is what I
34:43
do. I try to work out like 2 hours a
34:46
day. And that's when I listen to
34:47
action detrimental and BBC or stacking pennies to see what
34:50
people are saying. And I, I just got the impression
34:53
that Kyle did not actually fully get the context because Denny
34:57
was like, I think that Kyle was one of the Mount Rushmore
35:01
greatest of all time. This cat is really trying to
35:04
disrupt the show. I don't think he caught the full
35:09
context of what Denny was saying.
35:11
It's like then he even said, like talent wise, I can't hold a
35:14
candle to Kyle. But to your point, I think Kyle
35:19
is so frustrated that any, any criticism or anything that sheds
35:25
a negative light on what he's going through is just, you know,
35:29
playing with fire a little bit. But also, you know, it's it's
35:32
actions detrimental, not actions approved and actions pre
35:36
approved and, you know, positive only despite what he said in the
35:39
trial. I just, I just think Kyle's
35:43
super sensitive, right? And so he's had to kind of
35:47
smooth things over with what he tweeted and what he told
35:50
Hardwick on the pre ratio. And I appreciate that Hamlin is
35:54
super authentic and and candid and this fan base is better off
35:58
for it. But I also think that what Denny
36:02
said is fair in the sense that if we we talked about it last
36:06
week, if you think that you deserve maybe a Spire seat that
36:10
opens up or maybe a Hendrick seat that could open up, the
36:14
least you could do right now is go beat Austin Dillon handedly
36:19
and consistently. And to your point, you're
36:21
struggling to beat Cody Ware. And that's a fairpoint for Denny
36:26
to bring up. And Denny also said, you know,
36:29
his struggles predate moving to RCR and his struggles predate
36:36
the Next Gen. car. And I, I almost even wonder, you
36:40
know, was his superpower practice.
36:45
Not, not that he needs practice to be good, but Kyle, I've seen
36:51
this in his super late model stuff and his Truck Series
36:54
stuff, because Kyle is so analytical in ways that people
36:57
don't realize. Kyle is super in tune with, with
37:01
his cars, his trucks, the changes you have to make.
37:05
I, I remember one time at cordial for Speedfest.
37:07
It was one of the moments that I thought I, I'm, I'm really, I
37:12
admire Kyle Busch. He gets out of the car for
37:15
practice and he's struggling and he gets up under the car and
37:18
he's doing stuff. And we always hear the knock on
37:21
modern drivers is that they can't work on their own cars.
37:24
When it comes to his super late model program back in the day,
37:27
his truck program and now Braxton and Kyle's open wheel
37:31
program, he learns cars. And Denny even said in his
37:36
podcast that I think Kyle needs to stop being analytical.
37:40
And I think I would agree with that because I know Kyle is
37:43
super analytical and super in tune with the technical side.
37:46
Instead of getting on the radio with Jim Pullman and saying,
37:49
hey, did you make that shock adjustment we talked about
37:52
yesterday? He just needs to say loose exit
37:56
and no drive off, whatever. Just you let him be the engineer
38:02
because right now I think he's trying to play next Gen.
38:07
engineer too and it's just not working.
38:09
All of us to say it's just sad. I think I I don't know if I
38:15
talked about this with you last week, but it was so much fun
38:18
watching that truck race at Bristol because he was rowdy
38:21
again. He was rowdy over the radio.
38:23
And to Denny's point, this sport is way more interesting and way
38:27
more fun when he's not running P last.
38:31
Yeah, and you, you were 100. Spot on.
38:34
This struggle situation started really back half of 2019-2020
38:41
was awful. He didn't win until the the fall
38:43
Texas race, like the 3030 thirty fourth race of the year that
38:46
year. So this trend had kind of been
38:49
started 7-8 years ago almost at this point.
38:53
And it just only really has shined through the last couple
38:56
years. He hasn't finished top 20 in
38:59
five races, which is crazy when you consider it's Vegas,
39:02
Darlington, Martinsville, Bristol and Kansas, which is
39:05
like his bread and butter. Things are horrific there.
39:09
I, I'm not a big Kyle Busch fan personally.
39:13
I, I skewed the other way because of my past and, and, and
39:18
you know who I worked for and who was our enemy at the time,
39:20
which was Kyle Busch. Listen.
39:22
I've had run insurance with Kyle too.
39:23
I think that anyone who's worked in NASCAR has probably gotten
39:27
sideways and had a crossword. Kyle.
39:31
Kyle is so intense and Kyle can be so ornery.
39:36
And I'll tell you, even at times where there's times where I just
39:40
wanted to strangle and you're not being fair, you're being so
39:44
cranky and not being intellectually honest.
39:47
Then he turns around and does something really cool and really
39:49
impressive and it's like, yeah, you can be a pain in the butt,
39:52
but man, you're really cool. You're really bad ass too.
39:56
And so that's the the duality of Kyle Busch.
39:59
Yeah, I I don't, I don't want him to suck this bad.
40:03
I think you need, you know, the whole thing, like Hamlin is the
40:06
only real guy that we have that's a character that drives
40:10
emotion every freaking week. You know, even today it felt
40:14
like it felt like I'm watching a badass race car driver within
40:17
Hamlin, Right. And I don't get that feeling for
40:19
many people. And and Kyle.
40:23
Love him, hate him. He brought that out, you know,
40:24
he brought that emotion out. He's such a big figure and there
40:26
just isn't anyone that does that, not in a normal way, you
40:31
know, like bubble walls. Aside for the obnoxiousness that
40:34
is that fan base and, and going back and forth with him.
40:37
There's no polarizing figure like Kyle Busch.
40:41
And I miss it. I do miss it.
40:43
I, I don't like him running 30th, even if I I do relish that
40:47
he's running poorly at times. A lot of people you're having.
40:50
To sacrifice Kyle Busch at the altar to get the peak version of
40:55
Carson Hosevar at some point down the road.
40:57
Oh yeah, yes. For losing Rowdy to gain
41:00
hurricane. Hosevar went off after the race
41:05
today, Which. Kind of good for him.
41:08
Yeah, You know his race today reminded me a lot of Bubba Walls
41:12
here in 2022, the first race that Kurt Busch won when Bubble
41:16
Walls saw 6-7 spots every single time he came down pit Rd. went
41:20
from 15th to 8th. Every freaking run.
41:23
Bubble Walls came back and won the fall race, right?
41:26
He came back later that year showed that the speed he had was
41:28
legit and and won. I do wonder we the the speed
41:32
with host farts legit, but they got to execute.
41:34
They got to put all these things together.
41:36
Spire a a couple people 2-3 people mentioned Kyle Bush to
41:39
Spire. That was the thing, the thoughts
41:42
I was connecting earlier in the year just because obviously
41:45
still got the connection with the truck team, the 71.
41:48
I think Mcdowell's out of contract.
41:49
So technically there's an open ride and it makes a lot of sense
41:54
to for them to go get that, you know, that type of veteran
41:57
presents and and do that. But if your Spire doesn't make
42:01
sense to pay the money for Kyle Busch when he's putting this
42:04
type of performance on the track.
42:07
No, I mean, I don't. I don't even know that I have
42:08
anything to add. I mean, I said last week that.
42:11
That's why your peer. Yeah.
42:13
Well, yeah, we were talking about in context of Bowman,
42:16
right? Like if you're going to bring in
42:17
Kyle Busch, the question you have to ask yourself is, are you
42:21
going to get enough of a superior performance to what you
42:27
have to justify how much it's probably going to cost you?
42:31
I don't know. I mean, is Kyle Bush really
42:32
going to cost you at this point? There's got to be a part of Kyle
42:35
that wonders, you know, that there was a pathway to stay at
42:40
Gibbs. And I don't, I don't know how
42:41
realistic it ever was. I think it was more of a we're
42:44
going to offer Kyle this because we know he's going to say no,
42:49
The story's out there, right? That that he was offered a
42:52
version of a deal that he declined and he chased more
42:55
money. And so I wonder if there's a
42:56
part of Kyle that's like, I will do anything to get in a car that
43:00
I think is close enough to the front that I can make the
43:04
difference again. And FIRE certainly has a lot of
43:08
money. They're paying a lot of people,
43:10
superior people, contracts that are, that are worth making the
43:18
switch over. This is an F1 team.
43:22
I mean, really they they are an F1 caliber organization that's
43:25
just trying to, you know, make that jump over to we don't have
43:31
Hendrix data, but I should say data given the trial.
43:35
But Hendrick steers that ship, right?
43:37
It's it's probably the closest that Kyle could be to be back in
43:43
a Hendrick car without being in a Hendrick car, I'll say that.
43:46
Yeah. And and the reason I kind of
43:47
phrased it the way I did is he's.
43:49
And the merchandise, he's going to sell T-shirts and he's going
43:51
to sell die cast. That's true.
43:53
He'll sell stuff. He can bring in money elsewhere.
43:55
He probably get better sponsors with Kyle Busch in the car.
43:57
Then he came out and went down on the offense.
43:58
Michael But the reason I phrase that that way was also in
44:02
reference to Bowman a little bit in a conversation I I had with
44:05
some other people this past week, which was, you know,
44:07
Bowman is obviously on the hot seat.
44:09
Regardless of how loyal Rick Hendrick is the people and he is
44:14
ridiculously loyal. He's still on the hot seat.
44:17
He still could be out of a ride. But what people don't understand
44:20
is Alex Bowman isn't a high-priced guy.
44:22
He isn't Kyle Larson. He isn't Chase Elliott.
44:26
When you're running an organization that big and and
44:29
with that many big names, that much salary, it's nice to have a
44:32
driver who doesn't cost that much, that can help the the
44:35
budget of the team while still producing wins.
44:37
But which Alex Bowman does, he's produced a number of wins for
44:40
the team and they can run good. So I the my whole thought
44:45
process was like, OK, you're going to replace Bowman, one
44:47
with who? And then two, how much money are
44:49
you going to spend? Are you going to get a
44:50
high-priced guy or are you going to do Corey Day, which was my
44:52
answer earlier this year? Same thing with Spire.
44:55
It's like OK, McDowell doesn't cost you that much.
44:57
You can run that operationally well by the.
44:59
Way day starting to look like a really appealing option.
45:02
I told you. I told you I was a day one day
45:05
guy. I'm a I'm a Sprint car guy.
45:07
I was I was telling people Corey Day is the man before he even,
45:11
you know, got in a stock car. So you're not convincing me.
45:15
I've already I've already done the the convincing.
45:17
Fair enough, but I called him in that car next year.
45:20
I want that on the record. I'm not.
45:21
I'm not ready to go down that path yet.
45:23
I am no, we we can move on. I just I just don't really know
45:27
what to what to make a Kyle blush anymore and like, yeah,
45:30
him go inspire school, but what's that going to do?
45:32
He's going to run 18th instead of 22nd now.
45:34
I just I don't know. I I hope he's I want to get
45:38
better at some point. We we can move on, though.
45:40
Do you want I want to touch. I don't care if you want to do
45:42
it. It's my you know, I got the
45:44
microphone in front of me. ARCA race Cletus McFarlane goes
45:48
up with smoke. I don't know if you want to
45:49
touch on Cletus and Squirrel. We went 45 minutes and 50
45:53
seconds without saying the C word.
45:57
It's going to be a running bit, so I want to talk about that,
45:59
but I really want to talk about Gio.
46:01
Rosiero looked like an intentional wreck to me and then
46:05
goes on to win. Break down your view of what Gio
46:11
did in that situation and then getting the win, but then also
46:15
touch on the the person that draws the ratings would just
46:17
Cletus McFarlane. Yeah, So listen, I, I feel so
46:23
bad sometimes when I, when I have to criticize race car
46:26
drivers because one, I'm not qualified and I, I, I very
46:31
sparingly criticize race car drivers because it's important
46:34
for for me to let them know that I respect what you do, your
46:42
talent so much that I'm not going to imply that my decision
46:46
making would be better than yours because it's not in the
46:48
same way that I would. I would be really offended
46:51
anytime a driver or a person in the garage would come up to me
46:54
and tell me how to write a story.
46:56
You're not qualified to do that. I'm not qualified to tell you
46:59
what to do. But I will tell you watching the
47:02
end of the ARCA race and I've known Gio now for 6-7 years ever
47:08
since he started running prolate models for Anthony Campy.
47:12
So this is not a personal thing. That's the other thing too
47:15
people. I think fans sometimes conflate
47:21
bias and and criticism. Just because I express criticism
47:26
isn't bias, it's just criticism. I know there is a huge speed
47:33
disparity between the cars running for the lead and the
47:36
cars that are not in ARCA. And I just thought there was a
47:41
pathway for Gio not to run flat in the back of of Destiny.
47:46
And I, I expressed that in a tweet.
47:48
I, I called it undisciplined. I didn't say it was intentional.
47:51
I know that narrative is out there, that some people thought
47:53
that he created his caution. And certainly the interview that
47:57
Gio gave in Victory Lane did not help combating the narrative.
48:01
You know, he was not going to beat the allegations by going
48:05
into Victory Lane and saying, you know, I did whatever it took
48:08
to win. Probably not the best time to
48:11
drop that line. But I I thought in good faith
48:14
that if Gio running third is a good enough race car driver to
48:19
have not ran right into the the back of her turn right enough to
48:23
turn her left. That's I know how good he is.
48:26
I've seen him at his best and you know, at best it was just a
48:30
very undisciplined move from a driver that I know to be
48:35
frequently very disciplined. But you got to restart that he
48:40
needed. You got the caution that he
48:41
needed. And again, I'm not going to
48:44
imply intent because I can't read minds and I don't want to
48:47
be in the business of reading minds.
48:48
But best case scenario, he made a very undisciplined move.
48:53
And if you're going to do it, you better go out and win the
48:56
race. And he did.
48:58
There's a cat now once again in front of me.
49:00
The sabotaging the show again. My my big question within that
49:04
though is should I? I understand you want to win but
49:07
it's arca like you are a full time.
49:10
Too right, He's not even full time there.
49:12
Yeah, you're, you're a full time truck guy.
49:14
You're you're, you're a level above, you're doing something
49:16
else. You know, with the top
49:18
organization in that series, it feels like that's just kind of a
49:22
pointless situation. Put yourself in.
49:24
And then like I said, the reaction post race just wasn't
49:26
what you would expect from from someone that at least if they
49:29
had any awareness of the situation, they just put
49:31
themselves in. You know, that maybe hey, oh
49:34
God, I can't believe I did that. I was able to capitalize.
49:36
So obviously it went well. You know, something other than
49:38
what he said would have been better.
49:39
But yeah, anything on on Cleese? I didn't really watch the race
49:43
that much. I I saw he was running 15th.
49:46
I was I was doing some work but engine failure.
49:49
Obviously the more track timing gets the better, but was this a
49:52
good showing? Bad showing?
49:53
Does this help in any way? You know, it's funny because
49:57
like the he did the one thing which is ARCA, so he should be
50:00
doing it in ARCA. He did right off the bat.
50:03
The one thing the NASCAR said they wanted to see him do in
50:06
Rockingham in the O'Reilly race, which was go race.
50:10
You know, he he, I forget who he took three wide, but they're
50:13
like good cars. He took three wide, too, and he
50:16
mixed it up and he was, he was, you know, those cars are way
50:19
more stable, way more grip, way more aerodynamically sealed into
50:24
the racetrack. So it's easier for him to make
50:27
moves, you know, with confidence.
50:29
But that's good. Same thing with superspeedway
50:31
racing. You know, you can't control
50:34
blowing up, assuming that wasn't a a driver created error.
50:38
So, yeah, I mean, I thought it was a good showing for him.
50:41
I continue to hear good things about.
50:44
I can't believe I'm saying this name out loud.
50:46
Squirrel Mcnutt I I talked with Mark Rat, the the team owner at
50:52
red red Jones and crew chief and he's he continues to say that
50:56
Squirrel George asked a lot of really good questions.
51:01
He takes it seriously. You know, Cletus Garrett is
51:06
taking it very seriously. He's doing the things that you
51:09
need to do. You just can't approve him this
51:11
fast for where he wants to go. I want to see more stuff like
51:15
this, right? They don't want to see him go to
51:17
other ARCA races, and I want to see him pull out that late
51:20
model. I don't know how close it is.
51:22
We bought a late model from from Mark Red and Terry Jones and
51:26
Zippideli's over there too. I just want to see him race.
51:30
I want to see him, you know, mix it up two and three wide and go
51:35
door to door with people and something that's not a Crown
51:38
Victoria and we're starting to see that in big cars and that's
51:42
really all you want to see from them.
51:44
Yep. All right, O'Reilly race.
51:47
We'll, we'll, we'll wrap it up. We're all trying to get to the
51:50
Daytona 500 too. Is that the goal here?
51:52
Does he want to have like shake and bake in the Daytona 500?
51:56
Is that is that what this is all leading towards?
51:59
I hope not. I really hope not.
52:02
Although if. We're going to do it.
52:04
Let's go full stand. If they both get approved, it.
52:09
Actually, you know what, I feel like I'm almost gatekeeping too
52:12
much. Dude, if you go watch 1989
52:14
Daytona 500, there's just a bunch of random dudes showing up
52:16
anyways, right? Like, so if you're trying to be
52:18
a a realist and look back at the history of NASCAR, you know,
52:21
Bobby Gerhart show up or something.
52:23
Like it'd just be anyone from from lower series or with a
52:25
Hardy. Robbins Hardy Robbins was a
52:27
country music * and he raised stock cars at Nashville
52:30
Fairgrounds and superspeedways. I want people to take NASCAR
52:34
seriously so you know it. It feels like a legit sport.
52:37
But but yeah, fuck. I mean, if Charles Patroni could
52:41
get in one and and basically run top ten because of everyone
52:44
rocking out, why can't Cletus and squirrel go hang out in the
52:46
back and then run top ten? Right?
52:47
Like who cares? It's not that big a deal if they
52:50
if they bring enough money to the table to get cars on track
52:53
and people jobs and more power to them.
52:58
Taylor Gray wins he pretty strong all race.
53:02
I felt like Brandon Jones was the better car but a pit penalty
53:04
late cost him the win. JGR continues their dominance at
53:08
that time clear clearly better than everyone at Kansas.
53:12
The big moments of the race were Carson, I don't say Travis
53:15
Carson. Quapple flips lap one or lap 2
53:18
and then love versus hill. So a lot of entertaining stuff
53:22
in the in the early parts of of the race and then we get
53:24
another. Where do you stand on Austin and
53:26
Jessie? Huh.
53:27
This is like a litmus test for how intellectually honest I
53:30
think someone is. Where, where where do you stand
53:33
on that? What?
53:35
What was? What was?
53:36
What was it? I'm sorry.
53:38
Where where do you stand on the Austin Hill Jesse love mini
53:42
dispute? Because, and the reason I ask,
53:44
I'm asking everyone in the chat too, is I think there is like
53:47
just naturally such a dislike for Austin Hill that no matter
53:52
what the circumstance or scenario, Austin Hill is never
53:56
in the right. And, and in this case, I think
53:59
he had a fair gripe. Oh, he's 100% in the right.
54:02
Yeah. Yeah, no, it's not even close.
54:04
Where? Where?
54:06
Where do you want him to go? Yeah, I, I, I get running your
54:10
teammate hard and you know, composition matters and all
54:13
that, but you can't run someone's right rear any harder
54:16
than Jesse Love ran his own teammates right rear on lap 30.
54:20
Like what are we that's? The thing so early, if that's
54:23
for the win, godspeed, have at it.
54:27
Yeah, there was a race, I think. Someone was like, well, Austin,
54:31
Austin bobbles. Well, hell yeah, he bobbles.
54:34
He's being pinched to be there. Yeah, the, there was a race at
54:39
Texas, I think it was like 2022 or whatever.
54:41
And I, I, I'm probably going to get the names wrong.
54:44
I, I don't remember exactly who it was, but it was like lap 7.
54:47
And, and I think it involved like Noah Gregson, Riley herpes
54:49
maybe where he just booted them out of the way and wrecked them.
54:52
And it's like, dude, what are we doing?
54:54
We're 7 laps into this thing. They just stopped it.
54:56
That that was my biggest take away was like, you just do not
54:59
need to battle that hard. And then at the end of the day,
55:01
it is your teammate. Just come on, you don't have to
55:05
do that. He was going to make the pass
55:06
regardless of being that close on him.
55:09
So yeah, 100% on love. I didn't hear his post race.
55:11
I don't know if he took the blame or not, but yeah, I mean,
55:14
Austin Hill did nothing wrong. He he should be pissed.
55:17
I don't know if he he, he says a lot when he gets out of the car
55:20
and then he typically calms down I feel like, but he should be
55:23
pissed and he should walk in there Monday morning and say
55:25
what the hell was that? Does that sound call for?
55:28
Yeah, my guess is knowing both Jesse and Austin, it's probably
55:33
fine now. I I think that, you know, Austin
55:36
talks a game on the radio, he keys up and it's like, I'm going
55:39
to remember that one and whatever.
55:42
But knowing both Jesse and Austin, they probably talked it
55:45
over and it's just like, hey man, like we're points racing
55:49
now. Like we we need to work together
55:50
next week and we just need to be on the same page.
55:53
And if it had been for the win, I'm fine with.
55:56
I mean that that's the thing people are accusing Austin of
55:58
being a hypocrite. And it's true to a point, right?
56:02
Austin will race you really hard.
56:06
I don't. I don't even know that Austin
56:07
would race his teammate like that on on lap 30 either, but I
56:12
think they're fine. No many people that run someone
56:14
that hard on lap 30 like. Yeah, literally.
56:16
That's the other part. Like it.
56:18
That was egregious. It really was.
56:21
Yeah. I mean, that's pretty.
56:24
That's it. But yeah.
56:25
What? The cat got to say any input?
56:27
But he's he's, he's, he's, he's re emerged on the table.
56:30
And so I think Kimmy here has some opinions.
56:36
There we go. So Taylor Gray gets the win.
56:38
I believe it's the second O'Reilly Series win.
56:41
Obviously anyone with with Team 54 is probably a big fan and
56:44
happy of that. Already super excited in the
56:48
comments. There we go.
56:51
Any. Any, anything take away from
56:53
this race? Other than that, I feel like the
56:54
racing in this race, aside from the early chaos was pretty
56:57
similar to the Cup race. Long green flag runs, multiple
57:00
lanes, you know, pit strategy, short pitting, and I thought it
57:03
was a really entertaining race. I just don't know what you take
57:05
away from it for the rest of the year.
57:07
Obviously it's just JGR and JRM ran up front and you know,
57:10
Taylor Gray got a cool win. It kind of feels like a bit of a
57:13
lull for me in terms of overall excitement and nothing really
57:17
going to carry over. Do you have anything you want to
57:19
talk about within this series, like or you know, quarter of the
57:22
way through this, through the year, anyone we should keep an
57:25
eye on? Anything.
57:26
Just anything. Before, yeah, I mean, yeah, no,
57:29
the the narrative is true and I, I'm, I'm being super redundant
57:32
because I think, I think we talked about this last week too.
57:35
I, I do so many different shows and I do, I did club cast this
57:39
week and I'm super grateful for Jeff having me on club cast.
57:42
And so I forget that I talked about it here or there, but but
57:45
Brent is going to make the chase for the Championship and there's
57:48
going to be a moment where he looks like a real contender and
57:51
it's not going to to go all the way through, but he's good.
57:55
I've known Brent now for a couple of years and he's he's so
57:58
good. And the fact that he's already
58:00
this competitive on intermediates says a lot.
58:03
Like once he really figures it out in that car with that
58:07
equipment with Sapp as his crew chief, he's going to win some
58:10
races. And he's going to be a much
58:14
needed secondary character in this kind of just an all guyer
58:20
versus the world storyline that we're we're establishing.
58:23
Right. And so, yeah, you know, Carson
58:30
is going to win some races too. It's this this part's
58:34
unfortunate for him because this looks like a race that he could
58:36
have won. I don't even blame anyone for
58:39
that. I'm trying to I'm trying to
58:40
replay the race in my head. Right.
58:43
It was, was it Byron, Carson and Justin?
58:47
They were that was three wide. Is that what it was?
58:49
Yeah, I was running up around top and.
58:52
Super aggressive but everyone wants track position so they can
58:55
get out and set sail. I I enjoyed that race too for
59:00
the same reason that I enjoyed the cup race up until 2 laps
59:04
ago. Because I know it's not super
59:06
popular, but I I enjoy the the thinking man's race where it's
59:11
like hey if I can undercut at the right time to get track
59:15
position, catch lap traffic the right time and try to hold off
59:19
fresher tires behind me, make them burn up their tires in my
59:22
wake. I think that's sort of like
59:24
chess matches. So fascinating and even even
59:27
again watching this cup race, people were like saying yawn.
59:31
I thought it was so interesting that Bell by the way, Bell just
59:34
vanished on that long green flag run and he was driving away.
59:38
And so you, you went from Bell, Denny and then Tyler to being
59:43
flipped because of the undercut that Denny you know, pitted 5
59:47
laps before Bell and Reddick one lap before Bell.
59:54
And if you watch the run before, Denny was faster, I thought than
59:59
Christopher. And he would just, he would go
1:00:02
from 8 tenths back to 3/10 back. And every single time he would
1:00:05
get behind Christopher, he would just burn up his front tires and
1:00:08
he'd fall back. And eventually it just, it
1:00:10
killed the right sides. And Chris Gayle's gambit was, I
1:00:15
just need to get that track position back because I think
1:00:17
our car is good enough to if we're if we're the leader.
1:00:21
And now we're making either Christopher or Tyler burn up
1:00:24
their shit behind us. We can win the race and it
1:00:28
didn't quite play out that way because there was the fuel
1:00:31
pickup or fuel pump issue or whatever it was.
1:00:34
But I love seeing the crew chiefs in the war rooms and the
1:00:38
drivers all combine to try to win and lose races.
1:00:43
And I I just wish that race could have played out to its
1:00:47
natural conclusion, even though I'm sure fans would have found
1:00:51
it boring because I just I love seeing that Delta get smaller
1:00:55
and smaller, recognizing that, OK, well, you're going to get in
1:00:57
the wake and you're going to burn stuff up.
1:00:59
Austin Dillon playing a a role there, right?
1:01:02
He was equal opportunity, but he he, he made it really hard for
1:01:06
Denny and for Tyler. So if you're going to do that,
1:01:08
at least, you know, brace everyone.
1:01:10
Really hard to stay on the late lap.
1:01:12
I don't. Think Austin should get any
1:01:14
Flack for that? There's five laps to go.
1:01:16
A caution came out. I know, I know what you're going
1:01:19
to say and you're watching the old school race, but the caution
1:01:21
came out. I held him off for three more
1:01:24
laps. He's on the lap.
1:01:25
Battle for a better position. Yeah, someone called me out on
1:01:27
Twitter about it and I I said you're you're 100% right that
1:01:32
you want competitors to compete. And my rebuttal to this one, one
1:01:38
individual was it's like, OK, yeah, I hear you.
1:01:41
But if I were to do a pre season media day tour of every single
1:01:47
driver and say you're in this position, what is your
1:01:50
expectation? What do you think is ethically
1:01:54
the right thing to do? And on a tee, every single
1:01:57
driver would say, if it's five laps or less, just get out of
1:02:01
the way and hope the caution comes somewhere else.
1:02:04
And then there that guy, they're in, they're in Austin's shoes
1:02:09
and every single one of them would probably race the same
1:02:12
way. I'm sure.
1:02:13
I don't know. It's, it's interesting.
1:02:15
Do you think Denny and Tyler would race that way?
1:02:18
I don't know. Because they're they're, they're
1:02:19
in a different situation. Denny might not Denny might he?
1:02:23
He's the type of guy to be like, no, I'm going to.
1:02:25
But you know, the same thing happened in the O'Reilly race.
1:02:27
Brendan Poole was ripping the top when the leaders were
1:02:29
coming. That's.
1:02:30
Where I was getting at actually 100%.
1:02:32
And you know, I don't know that it's his job to get out of the
1:02:35
way. He's fighting for his bait to
1:02:37
Stanley lap. Hope for caution.
1:02:38
And then, you know, same thing with the leaders being caught.
1:02:41
Creed and Algar were coming, right?
1:02:43
That excitement of that race and the lot cards being there are
1:02:46
part of that. One of the arguments we've had,
1:02:48
not arguments like back and forth, we've had banter was
1:02:52
about shit boxes being in in the on the track.
1:02:55
Like I'm like, I don't need to see Mike Harmon cards on the
1:02:57
track. We can cut the field size.
1:02:59
I don't need it. And you're like, well, those lot
1:03:01
cards give us excitement when the leaders come around and pass
1:03:03
them. It creates.
1:03:04
And I think Boyer, even though I don't really like his
1:03:07
commentary, he brought that up at Bristol.
1:03:09
He was like, these lap cars are what's making this race
1:03:11
interesting. He's just making the guys have
1:03:13
to move around and and get by them.
1:03:15
And he was right. And that's the same thing you
1:03:16
said. Well, that's all.
1:03:19
I love the new DVP rolls. I want shit boxes dropping crap
1:03:24
all over the racetrack. I need speed disparity.
1:03:27
Yeah, yes, yeah. And and so I just, I just didn't
1:03:31
have any problem with it whatsoever.
1:03:33
And more importantly, again, if he stays on the lead lap, he's
1:03:37
running 16th, he's going to put on 4 fresh tires with the late
1:03:41
race restart and have a chance to go out there and finish 10th.
1:03:44
Like he could have gotten the top ten out of that if he
1:03:46
managed the Stanley lap. Like.
1:03:48
Gilliland When he got his lap back right, Gilliland went from
1:03:51
a lap down, Denny gave him a break and then he was
1:03:53
challenging for a top 10. Yes, exactly.
1:03:57
Exactly. I mean, that's really, that's
1:03:58
really all. Like, I want him to fight.
1:04:01
I want Austin Dillon and RCR to fight, and I didn't think he did
1:04:04
anything egregious he should be doing that and I, Tyler rage
1:04:07
should be mad. Like it's still affecting you
1:04:09
negatively. So yeah, be mad, but if you're
1:04:11
going to. Do it racing both that way and
1:04:13
he did it was it was equal opportunity.
1:04:15
Yeah, yeah. That overall I I love this type
1:04:19
of racing and I'm this why I'm so excited to get Chicago back
1:04:23
on the schedule. So I'm so excited that the fall
1:04:25
Charlotte race is going to be on the Oval.
1:04:27
This is the bread and butter. This is what NASCAR should be.
1:04:30
And I know people want Rex and they want chaos and they want
1:04:32
all those things, but it was real racing this weekend, you
1:04:35
know, it really was. And so I enjoyed it.
1:04:37
Hopefully did. Hopefully fans said I'm sure the
1:04:39
glut poll will be 50% or some shit but I I thought it was good
1:04:44
and I want to see more of it. Spot on.
1:04:49
Perfect. All right, I'm out of here.
1:04:51
You're out of here. Where are you going this week?
1:04:53
What's What's the plan? Well, actually I'm doing another
1:04:56
stupid weekend, so I'm doing Cars Tour on Saturday.
1:05:02
Cars Tours aggravated me this year because typically they
1:05:06
spread out their races throughout the year in a way
1:05:09
that's kind of nice. But I want to give them credit
1:05:12
from a racer standpoint. They have bookended their
1:05:16
schedule where they do every other week in the spring, every
1:05:19
other week in the fall, and they want to race a little less in
1:05:22
the summer because it's so darn hot.
1:05:25
They just want to subject their teams to less annoying weather.
1:05:30
But right now we're doing like every other week and it's kind
1:05:33
of complicating my my NASCAR schedule.
1:05:36
I love cars tour. It's the one I own short track
1:05:39
scene and I've got a staff who does all the other things for
1:05:43
me. ASA, Southern Super Series,
1:05:46
Modified Tour, all the ACT Pass, our website covers it all, but I
1:05:54
wanted to be super involved in motorsport and focused on
1:05:59
NASCAR. But the one short track thing
1:06:02
that I wanted to keep this year was CARS Tours.
1:06:05
I just, I think it's so much fun.
1:06:06
It's the most relevant. It has national prestige to it,
1:06:10
obviously, but their schedule this year is just complicating
1:06:13
my life because Bristol and Nashville being together and
1:06:16
making me go back and forth. I'm going to go to Caraway on
1:06:19
Saturday for Cars Tour. I'll be at the Cup race on
1:06:21
Sunday. I need to determine whether or
1:06:24
not I go to Talladega on Friday. That would be logistically
1:06:28
complicating and less convenient than Bristol and Nashville.
1:06:33
But I will be a Talladega on Sunday, so what's that?
1:06:37
That's a rough one, Asheboro. Yeah, so I will be at the Cup
1:06:43
race on Sunday, the rest of the weekend.
1:06:46
I will be at Caraway on Saturday, the rest of the week
1:06:49
TBA. Cool, well, I appreciate you
1:06:52
doing so. As always.
1:06:54
I I, I love when we have some spicy things to talk about.
1:06:58
So after caloric wins, Talladega, I'm sure we'll keep
1:07:01
up the the conversation. You want more?
1:07:03
Are you going to stay up and just drink more, more coffee?
1:07:05
Is that is that you're planning? My, my favorite coffee.
1:07:07
It should be yours. This is my Clint Boyer's stick.
1:07:10
We're we're, we're going to drink coffee on the air and try
1:07:13
to sell people some Starbucks holiday blend, even though the
1:07:16
holidays ended four months ago. My biggest question is why did
1:07:20
Harvick just like no sell the whole thing?
1:07:23
Like even he was annoyed by the whole prospect.
1:07:27
He was. Like that was that was the
1:07:29
weirdest part of Harvick was just like, yeah, that's some
1:07:31
good, but he just he screwed his buddy there.
1:07:34
But anyway, appreciate you guys checking out the show.
1:07:37
And and pro wrestling to to continue the theme from earlier.
1:07:40
He no sold it. Yes, he no sold it.
1:07:44
Please like the like the video, subscribe to the channel.
1:07:46
Kenny's obviously going to have about 15 different videos going
1:07:49
up this week. So there's a lot of stuff for
1:07:50
you, for you guys for being racing fans.
1:07:53
Check out Matt's short track scene and motorsport stuff and
1:07:56
we will catch you next week. Thanks guys.