Latest / A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast / Talks to Frazer Gregory & Si Hart about their choice of The Mysterious Planet (3/4)

Transcript

Talks to Frazer Gregory & Si Hart about their choice of The Mysterious Planet (3/4) · A Hamster With a Blunt Penknife - a Doctor Who Commentary podcast

• 0:33
  Hamster with a blunt pen knife for doing quicker.
• 0:37
  Every absurd opinion has its place, but the purpose of these
• 0:42
  commentaries between Sigio and Fraser are too big to be
• 0:45
  knowable. 1,000,000 computers. Couldn't work that one out.
• 0:50
  Welcome back to a hamster with a blunt penknife.
• 0:53
  The Doctor Who Commentary podcast 1 of many, but probably
• 0:58
  the best. I am here today with two
• 1:01
  delicious gentlemen. Mr. PSI Heart.
• 1:05
  Say hello PSI. Hello PSI.
• 1:08
  Once Upon a time, do you remember when I used to call you
• 1:09
  Simon at the start? I know God, what was.
• 1:13
  That it. Was phrased to call me Simon.
• 1:15
  Oh, OK. And of course, the magnificent
• 1:18
  Mr. Fraser Gregory. Hello, Fraser.
• 1:21
  Hello, what we're going to say handbag and hand real.
• 1:26
  I'll say Mr. Trick there. I will do you know, I did
• 1:29
  realise the other day I don't think a single recording of this
• 1:34
  bloody podcast goes by now where one of you or both of you is not
• 1:40
  mentioned. I'll defy you to find a strictly
• 1:42
  come hamster, book club, anything at all where you guys
• 1:46
  aren't mentioned. You are the DNA of this podcast.
• 1:51
  How do you feel about? That, but you think so after all
• 1:53
  these episodes I've done. I mean, it's, it's, it's nice.
• 1:57
  I just wish you know would come without the addition of that
• 2:00
  twat. Yeah, yes, yeah, usually, yeah
• 2:04
  or no. Now we started to you know, I've
• 2:07
  noticed your Fraser, your comments on the street to come
• 2:09
  hamster sometimes are quite negative.
• 2:12
  So we sort of go champion of the damned indeed.
• 2:19
  However. I've smashed my nicest guy in
• 2:22
  fandom tag with my book club top 10 so.
• 2:26
  Yeah, he went after Andrew Cartmel Fraser.
• 2:29
  Well. Twice.
• 2:30
  Yeah. Yeah, at least you didn't been
• 2:33
  garlic master planner. Wow.
• 2:38
  We're all wrong in so many, many ways.
• 2:41
  Fraser made an argument for Galaxy fucking 4, for God's
• 2:44
  sake. I know, and I would have been
• 2:46
  with him all the way. Oh.
• 2:48
  Yeah, God Almighty. Well, I'll tell you what is not
• 2:51
  damned and and doesn't really need an argument because it's so
• 2:55
  fabulous. That is Mysterious Planet.
• 2:57
  Or do I have a Time Lord Episodes one to four, if our
• 3:01
  pedantic friend here is to be believed?
• 3:04
  Well, if all everyone needs a pedantic friend, yes.
• 3:07
  That's very true. Usually it's me.
• 3:11
  Should we go into episode 3 and see what delights await us?
• 3:14
  Yeah, go on, man. Before we go, I would just like
• 3:17
  to ask you both a question. Have you ever wanted to see
• 3:19
  Colin Baker have sex with a robot?
• 3:24
  Not really. No, it's not a minister.
• 3:26
  Oh, well, you better prepare yourselves because you're going
• 3:29
  to see it in this episode. Let's go 532 person.
• 3:34
  Why do you look confused? You must know what I'm talking
• 3:36
  about. Well.
• 3:37
  Because I'm watching the iPlayer version, I don't want version
• 3:39
  you guys have got with. Suddenly I haven't got any Colin
• 3:43
  Baker porn. Jesus Christ.
• 3:46
  Are you watching Air Zone or? Something that's called BBV,
• 3:48
  Yeah, I said BBB. All right.
• 3:52
  You did. OK, so I haven't done this for a
• 3:58
  while and it might be quite amusing to do it.
• 4:00
  So I so if you could have to tell us please, what's happened
• 4:04
  in trial of a Time Lord today, off you go.
• 4:05
  We started or not. Yeah.
• 4:09
  Oh. Oh, we got some 100.
• 4:12
  All right, hang on. Go back to the start, everyone.
• 4:16
  Rewind. You got you.
• 4:19
  Started talking to Razor. In the middle of my numbers,
• 4:22
  yeah. I got 2.
• 4:26
  Jesus Christ. It's been a while since we've
• 4:28
  done this. 54321 Go. No.
• 4:35
  Would you like? Me to put the problems behind
• 4:37
  the scenes. Yes, I love doing this because
• 4:40
  people do it in such different ways.
• 4:43
  Well, the doctor is on trial for his life.
• 4:45
  Except he isn't. He's actually gone to an
• 4:47
  official inquiry, which the Valley Art has now termed a
• 4:50
  trial. And so the doctor is now on
• 4:52
  trial for his life because no one has stopped to say no, this
• 4:55
  isn't a trial. Everyone's just gone along with
• 4:57
  it. And so the doctor's termination
• 4:59
  of his lives is now the trial. I'm just to do the trial.
• 5:03
  They have taken the doctor's adventure on Ravalox with his
• 5:06
  companion Perry, where they are dealing with the mysterious
• 5:10
  planet of Ravalox. What is the mystery of Ravalox
• 5:13
  is probably Earth. Marble Arch is there.
• 5:16
  They found Marble Arch. There's a city of underground
• 5:19
  dwellers. There's a city of Overground
• 5:21
  dwellers and the two are in conflict with each other, ruled
• 5:26
  over. We're trying to take down the
• 5:29
  outside dwellers, are trying to take down Draft Row, the
• 5:32
  immortal who rules over the underground dwellers.
• 5:36
  I think that's about it, that. Is about it, yeah.
• 5:38
  That's quite a lot though. That's a lot of plot to be going
• 5:40
  on with are. They Wombles.
• 5:43
  No, they're only underground. And oh, hang on.
• 5:46
  Yeah. One bottle.
• 5:50
  One bottle of the free Hey. Oh, Tony Selby, looks like you
• 5:59
  don't enjoy running. No, I don't think Tony Selby.
• 6:02
  Did J&T say to him in a party, can you put weight on?
• 6:05
  Yeah, I've just lost it, he said.
• 6:08
  Apparently he scored Linda Bellingham and Tony Selby in the
• 6:11
  same party. Yeah, that's that's the kind of
• 6:14
  parties he went to, but. That was the way they did it
• 6:17
  back then, wasn't it? Well, not all these boring, you
• 6:19
  know. Yeah, what they call them.
• 6:22
  Auditions, yeah. No, the go to parliament says
• 6:25
  you're free. Can you eat a few doughnuts?
• 6:27
  Let's go. Linda, can you do 14 episodes?
• 6:30
  Yeah, of course I can. Oh, actually, I was going to ask
• 6:33
  a question about this and that is the target novelisation, or
• 6:37
  moreover, Linda Bellingham's reading of it.
• 6:40
  Oh yes, it opens with this very atmospheric sequence of a
• 6:44
  graveyard of spaceships. Yeah, which is what Robert
• 6:48
  Holmes wrote in the script as the as the opening, and then
• 6:52
  they did the magnificent ship sequence instead.
• 6:56
  But we could have had that sort of spaceship graveyard.
• 7:00
  They could have pulled in all those calendars and things for
• 7:02
  Blake 7. Absolutely.
• 7:04
  I mean, there's enough spaceship debris in the fishless pics
• 7:07
  workshop that they could pull together.
• 7:11
  Fraser, have you read the Target novel?
• 7:13
  No, I haven't. I think I've maybe he's read the
• 7:15
  first bit. She was a good reader.
• 7:19
  She I thought Linda Bellingham was a good reader.
• 7:21
  Yeah, she did well. Mind you, the whole trial,
• 7:24
  because Col. Colin does mind.
• 7:27
  War mind warp. Bonnie does Terra the ver voice.
• 7:31
  And Jason does Ultimate Foe, so yeah, I mean, that's that's
• 7:35
  quality stuff. That was.
• 7:38
  Did you see that? That was a big group of
• 7:40
  characters there. Now Balazar Perry's The Top
• 7:44
  Circle, It's Debar, Broken Tooth, and in a minute, Katrika
• 7:48
  as well. It's a big cast of characters.
• 7:53
  There's an issue there because Balazar recognises broken tooth
• 7:58
  and goes broken tooth. It's me Balazar.
• 8:00
  Now why is he called broken tooth?
• 8:04
  Well, he had a toffee when he was seven and.
• 8:08
  He's got a tribe of name, but Balazar recognizes that name.
• 8:13
  And yeah, there's a bit of a. You see that?
• 8:18
  But that is tempered perfectly by Dibber standing there going.
• 8:23
  I was just squeeze the trigger, don't pull it and the guy's
• 8:26
  taking hot shots at him. Dibber is fab, isn't he?
• 8:30
  Well that's a lovely long shot there as well.
• 8:32
  There is, yeah. There was a a moment there where
• 8:34
  we cut to the trial and it was a deliberate mention of Colin's
• 8:39
  violent behaviour in. 20 Oh, absolutely.
• 8:41
  He says the doctor is well known for these bouts of violence and
• 8:45
  Colin goes that is a foul slur. No, we just watched the.
• 8:51
  Last certain amount of graphic detail is.
• 8:54
  Unavoidable. Yeah.
• 8:57
  Much like these commentaries, Yeah.
• 9:00
  What do you think about this Merdeen and grill?
• 9:02
  Does that really come off? Yeah.
• 9:05
  It's all right. I don't think think the guy who
• 9:08
  plays Grill is is the most brilliant actor to being Doctor
• 9:11
  Who, but. Tony Selby said in the
• 9:14
  commentary that the actor who played him wouldn't join in the
• 9:19
  fun with any of the other actors, and he thought he was
• 9:22
  sort of a bit above all of this. Oh, OK.
• 9:25
  But it was work, you know. Just realized that looks like he
• 9:30
  needs a wee. He's like.
• 9:35
  Hopping around behind, he says. You are right though, because
• 9:39
  Croydon's got a funny walk as well, isn't it?
• 9:41
  So? Oh, I do like this.
• 9:45
  Colin tries to charm her, doesn't he?
• 9:47
  He does, yeah, usually with the doctor today with.
• 9:51
  Ageing females. I always I love Colin putting
• 9:57
  his his hand out to say hello and it then realising the fires
• 10:01
  there as. His name?
• 10:04
  Known as the Doctor. And in a second he goes, Oh
• 10:08
  yeah, I've come to repair her. And she goes, oh, well, how
• 10:10
  fortunate because you've just damaged it.
• 10:14
  This could be an episode of Rentable.
• 10:16
  Fossil here. Aye, aye, aye.
• 10:22
  It's similar to that, probably more fun where they've got in
• 10:25
  see Harriet dressed as engulfed in the Hut.
• 10:30
  What do you think about this whole sort of science versus
• 10:34
  superstition or science versus savagery?
• 10:37
  Seen it all before. We try to do that here.
• 10:41
  Are we making a comment on it or is it just one society has gone
• 10:44
  one way and the others gone the other?
• 10:47
  It's it's interesting because it's it's kind of set up as as
• 10:50
  that way. But then Katrika very cleverly
• 10:58
  subverts that trope by being. Yeah.
• 11:00
  Oh, you're from this. Yeah.
• 11:02
  Who are you? Star traveller?
• 11:03
  Yeah. Come for the totem.
• 11:05
  Yeah, we know. We know what it.
• 11:06
  Is, yeah. Yeah, we know about those.
• 11:10
  Yeah, sit down back in your box. I've seen Face of evil, she's
• 11:14
  saying. We're not doing that.
• 11:17
  We've got women in our tribe. That's amazing.
• 11:21
  Yeah, there's Colby Hinchcliffe story.
• 11:23
  There's far too many women about.
• 11:26
  I did like the fact that he goes, oh, we we searched him for
• 11:29
  guns and he doesn't have any. And she goes, all of that makes
• 11:32
  you very unusual. Yep.
• 11:35
  I mean, he would have had a gun last year.
• 11:38
  He did have a gun last year. Yeah.
• 11:40
  Well, frequently did, yeah. He would have a gun.
• 11:44
  That's another nice longshot in that, yeah, I think this
• 11:48
  direction isn't bad, you know? No, he's, he's, yeah.
• 11:52
  He's, it's not like, you know, it's not Graham Harper.
• 11:54
  He's not. No, but there is only Graham
• 11:56
  Harper. Who does.
• 11:57
  Graham, That's true. And as we'll see in the next
• 12:01
  episode, I think Ron, is it Ron Jones?
• 12:05
  Yeah, Yeah, he does a brilliant job in.
• 12:08
  Mind yeah, he's finally learnt his craft and then they never
• 12:10
  get him back again. I think he learnt his craft
• 12:12
  through Doctor Who. We'll get there, we'll get
• 12:14
  there, we'll get there. I even when I was younger, I
• 12:20
  didn't find this pair too funny. No.
• 12:24
  The two, the two blonde boys, are they supposed to be
• 12:28
  brothers? I don't know.
• 12:31
  I don't. I think it's not just like the
• 12:35
  just PSD because they've been locked in the Hut withdraw
• 12:38
  through all the time. Such an old visual.
• 12:41
  Defense, they're all going to be PSD on because none of them are
• 12:43
  seeing this one so. He's chosen, you know, the two
• 12:45
  twinks of the village, to come and live with him.
• 12:48
  I think J&T may have changed the two twinks of the village.
• 12:52
  There is a precedent around 2 from 1980 onwards.
• 12:58
  It's called the Twin Dilemma, I believe.
• 13:00
  Yeah. What a line that is.
• 13:02
  You're a Time Lord. Have you not got a ring?
• 13:04
  You can rob a magical lamp. That was definitely in the
• 13:10
  discontinuity. Guys, you're a scholarly
• 13:14
  philanthropist, are you? Now?
• 13:17
  If there's ever a line that was made for Colin Baker, like, I
• 13:24
  don't think there's a line of dialogue he can't get his mouth
• 13:26
  around. Did any of you listen to the Big
• 13:28
  Finish audio ish? Yeah, he.
• 13:31
  Dialogue they gave him that was extraordinarily difficult to
• 13:36
  say. Oh, Glitz knew.
• 13:39
  It was Earth. Oh so mysterious after all.
• 13:43
  Well. But why is it there?
• 13:44
  After something mysterious. What's this lost expedition?
• 13:48
  Andromeda bumped off these robots.
• 13:50
  Don't, don't. It's mentioned many times by the
• 13:56
  great writer HMS. They should be obvious.
• 14:00
  Do you know we were almost getting to the dirt then?
• 14:03
  Yep. Oh yeah, look, finally the walls
• 14:06
  come down. Yeah, watch.
• 14:08
  Shut up and keep in front of me where I can keep an eye on you.
• 14:12
  It's great, isn't it great? I'm not sure what happens then
• 14:21
  say electrocute him. I think the bin comes out and
• 14:25
  shoves him against the wall but. I'm sorry, that looks obscene
• 14:29
  what Colin is doing to that robot.
• 14:30
  Right now he's obviously unconscious and he's just all.
• 14:37
  Right. I've ended up in a few parties
• 14:39
  in that position. Give the robot a hug and that
• 14:44
  makes everything better. Oh, now Jones Sims gets the ham
• 14:48
  it up brilliantly, doesn't she? She does.
• 14:49
  Get the guns. Oh, Jaffro's surprised.
• 14:55
  What does he never put his cameras on above?
• 14:58
  No. Well, no, because he doesn't
• 15:00
  have any cameras above. It's only because the robot's
• 15:02
  there. I.
• 15:05
  Didn't see anything. I like this set like Drafthor's
• 15:10
  castle. I like all the bits of colour in
• 15:12
  the ceiling. Yeah, the lights down the side
• 15:15
  as well. So is it sort of holographic,
• 15:17
  isn't it? Yeah.
• 15:20
  Oh, there's rules. Do you remember those cards you
• 15:22
  got when you were younger? You know, and there'd be like
• 15:24
  one holographic card and each. And a lenticular card.
• 15:28
  And a bit of bubble gum in there as well.
• 15:30
  Oh, those were the days. Oh, no, look, he's commenting on
• 15:35
  the story again. Why am I listening to this
• 15:39
  stupid robot on a pair of nitwits who might as well be
• 15:44
  robots? He's commenting on the acting
• 15:47
  now. Colin, come on.
• 15:54
  It's a bit pardon this. Yeah, this is.
• 15:56
  Kind of like. You know, oh, do we need to
• 15:59
  explain how we're recording the story?
• 16:01
  Is. That, yeah.
• 16:03
  We'll be bunked. This feels like Eric's sidewards
• 16:07
  our. Disbelief has been suspended.
• 16:09
  We don't need this explanation why, although it does give the
• 16:14
  chance if you want to call them a few more.
• 16:16
  Names. I'm sorry.
• 16:17
  Valliard 4th of habit. I apologise.
• 16:20
  It's kind of the cut and thrust again.
• 16:21
  It's kind of the Valliards getting one over on the doctor
• 16:24
  now. Yeah, you don't need any of
• 16:25
  this. It's within the collection range
• 16:27
  of a TARDIS. Oh, you're this isn't Star Trek.
• 16:29
  We don't care. Are you telling me it's been
• 16:33
  bugged without my knowledge? Oh, Carly, I love you.
• 16:40
  An Earth term. And I think we're wasting time
• 16:43
  on an unimportant issue. Yes, we've come out of a scene
• 16:47
  that she said was irrelevant and then at the end of the scene
• 16:50
  that she's interrupted, she said this is.
• 16:52
  Irrelevant. We're definitely in Part 3,
• 16:54
  aren't we? Stop Immortal.
• 16:59
  This is, look at Colin, the indignity of this Jones Sims
• 17:05
  with a bloody gun. I mean, I'll pay my license fee
• 17:08
  for a year just for this. Oh, that's quite nice that the
• 17:14
  cameras coming towards them. Yeah, that's good.
• 17:19
  This is what we want. Action.
• 17:23
  Does he try to do a really bad Tom Baker impression in a
• 17:26
  minute? What I think it's Pertwee.
• 17:30
  Oh, really? Yeah.
• 17:33
  He's got it's a touch of the spotty man's about it hasn't.
• 17:37
  It. Oh, he does say Sarah Jane as
• 17:39
  well. Yeah.
• 17:40
  Does Thomas say no? Thomas says Sarah, doesn't he?
• 17:42
  John says Sarah Jane. Yeah, yeah.
• 17:49
  We're sort of running on the spot now.
• 17:51
  Folks, we are. Yeah, well, yeah, as as Fraser
• 17:54
  said, it's Part 3. It's all a bit I.
• 17:57
  Think it's ultimately that the story is quite late.
• 18:00
  The story story is it's quite late, so it's probably a good
• 18:03
  thing we do have the the court scenes to kind of interject with
• 18:08
  because, you know, we have a sticky.
• 18:10
  What extra would you put in there?
• 18:11
  Because we've got. 15 minutes or so.
• 18:15
  It's a we've got a single strand, a plot.
• 18:18
  Yeah. There isn't a there.
• 18:21
  The only subplot is Grail. Yeah, technically this is what B
• 18:24
  plot of sort of. It's very underdeveloped because
• 18:29
  you don't need to develop it so much because you've got the
• 18:31
  trial scenes, which are your actual B plot.
• 18:34
  It's all trying to do a bit of politic in here, isn't it?
• 18:36
  With Grail trying to expose Merdeen.
• 18:40
  And I only think it works really after Grail dies and it's
• 18:44
  because of Tom Chapburn's performance.
• 18:46
  It's great. Yes, he.
• 18:47
  Gives it a dignity, yeah. I think, but if you wanted to
• 18:53
  add more, you could add more to the tribe of the three.
• 18:56
  You could, you know, the destruction of the black light
• 19:00
  converter happens very quickly in the grand scheme of, you
• 19:04
  know, Doctor Who plots, you know, it's, it's like it
• 19:06
  actually happens at a time when it should happen.
• 19:09
  And, you know, there's, there's areas where if you didn't have
• 19:12
  the trial stuff, you could stick some padding in, you know,
• 19:16
  choice. You know I would.
• 19:18
  You know that fabulous old woman I keep saying to look at in the
• 19:21
  tribe? The one who's behind Katrika I'd
• 19:23
  I'd like a subplot of her trying to choose which of her sons is
• 19:27
  going to marry Perry. That would be a nice subplot.
• 19:32
  But yeah, but you'd have had an advisor to the Queen and sings
• 19:36
  of the Queen talking about things like that.
• 19:39
  So basically what we've got is a a three-part Doctor Who
• 19:43
  adventure with a one part Doctor Who adventure in the trial room,
• 19:48
  but interspersed because there's there's always that this
• 19:54
  wonderful article I read years ago in, in, in the fanzine
• 19:58
  Scara, where they said an alternative version of the trial
• 20:01
  could be you've got the mysterious planet as a free part
• 20:05
  opener, then a free part mind warp.
• 20:08
  And then they're dragged off to the trial with the doctor at the
• 20:14
  end of mind warp. He doesn't know any of this.
• 20:15
  Then they've got. Two-part courtroom drama, the
• 20:19
  vervoid story that they watch together to see how the Doctor
• 20:24
  goes and then the mysterious planet.
• 20:27
  Sorry, the ultimate foe sort of ending so.
• 20:30
  The only reason though, I would contradict that and I, I don't
• 20:33
  think I think that's a good alternative way of doing it is I
• 20:36
  think the moment when Colin is taken out of time and we realise
• 20:41
  this is when he entered at the start of the season.
• 20:43
  It's one of the best timey wimey moments.
• 20:45
  And Doctor whoever where you're going and you know, he's going
• 20:48
  after Perry and you know she's in danger.
• 20:50
  And we know because we've just watched the last 7 episodes of
• 20:53
  him in the trial room that he ain't going back to her anytime
• 20:56
  soon. Yeah.
• 20:59
  But that would also be a fabulous cliffhanger in its own
• 21:03
  right as well. You know, where he's whisked off
• 21:06
  before he can rescue her. It works either way.
• 21:10
  It's, it's a bit like those people that say, you know, watch
• 21:12
  the first two Star Wars films, watch New Hope and Strikes Back,
• 21:18
  then watch the three prequels as sort of like a flashback to beta
• 21:22
  and then watch Return of the Jedi to see, to see what
• 21:27
  happens. It's.
• 21:28
  I mean direct spiritual link between Trial of a Time Lord and
• 21:31
  the original Star Wars trilogy. Yeah, of course.
• 21:35
  I mean, I know which one I'd rather watch.
• 21:37
  I mean, it features Colin Baker, yes.
• 21:42
  But I think obviously the the structure of this season, this
• 21:48
  14 episodes is past, present, future.
• 21:52
  You know, you have the story from the past, the story from
• 21:55
  the present, the story from the future, then the quarter as it
• 21:58
  were. So would would you lose anything
• 22:02
  if you made it that way? I think it's an interesting idea
• 22:08
  and I think, but I think 2 episodes of courtroom drama
• 22:15
  that's. What we get basically in the
• 22:17
  last two? Well, it's not because you go
• 22:20
  off into the matrix. Oh yeah, marvelous.
• 22:22
  You know you're going into the matrix, you Colin's getting
• 22:24
  dragged through sand and Mr. Popovic, junior and senior and
• 22:29
  the other Mr. Popovic are popping up.
• 22:32
  My biggest criticism of like the evidence used, yeah, past,
• 22:36
  present and future, is that the Valeyard uses a piece of
• 22:40
  evidence that shows the Doctor saving the entire universe,
• 22:43
  whereas I think the Doctor should use that as part of his
• 22:46
  defence. And the Doctor uses a piece of
• 22:49
  evidence where he murders an entire race of people.
• 22:52
  And I think the value actually prosecution.
• 22:56
  It's perspective though, isn't it?
• 22:57
  Because the Doctor doesn't look at murdering this.
• 23:00
  The entire race of Vervoids is a bad thing.
• 23:03
  He looks at it as, you know, saving the world.
• 23:07
  And it's a very clever rug pull at the end of that.
• 23:10
  And we're skipping ahead quite a bit now.
• 23:11
  It's a very clever rug pull. When Pip and Jane turn around
• 23:16
  and say, you know, we look at it and go, Yep, they're safe, well
• 23:19
  done. And Pippa Jingle.
• 23:22
  No kids, that's a bad thing. Kill an entire race of sentient
• 23:25
  creatures. Do the line.
• 23:27
  Do the line. Genocide.
• 23:31
  The charge must not. Be therefore.
• 23:35
  Genocide. Oh, it's fabulous.
• 23:37
  It's crash zoom, of course. I mean, if you thought the quota
• 23:41
  was bad here, you wait till we get to Vervoids.
• 23:46
  There is a line in a minute though, which I think explicitly
• 23:50
  does show the Doctor to be different to the last season is
• 23:54
  when he says Perry, I can't go or what's it he says?
• 23:59
  I can't just believe that there's people to save or
• 24:01
  something. Else there's some people, yeah.
• 24:04
  Because she goes, well, fine. That's why we're going in.
• 24:06
  Is it? It's like, well, yeah, let's go.
• 24:11
  That's that scene we've just had there with the with them
• 24:14
  deciding which way to go. Is is it Jonathan Turner
• 24:17
  scripted scene? What do you believe?
• 24:19
  You must speak me a fool. Regularly she goes against you.
• 24:26
  Is it where she goes? I'll read it in the flames many
• 24:28
  times. It's one of the best scenes in
• 24:31
  the whole thing. You should have been scripting
• 24:33
  the whole thing. No, I don't think I would take
• 24:37
  AGNT script or a Bob Holmes script.
• 24:39
  I would. I would have liked like a
• 24:41
  two-part from him though. I think I'll retreat, yeah.
• 24:46
  I think I would have liked like do a bit of a Bobby let's you
• 24:50
  know and and actually direct. Direct, definitely.
• 24:53
  I think he yeah, he always said he wanted to direct black
• 24:56
  orchids. Yeah.
• 24:58
  She would have been right up his St. wouldn't he?
• 25:00
  Yes. Oh look, dip her in a big gun.
• 25:05
  A big gun that is supposed to be very heavy but clearly isn't.
• 25:09
  Although Tony Selby has a go, doesn't he?
• 25:12
  Oh, they are and. Then a few scenes later I was
• 25:15
  carrying it with one hand. And I think this episode,
• 25:19
  because it is a bit of sort of running to and fro, escaping and
• 25:23
  all of that, all of these sort of peppy lines of dialogue, all
• 25:26
  of these double acts, it's all kind of vital here before things
• 25:32
  really accelerate. Yeah, very, very quickly.
• 25:36
  Well, I don't think the two to be honest in four because
• 25:41
  ultimately we're end 3 in the position where we're no the the
• 25:45
  black light converters blow it up that's going to blow up draft
• 25:50
  through. So part 4 is basically just
• 25:53
  trying to avoid a big explosion, which we are only limitedly
• 25:57
  successful in. Yeah, Fraser, press all those
• 26:00
  buttons over there. Right.
• 26:01
  Good. We've stopped it.
• 26:02
  Let's go. Yeah.
• 26:03
  Oh, we haven't stopped. It's still going to explode,
• 26:05
  but. Yeah, but only a little
• 26:07
  explosion. It's kind of like the end of
• 26:09
  part three, you know, we need to get into here to stop this thing
• 26:12
  happening and part 4 is them trying to get into there and
• 26:15
  trying to stop what happened. Into the castle, although I will
• 26:21
  fight you if you say there's no great moments in Part 4 because
• 26:23
  I think there's just loads of great scenes.
• 26:26
  Anyway, we're not getting a part 4 because the rest of the trial,
• 26:29
  the rest of the evidence has been excised.
• 26:31
  Yes, Why? There's some mystery, yeah,
• 26:35
  mystery within mystery. What has been bleeped?
• 26:40
  You know, I've just had the most profound fault I've ever had on
• 26:43
  Hampsford with a blood pen knife.
• 26:45
  Oh my God, what? Well, I'm going to say sorry
• 26:49
  that's all you get, I'm afraid. Yeah, it's fine.
• 26:53
  Listeners at home, we can lip read.
• 26:56
  And yes, it was exactly what you think he said.
• 27:03
  No, mom. Give him enough rope to hang
• 27:07
  himself. Hey, he's.
• 27:10
  Loving it. He's loving it and I'm loving
• 27:12
  it. I'm loving these guys.
• 27:13
  He's the devil. Isn't he?
• 27:15
  I really am the they're not. Like I said, the vast majority
• 27:19
  aren't coming at a bad point. Now it's kind of like the common
• 27:22
  in between scenes, not in the middle.
• 27:24
  And I think that's where the best place to kind of put them.
• 27:27
  Ah, team, Mr. Train. What are you hunting?
• 27:33
  What are you hunting? You.
• 27:37
  I mean, it's a bit of a box. Standard cliffhanger ending.
• 27:40
  Oh, we didn't know. Finish on the No, no, that's not
• 27:45
  a box. Standard trial ending.
• 27:48
  No, no pujin gong. No2 one that is the the whole
• 27:54
  point and a gun, but then actually it's it's Andrazani
• 27:56
  again, isn't it? It's.
• 27:58
  Can. I pull in the trigger.
• 27:59
  Is this the case of one of those things in Doctor Who where, you
• 28:02
  know, it's a bit embarrassing, all those crash zooms on Colin's
• 28:05
  face, right? A bit like the code.
• 28:07
  But we sort of over time, owned it, and now we love it.
• 28:12
  And now we've got an episode and where there's no crash zoom and
• 28:15
  we're disappointed. No, because one the court isn't
• 28:18
  embarrassing. 2 the crash room is embarrassing.
• 28:22
  It's great cliffhanger, so no nonsense.
• 28:25
  Well, I do think there should be some variety, you know, in the
• 28:28
  cliffhanger. So that's why when Terra the
• 28:30
  Verve voice comes along, it's quite refreshing.
• 28:32
  Well, if you notice, the first Crash Room cliffhanger was on
• 28:37
  the right side of his face. You know what the best one is,
• 28:44
  Ron Joan, he goes. I'm not having this.
• 28:47
  So it's a completely dark corridor.
• 28:49
  He zooms in and then the strobe light goes boom and lights up
• 28:52
  his face and it ends. Yes, it's great.
• 28:55
  Oh, it ended well. It did it.
• 28:59
  It would have seemed that the entire universe is imperiled and
• 29:02
  we're going to have to wait another 2525 minutes, another
• 29:06
  week to find out how Doctor Who and his companion Perry are
• 29:09
  going to get out of this one. And it's true, I'll.
• 29:14
  Cut it there.