Latest / The Starfish Storytellers / Season 5, Episode 10: Following the Story - Curiosity, Journalism and Connection with Jacqueline Martinz

Transcript

Season 5, Episode 10: Following the Story - Curiosity, Journalism and Connection with Jacqueline Martinz · The Starfish Storytellers

• 0:00
  Welcome to the starfish storytellers the podcast
• 0:03
  that makes a difference one story at a time by
• 0:05
  bringing storytelling to life Okay, so the story
• 0:10
  I really love to share with people is what happened
• 0:13
  when I was doing some research for the very first
• 0:17
  article I ever got published. It was a long time
• 0:19
  ago. I was still a student I was studying journalism
• 0:23
  and I pitched this little blog that covered everything
• 0:28
  that was happening in Toronto, and they let me
• 0:31
  write about haunted houses in the city. So I
• 0:35
  pitched that idea. I was very excited. I was,
• 0:38
  you know, young. I was a horror movie fan. I
• 0:40
  thought, this is so exciting. I get to write
• 0:43
  about this. And one of the places that I covered
• 0:46
  was the lighthouse on Toronto Islands. And I
• 0:51
  remember going with a photographer from this
• 0:53
  blog. We took the ferry over to Centre Island
• 0:57
  and we had security meet us right when we got
• 1:00
  off the ferry and this man walked us over to
• 1:03
  the lighthouse and he introduced us to someone
• 1:08
  else who basically allowed us to come into the
• 1:10
  lighthouse. And I'm scared of heights, so I didn't
• 1:13
  end up climbing the stairs and going all the
• 1:15
  way up, but the photographer did. And he got
• 1:18
  some great photos. But it was probably one of
• 1:21
  the most eerie experiences I've ever had. And
• 1:24
  I'm not even someone who would say that I believe
• 1:28
  in ghosts or anything like that. I'm definitely
• 1:30
  a little skeptical. But as soon as I walked in
• 1:34
  there, there was just something about the air
• 1:36
  that felt a little bit different. I wasn't comfortable
• 1:40
  waiting alone while the photographer and this
• 1:43
  other man were climbing the stairs and taking
• 1:47
  photos and learning about the history of the
• 1:49
  place and I was really waiting to get back outside
• 1:55
  and eventually we did get back outside but it's
• 1:58
  a memory that has really stayed with me because
• 2:01
  of how uncomfortable being in there made me feel
• 2:04
  and I haven't really had that feeling in many
• 2:07
  of the other places that I've been to and just
• 2:10
  learning about the history of it and what people
• 2:13
  say happened to the lighthouse keeper who may
• 2:15
  or may not have been murdered. It's just it's
• 2:19
  a really fun place I think people should go visit
• 2:21
  on Halloween or you know if you're just looking
• 2:24
  for something spooky but definitely a very interesting
• 2:27
  experience that I had and After I wrote about
• 2:31
  it, I ended up having this interest in lighthouses
• 2:35
  because they had never really been places I thought
• 2:38
  of when I thought about things like history and
• 2:41
  folklore, but there's so much associated with
• 2:44
  lighthouses. And yeah, it really sparked an interest
• 2:48
  in that for me. And just recently, I actually
• 2:52
  wrote another article for CBC about lighthouses,
• 2:55
  so. that focused on just different lighthouses
• 2:59
  throughout the country that people can go to
• 3:01
  visit and what they can learn when they go there
• 3:04
  and it was sort of a full circle moment, but
• 3:08
  Yeah, I mean that experience. The photographer
• 3:12
  actually joked he felt something in there too,
• 3:14
  so it wasn't just me. But both of us were very
• 3:17
  skeptical and we sort of laughed about it on
• 3:19
  the ferry ride back to the city. But yeah, definitely
• 3:23
  my first experience as a real journalist and
• 3:26
  also I would say my most memorable one. Hello,
• 3:36
  my name is Liana Henry and welcome to the Starfish
• 3:39
  Storytellers. I'm the CEO of the Black Dog Group
• 3:42
  and your host. I'm passionate about storytelling
• 3:45
  and on a mission to raise up the next generation
• 3:47
  of storytellers. We're called the starfish storytellers
• 3:51
  after the moral of the starfish story, which
• 3:53
  centers on the power of one. Because no matter
• 3:56
  how big the challenge, every action matters.
• 3:59
  One step, one starfish, and one story at a time.
• 4:03
  Every episode, we'll welcome a new storyteller
• 4:05
  who will inspire and connect with you. So thanks
• 4:08
  for tuning in. Now let's get started. Today's
• 4:12
  episode is following the story curiosity journalism
• 4:15
  and connection and with me today is Jacqueline
• 4:19
  Martins Jackie is a Toronto based journalist
• 4:22
  and writer who recently joined CTV your morning
• 4:24
  as a segment producer for live programming where
• 4:27
  she pitches and produces segments for the national
• 4:29
  morning show It's the latest chapter in a career
• 4:32
  that's taken her across national television digital
• 4:35
  journalism strategic communications and community
• 4:38
  leadership Her reporting has appeared in CBC,
• 4:42
  the Philanthropist Journal, Metro, and other
• 4:44
  publications covering everything from politics
• 4:47
  and public policy to health, education, philanthropy,
• 4:50
  travel, and animal welfare. Jackie previously
• 4:54
  worked at CTV News Channel as a chase producer
• 4:57
  and writing. She was researching and producing
• 4:59
  breaking news stories under intense deadlines
• 5:02
  and sourcing experts, policy makers, business
• 5:05
  leaders, and community voices. At CBC, she wrote
• 5:08
  audience -focused stories for CBC life, many
• 5:11
  focusing on animal welfare. Today, her connection
• 5:15
  to storytelling extends beyond journalism. Jackie
• 5:18
  serves on the board of directors for Storytelling
• 5:20
  Toronto, an organization dedicated to bringing
• 5:22
  storytellers and audiences together and helping
• 5:25
  more people discover their own ability to tell
• 5:27
  stories. So welcome to the Starfish Storytellers,
• 5:30
  Jackie. We're really happy you're here. Thank
• 5:32
  you, Leanna. I'm very excited to be here. So
• 5:35
  we start every episode by having our guests introduce
• 5:38
  themselves in their own words. So before we get
• 5:40
  into your journalism background and storytelling,
• 5:43
  I'd love for our listeners to get to know you
• 5:45
  a little better. Well, thank you for the great
• 5:48
  introduction, Leanna. I don't really have too
• 5:50
  much else to add. I think you've definitely done
• 5:52
  your research. Yeah, I'm excited to talk more
• 5:57
  about journalism and storytelling. Great. So.
• 6:02
  I really appreciated you sharing your story about
• 6:05
  the lighthouse. You know, when folks are hearing
• 6:07
  this, it's in October. And so it might be a good
• 6:10
  time for folks to maybe visiting this lighthouse.
• 6:13
  If you're in Toronto, we're coming to you from
• 6:15
  the hive on Eglinton Avenue in Toronto, in the
• 6:19
  city where we're a pop -up today. And, you know,
• 6:22
  I, I don't know that I walk around thinking about
• 6:28
  ghosts, but I too, will know when I'm in a space
• 6:32
  that feels a little creepy and I can sense there's
• 6:35
  something there. But I too, I love the history
• 6:38
  of lighthouses. We have been in the New England
• 6:42
  area and the United States and there's a lot
• 6:44
  of lighthouses there and we've visited them.
• 6:46
  It's a beautiful area. Yeah, it is really nice.
• 6:50
  We want to talk today about your path and your
• 6:52
  journey through journalism and communications
• 6:54
  and storytelling. When we talked before as we
• 6:57
  were getting ready for the podcast, we talked
• 6:59
  about studying journalism, but entering at a
• 7:02
  time when journalism jobs were hard to find.
• 7:06
  And so this led you instead to a career in communications,
• 7:09
  which I having been in journalism myself and
• 7:12
  having been in communications, it seems like
• 7:13
  a natural progression when you're coming from
• 7:15
  journalism. You mentioned that even while working
• 7:18
  full time in PR, you were still freelancing.
• 7:21
  doing some journalistic pieces and doing some
• 7:24
  writing, sometimes finishing your work day and
• 7:26
  staying late to conduct your interview for articles.
• 7:29
  And I don't know if I had told you during our
• 7:30
  talk, but I was working a full -time job and
• 7:34
  I was working part -time for a newspaper. And
• 7:36
  on my lunch break, I would be on my phone talking
• 7:39
  to my sources so I could get everything in by
• 7:41
  deadline. But you said it simply, I just couldn't
• 7:45
  stop writing. So once you started writing for
• 7:48
  CBC, you decided to make the move. from communications
• 7:51
  to journalism and you ended up at CTV news channel,
• 7:54
  which is really cool because we watch the TV
• 7:56
  every night. And now you have your new role as
• 7:58
  a segment producer with CTV your morning. So
• 8:03
  what has kept you interested in journalism and
• 8:05
  storytelling throughout these different chapters
• 8:08
  in your career? Yeah. So I think sometimes I
• 8:12
  laugh when people talk about my path because
• 8:14
  I know so many people who have done it the other
• 8:16
  way around. They start off in journalism and
• 8:19
  spend many years working in that industry and
• 8:21
  then end up moving into communications. And I
• 8:24
  didn't spend much time in journalism when I finished
• 8:26
  school. I spent most of my career in communications
• 8:29
  and then went back into journalism. I think for
• 8:34
  me, I've always had a love for writing. Going
• 8:37
  back to when I was a child, I just loved books.
• 8:41
  I loved writing stories. I loved hearing people
• 8:44
  tell me stories. And as I got older, I was encouraged
• 8:48
  by a lot of people in my life to pursue that
• 8:51
  love for storytelling. So from teachers in high
• 8:55
  school who told me about careers in journalism,
• 8:58
  who on their own thought that would be a great
• 9:01
  fit for me, I found things I could volunteer
• 9:04
  to do to become a better storyteller. And eventually,
• 9:09
  once I got to university, I started writing for
• 9:11
  the school paper. I volunteered for the local
• 9:14
  TV station. and eventually ended up doing graduate
• 9:18
  studies in journalism. But once I got out, it
• 9:22
  was very challenging to actually find a job.
• 9:25
  So people told me, why don't you give communications
• 9:27
  a chance? So I did. And I really enjoyed working
• 9:30
  in communications. I had an amazing job that
• 9:33
  I loved at the University of Waterloo. I worked
• 9:36
  for a few very large corporations, met some really
• 9:40
  interesting people along the way. And I still
• 9:43
  wanted to keep writing just for fun. So I would
• 9:48
  pitch stories to editors and see if they would
• 9:51
  give me the opportunity to write. And I actually
• 9:54
  managed to build a fairly solid writing portfolio
• 9:58
  and eventually started writing for CBC. And by
• 10:03
  that point, I had enough of a writing portfolio
• 10:07
  to really look at full -time jobs in journalism
• 10:10
  again. I decided to just give it a shot and one
• 10:16
  did actually line up and that was at CTV News
• 10:18
  Channel and I did that for about two years and
• 10:22
  really just loved it. Loved chasing stories and
• 10:26
  working on very, very tight deadlines and just
• 10:29
  knowing what was happening all the time. I think
• 10:32
  to work in news you really have to love the news
• 10:34
  and I always have. That was something when I
• 10:38
  became a journalist. I was in newspaper. I was
• 10:41
  in broadcast news. And I remember starting to
• 10:46
  be sent out on different, first I was sent on
• 10:49
  more lifestyle stories. And then to see your
• 10:52
  name in print with a byline was amazing. And
• 10:56
  then I became sort of the journalist that was
• 10:59
  sent out for. town meeting and finance committee
• 11:03
  meetings and school board meetings and so then
• 11:06
  I really got to understand how government worked.
• 11:09
  Were there stories that were your least favorite
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  ones that you had to do? Well when I was doing
• 11:15
  mostly freelance writing I got to pitch the stories
• 11:19
  so I really got to write about whatever I was
• 11:21
  interested in. So not really, there weren't stories
• 11:24
  that I didn't like writing about. When I was
• 11:27
  working at CTV News Channel and I had assignments,
• 11:31
  there wasn't really too much I didn't enjoy focusing
• 11:34
  on because like I said, I just love the news.
• 11:36
  I love knowing what's happening and learning
• 11:39
  about different people's experiences and getting
• 11:41
  to write every day for work was incredible. So
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  I think... It's really incredible to be able
• 11:50
  to say you're doing the job that you love doing
• 11:52
  and that isn't to say I didn't love Communications,
• 11:55
  you know who knows where the future leads. There
• 11:57
  might be a time where I find an incredible communications
• 12:00
  role and I end up going back But right now I
• 12:03
  think I'm very fortunate to be doing a job that
• 12:06
  I've been interested in basically my whole life
• 12:09
  Mm -hmm. Yeah what you went to school for you
• 12:12
  get to do. Yeah, exactly. So that's nice. Mm
• 12:15
  -hmm So you just mentioned that throughout your
• 12:17
  career you pitched many of your own story ideas,
• 12:20
  which is the interesting part of storytelling.
• 12:22
  Sometimes before the research, before the interviews,
• 12:25
  before the writing, understanding and knowing
• 12:28
  there's a story here, or there's something here
• 12:30
  to write, and it can come from maybe a conversation
• 12:33
  or something you saw or an experience, where
• 12:35
  you're sitting now. Where do story ideas tend
• 12:40
  to come from for you, and what makes you think
• 12:43
  there's a story here? I've always been a very
• 12:46
  curious person. I love meeting new people. I
• 12:50
  love having new experiences. I love just exploring
• 12:53
  the city or even traveling and just learning
• 12:56
  as much as possible. And I think stories just
• 12:58
  come from exposing yourself to different things
• 13:01
  and different people. If you're doing the same
• 13:04
  thing every day, you probably won't get as many
• 13:06
  story ideas. So my story ideas tend to come from
• 13:11
  the people that I meet. or something that I experience
• 13:15
  in the city or outside of the city, and I just
• 13:18
  think this might be something that someone else
• 13:22
  has experienced, and there could be a common
• 13:24
  thread here that I could write about. And usually,
• 13:29
  I'll develop that into a pitch and send it to
• 13:32
  an editor, and they'll let me know if they're
• 13:33
  open to it or if they're not. But that's really
• 13:37
  what I would say. It just comes from putting
• 13:39
  yourself out there and... having as many experiences
• 13:43
  as you can. You must have quite a long list of
• 13:48
  editors that you've built relationships with
• 13:50
  over the years, because you saying you're pitching.
• 13:54
  Sort of. I would say, well I started pitching
• 13:58
  when I was still a student, so that was a long
• 14:00
  time ago, so editors have changed over the years.
• 14:04
  For the places that I write for frequently, I
• 14:07
  do have good relationships with the editors and
• 14:09
  you really have to earn that by proving that
• 14:11
  you're reliable and that you're delivering copy
• 14:15
  that doesn't require too many changes, that you're
• 14:17
  doing your own fact checking, things like that.
• 14:20
  With a lot of the publications I've written for,
• 14:22
  I've pitched them and gotten one article and
• 14:26
  then I write that article and then I move on
• 14:27
  to something else. It's not necessarily something
• 14:30
  that is ongoing. So I would say I know some editors
• 14:34
  very well and some I've only really worked with
• 14:37
  once and then moved on. How was it for you in
• 14:40
  communications? I know as a comms manager, having
• 14:43
  been on this side of the table as an editor and
• 14:46
  a journalist and then being on the other side
• 14:48
  of the table as the comms manager pitching to
• 14:50
  those editors, obviously relationships are really
• 14:53
  important and having the right pitch was really
• 14:56
  important, understanding what they found of.
• 14:59
  was interesting, was gonna determine what I was
• 15:02
  gonna pitch. What would you say to somebody who
• 15:06
  is starting out in communications and is trying
• 15:09
  to build those relationships? What would you
• 15:12
  say to them? What's important in a pitch? Yeah,
• 15:15
  so I think the first thing I would say is actually,
• 15:17
  When I was working in communications, one thing
• 15:20
  that really benefited me is that I was genuinely
• 15:24
  interested in journalism and what journalists
• 15:27
  encounter on a day -to -day basis. So when I
• 15:31
  interacted with journalists, I would... just
• 15:33
  naturally ask a lot of questions and want to
• 15:35
  know what they were working on and what their
• 15:37
  story was and how I could support them and what
• 15:41
  they were doing. So I ended up getting a lot
• 15:44
  of insight just because I was genuinely interested.
• 15:48
  And I think... You do much better in communications
• 15:52
  if you approach journalists with genuine curiosity
• 15:55
  when you have the opportunity to do so. You don't
• 15:57
  always have the opportunity to do so. Sometimes
• 16:00
  you're just calling media outlets or emailing
• 16:03
  journalists. But it really helps to get that
• 16:07
  understanding of how journalists operate and
• 16:09
  how newsrooms operate. So if you don't have the
• 16:12
  chance to go to an event and meet journalists,
• 16:15
  then learning about where they come from just
• 16:18
  by looking at their LinkedIn profiles or even
• 16:20
  reading some of their earlier articles to understand
• 16:23
  how they write and what kind of topics they like
• 16:25
  to cover. So we were just talking about curiosity
• 16:29
  and as journalists we're trained to ask questions.
• 16:33
  But as you know there's a difference between
• 16:35
  asking questions and demonstrating genuine curiosity
• 16:38
  when you're talking with someone. So you've interviewed
• 16:41
  an extraordinary amount of people. range of people
• 16:44
  through your career, from noble laureates and
• 16:46
  political figures to community leaders, and people
• 16:49
  just simply living through experiences worth
• 16:52
  understanding. So we talked about curiosity from
• 16:56
  the standpoint of you pitching and you talking
• 16:59
  to another journalist. But as a journalist and
• 17:03
  storyteller, has it changed the way that you
• 17:07
  listen to the people that you're getting stories
• 17:09
  from? So I think when I interview people, I try
• 17:14
  to be as open -minded as possible. So that means
• 17:18
  listening to whatever story they have to tell
• 17:20
  me without any kind of judgment, asking stories
• 17:24
  based on what I'm hearing, not necessarily coming
• 17:27
  with a list of questions and just sticking to
• 17:29
  that list. I think people respond really well
• 17:33
  and open up to you a lot more when they feel
• 17:35
  like you're genuinely listening to them. And
• 17:39
  I think that applies even to people who are public
• 17:42
  figures. I know that when I've interviewed politicians,
• 17:45
  for example, or entertainers, you want to know
• 17:48
  as much about them beforehand, because then you
• 17:52
  can ask the right questions, things aren't necessarily
• 17:55
  surface level, and they actually stop and pay
• 17:59
  more attention to you if they know that you've
• 18:01
  really done your research. When you have done
• 18:05
  stories, sort of on your everyday person. Did
• 18:13
  you find that, and you know how to ask the right
• 18:15
  questions, but I'm imagining that even them,
• 18:19
  they're not high profile people, they're just
• 18:21
  everyday people. Have you felt like that connection
• 18:24
  with them when you've interviewed them? Yeah,
• 18:26
  I think I've always believed that everyone has
• 18:30
  something interesting to share. A lot of the
• 18:33
  people I've worked with in journalism and even
• 18:35
  some people in communications, they believe that
• 18:38
  saying everyone has a story. And I think you
• 18:42
  really just have to sit with people and give
• 18:44
  them your time and try to learn about them. And
• 18:48
  you'll find something interesting that you can
• 18:50
  write about or talk about on television. Whether
• 18:54
  it's a story from their childhood, something
• 18:56
  that gave them a new path. People love talking
• 18:59
  about their experiences with relationships. There's
• 19:03
  always something interesting that you can find
• 19:04
  if you sit and genuinely listen. build on that
• 19:08
  conversation. When I was an owner -publisher
• 19:12
  of a town -wide magazine, I had gone to so many
• 19:17
  events. You're always covering events. And there
• 19:20
  was always a lot of awards events. And there
• 19:22
  was a lot of awards events for all of the high
• 19:25
  -profile people in government and in the town.
• 19:28
  And I just remember one day, kind of being an
• 19:32
  everyday person in the town, I thought, you know,
• 19:35
  people who are just everyday people should also
• 19:38
  get recognized as well and so we had put together
• 19:43
  a starfish award and we had rented out the town
• 19:48
  hall and we just went around and invited people
• 19:51
  who were just everyday people. So we invited
• 19:55
  the man who was living in the halfway house,
• 19:59
  who every day would don a construction jacket,
• 20:02
  and he would just walk up the street and pick
• 20:04
  up trash and put it in a bag. Every day, he would
• 20:07
  just walk along the street. And when I asked
• 20:09
  him, when I saw him, and I said, what are you
• 20:10
  doing? And he said, well, there's trash on the
• 20:12
  street. And I said, why are you picking it up?
• 20:14
  He said, well, if somebody's on a bicycle or
• 20:16
  a motorcycle, they'll hit it and they'll fall
• 20:17
  off. and that was his reason for doing that every
• 20:20
  day. It gave him purpose. There was a group that
• 20:24
  were leading a small team of differently abled
• 20:28
  children who couldn't be in the regular sort
• 20:31
  of little league team, and so they ran a little
• 20:36
  league team for them. And so they got to play
• 20:39
  the sport that they loved as well. And it was
• 20:41
  just people like that. It was just everyday people
• 20:43
  that were just making a difference quietly. Just
• 20:46
  making a difference one at a time. Yeah, one
• 20:49
  really great example I always think of when people
• 20:52
  talk about just getting to know regular people
• 20:55
  and learning their stories is the whole Humans
• 20:57
  of New York series. I've been following that
• 21:00
  for years and I think the... person who started
• 21:04
  that did such a great job of just talking to
• 21:07
  people and learning seemingly ordinary things
• 21:10
  about them and just transforming it into this
• 21:12
  really compelling story. So I think that website
• 21:16
  and that book is a great example of how you don't
• 21:19
  have to be a public figure to really have something
• 21:21
  interesting to talk about. Yep. And I think readers,
• 21:26
  everyday readers are going to connect with that.
• 21:28
  Everyday people watching the news connect with
• 21:31
  those. Human interest stories, I think. Definitely.
• 21:36
  We're talking a little bit about some stories
• 21:38
  that we remember and that, you know, have stayed
• 21:40
  with us. And I think as journalists, sometimes
• 21:45
  you have to get the story. You're just out there
• 21:47
  to get the story. You have to get the news. And
• 21:50
  people think journalists getting the news. But
• 21:53
  sometimes the journalist is the person that's
• 21:55
  spending time with somebody who's going through
• 21:57
  something. And you're a person too. You can't
• 22:02
  show it in your story that you write, but it
• 22:04
  can have an impact on you. So I guess my question
• 22:07
  is, has there been a person or a story that you've
• 22:10
  covered that has really stayed with you or has
• 22:12
  really changed the way you think about something
• 22:15
  other than the spooky lighthouse? But really
• 22:18
  stayed with you well after an assignment is over.
• 22:21
  Yeah, definitely. I was really moved by a lot
• 22:24
  of the wildfire stories that I heard while working
• 22:28
  at CTV. Just hearing people talk about how they've
• 22:32
  lost everything and had to leave their homes.
• 22:34
  I can't even imagine being in that kind of situation.
• 22:37
  And I was really moved by how incredibly strong
• 22:40
  everyone was and how determined everyone seemed
• 22:44
  to be to pick up the pieces of their lives and
• 22:47
  move forward. And I found it really moving. A
• 22:51
  lot of it was very sad, but it was also very
• 22:54
  inspiring. And I still think about some of those
• 22:57
  people and hope they're doing well. When you
• 23:01
  have had to cover the news, have you covered
• 23:05
  other fire stories where people have lost? Other
• 23:10
  than the wildfires, because I mostly focused
• 23:13
  on national news, I didn't really cover too many
• 23:16
  other fire stories. But with the wildfires, like
• 23:21
  I said, hearing from people who had lost everything,
• 23:24
  who had to leave their homes, some of those people
• 23:26
  had children with them, some of them had pets.
• 23:30
  There were a lot of really, really moving, compelling
• 23:34
  stories, and I found myself feeling sad, but
• 23:38
  also very inspired. I earlier asked you if there
• 23:42
  was a type of story that you didn't particularly
• 23:44
  like when I was in the newsroom. I hated fire
• 23:47
  stories and I hated having to go be the ambulance
• 23:52
  chaser, the fire truck chaser and get there and
• 23:55
  watch these people sitting outside their home
• 23:57
  while everything they have is being destroyed
• 23:59
  and having to go and get the story. But one of
• 24:03
  the things that I learned was asking the question,
• 24:08
  will you rebuild again? And for a moment, I found
• 24:12
  people would say, yes, we're going to rebuild
• 24:15
  again. And that was an inspiring moment and a
• 24:18
  moment of just tragedy, really. Yeah, I was really
• 24:22
  struck by, like I said, how strong everyone seemed
• 24:24
  to be after the wildfires. Everyone had just
• 24:28
  this determination to move forward. And even
• 24:32
  if they had no home to go back to, to find another
• 24:35
  home and just get on with their lives, I didn't
• 24:38
  actually talk to anyone who felt like everything
• 24:41
  had fallen apart and they didn't know how they
• 24:44
  were going to rebuild. Yeah, it's amazing. The
• 24:48
  human spirit is so resilient. Yeah, exactly.
• 24:53
  We've talked about being on both sides of the
• 24:55
  table, being the journalist and the editor, being
• 25:00
  the communications professional. And you made
• 25:04
  a distinction that I thought was important. In
• 25:05
  communications, you pointed out, you're representing.
• 25:09
  an organization, in journalism, you're not representing
• 25:12
  anyone. Your responsibility is the facts, the
• 25:15
  sourcing, the story. And at CTV, that's working
• 25:19
  under rigorous editorial standards, tight deadlines,
• 25:24
  some real pressure. So having worked in both,
• 25:30
  is there, outside of anything we may have already
• 25:32
  talked about, is there something, anything else
• 25:33
  that you can talk about? What have those two
• 25:35
  worlds taught you about storytelling? I think,
• 25:40
  first of all, CTV has very high standards. I
• 25:43
  was always very proud of myself when I managed
• 25:45
  to get a story out. And there's a lot of journalists
• 25:48
  I've looked up to for years that work for CTV.
• 25:50
  So it was just surreal seeing them and being
• 25:54
  anywhere close to them. But I think in terms
• 25:57
  of what I've learned about storytelling, I think
• 26:01
  you really have to make sure you get the story
• 26:04
  right. You want to be accurate. You want people
• 26:07
  to... believe that you're accurately sharing
• 26:10
  their experiences. I mean, you're talking about
• 26:13
  someone's life or someone's job or something
• 26:15
  that's very meaningful to someone. And also just
• 26:20
  making sure that you're getting the facts right
• 26:23
  for the audience because you want to build credibility,
• 26:26
  not just with the people who are sharing their
• 26:29
  stories with you, but also with the people who
• 26:30
  are reading what you're writing. trying to learn
• 26:33
  from it and trying to inform themselves. So I
• 26:36
  think just a commitment to accuracy is really
• 26:39
  something that I think is just fundamental to
• 26:43
  good journalism. So let's pivot away from journalism
• 26:46
  a little bit and let's talk about this organization
• 26:49
  that you're on the board of directors with, Storytelling
• 26:52
  Toronto. When we got to talking about it, you...
• 26:55
  got really excited about it. So you're serving
• 26:58
  on the board of directors and you talked about
• 27:01
  Storytelling Toronto as an organization where
• 27:03
  it gives people an opportunity not just to be
• 27:07
  story listeners and consume stories, but they
• 27:09
  can actually participate and they can tell stories
• 27:11
  as well. Somebody can go to an event, they can
• 27:14
  take a class, they can meet other storytellers
• 27:17
  and they can even discover, do I have a story
• 27:20
  worth? worth sharing. So I recently joined Storytelling
• 27:25
  Toronto a few months ago. I've been to a few
• 27:27
  events. Wonderful, just wonderful people in the
• 27:31
  audience who are the story listeners and wonderful
• 27:33
  people at the mic and tell their stories. So
• 27:36
  I know that there's some wonderful examples of
• 27:38
  some of their great storytelling that's coming
• 27:40
  up. Storytelling Toronto has story pillars, and
• 27:44
  they have their fall series coming up. So I was
• 27:47
  online and I was checking it out. So it looks
• 27:49
  like on October 24th, there's a double feature
• 27:52
  with one of my favorite storytellers, Keisha
• 27:54
  Christie. So she's gonna tell stories we carry,
• 27:57
  which draw on the Caribbean storytelling traditions,
• 28:00
  which I've heard some of her other story, her
• 28:01
  Caribbean storytelling. Some personal narratives
• 28:04
  and community building alongside Yugoma, an African
• 28:08
  folktale presented through storytelling music
• 28:10
  and dance. And then on November 21st, I know
• 28:15
  there's, I believe there's a book that was put
• 28:18
  together called Letters to Your Ex, which is
• 28:20
  bringing stories of love and loss to the stage.
• 28:23
  And it's expanding on a collection of 139 letters
• 28:27
  from contributors in 41 countries. I thought
• 28:29
  that was fascinating. And then. December 12th,
• 28:33
  which I love this, this warms my heart, the Food
• 28:36
  and Warmth Holiday Fundraiser is going to bring
• 28:38
  local storytellers together. They're going to
• 28:40
  tell festive stories and hopefully raise some
• 28:44
  funds to support Toronto charities. So those
• 28:47
  are three very different storytelling experiences,
• 28:51
  but they demonstrate the many ways that stories
• 28:54
  can bring people together in a shared space.
• 28:58
  So you work. in storytelling. What drew you to
• 29:03
  Storytelling Toronto? I don't know if you are
• 29:06
  an oral storyteller and you tell stories that
• 29:08
  way. And what do you think happens when we create
• 29:10
  spaces where people can come together not just
• 29:13
  to hear them, but to share them? Yeah, so I am
• 29:16
  not an oral storyteller, but I do love hearing
• 29:20
  stories and the people at Storytelling Toronto...
• 29:24
  have really fantastic oral storytelling skills.
• 29:28
  I know some of them have been involved with the
• 29:30
  organization for many, many years, and they've
• 29:34
  taken classes to get better at oral storytelling,
• 29:36
  and some of them actually perform live on stage.
• 29:40
  So... The story pillars that you just mentioned,
• 29:44
  I would definitely encourage anyone who also
• 29:47
  just loves hearing stories or even has an interest
• 29:50
  in other cultures to really go and get to know
• 29:54
  some of the people. The crowd with Storytelling
• 29:57
  Toronto is very diverse. People of all ages,
• 30:01
  there's people from different countries and there's
• 30:03
  so much that you can really learn. and so many
• 30:07
  new interesting things that you can expose yourself
• 30:09
  to. Letters to your ex, I think, will be great.
• 30:13
  Anyone who's still dating, there's definitely
• 30:15
  something that you'll be able to relate to. With
• 30:18
  the October 24th double feature, like I said,
• 30:22
  it's such a diverse crowd at Storytelling Toronto,
• 30:24
  and some of the stories people have from different
• 30:27
  cultures, they talk about their different traditions.
• 30:30
  It's really interesting, and it really helps
• 30:33
  you understand people that you might... know
• 30:35
  better if they're from those cultures and also
• 30:38
  I think Toronto in general just being such a
• 30:41
  diverse city there's someone that you could always
• 30:44
  meet who is a part of that culture and it's always
• 30:47
  fun to be able to say you know I know something
• 30:49
  about this and surprise someone in a good way
• 30:52
  yeah yeah yeah how long have you been on the
• 30:55
  board of directors So I've been on the board
• 30:56
  of directors for two years. I decided to join
• 31:00
  after I saw an ad on social media actually talking
• 31:04
  about the storytelling festival which happened
• 31:07
  earlier this year. It's an incredible event that
• 31:11
  happens over a period of days and people can
• 31:14
  hear storytellers from all over the world and
• 31:18
  also meet some very interesting people from all
• 31:21
  over the world. But after I saw that ad, I decided
• 31:24
  to look a bit more into the organization. And
• 31:28
  I found they had this opportunity to join the
• 31:30
  board and really take on more of a leadership
• 31:33
  role. And I thought, well, this sounds perfect
• 31:37
  for someone like me. So I applied for it and
• 31:40
  got elected. And yeah, it's been a part of my
• 31:43
  life since then. Now, what do you do as being
• 31:46
  on the board? Yeah, so being on the board, you
• 31:49
  talk about how to reach different people with
• 31:52
  these events. Are there any groups that we should
• 31:56
  reach out to who might find what we do interesting?
• 32:00
  Also getting different generations connected.
• 32:03
  I think storytelling is one of the ways people
• 32:05
  really connect despite there being an age difference.
• 32:09
  You know, parents love sharing stories with their
• 32:11
  kids. And even the older generation, sometimes,
• 32:15
  I used to love when I was a kid listening to
• 32:17
  my grandfather's stories, for example. So I think
• 32:19
  it's definitely a really effective way for different
• 32:22
  generations to connect. And with Storytelling
• 32:25
  Toronto, there's so many different age groups
• 32:28
  involved. So it's a great way to learn from people
• 32:31
  in all different stages of life. My first Storytelling
• 32:38
  Toronto event was the festival. It was actually
• 32:41
  over Mother's Day. I went on Mother's Day. It
• 32:43
  was my Mother's Day gift to get to go. And it
• 32:47
  was in our church, too. So we knew exactly where
• 32:50
  it was. And you talk about the variety. It was
• 32:54
  just so many different types of stories from
• 32:58
  just all over the world. Somebody was telling
• 33:01
  stories, I think, about Ireland. Somebody was
• 33:03
  telling stories about the Caribbean. Someone
• 33:06
  was telling stories from India. It's fascinating.
• 33:10
  Yeah. And I think one thing I really love about
• 33:12
  storytelling Toronto is that these people who
• 33:14
  get on stage and tell you stories, a lot of them
• 33:17
  have really unique day jobs that you wouldn't
• 33:21
  necessarily assume that they're storytellers.
• 33:23
  Some people are lawyers. Some people are dentists.
• 33:27
  Some people are, you know, very corporate and
• 33:31
  they've been in the corporate world for decades.
• 33:33
  Right. And then in the evening they're out there
• 33:35
  telling stories. So it brings a lot of different
• 33:38
  people together and it's a great creative outlet.
• 33:42
  Yeah, no, it was a lot of fun. Where should folks
• 33:48
  go to learn about storytelling in Toronto? You
• 33:51
  should go to the Storytelling Toronto website.
• 33:54
  There is also an Instagram account that is updated
• 33:57
  all the time. And if you're on LinkedIn, there
• 34:00
  is a LinkedIn page as well. Oh, OK. So it's lots
• 34:03
  of places where you can find them. Yeah, very
• 34:04
  active on social media. And the website is updated
• 34:07
  all the time. Perfect. Perfect. Great experience.
• 34:12
  Yeah. Well Jackie, that's all the time we have
• 34:15
  for today. Thank you so much for your story and
• 34:18
  for being here with us. I just I love talking
• 34:20
  about storytelling and curiosity and connection,
• 34:23
  finding stories in places where maybe we wouldn't
• 34:26
  otherwise. But I love the reminder that storytelling
• 34:29
  doesn't just belong to journalists or writers.
• 34:32
  Sometimes it's a person standing in front of
• 34:34
  an audience talking about you know, Caribbean
• 34:37
  folklore, or sharing experiences of love and
• 34:40
  loss, or a group of local storytellers trying
• 34:44
  to make a difference in their community. So the
• 34:48
  formats may change, but what lies underneath
• 34:50
  is we are telling stories, hearing one another,
• 34:52
  and making that connection. So thank you so much
• 34:55
  for the work that you do and the stories that
• 34:57
  you tell out there. Yeah, thank you so much,
• 35:00
  Liana. It's been very nice talking with you.
• 35:02
  Thank you. And to our listeners. Whether you've
• 35:07
  first heard us locally through BTV studios in
• 35:10
  Bedford, Massachusetts or you're tuning in from
• 35:12
  across the globe on Spotify, Apple podcasts or
• 35:15
  Amazon podcasts. Thank you for listening. We
• 35:19
  hope you enjoyed this episode and we'll see you
• 35:21
  next time. Happy storytelling.