Latest / Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast / MBA Wire Taps 484: Wharton versus Tuck. Kellogg versus Wharton. Johnson versus Stern

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MBA Wire Taps 484: Wharton versus Tuck. Kellogg versus Wharton. Johnson versus Stern · Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker A: Foreign. Welcome to the Clear Admit MBA Admissions Podcast. I'm Graham Richmond and this is your Wiretaps for Monday, April 6, 2026. I'm joined by Alex Brown from Cornwall, England. Alex, how are things?
• 0:28
  Speaker B: Very good, thank you.
• 0:29
  Speaker A: Graham, you had some vacations. Are you rested and ready to get back back to business here?
• 0:35
  Speaker B: Yes. No, really nice few days in Malaga. Yes.
• 0:39
  Speaker A: Awesome.
• 0:39
  Speaker B: Recommend it.
• 0:40
  Speaker A: Yeah. Probably better weather than in Cornwall at the moment.
• 0:44
  Speaker B: Yeah, it was actually nice sunny day today. But the reason why we go that time of year is it's the end of winter. Get back from Malaga, it should be spring.
• 0:53
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 0:53
  Speaker B: So very good.
• 0:54
  Speaker A: Yeah, that's perfect. Yeah. So this week we've got a great show. We've got some real human alums out there in the workforce at places like bcg, Bain and Amazon. A couple of important admissions tips that are timely given we're in kind of decision season and you've picked out three real applicants to talk about who are all facing rather tantalizing decisions between different top schools and scholarships. So we're going to get into that. But. But first, is there anything left in terms of decisions? Alex, I know last week was a big week because we had Stanford, Wharton, all these top schools giving out decisions. Mit. Right. But is there anything left this week? What's going on?
• 1:35
  Speaker B: A couple of decisions. Like you say, last week was a really huge week for decisions. And it's part of what we call decision weeks for round two, the last several weeks. So we've moved out of that now. But there are still a few, well, three programs scheduled to release decisions next week. Fuqua cox and Arizona McCarry. And we're also, as we said last couple of episodes we've moved into that round three or the next rounds admissions deadline. So upcoming. Is Sloan, Stanford and Anderson okay this week? So yeah, we're. We're definitely transitioning out to round three. But as you point out pointed out now lots of folks in round two have decisions to make, which is, I think it's a really interesting time of the season.
• 2:24
  Speaker A: Yeah, the shoe is suddenly on the other foot. The candidates hold all the power if they have multiple offers. I want to ask you a question, though. So given what we know about application volume this year and kind of international volumes down a bit, et cetera, what would you say to someone who's been listening to the show and thinking about applying and assuming that they were going to apply next year about a kind of round three application, like taking a flyer on a school or two, you know, there's still Some deadlines to come, as you point out. Is this a year where maybe the door's still open to get into some of these top schools late in the game?
• 3:00
  Speaker B: Yeah, I would think so. Especially if they're slightly sort of more non traditional in terms of their profile. But you know, there are a couple of different folks that fall into this bucket. It's those that were planning to apply next season but have sort of, you know, they already have their test scores and, and in place in that they might want to throw in a flyer round three this season. But also those that have decisions in hand may decide, you know what, I might take a flyer just in, in the next tier above.
• 3:34
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 3:35
  Speaker B: Just to see if, if I can strengthen my overall set of opportunities. So. So yeah, anytime that there's a potential drop in application volume, I don't know if that's absolutely the case across the board, but I think there is some sentiment that on the side there has been a drop because of all the ridiculousness that's going on in the geopolitical climate that we. The headwinds. The geopolitical climate are definitely not good for MBA admissions at this point at top US Schools. So one would presume that's had an impact. So. So yeah, I would say, as we typically state, Round three is very, very challenging for lots of reasons, but this might be more opportunity.
• 4:24
  Speaker A: Yeah, I agree with you. It's a very strange time in terms of app volume for US programs, but also some of these programs, some of the schools around the world that have programs in the Middle east, it's a challenging time for them as well.
• 4:39
  Speaker B: Well, Stern has closed its Abu Dhabi campus.
• 4:41
  Speaker A: Yeah, I saw that in the New York Times. Yeah. So, I mean, I think that's temporarily, but it's.
• 4:46
  Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, no, for sure. But I mean, this is. These are really troubling times.
• 4:50
  Speaker A: So.
• 4:51
  Speaker B: And yeah, I mean, I hate to get political, but I will cease this conversation now because nobody needs to know my points of view.
• 5:03
  Speaker A: Well, yeah, the only thing I will say is, what's interesting is that there could be opportunity in the chaos. Right. So lower application volume, as we said, maybe means opportunity around three upgrade or just get in a year earlier and get started. And the other thing I want to always remind our listeners is that if you apply now to business school, you're still not starting till the fall, or if you're applying next fall, it's the first fall after. It takes a couple years often to do the degree. By the time you're back out in the workforce, there will be a different president in the United States. There could be all kinds of things that would change in the interim. So very hard to predict this stuff. But sometimes the people who apply in times of recession or failures in financial markets are often the ones who emerge into an uptick in the economy and have the best experience post mba. So anyway, just something to consider. We continue to run our survey of applicants. If you listen to the show, just consider it like as a huge favor to us to go and take this survey. The survey can be found@bitlysurveymba26. And what we're asking is questions about how do you decide what programs you consider and even if you already have offers, how do you determine where to start and which program to go to? And there's a lot of fun questions in there too, even about reputation of programs and what sort of changes your opinion about programs when you hear news, et cetera. So check it out. It's like a five minute survey and it's the kind of thing that really helps us to better understand the candidate pool and schools to better understand the candidate pool too. So definitely check it out.
• 6:42
  Speaker B: Very good.
• 6:43
  Speaker A: And then we have some events coming up. As I've been mentioning. In May we have our affair in Atlanta. I'm really excited. In the last few days, the final schools have come on board. So I mean, it is an all star cast. It's literally the top 25 MBA programs in the United States. I heard recently from NYU and Columbia. They came on board for some reason. The New York scores were. The New York schools were the last ones to sign on, but they're coming too. So we have an amazing group. We've got the entire M7 coming again, all the top schools. It should be a blast. I'm working on the panels right now in terms of which admissions deans are going to speak and we're going to do a careers panel. I've got somebody from Bain probably who's going to come by. So yeah, lots of fun organizing that. It's on May 11th. It's a Monday night in Atlanta and probably worth a visit to Atlanta if you can swing it to come. It should be a really great and efficient evening for connecting with lots of schools at once.
• 7:37
  Speaker B: It has to be the only MBA admissions event that includes all the top schools, is that correct?
• 7:44
  Speaker A: I believe you're correct. Yeah. I've not seen any other. Yeah, yeah. And then if for some reason you can't, you know, come to Atlanta, May 19, 20th, 26th and 27, we're going to do some virtual events. It's our kind of series that kicks off the new admissions cycle. Those are always at noon Eastern. I think we have 18 or 20 schools taking part in that, including Berkeley, Wharton, Chicago, some other top programs. So that should be fun. Those are more application overview events where I kind of interview admissions directors and we talk through the basics of an MBA application. So yeah, a lot's going on in May. In the meantime, it's April. And because it's now April, we've run our monthly post about what in person events all the top schools are hosting this month. And I love looking at this just because I'm always curious, when are they out on the road? And April's kind of a quiet month because they're finishing the current cycle and they're not yet fully out looking for prospects for the next season. But I just had some fun scrolling through and I went down the list and I saw LBS is in Tokyo, Japan on April 10 and they have this evening event. It's like meet members of the LBS recruitment and admissions team as well as alumni at the Palace Hotel, Tokyo for networking and an information session. It's from 6:30 to 9:00pm I was like, wow, that must be if I was in Tokyo. That sounds like a great way to go have a few drinks or something and hang out in a nice hotel with a bunch of LBS people. So anyway, this is just one example, but every school's out and about and I love that we assembled this list. It must take Christina a lot of time to put this together every month, but it's a lot of fun.
• 9:23
  Speaker B: But also not forgetting that most of the admissions folks are preoccupied by hosting their own welcome events for those they've just admitted in round two.
• 9:33
  Speaker A: Yeah, there's a lot of that happening too. So, yeah, so in any event, so lots going on. We did run a couple of admissions tips on the site as well and both very timely. One is can I negotiate a scholarship for business school? There's a real art to this and we have a great article that breaks down what schools do and do not negotiate. Also how you can negotiate because sometimes we see some funny stuff on Decision Wire where someone's like, I have an offer from a school that's, let's say a top 30 school, but I don't have much money from this M7 school and it's sort of like, well, they're not going to be able to really negotiate much in that instance. Right. So there's a lot of different levers that are in play. So anyway, Read our tip and you'll learn more. And the other one that we ran is about reapplying to business school. So obviously there's some people, hopefully not many, but those tuned in who maybe didn't get in to programs that they want to attend. And so they're maybe thinking about reapplication. So we have a whole kind of piece on how that process works. Very important. You know, schools are open to it, but you got to go through the reapplication process in the right way. And I want to ask you, Alex, just give me one tip for reapplicant. I mean, you read many files at Wharton where people were reapplying and you're not biased against them. But were there things that some reapplicants did. Did that really were great versus things that some didn't do?
• 10:57
  Speaker B: I mean, at the time that I was at Wharton, we gave feedback to candidates after their admissions decision. Unfortunately, I don't think Wharton does that anymore. At least during my time there, they stopped doing it. But if a school provides you feedback and you don't take that feedback on board, then that's a no. Yeah, yeah, I would. I would leave it at that. I mean, obviously there are. Even if the school doesn't provide you feedback, there's a way to do some self reflection, get some other folks to help you figure out what the issues are. But you then have six months or, you know, a good amount of time to potentially identify and fix those potential weaknesses and so forth. And the other thing that I would suggest is really try to target the first round.
• 11:52
  Speaker A: Yeah, agreed.
• 11:53
  Speaker B: Even if you applied in round three and got denied, apply in round one as a re applicant. Because the lot of sentiment is, well, I only applied three months ago. Maybe I've got. I should wait till round two and further develop my goals, professional career and so forth. And I think you can run into a little bit of trouble by doing that. Round one one is the preferred round for all reapplicants in my book.
• 12:15
  Speaker A: Yeah, I totally hear you loud and clear. And I've had more than one admission director say to me, yeah, this person was reapplicant. We kind of wondered why they waited for the second round to apply. So there are some instances where if it's a lack of experience or you might say that if you have some unique opportunity that you really want to write about, but I think it's pretty rare because you could still write about what you're going to be doing. So in any event, the last thing
• 12:41
  Speaker B: I want to signal Value when you apply in round two, it's like you're telling the outcome. Well, I didn't get into my real, real reach schools in round one, so I'm coming back to you to see if you can give me a spot. So it's just not a good, not a good look.
• 12:56
  Speaker A: Yeah. Last thing I want to mention before we get into our candidates for this week is we have some real humans alum profiles that we've done. So I want to start with Sarah. She's a graduate from Indiana. Kelly graduated just recently in 25 and she's currently a consultant at BCG, also known as the Boston Consulting Group. She's 31 from Casablanca in Morocco and she studied there as an engineer and then also completed a master's in industrial engineering. And so before she went to business school she'd had a few different roles, most notably some time at Salesforce in sort of tech consulting. But she also worked as a marketing business analyst for Shell Morocco and did you know. So she had that sort of oil and gas experience with Shell combined with some Salesforce experience and now she's obviously working at BCG and we asked her why did you choose to go to business school? And she said I am one of the career switcher MBA pursuers. I graduated in 2017 as an engineer and and have had my fair share of experience in both oil and gas and tech working in technical, delivery and implementation roles. Those experiences taught me a lot. But over time I became increasingly drawn to the bigger picture. I wanted to move beyond execution and engage with problems from a strategic enterprise wide perspective. I wanted to move closer to strategic topics to help organizations solve complex problems and identify where to win and how to win. The MBA felt like the natural bridge to transition into strategy and more decision oriented work across both companies and public sector initiatives. So I think that's a really, I mean, well said. Right. This is a classic case of an engineer kind of more technical kind of role heading into strategy and needing an MBA to make that pivot.
• 14:50
  Speaker B: Yeah, I think it's absolutely fantastic and it's a really strong reason for pursuing an mba. And I do actually love the combination of a technical undergrad engineering experience, going off and working in sort of highly technical roles and then moving to the MBA for that strategy layer and insight and so forth. And she's obviously done very well and landed on her feet. Yeah, totally getting to an MBB consulting firm and I presume in the United States, but I don't know that. But still this is a really, really good move. On their part.
• 15:30
  Speaker A: Yeah, definitely. And the last thing, because she was giving such great, had some great things to say. I pulled another quote. I mean we asked her if she had any advice that she wished she'd been given during her mba and she said some factors will always be outside your control. The job market can shift, timelines differ, have a clear goal, but build flexibility into your plans early by preparing a fallback option. In other words, have a plan but expect life to edit it. So I thought that was good too.
• 15:57
  Speaker B: I like that. Yeah, yeah.
• 15:59
  Speaker A: Even though I mean sounds BCG is probably a plan A for most people. But yeah, she obviously just good advice. Another person we caught up with is this woman named Haley who went to Cambridge Judge and graduated back in 24 and has now been working in consulting at Bain and Company. She's 30, from Boston, Mass. Originally went to Little Shout out, went to Union College for undergrad and studied econ and basically before business school had been working at Bain. So econ major as an undergrad, goes off to Bain and ends up getting sponsored to go to business school and went to Cambridge. And I thought this was kind of interesting because here's someone from New England in the US working at Bain, presumably I think that was in the US as well. And then they land at Cambridge Judge, which is not a common path that we see. So I pulled the quote from why she chose Cambridge and here's what she said. Three major factors influenced my decision when choosing Cambridge Judge. First, I wanted to be part of a university, not just a business school. Cambridge Judge is a vibrant community in of itself. MBA students are also a real part of the University of Cambridge community, further expanding your brand and opportunities. The second was the diversity of the cohort. This was a huge draw. As someone who wants to have a global career, getting to build meaningful connections with students from around the globe was amazing and led students some great discussions and learnings. Lastly, the one year program made a lot of sense for me as a sponsored student. I wanted the full time MBA experience but did not want to step away from my career momentum for a full two years. So just interesting, a lot of factors here being sponsored, wanting a global career. Yeah. So what do you make of this?
• 17:47
  Speaker B: Well, I think she missed another big point. Cambridge is the capital of tech for the uk.
• 17:55
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 17:55
  Speaker B: So I would assume that the choice of Cambridge was somewhat influenced by that. I mean I don't know if that's a particular interest of theirs, but Cambridge is definitely our center of excellence in technology right now. And so I would assume that Might have influenced a little bit too. But yeah, I think what's interesting about this choice too is because they're a sponsored candidate, they have a bit more freedom, I would argue, in terms of their choice of school.
• 18:24
  Speaker A: Totally.
• 18:25
  Speaker B: Because, you know, as a non sponsored candidate who's, you know, obviously, you know, got plans to do, you know, figure out their career post mba. Our advice is always to try to do your MBA in the geography where you want to work post mba. Right, right. Whereas if you're sponsored and you know, you're going back to Bain, you, you can take a bit of a flyer and go off somewhere and have a completely different experience. So maybe that, that dialed into it too.
• 18:57
  Speaker A: Yeah, and maybe she'll land at Bain London, but she also could go back to the States. So yeah, a lot of flexibility and
• 19:03
  Speaker B: yeah, she sponsored Bain will help her take care of that.
• 19:06
  Speaker A: Right, yeah, exactly. So anyway, very interesting. And then the last candidate that we caught up with, or sorry, not candidate but grad that we caught up with is this guy named Javier and he is an HBS grad from 24, so he's also been out in the workforce for a little bit of time now and he's at Amazon, he works as a product manager. He's 30 and he's from Peru originally and he studied industrial engineering as an undergrad. Now before business school he actually worked at McKinsey as well as a couple of years in startups in the payments, e commerce and healthcare sectors. And we asked him if he had any advice that he wished he had been given while pursuing his mba and he said, plan ahead. The MBA is a great time to explore, but opportunities don't appear automatically. Timelines move fast, so you need to start early on recruiting relationships and any extra goals that you care about because momentum compounds quickly. I would recommend to have an attack plan even before starting classes with key milestones to reach based on recruiting deadlines. So yeah, it was interesting. Yeah, he definitely had this idea, you know, that you got to be prepared going into the NBA to make the most of it.
• 20:18
  Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely brilliant. And what, another high profile candidate.
• 20:22
  Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. So in any event, and there's a lot of, I mean, obviously I always share these quotes, but these are long pieces that we have up on the site, so. And what I love is, and I don't know whose idea this was, but there's always a photo of the person. Right. So the alum has their, their photo and it's like a headshot. But then we require that they also submit like a fun More personal photo. So there's almost always a photo of them doing something like climbing a mountain or whatever, running a marathon or whatever people get up to in their spare time. So I love that. It just somehow, I mean that's why we call the series Real Humans, right? It's to just make everyone seem real. But in any event, let's see. I think that's all I had. Alex. I want to remind people they can write to us@infoearadmit.com we have gotten some really lovely letters recently from a couple of listeners who are kind of applying to business school and one who got a bunch of great results. And I think we're actually going to maybe talk about that person today. But let's get into it. Unless you had anything else, let's kick on. All right, so this is Wiretaps candidate number one. So our first candidate this week and all of them actually this week are from Decision Wire Post. And that's because we're in the thick of it with people getting decisions and we want to talk about some of these dilemmas. So this first person up applied to Chicago, Columbia, Dartmouth, Duke, Harvard, mit, Wharton, Stanford and Darden. And they ended up getting offers at a lot of these schools. They got into Chicago, Columbia and Wharton. None of those schools gave them any money. But they also got into Tuck with $65,000 Fuqua at Duke with $85,000 and $110,000 scholarship at Darden. And this person had a 675 on the GMAT Focus Edition and they had a 3.6 undergraduate GPA. They said that they're coming from a non traditional background and that they want to pivot into consulting long term. They want to end up in the energy industry working on sustainability at startups. They're all great schools. They say in terms of the schools that have admitted them that could get me into consulting. But I'm struggling to understand how prestige, an MBA reputation plays into my long term goals. Side note, I have no interest in private equity or venture capital. So they had, they felt the need to disclose that. So yeah, what do you make of this, Alex? Because we have three M7 offers. Chicago, Columbia, Wharton with $0. And then we have three top 16 offers in Tuck, Duke and Darden with varying amounts of money. So what do you make of this?
• 22:57
  Speaker B: Yeah, it seems to me that the marketplace is correct, right? M7 no dollars, top $16. That makes perfect sense in terms of how we think about tiers. I think they should go to Wharton and the reason for that is they want to pivot into consulting. And I just frankly think that Wharton, if you look at their career reports, etc. Etc. Gives the most opportunity for access to MBB. But, yeah, I mean, all these programs will give them access to mbb, but there's a scale to a sliding scale. Right. So the higher the profile of the program, the more opportunity. And I think if you're pivoting into that becomes more important rather than a consultant getting an MBA to return to consulting. So you're going to argue potentially some of that money at top 16 is quite attractive. But if they can make Wharton happen, I think they'll be surprised by how much they'll enjoy that experience and the opportunities it'll provide them. Ground.
• 24:09
  Speaker A: Yeah. So I'm going to play devil's advocate. So I recognize that Wharton is probably the best school that admitted them. I mean, I think it's in the top tier of all the programs that accepted them.
• 24:19
  Speaker B: It is unequivocal.
• 24:20
  Speaker A: Yeah. So Wharton's the best school they got into. Right. And I understand the idea. Wharton, obviously great access to mbb, but I want to share something that they wrote. They said they have no geographic preference, would prefer to go to a smaller school. And then they said scholarship matters a little, but not a deciding factor. And they're not looking to maximize prestige as long as it doesn't hinder me professionally. So it's an interesting debate because you could argue that Wharton has the most prestige on the list that they're going to. And. And that that will.
• 24:52
  Speaker B: But again, prestige is based off of a foundation, Right?
• 24:56
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 24:56
  Speaker B: Of providing access and doing so. So this comment in terms of I'm not interested in prestige as long as it doesn't hinder me. Well, it's going to hinder you.
• 25:06
  Speaker A: Right, Right.
• 25:06
  Speaker B: That is the reality of life. What does prestige do? It means you've got a stronger alumni network, you've got better faculty, you've got better students in your cohorts, etc. Etc. They're all correlated, aligned, whatever you want to call it. So you cannot say I'm not worried about prestige as long as I'm maximizing my opportunity. Well, you can't sit in both camps.
• 25:29
  Speaker A: Yeah, it's interesting. And I want to get back to my point about playing devil's advocate, but one thing that was interesting, there was another comment from our favorite anonymous user about how even if you're not interested in private equity or venture capital, which is what this person has claimed, they said if you exited to sustainable energy and startups, having A network of classmates in PE and VC may be quite useful and that is something that Wharton would give them. But anyway, just back to my original point. I am thinking about how Tuck could be quite appealing here because they seem to have some fit there. There's a decent sized scholarship of $65,000. It is Ivy League. It's sort of the closest thing to an M7 that they got into that gave them money. But again, I understand the debate here, but I'm just saying I think that they could go to MBB from Tuck. Tuck has a very much smaller but very close knit alumni network and could potentially pull the levers they need to make their career happen. And so I just want to put that out there as a devil's advocate, you know, that maybe they could go to Tuck.
• 26:35
  Speaker B: But yeah, and quite honestly, Duke and Dard and Darden. 110. Right.
• 26:39
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 26:39
  Speaker B: These are all smaller programs, more intimate settings, etc. That will provide access to MBB. Not as much access, but will provide access.
• 26:50
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 26:51
  Speaker B: I think also Wharton, you know, Wharton being in Philadelphia and, and we've obviously you're a Wharton grad. I worked at Wharton lots of years. It's a little bit different to a big program in New York City.
• 27:04
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 27:05
  Speaker B: So I just want to put that out there too. You have. Wharton does provide a pretty good intimate environment simply because nobody's as coming from Philly that goes to Wharton or you know, very, very few people. So they're all developing, you know, the networks in, in the program. And there's lots of other arguments to that. But my point is more you can't. Prestige does provide lots of other advantages and you can't just presume that. I'm not worried about prestige.
• 27:39
  Speaker A: Yeah.
• 27:40
  Speaker B: As long as it doesn't hinder my opportunity. It's going to hinder your opportunity if you don't worry about prestige.
• 27:45
  Speaker A: Yeah. So fair points. Yeah. I wish them the best of luck. I'll be curious to hear what they decide. Hopefully they'll share on that post or put up a new post that shows the final decision. Let's move on now and talk about wiretaps. Candidate number two. So our second.
• 28:05
  Speaker B: Want me to sing?
• 28:07
  Speaker A: Yeah, our second. Our second candidate is actually someone that we discussed as a Plywire entry back in episode 450. And this was the candidate that you. I know you're offering to sing because it's the candidate that works on the railroad all the livelong day, as we would say. And so this candidate has come back and told us what happened And I love when people do this. So this candidate applied to Columbia, Emory, Indiana, Kelly, Michigan, Kellogg and Wharton. And you may recall if you go back and listen to the episode, we were kind of pushing this category to some very top tier schools. And as it turns out, they got in, I think they ran the table. So they got into Columbia, got into Emory with $100,000 scholarship, same hundred thousand dollar scholarship offered to them at Kelley Michigan came in with $80,000, Kellogg with $110,000 for this candidate and Wharton offered them acceptance, but no, no money. So just to remind everyone, this person had a 665 on the GMAT and a 3.77 GPA. They're based in Atlanta. I'm hoping they'll come out to our MBA fair even though they don't need to. But they come by and say hi and maybe connect with whatever school they choose in the end. But here's the comment that they left us. They said, my top school was Kellogg. They want to pivot into brand management. But now that I have an admit to Wharton, I'm rethinking Wharton. Given the value of the network, would Wharton even entertain negotiation? Given my scholarship of $110,000 from Kellogg, I'm planning on attending both admit weekends. So what do you make of this, Alex? Kellogg? I mean Kellogg with $110,000 or Wharton with nothing? I think that trumps everything else, right? Because these are the two, probably two of the best schools they got into. And it sounds like they're interested in Kellogg or, you know, so, so those are the two it's come down to, it seems like.
• 29:58
  Speaker B: Yeah, and they're probably the two best schools for what? You know, for their goals, right. In terms of brand management, marketing, etc. I mean Kellogg's renowned for that. Although, you know, they don't like to be labeled that. But I mean if you're good at something, you might as well, you might as well showcase it. And I, I would argue Wharton is also really good in this area and I think in terms of research and faculty in this area that they really do trump other programs. Again, we have experience at Wharton and I totally admire the likes of Peter Feder and various other faculty in that domain. So they've got some really good opportunities. I do think that 110 gap, if Wharton doesn't allow them to negotiate or doesn't close that gap in this case, I would go to Kellogg because I think Kellogg really aligns with what they want to do and just having that scholarship in hand and so on and so forth is going to be super helpful. So in this case, I would say, you know what, Kellogg is probably a really good opportunity.
• 31:12
  Speaker A: Yeah. And I think it comes down to Kellogg and Wharton as well for the reasons you say. And yeah, this person seems to have a fit with Kellogg and has said as much. Frankly, I just don't see Wharton coming in and getting even close. I mean, Wharton doesn't typically negotiate. And even if they were to, I don't see them coming close to 110. One thing that's quite fascinating to me was that they got 110 offer from Kellogg, but that the other schools on their list, arguably not as high ranking, didn't give them as much money. That's a little bit of an anomaly. In any event, Kellogg must really like this person and want them if they're offering that kind of package. I want person the best of luck. I was so thrilled to get into. This person emailed us as well and it was really exciting to see all these acceptances and they gave us a little bit of credit, I guess, because we were pushing them to apply to the very top schools and that's what they ended up doing, throwing some of those into the mix. And yeah, pretty impressive results. And I wish them the best of luck as they figure this out. And yeah, have fun at the admit weekends.
• 32:13
  Speaker B: Yeah, I think it's extraordinary how well they've done and I'm really thrilled for them. And I hope, you know, obviously the welcome weekends will help sway their choice and that'll be great. But I hope they do decide to attend your Atlanta event because you'll be there, Graham, and it'd be really good to meet them. But they can also use that event, like you say, to talk to either Kellogg or Wharton, whichever one they've chosen. And that can help further, sort of, you know, prepare them, I should say, for, for, for. For the next leg of their journey. So. So I'd encourage them to attend.
• 32:51
  Speaker A: Yeah. And actually, most of the schools at our event, I haven't been saying this, but many of the schools at our event will have alums show up. So there'll be Atlanta area alumni from some of these schools. And it wouldn't surprise me if there's a Kellogg or Wharton grad or two there at the table. So. All right, so let's move on. I want to thank that person for sharing. Let's move on and talk about wiretaps. Candidate number three. So our final candidate this week, again, another decision. Wire entry. This person applied to Cornell, Georgetown, Michigan, NYU, Rice, and UCLA, and they did so with a 3.85 GPA and they did not take a test. So they basically applied with a test waiver. They ended up getting in to a lot of these schools. So they got into Cornell with 80 grand, Georgetown with 60. They got into Michigan without a scholarship. Rice gave him $100,000, and UCLA is offering $100,000. They tell us that they interviewed at NYU and they're still awaiting a decision there. I expect they'll get in, I mean, given what we've seen here. But. So they're still waiting a decision there. GMAT waiver, as I mentioned, and they want to work in investment banking. New York City is the priority because of that. They say Cornell and NYU are their top choices. So they're asking if NYU admits me, but with no or slightly less scholarship, should I still take it over Cornell, could I leverage the other admits and scholarships to negotiate aid at Cornell or nyu? And they then say, shout out to ucla. The people were cool as. I can't, I can't say the next word. But they, they had a nice experience at ucla, but they're just not going to go there because they want to, in this case, land in New York and do investment banking. So, Alex, what do you, what do you make of this dilemma?
• 34:39
  Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, I'm just curious why they applied to UCLA in the first place. Obviously, they didn't know when they applied that they were going to get into Johnson. Yeah, with a nice scholarship and so forth. But their goals are very specific, and Johnson really does well for these goals. Right. Investment banking in New York City. So they've got a really good option there. And, you know, if Stern comes through and you think they will that which may very well be the case, you know, who knows? When they release their decisions, it does sometimes appear to be a bit random. But. So hopefully they'll get good news from Stern. And I, I think if Stern doesn't closely match the, the Johnson offer, they've got a great option at Johnson. Graham. I mean, this is exactly what Johnson is good for.
• 35:25
  Speaker A: Yeah, and, and you know, it's funny, in the comments on this post, someone pointed out, you know, because, because was asking could I take my $100,000, whatever it was, offer at UCLA and go to Johnson and say, hey, can you up that 80 to match UCLA? And one of the posters, again, our favorite anonymous poster who knows a lot about decisions, said that they could try to ask, but that Johnson knows they're really well suited for this candidate's goals and probably thinks to themselves as being a tear ahead. And so that probably isn't going to amount to much. Yeah, I would say, obviously, if they get into Stern, cross that bridge when they come to it. But for now, Johnson feels like the right choice. It's a great, great school. Great for their goals, as you say, and a nice scholarship of 80,000. Yeah, we'll see what happens.
• 36:12
  Speaker B: I'm just going to clarify something you just said, though, there, Graham. So Johnson considers themselves a tier in front, I would argue, actually, Johnson knows very well they're in the same tier as Anderson. And one. No, but one. One of the reasons why we use tiers is within the same tier. You prioritize based on your own personal goals, your professional goals and geographic goals and so on and so forth. So Johnson will know, yes, we're in the same tier as Anderson, but we know based off of what this candidate is telling us that we're far ahead in terms of matching and aligning with those goals. And that puts us significantly in front of Anderson for this candidate. Now, if this candidate was looking to do banking in LA or on the west coast, it would be different.
• 37:02
  Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. We'll see what happens. But I wish them luck, obviously, with the NYU Stern decision and then just figuring this out overall. But again, as I said, I think Cornell's a great fit for this person, given their goals as of now and that offer. I want to thank everyone that's been posting to Decision Wire. These are so valuable to the community, not only because we get to discuss them on the show, but because people share scholarship amounts and it really democratizes the sort of information that's out there about how this process works. So super helpful. If you haven't already, please post a Decision Wire. It's just a great sort of resource for everyone, including Alex and I, But Alex, that's about it. We gotta wrap the show here. It's great that you're back from vacation and yeah, it was so much fun to talk about all these candidates. And let's hang out again next week and do it.
• 37:49
  Speaker B: Very good. Stay safe, everyone. Take care. Of.