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Who Killed Elizabeth? · River City Mystery - Investigating mysteries in southern Indiana, southern Illinois, and western Kentucky

0:00
Speaker: Mark was the truck driver.
0:02
Speaker: Oh my goodness.
0:03
Speaker: Mark the truck driver who was the.
0:06
Speaker: Their mother's boyfriend, who
0:08
Speaker: was abusing the other siblings,
0:10
Speaker: ends up dating Elizabeth after
0:13
Speaker: Rose's death.
0:26
Speaker: You're listening to River City
0:27
Speaker: Mystery, a podcast that delves
0:29
Speaker: into the Evansville and
0:30
Speaker: surrounding Tri-State area's
0:31
Speaker: mysteries, including unsolved
0:33
Speaker: crimes, murders and
0:34
Speaker: disappearances, a show that
0:36
Speaker: isn't afraid to jump down the
0:37
Speaker: rabbit hole to investigate
0:38
Speaker: reports of local hauntings,
0:40
Speaker: sightings of UAPs and cryptids,
0:42
Speaker: among other paranormal
0:43
Speaker: phenomena.
0:43
Speaker: With your host law office worker by day.
0:46
Speaker: Insomniac researcher of the unknown by night.
0:48
Speaker: Matt Deig.
0:53
Speaker: Welcome to episode seventeen.
0:55
Speaker: We're going to be discussing the Elizabeth Banister case, Which
0:59
Speaker: is basically like a demented version of the movie clue.
1:03
Speaker: And we'll find out why as we get into this case.
1:06
Speaker: I was invited to join the show of Savannah, who actually is a
1:10
Speaker: member of my discord server.
1:12
Speaker: She has a channel called a YouTube channel called Don't
1:16
Speaker: Hate Create, and I've got a link down in the show notes for that.
1:20
Speaker: So check, check out her show and
1:22
Speaker: she discusses true crime sorts
1:24
Speaker: of stuff.
1:25
Speaker: And she really has been
1:26
Speaker: following the Delphi case really
1:27
Speaker: closely.
1:28
Speaker: So she has a lot of interesting stuff there.
1:30
Speaker: So check it out.
1:31
Speaker: She invited me to be on her show
1:33
Speaker: this week, and we did a live
1:34
Speaker: stream talking about the
1:35
Speaker: Elizabeth Bannister case this
1:37
Speaker: episode.
1:38
Speaker: Is that that discussion we had
1:39
Speaker: talking about Elizabeth and and
1:41
Speaker: what happened with her back in
1:42
Speaker: two thousand.
1:44
Speaker: And the discord server, by the way, has been growing quite a
1:47
Speaker: bit over the past few months.
1:48
Speaker: So if you're interested in talking to other people about
1:51
Speaker: mysteries, unsolved crimes, paranormal stuff that's
1:54
Speaker: happening in Evansville and the surrounding Tri-State area, Feel
1:58
Speaker: free to join.
1:58
Speaker: You're welcome.
1:59
Speaker: You just go to rivercity.
2:00
Speaker: Mystery dot com slash.
2:03
Speaker: And even if you're not familiar with discord, join anyway and
2:06
Speaker: we'll help you out.
2:07
Speaker: We'll walk you through it all.
2:08
Speaker: It's really a great place to kind of communicate with people
2:10
Speaker: who have similar interests.
2:12
Speaker: So you're welcome to join.
2:14
Speaker: So this is our discussion on the Elizabeth Banister case.
2:18
Speaker: This is the case of Elizabeth Banister.
2:21
Speaker: And she was murdered at eighteen years old in her apartment.
2:25
Speaker: She was murdered in a house that's full of people, yet no
2:28
Speaker: one heard or saw anything there.
2:30
Speaker: And there's no shortage of
2:31
Speaker: suspects, as far as I'm
2:33
Speaker: concerned.
2:34
Speaker: The House had apparently at the time of her murder, which was
2:38
Speaker: around one a m on January twentieth, two thousand.
2:42
Speaker: There was apparently someone passed out on a couch.
2:46
Speaker: There was someone in the bathroom.
2:48
Speaker: There was somebody watching a
2:50
Speaker: rerun of Matlock in another
2:51
Speaker: room.
2:52
Speaker: Um, yet no one.
2:54
Speaker: No one heard anyone come in or leave or anything.
3:00
Speaker: Apparently about an hour.
3:01
Speaker: Yeah, it's very weird.
3:03
Speaker: And she had an just an absolute tragic life.
3:06
Speaker: I mean, leading up to that point.
3:08
Speaker: It's just the more I read about
3:09
Speaker: it, the more like horrifying it
3:11
Speaker: is.
3:11
Speaker: How just bad her life was.
3:14
Speaker: And her sister Sara, um, she's done some podcasts and talks a
3:17
Speaker: lot about she's an advocate for finding her sister's murder.
3:21
Speaker: Um, she talks a lot about the abuse that took place and, and
3:24
Speaker: that sort of thing.
3:25
Speaker: But, um, she was born in, uh, California.
3:28
Speaker: And then when she was eight, she
3:29
Speaker: and her family moved to the
3:30
Speaker: Evansville area.
3:32
Speaker: And so Elizabeth had, um, she had three siblings there, Sarah,
3:36
Speaker: Rebecca and Doug.
3:38
Speaker: So Sarah, Rebecca, and Doug were
3:39
Speaker: from a different father than
3:41
Speaker: Elizabeth.
3:42
Speaker: So they were kind of separated for that reason, I believe.
3:45
Speaker: And also Elizabeth seemed to have some behavioral issues.
3:49
Speaker: Um, so she spent most of her time in group homes and with
3:52
Speaker: other groups rather than with the other three siblings, which
3:56
Speaker: is kind of sad too.
3:57
Speaker: Yeah.
3:59
Speaker: So Sarah, Rebecca and Doug ended up with one group and then
4:03
Speaker: Elizabeth off by herself.
4:05
Speaker: And Sarah tells the story about how when Elizabeth was eight,
4:10
Speaker: she was actually assaulted by a male relative as well.
4:13
Speaker: So that's when she was also sent off.
4:15
Speaker: Um, later on to live with someone else as well.
4:18
Speaker: So there was that factor as well.
4:19
Speaker: So she, she did not start off very well.
4:22
Speaker: She was sent off after she got like, um, yeah, the timeline is
4:27
Speaker: confusing as far as like when she was eight, she was assaulted
4:32
Speaker: by a male relative.
4:33
Speaker: So I'm not sure how soon after that that she was actually sent
4:38
Speaker: off somewhere else.
4:39
Speaker: I don't know if she did not report it until a later date,
4:42
Speaker: but oh yeah, I know that would probably explain her behavioral
4:45
Speaker: problems too a bit.
4:46
Speaker: Correct.
4:47
Speaker: So I don't know who knew what and when kind of a thing.
4:50
Speaker: Um, but apparently it did damage
4:52
Speaker: to her where she couldn't have
4:53
Speaker: children.
4:54
Speaker: I mean, it was like that kind of a thing.
4:56
Speaker: According to her, her foster mother later on said that, um,
5:00
Speaker: while Elizabeth was away with living with where she was, Sarah
5:05
Speaker: and Rebecca and Doug were with their mom, Rose, and her various
5:11
Speaker: boyfriends, and apparently she.
5:12
Speaker: Rose did not pick men very well, apparently.
5:16
Speaker: So they were all abusive to her and the children.
5:19
Speaker: And, um, one of those boyfriends
5:23
Speaker: that she was with was named Mark
5:25
Speaker: and Mark when Mark was a truck
5:29
Speaker: driver and when Mark would go
5:31
Speaker: off on over the road trips, he
5:34
Speaker: would have Sara or Rebecca go
5:37
Speaker: with him.
5:37
Speaker: They would demand it.
5:38
Speaker: And Rose would say, Rose, their mother would say, yeah, I want
5:41
Speaker: you to go with him, um, to give me a break, you know, and he
5:45
Speaker: would only want one at a time.
5:46
Speaker: Of course not.
5:47
Speaker: Both of them.
5:48
Speaker: Apparently, Sarah and Rebecca would tell their mother, you
5:50
Speaker: know, he's he's abusing, he's putting his hands on us, that
5:53
Speaker: kind of thing.
5:54
Speaker: And she really wouldn't listen.
5:55
Speaker: So that is really, really sad.
5:58
Speaker: It's really sad.
6:00
Speaker: Like people need to listen to their children.
6:03
Speaker: I do not imagine I it's
6:06
Speaker: appalling when people do not
6:07
Speaker: listen to their children saying
6:08
Speaker: these things.
6:09
Speaker: It's just like you just you can't believe it.
6:11
Speaker: But it does happen.
6:12
Speaker: Apparently he did.
6:13
Speaker: Um, Mark did assault Sarah on one of these trips.
6:16
Speaker: She says in one of the podcast,
6:18
Speaker: we'll actually listen to a clip
6:19
Speaker: of that, um, here in a bit, but,
6:20
Speaker: um, I don't know what Rebecca
6:22
Speaker: has not spoken, so I don't know
6:23
Speaker: if she's also, but it would not
6:25
Speaker: surprise me if he also did stuff
6:27
Speaker: to her.
6:28
Speaker: Yeah.
6:29
Speaker: Um, it goes to stands to reason that that would happen.
6:33
Speaker: Exactly.
6:34
Speaker: So and this just kind of giving, giving a little background
6:37
Speaker: because it just gets weirder here in a bit.
6:40
Speaker: Rose started going downhill physically, um, and started
6:44
Speaker: needing some help.
6:44
Speaker: So Elizabeth came home with Rose and started helping her at home
6:50
Speaker: and she ended up passing away.
6:53
Speaker: Elizabeth actually found her mother dead in the bed.
6:56
Speaker: Mhm.
6:57
Speaker: Um, she had apparently passed away of emphysema.
7:00
Speaker: And there's some weirdness there, too, because apparently
7:03
Speaker: she was next to her then boyfriend, which was not Mark at
7:06
Speaker: the time, apparently.
7:09
Speaker: But a dog had eaten like half of her face off, so apparently she
7:12
Speaker: had been there long enough for a dog to have eaten her face.
7:15
Speaker: But the guy she was with didn't know, so.
7:17
Speaker: Oh gosh, there's some suspicion
7:19
Speaker: there with like, what really
7:20
Speaker: happened, but I don't think that
7:22
Speaker: was ever even an open case or
7:23
Speaker: anything.
7:24
Speaker: It's just she passed away of emphysema.
7:26
Speaker: And then, um, Elizabeth was dating a guy that her her
7:30
Speaker: correct mom was with.
7:32
Speaker: After Rose passes away,
7:35
Speaker: Elizabeth goes back to the group
7:37
Speaker: home.
7:37
Speaker: I think she goes to Hillcrest, Washington youth home in
7:40
Speaker: Evansville until she ages out.
7:42
Speaker: And when she ages out at eighteen, she moves into the
7:45
Speaker: apartment on Washington Avenue, which is where she was murdered.
7:49
Speaker: She moved in with her boyfriend,
7:51
Speaker: then boyfriend Mark, who was the
7:53
Speaker: same guy that her mother was
7:55
Speaker: engaged to or dating or whatever
7:57
Speaker: later on.
7:59
Speaker: So yes, she ends up dating Mark, her her deceased mother's
8:05
Speaker: fiance, I guess you'd say.
8:07
Speaker: Um, wow.
8:08
Speaker: This obviously caused issues
8:09
Speaker: with Sarah and, uh, Elizabeth
8:12
Speaker: because Sarah was appalled that,
8:14
Speaker: you know, this man who had done
8:16
Speaker: all of these bad things to her
8:17
Speaker: and her sister would actually be
8:20
Speaker: interested in their other sister
8:21
Speaker: and that she would go along with
8:23
Speaker: Mark.
8:23
Speaker: Mark was the truck driver.
8:25
Speaker: Mark was the truck driver.
8:27
Speaker: Oh my goodness.
8:28
Speaker: Mark the truck driver, who was
8:31
Speaker: the their mother's boyfriend who
8:33
Speaker: was abusing the other siblings,
8:35
Speaker: ends up dating Elizabeth after
8:38
Speaker: Rosa's death.
8:39
Speaker: That's crazy.
8:40
Speaker: Was Elizabeth's older than the other three or she was younger?
8:44
Speaker: Yeah, she's a few years older.
8:46
Speaker: I think she's four years older than Sarah, and I'm not sure how
8:50
Speaker: old the other siblings were.
8:51
Speaker: She.
8:51
Speaker: I don't know that, but she's older than the others.
8:54
Speaker: Okay.
8:56
Speaker: Yeah.
8:57
Speaker: So Mark was obviously one of the, the people who were
9:02
Speaker: questioned by the police because he, he's clearly on that list of
9:07
Speaker: people who might have reasons to have done something.
9:10
Speaker: I guess he's just at the very
9:11
Speaker: top of mind right now as far as
9:13
Speaker: that story.
9:15
Speaker: And Kelly Fontaine is the foster mother who actually helped raise
9:20
Speaker: Elizabeth from the time she was twelve to seventeen.
9:22
Speaker: She was a big part of her life at that time.
9:26
Speaker: She says that Mark had something to do with it.
9:28
Speaker: She knew Mark had something to
9:29
Speaker: do with it before she even knew
9:31
Speaker: the details that she was even
9:32
Speaker: dating Mark.
9:33
Speaker: She did not know that they were dating, and she immediately
9:37
Speaker: suspected Mark for whatever reason, because he gave her a
9:39
Speaker: bad vibe or something.
9:41
Speaker: Um, but she was kind of shocked
9:43
Speaker: to learn that they were actually
9:44
Speaker: dating at the time that she was
9:46
Speaker: murdered, but he apparently had
9:48
Speaker: an alibi.
9:49
Speaker: He was working when she was murdered.
9:53
Speaker: So.
9:53
Speaker: Yeah.
9:54
Speaker: Right.
9:54
Speaker: I'm just kidding.
9:56
Speaker: That's what I'm thinking.
9:56
Speaker: I've.
9:57
Speaker: I've fallen down so many rabbit holes to figure out who this guy
10:00
Speaker: is, because none of the names have been released other than
10:02
Speaker: Sarah saying his name.
10:04
Speaker: Mark.
10:05
Speaker: Um, on a few podcasts.
10:07
Speaker: Um, because I'm trying to figure
10:09
Speaker: out like, where did the guy
10:09
Speaker: work?
10:10
Speaker: Like who?
10:10
Speaker: How did they verify he was at work?
10:12
Speaker: I don't know if he was a truck driver at that time.
10:14
Speaker: I know he was back a few years
10:16
Speaker: earlier, but was he a truck
10:18
Speaker: driver then?
10:19
Speaker: I guess that would be easier to verify if you were on on the
10:21
Speaker: road or something.
10:22
Speaker: But it's not that hard for
10:24
Speaker: somebody to clock you in if
10:25
Speaker: you're like, working in a plant
10:26
Speaker: or something.
10:28
Speaker: Uh, totally.
10:29
Speaker: Yeah.
10:30
Speaker: The coroner, who was Annie
10:32
Speaker: Groves, says that it was a crime
10:34
Speaker: of passion because apparently it
10:35
Speaker: was.
10:36
Speaker: She was stabbed multiple times in her apartment, and apparently
10:39
Speaker: the first stabbing was fatal.
10:41
Speaker: Like it hit her in the aorta and that's the one that did her in.
10:45
Speaker: And the person just kept stabbing.
10:47
Speaker: They think it's a crime of passion, not like just some
10:50
Speaker: random guy staggering into the apartment, you know?
10:53
Speaker: Yeah, like overdid it, overdid it.
10:55
Speaker: Right.
10:56
Speaker: So. But there's no proof the at the time.
11:01
Speaker: And to add some more strange
11:03
Speaker: things here, about an hour
11:05
Speaker: before she was murdered, she had
11:07
Speaker: asked if Elizabeth had asked a
11:08
Speaker: friend for some money to use the
11:11
Speaker: payphone.
11:12
Speaker: The friend came over, gave her
11:14
Speaker: the money and left, and he comes
11:18
Speaker: back an hour later to check on
11:20
Speaker: her.
11:20
Speaker: For some reason, I don't know why he would.
11:22
Speaker: I don't know if he was coming back to get more money, get the
11:24
Speaker: money back, or where's the payphone at that?
11:27
Speaker: I don't know, so I'm guessing it was nearby their house.
11:30
Speaker: Um, she borrows money from this friend to use a payphone.
11:35
Speaker: An hour later, he comes back to
11:36
Speaker: check on her and he finds her
11:38
Speaker: dead.
11:38
Speaker: Or he finds the crime scene.
11:40
Speaker: I don't know if he's the one who
11:41
Speaker: actually found her body, but he
11:42
Speaker: comes back and finds that she's
11:43
Speaker: been murdered.
11:44
Speaker: So a cabbie was questioned by police because a cab did
11:48
Speaker: actually come to the house, had been called, but no one ever
11:53
Speaker: came out when he got there.
11:55
Speaker: So he took off.
11:57
Speaker: So it we don't know, like where
12:01
Speaker: was she going, that kind of
12:02
Speaker: thing.
12:02
Speaker: Um, so we've got another that's always a strange situation.
12:06
Speaker: Just that, that whole the friend
12:08
Speaker: with borrowing money and coming
12:09
Speaker: back to check on her an hour
12:10
Speaker: later, that's just strange as
12:12
Speaker: well.
12:13
Speaker: There are reports in the Evansville papers that a, a
12:17
Speaker: neighbor saw an African American male jump out of a window and
12:21
Speaker: run down the street.
12:22
Speaker: That sounds you know, that sounds.
12:25
Speaker: I don't know, I'm not gonna say convenient.
12:28
Speaker: Yeah, it sounds like a little bit of racism or something, you
12:33
Speaker: know, like, I don't know, maybe.
12:34
Speaker: Yeah.
12:35
Speaker: There's a black guy.
12:35
Speaker: There was, I don't know, it's
12:38
Speaker: yet another strange part of this
12:41
Speaker: and it just gets stranger with
12:43
Speaker: this.
12:43
Speaker: Um, yeah.
12:45
Speaker: Did she live in like, a bad part of town though?
12:47
Speaker: I guess I shouldn't say that.
12:48
Speaker: It's like out of.
12:49
Speaker: Yeah.
12:49
Speaker: It wasn't a great part of town.
12:50
Speaker: And she lived in a house that's um a lady owned it.
12:54
Speaker: She apparently the lady who lived there, uh, who owned it
12:57
Speaker: was in her seventies and I don't think she was doing very well
13:00
Speaker: either, because I was, I've been doing some research on her, but,
13:03
Speaker: um, I think she had maybe Alzheimer's or dementia kind of
13:07
Speaker: developing at that time, but she would bring in these people.
13:11
Speaker: She kind of turned her house
13:11
Speaker: into an apartment complex where
13:13
Speaker: people would just come in and
13:14
Speaker: rent rooms.
13:15
Speaker: So I think she was living in the basement.
13:18
Speaker: Yeah, the lady was living in the basement of that house.
13:20
Speaker: The lady was living in the
13:21
Speaker: basement, from what I
13:23
Speaker: understand.
13:24
Speaker: And then she was renting out the
13:25
Speaker: room so that there were, uh,
13:27
Speaker: four people renting rooms, I
13:29
Speaker: believe at that time, there was
13:30
Speaker: Elizabeth and then three others,
13:31
Speaker: I believe.
13:32
Speaker: Oh, this the pictures you sent
13:34
Speaker: me that like it was torn down,
13:36
Speaker: right?
13:37
Speaker: It was torn down.
13:38
Speaker: Let me give you.
13:40
Speaker: I've got a picture here.
13:42
Speaker: Like the older pictures that.
13:44
Speaker: Yeah.
13:45
Speaker: It's like a black and white.
13:45
Speaker: It's from the newspaper.
13:47
Speaker: I have that, I think.
13:48
Speaker: You got that?
13:48
Speaker: Okay.
13:49
Speaker: And I went there a few months ago to, um, take some pictures
13:53
Speaker: of the actual scene.
13:54
Speaker: I got a video as well of the current scene, but.
13:57
Speaker: Oh. Do you.
13:57
Speaker: You can share your screen if you want.
14:00
Speaker: Um, Hiawatha says that they
14:02
Speaker: would love to read the police
14:03
Speaker: report.
14:04
Speaker: And you did try to get like FOIA, um, the information.
14:08
Speaker: Right?
14:09
Speaker: And they wouldn't give you stuff
14:11
Speaker: or they would not give me
14:12
Speaker: anything.
14:13
Speaker: Go ahead and share your screen because mine is not bringing up
14:15
Speaker: my pictures for some reason.
14:17
Speaker: Um, I sent a FOIA request to the Evansville Police Department a
14:21
Speaker: couple of months ago.
14:22
Speaker: Maybe it was over a month ago.
14:24
Speaker: And since I mean, this has been now almost twenty five years, I
14:28
Speaker: would I've got to think that this is, uh, you know, not
14:32
Speaker: considered a super active case.
14:34
Speaker: So I did send a FOIA request for
14:36
Speaker: all of the information on this
14:37
Speaker: case.
14:37
Speaker: And then they responded a couple of weeks ago that they are still
14:41
Speaker: considering this an active case.
14:42
Speaker: So they're not going to release any of the, um, police reports,
14:46
Speaker: which is very frustrating.
14:47
Speaker: It's like it's almost a quarter of a century later.
14:49
Speaker: It's like, come on.
14:51
Speaker: Yeah.
14:52
Speaker: Like, yeah, that's crazy.
14:55
Speaker: Yeah.
14:55
Speaker: I mean, so I would really love
14:56
Speaker: to read the police report as
14:58
Speaker: well.
14:59
Speaker: Yeah, there's the house.
15:00
Speaker: So she apparently lived.
15:02
Speaker: Um, God, that's a horrible picture.
15:04
Speaker: Um, but that's really the one of
15:06
Speaker: the only ones I could find
15:06
Speaker: because like I said, it was
15:07
Speaker: knocked down.
15:08
Speaker: So actually what happened was in
15:09
Speaker: two thousand and four, the owner
15:11
Speaker: of the house was apparently a
15:13
Speaker: hoarder.
15:13
Speaker: Apparently she was not doing well at all.
15:15
Speaker: So she would stack newspapers all over the place and they
15:18
Speaker: caught on fire.
15:19
Speaker: And the whole place burned down in two thousand and four.
15:22
Speaker: So which is kind of upsetting because, I mean, it had whatever
15:25
Speaker: evidence might have been in this house is gone.
15:28
Speaker: Uh, you know, they really can't,
15:30
Speaker: you know, look into anything any
15:32
Speaker: further.
15:32
Speaker: So which makes it even more difficult.
15:35
Speaker: Yeah.
15:36
Speaker: Um, but yeah, so now it's just a vacant lot.
15:39
Speaker: So, um, this happened in two thousand.
15:42
Speaker: Is that correct?
15:43
Speaker: Yeah, this was in two thousand.
15:45
Speaker: So a couple of years ago.
15:46
Speaker: This was in twenty twenty three.
15:48
Speaker: And this is another twist that's
15:50
Speaker: just it just gets weirder and
15:51
Speaker: weirder.
15:52
Speaker: In twenty twenty three, uh, Phil
15:54
Speaker: Chalmers, a podcaster who has a
15:57
Speaker: podcast called or did have a
15:58
Speaker: podcast, I don't think he's
15:59
Speaker: releasing episodes anymore, but
16:00
Speaker: it's called Where the Bodies are
16:01
Speaker: Buried.
16:02
Speaker: Okay.
16:03
Speaker: And his very first episode, he interviews William Clyde Gibson.
16:10
Speaker: He, William Clyde Gibson is a
16:11
Speaker: serial killer who killed three
16:13
Speaker: people in the Louisville, New
16:16
Speaker: Albany, Indiana area in, I
16:18
Speaker: believe, twenty twelve, I
16:19
Speaker: believe.
16:20
Speaker: Um, that time and he was he's on
16:23
Speaker: Indiana's death row right now
16:24
Speaker: for murder.
16:25
Speaker: And he, I mean, I'm not going to get into the graphic details,
16:27
Speaker: but he was basically a bad guy.
16:30
Speaker: Um, the stuff he was doing was, pretty much horrible.
16:33
Speaker: But during this podcast, he actually brings up, um,
16:38
Speaker: murdering Elizabeth Bannister.
16:41
Speaker: Um, and he goes into some details about why he, you know,
16:44
Speaker: what he did exactly.
16:46
Speaker: And you know, he mentions her name and that kind of thing.
16:49
Speaker: If we want to, I think I have it queued up if we want to listen
16:51
Speaker: to some of what he says.
16:54
Speaker: Yeah.
16:54
Speaker: Um, I somebody was saying something about like, um, a new
16:57
Speaker: law being passed in Indiana or like semi new law where after
17:02
Speaker: like a certain length of time, if like a family member can
17:06
Speaker: request that, um, a case be either like given to somebody
17:10
Speaker: else or like not declared or declared a cold case so that
17:14
Speaker: more information can get out.
17:16
Speaker: Um, I wonder if that's something that could happen.
17:19
Speaker: That's something to definitely look into.
17:21
Speaker: Um, so maybe if, uh, you know,
17:23
Speaker: the family, uh, Sarah in
17:25
Speaker: particular, maybe, uh, you know,
17:26
Speaker: something to think about because
17:27
Speaker: I actually, she's actually
17:29
Speaker: agreed to talk to me on my for a
17:30
Speaker: future episode.
17:31
Speaker: Sarah, um, Elizabeth's sister.
17:33
Speaker: So that might be something to ask her.
17:36
Speaker: Yeah, for sure, because I was holding off on interviewing her
17:38
Speaker: until after the FOIA information came through, because I was
17:41
Speaker: hoping I'd get that and then be able to kind of look through all
17:43
Speaker: that stuff and then have better questions for her.
17:46
Speaker: But apparently that's not going to happen now.
17:48
Speaker: So. Well, that'd be cool if she could get like that.
17:50
Speaker: Yeah, it would because I just, I
17:52
Speaker: mean, it's been twenty five
17:53
Speaker: years.
17:54
Speaker: And also we have a confession.
17:56
Speaker: This guy is confessing, which it
17:57
Speaker: makes me think, too, that maybe
17:58
Speaker: they don't buy his confession
18:00
Speaker: because if they, you know, they
18:01
Speaker: could close the case out and
18:02
Speaker: say, oh, yeah, serial killer
18:04
Speaker: just confessed it's a closed
18:05
Speaker: case, but they've not closed the
18:06
Speaker: case.
18:06
Speaker: It's still considered active even though he has confessed.
18:10
Speaker: Um, also, Sarah does not, uh, buy the confession as well.
18:13
Speaker: She's come out and said that she's not satisfied that he
18:17
Speaker: actually did it.
18:19
Speaker: Well, like, what are the chances that he would just be like, I
18:21
Speaker: mean, I don't know if he was like common to that area.
18:24
Speaker: Was he like, I don't know, I don't think so.
18:27
Speaker: I don't think that I'm not aware.
18:29
Speaker: I mean, he didn't have any other killings in the Evansville area
18:32
Speaker: that I'm aware of.
18:33
Speaker: I mean, the thing is, he claims he's killed thirty three people.
18:37
Speaker: He's been convicted of killing three.
18:39
Speaker: So there are other people that he claims are out there.
18:43
Speaker: And so that's this Phil Chalmers.
18:44
Speaker: His whole point of his podcast was to talk to serial killers
18:48
Speaker: and convicted killers, to try to get them to confess to other
18:51
Speaker: crimes they've committed.
18:52
Speaker: Oh, yeah.
18:53
Speaker: So which is it's kind of convenient.
18:56
Speaker: It was very first episode.
18:57
Speaker: He does find somebody who just spills the beans on a. Yeah.
19:00
Speaker: Okay.
19:00
Speaker: So some people are very suspicious of that.
19:03
Speaker: It's very convenient.
19:04
Speaker: But the guy did say, I mean, it
19:06
Speaker: is recorded, it's a recorded
19:07
Speaker: conversation, but a lot of these
19:08
Speaker: convicted killers do just they
19:10
Speaker: want attention and to be
19:12
Speaker: relevant.
19:12
Speaker: So maybe he's just.
19:14
Speaker: Well, I think that you're right.
19:16
Speaker: I think the police would
19:17
Speaker: probably have like a not it
19:20
Speaker: wouldn't be a cold case anymore
19:21
Speaker: because they'd have a confession
19:23
Speaker: and.
19:25
Speaker: Yeah.
19:25
Speaker: Right.
19:26
Speaker: Exactly.
19:27
Speaker: Uh, so this is the part to where, um, Phil is actually
19:32
Speaker: talking to, um, William Clyde Gibson and his prison, I guess
19:36
Speaker: the prison about the case here.
19:40
Speaker: Hello.
19:41
Speaker: This is a prepaid call from William Gibson, an inmate at the
19:46
Speaker: Indiana State Prison.
19:48
Speaker: Here's what I want to ask you.
19:49
Speaker: Clyde, are you positive you killed Elizabeth Bannister in
19:53
Speaker: Evansville, Indiana, which was a very high profile case?
19:57
Speaker: Yes.
19:59
Speaker: Elizabeth Bannister is a cold
20:01
Speaker: case murder that dates back
20:03
Speaker: twenty years.
20:04
Speaker: So we know the details of the case.
20:05
Speaker: We know that Elizabeth was
20:07
Speaker: killed inside of her home, which
20:09
Speaker: was split up into little
20:10
Speaker: apartments.
20:11
Speaker: We know she was stabbed to death.
20:12
Speaker: We also know that the
20:14
Speaker: perpetrator escaped without
20:15
Speaker: being seen.
20:16
Speaker: My next step now is to talk to
20:18
Speaker: William Clyde Gibson and to see
20:20
Speaker: what he has to say about the
20:21
Speaker: case, and see if his story
20:23
Speaker: matches up with the story the
20:24
Speaker: media released.
20:26
Speaker: A lot of your crimes have to run together.
20:28
Speaker: How do you know of her specifically?
20:30
Speaker: Well, I just remember.
20:31
Speaker: But just mainly because of what she looked like.
20:34
Speaker: How do you know that was her name, though?
20:35
Speaker: Well, she told me her name when
20:37
Speaker: I first met her, and I just
20:38
Speaker: remembered.
20:39
Speaker: Okay, there's a lot of details I
20:41
Speaker: don't remember just because of
20:43
Speaker: the time.
20:43
Speaker: There's so many other people that I killed, it's hard to keep
20:47
Speaker: it all in line.
20:48
Speaker: Was it a big case?
20:49
Speaker: Like, was it on the news and stuff?
20:52
Speaker: Well, you know, I don't really know because I went back to New
20:56
Speaker: Orleans, so we don't get much news down there.
20:58
Speaker: You know what I mean?
21:01
Speaker: Walk me through it.
21:02
Speaker: You're literally from the very beginning moment you laid eyes
21:05
Speaker: on Elizabeth Bannister.
21:06
Speaker: Where how?
21:07
Speaker: I mean, walk me through the whole story until you left.
21:10
Speaker: Well, like I said, I've just seen her on the side of the road
21:12
Speaker: waving her hands and shit, just wanting a ride.
21:16
Speaker: I picked her up, and then, you
21:18
Speaker: know that you you picked you up
21:19
Speaker: and you took her to her house,
21:21
Speaker: right?
21:22
Speaker: Right.
21:24
Speaker: as far as I can remember.
21:26
Speaker: I mean, like I said, I was, I was stoned.
21:29
Speaker: What did I tell you?
21:30
Speaker: Might not be exactly correct,
21:31
Speaker: but I remember a great thing for
21:34
Speaker: some reason.
21:35
Speaker: I'm pretty sure that's okay.
21:38
Speaker: But it was like a like a big apartment type building or
21:41
Speaker: something like a house, but it was a bunch of apartments.
21:45
Speaker: So that's what it seemed like to me.
21:48
Speaker: It was nighttime when we went.
21:50
Speaker: Yeah, I have, I can't, I don't recall that much of it.
21:54
Speaker: And did you kind of walk into the apartment with her?
21:57
Speaker: There was other people around too.
21:59
Speaker: I mean, it wasn't like, you
22:01
Speaker: know, it was incognito type
22:03
Speaker: stuff.
22:04
Speaker: I mean, you know, it was it was
22:06
Speaker: outside and shit, but it was
22:08
Speaker: just weird.
22:09
Speaker: I mean, it shouldn't happen like
22:11
Speaker: that to me many times where I
22:13
Speaker: should have been caught, you
22:15
Speaker: know?
22:15
Speaker: Right.
22:17
Speaker: I just killed her and pretty much left.
22:19
Speaker: I didn't, I didn't hack her up and stabbed her up.
22:25
Speaker: You stabbed her?
22:28
Speaker: Mhm.
22:28
Speaker: So you're just like.
22:29
Speaker: I kind of have the the feeling I'm.
22:31
Speaker: I think I can kill this girl.
22:32
Speaker: I'm going to follow her in and do this.
22:33
Speaker: Yeah.
22:34
Speaker: Yeah.
22:34
Speaker: I mean, that's that's how it works.
22:37
Speaker: That's how I did most of them.
22:38
Speaker: I mean, I just go out with that
22:40
Speaker: mindset and that's what ended up
22:42
Speaker: happening.
22:43
Speaker: I never knew exactly who it was going to be, you know.
22:46
Speaker: Right, right.
22:47
Speaker: Do you remember stabbing her and where'd you stab her?
22:49
Speaker: And how many times?
22:50
Speaker: If I sit around and think about it for a while, it might come
22:53
Speaker: back to me.
22:54
Speaker: I mean, I see, I see it in my mind.
22:57
Speaker: You know what I mean?
22:58
Speaker: When you left, did anybody see you leave?
23:01
Speaker: Well, I wasn't really paying attention, but I'm sure that
23:04
Speaker: people did see me leave.
23:05
Speaker: Got the hell out of there.
23:06
Speaker: Got in your truck and went home.
23:09
Speaker: Yeah.
23:12
Speaker: All right, so that's.
23:13
Speaker: I mean, I could go on.
23:14
Speaker: You can listen to the rest of the episode if you'd like.
23:16
Speaker: It's actually pretty interesting, but, um, I mean, so
23:20
Speaker: someone says, um, if he said he killed her, why not believe him?
23:24
Speaker: Um, that's a good question.
23:25
Speaker: Uh, Sarah, the sister doesn't
23:27
Speaker: believe him because some of the
23:28
Speaker: details don't line up with what
23:30
Speaker: apparently happened.
23:31
Speaker: Did.
23:32
Speaker: Was there a mirror that was broken?
23:34
Speaker: That's a good question, I don't know.
23:36
Speaker: Um, but that's a very specific thing to mention.
23:38
Speaker: If there maybe there was a broken mirror.
23:39
Speaker: Again, there's not much they
23:41
Speaker: haven't released a lot about the
23:42
Speaker: case.
23:43
Speaker: The murder weapon, we assume was a knife.
23:45
Speaker: It was.
23:45
Speaker: I don't think it was ever found.
23:47
Speaker: I think they're withholding some of the information.
23:49
Speaker: Um, to see if, you know, somebody does come forward.
23:52
Speaker: At some point, they might know something and they don't want to
23:54
Speaker: release everything, obviously, because for that reason.
23:57
Speaker: But Sarah, I think Indiana.
23:59
Speaker: Exactly.
24:00
Speaker: Some of the information doesn't line up with whatever actually
24:04
Speaker: happened, according to Sarah.
24:05
Speaker: So I don't know what that is.
24:07
Speaker: If. Well, is is he saying that
24:09
Speaker: he gave her a ride to her house
24:10
Speaker: and then went in with her and
24:12
Speaker: killed her?
24:12
Speaker: Because that's like, not what happened, right?
24:14
Speaker: Because she was at home beforehand.
24:17
Speaker: Well, One thing, right?
24:19
Speaker: She was at home.
24:19
Speaker: So one thing that could have happened is where she was
24:21
Speaker: hailing or, you know, waiting for a cab on the corner.
24:23
Speaker: Maybe he drove by and saw her there.
24:26
Speaker: Um. Oh it didn't this wasn't
24:29
Speaker: discussed in, but she apparently
24:31
Speaker: was prostituting at that time
24:33
Speaker: too.
24:33
Speaker: So I don't know if he picked her up for that reason.
24:35
Speaker: And under that circumstance, um, he, she was bringing him back
24:40
Speaker: under those circumstances, but apparently she had called a cab
24:43
Speaker: but didn't make it to the cab.
24:45
Speaker: So I don't know if she was standing outside and he happened
24:48
Speaker: to see her.
24:50
Speaker: You know, that's not clear.
24:51
Speaker: So was he like a big rig truck driver?
24:54
Speaker: Um, that I don't know.
24:56
Speaker: I don't think he was.
24:56
Speaker: I think I'm not aware that he was a truck driver.
24:58
Speaker: I just think he was out.
25:00
Speaker: Oh, he was just, like, in a truck driving.
25:02
Speaker: And then she held him.
25:04
Speaker: I get it, yeah.
25:06
Speaker: Um.
25:07
Speaker: Sarah.
25:07
Speaker: Sarah doesn't believe it.
25:08
Speaker: Um, after talking.
25:12
Speaker: After talking to him, do you believe his story?
25:14
Speaker: What's your feeling after talking to, I think he's he's
25:18
Speaker: talking about like that interview after like listening
25:21
Speaker: to that interview, you know, I don't know why someone would
25:25
Speaker: make up something so random.
25:27
Speaker: It seems so specific to me.
25:29
Speaker: I would be leaning towards that.
25:30
Speaker: He did it like, I don't know
25:31
Speaker: what he has to gain by bringing
25:33
Speaker: up Elizabeth Bannister, of all
25:34
Speaker: people, because it really
25:35
Speaker: wasn't, uh, it's kind of a
25:37
Speaker: random case.
25:38
Speaker: It's not like some sort of prolific case everyone's been
25:41
Speaker: talking about for twenty years.
25:43
Speaker: It's something.
25:44
Speaker: But was it a big case at the time?
25:47
Speaker: It just wasn't.
25:48
Speaker: I think some of these it was a kind of a bizarre case, but it
25:51
Speaker: didn't get a lot.
25:52
Speaker: It wasn't like a national.
25:53
Speaker: I don't understand why this one
25:54
Speaker: isn't like a Dateline NBC forty
25:56
Speaker: eight hours kind of high profile
25:58
Speaker: case.
25:59
Speaker: Like I could see Nancy Grace,
26:00
Speaker: like going crazy on something
26:01
Speaker: like this.
26:02
Speaker: I mean, you have all these suspects and just the craziness
26:05
Speaker: of it, but it really wasn't, um, she was just murdered.
26:08
Speaker: And, you know, police just, I think for people like that who
26:12
Speaker: are kind of living on the outskirts of society, they don't
26:14
Speaker: get a lot of, you know, if she had come from a wealthy family,
26:18
Speaker: probably she'd have.
26:19
Speaker: This has gotten a lot more attention, right?
26:22
Speaker: To be honest, it just didn't.
26:24
Speaker: Well, he said that there was
26:25
Speaker: people all around when they went
26:26
Speaker: in, right?
26:27
Speaker: Like.
26:27
Speaker: Right.
26:27
Speaker: And nobody says nobody saw anything.
26:29
Speaker: I mean, they have to believe the police must really believe all
26:33
Speaker: of the people in the house, or I could I cannot imagine that
26:36
Speaker: they'd all all be lying.
26:38
Speaker: Um, and having seen this killer come in, it seems like somebody
26:42
Speaker: would have said, oh, yeah, we saw this guy.
26:43
Speaker: And the fact that he.
26:44
Speaker: For sure, I don't know if, you know, somebody could have seen
26:47
Speaker: me or not.
26:47
Speaker: It seems like you'd remember if
26:48
Speaker: somebody saw you after you
26:50
Speaker: murdered somebody.
26:50
Speaker: Like it seems like that would stick in your head like, oh,
26:52
Speaker: yeah, there was a guy standing there and he'd be like, drenched
26:56
Speaker: in blood, probably, you know?
26:59
Speaker: Right.
27:00
Speaker: Um, but these people who were in this house, I think it's again,
27:04
Speaker: kind of like you.
27:05
Speaker: You were saying it's kind of a seedy neighborhood.
27:07
Speaker: And I, I don't think these are, you know, people up late
27:10
Speaker: studying kind of people.
27:11
Speaker: They're probably all Drunken high or whatever.
27:15
Speaker: So yeah, they might have just.
27:17
Speaker: If they did see something, they're not they weren't paying.
27:19
Speaker: Attention.
27:20
Speaker: I don't know, it's just a sad situation.
27:22
Speaker: Um, Sarah doesn't buy it.
27:24
Speaker: Um, so the and the case is still active.
27:27
Speaker: It's not closed.
27:28
Speaker: So I don't think the police
27:30
Speaker: necessarily buy his story
27:31
Speaker: either.
27:33
Speaker: Yeah.
27:34
Speaker: I mean, that mirror detail would definitely like, like be
27:39
Speaker: something that they would be able to check or they would
27:41
Speaker: like, know about, you know?
27:43
Speaker: Yeah.
27:44
Speaker: I mean, to me that's like an, if there was a, a weird mirror that
27:47
Speaker: had broken or something that would be a case closed situation
27:50
Speaker: in my mind, like what are the chances that he knows about a
27:52
Speaker: mirror that was broken?
27:54
Speaker: Um, was she killed in the bathroom or in her room?
27:57
Speaker: I don't know, I. Sarah had mentioned in, um, in a podcast
28:02
Speaker: that she was up in her room.
28:04
Speaker: So she mentioned that somebody
28:05
Speaker: would have had to have come in
28:06
Speaker: two doors in the bottom door and
28:08
Speaker: then gone upstairs and then gone
28:09
Speaker: into her bedroom or her
28:11
Speaker: apartment.
28:12
Speaker: Oh, I think she was killed in
28:14
Speaker: her apartment, which was
28:15
Speaker: upstairs.
28:16
Speaker: So it's not like somebody
28:17
Speaker: staggered in and randomly killed
28:20
Speaker: her.
28:20
Speaker: They would have had to have gone to her apartment.
28:23
Speaker: Um.
28:23
Speaker: Right.
28:24
Speaker: And what I understand about the
28:25
Speaker: house is that there was like a
28:27
Speaker: communal bathroom.
28:28
Speaker: And then each of like the then
28:30
Speaker: there was like little apartments
28:32
Speaker: throughout.
28:33
Speaker: Right?
28:34
Speaker: Right.
28:34
Speaker: It had been converted to multiple apartments.
28:36
Speaker: So but they all shared one bathroom.
28:38
Speaker: So, you know, people are coming, coming and going all the time.
28:41
Speaker: I assume that would be an interesting living situation.
28:45
Speaker: So. And then and then her mom's
28:48
Speaker: ex-boyfriend slash her
28:49
Speaker: boyfriend, he lived in the same
28:52
Speaker: apartment thing, but didn't she
28:54
Speaker: also have an ex-boyfriend that
28:55
Speaker: lived there?
28:56
Speaker: Yeah.
28:57
Speaker: So some of the early reports were, I think people were
29:00
Speaker: confused on the relationships.
29:01
Speaker: I think because some of the reports say, oh, yeah, an
29:04
Speaker: ex-boyfriend and her mom's ex-boyfriend lived there.
29:07
Speaker: That was the same person.
29:09
Speaker: I think.
29:10
Speaker: I don't think her she had an ex living there along with the guy
29:13
Speaker: she was dating, Mark, who was her mom's ex, but they have not
29:17
Speaker: released who these other people in the house were.
29:19
Speaker: Um, so I don't know.
29:21
Speaker: And then like the guy that came over to or that gave her money
29:25
Speaker: for the that I think maybe that's like he was getting drugs
29:29
Speaker: or getting like, uh, like paying for sex or something because
29:33
Speaker: like, why would he come over and give her money for the payphone
29:35
Speaker: and then leave and then come back to check or something like
29:39
Speaker: that doesn't sound right.
29:41
Speaker: That sounds like a story to me of some kind.
29:43
Speaker: Like he was buying like, I agree there was something else there.
29:46
Speaker: Like, why would you give some I
29:48
Speaker: mean, what is a phone call like
29:49
Speaker: a quarter at the time or
29:50
Speaker: something?
29:50
Speaker: Like when I came back, she's going to get it back like
29:53
Speaker: afterwards, like she had the money she would already like,
29:56
Speaker: why would she what did he think she was doing?
29:58
Speaker: Maybe she, he thought she was going to be earning some money
30:01
Speaker: doing something, and then he was going to come back and get the
30:03
Speaker: money, maybe see something about that doesn't make any sense.
30:06
Speaker: Yeah, definitely.
30:07
Speaker: And why would he come back to check on her?
30:09
Speaker: Like what?
30:10
Speaker: I hope the police ask these questions.
30:11
Speaker: That's all I have to say.
30:12
Speaker: Like, why did you think you needed to?
30:14
Speaker: Like, if I let someone borrow a dollar or whatever, it was like,
30:17
Speaker: I'm not going to at one o'clock in the morning, go to check on
30:21
Speaker: them an hour later.
30:22
Speaker: Oh, is everything still okay?
30:23
Speaker: You know, why would I do that?
30:25
Speaker: Yeah, that doesn't make it doesn't make sense.
30:28
Speaker: But again, we're dealing with
30:29
Speaker: some probably some interesting
30:30
Speaker: people here.
30:31
Speaker: Um, so Sarah, later on, like
30:33
Speaker: when she turns eighteen, starts
30:35
Speaker: investigating herself, like,
30:37
Speaker: she's like, she wants to find
30:38
Speaker: the answers.
30:39
Speaker: So she goes back to the house.
30:40
Speaker: Of course, the house has been, you know, knocked down.
30:43
Speaker: It's a vacant lot.
30:43
Speaker: But she goes around to the
30:44
Speaker: neighbors and starts asking them
30:46
Speaker: questions.
30:46
Speaker: And one of the neighbors that
30:48
Speaker: was living there at the time was
30:49
Speaker: still there.
30:51
Speaker: So she was asking him questions.
30:53
Speaker: And he said he distinctly remembers Elizabeth arguing with
30:58
Speaker: Mark in the yard that night.
31:01
Speaker: But Mark was working.
31:02
Speaker: So this is what the neighbor is saying.
31:04
Speaker: He he knew Mark?
31:05
Speaker: Apparently so.
31:07
Speaker: I don't know whether there's any if that's believable or not.
31:10
Speaker: I have no idea.
31:12
Speaker: Well, I can't decide if.
31:13
Speaker: I just don't like Mark because of what he did to like her
31:16
Speaker: little sisters and stuff.
31:18
Speaker: Or if, you know, because like, that's, that's a person that I'm
31:22
Speaker: like, oh, yeah, he did it.
31:23
Speaker: He's obviously a piece of crap, you know, like, right.
31:27
Speaker: But I mean, there's no shortage
31:28
Speaker: of reasons to not not like this
31:30
Speaker: guy.
31:30
Speaker: Um, but whether or not he did it, I mean, the police
31:34
Speaker: apparently have they checked out his alibi and they, they he's
31:38
Speaker: he's not a suspect.
31:40
Speaker: Apparently.
31:40
Speaker: For that reason, I would like to dig into more about his alibi.
31:44
Speaker: Like what?
31:45
Speaker: What did he say he was doing?
31:47
Speaker: And is it possible to, like, you
31:49
Speaker: know, fudge those records or
31:51
Speaker: whatever to say he was, you
31:52
Speaker: know, or did he pay somebody off
31:53
Speaker: to say he was there and he
31:54
Speaker: wasn't?
31:55
Speaker: Yeah.
31:56
Speaker: Because it just I know he's not a suspect and he was apparently
31:59
Speaker: working, but he's got to be at the top of the list.
32:01
Speaker: Then you have the serial killer
32:03
Speaker: coming forward saying he did it
32:04
Speaker: too.
32:04
Speaker: So do you.
32:06
Speaker: Did did he volunteer that, like without the podcast or bringing
32:10
Speaker: it up, or did the podcaster like, bring it up?
32:13
Speaker: He randomly brought it up in the middle of the episode like he's
32:16
Speaker: so he, the podcaster did.
32:20
Speaker: Had never heard of Elizabeth Bannister before.
32:22
Speaker: So in the middle of the podcast,
32:25
Speaker: he's talking about the other
32:26
Speaker: three murders, which are
32:27
Speaker: horrible.
32:27
Speaker: By the way, if you, if you're,
32:29
Speaker: if you're wanting to listen to
32:30
Speaker: those.
32:30
Speaker: But they're just horrible.
32:31
Speaker: But he, he starts digging for other cold case.
32:37
Speaker: You know, for him to drop hints
32:38
Speaker: about things and he, he just
32:39
Speaker: drops Elizabeth Bannister's name
32:41
Speaker: randomly.
32:41
Speaker: He didn't expect it.
32:42
Speaker: He was like, is this guy just feeding me full.
32:44
Speaker: Is he just feeding me crap?
32:46
Speaker: So he googles Elizabeth Bannister and finds out there is
32:49
Speaker: a cold case out of Evansville.
32:51
Speaker: And he's like, oh, maybe he's on to something here.
32:53
Speaker: And he just goes on from there.
32:54
Speaker: So he did not like, um, go into it thinking, oh, I'm gonna see
32:57
Speaker: if I can get him talking about Elizabeth Bannister or anything.
32:59
Speaker: He brought it up himself.
33:04
Speaker: I mean, he could have googled it or found cold cases and just
33:07
Speaker: randomly, you know, landed on that one, I guess.
33:11
Speaker: But it'd be strange.
33:12
Speaker: But I don't know what to think.
33:15
Speaker: It's, it's one of these things that you can kind of convince
33:17
Speaker: yourself of multiple people having done this.
33:20
Speaker: Well, I mean, any of those people, it seems like the the
33:23
Speaker: cops like would have moved forward on it if they're if it's
33:27
Speaker: still an active investigation, you know, and I've gone down
33:32
Speaker: some rabbit holes myself.
33:33
Speaker: I've there are ways to find out
33:34
Speaker: who lived in certain places at
33:36
Speaker: certain times.
33:37
Speaker: So I've gone through lists of
33:39
Speaker: people who I think might have
33:40
Speaker: been living there at that time
33:41
Speaker: and like done background
33:42
Speaker: searches to find out if there
33:44
Speaker: were someone who was there who
33:44
Speaker: was like, who's got some sort of
33:46
Speaker: seedy history that would be
33:47
Speaker: flagging me.
33:48
Speaker: But, you know, it's easy to get
33:49
Speaker: lost down these rabbit holes
33:51
Speaker: and, and you don't know what
33:52
Speaker: you're really going to find
33:54
Speaker: anyway.
33:54
Speaker: But, um, because the truth is,
33:56
Speaker: the people who rent these sorts
33:58
Speaker: of rooms are, are not model
34:01
Speaker: citizens.
34:02
Speaker: So almost all of them have like serious records.
34:05
Speaker: Um, because they, they need cheap places to live.
34:08
Speaker: And, you know, she probably accepted cash or something.
34:10
Speaker: I mean, you know what I mean?
34:10
Speaker: Like it's a certain kind of person is attracted to those
34:14
Speaker: kinds of places.
34:15
Speaker: So it's, you know, it's hard to kind of nail down who might be a
34:18
Speaker: suspect or who even was in the house at that time.
34:20
Speaker: I have to think that the owner of the house, the seventy year
34:23
Speaker: old lady, might have been one of, I don't know if she was one
34:25
Speaker: of the three or if she was in the basement and not even
34:27
Speaker: considered being there.
34:29
Speaker: I'm kind of confused on that.
34:31
Speaker: I don't know, it's kind of like
34:32
Speaker: funny to think of, I don't know,
34:34
Speaker: like an old lady in the
34:35
Speaker: basement.
34:35
Speaker: But it really, it really is.
34:39
Speaker: The whole situation is just bizarre.
34:41
Speaker: Um, yeah, it really is.
34:44
Speaker: I don't know.
34:45
Speaker: Uh, if you have any questions or
34:47
Speaker: anyone in the chat does, um, let
34:51
Speaker: me see.
34:51
Speaker: Sorry.
34:53
Speaker: Oh, it's Evansdale and Evansville.
34:56
Speaker: Evansville.
34:57
Speaker: That is a little confusing.
34:59
Speaker: Yeah.
35:00
Speaker: Evansville is in southern Indiana.
35:02
Speaker: Where's Evansdale?
35:04
Speaker: I'm not sure where Evansdale is.
35:06
Speaker: Let me look.
35:08
Speaker: Iowa.
35:08
Speaker: Apparently, Evansdale is in Iowa.
35:12
Speaker: Interesting.
35:12
Speaker: Um, well, yeah, I guess like
35:16
Speaker: with that case, I would say that
35:20
Speaker: that, um.
35:22
Speaker: Yeah, this person said probably
35:23
Speaker: walking from or to the payphone,
35:28
Speaker: like that guy could have like
35:30
Speaker: picked her up, I think is what
35:31
Speaker: they're saying.
35:33
Speaker: Um, and she had only lived.
35:34
Speaker: I'm kind of looking through my notes here.
35:36
Speaker: Um, she had dropped out of high school.
35:38
Speaker: She didn't finish high school.
35:39
Speaker: She had, um, she worked at rallies, which is like a fast
35:42
Speaker: food restaurant in Evansville and the west side of Evansville.
35:45
Speaker: Prior to her, a few months prior to her death, she had worked,
35:49
Speaker: um, at rallies.
35:51
Speaker: According to one of her
35:51
Speaker: coworkers who was apparently a
35:53
Speaker: friend of hers, she only lived
35:55
Speaker: there at the apartment for a few
35:56
Speaker: weeks, apparently before she was
35:58
Speaker: murdered there.
36:00
Speaker: Oh. Her sister.
36:01
Speaker: The last thing that she told her was she hated her.
36:04
Speaker: That's sad.
36:04
Speaker: Oh, what's kind of strange about Sarah?
36:07
Speaker: She talks about.
36:08
Speaker: And there's a podcast called
36:09
Speaker: Dealing Justice, where Sarah
36:12
Speaker: talks about, um, her sister's
36:14
Speaker: case.
36:14
Speaker: And she mentions that on the
36:17
Speaker: night that Elizabeth was
36:18
Speaker: murdered.
36:19
Speaker: So she was murdered around, um,
36:21
Speaker: the police were called and
36:23
Speaker: arrived at one eleven a m on
36:25
Speaker: January twentieth.
36:27
Speaker: So around one eleven a m is when all that happened.
36:29
Speaker: Apparently, the night of
36:31
Speaker: Elizabeth's murder, Sarah had a
36:33
Speaker: dream that Elizabeth was running
36:36
Speaker: through the woods, being chased
36:38
Speaker: by someone with a knife and
36:39
Speaker: being killed by someone with a
36:40
Speaker: knife.
36:41
Speaker: And Sarah wakes up at one oh four one oh two one oh three a
36:45
Speaker: m. You know, in a panic thinking, oh my God, Elizabeth
36:48
Speaker: just got stabbed.
36:50
Speaker: And little did she know that, you know, one, she probably had
36:53
Speaker: been at that time.
36:54
Speaker: So very strange.
36:56
Speaker: And I'm not saying she's a suspect or anything, but it's
37:00
Speaker: just really bizarre.
37:01
Speaker: And then she, you know, they had
37:02
Speaker: the the fight was the last real
37:04
Speaker: conversation.
37:06
Speaker: She later went through her, um,
37:08
Speaker: Sarah was going through
37:09
Speaker: Elizabeth's things later on and
37:12
Speaker: found a note that Elizabeth had
37:14
Speaker: written to Sarah that said, I'm
37:17
Speaker: sorry I forgive you, Sarah, I
37:19
Speaker: love you.
37:20
Speaker: So she never.
37:20
Speaker: That's way cool, at least.
37:22
Speaker: Yeah, she did find that.
37:23
Speaker: So she, of course, broke down, uh, after finding that.
37:26
Speaker: But I guess she never gave it to Sarah.
37:28
Speaker: But she found that in her stuff.
37:30
Speaker: So just a horrible story all around, basically.
37:35
Speaker: Yeah, totally.
37:38
Speaker: Yeah.
37:38
Speaker: Um, I think I have another clip we could watch really quick.
37:42
Speaker: Okay.
37:42
Speaker: Um, let me share my screen.
37:48
Speaker: Oh, uh, somebody asked, was the
37:50
Speaker: murder weapon found in DNA and
37:52
Speaker: fingerprints?
37:53
Speaker: Cryptex.
37:54
Speaker: Was it?
37:55
Speaker: Yeah.
37:55
Speaker: Um, the murder weapon was never found, as far as I know.
38:00
Speaker: Um, so they say that a knife was
38:03
Speaker: never found on the scene or
38:04
Speaker: whatever.
38:04
Speaker: So whoever took off took off
38:06
Speaker: with the murder weapon, they
38:07
Speaker: say.
38:08
Speaker: It's possible that they're not releasing that information.
38:11
Speaker: Um, and the last we heard was
38:13
Speaker: they were doing DNA testing on
38:15
Speaker: William Clyde Gibson to see if
38:17
Speaker: any of the DNA matched whatever
38:19
Speaker: they might have found at the
38:20
Speaker: time.
38:20
Speaker: The serial killer.
38:22
Speaker: That's the serial killer.
38:23
Speaker: And nothing has ever been released on that.
38:25
Speaker: So, I mean, that's been enough
38:27
Speaker: time where they'd have some
38:28
Speaker: information, but there's no news
38:30
Speaker: on that.
38:30
Speaker: So I don't know if they've also factored that in to the fact
38:33
Speaker: that they've they're not really taking him seriously.
38:36
Speaker: Yeah, probably.
38:37
Speaker: Huh.
38:38
Speaker: Okay, so we can watch this clip really quick.
38:41
Speaker: Or maybe we'll watch the whole thing, I don't know, we'll see
38:44
Speaker: how good it is.
38:45
Speaker: Sure.
38:45
Speaker: It's two decades after the murder of their loved one.
38:48
Speaker: It's a story we first brought you on Monday.
38:51
Speaker: And tonight, Another family member says it has more
38:55
Speaker: questions than answers, and there may be a potential break
38:59
Speaker: in the case.
39:00
Speaker: Eyewitness news Noah Alonso has the latest on the investigation.
39:05
Speaker: I feel like I've been I feel like me and my siblings, my
39:07
Speaker: family have been disrespected.
39:09
Speaker: Somebody on the inside is trying
39:12
Speaker: to use their authority and their
39:16
Speaker: power to cover something else
39:19
Speaker: up.
39:20
Speaker: It's a story.
39:20
Speaker: Eyewitness news first brought
39:22
Speaker: you on Monday, a potential break
39:24
Speaker: in a cold case from two
39:25
Speaker: thousand.
39:26
Speaker: The family of Elizabeth Bannister is keeping up the
39:29
Speaker: pressure tonight, as a private investigator now says agents are
39:32
Speaker: nearing closure on the case.
39:34
Speaker: One of Bannister's sisters, Rebecca Swett, says she still
39:38
Speaker: has many questions.
39:40
Speaker: They all ruled them.
39:40
Speaker: The police force ruled everybody out.
39:43
Speaker: It makes no sense.
39:45
Speaker: I don't understand this at all.
39:47
Speaker: Then nobody heard anything strange.
39:49
Speaker: Okay, so all of a sudden somebody goes in there and they
39:52
Speaker: see her stabbed multiple times.
39:54
Speaker: Okay, uh, three people in the apartment at the time, it says,
39:57
Speaker: and it says at the time, uh, never saw anyone break in.
40:02
Speaker: Okay.
40:03
Speaker: But an elderly, elderly neighbor
40:05
Speaker: saw a African American man, uh,
40:11
Speaker: flu.
40:11
Speaker: Flu?
40:12
Speaker: The flu vaccine.
40:13
Speaker: The family says they are fed up
40:15
Speaker: with the response from
40:16
Speaker: Evansville police.
40:18
Speaker: I feel like they did absolutely nothing.
40:19
Speaker: All they did was go and talk to people that were around there
40:22
Speaker: that were supposedly around at the time of her death.
40:25
Speaker: Then what?
40:26
Speaker: Okay, shake it off.
40:27
Speaker: No suspects.
40:28
Speaker: Rule out two weeks later.
40:30
Speaker: Cold case and a promise from a family still reeling from a
40:34
Speaker: tragic death twenty years ago to never give up.
40:37
Speaker: I just want people to know that I'm not blaming.
40:40
Speaker: I'm not pointing fingers at anybody.
40:41
Speaker: But if you really look at this case, if you really sit down and
40:45
Speaker: look at this case and take all of the articles that were from
40:49
Speaker: point A to point B to the from the beginning to the end.
40:54
Speaker: Take them and compare them and they make no sense.
40:58
Speaker: I just feel like they need to
40:59
Speaker: start doing more work in
41:00
Speaker: Evansville.
41:01
Speaker: Noah Alonso, Eyewitness News.
41:03
Speaker: We reached out to the Evansville Police Department earlier this
41:07
Speaker: week, and we were told that detectives are looking at a
41:10
Speaker: possible person of interest.
41:12
Speaker: We'll pass along more
41:12
Speaker: information as soon as it
41:14
Speaker: becomes available.
41:17
Speaker: Yeah.
41:17
Speaker: Fifteen people of interest.
41:19
Speaker: That's weird that like the they said that the private
41:22
Speaker: investigator said something, but they didn't, like, say anything
41:25
Speaker: about what it was.
41:25
Speaker: That's I don't know, I guess
41:27
Speaker: it's maybe it's not weird, but
41:29
Speaker: yeah, I think and I think the
41:32
Speaker: person of interest, I think is
41:33
Speaker: when they were talking about
41:34
Speaker: the, the serial killer, William
41:36
Speaker: Clyde Gibson, I think that was
41:38
Speaker: coming out with, you know,
41:39
Speaker: they're looking into him, um, at
41:40
Speaker: that time.
41:41
Speaker: So I don't know if that was the person they were talking about
41:43
Speaker: as the person of interest.
41:45
Speaker: Oh I see yeah.
41:46
Speaker: I'm not aware that there was another.
41:47
Speaker: There's been another person of interest other than him.
41:50
Speaker: After that podcast came out in twenty twenty three.
41:53
Speaker: So yeah, I think Mark, I think it's Mark.
41:56
Speaker: I don't know, right.
41:58
Speaker: And actually, I have another clip, um, of Sarah talking about
42:02
Speaker: Mark a little bit more.
42:03
Speaker: If you, if you want to hear about that.
42:04
Speaker: Um, yeah, it's kind of her
42:05
Speaker: talking about Mark and how he
42:07
Speaker: treated them and it's coming
42:08
Speaker: from her.
42:09
Speaker: It sounds a little better than me saying it, but, uh, let me.
42:14
Speaker: Right.
42:14
Speaker: And then this, uh, Cryptex asked sensitive question.
42:17
Speaker: Could it be drug related?
42:19
Speaker: I mean, oh, I, I that could certainly be on the table with,
42:23
Speaker: uh, a drug deal gone.
42:24
Speaker: Right?
42:24
Speaker: Well, considering the she borrowed money for a phone call,
42:28
Speaker: and who knows if that wasn't really drug money to go get
42:31
Speaker: drugs and somebody, uh, I would say it could be, I think
42:36
Speaker: anything is on the table here.
42:37
Speaker: And then like the person, the
42:40
Speaker: person running out, like maybe
42:43
Speaker: could be like the dealer or a
42:45
Speaker: John if she was being a
42:47
Speaker: prostitute.
42:47
Speaker: That's a high risk occupation.
42:49
Speaker: So it is.
42:51
Speaker: Yeah.
42:51
Speaker: And I mean, it could even be a
42:54
Speaker: situation where she was murdered
42:56
Speaker: in her apartment and some other
42:57
Speaker: guy was going up there to do
42:58
Speaker: something and finds her and then
43:00
Speaker: runs.
43:01
Speaker: He freaks out and runs out.
43:02
Speaker: You know, it might be the guy that ran away.
43:03
Speaker: He wasn't.
43:04
Speaker: You know what I mean?
43:05
Speaker: Like, I think anything is possible at this point.
43:07
Speaker: Like she could have been there for drugs or, you know, for any
43:11
Speaker: number of reasons and ran out if that even happened.
43:13
Speaker: I mean, that's just the neighbor
43:14
Speaker: saying it, but I mean, I don't
43:15
Speaker: again, I don't know why the
43:16
Speaker: neighbor would make that up,
43:17
Speaker: but.
43:18
Speaker: Well, she was elderly.
43:19
Speaker: And so I don't know how good her site is or like all, there's a
43:23
Speaker: lot of questions there.
43:24
Speaker: What was she doing up at one o'clock in the morning?
43:26
Speaker: Yeah.
43:26
Speaker: I don't know.
43:27
Speaker: The neighbor.
43:28
Speaker: I think it was a man, but I
43:29
Speaker: don't know if they've named who
43:30
Speaker: the neighbor was that saw the
43:31
Speaker: African American running out,
43:33
Speaker: did they?
43:33
Speaker: Oh, I thought, I thought it was
43:34
Speaker: that older lady that they
43:35
Speaker: showed, but that probably
43:36
Speaker: wasn't.
43:37
Speaker: Oh, it might have been, I don't know.
43:39
Speaker: Yeah.
43:39
Speaker: They probably wouldn't show who the eyewitness was.
43:42
Speaker: They might not.
43:43
Speaker: I wouldn't want my name anywhere around this case.
43:45
Speaker: Uh, honestly.
43:46
Speaker: Yeah.
43:47
Speaker: As somebody who's a witness anyway.
43:50
Speaker: Mhm.
43:50
Speaker: All right, let me get this cued up.
43:53
Speaker: Yeah, I don't know.
43:54
Speaker: Like, I always thought it was evansdale, too.
43:56
Speaker: Maybe it's always been Evansville.
43:59
Speaker: That's crazy.
44:03
Speaker: We only make the news for bad
44:05
Speaker: things when there's a tragedy or
44:07
Speaker: drug things.
44:07
Speaker: It's like, oh, we were like the
44:08
Speaker: meth capital of the world and
44:10
Speaker: and stuff.
44:11
Speaker: Oh, that's that's something to be proud of right there.
44:13
Speaker: Exactly.
44:14
Speaker: So it's like, can we not ever win any nice awards?
44:19
Speaker: I guess I wouldn't have material for my podcast if we did.
44:21
Speaker: Yeah.
44:23
Speaker: All right.
44:24
Speaker: And this is a clip from the
44:25
Speaker: Dealing Justice podcast season
44:27
Speaker: one, episode eight, where
44:29
Speaker: they're talking to Sara
44:30
Speaker: Elizabeth's sister about the
44:32
Speaker: case.
44:34
Speaker: Mark was not a good man, and I think everybody knew that.
44:37
Speaker: My mother, I love her to death, but she, uh, she tended to be
44:41
Speaker: with men who were very abusive towards her and us.
44:46
Speaker: My mom just never believed the
44:47
Speaker: stories that we would try to
44:48
Speaker: tell her.
44:49
Speaker: When it came to her boyfriends, Mark broke my finger trying to
44:54
Speaker: spank me with a belt.
44:56
Speaker: Um, Mark was a truck driver and, um, we were made to go with him.
45:03
Speaker: We didn't have a choice.
45:05
Speaker: Give my mom a so-called break.
45:07
Speaker: He wanted us to take turns, and
45:10
Speaker: I would go with him one time,
45:12
Speaker: and then my sister would go with
45:14
Speaker: him.
45:14
Speaker: Another time.
45:15
Speaker: He would take you and your other sister, though.
45:17
Speaker: On the truck ride, not Elizabeth Wright.
45:19
Speaker: It was just you and your other sister.
45:21
Speaker: Me and Rebecca.
45:23
Speaker: He would take on truck rides.
45:25
Speaker: I didn't want to go because of.
45:26
Speaker: Okay, he's already putting his hands on me like I was scared.
45:31
Speaker: You know, I didn't want to go.
45:32
Speaker: I begged my mom not to make me go.
45:36
Speaker: And she would make me go like you can't.
45:39
Speaker: We wanted to go.
45:40
Speaker: Me and my sister wants to go together.
45:42
Speaker: And he said no. But he never would let two of us go.
45:47
Speaker: He'd only do one.
45:48
Speaker: Each one of us.
45:49
Speaker: One.
45:49
Speaker: One at a time.
45:51
Speaker: Now I know why.
45:52
Speaker: Well, when I was in the truck with him, I was eight years old.
45:57
Speaker: And he told me he wants her.
45:59
Speaker: Those were his words.
46:01
Speaker: He wants her.
46:03
Speaker: And I had no idea what he was talking about.
46:06
Speaker: And I asked him, what do you.
46:08
Speaker: What are you talking about?
46:10
Speaker: He pointed to what he was talking about.
46:12
Speaker: He would point.
46:13
Speaker: Only Mark and Sara were in the truck together.
46:16
Speaker: So that means when Mark was pointing and saying her, he was
46:20
Speaker: pointing at Sara.
46:24
Speaker: And he said he wants her as he
46:27
Speaker: pointed to what he was talking
46:28
Speaker: about.
46:29
Speaker: I was scared.
46:30
Speaker: I told him no. And he writes me.
46:38
Speaker: He ain't years old.
46:39
Speaker: You don't think parents are
46:41
Speaker: telling you, I'm sorry, I didn't
46:42
Speaker: mean to hurt you, yada yada
46:43
Speaker: yada.
46:43
Speaker: You're going to believe it.
46:44
Speaker: You know?
46:44
Speaker: You're going to believe it because you, you you love them
46:48
Speaker: or you care about them.
46:49
Speaker: I never talked about it.
46:51
Speaker: The only person I ever told was my sister.
46:54
Speaker: So as I got older, when my
46:56
Speaker: sister was murdered, me and my
46:59
Speaker: adopted mom, I told my adopted
47:01
Speaker: mom.
47:02
Speaker: I remember we were in the
47:03
Speaker: bathroom and she was doing my
47:05
Speaker: hair.
47:05
Speaker: We were talking and I told her, I told her, I told her
47:09
Speaker: everything that I just mentioned and she said, Sarah, why have
47:14
Speaker: you not told me this before?
47:18
Speaker: I was scared, I was scared like I was going to get beat.
47:22
Speaker: I was going to get.
47:24
Speaker: Nobody would believe me, I was terrified.
47:27
Speaker: She reported to the authorities.
47:29
Speaker: She did call them and she
47:31
Speaker: reported everything that I told
47:32
Speaker: her.
47:33
Speaker: They spoke with me and then they spoke back with her.
47:36
Speaker: According to authorities, there
47:39
Speaker: is nothing that they can do
47:40
Speaker: because they don't know where to
47:44
Speaker: happen.
47:46
Speaker: Given that I was in a semi truck, you know, one of those
47:49
Speaker: ones with the bed in it, you know, because you go over state
47:52
Speaker: lines or I couldn't verify that it happened here at one point
47:56
Speaker: because not every time.
47:57
Speaker: I mean, it happened twice.
48:00
Speaker: So before we got taken again.
48:03
Speaker: So I'm not sure like where it happened.
48:08
Speaker: I don't know any of that.
48:09
Speaker: And because we don't know that information.
48:11
Speaker: They're saying that there's nothing they could do.
48:14
Speaker: There's even more shocking
48:16
Speaker: information to come involving
48:17
Speaker: Mark.
48:18
Speaker: Their mother, Rose, was guilty of having terrible taste in men.
48:21
Speaker: But one thing Sarah does insist upon was, despite it all, she
48:25
Speaker: loved her mother.
48:26
Speaker: I mean, my mother.
48:27
Speaker: I love her dearly, and I will always love her.
48:29
Speaker: And I don't blame her for anything.
48:31
Speaker: She.
48:31
Speaker: You know, she bought us what she could.
48:33
Speaker: She fed us.
48:34
Speaker: She had a bed for us.
48:36
Speaker: She had bedrooms like she had all that.
48:39
Speaker: It was just her health conditions were wearing in on
48:42
Speaker: her and we were molested and abused in the home, but it was
48:47
Speaker: never by her.
48:49
Speaker: She had a lot of health problems.
48:51
Speaker: Rose's health continued to
48:53
Speaker: deteriorate, and as Elizabeth
48:55
Speaker: was turning seventeen, Rose was
48:57
Speaker: able to get custody back of
48:58
Speaker: Elizabeth.
49:00
Speaker: Elizabeth moved in with her mom and Mark, and she helped care
49:03
Speaker: for her ailing mother.
49:05
Speaker: In nineteen ninety seven,
49:06
Speaker: Elizabeth and Sara's mother
49:07
Speaker: passed away.
49:08
Speaker: Elizabeth was there.
49:09
Speaker: I guess she found her body, I think is what happened.
49:13
Speaker: She had emphysema.
49:14
Speaker: When they did the autopsy, they
49:15
Speaker: found out that she had
49:16
Speaker: emphysema.
49:17
Speaker: And they claimed that she died of emphysema.
49:21
Speaker: I mean, how old was she when she passed away?
49:23
Speaker: She was.
49:23
Speaker: How old do I think she was in her thirties.
49:27
Speaker: Elizabeth was not yet eighteen when her mom died.
49:30
Speaker: So after she lost her mother,
49:32
Speaker: she was briefly put into a group
49:34
Speaker: home until she aged out of the
49:36
Speaker: system, and then she moved in
49:39
Speaker: with Mark.
49:40
Speaker: That's right.
49:41
Speaker: She moved in with the same man
49:42
Speaker: who took Sarah on those truck
49:44
Speaker: driving runs.
49:45
Speaker: And this is where it comes with.
49:46
Speaker: When I said I was angry with Elizabeth because she knew.
49:50
Speaker: She knew what happened to me.
49:52
Speaker: And she started living with him when she got the group home.
49:54
Speaker: Elizabeth and Mark weren't just roommates either.
49:57
Speaker: He asked her to marry him, is what she told me, and I thought
50:03
Speaker: it was immoral.
50:04
Speaker: I thought it was wrong.
50:06
Speaker: He was engaged to my mother, and I told her if she did, I would
50:11
Speaker: never speak to her again and that I. I hated her for it.
50:18
Speaker: Yeah, it's pretty horrible.
50:20
Speaker: Well, I mean, it it it does kind
50:22
Speaker: of like, um, make sense because
50:24
Speaker: he was like grooming her
50:26
Speaker: obviously.
50:27
Speaker: Right.
50:27
Speaker: She wasn't eighteen yet.
50:28
Speaker: So like it's not really like her fault.
50:32
Speaker: You get like a skewed vision of like what?
50:35
Speaker: Like, you know, love or caring is so.
50:38
Speaker: Yeah.
50:39
Speaker: And according to Kelly Fontaine and Kelly Fontaine was the
50:43
Speaker: foster mother for Elizabeth for a number of years.
50:46
Speaker: I think she was between twelve and seventeen years old.
50:49
Speaker: So she had a big part of her life at that time.
50:51
Speaker: And Kelly says that Elizabeth was kind of like mentally
50:55
Speaker: stunted as an eight.
50:56
Speaker: Basically, she was a, you know, a seventeen year old with an
50:59
Speaker: eight year old mentality.
51:01
Speaker: She never really, you know,
51:03
Speaker: progressed past that sort of
51:05
Speaker: mentality.
51:05
Speaker: So yeah, it's definitely I could
51:07
Speaker: see how she might fall into
51:08
Speaker: this.
51:09
Speaker: With Mark, I guess.
51:11
Speaker: Yeah.
51:12
Speaker: Yeah.
51:13
Speaker: It does not sound like a very nice guy for sure.
51:16
Speaker: No, no. So I don't know what you know.
51:19
Speaker: I don't know what's become of
51:20
Speaker: Mark or, you know, what he's
51:22
Speaker: doing.
51:22
Speaker: Uh, hopefully he's moved on to good things in his life, and
51:26
Speaker: he's not continuing this sort of behavior, but I don't know.
51:29
Speaker: I seriously doubt I have no hopes for that.
51:32
Speaker: Really?
51:33
Speaker: Uh. Sounds like he was doing it for years and years.
51:36
Speaker: And it's not like a one time thing.
51:38
Speaker: Yeah, I'd be curious to know.
51:40
Speaker: Like, I mean, I hope the police that are investigating this look
51:43
Speaker: into that sort of thing and like, oh, he's involved in
51:46
Speaker: another disappearance or this weird thing happened over here.
51:48
Speaker: You know, I hope people are
51:49
Speaker: connecting these dots, but I,
51:51
Speaker: I've looked into these things
51:52
Speaker: long enough to know that they
51:53
Speaker: don't like, like, I don't think
51:55
Speaker: there's a lot of follow up or
51:57
Speaker: things.
51:57
Speaker: I think that's why like internet sleuths need to kind of connect
52:00
Speaker: dots for, for them sometimes because I don't think they do.
52:03
Speaker: They don't have the resources a lot of times to, to, especially
52:06
Speaker: if they moved out of the area.
52:07
Speaker: If he's living in.
52:09
Speaker: Well, as far as I know, I think he is living out of state.
52:11
Speaker: Uh, from what I found, but, uh,
52:13
Speaker: did he move like right after the
52:14
Speaker: murders or or the not long
52:17
Speaker: after?
52:17
Speaker: Yeah.
52:19
Speaker: It's from what I can tell, he's
52:20
Speaker: he's he's living out of state,
52:22
Speaker: so I haven't really looked in to
52:23
Speaker: see if, you know, if there are
52:25
Speaker: criminal records up there or
52:26
Speaker: whatever, you know, that kind of
52:28
Speaker: thing.
52:28
Speaker: But I mean, like, if they got in
52:30
Speaker: a fight in the yard and then
52:33
Speaker: that happened.
52:34
Speaker: Nobody heard.
52:34
Speaker: Nobody heard it in the house, like quote unquote.
52:38
Speaker: Like, I don't know, he just
52:39
Speaker: seems like definitely one to
52:42
Speaker: look at.
52:43
Speaker: It's also, it's unbelievable for
52:44
Speaker: me that no one heard anything in
52:46
Speaker: the house.
52:46
Speaker: I just can't believe it.
52:47
Speaker: Like somebody got murdered.
52:49
Speaker: Like there was a I had to be a
52:50
Speaker: fight or something and nobody
52:51
Speaker: heard anything.
52:52
Speaker: But.
52:52
Speaker: Well, you said that, um, the
52:54
Speaker: first stab got hurt, like got
52:56
Speaker: hurt.
52:57
Speaker: Right?
52:57
Speaker: Oh, maybe if he just walked in and did it, then maybe there was
53:00
Speaker: no noise and it just, you know, but if he was in a rage, if he's
53:05
Speaker: stabbing and I mean, I don't know, maybe there was a loud
53:07
Speaker: music or something.
53:08
Speaker: Maybe there was I, I don't know, seems like somebody.
53:12
Speaker: I'm in the bathroom.
53:13
Speaker: Like what you were in the bathroom for what?
53:15
Speaker: For when were you in the bathroom?
53:16
Speaker: Like exactly that moment.
53:17
Speaker: How did you know that?
53:18
Speaker: That was the moment that that was happening?
53:20
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, you know what I mean?
53:22
Speaker: Like, I was in the bathroom at that time.
53:23
Speaker: Well, at what time?
53:25
Speaker: She was found at one.
53:27
Speaker: But that doesn't mean that's when she was actually killed.
53:29
Speaker: Huh?
53:30
Speaker: She was killed.
53:31
Speaker: Well, so the the timeline is
53:32
Speaker: between midnight and one was
53:34
Speaker: when she was killed because the
53:36
Speaker: guy let her borrow the money at
53:38
Speaker: around midnight.
53:39
Speaker: He says.
53:40
Speaker: And so when he comes back at one o'clock or whatever, you know,
53:43
Speaker: she's has been murdered.
53:45
Speaker: So it's between midnight and one a m that, according to the
53:48
Speaker: timeline from that guy that she borrowed money from, that would
53:51
Speaker: be the timeline.
53:52
Speaker: And the coroner, uh, Annie
53:54
Speaker: Groves says that she had been
53:55
Speaker: dead a very short period of
53:56
Speaker: time.
53:57
Speaker: So she.
53:59
Speaker: Yeah, it was not it was it was between midnight and one that
54:03
Speaker: that actually happened.
54:04
Speaker: Yeah.
54:05
Speaker: So I would think that like,
54:06
Speaker: maybe the music wouldn't be loud
54:08
Speaker: then, but I don't really know
54:09
Speaker: because I'm like, that's past
54:12
Speaker: the time you should have your
54:12
Speaker: music loud.
54:13
Speaker: But I know that people don't
54:15
Speaker: like follow the rules a lot, you
54:16
Speaker: know?
54:17
Speaker: Yeah.
54:17
Speaker: And if I mean, you have an old lady living in the basement,
54:19
Speaker: you've got somebody asleep on a couch, passed out drunk or
54:22
Speaker: whatever, and you've got somebody in the bathroom and
54:24
Speaker: somebody's watching Matlock.
54:25
Speaker: Somebody's watching.
54:26
Speaker: Matlock is probably not, you know.
54:29
Speaker: You know, screaming Metallica or something.
54:31
Speaker: You know, whatever they were listening to at that time.
54:33
Speaker: Um, it could have been somebody listening to music, but I don't
54:36
Speaker: know who it would have been because they were all they all
54:37
Speaker: seemed to have an alibi.
54:38
Speaker: Was the guy in the bathroom listening to music?
54:40
Speaker: Um, yeah.
54:41
Speaker: Yeah, I don't know.
54:44
Speaker: I don't know.
54:45
Speaker: So I don't know that we're ever
54:46
Speaker: going to find an answer on this
54:47
Speaker: one.
54:47
Speaker: But hopefully, hopefully they do get some answers.
54:52
Speaker: If you have any information on Elizabeth's case that you think
54:55
Speaker: may be relevant, call the Evansville Police Department at
54:58
Speaker: eight one two four three six seven nine seven nine.
55:03
Speaker: Even if you think it's an insignificant detail, maybe
55:06
Speaker: it'll be that one thing that helps crack the case.
55:08
Speaker: And be sure to check out the links.
55:09
Speaker: I have links to all of the
55:10
Speaker: podcasts we referenced today, as
55:12
Speaker: well as Savannah's YouTube
55:14
Speaker: channel, as well as my discord
55:16
Speaker: server if you want to check that
55:17
Speaker: out.
55:17
Speaker: Thank you for listening and until next time, take care.