Latest / Cosmic Peach / Murders, Occult Symbolism & Killers (Feat. William Ramsey)

Transcript

Murders, Occult Symbolism & Killers (Feat. William Ramsey) · Cosmic Peach

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Baby, I'm a gangstato.
• 0:02
  Speaker 2: It takes out a tangle.
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: You don't mess with me, baby, I'm a gangsta.
• 0:09
  Speaker 2: Touch baby, you're a Gangstattoo.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: For the warners, this podcast is designed to take you
• 0:26
  Speaker 1: outside of your comfort zone and make you question reality.
• 0:30
  Speaker 1: Listener Discretion is a vibe the fellas. This ain't my
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: first time at the rodeos, William Ramsey, It's been a
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: long time actually, I think maybe even about a year
• 0:58
  Speaker 1: since we've talked. How are you?
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: How are you?
• 1:02
  Speaker 3: How was your Christmas?
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: It's good, it was good. I'm interested to see what
• 1:08
  Speaker 1: it's gonna break loose in the new year. Not gonna lie.
• 1:11
  Speaker 1: Do you have any predictions for us?
• 1:15
  Speaker 3: I think it's just gonna be more chaos and trouble,
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: So I'm not so.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: I love you. I have no idea, you know. I
• 1:24
  Speaker 1: spoke with the guests recently and they were talking about
• 1:26
  Speaker 1: how the pendulum swings and right now we're super super
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: far left, and we'll gradually head to like super super
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: far right, and I don't know, it's just like a
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: pattern kind of throughout time. So I don't know.
• 1:41
  Speaker 3: We'll see, Yeah, we will see. I mean, it pretends
• 1:46
  Speaker 3: to be very interesting coming. I think that I'll be
• 1:50
  Speaker 3: surprised if Trump even gets into office. Thing, he's got
• 1:53
  Speaker 3: to really twenty more days. Yeah, so try to kill
• 1:56
  Speaker 3: him at least twice that we don't so who knows
• 1:58
  Speaker 3: next one will be like go truck bomb or something
• 2:01
  Speaker 3: like that. Right, they're scared. I think they're scared of
• 2:04
  Speaker 3: all the prime with some of the bags of mine. Actually,
• 2:07
  Speaker 3: the accountability this time because he seemed to angrycently may
• 2:11
  Speaker 3: not be a peaceful transference now, so we'll.
• 2:15
  Speaker 1: Have to see. Well, I actually have been kind of
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: looking into something recently and I think you might actually
• 2:25
  Speaker 1: know about it. I first discovered Dave McGowan from looking
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: into the Laurel Canyon and I read strange scenes from
• 2:35
  Speaker 1: the canyon, and then I've recently kind of been diving
• 2:39
  Speaker 1: into one of his other books, which is Programmed to Kill.
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: And I'm sure you're familiar with that one. Have you
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: ever read it?
• 2:46
  Speaker 3: I've read it many times. I read it again. I've
• 2:48
  Speaker 3: done a show on it. So I did a show
• 2:51
  Speaker 3: on program to Kill with Tom and Brett of SAP Cinema,
• 2:54
  Speaker 3: so we kind of reviewed it. So I would say
• 2:57
  Speaker 3: I'm very familiar with it. It's a seminal book. It's
• 2:59
  Speaker 3: a very important book when you think about it. From
• 3:02
  Speaker 3: two thousand and four. This is kind of the beginnings
• 3:04
  Speaker 3: of the Internet. What he achieved and what he was
• 3:06
  Speaker 3: able to compile for me is extraordinary, and.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: I think that a lot of times we get stuck
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: on like the serial killer aspect of it. But there's
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: like four or five chapters in the beginning when he
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: breaks down all these pedophile rings and like the Belgian
• 3:30
  Speaker 1: beast I think is what they called him, Mark Dutroux,
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: and he had all those little girls like buried all
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: over his property and stuff. Those are the kind of
• 3:40
  Speaker 1: things that people really don't even know about.
• 3:44
  Speaker 3: They don't know how dark it was. The dutro was
• 3:46
  Speaker 3: very very dark. I mean, that's an incredible story. I've
• 3:48
  Speaker 3: interviewed people from Belgium about that. And there was actually
• 3:52
  Speaker 3: a massive cover up, so much like the scandal that
• 3:56
  Speaker 3: happened in Omaha, Nebraska that was covered by a couple
• 3:59
  Speaker 3: of journals. But this is like, not only were they
• 4:03
  Speaker 3: trafficking kids and Dutroux was networked, but they're like people
• 4:07
  Speaker 3: kids who died in dungeons and stuff. But it went
• 4:10
  Speaker 3: through the whole system in Belgium, like it reached to
• 4:13
  Speaker 3: the top and implicated a lot of landed gentry like
• 4:17
  Speaker 3: people who are the aristocracy there. But then when he
• 4:20
  Speaker 3: got caught, like twenty five people around him died. So
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: it's clearly a pretty intense cover up as well. But yeah,
• 4:27
  Speaker 3: super dark.
• 4:29
  Speaker 1: And so what did you think. I know you've talked
• 4:33
  Speaker 1: about the Smiley Face killers a lot, what did you
• 4:37
  Speaker 1: think after it started getting into some of the more
• 4:41
  Speaker 1: well known serial killers, the gay Sy and the Dohmer
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: and the Bundy. So a lot of the crimes that
• 4:47
  Speaker 1: have been attributed to them don't even make sense for
• 4:50
  Speaker 1: them to have committed the crime. And a lot of
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: the Ted Bundy victims are like Smiley Face victims. They've
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: been they found out, they've been hell somewhere for like
• 5:00
  Speaker 1: a week and tortured and then they're drained of blood
• 5:04
  Speaker 1: and then their bodies just pop up somewhere else. And
• 5:06
  Speaker 1: then there was one of the gay Sy victims that
• 5:09
  Speaker 1: turned up in a river or something like that.
• 5:11
  Speaker 3: Last four, the last four Gaycy victims were all disposed
• 5:15
  Speaker 3: of in southern Chicago in a river, so very much
• 5:19
  Speaker 3: like the Atlanta child murders.
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: By the way, what do you think, Like, could it
• 5:23
  Speaker 1: be possible for the whole smiley faceing to have gone
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: back even further than we can imagine? Like and some
• 5:31
  Speaker 1: of these victims that they put on, these serial killers
• 5:34
  Speaker 1: Ted Bundy, Gayzy, I don't even think they did it,
• 5:38
  Speaker 1: like some of them, they weren't even in town, Like
• 5:41
  Speaker 1: it's crazy.
• 5:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah, No, I think you're right, and I think it's
• 5:44
  Speaker 3: an interesting thing. Gaysey was clearly traveling around. One of
• 5:47
  Speaker 3: the people who was going to be a victim who
• 5:49
  Speaker 3: survived Gayzy uh said that he was in the house
• 5:52
  Speaker 3: and saw a door open, So it wasn't Gayzy, So
• 5:55
  Speaker 3: somebody else had to have known. And Gaysey was networked
• 5:58
  Speaker 3: that there was these very uncomfortable connections between himself and
• 6:03
  Speaker 3: the candy They call it the candy Man and the
• 6:05
  Speaker 3: Clown was the documentary. But the Candyman in Houston, Texas,
• 6:10
  Speaker 3: who was part of this pedophile network. He was connected
• 6:14
  Speaker 3: between a guy whose name I can't remember now, between
• 6:16
  Speaker 3: him Philip Paski thank you Pasky PASDHK or something like that.
• 6:21
  Speaker 3: He who worked for Bundy and also one of the
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: employees of Bundy went on to become known as the
• 6:27
  Speaker 3: Ripper crew, So he was another his name was Gets
• 6:31
  Speaker 3: or Goats, who was like a crew going around abducting
• 6:34
  Speaker 3: women and torturing them the most horrible way imaginable. Definitely
• 6:38
  Speaker 3: a Satanist, which they conveniently cover up. So I think
• 6:42
  Speaker 3: some of the people who are attributed to Casey, I
• 6:44
  Speaker 3: think Casey was politically connected. He was part of He's
• 6:48
  Speaker 3: an Alderman. He was going to all kinds of jc's
• 6:51
  Speaker 3: and all kinds of like social groups, So I think
• 6:54
  Speaker 3: that there might have been other people involved. It would
• 6:56
  Speaker 3: totally make sense. But he just took the fall.
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: So I recently listened to The Clown and the Candyman,
• 7:03
  Speaker 1: and I had no idea about this Dean Coral guy
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: that was involved with all the gosh, what was his name,
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: John David Norman or something like that.
• 7:13
  Speaker 3: The Genesis Group or something Vegas group.
• 7:17
  Speaker 1: And so there's it's all like interwoven like a web.
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: There was like Dean Coral. Then there was a guy
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: in the documentary she called it the first Pedophile Island
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: or something like that, and I think his last name
• 7:30
  Speaker 1: was Sherman or I'm not, I can't remember. And then
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: this John David Norman guy in Philip Pasky, and when
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: you put all of those pieces together, it just it's
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: too much. And I don't know why we never took
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: them at their word. Like Gacy used to say, there's
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: other people involved. Bundy used to say there's other people involved,
• 7:52
  Speaker 1: and we were just like, Okay, yeah, sure, there's other
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: people involved.
• 7:58
  Speaker 3: I think that it's the same kind of phenomenon that
• 8:01
  Speaker 3: happened with Berkowitz. Is like you have the subject, there's
• 8:03
  Speaker 3: this big panic within the local community, somebody gets caught,
• 8:09
  Speaker 3: and then it's done, and so they have a clean cutcase.
• 8:11
  Speaker 3: So it's a lot easier for the police, I think,
• 8:13
  Speaker 3: and the authorities to just attribute it to one person
• 8:17
  Speaker 3: and move forward and saying it's a whole network and
• 8:19
  Speaker 3: trying to wrap it up with a huge network. And
• 8:22
  Speaker 3: I think that, yeah, that's what happens with Franklin cover
• 8:24
  Speaker 3: up too. This is a massive network. And I think
• 8:27
  Speaker 3: McGowan keyed into that earlier. And there's a really good
• 8:30
  Speaker 3: book that came out recently that's very arrowing, and I
• 8:32
  Speaker 3: think it's kind of an adjunct to program to kill it.
• 8:36
  Speaker 3: I have the CHICKENOK have you heard of that?
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: No?
• 8:40
  Speaker 3: Who is well? I don't know his real name, but
• 8:43
  Speaker 3: he goes I can't remember his alias, but it's let
• 8:46
  Speaker 3: me see if I can find it. But it's like
• 8:48
  Speaker 3: basically going over It's like McGowan's book, but more detail
• 8:52
  Speaker 3: of these networked pedophile groups. Oh my guy, Simon Dovey,
• 8:58
  Speaker 3: do O v.
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: E y, and you read this whole thing.
• 9:02
  Speaker 3: I skimmed it, but let me see. I wish I
• 9:05
  Speaker 3: could pull it up. Maybe you could pull it up.
• 9:06
  Speaker 3: It's interesting because it's basically like a flow chart of
• 9:10
  Speaker 3: these over It kind of goes into the theme of
• 9:12
  Speaker 3: what we've been talking about.
• 9:14
  Speaker 1: Let me I have the chicken behind it.
• 9:16
  Speaker 3: Because it shows these little boxes and float chart like
• 9:19
  Speaker 3: a I don't know what kind of diagram it is.
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: I don't think it's a ben diagram, but just shows
• 9:23
  Speaker 3: how they're all overlapping and connected, much like that Norman
• 9:27
  Speaker 3: guy was was like pre internet. He was like a collector, right,
• 9:34
  Speaker 3: so he's had this kind of collector keeper thing of
• 9:36
  Speaker 3: like the young boys and the names and the past
• 9:39
  Speaker 3: cards and all this stuff.
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: Let me see if I can share. I just found
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: I have the chicken hawk and it looks like so
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: I found it on that's it, Yeah, Amazon, And it's
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: got Yeah, it's got like this little web.
• 9:57
  Speaker 3: Show, these webs of connects and connect yeah, and on
• 10:01
  Speaker 3: mine it has really good reviews, like you know, four
• 10:04
  Speaker 3: point five, but you'll just see the different names.
• 10:07
  Speaker 1: So what are your thoughts on like Dahmer.
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: Connected, he was onnoperative. He was well known within the
• 10:14
  Speaker 3: kind of gay community, so I think that he whether
• 10:17
  Speaker 3: he was doing it with other people is a is
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: an open question, but he was definitely moving around. It's
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: kind of interesting because he got kicked out of the
• 10:27
  Speaker 3: gay clubs in Milwaukee and ended up in Chicago, probably
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: at this Man's club where in the gay clubs that
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: Barack Obama is a number of.
• 10:37
  Speaker 1: Gut Yeah.
• 10:38
  Speaker 3: You can look up the man's country stories pretty disturbing well.
• 10:44
  Speaker 1: And you know, I just actually was covering a little
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: something about Jeffrey Dahmer in the topic came up that
• 10:51
  Speaker 1: while he was in Germany there was people going missing
• 10:54
  Speaker 1: and weird stuff with that too.
• 10:56
  Speaker 3: So I don't know murders in Florida as well, so
• 11:01
  Speaker 3: he may not. And Gasey, I think I don't think
• 11:03
  Speaker 3: he had all his murders. He was traveling around. There's
• 11:05
  Speaker 3: a really good like I forgot the name of the
• 11:08
  Speaker 3: YouTube channel. But there's a guy who was a potential
• 11:11
  Speaker 3: gay sy victim in Tennessee. So Gaysey would take road
• 11:14
  Speaker 3: trips and try to find victims too. With the standard
• 11:18
  Speaker 3: m he would bring like one luggage full of porn,
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: another luggage with the like BDSM stuff and do the
• 11:27
  Speaker 3: same techniques like Coral did. Right, So he learned directly
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: from Coral. Hey do you want to try on these handcuffs?
• 11:34
  Speaker 3: You know, Hey, it's a joke. You can get out
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: of it. And they were done.
• 11:39
  Speaker 1: So even in that documentary The Clown and the Candyman,
• 11:42
  Speaker 1: she does a great job of connecting everything together, especially
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: with the handcuff trick. And why would those two killers
• 11:50
  Speaker 1: know the same handcuff trick quote unquote, But I had
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: I recently just found out about Dean Coral, and I
• 11:58
  Speaker 1: wonder why he's not made a bigger deal out of.
• 12:02
  Speaker 3: It's a good question. I think that that dad is
• 12:05
  Speaker 3: a huge bunch of like deaths, like all of them.
• 12:08
  Speaker 3: And yeah, and they had these two kids working for
• 12:12
  Speaker 3: him and they confessed. There's like videos of them together.
• 12:16
  Speaker 3: So it's a disturbing it's a super disturbing story. And
• 12:19
  Speaker 3: just the connections to the stuff, like where else is
• 12:22
  Speaker 3: it happening? And how do you attribute these abductions? And
• 12:25
  Speaker 3: then is this the predicate to the smiley faced killings?
• 12:30
  Speaker 3: Because how similar are those victims to the victims of
• 12:33
  Speaker 3: the SFK young men college age? Right? So instead of
• 12:37
  Speaker 3: like maybe they're doing some international thing and there's like
• 12:40
  Speaker 3: a psychic I had on my new on my most
• 12:43
  Speaker 3: recent book, and she says they are kind of you know,
• 12:48
  Speaker 3: in whatever she received, how much you want to take
• 12:50
  Speaker 3: it as he with a grain of salt. But she
• 12:53
  Speaker 3: says they're being collected. They're being filmed, much like these
• 12:56
  Speaker 3: guys are being filmed, you know, or I think there
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: was a film maybe in Connection Mists, but like she
• 13:01
  Speaker 3: thinks that that's part of this whole phenomenon. Is this
• 13:04
  Speaker 3: kind of duck did keep kept for a while, right,
• 13:08
  Speaker 3: and then disposed of like really bad.
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: So they're so they're making snuff films.
• 13:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what she's said.
• 13:16
  Speaker 1: That makes sense.
• 13:18
  Speaker 3: Yeah, makes a ton of sense. Right, So go select
• 13:21
  Speaker 3: and it's you know, where's the most vulnerable place a
• 13:24
  Speaker 3: dude walking alone after drinking at a bar, after maybe
• 13:27
  Speaker 3: he got drugged with somebody in there or something. There's
• 13:30
  Speaker 3: a process but the stories are just every story's kind
• 13:33
  Speaker 3: of the same. Sadly about the Smiley based killers, young guy,
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: most half of them are probably gay at a gay bar, acts,
• 13:41
  Speaker 3: strange disappears down the river and yeah, it's still happening
• 13:45
  Speaker 3: like a lot in are Austin.
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I was gonna say, I keep seeing him popping
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: up randomly and I'll be like, oh, I bet William
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: has seen this one. This is definitely it's hard to
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: keep up.
• 13:57
  Speaker 3: Like I it would be a literally be a full
• 13:59
  Speaker 3: time job.
• 14:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I'm kidding, But that's why I think, like
• 14:03
  Speaker 1: some of these victims, like Gaysey victims and even some
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: of the Bundy victims that were held for a long
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: time and then they turned up later and gay sy
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: five of them in the river. Well after they put
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: Bundy away, like people still kept going missing and bodies
• 14:21
  Speaker 1: kept turning up, and then they would blame it on
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: the Green River killer, or you know, it was the
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: next killer, the next killer. But honestly, it could be
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: the same group of killers since the beginning, Like I'm
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: talking Zodiac, I'm talking you know, Manson, son of Sam, all.
• 14:40
  Speaker 3: Of them, You're right, I mean, that's how scary it is.
• 14:45
  Speaker 3: And I think it, like I said, it's convenient for
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: the police, just like it's convenient for the authorities to
• 14:50
  Speaker 3: say these you know, stage drownings are accidents, right, It's
• 14:55
  Speaker 3: very they're looking for a convenient way. They don't want
• 14:57
  Speaker 3: to do the hard work or actually do the thing
• 15:00
  Speaker 3: and actually go, hey, this might be networked type of people.
• 15:03
  Speaker 3: I mean, they did it in the kind of the
• 15:06
  Speaker 3: Ripper crew out of Chicago. This guy gets who has
• 15:09
  Speaker 3: worked for Bundy. They actually arrested all the people surrounding
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: them and so but sometimes they do get the whole group.
• 15:17
  Speaker 3: But I think, you know, some of these are working groups.
• 15:18
  Speaker 3: There was another guy that I did a research who
• 15:21
  Speaker 3: was a gay serial killer and the book was by macdonnaugh.
• 15:24
  Speaker 3: His name was Craft. There's another kind of guy like
• 15:26
  Speaker 3: Coral who isn't emphasized. You almost never hear about the
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: skuy Los Angeles. Guess how many victims they think he
• 15:32
  Speaker 3: had attributed to him?
• 15:35
  Speaker 1: One hundred, one hundred victims here, one hundred victims.
• 15:38
  Speaker 3: And then mcdonna's like, yeah, there's no way he could
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: have done it alone. Because and this is kind of
• 15:43
  Speaker 3: like a process of thinking about the Smiley Face killers
• 15:45
  Speaker 3: that's why I interviewed him. But he couldn't have done
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: it alone because there was one where the victim was
• 15:51
  Speaker 3: tossed from a moving car, so like how could somebody
• 15:54
  Speaker 3: be driving or right, So it's like this, this doesn't
• 15:58
  Speaker 3: make sense. And the same thing happened with another gay
• 16:01
  Speaker 3: serial killer's name was Eyler in the Midwest, kind of
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: almost like Jeffrey Dahmer Isler A y L e R.
• 16:10
  Speaker 3: He was released to Kill that was the name of
• 16:12
  Speaker 3: the book by Colaric and he she said like he
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: probably was working with somebody else, and the filming and
• 16:19
  Speaker 3: keeping and the BDSM and all that, those elements are all.
• 16:23
  Speaker 1: There, you know, shut up. Wow. And then there's like
• 16:30
  Speaker 1: the her Baumeister, Yeah, that bridella guy.
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's the same thing. They were keeping people right right.
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So it's like they're getting trained from on high
• 16:45
  Speaker 1: and it's just like trickling down into like all these
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: different networks.
• 16:49
  Speaker 3: Right right, is in the program to kill also in
• 16:54
  Speaker 3: and out of mental institutions, just like what was his name,
• 16:59
  Speaker 3: Henry Lee Lucas, Right, So Henry.
• 17:01
  Speaker 1: And otis Tool, Yeah.
• 17:02
  Speaker 3: Adis Tool, yeah, O T T I s Audust Tool
• 17:05
  Speaker 3: who's a very scary guy. The videos on that guy online,
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: like if you saw him walking down the street, you
• 17:10
  Speaker 3: went across.
• 17:10
  Speaker 1: The street, Jesus, Yeah, no kidding, crazy looking. Oh, his
• 17:15
  Speaker 1: family was what Satanist who dressed him up like a
• 17:18
  Speaker 1: girl when he was a kid, and.
• 17:19
  Speaker 3: Like traumatized from the very beginning, Like it's really Gek
• 17:23
  Speaker 3: Robin Ghek was the name of the Ripper killer. That
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: was okay, I was associated with the Who's in program
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: to kill associated with Bundy g e ht But yeah,
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: I mean in a Satanist too, like a stone.
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: Called Satanist ted Bundy actually when after he was sentenced
• 17:41
  Speaker 1: to death, ended up in the cell right next to Tool.
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: It's just like it's just like they.
• 17:49
  Speaker 3: Know each other too. Like I've done a thing on
• 17:52
  Speaker 3: Schroeder who was the thing and he like compared himself
• 17:55
  Speaker 3: to Bundy, and Bundy had a suspicious background, like there's
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: research she said he was part of some kind of
• 18:02
  Speaker 3: dark group in the Washington area and people liked to
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: you know, I allege this and it's just so strange.
• 18:11
  Speaker 3: Like the girl he wrote about him knew him and rule.
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: She's she's something. She's also the first one that gave
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: his name to the police. She's also friends with two
• 18:24
  Speaker 1: of the victims. She also attended some kind of conference
• 18:31
  Speaker 1: that they were having about all these missing girls, but
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: they didn't know it was Ted yet, and then all
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: of a sudden she goes to this conference and like
• 18:38
  Speaker 1: a couple days later, she gives his name over to
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: the Ted squad is what they called it. And I
• 18:45
  Speaker 1: don't know. Ann Rule actually pops up a lot in
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: the Ted Bundy story, and then she wrote that book.
• 18:50
  Speaker 1: I think it's called The Stranger Beside Me, and she
• 18:54
  Speaker 1: made herself and Ted famous in the process, So I
• 18:57
  Speaker 1: don't know, cash Jen.
• 18:59
  Speaker 3: I mean, there's weird connections like that. In these serial Killers.
• 19:03
  Speaker 3: Catherine Ramsland becomes friends with Dennis Rader and writes the
• 19:06
  Speaker 3: book about him. She's a PhD student, makes a lot
• 19:10
  Speaker 3: of money, sells a lot of books, becomes famous. Who's
• 19:13
  Speaker 3: one of her students. It's the guy who killed all
• 19:16
  Speaker 3: the people in Moscow, Idaho. Was literally, yeah, the Moscow,
• 19:21
  Speaker 3: Idaho's killer studied under Ramsland criminal criminal.
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: Wow.
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: Yeah, No, there's a direct connection between what was his
• 19:30
  Speaker 3: name Ramsland? I forgot his name notes Schroeder.
• 19:37
  Speaker 1: So he has a I think in German last name
• 19:40
  Speaker 1: the serial killer.
• 19:41
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the guy who killed the four women of the
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: college aged people in Idaho, the Idaho More Coburger. Coburger
• 19:53
  Speaker 3: studied under Ramsland.
• 19:55
  Speaker 1: Yeah, So do you think that there are because I've
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: asked myself this question, do you think that there are
• 20:04
  Speaker 1: authentic grassroots serial killers among us? Or do you think
• 20:10
  Speaker 1: that this has all been sensationalized in its networks and
• 20:13
  Speaker 1: its cover ups and it's all I mean, we know
• 20:16
  Speaker 1: about the infamous serial killers, but could there be also
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: an equal amount of like grassroots just crazy psychopathic human
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: beings out there that just want to kill other people.
• 20:29
  Speaker 3: I think it's a mix. I think it's a mix.
• 20:31
  Speaker 3: I think some of these guys are working together and
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: they all there are only one who gets caught. And
• 20:36
  Speaker 3: I think that there are that one guy Little who's
• 20:39
  Speaker 3: an African American guy who had an incredible body count,
• 20:42
  Speaker 3: probably just hated women. So I think that they're a
• 20:46
  Speaker 3: mixed and I do think that some of these people
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: are programmed to kill. I think that they're clearly the
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: products of the stuff. One of the interesting things in
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: this book, as he mentions this narrut guy that's not
• 20:57
  Speaker 3: very well talked about, not often talked about ut who
• 21:02
  Speaker 3: kind of spilled the beans in nineteen seventy five. He
• 21:04
  Speaker 3: was in Europe and he's saying, like, we are the
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: O and I the Office of Naval Intelligence is training
• 21:09
  Speaker 3: guys to become program killers and then distribute them through
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: the embassy, you know, places through embassies in the unit,
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: the US kind of network or US Empire network to
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: carry out contract killings. And a lot of them have criminal records,
• 21:24
  Speaker 3: and it's all over the media like it's it's not
• 21:27
  Speaker 3: like a story. It's a story that they don't talk about.
• 21:30
  Speaker 3: It was covered up and then they denied it, but
• 21:32
  Speaker 3: that paper does exist, and I think that it just
• 21:35
  Speaker 3: shows that there's programs to create this programed killer, like
• 21:40
  Speaker 3: to dissociate people and control them. And that's so many
• 21:43
  Speaker 3: of these guys have come out of the Phoenix program,
• 21:47
  Speaker 3: are connected to the Free Phoenix program or something else.
• 21:50
  Speaker 3: Shaw Cross, Heydnick was part of this weird dark stuff.
• 21:55
  Speaker 3: So you know, it's hard to say, Oh, Mullins, was
• 21:58
  Speaker 3: these guys who were in Santa Cruz area, I think
• 22:03
  Speaker 3: it was. There were three guys, and two of them
• 22:06
  Speaker 3: are really strange, and I'd been exposed to large doses
• 22:08
  Speaker 3: of LSD, and they're like they were next to each other,
• 22:12
  Speaker 3: So Ed Kemper and Mullins and this other guy were
• 22:16
  Speaker 3: all next to each other, and the under the aegis
• 22:20
  Speaker 3: of a lot of MKL. This guy lund l u
• 22:22
  Speaker 3: n D is mentioned in Program to Kill who's a
• 22:25
  Speaker 3: big wig kind of behavioral science guy out of Stanford.
• 22:31
  Speaker 3: And for their trials they were kept I think in
• 22:34
  Speaker 3: San Jose or something away from Santa Cruz. So they're
• 22:37
  Speaker 3: like right next to this whole epicenter of all these
• 22:41
  Speaker 3: other people who you know, got out of jail, or
• 22:44
  Speaker 3: the guys from the Cimbinese Liberation Army, which is nineteen
• 22:48
  Speaker 3: seventy four. Manson's not sixty nine, so they're all around
• 22:52
  Speaker 3: this area. So there is this weird and I've done
• 22:55
  Speaker 3: shows like Vronsky where there's clearly a peak of serial
• 22:59
  Speaker 3: kill that dropped off. It's inexplicable, but one of the
• 23:03
  Speaker 3: ways you can explain it. There's a deduction you make
• 23:06
  Speaker 3: is that they're connected to these programs, is that a
• 23:08
  Speaker 3: lot of these guys have been literally programmed to kill.
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: Well, what do you think about? So the ones that
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: you're talking about that we're going down in the Santa
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: Cruz area. It was the same time that kind of
• 23:25
  Speaker 1: in the San Francisco area, they couldn't figure out who
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: the zodiac was, right, and the zodiac was running crazy
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: in San Francisco. What do you think about the theory
• 23:34
  Speaker 1: that like someone like Michael Achino or Michael Achino could
• 23:39
  Speaker 1: have been the zodiac or working with multiple other people
• 23:42
  Speaker 1: to do these.
• 23:44
  Speaker 3: I think it's pretty good. There's clearly an occulted element there,
• 23:47
  Speaker 3: Like I mean, I can see that markers of the face,
• 23:50
  Speaker 3: the targeting symbol, the letters that are sent out, the
• 23:54
  Speaker 3: smiley face, cross school and crossbone letters that are sent out.
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: The connection to some of the attorney who they reached
• 24:04
  Speaker 3: out and talked to is very sophisticated, Like this isn't
• 24:08
  Speaker 3: something so it implies a network also of like maybe
• 24:12
  Speaker 3: an initiatory thing, much like the Sons of Sam people
• 24:15
  Speaker 3: have made correlations between the Sons of Sam and the
• 24:20
  Speaker 3: Zodiac is like more of a team effort. I think
• 24:22
  Speaker 3: that it's very evident that the Son of Sam, it
• 24:25
  Speaker 3: wasn't just burkele wit'z he can't talk. But it's pretty
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: clear that the witnesses are seeing different people. The first
• 24:33
  Speaker 3: hand witnesses aren't seeing a guy to matches berkele Witz's right, think,
• 24:38
  Speaker 3: So I do think that there is something like that.
• 24:40
  Speaker 3: There's an interesting kind of conversation between people the Temple
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: of Set and the head of the Order of Nine
• 24:48
  Speaker 3: Angles where he's saying, like, you guys sit around and
• 24:51
  Speaker 3: decide to do it. And I think that it's part
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: of the larger program to kill motif, which is the
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: politics is to create social confusion and chaos in society.
• 25:03
  Speaker 3: And then people were freaked out by the Son of Sam,
• 25:06
  Speaker 3: like the whole at that time New York City was
• 25:08
  Speaker 3: like stuck in a crime with but everybody's focused on
• 25:11
  Speaker 3: these random killings, right, so it's created this massive fear
• 25:16
  Speaker 3: and dread, which is like one of the impacts. Like
• 25:18
  Speaker 3: they say that right at the beginning of it. McGowan
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: mentions this guy Paul Videre, which is painted fear of
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: the most useful tools, And what does the zodiac do
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: maximizes fear, right, the fear of Like that's what people
• 25:35
  Speaker 3: fear the most, is an unexpected instantaneous death. So like
• 25:40
  Speaker 3: death is right around the corner. Ah, you know, that's
• 25:42
  Speaker 3: what people like. Even if you say you're gonna die
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: in six months, people won't freak out as much. But
• 25:47
  Speaker 3: if they think that and that Osama bin Lauden's going
• 25:50
  Speaker 3: to jump out of a bush and Stabby to death,
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: much like ten to seven, really strange. So you see
• 25:56
  Speaker 3: these weird comed events seven seven, ten, seven, nine to eleven,
• 26:00
  Speaker 3: well or they all have the same component, like you're
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: going to get immediately killed by a moss or all that.
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: So you see that the psychological operation.
• 26:08
  Speaker 1: Aspect of all and there's so many layers to it too,
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: because with the Zodiac, you had all these people trying
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: to cipher codes and they they it was almost like
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: they made a game out of it. You know, they
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: would turn on the TV try to decipher the Zodiac's
• 26:23
  Speaker 1: new letter in the new code and it they literally
• 26:27
  Speaker 1: made a soap opera out of the Zodiac, like and
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: it's kind of sensationalized though.
• 26:36
  Speaker 3: It's a really good point. You use that word game
• 26:38
  Speaker 3: because it comes up in a lot of cult kind
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: of environments where they're playing games and it's almost like, I,
• 26:45
  Speaker 3: you know, the Finders was the game caller, the head
• 26:47
  Speaker 3: of the Finders, which is a cult involving many more
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: people than it's publicized, many more important people, but it
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: was pre kind of internet, so it didn't have it
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: doesn't have the same kind of impact because it happened,
• 27:02
  Speaker 3: you know, in the sixties, seventies and eighties and stuff
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: like that. But the guy's head was called the game caller,
• 27:06
  Speaker 3: you know, so he was playing games with his people,
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: and almost these heads of colts like play games with
• 27:11
  Speaker 3: their own people. That it's Jim Jones or Hubbard or
• 27:16
  Speaker 3: it's like this game playing thing. But so what I
• 27:19
  Speaker 3: think that that's part of it, you know, it's part
• 27:22
  Speaker 3: of kind of like the the dynamic.
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: I guess as well, you could put it even with
• 27:27
  Speaker 1: the night Stalker. There's this game the Satanist and actually
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: a lot of this goes back to Satanism anyways.
• 27:36
  Speaker 3: But that's the cover of the book, by the way.
• 27:39
  Speaker 3: I mean, it has this very harrowing picture, but it's
• 27:42
  Speaker 3: basically of a satanic crime work. Guy had a pentagram
• 27:44
  Speaker 3: carved into his chest. That's the cover of Program to Kill.
• 27:48
  Speaker 3: And there used to actually be there was a woman
• 27:51
  Speaker 3: who worked in the San Francisco Police PD who studied
• 27:55
  Speaker 3: satanic crimes like they were happening all over the Bay Area.
• 27:58
  Speaker 3: So there's all kinds of crime that happened around the
• 28:00
  Speaker 3: Bay Area that never hit the news and weren't attributed
• 28:04
  Speaker 3: to this. So there was definitely this upsurge and the
• 28:07
  Speaker 3: cult crimes around that time. Late sixties and seventies.
• 28:10
  Speaker 1: Well, what a time to be alive because you have
• 28:14
  Speaker 1: the counter culture movement going on, and you have all
• 28:17
  Speaker 1: this Laurel Canyon stuff with all these musicians. The Laurel
• 28:21
  Speaker 1: Canyon body count is crazy high too, It's like one
• 28:25
  Speaker 1: hundred two hundred people from that, So you know, you
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: have all this counter culture stuff going on, and then
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: you have the introduction of the serial killer and it's
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: just they hit us so hard in one decade. If
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: you go back and look at it, you're like, how
• 28:44
  Speaker 1: did people even make it out alive?
• 28:46
  Speaker 3: Like no good point, super scary operation chaos type stuff.
• 28:52
  Speaker 3: It really is incredible because it didn't really happen as much.
• 28:56
  Speaker 3: These kind of random events didn't happen in the forties
• 28:59
  Speaker 3: and fifties, So what right? And that's kind of what
• 29:02
  Speaker 3: people have to figure out, Like so many of these
• 29:05
  Speaker 3: guys did massive amounts of drugs, LSD and stuff. There's
• 29:09
  Speaker 3: all that element to these people and dissociative states, Like
• 29:13
  Speaker 3: I mean, that's kind of interesting how prescient McGowan was.
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: Like his intro chapter is about dissociation, and he keyed
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: into something that's very way ahead of his time. Again,
• 29:26
  Speaker 3: like he keys into Esterbrooks, who really is the precursor
• 29:30
  Speaker 3: to mk LTRA. Not a lot of people who talk
• 29:32
  Speaker 3: about this mind control stuff hit Estbooks. They don't emphasize
• 29:36
  Speaker 3: Esterbooks enough as a hypnosis and dissociation from the thirties,
• 29:41
  Speaker 3: guys like this is what And we can go back
• 29:43
  Speaker 3: to the history of hypnotism through Resputant and Mesmer and
• 29:49
  Speaker 3: all these other guys were practicing it back in the
• 29:51
  Speaker 3: nineteenth century. But this guy Estrabook is very well that worked.
• 29:56
  Speaker 3: Like you had conversation with Jaek or Huber and all
• 29:58
  Speaker 3: this stuff in the thirties. So when you see pictures
• 30:00
  Speaker 3: of jig Or Hoover in the sixties, he's well aware
• 30:03
  Speaker 3: of all of this crazy mind control stuff. And even
• 30:09
  Speaker 3: even like McGowan talks about Lee Harvey Oswald as a
• 30:14
  Speaker 3: mind control subject, and they all fit this weird thing.
• 30:16
  Speaker 3: Like Lee Harvey Oswald was in a hospital for like
• 30:20
  Speaker 3: a month or two for a sexually transmitted disease. That
• 30:24
  Speaker 3: was what they put on his when has anybody ever
• 30:27
  Speaker 3: heard of somebody being in a hospital for that long
• 30:29
  Speaker 3: for an STD in the sixties. And he's very strange,
• 30:33
  Speaker 3: like he's i mean, his his life, he emulates and
• 30:37
  Speaker 3: it goes all the way up to the present.
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 30:39
  Speaker 3: The second guy he tried to kill Trump's what was
• 30:44
  Speaker 3: his name was? Oh, I can't even remember it now,
• 30:49
  Speaker 3: But that guy has this weird background where he's in
• 30:53
  Speaker 3: like the north Shore of Wow, but able to travel
• 30:55
  Speaker 3: around much like Oswald. For Oswald's suspiciously has money to
• 30:59
  Speaker 3: go to Swiss Finland, gets into Japan, gets into the
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: Soviet Union, gets out, travels like it's so strange.
• 31:12
  Speaker 1: There's this picture floating around of Luigi, that guy who
• 31:17
  Speaker 1: shut it, and he's got like an outfit on that
• 31:20
  Speaker 1: looks just like Lee Harvey Oswald.
• 31:22
  Speaker 3: Right. They dressed up the both of them like that,
• 31:25
  Speaker 3: the Oswald purp walk well, the cop is in the suit. Yeah.
• 31:29
  Speaker 1: So do you think he didn't get to choose his outfit?
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: I think they did it intentionally as an insight.
• 31:36
  Speaker 1: I thought so too.
• 31:40
  Speaker 3: I mean, you can pull that picture up. It's astonishing.
• 31:42
  Speaker 3: I don't think that's a mistake at all.
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: No, no way.
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: The first guy was crooks who didn't make it. In
• 31:48
  Speaker 3: the second guy, I don't even remember his name. Uh,
• 31:52
  Speaker 3: what's his name? The other guy has all the hallmarks
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: of Ryan Ruth. What's his name? But the interesting thing
• 32:02
  Speaker 3: if you go back and look at David Chapman, right,
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: the alleged killer of John Lennon. He was in and
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: out of a hospital. He supposedly worked as an orally
• 32:11
  Speaker 3: at a hospital.
• 32:13
  Speaker 1: Jeffrey Dahmer, Wow, crazy.
• 32:16
  Speaker 3: This guy Ruth was it like literally like a stone's throw,
• 32:19
  Speaker 3: like two or three miles away from the hospital where
• 32:21
  Speaker 3: Chapman worked at and somehow gets these like the money
• 32:25
  Speaker 3: he's like laid on charld payments his his money to
• 32:28
  Speaker 3: his ex wife. He doesn't have a real job. He's
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: making like little houses for people who are homeless, probably
• 32:35
  Speaker 3: not making a lot of money. Somehow can afford to
• 32:37
  Speaker 3: go to Balm Beach and wander around and then go
• 32:40
  Speaker 3: to Ukraine like he's in Ukraine, Like hey, guys, like
• 32:44
  Speaker 3: that's the port. He's got the whole government line down too,
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: which is you know, the Ukrainians have been oppressed and
• 32:51
  Speaker 3: Zelenski's a freedom fighter. He's out holding his banners like
• 32:55
  Speaker 3: he's a tool of the government. It's incredible, like this
• 32:58
  Speaker 3: guy if he needs to be ah, it's super suspicious.
• 33:03
  Speaker 3: It fits all the Chapman kind of.
• 33:06
  Speaker 1: Well, wasn't Uh, there was something about sir hands, Sir
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: hand too, like there was something weird about with him.
• 33:15
  Speaker 3: Same thing in the hospital two weeks. Nobody knows why
• 33:19
  Speaker 3: weird writings. Automatic writing doesn't remember the shooting. The kill shot,
• 33:24
  Speaker 3: according to Naguchi, came from behind RFK, not in front. Uh,
• 33:30
  Speaker 3: there's more bullets than then. We're in the chamber of
• 33:32
  Speaker 3: the gun that sir anser hans, Sir answer, and it's
• 33:36
  Speaker 3: clearly seen going to gun ranges and things like that.
• 33:39
  Speaker 3: Outside of his Southern Carroll, California area. He was seen
• 33:43
  Speaker 3: in northern cal It's strange times. Weird people, the polka
• 33:48
  Speaker 3: dot addressed woman, just all kinds, I mean, there's just
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: so many suspicious things that all kinds of mk doctors,
• 33:55
  Speaker 3: doctors and psycholotrists, psychiatrists around Sir Answer and after arrest,
• 34:00
  Speaker 3: which is a real giveaway because they all around the
• 34:03
  Speaker 3: same thing happened to Chapman, Patty Hurst, like Patty Hurst
• 34:06
  Speaker 3: had like the big they they brought out the big
• 34:09
  Speaker 3: time CAAA doctors John Jolly and West Martin Orne Singer.
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: There's like a picture of them with Flee Bailey like
• 34:18
  Speaker 3: all together, like, oh, this is a jolly bunch of people.
• 34:20
  Speaker 3: Knew these are all deep like hardcore you know, government
• 34:26
  Speaker 3: agents like government people. Who knows Jolly and West isn't
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: the strangest places of all times. So you get back
• 34:33
  Speaker 3: to this kind of program to kill kind of mentality
• 34:36
  Speaker 3: and all that stuff. And Patty Hurst is really a
• 34:38
  Speaker 3: real interesting study in like thought reform, mind control. And
• 34:42
  Speaker 3: that's why they were there is because they put her
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: into basically isolation thing and abused her right and so
• 34:49
  Speaker 3: she goes from the supposed heiress with a lot of
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: money too. I forgot what her chain did. Was it
• 34:56
  Speaker 3: Tanya or something like that? This revolutionary bank robber, Like,
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: how does that happen? Are these guys sophisticated enough to
• 35:03
  Speaker 3: make that happen? It makes you wonder like there was
• 35:06
  Speaker 3: somebody else telling them what to do?
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: You know, mm hmmmm hmm. Well what do you think
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: about Like, I know we've talked about it before, but
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: we said Satanism is at the base of a lot
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: of this stuff, and so do you think that, let's say,
• 35:21
  Speaker 1: for example, West Memphis three those kids really did that
• 35:27
  Speaker 1: or do you think that they took the fall for it.
• 35:31
  Speaker 3: I think they were part of a larger network, and
• 35:33
  Speaker 3: I think that there were more people at whatever they
• 35:35
  Speaker 3: were doing in other places. I think that they were
• 35:39
  Speaker 3: one of the kind of in my opinion is that
• 35:42
  Speaker 3: they were probably some of the head people, and Jesse
• 35:46
  Speaker 3: was the one who implicated them but left other people out.
• 35:50
  Speaker 3: I do believe there were other people involved in that stuff.
• 35:53
  Speaker 3: They were networked, and I think they came from a
• 35:54
  Speaker 3: family that were into you know, black whatever occult general
• 36:01
  Speaker 3: in a general sense. And the like his girlfriend at
• 36:04
  Speaker 3: the time, that's like the one of the weirdest things
• 36:06
  Speaker 3: is she's involved in that stuff too, and her family,
• 36:09
  Speaker 3: like her her aunt was involved in some kind of
• 36:12
  Speaker 3: vampire thing about drinking blood in lah outside of La. Yeah,
• 36:16
  Speaker 3: so how are these going on? Like this isn't a
• 36:19
  Speaker 3: completely different state. So I think that they were just
• 36:22
  Speaker 3: of that ilk. But if you read through the court documents,
• 36:26
  Speaker 3: he's echoes and all these guys are traveling to Memphis.
• 36:30
  Speaker 3: They live outside of Memphis, the city, but they're talking
• 36:33
  Speaker 3: to people in Memphis, and there's somebody they mentioned as Lucifer,
• 36:37
  Speaker 3: who nobody's ever targeted. There was another guy who talked
• 36:40
  Speaker 3: about the group, you know, and even the police were
• 36:43
  Speaker 3: like making lists. There's lists in the police documents of
• 36:46
  Speaker 3: like other members of the cult like that, they're trying
• 36:49
  Speaker 3: to figure out who these guys are newwork with. So
• 36:52
  Speaker 3: I think that there's a lot And they used to
• 36:53
  Speaker 3: go out to this place called Stone Enge, and it
• 36:55
  Speaker 3: was groups of people. It wasn't just like those three,
• 36:59
  Speaker 3: So who were the other members of the group. And
• 37:01
  Speaker 3: while weren't they implicated And that's another example of the
• 37:04
  Speaker 3: police kind of getting their perp and that just they
• 37:07
  Speaker 3: enough evidence to get these guys arrested and then they
• 37:11
  Speaker 3: you know, I think they were looking for other things,
• 37:13
  Speaker 3: but they just didn't didn't seem they have the incentive
• 37:16
  Speaker 3: to do a huge roundup. But they interviewed so many people.
• 37:19
  Speaker 3: There's so many like interviews that aren't in these place.
• 37:22
  Speaker 3: Lame documentaries from Atrio, which are really sham documentaries in
• 37:27
  Speaker 3: my opinion.
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: But well, you know how people get obsessed with Netflix
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: documentaries and HBO documentaries and by the time let's just
• 37:35
  Speaker 1: pick a random serial killer. Let's say you watch a
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: Ted Bundy documentary. By the end of it, you're one
• 37:41
  Speaker 1: hundred percent convinced that he murdered upward of what they
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: say is could be like thirty, forty fifty. They don't
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: even know, just like you know, countless women, and they
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: sell it to you in a way to where the
• 37:54
  Speaker 1: cases closed, done, solved, no need to look any they're here,
• 38:01
  Speaker 1: And it's like that. It's true for any serial killer.
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: They just sell you the story and that's what you're
• 38:07
  Speaker 1: made to believe. And when you really start looking into
• 38:10
  Speaker 1: it and finding all these inconsistencies, if you were to
• 38:13
  Speaker 1: just tell a random person like, well, you know, I
• 38:15
  Speaker 1: don't think Ted actually murdered all those girls, It's like,
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: it's like blasphemous. Oh how could you say that, you
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: know he killed all those people. It's so tragic and sad.
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: They don't want to hear about, you know, program to kill.
• 38:31
  Speaker 3: No, they don't. They don't want to go that far.
• 38:33
  Speaker 3: And I think you have to ask you a question,
• 38:35
  Speaker 3: why why do they just tag Berkwoods. Why don't they
• 38:39
  Speaker 3: go into the process, even though he's mentioned the process
• 38:42
  Speaker 3: in some in one of his interviews. I think in
• 38:45
  Speaker 3: jail so it's too disturbing and the connections and the
• 38:49
  Speaker 3: crimes that are all associated with these things. Like they
• 38:52
  Speaker 3: want to keep it separate, you know, they don't want
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: them to see this big network, much like more Terry
• 38:58
  Speaker 3: exposed right connect between all the way from east coast
• 39:02
  Speaker 3: to the west coast. With the death of Arlest Perry
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: on October twelfth, nineteen seventy four, one of the interesting
• 39:08
  Speaker 3: things of Program to Kill is for a guy who
• 39:12
  Speaker 3: supposedly I think he was an atheist, but McCowan, he's
• 39:16
  Speaker 3: into all these dates and stuff, like the occult calendars
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: Crowley's mentioned.
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: Like he has like Crowley's birthday, Yeah, you know it's yeah, yeah.
• 39:25
  Speaker 3: You mentioned Curley like twenty times or something like that.
• 39:28
  Speaker 3: But he gets all of these dates and things like
• 39:30
  Speaker 3: that in there, which.
• 39:31
  Speaker 1: Are really something cult holidays, solstices.
• 39:35
  Speaker 3: And on March twenty first, nineteen sixty seven, the Spring Equinox,
• 39:38
  Speaker 3: Charles Mills Manson was released from prison. Like, so, yeah,
• 39:43
  Speaker 3: which are really I do believe, like the death of
• 39:45
  Speaker 3: Arlest Perry, it's not a mistake that it was on
• 39:47
  Speaker 3: Croley's birthday.
• 39:48
  Speaker 1: No, I don't either. In the so I speak about
• 39:51
  Speaker 1: it a little bit, how ritualistic it was. You know,
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: she had the altar candle and all of you know.
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: He actually in the book he links that one back
• 40:01
  Speaker 1: to Leno LaBianca from the Manson because they both had
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: like an intricate carving and people don't really know about
• 40:09
  Speaker 1: our lists that that well, you know, unless you were
• 40:13
  Speaker 1: to read the book. People don't really know about that one.
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: But I think they ended up the suspect was someone
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: who was in the Manson family, like a disciple that
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: broke off or something like that, something like that.
• 40:25
  Speaker 3: They call him Manson too. It's been identified as Menser,
• 40:30
  Speaker 3: This guy Menzer was involved in The Cotton. Was a
• 40:33
  Speaker 3: Cotton movie? Was that movie?
• 40:35
  Speaker 1: The Raydon The Cotton?
• 40:39
  Speaker 3: Yeah, which overlaps with Rory Raydon, who's also kind of
• 40:42
  Speaker 3: in that environment like New York at that time in
• 40:45
  Speaker 3: the seventies was very dark. There's a lot of dark
• 40:47
  Speaker 3: stuff going on. But uh, yeah, so I think that
• 40:50
  Speaker 3: that's true in the Latte LaBianca murders, right, there was
• 40:54
  Speaker 3: a fork in, but they they wrote war in a
• 40:58
  Speaker 3: way that the W was on almost like it's something
• 41:01
  Speaker 3: like you'd see on the cover of Program to Kill,
• 41:03
  Speaker 3: where it was a downward triangle and an upward triangle,
• 41:07
  Speaker 3: and so that's the way when Harles Perry was laid out,
• 41:10
  Speaker 3: they took her pants and so her legs were in
• 41:14
  Speaker 3: a triangle and they took pants and made a downward triangle.
• 41:18
  Speaker 3: So it's almost like a hexagram or something. And there's
• 41:21
  Speaker 3: rumors about her that, I mean, you don't want to go.
• 41:23
  Speaker 3: It was that that she was really on the altar.
• 41:28
  Speaker 3: That's where she really was, and the police told the
• 41:31
  Speaker 3: people she wasn't so that they knew it was like
• 41:34
  Speaker 3: sometimes the police when they see a crime scene, they
• 41:37
  Speaker 3: get out false information. So if somebody really knew the crime,
• 41:40
  Speaker 3: they know exactly how it was staged.
• 41:42
  Speaker 1: So it was an ultimate act of like sacrilege rumor
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: That's where I mean. It makes sense though, And I
• 41:51
  Speaker 1: have this whole grand theory that was presented to me
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: by someone else, and I just want to get your
• 41:56
  Speaker 1: thoughts about it. So they say that serial killers could
• 42:04
  Speaker 1: potentially be just characters. You know, the man Ted Bundy
• 42:10
  Speaker 1: and the character Ted Bundy could be two separate people.
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: Like the character's name is Ted Bundy, but the real
• 42:20
  Speaker 1: guy who's playing Ted Bundy is his name is John
• 42:24
  Speaker 1: or something like that. So you can't convict John of
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: murder because Ted Bundy is the one who committed the crime.
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: And so the theory is that potentially a lot of
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: these serial killer victims aren't real at all, and they're
• 42:45
  Speaker 1: all characters in this massive, grand theatrical play. That yeah,
• 42:51
  Speaker 1: what I mean, what are your thoughts on that? Because
• 42:53
  Speaker 1: I think real people die in as a result of
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: whatever type of project that the writing on us. I
• 43:01
  Speaker 1: do think that innocent people die and they're not just
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: all characters.
• 43:06
  Speaker 3: I've never heard that, Honestly, I've always thought that they
• 43:08
  Speaker 3: were real. So I would have to look into that.
• 43:10
  Speaker 3: I'll keep my eye out, But I've read out a
• 43:12
  Speaker 3: lot of these details. I've done tons of interviews on Cereal,
• 43:15
  Speaker 3: I mean, Bundy and all these guys. Creech. I just
• 43:20
  Speaker 3: did one on Thomas Screech, another really strange guy around
• 43:23
  Speaker 3: this era who's a hit man and a Satanist who
• 43:25
  Speaker 3: new Labay like Richard River Meres. But the deaths all
• 43:30
  Speaker 3: seem to be real, you know, it's not like I mean,
• 43:32
  Speaker 3: it would be incredible if the whole story was just
• 43:35
  Speaker 3: one big fiction and nobody really died, and that they
• 43:39
  Speaker 3: faked everything in certain certain of these people's desks, because
• 43:42
  Speaker 3: it seems like there's like family members and stuff like that, Like,
• 43:46
  Speaker 3: for sure, these guys died in the West Memphis three,
• 43:49
  Speaker 3: Like that's for sure, Like their parents are at the
• 43:52
  Speaker 3: trials and everything like that. So it would be incredible.
• 43:55
  Speaker 3: I mean it would.
• 43:58
  Speaker 1: They would entertain that. Maybe even some of them could
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: have been I'm.
• 44:02
  Speaker 3: Willing to entertain it. One of the interesting thing is,
• 44:04
  Speaker 3: like what comes to mind is the Oh it's the
• 44:10
  Speaker 3: I can't remember the guy's name right now, but he
• 44:12
  Speaker 3: says like a lot of those like are some of
• 44:15
  Speaker 3: these people involved in some of these big events are
• 44:17
  Speaker 3: crisis actors?
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, yeah, like Leanna when.
• 44:20
  Speaker 3: Like this woman who's coming out talking about even today
• 44:24
  Speaker 3: about this bird flu nonsense, She's shown up at weird places.
• 44:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah, what's going on with that? Anyways, it's just another sigh.
• 44:33
  Speaker 1: Do you think? So?
• 44:36
  Speaker 3: The timing is incredible, Right before the election, before the
• 44:40
  Speaker 3: new whole new administration shows up, they pull the stunt.
• 44:44
  Speaker 3: But I don't I don't think people are gonna fall.
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: It was announced by a crisis actor.
• 44:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think so. Wow my opinion, Yeah, go look
• 44:52
  Speaker 3: her up, like she showed up at least it was
• 44:54
  Speaker 3: either the Boston bombing or something like that. Like some
• 44:57
  Speaker 3: of these people are showing up at multiple different plays
• 45:00
  Speaker 3: like on TV, like are they state assets or what's
• 45:04
  Speaker 3: going on? So those are these are fake? Like I
• 45:07
  Speaker 3: think some of these people are stone called fakes and
• 45:10
  Speaker 3: they just dredge them out or pay for them and
• 45:12
  Speaker 3: train them. And I don't you know, so many of
• 45:14
  Speaker 3: these people like are agents of influence. They're not real
• 45:18
  Speaker 3: authentic things, and so much in the old media really
• 45:21
  Speaker 3: are agents of influence. Like I was very naive, like thinking, well,
• 45:25
  Speaker 3: these people had normal careers and they took a journal
• 45:28
  Speaker 3: and journalism degree. Now these guys were brought up and
• 45:33
  Speaker 3: trained and put in the right place and me it
• 45:35
  Speaker 3: made to become agents of influence, fake social media presence.
• 45:40
  Speaker 3: Everything's fake about them because they're being propped up by
• 45:44
  Speaker 3: either a wealthy person or by the government. And there's
• 45:47
  Speaker 3: a lot of them, Like they surround Joe Rogan like
• 45:50
  Speaker 3: it's incredible, like whoa years a rounded by like really
• 45:54
  Speaker 3: heavy intel, dark agents, dark propaganda's black propagandists. And that's
• 46:00
  Speaker 3: really incredible because you see the movement from the traditional
• 46:03
  Speaker 3: media to this kind of newer media, and it's it's scary.
• 46:08
  Speaker 1: Well, they they actually promote Joe Rogan, Like.
• 46:13
  Speaker 3: Why why why is he getting Why is this natural?
• 46:17
  Speaker 3: Is it because he's a good medium for their voice? Right?
• 46:22
  Speaker 3: So these very I'm not going to name their names,
• 46:24
  Speaker 3: people will know these names. They're very well known. But
• 46:26
  Speaker 3: Joe Rogan gets promoted because he lets them use him
• 46:30
  Speaker 3: as a kind of antenna for their ideas without questioning him. Munch.
• 46:35
  Speaker 3: That's that's very telling. How does Joe Rogan come in?
• 46:38
  Speaker 3: Like he's obviously very clever, but how does this guy
• 46:41
  Speaker 3: become the number one podcaster? Like? I think it's his background,
• 46:45
  Speaker 3: But I've done I've done a show called There's Something
• 46:48
  Speaker 3: Funny About Joe Rogan and it's kind of like it's
• 46:50
  Speaker 3: close friends. There's a lot of occultism there. Really, Yeah,
• 46:55
  Speaker 3: there's not that much of a separation between some of
• 46:57
  Speaker 3: his friends and Damian Ecles.
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah you didn't know, William, you're killing me.
• 47:04
  Speaker 3: No, that guy who he just had on with the
• 47:06
  Speaker 3: whole el Elf outfit, I can't even remember his name
• 47:09
  Speaker 3: right now. He had this guy on the I think
• 47:11
  Speaker 3: it was called Midnight Clomax was his show, and Damian
• 47:14
  Speaker 3: is on there he's promoting him, And then they had
• 47:18
  Speaker 3: an interplay. Somebody sent it to me, and it's like, uh, oh, man,
• 47:23
  Speaker 3: if he was unjustly committed, you should get some money
• 47:26
  Speaker 3: and pay out. Like he was a sympathetic take on Eccles.
• 47:30
  Speaker 3: And it's interesting too because Eckles, like they did two
• 47:32
  Speaker 3: hours of Eccles on Tim Poole, who's friends with Rogan,
• 47:36
  Speaker 3: and they did the same thing. It was just a
• 47:38
  Speaker 3: complete joke. I called a colossal l in the culture war. Gosh.
• 47:45
  Speaker 3: I wish I could remember. This guy's name is supposedly Comedian.
• 47:48
  Speaker 3: But they also Eccles his close friends with Amanda Knox.
• 47:53
  Speaker 3: There's pictures of them together, and Amanda Knox was on
• 47:56
  Speaker 3: Rogan and he never asked. Rogan didn't ask for any
• 47:59
  Speaker 3: incisive questionestions. He just actually let her walk all over him.
• 48:02
  Speaker 3: It's very interesting because he's not always passive. Sometimes he
• 48:08
  Speaker 3: fights back and pushes back, but in that case, he
• 48:11
  Speaker 3: was just like, oh, yeah, you've been un She was
• 48:13
  Speaker 3: convicted of colonia. She was convicted of the I think
• 48:18
  Speaker 3: the Italian version of defamation, throwing the black guy under
• 48:23
  Speaker 3: the bus, like she was trying to like literally blame
• 48:26
  Speaker 3: the black guy. And I don't think she's ever paid him. Yeah. So,
• 48:32
  Speaker 3: I mean I've got pictures of Eccles, and I mean
• 48:36
  Speaker 3: all these characters like Douglas is mentioned in this book
• 48:40
  Speaker 3: and in Program to Kill and Eccles and Douglas and
• 48:43
  Speaker 3: Berlinger and on this and what's her face? Amanda Knox
• 48:48
  Speaker 3: altogether I called it the poor Horsemen of the Apocalypse.
• 48:52
  Speaker 3: What yes, Oh yeah, no, it's bad.
• 48:54
  Speaker 1: Oh god, Well what do you think about people like
• 48:59
  Speaker 1: Alex Joe Jones?
• 49:01
  Speaker 3: Right, I mean there's a problem there too, Like I'm
• 49:03
  Speaker 3: telling you, these people are influence agents. Ah what was
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: the guy's name? Now, I'm just gonna like, shoot, yeah,
• 49:14
  Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, there's people who know more than me.
• 49:18
  Speaker 3: There's a problem with Jones too. I mean this that's
• 49:22
  Speaker 3: it gets really dark, like these are h.
• 49:26
  Speaker 1: Mm hmmm.
• 49:27
  Speaker 3: Show that's bothered me to figure out what this guy's
• 49:31
  Speaker 3: name was Midnight something, and I mean it's midnight special?
• 49:36
  Speaker 1: Was it on? Joe Rogan?
• 49:39
  Speaker 3: The guy's name I forgot. He did some show. It
• 49:43
  Speaker 3: wasn't Midnight Climaxes, Midnight something else.
• 49:46
  Speaker 1: And it was a comedy show supposedly.
• 49:50
  Speaker 3: M you said, let me see if I can find it.
• 49:56
  Speaker 3: Let me see if I can find his name. It
• 49:57
  Speaker 3: was a recent recent guest, Duncan Trussell. Ah, Okay, Duncan
• 50:04
  Speaker 3: Trussell was on December twenty fifth for Christmas. But this
• 50:07
  Speaker 3: guy did a show with Damian Apples, Damian Apples.
• 50:11
  Speaker 1: Oh my God, besties.
• 50:15
  Speaker 3: Yeah, Duncan Truss Damian that he had him on a
• 50:23
  Speaker 3: show twenty twenty Midnight Gospel was the name. And then
• 50:28
  Speaker 3: and he was on a show called Damian Eccles aka
• 50:30
  Speaker 3: fishpool Man.
• 50:34
  Speaker 1: So that you got all these weirdos hanging out together.
• 50:38
  Speaker 1: And then you know, anytime I tell somebody I have
• 50:41
  Speaker 1: like a conspiracy theory podcast or something like that, they're like, oh,
• 50:44
  Speaker 1: like Joe Rogan, Like he's.
• 50:47
  Speaker 3: The staple, He's the staple. Wow, because he's doing a
• 50:50
  Speaker 3: terrible job. I mean, the term the conspiracy theory is
• 50:54
  Speaker 3: just like a joke term. Like nothing I talk about
• 50:56
  Speaker 3: is theoretical. I do a lot of speculation and make
• 50:58
  Speaker 3: connections maybe, but like you can look all this stuff up.
• 51:03
  Speaker 3: So why are people doing real investigative journalism, that's the
• 51:06
  Speaker 3: real question. And why why is the public accepting these
• 51:11
  Speaker 3: talks like they're real investigative journalism when they're not, Like
• 51:16
  Speaker 3: the real investigative journalists are very few, and a lot
• 51:19
  Speaker 3: of the ones who really get it, they who are
• 51:21
  Speaker 3: real investigative journalists, like the guy who did Gary Webb recently.
• 51:27
  Speaker 3: I think it was his death, Like you get the worst,
• 51:30
  Speaker 3: like they come after you if you're not part of
• 51:32
  Speaker 3: the real group, like whoa like it's it's it can be. Yeah,
• 51:39
  Speaker 3: you're alone because most of these other people they're covered
• 51:42
  Speaker 3: they like I mean, like for example, I'll just use
• 51:45
  Speaker 3: one example. He's been on Ruban Ben Shapiro his best
• 51:48
  Speaker 3: friend or his buddy. Is that Yahoo? Right, So these
• 51:53
  Speaker 3: guys are connected. They're gonna tell the story of ten
• 51:55
  Speaker 3: to seven like it wasn't a black ath mm hmm.
• 51:59
  Speaker 1: I mean it's dangerous too because they're so influential to
• 52:03
  Speaker 1: so many people.
• 52:05
  Speaker 3: And I can't believe people trust these guys.
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: I'm sorry, I know, I know, I know, I know.
• 52:11
  Speaker 1: They even put like their health in everything, every aspect
• 52:14
  Speaker 1: of their life in the hands of these people.
• 52:17
  Speaker 3: Don't Rogan has a health thing, and it's I know,
• 52:20
  Speaker 3: I know he's a macho guy and he does MMA
• 52:25
  Speaker 3: and you know, so this is almost like the Hugh
• 52:28
  Speaker 3: Hefner in a way of our generation, Like you have
• 52:31
  Speaker 3: to was the kind of model like, oh he's got
• 52:34
  Speaker 3: the babes and there's good looking chicks and we're living
• 52:37
  Speaker 3: the you know, lifestyle. I think that he was a
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: great influencer tied to Kinsey, which is very disturbing, but
• 52:44
  Speaker 3: the tie to Crowley. So then you have Rogan like pictured,
• 52:48
  Speaker 3: you know, doing the cornudo with the grandson.
• 52:50
  Speaker 4: Of uh huh and a big time UFO exponent like
• 52:56
  Speaker 4: right behind him is the triangle with the UFO would
• 52:59
  Speaker 4: just bring you a cultural thing.
• 53:02
  Speaker 3: So he's on board with that. That side out that's
• 53:04
  Speaker 3: a I mean, I've done shows on that.
• 53:07
  Speaker 1: I don't believe in U and the UFO thing. I
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: don't think it's I mean, that's just the most bizarre
• 53:14
  Speaker 1: stuff that I've seen people start getting on the proof
• 53:18
  Speaker 1: right right.
• 53:18
  Speaker 3: Show uf you every picture they bring up or the
• 53:21
  Speaker 3: guy who was also on Rogan from Blink one eighty
• 53:24
  Speaker 3: two DeLong like he should the frisbee on there, like
• 53:28
  Speaker 3: it was real like for this, come on, this is
• 53:32
  Speaker 3: the new religion. Though, this is the new religion they're
• 53:34
  Speaker 3: they're they're promoting and is on board with the whole
• 53:38
  Speaker 3: like uh D m T and ayahuasca stuff. This is
• 53:43
  Speaker 3: the new drug era.
• 53:45
  Speaker 1: So.
• 53:47
  Speaker 3: Why is this that? Why is that out there? Why
• 53:49
  Speaker 3: is he? I mean, the guy's brought the bill dollars
• 53:52
  Speaker 3: is incredible.
• 53:53
  Speaker 1: And I used to watch him on Fear Factor and
• 53:56
  Speaker 1: I thought he was just a stupid guy who hosted
• 54:00
  Speaker 1: TV shows. You know, Now he's like one of the
• 54:03
  Speaker 1: most influential people on the planet.
• 54:05
  Speaker 3: He is the most influential. He and the bro podcast
• 54:10
  Speaker 3: helped get Trump over the finish line. Like all those
• 54:13
  Speaker 3: guys jd Vance who I don't even know what his
• 54:16
  Speaker 3: real name is, and Trump were on those shows. It
• 54:18
  Speaker 3: was Rogan, Dylan and Theovonne, like very influential shows. Those
• 54:25
  Speaker 3: are what pushed kind of the men like, oh, we
• 54:27
  Speaker 3: got to get out there because what's her face wouldn't
• 54:29
  Speaker 3: go on those shows. She can't really talk extemporaneously anyway.
• 54:33
  Speaker 3: But yeah, so I think, I mean this this was
• 54:37
  Speaker 3: changed world history in a lot of what it's unbelievable
• 54:40
  Speaker 3: influence world history, these kind of podcasts with not a
• 54:43
  Speaker 3: lot of well, like I said, it's just the same
• 54:47
  Speaker 3: thing we're talking about, how much influence is behind the
• 54:49
  Speaker 3: scene influencing these guys.
• 54:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's like you said, there's not a lot
• 54:53
  Speaker 1: of independent journalism out there, I would consider myself to
• 54:56
  Speaker 1: be at least trying to some degree to put some
• 54:59
  Speaker 1: pieces together.
• 55:00
  Speaker 3: Me too, Me too.
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: And before we wrap up, because I know we've been
• 55:04
  Speaker 1: on for about an hour, I do have to ask
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: you one more thing about Program to Kill that I'm
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: curious about, and it is the chapter on John Benet.
• 55:13
  Speaker 1: So recently John Ramsey has come out and he said
• 55:16
  Speaker 1: there's this new break in the case and they got
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: new evidence, and he's going on all these talk shows
• 55:22
  Speaker 1: to talk about it. And I think you and I
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: would both agree that they're never going to solve that
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: because we know what really happened to John Benet.
• 55:31
  Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it was Cyril Wett said that she
• 55:34
  Speaker 3: was being abused. There was evidence to arrest right there.
• 55:38
  Speaker 3: So how does that key into like some kind of
• 55:41
  Speaker 3: murderer outside of the family. What's going on? So then
• 55:48
  Speaker 3: problems with that case. The thing is is that he's.
• 55:52
  Speaker 3: One of the things about McGowan and why he will
• 55:54
  Speaker 3: stand the test of time is that he's his analysis
• 55:57
  Speaker 3: is almost always right, like the King into Esterbrooks and
• 56:01
  Speaker 3: seeing in this darker pattern of going on, dissociative states
• 56:05
  Speaker 3: and this operation cast and all these Cie doctors and
• 56:09
  Speaker 3: the questions, like I think that he was right about
• 56:11
  Speaker 3: John Bay too, and there's really I mean they had
• 56:14
  Speaker 3: this new documentary on Netflix too, right, and it's like.
• 56:18
  Speaker 1: The one that's blaming the brother.
• 56:20
  Speaker 3: Yeah, well no, I think that that one they got sued.
• 56:23
  Speaker 3: That was a different one. There's a more recent one
• 56:25
  Speaker 3: that just came out, but I think I don't know
• 56:27
  Speaker 3: that album.
• 56:28
  Speaker 1: It might be I think I might have saw it
• 56:30
  Speaker 1: actually on HBO or something like that. And yeah, they're
• 56:34
  Speaker 1: all they always pointed outside the family, right or the
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: little brother did it or like something ridiculous like that.
• 56:40
  Speaker 1: But it's like, was the little brother rapinger? Really? That's
• 56:44
  Speaker 1: because it's like you said that the I guess it
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: was the autopsy report there was clear signs of sexual abuse.
• 56:53
  Speaker 1: So I mean, are they going to tie that to
• 56:55
  Speaker 1: the little brother? That's it just doesn't It never makes sense.
• 56:58
  Speaker 1: None of the piece is at up.
• 57:00
  Speaker 3: Dude. Ciarrah Weckt was sadly he passed away, but he
• 57:04
  Speaker 3: did such great work even on The Spiley Face Killers too,
• 57:06
  Speaker 3: Like one of the victims was Dakota James because he's
• 57:11
  Speaker 3: in Pittsburgh, was in Pittsburgh. But another guy, you got
• 57:14
  Speaker 3: it right all the time, like like super bright guy,
• 57:17
  Speaker 3: Like it's really hard to get a JD or like
• 57:20
  Speaker 3: past the bar and stuff. But he had a bar
• 57:22
  Speaker 3: degree and a medical degree, but like he I mean,
• 57:24
  Speaker 3: you have to take him kind of facebaut So all
• 57:26
  Speaker 3: this other propaganda and all this other strange stuff, you
• 57:30
  Speaker 3: have questions about it. What's your take on.
• 57:32
  Speaker 1: John Maney, Well, I think that her parents were involved
• 57:35
  Speaker 1: in some crazy stuff. I mean with the access graphics
• 57:39
  Speaker 1: thing in John Ramsey, he got, you know, a huge
• 57:43
  Speaker 1: bonus for Christmas, and then I don't know, the handwriting matches.
• 57:48
  Speaker 1: Patsy and their friends, the Whites, they're into some weird
• 57:54
  Speaker 1: stuff and they had their kids like in these weird
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: pageant circles and stuff. And the pageant thing on its
• 58:01
  Speaker 1: own is enough for me to think there was something
• 58:03
  Speaker 1: else going on, because if you actually go and look,
• 58:09
  Speaker 1: there are no record of those pageants ever existing outside
• 58:12
  Speaker 1: of John Bennet. So it's like this underground pageant world
• 58:18
  Speaker 1: stuff and like the kittie porn stuff, and you know
• 58:22
  Speaker 1: the Wonderland raids, Like a couple of people turned up
• 58:26
  Speaker 1: with pictures of John Bennet during the Wonderland I'm telling you, William,
• 58:31
  Speaker 1: it's it goes deep and like for them to keep
• 58:34
  Speaker 1: drudging it up and like, oh, John Ramsey's back in
• 58:36
  Speaker 1: the news again because they've got this break in the case.
• 58:39
  Speaker 1: It's like they're never going to solve that. They're just
• 58:41
  Speaker 1: like bringing it up to remind you, Oh, look at
• 58:45
  Speaker 1: this little girl and it's unsolved. And I don't even know.
• 58:49
  Speaker 1: It's just a big joke, a big game, like I
• 58:51
  Speaker 1: said before, But it's.
• 58:52
  Speaker 3: These networks, like we started off, mc martin was probably network.
• 58:55
  Speaker 3: There's all some of the right right, right, and even
• 58:58
  Speaker 3: I think McGowan mentions tunnels had Opera interviewed that guy Steiner,
• 59:03
  Speaker 3: Like some of that stuff is verified and crazy weird
• 59:06
  Speaker 3: stuff was going on, weird magical hats like and then
• 59:10
  Speaker 3: it's like that you get into trauma based mind control
• 59:13
  Speaker 3: and SRA and it's like that they're traumatizing the kids, right,
• 59:16
  Speaker 3: and they've been proved like some of these were. There
• 59:19
  Speaker 3: was one it was the witch hunt narrative, right, I
• 59:22
  Speaker 3: can't remember the name, but the book, Like some of
• 59:24
  Speaker 3: these have been verified. So like some of the stuff,
• 59:27
  Speaker 3: like these child care things were the opposite of care,
• 59:31
  Speaker 3: child uncare places there was one and I think it
• 59:34
  Speaker 3: was Fuster was his.
• 59:35
  Speaker 1: Name, Yeah, Frank Fuster Country Walk Babysitting.
• 59:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah, you know they bust like they had the evidence
• 59:43
  Speaker 3: and they were. They'll deny it and call it satanic
• 59:45
  Speaker 3: panic or something like that or have some turn.
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: But explain to me how the Country Walk Babysitting Service
• 59:52
  Speaker 1: was the subsidiary of Walt Disney Company. Like, you can't
• 59:57
  Speaker 1: tell me that's not by design, you know, that's really so.
• 1:00:02
  Speaker 1: But anyways, William, thanks so much for joining me. I've
• 1:00:05
  Speaker 1: really enjoyed our conversation. And if you could just let
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: the listeners know if they haven't already, you know, dove
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: into William Ramsey Investigates. It's one of my favorite podcasts.
• 1:00:15
  Speaker 1: But where can they find it?
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 3: Uh, you can find it anywhere our tunes, Spotify. I've
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 3: done a lot of shows on kind of mind control
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 3: and things like that. I had like little carve out
• 1:00:25
  Speaker 3: called the d Hypno Program, and I cover a lot
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 3: of the stuff like this is real stuff like Esterbrooks
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 3: that's mentioned in this book, some of these other case
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 3: and I've got some kind of on my batter circles
• 1:00:36
  Speaker 3: I'm trying to get out and that are on the subject.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 3: I think it's important to understand, and it goes all
• 1:00:41
  Speaker 3: the way up to the present. This kind of kind
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 3: of take a shot at Trump has all the indicators
• 1:00:48
  Speaker 3: and some of these other guys, this guy Luigi whatever.
• 1:00:50
  Speaker 3: It's very strange that somebody would take such a radical
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 3: turn who had a very promising life. I mean, you
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 3: are the the valedictorian of your private school, so this
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 3: is kind of like an elite thing. How does somebody
• 1:01:03
  Speaker 3: go from that and goes through this behavior modification or
• 1:01:06
  Speaker 3: behavioral change into and I don't even know, how would
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 3: you know that the CEO is walking.
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: Out of a hotel at seven right?
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 3: That's the thing that's like, why doesn't anybody ask that question?
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 3: I would be like, if you would think the killer
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 3: would be like, I'm gonna get him because he's going
• 1:01:21
  Speaker 3: to this meeting. I know he's going to be there
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 3: for you know, so I'm gonna wait outside this meeting
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 3: or whatever. How does he know he's leaving at seven o'clock? Anyway,
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 3: So there's a lot of real questions. So a lot
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 3: of the stuff if you look deeper, who gets kind
• 1:01:34
  Speaker 3: of disturbing, So you can look into that. It's William Ramsay,
• 1:01:37
  Speaker 3: gotta say it's all. My books are on Amazon five books,
• 1:01:40
  Speaker 3: and then you can also watch them for free on
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 3: my Patreon.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 1: William Ramseys Well, thank you so much, William, I really
• 1:01:48
  Speaker 1: appreciate it, and thanks to all the listeners out there.
• 1:01:52
  Speaker 1: We will catch you on the next one.
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 2: City Whom is it pretty and the whole for me,
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: Whom in the darkness, Whome on the highway, Whome is in.
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 1: That way, who will never be.
• 1:02:23
  Speaker 4: Burn out? Stay?
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 1: But after night.
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 4: I can't say is a due put up a fake?
• 1:02:38
  Speaker 2: I'm live, a locking, a love, devil his due. I'm
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 2: burn burn you, I'm murder out burning you.