Latest / The Growth Project / Episode 353: Understanding Mental Rest and Why It Matters (Part 2)

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Episode 353: Understanding Mental Rest and Why It Matters (Part 2) · The Growth Project

• 0:00
  You.
• 0:03
  Welcome to The Growth Project, a podcast brought to you by inflows. Great to be back today. Doctor Drew Brandt joined by. I think I'm going with I know that prior to joining and plus a lot of people called you doctor C. Yes they did. Yes. My students at all call me doctor C, and my athletes as well.
• 0:26
  So that's, I can do doctor caveat it, but I think I'm gonna do that. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Go for doctor C, joined by doctor C today. And, we hope that you had an opportunity to to get on to episode one of this podcast that we're doing focused on, the concept in the concept of mental rest.
• 0:46
  If you didn't, if you're hearing this for the first time, easy. All you got to do, go check us out last week or we had episode one, and we really kind of got into who knew exactly what this means and what some of the components are. You still can get and we'll get plenty out of today if you did not catch episode one.
• 1:03
  But, Gaby, why don't we. Let's start there. Yep. Can you offer just a little bit of a high level overview and recap of what we got into for episode one? Absolutely. So, you know, we started off really recapping the the types of demands, individuals experience, whether that be in sport or life in general work.
• 1:23
  Really touching on that.
• 1:24
  There is, of course, your physical demands, demands that you're putting on your body and then you have your cognitive demands, those more thinking level demands having to process and make decisions. And then, of course, your emotional demands, having to deal with, you know, both positive and negative emotions that you experience in the day to day and how that affects performance.
• 1:48
  To really broke down the three different types of demands we experienced and then explored this idea of rest and further broke down rest into physical and mental rest. We've spent some time talking about how physical rest has really been, a main topic of discussion for a lot of years. We highlighted some of the, you know, Rest modalities that individuals go through for recovering their body.
• 2:14
  And, yes, that is where the cold plunges come in. But then we went into mental rest. And, you know, again, that's the type of rest that I think it's less talked about and less known widely. So, really went into discovering what mental rest is, and it's this idea of how do you let your brain and mind recover the same way you're letting your body recover?
• 2:41
  And introduce some of the experiences briefly that you can engage in to, get mental rest. And then today we're really going to delve deeper into that. Yeah. Awesome. Great recap for sure. And yeah, I just go back in my mind to our discussion on episode one. And one of the things that I felt like we were trying to establish fundamentally is how important it is to be resting.
• 3:09
  Yeah. And it's interesting. We're not that far away. I can't believe I'm saying this. We are not that far away from kind of the end of year rhythms that I know people typically get into in, in my experience, one of the more common things that people do is they get to the end of the year. And when they're doing, they're kind of like, look back.
• 3:26
  Assess, reflect. We hope we're doing those things. It's very, very normal to do that and then develop kind of this insight. Like I get I've got to do some things differently with my time with my schedule and I've got to create more margin and I've got they might not be using the word rest right. But it's part of what they're realizing they need to do.
• 3:45
  Absolutely. I think our timing in this conversation is is fantastic, because we aren't that far away from people going through the process of doing that. So I couldn't agree more. And this idea of scheduling in your me time is going to be something that I think we'll touch on today. But yeah, I think at the end of the year you reflect and you say, wow, I've done a lot this year, but I'm exhausted, I'm drained, and what have I done for me?
• 4:12
  Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And the one other comment I want to make here is when you go through that process of assessing, thinking about where you want over the course of the year, how you hope to maybe win, to a larger degree, or maybe a larger extent in the coming year. I find that the tendency is that people are looking to, like, dial up in different areas.
• 4:35
  Yeah. More. Right. Do more. And this isn't necessarily a discussion about, doing more versus doing less. It's about finding the right opportunities, to, to rest, to let your body rest. Let your mind rest. It's interesting because what we really see here is that if you'll just do that, it really can become a competitive advantage. Absolutely. And that's what so much of today is about the brain into helping you better understand the very practical, concrete ways.
• 5:06
  If you want to put this into practice, we're going to offer you ideas for how to do that. Yeah, I think it goes back to something both you and mill always say, which is finding the harmony in your work life balance. Yeah, I think that this is going to give you those practical strategies to help you obtain that harmony.
• 5:22
  We're headed on a Harmony mission. Yes, the Harmony mission. So, Gabby, before we get into these specific examples, I do want to spend a few more moments at least talking to you about, like why this is so vital. And specifically, I know you're going to touch on some of your data. Yeah, your dissertation research. So let's start there.
• 5:38
  We know that mental rest affects both wellbeing and performance. Yes. Share some of the data with the stress.
• 5:45
  my data really was focused on NCAA athletes and looking at mental rest and linking it to depressive symptoms and overall athlete well-being. And what we found was that over 50% of our large population that we sampled, had clinically, relevant depressive symptoms.
• 6:05
  So, that's quite, quite a large percentage. Yeah. Just pause there for one second. And, you know, I was in sort of last. Yeah. People were listening to this, were maybe some or I think probably some or we, we certainly have people that are currently in college listening. That's a tough stat to hear, isn't it? In part because for so many athletes, myself included, that was the dream, right?
• 6:32
  Like the dream, the goal, the vision was to earn an opportunity to play your sport at the collegiate level. And yet half of your sample was endorsing symptoms consistent with depressive symptoms. Yeah. Wow. Yes. It was a shocking statistic for us to find because, you know, we genuinely didn't think it would be that high. Yeah. And it's grown massively over the years, you know, especially post-Covid, it skyrocketed if you look back at the data.
• 7:04
  So, it's continuing to rise, which is really why this idea of mental rest became such a focus for me and, why it matters so much. Because it it has a large impact. Right. So I know that's not the primary focus of our conversation yet, but let's at least offer our listeners, a little bit of insight.
• 7:27
  And, you know, how is that? Why is that? Like, what are some of the key drivers of why those numbers are down? Yeah. So really what we found was that it was the cognitive and emotional demands that athletes were experiencing, that they felt that they weren't able to cope with those effectively or manage them effectively. And so it just wore that, wore them down over time.
• 7:56
  You know, they, they and some literature that we looked at, really highlighted that they were doing all the things for their physical recovery protocol. They were, you know, making sure that they were healthy, eating the right foods. Their nutrition was on point. So we were thinking, you know, what else? What else is it here?
• 8:16
  Yeah.
• 8:16
  Started asking some questions around, you know, what are you doing in your free time?
• 8:22
  Nine times out of ten, they said, what? Free time? Yeah. I eat bread, sleep, my sport and school. And, that led us down this path of. Okay, well, how do we help you manage that? How do we help you recover from that side of it? Yeah. So I'm going to make a leap here. Yep. It's not too far fetched, but if you go back to episode one, we were talking a lot about, just people in a professional sense who are in a highly pressured, highly structured type of industry.
• 8:54
  There's plenty out there. And I think the commonality here is those folks are also feeling under the gun, feeling pressure to yield outcomes to light up the scoreboard. There might be, here's a big difference. Guess what they're not doing. They're not getting nearly as much physical activity as the average. Right. Which is intended to be kind of a stress or a coping mechanism.
• 9:16
  Nor are they eating as well as these kids are. Right, I wouldn't think. I mean, you know, if the kids aren't eating well, that's on them, but they're being provided with more than enough nutritious food, right? So that the nutrition and the physical activity is more than likely much better, right, than the busy working professional. And so that gets me even more worried about, like, what are their numbers look like?
• 9:35
  You don't know. But it's hard to think they look better than that. Yeah, I would I would not be surprised if they were, you know, much higher than that. So approximately 50% of your sample have clinically relevant signs of depression. And then also talk please. About what? About flourishing. Yes. Explain what that means as well. Yeah. So this idea of well-being.
• 9:56
  Right. It's, we characterize it as either you have a flourishing wellbeing or a languishing well-being. And flourishing is where you experience a lot of positive emotions on a daily basis. You're you're happy, you're expressing gratitude for the life you have. And, just overall satisfaction languishing is kind of the opposite of that, where you dread the days you think negatively about, all of the things you have to do in a given day, the demands you have.
• 10:28
  And then it's just kind of like this gray cloud is how I describe it. That's, you know, you wake up and you're just, like, not excited to live the life that you have in front of you. And what we found was that only 45% of our athletes, were in that flourishing category. So going back to, like you said, this is something that they've dreamed of competing at the Division one level, being a D1 athlete.
• 10:56
  I mean, that's a dream for all of these kids. And they get there and all of a sudden that's not the case anymore. They they dread it now. And that's a very concerning. Yes. It's extremely concerning. And I want to as we're going through this, let's, I do think it's important interject this. We aren't trying to paint college athletics in just like a negative like that is.
• 11:20
  No, you know what we're saying? Yes. I mean, we both look out for. Yeah. What we are trying to bring to light here are just some I think compelling data. That forces us, I hope to really think critically about like how do we get here and what can be done. And then I think it's an important, connection to make to the working world.
• 11:42
  Right. Absolutely. Working professionals, whatever. However you define that really in any industry, I think it's important that we're able to do that. All right. So I think it's pretty clear to me why this is so important. Yeah. Any additional comments or thoughts from you on why it matters? Before we really get into kind of these resting examples now, I think the only other thing I'd add is that it's really, this goes for the professional world as well as breaking the stigma around what I call the productivity monster, where we, we feel like if we take five minutes just sitting on the couch, we don't even fully relax.
• 12:18
  And we're we're hard on ourselves. We saying, oh, I'm not doing enough. And that is going to be a big factor. And to this idea of applying these principles is don't let that productivity monster constantly be that chip on your shoulder. Allow yourself to engage in these practices. Yeah, I've not heard that term. Really? Yeah. Look out for the monster.
• 12:45
  Look out for the monster. Yep. Okay, well, then let's jump into Gabby and we're going to do it this way. We're going to kind of drill down and get into much more detail on kind of the four resting examples or categories that we talked about last time, beginning with detachment. And so as we get into these probably a little bit, we'll do a little review.
• 13:04
  But then I'm that we're particularly focused on unpacking these in the sense of like, here's how you put this to work. Yeah. So we'll start with detachment, which we're really defining is this is a person's ability to switch off. Yeah. So elaborate on that a little bit. Yeah. So switch off. Is really this principle of how do you separate yourself from your sport or work fully.
• 13:28
  Let your mind not worry about what you have going on at work when you leave the office or when you close that laptop for the day. And it's a complex principle because, you know, nowadays we've talked about this previously is everything's on your phone and there's notifications, they ping and, you know, if you have a smartwatch, you're not only getting it on your phone, you're getting buzzed on your wrist, even if your phone's not in your hand.
• 13:55
  although I turn it off. Yeah. Smart. Highly encourage me every time. They're like, why do you even have an Apple Watch? Yeah, because I don't utilize really, like, any of the things that it's supposed to offer you. Notifications. No tax, no calls, no nothing. Yeah, but I still like it. Yeah. Certain. You. Well, but I just turn things off.
• 14:13
  Yeah, well, that's this, that's detaching right there. That's what you're actively trying to do is, But you say trying. And what makes it trying and not doing well with the watch, I would say I'm doing. I guess I'm talking about other. Yeah. Other domains maybe not. And I think but even the you know, the example of trying to, to kind of wind down your day.
• 14:38
  Yeah I hear a bunch. Is that. Well I can never completely get away from it. My brain never shuts off. Yeah. Okay. Maybe there's some truth to that. But what I do know is that there are decisions you can make. You don't have to get back on that computer. You don't have to reply to that work email.
• 14:56
  But now I'm waiting kind of wondering if they're going to reply back to me. Right. So there are some things you can do that people want to show you. Yeah. And I mean you're not even hitting on the all of the increase in work from home individuals, which makes it even harder to detach because now your personal space, your home space has become your workspace.
• 15:16
  So another key principle here is how do you separate yourself from your office space in your home, from your bedroom? And keeping that a place of a work free zone, if you will. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think about the funny example. Mila has talked about this on the podcast a couple times, that there was a client of his that during Covid, started disrupting his work from home.
• 15:40
  Talking about a lot of people doing that. He started this routine where he would he would he was ready to shut down for the day. He would close his computer, he would walk out of his office, he would go out the side door of his house and walk around to the front and come in the front door.
• 15:57
  Wow. Going home? Yeah. I'm home for the day and I'm back. Yeah. Although it sounds kind of maybe funny as we're sitting here talking about it while on the podcast, it's interesting to me. Yeah. Like I think there and he and he talked. He wouldn't be doing it if he didn't find value in it. But even just that real kind of like thoughtful example of I'm going to detach from my day.
• 16:18
  Yeah, I like going out the side door and coming through the front door. I think it's pretty clever. Very clever. I mean, it's I like that detachment in an active setting right there. I love it, but it's that idea of like, how do you really separate from in this case we're talking about work. If we're talking for athletes, that's especially hard because.
• 16:41
  Yeah. You think here's one of the differences. Like we're in the sports world, we know it's normal in the evenings for example. And then you do bad people on social media. Because of what they're interested in. The odds are what's on their social media is sports. Absolutely. All those things. Yeah. Whereas you know if I'm in industry make up the industry and the health care industry, maybe some of that is coming in on my social media feed.
• 17:03
  But it's not the same. Yeah. Different. So it's particularly hard for athletes. Yeah it is. And it reminds me of, a client I worked with somewhat recently. It's affecting young kids these days, too. It's, it's, you know, just eye opening is I had this athlete who she after school, she had about an hour or maybe two hours before practice, and she'd go home, scroll on her phone and, all she'd see a soccer videos and.
• 17:33
  Right, she would express me. I'm dreading going to practice. Like, I don't know why, I just don't want to go. And I said, well, what are you doing in that? You know, it's two hours in that scrolling. I said, watch your favorite TV show instead. Yeah, I got home from school the next week, watch your favorite TV show for an hour before going to practice, and came back and she said, that helped me so much, just not thinking about my sport before showing up.
• 18:00
  So it can be done not only after at the end of the day, but prior as well. Well, and that's a good example too, about digital or sorry, active versus passive. Yes. Yeah, I know we've we've touched on that in some prior episodes, but if you're not familiar with it, you know, you'll hear people talking about how digital consumption before bed bad.
• 18:24
  And there is truth to that. But there's varying types here. Whereas if I'm on my phone scrolling that's active digital consumption. Yep. Where my mind is very much engaged. The example would be if someone's scrolling through TikTok or Instagram and you're going from like one video to the next. Yeah, you're like and you're kind of like checking in to each one.
• 18:45
  With each passing video it's very active. Yeah. Passive digital consumption is what you just said for more so TV show. Right where I'm watching a movie or. Show everything. And that's so much better for your brain. So much better. Yeah. So so much better. So if, if you've got to be doing something digital before you go to bed, try to select a passive example and not get scroll.
• 19:07
  Absolutely. Couldn't agree more. All right. Any other thoughts on detachment? I think that we've covered it pretty extensively here. Anything from you?
• 19:15
  The only one I would say that I have found super helpful in my personal life would be, trying to draw a hard line on the time that. What, you're not going to do any work?
• 19:26
  Yeah, yeah, because, like, I know, for me, if I go about and if I get, you know, whatever given bedtime, whatever the target is for me personally, if I can go rewind 90 minutes. And draw a hard line there. If I'm not doing any work at 90, after 90 minutes from I go to bed, I fall asleep.
• 19:48
  Right. Yeah. If I violate that and I'm working within that 90 minute window, I don't sleep very well. Right. And so you just have to know yourself. Yes. That's a really, really important attachment. Yeah. I love what you said there. You've got to know yourself and what what you need to detach because everybody's going to be a little bit different.
• 20:08
  And that way some people need 30 minutes, some people need 90 minutes, some people just need five. And that's figuring out what you need. And being aware of that. I'm glad it's five new people. Yeah. Let's move it up. Move on. Okay. Now we're talking about relaxations. First was attachment. Now to number two. Let's unpack kind of the relaxation component which a lot of that is about lowering.
• 20:34
  You know the terminology you'll see in the literature here is everything from arousal to stress and anxiety. Yeah there's there's a lot of kind of synonymous use of those terms. Yes. Yeah. So lowering that activation if you will. The arousal level is just getting yourself to a calm state. You know, keeping your heart rate low, your blood pressure low, and your breathing very regulated and calm.
• 21:04
  A lot of different things can be used for relaxation. All of the things we typically think about when we think about, oh, I'm going to go relax. I'm going to, meditate, do some deep breathing. I'm going to listen to my favorite music and just kind of really lock in and just listen, not think about anything else.
• 21:26
  Art is a form of relaxation where some people I know, something that's become more prominent is the paint by numbers a lot of adults are doing this now, where it's this idea of just getting a coloring book or a painting book, and all you do is like a lot a little kid does. You just color in based off of the number associated with the color.
• 21:50
  And so many people find this to just be so relaxing. That is a big deal. Now. Yeah, it is, but I've heard I've heard about it. Yeah. That it's a a lot of people find it to be super relaxing. Yeah. So anything like that I mean going for a little walk outside, preferably without your phone. Right.
• 22:11
  But anything that's really going to help you get into that calm, relaxed state. So let's do a practical example. Yeah. Because it could be could look something just like this. Imagine, you have a big meeting coming up. And you know it and it's been on your calendar for quite some time. Key client. Key potential client whatever it is.
• 22:34
  And let's create a very simple 1 to 10 system here whether we're using arousal anxiety stress whatever it is. 123 very low. Eight 910 very high. We don't want to be 123 nor do we want to be eight, 910. Right. Eight, nine, ten is usually the more common problem. Yeah. If it's a big meeting you're probably not one, 2 or 3.
• 22:54
  But when we talk about relaxation what we're saying is it's not good for you to go into that meeting at an eight, 9 or 10. Right. And so, Gabby, if I'm in a if I'm a nine, any given moment, what's the best thing I can do to dial back and figure out how to become a six? The most effective thing in the literature is breathing techniques.
• 23:19
  Deep inhales, long exhales. And just doing a couple two minutes worth of deep breathing will have massive effects on, your activation or arousal levels. The science behind it is there. It just forces your body to enter that calmer state by slowing the heart rate, and getting that oxygen into the bloodstream. Yeah, it's just such a massively helpful tool.
• 23:46
  It is a great tool. It's super efficient. It doesn't take long. Yeah. There's no cost involved. No there's no like advanced training needed to be able to like do you just it's great. It is. It's such a great tool. Okay. So we've got relaxation. Now let's get into talking about the third of four review control. Yeah. Which is really capturing this idea of regaining reclaiming autonomy.
• 24:15
  So talk us through that kind of what that really means Gabby. Yeah. So I know in the last episode we touched on how, you know, not only athletes but individuals, you know, working as well. I feel like they have very little control over their day to day.
• 24:30
  Yeah. Normal. You've got all these other commitments and obligations that interfere with you feeling like you have a say.
• 24:37
  So this idea of control is helping you regain that sense of, you know, I have some decision over what I'm doing and when I'm doing it. And the key here, too, is that includes doing nothing at all. If you know that you want to be able to do nothing at all, allowing yourself that, and it's it's a very powerful tool because we talk about autonomy all the time, and it's one of those core basic needs for motivation.
• 25:10
  So. And if we aren't prioritizing that, it has huge detriments on our productivity and, overall well-being. And that's just even one of the biggest ways, more common ways you increase stress. You take away the autonomy. Absolutely. So when you remove that from someone's capability it typically drives up stress, drives up cortisol. So the inverse there is true as well.
• 25:34
  How do we help people feel more at ease. Might give something back. So if you feel like you have a greater degree of autonomy as an individual and wherever else where you are in life or what you're doing, what you're focused on, you're more likely to be able to check out and you're using even the example here of controlling how it relates to mental rest.
• 25:53
  When I can choose, you know what? Like, hey, this, you know, next Saturday afternoon I'm going to take a couple hours and I'm going to go out to, you know, the park and yeah, nice. Well, okay, I'm choosing it. I'm getting away and there's a million other examples. But when you feel like you have a greater degree of control over making a decision like that, you get more out of it.
• 26:18
  Yeah, absolutely. And you know, I love your example because it like you said, you feel like you have a degree of control over. But let's say you wake up that Saturday morning and now it's raining and storming. So what you felt you had control over and what you were maybe looking forward to now that's gone and you don't have control.
• 26:42
  Yeah. So then how do you navigate still obtaining this in a moment like that? I guess you head to the fitness center and jump on the treadmill, maybe. Yeah. If that was part of what you were trying to do, exercise wise, you've got two options. Maybe your Saturday afternoon plan becomes your Sunday afternoon plan. Things like that.
• 27:03
  Absolutely. Being flexible. That's why this idea of control is so important. But you have to always be flexible with it. You can't be rigid in the control piece because you're never going to have complete control. Right. It's not going to be perfect.
• 27:18
  going back to your example that you were saying about your bedtime process, being able to, you know, control that you have 90 minutes before bad where you're not thinking about work, not looking at work.
• 27:30
  And, you know, that's detachment, but also control because you have that control. It's just a matter of, you know, holding yourself accountable to it. It's easy to say, okay, well, just one more email, I just or algebra homework. Yeah. To watch that call that work too. Because I did algebra a long time ago. To back up for to try to help.
• 27:57
  Yep. Okay. So let's give to the last one you're writing. Yeah. Breaking routine. How does breaking routine and having more variety help us rest mental. Well it helps with the monotony of it. Right. We we get into the same routines, day in and day out. And let's be honest, it gets boring. Yeah, yeah, there's there's a lot of average Tuesdays in life.
• 28:25
  Absolutely, absolutely. So it's how do you basically spice life up? How do you still have something to look forward to and get excited about? Even if it's something very small, like, you know, trying a new hobby or, you know, say your favorite artist puts out a new album listening to that on the way to work, and that switches things up for you.
• 28:49
  It's it's really these small things that can add variety into your day to day. Yeah. It's changing how you do meetings. Yeah. What you tackle thing and we tackle things in meetings. You know removing meetings and adding different types. There's lots of things you can do. Well something we've been doing in the new office even is you know, getting out of our offices and going to one of the other spaces in here and working in there for a little bit.
• 29:15
  So especially for those of you who maybe work from home, it's, you know, switch up, getting out of your office, you know, go respond to an email while you walk around the neighborhood or, you know, going to sit at the dining room table and look out the window if you have that kind of view. Anything that just changes up the routine.
• 29:37
  Yep. And we all know what that feels like, right? You get that feeling once again, I just I got to be out of here. Absolutely. That's what mental rest is. But ideally you'd want to be doing that before you get to the point where it's like, I got to get out of here. Let's do this sooner. Micro breaks.
• 29:52
  Yeah. Exactly, exactly. Okay. Well so let me just recap those last time for the listeners. Everybody has them. There are four categories of how do you go grab Ahold of and achieve mental rest. It's a function of detachment relaxation control and variety. Yeah. Those are the categories. We want to be challenging our listeners to think in and try to be creative, but absolutely.
• 30:18
  Okay, so I know we need to kind of move toward wrapping up here in a few minutes. What are some final thoughts we can offer on this idea of this for leaders, especially when we say we're just going to be coaches in an athletic environment. It could be business leaders and organizational sense, but how do you establish a culture of, hey, we value, we care about mental rest?
• 30:40
  Well, I think the leaders you have to to model it be that lead by example. If and this is where you have to kind of check in with yourself and say, what am I doing? What am I practices when it comes to mental rest? Because if you are not setting those boundaries, if you're not, you know, shutting down at 830 to give yourself an hour or 90 minutes before bed, then you know you're not really setting the tone for your employees or your athletes.
• 31:12
  And if you're constantly on your lunch break talking about projects that you have coming up or, things that need to get done throughout the day, that's being communicated, that lunch break is not really a break. It's it's a time where we still talk about what we have to do and what we need to get done, and it goes back to this idea of the productivity monster.
• 31:34
  If you're not creating a culture where it's okay to not talk about work, where it's okay to not be 100% go, go, go all the time. And allow yourself and your employees, to have these micro breaks, then it's just not going to happen. Yeah. No, I mean, yeah, if you're talking about, hey, this thing is important.
• 32:04
  But not doing that then you're sending a message is not doesn't matter whether we're talking about mental rest or whatever though. The example is gotta live with the life right. Absolutely. But you know that great irony of that as well is if you go back to the kind of a business leader, typically everybody wants the same things.
• 32:23
  A little bit about that is like, hey, the business leader wants the team to perform at the highest level of possibly can the people on the team want to perform at the highest level they possibly can. And yet sometimes what happens is the business leader or the leader in the company is just like pushing, pushing, driving, driving and not valuing things like it's enough and then no one's getting what they really want anyways, right?
• 32:45
  Because you're going to get a lesser capability level and kind of a, you know, a compromised human. Because he or she doesn't have the, the energy, the focus, the passion, whatever it is needed. Performing it on to a level. Absolutely. So there's massive ROI associated with valuing both physical and mental. Absolutely. I think it goes outside of the office to goes into your personal life when you get home from work.
• 33:13
  What are you talking to your spouse about? Of course you want to ask how their day was and you want to know how work was. But setting boundaries in that domain to have. Okay, well, let's talk about work for ten, 15 minutes. Let's do the updates. But now let's let's talk about things outside of work. Let me tell you the fix for that.
• 33:32
  Teenagers. Teenagers, if you just have some teenagers that live with you, you know what I hear about it one bit and they're not afraid to tell you that yet. Whereas, you know, with the when the kids were younger, they didn't want to hear about it then either. But they were a little more, maybe subdued, letting me know.
• 33:51
  So like, they don't want to hear about it.
• 33:54
  All right. Well, as we kind of wrap up, just want to thank our listeners for tuning in that really want to challenge you to, to to reflect on where you are with respect to a lot of the stuff we've talked about and we've given you particularly today, I think some very practical put these to work immediately, type ideas, maybe start with one category, whether it be detachment, whether it be control, whatever it is.
• 34:17
  But choose one area and choose one action you're going to get started with and then get moving. Absolutely. Start small and build from there. Yeah. Get moving. And maybe this becomes part of your end of the year review, although you don't need to wait that long. Yeah. So thank you for tuning in Gabby. Thank you for sharing particularly a lot of your, your research from, Florida State.
• 34:38
  Absolutely. I appreciate that very much. And it's the way it, really informative talking about that. All right. Well, thank you for tuning in and we look forward to our next conversation coming up here real soon. Take care.