Latest / For Azeroth!: A World of Warcraft Podcast / #260 - For Azeroth!: “Wrath of the WoW Token”

Transcript

#260 - For Azeroth!: “Wrath of the WoW Token” · For Azeroth!: A World of Warcraft Podcast

0:00
The wild token has come to Classic.
0:03
It's offered as a solution for the rampant, real money
0:06
transfers, but has a damaged being done and is a cure worse
0:10
than the disease. I'm joined by a special guest as
0:14
we go. Deep into what's happening over
0:17
on. Wow, classic Oak Island.
0:32
For the alliance for Azeroth. Hello and welcome back to
0:42
another episode of for Azeroth today.
0:45
We're going to be checking in on classic because there is a lot
0:49
of News, Making Waves in classic and I would not be able to
0:53
Figure it out myself. So I've called in the expert for
0:56
a jolly. Hello, how are you today?
0:59
I'm doing just great. How are you doing?
1:01
I'm doing pretty good. It's been a pretty chaotic
1:05
little bit of time, but yeah dude.
1:08
Alright I'm doing. All right.
1:10
So really for the people who may not know you can you introduce
1:16
yourself and all the work that you do.
1:19
Yeah. So I go by the pseudonym, a
1:21
jolly online. I am a co-host with my friends I
1:26
robe of Scrubs. First world podcast currently on
1:28
Hiatus but hoping to come back at some point.
1:32
I've also got a history of rating at a semi hardcore level
1:36
cutting-edge level 4 for most of Wow's history.
1:39
But in the Last couple of years that moved over to a more casual
1:42
schedule with Wow classic. So Wrath of the Lich King right
1:45
now. Yeah.
1:48
And Wrath of the Lich King. You know the fuck normal
1:52
expansion that everybody loves it?
1:53
How's it been going back to that?
1:58
It's been a lot of fun, a Nostalgia bomb of sorts.
2:03
Just it hits you, when you're leveling up and going through
2:06
northrend going through the zones that you remember, kind of
2:09
vaguely. But, but having those Quest by
2:11
Quest moments, it's been a lot of fun.
2:13
The, the rating is great old war has been the patch that we've
2:18
been in now for Upward a little over four months now, which
2:22
unironically is longer than original old?
2:24
War was out before Toc, but I think it's been Of fun.
2:29
I know we've got some members in the guild who never got to
2:31
experience it back in the day. So they've been having a lot of
2:35
fun, as well as a brand new experience.
2:38
Yeah. Actually that is a good point.
2:40
You bring up that Old Wire originally, like had such a
2:44
short lifetime before Toc showed up and they've been making
2:48
changes not only with the amount of time that it's been out, but
2:52
in fact, the way that this entire season has been, like
2:56
such a big Divergence, from just straight to Classic.
3:00
Because now they have those. What does it protocol Alphas to
3:05
add the hard mode into the dungeons?
3:08
Yeah, yeah. So they've they've tried to keep
3:12
dungeons relevant in a way so that With with five main,
3:18
heroics each phase, and they're not patches.
3:21
Technically, in the sense, they call them phases in the classic
3:24
realm. But each phase, they're adding a
3:27
new level of difficulty, kind of a layer of extra percentage
3:31
Health percentage damage a new, a new mechanic for each Zone.
3:37
It's been a lot of fun to run through those, at least, it
3:39
keeps them relevant because I feel like wrath definitely had a
3:42
reputation for dungeons being kind of Little too easy for some
3:49
folks and cataclysm kind of went the other direction later on
3:52
with probably too hard for some people so it's definitely kept
3:56
them relevant and they look kind of interesting going into the
3:58
next season two. Okay.
4:00
So they are not the Roundup and AOE fast that I remember.
4:04
From back in the day it there's still some of that.
4:08
But that's just, you know, once you hit a certain gear level
4:10
they can't, Unfortunately, they can't keep tuning dungeons.
4:13
I mean, that's kind of where Mythic plus comes in later and
4:16
while Michael is gives you a continuous ability to level up
4:20
and dungeons, I guess, but it's a little harder than just the
4:24
way we tested. It was okay, okay.
4:27
And then as for the raid now, I know that they had decided to
4:34
bring it back to something closer to its original tuning,
4:38
so it wasn't quite as easy as it was at the end of its life
4:42
cycle. How is your guilds progression
4:45
being through that? How are you enjoying that?
4:47
Yeah. So we we finished old wore a
4:51
young 0 and algalon. I think third week, which was
4:54
kind of our aim, we weren't looking to log on on Thursday at
4:59
3 p.m. when they release the rate and do it, you know, eight
5:03
days of PTR, testing before private servers, that sort of
5:06
thing. But I feel like for our level of
5:08
effort and coordination, three weeks was pretty solid.
5:12
I know a lot of girls are still progressing World War, just
5:14
because it is a longer raid. Some of the harder hard modes
5:18
are, I mean, pretty tough. If you're not accustomed to that
5:23
that level the they also bought the item level of the drops in
5:27
there. So just it kind of Nerf's
5:31
itself, the more gear you get, the more hard modes are able to
5:34
get is you know, you're doing more damage here, having more
5:37
Health, it's a little safer, but it's been a lot of fun.
5:42
I think the perspective of coming back to class because
5:44
you're never going to have the same level of You don't
5:47
understand the mechanics. You don't have the, you don't
5:50
have all the fights basically, mapped out for you ahead of
5:53
time. Something that is definitely an
5:54
advantage going back to Classic, but it's still a lot of fun and
5:58
going through it each week, it on Farm.
6:00
Like we did kind of a speed run this week and kept it fresh, so
6:03
it's been, it's been awesome. Awesome.
6:06
Okay, so that's the, the current stay of where you guys are in
6:10
classic, but recently, we've been getting some big news.
6:16
The first piece, I think, one of the biggest things that have
6:19
been announced is that the wow, token is coming to Classic and
6:25
this is not something I expected.
6:28
The original token, came back out in Warlords of Draenor.
6:34
So several expansions to go. So this is way ahead of schedule
6:37
but there has been a very rampant bought / gold selling
6:45
issue in classic and Economies have been very rocked by it.
6:50
What's, what has been the situation for you guys in the
6:54
servers? Playing with like before?
6:58
This was announced the, the gold situation has been interesting
7:03
in Wrath. It's I mean I think I think the
7:07
experience in vanilla classic is gold is scarce.
7:12
Gold is a resource that you got a farm, you got to put a lot of
7:16
effort into there was a feeling of oh my God I just got my epic
7:20
Mount. I got enough gold to buy this
7:22
thing. I'm you know, we're two raids
7:25
into vanilla. I don't think I had my epic
7:26
Mountain original vanilla until we started ahn'qiraj.
7:29
I think that's when I finally had enough, gold outside of rain
7:32
consumes to like actually buy mine when I was in high school.
7:35
But it and as you move through TBC and into the Wrath, they
7:40
start adding more daily Quest. They start adding more just raw
7:45
gold that you get from doing Dungeons and heroics and raids
7:49
and it's a resource. That's our are people who just
7:53
re-log like they log in right before raid and then they're
7:55
done after and they're going playing other games.
7:57
They've got enough, gold to do whatever they need to keep
8:00
rating. Basically just from our clears.
8:02
Like it's not a scarce resource. so, I think the argument for
8:08
them bringing in the token is Less of a impact to the
8:14
gameplay. Then I think some people think
8:17
it will be. I, we had some players in TBC,
8:23
get their hands slapped for buying gold and those
8:27
suspensions came and they never did it again.
8:30
But I think this gives them a way to I guess.
8:34
Keep playing the game in the way they want to without having to
8:37
risk going to, you know, third party sites that sort of thing.
8:41
But it It it's been a reality. There are a lot of gold buyers
8:45
in Wrath. They are able to avoid detection
8:50
3z multiple accounts and I guess maybe not entirely avoid
8:54
detection, but I guess it leads blizzard into a situation where
8:57
the do they want to dedicate the manpower to getting each
9:00
individual person, you know, those sorts of things.
9:04
It's it's messy right now. Golden rap is messy and I don't
9:10
know if this is a fix. No problem really.
9:13
Okay. So then yeah they've introduced
9:17
the token. It doesn't work exactly the same
9:20
as the token does on live servers.
9:22
You can buy gold but you can't then turn that into like
9:26
Battlenet balance with with you primarily in classic.
9:32
Do you think that that distinction is good bad or kind
9:36
of neutral? so I think it's probably a
9:41
better approach at least initially, I think you run the
9:47
risk of Yeah, I don't know. It's baby steps with it to see
9:56
if it's if it's not ruining the game as a lot of these Forum
10:00
posters seem to think it will be.
10:03
I think, introducing Battlenet balance, might make it
10:05
complicated with keeping the economies of each game separate
10:08
to, you may run into situations where the gold values start
10:13
directly impacting each other in retail and classic, which would
10:15
be interesting. There are, I mean, they seem
10:21
similar jit and I've never heard of anybody getting Band for it.
10:25
But people do trade gold from retail to Classic.
10:28
They have exchange rates that sort of thing, set up already.
10:31
I mean, you have to go through like there's there's a trust
10:35
Network to that sort of thing. But this I think Battlenet
10:39
balance almost makes them endorse that position, which is
10:43
probably not something that they want to do or manipulate game
10:47
economies that much. Yeah, I hadn't actually thought
10:50
about that, that this would cause like retail And classic or
10:56
wrath classic to start having these intertwined economies.
11:01
But you're saying that people were already offering that sort
11:05
of ability. So yeah, like you were saying
11:10
there was a lot of doomsaying on Reddit and then other public
11:15
forums, you kind of touched on it.
11:19
But like, what do you think are the negative impacts that like
11:24
That are going to going to be there or do you or is it as you
11:27
said where it's nowhere near as bad or is it somewhat going to
11:30
be? Are their fears that some of the
11:32
stuff that they're saying on Reddit is going to be bad?
11:34
And what a what fears do you think are the most founded?
11:41
As with any large change to software, PR can always be its
11:47
own negative impact. So regardless of the
11:50
functionality, regardless of what it does technically to the
11:53
game, I think public perception is something that blizzards had
11:56
to deal with over the years and in positive and negative ways.
11:59
And I feel like this is one of those things that it is,
12:03
probably a neutral feeling to the people who want to use it.
12:06
Oh, that's cool. Go to the people who think it is
12:10
bad. It is very bad.
12:13
And so this is, I don't think this is a net positive for them.
12:17
In the short term, may be long-term, when people realize
12:21
the gold value that you get from the token, you know it adjusts
12:25
itself to how much demand there is for it.
12:27
And so right now, you're not getting that much go.
12:29
I think the last time I checked last night it was something like
12:33
6560 700 gold, for 20 bucks, whatever.
12:37
The Owen cost is 20 us. It's I mean for the people who
12:44
want to use it. Sure.
12:45
But it's not this oh, here's free gold for everybody
12:49
situation. Hey, I don't think with the way
12:54
wrath is right now, it's going to be a huge impact to the
12:59
population, but we'll have to see kind of been a month or two.
13:02
I would settles out how Toc goes so, the new raid phase.
13:06
I mean that may have a larger impact of the player base.
13:08
Then the token does. So that is a very good answer
13:12
II. A lot of things that I hadn't
13:14
expected thought about that, where, yeah, it's not all.
13:16
It's almost that the announcement and the perception
13:21
of it is. Going to have more of an effect
13:22
than the actual implementation itself.
13:25
And we got a forum post after that.
13:29
They had put this up because the backlash was so bad.
13:32
We had people being like the game's over literally and they
13:40
were saying that they, this was something that they had to do,
13:43
because they had a lot of people dealing with, like, malicious
13:47
actors. They had thousands upon
13:50
thousands of And accounts in very short terms.
13:53
I believe they had said in the last, like, two short period of
13:58
time. They like, I think it was like
14:00
two days or something and band, like 11:00 accounts or something
14:03
like that. Oh wait, no total exploitive.
14:08
Battlenet account closures. 248,000 And the total exploitive
14:17
World of Warcraft account closures 73,000.
14:21
And that was just in the last two weeks, which is, which is a
14:25
huge number to have that going. So I guess to have the effect,
14:32
not on the players. But on these actors is that it
14:37
kind of takes the wind out of their sails where, you know
14:40
that, hey, if I'm going to buy it, I can get it in a more
14:46
legitimate way that isn't against terms of service that
14:49
isn't going to like put my account information in the hands
14:53
of people that I may or may not trust.
14:55
Obviously you've if you signed up for World of Warcraft,
14:59
blizzards already got your account information so whether
15:01
you trust them or not you've already made that leap, right?
15:07
And I think that it will help take the wind out of that sales,
15:10
but on the other end, I think that there were some people who
15:13
were, like, maybe on, The fence this being like man I could
15:16
really use some gold but I don't I don't want to do that that are
15:20
now like yeah okay I'll give it Blizzard's.
15:23
Authorizing it. So now it's legal so I could see
15:26
more gold being injected that way and that kind of goes back
15:32
to what you were saying. Originally where it's like,
15:36
yeah, well the warcraft and classic gold was scarce.
15:40
It was a long time for you to get your Mount and that and I
15:44
remember even in Wrath of the Lich King like my first flying
15:51
flying Mount. I didn't buy it.
15:53
Like I know everybody and their Uncle did the time run to get
15:57
the bronze Drake. I got incredibly lucky and had
16:01
the Loop Road. Rick drop for me.
16:05
And it was like, oh wow, you're so lucky.
16:06
I'm like, yeah, just great. It's like like okay, take it out
16:10
and take it out around and then I get around it and I'm running
16:12
around like a No-No fly and like, oh I have to buy flying
16:15
still. But um, yeah, it was it was an
16:18
expense so like go get the flying and people typically
16:22
didn't unless they had flying from like BC where I had taken a
16:26
sabbatical in BC and I did get flying then this was a lot of
16:31
people getting their flying mounts and such and so it was a
16:33
big accomplishment. Unlike what it is today and
16:37
World of Warcraft or but it's going to be soon where you'd
16:40
like, automatically get these flying ranks and mounts.
16:44
So I think that the difference is actually going to be felt in
16:49
those sort of subtle ways where there's just going to be a lot
16:52
more gold out there. Which means that the price is on
16:55
the auction house are going to be suitably inflated and it's
17:00
not going to be this subsection of gray Market.
17:03
It's going to be just fine. Are more wide widely affecting
17:08
which which I feel does change the experience a little bit.
17:13
It's like you were saying with the fights where it's not like
17:16
you can put yourself in a bubble in these fights.
17:19
Never existed in your learning them on the fly like that
17:21
information is out there and so it affects your team even if
17:24
you're not on the PTR weeks ahead to like make sure that you
17:29
know, the fight. So what when it goes live it's
17:32
basically a re Claire okay. But The informations out there
17:36
in the wasted duties fights is out there.
17:38
So when you are on your day one, it's not it's not completely
17:43
unknown and learning as you go and like, oh, let's go look at
17:48
the kill video because back then, it wasn't even live
17:51
streamed. It was go.
17:52
Look at the kill video after days after when they felt they
17:55
had a comfortable lead that they would put out the kill videos
17:59
man. What a trip that was sorry I
18:02
mean the Nostalgia area here. Yes that's Perfect.
18:07
Okay, so in general we think mixed bag on the on this token,
18:13
I think so I think blizzards in a position where if the
18:19
iron-forged up Pro population trackers right, I mean they're
18:22
down to about half the activity, they were during NAX.
18:26
So feel like the first days of Wrath when everything was fresh
18:29
and everybody's loving running all through necks and everything
18:32
and then old or comes out and it's a much more.
18:34
Minute of your time to progress through Old Wire?
18:38
Yeah, they're about half population right now the Bots I
18:45
think the benefit to this post and it unfortunately did come
18:49
out after people notice that it was in the store and that there
18:52
was a wow, head post about it as well.
18:56
It almost felt like somebody accidentally push something to
18:58
production before they were supposed to and they had to kind
19:01
of back pedal a bit. Well, here's the post but I I
19:04
think the benefit of this is they showed data.
19:07
They showed, hey, we are Banning accounts, we're Banning, you
19:10
know, six digits worth of accounts and they're still Bots.
19:14
Like this is this is something they've had to deal with since
19:16
day one of this game essentially and it's a constant arms race to
19:20
deal with Bots. I think it is a mixed bag in
19:24
that it does give goal against it mean it's going to add more
19:27
gold to the economy in the game. So that will increase Auction
19:30
House costs will increase. If you're a gdq Peter Runner
19:33
it'll there's more gold in there as well.
19:35
I mean that's its own controversy as well but I think
19:40
the more open and transparent they can be about their activity
19:44
with clearing out fraudulent accounts.
19:46
And these bladders they're going to get a better reception to
19:48
this because then it feels much more like they're still invested
19:52
in making. Sure that the game is as Fair as
19:54
possible, and I think that's where people's worries is,
19:56
they're removing the original experience and they're removing
19:59
fairness and just throwing up their hands and admitted defeat
20:01
and I don't think that's the case.
20:02
I think it's another tool to try.
20:05
Try and make the game better. Yeah.
20:08
I think that that's definitely imported that they had put out
20:12
those numbers because one of the common refrains was oh well.
20:16
They're just giving up in sanctioning.
20:17
Gold buying now and to see those numbers, the Staggering amount
20:21
of accounts that they took active The actions against in
20:24
the two weeks prior to this showing up shows that they were
20:27
very active. I kind of wish they had
20:30
continuously put Outpost being like, this is how many your band
20:33
today. This is how many were banned
20:34
today. Next Band waves coming.
20:35
Be careful. I think that would also kind of
20:38
have a chilling effect on that on the market for people buying
20:42
up gold. But yeah, this is this is
20:46
definitely going to be a game-changer but there's more
20:50
stuff coming to Classic again. You were saying that old wires
20:54
being out for longer than it was originally.
20:57
And that's because the trial of the Crusader had shown up quite
21:00
quickly after it and now, we know when that's showing up, so
21:05
that's going to be coming the trial, the Crusaders.
21:08
Going to be coming on June 20th, I believe.
21:12
Yeah, so similar to retail, they do content patches on a Tuesday
21:16
for us and Wednesday for Europe, but the raids they've been
21:22
dropping on On Thursdays and I think they've staggered it a bit
21:26
from from the retail schedule. I think it gives their their
21:29
Advance more, you know, more space to work with in each game.
21:33
But so, yeah, June, what does that 22nd?
21:36
I guess? Is when the actual rate is
21:37
available, but the five-man and the other content available on
21:41
that Tuesday, the 20th. It's, yeah, I think it's gonna
21:46
be a fun raid but it's also, in the context that Toc was a 5
21:52
Boss, No Trash rate. And it's if you're going through
21:56
normal, it's very quick heroic gives you a little more
21:58
challenge. But even then it's not it's not
22:00
necessarily as hard as old war was so I think they met, they
22:05
the buff, the old war item level in an effort to try and make it
22:09
still relevant during the TOC patch and so guilds will still
22:13
be going back to old war getting their legendary Hammer which is,
22:17
you know, a Chase, peace for all your healers.
22:18
That's a lot of fun to have that when you're able.
22:21
And just just keep going back and doing doing old war farm
22:25
with with better gear from Toc. I think a lot of players are
22:28
hoping. It's a shorter face that it's
22:30
not a four-month face on its own just because it's limited and
22:34
the content and I think there's a risk of especially with summer
22:37
and Diablo for and all these other things, pulling people
22:40
that they may not want to. They may not want to stick
22:42
around just put just playing winner here.
22:45
In your mind. How long should it last?
22:49
All, I mean for us maybe eight weeks, but I think for the more
22:54
general population, I think a three month, three months phase.
22:57
If they're clear on when ICC is coming, like trust.
23:01
This guy's is coming type of communication, I think, I think
23:03
three months is probably healthy for the game, okay.
23:07
But like the rate isn't on its own.
23:09
They're also bringing back the 80s, the level 80 version of
23:13
onyxia Slayer. Yes.
23:15
So that isn't going to give you too much because that's just the
23:18
one ball. Boss encounter sort of, like, in
23:21
the den and players have already defeated it back at the original
23:24
vanilla level 60, this is just going to be a little extra to
23:28
do. I remember back in class, but
23:32
not classic the original Wrath of the Lich King going and doing
23:36
that for a couple of pieces and that's when I like actually got
23:39
my dragon dragon mouth from there and that was a lot of fun
23:43
but Yeah, it's not going to be too much content.
23:48
The thing about it being a shorter phase is that they are
23:52
putting in the protocol beta for this, right?
23:55
So that's going to bring dungeons up to a new level.
23:59
Yeah. So they're going to introduce
24:03
yeah with the the beta. So this is there were you'll
24:06
sometimes see it called h plus plus or plus plus.
24:09
So maybe the next one is plus plus plus that seems like a
24:12
little Annoying to say but They're going to give different
24:16
Buffs to each. Each dungeon, I'm not 100% on
24:21
what the new ones are, but just kind of different ways to do it.
24:25
So almost imitating Mythic plus to the extent that they can in a
24:31
classic environment. But giving you more, more
24:34
challenges, more things to deal with than in those dungeons.
24:39
They're also because trial the Crusader trial the champion I
24:42
believe is the name of the five-man dungeon that comes
24:44
along with it and it should my understanding is it will also
24:47
have this available so you can immediately go into the new
24:51
dungeon on the regular one and then if you want to test your
24:54
limits you can push it up to the beta, okay?
24:58
So four teams that are engaged doing the new raid doing the
25:05
like against side rate of be returning, next to his lair, And
25:09
these dungeons should give some engagement.
25:12
I would think that yeah, three months would be, it would be
25:16
pretty good before we finally go into ICC and that the other part
25:24
to this is that they are throwing in those new currencies
25:27
to allow you to do additional upgrades and such and that you
25:33
would be able to use that to get like hard mode old War gear to
25:38
again Once again, keeping that Old Wire gear relevant.
25:42
And if you are somebody who has been farming, Old Wire, not
25:46
being in, not getting the drops, this alternate method should
25:49
allow your team to like get through that sort of stuff.
25:54
I remember the tournament. I remembered the jousting.
25:59
I remember how long it took to get all the rewards out of jazz,
26:02
ding that in itself seems like it, like I would still be doing
26:08
that after ICC came out if it's three months because you don't
26:13
originally start up with everything involved.
26:15
Your the original starting Quest were get the camp set up, build
26:21
up the the tournament grounds. Then once you do that, you have
26:25
Phase 1 of the tournament grounds and you have like a
26:27
couple of daily Quest and then you get the full experience
26:31
afterwards. And so I think even that means
26:35
that you're looking at something like three weeks or a month or
26:39
worth of solo content before it becomes the same dailies over
26:44
and over again, and then you start grinding towards getting
26:47
all these These like mostly cosmetic rewards from from the
26:53
jousting. So do you think that, I don't
26:58
think you're saying there was this nostalgic going through
27:02
those zones again? Have you been getting that same?
27:05
Sort of nostalgia, hit with the endgame dailies?
27:12
No, the dailies were a means to an end.
27:17
I think the going The sons of hold your stuff again to get
27:21
your shoulder and chance unlocked and some of that stuff,
27:26
I think there was something to that I you know, honestly back
27:30
in the day, I didn't do the Eben, Knights of the Ebon blade,
27:36
those quest lines and stuff and so without giving spoilers away
27:40
you know, there's a quest that you go offshore and discover
27:43
some story notes there that I hadn't done back in the day.
27:45
So that was those brand-new to me this time around.
27:47
So I've been trying to make an effort.
27:49
Fruit to go into those little nooks and crannies and do some
27:51
of those quests that I missed back back in the day.
27:56
The dailies though, not nostalgic.
27:57
I think those are just a tool at this point, you know, months
28:00
into the game once you've done it, it's a kind of repetitive
28:03
but it doesn't feel. I think it's it's nice in that.
28:07
It feels available if you need it.
28:09
And I think some of those moves are what they did in
28:11
dragonflight as a lot of those things are available if you need
28:14
it. But, it doesn't feel like Shadow
28:15
lands where they almost felt mandatory to be competitive.
28:19
In a raid which it's a breath of fresh air like you can, you can
28:23
pick up wrath and play it as you want to, which I think is
28:27
healthier for for that sort of game.
28:29
So, it's been nice. Yeah, I just remember back in
28:34
Wrath. It was about collecting the orbs
28:37
to complete to buy some stuff from the vendors, and that's why
28:41
I would like chain through heroics and everything.
28:45
Else was more just Killing time as it were right.
28:51
All right. So then that's where the future
28:54
is heading for, for Wrath of the Lich King Classic but we're also
29:01
getting a couple of additional emotions.
29:05
So what are the promotion's coming up is the joyous Journeys
29:10
and that's going to be going through until June 19th.
29:13
So, this is a buff for experience.
29:17
Right to help you prepare for the the call, the Crusader are.
29:22
You running a lot of also you switching characters between
29:25
tears so I have I have stayed main I'm the on the DK this time
29:31
around for since Sun. Well, I guess since pre patch
29:34
you can't you can't run it into PC but DK and then I have my
29:39
Shaman Andrew adults. I had been leveling other alts
29:42
just because I think, especially during the joists Journeys buff
29:46
because once you're on, Your fourth or fifth, all it starts
29:48
to feel, you know, I think any game, it's hard to keep that
29:51
consistent feeling that gets a little repetitive.
29:53
So having that that experience buff is nice.
29:57
So, leveling a priest, and maybe a warlock, but I know I know our
30:02
team is, we see a lot more activity in the guild win when
30:06
Joyce Journeys is running. Because a lot of people are
30:08
leveling up bolts and I think the benefit diving ten-man
30:11
rating. Also in in Wrath is makes it a
30:14
lot more alt friendly to. So, Guilds that that do a
30:18
primary 25-man roster and stuff, but want to do stuff on the off
30:21
nights. 10 man's come into play a lot and having more alts just
30:25
gives you more variety and more just more of a length to the
30:29
game experience. So it's been fun.
30:33
Okay. Yeah, I remember back in the day
30:36
because 10 and 25 difficulty was not the same that wasn't until I
30:42
think. Mr. Pandaria that they tried to
30:45
unify those. They did in Canada and mop, I
30:51
think mop. They had it a little better
30:52
tuned cat. It was kind of their their
30:54
training grounds to figure out the number tuning.
30:57
I think mop did a cleaner job of making them relatively
31:00
comparable. I mean, there's always, I mean,
31:02
the reason the why they eventually moved away from it
31:04
right was so they could balance around one single rate size
31:07
again, which they moved to Mythic 20 man in Lon I think but
31:12
it's yeah. It's it gives you an experience
31:14
to do with plugging is a lot easier in 10, man.
31:19
You just a little more social aspect to it rather than the
31:22
everybody pay attention, 25 men situation, okay?
31:25
Yeah. And now, that you're bringing up
31:27
all these difficulties, I remember trial, the Crusader
31:30
being fraught with like a bunch of difficulties, because you had
31:33
your 10 and 25 and then you had your grand Crusader of 10 and
31:37
25, have they addressed that for a changes they've made for that
31:41
coming up. Yeah.
31:43
So this was something that they talked about as a hypothetical
31:47
coming into Rath. So some other their table side
31:50
chats wouldn't fireside chat. The videos that they put out
31:54
with Holly talking about well Toc, like you said, had four
32:01
ways. You could do it back in the day
32:03
ca10, normal 10 heroic 25, normal 25 heroic and that led to
32:08
your raid week, essentially being running the same place
32:11
four times on 110 and and some people enjoy that.
32:14
A lot of people got burnt out by doing that, especially when
32:21
you're chasing the, they also introduced The Limited attempt
32:26
system in Toc. That was around 40, ocn ICC
32:29
where you get more rewards based on how many wipes you don't
32:34
have. So, if you go through the run
32:36
with no wipes, you get a 50 out of 50 tribute chest and I guess
32:40
you a really high item level cloak and Bunch of other
32:43
goodies. And so it creates this
32:45
environment where your the pressure is on to stay wipe free
32:50
and play play cleanly. So having that pressure on 10
32:56
and 25 it's just led to a lot of disgruntlement among Raiders.
33:01
So coming back to Toc what they said is you're going to be able
33:06
to do it on both raid sizes, but only one difficulty for each
33:10
rate size. So, you choose normal or heroic
33:13
Look for each boss and that's that's kind of how they levelled
33:17
it there. They buff told wire to keep you
33:19
running cold water so you had some more content to do but they
33:21
didn't want people running to you see four times a week.
33:23
So do it on 10 man. Do it on 25 man but one
33:27
difficulty And because they share items across normal and
33:33
heroic just left item level. Essentially, they made the
33:37
trinkets from each of them unique, equip so that you
33:40
wouldn't want the normal and heroic, which would, of course
33:42
lead. If they're not letting you run
33:43
both the same week that's going to lead raid team suing.
33:46
Well, is this normal week or heroically?
33:48
We're running normal for for Jimmy's trinket.
33:50
Okay, cool. Nobody else gets gear, like it
33:53
is going to create a bad social Dynamic.
33:55
So I think it's probably a healthier choice to do that.
33:58
Yeah. Remember initially, when unique,
34:02
equip came in and I was, and I actually breathed a sigh of
34:06
relief because it was all about, you know, farming, the Rings and
34:11
The trinkets in like both versions.
34:13
So that you could like, make sure it was going.
34:17
It was like the best setup you could.
34:20
Yeah, I'm glad that they've made those or, like, promised those
34:25
adjustments, because I remember it just being All hands on deck
34:31
sort of thing and especially if you want this to be a shorter
34:34
Bay's that would be, that would be pretty extreme.
34:42
So the last bit of news we have for classic is that the
34:46
community council sat down and had a talk with developers.
34:53
And so there was a couple of things that came out of this.
34:57
It was mostly talking about Old war and heading into trial.
35:03
Do Crusader, just like we've been speaking about the
35:06
highlights were that old war nerves, would not be coming with
35:11
phase 3. So that would allow the gills
35:15
that are still progressing to like still retain the the
35:19
challenges that they have yet to conquer and get through that.
35:23
They had said that nerves would be coming, just, of course not
35:27
right. Now, obviously, when we get into
35:30
ICC territory ICC loot, just was so much Beyond everything else.
35:36
I remember replacing everything. Have they said that they're
35:42
gonna be doing anything for ICC looters.
35:44
It's so good. Or has it been just left,
35:46
unsaid. I think it's going to be the
35:49
same width. The.
35:56
The buff to like it comes up in each each, you know, Reddit,
36:00
you'll see threads about it and Forum posts and such like or
36:03
they Buffy and Toc loot or they buffing ICC Loot and say, well
36:06
now because that's gonna that will revert what they're trying
36:09
to do with keeping old war relevant because it just becomes
36:11
a an arms race. And now you don't want to do old
36:13
war anymore because Toc is so far and Beyond because they
36:16
buffed it. So I think I think the plan is
36:18
probably just leave the rest of the loot alone.
36:22
I think the one question that didn't get asked in here that I
36:25
think a lot of players are curious about is what their
36:27
intent is with Ruby sanctum. Which was the Hallie on re the
36:31
the single boss raid that they added at the end of ICC, you
36:34
know, a couple months into that patch I think a lot of players
36:38
kind of want it at the same time as ICC and some people even said
36:44
maybe they drop it during Toc and Nerf the loot a bit.
36:47
Just just to give us another rate to do but it's I just Over
36:52
it having like a few High item level pieces.
36:56
They had also tuned it to be like, super hard like that laser
36:59
would just cut you and you're done.
37:00
There was no saving you from that.
37:01
Yeah. But like, it was just like a
37:04
pass/fail check. Really?
37:06
Not like a, not like something you would Work towards
37:11
overcoming. Um, yeah, personally, I don't
37:15
care because I never liked that raid, it was something that when
37:20
it came out, it was like, yeah, we'll try it for fun and like,
37:22
okay, forget it, we're wait for the next expansion.
37:27
Another thing that happened in ICC was that they had to Nerf
37:32
all the tanks of Asians. Yeah.
37:35
Is that happening again? Like, are we like building up to
37:39
like super Dodge tanks with TLC? It's, I mean, yeah, and there's
37:46
something that they had to do with TBC with sun while they
37:51
did, the sun will Radiance that. It was where.
37:54
Yeah, tank tank avoidance got too high.
37:56
Thanks. Essentially rolling into son,
37:59
while you could gear a bear to basically get hit once a fight
38:02
at that point without that debuff.
38:04
So a bit of a problem for if you're trying to make fights
38:08
like portalis relevant, where the tanks are taking lots of
38:10
damage, well, they're taking no damage.
38:12
So I think they suit, they do still have to put it into ICC.
38:18
There was a way that Dodge rating was getting calculated.
38:25
It wasn't being subjected to diminishing returns.
38:27
Ins. And so, we were already seen
38:28
tanks in Old work, getting up to stupid High avoidance values.
38:33
So fights like algalon, where your tanks getting just
38:35
destroyed the whole time damage was a lot, smoother, on tanks
38:39
are. And so, they had to fix that and
38:41
that's where you did see some some number tuning to a couple
38:44
bosses. I think out the lawn and maybe
38:47
one other boss got some, some damage reduced when they fix the
38:51
Dodge rating thing, But we are seeing tanks getting up to the
38:56
higher gear levels where I don't think they can avoid adding that
39:00
debuff to ICC. Okay.
39:03
Okay. So then yeah, I expect to see
39:07
that soon. I guess the next part that they
39:11
talked about was the possibility of bringing the random dungeon
39:15
finder to wrath classic as an outside Observer and not.
39:23
In classic at all. No please no.
39:26
Just keep it out like oh. I this will be a take that I'm
39:33
sure we'll get me. Flamed but random dungeon finder
39:38
is the second worst thing to happen to the World of Warcraft
39:41
period in my book. it like destroyed the ability of people
39:49
to like have Groups of people that they would hang out with
39:56
to, like have that constraint where it's like, okay, we're
39:59
going to go run dungeons on this day because this is when we can
40:02
get together and this is when I know, I can get a group to have
40:04
a server reputation, where it's like, don't run with that guy.
40:08
He's like known for this or she's known for for this.
40:12
Like that's not a person to run with.
40:14
And so, enforced a social contract without them having to
40:18
put it on the prompt screen. And when you add Add the
40:23
anonymity of random dungeon finder when your take can be
40:27
like your you guys, I'll press a button.
40:29
I'll be back into stunting and two minutes.
40:31
Like it just it bread so much of the toxic mentality that still
40:36
plagues wrath not wrath bed. Wow today.
40:41
So yeah, that's my, that's my hot.
40:43
Take any agreement from you. I think you're a tank.
40:46
So you might have a different take on this.
40:49
It's, it's It's definitely a touchy subject and and thinking
40:56
it through, there are some days where sitting in looking, for
40:59
group chat or trade chat trying to find a tank or a Healer for a
41:04
run, you know, being on a East Coast server to West Coast time
41:08
zone. It's a little tricky sometimes.
41:10
But I think those moments you like where is this tool that
41:13
would make my life so much easier in this moment?
41:15
This particular wash, but I think on the larger scale like
41:18
you said, the the social impacts to the game.
41:21
I think those have to be very and that was their original
41:26
discussion around this. When because I think ICC patch
41:29
was when the original looking for group dungeon finder was
41:33
added. I think the initial
41:35
implementation was server specific and so maybe that's a
41:39
interim solution. Like if you restrict it to the
41:42
server you're on there's still at least a community awareness
41:44
of the guild tag that you have or you know the naming you can
41:49
still get a reputation that way. On Guild discords or the server
41:53
discords that sort of thing it. But yeah, you don't have a
41:56
choice in who you group with still.
41:57
And I think that is a problem with the tool and that's what
42:01
they wanted to avoid with, with not adding it to rat classic, at
42:04
least initially was they want to try and keep the server's.
42:07
Relevant Community relevant reputation relevant, but with
42:11
loud token coming out, I think they're getting a lot of
42:12
pressure to there's a lot of memes out there saying.
42:15
Oh, but you don't do random dungeon finder but yeah.
42:17
Wow token, which wasn't in Classics at hashtag.
42:19
No changes but some Changes. I mean, no changes went out the
42:24
door when we added in like the older patch and they were doing
42:27
the heroic plus and all of that like that's like now it's like
42:31
the right changes. What are the right changes that
42:33
they can make? I don't like again this isn't
42:39
going to affect me because I'm not playing classic.
42:42
You guys at home can write in and tell me how wrong or right I
42:46
am in your opinion. Moving through something, a
42:50
little less controversial. There is a talk of adding skips
42:55
two old war which is it was similar something that happened
42:59
with naxxramas in, in this face. Yes.
43:05
So the the next skip was, you know, previously next Rama to
43:09
clear, each wing all the four wings spider, a bomb death,
43:14
death knight, all them before you could go to saffron and
43:18
kel'thuzad up top. The next skip was essentially
43:21
just adding the teleporter object as you Zone into max.
43:25
You can go straight to saffron and Katie old war.
43:30
And it's kind of in line with with the Nerf idea, is that I
43:34
think they're holding on Nerfs because they're actually weren't
43:37
there were some bug fixes going into Toc with Old Wire back in
43:40
the day but there weren't direct Nerfs really going into this
43:44
patch. It was really when ICC came out
43:46
that they did some old Warner. So I think they're trying to
43:48
keep in line with that and like you said give people more time
43:51
to progress if you know their Guild had some vacations they
43:55
couldn't get through Old Wire in the time they wanted to, this
43:57
gives them more time and more gear to go back and do some of
44:00
this Hardware. Your boss's, the skips.
44:02
Get technically complicated with Old Wire and because of how it's
44:09
not super linear but there are linear things to the progression
44:13
of that rate. So you've got teleporters
44:15
throughout the zone that unlock after you kill a certain boss.
44:21
Having a skip past flame, Leviathan gets tricky because
44:26
his teleporter is right under where he spawns.
44:31
Having one for XT, probably works having one for getting to
44:36
Freya, which is in a middle of a big Central platform.
44:39
There's a boss that Pat's right over it.
44:42
Mmm, so I mean there's all these different these elements to.
44:45
Okay, what are we going to do with boss spawns?
44:47
If we're going to unlock these teleporters, It, Do You Talk to
44:49
an MPC and they just wipe the boss or something?
44:54
There's an element to the game where you kill each of the four
44:57
Keepers and you can either send them down to assist you on yog
45:00
to Make it easier or harder if you don't, you don't send out
45:03
any keepers and that's what people talk about.
45:05
Zero lights is the hardest version of y'all, you don't get
45:07
any assistance, how did it, how do they do that?
45:11
If you're skipping directly to yog, but your guild still wants
45:14
to use some Keepers. Like I think they would have to
45:16
figure out a lot of those little nuances and that's where
45:19
technically they could do. It is the implementation doesn't
45:24
make sense. Like are the players going to
45:27
anytime you implement a software change?
45:28
You have to think about what is the user experience.
45:31
Does this is this clean? Does it make it too weird?
45:36
But you're just jumping straight to yogg-saron and there's no
45:37
story line attached to. Like, it's a lot of things to
45:40
consider with updating old or with skips.
45:43
Yeah, I almost feel like they would have to for their own
45:48
sanity hard-coded where it's like if you're skipping too
45:50
young, that means the assumption is this.
45:54
Many lights are on rather than it be like okay let me jump the
45:58
OG, let me set a toggle. As somebody who Mount Farms, I
46:02
would love implement this in in modern after they figured out in
46:06
classic. But, yeah, that there is a lot
46:10
involved in that and I glad they said no promises because that
46:15
seems like a lot of, of mental space and Technical know-how to
46:21
get that working definitely. Well honestly, this is being
46:27
very cool to like get kind of caught up with where classic is
46:32
and like, like we were saying there is that buff?
46:36
So if you want to run into classic, you can get your
46:39
character to level quick enough. Is it pretty quick to get your
46:44
character geared up with these with these mythic, or sorry,
46:49
rather heroic plus plus has I? Yeah, I think they've done a
46:53
good job. Another piece to it.
46:56
Is they with with next 25 loot? They moved it to be available in
47:00
the next 10 as well. So, you don't have to if you
47:03
want to get those next 25 pieces to go into Old Wire, you can run
47:06
a 10-man and still have access to those those higher item,
47:10
level items and then they move next, 10 level loot down to
47:13
these heroic plus dungeons. So, I think it's, it's been a
47:16
nice way to allow players to come back in with alts or if
47:21
they're wanting to roll a main and they're just brand new to
47:23
it. You can gear a up in a more
47:26
consistent way because I think that was a problem that the old
47:30
game had was trying to find a consistent, you know, next 25
47:35
group to run and then you could go into Old Wire and run Old
47:38
Wire and then you'd have to go into Toc like it was a larger
47:41
Hill to progress through. So I think the heroic plus
47:43
changes and the crafting available has made it a lot
47:47
healthier for people to gear up alts and catch back up.
47:50
So, yeah, I welcome anybody to run through, it's pretty.
47:54
Quick to level with Choice, Journeys, and then, just jump
47:58
in. I think a lot of the higher POP
47:59
servers, it's pretty easy to find find those five main
48:02
groups. Awesome.
48:04
Okay. And one last thing I want to
48:06
throw out, get your take on this because this is something that
48:09
if they were doing classic, I wish they had done and I don't
48:12
and I never actually said this before, I'll say it to you and
48:16
the listeners. If you do in classic and you're
48:20
now no longer doing the exact same experience, there's been a
48:24
lot of this. Oh, we meant to do this kind of
48:28
canceled material. They meant to have more of a
48:31
connection between the Lich King and yogg-saron.
48:35
Right? This is your chance to throw
48:38
some of that in there. If you had if you had wanted to
48:42
zooming that you haven't like later on done something that
48:45
negated that would That be something you would say would be
48:50
amazing, or would you say that that is trash if they were
48:54
remastering as a good thing or retconning with all the negative
48:59
connotation that people put with that?
49:01
What would you be up for that? Like we see a little, a little
49:06
Jailer like running out of the icecrown.
49:09
Citadel like at some point, right?
49:11
Yeah. Little like as you as an artist
49:14
dies, you see like sort of flash if Luther and be crowned, the
49:19
throne DeVos. Yeah.
49:20
Yeah, I think it's at this point, I am not a purist
49:27
experienced person. I and I, so I can't speak for
49:30
that. That aspect of the, the classic
49:33
player. I know that was a You feeling
49:35
for people in vanilla is you know, they wanted a true-to-life
49:39
re-creation of vanilla as much as possible.
49:42
I didn't play classic vanilla. It wasn't really interesting to
49:45
me because T BC and wrath were much more interesting to me.
49:50
I do like the idea of adding either story directives that
49:55
clarify more modern things or them expanding on those
49:58
connections or even if they had, you know, raids that they had to
50:04
basically remove for the game. I think, you know, there was,
50:07
there were talks of a new nerubian raid in Wrath that got
50:12
canceled potentially cat of had. I think a one for the veggie or
50:17
Zone where the the Naga and those things, I think that was a
50:21
potential rate for them as well. So if they wanted to explore
50:24
adding more content like that, they hadn't.
50:27
I'd be game for it. As long as they're not impacting
50:31
the existing content. In a significant way or
50:35
adjusting, you know, like if they cut bosses from old or to
50:40
make it happen, I think that might be an issue, but if they
50:42
were to add like, as long as it's additive purely additive,
50:45
yeah, I'm all for it. I think could be healthy and I
50:50
think there's a lot of players kind of looking a lot of our
50:54
late night discussions after raid.
50:56
Kind of edge into what would a classic plus b, you know where
51:01
where they've got the original material but they're adding
51:03
things to it. Adding maybe retail mechanics or
51:06
all the all these different things.
51:07
Like what could you layer onto a classic experience?
51:10
That would be awesome. So I and that vein, I think.
51:13
Yeah, let's we're this long and two classic.
51:16
A lot of people are like, I don't know if I want classic
51:18
CatEye because that's where it starts to get controversial in
51:20
terms of talent changes and all that.
51:22
All the things that people you change the old world.
51:26
Maybe this is the direction they go, is say layer stuff on top of
51:30
the old classic. Yeah.
51:32
And I guess the talking about layering stuff on the classic,
51:37
an alternate classic experiences, hard mode.
51:41
Classic has been a big thing that's popped off recently with
51:46
people doing that. You die.
51:48
You delete, have you dip your toes into this.
51:52
I have a level for rogue on Hardcore.
51:56
That's the pintos. Yep.
51:58
Yeah you could say there's there's one toe dipped.
52:02
I think it's a cool experience. I enjoy watching some of the
52:06
streams from time to time just because vanilla is a very, you
52:11
know, it's the leveling experience has been there for
52:14
what almost two decades now. And it's kind of scary to think
52:16
about but it is what it is. Irina element of of a new
52:23
Dynamic to it. I think that's great hardcore.
52:27
It's also super impressive because currently I mean, wow,
52:31
blizzard said they'll do their own hardcore, dedicated servers
52:34
as well, which will be interesting to see how they
52:36
Implement that. But this is all a community and
52:39
add-on driven approach to the game which I for something that
52:45
as essentially they tried season a Mastery, it wasn't super
52:47
successful. But for this to Spring New Life,
52:50
back in the Classic. That's that's incredible.
52:53
Like it being able to go back and do something in a brand new
52:58
way and have that risk reward. It's super cool.
53:02
I would do it more if I had more free time but Yeah, it is.
53:07
It is definitely something incredibly interesting.
53:09
I have watched a streamer bacon bits who's been on this show.
53:15
I've watched her do it at, she's got like a bunch of different
53:17
tunes that have like made it to different levels and sometimes
53:20
you like make it to 30 or 40 is like, oh good.
53:23
I got my like, this is the first character I got my like mount
53:26
on, and then the watch that character died and it's like it
53:29
puts such a tension on it, and I love that experience.
53:35
For them, I think that on these dedicated servers, I would want
53:42
them to be linked servers so that it is, I am on Hardcore
53:48
pagal and when my character dies on Hardcore pagal, it gets
53:52
immediately transferred over to regular pagal and instead of
53:54
like a full-on delete, it's like, okay, you're off the
53:57
server because you're no longer hard, you've died, but at least
54:00
I can be like, well, you know what?
54:01
I was really attached to that character.
54:02
You know what? I will continue playing it on
54:04
regular servers. Yeah.
54:08
That, yeah, I could see that being an ice bridge for those
54:11
players. Especially who don't want that
54:14
super hardcore approach, you know?
54:16
The death equals delete type approach.
54:18
And if yeah, if they could sit at the server structure to do
54:21
that, I think that'd be super healthy especially because you
54:26
know that the the limits are being pushed to where they're
54:29
doing hardcore rating to. So, I think recently c'thun, so
54:32
a q40 got cleared with a hardcore Group which, you know,
54:36
back in the day. Running into his boss.
54:39
Room was almost if you did it. Wrong was a raid wipe just chain
54:42
the beam and everybody dies. So just thinking about elements
54:45
of that with the hardcore approach.
54:47
You've got all these MC and Blackwing Lair, geared tunes and
54:50
all of a sudden Frank is 5 feet ahead of the wrong person and
54:54
everybody wipes. Like it's it takes a certain
54:57
approach to the game to be the one to do that with with Noah
55:01
benefit of a safety net. Yeah that it that is absolutely
55:06
insane. And I do love that, it is no
55:10
longer this like, oh get to max level and go through the the
55:17
Motions to like get your gear and such and it is more like
55:21
this is the story of how my hero lived and died.
55:26
And this was like For Jolly the, the Druid and he made it all the
55:33
way into like ashenvale forest. And then that was the, that was
55:38
his end and then like vagina second like he he like went that
55:43
much further and then unfortunately, he realized flap
55:47
wasn't on this server and fell to his death, like all that sort
55:51
of thing. Yeah, I think I think that there
55:56
is definitely something there. I just worry.
55:59
That. it's I worry about the longevity because I think at a
56:08
certain point, you just reach a level of frustration, where
56:11
you've gone so far, and then you lose that character and then
56:15
that last kick that one character is this to hit too
56:17
much for you. Mhm.
56:20
Yeah, it's yeah. And I think EverQuest had done
56:26
it for a long time, with a seasonal, release of their,
56:28
their old versions, their old shards.
56:31
And I think they tried it was seasoned a master.
56:33
I hope they try it again just because I think classic should
56:38
at least give them the freedom to spin up ideas and, and kind
56:43
of play around with it, I think hardcore.
56:46
Yeah, I think you're right. I think there's there's a
56:49
shininess to it right now where people are interested and it's a
56:51
new way to approach it and if it gets Solved, you know, kind of
56:56
like other things do. I think a lot of that interest
56:58
goes away. So I just hope they're
57:01
constantly looking for ways to keep the game fresh as much as
57:06
you can with the classic environment.
57:07
Maybe maybe something is the new carrot after after hardcore.
57:12
I mean a gilded mentioned maybe what if they were to have a
57:17
catarah lease or a wrath release or even maybe TBC or something
57:20
like where every single rate is available day one, every piece
57:24
of content. Is available day one and they're
57:27
gonna do like a six-month server availability and it's just a Mad
57:30
Dash to do as much as you like just exploring ideas like that,
57:34
where it's not so staggered like, what is the craziest
57:37
thing? We could see happen in a classic
57:39
environment where just everything's open day one.
57:41
Yeah, so there's a lot of things where it can go at it.
57:46
It is definitely a pork of where they go next because like you
57:52
said cataclysm is controversial. Is that At the end of The Golden
57:56
Arrow, do we go beyond that? The release schedule is is much
58:01
faster than what we have on life.
58:03
So there's this question of like what happens when classic starts
58:06
catching up to, to what we have? Because like, if somebody was
58:11
talking to me about like BF, a classic, which is roughly what
58:17
six, seven years ago now. No, no 2018 was was that BFA?
58:24
I mean it still fires right? Yeah right um but to me that's
58:31
still seems way too soon. And like if we were to do time
58:36
walking raids the next time walking raid What is that?
58:42
It's kind of the right. It's Katha right.
58:46
I guess Katha time walking Ray doesn't seem that bad to me.
58:50
Yeah. Yeah okay I'm okay with that but
58:54
it's a matter of like you don't want to catch up too much
58:57
editing. Many here Firelands is the cat
59:01
arrayed and that's already in the game.
59:04
So the next raid would actually go to Mists of Pandaria Verona,
59:09
Thunder paps, and I'm still okay with that.
59:12
As I'm sitting here right now, Right.
59:15
Anyways this has been an amazing conversation for Jolly.
59:18
Thank you so much for talking classic with me.
59:22
I would be pretty lost without you so thank you so much.
59:26
I'm hoping that we see scrubs versus the world's return but
59:31
where can people find you in between?
59:33
Yeah, thanks for having me it I'm on Twitter at the pro jolly
59:38
and I sometimes post videos on YouTube as well, but it's been,
59:42
it's been great talking classic with you.
59:44
Thank you again until next time guys.
59:46
Make sure you join the Discord that bit.ly slash fast Discord.
59:51
We're having conversations all the time / jelly is in there as
59:54
a friend of Faz and may all your hits secrets.