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E192 | How Clasp Is Transforming Healthcare Recruitment and Retention · The Advancing Healthcare Innovation Show

0:11
Hello and welcome back to the Advancing
0:13
Healthcare Innovation Show. I am your
0:15
host, Michael Stamatinos, and if you're
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new to us, welcome. We are so excited to
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1:01
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interviews come directly to you. So, I'm
1:40
actually super excited about this next
1:42
guest because they were referred uh
1:44
directly got pulled over. Funny story, I
1:46
was at a Becker's conference and got
1:48
pulled over by David. He's like, "You
1:49
have you have to meet someone." So, um
1:52
I'm super excited about this. But before
1:54
I dig into that, I want to I want to
1:56
share a number with you for just a
1:58
moment. Uh and the number is 3 million.
2:01
That's how many clinical roles um are
2:05
actually sitting empty right now in this
2:07
country. And then I want to share with
2:09
you another number. 1.7 trillion.
2:13
Not billion. Trillion. A trillion is a
2:16
billion
2:17
is a billion billion is a trillion. That
2:21
is the student loan debt carried by the
2:25
people who actually want to fill those
2:26
roles. So two numbers, two crises. And
2:30
the thing that I think that makes it so
2:32
hard, you know, for me to solve is that
2:34
I mean they're they're like feeding each
2:36
other. And the truth is is that this
2:38
debt, it shapes where clinicians choose
2:41
to go to work. It shapes how long they
2:44
stay. And health systems obviously are
2:47
desperate to fill these seats and
2:49
they're just throwing money at the
2:51
problem. sign on bonuses, you know, big
2:53
checks that are being laid out and and
2:55
the same people end up leaving and then
2:58
the same roles open back up and it's
3:00
just this perpetual vicious cycle and
3:02
healthcare has been paying people to
3:05
join and then they act surprised when
3:07
when they leave. So today's guest, you
3:10
know, grew up in a family of physicians
3:12
and she watched staffing gaps, you know,
3:15
basically wear down care teams. um she's
3:18
attended Harvard Business School and
3:19
this is where she started sort of asking
3:21
a different question. What if what if
3:23
you committed to a clinician before they
3:26
actually ever graduated like the way the
3:28
military does with the ROC? And she
3:30
explained this to me when we met and
3:31
she'll dig into it more. But what if
3:33
that financial support was tied to
3:35
staying instead of just showing up?
3:37
That's that question is what became the
3:41
company clasp which is led by Tess
3:44
Michaels the founder and CEO. So her
3:47
model is called loan linking hiring.
3:50
It's beautiful. She's going to go into
3:51
it but it basically employers commit to
3:53
clinicians before graduation and then
3:56
student loan repayment happens over
3:58
time. You know that's tied to tenure. So
4:01
they have uh incredible roster of
4:04
customers. uh her CV is just ridiculous.
4:07
You know, Forbes, 30 under 30, you name
4:10
it, it's there. And it is absolutely
4:12
delightful to have her come on to the
4:14
show to share her story. So, Tess, great
4:17
to see you. Welcome to the show.
4:20
>> Thank you so much, Michael. And it is
4:22
great to see you again.
4:24
>> Yeah, of course. Of course. So, I want
4:25
to start somewhere different. You know,
4:27
you grew up in a family of physicians.
4:29
Um, take me back to what that felt like
4:34
as a kiddo. U, not necessarily from a
4:36
career lesson standpoint, but really
4:39
what was it like at the dinner table,
4:41
you know, uh, parents having to feel
4:43
phone calls in the middle of the night?
4:45
Like what did you uh absorb from that
4:50
without knowing you were absorbing it?
4:52
>> Yeah. So, um, yeah, I've been, uh, you
4:56
know, in and around healthcare my entire
4:58
life. And it is, it's fun, it's special,
5:01
it's different. Um, having so many, uh,
5:04
clinicians in the family. I mean, family
5:06
gatherings means if anyone gets injured,
5:08
you're good to go. As a kid growing up,
5:10
what it means is I had no excuse to try
5:12
and skip school um because I was feeling
5:14
under the weather. And so, um, look, but
5:17
it it really um, taught me a lot. I I
5:20
will say as a side note, I mean, my mom
5:23
had me when she was in residency and she
5:25
joked that back in the day, 24-hour
5:28
shifts are a very real thing. Um, and
5:31
so, you know, I definitely feel like
5:34
from the womb onward got to experience
5:36
just how hard um, healthcare clinicians
5:39
work in America and just how important
5:41
the role is. And um I myself thought one
5:45
day I would practice and was weeks away
5:47
from um taking my MCAT to go into the
5:50
field and you know took a a right turn
5:53
and instead ended up exactly where I am
5:55
today. So
5:57
>> pretty fascinating because I know you
5:59
did a few cool tours of duty. You're in
6:01
finance, you know, in the private equity
6:03
space. Um that obviously was essentially
6:07
your trajectory and then and you walked
6:10
away from that to to start a company. I
6:14
guess uh who who in your life thought
6:16
that you were out of your mind?
6:20
>> Uh how much time do we have? No, just
6:22
just
6:23
um look, I mean I I really had the bug
6:26
to build early on. And so um I actually
6:30
built my um first business when I was
6:32
19. I was in college and I uh took a
6:35
leap of faith and said, "Hey, I really
6:37
believe that uh companies can invest in
6:40
their talent differently through all
6:42
sorts of ways, especially investing
6:44
through corporate social
6:45
responsibility." Now, frankly, I learned
6:47
a lot of what to do and what not to do
6:50
during the first set of sharp learning
6:52
curves, but the most important lesson
6:54
was, God, I got to spend every single
6:56
waking moment getting as close as I
6:58
possibly can to understanding how our
7:01
end user moves and shakes, what makes
7:04
them tick, and um you know, so with my
7:07
first goound, I spent so long just
7:09
focused on product in a vacuum and not
7:11
enough um really in the trenches. Yeah.
7:14
>> And you know um as you mentioned started
7:18
my career in finance as a healthcare
7:19
banker at Goldman and then worked in
7:21
private equity. And I got to say like
7:24
you know there are few careers you can
7:27
start your life in that I think are
7:28
better almost like training grounds.
7:30
It's like a total boot camp experience.
7:31
>> It's a total tour duty.
7:33
>> Yeah. Not only do you learn every
7:35
shortcut that possibly exists on Excel,
7:37
but you also, you know, um, really get
7:41
to just like have massive pattern
7:42
recognition. You're like, what makes for
7:44
a good business? Like, what are the
7:45
signals that, you know, just even
7:47
number-wise, metrics wise, give you an
7:49
inkling? Um, but
7:51
>> I think all of that really carried me uh
7:54
into clasp and um helped make this
7:57
business take off a lot a lot more
7:59
quickly. So
8:01
>> that's uh that's super interesting when
8:04
you talk about pattern recognition. Are
8:06
there certain patterns that you were
8:09
able to recognize especially with this
8:12
particular problem? Like how did how did
8:14
this problem surface for you? Um was
8:17
this obviously being a number of
8:19
clinicians in your family was this
8:20
something that was talked about? Like
8:21
did you guys talk about money and like
8:23
student loans and debt? Like what was
8:24
that like?
8:25
>> Oh totally. I mean, look, I founded
8:27
Clasp as I was headed for grad school
8:30
and I was looking at the sticker price
8:31
going like, is it worth it to go back to
8:34
school? And what I realized in that
8:36
moment is there are some industries like
8:38
business where you can you can consider
8:40
is it worth it or not worth it? But in
8:42
healthcare, it's not a choice. It's do
8:44
you want the job or not? Because in
8:46
order to do the job, you have to get
8:48
through this training. you have to get
8:50
licensed and then um after those prerexs
8:53
you can you can gain entry, right? And
8:56
um I hear about these stories all the
8:58
time. I mean my husband um is a
9:00
physician and he took out a significant
9:03
amount of student debt. He grew up in a
9:05
very small town um and didn't have a lot
9:09
of financial support. And he tells me
9:11
all the time, he's like,
9:13
>> "Look, um you know, the reality is you
9:16
have to take a huge leap of faith as a
9:18
student. A bet on yourself to say, I'm
9:20
going to put in the time to enroll in
9:22
school and get through school. I'm going
9:24
to take out hundreds of thousands of
9:26
dollars of student loan support, and
9:27
then I'm going to hope and pray that a
9:30
great job is waiting for me on the other
9:31
end. and then I'm going to spend another
9:33
decade or more of my life working to pay
9:36
down all of those costs that I'd taken
9:38
on. And so the the order of operations
9:42
is just completely out of whack, right?
9:44
We have to
9:44
>> like this like bottom bell curve and
9:46
it's like wait, we got to break that
9:47
plane. But once we break that, we'll do
9:49
all right. But it's like pretty deep.
9:50
>> We got to flip that entire equation
9:52
around and say, wait a second,
9:54
>> why do we have millions of people that
9:56
we are short in healthcare? It's because
9:59
it is so challenging to put the full
10:02
onus on the individual and be like,
10:03
"Hey, of course you should take this,
10:06
you know, bet on yourself." And so
10:08
instead, if we can bring employers into
10:10
the equation earlier, give individuals
10:13
that commitment of not only a job, but
10:15
hey, there's going to be an employer who
10:16
sees you, who cares about you, who's
10:18
going to help repay those loans.
10:19
Suddenly, you've knocked out the two
10:21
biggest uncertainties of someone's life
10:23
at the very point that it matters most.
10:26
and then the system can actually work,
10:29
right? So,
10:30
>> most people they see like they see a
10:32
staffing problem, you know, the
10:33
workforce crisis is a staffing problem,
10:36
but like I'm just amazed that you you
10:39
saw you saw something different,
10:41
>> you know, did it did it bother you that
10:43
you saw something that other people
10:46
couldn't see in your life? I see it
10:48
clear as day. Like, what what don't you
10:49
guys see here?
10:50
>> Yeah. So, look, I think, you know, the
10:53
reality is like the parties are just
10:56
siloed, right? Like employers aren't
10:58
always getting to talk to students as
10:59
they're thinking about enrolling in
11:01
school or when they're in school about
11:02
what's stressing them out the most,
11:04
right? They're thinking about what
11:05
happens once they're employed and how do
11:07
you keep them engaged and retained at
11:08
that point. And from a school's
11:10
perspective, they're doing as much as
11:12
they can to help you with access to
11:13
education and getting into the job, but
11:16
not necessarily how do I make sure that
11:18
people who graduated from here are
11:20
staying in the job.
11:21
>> And so I think the view we had is
11:24
there's three big parts of this
11:27
equation, right? Yeah.
11:28
>> Part one is how do you think about the
11:32
broad barriers to entry which include
11:35
the financial challenges that someone
11:37
has to deal with. Second is the fact
11:41
that there are real talent shortages and
11:44
so you got to help employers better
11:46
recruit and sometimes your local markets
11:48
may not have enough density of talent
11:52
and so like you just you got to get
11:54
creative with the how which you know we
11:56
we have all sorts of ways we do that.
11:59
And then the last piece is okay you got
12:02
someone through school you hired them
12:04
but in healthcare turnover is just
12:07
brutal. I mean they show that for new
12:11
grad nurses
12:13
50% of them leave their first job in the
12:17
first two years of employment. I mean
12:19
that cycle is so painful and that's
12:23
exactly what we want. It's
12:24
>> like a revolving door.
12:26
>> Spend all this time and energy training
12:27
people up and then it's like all right
12:29
goodbye see you later and you got to do
12:30
it all over again.
12:32
>> Exactly.
12:32
>> It's terrible terrible thing to do.
12:35
So you so you see this you see these
12:37
dynamics you recognize these patterns
12:40
you're considering B school you're like
12:42
I'm going into B school and I'm starting
12:44
this company like take take me through
12:48
that did you have people that were
12:50
trying to talk you out of it people
12:51
talking you into it what was the the
12:54
dynamic around you at the time
12:56
>> so first of all I did a lot of not just
12:58
soulsearching but actually talking to
13:00
all sorts of people uh from every walk
13:02
of life to figure out is this painoint
13:04
point as real as I think it is. And so I
13:07
was, you know, um, spending time talking
13:09
to students on campuses. I was talking
13:11
to Uber drivers. I was talking to
13:12
friends at bars. I was trying to figure
13:14
out like, hey, what's what's the real
13:16
driver here? And honestly, for better or
13:19
worse, this is a pretty universal pain
13:21
point. I mean, for a lot of the clinical
13:23
roles we support, like nurse anesthesia
13:26
or physical therapists, upward of 90% of
13:30
individuals have student loans for these
13:32
roles, right? So um so the so the
13:35
reality was like I was like okay
13:38
>> this is a felt pain like students know
13:40
it exists. Now on the employer side,
13:42
what I have to know is do they need to
13:45
hire this talent critically urgently? Is
13:47
it really important which of course yes
13:49
that proved out and second is are the
13:52
retention challenges as bad as what we
13:55
sometimes hear and is that universal
13:57
right and that definitely played out and
14:00
so this really brought us to um building
14:04
you know what you mentioned in the
14:06
beginning the ROC model for healthcare.
14:08
>> Yeah. And it's just been super
14:11
fascinating seeing how it's completely
14:13
changed how wide the clinical cal you
14:18
know candidate pools are for healthare
14:19
systems which I can talk through and how
14:22
low turnover can really go. So
14:24
>> let's let's let's let's dig in. I mean
14:26
this your episode do take it where you
14:28
want to dig in.
14:29
>> Yeah. So um yes. So giving you a little
14:32
bit of a flavor for how this works. So
14:33
as you mentioned we work with health
14:34
care systems all over the country. Our
14:36
partners include groups like Boston
14:38
Children's and Novant, Northwestern
14:40
Medicine, Ohio Health, and we
14:43
essentially help them meet hard to hire
14:45
clinical talent like respiratory
14:48
therapists, nurse anesthetists, um, rad
14:51
techs, nurses, etc. through some very
14:55
creative channels. So, we're plugged
14:57
into universities all across the nation.
14:59
So they're not just limited to their
15:00
local markets, but we also have I mean
15:03
curated networks of Tik Tok influencers,
15:06
which I know sounds funny, but these are
15:08
clinicians who have, you know, 100,000
15:11
plus followers and
15:12
>> yeah,
15:13
>> and this generation loves it, right? So
15:16
we build these national movements. We
15:18
let these employers get exposure outside
15:22
of just their their traditional channels
15:24
and suddenly we have applicants from all
15:27
over the country. So to date, Clasp has
15:29
had applicants from 48 states in the
15:31
country and our average employer has had
15:35
applicants from 10 plus states per
15:37
location. So a lot of uh widening there.
15:41
So that's part
15:42
>> Yeah, that's super. You know what's
15:44
amazing to me? First of all, those stats
15:46
are tremendous and obviously the logos
15:50
are, you know, sort of first first
15:51
movers. Um I just feel like historically
15:55
healthcare has been very
15:58
uh focused on well let's just let's just
16:01
give a sign on bonus and I see this a
16:03
lot. It's like hey 10 to 20k sign on
16:05
bonus for like a therapist and look
16:07
smart people design them and they they
16:10
keep funding them
16:13
but here's the thing like why do smart
16:15
people keep betting on something that
16:16
like clearly is not working.
16:18
>> Yes
16:20
working. I couldn't agree more. I mean,
16:22
if anything, the sign on bonus has
16:25
completely killed the incentive for
16:27
retention in healthcare, right? People
16:29
shift from health care system to health
16:32
care system.
16:33
>> And I recently did a talk all about the
16:36
concept of like we got to stop paying
16:38
nurses to leave because the reality is
16:41
this is exactly what it's doing is it's
16:43
>> it's not enforcing people wanting to
16:46
drive teamwork. It's forcing frankly
16:49
turnover because it's saying, "Hey, I'm
16:50
going to chase the next shiny dollar."
16:53
And by the way, starting this year, a
16:56
number of states have started to
16:57
eliminate the ability to do Clubbacks.
17:00
So, the one retention hook that
17:02
hospitals had for doing a sign on bonus
17:05
is now getting taken away from it as
17:07
well. Um, and so, yeah, so we got to
17:11
find an alternative. And that's where we
17:12
come in. and we say, "Okay, let's
17:14
reallocate the dollars you're using to
17:16
sign on bonuses and let's reallocate the
17:19
dollars you're using for all of that
17:21
unnecessary attrition
17:24
via contract labor toward student loan
17:27
repayment." And if we do that, then
17:29
every single penny of yours is tied to
17:32
retention. It's paid on a monthly basis
17:34
only once someone starts employment. And
17:37
not only have you now found more
17:40
clinicians, but we can gify it. Like we
17:42
can literally make them feel more loyal
17:45
to you. And if we do that,
17:47
>> Yes. So, yeah. I mean, look, half of the
17:51
battle is psychology with life.
17:53
>> Um, I always joke with my team. I'm
17:55
like, people have short-term memories.
17:58
So, odds are that if you paid them a
18:00
sign on bonus, they forgot about it real
18:02
fast after. In our model,
18:05
>> we, you know, are helping employers
18:08
design their student loan repayment
18:10
programs. It doesn't have to be 100% of
18:12
the loan someone's taken out. So, we
18:14
first design it based on their needs.
18:16
>> Uh figuring out what units or shifts or
18:19
locations or roles should we offer it to
18:21
>> and then once someone is employed every
18:25
single month, we're sending them a bill
18:26
and we're saying, "This is what you
18:28
would have owed your employer not had
18:29
your back.
18:30
>> It would have taken you 10 years to pay
18:31
this down. Now, it's taking you three
18:33
years." We gify that with thermometers.
18:35
We give them financial wellness tools
18:37
like budget tools that say, "Hint hint,
18:39
you got more in your budget now."
18:41
>> We collect video testimonials. So over
18:44
and over again, you're almost like
18:45
psychologically nudging people toward
18:47
that loyalty.
18:50
>> Do you have any stories of folks that
18:52
have, you know, come in with a certain
18:54
number of certain amount of debt and
18:57
have gone debtree? ones that you're able
18:59
to like publicly share just like
19:01
>> make it
19:02
>> make it concrete for me so that
19:04
>> if it's a nurse or a doctor I just would
19:06
love to
19:07
>> I'd love to hear one
19:09
>> so um yeah many of these stories I
19:11
always tell our team it doesn't matter
19:12
how many individuals we support um you
19:16
know even if there's thousands of
19:18
individuals it's always they're they're
19:20
never a number it's always a person um
19:22
and we collect a lot of these stories so
19:24
I have a a couple that I could share so
19:27
first
19:28
You know there's this individual Matthew
19:30
who was one of the first students that
19:33
we supported and I remember from the
19:36
early days there I had heard stories
19:39
about how he kept delaying school. Um he
19:42
was a optician so uh wanted to become an
19:45
optometrist
19:46
>> but he just could not take the the bet
19:49
there. He was like, "Look, it costs a
19:52
lot. Um, I don't know if I can just jump
19:55
ship, right? Um, and leave a paying job
19:58
to go to school full-time and not earn
20:00
when I have all of these things I need
20:01
to do for my life."
20:02
>> And so, what we ended up doing is
20:05
showing him employers that were willing
20:06
to help repay two years of his education
20:10
over the first few years of him his
20:12
employment. And he, first of all,
20:15
powered through school, highly
20:16
motivated. uh yeah
20:18
>> ended up being able to join private
20:20
practice which was not a career path he
20:22
thought was possible before this
20:25
usually need to be in a better financial
20:27
position to take that um change
20:30
>> he started his career there he was able
20:32
to then grow his family and I remember
20:34
during his video testimonial he had just
20:36
had a young baby girl who um he you know
20:40
kind of shared like I got to start my
20:42
life earlier I got to join my dream
20:45
career and I now have all of this
20:47
financial support. Um, and look, I mean,
20:50
we've got employers all over the
20:51
country, but we have some employers, for
20:53
example, for nurse anesthesia that are
20:55
supporting $180,000
20:57
of student loan support per person. I
21:00
mean, that's totally life-changing,
21:02
right? And so,
21:03
>> yeah. Yeah.
21:04
>> Yeah.
21:04
>> I mean, I think I read a stat somewhere
21:06
was like $130 million in employer
21:09
commitments.
21:09
>> Yes. Yes. How do you how do you how do
21:12
you get a CFO
21:15
u at a major health system to write a
21:18
check before a clinician has even
21:22
graduated like
21:23
>> Yeah. So let me
21:24
>> what's that sales conversation?
21:26
>> Yeah. So let me be very very clear. They
21:28
are not writing the check before the
21:30
individual has graduated. What we're
21:32
doing is we're saying, "Hey, you are
21:35
going to get to get an early commitment
21:37
around hiring this individual while
21:38
they're in school. We're going to help
21:40
them get access to federal student
21:42
loans, private student loans like Sally
21:44
Mayor, Sofi, or by the way, they can't
21:47
get funding for school. We at Clasp have
21:49
raised $75 million of impact capital and
21:53
we can help fund the patient. So, we're
21:55
going to make sure that person graduates
21:56
school and gets through the program, but
21:59
that individual is going to have a
22:00
signed commitment that says once you
22:02
graduate, pass your lensure exams, and
22:04
start employment over the first, call it
22:07
three years of your career, the employer
22:09
is going to pay down portion of your
22:11
student loans. So, from a CFO's
22:14
perspective, they think, wait a second,
22:16
>> I just eliminated my signon bonuses. I
22:19
reduced my locom or traveler or contract
22:21
labor spend. I reduced my overall
22:24
turnover and I'm now paying towards
22:27
student loan repayment, but a portion of
22:29
those dollars are tax advantaged. So,
22:32
you've checked all the boxes of I'm not
22:35
actually spending more dollars. I'm
22:37
saving or repurposing dollars,
22:40
>> but the individual
22:42
>> is getting a lot more than they were
22:44
receiving before. So, it's finally
22:47
funneled
22:48
>> to the individual that matters the most
22:50
for the workforce, which is that stable
22:52
full-time employee.
22:53
>> Well, well, I mean, the hospital is
22:55
actually earning, especially if it's a
22:57
if it's a physician or, you know, a
22:59
mid-level because they're if they're
23:02
billing with RVUs, whatnot. I mean,
23:04
they're so they are they are generating
23:06
>> 100%. I mean, I'll I'll give you an
23:08
example. So, uh, as I mentioned, my, uh,
23:11
my husband's a surgeon, and he recently
23:13
lost, um, you know, a nurse and
23:15
aesthetist that worked with them. And,
23:18
you know, he he told me, he's like,
23:19
"Look, surprise losses are scary because
23:22
if they don't have backup plans in
23:24
place, what happens, right? Surgeries
23:27
get cancelled, patients get delayed, and
23:29
physicians obviously get impacted from a
23:32
productivity perspective. But the most
23:33
important again is the the patient side.
23:36
And that is
23:37
>> just a tough pill to swallow for the
23:39
whole system. And that's exactly how we
23:40
think about it. Like health care is not
23:42
just about nurses or just about doctors.
23:44
It's like you got to have your surge
23:46
techs and your rad techs and your nurse
23:48
anesthetists all in place to make the
23:50
machine run, right?
23:52
>> Yeah. That's brilliant. Who was who was
23:54
the first health system that trusted you
23:57
enough to kind of run through this and
24:00
like what did what did that conversation
24:01
look like? Yeah. So, interestingly, our
24:05
very first partner um even before we
24:08
brought healthcare systems in place was
24:10
Warby Parker and they said, "Hey,
24:13
>> interesting. Got students and you've got
24:16
dollars and we've got jobs and we've got
24:18
a way to repay those dollars. What do
24:20
you think?" So, I met with their seuite
24:22
um and it was so special. This was years
24:26
ago. We ended up seeing the program go
24:28
gang busters. They had 3x the number of
24:31
optometrists apply. Wow.
24:32
>> versus seats they had available. And um
24:36
on top of that we ended up seeing like
24:40
you know many of their large peers
24:42
immediately um you know followed suit
24:45
and we had you know again not only just
24:48
3x the number of optometrists but we
24:49
placed them in 10 different states and
24:51
the program continued to grow year after
24:53
year and we thought in that moment wow
24:55
hold on um this is so interesting in the
24:59
subsector but let's look at the broader
25:02
landscape of healthcare and then we
25:04
started partnering ing with large health
25:06
care systems like the ones I mentioned,
25:07
Boston Children's and Novant and
25:10
Northwestern. And in that moment, we
25:12
realized that this model is such a great
25:16
fit for healthcare generally. Um, and so
25:20
last year, we 4xed the number of
25:22
healthcare employers that we supported
25:25
and then this year we just raised
25:27
funding to step on the gas for that. So
25:30
>> that's
25:32
because you've been at this for a while.
25:33
I think when we spoke you were like
25:35
you've been at it for like eight years.
25:36
>> Yes. Yes.
25:38
>> It's quite a it's quite a run.
25:41
>> Yeah. I mean it is just like one of
25:43
those things where you realize that the
25:47
the fact is most good things in life are
25:49
the long game. This is definitely the
25:51
long game. And I joke that startup years
25:54
are like dog years. Every year feels
25:56
like seven years. But um but I got to
25:59
say this has like been the most special
26:02
uh work to be doing and so I'm you know
26:05
pretty pretty about it.
26:08
>> Yeah.
26:08
>> I I'm tempted. I want to I want to ask
26:10
you something. Maybe you've never been
26:12
asked it before in an interview. Um
26:14
>> surprise me.
26:17
I don't know what like when was the
26:19
hardest week you had building this
26:21
company
26:23
>> because you've been outwardly I mean it
26:26
just seems like one can read headlines
26:29
and press releases like dude every
26:31
everything's great everything's great
26:33
but deep down I mean been around enough
26:36
founders to know that it's not always
26:37
great. I'm just curious what was
26:40
>> what was the hardest week you've had uh
26:44
building this company? Yeah. Um, first
26:48
of all, it's it is a roller coaster
26:52
period full stop, right? So, I think
26:53
there's there's a number of uh moments
26:56
where you look back and you're like,
27:00
wow, we got through that, right? Which
27:02
at the time felt nutty and wild. And I
27:05
always tell my team, I'm like, part of
27:06
the fun of being in a startup is there's
27:09
a lot of ambiguity. Um, and part of the
27:12
challenge of being in a startup, right,
27:14
is that there's a lot of ambiguity. Um,
27:16
but I would say, you know, the reality
27:18
is on the customer side of the house,
27:20
we've been very fortunate, right? We
27:23
have not had partners um, churn. We have
27:26
had a lot of partners, as I mentioned,
27:28
as recently as this week, who have
27:29
expanded their partnerships with us, and
27:31
that gives me a lot of um, you know,
27:34
joy. But I'd say the areas that have
27:36
been most challenging are one just the
27:39
people's side, right? Like you grow so
27:43
close and uh with every single team
27:46
member and I'm very fortunate that our
27:48
executive team
27:49
>> a lot of them have been with me for many
27:51
years, right? My COO has been with me
27:53
for six years, my CTO's been with me for
27:56
um five years, my uh you know our
27:58
operations lead for five years, etc. Um
28:02
but there are chapters in a startup,
28:04
right? Folks who were amazing from 1 to
28:06
10, folks who were great from 10 to 50
28:08
to from 50 to 100. And um there are hard
28:12
weeks. I'm not going to say it's just
28:15
one week. Hard moments where that is
28:18
probably the area where you know that
28:21
you have a lot to do and a lot to build
28:22
toward, but like
28:24
>> there's still just the heartbeat that
28:25
comes with, you know, like who helps you
28:28
get there
28:28
>> versus who you need going forward. And
28:31
those have been some of the toughest
28:33
calls but the most necessary um
28:36
>> parts of the equation hands down. Um for
28:40
sure
28:42
and uh outside of that I would say like
28:45
the rest of it just feels like it is it
28:47
is normal ter you know it's just it is
28:49
like part of part of the motion right
28:51
you roll with the punches you keep going
28:54
but
28:54
>> yeah yeah and what I remember is when we
28:57
first uh connected uh I think we had
28:59
both realized that both of our parents
29:01
are are immigrants
29:03
>> and I would suspect that you know
29:06
education is a is a big part of the
29:09
reason why you're able to kind of build
29:10
they were able to build a life here and
29:12
you I know you've said that kind of
29:13
publicly.
29:14
>> Um but I guess what does it feel like to
29:17
build a company
29:18
>> that's about educational funding while
29:21
also kind of carrying that story? Does
29:23
it feel personal for you every day or
29:26
>> as it has become something else?
29:29
>> Yeah. Um look I you know um from two
29:33
vantage points I'd say like with my uh
29:36
you know broader family with my parents
29:38
etc. It's special because it's always
29:40
been told to me there was nothing more
29:41
important than education. It was the one
29:43
area that my parents um always invested
29:46
in the most with us growing up and you
29:48
know like every car ride was like going
29:51
through Brainiac flashcards and you know
29:53
like asking me random math
29:56
multiplications on the spot and you know
29:57
like I had totally nerdy parents. I'm a
29:59
nerd, too. It is what it is. But, you
30:01
know,
30:02
>> all good.
30:04
>> But, I think, you know, that um was
30:06
always being to me. And I got to see my
30:09
parents who, you know, when they
30:11
immigrated here, both continued to go
30:13
for more advanced degrees while they
30:15
were in the states. And that takes a lot
30:19
because you can't get access to federal
30:21
loans, you know, easily as as a um
30:24
immigrant in the US, right? And so I
30:26
think um you know I I had already heard
30:30
about what they had to give up to get
30:31
there and then coming into a household
30:35
where I have a spouse who every day I
30:37
mean our you know you think about
30:39
largest bills in life and for most
30:41
Americans you know including our
30:43
household those rent and your student
30:44
loan payments right
30:47
>> four figures every single month makes
30:49
you really think about it and um
30:52
>> and so I think that you know uh lens has
30:55
really helped me craft my why every day
30:58
where I'm like, God, there's no sector
31:01
that I think, you know, uh, not only
31:05
needs this more, but that like gives me
31:07
more joy to be a part of and there's no
31:09
problem within the sector that I'm like
31:11
like if not us, then who? I tell my team
31:13
that all the time and I really believe
31:15
it. Right. So,
31:16
>> yeah.
31:18
>> What what I just sort of realized is I
31:21
don't even I don't even want to call it
31:22
infrastructure. It's not. It's more like
31:24
this is an ecosystem. It's a living
31:26
breathing thing that you're building for
31:28
a generation of clinicians. So, and my
31:31
hope is that many of them will will hear
31:32
this conversation. What do you what do
31:35
you want to say to them directly? Um,
31:38
you know, to the to the 23-year-old
31:39
nurse who's, you know, sitting in his or
31:41
her apartment
31:43
>> with, you know, 90 90 grand.
31:45
>> Yeah.
31:46
>> In debt and has got a shift at, you
31:47
know, 6:00 in the morning.
31:49
>> Yeah. Um,
31:51
you know, so much of what Clasp has been
31:55
built around is helping individuals feel
31:57
more seen. I think that healthcare has
31:59
become more transactional
32:01
>> because of the urgency with every hire.
32:04
That's why the main tools are things
32:06
like sign on bonuses. It doesn't show
32:08
>> care or long-term investment. It's, hey,
32:10
I really need talent today.
32:12
>> And when I think about Clasp, it's like
32:15
Clasp is in your corner. And when I say
32:17
that, what it means is it's hard to go
32:20
out to bat for yourself and be like,
32:22
"Hey, I want to get up really early. I
32:24
want to be able to work this long shift.
32:26
I want to serve my patients, right? But
32:28
I don't want to come home stressed and
32:29
have to, you know, count every penny for
32:31
the next big bill that I have to pay."
32:33
And so
32:35
>> if we can use our platform to go and
32:38
look at all the wasted dollars that are
32:41
being thrown into the wrong directions
32:43
in the wrong places and the wrong
32:44
pockets
32:46
>> and reallocate that to the right place
32:50
>> which is
32:51
>> to the actual clinician who is helping
32:53
that patient on a day-to-day basis who
32:56
is our long-term workforce. That's real
32:59
impact
33:00
>> and I just want you know um any
33:04
clinician to know that yeah it's a tough
33:08
it is a really tough job. I have so much
33:10
respect um for it and while you know I'm
33:14
I can't practice the ways that we can
33:16
help her saying what else can we take
33:19
off your plate while you keep your plate
33:21
pretty full right
33:24
>> before I forget where can people go to
33:26
follow your journey your team's journey
33:29
um give us like a commercial so that we
33:31
can you know help this out
33:33
>> yeah absolutely u so please please come
33:37
check out clasp cla asp.com.
33:40
Uh go to our website, take a peek around
33:43
if you're a health care system or
33:45
healthcare employer um or a a student or
33:49
even a a current practicing clinician
33:51
who's like, I need some support with my
33:53
student loans. Um and if you have any
33:55
questions for me directly, you can send
33:58
me an email. It's just test tsclasp.com.
34:03
But I would love to hear from you. Love
34:04
to hear what else we're missing or
34:06
should be thinking about. and um and we
34:09
can go from there.
34:11
>> You've been great, Tess. Um I think that
34:14
uh not I think no, I know you are like
34:16
wise beyond your years. I just feel like
34:18
you're like an old soul. Uh and I say
34:20
that in like the nicest kindest possible
34:22
way. So, just thank you for sharing a
34:24
bit of your journey and obviously you're
34:26
you're in a a newer chapter and there's
34:28
going to be other chapters and my hope
34:31
is that you continue to grow and and
34:32
drive impact and
34:34
>> continue to just sharing your why with
34:36
your team as they continue to grow. So,
34:38
that's that's incredible. And for those
34:39
of you if you've been listening to this
34:41
and you found it to be particularly
34:43
enlightening, entertaining, my
34:46
encouragement to you is is would you
34:48
mind sharing it? would you mind sharing
34:50
it with someone or commenting on it,
34:53
letting us know what resonated with you?
34:54
That's always uh helpful. That gives us
34:56
a little bit of a signal. So, just
34:57
remember this is this is not just a
35:00
content machine. This isn't a community.
35:02
It's a living breathing thing. So, if
35:04
there is a topic that you would like for
35:05
us to explore or maybe there's a leader
35:07
that you want to have come on to the
35:09
show, yeah, drop us a note. We do read
35:11
them. So, thank you for listening, Tess.
35:13
So good to see you again. Keep building
35:15
with purpose and we will see you next
35:17
time on the Advancing Healthcare
35:19
Innovation Show.