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Scott Carper's nightmare drug bust on the border · Nightmare Success In and Out

• 0:01
  What happens when your worst fear becomes your reality?
• 0:04
  Hi, I'm Brent Cassidy. Welcome to the Nightmare Success
• 0:07
  In and Out podcast, where we explore how to overcome your
• 0:10
  fears and nightmares that set yourself free.
• 0:13
  We're going to be exploring this topic with guys that was in
• 0:16
  Leavenworth with and others who survived their own nightmare.
• 0:20
  These stories can be inspiring, sometimes.
• 0:22
  Sad. There's some humor, but
• 0:25
  hopefully you can come away with a nugget of something that'll
• 0:28
  help you knock down some of the prisons you built up in your own
• 0:31
  mind. OK, welcome back, Nightmare
• 0:36
  success listeners. This is where you guys come for
• 0:40
  what happens when your worst fear becomes your reality.
• 0:42
  How do you adapt, survive, overcome, set yourself free?
• 0:47
  Well, I have got an interesting. I've really been looking forward
• 0:51
  to this interview because I was just talking to Scott about he
• 0:54
  and I were at the same place. Leavenworth and Gina Pentegraph
• 0:58
  was nice enough to send me. I think Scott did it every month
• 1:03
  if if I'm not mistaken. But he had a newsletter from
• 1:06
  from Leavenworth and and I told him, you know it's kind of like
• 1:10
  you know somebody that went to the same high school as you and
• 1:12
  you graduated a little bit later.
• 1:14
  I was reading to see like what's going on at that place at
• 1:18
  Leavenworth and he was he was giving us the the blow by blows
• 1:22
  of of the wonderful world of camp Leavenworth.
• 1:26
  But so Scott and and and Scott's got an interesting story, 'cause
• 1:31
  I was reading his bio, I forget where I was reading his bio.
• 1:36
  But he he did one of those things like you see in the movie
• 1:39
  where you go like cross the border, you know and think I'm
• 1:43
  going to go down and get some painkillers and come back and
• 1:45
  and and he and he did and I I and we'll get into this.
• 1:50
  But I think that he even, I think he even declared the
• 1:55
  medication. But he came up with some kind of
• 1:58
  funky story that he was getting it for his mom and and that
• 2:01
  ended up to be a charge for lying to a federal officer.
• 2:04
  There's more to the story, which we'll probably get into, but I
• 2:07
  can't wait to get into this because I think the other unique
• 2:11
  thing about Scott is we were just talking about this before
• 2:14
  we got on. He just got out at the end of
• 2:17
  September and all of this is fresh in his mind.
• 2:20
  And I think some of the steps and things that he went through
• 2:24
  will be revealing for me and to the listeners out there.
• 2:29
  So before we get into all that, I want to recognize our show
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  Tell them that Brent from Nightmare Success sent you.
• 3:22
  All right, Scott Carper, here we are.
• 3:26
  You made it. You're out through the whole the
• 3:30
  whole journey. Here you sit talking on a
• 3:33
  podcast. How are you?
• 3:40
  You know, I'm good. I'm real good.
• 3:45
  Prison for me was I think at the end, well, I'm still still
• 3:49
  technically in it, but I have really a big net positive.
• 3:52
  So I'm I have a really good outlook and I I look back and
• 3:56
  I'm working on some stuff that's kind of.
• 3:58
  Put my journey in perspective and I think think I did it
• 4:02
  right. And I think it helped me in a in
• 4:04
  a lot of ways, as terrible and brutal as it is.
• 4:07
  Well, let's go back a little ways.
• 4:08
  Because I mean, for for people who don't know you, Scott, your
• 4:15
  world before you entered into the nightmare of prison, like
• 4:18
  growing up, being a kid, what, did you have a pretty normal
• 4:21
  life or were you wild and crazy? No, I was.
• 4:25
  AI was a good kid. I I mean, I I like to toe the
• 4:30
  line I think. But no.
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  Played a bunch of sports. Wasn't a super athlete like a
• 4:35
  lottery guest or like you were. I was.
• 4:37
  I was good at the athletes. I bet I was good because I
• 4:39
  worked really hard at it. So you know I I played junior
• 4:43
  varsity varsity. But was the guy who played, but
• 4:46
  wasn't the guy who played a lot, but.
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  You know, prom, high school, prom king.
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  I was actually valedictorian. I had a great.
• 4:53
  I had a perfect You're the prom. That's awesome.
• 4:57
  Well, I'm. I'm married to the to the
• 4:59
  homecoming queen, so you know that stuff stays with you for
• 5:02
  life. Yeah, I know.
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  I I mean, yeah, our group, our group was kind of the a group
• 5:07
  that got nominated for that stuff and and so yeah, it was it
• 5:11
  was fun and I but I had perfect. I had perfect.
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  I had wonderful friends, fantastic parents.
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  You know, went to college, had a great college experience.
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  And then where'd you go to college?
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  I. Got injured and that would be
• 5:25
  the start of when things started getting sideways, I'd say,
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  Scott, where where did you go to college?
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  When did you see Santa Barbara? Santa Barbara's a nice place to
• 5:34
  be. Oh yeah, it was.
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  It was unbelievable. I loved it.
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  OK, OK, So you you got hurt. How did you get hurt?
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  So the first time. Let's just put it this way.
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  I'm a tactfully bad driver. So and and in that in in that
• 5:51
  breath, I'm also the person that's in the car when somebody
• 5:55
  else gets in an accident. So if you and I are going to,
• 5:57
  you know, drive somewhere to go to lunch or dinner, there's a
• 5:59
  good chance that we're going to get in an accident because I'm
• 6:01
  in the car with you. So OK, so I got in my senior
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  year before I'm going to college.
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  Like after I graduated I was in the passenger side of a
• 6:09
  girlfriend's car and. It wasn't major but we wrapped
• 6:13
  did a couple you know one 80s and slammed into a pole and that
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  that was the first time I significantly hurt my back.
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  And you know when you're young you kind of think oh it'll be OK
• 6:24
  and this will bounce things off. But I it was a significant
• 6:26
  injury and I should have handled it better.
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  But I I just thought, you know I'll be fine in a couple years
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  or I'll be fine in a couple months and it it didn't go like
• 6:33
  that. But I figured out a way to to
• 6:36
  work with it the stretching and. Therapy, physical therapy.
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  And I got it so that it was workable, but it was challenging
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  like it was it was a it was one of those things where you're
• 6:45
  young and you don't want anything to affect your life.
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  And it did. It was significant.
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  How old would you been at the time?
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  I was just going into college. So what, 18?
• 6:55
  Oh, you were like a young kid. Yeah, yeah.
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  And it was back. And, you know, I mean, everyone
• 7:01
  has back problems now. And so they'll get it.
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  But it was bad. So as at that age, you're going,
• 7:05
  oh, you know. A backpack was tough, riding a
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  back, buying a bike. So you know, with good
• 7:11
  therapist, I figured it out. I figured out how to make it
• 7:13
  work and and it wasn't like I couldn't do everything I wanted
• 7:16
  to do, but I could do most of it.
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  Like I could run, I could play sports, I could play softball,
• 7:21
  bike around. So it was fine.
• 7:23
  It was manageable. So you head to college.
• 7:30
  Is there anything that happens in college that we should know
• 7:33
  about or is was that just a step in your life?
• 7:37
  No, college was. I mean on the negative end or
• 7:40
  the bad end or what? No, just in general for your
• 7:42
  life experience. No, college was.
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  I know I was. I was.
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  I was wildly successful in college.
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  I was that kid who really didn't have to study much and got the
• 7:49
  best. But I, you know, spent a lot of
• 7:52
  time with attorney. I was in UC Santa Barbara at
• 7:55
  Lambda Chi Alpha. I loved, loved the fraternity
• 7:57
  experience. And you don't have to do it at
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  Santa Barbara, actually. Yeah.
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  I mean, I had a bunch of accolades in school and and.
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  You know, when when I ended college, I was ready for the
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  next experience in life. So, So what happened?
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  What happened to the next? What was your next step?
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  OK, I started started working in advertising and and in the
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  movies, in the movie industry. So I've made a lot of
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  connections in college working for MTV and for Viacom where,
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  you know, I had the potential to go into these different
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  industries and was super excited about that and.
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  But I started in advertising because I wanted kind of a more
• 8:38
  secure job. And then then then let's see
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  where, where, where can I take you into a little Segway here
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  that'll lead to the fun. All right, here's the one.
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  I was getting all excited about MTV.
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  And then he told me he took the advertising job IT.
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  Was a great experience and again, all through college and
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  stuff. So I'm being honest, I'm
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  partying, but I'm partying under control.
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  Sure. On the weekends with buddies.
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  Have it. Have it under control.
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  Yeah, no, I did the fraternity thing.
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  Yeah, I did the fraternity thing.
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  I loved it. So, but you know, I'm doing, I'm
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  doing coke and I'm doing, you know, I'm drinking, not a big,
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  I'm a big drinker, but I don't really like drinking now.
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  All the other stuff I like I'll be honest about.
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  But so anyway, what ends up happening is I I'm about 26,
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  about 25 and I get this really crazy injury to my stomach.
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  It's called a pelvic floor injury and don't even know how I
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  got it, but it was. Absolutely.
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  Mind boggling. Debilitating.
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  So it may have been related to my back problems, that's what.
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  I was thinking, so you know it started affecting me
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  significantly in terms of pain in in that area and I went and
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  saw every pain specialist and every urologist and gastro and
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  your neurological. I was on a mission to try and
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  fix it and they basically came to the conclusion that you know
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  it is what it is and you're going to have to live with the
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  pain. And now.
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  Taking pain medication as a part of your lifestyle.
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  And although I hated hearing that, it was that kind of level
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  of pain and that kind of daily pain that I did say, OK, this is
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  that part of the gig? Yeah.
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  So I started taking it and you know, things were fine until,
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  you know, getting into my late 20s.
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  And are you, are you taking this every day?
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  This is part of your daily routine, OK?
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  Part of the daily routine and actually I ended up figuring out
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  what was wrong. It was it was so crazy.
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  Not like an exon on a, you know, like X marks the spot on A on a
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  treasure map. But we kept when you battle with
• 10:45
  doctors, you know, here, here's my thing.
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  OK, so my pretend you're throwing a football all day.
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  Throwing a football all day and the next day your arm hurts.
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  Why does your arm hurt? It's because you were throwing
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  the football. So I had this big battle with my
• 10:58
  doctors. They'd say no, it's.
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  It's this. And I'd say, well, it hurt.
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  It happened when I was doing crunches or it happened while
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  I'm doing sit ups. So how can you tell me it's, you
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  know, a thigh injury? Like, it was crazy.
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  So I kept trying to work on the area that I thought it made the
• 11:13
  most logical sense. And turns out it did.
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  I met this doctor that recommended this one test.
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  He was a very specific diagnetician who retired, but he
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  was really great at telling people what's wrong with them.
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  So I meet this guy. He tells me what to do.
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  And end up finding this whole big community that's available
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  for men that treat pelvic floor injuries.
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  And after four or five months, it starts getting remarkably
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  better. Wow.
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  So Oh my God, wow. So in the meantime, marriage had
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  dissolved because me and the fiance didn't work out, probably
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  in large part because she didn't want to be with the guy that was
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  going to be hurt. Well, how long?
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  How long was that? How long was that time period?
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  We were that we were dating or that.
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  Well, did you get did you date and then get married or you
• 11:59
  dated and got married or you just dated?
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  No. We didn't get married.
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  We were a month away from getting married.
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  She pulled. She pulled the blog about a
• 12:06
  month before. OK, how did that work?
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  So I'm brutal. You know?
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  I mean, I'm devastated. I mean, I really relied on this
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  girl a lot at that time. And again, I'm thinking this is
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  going to be the rest of my life. So now I've got this spam.
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  I can start getting better, and it's noticeably getting better.
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  But here's the kick, Brent. Here's what I'll be honest
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  about. I like pain pills.
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  Yeah. And so do you feel like, did you
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  But, Scott, were you, did you like them or were you actually
• 12:34
  addicted to them because you had that kind of just part of your
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  daily feel of what you had as your routine of how you were
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  living. Were you addicted or was it just
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  like, OK, well, I like it. Well, here's that's a good
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  question. I mean that's a great question.
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  Here's the part of it that that hooks me up is is I when I was
• 12:53
  getting better and I didn't need to take them.
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  I could have stopped now. I was already addicted to him.
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  I mean we would I went, I went through detox twice and the
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  detox for painkillers, the amount that I was taking was
• 13:05
  crazy. It was absolutely brutal.
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  So I actually went through that in my late 20s and then again
• 13:12
  when I went to Leavenworth, so which which is now at 48 years
• 13:16
  old or what was 47 at the time. But yeah, I, you know I got
• 13:21
  better and I I kept taking him on and off well and I know and I
• 13:26
  know that you're I was reading like your dad was an attorney.
• 13:30
  Your mom was a teacher. And I don't know if you had
• 13:35
  siblings but like all along the way with you having this hurt
• 13:40
  part of your body and and then the pain, where was your mom and
• 13:44
  dad? Are they a part of this whole
• 13:45
  thing or you just live in this hole by by yourself?
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  Yeah, I have. My parents are absolutely
• 13:51
  spectacular. They.
• 13:53
  Been a part of it good and bad in terms of the support me
• 13:55
  through all of it they've felt the brunt of me you know trying
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  to get better and feeling and and I mean I couldn't ask for
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  better you know friends and and and parents I mean they're
• 14:05
  they're my best friends too So yeah that's great I mean.
• 14:08
  It was. It was.
• 14:08
  It was tough for them too. So all this time, are you still
• 14:13
  in the advertising world? Yeah, I had a during this time
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  for. About 18, about 16 to 18 years.
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  I was a large part of CBS Outdoor.
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  I ran a very small portion. Actually one of my closest
• 14:29
  friends is now the the biggest guy there.
• 14:32
  His name's Chris Steinbacher. He runs the the entire real
• 14:35
  estate division. But I was a couple steps below
• 14:37
  him running Southern California, Las Vegas, doing billboards.
• 14:43
  So a lot of the, a lot of billboards you see on the side,
• 14:45
  the roads, the digital stuff. We were a huge part.
• 14:49
  He still is. But in my you know late 20s,
• 14:53
  early 30s, I was a huge part of putting up a lot of those signs
• 14:56
  and and a lot of areas that that.
• 14:58
  I mean, people never thought we'd put them up.
• 15:00
  So it was a huge movement. The billboards became incredibly
• 15:03
  valuable and we were kind of where the kind of a pioneer and
• 15:09
  was that good money? I mean, will you make a good, I
• 15:12
  mean you're at a young age there where it sounds like that was
• 15:14
  you had a big region and it sounds like you possibly make
• 15:17
  good money doing that. Absolutely, it was.
• 15:20
  It was a great job. It was a great career.
• 15:22
  Lots of fun people and it and it and you know, one of those
• 15:24
  industries where you pull back the curtain and it's gigantic.
• 15:27
  And there's some, you know, our boss was already Marino, who
• 15:30
  owns the the and who owns the Anaheim Angels.
• 15:33
  So it was a super fun guy. He actually sold it to Viacom,
• 15:37
  so. You know milk Harmazon and they,
• 15:40
  I never met them. They weren't my bosses but they
• 15:42
  owned the company. So we were just this massive
• 15:44
  company with all these resources and all these neat people and
• 15:48
  you know so big. But yeah, it was a fantastic job
• 15:52
  and and again I worked with one of my best friends and a bunch
• 15:55
  of friends and you know a great boss and so I I really enjoyed
• 15:57
  the job. But yeah during that whole time
• 16:00
  I was not all of it. I mean again it's there's
• 16:03
  there's stages of it where it was worse.
• 16:05
  I just want to be real honest with you and with the viewers
• 16:07
  and with my family who. Who obviously will watch this,
• 16:09
  that I'm not sugar coding anything, 'cause that's one of
• 16:12
  the things that bothers me when people tell their story, You
• 16:14
  know, they try and minimize things and I will not do that.
• 16:18
  I need to own this stuff and I'm and I'm happy to, cause I've,
• 16:21
  you know, nothing to be afraid about, about being honest about
• 16:23
  it. But during that time I, you
• 16:26
  know, on and off, you know, there was a good period of five
• 16:29
  or six years where I was sober again, not on any pills.
• 16:33
  And then then I got back on them and you know I was kind of a
• 16:37
  functioning. So he was just struggling.
• 16:41
  I, you know, and I've watched some of the there's quite a,
• 16:43
  there's two or three shows on right now on Netflix pain
• 16:48
  hustlers and well, there's two or three of them that are on it.
• 16:52
  Just it it shows, you know, it was almost like a a moment in
• 16:56
  time when all these pills were being kind of divvied out there
• 17:01
  to say, hey, you know, does your knee hurt, does your elbow hurt
• 17:04
  here? And you know, all these people
• 17:07
  started getting addicted and it became, you know, something that
• 17:12
  they didn't expect. And and you know, the struggle
• 17:17
  is what I think people maybe don't understand, is how hard it
• 17:22
  is to to remove yourself from something that you're addicted
• 17:26
  to because that that it's, there's such a strong, you know,
• 17:30
  feel of your body to it. It's it's like nothing I can
• 17:35
  explain, I mean. That I read a lot of books and
• 17:38
  and over the last two years and some amazing books on addiction
• 17:41
  there's a book by an ex football player that that that just was
• 17:45
  written God I'm trying to think to remember name of it.
• 17:48
  Anyway he he does the best job I've I've seen on somebody
• 17:52
  you've played with Carolina Panthers that's what I do.
• 17:54
  Oh Lord of Lord of the underground.
• 17:56
  Hero of the underground, and he talks about addiction better
• 17:59
  than than any book I've read. And it's just brutal.
• 18:03
  I mean. What it does to your body when
• 18:05
  you detox, you know, when I was in Leavenworth for the first
• 18:07
  four months, I was detoxing for four months straight.
• 18:11
  And it was, Oh my God, I wouldn't wish it upon anybody.
• 18:16
  It's it's miserable. And you know, just so you see
• 18:20
  when you see the way it does that when it has that kind of
• 18:22
  effect on you, that's crazy. But also you see and hear the
• 18:25
  stories about what people do to get drugs.
• 18:27
  They go broke, You know, procuring them.
• 18:29
  They get into dangerous situations I.
• 18:34
  Mean the story and the struggle's real and it's it's
• 18:37
  scary Well so Scott cause up to this time and when did when did
• 18:44
  it get to the point where you got into your nightmare and you
• 18:48
  found yourself going down to Mexico Was that something you'd
• 18:52
  done before or was that a first time deal that you were going
• 18:56
  down for painkillers. No, I mean.
• 19:01
  You know I've been down to Mexico sporadically for fun
• 19:03
  trips and and purchased them then.
• 19:05
  But no, this was a new plan, a new stupid plan.
• 19:07
  Obviously want some spectacular thought went into it.
• 19:10
  But no, I this was just part of a of something that I was
• 19:15
  already doing. I was getting into the cannabis
• 19:17
  industry and some of the people that worked for me, some of the
• 19:20
  connections you know had access to these people in Mexico that
• 19:23
  had pills. We were driving close to the
• 19:25
  border to visit locations and. Temecula and and yeah, you know,
• 19:30
  just anyway, so it was one of those things like, Oh yeah, I'll
• 19:34
  go over to the across the border and see what I can do and then
• 19:36
  I'll go back and then you know take a look at some of the farms
• 19:39
  on the way back to Los Angeles. So because again at that time
• 19:42
  I'm living in LA, so do you go over across the border by
• 19:48
  yourself and then come back through with the with the pills
• 19:54
  or like had you first of all, it sounds like what happened was,
• 19:59
  is that you declared those pills when you went back to in or back
• 20:05
  into the United States. Is that how that happened?
• 20:09
  I did. But here, here's the here's the
• 20:11
  kicker, and here's where you know I've written out my story
• 20:13
  for people to read. It's a very complicated story
• 20:16
  and I'll I'll do my best to to to.
• 20:19
  Let's get complicated character for it, but what?
• 20:22
  What happened? Here's the gist of it.
• 20:25
  I trusted some people that were working with me that I shouldn't
• 20:28
  have and while in Mexico this guy that was working for me put
• 20:34
  enough meth in the car, in the floorboards and other things to
• 20:38
  populate. You know mess for for an entire
• 20:41
  another country. Now I drove through the Mexican
• 20:45
  border not thinking a thing of this.
• 20:48
  They asked me to declare anything.
• 20:50
  Yes. I'm declaring the pain pills
• 20:52
  that I purchased and and it just so happens that a dog probably
• 20:58
  located at the. Again I'm simplifying the story
• 21:01
  but you can get the grip just of I should have never been in
• 21:05
  Mexico. Was that the dumbest thing in
• 21:06
  the world for me to have done? Yes.
• 21:08
  Should I have known something was going on?
• 21:10
  Absolutely. Did I?
• 21:11
  No I did not and I will never change from that version of the
• 21:14
  story. But should I have?
• 21:16
  Yeah. So, you know, I've been getting,
• 21:20
  I'm a smart guy. Comments forever.
• 21:22
  I saw that in your pile. Yeah.
• 21:24
  And so this. This may take the cake, but
• 21:27
  again, when you're when you're looking and you're an addict,
• 21:31
  you're trying to get pills and stuff, you overlook some really
• 21:33
  obvious things. So I'm not, you know, this is
• 21:36
  100% my fault. I'm not pushing the blame off on
• 21:38
  anybody. But anyway, so the the dog
• 21:41
  sniffed it. They asked me if I'd go through
• 21:43
  secondary inspection. I'm like, sure nothing to work.
• 21:46
  I mean, I'm literally watching Rick and Morty on my iPad.
• 21:50
  I've been waiting at the at the border.
• 21:52
  We go through the secondary unit.
• 21:56
  Some red flags must have been raised.
• 21:57
  They asked, did you get out of the car pretty soon, that I have
• 21:59
  cuffs on me and then I'm sitting, you know, in in the OTA
• 22:03
  Mesa border lobby, wherever they, you know, hold.
• 22:07
  What are you thinking, Scott? At that time I was wasn't.
• 22:12
  I was thinking some sort of mistake.
• 22:14
  And then when they called me in, you know, the next day and they
• 22:18
  they started, you know, talking to me.
• 22:20
  And then again, the law enforcement can be very funny in
• 22:23
  certain ways. But I'm, I'm starting to get out
• 22:25
  of them what what I did wrong? And they're telling me, oh, you
• 22:27
  know, and they wouldn't tell me. And so finally I, you know, I
• 22:30
  got loud and I'm like, listen, there's so many games, you know,
• 22:33
  let's be honest here. As soon as they said mess in the
• 22:36
  car, I said counsel. And then I was freaking.
• 22:40
  Out. Wow.
• 22:42
  So what were the next steps that happened?
• 22:47
  Well, I'm at that point, I'm starting to detox even a few
• 22:50
  days off of the medication and you start to start to feel it.
• 22:54
  Now I've been taking, you know, a lot large quantities at that
• 22:57
  point. So my father immediately bailed
• 23:01
  me out. I was in, I think I was in four
• 23:04
  days at a medical portion of the San Diego and then I was in the
• 23:10
  SSMCCI think it's called for, you know, maybe 11 days total.
• 23:15
  And then I'm out and then I'm putting my case together,
• 23:22
  deciding that I'm going to go to trial.
• 23:24
  I'm figuring out my game plan how this is all going to work.
• 23:28
  So you're out. Your dad's an attorney is is he
• 23:31
  helpful in this situation knowing, you know the jam that
• 23:35
  you're in and and you know this is a federal case and you're
• 23:38
  talking about drugs and it sounds horrible.
• 23:41
  Like what what all is happening in your world.
• 23:46
  So unfortunately he had retired so he actually UN retired at a
• 23:50
  later date so he could help me. He's a poor guy but I but it's
• 23:54
  you know I actually have a lot of friends that have jobs in in
• 23:58
  law and unfortunately they're all state or or civil or and so
• 24:04
  federal crime is far different than you know better than than
• 24:09
  state. And so I'm sitting here going, I
• 24:11
  got all these resources. I did not.
• 24:13
  I had very little resources. So you know, we used referrals
• 24:19
  from other people, but we ended up going with attorneys we like
• 24:23
  and. You know there's nothing you
• 24:26
  Scott, you. But Scott, you bring up a good
• 24:29
  point there because I think that there was a moment certainly hit
• 24:34
  me when you see the United States of America versus your
• 24:40
  name. I mean, I don't know if there's
• 24:42
  anything more intimidating on God's green anchors than to see
• 24:47
  the United States of America versus your name, because you
• 24:51
  all of a sudden feel the weight of how heavy that is and what
• 24:55
  that means, and there's nothing you can do at that point.
• 24:59
  But try to step forward, and it's a heavy step.
• 25:05
  I think people don't understand too, how incredibly powerful to
• 25:09
  get the resources, the unlimited budget.
• 25:11
  I mean, they can. There's a reason they have a 96%
• 25:15
  conviction rate. And it's not because there
• 25:18
  aren't people out there that have, you know, great stories to
• 25:21
  tell that might be innocent, provide innocence.
• 25:23
  It's because they come at you with the with the machine gun
• 25:26
  and it's crazy. I mean, if they don't like your
• 25:30
  answer or that you, you beat them on something, they'll just
• 25:33
  switch up the verbiage and come after you for something
• 25:34
  different. It's crazy.
• 25:37
  It's crazy how much power they have and how they can influence
• 25:39
  it. And so fighting them, you know,
• 25:41
  knowing now what I said then, I would have, I would have never
• 25:44
  even begun. I would have just told the
• 25:47
  public defender to to find the best deal that we could.
• 25:50
  How long did the whole process take for you?
• 25:52
  It was during COVID. COVID really threw a wrench in
• 25:56
  all of it, but I don't know if the how much.
• 25:58
  That would have speed my case up, but it was about two years
• 26:02
  to trial and then, you know, it'll be four years when this is
• 26:07
  all said and done from beginning to, yeah, incarceration.
• 26:11
  So all along you're saying I'm going to take this to trial?
• 26:15
  Yeah. I mean, I had a different
• 26:20
  mindset at that time. And at that time it was a very
• 26:23
  simple thing. I mean, I'd never even been
• 26:26
  around meth and bite, for crying out loud, I couldn't finish
• 26:28
  Breaking Bad. I I have again a new found
• 26:33
  respect for meth. Since when you go to federal
• 26:36
  camp or prison you realize everyone on drug who's there for
• 26:39
  drugs has done meth. But at that point in my life, I
• 26:42
  mean, this is completely wrong on my part, but I'm just going
• 26:44
  to be honest about it. I was offended anyone could
• 26:47
  think I was had anything to do with meth and I just didn't know
• 26:50
  anything about it. So kind of like I had this
• 26:54
  belief that I was in some different echelon of drug right?
• 26:57
  Addiction. Like I didn't.
• 26:58
  Do you were in the upper class drugs.
• 27:00
  Yeah. And I'm.
• 27:01
  I mean that was that was just terrible logic on my part.
• 27:04
  But that's honestly how I thought.
• 27:06
  So I just did coke. I just did pills.
• 27:08
  I didn't touch that stuff. So how dare you accuse me of
• 27:11
  that. And so and I thought, you know,
• 27:13
  hey I I'm on the board of directors at UCSBA Greek Man of
• 27:17
  the year. I'm a Valedictor.
• 27:18
  I have all these amazing accomplishments.
• 27:20
  I have this All Star team of people that want to go to to bat
• 27:22
  for me. I'm thinking there's no way
• 27:24
  they're going to think I did it. You know, they're we're going to
• 27:27
  figure something out. It could not have been more
• 27:29
  wrong. They didn't care about any of
• 27:31
  that. As a matter of fact, they
• 27:32
  probably motivated them to go after me more.
• 27:34
  They're like, oh let's let's, let's make an example of this
• 27:37
  kid or or this kid should have known better, you know, all and
• 27:40
  all true things. So they did not.
• 27:43
  They did offer me at the very beginning lying to a federal
• 27:46
  officer before any of it. And you know, if I could go back
• 27:50
  in time, I probably could have took that.
• 27:51
  I probably wouldn't have done anything.
• 27:53
  But but again, at that time I'm going, oh, they wanted me to
• 27:57
  sign a statement saying that I knew there was methamphetamine
• 27:59
  in the car and at that I was not going to do so.
• 28:03
  You know, everyone asks these questions and and it's so funny,
• 28:06
  they can tell you're faced with this hypothetical scenario.
• 28:09
  It'll never understand. But facing between 15 and 20
• 28:12
  years in jail is terrifying. And so that's the risk you take
• 28:18
  if you go to trial because if you don't go to trial, maybe you
• 28:21
  do, you know, a couple years or maybe you get out on probation.
• 28:24
  And in my particular situation, they did offer, you know, line
• 28:28
  to, but I didn't even go into discussions with it.
• 28:30
  We were going to fight it. And so we went down that route.
• 28:34
  So tell me about it. Oh boy.
• 28:39
  You know, maybe we were cocky. Maybe I was naive.
• 28:44
  I thought we, I thought, being frank, we got our ass kicked in
• 28:48
  in in trial. It's not that my attorneys
• 28:51
  weren't good. They just here the power of a
• 28:54
  prosecutor is spectacular. We had all these motions set up
• 28:57
  to what motions are in this particular set sentence is their
• 29:01
  rules set up to how the trial is going to be governed.
• 29:04
  So for example, when I went across the border, the agents
• 29:08
  said I was out of control and combative and sweating and out
• 29:12
  all whacked out. And I'm like, that is not true.
• 29:15
  I was watching, watching a program on iPad, Rick and Morty.
• 29:18
  I want that video right now, that video.
• 29:21
  And there's videos everywhere of everything.
• 29:23
  I want to see that stuff. There's no way it went down like
• 29:25
  that. So, OK, so they start getting
• 29:28
  the videos together and I get the testimonies from the border
• 29:32
  agents who say all these things that I did.
• 29:34
  And then guess what? The video goes missing.
• 29:38
  Crazy, Right. OK, so so now we can't verify
• 29:42
  what I said or verify what they said.
• 29:44
  So we put together a motion in order for us to set the rules of
• 29:48
  how we're going to discuss that stuff.
• 29:50
  So I couldn't talk about what I think happened on the border.
• 29:55
  They weren't supposed to be able to talk about it either.
• 29:57
  OK. In terms of my, you know, my
• 30:00
  actions and what I look like, OK, so that's that's one of the
• 30:04
  things that's in place is a rule to govern the trial.
• 30:06
  When we're at trial, the prosecutor just ignores all.
• 30:09
  This, in my opinion, she just, she says whatever she wants.
• 30:13
  And so we're sitting here flipping through the guides
• 30:15
  trying to find where we said you could say or couldn't say this.
• 30:18
  So I feel like she really caught us off guard, like she got us
• 30:21
  off our game. And so I think we spent half the
• 30:24
  time in disbelief that she was doing the things that she was
• 30:27
  doing and getting away with them, 'cause the judge would
• 30:29
  admonish her, but she'd just keep going.
• 30:30
  She'd just stay at a slightly different way.
• 30:33
  And again, this is all my take on it.
• 30:36
  And then you know my, my. But this is interesting though,
• 30:41
  Scott, because most people don't go to trial.
• 30:44
  No. I know the and been smart but my
• 30:46
  attorney thought you know that there would be no you know I
• 30:49
  wanted to call these witnesses and put on the show you know
• 30:52
  about what what what a great guy Scott is and my attorney is like
• 30:55
  you don't need to do that. And then I also think that some
• 30:59
  of the people that we wanted to bring forward who were in
• 31:01
  cannabis wouldn't have been strong witnesses for me.
• 31:03
  They would have been picked apart.
• 31:04
  I think people underestimate when you go up as a witness
• 31:08
  you're going up against very intelligent people that do this
• 31:10
  for a living. So they would have been picked
• 31:12
  apart by the prosecutor who was sharp I So I just think my our
• 31:17
  our strategy was wrong. I disagreed with it, but I
• 31:19
  deferred to them. And you know, in the end we lost
• 31:24
  and we lost big. But here's the caveat.
• 31:30
  The prosecutor, I mean, said some outlandish things
• 31:35
  throughout the trial that we objected to and that the judge
• 31:38
  should have reprimanded her further but kept making mental
• 31:41
  notes. She said things like nobody in
• 31:44
  the history of of our office has ever had this much meth and
• 31:48
  occur and not known about it. How do you?
• 31:50
  How can anybody say? That when you you don't know
• 31:52
  what you don't. Know, right.
• 31:54
  She would say stuff like that to the jury and and that's a very
• 31:57
  powerful statement. And so literally out of luck,
• 32:01
  there was a there was a we had a big audience for this trial and
• 32:04
  in the back there was there was attorneys that were in the same
• 32:08
  office as our attorneys and they just happened to know of an
• 32:11
  exact case where this exact same thing happened where somebody
• 32:14
  didn't know about it was massive amounts of quantities of meth
• 32:17
  and it was under the prosecutor's caseload.
• 32:20
  So it looked awful for the prosecutor that she just made
• 32:24
  the statement. So we objected right after the
• 32:26
  jury verdict and the judge had everyone get together and
• 32:31
  basically she said to him, hey they've got a point.
• 32:35
  You're making up. You're making some.
• 32:37
  You're making some statements that you can't you can't
• 32:39
  possibly be saying you shouldn't be saying.
• 32:41
  So I think you guys need to come do a a plea deal.
• 32:44
  If you don't, you know, I may consider throwing this verdict
• 32:47
  out, which would have been very bad for her and her publicity.
• 32:51
  And so I had admitted on the stand of line to a federal
• 32:54
  officer. I did lie to a federal officer
• 32:57
  and so I took that. So then when I go to sentencing
• 33:02
  and I, you know, didn't have the right strategy because the
• 33:06
  attorney at that point, I hired another attorney because I was
• 33:08
  upset at the previous attorney. So the new attorney I had was a
• 33:10
  brilliant litigator but not so good at which, you know, at the
• 33:14
  rules of the BOP and the rules of getting into R DAP and what
• 33:17
  place do you ask for and if you want to get a lower sentence,
• 33:20
  how you need to talk to the judge.
• 33:22
  We didn't do any of that. So I learned about the prison
• 33:25
  professors and the Justin Bernies and Michael Santos after
• 33:29
  I'd already been sentenced. So wow.
• 33:31
  Missed out on a big opportunity. So I just went up there and
• 33:34
  said, hey, OK, wait, what do you got for me?
• 33:36
  And not in a disrespectful way. I just, you know, so I got 24
• 33:41
  months, the judge said to me, you know, I don't think you
• 33:45
  knew. I don't think you knew, but you
• 33:48
  should have known and that so all this stuff I've just said in
• 33:51
  the prior where I I feel like I'm justifying my actions.
• 33:55
  No, let's just you're just telling the story of of what
• 33:58
  happened. OK, well, good.
• 34:00
  I'm glad you feel that way, 'cause it's something I'm really
• 34:02
  concerned about, because the story is what it is, and I'm not
• 34:04
  going to let go into something I didn't do.
• 34:06
  But what an idiot for being there, for being in that
• 34:10
  situation. Nobody can.
• 34:12
  Nobody can prove that you knew anyway, Scott.
• 34:15
  You're the only guy and you know that's the.
• 34:18
  That's the unique thing about your case is, is that nobody can
• 34:23
  get inside your head except you and.
• 34:28
  Obviously you weren't. I mean, and just listening to
• 34:31
  your story, you're not even a meth guy.
• 34:33
  You were looking for painkillers because you were addicted to.
• 34:36
  And you you, you thought this would be an easy, fast way,
• 34:40
  cheaper way to stay on your high that you were addicted to.
• 34:44
  I get it. So I think another incredibly
• 34:49
  fascinating thing is, is that you're a California guy and.
• 34:55
  How do you find out that you're going to Leavenworth?
• 35:00
  My lawyer asked for Lompoc, which did not have an ARDAP, so
• 35:03
  that was a mistake once. So we started filling out this
• 35:05
  paperwork to try and get to an ARDAP, which was Sheridan.
• 35:08
  Oregon was supposed to be the closest.
• 35:12
  About a week before I'm headed to to turn myself in.
• 35:17
  We find out it's in Kansas and Kansas does have our ARDAP and
• 35:21
  I'm going wow, so four 1496 miles away is where you guys
• 35:28
  have designated me. OK, that's going to be
• 35:31
  interesting. So we we hop on a plane and flew
• 35:35
  to Fresno. My father was nice enough to
• 35:37
  come with me and and got up, walked up right in front of that
• 35:40
  big beautiful prison and terrified as can be and. 1879 is
• 35:46
  when that thing was built and they and they walk everybody
• 35:49
  through that gate, which is. Not where the camp is, but you
• 35:53
  process through. Yeah, you know better than I.
• 35:58
  Brother and you know The funny thing about and and terrifying
• 36:03
  thing about it is is when you walk through that and they
• 36:06
  process you and they they put you in that holding place in
• 36:09
  that basement for a while hours, you start thinking first of all
• 36:15
  I don't have any idea. You know what happens next?
• 36:19
  And nobody's going to tell me, I guess, until they tell me.
• 36:22
  But I'm wondering if they know that I'm not supposed to be
• 36:25
  here. And I wonder if that's what they
• 36:26
  hear all the time. Oh, yeah, You know, Hey, I'm not
• 36:30
  supposed to be here. Oh, yeah, that's fine.
• 36:32
  Yeah, whatever. Everybody says that.
• 36:35
  Yeah, they don't. They don't care.
• 36:36
  But you're right. You're wondering what they've
• 36:37
  heard and what they don't. If they believe some people or
• 36:39
  if others, they just shake their head at all of it.
• 36:42
  But you don't know. But you, you, you, you finally
• 36:45
  get through that process of getting prisonized.
• 36:50
  You get yourself set and ready to head down to the place that
• 36:54
  looks like a rundown schoolhouse with a big barbed wire fence
• 36:57
  around it and fenced. I think it's one of only three
• 37:00
  in the United States that has fencing for a camp.
• 37:03
  Bless their heart. Bless their heart.
• 37:06
  And tell me about walking in that place.
• 37:10
  Oh man, the best part is when I'm walking they say, hey say
• 37:12
  just walk that direction and and again you you know there's some
• 37:16
  fields and and. Buffalo for a long time without
• 37:19
  seeing anything. Buffalo sitting there thinking
• 37:21
  I'm going to get shot. Like they're going to think
• 37:23
  somebody's escaping because I'm not walking the right way.
• 37:25
  And I'm out in the middle of nowhere and finally I get to the
• 37:29
  camp. There's nobody there.
• 37:31
  And so I'm just trying random doors.
• 37:33
  I'm thinking now I'm late and somebody's getting in trouble.
• 37:35
  And so anyway, eventually I see somebody walk out of the one
• 37:38
  door I didn't try. And you walk right into the camp
• 37:41
  and you're going, whoa, this is, this is not what I thought it
• 37:44
  would be. So welcome to Leavenworth.
• 37:46
  What? What time of year was it?
• 37:49
  What season? Oh, it was October.
• 37:52
  What, eighth? Yeah, so winter.
• 37:54
  Yeah, yeah. And that's the other thing.
• 37:57
  You know, everybody talks about Leavenworth because it doesn't
• 38:00
  have air conditioning, which was really bad.
• 38:03
  But the other part of it was is that it got really, really cold.
• 38:07
  And they didn't turn the heat on until about a week before
• 38:10
  Thanksgiving. And you'd freeze to death in
• 38:12
  there. Yeah.
• 38:14
  Yeah. So Scott, you walk in, you walk
• 38:18
  into this place and where where were you?
• 38:23
  A 2A1 No, I start at you. I'm sure you I started in C2.
• 38:29
  I started in the in. The OK C2 OK, yeah.
• 38:34
  And you know, I'm. I'm then right down and walked
• 38:39
  out of the RDAP office And then the way I do things is I'm going
• 38:41
  to start getting working on whatever I need to be worked on
• 38:44
  and on the To Do List. And my first thing was you got
• 38:46
  to get an RDAP. Yeah.
• 38:47
  And so I spent you. Know I might.
• 38:50
  I'm going to. Let's let's explain real quick
• 38:52
  for those people down in the Cayman Islands, what RDAP is?
• 38:57
  RDAP is a residential drug and alcohol program that you can
• 39:00
  take. It's between 9:00 and 11:00
• 39:03
  months. It's structured.
• 39:05
  It's about 3 1/2 hours every morning, Monday through Friday.
• 39:09
  And if you pass, which is not as easy as you'd think it would be,
• 39:14
  you can get up to 12 months off your sentence.
• 39:17
  On the FSA, first step back credit.
• 39:19
  Now, depending on your sentence length, you may go as low as
• 39:22
  four or 12 months or six months. Excuse me, which I got six
• 39:26
  months because my sentence is 24 months.
• 39:28
  But for anything over 34, you get a a full 12 months off your
• 39:33
  sentence. So there's a big incentive to do
• 39:35
  it. So when you went in there, you
• 39:37
  you mentioned that you were starting to detox.
• 39:41
  Was that going on as you I mean you said the first four months
• 39:46
  every you know again I spent all this money prior trying to find
• 39:49
  out what drugs I can take look up what what the BOP says is not
• 39:55
  he knows better than anybody. It's not necessarily what's
• 39:57
  going to happen at the individual institution or what
• 40:00
  the nurse may do or what that. You know, particular staff may
• 40:03
  want to do at that time of day, at that hour, you know, based on
• 40:06
  their vibe. So the medication I've been on,
• 40:09
  which is a wonderful drug that helps you stay off opiates and
• 40:12
  helps with pain. And it's not a narcotic like
• 40:15
  Vicodin or like opiate, but it's called Suboxone.
• 40:19
  Suboxone is huge and the BOP says that you can take it
• 40:23
  Leavenworth. Leavenworth has it in their
• 40:26
  medicine cabinets. They can administer it, but they
• 40:29
  didn't want to because they claimed there was some problems
• 40:32
  with some inmates abusing it. So I said what I could have had
• 40:38
  two years. I could have weaned off this.
• 40:39
  If that was the case, we said, oh, it's OK, we'll just, we'll
• 40:42
  wean you off it and then a month later we'll put you on a shot
• 40:46
  called Vivitrol. Now I don't know anything.
• 40:49
  Can't look up the stuff on the Internet here.
• 40:51
  The Vivitrol and Suboxone are far different things.
• 40:54
  So I I detoxed off Suboxone and it was.
• 40:58
  I've been on it for over 10 years.
• 41:00
  Legal doses, not abusing that but wow.
• 41:04
  Wow. So that was that was awful.
• 41:08
  That was, that was absolutely awful.
• 41:09
  The advice was, you know, for detoxing was go visit, go to go
• 41:14
  to church or or or walk the track.
• 41:17
  Like there's no, there's no, you know, I went to the bubble once
• 41:21
  at like 4:00 in the morning because I thought I was dying.
• 41:23
  My heart was pumping through and the the guard looked at me and
• 41:26
  he goes you know they knew we got this way they Carver do you
• 41:30
  want to do you want to go to the shoe and and and be there or do
• 41:33
  you want to have it do you want to go back to your top bunk And
• 41:35
  I'm like OK I'm I'm. Going and of course I want to go
• 41:38
  to the shoe, but that's that's those are your options.
• 41:41
  Special housing unit the whole how, how did you start?
• 41:46
  Now you're in this new primitive world.
• 41:48
  You you're you're not someone who's been in this primitive
• 41:51
  world before. How did you start to adapt
• 41:53
  through it? I got kind of lucky.
• 41:57
  I think at the very beginning I met some really great people
• 42:01
  that were super supportive. But I also my particular skill
• 42:04
  set and the way that I love to help people.
• 42:07
  That's one of my passions in helping people.
• 42:09
  I was able to help some key people.
• 42:11
  That kind of just made my life easier right off the get go on a
• 42:15
  bit of, you know, luck. Wasn't that Scott?
• 42:18
  Wasn't that like one of the biggest surprises to you about
• 42:21
  prison? It was for me, is.
• 42:24
  I always say that I, you know, I was such a Pansy when I was
• 42:27
  standing at the, you know, the gates thinking, OK, let's see,
• 42:31
  I, I, I guess I'll get raped and then I'm going to get beat up
• 42:34
  and maybe get stabbed. I've seen that on the movies.
• 42:37
  And it was like immediately people, because I was walking
• 42:40
  into their world, they really did want to help me get set up.
• 42:44
  They really did want to help me, you know, get as comfortable as
• 42:49
  you can get into that environment.
• 42:51
  And I guess for me. Walking into an environment, a
• 42:56
  primitive environment like that, it was kind of the opposite of
• 42:59
  what I had planned in my head. And these guys helped me.
• 43:04
  They they truly helped me because I was like, you know, a
• 43:08
  pup just out of, you know, just walking.
• 43:11
  And and they knew that and they just took me and said, hey,
• 43:14
  we're going to help you. And they did.
• 43:17
  I mean, you have, like you said, you if you want to be safe at a
• 43:20
  camp, you can be safe at a camp. You can get in trouble if you if
• 43:23
  you're looking for it or if you fuck around, sure.
• 43:26
  But for the most part you're it's safe.
• 43:30
  I agree. So you said and one of the
• 43:32
  things I noticed was you you you talked about losing 70 pounds,
• 43:35
  you're reading 150 books and then he went through this
• 43:38
  paralegal program that you've actually did really well in. 95%
• 43:44
  or above is what I remember but. Then you really started helping
• 43:48
  a lot of people through motions and and all kinds of deals that
• 43:52
  happen. Is that how is, is that
• 43:55
  something? Did you have that planning in
• 43:57
  your mind when you were going through or did was this Once you
• 44:01
  were there, you're like, this is going to be a way for me to kill
• 44:05
  my time, eat up my time. By doing this.
• 44:07
  I mean you know this. The key to prison or surviving
• 44:11
  prison is avoiding idle time. Idle time is is absolute death
• 44:14
  match. But no, I didn't.
• 44:16
  I didn't plan on. I plan on doing the paralegal
• 44:18
  thing because I wanted it. That was part of my plan to stay
• 44:20
  busy. But to be honest, I mean, I had
• 44:22
  ABA in law and I I've always kind of loved to think of myself
• 44:25
  because of my dad and other factors that I have some sort of
• 44:28
  law genius. But I'm not.
• 44:30
  I don't know anything. I'm actually.
• 44:32
  I mean, who am I kidding? Let me be totally real.
• 44:35
  I'm not impressive with that. But I got better at it.
• 44:38
  And so I really forced myself to try and help people in these
• 44:43
  situations because they had no better option and what they were
• 44:45
  doing was, was just terrible in terms of its potential for
• 44:50
  success. And some of these people had
• 44:52
  really strong arguments. They just needed somebody to
• 44:55
  advocate for a little better. And so I didn't do anything
• 44:58
  other than organize them and put their story together in a better
• 45:01
  structure and then really push for them because it's it's kind
• 45:04
  of one of those funny things where sometimes we're we're the
• 45:06
  best advocate for other people than we are for ourselves.
• 45:10
  And so when it was somebody else, man, I was, I went to war
• 45:12
  for and we were very successful. I mean we.
• 45:15
  I'm sure that's why in the limited time, limited times that
• 45:18
  I got into some trouble, which wasn't much, but I'm sure I got
• 45:21
  messed with because of those potential things that, you know,
• 45:24
  I, I, I did go into the office hours and other other things
• 45:28
  representing other people with them there.
• 45:30
  And that's not usual. They let me get away with it to
• 45:32
  a certain extent. But you know, they put my dad on
• 45:36
  the watch list because you you send in legal mail that they
• 45:40
  didn't like, which was my newsletters, which I was just
• 45:42
  walking 20 feet over to give you another case manager.
• 45:46
  So there was stuff like that where it was just like, OK.
• 45:50
  So did you start writing your you did Scott, Did you start
• 45:54
  writing your newsletter from month one or did you start?
• 45:58
  Did you work your way into that? No, I wrote it every week.
• 46:02
  I'm on my 58th week right now, and I promised I'd do it
• 46:06
  throughout my incarceration. I did it the first week before I
• 46:10
  left, I think maybe 2 weeks, and then I wrote it every Friday.
• 46:16
  And then my dad, bless his heart with we we built the kind of
• 46:20
  program to have it and send it to him.
• 46:22
  He put it in for him at it, proofread it, and then he'd Kick
• 46:25
  It Out. Speed.
• 46:26
  And did you get any backlash from Leavenworth on that little
• 46:30
  bit? I got some funny.
• 46:32
  I mean I I I try to be proactive about it.
• 46:34
  Again, I I didn't use names and although I I had some very
• 46:38
  interesting things to say about certain staff and whatnot, I
• 46:41
  didn't, I didn't call them out individually.
• 46:43
  I actually brought it to a lot of them and showed them it said
• 46:46
  hey this is what I'm doing. I mean Noel knew about it.
• 46:49
  My my bosses at the kitchen, they knew about it.
• 46:54
  And then all my DTS staff, the RDAP program staff, I went and
• 46:58
  brought it to them and and you know, they were, I wanted them
• 47:01
  to know because our nap staff reads all your e-mail, it listed
• 47:04
  all your phone calls. You can get in trouble for some
• 47:06
  of the craziest things. And I saw people get in trouble
• 47:08
  for the craziest things. I saw a guy, they they heard him
• 47:12
  on a phone call and he was talking about his girlfriend and
• 47:15
  they knew he had a wife. So they made him call his wife.
• 47:18
  Tells him like so. There's crazy stuff that goes.
• 47:21
  On well, I mean I I wanted to get when you when you're talking
• 47:23
  about that Scott, you think they can't listen to all those phone
• 47:26
  calls we got. We lost our movie privileges for
• 47:31
  a month because a guy was talking about bragging about
• 47:34
  that we saw a first run movie that they got from Unicorp and
• 47:38
  because he was bragging on on riding.
• 47:41
  It was no, it was a phone call and that was it.
• 47:45
  And then he got in trouble and the whole camp lost the movie
• 47:49
  rights for a month, which you're like, wow, they really do.
• 47:52
  They really do listen to all that.
• 47:54
  Well, let's talk about, let's talk about this too, Scott,
• 47:56
  because your your, your world and my world crossed over
• 47:59
  because you worked in the kitchen.
• 48:02
  I worked at the food Warehouse and Co, Noel, correction
• 48:07
  Officer. Noel was my boss at the food
• 48:10
  warehouse and he was your boss in the kitchen.
• 48:13
  He'd changed jobs by then. Yeah.
• 48:17
  Well, Noah's a fan of you. That's that's what cracked me
• 48:19
  up. And he was, he was, I mean, he
• 48:20
  liked everybody, but he wasn't a fan of of people.
• 48:23
  But I I thought Noah was one of the good, probably two or three
• 48:26
  guys in that whole camp, staff wise, that was a good deal.
• 48:29
  He actually had some empathy and he went out of his way to try
• 48:32
  and help people. But I I got a job in the kitchen
• 48:35
  to be super honest with you and I.
• 48:38
  One of the things that I struggled with over the last 20
• 48:41
  years is I got lazy and I I did not, the lack of a better word,
• 48:45
  roll my sleeves up and get dirty.
• 48:46
  And I knew there is no way I would have gotten the job in the
• 48:49
  kitchen. That wasn't my style and so
• 48:51
  that's why I did do it is I wanted to wash tables and also
• 48:55
  I'm a terrible cook. I wanted to.
• 48:56
  I thought I was going to learn. To cook.
• 48:57
  That's not how it goes. But I wanted to, since I've
• 49:02
  screwed up so royally. I wanted to lean into this whole
• 49:05
  experience and say, OK, if you're going to do this, if
• 49:07
  you're going to change your life, if you're going to get
• 49:09
  better, you need to do all these things that you know are huge
• 49:12
  red flags, huge things you're failing at.
• 49:14
  You're going to succeed at it. Step one is stop thinking you're
• 49:17
  so fantastic you're not, and get a job where you have to bust
• 49:21
  your ass. And to me, that was the kitchen.
• 49:25
  And I I guess Noel was one of the kitchen cops.
• 49:31
  But there's usually like, what, two or three that you had to
• 49:33
  probably work through. But yeah, there's there's McCoy,
• 49:36
  who's who I like a lot, but it had his, had his interesting
• 49:39
  brushes, but Kingis was was one of my favorites.
• 49:42
  But it's 'cause he didn't fire me the one time.
• 49:45
  One time I just tried to steal something, not even for me,
• 49:48
  'cause somebody else asked me again, I'm a terrible criminal,
• 49:52
  but somebody asked me to get him some bread.
• 49:55
  Which man? When you turn around, half that
• 49:57
  half the inventory goes out of that place.
• 50:00
  I don't know how I got caught, but I I had a half a loaf of
• 50:03
  bread all in and I walked around the corner and he's standing
• 50:06
  right there and I throw it underneath the bin like he
• 50:09
  didn't see it. And he goes, really.
• 50:12
  And so I finished my shift and after he calls me in and he
• 50:15
  goes, you going to be an asset or a liability?
• 50:19
  And I was like, Oh my God, sorry, you know, I didn't mean
• 50:24
  to do it. He's like, OK, I just don't ever
• 50:26
  do it again. So I kind of actually helped
• 50:28
  Lucladi and fire me. Yeah, well, they do.
• 50:30
  Sometimes they do. Oh, absolutely.
• 50:32
  For far less. I think they knew I I just
• 50:35
  worked and and got. Yeah, you're a good worker.
• 50:37
  Yeah, they probably didn't want to lose a good worker, 'cause
• 50:39
  they're hard to find. And I mean, did you think it was
• 50:42
  odd, 'cause you and I talked about this before we got on, but
• 50:45
  did you think it was odd that that Noel, your boss, was
• 50:49
  reading a book that was from a prisoner from Leavenworth?
• 50:56
  Absolutely. I've never seen any of them.
• 50:58
  I mean, I know that I I used to have some good conversations
• 51:01
  with McCoy. I know McCoy reads and he, he's
• 51:04
  up on a lot of the shows and whatnot, but I've never seen and
• 51:07
  he's and he's earmarking it. Again, Brent, this is a huge
• 51:10
  compliment to you. And I mean, I guess I wish I
• 51:12
  would have known what I know now, so I can talk to him about
• 51:14
  it. But he was reading it because
• 51:15
  he's interested. He was reading it, 'cause he
• 51:17
  thought highly of you, which, which again, I didn't put this
• 51:19
  in together until way after, you know, a couple, I think a month
• 51:22
  ago. So you and I had already talked,
• 51:24
  and I still didn't remember it. I remembered it once.
• 51:26
  I saw your book and I and I saw the name 'cause he was, he was
• 51:30
  showing me and it was funny. He asked me for some illegal
• 51:33
  advice. He goes they don't need
• 51:35
  permission to have my name. Was he and I go no I I he
• 51:39
  doesn't. But I I didn't know the answer.
• 51:40
  I was just and I qualified that I said I don't know the answer
• 51:43
  to that but I don't think so. But he's not saying anything
• 51:45
  negative. It's is he bashing you?
• 51:47
  No. Then then what would you what
• 51:48
  reason would you have to be upset.
• 51:49
  But he was he was excited about it.
• 51:51
  He was highlighting it. That's I know.
• 51:52
  I. Thought that was, well, he was
• 51:53
  one of the good guys and you know like you said there it's,
• 51:56
  it's it's unusual because a lot of them really take advantage of
• 52:02
  the situation that you're treated like.
• 52:04
  Cattle and which is unusual because at Leavenworth are
• 52:08
  actually our Buffalo roaming in the in the front.
• 52:11
  That's not something I expected to see at prison.
• 52:14
  But so let's talk about this Scott.
• 52:18
  You you kind of get through and and become a guy that's helping
• 52:22
  people. You're giving yourself your own
• 52:24
  self punishment of doing the hard work in the kitchen that a
• 52:28
  lot of people don't like to do. You start getting close and then
• 52:31
  you you do well. You do so well in RDAP that you
• 52:34
  you give the commencement address to to our class.
• 52:39
  Both you and I had that in common.
• 52:41
  I I didn't know that I was going to take RDAP as as far or as to
• 52:46
  take it to as much as it I took in from it.
• 52:52
  How did you start? Once you start feeling like
• 52:54
  you're getting closer to the door, what what did you start
• 52:57
  thinking about getting to the next steps?
• 53:04
  I guess I as soon as it was my, you know, our our transition
• 53:08
  quarter, I started planning or the realities of that I would
• 53:12
  soon be leaving, started hitting me and I started trying to
• 53:15
  adjust plans for what would be going on outside.
• 53:18
  But my attitude in prison was kind of I had to do it one way.
• 53:22
  Like I didn't, I didn't talk a lot of the phone to people.
• 53:24
  I emailed a lot. But if I'm in prison, I'm in
• 53:27
  prison. If I'm out, I'm out.
• 53:29
  And so I really had trouble with that part of trying to stay
• 53:33
  connected to my life outside. Plus, you were so far away.
• 53:36
  Yeah. And I just so I didn't do well
• 53:39
  with that. So I really focused on prison.
• 53:41
  So I kind of was all in on our DAP up until the last day.
• 53:44
  And then when it was over, then it was a ton of emotions hit me
• 53:47
  and you know, it was crazy. Then I'm going home.
• 53:51
  Yeah. And I think that's always kind
• 53:54
  of a weird transition because you do get into living your
• 53:58
  primitive life and your routines in prison.
• 54:01
  And the closer you get to getting out, you start to kind
• 54:06
  of open up that world in your mind is like, wow, I'm going to
• 54:10
  go out and I've got to get and then and then that you have that
• 54:15
  unfamiliarity of. First of all, you can't wait to
• 54:18
  see your name that you're going to be released.
• 54:22
  But then you had this really unknown world of what you're
• 54:28
  going to be walking into next because so many people say,
• 54:31
  well, the next step you're going to hate it worse than, you know,
• 54:34
  the the than the world you're in right now with your halfway
• 54:37
  house. Tell us how those steps went for
• 54:40
  you. Well, it was funny as I'm as I'm
• 54:43
  leaving, I'm getting on there, you know, about to get on the
• 54:46
  plane and you're wearing all grades.
• 54:47
  So you know, half the people probably know you're either they
• 54:50
  probably think you're military or you're a prisoner And sitting
• 54:52
  there going, you don't get, you get $10 you don't get, they tell
• 54:56
  you you got to make some phone calls.
• 54:58
  So you're scoping out, you know, people that you can go up and
• 55:01
  ask to use your cell phones because we're not public phones
• 55:03
  anymore. And so I'm standing there and
• 55:05
  this guy goes, hey, congratulations.
• 55:07
  And I, I look around, he's he's a employee at a, like a earphone
• 55:12
  headphone store. And I said for what?
• 55:14
  And he says, well, you just got out right.
• 55:16
  And they're like, how do you know?
• 55:17
  And he goes, bro, we know, OK? And so he goes over there.
• 55:22
  Guy actually gets me. He sees the crappy headphones
• 55:26
  I'm wearing. He goes, you need a good pair of
• 55:27
  headphones. Guy gets me, you know, for a
• 55:29
  dollar. He gives me a really nice pair.
• 55:31
  Of Wow headphones. What a guy like it lets me use
• 55:34
  this phone so I can activate the credit card.
• 55:35
  And now I can buy something more than, you know, $3.00 with,
• 55:40
  which is what they gave us. I was excited to get home.
• 55:43
  I miss my family. I miss my friends.
• 55:47
  The I knew I was going to have trouble at the halfway house
• 55:49
  just because I don't like that kind of structure.
• 55:53
  I feel like you're half in and half out and don't like that.
• 55:55
  Like I said, and I wanted to get to home confinement as soon as I
• 55:58
  possible. The thing I'm cracking up about
• 56:00
  now is it's not easier. It's just different each step.
• 56:04
  Yeah, it's. Such a good.
• 56:06
  That's such a good point, Scott. Such a good point and I think
• 56:10
  that's something. But I maybe a lot of people
• 56:13
  don't realize what you just said is so good.
• 56:15
  It's it's it's it's it's your next step it's it's not
• 56:21
  necessarily easier it's your next step of getting to where
• 56:26
  you want to be. But there's nothing easy about
• 56:28
  any of those steps. I mean, I I I had all three of
• 56:32
  my jobs denied. I mean, what a job?
• 56:37
  Working at prison professors. White collar advice, helping
• 56:40
  felons to advocate for better positions.
• 56:42
  Like a no brainer job that they do hope they want me to do.
• 56:46
  I work in a law firm as a paralegal and then as a work in
• 56:50
  an advertising agency. Something I did for 17 years.
• 56:54
  My mind was blown. Like I would think like I can't.
• 56:57
  I turned these in on the first day.
• 56:59
  I thought they were going to go, wow, great, you know, thank God
• 57:01
  you've got these these resources good for you.
• 57:03
  That's lucky. Go at it instead.
• 57:05
  They're like, no. And I'm like, well, what do you
• 57:07
  want me to do? And they're like, well, no, we
• 57:08
  need you to work at this kind of place or that kind of place.
• 57:10
  And I'm like, all right, what's the next step And who I need to
• 57:13
  talk to? And so I eventually am getting.
• 57:16
  That so they so Scott, I want to make sure I that I understand
• 57:20
  what you just said you had three different jobs set up and your
• 57:25
  case manager said, I don't think so.
• 57:28
  She said no. She said the BOP reviewed these
• 57:32
  and they said the BOP said no. Did was there any qualification
• 57:35
  or why that those three jobs that sound like great jobs for
• 57:38
  somebody to do? I will get into it.
• 57:41
  But here's here's the first part.
• 57:42
  I said I didn't invent the wheel here.
• 57:44
  I'm not some brilliant guy that came up with these job ideas.
• 57:47
  These are things that other felons are doing right now out
• 57:51
  there in America. It's not like I came up, you
• 57:53
  know, I'm the guy inventing the Rubik's Cube in space and the
• 57:56
  no, these are jobs people are doing.
• 57:58
  I'm just copying them. How are you saying no to them?
• 58:01
  So the reasons I got that I got were that I need permission to
• 58:05
  speak with felons and so I said OK let me do I need to talk to
• 58:10
  you to get that. Then the other one, the law
• 58:13
  firm, they said they didn't want me around that type of clientele
• 58:18
  and and or potential felon thing.
• 58:20
  And I said excuse me, you don't know if I walk into McDonald's
• 58:23
  if I'm. Exactly under that.
• 58:25
  Under that theory, I can't go to an A, A meeting or an AA
• 58:29
  meeting. I'm felons all the time.
• 58:31
  I can't step outside of this house.
• 58:33
  So then then the the best one, the one that I got most, she
• 58:36
  said you nobody works from home, you can't work from home.
• 58:39
  I said after COVID, Everybody works from home.
• 58:43
  And working from home is a prevalent way.
• 58:45
  Well, we can't go to your house to view that.
• 58:47
  I said yes you can. The first day I met with you, I
• 58:50
  stand the way of my life. You can.
• 58:52
  You can walk in this house right now.
• 58:53
  So what are you talking about? So once I put all those
• 58:57
  arguments together in an e-mail and I said please, you cited
• 59:00
  some things in the manual that said I can't do these things.
• 59:03
  I've reviewed the manual. Please specifically point out
• 59:06
  where those things are. They took a looser stance and
• 59:09
  all of a sudden they're approved.
• 59:10
  But but for people that don't fight back, for people that
• 59:12
  maybe go, you know, I I don't know.
• 59:14
  If no, they fall through the trap door.
• 59:17
  Yeah, I mean, what are you supposed to do?
• 59:19
  They fall through the trap door. And Lewis L Reed's got a great
• 59:23
  analogy about, you know, the guy running on the track.
• 59:27
  You know the the the fire, the gun goes off and they start
• 59:30
  running and the the guy falls down and he gets back up and
• 59:33
  everybody cheers and says that's such a great guy, he's got all
• 59:36
  this potential keep running and they they cheer him all the way
• 59:39
  to the finish line, he said. Now let's take that same analogy
• 59:42
  and work it back to the the the race of life.
• 59:45
  Gun goes off, starts running, guy falls down, they make him go
• 59:49
  back to the starting line. And then he goes and starts
• 59:53
  running again and these trapdoors start opening up that
• 59:56
  he doesn't see. And each time he falls in the
• 59:58
  trapdoor he has to go back to the starting line.
• 1:00:00
  What you just said is exactly what Luis L Reid said is that if
• 1:00:05
  you wouldn't have done what you did Scott and been smart about
• 1:00:08
  it and get the information out and say tell me where it says
• 1:00:12
  this, that person just got walks away without three jobs that
• 1:00:16
  they could have had. And and that's the part of the.
• 1:00:19
  BOP. That scares me.
• 1:00:20
  Is Is. You don't know who's pulling the
• 1:00:22
  strings, who's saying no. Are they saying no just because
• 1:00:24
  they don't want to at that time being because they have some
• 1:00:26
  justification, but it's such a big deal because that's a life
• 1:00:29
  changing thing? Yeah, it's it's scary.
• 1:00:32
  It's scary how much? Power.
• 1:00:33
  They have all the entire BOP. And again, I won't get on my
• 1:00:36
  soapbox about this, but it's scary and you know this, this.
• 1:00:39
  They wield an inordinate about a power and I know society
• 1:00:43
  doesn't. I just thought, they don't care.
• 1:00:46
  They don't really know what's going on with all this.
• 1:00:48
  But if they did, if they even knew a shred without mismanaged
• 1:00:51
  and how corrupt and how unethical a lot of the stuff
• 1:00:54
  was, I think it would shock people.
• 1:00:56
  Yes, utterly well. I think what you just said
• 1:01:00
  shocked me, and I've been through the process.
• 1:01:03
  You know that that that story you just said as a guy that's
• 1:01:07
  gone through all of it shocked me.
• 1:01:10
  I mean those are all good legitimate jobs and you just got
• 1:01:14
  somebody said, yeah, I don't think so.
• 1:01:17
  I want you to go, you know, drive a bus, drive a school bus.
• 1:01:21
  You know, it's it's it's fascinating.
• 1:01:24
  But I think there's the more voices that are out there and
• 1:01:27
  you telling your story and and people listening to that it it
• 1:01:31
  it at least invites them to understand that there's some
• 1:01:35
  real hardships that happen because you know you've got a
• 1:01:38
  situation Scott, where and I, you know, and I did too.
• 1:01:43
  Where you have support for those who don't have support.
• 1:01:46
  When you have to check the box off that you're an ex felon when
• 1:01:48
  you're trying to get the job and then you got to tell a really
• 1:01:50
  good story to convince them to get past that or to go try to
• 1:01:55
  find a place to live and you got to check that box.
• 1:01:58
  They say we don't we don't rent the ex felons.
• 1:02:01
  Those are really tough things to get past that that you know you
• 1:02:05
  you you can see how it jumps up the recidivism rate with people
• 1:02:09
  that are really actually trying to make it work and then they're
• 1:02:13
  getting hit right in the face and and you're living it right
• 1:02:16
  now. I mean I I I've been excited to
• 1:02:19
  talk to you on this interview because you're everything's so
• 1:02:22
  fresh. You just got out of the halfway
• 1:02:24
  house. You just went through that with
• 1:02:25
  the case manager. You just had to go to battle for
• 1:02:28
  yourself. So where you are now are you?
• 1:02:32
  Are you, I think, are you doing all three of those jobs or what
• 1:02:36
  did you end up doing? Yeah, I mean.
• 1:02:40
  Funny thing, I of course we, you and I know you don't get
• 1:02:45
  healthcare in prison. No, you do get healthcare, but
• 1:02:47
  you do not get healthcare. Might not want to try it, no
• 1:02:51
  hey, but I got a hernia the last.
• 1:02:53
  Three months in there and then I got an Abscess on my tooth.
• 1:02:57
  And again, if these things could have been fixed quickly.
• 1:03:00
  They might have been not became the problem as they are, but so
• 1:03:03
  I had to get that stuff worked on.
• 1:03:04
  So I had emergency surgery on my mouth the first day I was out of
• 1:03:08
  the halfway house and then I finally got to the doctor on the
• 1:03:11
  1st when my insurance kicked in. And so I'm dealing with that
• 1:03:15
  stuff, but. There is.
• 1:03:19
  All three of the jobs are in play now.
• 1:03:21
  I'm already doing some of them, but what I've been doing is I
• 1:03:25
  wanted to. I wanted to really tell my story
• 1:03:28
  as well as I could in addition to the newsletter.
• 1:03:31
  So I've actually been working on a website that I just finished.
• 1:03:33
  It's just Scotty carper.com and I'm really proud of it.
• 1:03:38
  And it's going to basically for the remainder of people that
• 1:03:41
  don't know about what happened to me, because there's still a
• 1:03:44
  decent amount of people, you know, I want to, I want to
• 1:03:47
  really tell my story and then give everybody everything they
• 1:03:50
  want to know about it. So I.
• 1:03:53
  I partitioned a lot of live time off on that and worrying about
• 1:03:56
  the health. So now the health on its way and
• 1:03:58
  that's done. Yes, I'm gonna be working the
• 1:04:00
  advertising agency. I'm gonna be donating as much
• 1:04:02
  time as I can to help people on this journey.
• 1:04:05
  You know, I do that a few hours minimum every day.
• 1:04:07
  Love it. I had a bunch of calls today
• 1:04:09
  working with people. I'm talking about RNAP, talking
• 1:04:11
  about the ways that I would navigate the system, and it's
• 1:04:14
  incredibly rewarding. I love.
• 1:04:16
  Love being able to help people that are going in terrifying
• 1:04:18
  well and and see the thing too Scott is is that you can be such
• 1:04:22
  a help to somebody. And for that to be denied that
• 1:04:25
  you shouldn't be able to talk to that person.
• 1:04:27
  When you're the person that needs to have your your seat at
• 1:04:29
  the table to actually help walk those people through.
• 1:04:32
  Because you just experienced it and you can help them.
• 1:04:35
  And there's some new things in place with the first step back
• 1:04:37
  and some other things that people need to know about.
• 1:04:39
  And attorneys don't really get that involved in it because once
• 1:04:42
  you are done with the plea or you're you've pled or you've
• 1:04:48
  you've been sentenced, you're the attorney part's done.
• 1:04:50
  When you start to stand at that gate and you enter that prison,
• 1:04:55
  there's a whole nother education that goes on and you can educate
• 1:04:58
  people because you can take some of that.
• 1:05:00
  And I always say, you know nothing is ever as bad as your
• 1:05:03
  mind makes it out to be, not even prison.
• 1:05:05
  But people need to be able to walk through those steps and
• 1:05:09
  understand that too. It's funny you said.
• 1:05:16
  What you just said because. I completely agree it's.
• 1:05:18
  It's it's on you to how you decide you want to deal with
• 1:05:22
  this but this journey. But if.
• 1:05:25
  You can advocate for people. I think you should take the
• 1:05:27
  chance and do that, because there's a lot of things you can
• 1:05:30
  do and educating people on how this system works and how it you
• 1:05:34
  can what you can do within it to make your life better, That's
• 1:05:37
  essential, Yep. So Scott, out of everything that
• 1:05:42
  we've talked about and all that you've gone through, what do you
• 1:05:45
  think's your biggest take away through all of it?
• 1:05:51
  Wow, I think. We underestimate how powerful
• 1:05:55
  people, how powerful. People and and their actions and
• 1:05:59
  what? They do can mean to our lives, I
• 1:06:01
  thought. I I absolutely blew with all my
• 1:06:04
  friends and family, I thought. This was.
• 1:06:07
  Unforgivable and. They're never going to forgive
• 1:06:09
  me. And that's a lot of why I wrote
• 1:06:11
  the newsletters I wanted. I had to start building a case
• 1:06:14
  for that. I was going to be honest and
• 1:06:15
  that I was going to tell my story from day-to-day, good or
• 1:06:18
  bad, because that's it's full of stupid things I did, full of
• 1:06:21
  mistakes, full of me getting kind of realizations of of the
• 1:06:25
  people I hurt and how. But I I just thought I I
• 1:06:29
  underestimated how incredibly amazing some of my friends and
• 1:06:32
  family are and the support they have.
• 1:06:34
  But also I think. I was scared of this opportunity
• 1:06:38
  that I was going to prison. Life's over.
• 1:06:41
  And then it snapped for me and I got to be honest with my friends
• 1:06:45
  in prison are the ones that really got me to see it this
• 1:06:47
  way. A guy named Jason Newling, Phil
• 1:06:49
  gets some other people that just have are are unbelievable human
• 1:06:54
  beings that I feel so grateful to have met.
• 1:06:56
  But you know I'll give you a good example.
• 1:06:58
  So I'm going to Fresno and I'm like, God, I do not want to go
• 1:07:01
  to Fresno. This is going to suck.
• 1:07:02
  My attorney actually told me to try and stay in prison.
• 1:07:06
  At the camp. But you can't do that if you're
• 1:07:07
  an art app. So I, you know, I'm complaining
• 1:07:10
  about it. And in a funny gesture, one of
• 1:07:12
  them says to me, oh, no, man, you got to go to Fresno and get
• 1:07:16
  the most gangster job you can. You can own it.
• 1:07:18
  Like, you've been owning this entire process.
• 1:07:20
  You got a terrible job at Leavenworth.
• 1:07:22
  You've been doing, helping people for free.
• 1:07:24
  You've been doing all these things that I can't believe
• 1:07:26
  you're doing. And now you're going to stop at
• 1:07:28
  Fresno. And so he was right.
• 1:07:30
  Like, you know, if you're going to do this.
• 1:07:33
  If you're gonna fail spectacularly, you might as well
• 1:07:36
  put a Sherry on top and I'm gonna do everything I can.
• 1:07:40
  To make this the greatest story of my life, love it.
• 1:07:42
  So if that means volunteering in a clown costume.
• 1:07:44
  Spinning, you know, tables, I will do that because that's a
• 1:07:48
  great story. So, you know, if my hernia
• 1:07:50
  hadn't happened, I would have got a job at 711 or or Costco
• 1:07:53
  or, you know, going door to door giving out leaflets.
• 1:07:56
  I would have done anything to make it a great story.
• 1:07:58
  And so that right there, if you're going in, find out what
• 1:08:01
  you're what you're, what you're feeling at.
• 1:08:03
  Figure out a successful plan and then own it.
• 1:08:06
  Like if you want to lose weight, lose weight.
• 1:08:07
  If you want to public speak public speak.
• 1:08:08
  If you want to be a leader, be a leader.
• 1:08:10
  But do that stuff. Because there's no better time
• 1:08:12
  than trying that in prison. Man, I love that.
• 1:08:15
  That's a good way to end it because that is exactly spot on.
• 1:08:19
  Scott Carper, good job. Hey, if anybody wants to get a
• 1:08:24
  hold of you, Scott, what's the best way to do that?
• 1:08:28
  Well, I again the. The website just launched.
• 1:08:30
  It's WWW. Scotty Scotty carper C arper.com
• 1:08:38
  Or you can just Google me. I'm everywhere and you know that
• 1:08:43
  that works that way. Love it.
• 1:08:44
  And if anybody wants to get a hold of me, go to
• 1:08:46
  brentcassidy.com. It's with Aty, not a DY.
• 1:08:50
  I would have liked to have been a Cassidy though, like a Sean or
• 1:08:53
  David when I was growing up. But it's always, it's always
• 1:08:55
  been spelled wrong. It's with Aty and leave me a
• 1:08:59
  message there, 'cause I I'd love to go back and forth and and and
• 1:09:02
  respond to questions and answers and do all that.
• 1:09:07
  If if you like the show, hit the follow button.
• 1:09:11
  Share, share it, share it. It's a big deal to share it.
• 1:09:14
  Scott gave some good stuff here today.
• 1:09:15
  Share this thing out. I'm loving everybody.
• 1:09:19
  I've gotten a surge of of new reviews on Apple and it's just
• 1:09:22
  pumping the volume on the show and I so appreciate everybody
• 1:09:26
  out there doing that, so. As I used to say when I was
• 1:09:31
  riding back and forth from Leavenworth, stay strong.
• 1:09:34
  I'll do this thing. And Scott Carper, thanks so much
• 1:09:38
  today for sharing your story. That was awesome.
• 1:09:40
  Thank you for having. Me, I'm your success in and out.