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Bright young things: three future leaders on what they want from the profession · Project Podcast

0:09
Welcome to the IPM podcast. Opium is a childhood body for
0:12
the project profession. My name is Emma divita and I'm
0:15
the editor of project apm's quarterly journal and your host.
0:19
Today, we're speaking to through the professions Bright Young,
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things who care, deeply about sustainability, tan cover, what
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are the younger Generations? Biggest concerns expectations
0:28
and hopes? What?
0:30
Do they want to older generations, to understand about
0:32
them? What is it about the project
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profession that motivates them so deeply and what can we learn
0:37
from them about new ways of working?
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So, the three talented people I have with me today are some of
0:42
those I met at the cover, shoot for projects, Autumn issue.
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When we featured, nine young people who are going places to
0:48
spill the beans on what makes our generation tick as a
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Generation X. ER, I was really impressed with
0:54
our sense of agency and enthusiasm, listen on to hear
0:57
how they feel, they are very much part of the solution.
1:00
Many of the problems we face in the environment society and
1:02
business today, you can't afford to not listen to them.
1:14
Thanks for joining us today. Why don't you tell us a bit
1:19
about yourselves? If we start with you, Stacey.
1:22
Hi. I'm Stacy Bishop.
1:24
I'm 26 years old, and I'm an international integration
1:28
project manager for SSE Renewables.
1:31
What does your job role? Encompass, what projects are you
1:34
working on right now? So I span across a few different
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projects, all of which are international.
1:41
But my main focus is to look at policies and procedures.
1:44
The all currently based in the UK and figure out how we can
1:48
make them applicable in country. So that could be Japan,
1:51
Netherlands. The u.s. multiple different
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areas but that's my main focus. Okay.
1:58
Thanks and Ashland. Tell us about yourself.
2:01
Hi, I'm Ashley and I didn't. I'm 26 years old and I'm a
2:05
project manager with talent and send in London, okay?
2:08
Any particular projects you're working on at the moment.
2:12
Yep. Currently working with Essex and
2:14
Suffolk water. So doing a kind of range, I'm an
2:19
engineering and Construction contract p.m.
2:22
Sunday, ccpm. So I work with them doing about
2:25
13 different projects. A range of essential water
2:27
infrastructure but also mainly on their ill, regs health
2:32
program, which is a program to help increase the biodiversity
2:35
net gain of rivers in Essex and Suffolk.
2:39
Okay, thanks and James. Yeah.
2:41
Hi. I'm changed the traco at my,
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background is in Renewable Energy, Engineering.
2:47
So, that's what I did. My master's degree in and now,
2:49
I'm an engineering project manager for a company called
2:52
core energy, who leads hydrogen storage in Europe.
2:57
I've been working for the last year, on a base funded project.
3:03
That's the Department of Business energy and Industrial
3:05
strategy on a new novel, green, hydrogen storage.
3:11
Ecology and working with a Consortium to deliver that
3:15
McKay's, thanks. I think the first thing I'd like
3:18
to ask you all as kind of I'm going to say that your hive High
3:22
Flyers in your 20s. I'm curious to find out what
3:26
Drew you all to project management Ashton.
3:29
What do you to project management?
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I think the first thing that you need to project management was
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just that, I always felt like a bit of an all-rounder, the whole
3:39
way through school and especially in engineering,
3:41
Degree. I picked a range of modules, you
3:44
know, that might not have made sense for a specific discipline,
3:47
but gave me a good overview of the whole process and things
3:50
that I enjoyed. So, you know, might've done
3:52
computer, aided design, and also, if they're move and, you
3:55
know, these ones that maybe don't go together in the most
3:58
coherent technical sense, but I just really like the overview of
4:02
the whole process. So, I think, for those who, you
4:06
know, all around us, who enjoy a bit of everything at school and
4:10
at Uni, I really like project management.
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And I also think it's a really good blend of Technical and soft
4:16
skills, so you get to look in on on the technical subjects, but
4:19
you also get to be, you know, involved in team leadership and
4:23
management which is also really. Yeah, feeling, I think What
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appeals to younger people about project management because I'm
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always impressed. I think of project managers as
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the people who actually get stuff done.
4:36
It is that part of the appeal for you to actually see things
4:41
happen because of, you know, past pot, your efforts on it.
4:46
Yeah, I think the appeal to me is kind of seeing things from a
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bird's-eye view. I mean, there's subject matter
4:54
Experts of Kind of every function that's in every world
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that alone. Just the kind of corporate world
5:00
that I work it in but it's being able to see all of that at the
5:04
same time and organize it in a way that you deliver what you
5:07
need to deliver. I think for younger people today
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and actually a large part of what I enjoy so much as well, is
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the pretty much unlimited choice of industries that you can work
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in. So for example, I moved from the
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defense industry to the Renewables interest industry
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which is something that I'm really passionate.
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About. But the possibilities are
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absolutely endless. Whether you want to work in food
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or fashion or engineering or construction.
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There's so many options that you don't actually have to choose
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until you choose, if that makes sense.
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So you really can move around and just keep learning, which is
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really appealing. How about you James?
5:46
What do you to project management?
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It is, I think it's I'm learning that there's quite a similar
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story here between between us young project managers.
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I always found that, you know, through gcses and you have to
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make decisions quite quite early on in life, as where you want
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to, where you want to go into and that really Narrows your
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sort of your horizon of where you want your career to end up.
6:13
And I found just keeping my options as wide open as I
6:16
possibly could was what brought me most satisfaction in
6:19
learning. And then again, as Ashton was
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saying at University, I found that I just wanted to do
6:26
everything. I want to learn as much as I
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could and have oversight of things and group projects are
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always most exciting for me. You'll kind of around the age of
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25 26. So you're actually I think
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you're the very tail end of the millennial generation perhaps
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even bordering on Jen said, so I have quite a big question to ask
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if you which because because there's been a lot written about
6:53
generation said, and younger Millennials about what matters
6:57
most you in your career. So it's a huge question but it'd
7:02
be great to have some insight into what Oops, each of you
7:06
thinks is the most important for you personally, Min, what you
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get from your career? Is there any one of you brave
7:16
enough to start on this? I can have a go.
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So for me, I think and how I align myself in my personality
7:26
and also my career, what I initially start thinking that a
7:29
career as a project as well, which is probably very
7:33
quintessential project management.
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But so, I just want to make the largest net positive impact on
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on lives, bit human or animal, and, and the environment as
7:47
possible. But while maintaining my own
7:50
well, being mentally and physically as so you can, you
7:55
can push it a little bit too far and focus too much, but you have
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to do something that will enable you to keep going on your
8:03
mission. Yeah, Funk fundamentally for me,
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that's kind of the meaning of life, and what?
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Just speaks to me as a person. So, and then there's also, you
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know, getting myself into the position where I can make the,
8:22
the largest impact that I can do in a, in a positive way.
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So that will include responsibility having, you know,
8:32
learning along the way, making good networks with people and
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That in my career is about people as well.
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I just love interacting with people, you know, and trying to
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use, you know, talking to people finding out the personalities.
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What people are good at is just, it's brings a lot of color and
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to working. And also just challenge is very
8:53
important as well. So finding the right mix of
8:56
security and chaos. Chaos being not, you do not
9:01
papers flying everywhere. But, you know, having having
9:05
change JH at a good at a good rate while maintaining a level
9:09
of security. I think is important for change
9:12
to happen in the first place. So you feel very much connected
9:16
to the larger issues of our days.
9:20
Because obviously obviously climate sustainability is
9:23
massive, is that something that is cool to you finding
9:29
satisfaction from your work? Yeah.
9:32
Yeah. 100%. I think, you know, there are
9:35
there Pillars of personality and pillars of happiness.
9:40
And one of those pillars of happiness is to to feel like
9:44
you're, you know, you've got a name and you have purpose and
9:49
that you can make a difference and based on your own morals and
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ethics, what a mind being sustainability and the
9:56
environment and the planet, and all of those that live there is
10:01
to assume prove that. So for me, you know, quite a
10:06
dilemma Choice of going into renewable energy and being an
10:09
engineer and then becoming a project manager in order.
10:12
In order to make that, to make that change happen.
10:17
Okay. Do you feel that you have a
10:18
sense of agency? Because there's a lot of
10:21
pessimism monks older generations, and the sense of
10:25
responsibility that work are kind of passing down to those
10:29
who have to help. Find a solution.
10:30
Do you feel optimistic? Do you feel empowered?
10:33
Do you feel listened to In there are some ways you can feel
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listened to, I suppose there's I don't I don't have a seat at the
10:43
Prime Minister table, but in my in my own company I think you
10:47
can after a while you can command a certain respect and
10:52
and therefore your listen to. So, I think in the work that I
10:57
do, I can if I believe that there's a positive net gain from
11:04
a certain decision. Then I feel like I I can make
11:07
that decision and happily justify it to the people that I
11:10
need to justify it to. And that I will be listened to
11:13
and that they have a certain level of trust that I've managed
11:16
to build up. But I mean, that's always a
11:19
challenge and joining a new workplace in having to prove
11:23
yourself enough that they'll listen to you.
11:24
And that comes with a certain amount of confidence and
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everybody has imposter syndrome. And that's just something that
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you have to work through and know in yourself that you have
11:35
the ability to make changes. Change in that decisions that
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you make will be well-founded based on your own, you know,
11:40
principles and expertise. And you mentioned happiness, and
11:44
well-being as well. So they're, they're, they're
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kind of things are important to you as well.
11:51
Absolutely. Yeah, I really try to combine
11:54
both my professional life and my personal life.
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I don't want there to be a difference between them really
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in that sort of, you know, I need to keep myself.
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You know, well-maintained, mentally and physically and also
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I like to, you know, put in the same effort as I do into my
12:14
projects and the other things that I care about.
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So, you know, I do, I do lots of psychological research, you
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know, on on what can make me function in the best possible
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way. So, you know, optimal morning
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routines levels of dopamine cortisol, adrenaline, and that
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I'd like to focus on On. So I can keep myself operating
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because if I if I'm you know low or I'm not doing things right,
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you know physiologically and you know neurologically then I'm not
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going to function well as a project manager and just just in
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my general life and with my friends, I just want to be
12:55
present and effective in everything.
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And a large part of that is acknowledging, that mental
13:01
health is important and physical.
13:03
Health is important. What, what do you think of
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work-life balance? Is that a term that you think of
13:09
as it gone beyond that? Yeah.
13:13
Work-life balance. I think work should almost be a
13:17
lifestyle that you're living rather than, you know, work
13:22
versus versus life. I think they should.
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I mean, if you have the ability to to make them one in the same,
13:29
as I sort of mentioned, yeah, it's really important and I
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think I think people are becoming more, you know, and
13:36
companies are becoming more aware of that as well, you know,
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in Powering empowering the person to, you know, they get
13:45
home from work and they feel like they've really contributed
13:48
or they've been listened to. And that's, that's just so
13:52
important for morale. And so important for your own
13:56
the employees Hannity. We just, you know, if you're if
14:01
you're in a renewable field or a field that's looking to better
14:04
things. Then you know, a large focus
14:07
should be on the people as well. The people that you interact
14:10
with and the people that work for you, That should be you know
14:14
if your if your moral compass is pointing in the right direction
14:17
and that should always be something that you're looking
14:19
into just the well-being of your employees.
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Okay? Great.
14:23
Thank you. I'm Stacey.
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Is that does anything what James has said resonate with you mean
14:29
what matters most you to you in your career?
14:34
To me, what matters? Most of my career is a sense of
14:38
purpose. I agree with James in the fact
14:41
that you need to be passionate about something to be able to be
14:44
effective and deliver on that and working in the Renewables
14:48
industry, I do feel like my contributions, making a
14:52
difference and no matter how big or small and without that I do
14:56
find out lose motivation relatively quickly.
15:00
I think there's almost a stigma among Just many generations of
15:05
not talking about money and salary, and that it almost
15:08
doesn't matter, and I disagree with that.
15:12
I think it really does matter especially in our current
15:15
economic situation and project management is a well-paid career
15:20
and I think people should know that to be honest for me as long
15:24
as I am enough to maintain my lifestyle then I'm happy, I'm
15:28
not going to chase something. I don't need but I think it's
15:30
good to acknowledge and let others know that.
15:33
Is well-paid career, and there is job security, which is very
15:38
important at the moment. I think on James is point with
15:42
work-life balance, I do disagree.
15:45
I keep my work life and personal life, very separate.
15:48
And for me, that works, I work from home.
15:51
I constantly work from home. So my office is in my loft, um,
15:55
and everything below the loft is nothing to do with work.
16:00
I am a different person inside and out of work.
16:02
And I think that, that's Okay, as long as you can manage that
16:06
my morals Etc. Obviously are the same.
16:11
My belief system is still the same but the way that I act at
16:15
work and the way I acted my personal life is completely
16:17
separate and I think that does work and do you feel listened to
16:23
do? You feel that you've got sense
16:24
of agency about? I mean, you've picked you worked
16:28
in defense, you've moved over to Renewables, you'll see care,
16:30
deeply about the Environment or bigger issues.
16:35
But do you feel as though you are being listened to and that
16:37
you can make a change for the better?
16:41
Yeah, I think there's a difference in being listened to
16:44
as a generation and being listened to as a person as a
16:48
person. I think I am Listen to I've
16:52
built up confidence in my ability.
16:55
In the workspace that says, I know what I'm doing and
16:59
therefore, there's a trust within me and my team that I
17:04
know I'm talking about and I can deliver on what I'm telling them
17:07
that I can deliver. So, in that sense, I do feel My
17:11
ideas are taken on board and we can work with them.
17:14
Not all of them of course, but that's absolutely fine.
17:16
That's never going to happen but we can work on them because
17:20
chapter feedback Etc. And I think that really works as
17:22
a generation. I think it's different in that
17:26
there's different responses. One of the biggest issues for
17:29
this generation. I'm actually part of gen Z but I
17:32
like the year that it changed. So maybe a gen zhenya like that.
17:39
But I think There's a difference in who's listening?
17:43
I think there's a certain guilt for all the generations that
17:46
this has been passed down to the younger generations.
17:49
And I think there's also part of those older Generations that,
17:55
you know, counsels kind of like the woke culture in inverted
17:59
inverted commas. So I think there's a constant
18:03
battle to make sure that we listen to and respected in that
18:09
this generation. As you know, pursuing careers
18:12
around the subject of kind of climate change and
18:16
sustainability, and we do that research, we have that
18:21
experience and we do know what we're talking about and kind of
18:24
proving that and making ourselves hard is is a constant
18:27
challenge, but I think it's worth it.
18:30
If if we can convince a few people that it's real and that
18:34
we can do something about it individually, I think it's
18:36
definitely worth it. Do you feel is there ageism
18:39
against younger people? Do you feel as though it's
18:42
harder to be taken seriously, because you're younger.
18:47
I've had experiences of both, I think there is a certain stigma
18:53
around specifically. I didn't go to university.
18:56
So I've been in the workforce since the age of 18 and at that
19:02
age, yes, it's very hard to be taken seriously.
19:06
Now, that I've kind of grown, I mean going to 26 but growing
19:10
some fun and kind of work my way up and built that trust.
19:15
It's easy. ER, to be heard and it's easier
19:17
to be taken seriously and have those conversations, but I
19:21
definitely think there's a stigma around younger people
19:25
being assumed that they don't know what they're talking about.
19:27
Were, in fact, a lot of the time we do, Okay, that's interesting.
19:34
Ashton. What would you agree with
19:36
anything today? So James has said we're in what
19:38
matters most to you and your career.
19:41
Yeah, no. I completely agree with Stacey
19:44
and that, you know, purpose, super, super important.
19:47
Like, you know, you have to enjoy what you do in order to,
19:52
you know, put, you know, be the best the best employee you can
19:54
be. I think what I really enjoy
19:56
about project management is the sense of autonomy so much.
20:01
You know, how much kind of responsibility you're given
20:03
even, you know, as a graduate scheme that you're on The
20:05
Graduate scheme that I was just on.
20:07
There was a lot of autonomy which I really enjoyed but also
20:11
Yeah, this continuous self-improvement.
20:13
So the more experience you get, you know, more different
20:16
projects. You can do the more you learn.
20:18
And that's really important to me, you know, as for money like
20:24
a course, of course, money is important to our generation, you
20:27
know, we faced multiple financial crisis and our lives
20:29
and pressed into the vents and all this kind of stuff and to
20:33
continue to live and work. You know, money is important as
20:36
a driving Factor, but I think, you know, we might not be yours.
20:41
Successful as our parents as a result but I don't think that's
20:43
a driving factor for me. I think it's just as long as I
20:47
can continue to. Yeah, live and work.
20:50
If I am, then that's fine. I think the thing that really
20:54
matters to me is kind of the longevity of projects.
20:57
I mean, I'm biased here. I work in infrastructure but you
21:00
know, being able to walk past something and say, you know, I
21:02
was a part of that, you know, being able to say, all that's on
21:06
that. That's, you know, that's, that's
21:08
really important to me. So, I think James said it best
21:13
in times of Challenge and security.
21:14
You want a good balance of, you know, being able to feel secure
21:18
in a job. But also, yeah, continually
21:20
self-improving and do you feel as though you, you have a sense
21:25
of agency that you feel empowered and that your listen
21:29
to when it comes to the kind of bigger issues of the faces right
21:33
now? Yeah, I do I think, I think
21:37
delivery PMS have a kind of a difficult, you know, Ridin that
21:41
in terms of sustainability because, you know, you can only
21:46
really put into place what the current structure stands there
21:51
at the moment. So obviously, when it comes to a
21:53
new funding cycle for your client, for example, or a new
21:56
program set up, you can do quite a lot of work in terms of
21:59
sustainability, governments for the delivery of that set of
22:02
works. But actually when you're in the
22:04
cycle in the funding cycle, delivering those projects, if
22:07
those standards and specs and governance aren't sort of Down.
22:12
It's quite hard to make a difference as a delivery p.m.
22:15
So I think I think that the work that we can definitely do is
22:20
delivery PM's is you know, advising our clients.
22:23
When it comes to the new cycle, what we could do better and then
22:26
when that you Cycles in place, you know when you've got for
22:29
example, sustainable procurement targets to me when you've got
22:33
you know, a kpi is that you're monitoring contact us to, you
22:37
know, in terms of sustainable performance, making sure that we
22:39
hit those to the Out of our ability as is definitely way
22:42
that delivery PM's can make a difference.
22:44
But I think I think there's an interesting thing in that, you
22:47
know, people at top want to want to, listen to people who are
22:49
passionate about stuff at this. But there's a limited function
22:52
in which that happens. I also think sustainability is
22:55
one of those really tough ones that not a lot of clients have a
22:58
lot of buy into and as a result you know they need the
23:01
regulation to do that. So I think where I struggle to
23:06
feel heard is by perhaps you know governments or people
23:10
making regulations Allows us to do this allows us to deliver in
23:15
that way. If any of you found a way to go
23:20
beyond the 9 to 5 with an initiative beyond your actual
23:24
day job when it comes to sustainability or doing things
23:27
differently and actually been able to make a success of it
23:31
will be listened to as that does that.
23:33
Apply to any of you? Not necessarily outside of my
23:38
day job, but I do outside of my client work which is, you know,
23:43
95 5 days a week. I'm really trying to push Stuff
23:47
like internal training, internal awareness training.
23:51
There's a range of courses that, you know, project managers could
23:54
be more aware of stuff, like, sequels stuff, like, you know,
23:59
just the basics of scope one, two and three because I think
24:03
that knowledge is the best way to drive awareness within
24:07
clients, you know, being like, Oh, we offer this or this
24:11
Services out there or this tool is out there.
24:14
So trying to drive internal Learning and Development.
24:17
Mint is something that I'm doing and also trying to look at sort
24:20
of maturity of big players in the space on their
24:25
sustainability and how we can advise on that.
24:28
So it's kind of an extracurricular as you like it,
24:31
but it's not technically outside of my 95.
24:33
But yeah, I think education on that's really important but you
24:37
feel you can be proactive on something and actually get
24:41
something done about it. Yeah, for sure, I think.
24:45
Yeah. In terms of educating Project
24:48
managers of all levels and sustainability, that's something
24:50
we can definitely achieve. Jesus, the other two of you want
24:55
to add anything or yeah, I've got one from completely outside
25:01
by 95. Really, in my personal life.
25:05
I'm actually vegan and as, as my partner as, as my mom now, but
25:12
kind of showing people that, you know, the impact of not
25:17
necessarily going vegan. I don't kind of impose on other
25:20
people's lives. It doesn't, you know, doesn't
25:22
matter what people? it's completely preference, but
25:25
showing people the impact of maybe a meat-free Monday or, you
25:30
know, Taco Tuesday with With like, mushroom, instead of
25:35
normal men's showing people that they can, they can make small
25:40
changes in their personal lives. That make a huge impact.
25:43
Not necessarily just for Animal Welfare, but for the environment
25:47
as well, the impact on the environment of my enemy is, is
25:50
unbelievable, as well as not consuming Dairy.
25:53
So, I think without preaching in my personal life, I just try and
25:59
make it known, and I often cook for people to show them that.
26:03
It can be delicious and it doesn't have to be, you know, a
26:06
stab of meat on the plate with mashed potato or whatever.
26:10
It can be, it could be something more adventurous without harming
26:15
animals in any way. And also at the same time,
26:18
helping the planet, It's kind of a big question, but you work
26:24
with others Generations. I'm assuming on your projects
26:28
and within the organization, what I wanted to ask the three
26:32
of you would be. Can you identify any ways that
26:35
you see your generation doing things differently?
26:38
When it comes to work? Then older Generations do?
26:42
And if so what they are and also, if there's anything you'd
26:46
like the older generations of managers and leaders to
26:50
understand, And about those newer entrance to the
26:55
profession. What would that be?
26:59
I feel like this generation takes the saying, work smarter
27:02
not harder, quite literally, and it's not a bad thing.
27:07
I think it's a really good thing.
27:08
I've seen peers use technology to automate processes to make
27:13
systems more efficient and, you know, stop wasting time on
27:17
Monday night, ivities that you know take up.
27:21
Most of the Working Day, although it's not specifically
27:25
generational generational and in my experience, there are other
27:29
Generations that are more than willing to learn how to utilize
27:32
that technology to make their lives easier.
27:36
But that push I've seen often stems from kind of gen Z and
27:40
Millennials as for Noticing or getting the older generation to
27:49
bring in the younger generation and work with them.
27:52
I think talking is so important and being able to actively
27:57
listen to what, you know, new hires or younger Generations are
28:03
saying whether that's changes to how the corporate structure is,
28:09
or whether something's not quite working from them from a work
28:11
life perspective. Or they need something else in
28:17
their career to give them that sense of purpose and to give
28:20
them that drive and motivation. I think all of that comes from
28:24
active listening listening and the visibility of kind of
28:29
directors, CEOs, Etc, and availability of that
28:34
availability of those conversations is really
28:35
important. Can you give any plastic
28:38
practical examples of specific things that enable you to have a
28:42
conversation with those? More experience with you know
28:45
work do you do mentoring or reverse mentoring or anything
28:49
that works that others could use perhaps in their jobs.
28:54
Yeah, there's a few different ways.
28:56
There is a mentoring scheme at SSA and I really believe in
29:00
mentoring where it's so rewarding because not only can
29:04
you help others kind of find their path and teach them new
29:06
things but you can learn a lot of new things about yourself and
29:11
that's kind of mentoring and reverse mentoring all-in-one,
29:16
and whether it's, you know, finding out that your preference
29:18
of leadership style or something that you don't know about the
29:20
industry that you're in every day is a learning day, and I
29:22
think that's really important. Not only that there's and I'm
29:27
sure many corporations do this, but kind of all employee calls
29:33
where there's our visibility of senior leadership and
29:37
availability of submit questions and things like that.
29:39
I think that does work as well and to be honest from my
29:43
perspective I wouldn't really have an issue putting or trying
29:47
to find a slot for a meeting with someone on a director level
29:50
to chat with them about something that I think is
29:53
important. Me and should be important to
29:55
them as well and I think that approachability is really
30:00
impactful and has the pandemic affected.
30:03
Things has it made things more democratic, because by Nature
30:07
video calls, everyone is given equal space and everyone can see
30:11
everyone else. And perhaps, you'll meeting
30:13
people online that you would never have had in a meeting
30:16
face-to-face. Yeah, I absolutely agree really
30:20
with what you've just said. I think. the the impact of covid
30:26
and working from home, is that you're seeing everyone in the
30:29
house, whether they've got a blood background or a green
30:32
screen, or you know, someone's dog will jump on the camera or
30:36
Someone's Child will come and sit on their lap or someone's
30:38
doorbell will go and I think it just reminds you that the people
30:42
on your screen are people, whether they're, you know, five
30:46
corporate levels of blood above you or below you the their
30:50
people and their opinion matters if it matters to And then it
30:55
should be discussed if they want to raise it but I think.
30:59
Yeah. I think having that visibility
31:03
and having different people on your screen then you would have
31:04
in the room. You may be based halfway across
31:07
the world but you have that opportunity to talk to someone
31:10
that you wouldn't have had before and that's not minimizing
31:14
the negative impacts of working from home and covid of course,
31:18
but I think that's that's one of the few positive ones.
31:24
Mmm. Okay.
31:25
I shouldn't say anything. You want to talk about when it
31:28
comes to how your generation does things differently?
31:33
Yeah. It's also I think the big one
31:35
for me is that most gendered, I think technically, I'm a young
31:39
Millennial, but, you know, that sort of young Millennial, Jen
31:44
said, generation overwhelmingly, believe in climate change and
31:48
also more than that, something like 75% overwhelmingly believe
31:52
in climate. Engine and another 50% off at
31:56
75% think that we can't, you know, stop it, but we can do
32:00
something to mitigate it. So I think the fact that we take
32:03
it as a fact as a sort of undisputable fact, you know, we
32:09
want to do something about it, we have the energy to do stuff
32:11
about it is really positive, you know, and people who want to
32:17
sort of manage and Lead gen said, you need to harness that I
32:21
think the best way to harness that kind of energy is Is no
32:24
support our passion, you know, in these initiatives and the
32:28
best way to do that I found is you know act as a sponsor to
32:31
these groups maybe even if you don't understand it to the same
32:35
degree. Like I've been incredibly lucky
32:36
and have done a couple of years and corporate sustainability to
32:40
have a wealth of understanding. But you know even if you don't
32:43
understand it to the same degree, I think giving kind of
32:45
clear useful, deliverables and time scale stuff.
32:48
That's going to benefit. You know, how do you want what
32:52
this energy that we You know what format do you want to earn?
32:55
And what do you want us to do with it and then sponsoring and
32:59
supporting that energy? Because you know, we all have
33:03
that we have a time and energy to run with it.
33:04
So, so that's I think the big thing for that but I also think
33:08
in terms of the sort of Our Generation with the most
33:11
interconnected generation. But also we had the pandemic
33:16
where, I think a lot of people felt incredibly isolated.
33:19
So, I think, what's great about the new way of working is that
33:22
we've got this combination of working from home coming into
33:27
the office. And then, you know, a couple of
33:30
my colleagues are really happy to be back, full-time office
33:32
work. And as a result, you know, I
33:36
think we're very social generation and the combination
33:39
of being able to meet, you know, perhaps senior directors via for
33:44
these coffee connects. I think we do at work, you know,
33:46
even if it's 15 minutes, five teams or 15 minutes in the
33:49
office to get that visibility and to get that.
33:53
Of understanding of how they got to where they are.
33:55
And, you know, do they have you know, an interesting you is
34:00
really important as well. So I think that's something
34:02
we're trying to bring back. I know that there's there's
34:07
working from home, life is really great.
34:08
But I also think that for people who've been in, you know, you
34:10
New York school for the last couple of years who pretty much
34:13
work from home. The whole time, there is an
34:15
appetite to get back into the office when I would like to do
34:17
stuff in person again. Yeah.
34:20
So people people want to be sociable.
34:22
They do. Yeah.
34:23
Yeah, I think that that should be supported, you know, great
34:26
for team building and, you know, networking and stuff like that.
34:29
So our older managers and leaders good at knowing what to
34:34
do with your energy. No, kind of sense of urgency
34:36
about the climate and they are they good at knowing what to do
34:40
about that? How to use that effectively?
34:42
Or could they do it better? I think the big thing is that I
34:46
often find, I have a lot of ideas, but there's not a lot of,
34:52
you know, I We need specific kind of deliverables and
34:55
outputs. Like how is this idea useful to
34:58
you guys? How is it that I can put this
35:01
energy in this idea into something?
35:02
That's a useful PowerPoint, that's not just going to get
35:06
stuffed away and never looked at again, you know what I mean?
35:08
What's it, what's something that I can put my energy and that's
35:11
actually going to make a difference.
35:12
So I think having that kind of vision that roadmap planning to
35:16
2025 or, you know, further, okay?
35:20
This is what we want to achieve this percentage trained in this.
35:23
Example or or you know this amount of new hires with this
35:28
specialism or whatever if that's what you're trying to achieve
35:31
and you know you can translate that into something that you
35:34
know I'm passionate about as well.
35:36
Then we're happy, you know, to work towards that but I think
35:39
it's just I think I exactly as a young professional with a lot of
35:43
energy just needs kind of Direction.
35:44
Clear timelines and a sponsorship.
35:47
The Division. I think I'm very lucky that
35:49
where I work. I was a lot of vision so it's
35:52
given that but yeah. That's the main thing.
35:54
It's just how can we direct our focus into something that is
35:57
actually useful to society? Wider as well?
36:02
Okay. Brilliant and James.
36:04
What? I mean how do you feel your your
36:06
generation does things differently?
36:08
Would you agree? We'll station at Ashland have
36:10
said, would you like to know about what would you like her
36:14
managers and leaders who are older than you to know about
36:16
what your generation wants or needs some wore off?
36:21
Yeah, yeah, I completely agree with Stacey and Ashton.
36:25
I think they make great points. Yeah, I think I think we are
36:28
going further away from you. No more centralized Power
36:35
Systems and, you know, the sort of management methodologies and
36:40
work, it's actually a fresh out of the APM textbook.
36:43
There's a, there's an example of a theory by Douglas McGregor.
36:48
It's Theory. X and Theory Y.
36:52
And their motivational theories and Theory X talks about
36:56
managers motivating, their employees by supervision and,
37:01
you know, people don't actually intrinsically your enjoy work.
37:04
So then they must be supervised, where Theory, Y stresses reward
37:10
and recognition for employees empowering them to have a voice,
37:14
and a seat at the table. And the theory is such that the
37:19
employee does want to work and that they will.
37:21
I'll work. If, you know, then they're not
37:23
being strictly supervised, big brother asked.
37:26
And I think, I think partly the pandemic is helped in showing
37:29
that, you know, if people do work from home, then then they
37:33
are, they can be effective. And to make that that right, you
37:37
need to have communication, you know, you have to have, you
37:42
know, updates on how the individual is doing to achieve
37:46
their clearly defined, you know, goals aims and objectives.
37:51
If as as Ashley was saying as well.
37:55
So I think I think that's something that's happening.
37:57
A little bit more and it's not just the pandemic, it's the slow
38:00
moving towards empowerment of the people and against this sort
38:04
of sort of Rusty, generic capitalist structure.
38:10
So. And I think the more, the more
38:12
companies can move into that and just make sure that their
38:15
employees have morale and perhaps, you know, asking, you
38:19
know, Anonymous surveys which Which they have at my work as
38:22
well. So ask, what could we be doing?
38:25
Better is is good, you know, my company also has good and they
38:30
do, they do sort of mental health settlement seminars we
38:33
have access to counselors if we need them and I think that's
38:39
that's really fantastic. And again we've talked about
38:42
mental health in this this conversation earlier, but it's
38:45
really just being being open, open with that kind of thing.
38:48
You know, letting people Express Themselves being listened to,
38:54
you know, you know, movements with sexism racism and all of
38:59
this stuff we're slowly becoming more left as Generations.
39:02
Go on and and I think that's that's brilliant and it's a good
39:07
age to get into into the industry.
39:10
If I could text me on to the end of that, I completely agree with
39:13
James. I think something that's really
39:15
powerful that we should utilize more, especially in some of the
39:18
corporate world is reverse mentoring.
39:20
So, Obviously having, you know, mentoring is really important,
39:25
just from those martinis. There's my junior in terms of,
39:28
you know, drive and focus and interest in them, but I also
39:30
think as a generation, we are particularly up to speed with,
39:35
you know, diversity is very important to us.
39:37
Sustainability is very important to us.
39:39
Mental health is incredibly important to us and thanks to
39:42
the internet. You know, we have grown up
39:44
listening to people's experiences and listening to
39:46
people's stories and you know, that's something that that is,
39:51
you know, the The children who grow up with internet.
39:53
How about, you know, very much other skill of theirs and I
39:57
reverse mentoring, you can start to educate those in.
40:00
You know, perhaps people have seen your experience who
40:04
haven't, you know, heard those experiences or have the same
40:08
opinion. So I think, I think diversity
40:11
and mental health and sustainability are increasing
40:14
things that people look for. When they comment entry jobs,
40:16
you know, does this company have a commitment to diversity?
40:19
Does this company have a commitment to you?
40:21
No environmental sustainability and I think that, you know, they
40:25
could really learn a lot from what's important to us and
40:28
therefore it's important to I think, you know, the growing
40:30
Market in general and as so I suppose it goes again for you
40:35
know if you do want to suggest something to management it's not
40:38
to wait until you have the you know you'll offered the
40:41
opportunity to do it on a plate. And I think I think all managers
40:45
would would welcome any good manager and good CEO would
40:48
welcome you to put together a piece of Thing that you would
40:52
like to do to benefit the company concise, you know,
40:55
almost like an executive summary that you can quickly, present an
40:59
elevator pitch for an idea that you have.
41:01
I just say again initiative. If you've got that energy, put
41:04
it into something, create create yourself, you know, something
41:08
that you can take to somebody rather than waiting for the
41:11
opportunity. Because I think I think that
41:13
happens perhaps too much. We're nearly out of time and I
41:16
just wanted to thank you and if your time and your energy but
41:20
also if your honesty The and for sharing your perspective,
41:24
there's much food for thought and I very much hope that this
41:30
will give others within your own generation.
41:35
The ability to, to see just how important it is the work that
41:40
you do. And I'm just bowled over by your
41:43
sense of purpose and not being crushed.
41:47
Hi kind of pessimism which I wouldn't blame that.
41:50
You would have And thanks again for your practical suggestions
41:56
as well. So it's really appreciated.
41:58
Hope you've enjoyed it. Yes, been great.
42:01
Thank you, Emma. Thanks, Emma.
42:02
Thank you for having me. Thanks again to Stacy Ashlyn,
42:07
and James for joining us and to you for listening to this
42:10
episode of the OPM podcast, you can find out more about the nine
42:14
young leaders project featured in the Autumn issue by going to
42:17
AP, m dot org. Dot U k-- / project Don't forget
42:21
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