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From Skype to Delivery Robots · EU-Startups Podcast

• 0:00
  Speaker 0: You are now listening
• 0:01
  Speaker 1: to the EU startups podcast.
• 0:13
  Speaker 0: And welcome, To another episode of The EU Starbs Podcast.
• 0:16
  Speaker 0: as always I'm your host Dave Sanongarcia, news editor here at Eustarbs Today i chatted with Ati Heinle.
• 0:24
  Speaker 0: He's CEO and co-founder of the autonomous robot delivery company Starship Technologies.
• 0:30
  Speaker 0: Starship is found in Estonia In twenty fourteen And im sure if you haven't seen their little robots buzzing around You've probably see on social media They're quite a phenomenon Now, Atee's also known for his involvement with Skype which I don't have to explain what Skype is.
• 0:46
  Speaker 0: I'm sure its impact it had on the early days of digital communication.
• 0:51
  Speaker 0: Ateee and i chatted over the delivery robots' impact on the wider delivery ecosystem –the way that they've been implemented not only in Europe but US–and environmental impacts if any.
• 1:05
  Speaker 0: It was quite an interesting conversation quite willing to chat over the intricacies, over the company and technology.
• 1:13
  Speaker 0: And where he hopes to see cities and robots coinciding together in the future.
• 1:20
  Speaker 0: so I hope you're looking forward that.
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• 2:38
  Speaker 0: Hello, Atee and welcome to the You Startups podcast as a pleasure to have you on.
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: Thank you for having me here.
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: I think this will be an interesting episode for everybody.
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: Right, okay.
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: So I am building Starship Technologies which is automating logistics, automatic transport in the world.
• 3:11
  Speaker 1: We are creating this sort of future that you see in science fiction movies where You don't really see The delivery guys knocking on your door and seeing things flying to you Or things created out of thin air Things moving automatically.
• 3:24
  Speaker 1: That's what we're doing.
• 3:25
  Speaker 1: There were other people like Waymov for example Automating the movement of people.
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: We are automating the movement of staff.
• 3:34
  Speaker 1: So we do food and grocery delivery to people's doorsteps, I think they're the largest company in this world by far number one.
• 3:47
  Speaker 1: In fact you know like i mentioned Waymoe ,we have about as many robots driving around as Waymo has cars that we've done a similar number of miles more than nine ten million deliveries.
• 4:00
  Speaker 1: So we have lots of experience in this.
• 4:03
  Speaker 1: And, uh... In terms what I did before my background is software engineering.
• 4:09
  Speaker 1: My mother taught me how to program computers and i was on the founding team of Skype and a few other startups as well.
• 4:15
  Speaker 1: so I'm not already a revolution or helped do a revolution in one industry which is telecom now doing the same transportation.
• 4:23
  Speaker 0: Great!
• 4:24
  Speaker 0: Right.
• 4:26
  Speaker 0: It's an impactful portfolio, let me tell you just with that I think it's interesting enough if you hadn't done anything else.
• 4:33
  Speaker 0: but of course we're here to talk about Starship today and i am very interested before.
• 4:38
  Speaker 0: again to the company itself uh... And you briefly mentioned this how start as a programming As a programmer at an early age?
• 4:47
  Speaker 0: I saw somewhere where your first program is aged ten I think if i saw that right, which is impressive in of itself.
• 4:56
  Speaker 0: And uh...I've read about your video game development time as well!
• 5:00
  Speaker 0: I even found a playable version of Cosmonaut online Which actually had a lot of fun with it.
• 5:07
  Speaker 0: It was surprising because it reminded me of a mobile game You know?
• 5:10
  Speaker 0: It reminded me what's so popular now That you could just get on your phone and you know A flappy bird or all these things Even have this kind element where you can spend hours into it.
• 5:21
  Speaker 0: So it's really, quite interesting.
• 5:24
  Speaker 0: With your background on this I just kind of want to hear about what pulled you first into the realm of programming computer program and what kept you interested in?
• 5:35
  Speaker 1: Right so i definitely had a sort of technology interest from early age.
• 5:46
  Speaker 1: It was curious how machines work attention how to build machines and i grew up in the family of software developers.
• 5:54
  Speaker 1: so my parents for both computer programmers they met at work place.
• 6:01
  Speaker 1: So this sort of topic was, you know sometimes my parents worked on these computers that were filling a whole room And the time of these computers was really precious.
• 6:18
  Speaker 1: So sometimes they had, you know... These computer were booked like.
• 6:22
  Speaker 1: I'm not sure it was in twenty-four or seven but uh But sometimes they needed to have evenings In at the workplace and You know They collected me from kindergarten and then It took me too To their work and they were working and i Was playing around with punch cards.
• 6:38
  Speaker 1: and Then I grew up among this noises Of these taped horizons just quietly spinning and you know air conditioned rooms all of this stuff.
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: And my first interest actually as a child in terms of technology was electronics.
• 6:59
  Speaker 1: but I was reading a few books on it, i don't think I was actually good at using anything with my hands really.
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: But then when at some point when I was ten years old came home one day and said hey after you know, i'll teach something new.
• 7:19
  Speaker 1: I've taught you some of the basics for programming And it looked like that I'm a pretty good learner or pretty quick learner.
• 7:29
  Speaker 1: so actually learned some basic very quickly and I became hooked instantly because...I had been reading electronics books but then It's somewhat hard, I mean you have all of these physical skills.
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: You need to have this sort of mental engineering skills or be able understand how transistors and capacitors work at the same time being good that actually soldering things together.
• 8:04
  Speaker 1: it was high bar for like an eight year old me.
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: but the software development... The physical machines are already built.
• 8:14
  Speaker 1: I needed to just have something in my mind, to imagine how this program would work and put that on paper.
• 8:20
  Speaker 1: In the language a computer wouldn't understand.
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: but it kind of felt like wow!
• 8:24
  Speaker 1: It became so powerful...I could make the computer do lots of different things.
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: And yeah i became hooked instantly started using my imagination Kind of programs I could write what kind of things.
• 8:46
  Speaker 1: I would do.
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: So that's what threw me into it.
• 8:51
  Speaker 0: And then well, and I guess we're all indebted really to your parents.
• 8:55
  Speaker 0: Then because you know then along comes your involvement with Skype?
• 8:59
  Speaker 0: If i think back To my childhood skype was probably the first tech company I knew about.
• 9:04
  Speaker 0: That wasn't American It was just so global, and everybody used it.
• 9:11
  Speaker 0: I was raised in the States but all my family is in Spain And i remember using Skype to be able talk with them.
• 9:16
  Speaker 0: That's kind of new at that time for me.
• 9:21
  Speaker 0: Nobody really had to teach how to install on their computer.
• 9:23
  Speaker 0: But then when we finally got it, you know, they were able create a dialogue.
• 9:27
  Speaker 0: So I think Skype isn't everyone early life easily because it really was a first tech company that was pushing something forward and It wasn't American, which I think came as a surprise to probably many people.
• 9:40
  Speaker 0: So you know speaking on Skype?
• 9:42
  Speaker 0: Uh i just kind of want to hear cuz eventually You move on from skype.
• 9:45
  Speaker 0: We go into starship.
• 9:46
  Speaker 0: What lessons did you bring from your experience in developing skype Into the company that you're running now?
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: uh-huh so Skype was actually a company, even though it became global success very quickly.
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: And when we actually started.
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: this is what's really odd to a lot of people like are you're going to be our people?
• 10:09
  Speaker 1: Are people really going to talking through each other via their computers?
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: Computers I mean that's not used for talking with each other.
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: also phones already exist.
• 10:23
  Speaker 1: What problem are you solving?
• 10:24
  Speaker 1: the phone already exists.
• 10:26
  Speaker 1: Secondly, back then most computers.
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: This was a long time ago right?
• 10:32
  Speaker 1: It's more than twenty years ago.
• 10:34
  Speaker 1: Back in the most computers were desktop computers.
• 10:38
  Speaker 1: Desktop computers typically did not have microphones.
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: So wait a minute.
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: Computers don't have microphones.
• 10:45
  Speaker 1: How could this become big?
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: I mean luckily.
• 10:50
  Speaker 1: first the laptop revolution just started approximately at the same time and laptops had microphones built in.
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: So that was one thing, secondly also people with desktops went out and bought headsets to be able use Skype right?
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: And long range calls were quite expensive.
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: they were metered by the minutes or second when you give something for free paying for, and it was actually also a product that you couldn't use alone.
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: When he became the Skype user... You needed to go out and seek your friends who would want to talk too!
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: If in US you're going seeking out relatives or friends in Spain.
• 11:46
  Speaker 1: so far So these things helped do popularity of Skype.
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: It really took off.
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: We really did it pretty well.
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: I think we were also very lucky in that other people could have done a similar thing and ended up doing this, which is also the reason why there are loads of competition lots of time later.
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: when Covid happened then it was actually Zoom who got the big boost I think from COVID and not Skype.
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: And you know, Skype is no more.
• 12:29
  Speaker 1: Microsoft decided to shut it down so not because It wasn't popular.
• 12:36
  Speaker 1: I think Microsoft certainly could have done also a better job in growing Skype.
• 12:42
  Speaker 1: but what am i going to tell?
• 12:45
  Speaker 1: I only spent five years in Skype, five-and-a-half years in skype.
• 12:51
  Speaker 1: fifteen or twenty years was without me where other people were doing things, easy to criticize from the side.
• 12:57
  Speaker 0: Right right well that's interesting really and like you're saying I mean it does feel even what we are now speaking remotely through Riverside and everything Skype set groundwork for this in a sense of normalizing what it could be, and making that work.
• 13:16
  Speaker 0: And then of course COVID happens in other companies taking forward but I think the legacy cemented there's no doubt about it.
• 13:23
  Speaker 0: um so you've spoken here about kind of identifying why it worked and why people were looking for us?
• 13:30
  Speaker 0: So then What was that like in Starship?
• 13:33
  Speaker 0: at what point Was their realization That You said There is a gap Here!
• 13:37
  Speaker 0: There something thats missing and i can do It.
• 13:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that realization was very much in the beginning because I think people's point is we just realized hey!
• 13:52
  Speaker 1: We can do this.
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: Hey it is possible to automate deliveries and transport of stuff into the world.
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: It is possible create a science fiction future where things are moving by themselves whenever you want more efficiency than with people.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: I think it has been in the minds of people for a very long time.
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: It's been in their imagination that something will happen sometime in the future.
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: People probably think this is happening in twenty or fifty years, and so on... This actually happens right now but people have had these dreams for a really long time.
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: In fact transportation particularly lost my delivery.
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: you could argue it's actually the last industry in the world where it is not automated.
• 14:49
  Speaker 1: Like, most other things... You don't really get one person doing some job just for you!
• 15:04
  Speaker 1: There used to be lumberjacks cutting down trees for example And now there's somebody driving a harvester with it, riding the machine which does this job much more quickly and so forth.
• 15:15
  Speaker 1: But they're still of course their overseeing things and so far.
• 15:19
  Speaker 1: but in delivery is one person carrying your burger... It usually not one person sitting behind like a stream overseeing a fleet of hundreds or thousands of robots.
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: Which what happening at Starship right now?
• 15:39
  Speaker 1: We also have people in our operations but these people are overseeing loads of things, lots of robots and thousands of deliveries happening instead actually a person doing the delivery by themselves.
• 15:56
  Speaker 1: So it's different level-of job I would say And we realise that technologies aren't there to do so Just like with Skype People saying that you know, hey You know our people really going to be talking to computers and and phones already exists.
• 16:16
  Speaker 1: No there were a lot of people in the beginning who thought that That robot deliveries are not going to work or it's really Really a long shot.
• 16:26
  Speaker 1: Nowadays now after a decade of development I think we have convinced everybody that is very much A reality And that's why for example Almost all of the major delivery apps in the Western world are our customers, Starship Customers.
• 16:48
  Speaker 1: It's easier to name one or two that aren't our customers than list them as our customers because they believe this is what we should be doing.
• 17:02
  Speaker 1: They have an automation strategy and look into it and not just delivery apps but also the retailers, particularly grocery retailers.
• 17:14
  Speaker 1: So a lot of our businesses are with grocery retailers.
• 17:19
  Speaker 0: so how do you see this impacting?
• 17:22
  Speaker 0: well what is the vision for the impact that you look for Starship to have on logistics systems?
• 17:27
  Speaker 0: You know at Delivery Drivers What Is The Goal With Starship If You Get Everybody To Adopt And To Kind Of Get These Autonomous Robots Going?
• 17:38
  Speaker 1: We have created a whole system for autonomous logistics at Skate.
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: It's not that we've created this one robot, that you can do demos with or something like that... You're creating the whole system of thousands of robots running around and transporting things!
• 17:54
  Speaker 1: You say hey I want these to be delivered from point A to point B. our API tells us yeah, the robot will be there in seven minutes.
• 18:04
  Speaker 1: it'll cost about as much And businesses are using that all the time.
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: In Finland, it's actually nationwide coverage we have had.
• 18:17
  Speaker 1: So in Finland is a country where not only the majority of last buying deliveries Are under robots yet It's about ten percent Food and grocery same day deliveries in Finland.
• 18:32
  Speaker 1: That is done by Starship.
• 18:36
  Speaker 1: Finland is an example of what also it will be in other countries, where we have nationwide coverage.
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: Everybody in Finland knows our robots like you are very much a fixture that people are very aware off and We work with the largest grocer In the country And if you go to their app or want order for same-day delivery You always get our robots.
• 19:08
  Speaker 1: They don't have their own human courier network, they just use our robots.
• 19:15
  Speaker 1: And we have several customers that are doing the same as well in other countries and there is a blueprint for the whole world.
• 19:24
  Speaker 1: It's not the case that the human couriers will completely disappear.
• 19:28
  Speaker 1: That's not it.
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: clearly Our robots Are not suitable For all of The deliveries only do the relatively short range, like literally a couple of miles or four kilometers and we do these relatively smaller side-of deliveries.
• 19:48
  Speaker 1: I mean they're not going to be delivering at piano.
• 19:50
  Speaker 1: it just doesn't fit into the robot but a couple grocery bags absolutely does fit in with the robot.
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: that's what you are doing very well.
• 20:01
  Speaker 0: That was really my next question as the impact do feels it's going to have and is having on these kind of delivery drivers, which you know Is its own kind of whole problem?
• 20:12
  Speaker 0: I mean here we're based in Spain right now.
• 20:14
  Speaker 0: this EU service is based in spain and global has had quite a few difficulties with its riders and Riders law and how to identify them.
• 20:23
  Speaker 0: So It's an interesting topic too.
• 20:26
  Speaker 0: think about the impact because I'm sure that can be a critique, right?
• 20:31
  Speaker 0: Because maybe some people are saying this is God-honest job for his people.
• 20:35
  Speaker 0: That it's very easy to pick up and your robots are replacing them.
• 20:39
  Speaker 1: Oh i don't think we're actually replacing...I don't actually think that number of human couriers in the world will ever decrease.
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: The appetite for people get delivery And affordable delivery just increases.
• 20:56
  Speaker 1: The robots will be taking some of this increase, but I don't think actually the number of human couriers will decrease.
• 21:07
  Speaker 0: This is a side note – how much problem are people attacking these robots?
• 21:13
  Speaker 0: Or vandalizing them more?
• 21:14
  Speaker 0: because there has to be people who see a little robot going down in the street and kick it or do something to him!
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: That's one of these things where you know, oh people don't have microphones and you know that phones already exist like I've had that question from day One all the time.
• 21:31
  Speaker 1: All The Time It seems and these questions always come From People Sitting in Offices.
• 21:38
  Speaker 1: so i think somehow people sitting In Offices are really Aggressive And Really violent and Thinked That Oh These Robots Will Be Sturdy and Everything.
• 21:50
  Speaker 1: That's not the case, actually.
• 21:56
  Speaker 1: With human-delivered drivers... Suppose they drive a car and an auto FedEx or DHL pulls up with their van?
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: You could go puncture tires of a FedEx van!
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: Sure you can do that but I'm sure it happens once per million deliveries.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: maybe How many times you have done it?
• 22:22
  Speaker 0: No, no.
• 22:23
  Speaker 0: Hey You know I haven't thought about doing yet exactly.
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: you have not done It.
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: but your asking about if you think that oh wow That's going to be a big thing.
• 22:30
  Speaker 1: But you're now.
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: i'm.
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: never i've ever encountered the person who says yeah Yeah, do that for fun.
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: I knew that all the time like i've Never encountered that.
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: but these people don't think.
• 22:40
  Speaker 1: people think that others Do that all The Time.
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: that Not the case.
• 22:43
  Speaker 1: you Know We Have Done Done Millions and Millions Millions of Deliveries Like You have not had really that problem.
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm sure sometimes very rarely things happen but it's not an issue really.
• 22:59
  Speaker 1: Delivery is interesting business in the sense you get to experience a real world like loads of long tail situations happening and all sorts of interesting combinations that you don't necessarily think of.
• 23:27
  Speaker 1: We can't possibly anticipate in our technology everything that could happen, but we need to have safe handling for all sorts of long-term situations.
• 23:38
  Speaker 1: The nice thing is if any unusual things happened, robot driving on the sidewalk just stopped And, you know take this time to investigate the situation and think what they do is some sort of an obstacle in front them.
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: They can turn around schedule a new route or something like that Or go around or wait.
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: There's loads things that could happen rarely.
• 24:06
  Speaker 1: But no vandalism and thefts are not a big problem for us.
• 24:12
  Speaker 0: I guess we just assume the worst in each other and are surprised when people actually decent.
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: We also see that obviously it's a very, very unique new thing of the world That you see robots on streets doing their own things.
• 24:41
  Speaker 1: One thing that building Starship, I've actually been very surprised about or it was originally no.
• 24:47
  Speaker 1: It's commonplace but... ...I'm always very surprised when we started doing our first tests is how accepting people are towards robots?
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: When you have put the robots into completely new cities where people haven't seen a robot before And we just have robots drive on the streets and sidewalk, they'll see people walking past.
• 25:21
  Speaker 1: They're not paying attention to robots but they don't.
• 25:26
  Speaker 1: They very naturally accept robots as part of their neighbourhoods.
• 25:32
  Speaker 1: It happens quickly like a massive curiosity, or these robots do not really cause a lot of commotion.
• 25:46
  Speaker 1: People just happily accept that.
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: wow they have new way to get something delivered.
• 25:52
  Speaker 1: it's a new experience for them.
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: Like probably most of the audience here has NOT had a robot delivery because we only have a few thousand robots and not yet a few million robots in wirotka.
• 26:05
  Speaker 1: you're only covering Finland nationwide And in most other countries, there is no nationwide coverage yet.
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: So most of the audience probably have not experienced a robot delivery but you will!
• 26:19
  Speaker 1: In a couple years I'm sure.
• 26:22
  Speaker 1: and it's completely different experience with human career like knocking on your door or coming to your gate.
• 26:32
  Speaker 1: It's one type of experience With robots its very different.
• 26:37
  Speaker 1: One thing for example Robot has no judgment of you, it's completely neutral.
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: You can show up in your underwear if you want to or... It is not a social interaction that you have and robot has time for you.
• 26:59
  Speaker 1: I mean the courier maybe also has but they are always busy trying to get back which is completely natural.
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: But with robots.
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: it's a different, emotionally very different experience.
• 27:11
  Speaker 1: A little bit like maybe remember there was time decades ago where people used to book flight tickets by going for travel agent and you could sit down as the travel agents explain oh I need to go fly through Madrid or you know, and then they're oh yeah there's flights of these dates or this.
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah something like... This actually used to happen right?
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: And now it all moved to internet.
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: obviously people literally booked their flight tickets at two a.m in the underwear uh and-and they liked it even though maybe yesterday with human travel agent was like Oh!
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: There is like a human contact.
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: They just want to get the job done.
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah,
• 28:03
  Speaker 0: well it's probably what you're talking about here that people have been thinking for so long That this should be the next step in the future of delivery.
• 28:13
  Speaker 0: We are not that surprised seeing because we just kind of expect them to be there.
• 28:18
  Speaker 0: They haven't touched ground at Barcelona yet So I look forward to see them buzz around soon
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: Maybe also because i said its easier the delivery apps that are not our customers yet.
• 28:29
  Speaker 1: So you mentioned Glovo, so Glovo is not our customer yet but actually this globe was only one of the major apps
• 28:41
  Speaker 0: maybe?
• 28:42
  Speaker 0: Yeah yeah!
• 28:43
  Speaker 0: That's a key word.
• 28:44
  Speaker 0: yes I look forward to seeing them.
• 28:48
  Speaker 0: um and on the topic here of talking about the robots i think an important question.
• 28:52
  Speaker 0: it's something you're very involved in so i don't want give you chance to speak about It.
• 28:56
  Speaker 0: just kind of the environmental impact have, if at all because you're saying we are growing our fleet.
• 29:04
  Speaker 0: We want to increase and be in every major city these kinds of things.
• 29:08
  Speaker 0: then the honest question has become what's the environmental impact on having a little robot buzz around?
• 29:13
  Speaker 0: And I know that there is plenty involvement with climate and environment initiatives.
• 29:19
  Speaker 0: i've got here your member of nature protection NGO.
• 29:24
  Speaker 0: let us do it campaign way back in two thousand eight where you uh clean the countryside.
• 29:29
  Speaker 0: so i want to hear a little bit about where starship lands on their responsibility towards climate.
• 29:34
  Speaker 1: yeah, so Starship robots are actually The most environmentally friendly way to get anything delivered.
• 29:44
  Speaker 1: Wow.
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: So why?
• 29:46
  Speaker 1: because the robots are small and lightweight?
• 29:49
  Speaker 1: Uh the robot the weight of the robot is less than a weight of a person.
• 29:55
  Speaker 1: It's less than the weight of a delivery courier.
• 29:59
  Speaker 1: So it takes less energy to move, then it takes energy from moving with a bike or even a person walking for sure driving a car.
• 30:12
  Speaker 1: Due to that weight of the robot and its smaller light weight is actually the most efficient way.
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: Our robots try take more energy than the nutritional energy that people spend when they walk.
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: So therefore, you can actually argue it is more environmentally friendly to use Starship delivery then for short drive through a grocery store or restaurant.
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: so there's positive environmental impact.
• 30:51
  Speaker 1: I'm sure at some point people will also be very focused on that.
• 31:02
  Speaker 0: And when it comes to, because you've scaled... well Starship has scaled across Europe into the US and we're talking about these kind of regulations about the way that little robot needs to buzz around in a city, what kind of environmental regulation it needs to meet.
• 31:19
  Speaker 0: Has there been too much difficulty between adapting that in Europe versus the US?
• 31:26
  Speaker 1: So... The U.S is more forward-looking I would say and moves quicker.
• 31:35
  Speaker 1: everything you know has moved quicker but we have had great regulatory success everywhere.
• 31:42
  Speaker 1: We generally, we work with regulators everywhere.
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: We don't just do go rogue and put our robots without caring about what the traffic laws are or... ...we actually investigate the law.
• 31:53
  Speaker 1: then we talk to the regulators And regulators over the world have actually moved To put forward regulations that govern robots on the sidewalk.
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: So most of these states in US Have adopted laws that permit robots on the sidewalk and under certain conditions, of course like weight limits or things.
• 32:21
  Speaker 1: And a lot of countries in Europe have done it or are planning to do so.
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: we're operating eight different countries Finland UK Czechia Germany US Sweden Of
• 32:44
  Speaker 0: course.
• 32:45
  Speaker 0: Okay, okay so I mean maybe i want to hear a little bit more.
• 32:50
  Speaker 0: and just because I think it would be interesting too Maybe people are listening to this podcast if they're founders People interested in kind of moving their company around has there been as far as you're concerned any Particular difficulty when it comes to Europe versus us in scaling the company at large?
• 33:08
  Speaker 0: because we're talking you were found in twenty fourteen.
• 33:10
  Speaker 0: So we're taking ten years after the fact more than ten years After the fact.
• 33:13
  Speaker 0: right?
• 33:14
  Speaker 0: has there been a kind of noticeable difference for you?
• 33:17
  Speaker 0: Or was that as you say easy as both in the US and in the U or your?
• 33:22
  Speaker 0: Well,
• 33:23
  Speaker 1: I think i think in general u.s Has a better ecosystem in building companies.
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: There is you know, more.
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: most notably there's more gross capital in US.
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: Like it's when companies are raising rounds which are like one million or five million or so.
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: that can easily be done both Europe and the U S. but we move where a company starts growing and moves towards larger capital raising rounds like tens of millions or hundred million, I think generally the round is about fifty million.
• 34:13
  Speaker 1: Usually even with European startups they often are mostly involved US investors because there's just fewer investors in Europe that are investing in start-ups and scale ups.
• 34:26
  Speaker 1: but do these sorts These sorts of tickets so I would say availability of capital or the uberness saviness of investors Is part of the biggest difference?
• 34:40
  Speaker 1: In in us bird versus Europe even though some people Of course have taken a very back to black and white view that hey, you know It's everything much better in US.
• 34:53
  Speaker 1: I don't like I'm not inclined To take views like that European, I am building this from Europe.
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: We have of course large US presence as well and we are registered as a Delaware company actually.
• 35:09
  Speaker 1: but absolutely believe you can build successful startups in Europe.
• 35:16
  Speaker 0: Well, talk about the ecosystem.
• 35:18
  Speaker 0: I had a look and usually do this for most interviews because it's an interesting tidbit as i looked over the funding that we've covered in adjacent areas.
• 35:26
  Speaker 0: you operate on from quick-look at this past year whether it's warehouse automation or AI infrastructure, robotics and things like that.
• 35:43
  Speaker 0: That is around the number I've seen flowing around.
• 35:45
  Speaker 0: so with that in mind... I just wanted to hear a little bit about where you feel Starship sits within the broader ecosystem?
• 35:52
  Speaker 0: Whether its competition wise.
• 35:54
  Speaker 0: how have you been seeing it grow since you began to now?
• 35:58
  Speaker 0: How do look at Starship?
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: If we think of fundraising and European capital as well Clearly, the trend is positive in a sense that European investors are getting better at it.
• 36:17
  Speaker 1: And their amounts also get getting better.
• 36:22
  Speaker 1: Starship's actually in place where we're fairly close to being... Close to be in places you don't need venture funding anymore because it's a good business that we are doing.
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: But also, certainly there is lots of investor interest in investing these types of areas especially anything around physical AI... ...is hot topic among investors.
• 37:00
  Speaker 1: Well,
• 37:02
  Speaker 0: I'm going to leave you now but with one last question and then we're gonna call it a day on the podcast.
• 37:09
  Speaker 0: Uh...I was interested kind of to hear about what youth would look at if-if we were looking as city fully ingrained with uh..you know autonomous delivery robots because you've spoken about grocery when your again ordering something delivered.
• 37:26
  Speaker 0: What does a city fully engrained by Autonomous Robots Look Like for You?
• 37:29
  Speaker 0: Is that we are all sitting in our house everything is brought to us, what's the kind of balance there that you see?
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: I think it's a combination of things.
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: I don't really envision in the future where people don't get out of their houses at all and i don't think thats...I dont' think that's what people want to do.
• 37:45
  Speaker 1: uh another reason why that would happen.
• 37:52
  Speaker 1: actually in terms of how these cities look I actually don't see that the cities would be totally looking differently.
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: Just like, just like the fact that there are human delivery couriers running around doesn't make this city to come somehow work totally differently.
• 38:12
  Speaker 1: but robots Are commonplace in many many many cities around the world right now and they will become common place pretty much everywhere.
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: But The cities still look the same Largely, and we are also building our technology to fit into the existing infrastructure.
• 38:32
  Speaker 1: We're not assuming that these cities And the sidewalks and roads will be built differently for robots.
• 38:42
  Speaker 0: Okay great well thank you for this hot tea.
• 38:44
  Speaker 0: It's it's been a pleasure to have you on.
• 38:48
  Speaker 0: we don't usually get to talk too many people working in robotics.
• 38:51
  Speaker 0: So has been very interesting conversation for me.
• 38:54
  Speaker 0: so Thank You?
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: Thank you
• 38:57
  Speaker 0: This is been a Pleasure talked to soon.
• 38:59
  Speaker 1: Thank you for my side.