Latest / Crime Stories with Nancy Grace / Uber Eats driver mom-of-3 killed during food drop-off

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Uber Eats driver mom-of-3 killed during food drop-off · Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

0:05
Speaker 1: Breaking news now and a hate filled crime leaving a wife,
0:12
Speaker 1: a mother of three beautiful young children dead. She was
0:17
Speaker 1: just doing her job. Why her? Why is a mother
0:22
Speaker 1: of three young children, ages five, ten, and eleven dead.
0:35
Speaker 1: We got a call of a person that was lying
0:38
Speaker 1: in a breezeway that had obvious signs of trauma. Eric
0:43
Speaker 1: Peters is a sergeant with the Holtham City Police Department.
0:46
Speaker 1: On Saturday night to emergency responders pronounced Ryan dead at
0:50
Speaker 1: this complex where she made a delivery. Over the last
0:52
Speaker 1: couple of days, the detectives have been working non stop
0:55
Speaker 1: to try to identify a suspect. Right now, police will
0:59
Speaker 1: only say she's suffered obvious signs of trauma. Well, the
1:02
Speaker 1: detectives are kind of holding that close to the vest
1:04
Speaker 1: for investigative purposes, so they don't want the actual cause
1:08
Speaker 1: of death out there yet, so they're using that as
1:11
Speaker 1: an investigative tool. At this point, you are hearing Sargeant
1:15
Speaker 1: Ery Peters with the Haltam City Police speaking to our
1:18
Speaker 1: friends at WFAA ABC eight with me and all start
1:23
Speaker 1: panel to make sense of a senseless killing with me
1:27
Speaker 1: Gina Tron, Crime reporter Auxygen dot com. You can find
1:31
Speaker 1: her at Twitter under Gina Tron. Joseph Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics,
1:36
Speaker 1: Jacksonville State University, author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon,
1:41
Speaker 1: star of a brand new series, Poisonous Liaisons on the
1:44
Speaker 1: True Crime Network. Renowned psychologist, Professor Behavioral Medicine at Trurou College.
1:50
Speaker 1: Author of the Causes of Autism. Doctor Jeff Gardere special guest.
1:56
Speaker 1: John W. Dill, high profile lawyer joining us out of Florida,
2:01
Speaker 1: author of the method Proven Techniques for Winning Jury Trials
2:04
Speaker 1: at johnwdel dot com and joining US. Sergeant Eric Peters
2:11
Speaker 1: leaving literally his job there with the police with the
2:15
Speaker 1: Haltam City Police Department on this case from the get go.
2:20
Speaker 1: But first let me go to someone I've been wanting
2:25
Speaker 1: to speak to very much, and I want to first
2:27
Speaker 1: start with offering our prayers and our thoughts to the
2:33
Speaker 1: husband of Ryan Munsey Graham. She's just thirty one years
2:38
Speaker 1: old with three gorgeous children with me, her husband, Cameron Graham,
2:44
Speaker 1: and right at the get go he is We've never
2:47
Speaker 1: mention it himself. I want you to know there is
2:51
Speaker 1: a go fund we set up for this wonderful family.
2:57
Speaker 1: It's GoFundMe dot com slash Ryan Dash Graham's dash funeral
3:03
Speaker 1: dash expenses and you can see that if you want
3:07
Speaker 1: to join us in helping this family at crimeligne dot com.
3:14
Speaker 1: Cameron Graham, thank you for being with us. I know
3:18
Speaker 1: that you're needed at the funeral home and you're taking
3:21
Speaker 1: your time to be with us. Thank you. Thank you
3:25
Speaker 1: Anna for reaching out to my family and the Swansa
3:28
Speaker 1: and just pursuing them the rifles Jena that need to
3:32
Speaker 1: be done. We really appreciate that, Cameron. I I can't
3:37
Speaker 1: imagine growing up without my mom. She and my dad
3:42
Speaker 1: were the biggest parts of my life. How are your
3:46
Speaker 1: children five, ten and eleven years old doing? I mean
3:52
Speaker 1: with children as young as five, with Marshall and Jason,
3:56
Speaker 1: it's really hard to tell. For emotional trauma at this age,
3:59
Speaker 1: it's kind of a long term situation. It's something that
4:03
Speaker 1: you know we'll never get over. And then her ten
4:06
Speaker 1: and eleven year old girls loved her mom very much
4:08
Speaker 1: and they're devastated by it, and they're every day they
4:13
Speaker 1: asked why they can't see their mom and no more.
4:15
Speaker 1: And it's just the worst thing I've ever gone through
4:20
Speaker 1: my taire life. It's so hard to explain. There's there's
4:24
Speaker 1: just so much love and emotion going around that every
4:28
Speaker 1: day we can think this is a nightmare and hopefully
4:30
Speaker 1: it'll hind and it doesn't. Mister Grandma, I did that
4:34
Speaker 1: for so long after my fiance was murdered, a really
4:39
Speaker 1: long time. I'd wake up and at the first moments
4:45
Speaker 1: thought everything was fine, and that would hit me and
4:49
Speaker 1: then I'd have to try to figure out, I know
4:52
Speaker 1: this sounds crazy, is this real, Am? I did? I
4:55
Speaker 1: have a bad dream that he was murdered and it
5:00
Speaker 1: take but just you know, a minute before I would
5:03
Speaker 1: make sense of all those thoughts. I go through the
5:08
Speaker 1: same thoughts every day. I wake up and the first
5:10
Speaker 1: thing I wake up and realize is that I'm not
5:12
Speaker 1: holding my wife, and I think, well, maybe she's in
5:15
Speaker 1: the bathroom. And then reality comes back and I realized
5:20
Speaker 1: that I want to get to see her again. Her
5:22
Speaker 1: children won't get to see her again. O sense was
5:25
Speaker 1: violent for no reason, So senseless, Cameron, When did you guys,
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Speaker 1: for those of you just joining us with me as
5:37
Speaker 1: a husband of Ryan Muncy Graham, She's just thirty one
5:42
Speaker 1: years old when her life is cut short brutally, and
5:47
Speaker 1: this is a mom working multiple jobs, just like her husband,
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Speaker 1: to pull their family and their children up, up, up.
5:58
Speaker 1: And I remember my mom and dad doing the same thing.
6:02
Speaker 1: My dad worked in the night shift, the morning shift,
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Speaker 1: the afternoon shift, my mom being gone all day into
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Speaker 1: the night working and it just breaks my heart. Cameron,
6:14
Speaker 1: when did you realize something was wrong? Well, my wife
6:19
Speaker 1: had left at about eleven forty five that morning to
6:22
Speaker 1: go to Doubt and do some Uber Each deliveries because
6:25
Speaker 1: they were running a special. And she told me she
6:27
Speaker 1: would be home about seven, and about seven to ten
6:32
Speaker 1: I called her. I was like, hey, baby, where are you.
6:34
Speaker 1: He was taking you so long, and she said, oh,
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Speaker 1: I got to do seven more deliveries to finish the special.
6:41
Speaker 1: And then at ten forty one, my message her, and
6:44
Speaker 1: she never called me. She needn't message me back. So
6:46
Speaker 1: I called her and I called her, and I called
6:49
Speaker 1: her and I called her and I called her, and
6:51
Speaker 1: every time it was going straight her voice now. And
6:55
Speaker 1: then at about twelve o'clock PM, twelve hours later, I
6:59
Speaker 1: get a call from her dad. And as soon as
7:00
Speaker 1: I see her dad calling me, I know what that
7:04
Speaker 1: call is, and I'm terrified to an answer, and I
7:08
Speaker 1: do and it's her dad telling me that they found
7:11
Speaker 1: her body deceased. Damn, and I just fall to the ground.
7:16
Speaker 1: I met. It's hard talking about it now. I don't
7:25
Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't understand why anyone anywhere I
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Speaker 1: would want to do anything like this to my wonderful wife,
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Speaker 1: who it's the nicest person, and all she wants to
7:36
Speaker 1: do is make people happy. She was, she delives. She
7:39
Speaker 1: drove the handicap around as her a full time job.
7:43
Speaker 1: She brought people food that didn't want to get out
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Speaker 1: in the middle of a pandemic. She taught que playing
7:47
Speaker 1: glasses to try to teach people how to save money.
7:50
Speaker 1: And on top of all that, she made her all.
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Speaker 1: She had her own business where she does personal tumblers
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Speaker 1: and cups and stuff like that to me to bring
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Speaker 1: a smile on one's face. And for her to be
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Speaker 1: brutally murdered as an attempt of trying to rob her
8:07
Speaker 1: or whatever they were trying to do, there's no reason this.
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Speaker 1: Everyone to ask why. I can't even ask that question
8:13
Speaker 1: because there's no good answer for that question. There's no
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Speaker 1: reason why. When you saw that phone call come in,
8:23
Speaker 1: what went through your mind? Well, at first I thought
8:28
Speaker 1: I was. As soon as I saw his name on
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Speaker 1: the phone, I was terrified. But when I answered it,
8:33
Speaker 1: and I was hoping I would hear my wife's boy saying, hey,
8:36
Speaker 1: I've lost my phone or something like that. And when
8:40
Speaker 1: her dad answered and he was in tears and telling
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Speaker 1: me that they found her body deceased, my whole body
8:46
Speaker 1: just like quit working. I fell to the ground. I'm bawling.
8:51
Speaker 1: My five year old son is sitting deck to me,
8:53
Speaker 1: asking me what's wrong, and I had to tell I
8:58
Speaker 1: had to tell him. I didn't want to hold it
9:00
Speaker 1: back from him. He's really intelligent five year old, so
9:04
Speaker 1: he knew that there was something wrong. And there's never
9:09
Speaker 1: been an art of conversation. I'll ever having my life
9:11
Speaker 1: having to tell all of my children that their mother's
9:15
Speaker 1: gone and she went to heaven, and then they may
9:19
Speaker 1: not be able to see her, they may not be
9:21
Speaker 1: able to hear her, but they always still her in
9:24
Speaker 1: her heart. That's a heartless conversation anyone will ever have to,
9:29
Speaker 1: and I hope no one has to tell their children
9:31
Speaker 1: that their mothers passed away. Guys with me is our
9:36
Speaker 1: special guest today. It is the victim in this case,
9:41
Speaker 1: A tan gentle victim of a shooting death, the shooting
9:44
Speaker 1: death of his beloved wife just thirty one. This couple
9:50
Speaker 1: had gone through so much together and faced so much
9:55
Speaker 1: adversity together, already doing everything and they could to raise
10:01
Speaker 1: their three children and pull their family up, only to
10:07
Speaker 1: get the call that Ryan, his wife, just thirty one
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Speaker 1: years old, is found dead just doing her job. Jackie,
10:19
Speaker 1: I'd like to let mister Graham go so he does
10:22
Speaker 1: not hear our forensic discussion. Mister Graham, thank you for
10:28
Speaker 1: being with us. I know you're headed to the funeral
10:30
Speaker 1: home right now, and please know our prayers are with you.
10:34
Speaker 1: That's a trip no one wants to make, and it
10:40
Speaker 1: is a long and hard path that you have to
10:44
Speaker 1: walk alone. And I'm just so sorry for you. Please
10:48
Speaker 1: let us know whatever we can do to help you.
10:52
Speaker 1: I really do appreciate that. I would like to say
10:54
Speaker 1: thank you and Nancy and in the whole Howcome City
10:57
Speaker 1: Police Department, thank you all for working it'll do and
11:02
Speaker 1: bringing the justice that was due. And this will see
11:07
Speaker 1: something that my family can't recover from. But I would
11:10
Speaker 1: like to say the last quote that my wife told
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Speaker 1: me before she left that day, and she said to
11:15
Speaker 1: me that we may not have it all together, but
11:18
Speaker 1: together we have it all and from that we have
11:22
Speaker 1: to build and move forward. And every contribution you can
11:27
Speaker 1: make to the go fund me is really appreciated, even
11:30
Speaker 1: if you just want to stay on there that you're
11:32
Speaker 1: giving out prayers. Everything counts, every word, everything, and thank
11:38
Speaker 1: you all so much. Thank you, sir. Clime Stories with
11:51
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace. Police in Haltom City investigating the death of
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Speaker 1: a woman. They are calling it murder. Police say someone
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Speaker 1: found the victim this last night lying in a breezeway
12:02
Speaker 1: of an apartment building. This is a Northern Cross boulevard.
12:06
Speaker 1: Please say she had obvious signs of trauma. By the
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Speaker 1: time paramedics arrived, that victim was pronounced dead. Authorities say
12:12
Speaker 1: this is an ongoing investigation today, breaking news right now
12:19
Speaker 1: in the case of the murder of this thirty one
12:21
Speaker 1: year old woman. With me, I hope you got to
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Speaker 1: hear Ryan's husband Cameron Graham with us with me. High
12:31
Speaker 1: profile lawyer John Deal, doctor Jeff Gardier, Sergeant Eric Peters,
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Speaker 1: death investigator Joe Scott Morgan, and crime reporter Oxygen dot com.
12:42
Speaker 1: You know her name well, as do I GENA tron
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Speaker 1: Gina Tron first to you tell me the circumstances surrounding
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Speaker 1: Ryan's death. So she it was Wednesday night and Ryan
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Speaker 1: was in the middle of each delivery when you know,
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Speaker 1: she she stopped buy an apartment complex and that's when
13:04
Speaker 1: her husband stopped being able to reach her. You know,
13:07
Speaker 1: she was working this this job. She and her husband
13:13
Speaker 1: they lost part of their income due to COVID, like
13:15
Speaker 1: so many other Americans, So she was working this job
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Speaker 1: on the side to try to make extra money. And yeah,
13:21
Speaker 1: you probably heard earlier her her husband was waiting for
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Speaker 1: her to come home, and she had got seven more
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Speaker 1: deliveries to make and she wasn't able to finish it
13:30
Speaker 1: because somebody or some people took her life. You know,
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Speaker 1: Gina Tron, I'm glad you told me that. You can
13:36
Speaker 1: find Gina Tron on Twitter, course at auction dot com.
13:40
Speaker 1: She's the author of Star sixty seven on Amazon. Jina,
13:45
Speaker 1: I did not realize that they were struggling, that their
13:49
Speaker 1: financial problems were because of COVID. I didn't know exactly
13:53
Speaker 1: what had happened, but like so many people across the
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Speaker 1: country now taking second, third jobs, trying to just keep going,
14:01
Speaker 1: I didn't know that Gina Tron to Sergeant Eric Peters
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Speaker 1: special guests joining us in the Haltam City Police Department. Sergeant,
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Speaker 1: thanks for taking your time away from everything that's happening
14:12
Speaker 1: right now to give us information. Sergeant, I know what
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Speaker 1: it's like to work multiple jobs, to finish one job,
14:20
Speaker 1: then trust to your car and go to another job.
14:23
Speaker 1: I've worked as many as three and sometimes four jobs
14:26
Speaker 1: at once. That's hard and that's the position that Ryan
14:31
Speaker 1: Mutsey Graham, just thirty one year old Mama three was in.
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Speaker 1: What do we know? I'm trying to figure out. Was
14:37
Speaker 1: she under an overpass? Was she walking through trees? How
14:42
Speaker 1: did this happen? So late Saturday night, we were called
14:46
Speaker 1: to an apartment complex. Somebody had called in and said
14:50
Speaker 1: that there was a person lying outside their door that
14:53
Speaker 1: had obvious signs of trauma. When we got on scene,
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Speaker 1: we went up to the third floor of an apartment
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Speaker 1: complex building and found the victim lying in the breezeway
15:04
Speaker 1: there on the ground. Let me understand that, sergeant with me,
15:07
Speaker 1: Sergeant Eric Peters from the Haltham City Police Department. Sergeant,
15:11
Speaker 1: you're saying this was on a third floor apartment somebody
15:15
Speaker 1: calling and says, she's out a person lying outside our door.
15:20
Speaker 1: And she was in a breezeway on the third floor.
15:23
Speaker 1: What do you mean by breezeway just the corridor the
15:28
Speaker 1: hallway that goes to the different apartments there on the
15:31
Speaker 1: third floor. And it was open air, like you walk
15:33
Speaker 1: up and it's open air and you can go left
15:36
Speaker 1: or right. Yes, that's correct. Got you would she have
15:38
Speaker 1: walked up the stairs or taking an elevator. She would
15:41
Speaker 1: have walked up the stairs from the bottom floor. And
15:44
Speaker 1: I understand correct me if I'm wrong, because you certainly
15:47
Speaker 1: know the facts better than we do. Sergeant Eric Peters.
15:50
Speaker 1: She had not yet made the delivery. The food was there,
15:53
Speaker 1: that is correct. She had not made her delivery. That
15:55
Speaker 1: yet what she robbed. That is what we're believing the
15:59
Speaker 1: motive is. We believe that that she was robbed and
16:02
Speaker 1: that was the reason for the offense. You know, I'm curious,
16:06
Speaker 1: Gina Tron, crime reporter with Oxygen dot Com. I've seen it.
16:09
Speaker 1: Maybe this is anecdotal knowledge, sheina, But I see um
16:14
Speaker 1: when a pizza guy goes by, or sometimes I see
16:17
Speaker 1: it on the doors of restaurants. We only have x
16:21
Speaker 1: amount of twenty five dollars cash. Our drivers don't carry cash.
16:25
Speaker 1: I mean, when you attack an Uber driver, what are
16:29
Speaker 1: you really going to get? Isn't their procedure or policy
16:33
Speaker 1: that they don't carry a lot of cash around? Yeah,
16:36
Speaker 1: that's right, um and uh. In fact, this is not
16:39
Speaker 1: the first Um delivery driver in the area that's been killed.
16:44
Speaker 1: I guess apparently there was a Uber I'm sorry, there
16:47
Speaker 1: was an Amazon delivery driver that was killed just two
16:50
Speaker 1: days before Christmas, Timothy Allen, who was shot in his
16:53
Speaker 1: car right after making a delivery as well. And I
16:55
Speaker 1: mean they don't you know, they don't know what the
16:57
Speaker 1: motive was for that because nothing was taken from him.
17:00
Speaker 1: But yeah, drivers, that's extremely odd, Gina Tron, And you're
17:04
Speaker 1: absolutely correct, Gina Tron joining me from Oxygen dot com
17:08
Speaker 1: kind of a red flag that another delivery person have
17:11
Speaker 1: been shot. But back to you, Sergeant Eric Peters, we
17:15
Speaker 1: don't know yet whether Ryan was robbed. I mean, if
17:20
Speaker 1: she's not raped, there's no sex attack, and she's not robbed,
17:25
Speaker 1: could it be just a thrill kill of a mother
17:28
Speaker 1: of three, Well, I would hope that that's not the case.
17:31
Speaker 1: But again, we do believe that she was robbed in
17:34
Speaker 1: this instance before she was killed, and another issue just
17:38
Speaker 1: putting it out there. To doctor Jeff Gargier, Board Certified
17:41
Speaker 1: Clinical Psychologists, Professor Behavioral Medicine at Truro College, Doctor Jeff,
17:47
Speaker 1: almost everything is cash less right now. I mean, if
17:52
Speaker 1: you go to try to buy something and you actually
17:54
Speaker 1: interact with a human during COVID, they're covered head to
17:58
Speaker 1: toe and plastic and rubber gloves and you put your
18:03
Speaker 1: credit card in a little device. You don't sign anything, nothing.
18:09
Speaker 1: Nobody wants to touch anybody. A lot of places even
18:13
Speaker 1: ban the use of cash now, doctor Jeff. So what
18:17
Speaker 1: could they get off this mother of three? I don't
18:19
Speaker 1: get it. I think you may have it right here.
18:22
Speaker 1: Even if they thought that she may have had some
18:26
Speaker 1: loose change or some kind of money on her, this
18:30
Speaker 1: was a thrill kill because think about this. If it
18:33
Speaker 1: was just about the money, they could have held her up,
18:37
Speaker 1: said emptier pockets will take it. You disappear. We have
18:41
Speaker 1: masks on, pretending that we're you know, we're trying to
18:46
Speaker 1: prevent COVID or whatever the case may be, and that
18:49
Speaker 1: would be the end of it. But the fact that
18:51
Speaker 1: they killed her, and she was so viciously killed, you
18:55
Speaker 1: have to look at, you know, a diseased mind or
18:58
Speaker 1: diseased minds that are some sort of adrenaline and thrill
19:02
Speaker 1: off of this. Back to you, Sergeant Eric Peters, the
19:05
Speaker 1: media relations officer with the Haltham City Police Department. You know,
19:09
Speaker 1: I know you just heard her husband thanking the police department,
19:13
Speaker 1: which of course you deserve, but doesn't I just break
19:16
Speaker 1: your heart to hear this guy and his whole family,
19:20
Speaker 1: little babies five, ten and eleven, thanking you for doing
19:24
Speaker 1: your job when he's in so much, so much pain.
19:28
Speaker 1: It does. You know, murders in Haltham City, they're a
19:30
Speaker 1: rare thing, so so for us to have one a year,
19:33
Speaker 1: that's that's kind of the norm. But for him to
19:38
Speaker 1: to to be be hurting so bad. We're just happy
19:41
Speaker 1: that we were able to come to a conclusion and
19:44
Speaker 1: then you correct the case. You sure it did, Sarah.
19:47
Speaker 1: Sergeant Eric Peters the Haltham City Police Department congratulated for that.
19:52
Speaker 1: It reminded me of so many times at the end
19:54
Speaker 1: of a murder trial, Sergeant, where the victims family, I mean,
19:58
Speaker 1: they've been suffer suffering, sitting through the trial, hearing the
20:03
Speaker 1: medical examiner, hearing all the Abdens come up and thank
20:06
Speaker 1: me at the end of the trial, and it would
20:10
Speaker 1: just break my heart. I don't know why, it just would.
20:23
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. For those of you joining us,
20:28
Speaker 1: we are talking about the death of a beautiful young mom,
20:33
Speaker 1: just thirty one, doing her job, finishing her last seven
20:37
Speaker 1: deliveries with Uber Delivery. They were running a special she
20:42
Speaker 1: never made at home. Who is Ryan Munsey Graham? Earlier
20:48
Speaker 1: you heard from our friends at eleven DFW. Take a
20:51
Speaker 1: listen to Maria Guerrero NBC five, wife and mother of
20:56
Speaker 1: three small children. Ryan Graham Munsey was working her Uber
21:00
Speaker 1: Eats delivery jobs Saturday night when she was murdered. Found
21:04
Speaker 1: in the breezeway of the Northern Cross Apartments in Halsam City.
21:07
Speaker 1: I believe she was delivering food to somebody in that building.
21:10
Speaker 1: The thirty one year old did not make it to
21:12
Speaker 1: the customer's door before she was killed. A motive isn't
21:16
Speaker 1: being made public. And to Alex Reiser w FAAABCA, it
21:22
Speaker 1: was Bailey who introduced this kind hearted, hard working mom
21:26
Speaker 1: to her husband, Cameron. So it's just really sad this
21:29
Speaker 1: all happened. Now Cameron is left to raise the kids
21:31
Speaker 1: alone as police work to figure out who killed his wife.
21:35
Speaker 1: I'm just hoping that we can catch who ever did this.
21:39
Speaker 1: If anybody has any information, heard anything, so anything, obviously,
21:42
Speaker 1: just come forward and let us know. I'm still kind
21:44
Speaker 1: of in shock. It's really hard to believe just that
21:47
Speaker 1: somebody could do that to her, to anybody and more
21:51
Speaker 1: from her best frantake a listen to w FAA. Those
21:55
Speaker 1: who knew Ryan Munsey remember her as a loving wife
21:58
Speaker 1: and mom man her and she just loved her kids
22:00
Speaker 1: so much. She has two daughters, Roxy and Mollie, and
22:04
Speaker 1: she has a son, Jason. Her friend Bailey Abels has
22:06
Speaker 1: known her for nearly a decade. She was goofy as
22:09
Speaker 1: all can be and just a really kind person. Ryan
22:13
Speaker 1: worked as a driver for the disabled, but she also
22:16
Speaker 1: delivered for Uber Eats until this weekend when she made
22:20
Speaker 1: it to this Haltham City apartment. To Joseph Scott Morgan,
22:24
Speaker 1: Professor Forensics, Jackson State University, take a listen to this,
22:27
Speaker 1: Joe Scott. Sergeant Peters, do are you releasing her cod
22:32
Speaker 1: cause of death? Yes, we believe that the she sustained
22:36
Speaker 1: a fatal stab wound. Turn Nack during the attack. You know,
22:39
Speaker 1: Joe Scott, to come up on a defenseless woman's trying
22:46
Speaker 1: to make a living, the mother of three. You know,
22:49
Speaker 1: Joe Scott, you and I've taught many many times there
22:52
Speaker 1: is a big psychological difference. And the killer that shoots
22:57
Speaker 1: at fifty feet and one that comes up on the
23:01
Speaker 1: victim with a knife and stabs him, I mean in
23:06
Speaker 1: the neck in my mind makes it even worse. Such
23:08
Speaker 1: a vulnerable area on a vulnerable person, unarmed, a lady,
23:16
Speaker 1: a mother at night. I mean, the only the only
23:23
Speaker 1: consolation is that with a stab in the neck, I
23:27
Speaker 1: think she died almost immediately. But did she have time
23:30
Speaker 1: to think about her children? Did she have time to
23:34
Speaker 1: wonder what's happening or to fight back? I doubted Joe Scott. No,
23:39
Speaker 1: But she had an awareness of what was happening. She
23:41
Speaker 1: had an awareness that she was in trouble. And you know,
23:46
Speaker 1: the two adjectives that come to mind are gutless and
23:50
Speaker 1: cowardice when you think about and you know you said
23:53
Speaker 1: that she's defenseless. Yeah, she's defenseless. Let me put a
23:57
Speaker 1: note layer to this. Nancy, her hands were full. She's
24:00
Speaker 1: a food delivery person and she's up on that landing.
24:04
Speaker 1: When you egress onto a landing like this, they had
24:07
Speaker 1: to have been tracking her, they knew where she was
24:09
Speaker 1: going to be. They'd probably be Sergeant Eric Peters said
24:13
Speaker 1: it was an open breeze away. I know exactly the
24:17
Speaker 1: kind of apartment you go up, you know, zig zaggy
24:20
Speaker 1: step and people on the outside can see you trudging
24:24
Speaker 1: up the steps and then it's external. It's probably well lighted.
24:29
Speaker 1: It's got a concrete base to it. I've been on
24:31
Speaker 1: these numbers, numbers and numbers of times on cases similar
24:35
Speaker 1: to this, but this, you know the problem. The problem
24:39
Speaker 1: here is, and it's actually good for the police from
24:42
Speaker 1: a forensic standpoint, whoever did this would have been saturated.
24:47
Speaker 1: They would have been inundated with this poor woman's precious
24:52
Speaker 1: blood that has poured out onto them. It's probably on
24:56
Speaker 1: their hands, certainly on the weapon. It would have transferred
24:59
Speaker 1: to the clothing. And so she is very vulnerable. But
25:02
Speaker 1: she left a piece of evidence with these idiots that
25:05
Speaker 1: did this to her, these cowards. And when whoever came
25:10
Speaker 1: across this, I can tell you this, Nancy, when they
25:14
Speaker 1: called this in and they saw this poor woman in
25:18
Speaker 1: the hallway on this platform. I can tell you this
25:21
Speaker 1: will be an image that will live with that person
25:24
Speaker 1: for the rest of their life because it is scarring.
25:28
Speaker 1: It's jarring, it's absolutely horrific. Guys. We are talking about
25:33
Speaker 1: the death of a gorgeous young mon just thirty one
25:35
Speaker 1: years old, the mother of three little children, Roxy, Molly
25:40
Speaker 1: and Chase, ages five, ten and eleven. Her husband left
25:44
Speaker 1: behind to try to raise his children all on his own,
25:47
Speaker 1: struggling with finances after COVID Mommy working apparently either three
25:53
Speaker 1: or four jobs, Daddy doing the same and the last
25:57
Speaker 1: hours of breaking news taking Listen to our friends at
25:59
Speaker 1: CBS eleven all they wos ten o'clock tonight, Haltham City
26:02
Speaker 1: Police say that they have made arrests in the death
26:04
Speaker 1: of a delivery food driver. So thirty one year old
26:07
Speaker 1: Ryan Munsey was found dead at an apartment complex on
26:10
Speaker 1: Saturday evening, and they have called her death a murder
26:14
Speaker 1: from the start. Joining me, let's go straight out to
26:17
Speaker 1: Sergeant Eric Peters with the Haltham City Police Department. Who
26:21
Speaker 1: are the purps. So last night, late last night, we
26:25
Speaker 1: arrested to fourteen year old juvenile males in connection with
26:28
Speaker 1: this murder. They were arrested at an apartment complex nearby
26:32
Speaker 1: over in Fort Worth and taken into custody by our
26:34
Speaker 1: SWAT team without any incident. Were they in their own home?
26:38
Speaker 1: I believe they were outside their residence when they were
26:40
Speaker 1: taken into custody. And then as she said, they're residence
26:43
Speaker 1: to me, that means they're brothers or at least related. Well,
26:45
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't know that they're related. I do
26:48
Speaker 1: know that they know that they knew each other. They
26:51
Speaker 1: when I say outside their residence, I mean outside the
26:54
Speaker 1: apartment complex there where they lived in an apartment complex nearby.
26:58
Speaker 1: You said that they are fort teen year old juveniles,
27:01
Speaker 1: and I assume that it's why you're not revealing their names.
27:03
Speaker 1: That is correct. Can you tell us if they make confessions?
27:06
Speaker 1: I do not have that information. I believe the detectives
27:10
Speaker 1: were still talking to them this morning. Well it's my experience.
27:14
Speaker 1: John W. Deal, high profile lawyer joining US, author of
27:18
Speaker 1: the method Proven Techniques for Winning Jury Trials at johnwdal
27:21
Speaker 1: dot com. John, if they're talking at all, that's going
27:27
Speaker 1: to be used against them in a court of law.
27:30
Speaker 1: And let me point out that juveniles are not questioned
27:34
Speaker 1: unless police have authority from a guardian, just so you
27:38
Speaker 1: know that. But John Deal, if they are speaking at
27:42
Speaker 1: all at that age, whatever they say, where that they
27:46
Speaker 1: confess or they make up a lie, that lie is
27:50
Speaker 1: going to be very transparent, probably full of conflicting statements
27:55
Speaker 1: and facts. What do you think that's correcting, Nancy? At
27:59
Speaker 1: this if they're talking, I'd be curious as to who
28:03
Speaker 1: the actual person who did the deed was. It's very
28:05
Speaker 1: possible there, That's what the conversations are at this point
28:09
Speaker 1: between the two of them. Both would be culpable, of course,
28:12
Speaker 1: but I'm sure that's what the detectives are working on.
28:14
Speaker 1: And if they're talking, they've had the permission to talk.
28:17
Speaker 1: I think eventually we'll get a clear picture of exactly
28:20
Speaker 1: what happened in his last moments. John W. Deal joining me,
28:23
Speaker 1: high profile lawyer. How do you get a statement from
28:26
Speaker 1: a fourteen year old? Generally have to get permission from
28:29
Speaker 1: the parent or guardian, and in this case, unless it's
28:33
Speaker 1: a spontaneous statement, I mean, they're in cussody. So therefore
28:36
Speaker 1: they would still have them random warnings available to them,
28:39
Speaker 1: even a juveniles. So they've had the permission to speak
28:42
Speaker 1: with them, So anything they're going to be saying now
28:44
Speaker 1: is going to be used against them clearly. Sergeant Eric
28:47
Speaker 1: Peters with me from the Haltham City Police Department. Sergeant Peters,
28:51
Speaker 1: was any evidence removed from their domiciles. The detectives did
28:56
Speaker 1: discover some evidence that linked the two juveniles to the offense.
29:00
Speaker 1: They were able to find that evidence last night after
29:03
Speaker 1: the arrest. Do you know what the evidence is? I
29:06
Speaker 1: do not have that information at this time. You're not
29:09
Speaker 1: giving it up like a good cop, well in any
29:13
Speaker 1: way harm the integrity of the case. But I've got
29:15
Speaker 1: a pretty good idea climb stories with Nancy Grace, and
29:29
Speaker 1: now I want to go straight back to our own investigation,
29:32
Speaker 1: to the death of a young mom, leaving behind her
29:37
Speaker 1: husband's who's already working multiple jobs and three little children.
29:44
Speaker 1: You know, doctor Jeff Gardier, or clinical psychologist, Professor of
29:48
Speaker 1: behavioral Medicine at TURO and author of the Causes of Autism.
29:54
Speaker 1: Doctor Jeff, A lot of people can't quite remember what
29:58
Speaker 1: happened when they were five years years old. These children
30:01
Speaker 1: are five, ten and eleven. But what they'll remember. What
30:06
Speaker 1: the takeaway is their life will always be void of
30:11
Speaker 1: their mom exactly. And these are critical ages, of course,
30:16
Speaker 1: where that bonding with their mom has been horrifically interrupted,
30:21
Speaker 1: and they will experience this through their adolescence, through their
30:25
Speaker 1: teen years, and right up into their marriages, that there
30:29
Speaker 1: is something that is missing. It will take years of
30:33
Speaker 1: therapy for them to try to even reconcile this, and
30:37
Speaker 1: of course as they get older, they'll learn more and
30:41
Speaker 1: more and more about the horrific details of the death
30:45
Speaker 1: of their beloved mother. So this will be a lifelong
30:50
Speaker 1: struggle for them in every arena of their lives. Well,
30:54
Speaker 1: I am grateful for one thing, doctor Jeff Gardier. You
30:57
Speaker 1: didn't start up about these being young guys who didn't
31:02
Speaker 1: know what they were doing, probably didn't have a good education.
31:05
Speaker 1: And you know what, all of that may be true.
31:10
Speaker 1: Maybe they didn't have a good education, maybe they had
31:12
Speaker 1: about upbringing doesn't matter. Ryan Mutsey Graham is dead and
31:19
Speaker 1: her husband is at the funeral home as we speak,
31:23
Speaker 1: and her children are saying, why can't I see mommy?
31:26
Speaker 1: Why can't I see mommy? Straight back out to Gina Tron,
31:30
Speaker 1: crime reporter or Oxygen dot Com and author of Star
31:33
Speaker 1: sixty seven on Amazon. Gina, what if anything do we
31:37
Speaker 1: know about these two teams. Other than they're fourteen, there's
31:41
Speaker 1: no other real information that's been given out about them.
31:45
Speaker 1: The press leisas came out this morning, and it seems
31:48
Speaker 1: like Polica being pretty taint lisped about about them, especially
31:52
Speaker 1: because they're juveniles. But it appears that they probably lived
31:56
Speaker 1: in the same complex building as one another. Basically all
32:02
Speaker 1: that I can gather from it for now. And you
32:04
Speaker 1: know what else, Gina, Statistically, when you apprehend a per
32:10
Speaker 1: inny case like this, this is not their first swing
32:14
Speaker 1: at the ball. I would be willing to bet these
32:17
Speaker 1: two have been in and out of trouble, whether it's
32:19
Speaker 1: been reported or apprehended or not. Earlier, we heard Gina Traun,
32:25
Speaker 1: crime reporter with Oxygen dot Com mentioned that this isn't
32:31
Speaker 1: the first time a delivery person has been murdered in
32:36
Speaker 1: the general area. I take a listen to our cut seven.
32:39
Speaker 1: This is Maria Guerrero NBC five k x AS, almost
32:44
Speaker 1: exactly a month before Munzie's murder. So my first thing
32:48
Speaker 1: was shocked, and then my first thought was, oh my god,
32:51
Speaker 1: the community, what a loss. Another delivery driver was shot dead,
32:57
Speaker 1: this time in West Dallas. Timothy Paul Allen was an
33:01
Speaker 1: independent contractor delivering packages for Amazon in his personal car.
33:06
Speaker 1: According to family, You know, I'm trying to figure out
33:10
Speaker 1: is there someone is there a group resist an mo
33:13
Speaker 1: that is just peeking off delivery people or Uber drivers.
33:19
Speaker 1: That was you speaking Sergeant Eric Peters, discussing the impact
33:23
Speaker 1: on the community. Was the perp caught in that case
33:28
Speaker 1: where the Amazon delivery person was shot? Well? Being that
33:32
Speaker 1: that's a Dallas case, I'm I'm not aware of them
33:36
Speaker 1: if they've solved that case or not? Right right well,
33:39
Speaker 1: as a matter of fact, take a listen to k
33:43
Speaker 1: X as cut thirteen. Police were called to the twenty
33:46
Speaker 1: four hundred block of Leith Street on December twenty third
33:50
Speaker 1: and found Allen shot and killed in his car. Police
33:53
Speaker 1: say he had made a delivery to the nearby Hampton's
33:56
Speaker 1: at Lake West apartments before being murdered. A motive is
33:59
Speaker 1: not yet known. His killer is also on the loose.
34:03
Speaker 1: You don't get to meet somebody like Paul Allen every day.
34:06
Speaker 1: The sixty five year old played piano at Nordstrom and
34:09
Speaker 1: area churches. He played in bands and influenced hundreds of
34:13
Speaker 1: musicians over the years. He would have two sets of
34:16
Speaker 1: keyboards up there playing them. He would have a drum
34:19
Speaker 1: machine that he was controlling with his feet. He would
34:21
Speaker 1: be playing the bass with his left hand. I mean,
34:24
Speaker 1: just an incredible, incredible talent. Allen's family says he picked
34:28
Speaker 1: up Amazon Delivery as a side gig amid COVID nineteen.
34:33
Speaker 1: You know to you, John W. Deal, high profile lawyer
34:37
Speaker 1: joining us at John wdel dot com. John, you and
34:41
Speaker 1: I have saying along with you J Morgan, Well, everybody
34:45
Speaker 1: on this panel has saying more than our share of homicides.
34:49
Speaker 1: Do you ever wonder why is it the great people
34:53
Speaker 1: that are martyred? Like this mother of three working three
34:56
Speaker 1: or four jobs just to keep the family go go,
35:00
Speaker 1: along with her husband working just as hard. And then
35:02
Speaker 1: you've got this guy Alan who play carried two keyboards
35:07
Speaker 1: in his car, played all over influenced so many of you.
35:11
Speaker 1: Just a great, wonderful, giving person. Do you ever wonder
35:15
Speaker 1: why them? Yes? Exactly, Nancy. And also a lot of
35:19
Speaker 1: times when we hear about victims, there's a sense to say, well,
35:22
Speaker 1: they shouldn't have been doing what they were doing, doing
35:25
Speaker 1: something risky, But there's absolutely nothing certainly with either of
35:29
Speaker 1: these victims here. They're doing all the right things or
35:31
Speaker 1: out there just trying to make a living and there's
35:34
Speaker 1: no way to say, hey, they contributed somehow. It's putting
35:37
Speaker 1: themselves in the wrong place for the wrong time. Just
35:39
Speaker 1: underscores the tragedy of this case, right jump in. Yeah, listen,
35:45
Speaker 1: you had mentioned like connectivity between people targeting these people.
35:48
Speaker 1: I don't think that there's an organized effort to do this. However,
35:52
Speaker 1: there's an awareness with people that are predators. And keep
35:56
Speaker 1: in mind they are predators, Nancy. Over the years, I've
36:00
Speaker 1: worked cabbies, I've worked pizza delivery people, Chinese food delivery people,
36:05
Speaker 1: and we've actually covered cases of food delivery people on
36:09
Speaker 1: the air. And it's because they're vulnerable. These predator types
36:14
Speaker 1: know that these individuals have no way to defend themselves
36:18
Speaker 1: most of the time that they're focused on their job
36:21
Speaker 1: because they're just going about living their lives and they're
36:24
Speaker 1: in vulnerable places. Just think about if you're a cabby,
36:27
Speaker 1: you're the back of your head is exposed. I've had
36:29
Speaker 1: several that have been executed while driving down the road, Nancy.
36:32
Speaker 1: And these people are among the working class folks out there.
36:37
Speaker 1: They're just trying to make a living. But yet you
36:39
Speaker 1: know their flanks are always open. There's no way to
36:43
Speaker 1: defend yourself because you don't see it coming. Just like Puran,
36:47
Speaker 1: she didn't see this coming. Nancy thinks she would have
36:49
Speaker 1: walked up there on that landing. No, she wouldn't have.
36:52
Speaker 1: But this guy got close enough to bury to bury
36:54
Speaker 1: knife in her neck, and so they are very, very vulnerable.
36:58
Speaker 1: She wanted to do was finish those seventh deliveries, is
37:00
Speaker 1: part of an Uber special and get home to her
37:04
Speaker 1: children and her husband. Right now, the two cases are
37:08
Speaker 1: not being linked. Take a listen to our cut eight
37:11
Speaker 1: NBC k X as police are not linking the killings.
37:17
Speaker 1: Faltam City says their case hits close to home, not
37:20
Speaker 1: only the fact that she was delivering in our city,
37:22
Speaker 1: but the fact that you know she has three children
37:25
Speaker 1: now that that don't have a mother, but also the
37:28
Speaker 1: fact that she's just out trying to make money in
37:30
Speaker 1: this difficult time, during this pandemic. So you know, it's
37:34
Speaker 1: it's a sad deal. Guys. Again, for those of you
37:38
Speaker 1: that can spare even a dollar, I'm going to there
37:42
Speaker 1: gofund me, GoFundMe dot com slash Ryan Dash Graham's Dash
37:51
Speaker 1: funeral Dash expenses Sergeant Peters, do you ever pause and
37:58
Speaker 1: wonder why the great, good, wonderful and kind people fall
38:04
Speaker 1: victim to predators like these two teens? And make no mistake,
38:11
Speaker 1: only one team was holding that night, but they are
38:14
Speaker 1: both going to be charged with murder. Do you ever
38:17
Speaker 1: wonder that, Sergeant Peters? Yeah, you anytime you go to
38:21
Speaker 1: something like this, you always wonder why something like that
38:24
Speaker 1: would happen. And you know that's that's that's why we
38:27
Speaker 1: do our investigation to figure out why somebody would do
38:30
Speaker 1: something like this. But even when you find out why,
38:32
Speaker 1: it just seems so senseless, just may seem want to
38:35
Speaker 1: jump up from this anchor chair and race to my
38:38
Speaker 1: twins and just hold them and protect them and spend
38:42
Speaker 1: every minute I can with them. God be with this
38:46
Speaker 1: precious family. Nancy Grace Crime Story signing off, goodbye friend,