Latest / Worldview Matters With David Fiorazo / M.D. Perkins: Defending Christian Morality And The Need For Culture Warriors

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M.D. Perkins: Defending Christian Morality And The Need For Culture Warriors · Worldview Matters With David Fiorazo

• 0:00
  Here in the Christmas season of 1976, I said I want not to watch television.
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  As we started looking for something to watch, every channel had something inappropriate on
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  it.
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  There was nothing good.
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  I became angry that night.
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  I left the parish ministry and founded the National Federation for Decency.
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  And I remember people going, you're going to do what now?
• 0:23
  Exactly.
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  Welcome to World View Matters, discussing controversial issues, discerning current
• 0:38
  events, defending biblical Christianity.
• 0:42
  No topic off limits.
• 0:45
  And now, here's your host, David Firazzo.
• 0:50
  Hello, friends.
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  God bless you and Merry Christmas season.
• 0:52
  Our guest coming up in just a few minutes, MD Perkins with American Family Association.
• 0:57
  And discussing the role of Christianity and Christians in today's culture, people often
• 1:03
  insist that believers should focus on changing hearts rather than changing politics.
• 1:10
  But according to the late Don E. Wildman at AFA, this is a false dichotomy that does not
• 1:17
  involve an either or option.
• 1:19
  And we're going to talk today about the brand new project or recently released Culture
• 1:24
  Warrior movie through American Family Association.
• 1:27
  Where it is, culture warrior dot movie, culture warrior dot movie.
• 1:32
  You can watch it for free right now.
• 1:34
  But I want to thank a new donor to the podcast, World View Matters Jeff from Couple, Texas.
• 1:41
  It might be Capell.
• 1:42
  But I think it's Couple, Texas God bless you, brother.
• 1:45
  Thank you for your generous gift.
• 1:46
  And we are doing a fundraiser.
• 1:48
  Guys, I'll talk to you more about that about halfway through the podcast.
• 1:51
  But the website worldviewmatters.tv.
• 1:54
  Couple more days of the fundraiser and we're just so thankful for your prayers and your
• 1:59
  support.
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  So I'm going to bring an MD Perkins.
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  He's a research fellow of church and culture for the American Family Association.
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  He joined AFA in 2014 and his primary role has been with American Family Studios where
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  he has written, produced and directed a number of documentaries.
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  They've been amazing.
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  He produced and directed the God who speaks in 2018.
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  Also was a producer on in his image and that was a delighting in God's plan for gender
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  and sexuality.
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  We've had Laura Perry-Smoltz on the podcast and she was in that his book Dangerous Affirmation.
• 2:36
  The threat of gay Christianity gives an in-depth look at the way the LGBT movement has impacted
• 2:42
  the church, unfortunately.
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  And his other writing on sexuality issues can be assessed at a little leaven.
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  And I quoted him in my book, Assault on the Image of God, wrote a lot about the transgender
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  ideology.
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  I quoted his book Dangerous Affirmation.
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  So MD Perkins, welcome to Worldview Matters.
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  Good to see you, brother.
• 3:02
  Yes, thank you, David.
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  Good to be with you today.
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  So we're going to spend a lot of time talking about AFA.
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  I love this organization and I'm so thankful.
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  I've talked to Tim Wildman before and obviously Laura Perry was on.
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  She was featured in his image.
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  But before we dive into Culture Warrior movie, thank you for your book Dangerous Affirmation.
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  I did quote you.
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  I love it.
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  It gets very informative and in-depth and it was a much needed book at the time.
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  And I know we talked about this several years ago.
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  Could you speak to where we are as a culture and a church compared to maybe when you started
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  writing that book because things have gotten better, worse, what have you noticed with
• 3:51
  the transgender ideology and the political battles in our country?
• 3:55
  Well, there's been good news and bad news.
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  I mean, obviously in many respects, we've seen an overall growing support for the LGBT
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  movement, culturally, overall and we've seen that movement infiltrating the church,
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  the rates at which even evangelicals are beginning to show support behind same-sex
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  marriage has grown 10% since 2014 to now.
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  But at the same time, we're also seeing a growing awakening of people to the issues around
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  this, particularly with the transgender movement.
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  I know you're very familiar and probably following closely the Supreme Court case, some of
• 4:34
  the arguments being made there, perhaps you've seen some of the things that are happening
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  in the UK with even in Britain people are beginning to say, this is not right, this
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  is not good, and even in secular societies, people resisting this, not from a Christian
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  perspective, but seeing the harm that it's causing to teenagers, to young kids, to children,
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  and the impact on free speech and all these other things that it's beginning to have.
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  So I think there is a general awakening that is happening among some people, but sadly,
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  I think the church is very timid in speaking out too forwardly on this issue, and that's
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  one of the things that I cover in the book, Dangerous Affirmation.
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  Yeah, why do you think that is?
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  Why do you think?
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  I mean, this is, it's a matter of truth.
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  I mean, aside from science and biology, right?
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  I mean, this is biblical truth and God's creative order.
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  So is it the pastors being afraid to touch on, quote, controversial issues?
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  Is it, because there's a lot of ignorance it seems in the body of Christ on this?
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  There is a lot of ignorance, and I think part of it is that fear that's there, the fear
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  of man overall, also this kind of general sense that we've been receiving over the years
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  that somehow the real impact of the great commission is that we're supposed to be nice
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  to people or we're supposed to say nice things and kind of be perceived as generally nice
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  and agreeable people, because we generally are nice and agreeable people.
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  But there are those points of conflict where what we believe and what the Bible teaches
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  rubs directly against what is being promoted in our culture, and that's one of the things
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  I talk about in the book is the fact that these are competing ideologies and you will never
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  be able to reconcile homosexuality and Christianity, but that's the attempt that's happening
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  with the gay Christian movement.
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  Exactly.
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  This astounds me as a Bible believer and a student of scripture.
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  How much progress the left, the demoniacs have made.
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  But friends, if you can get dangerous affirmation, the threat of gay Christianity, you can get
• 6:45
  that on Amazon.
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  Is there a better place, what website can they go to, MD?
• 6:50
  If you go to dangerousaffirmation.net, you can kind of get it directly from the ministry.
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  We were the one who pushed it, and so you can get it from us, but yeah, it is available
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  on Amazon as well.
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  Okay, dangerousaffirmation.net, very important book friends.
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  So thanks, MD.
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  Now the American Family Association, I love these guys, I love what you do, I'm glad you're
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  a part of it, founded in 1977, 501c3 nonprofit, and I'll tell you what, so you know the history
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  now of AFA, you've been with them for several years, they have branched out into so many
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  different venues, and they're doing some effective work in this country for righteousness,
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  for the biblical morality, share a little bit about the early development of AFA, and
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  just what you've perceived now that you've come on board and you've been with them for
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  a while.
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  Well, the amazing thing about working on a documentary like this is that I get to spend
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  countless hours really just digging through all of the history and the minutia, all these
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  old files, old pictures, old videos, all the stuff, and you know, stuff, frankly, some
• 8:00
  of which that was on its way to the trash can, and I intercepted it on the way, it's
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  the one who went through the first, you know, a handful of gems coming through that,
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  but you know, Don Wildman, who was just a Methodist minister from here in Tupelo, in
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  Northeast Mississippi, founded the ministry because he was concerned about television, and
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  he sat down one night, December 1976, to watch television with his family, and there
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  was only three network stations at the time, I'm sure a number of people remember this,
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  there was only ABC, CBS, and NBC, and on each one of those, he found something objectionable
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  and they were each objectionable from a different perspective.
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  One was, you know, kind of adulterous affair that was becoming more and more seductive,
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  one was obscenity and profanity kind of on the show, and then one was his violent act with
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  one man beating another with a hammer, and he was sitting down to watch TV in the Christmas
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  season, you know, he's ready to just enjoy something that was festive or, you know, sentimental
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  or something, just generally, you know, good wholesome entertainment for the family.
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  So he had his son turn off the TV, Tim, you know, who's now president of AFA, but Tim
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  was in high school at the time, and he had Tim turn off the TV, and Don sat there and
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  kind of contemplated what had happened, what had happened at the course of his life, born
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  in the mid-1930s, and, you know, was kind of used to a certain way that society functions,
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  and the way that people thought, and was realizing that was not the case anymore.
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  And it wasn't that these were completely new revelations to him.
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  He had noticed that there were more and more raunchy things on TV and in movies and stuff,
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  but it hit him that night just how passive he had been, and so that's what motivated him
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  to get involved.
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  He organized something called Turn the Television Off Week.
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  He went to his local congregation, got them on board, and then through that began to
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  realize, really, I need to leave the pastoral ministry and step into more of this public
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  activism and advocacy front in order to awaken the church and believers to the things that
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  have been happening while, essentially, while we have been asleep, you know, while we
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  have just been sitting bypassively with this live and let live approach without really
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  realizing that God has called us to something more.
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  He's called us to be able to speak to the issues publicly, and in America, we have the
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  opportunity to do that as citizens.
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  So, you know, just really kind of taking up that mantle, and so it grew, AFA has grown
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  from that initial concern of television to dealing with questions of pornography, anti-critical
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  bias in the media, the homosexual agenda, and just so many other fronts, from the political
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  front to the social front to issues arising in the church and in denominations, AFA has
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  been actively involved in trying to raise awareness, and not just, like, talk about it,
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  but get Christians involved.
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  Like, what can we do to make a difference, and that was really what we're all about?
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  And that's needed more today than ever, because the biblical, the moral decline and the
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  biblical literacy.
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  So, you've got two things happening at the same time, which, you know, the church kind
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  of drives culture, or it should, but it doesn't work that way anymore, culture is driving
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  the church.
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  But that was in the late 1970s, MD Perkins.
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  That was, he was noticing this and going, what have we been doing about this as the body
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  of Christ?
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  And here we are today.
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  So I'm thankful for the work you guys have done, AFA.net and continue to do.
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  My friends, I want to give the website again for the culture warrior movie.
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  And it is culture warrior dot movie.
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  And at the very beginning of this podcast today, we showed a 30 second trailer.
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  There is a two and a half minute trailer you can watch, if you go to culture warrior
• 11:52
  dot movie.
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  So we'll jump around a little bit, MD today, and I want to say Merry Christmas to you.
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  Merry Christmas season.
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  Merry Christmas.
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  I also want to talk about the Christmas campaign.
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  Say Merry Christmas, right?
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  People think that's not a big deal.
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  People want to say happy holidays.
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  Let them say happy holidays.
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  What are your thoughts about just that?
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  Well, you know, it's interesting.
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  I was just watching an NFL football game the other night and the one of the commentators
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  was reading the script about something that you could do at your holiday party, your
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  office holiday party.
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  And I thought this is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard just from a linguistic
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  perspective.
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  You know, I'm sitting down to watch a professional sports game tonight.
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  You know, I'm not watching a NFL football game.
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  I'm watching a professional sports game.
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  You know, it's just losing that aspect of specificity.
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  But even more deeply, we recognize that there is there is an affront to anything that recognizes
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  Jesus or Christianity is being involved in the shaping and molding of American culture
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  and society.
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  So it's just, you know, I mean, these were things that Don and AFA have been involved
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  in for a long time.
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  I mean, Don was recognizing some of these early movements.
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  He spoke about the anti-Christian bias that was creeping into movies and television, the
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  way that television depictions rarely ever had a character on there in the modern day
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  that was a Christian without it being some kind of cookie character or somebody who's
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  a psychopath or just, you know, really hypocritical and all of these things.
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  So I think it feeds into this longstanding thing that's been influenced by secularism
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  and all these other things to just eradicate the Christian influence from society, even
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  though everybody still recognizes what Christmas is and even that word, but it's funny that
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  resistance, even the word Christmas that we see even today.
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  How offensive.
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  Oh, you said eradicate, that was my first book.
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  My first book was eradicate, blotting out God in America and this is what's been happening
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  and I think AFA has opened a lot of eyes of people, but I just want to mention, by the
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  way, it was originally AFA was named the National Federation for Decency and then changed
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  to American Family Association in 1988.
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  So let me just, so I keep track, I was telling you before we got on the show that I keep
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  track of watch television, come or not everyone, but when I do watch a movie or a show and
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  I see commercials that obviously the red and the green and the presence and they even have
• 14:24
  a tree, maybe Santa's involved somehow, but they never mentioned Christmas.
• 14:29
  Very rarely do you hear Christmas anymore.
• 14:31
  I just want to mention a handful and then we'll have to take a break and we'll get your
• 14:34
  thoughts when we come back.
• 14:35
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• 14:38
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  Pizza Hut, this holiday, lows, knows how to help your holiday and that's a partial list.
• 15:06
  MD will get your thoughts on that and talk more about the culture warrior movie when we
• 15:10
  come back on World View Matters.
• 15:12
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• 16:15
  So MD Perkins, American Family Association, what are your thoughts on the blatant, almost
• 16:22
  whitewashing of Christmas or Merry Christmas or mentioning Christ during this time of year?
• 16:28
  It's astounding in the United States of America, isn't it?
• 16:31
  Yeah, I mean, it's just more of the erosion, you know, I mean, this is the longstanding
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  influence of secular humanism that wants to pretend as if secularism is normal life and
• 16:46
  that people have no really real religious influence or persuasion or interest at all, except
• 16:54
  of course, now Apple is assaulting us with all the Muslim holidays on our phones and calendar
• 17:02
  apps and all of that.
• 17:03
  But you know, it's just, I don't know, it's just ridiculous too.
• 17:07
  I mean, the word holiday as if it's just some generic term, there's a specific holiday
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  that we're celebrating and it's okay to acknowledge it even if you're not a Christian, even
• 17:17
  if you're not really celebrating it for the reason religiously that Christians are celebrating
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  it with the advent of Christ and you know, Christ coming into the world to take on human
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  flesh and say people from their sins.
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  I mean, that's, you know, that's why we celebrate it and we extend that out to some of the
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  festivities of gift giving and, you know, Merry making and all these sorts of things.
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  But, you know, it's just, it's just ridiculous.
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  Like I was saying, you know, it's like saying, I'm just going to sit down and watch professional
• 17:47
  sports game instead of saying that I'm going to watch a football game, you know, just
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  linguistically, it's silly and foolish, but you know, we recognize there's something
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  more underneath it that's obviously.
• 17:58
  Oh, yeah, absolutely.
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  And it goes back a long ways and it is demonically driven because you want to remove all references
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  to Christianity, Christ, the truth.
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  I want to mention for nearly four decades, Don Wildman served as a founding figure in the
• 18:11
  pro family movement.
• 18:12
  He's been on the front lines and that's why I appreciate AFA so much and so MD, I want
• 18:17
  to quote Tim, Tim Wildman, then let you continue to respond with regards to the culture warrior
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  movie.
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  He said, this is back in the 1970s along with others like Dr. James Dobson and Dr. D. James
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  Kennedy.
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  A lot of what my dad saw was the cultural and moral decline going on in America.
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  He wanted to try to do something to stop it or at least hold it back because he knew
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  like others who were looking into the future that if America began to reject the Judeo-Christian
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  heritage of our country and our founders, we would eventually end up where we are now.
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  End quote, that's from Tim Don Wildman son, who's now the president of AFA.
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  So your thoughts on that, that was almost prophetic.
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  What Don was doing and what Don was looking ahead to seeing if we don't get more Christians
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  involved, more culture warriors to resist this evil and to promote righteousness and stand
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  on the truth, we are going to be in a very dangerous place one day.
• 19:22
  Go ahead, MD.
• 19:23
  Yeah, you know, Don was often characterized, I think rightly we could say at this point
• 19:29
  as a prophet, you know, speaking to people, speaking to the church, whoever would listen
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  and trying to point people back toward righteousness and truth and frankly just common sense
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  a lot of times now, kind of the battle that we're facing these days.
• 19:43
  But you know, I think there was a lot of stirring that was happening there in the late 1970s,
• 19:48
  early 80s.
• 19:49
  You think of the ministries that were begun at that point, the rise of prominence of
• 19:53
  men like Dr. James Dobson and Jerry Falwell and DJ James Kennedy and some of these figures
• 19:59
  that were speaking not only Christian truth and the gospel message but also linking that
• 20:05
  to Christian involvement in the culture and society and speaking out on social issues.
• 20:10
  And so that's one of the things that we're trying to do in the culture warrior documentary
• 20:13
  is to make that connection for people, especially younger viewers who may not realize the
• 20:18
  history behind the movement.
• 20:21
  They may just remember something like the Disney boycott in the late 90s and think, well,
• 20:25
  Christians were just kind of irritated about, you know, they saw something kind of weird
• 20:29
  in a Disney movie one time and it made them upset.
• 20:32
  Well, no, there was actually, there was a lot of concern about what happens when you
• 20:37
  start to normalize homosexuality, for instance, in the case of the Disney boycott was there
• 20:42
  were corporate policies that had changed at the Disney corporate level.
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  This was the mid to late 90s, by the way, you know, think about Disney now.
• 20:51
  But the corporate policies were changing.
• 20:53
  They were starting to host gay days at Disney, which were the kind of exclusive, but we're
• 21:01
  not advertised nationally, but we're advertised within homosexual magazines and periodic things
• 21:08
  like that.
• 21:09
  And then families were showing up just ready for a normal family vacation.
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  And then suddenly they see two guys walking down the street holding hands and kissing
• 21:16
  each other.
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  And they're like, wait, why are all of these people here at the same time, what's going
• 21:20
  on?
• 21:21
  And then they realize, and of course, Disney brass denied it for a while.
• 21:27
  But, you know, these are the stories of the culture wars, you know, dispatches from the
• 21:32
  culture wars, as I like to describe it, you know, these are the stories of things that
• 21:36
  have happened that I think many people have forgotten about why Christians have been involved
• 21:41
  in these things.
• 21:42
  What were those initial concerns?
• 21:44
  You know, you spoke about holding things back.
• 21:47
  You know, the pornography issue is something that began to be something that Don focused
• 21:53
  on very heavily in the 1980s, especially with convenience stores selling Playboy and Pinthouse
• 21:59
  pornographic magazines.
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  And of course, there were worse things in Playboy and Pinthouse magazines in terms of the
• 22:04
  depictions, but Don always emphasized the fact that these were soft core magazines.
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  And yes, there was harder things out there, but he said those things are prosecutable.
• 22:13
  The hardcore stuff is prosecutable.
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  But if we can get people to deal with the soft core pornography, it'll be much easier
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  to deal with some of the hardcore stuff that are in kind of these other places.
• 22:24
  And you know, if you walk into, I don't know where people shop, you know, if it's a Kroger
• 22:30
  or a Walmart or whatever, but you know, I walk into a Kroger store, you know, and I look
• 22:35
  at the magazine rack, which still exists, even though people are in magazines.
• 22:40
  And you know what I don't see?
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  I don't see Playboy and Pinthouse magazine.
• 22:44
  Now that is not because Kroger just of its own goodwill just decided to no longer host
• 22:50
  these magazines on its shelves.
• 22:53
  That was the result of Christians being involved in the efforts in the 1980s because of
• 22:58
  guys like Don Wallmann raising awareness about this, getting Christians all to speak at
• 23:02
  their local supermarkets and convenience stores and drug stores and things like that.
• 23:08
  And to complain, because oftentimes he noted at the time that, you know, the managers
• 23:14
  of these stores would say, you know, I would like to get rid of these magazines, but I have
• 23:19
  to have a formal complaint from a customer before I can actually make a case for removing
• 23:24
  them, but I'm just kind of waiting.
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  And Don would kind of make that connection for people who have like, there are reasons
• 23:32
  that you can make a stand, you can stand up and speak out and have a difference.
• 23:36
  So even now we are living in the fruit of some of that effort like, yes, there have been
• 23:42
  numerous declines and other people still have to take up the mantle and pornography technologically
• 23:47
  has changed from magazines to internet and phone and videos and all those kinds of things.
• 23:54
  But there are still ways that we can stand up and speak out and have a difference.
• 23:57
  And that was one of the big messages we want people to see to take away from the documentary
• 24:01
  culture warrior is that one person can make a difference.
• 24:04
  Amen, brother.
• 24:05
  Amen.
• 24:06
  Again, the website friends culture warrior dot movie.
• 24:10
  So 2017, I think, if I remember right, MD Perkins target corporation changed their bathroom
• 24:18
  policy to allow biological males to go into women's dressing rooms and restrooms.
• 24:24
  I don't think they have reversed that policy.
• 24:29
  And some corporations are doubling down on this and where do you see this going and because
• 24:36
  I don't see enough resistance and they're quietly continuing to support transgender ideologies
• 24:42
  with their big, you know, section with LGBT merchandise.
• 24:45
  Go ahead in your thoughts.
• 24:46
  In the last three minutes here, where do you see this going and what else can we do?
• 24:52
  Well part of the issue here is that there's a guy named Darrell Paul who's a sociologist
• 24:57
  who made the case that part of the reason that corporations were so involved in the marriage
• 25:03
  fight is because they held up gay marriage as basically an icon of what it means to be a
• 25:09
  cultural elite.
• 25:10
  The idea that you want to be seen as someone who's intellectual and all of these things.
• 25:17
  So it will take a lot of resistance, I think, from the public in order to really pull down
• 25:23
  some of these things at the corporate level because these are ideologies that are balled
• 25:27
  in, balled into very heavily by the administrators and executives and things like this.
• 25:34
  But you know, what we are seeing is that sometimes behind the scenes there is resistance to
• 25:39
  this because it's seen as not reaching the same market that they want to reach.
• 25:44
  And quietly behind the scenes corporations will change their policies or shift things
• 25:49
  without making public statement and no press releases are coming out about this.
• 25:54
  But they will shift some of their policies and things behind the scenes because they
• 25:57
  want to acknowledge that still the majority of people recognize how foolish and ridiculous
• 26:02
  this is.
• 26:03
  You know, if you can't define what a man or a woman is, then you don't have any real position
• 26:09
  to be on the Supreme Court for the first, but even more broadly, you know, it upends all
• 26:17
  sorts of ability for just basic blog and conversation and debate and all of that.
• 26:22
  So I think they're the growing resistance to some of those things at the public level.
• 26:26
  Well, I hope there's more and I hope more churches pastors have to get a spine, a backbone.
• 26:32
  I think more pastors have to get on board with this.
• 26:36
  Like pastor story hour, there's a couple that are doing that instead of the drag story
• 26:39
  hours.
• 26:40
  They're reading kids books or reading Biblical stories.
• 26:43
  And there was some resistance to that, by the way.
• 26:45
  A lot of libraries didn't want to do that, but anyway, there's a lot of good movements.
• 26:49
  I think we need a lot more, but MD, I would love to have you back.
• 26:53
  There's so much more to talk about, but I appreciate AFA stance and a couple of things
• 26:58
  that they continue to try to do to inform, equip and activate individuals to strengthen
• 27:04
  the moral foundations of American culture and give aid to the church, help the church
• 27:09
  get out there and fight these battles.
• 27:12
  Let's check out dangerous affirmation by MD Perkins, great book and also a culture warrior
• 27:17
  movie.
• 27:18
  This is so important guys, so it's a great topic where we will continue to have to talk
• 27:23
  about these things.
• 27:24
  So brother, Mary Christmas and say hi to our friends there at AFA, thanks for your time.
• 27:30
  Merry Christmas and thank you for the time.
• 27:32
  Most welcome, MD.
• 27:33
  All right, Lord willing, we will have him back.
• 27:36
  Thank you guys so much for sharing the podcast.
• 27:38
  Merry Christmas.
• 27:39
  God bless you and as always, keep speaking the truth about things that matter.