Latest / The Epstein Chronicles / Mega Edition: Tova Noel’s Account of the Morning Jeffrey Epstein Died (Part 11-13) (5/19/26)

Transcript

Mega Edition: Tova Noel’s Account of the Morning Jeffrey Epstein Died (Part 11-13) (5/19/26) · The Epstein Chronicles

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the
• 0:03
  Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to dive right
• 0:06
  back in to the Tovin Noel interview with the OIG Inspectors. Question,
• 0:13
  all right, and who was present with you in the
• 0:15
  shoe after midnight from approximately six point thirty on August tenth,
• 0:20
  twenty nineteen, Noel, me and Thomas. Question anyone else? Noel?
• 0:25
  No question visitors Noel lieutenant redacted? Question at around what
• 0:31
  time did she visit? Noel? I don't remember the time.
• 0:35
  Question does around four amsul? Right? Noel, I don't remember
• 0:39
  the time, to be honest. Question okay, was there another
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  officer that you remember around like five thirty am that
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  visited Noel? No the officer upstairs? He left to go
• 0:50
  get food and come back. Question so would that be
• 0:54
  ten Souths? Noel? Yeah? Question all right? And then when
• 0:59
  he leaves ten Souths to come to the shoe, do
• 1:02
  you also have to allow him access into the shoe
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  or is he able to get into the shoe by himself?
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  Noel coming down from ten South question uh huh, Noel.
• 1:13
  Thomas relieved him, and then he came down and went
• 1:16
  question Thomas relieved the person on ten South. Noel. Yeah. Question,
• 1:21
  So Thomas wasn't assigned to the shoe. He was assigned
• 1:24
  to ten South, Noel, he was assigned to the shoe. Question,
• 1:29
  So can you just explain what you mean by relieve?
• 1:32
  You mean he relieved him temporarily while he got food. Noel.
• 1:36
  He called and said that the lieutenant said that he
• 1:39
  could go get his food. So can one of us
• 1:41
  relieve him to go get his food? So Thomas went
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  relieved him, and he came down and he went out
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  to get his food. Question. Okay, so you were the
• 1:50
  only person in the shoe at that point, Noel downstairs,
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  I guess, question and Thomas Noel as far as the time,
• 1:58
  I don't know. Question. Okay, so are there only two
• 2:01
  people that were in the shoe? Foy? Do you want
• 2:06
  context of when that requests from redacted to get coverage
• 2:10
  to get food? Because there's context there? Question? Sure? I mean, Foy,
• 2:15
  all right, So I want you to talk about what
• 2:17
  you were doing before he asked you, right, Noel, Okay, Foy,
• 2:21
  you remember what you were doing? Noel, I remember what
• 2:25
  I was doing. But she gets cut off by Foy.
• 2:28
  This is a three event there's a five event and
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  then Noel. Oh, like, I counted with redacted upstairs at
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  the time, and when I came back downstairs, he called
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  and he said that the lieutenant said to relieve him
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  to go get food. I didn't believe them, so I
• 2:44
  called the lieutenant's office and I said, did you say
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  for me to relieve redacted to get food? But another
• 2:50
  lieutenant came on, so he said, well, I don't know
• 2:53
  if the lieutenant before said that. So I said okay,
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  and I hung the phone up, and Thomas said, I'll
• 2:59
  go relieve him so he could go get his food. Question, okay,
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  And I do apologize. You counted with him, Noel, Yeah, question,
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  and you're talking about the individual in ten South Noel, yes, question,
• 3:14
  and then you came back to the shoe and then
• 3:16
  Thomas relieved him Noel, Yes, question, Noel. But I don't
• 3:22
  remember if it was at three or five. I don't
• 3:26
  remember which one. Redacted all right, And I do apologize.
• 3:30
  I just want to make sure I have this clear.
• 3:32
  So when you went up at either three or five,
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  and I'm assuming it was five, you helped him count
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  and at that point when he said he wanted to
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  go get food, Noel. When I came back downstairs, he called, question,
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  Oh so not while you were doing the count? Noel.
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  No question, so you left? Noel came back downstairs. Question
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  he called and said, I just spoke to the lieutenant. Noel.
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  He said the lieutenant said for you had to relieve
• 4:01
  me to get food. Question and then you said you
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  verified that? Noel. I called question the lieutenant Noel, yes,
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  question was this both redacted? Both times? Was that who
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  it was? Noel? No When I called lieutenant redacted answered
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  and he said he didn't know. Question, so was lieutenant redacted?
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  So this would have been at like five point thirty?
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  Then probably Noel? Probably question. Okay, if you look at
• 4:28
  the schedule, can you tell me what time redacted came on? Noel?
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  On here it says eight to four. Question. Are you
• 4:35
  looking at eight ten August tenth, Noel, Yeah, but it
• 4:39
  was before that it was indiscernible. Question. Oh sorry, there's
• 4:44
  a little caveat there. So the officers times are two
• 4:47
  hours before. Would he have started at six? But I
• 4:51
  believe he actually his would have been six to two
• 4:54
  as opposed to eight to four like the roster. So
• 4:57
  it's confusing. They allowed the lieutenants to come in two
• 5:00
  hours earlier and then their shifts too earlier. Noel, Uh
• 5:04
  huh question, but I do believe he arrived at five thirty,
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  so this would have been probably you said you said
• 5:11
  there were two different lieutenants you spoke to, so I'm
• 5:13
  assuming one. Noel cuts him off. No, I spoke to
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  Lieutenant redacted asking did he say for me to relieve
• 5:20
  Thomas to get the food? So he said he didn't know.
• 5:23
  Maybe Lieutenant redacted told him, but I didn't speak to her. Question. Sure,
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  and what I think that he started around five thirty,
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  so he probably called around like five twenty eight, spoke
• 5:35
  with lieutenant and then you probably called shortly after five thirty.
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  Does that sound like potentially it could have happened, Noel
• 5:42
  could have yeah. Question. Okay, So does around that five
• 5:45
  thirty time frame, right before you know you were going
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  to feed the inmates, does that sound about right? Noel
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  right question? Okay, so the five am count that discernible?
• 5:56
  Noel right question? Okay, so he is I'm sorry, who
• 6:00
  was intense south Noel redacted? Question? It was redacted? And
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  then who else visited the shoe where Epstein was housed
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  between twelve am and six thirty Noel, Lieutenant redacted question,
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  are they the only two people that visited the shoe
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  aside from you and Thomas? Noel? Yeah, question, okay, no
• 6:20
  one else? Noell, no question. Okay, when you were in
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  the shoe with Thomas, was there a hierarchy then? Noel.
• 6:26
  On the paper it says that I was number one? Question?
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  And would that be? I know you said a lot
• 6:31
  of time, it's because you're new you would ask other
• 6:34
  people for guidance. Is that because that was your quarterly post? Noel? Yeah,
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  the post question? And was Thomas in there as an
• 6:43
  overtime post? Noel? Yeah, question, not as regular assignment? Noel,
• 6:47
  correct question. So on paper you were in charge, but
• 6:51
  in practice you're both the same. Noel. In practice, I
• 6:55
  ask because I don't know. So even if I'm in charge,
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  I don't know everything because I'm new. So I asked
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  the senior officer question. Okay, do you remember any conversations
• 7:05
  you had with Thomas that knight? Noel. As far as question,
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  just were you conversing while you were there just the
• 7:14
  two of you? Noel, I'm not, She gets cut off.
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  I'm not asking for what conversations at this point, I'm
• 7:21
  just saying, were you talking to one another? Noel? No
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  not really. Question You guys didn't really communicate or talk Noel,
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  No question. Okay, do you remember any conversation with regard
• 7:32
  to Epstein at all? Noel? No question. All right, So
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  it's just the two of you. You said, redacted and
• 7:39
  redacted the only four people from that those periods when
• 7:42
  you started your shift at twelve am to six thirty Noel.
• 7:46
  Correct question. What was the purpose of redacted's visit? Noel
• 7:51
  to conduct a round? Question? Okay? And what is she
• 7:54
  required to do during a round? Noel, I don't know. Question.
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  Are you aware if she was supposed to conduct the
• 8:01
  count with you during her rounds or Noel, She's not
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  supposed to conduct the count, but I don't know how
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  she's supposed to conduct the rounds. Question. So do you
• 8:12
  understand if her round is that a round of her
• 8:15
  staff members or is it also she's supposed to do
• 8:19
  anything with inmates when she does rounds? Noel, I don't know. Question.
• 8:24
  You don't know. Do you remember when she entered and
• 8:27
  exited the shoe who let her in and out? Noel?
• 8:30
  I did question both times? Both in and out. Noel,
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  Yeah question okay. And when was that about when redacted
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  departed the shoe? Who let him in and out? Noel?
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  That I don't remember. Question. Would it be Noel cuts
• 8:46
  them off? But it probably would have been me? Question
• 8:49
  you since Thomas relieved them Noel right went upstairs? Noel,
• 8:54
  yeah question. I would think Thomas went up there, then
• 8:58
  you probably would have Noel cuts them off, let them out?
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  Yeah question. Okay. And both with redacted and redacted, you
• 9:06
  verified that those doors were shut and sealed Noel, yeah. Question.
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  And no one else got in and out between those times? Noel,
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  no question. And there were those two individuals authorized visitors
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  and authorized visits within the shoe? Noel? Who lieutenant redacted? Question?
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  Was there a presence in the shoe authorized? Noel, yes question?
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  Was it justified? And did you see them the entire
• 9:32
  time that they were actually in the shoe? Noel, yes question.
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  Was there anything out of the ordinary? Noel, no question.
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  Do any either of them have conversations about Epstein? Noel,
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  no question. And you say redacted was the operations lieutenant
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  on August tenth, Noel, yeah, question. Did you have any
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  conversations with her on the phone? Noel. Know question that
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  you recall. No What about like when you guys would
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  call in counts, Noel, I don't remember who took the count,
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  but when I got called control to give the count,
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  I don't remember if it was her that took the count. Question. Okay,
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  So you don't recall any other conversations with redacted besides
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  from when she visited at four to check in, Noel,
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  correct question. And she never provided any special instruction, Noel,
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  no question about anything during that shift, Noel, no question.
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  She never told you that Epstein was required to have
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  a cell mate, Noel, no question. Didn't ask about reus
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  or anything, Noel, no question, or about a new cell
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  mate being placed in Noel, no question. All right, And
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  we just briefly mentioned that who was Lieutenant redacted? Noel,
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  the lieutenant that came on in the morning question Okay,
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  and he started, we believe around five point thirty based
• 10:58
  upon what we just talked about. Well, correct question, Okay,
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  five thirty am on August tenth. During the conversation, you
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  said that you called Lieutenant redacted. What all was spoken
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  about during that call? Noel? If I should relieve or
• 11:12
  redacted to get food? If that's what he said. Question
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  any discussion about inmates, Noel, No question. Any discussion about Epstein, Noel,
• 11:22
  no question. No he didn't provide any special instruction or
• 11:27
  ask about anything about your shift, Noel. No question about
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  him coming on, Noel, No question. Do you remember if
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  the Control Center R and D or anyone else called
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  the Shoe on August ninth or tenth during your two
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  shifts about Epstein's cellmate leaving. Noel. I don't know if
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  they did. They didn't speak to me. Question you didn't
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  speak with anybody, Noel, No question, R and D or
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  anyone else, Noel, no question. If an inmate is removed
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  from SHOE and is released from MCC, how does the
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  Shoe find out? Noel, I don't know. Question you don't know, Noel,
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  No question. Has that ever happened to you before? Noel?
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  Where an inmate is gone? No question. When an inmate
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  goes to court or something and then is released, Noel,
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  know if that happens like redacted gives the phone to
• 12:19
  the senior officer, because I don't know, but that never happened.
• 12:23
  Where like an inmate was released when I'm there? Question?
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  So from four PM on August ninth, you don't recall
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  that call coming in, Noel, know or discussion happening? Question? Noel,
• 12:35
  not to me. How about about Reyes not coming back? Noel,
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  not to me. No question. And you didn't have a
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  conversation with anybody at all, Noel, Nope. Question. And you
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  don't know if Control or R and D or anybody
• 12:50
  spoke with anybody else, Noel, I don't know. Question. Even
• 12:54
  if they didn't discuss the details of it, you didn't
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  overhear the conversation, Noel, no question. So what's your understanding
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  if Reyes is released on August ninth from the shoe,
• 13:05
  Epstein's required Davis, cel mate, what should have happened? Noel,
• 13:09
  I don't know what should have happened because when I
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  came in at four, the cell was empty, so I
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  don't know what should have happened. Epstein came back and
• 13:17
  went to a cell. I don't know where Reus is
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  or if he's coming back, so I don't know what
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  should have happened. Question. Okay, So if an inmate is required, Davis,
• 13:27
  cel mate, such as Epstein, when the cell mate, sorry,
• 13:31
  I don't know if I just bespoke if Epstein was required,
• 13:34
  Davis cell mate, as Epstein was after a cell mate departs,
• 13:38
  which was Reyes. Do you know if there's how long
• 13:41
  it should take for him to get replaced? Noel, I
• 13:44
  don't know. Question. You don't know that, Noel. No question.
• 13:48
  Do you know who the decision makers would be on that, Noel,
• 13:51
  I don't know. Question. Do you know if you were
• 13:54
  authorized to assign Epstein a cell mate? Noel, I don't know.
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  Question again, no conversation at all, Noel, none. Question. He's gone.
• 14:03
  No you don't remember him being removed from the roster list.
• 14:07
  So when you're doing your rounds in your accounts, Noel,
• 14:09
  No question. You know how many are supposed to be counting? Noel? No.
• 14:16
  All right. So we're going to wrap up right there,
• 14:18
  and in the next episode dealing with the topic, we're
• 14:20
  gonna pick up where we left off. All the information
• 14:23
  that goes with this episode can be found in the
• 14:26
  description box. What's up, everyone, and welcome to another episode
• 14:30
  of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode, we're going to
• 14:34
  dive right back in to the Tovin o Weell interview
• 14:37
  with the OIG Inspectors. Question. All right, We're just going
• 14:42
  to talk a little bit about counts and rounds according
• 14:44
  to you. What is a cell count? And you have
• 14:48
  it in front of you if you need to refer
• 14:49
  to the policy. But what is your understanding of a
• 14:52
  cell count or sorry, an inmate count? Noel? You count
• 14:57
  every inmate to make sure that they're alive. Question to
• 15:00
  make sure that they're alive and accounted for? Noel, yes,
• 15:04
  question all right? And can you just explain the process? Noel.
• 15:08
  The first officer goes down and counts, and then the
• 15:11
  second officer goes down and counts, and then we confirm
• 15:14
  the numbers. Question. Okay, And prior to confirming the numbers,
• 15:18
  do you tell the other officer how many you counted? Noel?
• 15:22
  No question? All right. So you get your number, then
• 15:25
  another officer goes down, gets their number, Noel. And when
• 15:29
  they come back. Question and is that tier by tier
• 15:33
  or do you she cuts them off? Yes? Tre by tier?
• 15:37
  Question tier by tier? Just one person stands outside while
• 15:40
  the other person goes down range and counts the inmates. Noel. Yeah.
• 15:45
  Question So do you have to like see the person moving?
• 15:48
  What do you need to do when you're doing the count? Noel,
• 15:51
  You need to see the prisoner move redacted? Question do
• 15:55
  you have to like talk to them, make sure they're
• 15:57
  responsive or anything like that, Noel. Or you could see
• 16:00
  them breathing. Question, just as long as you see some life. Okay.
• 16:05
  So what are the requirements in the shoe on? How
• 16:07
  often is account conducted for counts? Noel? Count is at four.
• 16:12
  I mean it's been a long time. I really don't remember,
• 16:15
  but I think four, ten, twelve, three and five. Question. Okay,
• 16:20
  So four pm, ten pm, twelve am, three am, and
• 16:24
  five am Noel. Yeah. Question And is this every day
• 16:28
  or is it Monday through Friday? Do you know, Noel?
• 16:31
  Every day? Question? Every day? And you're just making sure
• 16:35
  that they're alive. You don't actually have to speak to them, Noel. No,
• 16:39
  you don't. Question, Okay. And what's the difference what's around Noel?
• 16:44
  I mean the round you're walking down the tier basically
• 16:47
  checking to see if they're okay, but you're not counting.
• 16:50
  You're just checking to make sure. Question. So you're doing
• 16:54
  the same thing. You're just counting the inmates, all right,
• 16:57
  So you're making sure that they're okay and they're alive. Noel. Yeah,
• 17:02
  Like you don't need a number. Question, but one CEO
• 17:05
  goes down checks and then does the other one or
• 17:09
  does there only need to be one Noel, Well, it's
• 17:12
  one question, so both don't need to actually do that, Noel,
• 17:15
  No question, all right, So just one CEO goes down,
• 17:19
  does the other CEO have to remain at the door
• 17:22
  to make sure the CEO is okay? Noel? Yeah. Question. Okay.
• 17:27
  So is that the difference then, Noel, between the counts
• 17:29
  and the rounds? Yeah. Question, Only one CEO is required,
• 17:33
  that's for your understanding of policy. Noel, yeah. Question okay.
• 17:38
  And during the rounds, do you have to speak with
• 17:40
  the inmates? Noel, you don't have to question. No, But
• 17:44
  on both instances, both CEOs have to be present. You're
• 17:47
  just saying. With rounds, only one CEO actually needs to
• 17:50
  go down, Noel, go down range? Yeah question. You said
• 17:54
  the purpose is to make sure that they're okay and
• 17:57
  they're alive. Noel. Yes. Question. And are they are the
• 18:01
  counts and the rounds both documented? Noel? Yeah question? And
• 18:07
  do you have to sign documents when you conduct counts
• 18:09
  and rounds? Noel? Yeah. Question. Okay. Now, if you and
• 18:13
  another officer, like on the case of when you work
• 18:16
  twelve am to eight am, if you and another officer.
• 18:20
  Are the only ones assigned to the shoe? Are you
• 18:23
  both just responsible for documenting the round sheets and the
• 18:26
  count slips? So if you're the one documenting all the
• 18:30
  rounds for the thirty minute rounds, is your documentation does
• 18:34
  that also carry weight for the other person that's with you?
• 18:38
  Are you signing for both? Noel? I don't think so,
• 18:42
  because I just have my signature. Question, so you would
• 18:45
  take responsibility for the cell count rather than saying that
• 18:49
  you're both responsible? Noel, Well, the rounds and the counts
• 18:53
  have to be done with two people. Question. Let me
• 18:56
  just show you so you know what I'm talking about.
• 18:59
  I'm just going to show you from August ninth and
• 19:01
  tenth the cell counts and the rounds so that there's
• 19:05
  no misunderstanding. So this first one is going to be
• 19:09
  the eight nine twenty nineteen for the thirty minute check sheet,
• 19:14
  and the other one is going to be a ten
• 19:16
  twenty nineteen. Can you just let me know if you
• 19:19
  see your handwriting and initials on these two documents? Noel, Yes,
• 19:24
  question okay, and I guess we'll first discuss August ninth.
• 19:28
  Where do you see it and from what time to
• 19:30
  what time? Noel from four to eleven thirty question, and
• 19:34
  are you ever one of them? Noel? Yeah? Question okay,
• 19:37
  So every thirty minutes you have your initials and you
• 19:40
  wrote those, that's actually your initials on that one Noel, yeah. Question?
• 19:45
  And what about on August tenth, twenty nineteen, Noel, yes,
• 19:50
  question okay. So what I'm asking here is by placing
• 19:54
  those initials, is that now fall on you or if
• 19:57
  you're only two people in there, like on aug tenth,
• 20:00
  are you basically signing for both people or do you
• 20:03
  think you're only signing for yourself? They're avowing what the
• 20:08
  round was conducted? Noel, I don't know. Question okay, Noel.
• 20:13
  I guess like you're trying to say, if the rounds
• 20:15
  have to be conducted with two people and then I sign,
• 20:18
  it would be I don't know. Question okay, But you
• 20:22
  did sign and certify that they were conducted, Noel, Yeah.
• 20:26
  Question okay. And what do you do with the rounds?
• 20:30
  The sheets? How are those maintained? Noel? Well, I usually
• 20:33
  fill it out like prior in hopes to conduct the round,
• 20:37
  like when I work in the shoe, I never actually
• 20:39
  done the round every thirty minutes, like when you go
• 20:42
  down to give out toilet paper that's counted as around,
• 20:45
  to pick up trays it's counted as around, to give
• 20:48
  out food that's counted as around. But and then you
• 20:53
  fill it out either after or before. You're not sitting
• 20:56
  like every thirty minutes, like filling it out? Question? Okay,
• 21:00
  And you said you did it a lot of times
• 21:03
  prior to actually conducting the round Noel, yeah. Question all right.
• 21:08
  And with the rounds, do you call anybody with that information? Noel,
• 21:12
  no question. What's done with the sheet? Is it at
• 21:16
  the end of the shift? Something done with it? Are
• 21:18
  they logged into the BOP database at all? What happens
• 21:21
  with those sheets? Noel? I don't know, because it's left
• 21:25
  on the table. I don't know what they do with them. Question. So,
• 21:29
  as far as you know, you just fill it out
• 21:32
  and you leave it there, Noel, Yeah. Question. Okay, you
• 21:35
  don't ever provide it to anyone Noel, no question. And
• 21:38
  you don't ever go into any BOP database and enter
• 21:41
  those rounds Noel, no question. Do you know if someone
• 21:45
  else does? Noel, I don't know. Question, you don't know. Okay,
• 21:49
  what about the counts? Do you call people after the
• 21:51
  counts Noel, Yes, control, question you call control Noel? Yeah. Question.
• 21:57
  And do you recall on August ninth or August tenth
• 22:00
  you called? Did you call anyone with those numbers? Noel? Yes?
• 22:04
  Question okay. And do you remember which counts you called? Noel,
• 22:08
  I don't remember which. Question and you know you did
• 22:13
  some of them, you just don't remember specifically which ones? Noel?
• 22:17
  Which ones? Question? Okay? And do you remember speaking with
• 22:21
  lieutenants when you were there or with regular officers assigned
• 22:25
  to the control center? Noel, I don't remember who I
• 22:28
  spoke to. Question You don't remember. Well. With the count slips,
• 22:32
  you said you just leave those round slips on the
• 22:35
  table when you're done. When you do the account slips,
• 22:40
  What do you do with those slips? Noel, We did
• 22:43
  the same thing. We filled them out before. Question before
• 22:47
  you actually conduct the counts, before you fill them out, Noel. Yeah. Question.
• 22:52
  So before you actually even getting the number, you fill
• 22:55
  out the number Noel, because we know the number. Question okay,
• 22:59
  So do you then call somebody with the number? Noel? Yeah.
• 23:04
  Question Who do you call? Noel? Control? Question? Control? Okay?
• 23:10
  And you provide them with the number that you wrote
• 23:13
  on that document. Noel, Yes, question, Sorry we did this.
• 23:17
  My question was supposed to be, what do you do
• 23:20
  with the physical pieces of paper? Noel, stick it in
• 23:23
  the door and then internal takes it. Question. Okay, so
• 23:27
  no one actually comes in to the shoe. You stick
• 23:30
  it in the door, Noel. The outer door. Question, so
• 23:34
  you open up the interior the inner door, and then
• 23:37
  you go to the outer door. Noel, then stick it
• 23:40
  in there. Question there's like a special slot for it, Noel,
• 23:43
  not a slot, it's just between the door. Question. Okay,
• 23:47
  Internal never comes in though, Noel, they didn't that day.
• 23:51
  I don't know if they ever come in, but they
• 23:52
  didn't that day. Question. Okay. On August ninth, twenty nineteen,
• 23:57
  you said you filled all that out. What rounds did
• 24:00
  you conduct during your shift on August ninth, twenty nineteen. Noel, Well,
• 24:05
  that's hard for me to tell because I didn't conduct
• 24:08
  it every thirty minutes. It was give out food, pick
• 24:11
  up the trays, give out toilet paper, go down. So
• 24:14
  those were the rounds that I conducted. Question. So you
• 24:18
  were conducting around as just doing something with an inmate, Noel, Yeah,
• 24:22
  because I actually physically walked question every tier all six Noel, Yeah.
• 24:30
  Question Are there six tiers in the shoe? Noel, yeah.
• 24:33
  Question Okay, two floors, two levels? Noel, yeah. Yeah. Question.
• 24:39
  So when you do these rounds, when you would go
• 24:42
  down range and handle an inmate or give something to
• 24:45
  an inmate, you would also do all six Noel, yeah. Question?
• 24:50
  All right, So about how often? Let's ask it a
• 24:53
  different way, about how many of those didn't you do?
• 24:57
  On August ninth? Noel, I don't know. I can't give
• 25:00
  a number of how much I didn't do? Question? Are
• 25:03
  some of those that were documented? Were they not done? Noel? Yeah? Question?
• 25:08
  All right, So you didn't do some of them, You
• 25:12
  just don't know which ones? Noel, right. Question all right, okay,
• 25:17
  and now mister Foy interjects. Let me just say to
• 25:21
  help clarify the times that you wrote down Noel, okay, Foy, right, Foy?
• 25:28
  When did you write the times down? Noel? Before Foy?
• 25:30
  Al right, So when did a round to take toilet paper?
• 25:34
  Did you change the time to reflect that particular round?
• 25:37
  Did you do anything with the paperwork to change the
• 25:40
  actual time? Noel? No question. And why did you do that?
• 25:44
  Is it because of the requirement? Noel? Why did I fill,
• 25:48
  she gets cut off. Why did you fill these ahead
• 25:51
  of time? Were you just trying to stay on top
• 25:53
  of what the actual requirement was to conduct a thirty
• 25:56
  minute round? Noel, I mean, I don't know why I
• 25:59
  did it. I just always did it that way. Question.
• 26:02
  Did someone train you to do it that way? Noel?
• 26:04
  I mean I've seen it done that way before, and
• 26:07
  three people that actually do it as they do it.
• 26:10
  It's been done all three different ways. Question. Some do
• 26:14
  it before, some do it during, and some do it after. Noel. Yeah. Question,
• 26:19
  and just this instance, you did it all before Noel, yes. Question,
• 26:24
  all right, and some at least some of them. Would
• 26:26
  you say the majority were not done or we're done? Noel?
• 26:30
  On the ninth majority was done? Question? You believe the majority? Now,
• 26:35
  I know we're doing estimates because you don't know exactly
• 26:38
  you think like fifty one percent? Noel, I don't know. Question,
• 26:42
  you don't know, Noel, No question. All right. But again
• 26:45
  for the ones that you did do you're not just
• 26:49
  going down the tier Noel, No question, You're going down
• 26:52
  all six tiers. Noel, I'm doing all question you are Noel, Yes. Question.
• 26:59
  This is the under oath thing we've got to make
• 27:01
  sure because the video is and all that kind of stuff. Noel, Yeah. Question,
• 27:07
  that's your understanding, Noel, yes, question. All right? That you're
• 27:11
  actually checking every door, Noel, yes. Question. And when you
• 27:15
  go give that one person toilet paper or whatever, you're
• 27:18
  actually looking out all the different doors. Mister Foy, Can
• 27:22
  we take a break real quick because I need to
• 27:25
  take a break? Question? Absolutely? All right, folks, We're gonna
• 27:29
  wrap up right here, and in the next episode dealing
• 27:31
  with the topic, we're gonna pick up where we left off.
• 27:35
  All the information that goes with this episode can be
• 27:38
  found in the description box. What's up, everyone, and welcome
• 27:42
  to another episode of the Epstein Chronicles. In this episode,
• 27:45
  we're gonna pick up where we left off with the
• 27:48
  Toven Nowell interview with the OIG Inspectors. Question, all right,
• 27:53
  that you're actually checking every door, Noel, yeah. Question. And
• 27:58
  when you give that one person to the paper or whatever,
• 28:01
  you're actually looking at all the different doors. Foy, Can
• 28:05
  we take a break real quick because I need to
• 28:07
  take a break, all right. So they come back from
• 28:11
  the break and they dive right back in question, all right,
• 28:14
  is there anything that we wanted to revise? Before we
• 28:17
  continue Foroy, Yeah, I want her to go back. This
• 28:20
  was from earlier about the double door how they operate?
• 28:23
  Question Okay, Foy, inaccuracy is on that question, sure, Foy.
• 28:28
  That we clarified. So let's start with that first. Noel,
• 28:32
  the outer door control pops the outer door. I control
• 28:35
  the inner door, so the outer door can only be
• 28:37
  opened by control. Question. Okay, so we're talking about like
• 28:42
  popping it was just your memory was foggy, Noel. I
• 28:46
  don't remember a lot of stuff, but yeah, the outer door.
• 28:49
  You have to call control to pop the twenty seven door,
• 28:52
  and we control the inner door. Question okay. And then
• 28:56
  just while we're going back, it's something I was probably
• 28:59
  going to follow up later, but there's been a ton
• 29:01
  of questions of like, you don't know question or answer Noel, Yeah, question.
• 29:07
  I just want to remind you you did go to
• 29:09
  Federal Law Enforcement Training Center Noel. Yeah, where you were
• 29:13
  trained as a correctional officer, and you also received this
• 29:16
  IF training, which I think you said was like two
• 29:20
  weeks in house training. Noel, Yeah, question, is that what
• 29:24
  it was? As well as you receive the annual training
• 29:28
  and all this stuff that we're talking about. Isn't like
• 29:30
  the real detailed stuff. This is like, you know, conducting
• 29:33
  rounds and counts and the essential duties as a correctional officer.
• 29:37
  So I'm assuming you is it safe to assume that
• 29:40
  you received this training, you know, during those trainings. I
• 29:43
  know you didn't go to the shoe trainings, but not
• 29:46
  too far from when this happened. You were only on
• 29:50
  for a little over a year, and you conducted all
• 29:52
  three of those trainings, correct, Noel, I was only on
• 29:56
  for a little under a year. The training that I
• 29:58
  received in Georgia in space civic to camps and not
• 30:01
  necessarily high rises, and the in house training. The roster
• 30:05
  reflects all these trainings that we didn't actually receive all
• 30:08
  the training because sometimes there was nobody to train us.
• 30:12
  Question okay, Noel. So when I say I don't know,
• 30:16
  I don't know. Question Yeah. No, it's just almost every question.
• 30:20
  I feel like we've gone through eighteen pages so far,
• 30:24
  and so many of them are like I don't know, Noel,
• 30:27
  I really don't know. Question all right. It's just because
• 30:30
  you know, people are going to say, like, well, you
• 30:33
  went all these trainings, you should know at least some
• 30:35
  of this stuff. So I just wanted to try to
• 30:38
  get you to like think back on your training Noel.
• 30:41
  Uh huh question and your duties and your responsibilities when
• 30:45
  I'm making these questions, just so you can really like think,
• 30:49
  do I really now know? Or is that you know?
• 30:52
  Did I know that these things should be done? Does
• 30:55
  that make sense? Noel? Correct question? Can I say, just
• 31:02
  to clarify, I know you might not have received some
• 31:05
  of the official trainings, some of this stuff you might
• 31:07
  learn along the way, Miss Noel. Uh huh. Question from
• 31:11
  your deaily duties. Noel, right. Question, Like it's repetitive some
• 31:15
  of the stuff that you do, So you might have
• 31:18
  known this based on the fact that you've done it
• 31:20
  on a daily basis. So if you say I don't
• 31:23
  know and you've actually done it as part of your
• 31:25
  daily duties, it kind of contradicts each other, Miss Noel,
• 31:29
  I understand question. And I just had a question. You
• 31:33
  mentioned the door. Was it at any point in time
• 31:36
  on the ninth tenth or was there a practice to
• 31:39
  ever leave the doors propped open in the shoe? Noel?
• 31:42
  No question? All right. I think my last question, I
• 31:46
  just want to revisit it just to make sure that
• 31:49
  we're of the same understanding. So again, when you're pre
• 31:53
  populating all these rounds, correct Noel, correct question. But you're
• 31:58
  saying you believe you did more than fifty percent of
• 32:00
  the rounds that were listed. Noel, I can't give you
• 32:04
  a percentage because I don't know how to put a
• 32:07
  percentage to a round. But I can tell you that
• 32:10
  I conducted rounds as I went to go do something,
• 32:13
  But I can't give you a number. Question, And I
• 32:16
  want to make sure that we understand too, if you're
• 32:18
  going down range to give some inmate, like toilet paper
• 32:21
  or something, that you're also at that time where you're
• 32:25
  saying you did around not just talking about that tier,
• 32:28
  but all six tiers. Noel, Yes. Question. All right, So
• 32:32
  you're going down to give somebody toilet paper, and at
• 32:35
  that point he gets cut off by Noel because I'm
• 32:38
  giving toilet paper to everybody. Question, all right, So you're
• 32:41
  not just addressing one inmate, Noel, No question, you're saying
• 32:45
  when you're giving everybody toilet paper, Noel, yes. Question. So
• 32:50
  on August ninth, cut off by Noel. When I'm giving food,
• 32:53
  I give everybody food. When I'm collecting trays, I'm collecting
• 32:57
  all the trays I'm giving toilet paper, she's cut off.
• 33:01
  So aside from the times, you're now giving toilet paper
• 33:04
  and giving food and collecting trays, which are a handful
• 33:07
  of those times, granted, are you doing any other rounds? Noel? Yeah?
• 33:12
  And if somebody calls, she gets cut off on August ninth.
• 33:16
  We're talking about Noel on the ninth. If somebody calls
• 33:20
  and ask for something, yeah, I conduct around. Question, And
• 33:24
  that's kind of what I'm getting at. If you're handling
• 33:27
  one specific inmate because they called and asked for something,
• 33:30
  you're then also addressing the other five tiers Noel, Yeah. Question, Okay, Noel,
• 33:36
  because usually when one calls, everybody else hears, and everybody
• 33:39
  wants something, so I just do it. Question, all right?
• 33:42
  So on August ninth, you didn't conduct all the documented rounds, Noel,
• 33:46
  No question, but you did do some of them, Noel. Yeah. Question,
• 33:51
  And you don't have a number Noel, no half for anything?
• 33:58
  No question? Okay? Okay. To this, Foy interjects, but I
• 34:02
  think the clearer point is when she did it, it's
• 34:05
  not based on the times on the paper question. Okay, Foy, Right,
• 34:09
  So that doesn't match the time she did it versus
• 34:12
  the time on the paper, because that paper is done
• 34:15
  at the beginning of the shift with the time already selected. Question. Oh,
• 34:20
  are you filling out the entire paper at the beginning
• 34:22
  of the shift? Noel? Yeah. Question. Oh, so you're not
• 34:25
  doing it every thirty minutes, just pre populating before you
• 34:28
  do the round foy right, Noel, no question. You're going
• 34:33
  at the very beginning of the shift filling everything out Noel, Yes, sir.
• 34:37
  Question So that when did you fill out the August
• 34:40
  ninth round sheet? Noel? Like how the numbers are like
• 34:43
  the round sheets before, like the times. So I just
• 34:46
  fill it out because that's what I've seen being done,
• 34:49
  like it's filled out before or sometimes at the end after,
• 34:52
  so I fill it out all before. Question. Okay, so
• 34:55
  you prepopulated that entire thing at the very beginning of
• 34:59
  your shift Noel. Well, yeah, question, and then you just
• 35:02
  conducted the rounds as needed Noel, yes. Question all right,
• 35:06
  and you've seen people do this Noel? Yeah. Question Who
• 35:10
  else have you seen do that? Noel? I mean I
• 35:12
  don't have a specific name, but I've seen it done.
• 35:15
  Question did anyone ever tell you to do that? Noel?
• 35:19
  This is actually I think the first time I've ever
• 35:22
  done the round sheets, because I've never actually done the
• 35:24
  round sheets in the shoe, but those two days were
• 35:27
  the days that I've done the round sheets in the shoe. Question. So,
• 35:31
  if this was your first time doing a round sheet,
• 35:33
  did someone instruct you on how to do it? Noel, No,
• 35:37
  because I just followed what I seen. But I've worked
• 35:40
  with people before that were filling it out and that's
• 35:42
  how it's been done. Question. And did you have discussions
• 35:46
  with them? Noel, No, I never had a discussion about it. Question.
• 35:50
  So you just observed people doing this Noel, yes. Question,
• 35:55
  But no one ever told you to do that? Noel,
• 35:57
  no question. And did you know that it was wrong
• 36:00
  to do that? Noel, no question. You didn't know that
• 36:03
  it was wrong to prepopulate the rounds you conducted when
• 36:07
  you weren't conducting those rounds, Noel. Know. I mean, if
• 36:11
  I'm putting the time on there saying that I conducted
• 36:13
  the round at this time and I didn't conduct the
• 36:16
  round at this time, that's wrong. But I didn't think
• 36:18
  it was wrong to just fill it all out because
• 36:21
  or after, because that's how they do it. Question. So
• 36:25
  that's a contradicting statement. You know that it's not right
• 36:28
  to conduct a round at the time that you conducted it,
• 36:31
  but you didn't know that it was wrong too indiscernible Foy.
• 36:34
  She knows that now, but this is the way it
• 36:37
  was done. Foy, She followed. But like when you look
• 36:41
  at the policy and now that we're here and we've
• 36:44
  had discussions, Okay, that's not how it's supposed to work. Question,
• 36:48
  But at the time that you're filling this out on
• 36:51
  August ninth, at the beginning of your shift, saying that
• 36:54
  you conducted these rounds at a time that they weren't
• 36:56
  conducted yet, you had to know that it wasn't Maybe
• 37:00
  you saw people doing the wrong thing, but you couldn't
• 37:02
  have possibly thought that that was correct. Noel, Well, I,
• 37:06
  she gets cut off because you're falsely certifying that rounds
• 37:09
  or completed when you didn't. There's times even that they're
• 37:14
  events in the future. Noel, I understand, but I didn't
• 37:17
  know that. I just followed whatever I saw that was
• 37:20
  being done. Question. I absolutely understand that defense that you said,
• 37:24
  other people have done this and you're following their guidance,
• 37:27
  But you can't possibly think that it's okay to fill
• 37:30
  out certifications saying that you conducted rounds in the future
• 37:33
  that haven't even taken place, and that you've actually didn't
• 37:36
  do At the same time, is that something being lost
• 37:39
  in translation? Do you follow what I'm asking you? Did
• 37:43
  you think it's okay to sign on the round sheet
• 37:45
  that you conducted a time conducted around? Noel, But it's
• 37:50
  the same thing as the end, Like if I do
• 37:53
  it all at the end, at the times that I'm putting,
• 37:56
  I'm not doing going to remember all these times specifically. Absolutely.
• 38:01
  I would also argue that at any time you're falsifying
• 38:03
  a record, you always know that that's wrong. Noel. So,
• 38:06
  but I mean question, So I understand what you're saying,
• 38:10
  that other people do it, and that's why I want
• 38:12
  to get into who else is doing this? Who trained
• 38:15
  you on this? How do you know that this was
• 38:18
  the way that things are done? So that's where my
• 38:21
  question of who talked to you about it? You said,
• 38:24
  no one actually spoke to you about this. Noel cuts
• 38:28
  them off. No, I just seen people do it. Question
• 38:31
  observe people, So who did you? Noel cuts them off
• 38:34
  because I never had He picks up observed do that? Noel,
• 38:39
  I never had a conversation with anyone about filling out
• 38:42
  the roundsheets. Question right, So, if that's going to be
• 38:46
  the argument that you're doing it based upon your training
• 38:49
  and experience, I need to know more about this training
• 38:52
  and experience. Who is it that you experience do this
• 38:56
  in the past, Noel, People that I've worked with. Question,
• 39:00
  so I'd like to think about all right, I know
• 39:03
  this because I saw that person do it. Who Noel umredacted?
• 39:07
  Question So you've witnessed redacted overpopulate or at the end
• 39:11
  of the shift. Noel. I don't remember exactly, but it's
• 39:14
  done either or the way. Question. All right, so you
• 39:18
  saw redacted and who else? Noel redacted? Question redacted? Is
• 39:23
  that the SOS? Noel? No question? Noah different redacted? What
• 39:28
  is redacted? A gentleman's name? Noel? Yes. Question what's the
• 39:32
  person's first name? Noel, I don't know the first name.
• 39:36
  Question who worked in the shoe? Noel? Yes. Question you
• 39:40
  mentioned redacted before? Is it redacted? Noel? Yes? Question? Okay,
• 39:45
  say that again, Noel redacted. Question it's like indiscernible, foy,
• 39:51
  it's a first or last name. Question? Is it the
• 39:55
  first or last name, Noel redacted, Foy redacted. No, well, yes,
• 40:00
  Foy redacted. Noel, Uh huh. Question anyone else aside from
• 40:06
  those three people? Noel, I never seen redacted. Question. All right,
• 40:11
  So in the recollections of the three people that you named,
• 40:14
  what did you observe them? Do miss Noel fill it
• 40:17
  out after or fill it out before? Question? And was
• 40:20
  that on numerous occasions? Noel? Yes, all right, So we're
• 40:25
  gonna wrap up right here and in the next episode,
• 40:27
  we're gonna pick up where we left off. All the
• 40:30
  information that goes with this episode can be found in
• 40:33
  the description box.