Latest / Tiger Territory: A Detroit Tigers Podcast / Framber Valdez's struggles, Tarik Skubal's situation and the Tigers' rollercoaster

Transcript

Framber Valdez's struggles, Tarik Skubal's situation and the Tigers' rollercoaster · Tiger Territory: A Detroit Tigers Podcast

0:09
Speaker 1: And welcome in toun that episode of Tiger Territory, part
0:12
Speaker 1: of the Foul Territory. Now we're at Detroit Tigers Podcast.
0:15
Speaker 1: I'm Karen Steckley with me as always as a man
0:17
Speaker 1: who is happy to not have to answer the question anymore. Hey,
0:21
Speaker 1: do you catch that World Cup match? Here's Cody Savina.
0:24
Speaker 1: How we're doing.
0:25
Speaker 2: You're right, it's time to watch some baseball people. We're
0:28
Speaker 2: done with the little soccer tournament. We can lock in
0:30
Speaker 2: on the big leagues. The trade deadline is coming up.
0:34
Speaker 2: We've had a really exciting Monday for the Tigers, not
0:37
Speaker 2: such an exciting Tuesday. That's all right, Well, we kind
0:40
Speaker 2: of have a lot to talk about. There's kind of
0:42
Speaker 2: a lot going on.
0:46
Speaker 1: Yep. So just in the interest of full disclosure, we
0:49
Speaker 1: are recording this before the conclusion of Tuesday's game. I
0:52
Speaker 1: hope you guys will forgive us as we as we
0:55
Speaker 1: get going here. I just got a text with my
0:57
Speaker 1: wife actually the.
0:59
Speaker 2: Full breakdown of Zach McKinstry's pitching performance.
1:01
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, Dingler just hit a home run, So wife
1:05
Speaker 1: just texted me looking out for me that little update there.
1:07
Speaker 1: So right now it is eleven to two, so if
1:09
Speaker 1: this comeback happens, we'll come back on here and then
1:11
Speaker 1: we'll adjust everything we have to say. But like you said, Cody,
1:15
Speaker 1: there's a lot of storylines big and small, and and
1:19
Speaker 1: to be honest, I kind of want to start with
1:22
Speaker 1: a larger thought process here that I had coming into
1:27
Speaker 1: this game, and I thought this could go one way
1:30
Speaker 1: or another, and it went like pretty far in the
1:34
Speaker 1: direction I did not anticipate, which was, look, you have
1:37
Speaker 1: this awesome win on Monday, and then you have your
1:42
Speaker 1: big free agent acquisition starting pitcher from Bervaldez coming on
1:45
Speaker 1: on Tuesday. It's like, wouldn't it be great for him
1:48
Speaker 1: to kind of come in here when you a series
1:51
Speaker 1: on the road against a team that's like what twelve fourteen,
1:53
Speaker 1: whatever it is, games above five hundred, Like this would
1:56
Speaker 1: be great. It's not great, Cody. In case you guys
2:02
Speaker 1: missed it, Robert did not make it out of the
2:04
Speaker 1: first ending allowed five hits, six earned runs. He had
2:07
Speaker 1: two walks in one k and basically he was just
2:09
Speaker 1: kind of getting hit all around the yard and and look,
2:13
Speaker 1: but you know, much much empathy and sympathy for what
2:16
Speaker 1: he you know, just coming off the bereavement list, you know,
2:18
Speaker 1: dealing with the death of his grandmother. Obviously, all the
2:21
Speaker 1: thoughts and prayers to him and his family, but we're
2:23
Speaker 1: just going to keep it to the baseball part of this.
2:25
Speaker 1: I had a a thought, Cody. I was like, you know, look,
2:30
Speaker 1: the Tigers, obviously the goal is the playoffs, and given
2:34
Speaker 1: where they've been the season, the goal is not to
2:37
Speaker 1: skip the wildcard round. The wildcard round is coming if
2:40
Speaker 1: you if you make the postseason, so that's the best
2:43
Speaker 1: of three. So who's your three? That was the question
2:47
Speaker 1: that was kind of like like percolating through the mind
2:50
Speaker 1: a little bit because it's like, Okay, you have school
2:52
Speaker 1: bull or you don't, and we can kind of talk
2:54
Speaker 1: about that a little bit later. You have school where
2:56
Speaker 1: you don't. That's one Moultain feels pretty safe. Mys what
3:03
Speaker 1: has definitely pinched the like to be in that rotation.
3:07
Speaker 1: But the injury thing. As of now he's on the
3:10
Speaker 1: il so hopefully everything's okay with him. Uh from Bert
3:15
Speaker 1: like should be like a no discussion boom, that's that's
3:20
Speaker 1: in there. Unfortunately today and we saw I would probably
3:25
Speaker 1: wager the worst version. Unfortunately today that just in my
3:29
Speaker 1: mind does not feel like a slam dunk.
3:32
Speaker 2: Is that fair?
3:33
Speaker 1: Is that fair to me to kind of like percolate
3:35
Speaker 1: that through my mind a little bit?
3:37
Speaker 2: Well, that's certainly an interesting thought. And of course to
3:40
Speaker 2: get to this situation a lot would have to go right.
3:42
Speaker 2: They would have to keep everybody, everyone would have to
3:44
Speaker 2: stay healthy. But it's kind of an interesting thought exercise, because, Yeah,
3:49
Speaker 2: if I was just picking who are the three best
3:52
Speaker 2: pictures right now from Bervaldez, is not one of them.
3:55
Speaker 2: His era went up nearly a half run, what four
3:59
Speaker 2: four nine after the last outing, and beyond that, it's
4:03
Speaker 2: this is at least the third time he has come
4:05
Speaker 2: out this season and basically been completely useless. He gave
4:09
Speaker 2: up eight earned runs on April eighth. You give up
4:11
Speaker 2: seven earned runs on May fifth, That was the ejection game.
4:14
Speaker 2: He came out here six earned runs, didn't even finish
4:17
Speaker 2: an inning. Froumber has kind of been prone to outings
4:20
Speaker 2: like these throughout his career, but it's happened three times
4:23
Speaker 2: in just over half a season. He's had a couple
4:26
Speaker 2: other outings that weren't great. Maybe that speaks to actually
4:29
Speaker 2: the fact he's a really good pitcher, because he's been
4:32
Speaker 2: just terrible several times, and his era still has a
4:35
Speaker 2: four instead of a five or six in front of it,
4:37
Speaker 2: so he's capable of being good. He has playoff experience.
4:41
Speaker 2: He's maybe about thirty six and a half million dollars.
4:43
Speaker 2: I think as a result of that, realistically, the Tigers
4:47
Speaker 2: would probably start from Rivaldez in a playoff game, and
4:49
Speaker 2: they'd probably yank around and find a different way to
4:53
Speaker 2: use Troy Melton or even Casey Mize or even cater Montero,
4:57
Speaker 2: because that's just how these things tend to go. Then
5:00
Speaker 2: you could argue Fromber's experience pitching in the playoffs in
5:04
Speaker 2: the World Series might actually hold some weight there in
5:07
Speaker 2: terms of just being able to manage the environment, the emotions.
5:11
Speaker 2: He's been there, he's done it. However, it's just disappointing
5:14
Speaker 2: when this guy comes here to that much acclaim, when
5:18
Speaker 2: he's getting paid that much money, and he just hasn't
5:21
Speaker 2: quite performed up to that standard on a consistent basis.
5:26
Speaker 2: I think it is totally fair to be asking the
5:28
Speaker 2: question you're asking right now, Kieran.
5:31
Speaker 1: Well, I'm glad you think that, because the other thing
5:34
Speaker 1: that I like ask myself, like, is it fair to
5:37
Speaker 1: think X is like is it fair to over empathize,
5:44
Speaker 1: over emphasize, over critique, like really notice some like the
5:49
Speaker 1: little things with fromber And I've talked about this before,
5:52
Speaker 1: especially after the ejection game, where it's like, look, dude,
5:55
Speaker 1: like it like if you want to be the guy,
5:57
Speaker 1: which that money dictates, you are the guy, whether or
5:59
Speaker 1: not schools on this roster or not. And at that
6:02
Speaker 1: time he was hurt, right, It's like you have to
6:04
Speaker 1: carry yourself a certain way in my opinion, like maybe
6:08
Speaker 1: not everybody agrees with me, but you got to carry
6:09
Speaker 1: yourself a certain way if you're gonna carry that price
6:12
Speaker 1: tag and you're gonna have that sort of a claim
6:14
Speaker 1: like that's what the money's for, as as they say
6:16
Speaker 1: in mad Men. And today was another example of just
6:21
Speaker 1: bad body language. You know, a ground ball goes up
6:24
Speaker 1: the middle, like you know, look, it's a groundball. Your
6:27
Speaker 1: job in that situation is a good groundball. So I
6:29
Speaker 1: understand like potentially being frustrated, but you have the whole
6:33
Speaker 1: like kind of raise your hands and you know, like
6:36
Speaker 1: kind of emotion here that kind of it's not showing
6:40
Speaker 1: anybody up per se, but it's not calm and cool
6:44
Speaker 1: and and and in these situations, especially in the first ending,
6:48
Speaker 1: especially on the road, especially when everything everyone's looking to you.
6:52
Speaker 1: I want guys that look like they can like they're
6:55
Speaker 1: the same no matter what. And there's and there's a
6:59
Speaker 1: difference between demonstrative and forceful. Like I think we could
7:04
Speaker 1: say Schooble is a forceful reactionary, but like fromber a
7:09
Speaker 1: lot of times, is a kind of head up, sigh
7:12
Speaker 1: like reactionary. And I just don't think that does a
7:15
Speaker 1: lot of good. And we saw multiple examples of that
7:17
Speaker 1: today when we just didn't have his stuff, and so
7:20
Speaker 1: that those kind of things concerned me overall as well.
7:23
Speaker 1: And again I repeat myself, this is why Houston wasn't
7:26
Speaker 1: exactly like having candlelight vigils when he like signed with
7:30
Speaker 1: another team.
7:32
Speaker 2: Yeah, I would just say that's that's part of the package.
7:35
Speaker 2: The Tigers knew what they were getting when when they
7:37
Speaker 2: signed him. Again, like starting the more we see it
7:40
Speaker 2: starts to make sense why maybe other teams weren't willing
7:43
Speaker 2: to give him that five plus year deal he initially wanted,
7:47
Speaker 2: probably initially thought he was gonna get, probably want a
7:49
Speaker 2: ship performance basis deserved by the way he had pitched.
7:53
Speaker 2: It's kind of things like that that have followed him
7:55
Speaker 2: out throughout his career. You know, you kind of hear, well,
7:58
Speaker 2: he's gotten better, he's gotten better at managing his emotions
8:01
Speaker 2: and bouncing back, and it's like, well, only for so
8:04
Speaker 2: long when things are going badly, he does still have
8:06
Speaker 2: a tendency to kind of let the emotions, the body
8:09
Speaker 2: language creep in. He's not the only guy, like, like,
8:11
Speaker 2: there are others throughout the league, even on this team
8:14
Speaker 2: who can kind of struggle with that. But I think
8:16
Speaker 2: just subjectively, it's it's fair to say that's not the
8:20
Speaker 2: most desirable trait. That's not the ideal trait in what
8:23
Speaker 2: you want to see from your guy on the mount.
8:25
Speaker 1: And again, like you're throwing guys like Montero who don't
8:28
Speaker 1: have near the experience that he does. I feel like
8:30
Speaker 1: Montero like always looks locked in, Like sometimes with Valdez
8:34
Speaker 1: it doesn't necessarily always appear that he's locked in, because
8:37
Speaker 1: he does kind of let those spurts out. And the
8:41
Speaker 1: reason like, and I struggle even bringing this up because
8:45
Speaker 1: I am a believer in like accepting people and accepting
8:49
Speaker 1: like players and coaches and everybody like as they are.
8:52
Speaker 1: Like I don't want to like double punish them for
8:55
Speaker 1: just doing what they usually do. Does that make sense?
8:58
Speaker 1: So like I struggle bringing that up, but like when
9:00
Speaker 1: on a game like today, and what everything's crucial, right,
9:02
Speaker 1: We've talked about this a lot on a game like today,
9:05
Speaker 1: like you just needed to put your best foot forward
9:08
Speaker 1: and if it wasn't your stuff, it had to be
9:10
Speaker 1: something else and and and neither one was the case here,
9:14
Speaker 1: and you end up you know, ty Madden just come
9:16
Speaker 1: just gets called up, and yeah bring in ty Madden
9:19
Speaker 1: the first endy and that you know, you know, yet
9:22
Speaker 1: no days off here for a bit, Cody, Like that
9:23
Speaker 1: throws everything off into you know, contingency plan territory there.
9:28
Speaker 1: So just disappoint overall from fromber And again, like you're right,
9:33
Speaker 1: he probably is going to start a playoff game should
9:36
Speaker 1: they get there. But like as of right now, there's
9:41
Speaker 1: been too many instances of of lack of feel that
9:46
Speaker 1: will give fans and even you know, coaches and players,
9:49
Speaker 1: I'm sure confidence overall should that situation presents present itself.
9:53
Speaker 1: All right, we are going to get to a quick
9:55
Speaker 1: break and then afterward we're gonna talk some tek Schooble
9:58
Speaker 1: Cody just wrote a story at Tererek, and of course
10:01
Speaker 1: you know he's the man of the hour, of the week,
10:03
Speaker 1: of the next couple of weeks in Major League Baseball.
10:05
Speaker 1: It's a lot to get there. But first I'll work
10:07
Speaker 1: from our sponsors.
10:09
Speaker 3: What if you can actually have it all? And I'm
10:11
Speaker 3: talking about mint Mobile taking the premium wireless bouginess crafts,
10:17
Speaker 3: but then bringing it to the transparency in pricing and
10:20
Speaker 3: the affordability in pricing.
10:22
Speaker 4: They're going to lay everything out there with a cheap
10:25
Speaker 4: bill that you know what everybody can handle right now.
10:29
Speaker 3: You can even bring your current phone and your number.
10:31
Speaker 3: If you're thinking about it and you're like, I'm worried
10:33
Speaker 3: about that, No worries. They have you covered because they're
10:36
Speaker 3: able to convert people all the time to the Mintmobile way.
10:39
Speaker 3: Go to mintmobile dot com slash territory. That's mintmobile dot
10:42
Speaker 3: com slash territory. Cut your wireless bill of fifteen bucks
10:45
Speaker 3: a month at mintmobile dot com slash territory.
10:47
Speaker 1: That's it.
10:48
Speaker 3: There's no catch upfront payment of forty five dollars for
10:51
Speaker 3: three months, ninety dollars for six months, or one hundred
10:53
Speaker 3: and eighty dollars for twelve month plan required fifteen dollars
10:56
Speaker 3: per month equivalent taxes and fees extra initial plan term
11:00
Speaker 3: only greater than fifty gigabytes may slow when network is busy.
11:03
Speaker 3: Includes up to twenty gigabyte hotspot capable device required, Availability,
11:07
Speaker 3: speed and coverage varies Cement Mobile dot Com.
11:13
Speaker 1: All right, coming back here, So there's two things regarding
11:17
Speaker 1: Trek Schouble that are gonna dominate the headlines here for
11:21
Speaker 1: the next couple of weeks. There's Terrek Schouoble the Man,
11:24
Speaker 1: and then there's Terrek Schooble the Plan. And so Cody,
11:28
Speaker 1: you wrote about Trek Schoolble the Man as somebody who
11:31
Speaker 1: is just kind of been at the forefront of I
11:37
Speaker 1: don't know, everything extracurricular that you don't necessarily like want
11:42
Speaker 1: to talk about on a near daily basis or whatever.
11:46
Speaker 1: You know, like like, look, he's gonna it's all gonna
11:50
Speaker 1: be worth it for him, because no matter who the
11:51
Speaker 1: team is, he's gonna be, you know, one of the
11:53
Speaker 1: richest players in the history of Major League Baseball. So
11:55
Speaker 1: I'm not trying to paint like wax poetic that he's
11:58
Speaker 1: some victim here, but it is a again, like extracurricular uh,
12:03
Speaker 1: not advantageous to the day to day being of a
12:06
Speaker 1: baseball player and having to deal with everything from injury
12:08
Speaker 1: from Team USA, from arbitration, from rehab to just kind
12:14
Speaker 1: of getting back right dealing with the trade rumors and
12:17
Speaker 1: then what you know, the uncertain future. You've seen him
12:22
Speaker 1: on a daily basis. You've talked to him about this, like,
12:24
Speaker 1: how is he kind of how is he being? I
12:27
Speaker 1: guess is the way to kind of ask his question.
12:30
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I'm glad that the story finally running and
12:33
Speaker 2: that we're finally talking about it. I think for as
12:35
Speaker 2: much as you know, we do the speculation thing too,
12:39
Speaker 2: when we talk about the trade deadline. Like in my
12:42
Speaker 2: actual job as a writer, one of the things that
12:44
Speaker 2: really fascinates me is kind of chronicling fame and attention
12:49
Speaker 2: and money and pressure and criticism and what that does
12:53
Speaker 2: to people. I've seen it a lot. I haven't necessarily
12:56
Speaker 2: covered many people as famous as Trek Scooble in my
12:59
Speaker 2: time around the Tigers, but I'd seen another sports before,
13:02
Speaker 2: and it's a very fascinating, quite honestly, very modern thing,
13:06
Speaker 2: especially in the social media age. I mean, think about it.
13:08
Speaker 2: There was a time where athletes were revered the greatest
13:12
Speaker 2: athletes where they were just revered figures, and I feel like,
13:15
Speaker 2: now there's a thing where you achieve a certain level
13:17
Speaker 2: of success and then people inevitably just start to dislike you.
13:23
Speaker 2: It's kind of a weird thing. And Schoolbol I think,
13:25
Speaker 2: has experienced a lot of this over the past couple
13:28
Speaker 2: of years, and especially over the past six months. If
13:31
Speaker 2: you think about it, from off season trade rumors to arbitration,
13:35
Speaker 2: to the WBC back and forth drama, to getting hurt,
13:38
Speaker 2: to the surgery to now back at the center of
13:41
Speaker 2: trade rumors. He has been the main character kind of
13:45
Speaker 2: in the twenty twenty six baseball season, and that might
13:49
Speaker 2: just be getting started. Seeing how Schooble's handled kind of
13:53
Speaker 2: a rise from a ninth round pick, a guy with
13:55
Speaker 2: one d one offer, I think has been very fascinating,
13:58
Speaker 2: and I've always wondered if that for a little bit
14:01
Speaker 2: of why he is kind of handled the public side
14:04
Speaker 2: of things, I would say as well has as he has,
14:07
Speaker 2: He's become very friendly. He's been incredibly accessible. Where a
14:11
Speaker 2: lot of guys can kind of close off, become very guarded.
14:15
Speaker 2: S Google has been the opposite. He's kind of opened
14:17
Speaker 2: up this year. You could argue he hasn't necessarily done
14:20
Speaker 2: himself any favors simply by being out there and talking.
14:24
Speaker 2: He's talked to himself, you know, think about the WBC,
14:26
Speaker 2: the back and forth. Maybe if he just would have
14:28
Speaker 2: not said anything, that wouldn't have been a thing. As
14:31
Speaker 2: a media member, I obviously appreciate it when guys are
14:33
Speaker 2: open and when guys are honest and willing to talk.
14:36
Speaker 2: But you know, I sat down with Errek a while
14:39
Speaker 2: back and I kind of just asked him, what is
14:41
Speaker 2: it like when everything you do becomes a story? How
14:44
Speaker 2: does that impact you? And it seems to me like
14:47
Speaker 2: Trek has a pretty good head about it. He gets it,
14:50
Speaker 2: he understands it. He seems to do a decent job
14:53
Speaker 2: of blocking out the noise. But I think he's very
14:56
Speaker 2: much aware of what's being said, what's going on. He
14:58
Speaker 2: had some quotes about that in the story. Interestingly enough, though,
15:02
Speaker 2: like Terrek's at this point where he can't even explain
15:06
Speaker 2: like the real human side of what he's been through
15:08
Speaker 2: without probably generating some other headlines. I'm sure a lot
15:11
Speaker 2: of people will latch onto a quote where he says,
15:14
Speaker 2: if I could go back, I probably should have gotten
15:16
Speaker 2: MRI in January and hammered it out to where I
15:20
Speaker 2: was done with it in the off season. He's talking
15:22
Speaker 2: about the loose body in his arm, but there were
15:24
Speaker 2: other factors in play. I was going through arbitration, the
15:27
Speaker 2: decision by the organization to take me to court. I
15:30
Speaker 2: think that probably had some impact subconsciously. I'm sure that's
15:34
Speaker 2: probably already sparking some reaction out there, and it's sparking
15:37
Speaker 2: reaction because Trek Scoble said it. These things don't necessarily
15:40
Speaker 2: spark the same reaction when I don't know, Drew Summers
15:44
Speaker 2: says it or something like that. You know, this is
15:47
Speaker 2: like the stuff that comes with the territory, and my observation,
15:51
Speaker 2: Schooble's handled it very well for the most part, but
15:53
Speaker 2: now it's it's grown. It's just this thing, and every
15:56
Speaker 2: day there's a there's a new Schooble segment on talk radio.
15:59
Speaker 2: So there's another report, there's another rumor, there's another school
16:03
Speaker 2: quote that's stirring up, and people are kind of picking
16:05
Speaker 2: it apart. What does he mean? What are his motivations?
16:08
Speaker 2: So I kind of tried to write just about that
16:10
Speaker 2: aspect and some of the things that's gone on behind
16:12
Speaker 2: the scenes and what that is like on a human level,
16:17
Speaker 2: because I just think it's a fascinating topic. And I
16:20
Speaker 2: know not everyone loves the way School has handled it,
16:23
Speaker 2: but it's interesting put yourself in his shoes, how would
16:25
Speaker 2: you handle it? How would I handle it? Like, I
16:27
Speaker 2: don't know, probably not well, probably worse than Trek Schoobel,
16:31
Speaker 2: because it's a strange position to be in. You're right,
16:34
Speaker 2: that doesn't mean he's a victim. Like he's a very
16:37
Speaker 2: wealthy man and going to become a wealthier man. But
16:40
Speaker 2: he is living this life that not that many people
16:43
Speaker 2: either get to live or have to live, and there's
16:46
Speaker 2: no simple roadmap for how to navigate that.
16:50
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're right. And the word there that's key is human.
16:55
Speaker 1: And by the way, Schooble doesn't look at himself as
16:57
Speaker 1: a victim, like you know we've had him on the
16:59
Speaker 1: podcast couple. You know you have him on the podcast
17:02
Speaker 1: and you know you've talked to him, and if you
17:03
Speaker 1: observe the way that he goes about his business, he
17:06
Speaker 1: is not someone who carries himself as like a victim.
17:09
Speaker 1: He is somebody who has the utmost belief in himself
17:11
Speaker 1: and thus the utmost belief in the team, and he
17:13
Speaker 1: has given everything to the organization through now and however
17:20
Speaker 1: long he is here, you know what I mean, Like,
17:22
Speaker 1: there's no doubt about that. So the people that are
17:23
Speaker 1: kind of like picking everything apart just kind of feels,
17:28
Speaker 1: I don't know, I'm gonna say, lazy and kind of
17:31
Speaker 1: missing the broader picture here. Uh And so like I
17:34
Speaker 1: don't really have a whole lot of like headspace to
17:37
Speaker 1: give like those kind of like talk radio segments and
17:40
Speaker 1: and and those kind of opinions because I just don't
17:43
Speaker 1: think they're based in reality. So uh So, like I
17:46
Speaker 1: see him, I'm not viewing them. I'm not giving them clicks.
17:49
Speaker 1: I'm not giving them like impressions or anything like that,
17:52
Speaker 1: because I just know that it's not grounded. And I
17:56
Speaker 1: you know who I know is grounded, Terrek Scoogle, Cause
17:58
Speaker 1: that quote right there that I'm sure you we're gonna
18:00
Speaker 1: pick apart, that's a grounded quote. That's a quote of
18:03
Speaker 1: him just like thinking everything through, you know what I mean.
18:07
Speaker 1: And then and just be like, well, like maybe I
18:09
Speaker 1: should have just gone back and done this. How many
18:11
Speaker 1: times in your life? You you know, everybody out there
18:14
Speaker 1: have you thought, you know what, maybe I should have
18:16
Speaker 1: done this, But at the time I thought this was
18:18
Speaker 1: kind of the best way. That's just him going through life,
18:21
Speaker 1: man livelihood, that's okay, and it had nothing, and it
18:25
Speaker 1: was not pulling back or holding himself back in any fashion.
18:28
Speaker 1: So like, if people look at that in any other fashion,
18:31
Speaker 1: I'm just I'm just gonna say, miss me with that.
18:34
Speaker 1: So like, so there's so so there's the school human piece,
18:37
Speaker 1: all right, and then the broader piece of this is
18:41
Speaker 1: is he gonna get traded? What's the likelihood more likely
18:45
Speaker 1: than not? So I guess I'll give my uh my
18:49
Speaker 1: seventy percent is my number right now as the Tigers
18:51
Speaker 1: lose eleven to two to the.
18:53
Speaker 2: Cup, so I'm thirteen what a jump?
18:55
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, so yeah, seventy percent, how about that? Uh,
18:59
Speaker 1: because there's something picking up steam. This was one of
19:04
Speaker 1: my bold predictions that we talked about a couple of
19:06
Speaker 1: weeks ago, Cody, that I know you're not a fan of,
19:09
Speaker 1: but like it just kind of seems like other people,
19:14
Speaker 1: not just me, other people are kind of saying, you know,
19:17
Speaker 1: maybe the Tigers they trade schoogle, but they're but they're
19:20
Speaker 1: not punning on the season, and and your colleagues at
19:23
Speaker 1: the Athletic also wrote about this and it and we
19:25
Speaker 1: don't know. I would encourage everybody to go read it.
19:28
Speaker 1: See the names on there. That kind of makes sense
19:30
Speaker 1: for various teams. I want to spoil, uh, spoil the story,
19:33
Speaker 1: but the fact that this is picking up.
19:34
Speaker 2: From Ken and will Sanon was sourced information from other
19:38
Speaker 2: executives around the league, basically just saying the Tigers are
19:41
Speaker 2: considering a thread the needle option. Not that they're going
19:44
Speaker 2: to do this, but they are. They're looking into it,
19:47
Speaker 2: They're thinking about it. That's as close as to anything
19:50
Speaker 2: solid as we've heard anywhere throughout this whole thing.
19:53
Speaker 1: Which I think means that like it that, like again,
19:56
Speaker 1: that notion is like, as we sit here July twe
20:00
Speaker 1: first is picking up steam, which, like it, like anything
20:06
Speaker 1: else with the school decision, is something that no matter
20:09
Speaker 1: what you decide, can easily be picked apart and eventually
20:13
Speaker 1: it's gonna be Monday morning quarterbacked. Right, This is the
20:16
Speaker 1: one that probably in the moment, would be the easiest
20:21
Speaker 1: one to pick apart and Monday morning quarterback fair or not.
20:25
Speaker 1: But I do feel like this is something that if
20:28
Speaker 1: you're gonna like appease all bosses metaphorically. This might this
20:33
Speaker 1: might be what they end up doing. I'm saying I
20:35
Speaker 1: would do it. I'm just saying that was my BOT
20:38
Speaker 1: prediction for a reason.
20:39
Speaker 2: Yeah. Again, it's not what I would do if I
20:43
Speaker 2: were running the team, but I understand it. It would
20:46
Speaker 2: also be malpractice if they didn't at least consider this
20:48
Speaker 2: and think about what it would look like. But as
20:52
Speaker 2: we get a little bit closer here, I do wonder
20:55
Speaker 2: if the schoopl thing comes down a little bit less
20:57
Speaker 2: to the wins and losses in the playoff odds and
21:01
Speaker 2: more simply, what are the offers they're going to get.
21:03
Speaker 2: Scott Harris is going to have to weigh the offers
21:07
Speaker 2: against the odds and think, Okay, is this offer so
21:11
Speaker 2: good that it is worth it for twenty twenty seven, eight,
21:15
Speaker 2: twenty twenty nine, regardless of you know, the Tiger's chances
21:20
Speaker 2: in twenty twenty six, regardless of if they hope to
21:23
Speaker 2: make a run. If it's just an okay offer, I
21:26
Speaker 2: wouldn't blame Scott Harris saying you know what, no, screw it,
21:29
Speaker 2: we'll keep them, We'll take our chances. But if they
21:31
Speaker 2: get a really good offer? Could he turn that down?
21:35
Speaker 2: Simply hoping they can make what's still and against the
21:38
Speaker 2: odds run in twenty twenty six. That might be all
21:41
Speaker 2: it comes down to, because maybe unless they go undefeated
21:45
Speaker 2: from now to August third, it's gonna be tough for
21:48
Speaker 2: them to be in a whole lot better position than
21:50
Speaker 2: they are right now. They can improve a little bit
21:52
Speaker 2: and we'll see where we're at. But like it, it
21:55
Speaker 2: might be as simple as like, how good is this offer?
21:58
Speaker 2: That might be the whole thing. And even if that's
22:02
Speaker 2: not the way I would handle it, well, no, I
22:04
Speaker 2: would handle that with Schoogle. I would just be all
22:06
Speaker 2: in or all out with the team as a whole,
22:09
Speaker 2: rather than trying to trade him and still win for
22:12
Speaker 2: twenty twenty six. But I think this is a more
22:16
Speaker 2: complicated thing than a lot of people realize, and there's
22:19
Speaker 2: a lot going into it from a lot of different angles.
22:23
Speaker 1: Odds versus offer. I like that. I'm steal it. That's
22:26
Speaker 1: everything that that's how we're going to frame everything from
22:29
Speaker 1: here on out. All right, we are going to take
22:32
Speaker 1: a quick break and then afterward, little Kerry Carpenter News,
22:35
Speaker 1: a little Spencer Torkolsen news opposite ends of a spectrum
22:39
Speaker 1: like everything else earlier this week. But first a word
22:41
Speaker 1: from our sponsors.
22:46
Speaker 3: If you're watching us, you already know we're wearing mack
22:49
Speaker 3: Weldon right now as we talk about a great brand
22:51
Speaker 3: that makes things so comfortable and easy to wear. But
22:54
Speaker 3: if you're listening to the show, let me tell you
22:56
Speaker 3: a little bit more about mac Weldon with my friend
22:59
Speaker 3: Eric Kratz.
23:00
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's comfortable, it's light. It's summertime right now. For
23:05
Speaker 4: me though, they cater to what I need tall clothes. Normally,
23:09
Speaker 4: when I buy tall clothes it's like something that's cumbersome
23:13
Speaker 4: and boxy. It still fits incredibly well, super light, perfect
23:18
Speaker 4: for the summertime. They got me all covered.
23:22
Speaker 3: Comfortable performance material can be yours. Mack Weldon is the spot.
23:28
Speaker 3: Don't sweat the heat this summer. Feel as effortlessly cool
23:32
Speaker 3: as you look. With mac Weldon. Go to mackweldon dot
23:34
Speaker 3: com and get twenty percent off your first order of
23:36
Speaker 3: one hundred and twenty five bucks or more with promo
23:38
Speaker 3: code foul. That's m ackw e l d o N
23:40
Speaker 3: dot com code foul.
23:46
Speaker 1: All right, coming back here, let's let's start with Kerry Carpenter. Now,
23:50
Speaker 1: he did exit Monday's game, and look, a lot of
23:53
Speaker 1: fun things happen on Monday that we're just not going
23:56
Speaker 1: to get to and I wish, I wish we would,
23:58
Speaker 1: but they were just too many other more pressing things
24:00
Speaker 1: to get to. It was a fun game to watch,
24:02
Speaker 1: So I want to discount that game and then maybe,
24:04
Speaker 1: depending on what happens Wednesday, we look at this series
24:07
Speaker 1: completely different, but we can only talk about what we've
24:09
Speaker 1: seen most recently. Carry Carpenter Cody, There's no other way
24:14
Speaker 1: to put it. He's in a slump, and it's been
24:16
Speaker 1: a slump this entire month of July. And look if
24:20
Speaker 1: you look at his splits coming in and we don't
24:24
Speaker 1: know the extent of his how hurt he is. He left.
24:28
Speaker 1: He's being evaluated with a bruised heel. That's why he
24:30
Speaker 1: left Monday Night's game after the error by Nico Horner.
24:35
Speaker 1: June was a good month for Carry Carpenter. He was
24:39
Speaker 1: two fifty three, He had seven bombs like you know,
24:42
Speaker 1: with a eight eight seven ops like we kind of again,
24:46
Speaker 1: he had had the injury. He comes back and everything
24:48
Speaker 1: kind of looks hunky dory, right, been a bad month
24:53
Speaker 1: of July. Man so like he is three for thirty
24:57
Speaker 1: nine Cody. That's a zero zero seven to seven ballion
25:01
Speaker 1: average obviously, and the slug matches it also a zero
25:05
Speaker 1: seven to seven slug Like they don't have to go
25:07
Speaker 1: other numbers. It's bad he is. He has had a
25:10
Speaker 1: futrid month of July. And like, as we're trying to
25:14
Speaker 1: project out like what this team is and what does
25:17
Speaker 1: it mean and like all these things as of right now,
25:22
Speaker 1: this kind of feels like the biggest pullback like that
25:26
Speaker 1: the Tigers have, like in terms of trying to project
25:29
Speaker 1: like what they could be, what we kind of expected
25:31
Speaker 1: them to be this entire year, which is like I
25:34
Speaker 1: just don't know if you can be a playoff team
25:39
Speaker 1: with Carry Carpenter in the tank, Like I just don't
25:43
Speaker 1: know if that's possible, and and so like like I
25:47
Speaker 1: don't know what the solution is. I'm not going to
25:49
Speaker 1: try to evaluate all of his bats timed up for
25:51
Speaker 1: the fastball this that The other thing, the bottom line is,
25:54
Speaker 1: if we're talking about needs for this team, they need
25:58
Speaker 1: him a to be healthy and then be to be performing.
26:01
Speaker 1: And I don't know, I don't think it. I don't
26:03
Speaker 1: think that's controversial.
26:05
Speaker 2: No, not at all. I think Carry Carpenter would probably
26:08
Speaker 2: agree with you on all those fronts. He's seing two
26:11
Speaker 2: o six for the season, given both some time he's
26:14
Speaker 2: missed and just some rough performance. It's kind of amazing
26:18
Speaker 2: to think he has thirteen home runs. The power has
26:20
Speaker 2: still largely been there when he's been on the field,
26:22
Speaker 2: but nothing else really has. He's still seeing just a
26:25
Speaker 2: ton of spin and he's chasing it. He's whiffing far
26:29
Speaker 2: more than he did last season, bottom eleventh percentile and
26:33
Speaker 2: strikeout rate, So even though the walks are up a
26:36
Speaker 2: little bit, it's kind of been negated by the strikeouts,
26:39
Speaker 2: and it feels like he's digging himself deeper into this
26:42
Speaker 2: hole trying to get out of it. Certainly, concerning leaves
26:45
Speaker 2: a game with a bruised heel, we don't know a
26:48
Speaker 2: ton about that, hoping that that will simply be a
26:51
Speaker 2: day to day thing as it's being advertised, but I
26:55
Speaker 2: don't know. Almost does make you wonder if maybe he's
26:57
Speaker 2: been fighting something more physically, because he just hasn't looked
27:00
Speaker 2: right at the play it, and we kind of learned
27:01
Speaker 2: last year he's battling hamstring woes and stuff that something
27:05
Speaker 2: about it. When he's feeling good physically, his whole approach
27:09
Speaker 2: seems to be better. And really I think it's as
27:11
Speaker 2: simple as it's been in an approach issue, and that
27:15
Speaker 2: not being able to lay off spin has really created
27:18
Speaker 2: some big time problems for him.
27:22
Speaker 1: Let me ask you this, Let's frame it this way, Cody,
27:25
Speaker 1: who do you think is more well received by the
27:29
Speaker 1: fan base? Carry Carpenter or Spencer Torkleson.
27:34
Speaker 2: I with Terry Carpenter. Everyone still wants him to hit
27:36
Speaker 2: lefties more and all that good stuff, and work's doing
27:40
Speaker 2: all right for where he's at. He still has his
27:43
Speaker 2: campus supporters. There are also some people who really dislike
27:48
Speaker 2: to work. So, as I've always said, it's just really
27:50
Speaker 2: hard for anyone to ever be rational about Spencer Torkelsen,
27:54
Speaker 2: which is a strange thing.
27:56
Speaker 1: So if you're in the war coming into Tuesday, they
27:59
Speaker 1: have the same more negative point five. So if you're
28:02
Speaker 1: in the war, they're the same, then then you keep
28:04
Speaker 1: it then and then you factor in that Spencer's played
28:07
Speaker 1: ninety nine or one hundred games now to carry seventy seven,
28:12
Speaker 1: And the fact, here's a funny stat I think we
28:15
Speaker 1: would agree that carry Carpenter's power also has to be
28:17
Speaker 1: gap power. Would we agree with that, Like, it can't
28:20
Speaker 1: just be Homer, It's gotta be gap help. Yeah. Okay, Well,
28:23
Speaker 1: how does the fact that carry Carpenter only has five
28:26
Speaker 1: doubles sound to you?
28:29
Speaker 2: That's a good stat right there, Kieran, I don't like
28:31
Speaker 2: that stat one bit.
28:33
Speaker 1: Torglsen has eighteen for the record. He's also got eighteen
28:36
Speaker 1: home runs, and they have basically identify identical They do
28:41
Speaker 1: have identical baalting average Spencer is probably a little bit
28:43
Speaker 1: lower now, but basically identifal identical valuing averages. So the
28:47
Speaker 1: one that everybody's quick to replace and the one that
28:50
Speaker 1: everyone wants to get more opportunity. And they're the same
28:54
Speaker 1: with some elevated stats for torkal Sin and they both
28:57
Speaker 1: play position, and I would say tortals defense, despite you
29:01
Speaker 1: know what overall metrics would tell you, is more key
29:04
Speaker 1: than Carpenter's defense. I think that is also fair. We
29:06
Speaker 1: saw that on you know, earlier this week as well.
29:10
Speaker 1: So I just to me, like, the Carpenter thing is
29:15
Speaker 1: actually really troublesome. The more I look at it, the
29:17
Speaker 1: more I want to believe in track record but it's
29:19
Speaker 1: actually quite troublesome and something that needs to be rectified
29:22
Speaker 1: because he's not gapped to get power. If he's not
29:25
Speaker 1: over the fence power, there's not that much more you're
29:29
Speaker 1: offering me right now, Cody, and and you need more
29:32
Speaker 1: of it. And if while we're on the subject of Torque,
29:35
Speaker 1: when I give him some credit, here, here's some here's
29:38
Speaker 1: something wild, all right? I like this. This got the
29:41
Speaker 1: trend on Tiger's Twitter, and people didn't believe it. I'm
29:44
Speaker 1: not sure I believe it either, but I went looked
29:46
Speaker 1: it up. It is true. Here is special Torgelsen this
29:49
Speaker 1: year with runners in corp position three h nine with
29:53
Speaker 1: a six zero three slug and a one point zero
29:57
Speaker 1: four six ops with runners of this corp position all right,
30:02
Speaker 1: one eight eight WRC plus code. I know you love
30:05
Speaker 1: that stat. WRC plus one eight eight WRC plus with
30:09
Speaker 1: runners of scoring position. According to database on Twitter, that
30:13
Speaker 1: is eleventh among qualified hitters in baseball. And by the way,
30:17
Speaker 1: on Monday night, all the positive things that was a
30:20
Speaker 1: to run base hit with a run with the bases loaded,
30:23
Speaker 1: not just running to scoring the base loaded.
30:25
Speaker 2: Is a hit with the bases loaded. He's one of
30:28
Speaker 2: nine this year, one, hitting, twelve played appearances, nine at bats,
30:32
Speaker 2: but all those other numbers are real. I'll admit I
30:34
Speaker 2: was surprised at his success with runners in scoring position.
30:38
Speaker 2: But another important reminder, you know, just because you see
30:40
Speaker 2: you guys strike out a couple of times with runners
30:42
Speaker 2: on base, doesn't mean he sucks with runners in scoring position.
30:45
Speaker 2: It's like the rest of baseball. If you get a
30:47
Speaker 2: hit three out of ten times, you're doing pretty well.
30:50
Speaker 2: And that's about what Torque has done. He's done that
30:52
Speaker 2: with a little pop with runners in scoring position. Overall,
30:56
Speaker 2: though he is hitting two a five like Carry Carpenter.
30:58
Speaker 2: Like Carry Carpenter, not doing well against spin with rates
31:02
Speaker 2: way up one base percentage, you know, and Torks the
31:06
Speaker 2: guy who does take his walks, but he's not hitting
31:09
Speaker 2: for average at all. If your one base percentage is
31:11
Speaker 2: below three hundred, you're gonna have a really tough time
31:14
Speaker 2: contributing to a major league lineup. You better hit for power,
31:17
Speaker 2: which I guess both of those guys do just enough
31:19
Speaker 2: to really make them viable. You know, I want to
31:23
Speaker 2: see one base percentages of three point thirty plus for
31:26
Speaker 2: those guys, and that just takes being a more well
31:28
Speaker 2: rounded hitter, and it's it's obviously not an easy thing
31:32
Speaker 2: to do because both of them are still struggling with it.
31:37
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, as we wrap up here, Dylan Dingler
31:41
Speaker 1: three home runs in two days. I did say on Sunday.
31:44
Speaker 1: I was like, you know, you got it Fields Due.
31:47
Speaker 1: I'm not sure I would have thought three in two days.
31:49
Speaker 1: But you know, credit to Dylan Dingler five, isn't he?
31:51
Speaker 1: I mean, you have to apologize to him. And again,
31:57
Speaker 1: there are several fun moments on Monday's game that we're
31:59
Speaker 1: just not gonna be able to get to. But I
32:02
Speaker 1: did want to kind of wrap up here. We talked
32:04
Speaker 1: about what would happen when Labor came back and you know,
32:08
Speaker 1: roster move wise, and the Tigers ended up going with
32:12
Speaker 1: Eduardo Valencia being sent down. I'm not sure what the
32:17
Speaker 1: read is on there. Maybe maybe it's one of those
32:20
Speaker 1: things where they just kind of combled with the expected
32:22
Speaker 1: return of Hobby Bias too, and so they kind of
32:25
Speaker 1: lumped them together as opposed as to what they would
32:28
Speaker 1: do as opposed to just like one off each move
32:31
Speaker 1: because I figure Ben Maljerry probably would be next if
32:36
Speaker 1: when Hobby is ready. That's just a guess though. Any
32:39
Speaker 1: any thoughts on Valencia's kind of short little tenure being
32:43
Speaker 1: or I said tenure being short?
32:45
Speaker 2: I guess, yeah, you know, I guess I should have
32:48
Speaker 2: seen that coming. As I said, I kind of thought
32:50
Speaker 2: it would be more mal Jerry, mostly based on the
32:53
Speaker 2: team that just talked about Valencia like they were interested
32:56
Speaker 2: in having them stick around for a bit after the break.
32:59
Speaker 2: But Glabor Torres, you know, made it back in pretty
33:02
Speaker 2: quick fashion after the All Star break. The move ultimately
33:06
Speaker 2: makes sense. Having three catchers is an extreme luxury. There's
33:09
Speaker 2: going to be tough for Valencia to play much and
33:12
Speaker 2: with Glabor taking over a second base role, that probably
33:14
Speaker 2: pushes how you lee to the bench a little more often.
33:17
Speaker 2: So then even like getting either of those guys right
33:20
Speaker 2: handed pinch hit at bats is tough, and Valencia, I think,
33:23
Speaker 2: is a guy you still want playing. He definitely has
33:25
Speaker 2: a lot of work to do catching, receiving, maybe even
33:29
Speaker 2: playing a little first base. He has to become a
33:32
Speaker 2: more well rounded defender if he's really going to have
33:35
Speaker 2: a career in the big leagues. We know the dude
33:37
Speaker 2: can hit a little bit, but that's someone I think
33:40
Speaker 2: you want to continue to hone his craft. So if
33:43
Speaker 2: you have Dylton Dingler healthy and available, I actually think
33:46
Speaker 2: this makes sense for now. Although Valencia, you know, did
33:51
Speaker 2: enough to open some eyes. It will be really interesting
33:53
Speaker 2: to see what his future holds. I'm sure we will
33:55
Speaker 2: see much more of him in the next couple of years.
34:00
Speaker 1: Next couple of years could be next couple of weeks,
34:02
Speaker 1: given how you know baseball works. And you know another
34:06
Speaker 1: example of that is, you know, from the pitching side,
34:08
Speaker 1: Jack Flarerty today goes on the fifteen day I l
34:11
Speaker 1: with right flexer inflammation. He was four innings, four runs,
34:15
Speaker 1: yeah or yeah, four runs, gave up the the two
34:19
Speaker 1: bombs there and and you know, one of those games
34:24
Speaker 1: that we would in a different circumstance we have been
34:26
Speaker 1: talking about, like what do you make of Jack Flaherty.
34:28
Speaker 1: You know, we would have done that, We would have
34:30
Speaker 1: done that old game. Obviously, I hope he's healthy, but again,
34:33
Speaker 1: like this is this is the the Cater Montero luxury.
34:37
Speaker 1: And why we keep talking about him is because like
34:42
Speaker 1: it sucks that flaaritys shurt, but it just kind of
34:46
Speaker 1: just kind of smoothly runs Montero in there. He would
34:49
Speaker 1: have been there anyway, the six man rotation now is
34:51
Speaker 1: just kind of back to normal. I guess with Montero.
34:54
Speaker 2: It's all right, But to be honest, here in this
34:56
Speaker 2: kind of worries me because it sounds like Montero is
34:58
Speaker 2: going to be back in the rotation for a couple turns,
35:00
Speaker 2: which means Cater Montero is not gonna be pitching at
35:03
Speaker 2: the end of games. We just saw a blow up
35:06
Speaker 2: that you're gonna have to tax your bullpen a little
35:08
Speaker 2: bit Tuesday and Wednesday, and in a time where every
35:12
Speaker 2: game really matters, Like, how good are you going to
35:14
Speaker 2: feel about that bullpen? Also, for Jack, unfortunate surprise injury
35:19
Speaker 2: kind of came out of nowhere. At least it felt
35:21
Speaker 2: like this is a guy who is wont among the
35:25
Speaker 2: potential trade chips, and he's now out with a flexer strain.
35:29
Speaker 2: The Tigers tried to sound like it could be a
35:31
Speaker 2: minimum fifteen days stay on the IL. I don't know
35:34
Speaker 2: how many flexer strains are minimum stays. And also, if
35:38
Speaker 2: they were to try to trade him, I'll say I
35:41
Speaker 2: wouldn't really be trying to trade much for a guy
35:44
Speaker 2: with a with a flexer strain, so potentially he could
35:48
Speaker 2: throw a huge wrinkle in the Tigers' plans in a
35:51
Speaker 2: couple of different ways. We will see how they weather that.
35:57
Speaker 1: We'll see how they weather that that's kind of been
35:59
Speaker 1: since June one, like like, we'll see how they weather that,
36:04
Speaker 1: whether it alone, whether they've weathered a lot. And and
36:07
Speaker 1: in fairness, like you know, when it's eleven to two
36:11
Speaker 1: you get blown out like they did today, it feels natural.
36:13
Speaker 1: It is kind of be a little bit more pessimistic
36:16
Speaker 1: or whatever. Again, Monday was a very fun game. You
36:18
Speaker 1: can say what you want about like ken Lee, you
36:21
Speaker 1: can say what you want about finning in and all that.
36:23
Speaker 1: All that is fair, All the overarching concerns are fair.
36:26
Speaker 1: But it was a very fun game. There are a
36:27
Speaker 1: lot of elements there where it kind of felt like
36:29
Speaker 1: this is a team that's in like refused to lose mode.
36:33
Speaker 1: Was kind of like when I was watching and and
36:36
Speaker 1: maybe that will still be the case. From your destiny to.
36:39
Speaker 2: An eleven two blowout. That's kind of the story of
36:42
Speaker 2: the twenty twenty six Tigers in the show.
36:45
Speaker 1: There you go, and we're gonna continue talking about them
36:48
Speaker 1: and speculating and assessing and and giving predictions and having
36:53
Speaker 1: fun doing you guys can follow along at Coe Steven Higgen.
36:56
Speaker 1: I am at Kering on his course. Decly pot page
36:58
Speaker 1: at Tiger Territory to score YouTube Apple, we are so
37:02
Speaker 1: close to three k on YouTube. Thank you to everybody
37:05
Speaker 1: who subscribed. If you haven't already, please hit that subscribe button.
37:08
Speaker 1: We appreciate all you guys Apple Spotify five star review
37:10
Speaker 1: if you feel so inclined, we appreciate all of you.
37:12
Speaker 1: So for Coach Stapenhagen, I am Kieran Steckley. Everybody, have
37:16
Speaker 1: a great day.