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Katie Woolf spoke with AFANT CEO David Ciaravolo · 360 with Katie Woolf

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: Joining me live in the studio from a f and
• 0:03
  Speaker 1: it is David Girovolo.
• 0:04
  Speaker 2: How are you. I'm well, Katie, how are you?
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah? Good. We haven't had a catch up for a while.
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: And there's so much happening in your sector.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: That's right, it's been too long.
• 0:12
  Speaker 3: And yeah, always a lot happening in the world of
• 0:14
  Speaker 3: recreational fishing.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: Mate, There always is, especially here in the Northern Territory.
• 0:18
  Speaker 1: And I know that very recently you guys had your AGM,
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: didn't you.
• 0:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, we did. We had that on Thursday last week.
• 0:26
  Speaker 3: Gosh, it feels like longer ago now, but wow, it
• 0:29
  Speaker 3: felt like a long time getting there.
• 0:30
  Speaker 2: It's been a.
• 0:30
  Speaker 3: Really really big year and a year that we're really
• 0:34
  Speaker 3: proud of, but also we've got a lot to look
• 0:36
  Speaker 3: forward to as well.
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and I guess those agms they are always a
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: really important time to kind of look at the year
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: that's been, but also look at where you're going. And
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: no doubt that's an incredibly important thing for you guys
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: to do with our Fand it's been a tough year,
• 0:50
  Speaker 1: has Nash, Yeah, look, it certainly has.
• 0:53
  Speaker 3: I think it's been a tough year for everybody in
• 0:55
  Speaker 3: all work walks of life no matter what they do,
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  Speaker 3: and obviously having the pandemic and the lockdown has had
• 1:03
  Speaker 3: an impact on so many people's lives. And you know,
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  Speaker 3: it was really during the peak of that pandemic lockdown.
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  Speaker 3: I'm sort of casting our minds back now to sort
• 1:12
  Speaker 3: of that March April May period when there was a
• 1:15
  Speaker 3: lot of uncertainty, when people were doing it tough. You know,
• 1:18
  Speaker 3: we saw a lot of people turn to fishing during
• 1:20
  Speaker 3: that time, and it was a main focus of ours
• 1:23
  Speaker 3: to make sure that we had good information, accurate information,
• 1:27
  Speaker 3: advice out to people, that we worked with the government
• 1:30
  Speaker 3: on making sure that advice was practical and most importantly
• 1:34
  Speaker 3: that we could keep people safe but keep people fishing.
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: David, did we find that people really turned to fishing
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: in those times, because I know, when there was discussion
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: about the rules changing right in the middle of that pandemic.
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: People were really really upset about.
• 1:50
  Speaker 1: It, and not just because they enjoy fishing on the weekend,
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  Speaker 1: but it was as if if those you know, if
• 1:55
  Speaker 1: those changes were too sort of strong, a lot of
• 1:59
  Speaker 1: people felt like it was going to have a big
• 2:01
  Speaker 1: impact on their mental health.
• 2:02
  Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right, and we know that there are huge
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: mental health, general health and well being benefits and social
• 2:09
  Speaker 3: benefits that come from going recreational fishing. And at a
• 2:13
  Speaker 3: time when people had had so much uncertainty and so
• 2:15
  Speaker 3: much change, and also at a time when other activities
• 2:18
  Speaker 3: were restricted, those benefits were highly accessed by recreational fishers.
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  Speaker 3: People who had never been fishing before picked up a
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  Speaker 3: rod for the first time, and it was about getting
• 2:28
  Speaker 3: into the outdoors, spending time with family, maybe spending some
• 2:32
  Speaker 3: time alone, and also doing something that wasn't that took
• 2:36
  Speaker 3: you away from your worries, something that was sort of
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  Speaker 3: meditative and contemplative that allows you to do that, or alternatively,
• 2:42
  Speaker 3: something that's quite fun. So there's a whole lot of
• 2:45
  Speaker 3: different ways that people access those benefits, but keeping people
• 2:48
  Speaker 3: to have access to them was obviously so important.
• 2:51
  Speaker 1: And has this sort of been a way to measure,
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: you know, whether recreational fishing has become more popular over
• 2:58
  Speaker 1: the last year, or whether there's more people doing it
• 3:00
  Speaker 1: in the Northern Territory as a result of COVID, or
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: is it sort of too difficult to tell.
• 3:04
  Speaker 3: Yeah, So, you know, in typical fashion, we collect this
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  Speaker 3: data periodically, and we collected it the year before the pandemic,
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  Speaker 3: So that's terribly unhelpful. But one of the things that we,
• 3:13
  Speaker 3: of course can go on is the feedback that we've
• 3:16
  Speaker 3: had from the fishing tackle industry, from the camping retail sector,
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  Speaker 3: and also from our campgrounds and so on and so forth,
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  Speaker 3: and by all accounts, it's been actually a bumper year.
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  Speaker 3: Now when you think about the fact that so often
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  Speaker 3: these service industries not only rely on domestic fishing, but
• 3:36
  Speaker 3: on that huge amount of people who come.
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  Speaker 2: To the territory for holidays.
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  Speaker 3: To think that they've had a bumper year when people
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  Speaker 3: were not able to travel here for most of that
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  Speaker 3: really hits home at how much additional focus there has
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  Speaker 3: been from people on going fishing.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, one hundred percent. Hey, let's talk about the fact
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  Speaker 1: that I know that we've got the new artificial reefs,
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  Speaker 1: but they're actually well, is it one year on?
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  Speaker 3: It's hard to believe, but coming in about a week
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  Speaker 3: or so's time, it's a year that those structures have
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  Speaker 3: been in the water.
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  Speaker 2: Some of them have been in the water for a
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  Speaker 2: year already.
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  Speaker 3: So the project was wrapped up in sort of mid
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  Speaker 3: December last year, and it's amazing to see the results
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  Speaker 3: it's been yielding already.
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  Speaker 2: Has it gone well. We've seen some amazing footage.
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  Speaker 3: There was a presentation from evaneed them at Fisheries at
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  Speaker 3: our AGM and it showed some of the most recent
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  Speaker 3: footage that's been collected by their baited underwater cameras.
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  Speaker 1: I reckon. I saw that on Channel nine as well,
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  Speaker 1: and it looked amazing.
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  Speaker 2: Indeed.
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  Speaker 3: Indeed, so what we're seeing is not only large fish
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  Speaker 3: and also lots of small fish recruiting to those structures,
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  Speaker 3: but those structures have become whole new habitat in their
• 4:39
  Speaker 3: own right, so they are alive with it's a horrible name,
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  Speaker 3: it's called fowling, but fowling is essentially the thing that
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  Speaker 3: sticks to something when you put it in the sea.
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  Speaker 3: So you don't want that on your boat, but you
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  Speaker 3: do want that on your reef. And we're seeing things
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  Speaker 3: like muscles and oysters, bivalves, we're seeing different types of
• 4:56
  Speaker 3: algae's but we're also seeing corals already growing on them,
• 5:00
  Speaker 3: and that's fish homes and that's fish food.
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  Speaker 1: That's good news. Good news for us as territorians and
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  Speaker 1: those who want to get out and go fishing.
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  Speaker 3: It's all about expanding those opportunities and diversifying that offering
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  Speaker 3: not only for locals to make it more sustainable, but
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  Speaker 3: to make it a better tourism destination and to cement
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  Speaker 3: our places the best place of fish in Australia.
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  Speaker 1: Yeap one hundred percent. Now, I know that we talk
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: a lot about diversifying when we talk about the economy,
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  Speaker 1: and mining is one of those industries where we talk
• 5:26
  Speaker 1: about this a lot. But there is a certain type
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: of mining that our fans are quite concerned about, and
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  Speaker 1: that is seabed mining. Talk us through the situation here
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  Speaker 1: and what you sort of you know, don't want happening.
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, So what we've seen is the period of comment
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  Speaker 3: sort of close on the EPA's draft report into seabed mining.
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  Speaker 2: So there's been a moratorium or a ban.
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  Speaker 3: On seabed mining since twenty twelve, and the EPA we're
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  Speaker 3: tasked with looking into how it might be regulated, and
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  Speaker 3: part of it is about analyzing the risks. They came
• 5:54
  Speaker 3: out with a really good draft report which we supported.
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  Speaker 3: It's really highlighted that most types of seabedd are unlikely
• 6:01
  Speaker 3: to ever be able to be safely regulated, and that's
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  Speaker 3: because so many of the baseline conditions are unknown, how
• 6:08
  Speaker 3: far the impacts would spread are unknown, and the fact
• 6:11
  Speaker 3: that it would typically occur in the areas that are
• 6:13
  Speaker 3: really important fish habitat and fishing grounds.
• 6:16
  Speaker 1: And so would you, guys, you want to see that
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  Speaker 1: moratorium stay in place. You don't want this to be developed,
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: and you feel as though it's going to have a
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  Speaker 1: big impact if it is.
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  Speaker 3: So, having seen the draft report and having provided a submission,
• 6:27
  Speaker 3: knowing that submission will go not only to the EPA
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  Speaker 3: but to the government, it's certainly our position that the
• 6:33
  Speaker 3: report is a good report, but the government, when it
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  Speaker 3: comes to the crunch, needs to make a decision, should
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  Speaker 3: consider either bringing in a permanent moratorium on seabed mining
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  Speaker 3: or at least an extended moratorium for a period of
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  Speaker 3: ten years or so. And I think in one of
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  Speaker 3: the things that really echoed you hosted the Industry breakfast
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  Speaker 3: last week and we heard Andrew Liiveris and the rest
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  Speaker 3: of the Reconstruction Commission talking about what the future holds
• 6:59
  Speaker 3: for the territory, need to back winners and pick winners,
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  Speaker 3: and I just don't think that this is one This
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  Speaker 3: isn't one that there's an opportunity cost of focusing on
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  Speaker 3: regulating developing an industry that has high risk, no social license,
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  Speaker 3: and is highly unlikely to be able to win the
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  Speaker 3: kind of money it needs to do at the job properly.
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  Speaker 3: So let's focus on other things to grow the territory well.
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  Speaker 1: Look. To be honest, I don't know a huge amount
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  Speaker 1: about seabed mining, but I can certainly understand the concerns
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  Speaker 1: that you guys have got, particularly when you're talking about
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  Speaker 1: you know, when you're talking about an area and the
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  Speaker 1: ocean where we, like you've pointed out all throughout the
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: interview so far this morning, how important our fishing is,
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  Speaker 1: how important the industry is to us. So I think
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  Speaker 1: you've always got to be cautious in that space when
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  Speaker 1: you know developing another industry could actually quite substantially impact
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  Speaker 1: one which is already here.
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  Speaker 2: Yes, and that's always an important thing to balance.
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  Speaker 3: And I think it's always important that we can't say
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  Speaker 3: no to all kinds of development. Obviously it's important to
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  Speaker 3: understand that we need to have development, but those developments do.
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  Speaker 2: Need to be embedded in the environment.
• 8:00
  Speaker 3: And the early warnings that have come out from the
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  Speaker 3: EPA here is that most types of sea bed mining
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  Speaker 3: are unlikely.
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  Speaker 2: To be able to be safely regulated.
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  Speaker 1: Hey, I'm keen to get a bit of an update
• 8:08
  Speaker 1: for you, or I'm keen to get an update from you,
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  Speaker 1: I should say, from the progress at the Dundee boat ramps,
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  Speaker 1: how are things going there?
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  Speaker 3: Well, look, by all accounts, there is an interim interim
• 8:21
  Speaker 3: management or what we call it maintenance program there at
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  Speaker 3: the moment, and the maintenance has been better in terms
• 8:26
  Speaker 3: of people being able to get in and out. And
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  Speaker 3: so one of the things, if we can cast our
• 8:30
  Speaker 3: mind back to sort of the middle of the year,
• 8:31
  Speaker 3: was our fat met with the Minister for Infrastructure and
• 8:35
  Speaker 3: also the Minister for Fishing is now wreck fishing and
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  Speaker 3: we asked to have a working group form to focus
• 8:41
  Speaker 3: on Dundee. So we've actually met about six times since then.
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  Speaker 3: We're just about to provide some recommendations.
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  Speaker 2: To the government. I'm not here to.
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  Speaker 3: Unfortunately, but what I can say is it goes to
• 8:55
  Speaker 3: ongoing maintenance. It looks at long term, medium, short, medium
• 8:59
  Speaker 3: and long term kinds of solutions or implementation of certain
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  Speaker 3: management strategies.
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  Speaker 2: But what I can say for our fans part, and certainly.
• 9:08
  Speaker 3: We took this to the election policy prior to the
• 9:13
  Speaker 3: territory election was that we see Dundee as a duel
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  Speaker 3: in the crown of not only territory fishing, but territory tourism.
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  Speaker 3: It's an important place that really needs to be made
• 9:22
  Speaker 3: and needs to be future proofed. We want to see
• 9:25
  Speaker 3: improved launching and maintenance. We'd love to see land based
• 9:29
  Speaker 3: fishing occurring on that rock groin and make that pedestrianized.
• 9:33
  Speaker 3: We'd like to see improved passenger landing through the installation
• 9:36
  Speaker 3: of a pontoon. And you know, there's been a lot
• 9:39
  Speaker 3: of talk over time about the car park being fixed,
• 9:41
  Speaker 3: and yeah, that's certainly something we need to focus on.
• 9:44
  Speaker 3: But we've got very limited public space at Dundee. We've
• 9:47
  Speaker 3: got to get that foreshore area right and we have
• 9:50
  Speaker 3: to continue to make it a public asset so that
• 9:51
  Speaker 3: when people travel to Dundee it lives up to their
• 9:54
  Speaker 3: expectations now and into the future.
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: So, David, are you expecting that there's going to be
• 9:59
  Speaker 1: some announcements in this space. I know that you're obviously
• 10:02
  Speaker 1: going to the government with those recommendations and no doubt
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: hoping that those recommendations will come to fruition.
• 10:09
  Speaker 3: Well, look, certainly We certainly hope so, and it is
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: something that we would expect in this term of government. Look, obviously,
• 10:16
  Speaker 3: we have to acknowledge that COVID and the post COVID
• 10:20
  Speaker 3: recovery means a hit to both federal and territory governments,
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: and we have to understand that. But strategic investments in
• 10:28
  Speaker 3: our important places. Dundee is the most popular boat ramp
• 10:31
  Speaker 3: in the territory and it's arguably one of the most
• 10:34
  Speaker 3: important destinations. I think there was an article in the
• 10:37
  Speaker 3: paper yesterday talking about Dundee as being one of the
• 10:39
  Speaker 3: top places that people are traveling to the NT to visit.
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: Yep.
• 10:42
  Speaker 3: So you know, when they get there, we've got to
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: have good facilities and they also we don't want people
• 10:47
  Speaker 3: just being confronted with a concrete jungle. We want people
• 10:50
  Speaker 3: being confronted with palm trees and a warm, inviting environment
• 10:54
  Speaker 3: and good healthy public space.
• 10:56
  Speaker 1: Well, and particularly then when we talk about tourism and
• 10:58
  Speaker 1: we talk about tourism within a strike, which is what
• 11:00
  Speaker 1: we're going to see, you know what we're really pushing
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: at this point in time. Because we can't travel overseas
• 11:06
  Speaker 1: at the moment itself, we're able to get that domestic
• 11:08
  Speaker 1: tourism and really tap into that market of people wanting
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: to come to the territory to fish. I would suspect
• 11:14
  Speaker 1: that Dundee is one of the flagship places to visit. Well.
• 11:18
  Speaker 3: I think it comes back to that sentiment earlier, which
• 11:20
  Speaker 3: is really about picking winners and understanding that we have
• 11:23
  Speaker 3: to go with where the strengths lie and where the
• 11:26
  Speaker 3: opportunities lie. Dundee is the destination. Unfortunately, probably due to
• 11:31
  Speaker 3: a real lack of master planning in the beginning, there
• 11:35
  Speaker 3: wasn't enough public space at Dundee and so it's quite
• 11:37
  Speaker 3: a cramped area and it's becoming a bit of a
• 11:41
  Speaker 3: victim of its own popularity. So what we have to
• 11:43
  Speaker 3: do is try to work together with all stakeholders to
• 11:47
  Speaker 3: make sure that not only do we have great facilities,
• 11:49
  Speaker 3: but we have a great public space there for the future.
• 11:52
  Speaker 1: Well, David Chirravolo from AFANT always great to catch up
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: with you, mate, We've left it too long. We'll have
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: to catch up with you a bit more regularly. Again.
• 11:58
  Speaker 2: That sounds good to me. Thanks you, Udeo