Latest / Pop of Culture / S03 E06 - We Take a Dive Into the Archives

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S03 E06 - We Take a Dive Into the Archives · Pop of Culture

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0:15
(upbeat music)
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[Jen Blackmer] This week on Pop of Culture,
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we take a dive into the archive.
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[Kara DuQuette] We'll hear from Indiana's Poet Laureate.
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[JEN] We'll enjoy some music from a local band,
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and an artist who makes up a band all by themselves.
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[KARA] And have a meditation on teaching, a beautiful thing.
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Usually.
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[JEN] That's all coming up in this encore edition
0:38
of Pop of Culture.
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(upbeat music)
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comes from Stallings Wealth Management,
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the Innovation Connector,
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and from, you.
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1:01
Become a member today at indianapublicradio.org.
1:14
[KARA] From IPR, this is Pop of Culture.
1:16
I'm Kara DuQuette.
1:17
[JEN] And I'm Jen Blackmer.
1:19
Our team is off this week, so we'll be listening back
1:21
to some relevant interviews from the archives.
1:25
[KARA] Curtis Crisler is Indiana's Poet Laureate.
1:28
He was on Ball State's campus this week
1:30
talking about new forms of poetry.
1:32
But first, we heard him in Season 1.
1:35
[ELLA ABBOTT] Well, Curtis, welcome.
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[CURTIS CRISLER] It's nice to be here.
1:38
[ELLA] I wanna start by congratulating you
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on being selected as Indiana's Poet Laureate.
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How are you feeling about that?
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[CURTIS] It's been a whirlwind.
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My life has changed so much
1:48
in the sense that I'm kind of low key person, not anymore.
1:54
So I've been on TV,
1:56
and just to get through emails and texts and phone calls
2:00
has been crazy.
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And I'm still teaching,
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so it's kind of like I have to teach too.
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I'm not a morning person,
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and everything has to be in the morning.
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So then they're taking pictures,
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and I have bags under my eyes,
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and I don't feel like,
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I just got three hours of sleep,
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and it's like, okay, we'll do this.
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Yeah, it's kind of cool, you know,
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to represent poetry for the state.
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[ELLA] And what was the selection process like for you?
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[CURTIS] This is my second time going through it.
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The first time I went through in 2020,
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they got the questions to you,
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and then if they liked the questions,
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you went on to another round.
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It was still that, but this time they had a Zoom,
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and I'm looking at like 15, 20 people,
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and it's like, wow, okay.
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And everybody gets to, you know, ask questions and stuff.
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It was cool.
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I thought I flubbed the last question,
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so I was trying to get it out of my head.
3:01
So it was like, oh, I flubbed the last question,
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so it's over.
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And I talked to a friend of mine who was on a panel,
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and she's, ah, you'll be okay, whatever.
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And then I started detecting, what does she mean by that?
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And then the director had said,
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"Well, I wanna have a call with you,
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"I wanna do a Zoom call with you.
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And I was like, okay.
3:21
So then the internal stuff started coming,
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so I just wanted it out of my head.
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And then we had the meeting and she said,
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"Well, you're going to be the next Indiana Poet Laureate
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"if you so please."
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And I was like, yeah!
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And the 10 year period where my friend,
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my colleague, my mentor, George Kalamaras,
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was that I don't know of any school
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that had two Poet Laureates in it.
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So that's really, I think,
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unique and hopefully says something about our program.
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[ELLA] On your poetry,
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I had a chance to read "Tough Boy Sonatas",
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which paints this really interesting picture
3:57
of young boys growing up in Gary.
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Can you tell me about the inspiration for that book
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and how growing up in Indiana has affected your writing?
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[CURTIS] Well, that was my thesis for grad school.
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It was the first time I had,
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I was in a place where I could just write and focus on that.
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Although, you had to teach two and take two classes.
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My writing process is chaos in a sense,
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and when I get down to addressing stuff,
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I just get so focused that I drown out all the white noise
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because I'm focused on what I'm writing.
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In that place, I was able to do that for a long stint.
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So it was really a powerful time.
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I don't know how I got to the first image,
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but I just started thinking about where I came from,
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and coming up with images
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of my mother getting us out of the projects.
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And I think with Laroi, that poem addresses that,
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where she saw me spick and span or something like that.
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She saw me clean,
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and she didn't get us out just because of me.
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But in the poem, it goes that way.
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And she got us out because she saw something in us,
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you know?
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But it's showing that trajectory
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of going from the Delaney projects to the suburbs.
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[ELLA] Related to that,
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is that a theme that I've noticed in your poetry
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is sort of like odes to mothers.
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Can you tell me about like,
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what makes you write so passionately about moms?
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[CURTIS] Well, it's always about my mother.
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I think it's, I'm trying to think.
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One of the books George gave us
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and the author says,
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the voice that he hears in his head
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is the voice of his mother.
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And that's the voice that's in my head all the time,
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because I remember a time with my mom
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before my sisters came.
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My mom is just there, her voice is in my head.
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I'm saying stuff that she says sometimes
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to my class or classes.
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And oh my goodness, I'm sorry,
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I sound like my mom right now, you know?
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And I don't think I can get away from it.
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It's so weird,
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so many people know my mother 'cause I talk about it,
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'cause she's such a fabulous person
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and a character so to speak,
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that they know my mother before they even meet her.
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And so when they meet her, they're like,
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"Oh, so you are the one Curtis is always talking about."
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So she's just this shining star in my life,
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good, bad or indifferent.
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She's always been there.
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And so yeah, that's just a voice
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that's in one of those rooms in my head.
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(Curtis laughing)
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[ELLA] In "Dreamist", a recurring theme
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throughout the main character's story is death.
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His grandparents die early in the book.
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He contemplates the loss of friends from home.
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And at one point he does consider like his own death.
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Yeah.
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What made you wanna ruminate on that in that story?
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It was weird because they're so,
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all the poems are so disparate
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in the way that they are in and of themselves.
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But I brought 'em together for Malik,
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and I wrote this story around Malik.
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So when he gets to Southern California,
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and he opens up his,
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he's unpacking, and he finds the portrait book.
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He just starts, all the images start running back to him.
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And through those images, that's how he's writing the poems.
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So that book has the, you know, the prose and the poetry.
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And so I'm trying to fit, I tried to fit that together,
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as well as tell the narrative of his story.
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And I think what, just, what happens is,
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I never thought about death a lot,
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but death is always around me.
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The new book has a lot of life and death in it.
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So I think I am trying to answer questions for myself,
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or trying to get to questions.
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We always address life, life, life.
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We never think of death as, when we think of death,
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we shroud it in this shadowy darkness.
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[ELLA] In both "Dreamist", and obviously more specifically,
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"Don't Moan So Much (Stevie)",
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there's call outs to some great musicians.
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What's been the impact of music on your life,
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and then ultimately your writing?
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[Curtis] The reason that "Don't Moan So Much" came about
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was Michael Jackson died.
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And I was like, wow, Michael has been,
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Michael and the Jackson Five have been, or J5,
9:01
have been a soundtrack to my life.
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Then I thought about Stevie, then I thought about Motown,
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because I tell people when, you know,
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what kind of music you like, I never say Motown.
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'cause Motown is a default.
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It's always been there.
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So I was mentioned everything else,
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and just like, what about Motown?
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It's a given.
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Motown was there.
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So I didn't think anyone had written anything about Stevie.
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And I wanted to write something about him before he passed.
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And then it was another aspect of writing about,
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what I call urban Midwestern sensibility in Detroit.
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How Detroit had this from the late '50s, to the early '70s,
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basically you're making cars.
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And when the cars come off the line,
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and people turn on the radio, they're turning on Motown.
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So the aspect of what Detroit was,
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is still to a certain extent,
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but it was a conglomerate to the African American experience
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in that sense.
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And I thought that was really powerful.
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So I have like the poem where Berry Gordy is talking to,
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you need to be Stevie,
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you need to do your Stevie stuff.
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And you know, and I just took out all my Stevie CDs,
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and read everything in the liner notes and stuff like that,
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and looked up certain things
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and found out these certain things about 'em.
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And then I just start thinking about practical things.
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What would it be for someone who's blind
10:34
to visit their cousins or something like that?
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And how would that be?
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When you're in the house, you would hear sounds
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that you're not used to,
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the house settling or whatever it is,
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the commode or whatever it is.
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And trying to get in his head and address that.
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So Stevie's in his house for the first time,
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staying with his cousins, and they just go to sleep,
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but he's listening and he's picking up these sounds,
11:02
and they say, Stevie has anesthesia.
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And so I say, Stevie sees the notes,
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and the notes are his friends.
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And to the extent where
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he's actually like just playing with them, you know?
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And then he say, "Hey fellas, why don't we do this?
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"And you get over there, you get over there,
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"you get over there."
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And it becomes, "Isn't She Lovely"
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And you know, it's that kind of thing, how he sees music,
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how he hears music, how he plays music.
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And so, yeah,
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so the whole thing came about after Michael passed.
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And then, yeah, it was just kind of wanting to do something
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to honor that aspect of that soundtrack to my life.
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[KARA] In your work, you discuss race,
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and specifically being Black in America
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in a way that is not shy at all.
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What do you hope people who read your work
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get to take away from those observations?
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[CURTIS] Well, this is my life.
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It's not something I'm making up.
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It's a different, now for me, when I get pulled over
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to be aware of what I do, how I do it,
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when I do it, how I talk, how I say things.
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It's a conversation that has been had for many generations.
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So when you look at "Tough Boy Sonatas",
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it's said to be a lot of boys, but it's actually just me.
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So this is what I found out.
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With Laroi in "Tough Boy Sonatas"
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and Malik in "Dreamist",
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I had to give myself to those personas.
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So my name is Curtis Leroy Crisler,
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but my mother used to call me Laroi,
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and I said, so one day I did ask her, I said,
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"Is my name Leroy or Laroi?"
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She said, "It's Leroy, but it's Laroi when you piss me off."
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And I was like, "Oh, okay."
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So Laroi became the catalyst and persona for the book.
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Once I gave everything to Laroi,
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it kind of veiled me, and Laroi took on everything,
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then I can move, you know,
13:22
move around and and play around with that.
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And the same thing with Malik.
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The problem I had with Malik at first was,
13:29
I was still holding onto the poems.
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These are Curtis Crisler poems,
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and it's like, you have to give the poems to Malik.
13:36
And once I gave them to Malik,
13:37
again, Malik just ran with 'em.
13:40
What he did with the pictures, how he saw the pictures.
13:42
And he just, I even changed,
13:45
there's a poem in there that I say is my,
13:48
would be my eulogy.
13:50
So most of, like I say,
13:51
90% of "Tough Boy Sonatas" is creative nonfiction,
13:56
and the other 10% is just word magic,
14:01
because it's just my life.
14:02
And if you can't see my life,
14:05
or if you don't wanna see my life, then you have a problem.
14:08
There are Black people all around us, you know?
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There are white, Latino, Asian, everything.
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And if we're not paying attention to that,
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then that's on us.
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Yes, we can move to suburbs,
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and different places and all that.
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You're gonna come into connection
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with someone at some point.
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So why can't I tell my life like Samuel Clemens,
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or whoever it may be.
14:36
I have a life too, and I just want you to see it.
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[ELLA] Well, Curtis, thank you so much for joining me today.
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[CURTIS] Oh, I'm so glad to be here.
14:43
Thank you for having me.
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[JEN] That interview came to us in 2024
14:47
from Indiana Public Broadcasting.
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(upbeat music)
15:00
[KARA] You are listening to Pop of Culture.
15:02
Meanwhile, the NPR Tiny Desk team
15:05
is listening to thousands of 2026 contest entries.
15:09
[JEN] That's right.
15:10
The window to enter this year's contest
15:12
closed earlier this week.
15:14
So we thought we'd rewind one of the Hoosier entries
15:18
to last year's contest.
15:19
Let's listen.
15:20
[KARA] We are speaking with IPR's local favorite,
15:23
from NPR's 2025 Tiny Desk Contest, SUN.DYLE.
15:29
And we're happy to have you with us.
15:31
[EMMA TORES] Woo-hoo, we're happy to be here.
15:32
Yeah, happy to be here. [KARA] Excellent.
15:34
Can you all please start by introducing yourselves for us
15:38
and what you do in the band?
15:41
[EMMA] Hi, I'm Emma Torres, I'm the vocalist.
15:44
[BEN] And I'm Ben Beutel, I'm the bass player.
15:46
[EMMA] And Carlos Rosa, our drummer, is also here.
15:49
[KARA] Excellent.
15:51
I wanna know, how did your band form,
15:55
how'd you get together?
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[EMMA] We got together almost two years ago, July of 2023.
16:02
It kind of started out as a mutual jam session
16:06
that was happening between our sax player, Ashton Morris,
16:11
and our drummer, Carlos Rosa.
16:15
And kind of from then on,
16:17
they met with our original guitarist, Luke Delgado,
16:20
and he introduced them to me.
16:23
Ben Beutel and Ben Francis, our bass and keys player,
16:27
we got them in October of that year.
16:30
And, yeah, it's kind of been history since then.
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[KARA] Excellent, so the jamming brought you together.
16:38
(jazz fusion music)
16:58
♪ Woke up the sun ♪
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♪ Sunshine ♪
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♪ Fills my mind in bright colors they shine ♪
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♪ Through you any time ♪
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♪ Stars and trees align ♪
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♪ Come on be entwined ♪
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♪ Yeah, I'm alive ♪
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[KARA]I wanna know what, so of listening to some of your
17:22
music, which is fabulous,
17:23
and what genre do you feel like your music fits into?
17:29
What's your vibe?
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[BEN] It's tough. Oh, that is--
17:32
[KARA] Sorry.
17:33
[EMMA] Thank you for saying that too.
17:34
No, no, it's just, it's hard to pinpoint.
17:35
I think, you know?
17:36
It's so cool that people are loving the music
17:38
the way that we do.
17:40
So thank you for saying that.
17:41
I'd say we originally started,
17:44
we wanted to form kind of a jazz fusion, R&B,
17:48
neo soul type of vibe.
17:51
But right now, it's kind of forming into, you know,
17:53
we play a lot of funk,
17:55
we play a lot of mainstream more pop music.
17:59
And I guess you could say it's got a couple twangs,
18:01
Indian in it sometimes too.
18:02
So it's really hard to put a label on it.
18:06
But I think right now we're kind of still sticking with
18:09
that jazz fusion and R&B feel.
18:13
[KARA] Oh, I think it was so hard for me to form that
18:15
question because I was hard pressed to come up with labels.
18:21
And I think you did a really good job
18:23
in giving us a feeling.
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♪ Always another place ♪
18:29
♪ Always another space ♪
18:32
(jazz fusion music)
18:36
♪ Always another place ♪
18:38
♪ Always another space ♪
18:45
(jazz fusion music)
18:55
[KARA] I wanted to delve a little deeper into your process
18:59
for creating songs.
19:01
If you could talk about it a little bit.
19:03
[EMMA] It's kind of funny.
19:04
We don't have a blueprint, I would say, at all.
19:08
I mean, we each on our own, like me personally,
19:12
I'm not good at sitting in a group
19:14
and thinking of lyrics on the spot or melodies on the spot.
19:18
But it's this suit of every single one of us.
19:23
We write our own parts,
19:25
but everybody has a say in everything.
19:28
So if somebody, you know,
19:30
brings to the table a fully formed song,
19:32
it's gonna sound completely different
19:33
than the way that it started.
19:36
[BEN] Yeah, and a lot of times what we'll do,
19:39
we'll have maybe like two or three of us
19:40
get together sometimes to write
19:42
if we're looking to write something,
19:44
or just kind of hanging out to play.
19:47
But we'll record it and we'll put it up for everybody.
19:49
And then, like, Emma can take it
19:51
and try and come up with a melody, or lyrics,
19:53
or, you know, whoever's not there can kind of like
19:56
listen to it and maybe think of a part,
19:58
or even we've had times where they'll be like,
20:01
I really like this, but what if the feel was this way?
20:04
Or what if we slowed it down?
20:06
Or, you know, like those kind of things.
20:09
Because we come from different places,
20:10
we all have these different kind of tools in our arsenals.
20:14
So like our keyboard player, Ben Francis,
20:16
that couldn't be here today 'cause he's not feeling well.
20:20
He does a lot with, he likes to build his own synth sounds,
20:24
and he loves to run synthesizers and those kind of things.
20:28
And so every song that we bring to him,
20:30
he'll try and come up with a new sound for it,
20:32
which really kind of changes the feel.
20:35
Me, coming from the jazz background,
20:37
you know, I am big on kind of playing the bass
20:41
all over the place.
20:43
So it's still a really nice collaborative process
20:46
most of the time.
20:47
[KARA] Oh, you can hear the collaborative flow, I will say
20:50
[BEN] Well, that's good.
20:51
[EMMA] Good, good.
20:52
[BEN] I'm glad but you know, it still takes work.
20:57
♪ Who's gone is always blue ♪
21:04
♪ And I trusted you ♪
21:11
♪ I may not be the same ♪
21:18
♪ God, I miss how you said my name ♪
21:24
[KARA] So my next question is,
21:26
as we were talking about who's doing the lyrics,
21:29
and like how you freeform,
21:31
like so if I went and listened to your concert,
21:35
it would be very different than some of the recordings
21:37
I've heard possibly.
21:40
[EMMA] Yeah, yeah.
21:41
I'd say like,
21:42
'cause, so we released our debut album, "Mirror",
21:47
well, almost, yeah, almost a year ago.
21:50
So we've been playing these songs,
21:51
and we went on a tour last summer, which was awesome.
21:54
But we've been playing these songs for quite some time,
21:57
even before the album was released.
22:00
And yeah, we're all a little crazy.
22:03
We like to change it up.
22:05
[CARLOS ROSA] Dude, yeah.
22:06
I mean, I think modulating is like one of my favorite things
22:11
to experiment with.
22:12
It's like super difficult to do,
22:15
but like, when you can put a completely different rhythm
22:18
over what you got, like what we're already playing,
22:20
and like, it's like not the same anymore,
22:23
but then we can switch right back to it
22:25
and go back to what we were doing before.
22:26
Like, that's like one of the coolest things in music,
22:29
in my opinion.
22:30
So, I mean, anytime I get to do that,
22:32
that's like a huge treat.
22:33
[EMMA] Heck yeah.
22:35
[KARA] Well, I see you're booked up through the summer,
22:37
so there's gonna be a lot of opportunities to listen to you.
22:45
♪ The trees are free ♪
22:53
♪ Soft, golden glint too ♪
23:05
♪ And melody ♪
23:13
(calming music)
23:18
[KARA] Well, I must know, why Tiny Desk?
23:21
Why did you all want to be a part of NPR Tiny Desk?
23:27
[CARLOS] Hi, this is Carlos.
23:29
[KARA] Hey, Carlos.
23:30
[CARLOS] I don't know if you, I mean, are familiar with the
23:33
Like they, I mean, of course, you are obviously, but.
23:38
[KARA] I've heard of it.
23:39
[Carlos] Like, obviously, that YouTube series is just like,
23:43
it's massive.
23:44
Like it's a place where I feel like everybody goes to
23:48
for like comfort in some way, shape or another.
23:50
Like we've all had it in an artist that we are like
23:53
feel so personal with, like be on that like series.
23:57
And we're just like, dude, a chance to be on that,
23:59
like that's awesome.
24:00
Plus, I mean, the quality always sounds super cool,
24:03
and it's like, I want my playing
24:05
to come through that clean, you know?
24:08
[EMMA] Well, not only that too,
24:09
you see like artists that you're familiar with,
24:11
and then you see artists that you've never heard of before,
24:13
and it's just a great place
24:16
to find new music and to connect.
24:19
[KARA] I completely agree with that.
24:21
Well, I just wanted to really thank you all
24:24
for talking to us,
24:26
and it's been a quite a pleasure
24:28
to get to know you all a little bit.
24:30
[CARLOS] Yeah, no, this has been great.
24:32
Thank you so much you for taking the time to have us on.
24:34
[EMMA] Agreed, thank you so much for having us.
24:36
(calming music)
24:39
[KARA] We spoke with the bad, SUN.DYLE, in Season 2, Ep 14.
24:44
(calming music)
24:52
[JEN] The Pop team has taken a break this week.
24:55
And speaking of breaks,
24:56
schools across the country have experienced some disruptions
24:59
over the past month for a variety of reasons.
25:02
That got us thinking about this beautiful thing.
25:06
We are featuring a micro essay today
25:08
by the author, Robert Erle Barham.
25:12
And "Beautiful Things" is a weekly online magazine
25:15
filled with nonfiction micro essays.
25:18
Today's essay is a meditation on teaching,
25:23
and the relationship between teachers and students.
25:28
Welcome to our show, Robert.
25:31
[ROBERT] Thank you so much, Jen.
25:32
Thank you for having me.
25:33
[JEN] Well, we're so happy you could take some time
25:35
and share your piece with us.
25:39
And the piece is entitled "For My Students".
25:44
[ROBERT] From Alabama, Tennessee, and Michigan,
25:47
China, Austria, and Indonesia,
25:49
they see the world's grandeur and glory, menace and ruin.
25:53
They're Nabokov's, Morrison's, O'Connor's, Didion's.
25:58
They want answers, want to know what matters,
26:00
would rather be somewhere else.
26:02
They wear masks, stare at me in silence,
26:05
say everything tastes different after COVID,
26:07
especially oranges.
26:09
They lose friends, grandparents, parents.
26:13
They break down, break open.
26:15
They come to class, say they didn't wanna fall behind,
26:18
didn't know what else to do.
26:20
They say Juliette was maligned.
26:22
"The Iliad" feels real, feels like Afghanistan.
26:26
The writer took tragedy and made it beautiful.
26:29
This is what grief is like.
26:31
They ask me how I met my wife, what it's like to have kids.
26:34
They stay after class and ask, is this true?
26:37
Is this how the world is?
26:39
They ask, can I talk to you?
26:41
How am I doing?
26:42
What's the point?
26:43
Why am I here?
26:45
They say they wanna belong somewhere,
26:47
don't know who they're supposed to be.
26:49
Feel like two opposing magnets,
26:52
like their blood and brains are at odds.
26:55
When class ends, they say, I wish I had talked more,
26:57
wish you had talked more.
26:59
This stuff is the bee's knees, ants pants, cat pajamas.
27:03
Would rather have watched paint dry.
27:06
Didn't like it but know you tried.
27:08
Appreciate that you listened.
27:10
They say thanks.
27:13
[JEN] Thank you so much for sharing that piece with us,
27:17
And anyone who has spent any time in a classroom,
27:22
either as a teacher or a student,
27:24
I think understands this moment.
27:26
And I in particular understand it profoundly and viscerally.
27:32
And just the specifics with which you set up
27:36
the contradictions of what it means
27:41
to be both a teacher and a learner in this space
27:43
is so powerful.
27:46
[ROBERT] Thanks.
27:46
That's a great encouragement.
27:48
Yeah, it's humbling and mysterious, I think,
27:51
to try to teach and stand in front of these kids,
27:53
and we're all looking at you earnestly, and they're candid.
27:57
Yeah, it's pretty magical and terrifying.
28:00
[JEN] Magical and terrifying, and I love that.
28:02
And again, the thing I seek in my own work
28:05
are those contradictions that we embody all the time, right?
28:10
And this idea of, they want to know,
28:15
yes, what you have to teach,
28:17
but they also wanna know you, right?
28:19
And there's a such a strange,
28:22
I think, tension in that, right?
28:24
Because our subject is supposed to be isolated from us.
28:27
Yeah, it's supposed to be isolated from the person
28:29
who shares the knowledge, but it never really is.
28:34
[ROBERT] Yeah, that's right.
28:36
Yeah.
28:37
Yeah, I think I often want to deflect toward the material,
28:40
but they'll say, you know, they'll ask questions,
28:42
and I'm like, wow, I guess I should answer.
28:46
So it's, yeah, it's way more,
28:48
I guess, the teacher is as legible
28:51
as the material is sometimes.
28:53
And they're looking for answers, they really are.
28:55
It's something else.
28:56
[JEN] Right and the times I I remember in the classroom,
29:02
which your piece made me reflect upon,
29:05
are those moments where your passion for the material
29:09
is really what kind of drives the interaction, right?
29:13
And I love that.
29:15
So obviously, I mean,
29:20
the world that you've created here in this piece
29:23
that is a reflection of your classroom
29:25
is certainly clear, and lovely, and specific.
29:28
So what inspired you to write this?
29:31
[ROBERT] Oh, sure.
29:32
I think, so the piece began
29:36
with a conversation with a student.
29:39
Yeah, so a student from Tupelo, Mississippi.
29:42
We walked to the Great Hall where we have the dining hall,
29:46
and we were just standing in line.
29:47
And yeah, he was just musing, talking about graduation,
29:51
and he made the remark, you know,
29:54
I think we were talking about the strange consequences
29:57
of COVID.
29:59
And he said like,
30:00
"Everything tastes different after COVID,
30:02
"especially oranges."
30:03
And I was like, that is an amazing line.
30:06
[JEN] Yeah, absolutely.
30:07
[ROBERT] You know, that's such an exquisite expression.
30:08
Yeah, and so he said it,
30:09
and I was like, "Oh my gosh, Nathan, can I write that down?"
30:14
And then I think with that line, I thought,
30:17
that's like shorthand for all the interesting things
30:22
that students say, and often they don't have a filter.
30:25
They're so candid.
30:27
In a way that I feel like, you know, in middle age,
30:29
like tired and grumpy,
30:31
you know, with, you know, taking care of three kids.
30:34
But like these are fresh-faced kids,
30:36
like earnest and honest, and like reckoning with things.
30:40
And so you have a ringside seat to their lives,
30:43
and they're struggling with hard things,
30:44
and engaging with ideas for the first time.
30:47
So it's really animating.
30:48
But he said that,
30:50
and it was like retroactive, igniting all the memories
30:54
that I had about students who say
30:56
the things that they've said.
30:58
[JEN] Right, yeah.
30:59
And I think they're just so profound
31:01
not even realizing that they're being profound,
31:03
which are, you know, those moments kind of stand out,
31:06
and you're like, wow.
31:08
And within that, sometimes I just have to remind them
31:13
that their voice matters, right?
31:15
So you can trust these observations
31:17
that you have about the world.
31:20
And I also love the line,
31:22
"They break down, they break open".
31:25
Right, because that's both
31:27
difficult and hopeful at the same time, right?
31:31
- Yeah, yeah.
31:32
Yeah, that's right.
31:34
Yeah, they're living away from home for the first time.
31:38
They're losing, a lot of 'em are losing loved ones
31:40
for the first time.
31:41
So there's a kind of vulnerability coupled with articulacy
31:46
because they're diving into ideas,
31:48
and they're given like language to things
31:51
that they're experiencing.
31:52
So, it's just right for their,
31:56
like so I teach a number of classes,
31:58
including writing classes.
31:59
And their open-heartedness that shows up on the page
32:03
is really just exquisite, and moving,
32:05
and, yeah, humbling to have a ring side seat to these kids
32:10
and their making sense of the world.
32:12
[JEN] It really is.
32:13
And I'm assuming in your writing classes,
32:17
you have them share work with each other.
32:20
Is that, yeah.
32:21
[ROBERT] Yeah, that's right.
32:22
Yeah, exactly, yeah.
32:23
[JEN] And I do that as well in my playwriting classes.
32:27
And they're so surprised when, I, as an instructor,
32:33
am moved by what they have done,
32:36
because there's this sense of,
32:37
well, wait, you're the teacher, right?
32:39
You've got all this figured out.
32:40
And I'm just somebody who's kind of, you know,
32:42
stabbing in the dark with this.
32:45
And the fact that they can write something,
32:47
much like what you were talking about with your students,
32:49
and the line about COVID.
32:52
The fact that they can write something that moves you,
32:55
you know, the experienced older voice in the room
32:58
is so surprising to them.
33:00
[ROBERT] Yeah, yeah.
33:01
That's it, yeah.
33:03
Yeah, and giving them permission, authorization
33:07
to explore these ideas and to affirm and say like,
33:11
yeah, nobody has seen the things that you have seen
33:14
in the way that you have seen them.
33:15
And I think you need to testify
33:20
all that's kind of fallen in your direction.
33:23
And so I think they take that and run with it.
33:26
[JEN] Hopefully, yeah.
33:27
And my guess is based on the observations
33:30
in this piece that we just heard,
33:34
that your students are incredibly lucky
33:37
to have you.
33:38
[ROBERT] That's encouraging, that's kind of you to say.
33:42
Yeah, it's aspirational.
33:43
I mean, I want to be as attentive
33:45
and as open-hearted as they often are, so.
33:48
[JEN] Yeah.
33:50
Oh, Robert, thank you so much for joining us here
33:52
on Pop of Culture
33:53
and sharing your piece called "For My Students".
33:57
This story comes from IPR's collaboration
34:00
with River Teeth's "Beautiful Things",
34:02
a weekly magazine of micro essays.
34:05
More at riverteethjournal.com.
34:08
(calming music)
34:12
We spoke to Robert Erle Barham in Season 2, Episode 32.
34:17
[KARA] We also spoke to 142 other guests last season.
34:21
That's dozens of artists, curators, and community members
34:25
crafting the culture in East Central Indiana.
34:28
You can catch up on every episode of Pop of Culture
34:31
with our podcast.
34:32
Find us on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcast,
34:35
and indianapublicradio.org.
34:39
(calming music)
34:43
[JEN] We're doing a themed month for WAYWO?
34:46
[KARA] What are you working on?
34:47
[JEN] So we reached back to Season 1
34:49
for one of our favorite painters.
34:51
[KARA] We are here today with Anne Maddox.
34:54
She's an artist, educator, writer, and wildlife advocate.
34:58
British born, and currently resides in Marion.
35:02
Welcome, Anne.
35:03
It's nice to have you here with us today.
35:05
[ANNE MADDOX] Thank you.
35:06
Glad to be here.
35:07
[KARA] Excellent.
35:08
We would like to ask you, what are you working on?
35:14
[ANNE] Well, I am finishing up
35:16
the last of a series of six ecosystem paintings.
35:21
I've been working on them for over 15 years now,
35:25
and this will be my last.
35:26
They're very time consuming.
35:27
[KARA] Can you explain to us what an ecosystem painting is?
35:33
[ANNE] Okay, it's like a little slice of time and space
35:38
that shows the interconnectedness
35:42
of both nature, and the animals or critters,
35:49
insects that inhabit them, that space.
35:54
And I restrict it to a time period,
35:56
so not going from month to month.
35:59
[KARA] Okay, so you say it's a slice of time and space,
36:05
so during a certain season or?
36:09
[ANNE] Well, in summertime is when you get
36:11
all of the flowers that grow on the roadsides.
36:17
The woodland is more of the spring flowers
36:19
before the trees foliate, and so they get maximum sunshine.
36:24
But in the summer,
36:26
you'll get all the roadside and meadow flowers
36:30
with all the accompanying critters
36:31
that inhabit that little space and time.
36:36
[KARA] Wonderful.
36:37
I read that a few years ago,
36:40
you received the Robert Cooper Audubon Society Award
36:44
for Education Through Art,
36:47
and their chapter of East Central Indiana.
36:50
And this year, you were the recipient
36:52
of the Hoosier Women Artists Award.
36:55
And I wanted to talk to you about the award you got
37:00
for "Ecosystem 1".
37:03
And actually, you brought "Ecosystem 1"
37:06
into the studio today.
37:07
And myself and Luke are amazed.
37:10
Your work is just so intricate.
37:14
How would you term your work, your style?
37:18
[ANNE] Well, it's realism, obviously.
37:21
I want people to be able to recognize
37:23
what they're looking at.
37:24
And then I have a guide that goes with each painting
37:27
that gives you the names of all of the plants, and insects,
37:34
and birds in the picture.
37:36
[KARA] Yeah, it looks like a map
37:38
that you could put up next to the work.
37:41
And without it, you might miss some things
37:45
because it's so packed with beautiful things.
37:49
Can you talk a little bit about the colors you utilize?
37:53
[ANNE] Well, it's the colors I find in nature.
37:55
Some of them are very hard to duplicate
37:58
because the pigments don't always line up
38:02
with the actual flower.
38:05
So some things are easier to paint than others.
38:09
But I try to be as true as I can
38:11
so that people can recognize it
38:14
and be able to see it in the wild and know what it is.
38:18
But I started, I was painting flowers initially.
38:24
I was teaching in The Bahamas,
38:25
and discovered that there was no local book
38:29
for other than experts that could identify the flowers.
38:33
So I figured it couldn't be too hard to just go ahead,
38:38
and I started painting the flowers that I found,
38:41
and then got help identifying them.
38:44
[KARA] What medium do you use typically to create them?
38:47
[ANNE] These are all done in watercolors.
38:49
- The whole series is watercolors.
38:51
- And I work from the actual plant.
38:53
I don't use photographs.
38:55
And there's nowhere you can go
38:57
and just take a snapshot of what I've got
39:01
and say that this is the ecosystem,
39:03
because I go back constantly to the area or similar areas,
39:09
and then add the birds or other critters that I have seen,
39:16
but not necessarily all at the same time at the same place.
39:20
So I work piecemeal and build it up like a jigsaw puzzle.
39:26
- Well, you said that you're working towards
39:27
the end of this series after 15 years on it,
39:32
which is amazing.
39:34
- They take the minimum of two years a piece.
39:36
- Wow, that's an incredible commitment.
39:42
I wanted to know what's next for you
39:44
in your artistic journey?
39:47
- Well, what I'm doing is moving out of having to do
39:52
sort of shows, and festivals, and things.
39:58
I want to just concentrate on going out as a speaker.
40:01
So I'm taking, using my art to illustrate my message.
40:08
So it's education through art.
40:10
So I'm finally, since I also trained as a teacher,
40:14
I'm bringing all my skills and loves together,
40:18
art, nature and teaching.
40:21
- Oh, that's beautiful, right?
40:23
When everything you love can coalesce.
40:27
How do you utilize your art in teaching?
40:32
- Well, what I'm trying to tell people
40:37
is I'm trying to open their eyes
40:40
to understand what is happening in nature.
40:43
And that is that nature is interconnected
40:47
in so many ways that we are still learning about.
40:53
That we are talking about relationships,
40:55
and we can't pick and choose what we want to save,
41:01
or nurture, whatever.
41:02
We have to have the whole picture,
41:04
because when you start missing out certain building blocks,
41:09
the whole thing collapses
41:12
because everything in nature eats and is eaten
41:18
by something else.
41:20
So it's, the birds rely on the caterpillars.
41:26
If there aren't enough caterpillars
41:27
to satisfy the needs of the birds, then we can,
41:31
the caterpillars won't be around to turn into butterflies.
41:35
So it's that balance in nature that needs to be maintained.
41:42
And we are very uneducated, generally speaking,
41:47
about how all this works together.
41:49
- Well, that's a wonderful endeavor.
41:51
I do think that a lot of people are unaware of the synergy
41:54
that nature has.
41:56
- Oh, absolutely.
41:57
So what I'm trying to do is get,
42:01
encourage people to create habitats
42:03
in their gardens or yards,
42:05
because they have control over that area,
42:08
whereas out in nature,
42:10
what the farmers don't get real estate does,
42:16
or all the roadsides mode on a regular basis.
42:19
[KARA] Is that what your Wild About Marion Facebook page is?
42:24
[ANNE] Yes, it is.
42:25
And what I'm finding is that there are other communities
42:28
that have started something similar,
42:30
but they've given it a different name.
42:32
So it's becoming quite a sort of movement
42:36
to encourage city dwellers to take care of nature
42:42
by offering them a space that they can control.
42:46
[KARA] Well, can you tell us where we can find your art?
42:53
[ANNE] Well, I have a Facebook art page,
42:58
so that's Anne Maddox's Fine Artist.
43:01
And then I have a Flickr page.
43:07
I've tried for a website a couple of times,
43:10
but you have to, you are gonna outlay quite a lot of money
43:16
just trying to get something that's functional.
43:19
It doesn't always translate
43:20
into getting sales online, unfortunately.
43:23
[KARA] Thank you so much for joining us today, Anne.
43:26
[ANNE] Thank you.
43:27
[KARA] And it was a pleasure talking with you.
43:30
[ANNE] Well, I appreciate that.
43:31
Thank you.
43:32
(calming music)
43:35
[KARA] We spoke with Anne Maddox in Season 1, Episode 32.
43:39
[JEN] Kara, this is the part of the show
43:41
where we usually do an arts calendar.
43:43
We'll be back with a full list next week,
43:45
but this week, we thought we'd enjoy some music.
43:49
[KARA] We recently introduced you to our segment,
43:52
Story Behind the Song,
43:53
with our first artist, Katie Jo Robinson.
43:56
You're going to hear their song, "Weekend Religion".
44:00
[JEN] Now it sounds like they're joined by a full band,
44:03
but it's just Katie Jo.
44:04
(upbeat music)
44:06
♪ It's just for weekend religion ♪
44:11
(Katie Jo Robinson singing)
44:16
(calming music)
44:45
(calming music continues)
45:15
(calming music continues)
45:31
♪ Make these feelings for the last time ♪
45:37
(calming music continues)
46:04
(calming guitar music)
46:34
(calming guitar music continues)
46:55
(audience applauding)
46:57
(upbeat music)
46:58
♪ It's just for weekend religion ♪
47:02
♪ Say got friends in other states I still believe in ♪
47:07
♪ Say got friends in other states I still believe in ♪
47:12
♪ Say got friends in other states I still believe in ♪
47:19
(upbeat music)
47:49
(upbeat music continues)
48:18
(upbeat music continues)
48:28
[JEN] That's Katie Jo Robinson with "Weekend Religion"
48:31
recorded live for Pop of Culture.
48:34
(upbeat music)
48:35
[LUKE JONES] Support for Pop of Culture comes
48:38
from Stallings Wealth Management, the Innovation Connector,
48:43
and from, you.
48:45
With state and federal money eliminated,
48:48
You are the difference in keeping local programming
48:51
on the air at IPR.
48:54
Become a member today at indianapublicradio.org.
48:58
[JEN] And that's our show.
48:59
Our general manager is Phil Hoffman.
49:02
[KARA] This week was produced by Luke Jones,
49:05
who would like to ask who's ever in charge
49:07
of the thermostat outside to turn it to at least 60.
49:11
[JEN] 65, maybe?
49:12
[KARA] No snow.
49:14
[JEN] We had production assistance from Andrew Montavon.
49:18
[KARA] And our audio fellow is Maya Doss.
49:20
Our show was hosted by me, Kara DuQuette,
49:23
[JEN] And me, Jen Blackmer.
49:24
Pop of Culture is a production from IPR
49:28
on the campus of Ball State University.
49:33
Did you not get a full night's sleep last night?
49:34
[LUKE] God, no.
49:35
[JEN] You did the night before tho or no two nights before
49:37
when I saw you before on Wednesday.
49:39
[KARA] You can't store it up though.
49:42
[JEN] Don't you wish?
49:43
[LUKE] God, if I could.
49:44
[KARA] You'd be golden.
49:46
Wouldn't we all?
49:48
(Jen sighing)