Latest / College Is Fine, Everything's Fine / #40 Home for the Holidays: How to Balance New Freedoms With Family Expectations

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#40 Home for the Holidays: How to Balance New Freedoms With Family Expectations · College Is Fine, Everything's Fine

[00:00:00] All right, hi, we are live. This is exciting. I know our second, I can't say inaugural anymore, right? It's our second webinar from Loom Maid Academy and I'm excited to be joined again by Godmama Anne Marie. To talk with families of college freshmen, most likely, uh, we might have a few boarding school parents on here, or maybe some people who doing it round two with their sophomores and want to see a different way to start to do it.But, um, you have seen, I don't know how many families and work with so many young adults and parents of young adults through these transitions. So I, I, I'm actually excited to hear as a future mom of college students, some of the, uh, words directly from your mouth. Well, thank you. [00:01:00] Yeah, this is actually, this is the space I love to be in and that is with parents and the emerging adult.And just for a little background, as Sarah knows, um, I'm Anne Marie Albano and I'm a clinical, uh, psychologist and have been working my entire career. with kids. Um, and actually when we go back to the 1980s, I used to work with young children and get on the floor and play. And it's really nice now at this time that I've been working more over the last 20 years, uh, with adolescents and young adults who sit in chairs and talk to me, um, for therapy and such.But what's important really is the, uh, research that we've been doing and the work, uh, that we've done clinically. has been around developmentally, what is it like to grow up? I mean, we've all been through growing up, but really what is it like to grow up? What do our bodies and our minds go through in developing typically along the way?Uh, what do we need to [00:02:00] learn and, uh, what happens to us as we're engaging in the world? And then what are the challenges that happen to us? And mind you, as we're developing, and I'm referring to the young adults and teenagers now, The parents and the families are developing along with them. So Sarah, that's why we're here, right?We're going to talk about really this particular developmental stage, which is the emerging adult who goes off to college. and the challenge of coming home for extended periods of time over these four plus years. Sound okay? And one story, yeah it sounds great and I um, someone said it to me beautifully once where she said it's, It's sort of like I'm becoming less of a manager and more of a consultant.And that can be hard for some people to try to navigate that role. And I think it becomes more and more of a, that consultant role, maybe consulted less than even in the early teen years. [00:03:00] So I want to also mention to our audience, we're going to have some basic information for you. Anyone listening or who has registered for this webinar, We'll get access to some of the points we're talking about in the handout later.We just want you to be able to know that will come to you. Don't feel like you have to take a lot of notes. We also have a chat function. So I will be monitoring the chat. And as we go, we will certainly leave time at the end to answer a multitude of questions. We will also be happy to, if it feels, you know, you know, timely, or if you have a question, we really want to make sure we get to, we'll answer it in between times.So we'll try to make this as conversational as possible. Um, as conversational as possible, uh, but we also want to make sure you leave here with some concrete tips. Great. Yep. So, you know, just to put everything in a, in a frame, um, you've been through it with your kids as you've been seeing them grow from toddlers into elementary school and into high school.This is, this [00:04:00] is another challenge now because, you know, when we think about it as parents, We have our kids and what is really critical is that from very early on, we are helping them to develop into a healthy minded, independent young adults who take responsibility and own the things that are going on, you know, in their life, um, manage stress and manage whatever's thrown at them.Um, seeks, they seek advice. We want them to seek advice. We absolutely want them coming to us, um, and so that we can help them where we can. But really it's about them developing, developing into what will be independent beings. And of course, freshman year, you know, they're going off for the first time.This is the most important decision they've made in their lives, is joining with you to say, yes, this particular college is for me and I'm going for it. Um, so [00:05:00] we have to bear in mind a few things. When we think about the developmental milestones of a young child, you're talking, uh, toddling, talking, potty training, we know what those are.The developmental milestones now for your emerging adult who's a college student are that number one, they fall in the realm of independence. that they more and more are becoming independent in managing their emotions and their reactions to things that go on. The good things as well as the challenging things, the sad things, the frustrating things, they're managing those in the moment.And they may seek advice, that's fine, and they may seek comfort from you, too, absolutely. But they've got to be the ones to problem solve, to manage their emotions, when things are happening, and problem solve. They're also managing, uh, and being independent on taking care of [00:06:00] things. From their hygiene and self care, they're seeking medical advice and medical appointments at school when they need to.They're taking care of all their responsibilities of, uh, getting the class or deciding not to go to class. This is on them now. You're no longer waking them up. You're no longer driving them in. You're no longer calling teachers for them. They've got to manage all this stuff. So behavioral independence is important too.So this is key. Emotional and behavioral independence. These are key tasks and the further they get on this, the more they're becoming bonafide adults, let's say. A second thing that they are wrestling with, uh, a developmental task, is that of identity. And while in the news and, uh, you know, in the political sphere, talking about gender identity and sexual identity, these certainly are things that they will be struggling with and working with, some of them.And hopefully they seek help as needed for [00:07:00] talking through things. But it's also independence or in terms of understanding their identity as to who they are as a citizen, as a member of that college, as a doormate, their identity as a person entering the world without parents around them, walking them.into a religious worship house, walking them up to a classroom, telling them what to do and where to go and how to identify themselves in some way as within a family. They're still in your family. They're still with you, but they're becoming independent as to who am I and defining themselves. So you're going to hear when they come home, a lot of things that are probably a little different because they're absorbing and taking in and questioning ideas and things that professors and peers and other people are talking about.And they're going to talk to you about them. And it may relate to identity as I'm a Democrat, I'm a Republican, I'm an independent, I'm a traveler, I'm a homebody, various [00:08:00] things like this, as they're identifying for themselves who they are. And these These, they're going to work through over the next five or so years.Then comes accountability. Jump in. So I'm sorry to interrupt. No, I just was going to say, um, you notice a lot too when I'm working with college students is it's really normal for their identity for them to try on a few different hats at this time too. So I have certainly had the college students come in and be like, you know, I'm just kind of in this phase right now, or I want to try this out.Or the parents might say one time they felt like they were this and now they're struggling and they're, they're kind of more into this. And it's, it's, this is. Very appropriate. It's called moratorium, right? It's this idea of kind of expanding out various identities and then pulling back in and finalizing on that core sense of self.So don't be, don't be thrown if you see some change even within as they build their identity that that might look, you might feel kind of some pendulum swings there. And I mean, I hear a lot from parents who their kids come home and they'll tell me [00:09:00] after the break, Oh my gosh, he thinks he's a philosopher and he's telling us how to live our lives in the way we should be.And then like a year later, Oh my goodness, he thinks he's the most medically informed because he's in pre med now, you know, these things change over time. So, but that's what this time of life is about. It's trying out new things and, and figuring it out. So the next thing, too, then, in terms of tasks of development that take time, is taking on responsibility.And some of this is what we talked about with independents, you know, filling out forms, getting, getting applications, and all this kind of stuff on their own. But there's a lot of owning responsibility for their actions. So look, I just got to tell you, uh, I could not get my diploma from Florida State University for my bachelor's until I paid my 650 worth of parking tickets.Uh, they held it back and you know, my mom's like, well, you know, start working and you'll be able to pay it off, which was a [00:10:00] good thing that she did that. I paid it off, but you know, it's things like that. They have to take responsibility for. for their actions. And that means if they sleep through classes and you know, and they have to go walk up to the professor, see him at office hours and talk themselves into makeups or what have you.Um, this is important. It's owning it. Uh, it's learning how to say, I messed up and I'm sorry, and here's, uh, how I think I should resolve this and get advice. So it's things like that with responsibility. This is big. So these things are going to be happening and evolving because, of course, for them, there's more and more that piles on in terms of things to do as they're heading towards sophomore, junior, and then senior year.And then the last sort of, uh, a group of socialization tasks really involves being able to engage with other people. And this again is everything from living in a dorm, let's say, or in a house with other people, and sharing spaces. [00:11:00] Um, it's about engaging with professors as well as teachers. teaching assistants.Um, it's finding your way into different kinds of groups, uh, for interests, uh, to pursue things like sports and, uh, cultural activities and such. And it even works towards, you know, who you are, again, as a person in a community. broader than your family and your community of origin, but now your college community and beyond.So socialization is big. I have to say, you know, back to my college days again in grad school, my mom used to say, I cried when I dropped you off at college, cried for eight hours, driving home from that college, uh, from Florida state down south to Florida. And then I cried every time you came home because I would come home with like Three carloads of friends because we live near the beach, you know, for spring breaks.And this continued through two grad schools. So imagine how long she went through all that. [00:12:00] But that socialization is, you know, getting used to being around all kinds of different people and how you're engaging with them and making relationships that last over the longterm. So, with that in mind, Sarah, where are we?What are we going to help these parents to know and be ready for as their kids are coming home? Well, we wanted to do a bit of an experiential exercise. No need to shout out anything, but when you're sitting at home, take a look, and we want you to reflect on where you might be on these continuum, I'll say a little bit more, but just, The exercise is going to be for you to think about where you are.And I want you to put, as I describe these things, a little blue check mark on where you are, and then I want you to think about or kind of guess at where your teen is and put a little bit of an exclamation mark. there. Um, if you want to get really fun with it, if I do these with families directly, I might see, okay, where do you think your team would put you [00:13:00] and where do you think you're, you know, your mom would put you or your dad would put you.So, um, it's just something to think about because as we talk about the next set of skills, they're really going to be couched in these different areas. So the first one is, are you right? Or wrong. If you feel really polarized, right? If you feel like you are 100 percent right, no questions asked, and your college student is like, I am on a totally different page, you are wrong.Well, that is going to be something that potentially, if you find yourself on extremes, could lead to some tension. Right? And the same thing for holding on too tight, what that means is where instead of allowing them to have that independence, you are really trying to grab hold of and keep to how they were in high school, or they are, they might be holding on too tight and not really able to explore as much.Um, [00:14:00] alternatively, letting go too soon, saying like, Oh, well, you're in college now. All your problems are your own, um, or you're a student going off and might maybe never calling home, never reporting back what's going on, right? So thinking about where the two sides might be on that independence spectrum.And then last but not least, heavy handed versus Liz at Liz A Fair. Sort of my way or the highway in terms of the rules and boundaries and everything you come back in is going to be just like it was when you were in 9th grade, 10th grade, 11th grade. Thanks. Same deal. Just cause you're a freshman, nothing changes as opposed to laissez faire.Um, you know what, Hey, take some risky behaviors. No big deal. You're 18 now. So it's all, you know, above board. Um, and you might find alternatively that your, if your child, your college student is engaging in, you know, a lot of certainly more risky behaviors, according to you, and you're feeling like, Oh, I need to set some boundaries.What we see is the [00:15:00] wider. The gap between these two differences on the continuum is going to be more likely where you're going to see the conflict rise up or where you're going to see the misinformation rise up or just sort of two ships passing in the night. You cannot agree. And the point is not to say here that there is a right or a wrong or that one person's on the right side or the wrong side of the continuum.For instance, one way to say, The top, you know, the top continuum is, would you rather be right or would you rather be effective in how you're communicating with your child? Same goes for them, by the way, if I were talking to a group of college students, I'd be saying the same thing. Would you rather be right about your perspective or would you rather be able to communicate with your parents about why you feel this way?All right. So we don't want to stay so stubborn in our side that we aren't effective. And trying to figure out something that can work for both parties for holding on too tight versus letting go too soon. We're going to talk you through ways to know about some typical teen and college student [00:16:00] behaviors and young adult behaviors around this time so that you can know where to support their independence, but also where to still make sure that you're checking in and there's some safety net for them there.And last but not least, if you feel like you're trying to really think about setting boundaries, um, now is the time to really Convey family values. What are the reasons behind some of the rules that you had? It's not just about them coming home at a certain time for a curfew. It might be about a work ethic and making sure you feel alert for something you have to do the next day.So how do you start to, now that they're a little bit older, understand the values behind the rules? This is very good because the thing that we have to bear in mind and this Didn't hit home. I don't think for many parents is as sharply as it did during the pandemic is that your kids have gone off to school and they really have tasted independence and independence just in [00:17:00] when they go to bed, when they wake up, what they choose to do with their time.It's really on them. When they're at school and, you know, so then coming home, they're coming home. And then in the typical college year that come home for these holidays and maybe over the summer and their brief stays, what happened during, of course, the pandemic is when especially sophomores and beyond came home and they've had much more experience with being independent in many ways.It really clashed with the parents who. Uh, when the kids had their way of doing things, the parents needing them to do it a different way, because that's how it fit for the house, for their work schedules, and what have you, it was a big clash, if they didn't get to talk about this. And in a lot of ways, some of this had to do, too, with going out and doing things.And now, mind you, everybody was home during, um, the pandemic, but we just talk about in general. If they're [00:18:00] used to being out and nighttime is their party time, um, and they do sleep in late on weekends or what have you, seeing that right under your eyes for the first time is tough, very tough. Um, you know, if you're, you know, really still knowing your child, knowing how they could get dysregulated or what have you, you know, they need sleep.It's hard to watch that. So, this isn't to say hands off, but it's how to approach and work with your, uh, college student for what might be very different for both of you in being back in the same house at the same time. And a big thing here is for you to, when they come home and settle in, this is after the hugs and you know, all the excitement of their home and, and, and everyone's getting together and such.But find the time to say, Hey, let's talk. Um, tell me about how things are going and find out about them, but we have a certain way of doing that. It's to [00:19:00] listen and respond when you hear things in a way that doesn't sound like you're judging, because if you do judge them like you do what, what do you mean?And if you're doing things like that, then of course, and it may be shocking things to you, you know, in some way it, You know, what'll happen is you can shut them down and then they don't come to you and you don't find out about things going on. So you want to talk about some of this? Yeah, I was going to laugh.I was just going to jump in. I made this slide. Um, but what I might actually add is listen to one another without expressing judgment. It's going to be oftentimes really hard not to have. judgments. We all have judgments. It's sort of impossible to hold them back. Um, so really, if I had a little asterisk, I might say without expressing judgment, um, because that's the part where you do, you might have to bite your tongue, not forever.Right. But in that moment, You are, your kid is going to be very [00:20:00] attentive to how you're reacting. They're looking for facial expressions, especially with some new content. So I think it's just about sort of,I've, I've, I've talked with, you know, a group of families before where the mom is, you know, You know, not necessarily saying anything, but you could just see it in her face, just her disappointment and even some head shaking. I'm not even sure she was aware she was doing it, you know? So I think it's something where just being aware that they really do care.Ultimately, um, if you have some significant judgment, they're not going to tell you that. Um, but, but the more you're able to just sort of sit and hold it, the more your information you're going to get. So again, that's. Being effective hair, um, in terms of a beginner's mindset. So often, um, and Emory, you were the one that really pointed this out to me, just the importance of checking in on what your expectations are of the visit.And it doesn't mean that you are an eternal optimist and that [00:21:00] it's, you think it's going to all go beautifully, but you might be kind of expecting and exciting for some, um, Great reunion and just going to sit and kind of cuddle up and hear everything. Alternatively, you might be expecting a great independent child.They come back, or I should say student, young adult, and they come back and they're, they're maybe a bit more clingy than you would expect it, you know? So we can always be surprised. I think that knowing and being aware of what your, your expectations are, um, Then trying to have an act on a beginner's mindset about how the visit will go, and it's, it's hard to really fully embrace that oftentimes because we're gonna have hopes and excitement, but the idea is just to when you do just say, Okay, I'm just going to go into this with almost like a blank slate.And if you think about it, this is a blank slate. If you have a freshman, they've never been home yet. For Christmas. So this or how the holiday winter break. So I think this is a time where you can actually try to say, this is truly a [00:22:00] new experience. I'm a beginner at what it's like to have them home for a couple of weeks after they've experienced sort of life on their own, um, and try to have that in mind.Um, but Annemarie, I will let you talk about your sort of 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 step, uh, strategy when they do get home. Okay, do we have those spelled out as number 1? Which one? Uh, you see, I put your words in there, you know, hug. Okay. Hug, listen, pause. We were discussing that. Then putting it into what I didn't think of it in those steps.But that's, I mean, in that sense, but yes, I mean, this is a big thing. Look, you welcome them home. Everybody's got a hug. Uh, and then, you know, just let them emote, let them talk, let them. Now, let me just say, there are lots of kids who come home and I've heard this time and time again, they come home, drop their laundry off and they run out to see their friends from high school.[00:23:00] Um, and you know, that happens. And there are sometimes, you know, feelings of disappointment and sadness on the part of parents and younger siblings who might be at home. Um, so it is something to think about and you can bring that up and you should bring that up. Hey, you know, we, we would like to have some time for us all together as a family, you know, so we'll get to that.The next thing though is listen to them. What are they saying? And here's where I want parents to tune into two things. One is, in listening, you will get those kids who are like, telling you just everything. You know, this is exciting, that is exciting, this was frustrating, the roommate, this, the professor's that, that, that.You know, and they're just like, dropping it all over the place. Okay, take it in, and this is where, you know, you pause, and then you can ask some questions about things that are going on. Um, the, you know, the fun stuff as well as, well, you know, it said, you know, had a little bit of trouble with that professor, they, uh, you went in to see them and they didn't listen to you about, you know, what you were concerned about with, [00:24:00] with that subject.What happened? Is there anything you want to talk about, about that and how to handle it? So that's, you know, the kind of way to do that. Now, I also ask parents though, to listen if you're not hearing anything and especially. If you're asking, how's, how are things? Fine. How's your roommate? What's going on?Do you get along? We're okay. You know, if you're not hearing about specific professor's names, let's say, or things about classes, not hearing names of other kids. In the school that, you know, they are lab partners with or, or, you know, or anything, those are times to really pay attention and listen to see is your son or daughter getting out and doing things, meeting people, getting along, or.Are [00:25:00] they a little more isolated? So there are some times we got to watch for the red flags. On the one hand, you're going to watch that they're partying too much, you know, in a sense for those who are like all over the place, but then also what about. Not hearing about specifics. And, and really it's about not having names of people, especially people in the dorm and peers and professors, and not talking about anything that they've done.From attending a football game, if that's on campus, to, you know, things that may be of interest to them. Watch for the lapses in that, because that might indicate some difficulties. Sarah, you want to go to the next slide? Ilove this metaphor. You want to take this one?So, this comes from a little bit of, um, acceptance and commitment therapy, but, or for the person who created that therapy, Steve Hayes, he came [00:26:00] up with this idea of dropping the rope. Um, I think where it's really relevant here is because sometimes, and this is back to that being effective piece, um, Oftentimes when people come home and again, you might've had an expectation of something going to happen or you're disappointed and you want to try to maybe convince your college student to, to be at home more.You want to be able to look out for some power struggles. And the idea behind power struggles is that essentially once you get into sort of that battle, it's like both of you are playing tug of war with a monster. And the, no matter how much you tug, you might get a little bit of a wiggle room towards your side of the line.But that monster is going to constantly be pulling harder and he doesn't sleep and he doesn't need to eat, you know, so that he's just constantly there and you're going to be worn out. By the time you do it, your hands are going to be raw. So the best thing to do in order to win the game is to drop the rope.It's the only way that he won't win. So [00:27:00] Amory, I'm sure that you have examples where you've seen some of these power struggles in where it's just like constantly you're just watching them play that tug of war. Yeah. The big ones that are going to come up for some families, number one is going to be around independence in the sense of my time is my time now.And so for parents who You know, you want to see your kids. You have things you want them to do, maybe with extended family members. And, um, and, and also you, you, the way you run your house, you know, uh, it's under your control for it to be calm and quiet and you can sleep peacefully knowing who's all tucked into their beds, but your college student is home and they want to be out.Um, and so, and they want to be in charge of their schedule. And so you start, you know, struggling with that and, and fights go on. Um, so this is, this is something to think about, um, how to drop the rope to, and then say, we had it, you have your independence. No, we're not [00:28:00] hovering over you while you're at school, but let's take a breath here and let's talk about, you want to be out with your friends or this and that.We understand. What though, let's think about, what could we do together and what are the things that we need to put on the table that are really important to us as a family? Visiting the grandparents, whatever, these things, letting us know where you are and what time you will be home so that we can sleep at night.Um, letting us know in advance, if you're not going to be in, or at least with a reasonable amount of time, can we talk about this? If you're not gonna be home for dinner, because we have to come to an agreement of what's comfortable for everyone, respecting your independence, but respecting us as parents and, and having the house and this family that we are.And everyone who loves you, respecting that too. So this gives your college student, you approach it that way. Let's, let's meet and [00:29:00] figure this out. So we're respecting one another and you're not telling them how to be, and you're not telling them they can't, but you're asking them to open their minds. to working with you.And then you'll also hear about some things that may be, you know, really important for them. Maybe there is someone they're interested in and now they're a little more open to telling you about that or who knows. But you get the gist of, you know, not struggling with them, but all right, stepping back. I hear that it's important for you to see your high school friends because you feel you're losing contact with them.You haven't seen each other. We get it. We get it. Does it have to be on the first night of Hanukkah or Christmas Eve? Does it have to be the night when everybody's gonna be here? Uh, can we come, can we think about that? So this is what Drop the Rope is about.Then, know your limits. Yeah. [00:30:00] Yeah. And, and this is a big one. Well, you know, this is a big one. Um, and this is, this is one where a lot of times I see the conflict coming. In with kids who have had and who have taken more freedom and, and decision making for themselves in things like their sexual behavior, um, and you know, those who, depending on the age and what have you, their party behavior, there's things like that that may fly in the face.of what your family rules are. I even see the conflict here with those kids who have gone off to school and mind you, I've had kids who have gone to Notre Dame, uh, you know, as well as Brandeis, who come home, um, and they've gone off with certain religious training and background, and they come home and they don't want to practice right now for various reasons.So these are the things that are like, wow, what's our family values, our family rules, [00:31:00] and what is different that you're coming home now and wanting to do something very different from what. We believe in or we're used to, um, or we're comfortable with in this house. And so we have to talk, you have to talk with them about, okay, look, this is where we're at when it comes to this issue.Um, let's talk about some limits that are important for us so that we're comfortable and your younger siblings, you know, are comfortable and what's important to you that, yeah, when you're off, you do your own thing, but you're home. How to make this work. Um, now this could be that there is a, uh, relationship that is, you know, in town or they want to go visit, uh, someone they're having a romantic relationship with.How to make that work so that they're not hiding things from you and they feel you're respecting them as they're growing. Into being, you know, independent [00:32:00] relationship adults. Um, but it's not in your face if it's not something that you, you know, want someone sleeping over in their room or whatever, you've got to really talk about how to work with that.Did they go off to that, uh, you know, to their partner's home for a couple of days? And it's. You know, they're out of your house or how's it going to work? Do they come and they agree they're staying in separate rooms and not sneaking in the middle of the night and that kind of thing. So you got to negotiate these things with them and define consequences for what might be out of bounds for you coming home drunk or various things like that.What does that mean? Uh, to you and how do you want to handle it? You got to let them know. And it's again, why you're doing this is because it's not acceptable to you. And also you're worried about their safety. Um, in some ways there's going to be things that they will suffer. The consequences are, uh, from hangovers to missing class because of things like that.And [00:33:00] they've got to learn from some of these things. And then in other ways, we have to keep our ears open and listen carefully so we hear whether there's high risk stuff going on. That you then need to work a little with your teen, again, reflecting is, what do you, you missed several weeks of class because you were partying, fraternity, sorority, rush.How's that going? What, you know, what did that mean to you? What happened with that? How do you handle that, you know, to help them understand the consequences if they fell behind if they wound up failing a class, whatever it might be, what are you going to do about that? How are you going to make that up?You know, so talking about that, and I've worked with parents who have had to set limits on, for example, Um, the kids having to take classes that may, or make up in the summertime at a community college as opposed to extending the amount of time they would be at a higher priced university to you know, have [00:34:00] an extra semester, go, go to the university and have dorm fees and stuff during the summer.All right. So these are all things you have to talk about accepting consequences of their actions. But you got to get them to brainstorm with you what this might be and then negotiate and agree on, uh, for any kind of consequences, you know, what you're willing to do, uh, and what their responsibility will be.I think that you, you talk about this a lot and I, I reflect on it a lot, this idea that this is really mirroring something they're going to have to learn anyway. I think it can be hard as a parent when you sometimes have the ability to rescue them, but that runs out over time. And then we'veSo the same way that you were with them and taught them how to drive and they didn't drive beautifully right away. I think it's, it's similar here. Teach them how to make a mistake and to learn from that mistake and suffer the [00:35:00] consequences, but also figure out how they might want to do it differently the next time.Um, and I know that a big part of your work has been trying to, um, To go back, wishing you could go back in time or families wishing they could go back in time and letting their kids struggle a little more so that they could be ready for the, you know, the big leagues. So this is the minors. They're going to play in the big leagues one day.Um, and you can help coach them through that, even if it is, feels like a failure at the time. Yeah, and I, you know, look, we, we always want to protect our kids from harm. Um, so, you know, again, big ticket items. If your kid is drinking too much, is engaging in substance use, you know, too much, and you're worried about that, you've, you've got to really sit and have a serious talk.But if they've been partying, if they've slept through classes, if the professors are like, you know, you're on academic probation because you didn't get your work in, they have to solve that. You can problem solve with them how to do it, but if you [00:36:00] rescue them, it sets them up to be wanting to be rescued again and again.And you know, and I'm coming at this from having the experiences of having every letter in the alphabet on my college transcript. I was not a straight A student. It took me a while to figure it all out. Um, and it's important that, you know, they do figure it out. I, I always say, you know, uh, getting failing classes or, you know, having to take, retake classes is not the end of the world and don't treat things like that as catastrophic.Um, they are big learning experiences and also help the kids to think through, is this class, this subject, is this right for me? You know, what do I need to do? Is that group and parties and this and that right for me? Is it time for me to slow down and step out of the fraternity? Let's say, you know, they've got to come to those decisions with your guidance.But they won't come to them if you tell them what to do and if you step in and fix things. That just leads [00:37:00] to conflict and also de skilling your kid. They won't develop the problem solving and the social consciousness skills and social skills that they need to manage difficult situations. I can actually speak from the opposite side of the spectrum, which is I was saved quite a lot growing up and I can tell you as an adult, there have been plenty of times where I look back and think, I really wish I had learned this lesson earlier in life.So not only am I an owner, I'm also a client of this particular issue. So take me as an example. I promise you they would, they will feel the benefits of this if you put in the hard work now. You know, I think we both wound up okay, finally, though. Thank goodness. I think. I'm not sure. That's true. You know, on managing the stress, one of the things I want parents to look into, and I had to do this for myself when I became a parent.What are we afraid of from our own past, our own [00:38:00] histories, or the people around us that we knew and saw crash and burn? What are we afraid of that, woof, we are catastrophizing too much in advance, given what our kids are telling us? So that's one thing to monitor that, that might be yours. And I've worked with a lot of parents who had gotten, like me, into situations with too much partying or what have you, that, you know, put you in scary situations at times.Um, listen to your kids, listen to how they're handling things, because they may well be handling things well, um, while they're still seeing friends out there. They may be the ones who are the designated drivers, or you might hear that they actually leave things early, You know, they're managing okay, but you know, so let's try not to transfer our own histories and fears and stuff onto them.Um, but there are other things that we can do, um, and Sarah, I'll let you talk about a lot of these because these are, these come from a lot of the DBT world too. Oh yeah. [00:39:00] Um, well, listen, even though I don't have a child in college, um, I want to tell faster than you think. I know. I know. Believe me. Like I said, I'm, I'm taking notes from you as I'm, as I'm talking to you, but, um, you know.We have experienced these stressful moments ourselves, even though we can talk the talk. I can share a story of this is when I was living in Brooklyn and I had a toddler, um, who like three or four and he, you know, going up those hills and park slope and he wouldn't get in his stroller. Um, and so at some point I just had him in like a.Like a death grip kind of in his like, right on his groin area, just like crushing that, you know, just like in a full body, just pushing him in and trying to get all the different stroller parts to just strap him in. And he's takes, he has a snack and he's literally waving it like, you know, a helicopter and it's flying everywhere.And guess who walks right by me. Is apparent that I had been doing some parent behavior [00:40:00] management training with perfect. Um, so my point is, these are things that not only do we talk about, but have to practice ourselves and I think that 1 of the. The things that I, I find to be really helpful. Um, I'm not necessarily somebody who has a meditation practice.I don't nec, I don't have the discipline. Um, I, I feel like I'm constantly really busy. The beautiful thing about this is, first of all, if you can do that, it's wonderful. I mean, tons of research packs that up to set aside some time to be reflective and go internal. Um, but. I, we know that being able to do this and sort of sprinkle it throughout the day is equally as helpful.Big chunks of managing your stress and kind of regulating your emotions have are just as good as sort of sprinkling them in smaller chunks. pieces. So if you can't do sort of some big stress reduction strategy, [00:41:00] take heart. You can give yourself smaller pep talks for the day, have those mantras, take in a few purposeful breaths.Just one thing that we say here is Practice them when you're calm so that you're not just ready. You know, it's not like you decide to run a marathon and just run that day, the 26 point, whatever miles, you know, you do need to work your way up to these strategies too. So practice when you're calm, make habits.To put these into, um, to put these into sort of some daily practice. Sometimes if I'm washing dishes, I'll be like, okay, this is a good time. You know, I got a multitask heaven forbid, but I can still practice doing some breathing or checking in, um, tapping into your support system. You might have some. Some friends who've been through this before.I'm a big advocate for making sure that part of my parent crew have older children. So I can say, Hey, what have you done? What's coming next? So, you know, we don't just talk and listen to things like [00:42:00] this webinar, talk to somebody who's had this experience before who you trust their opinion and see what they have to say.Um, I also think it's. Not cheating to put post it notes up and to set apps for yourself or to put a little calendar reminder and like a little 15 minute increments if you can, so that even scheduling it in, if that's what it takes. So those are some things that have worked for me. I've drunk the Kool Aid.No, that's, I mean, and this comes from dialectical behavior therapy, a form of cognitive behavior therapy, and also from acceptance and commitment work. I will say one other thing that came out of research that happened, that was conducted through the pandemic, and this was something that we thought to be a helpful stress relief, but really proved to be.Get outside. Each day, even if it is for 10 minutes, and even if you are living in a, you know, in the way up north and it's dark early, what have you, it's [00:43:00] okay. Get outside and take a five, 10 minute walk around the block or to a park. What was shown is families, Who got out during the pandemic and went to a green space, a park out on their lawn or something, were able to walk around a neighborhood that, you know, has grass and trees.If you can get out and do that for about 10 minutes, what was found is parents level of stress during the pandemic. were lower. Parents reported more satisfaction, better connection to their kids and less depression and anxiety. And the kids who also got out into green space also fared better with their mental health.As compared to families that were shut in and had no or didn't go outside. So just, and my husband has me do this. And when I'm stressed, he's like, take a walk in it. And it really, you really have to get [00:44:00] out and take a walk. Um, so do something like that. Try to get outside, stretch. Smell the air and, you know, and, and let the relief of just walking outside and doing something physical for a little bit, um, you know, help you out with stress reduction.And I tell kids this, I, you know, when, of course, when you tell your kids to do that, they're like, mom, you don't know, you don't get it. But as a therapist, I can tell you, all my college students take walks. All of them take walks. Next slide. Yeah, I also see actually a quick little tidbit that, um, which is the parenting, uh, hack.Just add water. So if you're struggling or if they're struggling, you know, take a drink of water, splash some water on your face. If it's summer, dip your toes in a pool, if you have it, or, you know, I, I do think that, and part of the reason I think that works is because when you talk about self soothing, um, The, the idea around soothing yourself really is about how you pay attention to each of your senses and giving them some [00:45:00] time.So if you just add water, your experience in the cold of the water, you're tasting the water, it's going down into your system. You can kind of feel it physically that way. Um, when you're going outside, you're able to hear nature in a different way. You're able to smell the different smells of outside. So it just engages more of your senses.Um, so I just wanted to say, I think there's Why some of these things work is because ultimately our body can be soothed when we're paying attention to it from a multi sensory perspective. So having a different strategy for each of your senses can be really helpful. Um, all right. So we do have some time for questions here.Emery, nothing has popped up in the chat. Although, why don't we spend a couple of minutes? I would love to hear from anyone who's listening, even if it's a comment, it could be that we've missed something. What are some things that have worked that you think could be helpful to our guests, but we'll give you a few minutes and we'll see if we have any questions pop up.[00:46:00] That we can let me while we're waiting. Let me say this. Um, I'll also tell you all about a few things. I run groups for college age students, um, who have had difficulties and they're either on medical leave or some of them come like during the holidays and summers, uh, because of a lot of anxiety they have.Uh, and one of the big things about the holidays is all of our college age groups, all of the youth talk about the holidays as being stressful because of the questions. What questions? So. You have a girlfriend. What are you going to do with your life? Hey, you know, your cousin over there. Wow. Well, he is on wall street.He's making money hand over fist. What about you? It's the questions. They really, we go through so many role plays and stress reduction techniques and how to deal with them. This kind of conflict that comes up because what [00:47:00] happens is the old uncles and aunts and relatives who come over are interested in the kids, but you know, they don't know your son or daughter the way that you do.And these questions get popped at them and they get so anxious about it. Um, when they feel either. They're being compared to someone else, or if they haven't figured out what they want to do, you know. If they don't have these things going on that they're being asked about, they, they start internalizing that they're looked at as failing and they feel like they're failing.So this is one of the things just to be mindful of is, you know, your kids don't need to have the answers to these questions. I don't care if they're 20 or 29 or 30. You don't have to have the, I tell them, you don't have to have answers to these questions for the people who are asking them. If you just, you know, just say, you know, I haven't decided any of these things yet.And you sort of move along or change, change the topic and recognizing who that uncle or aunt or whoever it is that they, there may be well meaning or they may be [00:48:00] a bit curious and intrusive, but you, you know, we work on how to manage anxiety about these things. And why those questions also are so big is because they actually hit on these developmental milestones.I mean, Jeffrey Jensen Arnett is the big developmental psychologist. We have a link to, uh, one of his books, um, Getting to 30 is the name of his book, you know, um, making it through the 20 something years. He has, he has studied. Emerging adulthood and he calls it the age of in between the age where kids are between 18 to 30 something where they're finding themselves and figuring it out And they're taking longer to do that these days than in past days So this is that age and these these questions cause anxieties because these things do make kids anxious It's about figuring it out.But they don't have to do it in the four years of college. Let's bear that in mind. It's not 1950 where you get a college [00:49:00] degree, buy a little pink house, and set up and have a family. It takes longer now, and that's okay. You know, no questions yet, but I, I might throw one at you because in my work with dialectical behavior therapy, there's actually a list that they have for teenagers that says typical.It doesn't mean We love them, but it's difficult to experiment with drinking and drugs. Um, again, not to say we'll let them get away with it. Um, but sometimes parents panic when that happens. And if you see it as, okay, these things are normal for these kids to try, but we also want to make sure that we help them set boundaries and let them know that it's no bueno.Right. Um, what? I don't know if there's a similar list for college. If there's one, I don't know of it, but I can guess that in your experience, you've seen or understand a pretty typical range of what parents might see that could feel a little scary or [00:50:00] feel out of their sense, you know, out of the comfort zone, but it's also pretty normal for the age.Yeah. Well, this is, yeah, we do know that experimentation is normal for the age experimentation again with freedoms. Um, and with things that are, have been adult like then. So for drinking, it's normal to, um, experiment with drinking to some extent. Um, marijuana, uh, Uh, you know, with that and especially in places where it is decriminalized, legalized, and it's all around them.Uh, the question always for any parent is, are you noticing a change, a real change in personality? Anger, irritability, withdrawing, and not talking to you about anything. Are you finding, and this is a critical time of year, the holidays, are you finding your kid is not talking about college at [00:51:00] all? Not sharing how they did when you ask them, well, how'd you do this semester?Did it go okay in your classes? And you hear nothing. But what happens is come early January, they're not getting ready to go back to school because they actually are on probation and they can't come back. Uh, hopefully you'll hear if that's the case before, but I've had families where it came down to the last day and that's when they found out that their, their college student was asked to take a leave.So these are the things you gotta be worried about. And this is why I say, if you don't hear specifics about people, Names of friends or peers, other students and stuff. You know, it's like, what's going on? Um, so typical is to have some, you know, not wanting to share everything. Typical is yeah, you know, they've been out and done things.Typical is that they're talking some about school. Maybe not everything that's going on. Um, but it's the out of [00:52:00] range is the out of range change. Like I said, in mood and personality. And really, you know, being sullen, not sharing anything and finding out then that, wow, you know, they had a tough, tough time.All right. And that's where, you know, you have to have the hard conversation about, okay, we want to help. So let's talk about what your needs are and what we need to do. And you know, I've worked with a lot of families. Get a leave of absence letter done by, uh, some, uh, mental health professional or your, your family physician, um, and then help you and, and your child to get some therapy around whatever the issue might've been.There are some kids, Sarah, as you know, as a psychologist, we find they've made it through high school with a sud, a, a subtle learning disability that was not uncovered until they go to college. And college is much more demanding than high school. And then all of a sudden they're [00:53:00] not able to handle certain classes or what have you.And they come home with some failures and we get at a neuropsychological evaluation and find there was a certain kind of learning issue that was never addressed. Okay. Get a leave of absence and get into a cognitive remediation or some kind of program That remediates them and and they go back to school with some accommodation So there's you know again It doesn't have to be a catastrophic end to this and it doesn't mean you don't go back to school if that's what's in your Plan and what your desire is but it means addressing problems that might be there Yeah, I certainly, and not that I think we expect that from, you know, the majority of the kids that come home and when it does happen, it can be a really great way to correct course and to get some help people understand accommodations that they need, right?Society, when you're in high school, the whole kind of system sets you up to have a bit of a schedule and to have a lot of, Not a lot of free time. [00:54:00] So you're a bit more, you know, it's, it's almost like a well oiled machine a little bit more. And when you go to college, suddenly you have to start to drive or be the engineer, um, yourself.So I, I think that, um, it's, it's nice to hear you say that you've worked with these families and yes, same here where, yeah, there has been a pretty big surprise. Um, again, not saying that that's the point of this talk. We're talking about more normative stuff, but if that does happen to you, then that also is grounds for a beginner's mind.Where can we start to see our, you know, our student from the ground up and get them right back on a path, maybe not the one we thought it was going to be. And sometimes it is, sometimes it's just, it's just a quick, you know. You go off the ramp, you get back on. So, um, I love that we get to just talk to you about this stuff for free.Yeah, no, I gotta say Sarah and I shared the same post, the same mentor, um, different years. I think I was there 20 years before you, but Dr. David [00:55:00] Barlow was my postdoctoral mentor and Sarah's doctoral. And as a new postdoctoral fellow and managing people for the first time, um, I got into some like, Oh my gosh, conflicts with folks.And I'll never forget Dave called me in. And of course, people were like, Oh, damn early. He's in trouble with Dave. And, you know, went in and sat down and he was so wonderful. He's like, Emery, tell me what's happened. Tell me how you're doing, what's going on. What are the stress your what stresses you out?Let me tell you what I heard and it was so wonderful and he looked at me and he said, all right Let's make some mid course corrections. What do you think you could do? And I have used that phrase Let's make some mid course corrections That's what you're doing. You're not erasing the life. You're not starting from scratch.So you learn from something here and you're charting a little bit of a [00:56:00] different course in some way to remediate or deal with things. I am so grateful for that because that really resonates for all the families that, yep, that's where we're at. Your kid is still your kid. They're great kids. We just gotta, you know, Right the ship a little bit onto a course, and in our 2nd webinar, we'll get am ready to dish all the things she did to get there.Let me tell you. There's a lot. Thank you so much. Do we have another slide with all those? So people can see what they're I was going to say we have the fact that we. It doesn't have any questions. I think, you know, I always like to say, well, I guess we just answered everything in our talk, but let me share with you some of the resources and everyone will get these in an email after the fact.So don't feel like you have to screenshot or anything like that, but just take a quick scan. There might be some things before you get that email while you're it's on your mind that you want to take a look at. And we try to create a few different ways, you know, for [00:57:00] people to read some books, if you want to dive deeper.Go to some websites. Of course, ours, we always try to update some of our content based on our webinars so that there's resources for you to see there. Um, we included some that are specific to the college population as well. And then a couple of podcast episodes that talk about the skills that we discussed here, if you feel like you just need something, um, in your ear while you're, like I said, you know, doing the dishes and needing to multitask.So we will share that with you. And we want to thank you so much. Um, if you need or know of anyone who does need some, some actual help, um, in a more, in a more, you know, meat and potatoes, CBT way, please scan this code or go to our website. We're always welcome. If this feels like we you're the person we'd speak to doesn't need, you know, if we're not a right fit, we always try to make sure we help them connect to someone who is, but we would love to hear from you if you ever need some additional help.And thank you so much for your time tonight. Good night, everybody. Thank you. [00:58:00] Thanks, Sarah.