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Finding the Agent You Need with Leticia Gomez · WriterCon

0:00
Speaker 1: This week on the writer Con podcast to.
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Speaker 2: Do some heavy duty soul searching and decide what kind
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Speaker 2: of writer you want to be. Do you want to
0:09
Speaker 2: be a one book wonder or do you want to
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Speaker 2: be a career bankable author.
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Speaker 1: Welcome to writer Con, a gathering place for writers to
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Speaker 1: share their knowledge about writing and the writing world. Do
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Speaker 1: you have a desire to write? Every successful writer started
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Speaker 1: with their first book. All it takes is determination and knowledge,
0:26
Speaker 1: and writer Con can provide that knowledge. Your hosts are
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Speaker 1: number one national best selling writer William Bernhardt, author of
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Speaker 1: more than sixty books, including The Superman Wars, and Laura Bernhardt,
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Speaker 1: Award winning author of the Wantlan File series and Shadow
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Speaker 1: of the Tajo.
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Speaker 3: Thank you, Jesse Ulrich. Hey, they're writers. Thanks for joining
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Speaker 3: us today. We are in the month preceding writer Con,
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Speaker 3: the annual conference in Oklahoma City Labor Day Week in
1:00
Speaker 3: September fourth through seventh. There is still time to register
1:04
Speaker 3: and make plans to join us, and I hope you will.
1:07
Speaker 3: I tried to make a list of everything that I
1:09
Speaker 3: haven't mentioned yet about writer Con on the podcast, and
1:13
Speaker 3: I came up with free Friday lunch. Because people will
1:17
Speaker 3: go anythwhere for free lunch right, and pitch a Palooza,
1:20
Speaker 3: which is brand new this year. We're still doing the
1:23
Speaker 3: traditional pitching as well, but trying something new out writer
1:27
Speaker 3: con jeopardy Okay, we do that every year, but that's
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Speaker 3: my thing. Manuscript reviews, private consultations. I don't know, Laura,
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Speaker 3: what would be on your list or discuss those? You
1:40
Speaker 3: have thirty seconds?
1:40
Speaker 4: Go thirty seconds? Okay, I believe on the list of
1:45
Speaker 4: new things? Do we mention already that we're going to
1:47
Speaker 4: try sing? Oh? That sounds super fun.
1:50
Speaker 3: If I mentioned it, it was probably just to tell
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Speaker 3: everyone that our own Jesse Ulrich will be DJing for
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Speaker 3: this event, So you know, I mean, what else are
2:01
Speaker 3: you going to do? Come on, have some fun. It's
2:03
Speaker 3: vaguely book related, but mostly it's just fun. It's like bingo,
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Speaker 3: but more musical and more fun because Jesse's DJing.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, come see how we're going to put this together
2:14
Speaker 1: on the fly, so we're gonna see how it goes.
2:16
Speaker 1: It's doing great.
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Speaker 3: Not on the fly exactly, but for the first time.
2:20
Speaker 2: That's true.
2:21
Speaker 3: Yeah, so usually a few things to be worked out.
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Speaker 3: What else were you going to say, Laura?
2:25
Speaker 4: I think we're doing karaoke again, aren't we?
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Speaker 3: We are doing karaoke again. Last year, we invited people
2:32
Speaker 3: to pick you and I's duet number, but I don't
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Speaker 3: remember that anybody did, so I guess there is still
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Speaker 3: a shot. I guess.
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Speaker 4: Well, if you comment comment below, comment below, let us
2:43
Speaker 4: know what you think that we should do. We always
2:45
Speaker 4: do it every year, and We're already starting to eye
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Speaker 4: some options and I need time to coordinate my outfit
2:52
Speaker 4: with that. You really want to see us perform something,
2:55
Speaker 4: you better start suggesting it now.
3:00
Speaker 3: See. I think we normally see you at karaoke? Do
3:03
Speaker 3: we have you and and or Michelle? Ever come you've
3:06
Speaker 3: seen me?
3:07
Speaker 1: You have not seen Michelle?
3:09
Speaker 3: Okay? I did?
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Speaker 1: I did come that one. Remember I made I made
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Speaker 1: a good friends that night. Yeah, I met a group
3:14
Speaker 1: of friends that during karaoke at a table and we
3:17
Speaker 1: were just like we should do a song together. Fifteen
3:19
Speaker 1: minutes later we did. Never seen any of those people again.
3:22
Speaker 4: And girls just want to have it was.
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Speaker 1: Yeah, that was fun, so you may see me.
3:29
Speaker 4: We lit that night.
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Speaker 1: That was so yeah, there was an energy in that
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Speaker 1: particular way.
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Speaker 2: Yeah.
3:37
Speaker 3: See we have fun, right we do? And we learned?
3:41
Speaker 4: Did you want to talk about what people could learn about.
3:43
Speaker 4: I just I was I got carried away with all
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Speaker 4: the fun stuff.
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Speaker 3: Schedule is on the website, but let me just give
3:50
Speaker 3: you the short and about not very much time. We'll
3:52
Speaker 3: be inviting people into the into the app so they
3:57
Speaker 3: can see the schedule for themselves. In fact, that might
3:59
Speaker 3: be happening about the time this goes out. Anyway, Yeah,
4:03
Speaker 3: they can see it. But you know, take assume that
4:08
Speaker 3: whatever you want to talked about will be talked about,
4:11
Speaker 3: because I think it will be. We cover every aspect,
4:15
Speaker 3: every kind of writing, marketing, publisher, getting a publisher there.
4:21
Speaker 3: As Lara knows, there is a moment I don't know,
4:23
Speaker 3: a week or two or so when I kind of
4:24
Speaker 3: slapped the table and said, wait, we don't have a
4:27
Speaker 3: songwriter now. To be fair, that's not usually the you know,
4:32
Speaker 3: what most people come to writer con for. But I
4:35
Speaker 3: want to cover everything, so bye, gosh, Lara suggested a songwriter.
4:39
Speaker 4: Right too, And they're coming, Yes they are. And to
4:43
Speaker 4: all the gamers out there who are listening, who really
4:46
Speaker 4: want to get involved in writing for games, this is
4:49
Speaker 4: the place to be. Bill has even made sure that
4:52
Speaker 4: we are going to cover writing for games. This year
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Speaker 4: really and.
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Speaker 3: Comic books which christ I've been talking about Superman Wars
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Speaker 3: all year.
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Speaker 4: Law literally everything this year.
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Speaker 3: So take this opportunity, Heed, to jump your career to
5:10
Speaker 3: the next level. All Right, I just.
5:12
Speaker 4: Say one more thing, just in case you're sitting out
5:15
Speaker 4: there thinking, well, I've never been, I don't know anybody there.
5:19
Speaker 4: It'll be awkward, I'll feel uncomfortable. Put that thought aside.
5:24
Speaker 4: Don't let that inner boys talk you out of coming.
5:27
Speaker 4: We do not have strangers at ryd Orcan. We have
5:32
Speaker 4: new members of the family that we welcome in with
5:35
Speaker 4: open arms. And I promise you will feel welcome, you
5:38
Speaker 4: will feel included. I do not let anybody feel like
5:42
Speaker 4: they don't belong there or aren't wanted there, because we
5:46
Speaker 4: do want you there. We absolutely want you there, So
5:49
Speaker 4: don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. We are
5:51
Speaker 4: all a bunch of introverts at heart, but this is
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Speaker 4: the most loving, accepting, welcoming group of people you can imagine.
6:00
Speaker 4: And I'll be right there at the registration table. You
6:02
Speaker 4: can always come find me. If you're feeling a little uncomfortable, lost, awkward,
6:07
Speaker 4: come and find me. I don't want anybody to feel
6:09
Speaker 4: that way.
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Speaker 1: I was just going to say, it's a good mix
6:12
Speaker 1: of introverts and extroverts there. Uh yeah, so.
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Speaker 4: The exos lift us all up.
6:17
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's right. Yeah, we'll bring the energy.
6:21
Speaker 3: So there you have it. Everything she said is true,
6:24
Speaker 3: although the hugging is optional. But I always encourage people
6:28
Speaker 3: to make friends. Because now I am backing into my book.
6:33
Speaker 3: But you know what my pitch is, don't let what
6:36
Speaker 3: happened to Jerry Siegel happened to you get the information
6:39
Speaker 3: you need to protect yourself and make the most of
6:44
Speaker 3: the publishing and writing opportunities that are out there now.
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Speaker 4: Absolutely, and I have bad ribbons for people who don't
6:50
Speaker 4: want to hug and don't want to shake hands, So
6:52
Speaker 4: you can go ahead and let people know that you'd
6:54
Speaker 4: prefer not to and we will respect those.
6:57
Speaker 3: She has ribbons for everything I did.
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Speaker 4: I kind of a little crazy on the ribbons this year.
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Speaker 3: So if nothing else, she got to come to writer
7:05
Speaker 3: kind to see the ribbons.
7:07
Speaker 4: Right, it's gonna be fun.
7:08
Speaker 3: We're gonna have so much fun today. For a change
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Speaker 3: of pace, we're going to interview and not a writer,
7:15
Speaker 3: but someone who has worked as both an agent and
7:18
Speaker 3: an editor. Now for Kensington. She's coming to write her
7:22
Speaker 3: con and that's Laticia Gomez. As I said, she was
7:26
Speaker 3: the founder and principal agent of the very successful Savvy
7:29
Speaker 3: Literary Services. Now she's focusing on being editor at large
7:33
Speaker 3: for Delphina Books, which is an imprint at Kensington Publishing,
7:38
Speaker 3: which I bet you've heard about or seen on the
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Speaker 3: spine of a book before. She has helped her client
7:44
Speaker 3: secure deals with the largest publishers in the world as
7:47
Speaker 3: an agent, and now as a publisher, she's seeing several
7:50
Speaker 3: of her projects successfully optioned for teaching, TV and film adaptation.
7:56
Speaker 3: So we will talk to her about all that and more.
8:01
Speaker 3: But first the news news story number one, a new
8:17
Speaker 3: Simon and Schuster imprint is targeting self published authors. Maybe
8:23
Speaker 3: I shouldn't have used the word targeting. That sort of
8:25
Speaker 3: sounds like a firing squad, But what I meant to
8:27
Speaker 3: say was that they're providing additional opportunities. This is not
8:33
Speaker 3: the first Big five initiative trying to pick up successful
8:37
Speaker 3: self published authors, because why not. They're low risk, because
8:42
Speaker 3: they've already done the work of building up their audience.
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Speaker 3: And you know who would you bet money on a
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Speaker 3: total unknown or somebody who's got a big following. They're
8:49
Speaker 3: always trying to lure in the self published. The director
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Speaker 3: of this new imprint said, and here I'm quoting, legions
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Speaker 3: of authors have carved out huge success in the indie s,
9:00
Speaker 3: appreciating the speed and reader focus that self publishing offers them.
9:05
Speaker 3: But they can also gain so much from the editorial partnership,
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Speaker 3: digital marketing expertise, and the global reach that a publisher
9:12
Speaker 3: such as Simon and Schuster can offer them. And quote,
9:17
Speaker 3: of course, there's a difference between can and Will Jesse.
9:23
Speaker 3: As a I can't really call you an outsider anymore,
9:27
Speaker 3: but as an alleged non writer. Is this an opportunity
9:31
Speaker 3: for the self published to gain a bigger audience with
9:34
Speaker 3: a big publisher or an opportunity for traditional publishers to
9:39
Speaker 3: take advantage of the audience they've already built at their
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Speaker 3: own expense while simlent Now, I'm really this is what
9:46
Speaker 3: lawyers call a leading question.
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Speaker 1: I was going to say, it's a very inpretting to continue.
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Speaker 3: While simultaneously segregating them onto their own separate imprint. What
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Speaker 3: do you think? Jesse objection?
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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm confused about how this is. How is this
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Speaker 1: different from a publisher, you know, taking a book and
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Speaker 1: doing what publishers normally do. Like where where where is
10:15
Speaker 1: the like is there a agreement about who gets what?
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Speaker 1: I just I'm trying to figure out how this is
10:22
Speaker 1: different from you just being is this Are these people
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Speaker 1: just targeting people who are already sorry, focusing on writer
10:30
Speaker 1: independent writers who already have a big audience and being like, hey,
10:33
Speaker 1: we want some of your audience. You can have some
10:34
Speaker 1: of the things that we normally do. Or is this
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Speaker 1: an opportunity for people who are, you know, beginning in
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Speaker 1: independent publishing who.
10:42
Speaker 3: Know this is so yeah?
10:45
Speaker 1: So I don't see what the I mean. I guess
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Speaker 1: there is a value add to this for people who
10:50
Speaker 1: are already successful in indie publishing, just to you know,
10:52
Speaker 1: say that they are now published. I just yeah, I'm
10:56
Speaker 1: just like this, this feels Yeah.
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Speaker 3: That's why I emphasize this separate imprint. I mean, they've
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Speaker 3: been acquiring self published authors for a long time now,
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Speaker 3: and for obvious reasons that I think I just explained
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Speaker 3: they're a safer bet. But why did they have to
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Speaker 3: have their own imprint? What's that that smacks? It's not
11:16
Speaker 3: quite as bad as the basically vanity press imprints that
11:20
Speaker 3: are totally segregated. But it does have sort of a
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Speaker 3: I don't know, I'd say taint about it. Bet Laura
11:29
Speaker 3: would be really upset if I use that word. So
11:31
Speaker 3: never mind that. You remember when they acquired q Houris
11:35
Speaker 3: and it might have been one of the first to
11:38
Speaker 3: get this kind of treatment because after Wool which we
11:41
Speaker 3: now know as Silo, took off, I think it was
11:44
Speaker 3: the same big publisher came calling and he notably said, sure,
11:49
Speaker 3: you can have the print rights because you can get
11:50
Speaker 3: into bookstores, but he kept the e book rights. Now
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Speaker 3: these people everything while for I don't know, maybe there's
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Speaker 3: a benefit to being in a separate imprint, but I'm
12:03
Speaker 3: really not seeing it.
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Speaker 1: This feels like a problem, like a solution in search
12:08
Speaker 1: of a problem sort of situation.
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Speaker 3: So looks to me like a way for them to
12:13
Speaker 3: take advantage of this. I mean, they've spent like a
12:15
Speaker 3: decade now imitating all the marketing innovations that indie authors
12:20
Speaker 3: came up with, and now they're just trying to get
12:22
Speaker 3: the authors totally. I mean, maybe there is you probably
12:25
Speaker 3: get better distribution in bookstores that might.
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Speaker 1: Be Yeah, I guess I mean that that part helps it.
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Speaker 1: Just it feels like this this publisher is skipping the
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Speaker 1: stages of having to like review and find new authors,
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Speaker 1: like the thing they were normally good at and helpful for.
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Speaker 1: There's like, we're just gonna find people who are ready
12:42
Speaker 1: popular and you know, slap our name on it, and
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Speaker 1: that feels doesn't feel great.
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Speaker 3: No, would you, Laura? Would you sign with this imprint.
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Speaker 4: If I ever reached the point where I'm off?
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Speaker 3: Yeah, if you had, if you had self published a
12:58
Speaker 3: book that hit the top ten and people's art calling,
13:00
Speaker 3: would you do exactly?
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Speaker 4: So all of those things we've talked about would be
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Speaker 4: on my mind. So I would need to sit down
13:06
Speaker 4: and I would I would want to know how does
13:08
Speaker 4: it benefit me? I can see how the publisher benefits
13:12
Speaker 4: from this scenario. I've built up a following, I'm already
13:15
Speaker 4: selling books, I've already got a readership for them. They
13:18
Speaker 4: don't have to invest anything in that. So what would
13:22
Speaker 4: they be offering me that would make it then worth
13:25
Speaker 4: my while? Yeah? And I was actually thinking of exactly
13:30
Speaker 4: Hugh Howie and how he'd just let them have print rights,
13:34
Speaker 4: because why not if they could, if they could really
13:37
Speaker 4: convince me that they could sell more than I could
13:40
Speaker 4: and offer me more opportunities. Maybe they were going to
13:43
Speaker 4: back trying to get it made into some kind of
13:45
Speaker 4: series or film or something along those lines, something that
13:49
Speaker 4: might be a little more difficult for me to open
13:51
Speaker 4: the door to. Then we could talk.
13:54
Speaker 3: Yeah, well I can help them that answer. I feel
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Speaker 3: less bad now about all the months you've spent listening
14:01
Speaker 3: to me yak about the Superman Wars, because you got
14:04
Speaker 3: the bottom message. Oh yeah, don't sign anything unless first
14:09
Speaker 3: it's been reviewed by a lawyer or an extremely experienced agent.
14:14
Speaker 3: And don't sign anything unless there's something in it for you.
14:17
Speaker 3: And I don't just mean getting your book published, I
14:20
Speaker 3: mean what's in it for you? What do you get out?
14:23
Speaker 2: At least?
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Speaker 4: Well, that's one of the perks of being married to
14:26
Speaker 4: an attorney and attorney slash writers.
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Speaker 3: Oh yes, News story number two. Here's the debate. Can
14:37
Speaker 3: agents charge fees to their own clients ethically? This has
14:44
Speaker 3: two parts. First, the results from an American literary agent's survey,
14:51
Speaker 3: and second, what we found out now is happening to
14:55
Speaker 3: the agent's canon of ethics. So this survey was taken
14:59
Speaker 3: recently working conditions and compensation, but the big thing it
15:03
Speaker 3: targeted was financial instability. It was a top concern in
15:09
Speaker 3: this year's survey. Just under thirty nine percent of those
15:13
Speaker 3: answering reported and income of under fifty thousand dollars from
15:17
Speaker 3: their agency agenting work, which would be hard to get
15:21
Speaker 3: by with, especially if you're in New York, and twenty
15:24
Speaker 3: one point two percent reported in an annual income of
15:28
Speaker 3: less than twenty five thousand, which I think is like
15:31
Speaker 3: below the poverty line. Now, three quarters of respondents reported
15:36
Speaker 3: secondary income streams no surprise there, or spouses or trust
15:41
Speaker 3: funds or something, and nearly half depend on income derived
15:45
Speaker 3: from an additional job inside or outside of publishing. So
15:50
Speaker 3: the AALA is in the process of revising its canon
15:55
Speaker 3: of ethics, and this time the word is it's going
15:59
Speaker 3: to allow for more flexibility in how agents earn a living. Specifically,
16:05
Speaker 3: agents will be able to potentially make money from referrals
16:10
Speaker 3: to third party like when you send the project to
16:13
Speaker 3: somebody else, you'd get a referral fee. Another one, agents
16:18
Speaker 3: can service the publisher of their client's work if both
16:22
Speaker 3: of them agree to it. Basically so an agent can
16:25
Speaker 3: publish their own work, presumably as sort of a self
16:28
Speaker 3: published thing. That seems agents can keep money paid by
16:34
Speaker 3: clients for editorial services. Some agents do read their clients'
16:40
Speaker 3: work and some even edit it, but I don't think
16:43
Speaker 3: they normally charged for it. Now they're going to be
16:48
Speaker 3: able to the downside there, of course, is that somebody
16:50
Speaker 3: could charge for editing your fee and then not take
16:53
Speaker 3: you on as a client. But I won't editorialize anymore.
16:57
Speaker 3: Agents can to offer paid services for clients for clients,
17:02
Speaker 3: and agents can offer any kind of paid service to
17:07
Speaker 3: non clients. Some of this has been going on for
17:10
Speaker 3: a while, Like they can be a social media consultant,
17:13
Speaker 3: or an indie publishing consultant, or a web design consultant
17:16
Speaker 3: or whatever. Okay, Jesse, we're gonna boil all this down.
17:23
Speaker 3: So I can't exactly charge for representation exactly, but they
17:28
Speaker 3: can charge for services that are very representation adjacent. How
17:33
Speaker 3: does this look to you?
17:36
Speaker 1: I feel like this is just a reflection of the
17:40
Speaker 1: time that we are in as far as like what
17:42
Speaker 1: the publishing world is going through. Where I think before
17:46
Speaker 1: like agents at major publishing houses could survive off of
17:53
Speaker 1: what they were normally making, and now like all of
17:55
Speaker 1: the small things that used to be given are now like,
17:58
Speaker 1: maybe we should charge for this because when I'm enough
18:00
Speaker 1: doing the other things doesn't feel great when you read it.
18:05
Speaker 1: But also as someone who is a contractor themselves, like
18:08
Speaker 1: some of this makes sense where there are things you
18:10
Speaker 1: would give a client for free when the economy is good,
18:14
Speaker 1: and then things you would charge for when the economy
18:15
Speaker 1: is not so good. So but it does feel it
18:20
Speaker 1: feels like it's just another complication on top of the
18:23
Speaker 1: relationship you have to build with your agent ahead of time,
18:27
Speaker 1: and another opportunity for people to take advantage of other people.
18:31
Speaker 3: Lara thoughts, Yeah, what do you think of an agent
18:34
Speaker 3: who sent you an invoice for a line at it?
18:37
Speaker 4: Or well, if I had gone into that relationship with
18:44
Speaker 4: awareness obviously, not if it got sprung on me. And
18:46
Speaker 4: also is that a condition to being taken on as
18:50
Speaker 4: a client. What if they're just doing some editing on
18:53
Speaker 4: the side. Agents are very savvy about what's selling, what
18:58
Speaker 4: publishers are looking for. I can bring that expertise to
19:01
Speaker 4: a manuscript and say, hey, I'm available for an edit
19:06
Speaker 4: for this amount of money. I can bring this expertise
19:08
Speaker 4: to your project and help you out. I think that's
19:11
Speaker 4: completely fine, But if it was again, it would feel
19:16
Speaker 4: more like charging a potential client if they say, if
19:21
Speaker 4: you want me to read that, you're going to have
19:23
Speaker 4: to pay me this reading fee. And we've really warned
19:26
Speaker 4: against that in the past, and so that starts to
19:29
Speaker 4: set off for me some kind of an alarm bell.
19:33
Speaker 4: But maybe we're just I don't know. Maybe that's where
19:35
Speaker 4: we're moving and we're going to have to get used
19:36
Speaker 4: to it. I don't know.
19:38
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm worried that all my thoughts on this are
19:42
Speaker 3: just a sign of age. But you know how I
19:45
Speaker 3: feel about publishers who want a charge a fee for
19:50
Speaker 3: one reason or another. Up front, I tell I tell
19:54
Speaker 3: our students to run, don't. That's not what a real
19:58
Speaker 3: publisher does. And similar this feels like something not a
20:03
Speaker 3: real publisher does. I think there have been agencies that
20:06
Speaker 3: charged for edits or even forgiving opinions on manuscripts, but
20:13
Speaker 3: you know that's probably wasn't in the code of ethics,
20:17
Speaker 3: and this is going to be.
20:19
Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't know it.
20:22
Speaker 3: But I don't want people to starve to death either. Yeah, yeah,
20:27
Speaker 3: all right. In Craft Corner, our guest this time is
20:31
Speaker 3: Jeff Provine, who has written many nonfiction books, and comic
20:36
Speaker 3: books and much more. He's discussing nonfiction research used for fiction.
20:43
Speaker 3: Take it away, Jeff.
20:47
Speaker 1: Craft Corner.
20:49
Speaker 5: Hey, y'all, I'm Jeff Provide, local author who's done a
20:51
Speaker 5: lot of fiction and nonfiction. I might have seen some
20:54
Speaker 5: of my nonfiction works around, such as Haunted Oaklhoma City,
20:57
Speaker 5: a collection of spooky stories and history all around the metro,
21:00
Speaker 5: and I am going to have Haunted Stillwater published September fifteenth,
21:04
Speaker 5: so keep an eye out for that if you like
21:06
Speaker 5: that spooky stuff. I want to talk about how this
21:10
Speaker 5: nonfiction research has turned into a really great source of
21:14
Speaker 5: ideas for fiction. For example, after I did the Campus
21:19
Speaker 5: Ghosts of Norman, all about spooky stories around OU, I
21:23
Speaker 5: had a story talking about the library ghost published in
21:26
Speaker 5: the newspaper, which is kind of that fun take on
21:30
Speaker 5: here's the legends and then what happens when we experience it.
21:33
Speaker 5: Like a lot of folks, whenever I run across on
21:35
Speaker 5: the cool, I keep packed full of things and notebooks.
21:40
Speaker 5: So what I want to talk about is ghost Hollow.
21:43
Speaker 5: Despite having lived almost my whole life in Oklahoma, I
21:46
Speaker 5: had never heard this story. But just south of Stillwater
21:49
Speaker 5: there's a little creek running up in what's called Ghost Hollow,
21:53
Speaker 5: which I didn't know we had haullers this far west,
21:55
Speaker 5: but sure enough, it's a very narrow ravine. It's all
21:58
Speaker 5: covered in trees. I got a chance to go on
22:02
Speaker 5: a jeep tour through it in the middle of August,
22:04
Speaker 5: which Oklahoma's hot, it's muggy, but right there plunge temperatures
22:09
Speaker 5: it was so freezing.
22:11
Speaker 2: Was weird.
22:12
Speaker 5: So the legend of Ghost hollows that in eighteen seventy
22:15
Speaker 5: one a young lady was running off with her boo
22:18
Speaker 5: and her father didn't want her to, so he shot
22:21
Speaker 5: at them and ended up hitting her. And since she
22:23
Speaker 5: was only seventeen at the time, every seventeen years there's
22:27
Speaker 5: been another violent murder there. They've been well documented. Sometimes
22:31
Speaker 5: it's motorcycle accidents, sometimes it's thefts. Sometimes it's mob justice
22:36
Speaker 5: where people grab some horse thieves and hung them on
22:38
Speaker 5: the old hanging tree. So with so much going on
22:42
Speaker 5: just right there, it already starts spurring story ideas. These
22:46
Speaker 5: could obviously be like some Stephen King horror type. Right,
22:49
Speaker 5: it's just this isolated location where all kinds of bad
22:53
Speaker 5: things happen over and over again. Just those bad places
22:56
Speaker 5: he talks about, or you could take a little bit
22:58
Speaker 5: lighter with a supernatural You see the woman who's said
23:02
Speaker 5: to be there, walking all glowing in white, wearing a
23:05
Speaker 5: burial ground, going across the river before she disappears, and
23:09
Speaker 5: it could be the characters are trying to figure out
23:11
Speaker 5: who is this person and how can we lay her
23:13
Speaker 5: to rest or as part of your world building. It
23:16
Speaker 5: could just be a corner of your urban fantasy where
23:18
Speaker 5: people get out of the town and into something a
23:23
Speaker 5: little amiss that seems natural on the surface, but as
23:26
Speaker 5: they get closer, they see the lights floating over the streams,
23:30
Speaker 5: or they hear the calls of familiar voices out in
23:32
Speaker 5: the wilderness that draw them into the trees and then
23:35
Speaker 5: never to be seen again. So all these different things
23:39
Speaker 5: could fit within whatever story you're trying to make. So
23:42
Speaker 5: keep your eyes open and keep your ears open, and
23:44
Speaker 5: you never know what's out there that you can find,
23:46
Speaker 5: and you never know what story it's going to end
23:48
Speaker 5: up in.
23:53
Speaker 3: Thanks Jeff, and now let's talk to Letitia Gomez. Latitia Gomez,
24:04
Speaker 3: Welcome to the podcast.
24:07
Speaker 2: Hi, thank you for having me today.
24:09
Speaker 3: Our pleasure. Okay, traditional first question, if you could offer
24:14
Speaker 3: writers one piece of advice. What would it be.
24:17
Speaker 2: To do some heavy duty soul searching and decide what
24:21
Speaker 2: kind of writer you want to be. Do you want
24:23
Speaker 2: to be a one book wonder or do you want
24:26
Speaker 2: to be a career bankable author.
24:29
Speaker 3: Now, I would assume most people want to be a
24:31
Speaker 3: career bankable So what are you trying to inspire people
24:39
Speaker 3: with their or send a message?
24:43
Speaker 4: Uh?
24:44
Speaker 2: The message is that if you want to be a
24:46
Speaker 2: career bankable author, you're in for the long haul. And
24:52
Speaker 2: so you know you're not just happy with taking one
24:59
Speaker 2: advance and going to the bank with it, that you
25:02
Speaker 2: really do want to make a career of writing fiction
25:06
Speaker 2: or no fiction, whatever it is.
25:08
Speaker 3: You really you get a lot of people who say,
25:10
Speaker 3: I just want to write one book. I just want
25:12
Speaker 3: to have a book with my name on the spine,
25:14
Speaker 3: on the coffee table. I mean, I would assume everybody
25:17
Speaker 3: wants a career.
25:19
Speaker 2: You know, I feel that every person has at least
25:23
Speaker 2: one book in them, right, I really do. I think
25:27
Speaker 2: that most authors want to write more than one book. Right,
25:33
Speaker 2: But if they don't play their cards right, and I'm
25:36
Speaker 2: talking about not creativity wise, but business wise, that they
25:42
Speaker 2: can become one book wonders if they you know, it's
25:46
Speaker 2: not their intention.
25:47
Speaker 3: If you don't up.
25:48
Speaker 2: Yeah, but that's what happens sometimes.
25:51
Speaker 3: Yeah, I've seen that too. So let's turn back the
25:55
Speaker 3: pages a little bit. When did you or how did
25:57
Speaker 3: you first get interested in books?
26:00
Speaker 2: Wow? Okay, Well I have always been interested in the
26:03
Speaker 2: written word, you know, growing up. I mean the first
26:06
Speaker 2: book I read was The Bible, which is the best
26:09
Speaker 2: collection of short stories I've ever read. So I've been
26:11
Speaker 2: a very early reader. And my interest not just in books,
26:18
Speaker 2: but in publishing really started back in the early nineties.
26:22
Speaker 2: I actually have worked in different facets of publishing. So
26:25
Speaker 2: in the early nineties I started my publishing career as
26:28
Speaker 2: a newspaper publisher. That was back in the early days
26:32
Speaker 2: before you know, when the Internet was new, social media
26:36
Speaker 2: wasn't really existent. It was just good old fashion journalism
26:41
Speaker 2: telling stories the good old fashion way. And so that's
26:46
Speaker 2: how I first got interested in publishing. Then I moved
26:51
Speaker 2: on to doing magazine writing work, and then I decided
26:54
Speaker 2: to write a novel while I was pregnant with my
26:57
Speaker 2: first child, and I just didn't yeah, well, you know,
27:03
Speaker 2: I wanted to produce life inside and life on the
27:06
Speaker 2: page right, and so I, you know, so I wrote
27:09
Speaker 2: a book and that was you know, you know, that
27:13
Speaker 2: was the first experience that I had as an author,
27:17
Speaker 2: as a writer, and I ended up selling that book
27:19
Speaker 2: on my own to a publisher. And then and then
27:24
Speaker 2: I had, you know, and then I had to I
27:26
Speaker 2: had two children, and I wanted to have the h
27:29
Speaker 2: the luxury of being able to stay home and raise
27:32
Speaker 2: them myself, and so I started a literary agency back
27:35
Speaker 2: in two thousand and seven.
27:37
Speaker 3: Mm hmm. And now you're working both as an editor
27:42
Speaker 3: for a major publishing house and as an agent. Does that, well,
27:49
Speaker 3: which came first? Did the publishing job come first? No?
27:52
Speaker 2: It was the the the agency, yes, so yeah. But
28:00
Speaker 2: but my story, I kind of have a full circle
28:03
Speaker 2: story where, you know, I wrote my first novel and
28:07
Speaker 2: then I didn't have an agent at the time, and
28:11
Speaker 2: one day I came across an ad from a New
28:13
Speaker 2: York publisher that was advertising the launch of a new book, Imprint.
28:19
Speaker 2: It was a book Imprint of that was going to
28:22
Speaker 2: publish romance novels written by Latina women for Latina women,
28:28
Speaker 2: and so it was an open call for submissions. So I,
28:33
Speaker 2: you know, I wrote my novel, and I said, look,
28:35
Speaker 2: I've got nothing else to lose. I'm going to send
28:37
Speaker 2: it my manuscript. I send in my manuscript. About a
28:40
Speaker 2: month later, I received a call from the acquiring editor
28:43
Speaker 2: of this imprint and said, I got your novel. It's
28:46
Speaker 2: a solid novel. We'd like to make an offer to you.
28:49
Speaker 2: Do you have an agent? I said no, Well, this
28:51
Speaker 2: publisher was willing to, you know, to work with me
28:56
Speaker 2: even though I didn't have an agent back in the
28:58
Speaker 2: early two thousands, and so my novel was published. And
29:05
Speaker 2: you know, fast forward about twenty five years later down
29:09
Speaker 2: the road, when I was ready to make the transition
29:13
Speaker 2: from being a literary agent to an acquisition editor, I
29:18
Speaker 2: saw another ad from from the same publisher that published
29:24
Speaker 2: me twenty five years ago, looking for an editorial director
29:28
Speaker 2: for their Imperor. And guess who they hired. They hired.
29:32
Speaker 3: That was meant to be, obviously.
29:34
Speaker 2: I think so. I think so that has.
29:37
Speaker 3: Never create any like conflicts of interest because you're kind
29:41
Speaker 3: of wearing two different hats at different times.
29:44
Speaker 2: It does, it can, and it does. Okay, So the
29:48
Speaker 2: reason that I had my dream job was to always
29:51
Speaker 2: be an acquisition editor. But back in the early two thousands.
29:55
Speaker 2: Not too many publishers were open to hiring editors on
29:58
Speaker 2: a remote basis. It was an until after COVID that
30:02
Speaker 2: that whole world opened up. Uh. And then so my
30:06
Speaker 2: children grew up, you know, they went to college. I
30:09
Speaker 2: did my job as a mom, and so I was
30:11
Speaker 2: ready to make that transition. And it's a transition that
30:15
Speaker 2: is made a lot in the business. You have acquisition
30:19
Speaker 2: editors who become literary agents and vice versa. Uh, it
30:24
Speaker 2: really takes the same skill set from I truly believe
30:28
Speaker 2: that a good literary agent can make a good acquisition editor,
30:31
Speaker 2: and a good acquisition editor can make it can be
30:34
Speaker 2: a very good literary agent. So the roles are interchangeable.
30:38
Speaker 2: I was just ready to make that change, and so
30:43
Speaker 2: I did. I was hired, you know, to run an
30:46
Speaker 2: imprint for Kensington. It's an imprint that is now twenty
30:49
Speaker 2: five years old. But and they knew that I was
30:54
Speaker 2: a literary agent coming in from the start. So, but
30:58
Speaker 2: what my special was championing the voices of color or
31:04
Speaker 2: those voices that had always had a hard time of
31:06
Speaker 2: finding representation. And so that was particularly the skill set
31:10
Speaker 2: they were looking for. And so, you know, but my
31:17
Speaker 2: you know, I had reached that fork in the road
31:19
Speaker 2: where I had spent two decades building my agency because
31:24
Speaker 2: I started it back in two thousand and seven, probably
31:27
Speaker 2: the worst time in the to do it, because we
31:29
Speaker 2: were going through that terrible recession. I was not I
31:34
Speaker 2: was Texas based, I was not based in New York
31:38
Speaker 2: or in LA You know, I had a lot of
31:41
Speaker 2: you know, a lot of things against me, and so
31:44
Speaker 2: I felt conflicted because although I did want to take
31:48
Speaker 2: on my dream job of being an acquisition editor, but
31:52
Speaker 2: I didn't want to lose my agency either. But I
31:56
Speaker 2: knew that I couldn't do both. So what I did
31:59
Speaker 2: is I asked my husband and my son if they
32:01
Speaker 2: would take over the financial duties of the agency, and
32:05
Speaker 2: then I hired a couple of agents to represent under
32:09
Speaker 2: my banner. And you know, I stepped away from it,
32:15
Speaker 2: you know, so that to avoid any conflict of interest
32:19
Speaker 2: and and to be able to excel in my role
32:23
Speaker 2: as editorial director, because I mean it was that that
32:27
Speaker 2: was monopolizing my whole time anyway. So that's how I did.
32:31
Speaker 4: Thought you had some family that was willing to kind
32:34
Speaker 4: of step up and assist with that, right, right, Are
32:38
Speaker 4: you able to tell us about some of your success sports.
32:43
Speaker 2: Yeah, sure, sure, okay, all right, Well I'll start off
32:50
Speaker 2: with the the the acquisition editor side.
32:54
Speaker 3: Right.
32:57
Speaker 2: So, one of the novels that I acquired and was
33:02
Speaker 2: recently published in February of this year, is a novel
33:06
Speaker 2: called Burned Down Master's House by Clay King. That novel
33:11
Speaker 2: I felt was special the minute I got it, I
33:13
Speaker 2: got it in right, but it was it was an
33:17
Speaker 2: uphill battle to get approval to acquire the novel.
33:21
Speaker 1: Right.
33:22
Speaker 2: What a lot of authors don't understand, and this is
33:26
Speaker 2: really a really brutal, honest truth that I'm going to
33:30
Speaker 2: reveal right here, right now, is that one acquisition editor
33:34
Speaker 2: alone does not have the power to acquire a book, right.
33:40
Speaker 4: Yeah.
33:41
Speaker 2: The decision to acquire a book is a group decision.
33:46
Speaker 2: The acquisition editor is just the editor who got the project,
33:51
Speaker 2: who loved the project, who's going to go to bat
33:54
Speaker 2: for the project, but not necessarily going to hit a
33:58
Speaker 2: home run with it, because that acquisition editor has to
34:01
Speaker 2: convince a whole group of people.
34:03
Speaker 4: A marketing team, and write whoever.
34:06
Speaker 2: Right Right. Sometimes when I'm doing writing conferences, I like
34:10
Speaker 2: to use this analogy is that the acquisite the publications
34:15
Speaker 2: board are the parents, right, the acquisition editor is their child.
34:22
Speaker 2: And so an acquisition editor gets a piece of candy, right,
34:27
Speaker 2: or a manuscript that they really fall in love with
34:29
Speaker 2: it they feel that they must have and they go
34:31
Speaker 2: to the parents during the meeting and they say, hey,
34:34
Speaker 2: Mom and dad, I've got this piece of candy. It's
34:39
Speaker 2: such a great piece of candy. Can I have it,
34:42
Speaker 2: and then explain the reasons why they should let you
34:45
Speaker 2: have this piece of candy? Right? And so what happens
34:49
Speaker 2: is either the you know, the parents will say, well, yeah, yeah,
34:54
Speaker 2: I can see this is a really good piece of candy.
34:56
Speaker 2: You could have it. Leticia, right, or if if if
35:01
Speaker 2: the board just you know, if if the board, which
35:03
Speaker 2: are comprised of both you know, your editor, your editor peers,
35:08
Speaker 2: the sales and marketing people, they'll say, no, this is
35:10
Speaker 2: not a good piece of candy. It's going to give
35:12
Speaker 2: you lots of cavities. You can't have it, right. So
35:16
Speaker 2: that's how it really is, you know. So with this novel,
35:20
Speaker 2: you know, I did not get approval to acquire it first,
35:24
Speaker 2: I did not, but but I kept working. I didn't
35:29
Speaker 2: let it go.
35:30
Speaker 6: Uh.
35:31
Speaker 2: You know, one of my nicknames that some of my
35:33
Speaker 2: clients gave me as a literary agent was I was
35:35
Speaker 2: a pit bull and skirt. I just when I when
35:38
Speaker 2: I found something and I sucked my teeth into it,
35:41
Speaker 2: I would not let it go. So I could not
35:43
Speaker 2: let this novel go. Uh And eventually, you know, I
35:47
Speaker 2: had to brainstorm with the agent and the author and saying, look,
35:51
Speaker 2: we can't acquire it as is, but if you were
35:54
Speaker 2: to make these changes, I might be able to get
35:58
Speaker 2: it green lit for acquisition. And so the author was
36:01
Speaker 2: open to it. I acquired it, It was released, and
36:06
Speaker 2: it hit the New York Times Bestseller List and the
36:09
Speaker 2: USA Today Bestseller List.
36:10
Speaker 4: Awesome. So that's yeah, that's the best. What a great feeling.
36:15
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's one of the you know, so that and
36:18
Speaker 2: so I feel like, you know, a lot of the
36:21
Speaker 2: books that I acquired were very important books. So I
36:25
Speaker 2: feel like the list that I built for Defina in
36:29
Speaker 2: three years, three and a half years was a very
36:31
Speaker 2: strong list. So I consider that to be you know,
36:36
Speaker 2: feathers in my cap you know. So, like the first
36:40
Speaker 2: year I did thirty titles for them, the second year
36:43
Speaker 2: twenty five, the third year twenty one. But you know,
36:48
Speaker 2: and so so that. You know, that is what I
36:53
Speaker 2: measure success as an acquisition editor now as literary agent. Uh,
37:01
Speaker 2: I feel successful because I had I was able to
37:04
Speaker 2: make to get many debut authors their first traditional publishing deal, right,
37:11
Speaker 2: So I loved working with Hurdle. Yeah, it is, it is,
37:16
Speaker 2: you know, that's the uh, you know, debut authors, it's
37:19
Speaker 2: very tough for them to find representation, it's very tough
37:23
Speaker 2: for them to get a traditional publishing deal. So I
37:26
Speaker 2: did a lot of debut authors, and the majority of
37:29
Speaker 2: them being voices of color. So I'm very very proud
37:33
Speaker 2: of that, and I've had very you know, very interesting experiences.
37:39
Speaker 2: One of them I'm actually going to incorporate into one
37:42
Speaker 2: of the presentations that I'll be giving at Writer con
37:46
Speaker 2: So I don't know if I should rebal it here
37:48
Speaker 2: or way.
37:50
Speaker 3: Either way, were okay.
37:52
Speaker 2: Well, it's it's a story of a woman that I
37:58
Speaker 2: represented her young adult model. Okay, I won't give the
38:01
Speaker 2: full spiel that I tried to give at the conference,
38:04
Speaker 2: but what made this experience really meaningful to me is
38:09
Speaker 2: that it was about a young adult adult novel called Shelter,
38:13
Speaker 2: which takes place in a domestic shelter. So I thought
38:17
Speaker 2: that was a very interesting setting in itself, and it
38:19
Speaker 2: features a young male protagonist who summons up the courage
38:23
Speaker 2: to stand up to his violet father and remove himself
38:29
Speaker 2: and his mother and sister and take him to go
38:32
Speaker 2: live in a shelter. And Patricia was the reason she
38:36
Speaker 2: decided to write this novel is because she had volunteered
38:40
Speaker 2: to work at shelters for twenty years, so it's a
38:42
Speaker 2: very important part of her life. And so what happened
38:45
Speaker 2: was we were in the middle of negotiating the book
38:48
Speaker 2: deal when she died suddenly, you know, Well she didn't
38:54
Speaker 2: die suddenly. She had cervical cancer, you know, and she
38:58
Speaker 2: died from complications from that. But despite you know, her
39:03
Speaker 2: her unfortunate passing away, I was still able to continue
39:09
Speaker 2: negotiating the deal and finalize the deal and the novel
39:14
Speaker 2: was and the novel was actually published. So so I
39:19
Speaker 2: don't measure sometimes I don't measure my successes by by
39:24
Speaker 2: them be by it being a project that generated a
39:27
Speaker 2: lot of money. Sometimes the most successful ones are, you know,
39:31
Speaker 2: experiences like the one that I had with Patricia.
39:35
Speaker 4: That's so important and and that's going to connect with
39:37
Speaker 4: somebody somewhere and it's going to be very, very meaningful
39:41
Speaker 4: to them. I believe it.
39:44
Speaker 2: Well, see, I feel that, you know, books, every book
39:50
Speaker 2: to me is a dream realized many people. They dream
39:56
Speaker 2: of publishing a book. And it's not just a publishing
39:59
Speaker 2: a book, but they I I think it's it's it's
40:01
Speaker 2: they want to leave some kind of legacy behind, you know,
40:04
Speaker 2: they want they have something that they want to share
40:07
Speaker 2: to the world, and by writing a book and having
40:11
Speaker 2: it published, you know, they kind of get the opportunity
40:15
Speaker 2: to immortalize themselves in a way.
40:18
Speaker 4: Yeah, I could say that. Yeah, Well, you've shared some
40:21
Speaker 4: about kind of the workings of the publishing industry today.
40:27
Speaker 4: How has that changed since you first started working in it?
40:31
Speaker 2: Okay, well it's it's it's changed a lot, right, So, uh,
40:35
Speaker 2: first of all, it's it's it's you know, there's been
40:39
Speaker 2: good changes and there's been bad changes. The publishing industry
40:45
Speaker 2: does seem to be the traditional publishing industry, let me
40:48
Speaker 2: rephrase that does seem to be shrinking because of the
40:54
Speaker 2: ability that authors have now to publish independently. Sure, so
41:00
Speaker 2: that is really cutting into the action of and the
41:05
Speaker 2: profitability factor for traditional publishing houses because everybody is publishing
41:12
Speaker 2: these days and that and I think it's human nature.
41:16
Speaker 2: People have something to say, whether whether it's verbally or
41:20
Speaker 2: in written form, and there's so many ways now than
41:25
Speaker 2: ever that people can get their message across. So what
41:30
Speaker 2: has changed is the advent of social media, right, which
41:35
Speaker 2: which you know, which now traditional publishers really take a
41:39
Speaker 2: lot of stock in social media authors who are on
41:43
Speaker 2: social media because, you know, because it is the most
41:47
Speaker 2: cost effective way to market a book these days, exactly exactly,
41:54
Speaker 2: and so you know, there's a far wider reach. So
41:58
Speaker 2: that has changed, I mean, and believe it or not,
42:01
Speaker 2: when I first started as a literary agent, everything was
42:04
Speaker 2: still done you know, through snail mail, right, hard copies
42:10
Speaker 2: of manuscripts being mailed, you know. And so when the
42:14
Speaker 2: publishing industry world opened up electronically, it just really really opened,
42:19
Speaker 2: you know, illuminated the industry in so many ways, and
42:24
Speaker 2: it was so much easier, you know, to go about
42:28
Speaker 2: publishing and getting published.
42:30
Speaker 4: Absolutely.
42:31
Speaker 2: Also another change is the creation of so many genres
42:36
Speaker 2: and subgenres.
42:36
Speaker 4: Oh, yes, that's a good point. I hadn't thought about that.
42:40
Speaker 2: Yeah, they didn't, you know, back in the day, it
42:43
Speaker 2: was just romance, right, that's it right now. It's roman
42:47
Speaker 2: to see now, it's it's you know, you know, it's
42:51
Speaker 2: all these creations of the different ropes you can find.
42:56
Speaker 4: Your your very specific audience that way exactly.
43:00
Speaker 2: And the and I think it's because the the you know,
43:04
Speaker 2: there's more diversity now in terms of authors in publishing. Uh.
43:08
Speaker 2: And the reason I feel that there's so many genres
43:12
Speaker 2: and subgenres is because it now because publishing is now
43:16
Speaker 2: reflecting what the real world is like in terms of
43:21
Speaker 2: we are you know, we come from different backgrounds. I mean,
43:26
Speaker 2: you know, there's so many you know, nationalities that are
43:32
Speaker 2: races that are writing, so many different points of view.
43:35
Speaker 2: It's a melting pot. And I think that these subgenres
43:41
Speaker 2: are a result of that of of of the diversity.
43:46
Speaker 4: So even though you can look at that and feel
43:48
Speaker 4: a little overwhelmed, really is a good thing. It's a
43:51
Speaker 4: good thing. Yeah, yes, Well, speaking of those increases increases
43:56
Speaker 4: in genre and moving to electronic submissions, I suspect you're
44:03
Speaker 4: probably like most agents that we've spoken with, and receive
44:08
Speaker 4: more submissions than you maybe ever imagined that you would.
44:13
Speaker 4: Could you talk a little bit about how you deal
44:15
Speaker 4: with the presently crushing number of submissions that you receive.
44:21
Speaker 2: Yes, so you know, I've been at it for a
44:23
Speaker 2: very long time, so it you know it. So I
44:26
Speaker 2: get submissions, you know, through my website. I also get
44:31
Speaker 2: submissions from you know, writing conferences, right, you know, I
44:36
Speaker 2: do a lot of writing conferences. I feel like it's
44:39
Speaker 2: it's very important. There's a lot of editors, acquisition editors
44:43
Speaker 2: and literary agents that do not like going to writing
44:47
Speaker 2: conferences because it is a lot of work. It is
44:50
Speaker 2: work before, during, and after. But I think it's very
44:54
Speaker 2: rewarding and that is still I think the best place
44:58
Speaker 2: is to meet talented new authors.
45:02
Speaker 3: Uh.
45:03
Speaker 2: So I you know, so I get submission you know,
45:06
Speaker 2: A lot of the bulk of my submissions come from
45:08
Speaker 2: my website as an agent, also from writing conferences. And
45:14
Speaker 2: believe it or not, when you're in when you've been
45:17
Speaker 2: in the business as long as I have, I get
45:18
Speaker 2: a lot of word of mouth referrals. Interesting, Yeah, I do.
45:23
Speaker 2: I'll get a lot of a because I really spoiled
45:26
Speaker 2: my authors to death. I do. I do. Uh, And
45:31
Speaker 2: they like the relationship that I have with them, and
45:36
Speaker 2: so they they tell other other authors. So a lot
45:41
Speaker 2: of my business does come from from word of mouth referrals.
45:44
Speaker 3: Okay, that's fantastic.
45:46
Speaker 4: What about your inbox, though, how do you how do
45:49
Speaker 4: you weed through all the submissions? Like do you spend
45:52
Speaker 4: a certain number of hours every day trying to work
45:54
Speaker 4: through all of those?
45:55
Speaker 2: Okay, So as a literary agent, I did, right, I
45:59
Speaker 2: would do those first in the morning, right, I would
46:01
Speaker 2: look at submissions first thing in the morning, because I've
46:04
Speaker 2: gotten some sleep. You know, my brain isn't musshit, I
46:11
Speaker 2: have a good cup of coffee in my hand. I'm
46:13
Speaker 2: more open minded, right than if I were to look
46:17
Speaker 2: at submissions at four o'clock in the afternoon eight nine
46:22
Speaker 2: o'clock at night. Right, So you know I look for
46:27
Speaker 2: you know, so I try to look at submissions when
46:31
Speaker 2: I'm happy, when I'm well fed, when I've had coffee, right, right,
46:37
Speaker 2: you know, Okay, because you know and and so, and
46:42
Speaker 2: you do have to make snap decisions about you know, what,
46:46
Speaker 2: which ones you want to give more time to, and
46:49
Speaker 2: which ones you want to pass on right away? Right.
46:53
Speaker 2: I do feel it is important to try to answer
46:56
Speaker 2: every submission, whether you're answering positively and negatively. Because I'll
47:01
Speaker 2: tell you what, it takes real courage to put your
47:06
Speaker 2: work out there, and I think that courage should be
47:11
Speaker 2: rewarded with kindness, not with brutality, not with saying your
47:15
Speaker 2: work sucks. You know, you've got to be nice to people,
47:19
Speaker 2: sure you really do? You know, authors can be very
47:23
Speaker 2: sensitive and so you know, yeah, yeah, but no, it's
47:30
Speaker 2: it's you know, as an age, as a literary agent,
47:32
Speaker 2: it is you know that is probably the most important
47:35
Speaker 2: part of the job, is looking for new authors to represent,
47:39
Speaker 2: So it is it is a balancing act, right, But
47:42
Speaker 2: then you also have to take care of the authors
47:46
Speaker 2: that you do have, right, So you don't want to
47:49
Speaker 2: be taking in new authors while you're older, your your
47:53
Speaker 2: authors are slipping out the backboard, right, so you you
47:57
Speaker 2: have it has to be a very nice balancing act.
48:00
Speaker 2: And so you know, I I, you know, try to
48:03
Speaker 2: get through every submission. A lot of my decisions sometimes
48:06
Speaker 2: it is based on the query letter. Yeah, you know,
48:09
Speaker 2: it's it's very important. If I don't like the query letter,
48:12
Speaker 2: I'm probably not going to ask to see more. It's
48:16
Speaker 2: I would, you know, because it is physically impossible for
48:19
Speaker 2: literary agents to yet to say yes to everything unless
48:23
Speaker 2: they have forty eight hours in their day. Unless that
48:27
Speaker 2: no one, no, you know, and I know that authors
48:30
Speaker 2: get frustrated because you know, agents don't answer right, But really,
48:39
Speaker 2: all the agent is trying to do is be responsible.
48:42
Speaker 2: Because if we say yes to everybody, do you think
48:45
Speaker 2: everybody's going to get good representation?
48:49
Speaker 4: No?
48:50
Speaker 2: So sometimes the responsible thing to do as a literary
48:53
Speaker 2: agent is to say, look, I'm sorry, you know your
48:57
Speaker 2: work sounds interesting, but I just cannot pursue it at
48:59
Speaker 2: this time time, right right now. As as an acquisition editor,
49:07
Speaker 2: you a lot of people have a misconception that all
49:10
Speaker 2: acquisition editors do is just acquire new books. That's just
49:16
Speaker 2: a very small name. Yes it's in the name Laura,
49:23
Speaker 2: but that's just a small portion of their responsibilities. Their
49:27
Speaker 2: responsibilities is to get every title on their list down,
49:34
Speaker 2: an assemblying line down, the editorial process on time. Really,
49:41
Speaker 2: as the bulk of an acquisition editor's day is day
49:45
Speaker 2: to day project management. That's what it is. It's there's
49:50
Speaker 2: always some fire to put out, there's always a problem
49:55
Speaker 2: that needs to be solved, and so that's why most
49:59
Speaker 2: acquisitions editors they're due their reading when not during your
50:05
Speaker 2: normal nine to five hours. Yeah they do it at night. Yeah,
50:10
Speaker 2: they do it on the weekends. You know, they do
50:16
Speaker 2: it on their way to the airport while their uber
50:19
Speaker 2: drives them around. Yeah, they have to carve out extra
50:24
Speaker 2: time to read new submissions.
50:28
Speaker 4: That's very interesting. Wow, we are we are really enlightening us.
50:34
Speaker 4: So then you also go to so yeah, so while
50:37
Speaker 4: you're driving to the airport and your uber and reading
50:39
Speaker 4: new submissions on your way to conferences, so that you
50:42
Speaker 4: can take some pitches. Yeah, let's talk about pitches. What
50:47
Speaker 4: do you think is the most successful approach to pitching?
50:49
Speaker 4: So while you're while you're doing all of that, what's
50:51
Speaker 4: your hope when you arrive, what are you hoping that
50:54
Speaker 4: someone will bring to you and how they will bring
50:57
Speaker 4: it to you?
50:58
Speaker 2: Okay, well, I hope to find something truly unique that
51:05
Speaker 2: hasn't been done to death before, from an author who
51:12
Speaker 2: who has a strong work ethic, who has a sense
51:16
Speaker 2: of humor, because in this business, oh my god, you
51:21
Speaker 2: really need the comic relief sometimes, absolutely, you know, But
51:25
Speaker 2: I'm but I'm not really I'm looking see pitches. I
51:28
Speaker 2: think should always just be a casual conversation. I love that,
51:33
Speaker 2: you know, just just having a memorable conversation with someone. Yeah,
51:38
Speaker 2: I mean isn't that how sometimes we have met our
51:42
Speaker 2: best friends in life, is we had a first great
51:46
Speaker 2: conversation right about a topic that was of interest to
51:51
Speaker 2: both of us. Right, So, you know, so authors just
51:55
Speaker 2: need to to just get comfortable, you know, when they're
51:59
Speaker 2: contemplating pitch. It's not they're they're not being you know,
52:05
Speaker 2: interviewed for a job. I mean, well, they are being
52:07
Speaker 2: interviewed for the job of a published author, but but
52:09
Speaker 2: not in the in this it's not a committee senate
52:13
Speaker 2: hearing me, right, Yeah, it's not. It's just a chance
52:17
Speaker 2: to have a meaningful conversation with a book publishing professional
52:21
Speaker 2: with experience about your work, and that means just being yourself.
52:28
Speaker 2: I really I've never met an author who I did
52:31
Speaker 2: who was not an interesting person. Authors are interesting people.
52:35
Speaker 2: That's why they're right, Okay, not you know, not everybody.
52:40
Speaker 4: And usually very nice. Again, not everybody, but usually very nice.
52:44
Speaker 2: Right, you know. So after writer con, I'm just looking
52:48
Speaker 2: forward to meeting uh, you know, very interesting authors who
52:53
Speaker 2: are also interesting human beings who have written something that
52:58
Speaker 2: they feel confident about, that they feel strongly about. Uh,
53:03
Speaker 2: and uh, you know, that's what I'm looking forward to.
53:07
Speaker 2: That's what I always look for in pages. It's just
53:10
Speaker 2: giving an author a chance in the world.
53:13
Speaker 4: Yeah, specific genres still, oh yes, yes, I think So
53:19
Speaker 4: are there specific genres? Can you remind us that you're
53:23
Speaker 4: that you're hoping to acquire?
53:25
Speaker 2: All right? So so you know I'm a little bit
53:27
Speaker 2: you know, uh uh, I have very uh discriminating taste.
53:33
Speaker 2: I love different things. I'm an out of the box
53:36
Speaker 2: acquisition editor. All right. So, uh but my favorite genres
53:41
Speaker 2: are horror, believe it or not, right, yeah, horror. One
53:46
Speaker 2: of the most successful books that I've acquired at Defina
53:51
Speaker 2: is a trilogy called Blood Slave The Blood Blood Saga,
53:56
Speaker 2: And the first book is called Blood Slaves. Uh. And
54:00
Speaker 2: this book is what really turned me into a horror fan,
54:03
Speaker 2: right and I and yeah, and it's it's a very
54:09
Speaker 2: interesting book because you know, we're all familiar with the
54:12
Speaker 2: Tale of the Vampire, right, you know the vampire originated
54:16
Speaker 2: in Europe, YadA, YadA, YadA. Right. But what made this
54:20
Speaker 2: book very not controversial, but very interesting and unique. It's
54:24
Speaker 2: written by a screenwriter and actor named Marcus Redmond. But
54:28
Speaker 2: what he did was he reimagined the vampire tale where
54:33
Speaker 2: the vampire actually originated in ancient Africa, okay, okay, And
54:42
Speaker 2: it was a clan of vampires who became extinct because
54:48
Speaker 2: you know, the the people they were, you know, drinking
54:52
Speaker 2: their blood, wasn't There was a plague infestation and that,
54:58
Speaker 2: you know, and so that that started killing off the
55:01
Speaker 2: klan of vampires until there was only one sole survivor
55:05
Speaker 2: who somehow survived that the different generations in different centuries
55:10
Speaker 2: and ended up in a slave plantation in north in
55:14
Speaker 2: Carolina in the year seventeen ten. He arrived at this plantation,
55:20
Speaker 2: he befriended slaves who were set up with being oppressed
55:25
Speaker 2: and set up with being slaves, and he starts turning
55:28
Speaker 2: them into vampires so that they create a rebellion against
55:34
Speaker 2: the plantation owners, right and so it's so it was
55:39
Speaker 2: a very interesting take. It's kind of like an alternative
55:43
Speaker 2: history spent to what would have happened if the slaves
55:46
Speaker 2: were able to emancipate themselves before the Civil War. Because
55:50
Speaker 2: they were, they became a plan of vampires, right and
55:55
Speaker 2: and it's so it's a very interesting concept. But it
55:59
Speaker 2: but the reason Marcus wrote the book was because he
56:02
Speaker 2: wrote it right after the murder of George Floyd. He
56:06
Speaker 2: was very upset, as many people were, and he said
56:10
Speaker 2: that one morning, you know, he woke up feeling just
56:13
Speaker 2: very angry, and his wife told him it wouldn't it
56:17
Speaker 2: be something if if you know, if if you could
56:21
Speaker 2: if the if black people go back in time and
56:25
Speaker 2: be because he was writing a vampire story, but it
56:27
Speaker 2: wasn't coming along for him. He says, whenn't if the
56:30
Speaker 2: vampires were if they were able to go back in
56:33
Speaker 2: time and fix everything from the very beginning, right So, so,
56:38
Speaker 2: you know, so in horror is a very very popular genre.
56:41
Speaker 2: More and more in prints, especially in prints of the
56:45
Speaker 2: Big Five, are very interested in horror. I also love
56:50
Speaker 2: speculative fiction. That's one of the more popular new genres
56:55
Speaker 2: is speculative fiction. Also magical realism, novels that have magical realism.
57:05
Speaker 2: Of course romanticy. Everybody knows how big Romanticy is right now.
57:10
Speaker 2: I still love historicals, I really do. I think there
57:14
Speaker 2: will always be a demand for historical I have the
57:17
Speaker 2: utmost respect for authors who write historical historical because not
57:23
Speaker 2: I don't think I think a lot a lot of
57:26
Speaker 2: people can write a story, but very few people can
57:28
Speaker 2: really write an evocative historical story. And I love historical
57:34
Speaker 2: novels that are based on real people and events.
57:36
Speaker 3: Yeah, Tisha, this has just been a fabulous interview. Thank
57:43
Speaker 3: you for doing this, and thank you for coming to
57:45
Speaker 3: writer Con. I think you're going to really plus this
57:49
Speaker 3: conference some thanks.
57:51
Speaker 4: Look forward to seeing you. Well.
57:53
Speaker 2: I'm a social butterfly, and so you know, to anybody
57:56
Speaker 2: the plans to attend, do not be afraid to approach nice.
58:01
Speaker 3: Okay, great, all right, thanks so much, see you soon.
58:05
Speaker 2: All right, thank you, and I look forward to meeting
58:08
Speaker 2: both of you at the conference.
58:09
Speaker 6: Yes, like okay, bye bye.
58:24
Speaker 3: Just one last reminder, the last one of this podcast, anyway, Rod.
58:29
Speaker 3: Writer Con is Labor Day weekend, September fourth through seven,
58:33
Speaker 3: Oklahoma City. Laura and I will be there, plus Jesse
58:37
Speaker 3: will be there, plus about sixty other writers, agents, publishers,
58:41
Speaker 3: and others in the publishing industry. And I really wish
58:44
Speaker 3: you'd be there too. So give some thought just for
58:49
Speaker 3: a moment or two, about joining us for writer Con.
58:52
Speaker 3: I think you'll be really glad that you did. Let
58:55
Speaker 3: me also remind you that writer Con has its own newsletter,
58:58
Speaker 3: and you don't want to miss the next issue. We
59:02
Speaker 3: have wonderful articles written by various authors and agents and
59:06
Speaker 3: the writer Con family on whatever the breaking issues are,
59:10
Speaker 3: and that is completely free. Go to substack search for
59:13
Speaker 3: writer Con. Have a Facebook group too, and if you
59:18
Speaker 3: haven't joined yet, please think about doing. That's totally free
59:22
Speaker 3: and I'll put a link in.
59:23
Speaker 1: The show notes.
59:23
Speaker 3: Okay, until next time, keep writing and remember you cannot
59:29
Speaker 3: fail if you refuse to quit. See you next time.