Latest / The Elevator Careers Podcast / From Elevator Mechanic to Elevator Consultant | Nick Montesano

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From Elevator Mechanic to Elevator Consultant | Nick Montesano · The Elevator Careers Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_05: It's what you want to put into it.
• 0:01
  SPEAKER_05: It's always there.
• 0:02
  SPEAKER_05: It's a service business like any other service business, but be intuitive, be curious.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_05: Uh how about be polite and eager to work.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_00: Sure.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_05: And there's no stopping you.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_05: It really is no stopping you.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_00: Hello, and welcome to the Elevator Careers Podcast, sponsored by the Allred Group.
• 0:21
  SPEAKER_00: I am your host, Matt Allred.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_00: In this podcast, we talk to the people whose lives and careers are dedicated to the vertical transportation industry.
• 0:30
  SPEAKER_00: To inform and share lessons learned, building upon the foundation of those who have gone before, to inspire the next generation of elevator careers.
• 0:38
  SPEAKER_00: Today our guests are next month now.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: Nick started at the Alpha MR elevator.
• 0:56
  SPEAKER_00: Nick Free 43 years of ensuring that the elevator industry and elevator professionals continue to be successful and well respected.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: Nick, welcome to the show.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, thank you.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: Appreciate the opportunity.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, no, I'm excited to uh to get to know you a little bit better, to to dig into your story.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_00: And the question I always like to start with is tell me how you got started in the elevator industry.
• 1:21
  SPEAKER_05: Well, that's that's a great one.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_05: Uh long history here.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_05: I'm 43, just about 43 years in the industry now.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_05: And uh, like many of uh many of the interviewers that you've had in the past, Matt, uh my dad was in the business, right?
• 1:34
  SPEAKER_05: Uh he was a Korean War vet.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_05: He came out of there.
• 1:37
  SPEAKER_05: He he had expertise in in drafting in high school back in those days.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_05: And that you know was a trade that a lot of people went into at that time.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_05: And uh one of his uncles in that lived in Manhattan said, hey, there's this company called you know Westinghouse looking for draftsmen.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_05: And hence he started in the industry drafting and eventually worked up to being uh one of the top uh professionals in the uh in the office for for Westinghouse uh in uh into his 50s.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_05: And then he saw uh an opportunity uh for consulting.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_05: I had started out of uh high school, right into the industry.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_05: I've always worked with my dad, working on people's houses, electrical, fixing small appliances.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_05: You know, back in the day, you people didn't throw everything away.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_05: It wasn't a throw, it was a fix.
• 2:22
  SPEAKER_05: No one sure, you know, no one had the money to throw stuff away.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_05: So I have been working with my hands since I was seven, eight years old, following him around when we wire up family members' houses and you know, really appreciate hands-on.
• 2:37
  SPEAKER_05: Uh then when I became a teenager, it was automobiles, you know, uh fixing up the third hand-me-down automobile I got from a family member and you know, working on cars in in high school.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_05: And so I knew, you know, I knew I I would be a tradesman.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_05: I the opportunity came to go to college, and uh at that time, uh anything else that interests me was probably accounting.
• 2:59
  SPEAKER_05: Uh but my father asked me, you know, he said, uh, I can't get you in Westinghouse, but do you want to come get into the elevator field?
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_05: And I said, you know what, I think I want to give it a shot and give it a try.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_05: And uh here I am then many years later.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_00: Very cool.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_00: So when you said a tradesman, were you in the union?
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_00: Were you a mechanic, or where where did you start exactly?
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_05: No, so I started, yeah.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_05: So I started uh I started with Millar Elevator in 1979.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_05: Uh they were the Manhattan leading independent at the time.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_05: Remember, the big uh OEMs had most of the share of the work in those days, the Otis and the Westinghouse.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_05: Uh so yeah, I started uh started with Millar.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_05: Matter of fact, the funny story is I went in for the interview, uh, took one of those basic mechanical tests and uh went into some senior vice president's office and he said, Okay, great.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_05: Uh you're hired.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_05: And I said, uh, well, when do you want me to start?
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_05: He goes, Well, you know, I'd start tomorrow.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_05: And I said, Tomorrow?
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_05: I'm not 18 then.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_05: You know, I had to, I was turning, I was eight, I was turning 18 in a week.
• 3:58
  SPEAKER_05: He goes, When are you 18?
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_05: I said, next month, you go see you next Monday.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_05: So that's uh right out of, you know, just uh legal, 18.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_05: And uh started, started showing up uh 40 Wall Street, Manhattan, famous building downtown, and uh started my career career there with uh elevator and and enjoyed it immensely.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: No, that's uh it's amazing.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_00: So started um started at 18, started, I mean, just kind of right out of the gate, and you were uh I assume a helper or apprentice?
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_00: What was the title?
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, I I was so green.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_05: I walked into 40 Wall and I was looking at the uh the building uh list of where the tenants are, and I'm looking up and down and one of the starters, uh uh old Irish gentleman, great guy, looked over.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_05: He, you know, back then there was at least two or three starters in the lobby, and he came over and he goes, uh he goes, What are you looking for?
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_05: Who are you looking for?
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_05: And I said, Malai, he goes, Oh, you'll never find them on there.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_05: He goes, Let me call the mechanic for you.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_05: And yeah, started as a helper.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_05: Uh back in that day, the industry, every mechanic that had a resident building, if you were in a building full-time, uh, you had a helper full-time.
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_05: And if you were a mechanic on a route, there was one helper split between two mechanics on a route.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_05: So, you know, half a week you were it with either mechanic.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_05: So uh there were a lot of helpers in the industry back then.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_05: I in the downtown area, there had to be 10 of us, you know.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_05: Sometimes it would, you know, reach up to 12.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_05: Um, Malar had a pretty good foothold in the city, particularly downtown in the financial area.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_05: So yeah, I started uh started the apprenticeship and uh haven't looked back.
• 5:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_00: How how long before you realized that that you had made the right choice career-wise?
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, well, I guess that's that's a tricky question because some of those days you think that through, right?
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_05: Wait a second, what am I doing here?
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_05: And and why am I putting up with this?
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_05: You know, things were different back then.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_05: I always enjoyed it right out of the gate.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_05: For a lot of the reasons I think people you've interviewed or continue to interview will tell you this this is there's a a real uh real freedom to this job, first of all, maybe not as a helper, but as you get into it as a mechanic, it's not like your boss is over your back every day and you're sitting at a desk and uh you know you're being monitored or anything that I enjoy that.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_05: And then I enjoyed the opportunity to work with my hands, and then I've worked for many of a great person in my years, and some not so great.
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_05: But I think I knew right out of the gate, once I got comfortable, you know, understanding what it was.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, the first couple of days I knew how to fix stuff.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_05: I didn't know elevators, but I could pick up a tool and know not to, you know, electrocute myself.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, but there was uh, you know, there were times there you had tough days, but I could tell you right out of the gate, I knew I wanted this and I wanted it to work.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_05: And I think that's important because you need that, right?
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_05: I think a lot of the successful people you've interviewed in the past, and I know for for over 40 years, you know, they want it to work.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_05: So you don't just bail the first time it's a difficult day or a difficult week or a difficult mechanic or a difficult, difficult supervisor, a difficult project.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 7:02
  SPEAKER_05: You know, and some days you question yourself on that.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_05: But yeah, I knew right away, and uh yeah, I was just lucky enough to to be blessed with with this industry.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: And I have been told that, yeah, those first year or two, or or maybe it's just six months, it just depends until you kind of uh earn some respect from the mechanics and hey, I'm I'm not going anywhere.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that that can be a bit of a challenge to kind of start out that way.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_05: Well, that's an understatement.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_05: They back, remember, I'm going back to 79, right, in the 80s.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_05: Uh they did a a third of what they did to us, then now they'd be in jail.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_05: So uh it's it's they they try, you know, they press you, right?
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_05: There's it's an initiation, sort of.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_05: Uh nothing crazy like uh, you know, a pledging or anything, but they want to they want to see they're they're trying to see who you are as a person.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_05: Sure.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_05: Are you right for the industry?
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, because two, there's a safety aspect right out of day one.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_05: Uh whether you're a helper, a mechanic, a mod, a new construction, right out of the gate, you're responsible for yourself and usually most of the people you're working around.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_05: So they're gonna push your limits.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_05: And I definitely had stories I could tell you if I don't think you have enough time.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_05: If you want three podcasts, I could do it.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_05: But uh yeah, there were times you get pushed, but yeah, it's at least, you know, it's what you put into it, right?
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_05: With any so when I showed up and I I I wanted to try it, and I got past the nervousness of getting to the city, meeting new people, high-rise buildings, all of that, I really, you know, made it made it an effort.
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_05: I wanted to do what was right.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, not that I was an angel all the time, no one is, but I would I would be the guy that would listen.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_05: I would be the guy taking notes.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_05: I would be the guy asking what else I could do.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_05: Sure, you know, and then once they saw that in you, uh I'm gonna tell you 99% of the mechanics would help you, train you, uh, want you to do well, uh, help you advance.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, they were really, really tight industry like that.
• 9:04
  SPEAKER_05: Once they know your part and willing to go the extra mile, uh, it's it it almost it almost becomes easy.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, I don't think so.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: You know, once once they can trust you and and know what you're about, and and and it goes back to the the stories I hear over and over and over that uh you know, I worked with so-and-so 30 years ago and I I called him up and he helped me walk through this thing.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_00: And and you know, the uh that level of camaraderie is something I haven't seen in other uh industries at all.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I haven't worked in every industry, but um touched a lot of them over the years.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so to uh to have that uh level of of relationships, I mean you you probably still have people uh 40, what you say, 43 years in the industry, you can probably call them up 40 years later and walk through an issue.
• 9:48
  SPEAKER_05: It's it's amazing.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_05: That's it, it's so true.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_05: It's so true.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_05: We and back then, remember, we had a a little bit of a luxury based on the amount of people that the elevator company would have in an area, right?
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_05: Things have changed because of financing and you know, the accountants looking at time and overhead.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_05: So it's it's not as flush with mechanics and helpers as it was, obviously, back in that day.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_05: But 100%, and it and that's comforting, right?
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_05: Because none of us are gonna know everything, and particularly technically.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_05: You know, some are gonna be better mechanically, some are gonna be better reading prints, uh handling solid state boards.
• 10:23
  SPEAKER_05: Uh I can tell you stories about that.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_05: So it's it was easy to pick up the phone.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, you had to actually go to a payphone in those days, right?
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_05: None of us, you know, we had beepers at one point, and that was like, oh my God, we got a beeper, you know.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_05: But yeah, they were all we were always there to help each other, you know.
• 10:39
  SPEAKER_05: There was always that one ass outcast guy who maybe didn't help you that much.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_05: So you you go to your other buddies first, you know.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_05: But when it came down to it, you really needed you, you always had someone there to help you.
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_05: And even as you said to this day, of of the group I still see for either certification classes or I know have retired but show up one or two days a month to help the elevator company they were with for you know 20 years uh with special projects, it's it's just like yesterday.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_05: You know, except their grandparents now, and you know, they got back, you know, their grandkids are getting married in some cases, you know.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_05: So it's it's really, and that's what's different.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_05: We've talked a little bit about this in the past.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_05: It's really what's different about this industry.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_05: You don't see that in other industries.
• 11:22
  SPEAKER_05: We, even though we're we have competition and we have competitors, it was a camaraderie, right?
• 11:27
  SPEAKER_05: We were there.
• 11:28
  SPEAKER_05: Uh yeah, there was some, you know, I'm this local, I'm that local, or I'm that company and that company, but a little bit that's just showmanship, you know.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_05: It's when it comes down to it, if we all met at a bar or met at a family outing or a retirement party, there'd be multi, multi people there from different companies at that retirement party because everybody keeps in touch.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_05: And everybody really just wants to see everyone else succeed.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 11:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I've seen that.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_00: I see that a lot.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_00: So um, so how long were you in the field?
• 12:00
  SPEAKER_00: You you started as a helper with Malar, and then what would what did that look like for you?
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, so that that was uh, you know, that was for me, it was great in the beginning.
• 12:09
  SPEAKER_05: Uh for a whole year, I was in uh 40 Wall Street as as the helper to one uh resident mechanic.
• 12:15
  SPEAKER_05: So I really got a lot of learning, a lot of hands-on there.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, you know, overtime was there too to help if they needed weekend work and doing freight car maintenance and that kind of stuff.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_05: So them the money was the money was good.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and then I then they I had to start going to the school, the union school.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and that union school was was fails in comparison to what they have now out there, bringing bringing new people in and training.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_05: It it's amazing what the unions are doing these days.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_05: And even some of the non-union shops on their educational program that are certified.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_05: Really, I mean, I was lucky some of the times if the teacher would show up, you know, and and that's tough because you had to do two days a week, sure, right?
• 12:55
  SPEAKER_05: For the four years, and you had to go, or in my case, it was still downtown, but it was somewhere in the village, and you know, getting there after a full day worth of work, you're not getting home then until 10 o'clock at night.
• 13:06
  SPEAKER_05: It's but that's what you do when you join an industry, right?
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_05: You commit to it.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_05: So eventually the teaching got better to school, the programs got more educational, and you got something out of it.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_05: That was about four years when I graduated, and then at just about at that time, they were ready, you know, they were talking about putting me up as a mechanic.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_05: And then the local I was in at the time, you didn't have to take a mechanics test.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_05: You had did your training kind of during the whole course of that apprenticeship program.
• 13:35
  SPEAKER_05: And uh then they came to me and said, hey, we're gonna put you out.
• 13:38
  SPEAKER_05: There were different levels of mechanic.
• 13:39
  SPEAKER_05: The first time you go out, you're a B mechanic, then you could be A.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_05: And then I think there was like a double A.
• 13:44
  SPEAKER_05: Uh so they put me out and uh they moved me into Midtown, uh you know, as a mechanic, because I had some, I had my other three years still downtown.
• 13:54
  SPEAKER_05: And then the fourth year I moved to Midtown, and they actually put me in another very beautiful, prestigious building, the Chrysler Building in Manhattan.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_05: Wow.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, and what was really interesting that I think that I hope some of the listeners would enjoy.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_05: At the time I went into that building, which had to be maybe 83 at the time, well, 80, 79, 81-ish, 82-ish.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_05: Uh it was the first building with computerized dispatching in the low rise motor room.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_05: And uh it was it was designed by John Pierre, who uh it was one of the leading industry uh with solid state dispatching, and there was the low rise motor room that had a tile floor down.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_05: Okay, it had dimmed lights.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_05: Dimmer switches weren't around back then for the normal household lighting, right?
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_05: They had a dimmer switch.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_05: We had to keep the lights dim.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_05: There were orange tile floors, and then the dispatcher was in its own room in the secondary level with a clear, a smoked plexiglass cover to the dispatcher, and all you saw were the little different dots lighting up, and there was where the modules used.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_05: And that was a big showcase for Malar to bring all these owners.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_05: Hey, we got the latest technology in comparison to even the big manufacturers, you know, or as equal.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_05: And uh, I was responsible to make sure that room was looking presentable if anyone was being walked through the door to see what the and it really looked pretty cool.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_05: It looked like something out of uh, you know, Star Wars at the time.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_05: And in addition to that, having the dispatching, and it was only in the low rise, the the solid state dispatching, the whole building had gone to GE value drives.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_05: Those were replacing motor generators.
• 15:34
  SPEAKER_05: I had replaced it prior to me getting there, and that was like the latest and greatest technology.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_05: And uh talking about handling solid state stuff, I had a great mechanic uh at in there, Danny Kirk, who was formerly with Otis.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_05: And uh he was the type of guy, once you once he trusted you, like we mentioned early, and he knew you were going to work hard, uh, he'd have you right next to him.
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_05: So as a helper, I was well trained in all the solid state components, including the drive units, where which were a little bit of a mystery back then.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_05: It wasn't like any real diagnostic, you had to have the meter at the right spot at the time it failed to try and eliminate the process of elimination for solid state boards.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_05: And you could think at that time what these boards cost.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_05: So we had them locked up in a cabinet in the protective, you know, we had to make sure we were static, safe, and all that.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_05: And I would have mechanics walking in because we were the depot for having those boards once they started to branch out and have be installed in more buildings, and they would come and say, I don't know, the light goes out on the big board in the middle, and I'm like, oh, that's the the MCC board, and I'll get you, you know, you got to check this, you know.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_05: And they're looking at me like, wait, you're a helper.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_05: You know, why are you telling me what to do?
• 16:44
  SPEAKER_05: You know, but then they appreciated because they had no idea what to do.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_05: And of course, back then boards had to be signed out and signed in, similar to now.
• 16:51
  SPEAKER_05: Uh so yeah, I really got great exposure working with great mechanics like like uh like uh Danny Kirk, and uh it was just amazing.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_05: So I had from there, they put me out in the Chrysler Kemp building, which was attached.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_05: So it was an older building on the back side instead of on Lex, it was on third, and uh I was a mechanic there, and I think I think I had like 15 units in it, old relay logic, uh Otis controllers with the pie plate selectors, and then I had a surge dispatching overlay.
• 17:25
  SPEAKER_05: And the weirdest thing is they put this overlay panel on top of the elevators.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: That's interesting.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_05: So I'm like, I don't know why, I don't know how.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_05: All I know is when I had walked in and a bank wasn't dispatching, I had to get on top of cars to press relays.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_05: So I don't know, not not one of the safety procedures you'd be allowed to do now, but uh yeah, really crazy industry.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_05: Interesting.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: So so you mentioned uh Danny, who were some of the the mentors that you that really put an impact on you?
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, uh Pat Kramer was was one of the early guys, and and Pat was a shop steward too at the time.
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_05: And uh he would be the type that he made sure every day we sit down for an hour and went over electrical prints.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_05: He'd also be the type having me save my own soup cans at home after eating soup, clean them, paint them black, and then paint the Malar emblem on them so we could hang them under the secondary sheds to catch the oil drips.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_05: So, you know, this was one extreme to the other, you know.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: That's impressive.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, very I still to this day, I I I've lost touch with Pat.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_05: I I heard he had obviously retired out.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, but yeah, he was the type.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_05: And the only funny story with him is we would never he'd always make sure if we got a call, he'd always think of the worst scenario.
• 18:40
  SPEAKER_05: Oh, the traveling cables must be short.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_05: I'm like, Pat, it's Friday at two o'clock.
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_05: Why do you wish that on us?
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_05: You know, you know, I'm single, I want to go home.
• 18:48
  SPEAKER_05: You know, you're married, you may want to stay here and try and troubleshoot an open traveling cable for the next six hours.
• 18:54
  SPEAKER_05: I would like to get home.
• 18:55
  SPEAKER_05: So he was great.
• 18:56
  SPEAKER_05: Danny Kirk, I mentioned, he was superior in solid state.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_05: Uh there were there were a bunch more that I just can't remember most of their names now.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, but even my local supervisor here when I was a helper, uh Tom Marino.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_05: There were two Merinos in in Malar.
• 19:12
  SPEAKER_05: One one was the expert on the Westinghouse side, the other was on everything else, and that was the Tom that was downtown.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_05: Uh he would hang out down in his uh, you know, shanty down at 20 Exchange Place.
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_05: And uh he just he was a sweetheart of a guy, you know, a little bit tougher boss when he had to be tough, but he knew he knew the industry, he knew what the helpers were going through.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, and then even to add to a funnier story, I've hired a bunch of these guys over the years to come work for me now.
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, Al Sauno was the assistant supervisor when I came.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_05: And I I must have been downtown for a week and a half, and I I get beep to go meet Al in front of 20 Exchange, and uh I knew who he was.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_05: He introduced himself.
• 19:53
  SPEAKER_05: This is how he introduced himself.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_05: I was cleaning secondary levels, and I was, you know, climbed up the ladder, got into the secondary.
• 20:00
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, and I was, you know, I believe the car I was working on was shut down, but you still had a walk, you know, you were crawling between cars, right?
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_05: The other cars were in.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_05: So all of a sudden I hear the door open to the secondary level, and I walk to the edge and I see Al and I say, Hello, sir.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_05: And he goes, hi.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_05: He goes, uh, how you doing?
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_05: You you know, you're being careful up there.
• 20:18
  SPEAKER_05: I said, Yes, I'm being careful.
• 20:19
  SPEAKER_05: You know, he goes, uh, you see that shiv, and there was a tape shiv on one of the cars earlier in front of the secondary, and it's going around, and Otis uses the solid tapes.
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_05: Okay, and those edges are sharp as razors.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_05: He goes, uh, you see that?
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_05: He goes, You touch that, you'll lose your fingers.
• 20:37
  SPEAKER_05: If you're lucky enough just to lose your fingers.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_05: So I said to him, I said, Al, I'll make sure I don't touch that.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_05: Get near it.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_05: Hence, he retires from the law.
• 20:47
  SPEAKER_05: I he comes to me part-time to be one of my inspectors.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and then he retires out from me.
• 20:54
  SPEAKER_05: So we had a retirement.
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_05: This is probably going back about a year and a half, yeah, about a year and a half or two years before COVID.
• 21:00
  SPEAKER_05: I said, uh, at his going away thing and in the restaurant, I had to put a group together from my company, plus some some of the old guys still around from Malar and a couple of other associates that knew Al for 30, 40 years.
• 21:14
  SPEAKER_05: And I said, Al, I can tell you I paid attention to you.
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_05: And I held all my fingers up.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_05: I still got them, Al.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_05: So thank you for that.
• 21:21
  SPEAKER_05: But he uh, you know, those are just those are the stories with great people.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_05: And that's how the industry was and still is to an extent.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_05: Unfortunately, there's not as much time alligated to anybody or anything now, which you kind of lose that time to, you know, really become close like that and really work as a team to make what's best for the job.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_05: And, you know, Malar was a great company.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_05: They treated you great and they expected a lot out of you.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_05: But you know what?
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_05: You were more than happy to do it.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_05: You know, they were the type of company.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_05: If you went above and beyond from them, they rewarded you financially.
• 21:53
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, they praised you.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, you know, and that's hard to say.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_05: Some people say no, Nick's full of it because no one praises anybody in L.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_05: But let me tell you, if you worked a water damage for them, besides putting the hours in an overtime, you got dinner, and then many times you were able to stay on the clock until the super got home from the job.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_05: So it was just basically giving you another hour for travel.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_02: Sure.
• 22:14
  SPEAKER_05: You know, and that's just as a thank you for you coming to do your job because they needed your help.
• 22:19
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_05: You know, so that's what a lot of us grasp in the industry: the friendships, the camaraderie, the fact that you were rewarded, besides being a you know, a very lucrative industry to start as a trade person to come in.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_00: Right, true, true.
• 22:35
  SPEAKER_00: So that's how you got your start.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_00: Sounds like you had some awesome mentors, you had some a great learning opportunity and to work at really a New York icon, you know, the Chrysler building.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_00: So how many years were you in the field before you uh moved to the next step?
• 22:50
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, so the next step was uh I was I was in the Chrysler building and uh my father had decided at 52 years old to give consulting a shot.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_05: And we'll we could go into that a little bit more detail in a minute because that was unusual at that time in 1982.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_05: And uh I had been helping him out on weekends and nights, you know, when he needed help.
• 23:12
  SPEAKER_05: But he was doing he was going out mostly to do the design and engineering of the building, the vertical systems for the new buildings and or modernizations.
• 23:20
  SPEAKER_05: And uh and I was in the Chrysler, and unfortunately, there was an incident on a freight car where someone got hurt, you know, and that's always, you know, that's the industry, right?
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_05: It's safety.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_05: There are there are unfortunately accidents.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_05: So uh, you know, it winded up unfortunately.
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_05: Some vandalism was done on an elevator, uh, a hallway with no lights, and this poor delivery guy winds up falling two floors down the shaft.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_05: So, you know, that always sets you back.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_05: You know, that's like that's that's you know, drama right there, right?
• 23:47
  SPEAKER_05: It's it's hard to to to go through something like that.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_05: And at that same time, my father had been picking up business.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_05: And he's like, you know, and I was already a mechanic about a year now.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_05: Uh and uh my father goes, Well, listen, what do you think?
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_05: Because if you're not interested, if you want to stay there, I understand.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_05: You want to stay with Malar and be a mechanic.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_05: If not, if you want to give this a try, but I got to make some decisions here because I'm getting a volume of business in that I need someone around totally full time.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_05: So with that, I said, Listen, if I'm gonna get aggravated over here at Malar, you know, and basically just through that accident on what happened, uh, no one's fault except whoever vandalized the doors to have an and no lighting in a hallway.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, I said, I might as well get aggravated with you.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_05: But when I said that, Matt, I'd had hair.
• 24:33
  SPEAKER_05: So if they, you know, 30 something march up for DAG, rest his soul now.
• 24:39
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, yeah, I lost those babies right away.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_05: Let me tell you.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_00: So uh so jumped out into consulting.
• 24:46
  SPEAKER_00: You you told me uh, and you kind of alluded it to it uh just a minute ago, that that that was unusual.
• 24:51
  SPEAKER_00: So you said your your dad had seen an opportunity in consulting.
• 24:54
  SPEAKER_00: What was the opportunity?
• 24:56
  SPEAKER_00: What was he looking at and saying, hey, this is where I need to go?
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_05: Well that's that's that's very interesting because he he it was his he was with Westinghouse, probably the third guy in the ladder at the New York office, which is their premier office around the country, right?
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_05: He had seen a lot of other managers and district VPs or EVPs come and go, and it would be an over and under if the guy's from Texas or if he's from uh you know uh whatever, the Carolina, you know, how long they would last.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_05: And and mostly non-New Yorkers don't usually last too long in senior executive positions, especially in a in a big company or a trade company, you know, a company like an elevator company.
• 25:33
  SPEAKER_05: So with that being said, he saw that the industry was changing.
• 25:37
  SPEAKER_05: See, years ago, West Thing House I noticed you had clients and you were fighting for the same pool of work, but it was always the high-end owners doing Rock Center, doing rebuilding or setting Third Avenue up.
• 25:49
  SPEAKER_05: So they would do all the preliminary work as a courtesy.
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_05: They would they would look at the architect drawings, they would tell you what their options would be for equipment, they'd possibly even do layout drawings.
• 25:59
  SPEAKER_05: And this is before they even have the job, just to try and get the job, right?
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_05: And then they would price it up and obviously network and try and get the owners to pick them over over their competition.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_05: And he saw that all of a sudden that kind of let's do above and beyond for the client was going away, particularly those upfront designs that they weren't making any money off of, right?
• 26:21
  SPEAKER_05: So he says, now this is the industry's changing.
• 26:23
  SPEAKER_05: How's an owner going to you know not know what he's buying ahead of time, you know, with an architect just giving him numbers and figuring so without real layouts?
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_05: So he thought there'd be a great opportunity to have layout drawings done by owners that are looking to build buildings through an architect or directly with ownership.
• 26:38
  SPEAKER_05: Most of his relations were directly with the owners.
• 26:41
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_05: So he went for it.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_05: And at the time he went for it, you know, there were like three or four engineering firms in Manhattan, big name engineering firms, that actually had elevated departments.
• 26:53
  SPEAKER_05: So they would have, you know, someone that retired out of Otis or someone younger that came over from Westinghouse, and they would be doing that for the as the architect and the engineer for the building.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_05: Um, but other than that, there were a handful of people like my dad that were doing it on home, maybe eight of them all together, you know, and some of the names you, you know, you're aware of.
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_05: Uh Van Dusan was out there.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_05: Uh Kaiak was out there, Cadmiani was out there.
• 27:18
  SPEAKER_05: Uh Walsh, Walsh came a little bit later, you know.
• 27:21
  SPEAKER_05: So I had said, you know, there was one time back in the early 80s, one of the big elevator independents had a Christmas party, and he invited some people to a very nice Italian place in Midtown, famous for real estate and tradespeople to go to.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_05: And uh he had three tables.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_05: Two tables were full with his employees.
• 27:42
  SPEAKER_05: The other table was him with just the other eight consultants.
• 27:47
  SPEAKER_05: Hence, 25 years later, another company growing, you know, another independent that's growing, host a party at a very famous uh venue, the 101 club, uh right next by Grand Central, and had 110 people there.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_05: So, you know, they it just I I always joke if it had stayed to those eight, you know, I I would have took this interview in person from my private jet, you know.
• 28:09
  SPEAKER_00: But it has a lot of people.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, the the the consultant, uh I guess consulting industry uh really has seemed to to grow a lot.
• 28:19
  SPEAKER_00: And I I mean I haven't seen it as long as you have, but obviously you're you're a witness of that from eight to a hundred plus.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_05: Yes, yes.
• 28:28
  SPEAKER_05: Well, and it was listen, in the beginning it was a rough road for us too.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_05: No one knew what to do with us, right?
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_05: Uh the owners thought it was great because they were there.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_05: We're we're their advocate.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_05: You know, we're protecting them.
• 28:39
  SPEAKER_05: We got the knowledge.
• 28:40
  SPEAKER_05: The my father had the reputation of being, you know, honest and and a fighter.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_05: And uh they loved it.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_05: They grasped right away, hey, this is this is something we need.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_05: You know, these investments are big investments, and they're long-term investments.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, sure.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_05: The elevators and the vertical transportation systems in the building.
• 28:56
  SPEAKER_05: And uh, but everybody else looked at those little little strange, right?
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: The uh the contractors think about you.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, that wasn't that wasn't easy.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, at times uh, you know, there might have been pretty close to fist fights, you know.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_05: And uh yeah, it wasn't easy.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_05: Uh they thought, well, what do we need them in our business?
• 29:16
  SPEAKER_05: You know, why are they so why are they the expert?
• 29:19
  SPEAKER_05: You know, it it was confrontational for a pretty long time there.
• 29:23
  SPEAKER_05: I would say a good uh I would say a good 15 years.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_00: Wow.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_00: That's a long, that's a long time to to kind of feel that uh, you know, the animosity, maybe they felt like you were a threat or that you were the watchdog and and they were gonna, you know.
• 29:37
  SPEAKER_05: Exactly.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_05: All of that, all of that, right?
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_05: We were a threat that we would call them the task, sure, right?
• 29:43
  SPEAKER_05: Uh we were the watchdog looking at things, making sure the owner got what he was entitled to.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_05: But then you know what, it all every industry kind of feels its way out, right?
• 29:51
  SPEAKER_05: So once they knew you were being truthful and honest and wanted the best for the client, then if they weren't happy with that, they were the wrong vendor.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 30:00
  SPEAKER_05: And now it's commonplace, and there's not a job really done in most of the cities that you don't have a consultant involved.
• 30:09
  SPEAKER_00: Right, right.
• 30:11
  SPEAKER_00: And so, yeah, obviously they understand your role, you understand theirs.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_00: And I I am curious, um, as as a consultant, it does seem like you you do walk a bit of a fine line between you know representing the owner and and not you know, not totally offending the uh the contractor, or maybe they're not the one right one for the job, but talk talk to me through that just a little bit of what's that like to, you know, is there a fine line and and what does that look like?
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, so I I'm gonna you know contribute this to my mentor, which is my dad, right?
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_05: Uh you know, you got to look in the mirror every morning.
• 30:45
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_05: When you shave, even if you don't shave, and once in a while, I'm not looking for my hair, but I'm looking for shaving, right?
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_05: And you got to be truthful to yourself.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_05: Sure.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_05: And it comes out in in your day-to-day operation.
• 30:58
  SPEAKER_05: It comes out with the people that you mentor and you hire.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_05: And that was the fine line, right?
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_05: I want to be fair.
• 31:05
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, I want to be able to sit in a meeting with my client next to me and the elevator company on the other side of the table and and do what's right uh and fair to both sides of the table.
• 31:16
  SPEAKER_05: Now, of course, I'm being paid by the client, so I'm always going to make sure I'm performing, but I'm not gonna take advantage of anybody.
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_05: My father trained me like that.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_05: I grew up that way as a kid.
• 31:26
  SPEAKER_05: It's just, you know, do I get mad?
• 31:28
  SPEAKER_05: Do I get frustrated?
• 31:29
  SPEAKER_05: You know, do we have to drop the hammer sometimes hard?
• 31:32
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, but if you could look at yourself in the mirror every day when you wake up, that's that's what he said.
• 31:37
  SPEAKER_05: And it is a fine line.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_05: And, you know, sometimes you lose an account over it, you know, where you're like, you know, none, you know, you're trying to take advantage of the guy.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_05: You know, he he doesn't owe you that.
• 31:47
  SPEAKER_05: Or, you know, I'm not asking for that.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_05: You know, it's not right to ask for that.
• 31:51
  SPEAKER_05: I always found the most successful jobs we have is when everybody works well together.
• 31:56
  SPEAKER_05: You want the elevator company to be on site doing what they're supposed to do, what they're getting paid for, but making the money they need to make to stay in a prosperous company, keep the company going.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_05: At the same same side, the other side of the coin, don't take advantage of the client.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_05: If it's not due to you and you owe it, then perform and do it.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 32:14
  SPEAKER_05: You know, and that's how we that's why I'm I'm blessed that my father trained.
• 32:18
  SPEAKER_05: Everybody that came in under him understood that philosophy.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_05: I've taken it.
• 32:22
  SPEAKER_05: Uh now I have my two sons in the business.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_05: So we're besides my sister who's my partner, uh, we're into third generation with with my two sons now.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, and there's other family members in uh from my my wife's uh my my sister's side, a son-in-law.
• 32:38
  SPEAKER_05: And at one point someone would say, Nick, do you hire, you know, I said, I first you got to be family, then I'll talk to you.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_05: You know, so yeah, it's a fine line, and I think I think the industry's come around and it's worked pretty well with it.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_05: And there's always, you know, people out there that you know, eventually their reputation if it's not if it's not proper to get caught up with, you know, or just you know, but it is very fine line.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 33:05
  SPEAKER_00: No, thank you for speaking to that.
• 33:07
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm curious, uh, you know, obviously you've you've been at it a while, you've seen a lot of change, a lot of evolution, you've seen all kinds of of things happen.
• 33:14
  SPEAKER_00: I'm curious what are some of the uh uh challenges or or issues you see facing uh maybe the industry or certain aspects of the industry as you look forward.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_05: Uh oh, I think personnel, uh number one.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, just first of all, we require certain credentials, certain licensing.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, those of us who have it are aging out.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_05: And and the fact that we, you know, the industry many years ago stopped flooding the contractors with helpers.
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_05: Now you got retiring out mechanics who, if they're still healthy enough for coming to maybe work for someone like me, either full-time or part-time, to do inspections if they have their credentials, but we're losing a whole generation there.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 34:00
  SPEAKER_05: And and we're not, you know, and I've talked to the other uh leads of industry associations, and we're not grasping that the old formula is not going to work at a point.
• 34:10
  SPEAKER_05: It's not gonna be someone that started as a helper, worked so many years at that, then did 20 something years or 30 years as a mechanic, and then goes to be, you know, the next inspectors for these required licensed inspectors.
• 34:23
  SPEAKER_05: We're missing that middle piece.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_05: So everything requires experience, but we almost have to look at how we how we could substitute that 30 years of experience with education and training.
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_05: Because in particularly in New York, with these some 83,000 devices that get inspected twice a year now, besides the municipalities doing what they do, right?
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_05: Where we don't have that next generation stepping up that are in there, even in let's let's call it 50s.
• 34:54
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_05: They're not coming into our end until you know late 50s, 60s, and older.
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_05: So how are we going to fold that crevice?
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_05: Never mind when you look as a vendor, if you have an elevator company, where are you finding these account reps?
• 35:08
  unknown: Right.
• 35:08
  SPEAKER_05: You know, never mind the supervisors you need to watch your guys or help your guys that maybe aren't the greatest troubleshooters, right?
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, years ago you had a super walked on your job once a week, and he was just there to make sure it was clean, make sure the cars ran well.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_05: You know, you were doing what you're supposed to.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_05: You are where you were supposed to be.
• 35:26
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 35:27
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, if I needed help, like we talked about earlier, I'd call El Sano, the assistant.
• 35:31
  SPEAKER_05: Hey, I'm jammed up on this electrical problem, I can't figure it out.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_05: He'd come over, you work on it.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_05: Those days are over.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_05: Everybody's running now.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_05: Running, running.
• 35:40
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, it's a great industry still to get into.
• 35:43
  SPEAKER_05: But even the account reps and even sometimes the managers of regions have had no real field experience.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_05: Very smart people, very well, you know, educated.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_05: But I can't have the same conversation I could have with them as I could have with a guy that spent 30 years in the field that's now in charge of monetization or in charge of repairs or in charge of maintenance.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_05: Because they obviously they can't relate to what I'm trying to tell them on more so the technical, and this is the way it works then, you know.
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 36:12
  SPEAKER_05: Not to take anything away from them.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_05: They're all well educated and all proper for that spot, with the exception of the industry's gone away from that history that when you were talking technical, you had to have lived it.
• 36:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_00: No, there's there's definitely that that tradition.
• 36:29
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but but like you say, it's uh it's kind of going away.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_00: And so uh it'll be interesting to see how some of those challenges are met.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_00: I and I you you talked about the the union is really stepping up with their training and even some of the um like the the elevator learning center that some of the the the non-union shops use.
• 36:47
  SPEAKER_00: I know that uh that they're doing a lot to try to fill that gap, but uh it feels like the gap's still there for sure.
• 36:54
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, there's you know, in my other office in Queens, uh I'm talking to you now from uh the Equitable Building, 120 Borough, a very historical building in uh in New York, very long history, great building, but the other office was uh a little residential.
• 37:10
  SPEAKER_05: We converted to uh when we moved out of the basement where we started the business.
• 37:14
  SPEAKER_05: So my dad started the business at the house.
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_05: Uh when we got to 14 people, my mother was like, Who are these strangers coming and going everything?
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_05: Better get out of here.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_00: 14's a lot to have in your basement.
• 37:24
  SPEAKER_05: And we expanded it.
• 37:25
  SPEAKER_05: We actually dug it out to even get more at one point.
• 37:28
  SPEAKER_05: Uh but with that being said, the union would call, I think it was local one for New York, the union would call, you know, an opportunity for applications, and they would start sleeping out two days ahead of time.
• 37:38
  SPEAKER_05: And they would circle the block because we had the block with the post office on it, and that's where they could pick up the application when it was time to, you know, whatever it was, 12, you know, 8 a.m.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_05: on let's say Monday, they would be lining up over the weekend to try.
• 37:51
  SPEAKER_05: So people want to be in this industry, they should.
• 37:54
  SPEAKER_05: It's a great industry, it's a great way to make a living.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, it's it's a it's a very uh lucrative one, too.
• 38:01
  SPEAKER_05: If you're willing to work, particularly if you're willing to do the overtime.
• 38:05
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, you know, people don't realize what, and and rightfully so, because of the talent you need electrically, mechanically, and keep yourself safe.
• 38:13
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, you know, there's there's money, you know, it's a it's a a good living, a very good living, besides annuities and everything else you could get.
• 38:21
  SPEAKER_05: Uh really is so so the people want it.
• 38:24
  SPEAKER_05: It's that I think we did it, the industry and probably corporate to a level, or the accounting trying to save money.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_05: When they eliminated that tradition of a helper always with someone, they really just eliminated their future mechanics.
• 38:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's true.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 38:40
  unknown: Yeah.
• 38:40
  SPEAKER_05: And that's one of the big ones.
• 38:42
  SPEAKER_05: And then, of course, there's supply chain.
• 38:44
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, you know, the these boards now, uh particularly what we've gone through, and you've all read it in the paper and heard in the news, this chip shortage.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, uh, you know, look at our I explain to uh non-technical people when I'm presenting to them or I'm part of their team for a mod or a new install.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_05: It's like you got to realize how many of you have a computer that's older than two years old?
• 39:06
  SPEAKER_05: You don't.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 39:07
  SPEAKER_05: I said, your elevators are the the leading computers in the world right now.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_05: We're what we're doing.
• 39:13
  SPEAKER_05: It's all so that you know, those boards, those chips, uh, the drive units, the components we need for drives.
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, their jobs that got delayed months now because they weren't available during this whole you know supply chain COVID thing.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, and that's you know, the industry's got to worry about that.
• 39:30
  SPEAKER_05: You know, but that also goes back to where we where we're getting all this stuff from, also.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_05: You know, I'm I'm a big believer we should be bringing some of that or a lot of that back back to our beautiful country.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_05: But with that being said, though those are the challenges too.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_05: And you know, you can't go to a you can't go to a client and say, well, you know what, we can't get this board, so you're three months late.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, what kind of you know, something put up with it because of COVID and they saw it happening and the ships couldn't get in download, but no one wants to hear that.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_05: Imagine you did a mod in a residential building, a one-car residential small building, had it walking up from what, three more months?
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_00: You don't want to be Yeah, no, that's tough.
• 40:08
  SPEAKER_00: That's tough for sure.
• 40:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um so, so um, Nick, we're we're kind of running out of time, but I was just curious.
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_00: I what the last question I want to ask you is what what's some advice you would give to to someone who's maybe just starting out their career new and and maybe they don't even know what they've bitten off.
• 40:23
  SPEAKER_00: What is this elevator industry?
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_00: They're just learning.
• 40:26
  SPEAKER_00: What would you say to them?
• 40:27
  SPEAKER_05: Uh run?
• 40:28
  SPEAKER_05: No, I'm only kidding.
• 40:31
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, you know, what's the old saying?
• 40:33
  SPEAKER_05: You know, the seven rule, like show up on time, right?
• 40:37
  SPEAKER_05: Be prepared.
• 40:38
  SPEAKER_05: In my day, prepared meant you had the pad, you had a pen, you had a rag on you.
• 40:43
  SPEAKER_05: Okay.
• 40:44
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 40:45
  SPEAKER_05: Be interested.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_05: Right.
• 40:47
  SPEAKER_05: I looked, I absorbed everything.
• 40:48
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, you know, I wanted to know how to change those solid state boards where everyone else, you know, would have been been interested.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_05: I I wanted that.
• 40:57
  SPEAKER_05: You got to be eager, you want to succeed.
• 40:59
  SPEAKER_05: It's gonna take some work, but it's a great, great industry.
• 41:03
  SPEAKER_05: You're gonna meet great people, you're gonna learn amazing things.
• 41:07
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, and there's it's perfectly you could full your whole career out and retire very successful, very comfortable financially, but it's all about the effort you want to put into it.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_05: And you see that, and you can kind of tell right away, particularly on more so the mechanical side, you know, if you want to go into the field, but also the opportunity, because you've interviewed other people that came out of school with degrees and then now have their own elevator companies.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_05: So it's what you want to put into it, it's always there.
• 41:38
  SPEAKER_05: It's a service business like any other service business, but be intuitive, be curious.
• 41:43
  SPEAKER_05: Uh, how about be polite and eager to work?
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_04: Sure.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_05: And there's no stopping you.
• 41:49
  SPEAKER_05: There really is no stopping you.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, me, God bless me, my father did what he did and it worked out with my mother's support and the other family members' support.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_05: And uh if you told me, you know, in my freshman year in high school if I'd be doing it, I'd say probably, but would I have known I'd be where I am today, thank God?
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_05: No, not at all.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_05: I'm no genius.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, a lot of people out there that listen to this podcast would agree to that comment.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_05: But what it is, is it's hard work and wanting to better yourself, better the industry.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_05: We all give back.
• 42:20
  SPEAKER_05: Everyone, I you could go down the list of people you interviewed and see what they give back, not only to our industry, but to charities.
• 42:27
  SPEAKER_05: We're we're a very charitable group of people, particularly the people that have worked hard to be successful.
• 42:34
  SPEAKER_05: And it, you know, people should say, oh, well, they own a bit they could do.
• 42:36
  SPEAKER_05: No, they don't have to do that.
• 42:38
  SPEAKER_05: We do that because we want to do it.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_05: You know, the Elevator Escalator Safety Foundation, our own foundation within our industry, to help, and believe it or not, to help children be cautious of what to do, how to do, how to ride an escalator.
• 42:50
  SPEAKER_05: I mean, all the elevator companies, all the retired elevator mechanics, they support that.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_05: It's a nonprofit.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_05: And if you ever did it, I've done it, but maybe Matt, if there's one that used to go on, we used to do classes in person.
• 43:02
  SPEAKER_05: When you see those two kids ask you the question in the hallway after the seminar saying, Did I ask, did you learn anything?
• 43:08
  SPEAKER_05: And the kid goes, Yes, I did.
• 43:09
  SPEAKER_05: And he grabs his little buddy's hand.
• 43:11
  SPEAKER_05: We have to hold hands in the hamrail when we get on the escalator.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_05: You know, and this is from a second grader.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_01: That's all right.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_05: You know, you'll you'll your heart just you know lights up.
• 43:19
  SPEAKER_05: Yeah, but that's our industry.
• 43:21
  SPEAKER_05: We give back, we give back.
• 43:23
  SPEAKER_05: We're part of the real estate industry, we participate in all of those events, but just be want to do it.
• 43:29
  SPEAKER_05: I guess it's a simple one-liner.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_05: You have to want to do it, and you will be successful.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_00: Beautiful.
• 43:35
  SPEAKER_00: That was a perfect, perfect.
• 43:37
  SPEAKER_00: Nick, thank you so much for your time.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for the the interview.
• 43:40
  SPEAKER_00: It's been a pleasure, and I wish you the best as you continue to to build your business and and uh keep people going up and down in New York.
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_05: Thank you.
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_05: I appreciate the time and for you reaching out.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_05: Thank you.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, bye-bye.
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you for listening to the Elevator Careers Podcast, sponsored by the All Red Group, a leader in elevator industry recruiting.
• 44:01
  SPEAKER_00: You can check us out online at elevatorcareers.net.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_00: Please subscribe, and until next time, stay safe.