Latest / Money to Give / Ep. 58 Why Nonprofit CEOs Must Embrace Philanthropy Leadership with Randall Hallett

Transcript

Ep. 58 Why Nonprofit CEOs Must Embrace Philanthropy Leadership with Randall Hallett · Money to Give

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: In a rapidly changing nonprofit landscape, leaders are being asked
• 0:04
  Speaker 1: to do more than manage operations. They're being asked to inspire,
• 0:09
  Speaker 1: to articulate vision, and to build authentic relationships that make
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: generosity possible. But many CEOs have never been trained to
• 0:17
  Speaker 1: lead through philanthropy, and that gap has real consequences for
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: mission and impact. Welcome to Money to Give with me
• 0:25
  Speaker 1: Rick Peck, the philanthropy guy. With over twenty years in
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: the nonprofit sector, I've seen hundreds of millions of dollars
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: transferred from donors to nonprofits. I have learned a lot
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: along the way that I want to help convey to you,
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: my loyal listeners. This podcast series, we talk about one
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: how nonprofits can most effectively showcase their mission and vision
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: and raise as much money as possible. Two how donors
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: and potential donors can make the greatest impact possible in
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: the world. And three how professional advisors, including philanthropic advisors,
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: can offer the most up to date information and services
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: their clients. So join us here each episode for more
• 1:02
  Speaker 1: of that giving feeling. Today, I'm joined by Randall Hallett,
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: a consultant, author, podcast host, and longtime leader in philanthropy
• 1:13
  Speaker 1: who helps organizations elevate their culture of giving through leadership, trust,
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  Speaker 1: and intentional partnership. Randall explains why many CEOs struggle to
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: engage in fundraising not out of disinterest, but because they've
• 1:27
  Speaker 1: never been equipped, encouraged, or supported to lead in that space.
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: We explore how vulnerability, vision and authentic storytelling can transform
• 1:37
  Speaker 1: leadership and how CEOs and chief philanthropy officers can work
• 1:42
  Speaker 1: together to build trust, inspire generosity, and lead organizations toward bold,
• 1:48
  Speaker 1: mission driven goals. Let's begin so, Randall, why do so
• 1:54
  Speaker 1: many CEOs fail to fully engage in philanthropic efforts despite
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: having advancement teams in place.
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: It's a great question, Rick, and one that industry wide
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: we need to be asking because we're dependent on that leadership.
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  Speaker 2: It's the quintessential part of any good organization. For profit,
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: nonprofit sports team, maybe it's a group of seventh graders.
• 2:19
  Speaker 2: Somebody's leading drives success in this area specifically, it's a
• 2:26
  Speaker 2: two prong challenger issue. The first is that many nonprofit organizations,
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: particularly those with alternative revenue streams, universities with tuition, healthcare
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: with reimbursements. There's lots of examples, in the nonprofit or
• 2:40
  Speaker 2: where they have revenue streams that aren't connected to philanthropy directly.
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  Speaker 2: The model over the last forty years has been they
• 2:49
  Speaker 2: can depend on that to not only survive, but thrive
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  Speaker 2: today's world. In the last five to ten years, the
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: economic climate of not only our country, but I'm lucky
• 2:59
  Speaker 2: enough to work clients around the world has changed and
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: those margins are tightening. So they've never had to think
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: about it from a strategic alignment perspective. In that same
• 3:10
  Speaker 2: vein most of our leaders in nonprofit space, university president,
• 3:14
  Speaker 2: hospital CEO could be a food provider, that's a executive director.
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: They've never, for the most part, been brought up through fullyanthropy.
• 3:27
  Speaker 2: It's just kind of handed to them eventually when they
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: become the ultimate leader. And I've researched this, I mean,
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  Speaker 2: it's something I'm kind of fascinated by. Higher ed maybe
• 3:38
  Speaker 2: the best example twenty five, thirty, maybe even fifty years ago,
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: public universities began to make this pivot towards philanthropy. They
• 3:46
  Speaker 2: do it better than most because they ran out of money.
• 3:50
  Speaker 2: I mean, the states began to say we're not going
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: to give you as much a tuition began to increase.
• 3:54
  Speaker 2: And that's a whole other conversation, not for us here today,
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  Speaker 2: but university presidents and deans. When you think about who
• 4:02
  Speaker 2: they're hiring in today's world, they aren't hiring the chemistry professor.
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: They're hiring a fundraiser. They're hiring a communicator, a strategist.
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  Speaker 2: Healthcare and others have really not pivoted yet. And as
• 4:15
  Speaker 2: a result, the people that are the CEOs have never
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: spent twenty thirty forty years in minor or even the
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: intermediate ways with philanthropy, and now they're thrust into this
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: leadership role. And then here comes the chief hilanthropy opsis, Hey,
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: I report to you, and they have no idea what
• 4:32
  Speaker 2: goes on in our sector. So the changing nature of
• 4:36
  Speaker 2: the economic financial world we live in, and then the
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  Speaker 2: fact that most haven't had to do this has positioned
• 4:42
  Speaker 2: us in a place where our CEOs are many are
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  Speaker 2: not equipped experienced maybe even curiosity, intellectual curiosity, having enough
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: of it to engage in a more meaningful way with
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  Speaker 2: what we actually need to move philanthropy forward to serve
• 4:58
  Speaker 2: our organizations.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it reminds me of the idea of
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  Speaker 1: like CEO as ambassador, and I guess as fundraiser, but
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  Speaker 1: as for lack of a better way to describe it,
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  Speaker 1: I mean, they're really selling the institution that they're in
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  Speaker 1: the best possible way and in the most positive manner.
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  Speaker 1: So I just feel that why would you not want
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  Speaker 1: to have somebody who is that person who makes you
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  Speaker 1: want to support the organization, helped it move forward, provide
• 5:29
  Speaker 1: that additional impact.
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  Speaker 3: Right, So I'll tell you a true story.
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  Speaker 2: This is actually the last month did a feasibility study.
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  Speaker 2: We're all familiar with what those generally are, and the
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  Speaker 2: one thing that came out of feasibility to say this
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  Speaker 2: is a twenty five year veteran of the organization and
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: incredibly well respected and thought of. The number one thing
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  Speaker 2: that came out was we don't see the CEO as often,
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: and particularly with the high level potential donors. There was
• 5:55
  Speaker 2: even indication I never hear of him or her keeping
• 5:59
  Speaker 2: it kind of cheer. And so I positioned this back
• 6:02
  Speaker 2: to the CEO and to the Chief philanthropy officer, saying,
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: here's what your people are telling me. I'm just the conduit.
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: And the CEO looked at me and said, I don't
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  Speaker 2: want to do that. And I said, do you want
• 6:15
  Speaker 2: the money because your best opportunities just told me they
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: want your engagement. And then in this case, the CEO
• 6:24
  Speaker 2: asked me. Some began to ask questions, why don't they
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  Speaker 2: just give it to our chief philanthropy officer, And I'm like,
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: because he doesn't spend the money, he's not there's a
• 6:34
  Speaker 2: disconnect here. And this was an embodiment in an anecdotal situation.
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  Speaker 2: But what I found more interesting in the same situation
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: was what Russell James, the professor Texas Tech, who kind
• 6:48
  Speaker 2: of is the leading academic writer in philanthropy. If you
• 6:51
  Speaker 2: don't follow him, you should. He does tremendous work, wrote
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  Speaker 2: an article about four or five years ago about nonprofit
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  Speaker 2: boards being more positioned in their own self view of
• 7:03
  Speaker 2: I'm here to support the CEO, not to manage and
• 7:06
  Speaker 2: oversee him or her. And I went crazy, like, no, no, no, no, no,
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  Speaker 2: CEOs come and go. The board is the ownership representation.
• 7:15
  Speaker 2: In my circumstance. I positioned this back to the board
• 7:18
  Speaker 2: chair and the executive companty, saying here's what the report said.
• 7:21
  Speaker 2: What do you think about this? And the board said, well,
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  Speaker 2: we don't want to push the CEO where he doesn't
• 7:25
  Speaker 2: or she doesn't want to go. And I said, but
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  Speaker 2: don't you own this doesn't see a work for you.
• 7:33
  Speaker 2: Your people are telling you they want to give you money,
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  Speaker 2: and what the missing component is is time with the
• 7:38
  Speaker 2: CEO about what the vision, the strategy, the ambassador that
• 7:41
  Speaker 2: you just said, and the CEO doesn't want to do it,
• 7:44
  Speaker 2: and the board doesn't want to push them. And I'm like, folks,
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  Speaker 2: this is why we have a challenge with leadership around
• 7:50
  Speaker 2: philanthropy because we're not embracing it. Part of its fear,
• 7:54
  Speaker 2: part of its lack of knowledge, part of its they
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  Speaker 2: think it's more complicated than it is. But what's not
• 7:59
  Speaker 2: optional is having leadership involved with our community to raise
• 8:05
  Speaker 2: philanthropy aspirations for the organizations that we need in our community.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, I mean it seems so obvious to you
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  Speaker 1: and me because we're in the field, right, But the
• 8:15
  Speaker 1: idea that I am a leader but not a fundraiser,
• 8:18
  Speaker 1: to me, they go hand in hand. And the reason
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: I say that is because you're talking about academia. One
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: of the best ambassadors for an organization I ever saw,
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: and he didn't last very long at Dartmouth College, but
• 8:31
  Speaker 1: he was President Jim Kim. He was so amazing. He
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: stood in front of an audience and I don't even
• 8:38
  Speaker 1: know if he was on script so to speak. He
• 8:40
  Speaker 1: just went out and you just wanted to buy from him.
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  Speaker 1: You just felt like, I just want to follow this guy.
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  Speaker 1: And one of the best examples of that, I thought
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: was there was a gentleman who at the time, he
• 8:51
  Speaker 1: was a class in nineteen twenty nine. He was a
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: classmate of former President John Sloan Dickey, so they were classmates,
• 8:58
  Speaker 1: and this guy, his name is Hal Ripley. He said,
• 9:02
  Speaker 1: I think that Jim Kim is going to be a
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  Speaker 1: better president than John Sloan Dickie, which was a pretty
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: strong statement from a classmate and from one of the
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  Speaker 1: most iconic presidents in Dartmouth's history. So but I felt
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  Speaker 1: like what he was doing, he was always making you inspired.
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  Speaker 1: He always made you want to follow him and follow
• 9:23
  Speaker 1: where they're going. And yeah, very much. So it's it's
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  Speaker 1: that type of thing, and I think that I'm just
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  Speaker 1: not sure sometimes when these CEOs are worried, it's like,
• 9:34
  Speaker 1: what do you think you would possibly say if this
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  Speaker 1: person wants to spend time with you, I mean to
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  Speaker 1: qualify not everybody should and deserves time with the CEO,
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  Speaker 1: because that would be impossible. The CEO could never be
• 9:47
  Speaker 1: with everybody all the time. However, strategically placed, it's the
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  Speaker 1: perfect touch point, and I have to believe that the
• 9:56
  Speaker 1: CEO's doing it well that person will walk away and go.
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  Speaker 1: That was actually a satisfying experience for me too. It
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  Speaker 1: wasn't just oh, I had to do this, but rather
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  Speaker 1: this kind of gives me energy and helps me understand
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  Speaker 1: what people like these potential donors or donors are looking for.
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  Speaker 3: Right.
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  Speaker 2: So, one of my two mentors, the first of my
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  Speaker 2: first mentor a Jesuit priest. He was a fundraisers. Fundraiser
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  Speaker 2: I used to say he was one of the best
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: fundraisers I ever met. When he wasn't in his clerics
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  Speaker 2: when he put the collar on, he was deadly. My
• 10:32
  Speaker 2: second mentor hired me in particular because I was young, aggressive,
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: probably pretty stupid to be honest, but unabashedly a promoter
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  Speaker 2: of philanthropy. And what he realized is that he did
• 10:49
  Speaker 2: not understand the depths for a large academic medical center.
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  Speaker 2: Of what his role was and what I so appreciated
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  Speaker 2: in him was is his willingness to let me teach him,
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  Speaker 2: and what he learned was exactly what you just said.
• 11:02
  Speaker 2: I would put him in front of people, small groups, individuals, couples,
• 11:05
  Speaker 2: larger groups, and he began to figure out that I
• 11:09
  Speaker 2: was never going to put him in front of someone
• 11:11
  Speaker 2: where the outcome was in doubt. He was going to
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: walk away looking like the hero, like he was in
• 11:17
  Speaker 2: a permanent state and of being angelic. He was always
• 11:21
  Speaker 2: wearing halo, and he goes, this is the best, most
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: fun part of my job. Nobody yells at me. Nobody
• 11:27
  Speaker 2: wants me to cut their budget. I don't have to
• 11:29
  Speaker 2: fire anybody. I don't have to make somebody mad. And
• 11:32
  Speaker 2: I said, that's the point and what we kind of
• 11:36
  Speaker 2: worked through over those years of raising that money. And
• 11:40
  Speaker 2: I certainly was involved. But he gets the credit, the
• 11:43
  Speaker 2: board got the credit, the donor got the credit. Nobody
• 11:45
  Speaker 2: cares who I am.
• 11:47
  Speaker 3: He said, this is so easy.
• 11:49
  Speaker 2: And I said, if you will listen to me about
• 11:51
  Speaker 2: the prep, stay away from the potholes in terms of
• 11:55
  Speaker 2: conversations where we kind of know we don't want to
• 11:57
  Speaker 2: go there. I don't even really want you to ask.
• 12:00
  Speaker 2: I just need you to set me up I'll take
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: care of the heavy lifting, and he walked out. When
• 12:06
  Speaker 2: we both left the medical center at this at the
• 12:09
  Speaker 2: same day, he walked out. He says, you made this easy,
• 12:13
  Speaker 2: and I said, you're very kind. Actually you made it
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: easy because you were vulnerable enough to let me teach you.
• 12:18
  Speaker 2: But to your point, there was never a moment where
• 12:21
  Speaker 2: he wasn't just talking about the organization and what we
• 12:24
  Speaker 2: were trying to do and why it was good for
• 12:26
  Speaker 2: the community, and how we were trying to promote something
• 12:29
  Speaker 2: health which is good for everybody, and how we would
• 12:32
  Speaker 2: be a resource for them, and that that resource could
• 12:35
  Speaker 2: be private. I eat in you individually, or I got
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: a company problem, Well he's not going to solve it,
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: but we got people who do that and we'd love
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: to We're a resource. Once he saw that, and once
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: you get past that, I wish more people, more CEOs
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: had vulnerability, because you're right. I think they would naturally
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: matriculate to it because it's the easiest thing they have
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: to do. Just talk about how great the organization is
• 12:58
  Speaker 2: and what it's trying to accompl and why we need
• 13:01
  Speaker 2: the community to be engaged with us. We'll take the
• 13:04
  Speaker 2: professionals will take it the rest of the way, right, Yeah,
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: don't create the ask, I'll do that piece.
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: Just promote right. Right.
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: Well, there's two things I'm thinking of as you're talking.
• 13:15
  Speaker 1: One is that you are you remind me that role
• 13:20
  Speaker 1: sometimes the chief development officer is like a or or
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: development officer in general is like the campaign manager. You
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: never see that person, but they're always making sure their
• 13:29
  Speaker 1: candidate looks good. They're making sure everybody really looks good
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: for all the right reasons. Right, they're the coordinator behind
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: the scenes, or they're they're the producer, or maybe they're
• 13:37
  Speaker 1: the director kind of thing. But I'm also thinking about
• 13:41
  Speaker 1: the fact that there isn't a time where people don't
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: care about leaders. That was one thing I really learned
• 13:47
  Speaker 1: back with Jim Kim is that I thought at the
• 13:51
  Speaker 1: time before Jim Kim, I thought, well, you know, an
• 13:54
  Speaker 1: organization runs pretty well and the president's really just a figurehead.
• 13:58
  Speaker 1: There's you know, I mean, really what is the president doing?
• 14:01
  Speaker 1: But sometimes it's all about who's leading, and so to
• 14:06
  Speaker 1: have that leader speak about the vision and where things
• 14:09
  Speaker 1: are going matters a lot to people. It's not just oh,
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: that person's just talking, but it's more like this person
• 14:16
  Speaker 1: will lead us into the next era, and what does
• 14:19
  Speaker 1: this person need from a financial standpoint to do that?
• 14:23
  Speaker 1: And that's what I learned is that that is a
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: very powerful thing. Never underestimate the power of an influential
• 14:32
  Speaker 1: leader or somebody who's in that role, because they can
• 14:35
  Speaker 1: literally move mountains. I was stunned in how powerful that
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: leadership was.
• 14:40
  Speaker 2: I think the other part of it is that there
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: needs to be a continuation even though we have interesting
• 14:46
  Speaker 2: I'm not saying calamitous, but interesting economic times. I think
• 14:50
  Speaker 2: there's a lot of unnerved contemplation about what might be
• 14:56
  Speaker 2: coming and what it all means. It happens in various
• 15:00
  Speaker 2: economic periods.
• 15:00
  Speaker 3: Of our existence.
• 15:02
  Speaker 2: But what I've also seen is not only do they
• 15:05
  Speaker 2: need to talk about and be that catalyst as you're
• 15:08
  Speaker 2: talking about for inspiration, they have to have inspiration. They
• 15:12
  Speaker 2: can't be paralyzed by the changes that are occurring. And
• 15:16
  Speaker 2: that is a concern I think that some nonprofits that
• 15:19
  Speaker 2: I have the privilege of working with. My grace concern
• 15:22
  Speaker 2: isn't their ability to communicate it. But well, we're just
• 15:26
  Speaker 2: trying to keep the doors open, And I'm like, you
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: can't keep your doors open if that's the only inspiration
• 15:31
  Speaker 2: and vision you have. What is it you want to
• 15:33
  Speaker 2: do that fits that mission? What is it that's possible
• 15:36
  Speaker 2: in terms of growing that mission as a strategy for implementation.
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: That only comes from the CEO and with the support
• 15:44
  Speaker 2: of an administrative or executive team. But we don't get
• 15:48
  Speaker 2: to do that, I mean, and that's what another one
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: of those understandings of how we need CEOs to be
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: engaged is we only can fundraised for what you imagine.
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: I don't run.
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: Look, I was the head of planthe being an incredibly
• 16:02
  Speaker 2: large academic medical center. I'm an overly educated person. I
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: didn't go to medical school. I didn't go to nursery school.
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: I have no idea other than how they draw blood,
• 16:12
  Speaker 2: how medicine works. So somebody over there has got to
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: tell me what we're trying to accomplish.
• 16:17
  Speaker 3: You could be a.
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: Small organizational, large organization. Your CEO has to be the
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: visionary with that board to say we're gonna keep moving forward.
• 16:25
  Speaker 2: They have to adjust. But not only is there the communication,
• 16:29
  Speaker 2: but it's actually the vision, the dream. What are we
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: trying to do that's kind of make our community a
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: better place?
• 16:35
  Speaker 1: It's so true, yep, I agree. So let's talk about that.
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: What would you say, just regarding what we've been talking
• 16:43
  Speaker 1: about CEOs and CDOs chief development officers, what does the
• 16:47
  Speaker 1: successful CEO CDO partnership look like? And how can that
• 16:51
  Speaker 1: model be replicated across various sectors. We've been talking about academia,
• 16:55
  Speaker 1: but just maybe some other sectors as well.
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: So the story that I used to when that question
• 17:02
  Speaker 2: is asked is it's a great one. Is maybe not
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: completely applicable everywhere, but the concept will be pretty evident.
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: When I was at the Academic Medical Center, we were
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: all required to go through kind of a professional development
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: process and succession planning and I sat down did mine,
• 17:18
  Speaker 2: and then the head of HR comes, who was not
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: at the senior level, and said, well, you didn't finish it.
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: I said, what are you, deb, What are you talking about?
• 17:27
  Speaker 2: And she says, what position would be aspirational for you
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: inside this organization.
• 17:30
  Speaker 3: I'm like none. She's like, but you have to have one.
• 17:34
  Speaker 2: I said, Deb, I need you to understand I will
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: never be the CEO of this organization. I report to
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: the CEO. I'm a member of a seven member executive cabinet.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: There is the only person above me is the CEO,
• 17:49
  Speaker 2: so the only position above me would be that. And
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: I'm not qualified nor aspirationally interested in being CEO of
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: an active medical center. The reason I tell that story
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: is is that once my boss figured out about our relationship,
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: that I didn't want his job, and it was as
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: blunt as in a closed door meeting where I looked
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: across the table and said, Glenn, I want you to
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: think about this. We have executive meetings twice a week,
• 18:12
  Speaker 2: two hours per week. Think about the people around that table.
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: There's only one that doesn't envision themselves in your chair
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: at some point, and you're sitting in a room with him.
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: I don't want your job all if you don't look good.
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: I failed.
• 18:29
  Speaker 2: And so the first thing is the contemplation of the
• 18:33
  Speaker 2: CEO understanding and our responsibility as chief philanthropy development officers
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: to help them understand our only job. Your campaign managers
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: are the perfect example. They're not running right. The first
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: part is is all we're there is to make them
• 18:47
  Speaker 2: look good. Trust number two is you have to learn
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: how to manage job. You have to bring concise messaging
• 18:56
  Speaker 2: that gets the CEO where they need to be in
• 18:59
  Speaker 2: a philanthropic way and realize they have other responsibilities, so
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: they're not going to spend one hundred percent on philanthropy,
• 19:06
  Speaker 2: So you have to be strategic as to what you're
• 19:09
  Speaker 2: asking of them. Third, you've got to give them metrics.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: Every CEO is used to dashboards in some way, shape
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: or form. You have to present regular, normalized dashboards of
• 19:20
  Speaker 2: accomplishment for the office. Here's what we do, here's what
• 19:24
  Speaker 2: and please everyone stop using cost to raise a dollar.
• 19:27
  Speaker 2: Nobody knows what the hell that is.
• 19:30
  Speaker 3: ROI.
• 19:31
  Speaker 2: Our return on investment in philanthropy is X. That's how
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: they value every other piece or part of the organization. Metrics,
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: how valuable we are. The last thing is the conversation
• 19:42
  Speaker 2: that I have with every boss I've ever tried to
• 19:46
  Speaker 2: work for and believe in when before I start, I
• 19:49
  Speaker 2: have one rule.
• 19:51
  Speaker 3: If you will allow.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: Me the privilege of being heard on issues that I'm
• 19:54
  Speaker 2: responsible for philanthropy in a closed door session, even if
• 19:58
  Speaker 2: you make another decision that is contrary to maybe some
• 20:01
  Speaker 2: recommendation I made, I will promise you I only have
• 20:04
  Speaker 2: two choices, not three, not six, not nine, not two
• 20:06
  Speaker 2: and a half, one or not and the other I
• 20:10
  Speaker 2: will either open that door and back you one thousand percent,
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: or I will resign h because that gets to the
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: essence of what a CEO's most looking for. Yeah, how
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: do I trust the people that I'm empowering to lead
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: certain sections, parts, departments, whatever you input of the organization.
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: And part of that is is they have to understand
• 20:31
  Speaker 2: I will never backstab you if it comes to that,
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: and we hope it never does. It never has for me,
• 20:36
  Speaker 2: I'll just resign, I'll go find another job. But I
• 20:39
  Speaker 2: will never undercut you. As long as you allow me
• 20:42
  Speaker 2: the privilege of sitting in your office and explaining how
• 20:46
  Speaker 2: that decision, this issue, whatever we're dealing with might be
• 20:49
  Speaker 2: affected by philanthropy, or that decision will affect philanthropy. I
• 20:54
  Speaker 2: will support you one hundred percent, or I will quietly
• 20:57
  Speaker 2: walk away and you'll never hear from me again. Yeah,
• 21:00
  Speaker 2: that's how you have to build that from the ground
• 21:02
  Speaker 2: up is trust, limited scope, details, metrics, and eventually unwavering
• 21:10
  Speaker 2: support until you have to walk away.
• 21:14
  Speaker 3: You do that, That's how you build a relationship.
• 21:16
  Speaker 1: That reminds me of a phrase. Have you ever heard
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: of manager's point of view? Yes? MPOV, Yeah, it's the
• 21:22
  Speaker 1: same idea. It's like I can argue with you in
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: a closed room, we can just be at each other's throats.
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: But as soon as I walk out of this room,
• 21:29
  Speaker 1: whatever's decided. That's what we're going to say. It's not
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: going to be Oh, I disagree publicly or even in
• 21:36
  Speaker 1: a hallway conversation. It's like, that's that's the that's how
• 21:40
  Speaker 1: we're going to perceive, we're going to that's the point
• 21:41
  Speaker 1: of view of management.
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: At this point, I'll give you something even more personal.
• 21:44
  Speaker 2: Anybody listening might understand even better. It is no different
• 21:48
  Speaker 2: than what we do. We're very blessed to have a
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: twelve and a year old and an eight year old.
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: What my wife and I do as parents, what we
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: talk about behind the closed door of the bedroom regarding
• 21:58
  Speaker 2: our kids will be between the two of us us,
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: but I will never undercut her as a mother, She
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: will never undercut. We are a unified We are one unit.
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: We are not two people. We are one to our kids.
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: But what happens behind that closed door, which usually means
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: I've gone too little or too far, and my wife's
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: gonna correct me because I work for her, we adjust quietly.
• 22:21
  Speaker 2: But it's the same principle because when people sense a
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: division human nature is not to take advantage of it,
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: but to use it to get what they want. And
• 22:32
  Speaker 2: so that's that unification process. It's no different than what
• 22:35
  Speaker 2: my wife and I did with Glenna. Inside the door.
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: We'll have manage point of view. We're going to talk
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: door opens. We're on the same page, period.
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, agreed. It's really just the most respectful way to be,
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: I think, with each other. And it's not a confusing message,
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: is it to the audience. It's a clear message. Nobody's
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: going to play one against the other. There's no open
• 22:57
  Speaker 1: discord about it. It's this is the way it is. Yeah,
• 23:00
  Speaker 1: that's super helpful. So I want to call back to
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: something you talked about before around a leader being vulnerable.
• 23:07
  Speaker 1: Tell me a little bit about what role storytelling or
• 23:10
  Speaker 1: vulnerability plays in a CEO's effectiveness with donors.
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: So it's a great question, and it's kind of the
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: premise of the book that I wrote and about this issue.
• 23:22
  Speaker 2: I wrote it through the lens of healthcare, but if
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: you read the book, it's applicable in any sector of
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: the nonprofit world. The book's called Vibrant Vulnerability, and I
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: wrote it from the storytelling perspective. When you read the
• 23:34
  Speaker 2: book about pulling things from Hollywood, pulling historical things. When
• 23:40
  Speaker 2: I think about what is the best way to teach people,
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: and maybe the premise, I always go to the lowest
• 23:48
  Speaker 2: common denominator, and that's my kids make complicated.
• 23:51
  Speaker 3: Kids don't understand right while were the rules we tell.
• 23:56
  Speaker 2: Good parenting to me is about telling stories about what
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: if might happen if they did that, or hey, this
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: is what I experienced or hey, your friend did this,
• 24:05
  Speaker 2: or how did you feel about that, where they can
• 24:08
  Speaker 2: kind of contextualize the application of the rule or the
• 24:12
  Speaker 2: issue or the challenge. So it's a wider perspective. I
• 24:15
  Speaker 2: think the same is true with how we engage our CEOs.
• 24:20
  Speaker 2: I think the critical element is not just storytelling, but
• 24:24
  Speaker 2: who's telling the story. All too often, particularly with our
• 24:31
  Speaker 2: hopeful growth in relationships with our chief executives that we
• 24:35
  Speaker 2: deal with, our voice gets tired. Sometimes we have to
• 24:39
  Speaker 2: bring in outside voices. This is why consultancy sometimes works
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: because as consultants, we know we probably are saying things
• 24:46
  Speaker 2: that were said internally, but all of a sudden, there's
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: a revelation and you can see the chief philanthropy ips go.
• 24:52
  Speaker 3: I've been talking about this for two years. It's a
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: different voice. The same thing is true.
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: I think a better than consultants, and I'm an advocate
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: for them because I am one. But sometimes getting donors
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: to tell the story, sometimes it's not us the fundraising people,
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: as much as it is the philanthropists. Where I've had
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: great opportunities for storytelling around bringing a philanthropist into a
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: room with the CEO and saying, I want you to
• 25:26
  Speaker 2: reiterate the conversation or you're part of the conversation you
• 25:30
  Speaker 2: had with me two weeks ago about your concerns, and
• 25:34
  Speaker 2: they're going to look right across the table and tell
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: the CEO that. Now.
• 25:36
  Speaker 3: My guess is I've had that conversation with the CEO.
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: So storytelling is about connection. It's about metaphorical or analytical connection,
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: tying it to something that they will better understand, particularly
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: since they don't understand and it drives me crazy. But
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: I see chie philanthropy officers. I want to talk to
• 25:54
  Speaker 2: my CEO about the moves management process. Why they don't
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: understand it. They don't care. They want to know where
• 26:01
  Speaker 2: they are in the relationship. They don't know what the stages,
• 26:06
  Speaker 2: So you have to make it relevant and storytelling can
• 26:09
  Speaker 2: do that in a way that will connect the things
• 26:12
  Speaker 2: they already understand. That's the metaphors that I use all
• 26:16
  Speaker 2: too often. I'm a storyteller ASoP. There's a reason Asop's
• 26:19
  Speaker 2: fables still live. It's because they connect us to lessons.
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: That's why it's so important. And that's what I write
• 26:26
  Speaker 2: about in the book in a myriad of different ways,
• 26:29
  Speaker 2: about how do you engage your CEO to bring them,
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: hopefully to a new level. And frankly, the book wasn't
• 26:35
  Speaker 2: written for us. It was written for the CEOs from
• 26:38
  Speaker 2: their perspective of the challenge, using those stories around Here's
• 26:43
  Speaker 2: what I've experienced, Here's what I've seen. Here's what you
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: can do so that you can begin your journey as
• 26:49
  Speaker 2: a CEO to lean in more to philanthropy and it's
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: value that will help your organization.
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: I think also, what I'm hearing you say around that
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: is by showing that you're human and vulnerable, and then
• 27:01
  Speaker 1: you have stories of success and maybe challenges that people
• 27:06
  Speaker 1: know that you have humility, they know that you are
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: introspective and when you go out there into the world,
• 27:13
  Speaker 1: you are looking at things from a lens of I
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: learned and I'm trying to apply what I learned versus
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: I'm not humble at all. I have a large ego.
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: I think I know everything. I'm just going to go
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: out and just tell you how it is. And I
• 27:28
  Speaker 1: would think that a lot of people wouldn't necessarily be
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: able to relate to that. And I would think that,
• 27:32
  Speaker 1: you know, back to storytelling, when you think about movies
• 27:34
  Speaker 1: or television, there's probably something that draws you in. When
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: you see the lead character or even the villain for
• 27:41
  Speaker 1: that matter, that's vulnerable. You say, oh, well, they're human,
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: or they're you know, they have a soft side here,
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: I have more empathy for them, or I'm actually I
• 27:51
  Speaker 1: care about both sides, both the hero and the villain here.
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: But I'm the point I guess I'm trying to make
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: is that if you're not showing that, and you're not
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: telling stories about things we've learned together, things I've learned
• 28:05
  Speaker 1: as a child, the things I've learned as a CEO,
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: that people won't necessarily be as engaged and therefore they
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: won't see you with somebody they want to follow.
• 28:16
  Speaker 2: My father and mother gave me such a wonderful upbringing.
• 28:22
  Speaker 2: One thing that to your point that they always preached
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: and now I harp on it with my children. People
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: will forget what you say, but they'll never forget how
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: they how you made them feel.
• 28:33
  Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, And.
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: That's that part of vulnerability. How do you, as a
• 28:39
  Speaker 2: leader open yourself up to learn or if we're trying
• 28:44
  Speaker 2: to if we're on the fullanthrough side, trying to help
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: our CEOs, how do we help them feel safe in
• 28:49
  Speaker 2: that vulnerability? And that comes from storytelling, that comes from trust,
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: that comes from and I always joke, but there's some
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: truth in it. I make more mistakes every day than
• 28:59
  Speaker 2: most people doing a month. The difference is I'll talk
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: about it, yeah, because my goal is not to make
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: the same mistake twice. Mistakes are part of life. And
• 29:09
  Speaker 2: if you can talk about them, talk about them in
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: a positive way, connect them to stories, the metaphors, you
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: open yourself up as a leader to not only allowing
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: people the opportunity and the privilege for you for them
• 29:22
  Speaker 2: to follow you, but also with the managing up, you
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: also give them the opportunity to build that relationship with you,
• 29:29
  Speaker 2: to trust you. Yes, And that's what the book's really
• 29:32
  Speaker 2: all about is and I talk about my mistakes like, man,
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: there were a million of them. I mean, there are
• 29:38
  Speaker 2: enough to write volumes of books. How do we use
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: them to our advantage to get to where we all
• 29:44
  Speaker 2: want to go?
• 29:45
  Speaker 3: Right?
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: It's like they say, you learn more from your mistakes
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: than you do from your successes. And by sharing your vulnerability,
• 29:52
  Speaker 1: sharing the fact that you've made mistakes or some might
• 29:56
  Speaker 1: call them not so much mistakes but steps toward success, right,
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: then that changes everything. And so I like the fact
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: that you're talking about it that way. And you know
• 30:08
  Speaker 1: myself too, I also with my kids. I was never
• 30:11
  Speaker 1: trying to show myself as invincible, just like, hey, guys,
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: I just want to tell you about something I did
• 30:16
  Speaker 1: when I was little and or this happened, and maybe
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: you can learn a lesson from it. And usually it
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: was a story about a mistake I made or something
• 30:24
  Speaker 1: I did that was dumb, and they go, all right, well,
• 30:27
  Speaker 1: he's just telling us. He's obviously trying to help us here,
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: he's not trying to show us. He's you know, never
• 30:33
  Speaker 1: done anything like that, and you know you shouldn't either,
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: and all that stuff.
• 30:36
  Speaker 3: So no, I think there's a lot of truth in that.
• 30:39
  Speaker 2: I think I'm a by design a very small consultancy,
• 30:43
  Speaker 2: I mean one person, so I can't get any smaller,
• 30:46
  Speaker 2: and that's by design. I managed large groups of people
• 30:49
  Speaker 2: for the first twenty six seven years of my career.
• 30:54
  Speaker 2: The thing I missed the most is the opportunity to lead.
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: Now I get my clients and but to your point,
• 31:01
  Speaker 2: the part that I miss leading is the vulnerability that
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: comes from finding common ground to help the organization go
• 31:07
  Speaker 2: or the department go where it needs to go. Number two,
• 31:10
  Speaker 2: to individually build a relationship with the team members that
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: is based upon trust. And number three, then to elevate them.
• 31:17
  Speaker 2: The better they do, the better I do. I don't
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: have that, and that's by choice. But to your point,
• 31:23
  Speaker 2: that's what leadership and CEOs are all about. The good
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: ones at least.
• 31:28
  Speaker 1: Right the good ones. And you know, when I think
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: of the best leaders, I mentioned Jim Kim, but I
• 31:33
  Speaker 1: think of some leaders who are actually pretty mild mannered,
• 31:37
  Speaker 1: almost introverted. There was still something about them that they
• 31:41
  Speaker 1: kind of drew you in. You know, I just feel
• 31:43
  Speaker 1: like this person is a good person. I feel like
• 31:45
  Speaker 1: they really have the best interest of the institution in mind,
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: and I just like them, and that goes a long way. Right,
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: versus I couldn't identify with that person. I thought he
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: was a jerk. I thought he just was cold to it.
• 32:00
  Speaker 2: She was talking to or she wasn't honest. They didn't,
• 32:03
  Speaker 2: they didn't, they didn't, they didn't.
• 32:04
  Speaker 3: Deal the deck fair.
• 32:06
  Speaker 2: People will leave jobs when they feel they're they're not valued,
• 32:09
  Speaker 2: or that they feel they're being lied to or misdirected,
• 32:13
  Speaker 2: or or there's a small misrepresentation. Just that's where you
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: I'm a sportsperson in terms of personal television habits. You
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: listen to any great let's say NFL coach or college
• 32:28
  Speaker 2: football coach. The best coaches are honest. They will look
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: at the second string quarterback and say, I do not
• 32:33
  Speaker 2: see you as the starter because this person does this, this,
• 32:37
  Speaker 2: and this better. Now, they may disagree with the assessment,
• 32:41
  Speaker 2: but there's no lying as to what the assessment is.
• 32:47
  Speaker 3: Most of the time.
• 32:48
  Speaker 2: Most of the time assessment is not that far off.
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: I think that's the only way you can lead to
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: say honest, like, hey, here it is. You cannot like it,
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: but these are the facts. Is the data. How do
• 32:59
  Speaker 2: we find a solution based upon this? And that's to
• 33:02
  Speaker 2: your point. People want to feel as if the relationships legitimate.
• 33:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and they and they understand how you're thinking as
• 33:11
  Speaker 1: a leader. When you when you talk things through like that,
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: you say, okay, I see how they think. And in fact,
• 33:16
  Speaker 1: when you think about you're talking about sports, some of
• 33:18
  Speaker 1: the best quotes of all time are from coaches who
• 33:21
  Speaker 1: are telling it like they see it right. They're they're
• 33:24
  Speaker 1: just saying, I've seen a lot of games and this
• 33:26
  Speaker 1: is the way I coached, and this is the way
• 33:28
  Speaker 1: I feel. And you just go, I love that quote
• 33:30
  Speaker 1: or I love you know, just you fall in love
• 33:32
  Speaker 1: with that coach because maybe they were a winning coach,
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: but more importantly, they felt like you felt like they
• 33:37
  Speaker 1: were just human and they got it and they knew
• 33:41
  Speaker 1: talent when they saw it, and obviously they knew how
• 33:43
  Speaker 1: to promote that, but they just their heart was in it.
• 33:46
  Speaker 1: And I think that's what you see. Even when you
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: see like major games like the super Bowl, you see
• 33:51
  Speaker 1: certain coaches you can tell all the team loves that coach.
• 33:54
  Speaker 1: Sometimes you could just feel it.
• 33:55
  Speaker 2: You know they're not and they're not the offensive genius
• 33:58
  Speaker 2: or the defense. I mean, that's where the evolution of
• 34:00
  Speaker 2: coaching has gone. If you look at the NBA, you
• 34:02
  Speaker 2: look at college, but it's leadership. It's no different than
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: healthcare or no different than universities. They are not content
• 34:08
  Speaker 2: experts in their particular area. They hire people to be.
• 34:13
  Speaker 2: There's an offensive coordinator, defensive coordinators, and offensive coaches, a
• 34:15
  Speaker 2: guy that coaches the out of bounds place. Because they're
• 34:18
  Speaker 2: managing people, they're managing vision, they're managing strategy, they're managing expectation,
• 34:23
  Speaker 2: they're setting a direction, and at the end of the day,
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: they're embracing all of those aspects. And we're back to
• 34:29
  Speaker 2: the whole. If a CEO in a nonprofit doesn't engage
• 34:33
  Speaker 2: in philanthropy, that's a hole that no one else can fill.
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: We can put their little dirty in as chiefhilanthropy officers,
• 34:43
  Speaker 2: foundation office, development office, advancement office, what do you call yourself?
• 34:47
  Speaker 2: The CEO is the embodiment of that. And there's all
• 34:51
  Speaker 2: of these parallels around leadership that I talk about in
• 34:53
  Speaker 2: the book that I talk about when I speak about
• 34:55
  Speaker 2: why we need them to engage in a more meaningful way.
• 34:59
  Speaker 2: And by the way, it's really not, as you said earlier,
• 35:01
  Speaker 2: not much more than they actually want to do in
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: the first place.
• 35:04
  Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, this is super insightful.
• 35:07
  Speaker 3: Randall.
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: I appreciate you coming on the program here, and so
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: just kind of wrap things up. How would people reach
• 35:13
  Speaker 1: out to you, connect with you because you you know,
• 35:18
  Speaker 1: you mentioned that book, and how would people be able
• 35:20
  Speaker 1: to buy that? How would they be able to you know,
• 35:22
  Speaker 1: learn more.
• 35:23
  Speaker 2: It's my great retirement package. I make no money when
• 35:26
  Speaker 2: person buys the book. You buy it at Amazon. I
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: self printed it. I think it's twelve dollars if you
• 35:31
  Speaker 2: do digital maybe five. I did it purposely. Vulnerability is
• 35:36
  Speaker 2: the name of the book because I want it out there.
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: I want people to read it. It's not going to
• 35:40
  Speaker 2: move the needle when it comes to the monetary needs
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: of the Hallett family.
• 35:45
  Speaker 3: It's just not going to happen. Number one. Number two.
• 35:48
  Speaker 2: I do my own podcast and a different than yours,
• 35:51
  Speaker 2: and that's what makes I think both great. Mine's a
• 35:54
  Speaker 2: twenty minute classroom.
• 35:55
  Speaker 3: Every week.
• 35:56
  Speaker 2: I pick one subject and the podcast is called Around
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: with Randall. One subject in the nonprofit world, that's a problem,
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: take it apart and within twenty minutes or so, what
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: are the tactical things you can do today to make
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: that problem work less?
• 36:13
  Speaker 3: Solve it?
• 36:15
  Speaker 2: The other thing I do right blogs at Hall at
• 36:17
  Speaker 2: philanthropy dot com two per week, some on you know,
• 36:21
  Speaker 2: personal things, some on what I see in the industry,
• 36:23
  Speaker 2: some of what I see coming down the pipeline in
• 36:25
  Speaker 2: terms of challenges. And then people can reach out to
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: me at the website, and you know, there's plenty of
• 36:32
  Speaker 2: places to do that. Frankly, kind of like a gift officer.
• 36:35
  Speaker 2: I think about what I do. Two thirds of the
• 36:38
  Speaker 2: people I speak with every day today is a great example.
• 36:40
  Speaker 2: With you, it's a privilege. Aren't about client of money.
• 36:43
  Speaker 2: It's about relationships. It's about making our world a better place.
• 36:47
  Speaker 2: And I tell people all the time, let's not forget
• 36:50
  Speaker 2: some of us stuck with a mother who made you
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: take Latin in high school. Philanthropy doesn't mean money. Philanthropy
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: means love of mankind, love of humankind. And if we
• 37:00
  Speaker 2: really love mankind and humankind, we should spend more time
• 37:05
  Speaker 2: talking with people and not at people. And when you
• 37:07
  Speaker 2: talk with them, that's the two thirds of where I'm
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: not making money, and that makes me very happy at
• 37:14
  Speaker 2: what I do. So there's lots of different ways people
• 37:15
  Speaker 2: can follow or track or reach out to me, and
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: I'm glad when anyone does. If I can be helpful.
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: Well, we appreciate the fact that you do show up
• 37:25
  Speaker 1: in all those different ways to really share and as
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: you say, show vulnerability yourself about all the mistakes you've
• 37:32
  Speaker 1: made and all the wisdom that you have to convey.
• 37:34
  Speaker 1: And so that is appreciated, and so thank you for
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: coming on. I invite you back again to maybe talk
• 37:39
  Speaker 1: a little bit more about vibrant vulnerability or anything else
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: that crosses your mind, because you are a wealth of
• 37:46
  Speaker 1: information and we appreciate that.
• 37:48
  Speaker 2: Well, thank you for what you're doing. Everybody who has
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: something that they can share makes the collective world a
• 37:53
  Speaker 2: better place. And I think we all can agree, no
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: matter where you stand in terms of where you live,
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: or what political persuasion, what your race is, your religion,
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: we need more collective gathering talking, working together to make
• 38:07
  Speaker 2: the world a better place. At the end of the day,
• 38:09
  Speaker 2: we all want the same thing, and that's to have
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: fun and to have a great place for our kids
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: and to see things be successful. And you're a part
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: of that as well, certainly with this podcast and the
• 38:19
  Speaker 2: work you do.
• 38:20
  Speaker 1: Thank you very much. I agree we all can contribute
• 38:23
  Speaker 1: something and make the world a better place. As you said,
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: so thank you very much, Randall, and we'll see you
• 38:30
  Speaker 1: next time.
• 38:30
  Speaker 3: Thanks Rick.
• 38:34
  Speaker 1: That wraps up today's conversation with Randall Hallett, and it
• 38:37
  Speaker 1: leaves us with an important reminder. Philanthropy doesn't flourish because
• 38:41
  Speaker 1: of tactics alone. It flourishes because of leaders who bring honesty, courage,
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: and humanity to the work. Here are three key takeaways
• 38:51
  Speaker 1: from our discussion. First, many nonprofit CEOs are not resistant
• 38:56
  Speaker 1: to philanthropy, they're unprepared for it. Training, encouragement and support
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: are essential. Second, a strong CEO CDO partnership is built
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: on trust, clarity, and shared commitment behind closed doors, honest
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: dialogue in public, unified leadership. And Third, vulnerability matters. Storytelling,
• 39:20
  Speaker 1: self reflection and openness helps leaders connect, inspire, and elevate
• 39:25
  Speaker 1: donor engagement in meaningful ways. Thanks for listening to Money
• 39:29
  Speaker 1: to Give. If this conversation resonated with you, please leave
• 39:33
  Speaker 1: a review on your preferred streaming platform, share it with
• 39:36
  Speaker 1: a friend or colleague, and most importantly, keep that giving
• 39:40
  Speaker 1: feeling going. We are now broadcasting in thirty seven countries
• 39:44
  Speaker 1: and growing with nearly ten thousand downloads to date. A reminder,
• 39:49
  Speaker 1: this podcast is meant to be for educational purposes only.
• 39:53
  Speaker 1: For specific advice related to your own situation, please consult
• 39:56
  Speaker 1: an attorney, financial advisor CPA, or other type of trusted consultant.
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: If you're looking for fresh insights on how to give smarter,
• 40:05
  Speaker 1: raise more money, and advise your clients in a more
• 40:08
  Speaker 1: informed way, please subscribe to my weekly newsletter, Charitable Giving
• 40:12
  Speaker 1: News For you. Register by going to my website, The
• 40:15
  Speaker 1: Philanthropy Guy dot com. In the newsletter, you'll also read
• 40:19
  Speaker 1: about many of our podcast guests, while also getting helpful
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: tips and advice for nonprofits, donors, and professional advisors. Meaningful
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: giving starts with meaningful connection, so please connect with me
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: Richard Peck on LinkedIn as well. Until next time, let's
• 40:36
  Speaker 1: keep making a difference together.