Latest / Coconut Justice / CJP #41: Dr. Nancy Dome

Transcript

CJP #41: Dr. Nancy Dome · Coconut Justice

• Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hey, what's good? Dr. Nancy Dome is a renowned speaker, author, coach, and in 2014 she co-founded Epic Education to provide leaders in education and business with accessible professional development to support equity efforts in pursuit of greater diversity, inclusion, and belonging. This is my conversation with Dr. Nancy Dome. Before we get into it, Hey everybody, because of all of this stuff that's happening out in the world today, I wanted to introduce you to one of the people that always brings me peace through knowledge and love. You guys, please meet Dr. Nancy Dome. Dr Nancy Dome: Hey there, thanks for having me. it's good to see you too. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hi. It's good to see you again. So to let everyone know, up front, Nancy and I met in Sonoma. We've shared offices and we've worked together and we've done all the things. But ⁓ Nancy works ⁓ ⁓ or she's the creator of Epoch Education and I'm going to let her describe what Epoch is. Remember to go to coconutjustice.com to get you some clothes that I think would look good on you. Let's go. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Yeah, so let's see, it's been 11 years, you can believe that, Carlos. And it started off as an education consultancy supporting ⁓ education through looking at like DEIB issues, like diversity, equity, inclusion, belonging. ⁓ And I think it's... As it evolved probably around year five, part of my ⁓ work as a professor was to ⁓ do research. so I developed a protocol, a communications protocol, which really fit into the work we were doing. And I realized ⁓ actually had more implications as the foundation of all the work that we do. So somewhere around 2020, I shifted gears to be more around communication, effective communication, skill development. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. ⁓ cool. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: Like, that's great, but I don't know how to go about it. Well, you the first thing is how do we communicate? And that means that we have to have a certain level of understanding and self-reflection and self-regulation to be effective. So Epoch has had, you know, these iterations in our year where now work ⁓ in and education, ⁓ focused developing communication skills to ⁓ shore up ⁓ issues that they have around climate culture builds. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): How much pushback have you had? Well, how much pushback to DEI did you have when you first started it compared to like when the current presidency took over? Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ When I first started, there was very little pushback. The pushback was more on an individual basis, like people who didn't understand why they had to do this work. But a lot of it was prescribed. People had professional development dollars they had to spend. They had ⁓ equity initiatives in their institutions. So if you worked in that institution, you didn't really have a choice. So the resistance was really at a more individual level. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): you Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: I will say that while it was not part of our design, when we made that shift to more of a communications company, it actually served us pretty well because the work that we're doing now is about compassionate dialogue and even the most like. extreme person is gonna, you're gonna be kind of an ass if you're pushing against compassion. Like I'm really trying to figure out how to build bridges. I really am about connecting. And I do understand though, and what the protocol shows us is that... Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: know, repair doesn't always mean a happy ending. Repair sometimes means we need to get up out of here. know, repair, and so I think that we've been positioned in a really, you know, kind of sweet spot right now to be part of a solution, right? Like of how to mend some of these fences or how to... Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dr Nancy Dome: to tear them down, but do them from a place of full knowledge, right? If we're gonna do it, it's not gonna be reactionary. Right, right. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): If we're gonna rebuild might as well, yeah. I've tried to explain to people. ⁓ I run in groups ⁓ that would rather remain silent, but ⁓ talking to those folks about DEI and why we need DEI. I am a, I've been trying to explain to them. It's, it's, it's not, you know, it's not the extreme that everyone is thinking about. Like it's not that we're asking for furries to be able to eat off the floor at work. That's not what we're doing. For me, it's, for me, it's, we found out that these corporations are exporting jobs and the few that are left. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): going to a certain group. Dr Nancy Dome: Demographic, yep. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Along your studies, can you prove to people that I'm not lying? Dr Nancy Dome: You know what, I mean, yes, and they can prove it to themselves. You know, the thing is, if they want the answers, they can find them, right? And so, you know, we're in this kind of news cycle right now that just keeps feeding you more of the same. And people aren't really looking for truth. They're looking for validation. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And so that's kind of got to be the biggest shift is that we have to become seekers of truth, even if that truth is contrary to what we believed, even if that truth is difficult to, you know, to digest until we're honestly in pursuit of truth, we're going to continue to be where we are right now. mean, and truth looks like, I mean, there's some truths that I'm like, you 100 % happy with, but it's still the truth. So I'm not going to deny it because I don't like it, right? I'm going to embrace it and like figure out if I don't like it, how do I shift it? Right. But so, you know, the, but the one of the larger things, and I'm curious to see what you think. And I should try to find it. It was, it was an interview that Trevor Noah did. I got to remember her name and I'm ashamed that I can't think of it, but I will know it by the end of it. And it was, it was kind of like, it was a title like the death of DEI or something like that and and she really made it it was the first time I'd really thought about it because I've been so raised in this water of fighting for equity. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: But she was like, we knew this was going to go. So I've never been, the work doesn't stop. We knew right now, everybody was on this pendulum and the pendulum was going to swing back. And so our work continues. And I really appreciated that lens. Our work continues and maybe part of, and this will be up for some debate, but maybe part of Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hahaha Dr Nancy Dome: The issue we have is that we've made it an initiative instead of trying to make it a part of how we do business, right? It needs like, if there was equity, we wouldn't need DEIB. If systems were more just. those things wouldn't need to exist. So is our goal to keep putting a bandaid over it or is our goal really to dismantle kind of the master's house, right? That's Audra Lord's work and say, hey, let's rebuild in a way that sees all of us. And I find, you maybe it's just cause my butt is getting old. I find that I'm more interested in, instead of putting a bandaid in like dismantling. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. That's that's now that I'm talking to more politicians, more grassroots politicians. I'm learning more about both parties and I'm learning, but I'm getting a peek, just a peek behind the curtain. And let me tell you, no me gusta. I am I am I'm there and we're starting to see people that are like the way we're doing this doesn't work. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Good luck. It doesn't work. And I think that, know, ⁓ hindsight, what I think was harmful to the work, you know, I wrote this article, gosh, it's been like 20 years. In fact, I think maybe not 20, but I think we were sharing an office when I wrote this article and it was titled like White Privilege versus White Opportunity. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: Right? And because we were getting, there was so much pushback on white privilege and people, white folks just couldn't get past. I don't have privilege. I grew up poor. I worked for everything I have, you that whole narrative. And without understanding that. It was never about what you had. It's about opportunity. And I was like, maybe that misnomer is part of our thing. It's like, it's this white opportunity. You have opportunities and you cannot deny it that exists to you. It's that because of your skin color, you know, but calling it privilege, people have this definition about privilege in their head. And so they struggled with this. And so I wrote this article years ago about white opportunity. And can we get behind the fact that you have opportunity? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: Can you acknowledge that some things are easier, not all things, but some things can be easier, you know, and have that conversation. I wonder how much the language has hurt us in this pursuit for people who are, and I'm not talking about extremes. I'm talking about people who are kind of in the middle there, who kind of, who can look at what's happening right now and have feelings about it and know that it's not right, but also not sure what is right, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Right. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: And I think we lost those people ⁓ in some of work we did. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): The same thing happens. Same thing happened with the climate. We if we would have came out and said climate change, we like I was a scientist, like I had something to say about it. But when they first came out with global warming and it was blizzard, it was a blizzard in Chicago. Everyone's like, what? It's whereas if you would have come out with climate change because. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Hmm Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, unfortunately, when you're doing the work and you're doing the research, you do need marketing to break things down to the normal people. So you can consume that information however it is that you consume it. But the fact still remains, there's a problem. Whatever you name it, we can call it lollipops and rainbows if it makes it better. Dr Nancy Dome: you ⁓ lollipops and rainbows. Hey, but I think that to your point, I think that that language matters, right? And I think that as we think about how to move forward, trying to figure out that language that folks can get behind, right? So not maybe as soft as lollipops and rainbows, but also something that Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: that people can hold onto, right? mean, because there's also this, I think this, not a belief, it's like, well, like they just need to figure it out. They just need to get on board, but they're not, right? And so what is our responsibility to invite people in? And it is, you know, there's people who think that my approach is weak. you know, sauce, because it's not hard enough that like I'm too, you know, if white people like your work, then there's something wrong with your work, you know, and, know, you know, I... Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Meanwhile, if your work is too hard, they're not accepting it. And so who wins? Dr Nancy Dome: They're not exactly. And I've been in both of those environments. I've been in the environment where, you know, the presenters came out swinging, you know, and if you're not ready, get out the room, you know, and works for me because I always got it. Like that approach does not bother me, but we're losing ⁓ the support. We're losing all the allies. And if we make it so ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dr Nancy Dome: Savory for them then not only will we lose them in our support? But they actually end up moving to the other side and become the people against you right and so I think it is a fine line and you know my job I don't want anybody in my training. I think about Everyone should have some level of discomfort Otherwise, I'm not doing my job But my goal is not that you walk out feeling shame or feeling belittled or feeling. marginalized in any way. That is not my goal. That doesn't serve anybody. It doesn't serve me when someone makes me feel that way and it's not going to serve you. And if I think about how would I like to be treated and I do that and that's what I put out into the world, that's what I tend to get back. so, ⁓ you know, haters are going to hate. Everybody, there's room for all of us to do this work. There's so much work to be done. Not just one way is the right way. I think that that's also part of the narrative is that we need to understand that people may not resonate with me, so maybe they'll resonate with you or maybe they'll resonate with somebody else, but all of us gotta keep doing the work. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I reflect when I'm hearing things like this. I reflect to where I am. Sonoma, if you don't know Sonoma is very white and brown. When I see black people in the street, I get so excited. ⁓ I'm almost anti-racist. I get so excited. I'm like, hey, let me show you all the spots. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Literally, Eric and I are mad at each other. Bye bye! Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Don't leave me. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, no, I know, I know, I know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): But I get the opportunity to talk to some of my neighbors and some people out on the square and whatever. And they talk about, ⁓ if you only kept your hands where they can see them and keep your hands on 10 and two when the cops are there. And I'm like, you understand. We know each other. I have had my hand. You know I'm not a troublemaker. I have had my hands where they needed to be and I still got pulled out of the car. Dr Nancy Dome: Okay. Mm-hmm. Yep. Yep. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I drove the proper speed limit and because I made that left hand turn, I got pulled over. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And even now, I'm starting to get these folks that are like, ⁓ this ICE stuff is so new. They've never, I'm like, are you kidding me? My childhood was riddled. I was tired of seeing black and brown people getting jacked up by cops. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I thought that was it. I was like, yeah, for the rest of my life, I'm gonna be getting this. Dr Nancy Dome: This? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, people, think they, I don't think that those thoughts or comments come from a bad place. I think they come from a very naive place, right? I think they come from a place that says if, know, because we've been told, even though it's never been true, especially for us, this society tells this message that if you follow the rules, you'll be okay. So obviously if I'm not okay, I'm not following the rules. That is the jump in logic, right? But we know as black and brown people navigating largely white spaces that it doesn't matter if we're following the rules. That if we're in the wrong place at the wrong time, there's gonna be a problem. And ⁓ I remember one of my first times when I moved up to Sonoma, ⁓ I literally got followed from... ⁓ ⁓ my gosh, what's the name of the, I don't know why I'm blanking on the area. ⁓ I got followed from where I lived all the way into the square by a cop who made an illegal U-turn on highway 12 to get behind me. And when I pulled into that little, you know, the Starling bar, was meeting, and funny enough, I was meeting, you know, someone in the city business, you know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. ⁓ yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And I stood at the door, I'm like, what you gonna do? Like literally, like you have just followed me for like six miles and I can't go any faster. And I just stared at him because I was a black face, you know, here. And I walked in and I'm like, your people out there following me, you know? And we ended up, you know, taking it to the, you know, the police chief and having a conversation because I'm like, this is ridiculous. Like, and it's intimidating. And if I knew that I was a meeting, you Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: Bob and if I knew if I didn't have the confidence that I have, you know, that shit is crazy. It's scary to have someone, a cop follow you as a black or brown person in this country because you don't know what's going to happen next. Right. And I'm by myself. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah, yeah, right. Dr Nancy Dome: There's no one there. So yeah, mean, that stuff is real. That stuff and people are like, ⁓ but that, you know, like it's a one-off and I'm like, don't minimize what I'm saying. I'm telling you that this is not a one-off. Have you been in jail? I have, you know, basically being black with a white boyfriend, you know, in the wrong place at the wrong time in Arizona. like, it's, so can we suspend any doubt and really just be curious? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. Dr Nancy Dome: And when someone tells you something like that, seek to understand what their experience is instead of trying to tell me what my experience is, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And then don't even think that it's just the cops. I got to, I have a really wonderful story. I was riding my bike and this is back when I had a job. This is when I was getting paid. So, you know, I was looking good. Have my little helmet on, have my, hello, you better tell them. You better tell them. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yeah. You're always looking good though. So, hello. I'm tellin' they, they don't know, but I know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): So on my bike, I was in an obviously residential area. And this lady pulls me over. She was in a Jeep. And she like weighs me down. So I like I thought maybe she was lost. Yeah. I was like, what's going on? You lost? She goes, do you work around here? Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm. thought this is like maybe she need help, right? Yeah Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I was like, what? I was like, nah, you, I'm over there in the big house. You should come over sometime. Yeah, I'm on top of the hill. I just got done coming down, your house is cute, bitch. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. On top of the hill. I looked down at your ghost. ⁓ Lord of Mercy. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And it's those things, you know, like I have another story where and it's again, I that's why I always I take things as I try to accept things as humor or just plain lack of understanding, right? How are you going to how if if if this this didn't happen with anyone that you know, but how is it that you're going to bring your boyfriend Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): a Cuban dude to your family's house and they decide to serve taco salad. Dr Nancy Dome: You Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Now I gotta sit here for two hours explaining to you the difference between a Cuban and a Mexican. That's my life. That's my life. My life is a sitcom. No, laugh. Laugh, because it's hilarious. Dr Nancy Dome: I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. No, it's funny. It'd be like someone serving me up some fried chicken and watermelon, my ass a vegetarian. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ my God, ⁓ my God, I'm sorry. just, it just, it just, I think, you know, I think, I think what you're hitting on is one point that I think people miss is that we gotta have some humor in this. Cause if not, if you can't laugh at it, then you're gonna cry, right? It's because it is that fine line, right? There is that fine line that it's like, I gotta laugh at this. I gotta, I gotta, because I can't, I can't carry all of it. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Listen, listen. Mm-hmm. Right. And I don't want to, I don't want to live my life that way. And if you make me feel that way, I will leave. That goes back to that confidence you were talking about earlier. Dr Nancy Dome: And laughter is a really beautiful release. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Like don't, I am, and I say this to the politicians that I talk to now, I've done everything you told me to. I went and I got an education. I served the country. I got degrees. I worked real hard only to come up to Silicon Valley and I find out that these knuckleheads are giving away all the jobs. And I did everything you said. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah. That's right. Yeah. And that's, you know, that's what we start to see this hierarchy to because, you know, the irony about this is that this is a narrative for a lot of people of color, but it's also a narrative for white. folks now, but they don't what to do with it now. Because before there was always a space for all of them, right? For most of them. And now they're not just shipping jobs away from all, they're shipping all the jobs away, right? So now you've got kids who've been told if you keep your head down, you stay out of trouble, and I'm talking white kids, you go to college, you get a degree, you get a job. And this is how we're getting into this debate now about they took my job. I'm like, that's still that entitlement white privilege piece, right? Like the fact that you think that the job that we both Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Right. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: apply for was yours because automatically that's a whole other conversation. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): was yours automatically. ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: But that, you know, now there's, all, know, so everyone's doing everything. And so now the only, you know, we have become the scapegoats. We were always the scapegoats. Now it's just this whole new level of, you know, I was reading this thing about, and I don't follow a lot ⁓ of kind of celebrity news, but I've been interested in the thing going on with Bad Bunny, right? And so, you know, and so I, and then ⁓ there was a post yesterday, ⁓ someone telling, and Bad Bunny to go home, right? You know, that we need an American playing at the Super Bowl and Bad Bunny needs to go home and then someone, and it was a white woman, so I appreciate that, had to educate this person who said that I'm where Puerto Rico was and that it was, that they are American citizens and the fact that he is an American who is multilingual, you know, like, that is the ignorance, right? The ignorance that's like, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You know what I'm saying? Dr Nancy Dome: You know, go back to where you came from. Go back, you know, get, you know, this is America. It's like, he was born in America. He is a U S citizen. You know what I mean? He's not naturalized. He's not, he like, the fact that they doubled down on this, right? So anyways, so I've been interested. I didn't even know who Bad Bunny was like two months ago. Cause it's not my thing, but I'm like, he's my hero now. Like he's got a fan right now. He's got a fan. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I wonder. He was easy. Hahaha! Yeah, yeah, that whole situation has just been hilarious. That whole situation. They've had people from not here. Dr Nancy Dome: because. Mmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And I've been, I'm trying to remember, did, I can't remember his name. He makes all the, all the party boat music. He's a Cuban dude. I'm trying to remember if he ever did the Super Bowl. I can't remember if he did. Dr Nancy Dome: This person put a list out there like Phil Collins, Rihanna, Rolling Stones. They listed all the people who were not Americans who did, and that was another thing. was like, Rihanna's not American? Yeah, didn't, you know, because. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. And even even not for anything, because I know you don't listen to hip hop much, but or at all. But ⁓ Nicki Minaj isn't even a legal citizen. And she got one of these. She got one of those Trump gold cards only to find out it was if he's like, like, yeah, no, she didn't get. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. He's not American, see? You can't know you. Yeah. ⁓ no. So yeah. So I just, don't know that for me, going back to what I said at the very beginning is like truth, right? Like you, we have to be in pursuit of truth and we cannot just accept something as true because of who told it to us. Like I hear stuff all the time now, even from people that I trust and people there's this one girl that I started following. She's called political girl, political. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: politics girl or whatever. She's really good, but she said something that I was like, I need to go double check this. because I hadn't heard it, right? And I was like, ⁓ I need to go double check this because I don't want to be that person either. That just because I agree with a lot of what she says and she's providing information. I don't want to assume that just because she said it, that it's true. So I'm gonna go get, you know, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: get my own information. And I feel like now more than ever, especially with AI and everything going on, like we need to be fact checking every day and we need to be fact checking the facts, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): 100%, 100%. All you have to do is turn on the news and you will see that they are straight up lying to you. And then when you start doing research, you find out that they have been subtly lying to you this entire time. Dr Nancy Dome: straight up. the whole time. Yep, yep. And building a case to get us to where we are. know, someone was talking and they were like, this just didn't happen yesterday. Like the seeds of this was planted, you know, decades ago. You know, just, and it's just little, slow. insidious, you know, the slow takeover of local councils, of local school boards, you know, like the plan book, right? And they're like, they were in for the long game, right? And then all of a sudden, you know, we're all living our lives, doing our thing. And all of a sudden it feels like, bam, but this stuff has been happening for decades. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, I've been doing a little bit of research and checking in with smart people like you and scientists and like all kinds of stuff. ⁓ What was I going with that? ADHD just kicked me right in my head. The fact that... The American populace is so gullible. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): goes back to like the 70s. Because when TV first started and everything, you know, we had conjunction junction, what's your function? Right? And things were like educational and stuff like that. But then in the 70s, the deindustrialization of America started happening. And that's basically when they wanted to have America be ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: Let's go phone calling. Hey. ⁓ Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Be like the thought leader of the world. And we would invent things, but then we would have China and Taiwan and all these other places build the thing. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): But then all of a sudden, they forgot to invest in education. Shh. And now we have people that you're looking at fake imagery and you have a president who is telling you to not believe your eyes and has been doing this since last time he was in office. And people just eating it up like soup. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, and that is when we think about the defunding of education, the way that and it's been a gradual thing and it's been ongoing, you know, and California, you know, one of the most progressive in the union, you know, but Prop 13 put a hole in education, you know, back in the 70s. Right. And when they took out the the taxes, the property taxes from, you know, from funding schools. And so, you know, so you start to see this decline in education Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: you start to see this ⁓ kind of mass ⁓ production of curriculum that's telling a singular narrative, right? So it's one story, one side, one perspective. And you basically brainwash a nation on lies. There was an, he has since passed away in the last couple of years, but he was a brilliant man. His name was Dr. James Lowen and he wrote the book, called the lies my teacher told me. And what he did was he took the active current textbooks, US history books, and he called them out for all the lies that were printed in there. And then what he did was he put the primary sources. So it wasn't just that he was telling you that this was a lie, but he was putting the primary resource in there to show you the truth. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): you Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: literally our curriculum is riddled with lies like that. that, so, you know, I'm a, and I'm a product of Los Angeles Unified School District, right? So I learned all those lies, you even, you know, you think about the stories we told, you know, it's Black History Month, so let's go a little bit of that. Let's talk about Rosa Parks, you know, and we did this kind of thing where we did, we went to Chicago and we went to Portland. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: And we did it like a 60, not 60 minutes, ⁓ what was that? Street scenes where you walk up to someone on the street. I can't even remember what it's called, but anyway, that's me getting old. ⁓ Anyway, I was like, so the question was, tell us who Rosa Parks was. And I felt like the Stepford-wise, like literally. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): ⁓ Mm-hmm. Yeah. Hahaha Dr Nancy Dome: Every single person was like, ⁓ she was the black woman who refused to give up her seat on the bus. mean, like the words were identical. It's like, we have memorized this, right? And that was me too. That's who Rosa Parks was for me for a long time, you know? Some people who knew a little more were like, yeah, it started the bus, you know, the bus boycott. And I was like, yeah. But I was like, okay, I said, but, so let's talk about, did you know that she worked for the NAACP? And they're like, what? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Montgomery boys bus club, yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: She was a seamstress. I'm like, and she worked, she was a secretary for the NAACP. And then the next. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, I didn't even know she was a seamstress. I thought she was the secretary for the NAACP. Dr Nancy Dome: You actually learned the but you know, the story is really about like, you know, this old and she wasn't even old, right? They just old, you know, tired. black woman refused to give up her seat on the bus. She was a sleep stress. Well, you then you go on to find out when you know the history that they had actually planned this, that this was planned on this day that she was going to do this. Right. And then, you know, a year before, year and a half before, they had tried it before, but the woman they tried it with was too dark. She was too young and was pregnant. And so she couldn't capture the hearts of the people. So nobody knew about it. So they were like, we need an older woman. light skin, you know what mean? that she can do, but like, so I had to learn this, but this is the thing is that as we did these three street scenes, if, and if we interviewed maybe 30 people, maybe two actually knew the truth. Cause we're products of a system that it, and then I asked, why do you think that is the narrative everybody has? And they're like, I was like, think about it though. If it was an accident, it's not recalculable. They got 10 times fast, right? Can't replicate it. This is minute to pause too. Let's keep it real. Like, I'm not great. ⁓ But if you know that it was plan, like that the work that had to go in ⁓ that the civil rights movement, that they planned this and executed it and it worked. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): for Dr Nancy Dome: That's too much power, right? That's too much. So if that's a story I'm told all of sudden as a young black kid in school, I have some pride here. I had pride in the original story, but now I'm like, ⁓ we can organize. we can actually do something for change. so keeping these narratives of the accidental hero, this thing actually disempowers an entire group of people from believing that they can actually enact change themselves. so it's not an accident. systems like this, it keeps us, we are brainwashable because we don't teach critical thinking anymore. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): We don't teach research. We don't even teach cursive. Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ I did hear that writing's coming back, they, cause people can't write. Like everyone can't be a doctor. yeah, like, you know, so you gotta learn how to write at least, you know, like I got grown-ass people who can only print. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): ⁓ hell yeah. Shout out writing. Yeah. Yeah, not me. It depends on where I go. All capitals and cursive all in the same sentence. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Well, but that's a choice. That's a choice, you know? And I think that's what that is also it. It's like, you know, code switching is a choice. You know, being able to write cursive is a choice, but if that choice is taken away from you, do you know what I mean? Like. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And I feel like our education system is taking away a lot of choice. It's creating a, like we're zombies. mean, and it's, It's disheartening because all of a sudden the rest of the world, as you were saying earlier, we've been shipping out all this stuff to other countries to produce mass produce for us to build. But when we decided to divest from education in the way that we were, now you've got people who can't do anything. All of a sudden trades were... Yeah, well, and we can't even really do that. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right? You all gonna be, you guys are gonna become servants. I mean... Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ We can't even clean well! Can't make a bed, can't clean the toilet. Like what can we do? We'll consume, we can spend money, we can work these dead-end jobs and then come home and then give it all away, you know? I got like. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Ha! Yeah. Yeah, yeah. There, I've, I've, I've read some, some goofy things and they just talking about how there is this upper crust of people. that are just ready for poor people to die off. And like, this is part of that push. Dr Nancy Dome: And, and it's same more, because I honestly like just die off to what end just to be gone so that there's less population just no no just rich. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): to be gone. Yeah, they want robots, they want AI. people that aren't idea people and people that aren't... ⁓ move makers, you know what I mean? Like the PayPal mafia, like the Elon Musk, the Peter Thiel's, those guys, right? Those guys, they want robots and AI, they want to be in control of everything, and we are just a liability. And so they want to do away with us. And either you can move to a different country, Dr Nancy Dome: Okay. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Hmm. That's an interesting thought. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Or you could just sit here and struggle until you pass away. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That's crazy. You know, I wonder, because, you know, I've never been rich, so I don't know. But I wonder, like, if part of the problem is, like, the more money you get, the more bored you are, right? As only someone who's been poor can say, right? Because I'm sure there's someone's... who obviously never had no money, but... Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hahaha Yeah. Right. Do you know what it is? Dr Nancy Dome: But because all of a sudden you require more to interest you. Because I remember the first time I went to Europe, I was 19, my mom was living there and I went over and I was like, oh my God. Like it was a whole new experience to me, right? And so I can, there are still so many things in the world that will make me have that reaction that I'll see for the first time that I'll be like, ⁓ my God, like, wow. But when you have everything and you've seen everything, there's for me, yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And there's no friction. There's no friction at all in your life. You can do what you want, when you want, how you want. And you have the thing about people with money. Or let me say it like this, the people that don't have money, they get so, you know, that wow thing that you felt when you went to, people get like that when they bump into people with money. And so to be able to stick with that Dr Nancy Dome: Thank Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): person, you start to see people changing who they are. You start to see changing of their values. That's why Diddy did his thing. That's why, you know what I mean? Like people just want to be associated to that lifestyle. So, Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Yeah. You know, I'd like to find out, Carlos. I'd like to, I'd like to find out. I want to find out. I say that half jokingly, like, you know, when the lotto got crazy, remember? just like a few years ago, the lotto was like a billion dollars. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. I want people to kiss my ass too. Hell yeah. Me and my family kept, me and my family kept, hey, you got five? it, just me five. Dr Nancy Dome: I was like everybody, was like, collective. I was like, we're gonna do it. Because I would be that, I would, most of that would go away. Like I had already spent like more than half of it in my mind, but it was all like for me, there's not much better joy than being able to give something, right? To provide something to you. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dr Nancy Dome: to be a part ⁓ of change. what do I need a billion dollars for? What do even need, you know, a hundred million for? Like, I don't, I don't. I'm almost 60, what? You know, yeah. I, so, you know, so I think about that, about rich people being bored. And I think the... Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. To be what? Lazy? Or not lazy, but lonely? Dr Nancy Dome: adjust and I don't know anybody who's super, super rich. mean, I have friends who have money, right? And would probably be in the maybe 10, 20%, maybe 20%. Right? I don't know no one in the 1 % like personally. So I don't really know that. But the people that I know that are in that 20 % do a lot of service. They give a lot. I think that and, and, it's remembering that like, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right, right. Dr Nancy Dome: We are only as good as our neighbors. We're only as good as the people that surround us. This is a society. You don't live in isolation, you know, unless you're 1 % where you have your own island. But most of us don't have an island. And so if my neighbor is struggling, then it behooves me to support that neighbor because if the struggle gets too real, they might come for what I got too. You know what I mean? It's like people, well, I mean, that's it. You know, like people are gonna do what they need to do to survive. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dr Nancy Dome: Like I'm thinking about like, you know, shifting gears, but I'm thinking about like this, you know, they're taking people, leaving, taking parents with multiple kids who are not like, who are babies, leaving them by themselves with no, and so with no income, with no. So what do you think is going to happen? So are we also trying to create the next group of criminals to incarcerate? Because when I start stealing money because my baby sister is hungry or stealing food because we don't have any food in the house. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Or something, I've been using this example because it's so easy. Let's say you're going to work and you don't quite have enough for the subway and you jump the turnstile. Now you're going to go to jail for what? Five bucks? Four bucks? Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. There was ⁓ this kid, ⁓ he's by himself, he's waiting for a foster placement, 17 years old, has a car, or 16 years old, sleeping in his car in like a Walmart parking lot. and they call the police on him. He sleeps there and he goes into this restaurant and buys dinner when he can, when he has some money to do it. Not stealing, not doing anything. Got his backpack studded in his car. Police officer arrest him, tows the car. He goes to court and the kid is like, he's like, I'm waiting for a placement. I have nowhere to sleep. I tried to spend money so that I'm there. I got my backpack, I'm going to school every day. And the judge, to the judges, was like, find the police officer, $500. It was like, the system has failed him. You arrested someone who is trying to. And I had never, it gives me chills just thinking about it. And I'm like, thank you. So find the police officer, $500, for basically wasting the court's time. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. for being an ass. Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ and doing it. like, and why isn't that part of like, that's a critical thinking. You got all these people in these positions of power who aren't really about, you know, like the model here in San Diego's protect and serve. like, I don't I have no complaint with San Diego PD. I don't know. But but my question is, are you? Right. Are you protecting and serving? The people that you've been put in that look, that's me. Right. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. Right. Right. And you can, as a police officer, well, granted, I know these days, everyone, every lawyer I talk to, they're like, whenever a cop shows up, just shut up. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): So it'd be tough, but that kid, as a police officer, I would have to ask like, hey, what's going on? And then if you tell me, ⁓ I'm just here because of it. And here are my books and all this stuff, like. Dr Nancy Dome: Great, great. Yeah. Why am I trying to figure out how to help you? Why aren't, you know, cause that's also protecting. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Like all of a sudden this police officer ⁓ is a, what are they called? A counselor? Or he should be a counselor, but a social worker. All of a sudden you, it's, their training is, they're being trained incorrectly. They need way more social work. They need way more. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, well, some counseling skills. Yeah. Yes, yeah, because Right, right, because that's also part of your job, right? It's not just about when crimes are happening to go in, know, guns a blazing, you know, it's about serving the people who need help. So this kid needed help. He needed a loving adult. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. Dr Nancy Dome: because he was doing the best he could. wasn't breaking, well, outside of law of sleeping in his car in a parking lot that he wasn't allowed to. He wasn't hurting anybody. He wasn't stealing anything. wasn't, you know, and instead of helping him, we arrest him. And that is a fundamental problem. And then what kind of trauma does that create for this kid? And then what is the relationship that this kid has with law enforcement moving forward? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): red. because living in the car isn't traumatic enough. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, seriously. And living alone in a car as a 16-year-old. Right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, I mean, I feel like we've lost a lot of our humanity. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Truly. Dr Nancy Dome: You know, I really do. feel like, you know, we look at each other. I walk around literally now with a t-shirt that says like love is an action word. And that is my, that's now my official t-shirt. I travel in that. do because I feel like, you know, you look at me and you've already made an assumption about who I am or if I'm safe to talk. And then when I speak and then they're like, she can put two words together. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Mm-hmm. I get that too. I'll be walking around, especially when I'm walking my dogs and I say to people, hey, how are you today? And they look at me like, what? I hope you're well. They're like, what? ⁓ No leaf flow or nothing? Dr Nancy Dome: And no accent? No people. Stop. Stop. ⁓ Lord. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Were you, you told us, you told us that you, you're a product of the LA Unified School District. Have you always wanted to be a world changer? Dr Nancy Dome: I am. Yeah. Yes, yes, but not as a teacher. I, if you would have told me, honestly, I don't know. I was in my twenties before I even figured that out, but I wanted to be, I knew probably around 11 or 12 that I wanted to be a social worker. That's actually what I wanted to help people. I was a good communicator. I like people. I'm very social. ⁓ And so that's my undergrad with psychology. And I, ⁓ I got a scholarship to do my masters in Europe to co- Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): ⁓ Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: and they would exchange for my masters. And I was going for MSW and I got there and the program was gone. They were like, oops. And I was like, they're like, why are you doing? I was like, what do mean? am I here? Like I sold everything I own. I got my two bags and then new graduate, you know? And they're like, well, we sent you a letter, right? And they were like, ⁓ well, we sent you a letter, but we sent it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I ⁓ I came here to fix people. Dr Nancy Dome: I was like, well, where did you send it to? They're like, well, we sent it to the San Diego campus. I'm like, well, I graduated. They're not forwarding mail. So I was like, y'all need to figure it out because I sold everything and I'm here and I only had a one-way ticket and a student visa. So they gave me ⁓ two years and they said you can choose between a master's and. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Where? Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: Business administration or a master's in education were the two and I was like, I know nothing about business. So education is as close to, know, psychology. mean, again, I wasn't ready to work and I wasn't ready to go back home. So that, you know, it's kind of like all this divine intervention that kind of got me in the path. But no, I didn't. I always wanted to change the world. I did. But I did not think it would be as an educator. Yeah. How about you? Did you always want to the world? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. It's, it's, I've always wanted to make movies. Dr Nancy Dome: And change the world through movies? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Now. Now, now that I've seen, now that I've seen the inner workings, I'm like, y'all built some bullshit. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, and sold us some bullshit, right? like, seriously. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): How about it? So yeah, no, I've always wanted to do animation. I've always wanted to make films and stuff. And thank you. ⁓ And it's funny because divine intervention again, you know, I'm making movies, doing my cartoon thing, doing tutorials, doing all the things. And I started, you know, getting some momentum on YouTube. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, you're so good. You're so good. You're welcome. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And then I had a conversation with my girl, Lady Champ. She's in the Breakdance Hall of Fame. Dr Nancy Dome: Uh-huh. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And then I had a conversation with my boy Mike, who's a rapper out of Chicago. And then all of a sudden, Mike, he got bit by the podcast bug. And this goes, this goes back to us, like bringing people with us. Mike is like, Hey, ⁓ is it cool if I invite a couple of people to come and do podcasts with us? And I was like, yeah, bitch. Cause if I'm rich, we rich. I'm not trying to do this by myself. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That's right. Yeah, hey, and can we even, right? Like, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right, right. And so then like that, that turned into I had a conversation with this professional comedian. He's a he tears MAGA a new one and it's it's no holds barred. He don't even care. He told me on the podcast, he told me that MAGA Florida MAGA men will fuck an alligator in church. Dr Nancy Dome: You Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I say, good lord. Dr Nancy Dome: And even! I gotta get all that visual going! Holy cow. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And then that just kept going into and then that turned into Chargent Rhodes and then that turned into a turned into turned into and now I'm talking to all kinds of people that want to change the world in a positive way. And it's it's at the point where my girl says. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): no matter or everything that you've done up to this point hasn't really made sense until now. Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ wow. Wow. And maybe that's it too, because it's a journey, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. And for me, it's always been about the journey. You know, I tell people on the channel, I've won basketball championships, I've played baseball and all that stuff. I love the high pressure. I love it. I'm taking the shot every time. Every time. But for me, it's always the journey, because once you get that, once you get the championship, whatever it's done, like, OK, well, there's that. Now what am I going to do? Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And if we could focus on that instead of the outcome, you know, instead of being so tied to what something has to look like at the end and really be present. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. And then. Dr Nancy Dome: as we, be open, right? Because if it wasn't for those little detours, like you gotta be on some kind of path because you can't get nowhere if you ain't going nowhere, right? So, but you're on a path and if we could just release attachment to it looking a certain way and being open to when those kind of forks in the road happen, and if you're intuition, trusting our intuition to say, wow, I wanna take that road less traveled, I'm gonna go right instead of left. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. Right. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: Like what it opens up for us sometimes is truly miraculous. But we just have to be open to it. And I think so many people are so, they have one limited perspective about what something needs to look like. And it's not that they're wrong, but when it doesn't look like that, they can't even enjoy what it is, right? Because it doesn't look like what they thought it should. And so I think that's also a shortcoming of humanity is, you know, we're so rigid instead of being, you know, we got to be more like water. mean, water could teach us a whole lot, cause water over time can create a canyon. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. Right. Yeah. so much. Dr Nancy Dome: Like it's powerful, but it's just, it's just like, yeah. And, and you just gotta, you know, if it moves you to the right, go to the right, know, too hard, go to the right or go to the left. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. But you need more than just a drop. go to the right. Right. And it's those things for as loose for as loose as I am. I'm not I'm not religious, but for as loose as my religious bumpers are in my life. I am I always. I always have whatever God is to you. I always have that in my Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): mind and I go off of everything that I've learned about being a good person, whether it was in the Bible, whether it's in a book, whether it's in a conversation, whether it's whatever. And then I take those and I build stories because it's all about the path. And I can tell you about some lady making taco salads and not be offended. You know what I mean? Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Because that's the other thing, your rigidity of who you want to be. People are going to think about who you are their own way anyway. You can't control that. Dr Nancy Dome: Right, Right, right. Well, and you know what? And if we're, if we spend less time being offended, we can actually spend more time educating, right? Because you know that that gesture came from a good place, right? And that's the intention, right? Twisted upside down, backwards, but. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Right. Right. Dr Nancy Dome: the origin, the intention came from a good place. And so, you I like to make this distinction between intention and impact, right? I can appreciate a good intention and can you appreciate that the impact is a little bold, you know, whatever that impact is, right? And it's not either or, it's not like this, this good, bad, black, white binary, it's both. Like it was a good intention and it had a negative impact. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. Dr Nancy Dome: You know, and that's okay, but can we grow and learn from that? And if we could, that's part of that fluidity I'm talking about. It's like, you know, I can make a mistake and do something well intended, but we so, well, I meant well, you know, like we're so locked into well, meant well, but it doesn't matter if you mean well, if the impact is not well. It's like, yeah, I understand that. And can you acknowledge that it didn't land the way you thought, you know? And. Yeah, I mean, that's, think, what do they call that? Emotional intelligence, right? Like you've got to be emotionally intelligent. You've got to be secure enough and understand that we are all in a growth journey that if you're not learning and growing, you're dying. Like it's not either or. And so, and we have to normalize failure as a part of that growth process. I can't grow and get better if I don't fail first. And so we're so afraid of failure. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Right. You Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: that we don't even take risk anymore. We're safe and we stay with the same people who don't challenge us and the same people who, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. ⁓ Yeah, everyone finds their comfort zone and it's easy. It's easy to sit still. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, yeah. Well, and you know, we, you know, with this, I guess the best way, like we're comfortable. I feel like we're almost too comfortable, right? Because like, even though I don't have a lot, I have more than I had, right? And I'm comfortable and I don't want to lose this comfort so I ain't gonna rock the boat. Right? so we, we're not willing, although, you know, hell, cannot be prouder of Minneapolis, you know, like friggin', they're like, people were like, it don't matter. They, they in the, and they were out there. And, and I think, you know, and that, that is a tipping point of sorts, right? Where people are finally opening their eyes to say, I can't. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): listen. It was cold and they were out in the tens of thousands. Right. Dr Nancy Dome: sit in my comfort and feel good about who I am while this is happening out there. And so I gotta be a part of it. And yeah, and more of us need to feel that way. I was reading something, someone that I know posted something and it's so hard for me when I see people defending this administration. It's so hard for me. Like defending... Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Still Dr Nancy Dome: what they're doing to people and to families and to children, sending arresting US citizens, you know, because they brown, know, or, you know, or trying, you know, looking at like, if they can do they're doing, like I could be deported at some point, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Shooting the white ones. You look Cuban to me. Dr Nancy Dome: You know, just because now, you know, there's no, you know, being born here don't matter anymore. That's what they're trying to do. Right. And so it doesn't matter if you're born here. ⁓ and, ⁓ and they're, they're defending it by saying, look at all the other things that have happened, you know, all the, the, the things that are good. I'm like, it's again, it's not black. It's not either war. Like you, you, the, the, the, the, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): It does not. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: end cannot justify the means. Right? Because this one thing is good. You cannot justify, you know, needing to deal with our immigration issue by what we see happening right now. Like those two things are incongruent. You can want immigration reform, but you cannot justify the way in which we are doing it. And if you are, and this is my, and there's someone who does this work, who's like all about like, let's have these conversations, let's lean in. I'm willing to lean in, but I have to say that. I read that and it just, I'm like, I need to silence this thread for a minute. You know what mean? Because I, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: what I'm trying to tackle, and I do believe it's both, like we need to work on that individual level, but like what I'm working on right now is bigger. Like I wanna have a greater impact. And so sometimes I just have to. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dr Nancy Dome: Kind of quiet that noise for a minute. And, you know, there's going to be an opportunity when we're face to face where I can say something, but I don't need to get into it online. Right. And I need to keep doing what I'm doing, which is the work that I'm doing out in the world every day right now. You know, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dr Nancy Dome: But it's crazy, because I just like, you realize that, and I'm sure people feel that, although I've been seeing, the thing is you've always known who I was, right? Like there ain't no secret. Like you're not like, ⁓ she's an activist. Like you're not surprised by that, right? So like, I wish people would just tell us who they were, like upfront. Tell me who you are in the beginning before I can attach. ⁓ I don't know, Carlos. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Ha Hahaha! Right, right, right. Right. I mean, we could put our resume on the on our t-shirts, but let me tell you that one. I let I let someone who cares about me take a look at my resume. I hey, take a look at my resume out here because I haven't. Nancy, I haven't had a job since 2017. Dr Nancy Dome: Hey. Hey. you Whew, that's all right. You doing it, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I'm there, I'm making, paying the bills. I haven't had to ask for too much money. But I was told, whoa, your resume is big around here. Why don't you, you should take a couple of things off. And I said, so what happened to Merritt? What happened to best man for the job? And he just looked and laughed. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I hear you. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): hahahaha Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ lord. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. That's it. You know what I'm saying? it's like, it's like, don't don't. And, know, my brain is my brain is fun. I've been now that I'm older and, you know, ⁓ just taking time to to to navigate my brain. Dr Nancy Dome: That says it all. That says it all. Right? You Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I was going somewhere with that too. ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: My brain is older. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, but when you, when you, again, when you try to do all those things and, and you order up business owners, order up, give me everything that you can do at the best that you can do and all that stuff. Right. And then I give you that bad motherfucker that you're looking for. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): only to turn around and see that you're giving my job to like three and four other people because they're more affordable. Dr Nancy Dome: and be told. Mm-hmm. Yeah, well, yeah. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): So then, and then I turn around and I look at you jacking people up that look like me in the streets. And then you wonder where people, places like ISIS comes up. You're doing to me and my people, same thing you're doing to the Palestinians, same thing you're doing to the people over in Afghanistan, same thing you're doing to people over in Iraq. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. ⁓ Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yep. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You're tearing families apart and then you're asking us to tap back into this bullshit system that you have going on. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's hard, right? Like how do you not play the game and still do what you need to do, right? Or how do you play the game? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dr Nancy Dome: and then try to work from inside. I don't think there's one right answer, right? I think people figure out how to do both. mean, like for me, my figuring out was like start a business because the game wasn't working for me. Like higher ed did not work for me. The only thing that, know, alternative ed, high school K-12, that worked for me. Like that was probably my happiest place, but it was my happiest place because of the people I got to serve. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: right, the kids I got to serve and I saw the impact that I was making. But everywhere else was just kind of like, you you didn't really want me because if you really wanted me. then you wouldn't be pushing, you know, pushing back on what I'm choosing to do my research on. Like, you know, you're giving too much time to juvenile court and community schools. I'm like, I am the only one on this faculty of 30 who is doing any work with any group of kids that look like me, you know, south of the 8th freeway down here. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. You Dr Nancy Dome: And I am too limited in my research, right? Yeah, I, yeah, so I started a business because I'm like, you know what? I can be poor and work for myself and make my own rules, or I can be super poor and work for you. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. working on somebody else's dream. Dr Nancy Dome: And working on, yeah, and making somebody else rich, right? Or working with schools who, know, I had a student tell me, I was all excited. I got this video, you know, was this, her name is Erin Gruwell, and she was a white student teacher at a Long Beach, in Long Beach. And she, she became famous and her kids became famous because she, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ created, they, they, she, ⁓ renamed them as the freedom writers, writers, right? ⁓ and she introduced the freedom writers to them as it, she was basically doing this class, this detention class, right? And she changed the circumstances of these kids lives. She went in there. She's like, they didn't know all this. So she just, she, they didn't know about the Holocaust. She just, she just went off, right? ⁓ where would see now I got your, I got your, I caught your disease. I was trying to see where I was going with this. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. day. Dr Nancy Dome: Um, Oh my God. Oh yeah. But, uh, yeah, I don't know. It just lost, but it's, it's, it's a good, it's a good, it's a good story about, and totally not what I was going to say, but since I forgot what I was going to say, I'm going to go there. Great story to show that, you know, even though we're talking and focused on people of color, like white people have a role. This is our issue. It's not our, it's not you and it's all of our issue. Right. And. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. Dr Nancy Dome: The fact that she could go into this school kind of considered inner city as a white young student teacher teaching all black and brown kids, all of them. I don't think there was a white kid in her class to start and have the impact that she has shows that we can all do this, right? What you have to have is a level of desire, right? So that's, and when I do remember what I actually wanted to say, I will say it later. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): right. ⁓ I know that's my brain is like that. I try to paint the picture and then I forget the story. ⁓ I like and then the flowers are red and you're like you were just talking about going to the bathroom. ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ huh. And then in the painting you get lost. They're gonna be like, I apologize in advance to your listeners. I'm usually much more coherent, but yeah, yeah, it just is what it is today. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, it happens. Take a look. But again, that's what's exciting with the people that I've been talking to lately is because you do see younger generation who came up with the internet. We don't have the internet. We had dusty encyclopedias. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Mm-hmm. No. Yes, yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): these younger, this younger generation is coming in and they are looking at the watch to see when they qualify for run for, to run for Congress. Kaya Creekmore is a young black man, grew up single, single mother. And I think it was four kids. He was the oldest of four. And now he's running for Congress in North Carolina. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Awesome. Yeah. I got a text message from ⁓ someone in the Democratic Party in Montana and asking me to run for office. ⁓ So, yeah, and I was like, you know what? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. I have a buddy out there, ⁓ Russell Cleveland, if you've seen any of his announcements. He's been on the channel. Dr Nancy Dome: No. ⁓ yeah. So, ⁓ he's in he's in my district, I think. Well, I don't so Russell White Guy in Plains, Montana. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): District 1. Mm-hmm. Okay, I'll go with that. No, that's yeah, I'm asking. Dr Nancy Dome: No, I'm asking because there's a Cleveland running for office out of, ⁓ that is my area. That's like 20 minutes from where I live. And I don't know if the same person. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. ⁓ cool. Yeah, he's one of the he's one of the he's one of the guys that are he wants to get money out of politics. He wants to he wants to because I guess Zinke Ryan Zinke is your representative now. Yeah. I think Ryan Z ⁓ Russell took a picture of Ryan Zinke's car. I had the license plate from California and like. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. ⁓ you see? Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. ⁓ yeah, ⁓ yeah, ⁓ yeah. Or like, ⁓ I think it was him too, who, okay, so Montana ain't no joke. If you, if you ain't from Montana, if you don't, if you're not a resident of Montana, if you want to hunt, fish, whatever that, you're to pay an arm and a leg period. It's going to be like five times the amount that a resident is going to pay. And because he didn't want Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: to pay those fees as an out-of-stater, even though he was not legally a resident of Montana, he lied and said he was so he could get the resident rate for his hunting and fishing licenses. So, know, people calling that stuff out, I appreciate that, you know, because it's like, and you got money, and you have money, like what's up? And you don't wanna spend it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): ⁓ my god. ⁓ boy. and you have money. and all the networks and all the connections. How dare you, Dr Nancy Dome: So I'm looking, I'm looking them up right now. District one. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, Russell Cleveland. Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ yeah, yep. He's the same one. I met him. I met him at the fair. I was working the fair. You know, I'm raising money for a pickleball court. So I got to work my first fair and he was there. I met him and his daughter is a volleyball player. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Pickleball is fun. That's cool. Dr Nancy Dome: Yep, so she is a senior this year. And I coached volleyball. So this is all that to say that I got to meet him a couple of times. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. ⁓ that's cool. Yeah, he's a good guy. I like him quite a bit. ⁓ yeah. I'll send the link to you. I'll send the link to you when when I'm done. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: Have you interviewed him on the show? ⁓ cool. ⁓ yeah, please, please, Small world, Look at that. Nobody knows anybody from Montana. think everything, they think Montana is Yellowstone. The show, like, they're like, the first question people ask me, like when I say it, how much land do you have? Do you have water? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Ha ha ha ha ha! Dr Nancy Dome: And so when Taylor and I started dating my neighbors when I was in Sonoma, they invited us to dinner and, you know, Diana, rest your peace, because she passed away. She says to him, she was my neighbor in the Greens, and she said, so how much land do you have? And he looked at her and he's like, that's like asking. a person how much money they have. And she's like, I shouldn't have like, it's just that kind of like, figure out who you are kind of thing. They have this big romantic notion about what Montana is. And I'm like, you know what, there's a, so the community that we're in that that Russell is in, you know, we're one of the poorest counties in the, in the state with a median income of about ⁓ between 12 and $18,000. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. ⁓ Yeah. Whaaaat? Dr Nancy Dome: Like it's crazy, right? And these are, you know, predominantly, because you know, also, if you think I was a spot in Sonoma. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You know, hey, you know, when I when I write a Dr Nancy Dome: I can't go nowhere. Everybody knows my name. They're like, hey, Nancy. I'm like, I don't even know who you are. But I love my community. So, you know, I'm not talking bad about my, I love my community for that reason, you know, but it is, it was one of those things like I need to be involved. People need to know and care about me. know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): you Right. Right. Right. Right. I need you locked in because I whatever you see on TV that ain't me. That ain't me. So you're a volleyball player. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, and a pickleball player now. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, pickleball is fun. I like pickleball. Dr Nancy Dome: It is fun. Yeah, I just won my first tournament last weekend. Yep, amateur 15 over 30. I didn't know. Well, you know, they were replaced right 10 years ago, and then I had that real bad issue with the one and so finally two years ago, they redid that one. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah? how them knees holding up. Yeah. ⁓ huh. Yes ma'am. Dr Nancy Dome: and my life is completely different. Completely different. ⁓ now, but now I lost, you know, 10 years of losing muscle mass and gaining weight. So now I'm trying to lose weight and, you know, get it together. But my knees feel so good and I'm more active than I've been in a decade. So, yeah, so it's all good. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Did being a volleyball player help you in your earth changing endeavors? Dr Nancy Dome: You know, ⁓ being a volleyball player... I would say is outside of key people in my life, probably the number one reason that I am as educated as I am and that I am able to do the work that I do. It provided me access that I, you we grew up literally on food stamps. You know, we were poor and the only way, and I'm not, I'll say this first, the only way that I was going to college was on a scholarship. Fortunately, I was that good that I could play Division I. and, but I have this little warning thing because I say that and, know, and people are really excited and celebrated, but the, but the fact that we have such limited channels for what people of color, like it's either sports or music. And then there's no other way you're going to get that, you know, so I don't want like the, I got to live a dream, but it, the, the, reality of how difficult it is, especially today to. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: secure one of those spots and the fact that that's still where we're kids of color to go as opposed to saying, know, like, why aren't we telling our kids that they can be doctors and they can be lawyers and they can, know. So I struggle with that, but it truly was my saving grace, right. You know, I. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dr Nancy Dome: I got my undergraduate, my graduate and my doctoral work all because of volleyball, you know, playing first and then coaching in the end. You know, I coached for four years while I was doing my full time going to school at night. And that's, they couldn't pay me no money, but they could give me an education. So. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yes, ma'am. Yeah. I'll take it. It's going for that anyway. Dr Nancy Dome: Absolutely, Yeah, yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Ha ha! That's cool though. That's cool that you were able to open those doors for yourself, basically for yourself, your ability open those doors. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. And I think like, where, you know, I do wonder like, where would I have been? Right? If I wasn't. And also, like, I do not, I am so glad that I am not 18 today trying to play volleyball. Yes, yeah, let's just say that, right? But Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. I am glad I'm not 18 today, period. 70s were so easy compared to this. Dr Nancy Dome: So easy, right? And we were so active. I think I was strong because there was no sitting on the couch. You watch TV on Saturday mornings, that was it. That was it. You're on your bike, you're walking, you're running, you're swimming, you're doing all this stuff, So I was five foot 10, I'm shrinking. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, we were feral. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: But I was five foot 10, 195 pounds, right? So I'm, I'm playing division one volleyball and they've never seen, you know, players at that time. The average weight was like 135, 150 maybe if they were six, two or something. And so I spent my first year with my coach having me on a perpetual diet because I was overweight. And because, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. You're like, damn it, I'm big-boned it. Dr Nancy Dome: Well, yes, I am big-boned it. Yes. And so, and I kept telling him and he's starving my ass, literally starving my ass, like you got to lose 20 pounds, you know, and I'm weak and I'm hungry and I'm hangry and, you know, and finally, ⁓ you know, cause he's got the trainer like. like beating me up like the trainer and Heidi was amazing, but she's like, she's like, I've me on the train, like on the bicycle. And, you know, I'm doing double day practices and I have to do an extra run because I got to lose all this weight. Right. So finally I just lose my shit. And I'm just like, you know, Oh, well, and part of it, like this is when bioimpedance came out. So there was this whole thing. They hooked you up to electrodes and they measure your body fat. So the bioimpedance said that I was 34 % body fat. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: which is what started all this craziness. And I'm like, I'm looking at my body and I'm like, I know I am not 34 % body fat, but he don't believe it because this is what the test told him. So finally he's breaking me down so much. And I finally was like, you need to do the caliper, like the good old fashioned caliper body fat test. So we go down to San Diego State ⁓ to their gym and they do the caliper. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): There's no more coming up. Dr Nancy Dome: And they're like, he's like, so what is it? And he's like, she's 17 % body fat. And he's like, oh, you know, because that whole scale, that whole like you 5'10", you're supposed to weigh 135, you know, six foot, you're supposed to weigh whatever. Like it ain't, it wasn't normed on us. It wasn't normed on me. My wrists are seven and a half inches, right? But it was, and so then I kind of gave him the look and I was like, can I eat now? Like, you know, because I've been hungry for like two months. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Can I get a sandwich? Protein bar sifted? ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: Two months, you know? But that is, you that's kind of that institutionalized racism, right? That kind of, you know, like, so then, you know, I'm this big player and they didn't see nothing, and I was strong and powerful, so I had a great career. Now, you know, I went to a game, they have a pro team here in San Diego, and I went to a game, I'm like, all these white girls are bigger than me. I look little now, you know, like. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And when I say bigger, don't mean just taller. I mean like they are strong. Like, and they're probably weighing in at 180, 190. Do you know what I mean? And I'm like, ⁓ yeah, hell no. You're like, you know, like I'm glad I did it in the seventies when, I was considered big. Cause now I'm a munchkin. Now people want, I'm like, which I never thought at, you know, at 200 pounds, 210 pounds, I'd be saying I'm little, you know, like. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Stronger. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Right. Dr Nancy Dome: But yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): But there's a lot of that dynamic happens in technology too. Cause I don't know if you remember when all this AI and computers were drawing pictures and stuff, when Google first came out with their stuff, it was coming out with some dumb ass pictures. Dr Nancy Dome: with Uh-huh. huh. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): It would identify gorillas as black people. Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ I, okay. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Like it was, it was, it was dumb. Dr Nancy Dome: Yes, or the one where they had the camera that would follow you except for it didn't recognize the black face. So if your face move and it didn't move with you and they had to recall all of them. Right. They had to recall all of the cameras and redo them because if I move the camera stayed there because it didn't recognize my black face. Yes, I know what you're talking about. Yes, sir. Yeah. Yep. Yep. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): No. And that's what happens when you don't have colored people coding. You Dr Nancy Dome: Yep, yep, yeah. And this, in essence, going back to what you said, is what gets lost. When you start to have, we're going to let AI create everything. We're going to get rid of all these people. But you're getting rid of diversity and diversity of thought. And we are better together, like exponentially. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. 100%. Dr Nancy Dome: What we can create together far outweighs what one person is going to do in isolation. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dr Nancy Dome: Right? Or maybe they create something in isolation, but it's all those other minds. That's why, you know, like if you're going to come up with, come out with something new, you need to have it tight because the minute you put it out there, there's going to be a hundred other people taking your idea and taking it even beyond what you even thought about. Right? So if you want to get yours for what you did, you need to have it ready to go because it's only going to be yours for hot minute. Right? So. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. And these are the things that we learned in art school. Like when I went to film school, animation school, ⁓ we got used to getting beat up. You put up something up on the board that was trash. We'd be like, uh-uh, literally go back to the drawing board. Uh-uh. ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, huh. Yeah, like what that? Don't put that shit up here. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): No, you need about another, you know, you need another hour of work on that drawing right there. Yeah, no, no, no. And so they get you used to, ⁓ well, they probably feed more into that artist, ⁓ the what is it called when when when you're a good artist, but you think you're fake imposter syndrome, they feed into that. But no, the thing is. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, at least. ⁓ yeah, ⁓ yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You could be working on something, especially as a creative. You could be working on something and it could just not be working. And you give someone a fresh set of eyes to look and they said, no, no, no, turn that blue. Turn that shit blue all of a sudden. Yeah. Yeah. We are better together. Dr Nancy Dome: on it. Yeah, it's popping. Yep. We are better together. And that, you know, I think if there's any motto that keeps me going, it's that one, like remembering. And regardless of what you look like, you know, like I'm going to try my best. I'm a human though, having a human experience. So some days are better than others, but I'm going to try my best to remain open-minded, but also open-hearted, right? And just like, show me who you are. And when you show me, I don't care what you look like. If you show me what I need to see, let's do it, right? And if you don't, then okay, then I know you and I see you, right? And so... Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Yeah. We good, yep. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, but I will say that, you know, and I wonder, you know, like there's something to affinity groups, right? Cause it's just, it's just different. I'll just say that. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Hahaha Dr Nancy Dome: It's just different. I got a lunch with my girlfriend and it's just different, you know? But it's also, it's different in this way. It's like, I haven't talked to you in I don't know how long, right? You know, I haven't seen you in a couple of years. But it's like, there's just this, ⁓ there's a trust, there's a knowing, there's a comfort. And I think that that's a relationship. And, you know, I... Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Right. Dr Nancy Dome: And I know you've had this experience. you ever, walking down the street, you you see, like you were saying when you see someone, you know, black and Sonoma, you'd be like, hey. Like I'd walk in San Diego and I'd be like, hey, what's up? And I was on a date with this white guy and ⁓ we were downtown and I, you know, I had to say hey a couple of times because there was a couple of brothers. So I had to say hey. And then like the third time he's like, do you know him? And I was like. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): No, but I'm trying to keep you from getting your ass whipped. You ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: It was not simple. was like, I had this, you know when something is so out of context, I'm like, does it look like I know him? And I really thought that. And to him, the answer was yes. Because I said hello. I'm like, do you only say hello to people you know? Or do you think that all black people know each other? I wasn't sure which one. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Hahaha Dr Nancy Dome: It was, but we didn't have a conversation. We didn't stop on the street and hug each other like, you know, lost long, you know, friends. So I was like, no, he's like, but why are you saying hi to that? said, because they're black. And he's like, you say, I was like, well, how many have you seen? And he goes, well, we've seen three. I'd like how many white people have we seen? A lot. Like you take this for granted. I don't take this for granted. Like, you know, but I will tell you, so you'll appreciate this. Cause I think you're from Chicago, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Right. Right. 100 % Yes, ma'am. Dr Nancy Dome: Okay, so the first time I went to Chicago, I was there for a conference when I was a professor, was AERA, American Research, something, something, something, educational, something research. I get to the airport and I get there early because I have a friend who lives in the suburbs of Chicago who's picking me up. So I'm going there a week and early to hang out with him because he moved from San Diego. He lives out there now with his wife and kids. So he's like, I'm running late. I'm like, okay, so I get in the airport. And I'm like, hey, hey. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: Hey, Carlos. These people in the airport were like, is she okay? They're like, is wrong with her? What is wrong with her? And I realized that basically, I had to say hello to the whole airport because I had never ever been in the space with that many black and brown people ever. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): She got dressed. What's going on? Hell yeah. Yeah, yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: really, in the US, right? I had to go to the Dominican to do that. I had to go somewhere else. But so I'm sitting outside and he calls me again. He's like, I'm sorry, traffic is bad. I'm like, dude, take your time. I am going to sit right here and I am going to appreciate all these black people that I get to look at. And he shows up, he's all like. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And I was like, this was the best hour of my life. Just watching them be, watching us be, it was transformative. And Chicago from that day has become one of my favorite cities to visit. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, right. Chicago is it for me. ⁓ I love it there so much. So let me let me give you a similar story. Last summer. I took a girl to Chicago and this is the first time that we didn't have a wedding. We didn't have family to anything. We we did Chicago stuff. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Bye. Mm-mm. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And on the north side on Clark, there's a place called the Brunchery. And when I asked my sister, hey, what's the deal with the Brunchery? She goes, go there. The owner and the head chef is a black dude and he cooks his ass off. All right, cool. So we go there. Nancy. Dr Nancy Dome: Okay? Okay. Okay. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): It was, and the North Side is primarily white folks, but it's a good blend, right? But the Brunchery is a black spot, and it was full of black people. Nancy, wanted to just, I wanted to rub myself with the energy. just, I was trying to soak it in so much. I loved it. I love our people. Dr Nancy Dome: Okay. Okay. Okay. Thank you. Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You drop me in there, boy. I'm dancing, whether it's salsa music or if you need me to dance some hip hop, I got you. I got you every, who knows the spades, I got you. Dr Nancy Dome: Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. And that feeling, right? Like even you talking about it or me talking about just sitting in the airport, because normally I'd be pissed off sitting in the airport. I don't like an airport, right? The joy, right? Just the joy of being in, in, that, in that Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): We are. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: in that energy and that presence and what that does, you know, and then how do we replicate that, right? How do I bring that home with me when I come back here, you know, and replicate that joy of just being us, right? Just being able to be us unapologetically, like whether it's loud or whether it's dancing or singing. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Sometimes it gets loud. I get accused of being angry all the time. I'm like, I'm not angry. I'm just telling you a story. Dr Nancy Dome: Right. And what are, I'm just telling you the truth, right? You know, so I'm writing a book right now. ⁓ We're in the final edits and it goes to the publisher next week. And it's a series of short stories. So it's different from the other two books. But it's kind of like the origin story of my compassionate dialogue and all that, but it's told through the lens of my life. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Nice. Dr Nancy Dome: And as I'm telling these stories, I realized that some of these things I hadn't thought about since they happened, you know, since I was young. And I realized at the end of it, like, just how beautiful, like, my upbringing was. even though we were poor, like, people will focus on the food stamps. They won't focus on the love in the house, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: Like we focus, people's focus on the lack instead of focusing on the joy. And as I'm retelling these stories and some of them are making me cries, most of them are making me laugh. you know, recounting the antics of my crazy ass brothers and all of us, you know, five kids in a house, cause there ain't no adult in the house and the shit's going on and shit's flying and we're breaking picture windows, you know, kicking in TV sometimes. you know, our grandma, you know, one of my favorite stories was like my grandmother when we were six and I'm not kidding six. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hahaha Dr Nancy Dome: Grandma is 1912 Alabama, right, Grandma was no joke. You didn't mess around with grandma. So we come home from school and once a week she would have that Monopoly board on the floor. Like, and we walk in and start crying. No, we don't wanna cry. And she'd be like, stop sniveling, get a snack, get a pee, and sit your ass down. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. hahahahah ⁓ up. Dr Nancy Dome: Right? You know? Like- Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): my grandmother with she used to play casino with her cards so we'd build it we'd and it was that was that you show up at her house you had to play at least three hands. Dr Nancy Dome: Okay. Yeah. And you know, no was not an option. Quitting was not an option. Right. And crying was not an option. Right. But so I think, you know, I've been thinking a lot about that just about like joy in those simple moments. Right. And Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): No, no, you don't make rules around here. You don't pay bills. You don't make rules Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: being and appreciating what you have instead of looking at what you don't have. And if I can appreciate what I have and then I look at someone who doesn't, it's easy for me to give something, right? It's easy for me to, because I'm like, hell, I've been there, I know, right? So I don't, if I see you out there, if I can do something, know, and I've been struggling, what's your thought to, like giving money to people in the streets? And I do, but I struggle with it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: And so what I started doing was I started getting subway gift cards, $10 each. I get $100 worth and somebody's, know, and I just give them the gift card. You know, but what it's, and why do I care what they do with the money? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm. Mm. Mm-hmm. That's cool. Well, right. Dr Nancy Dome: This is a whole different conversation, but this is the stuff that I think about. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, let's grow that. Let's grow that a little bit. I saw this young black lady talking about reparations. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Okay? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And she said, why is it that white folks want to tell us what to do with our money? We didn't tell you what to do with yours. And when I heard that, I was like, yeah, yeah. And then, and then I hear white folks saying, well, we're not just going to, even if it does happen, which it probably won't, but even if it does, we're not just going to drop cash on them. I did a little bit of research on that. There was a study done in Africa. Dr Nancy Dome: Yes, yes, yes. Yeah Uh-huh. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): They had, I don't know if it was how many villages, but they had, let's say two villages and they tried to control one village and how they spent that money. And then they just plop money on this other village. And the one that they just gave them the money, they figured it out before the one that was being coached. Because they know they need exactly. Dr Nancy Dome: You okay? Really? Yeah. Yeah. Cause they know what they need. Right. Yeah. Yeah. So to get, you know what I mean? Like I, that's, you know, that's, this is why these conversations are important because I, I feel like there's something a little wrong with my thinking, right? Like my, my need to control and maybe because I've worked so hard for it, you know, and, then I always come back to why do I care? Like, why? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Well, you care because you're about to give this person five bucks or whatever and you don't want them to use it on something that's going to hurt them because you've been told homeless people smoke crack. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, well, that's true. That's true. But is it even my place to control that? Right. Yeah. Well, see, that's a whole nother, right? where am I? And I know that I am guilty of the same biases, right, about who someone is based on what they look like or where they're living or not living. Yeah, I know. And I'm not. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. That's just being human, Dr Nancy Dome: like beating myself up for it. But I think those are the critical conversations though. It's like, know, where do I get to like put the lens on me, shine that mirror back on me about where am I perpetuating, you know, some of the oppressors rules, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Mm-hmm. Right. I do that too. I do that too. ⁓ When I lived in LA, I was coming out of a restaurant, my roommates and I went to go have dinner and I had my leftovers in my hand and I go to give it to the homeless guy. said, hey dude, you hungry? Here's this. And I put it down on his belongings. And he goes, yeah, but would it kill you to give me 10 bucks? Dr Nancy Dome: Yep. Mm-hmm. ⁓ huh. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): So I took the food and I was like, act like you're the only one out here. I went to the next guy. was like, hey, you hungry? said, hell yeah. I was like, here's some really good pasta, son. Enjoy. He just went in there and went to work. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yeah. That's so funny. I came out of, we were in Oakland, I came out of this, this really good restaurant. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Girl, you know they close the internet in Oakland? Dr Nancy Dome: I did not know that, but I try not to go to In-N-Out. And only because like me and my double double animal style, it's... I'm trying to get my butt in shape after 10 years. So that's why. But we come out of this Ethiopian restaurant in Oakland and they give you so much food. There ain't no way in... Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Ha ha ha! Dr Nancy Dome: how, you know, so the box is heavy. If you've eaten Ethiopian food, it's heavy. It's good. So I go, there's this guy by where we're parked and I go to give him the food and he, kind of hesitates and I look at him and I was like, it's, it's okay. And he's like, but is it good? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): ⁓ yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And I was like, well, of course he would ask that question. Like, just, it's just so funny because I'm like, you know, this is my shit, right? You're homeless, you're hungry, you're on the street and you're asking me if the food's good. You don't want to drink it unless it's good. And I'm like, brother, the food's really good. I'm like, so like cop a squat and digging, cause it's really, really good. And then he took his first bite cause I waited for him. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You could be eating with your fingers anyway. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And he's like, ⁓ this is good. And I'm like, I told you, I'm like, I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna go one, go eat some food and shit and I'm gonna take shitty food and give it to you. Like just because shitty food is better than no food. Like that ain't how I roll. But anyway, I do find humor in those moments, you know, where I get to check myself about my own beliefs and like, know, whatever you should, anytime you start with the you should, it's fucked. So. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Now give it back. Yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: Sorry, sorry for cussing. Okay. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): dude. ⁓ don't even worry about it. I cuss all the time. I cuss all the time. I'm trying to design a t-shirt that says, no, I'm really smart, but my mouth is from the hood. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah Yes, yes, I like that. Yes. My brain is from Harvard, but my mouth is from the hood. ⁓ yeah, yeah. You could just change the name. I'm from Brown, but my mouth is from the hood. You know? ⁓ my goodness. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay, so. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah. I have nothing but potential, but you guys put me through the Chicago public school system. ⁓ Right. Well, yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: I'm gonna throw something else your way. learned like I love when I learned something new. Yeah. And so yesterday I was getting my hair did and I'm going to find my tab and so I'm sitting there and I don't know how we started talking about something, you know, just kind of politics going stuff. I think it was around ice too. And then ⁓ he, he, he breaks down. He's like, you know, about Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Tell me. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: like Tulsa and I'm like, yeah. And you know, this is all the history I do know. He's like, did you know that not only did they burn and murder black people and burn down black towns, you know, but they flooded them too. And I was like, what? He's like, did you know that? See, I am 59 years old. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Here we go. Oh, yeah. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: old and I had never heard the stories of the flooding of these black communities literally with lakes that are now recreation for predominantly white folks. They will and some of them still have the houses and the churches and the graveyards underneath. Carlos! Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. They want you out. Isn't that heartbreaking? Isn't that heartbreaking? No, when I, I was told about Tulsa, so I did a little digging there. And then I found out while I was doing that, I found out that Central Park used to be basically the same thing. It was a situation where there was black folks building their own thing. You wanted to be separate, so they did things separate and you didn't like it. So you took it all away. Dr Nancy Dome: So I have to- Go ahead. Mm-hmm. ⁓ yes, Seneca Village, yes! Yes! Yes. Yes. And you didn't like this and gave nothing like that. They couldn't pass on that generational wealth because when they got stripped of the property that they did get, they weren't given fair ⁓ prices for them. So they couldn't rebuild. mean, that's just, you heard about that park in Long Beach, right? That one that's ⁓ Newport Beach. Gosh, and I got a picture of it. ⁓ was, know, blacks weren't allowed on the beat. And so with the help of ⁓ some white attorneys and stuff in the, and I want to say this is like the seventies or eighties, seventies, they bought black family bought this land and they, these people helped them buy this land. And ⁓ finally the city took it from them. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: And they finally won the court case and got it given back to them. Right. But they got a plaque up there now. you w and I had heard, I had heard about it, but I didn't know nothing. And so we were up on El Segundo for my cousin's 60th birthday and we're walking down and I'm like, this is that piece of land, that strip of land that they took from this black family because they didn't want them here. You know, like it's, it's crazy. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: And you know, and that finally, what, 30 years later, 40 years later, there's some reparations for that. You know, but you can't make reparations if you're not willing to acknowledge that wrong has been done, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. I got to speak to a guy who's running for office up here. ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And he kept mentioning Marin, Marin, Marin, right? And I said, do you realize that in 2018, it was somewhere in Marin that a black family was trying to sell their house and the real estate agent gave them almost a million dollars less or they were saying it was a million dollars less than what it was worth? 2018. And then what they ended up doing was changing all the pictures to white people, their white friends. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And then they got ⁓ the proper property value when they whitewashed it. 2018. Dr Nancy Dome: anything. Yeah. ⁓ Yep, Yeah, well, yeah, it's no surprise. ⁓ Yeah, it's no surprise. And even in appraisals, across the board, that happens. And so when I ended up, when I sold my house in San Diego, taking everything out of it. And the one advice, my realtor, because I had a whole family wall, like 50 different small little pictures. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: And they were like, you you need to take that off the wall. You know, so then, and I didn't, and my house didn't sell. And then I had a dream and, ⁓ and it said, everything needs to come out of the house. So I had a party. invited all my friends over and did a silent auction. I'm like, I'm a feed you, I'm I'm applying with alcohol and then you need to spend your money because this house needs to be empty by tomorrow. And I did, I sold everything, every piece of art, everything down. Two days later, the next person who came into that house without, without me bought it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hahaha Nice. Damn. Isn't that weird? Isn't that weird? Dr Nancy Dome: It's crazy. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): So many stories like that. So many stories like that. And my sister gets some good ones too because she's half black. And so people think that she doesn't speak Spanish until she does. Dr Nancy Dome: Yep, yep. Yeah. don't know. You don't know how much I wish that was me. My sorry ass though. I have taken, I did Spanish in high school. I did Spanish in college. I had to take it from my teaching credential. I did an immersion. And if I'm in the space, I can catch on really quick, but I don't use it enough. And so I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hahaha ⁓ Yeah, same here. Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ you don't know how much, how much, and like, I feel the same way too about German, like when I'm over in Germany with my mom. And I, the thing is I understand enough to be dangerous, right? So people start talking and you kind of look and then they have to, you know, so even, and so I realized is that even if I don't understand them, if I pretend like I understand, makes you. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: They change her to be like like this and they'd be like So but yeah, that's yeah Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): you I back to Germany a couple years ago, a few years ago now, but it was fun. It was fun. I love a challenge. So my German, I was like muscling through. I have a picture of me and this old lady. had, she had her hair was, you know, like when old ladies start coloring their hair. So it's the red never really catches. The orange never really catches, right? So it was like bright. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I do. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): red orange hair, right? And I was taking a picture with her because I was like, you're Lucy and I'm Ricky. Dr Nancy Dome: What? ⁓ Did she know what you were talking about? She did? ⁓ I love that. I love that. Yeah. But yeah, you have to like the Ricardo's. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yes, she did. She did. After a little while, she's like, what? I'm like, you're Lucy, I'm Ricky. I love Lucy. She's like, ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: that's funny, that's funny. Yeah, I honestly think that it should be mandatory in high school that kids have to do a year abroad like how they do in other countries. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: I think that we would be in a far different place with that exposure. You really would just realize what a bubble we live in here, you know, and see, just appreciate what you have, but also to, you know, to just have a broader perspective of like really how the world works as opposed to being in this limited, you know, kind of environment. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Right. And again, remember the TV programs in the seventies. They were making fun of these situations that we're laughing about to make it to expose people and to make the blow just a little bit softer because it is heavy. But boy, Archie Bunker and Mr. Jefferson and all those guys. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Which do you think it could be on TV today? Or do you think somebody would have some issue with it? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Obviously, someone's going to have an issue with it. Obviously, because you can't do anything. But I think programming like that needs to happen. think even this is another thing I found out in the 70s. I think it was called the Fairness Act. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): If you were giving airtime to, let's say a right leaning person, you'd have to give the same amount of airtime to left leaning people. If you're teaching something, you have to teach the other. Everything was equal. Yeah. In the seventies, they repealed this or they did away with it. I don't know if they made a law, whatever. Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ huh. You okay? I didn't know that. didn't know that. Yeah. Right. Right. Or two point nobody. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And that's why now we have these news silos. You have your CNNs, you have your Fox News, you have your Newsmax. And they're not forced to explain the other side of the argument. So that's why we have all of these little echo chambers of dumb shit. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): So even though it would hurt someone's feelings, I had a conversation with a black dude that's an old time 2D animation for Disney guy. Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ I saw that. I think that's one I watched. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, he was telling us about how he went to go work for Al Roker and there was a story, the character, the cartoons was about a black family and he was the only black dude writing and he's an animator. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. ⁓ God. That's funny. Somebody else telling your story, right? Through their lens. Like, but that happened all the time, right? It's like, can you get a real, like, and it's not like you have to go that far, right? To get the real perspective, you know. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Yeah. Right. Dr Nancy Dome: Why we gotta have, that was movies too. Some of those Westerns, the Indians were white dudes, with things on, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): painted like the president. Ain't that a bitch? And we're back. Maybe that's where he got his makeup tips, his old Westerns. Dr Nancy Dome: No. ⁓ lord. ⁓ lord. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Either that or the Charlie Brown ⁓ Halloween special. Dr Nancy Dome: yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. But no, I think, I think stuff like that where we're able to address some of these issues in a humorous way, a humorous caring way. Dr Nancy Dome: enough. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I think would start bringing down because the seventies were okay. It was like hella racist, but you started to see the facade crumbling and then all of a sudden Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, were talking, people were at least talking to each other, like, you know, product definitely of, you know, the 70s and, ⁓ you know, well, hell, I grew up in West Hollywood, though. I actually thought civil rights worked. That that is my statement, because we were super diverse. We were naturally integrated, so we didn't have the full scale busing that was happening around L.A. County. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: So I, yeah, I totally thought that we were on the other side of this. And then my ass went to school in Arizona for one year for college and a volleyball scholarship. And I'm like, ⁓ That's where I got arrested. My one little foray in jail was in Arizona. I was like, what the f... Like it was like stepping into the Twilight Zone. Like I had no idea. I had no idea that segregation still exists. I really didn't. I didn't know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You Yeah. You Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And yeah, and then I. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Not me. I knew it was there. I had a front row seat. One of the weirdest stories, not weirdest, because I went up to Wisconsin with a friend. We're going to go visit his girlfriend. so we get to the house. We're sitting on the porch, you know, just talking like teenagers. I was Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): 14, 15. Her dad gets home from work and comes to the front door and sees me and he says, is that one of them N words on my porch? I went left from there. I went straight to the train station. My friend is like, what's going on? Why are you leaving? The girl was like, whoa, like, Like, no, no, no, we don't play that game. We don't play that game. I'm going home. Dr Nancy Dome: Okay. No, no, no, no. Yeah, yeah, see, I'm not sure. I mean, I think ultimately because my foundation did not have really any of that, that it made me more open to trying to resolve it. Cause I can hold the grudge if I want to, you know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Hahaha Dr Nancy Dome: So, yeah, because we, you know, I didn't, you didn't even, we didn't even hear the N word. Like we didn't, we just didn't. And, but, what it, so I think it's served me in some ways, but what it did, how it didn't serve me was I was totally naive to its existence. So like going somewhere else and it felt like a slap in the face, like, of like, ⁓ this, this shit still happens. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: Like, and it's for reals, like, you know, ⁓ yeah, and that was, that was hard. That was that, that, kind of like wake up call that, you know, my little microcosm was just that, that it was not representative of the larger experience. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. But what a wonderful way to grow up. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, I think so. And that's what I come back to. think that, well, it gave me this foundation. It gave me a place of like, I was very confident. I had a lot of confidence. had lot of, I saw the value in me. I didn't have a lot of deficit beliefs being kind of forced down on me. And even, know, the one thing that probably could have happened, like 11 years old, I'm already five foot seven, 135 pounds. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: I'm a foot taller than the next person in my class graduating from sixth grade. And so I did have a little like kind of dysmorphia going on, but it didn't last long because then I realized that my body was actually my power. Like it was my ticket. so, you know, being that much stronger and that much bigger than everybody else, you know, that's my, you know, my mom left when we were. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Sure. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: 11 and my grandmother had a stroke when we were 12. So we started working at 12. No, no real adults in the house. And I was able to get a job because I looked like, you know, like, like a young woman, I look grown, I actually grown, you know, so you know, they hired me. And then when they found out that I was 12 years old, they tried to fire me. I was like, I kept showing up. I'm like, I don't get to you don't get to fire me because I need this job. they're Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): there. I look grown. Dr Nancy Dome: So you need to pay me and you know, so I'm working at this roller disco flippers from on La Cienega in Santa Monica from literally like five, six o'clock until 2 a.m. and then getting up and going to school in the morning. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: and I did that for two years while the whole time it was open. then I was finally old enough to have a ⁓ work permit, you know, because then I was 14 and so I could work at the movie theater, right? But for two years, like I was, I started off as a bar back and ⁓ then they found out how old I was. Like, are you gonna get from behind the door? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. 12 year old If you don't get out of here Dr Nancy Dome: Seriously, that was in the end. So I moved over to the skate shop side. I had to get out of the bar side, but I was like, ⁓ yeah, no. Yeah. Yeah. You know, so that was the only thing that could have been an issue, but it wasn't because I saw the value of what I had. Right. But so that is that foundation of not having to have that kind of just bullshit laid on you every day. You know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): that's Dr Nancy Dome: you know, because what that does to your soul, I just, I don't know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, and that traveling, traveling is gonna make your life so much better. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): expose yourself to different people. people aren't out to get you. People, well, people that don't have anything might be out to get you. Let's keep this real. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, first of all. That's why you wear the belt underneath your pants. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Ha ha ha ha. Dr Nancy Dome: The money belt stays close to the body. You can always tell, you know, so like, okay, so you know, you're like in Italy, right? And I see people still hanging like their purse in the back. I was like, what are you doing? You know, but those are also, I mean, well, this is, that knowledge that you gain when you're poor, that is a survival skill in the end, right? That lets you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hahaha Yeah. Yes ma'am. Dr Nancy Dome: That you, that everywhere you go, there are, you know, poor, disaffected folks who will see you as some, someone to take something from. And I can always tell those people who maybe had a little bit too easy because it's in their backpack sitting right here. I'm like, not. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You know what I'm saying? Like, I am like, you are very competent. I tell this story all the time. We went to Dubai. And in Dubai, they have cameras everywhere. And they have where if you steal something, they take your hands. And I walked out and I walked by this coffee shop and there was this table out in the street with a laptop just sitting there. Dr Nancy Dome: Thank Uh-huh. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, because you and goodbye they're not messing around. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I was like, you are daring me, you are daring me, just to see if I could do it. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. And I'm sure that thought lasted one second. Like, you don't mess around. When I went to Dubai, I was the only woman in my group who came alone. so I went to school, most of my classmates were Middle Eastern. And so our class reunion was in Dubai. And ⁓ they were like, you don't have to worry. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Half a second, half a second. Dr Nancy Dome: about your safety necessarily, but as a single woman, you're never gonna be alone while you're here. And that was just it. So I got off the plane, I got to my hotel, and that was the last time I was alone, literally until, so we had to check out. So the reunion was four days, everyone left. My flight was until seven, because I was continuing on to like Singapore or something. my friends find out that I'm there alone, that I'm gonna be. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And they're like, ⁓ no, so they both take off work. They pick me up, they take me to this outdoor area by the water. And I was like, but this is 11, my flight's not until seven. They're like, and we will be dropping you off at five o'clock at the airport. And they sat with me for five hours and just ate and talked, because they're like, you will not be alone while you're here because you're a woman. you're not going to be alone and you know this is a safe place but you're not going to be alone and but I will say that there was something about like I had never really been taking care of them like I can kind of get used to this you know it's like somebody it's like I kind of like having you know Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Do you know what I'm saying? ⁓ that's why you guys do this. Dr Nancy Dome: these guys, you know, and looking out for me. And also, you know, I don't know that I got to spend a penny once I got there. Like they were like, you came all this way, you're not, you're not spending. And it's also another thing too, like culturally, which I'm not used to again. It's like, you know, Bill comes, you know, I'm looking, I'm reaching to my pocket and I get a hand on me. They're like, uh-uh. And then I look around at the other women that are there and know I'm the only woman reaching for my purse, right? Everybody else is just like talking and all the men are splitting up, divvying in the check. And I'm like, God, this is a whole nother world. And there was something nice about it, I have to say. Like not having to worry about it, not having to, you know, and people who love you, like this is how they also show you that they care for you. Like this is one of the ways is by looking out for you. yeah, my week in Dubai was amazing because it was an experience, a culture that Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: that I had only known at Armsling, you know, and to be there, it was beautiful. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah, I agree. It was a wonderful, wonderful time. ⁓ Everything, is the world's largest, the world's widest, the world's biggest, the world's this, the world's that. That part, you you take out the, you know, what do they call it? Dr Nancy Dome: Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Small D Energy. ⁓ Take that part of out of it. And it's still an incredible place. The people are very kind. They if you're from Dubai, you get what we consider universal basic income. So you only work when you want more than that gets you. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yes. Yeah. ⁓ really? The basic. Wow. Wow, I didn't know that. That's amazing. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. And tell me if we wouldn't solve a lot of these problems that we have with a similar approach. If we're the richest country in the world, we have all the best schools, we're just, I know, I'm just saying that's what they say. Yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yeah. Do you believe that? Well, I don't believe that. Yeah. You're perpetuating a rumor. Percurating a fraud, as my brother would say. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): If we are that and the mega chips. Dr Nancy Dome: And a bag of chips, yeah, then why aren't we doing better? yeah, and doing more and the benefits for everybody, right? Like again, you thrive, I thrive, we thrive. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Why aren't we doing better? Yeah. Yeah. Then all of a sudden, all of us get to go to the west side of Chicago, go watch a basketball game, and I have to worry about people in the streets about to take that under about that you just got to... Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, that's right. going down with a fight to say, I'm fighting. Yeah, no. And actually I'd hand that belt over. I had this, ⁓ when I taught in juvenile hall, ⁓ I did this because the kids didn't have a lot of exposure and I wanted them to see black and brown people doing things outside of. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: the stereotypical, right? So one day I brought in Mexican pilot, you know, for United. And another day I brought in a Black chef, you know, so was doing this, the Black chef, he about 6'3", former military fit and fine. Like, he's no joke. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): singing in sports. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: And he comes in dressed to the nines. Like this brother does not play. When he dresses up, he is like, he is fine. So he comes in, he's got these, you know, $500 shoes on. He's in, you know, his fitted, you know, pants and he's like the swimmer body, the, you know, like. So, you know, already the boys, because I'm in the hall and it's a boys unit. So it's all boys and they're all black and brown. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And they're already staring at him because he's just this big brother and he's a chef. And so they're trying to reconcile. Chef, like, did you play sports? They can't get it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You look like you could catch a touchdown. ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: And they're also bought into this, right? ⁓ we're, ⁓ you know, and it's a Q &A. So he talks to them about his work and then there's time for Q &A. It's an hour session. But there's this one kind of big Simone kid, you know, in there and he's just kind of side-eyeing, you know, my friend Courtney. And Courtney's like, what's up, man? He's like, I see those shoes. He's like. ⁓ What would you do if I jacked you for those shoes? I, know, probation's already starting to get up and, you know. And Courtney, without missing a beat, and I am not kidding, he jumped out of the shoes. It was almost like they were slides. He jumped out of the shoes. He picked them up and he put them on the table in front of this boy. And everyone, all the kids are like looking and they're like, you know, and then the kid goes, you just gonna let me jack you like that? He's like, look, brother, I bought them once I can buy them again. I'm a father, I'm a wife, I'm a husband. Ain't no pair of shoes worth me not showing up. So if you want those shoes. And I was like, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You know what I'm saying? me not getting home. Hell yeah. There you go. Dr Nancy Dome: I'm done, my work is done. I don't need to say nothing because it was that moment, right? Like, seeing, because, you know, they're all, you know, about posturing and being big and bad. And they didn't, you know, it's like, you can be big and bad, but a gun is still gonna take you out, right? You're not so big and bad that you can resist a bullet, right? You ain't Superman. So, you know, he did that. And I saw a light bulb go off for some of my boys, right? About, like, you know, they're fighting over, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dr Nancy Dome: jackets and kicks and stuff that has maybe 500, $200, but your life. Like, let's put it into perspective, you know? But this is also that creation, right? Like we're fighting over material things without understanding that those aren't the things that actually matter. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right? Right. Dr Nancy Dome: Right? I'm this t-shirts from Target. I'm okay with that. Do you know like that gets the job done and it's Yeah. Don't let my husband be part of this conversation. Or holes like mine get the holes in my belt is right for my belt. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hmm My t-shirts are old as hell. As long as they don't have those weird pit stains, I am good. It depends on where the hole is. It might be stylish. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, if my husband had it his way, they would all be in the trash. He's trying really hard to throw them away. I'm like, you can't throw them away until I get a new one. you know, but ⁓ yeah, but I don't know. just, think about, I think about that and I think about. you know, how important it is that like what you're doing right now, you know, even having these conversations and just putting information and perspectives out into the world, like how important that is. ⁓ And you're having fun with it too. And that's also important, right? To show that, you know, these heavy... Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: Topics don't have to weigh us down. They can actually, we can resolve them and solve them and still find joy in the process even if they're painful, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Because my thing is always and then what? Okay. So the black and brown communities are struggling. Okay. And then what? Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Well, we need to find funding. Okay. Well, where's the money coming from? Well, over there. Okay. And then what? Dr Nancy Dome: And then what? Right? Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And unfortunately, what I see in today's society is black and brown communities have been whatever they say on the news forever, so it's not worth fixing. That's not good enough for me. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, no, it's not good enough for anybody. And everybody suffers from that mentality, like not just those communities. I think that when I think about the work that I have been doing for the last decade or so, it's really about showing how the victims are not just. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Everybody suffers. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: the actual ones who are immediately, we're all victims of this. Your white family is a victim of this too. And you may not know it now, you may not feel it now, but even growing up with animosity and hate in your heart, that's your victim, right? It's stealing your joy. For you to hate me so much actually is stealing your joy. You know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Right. Yeah. And you know what? I am so glad you said that. Will you tell people this is going to sound kind of rough? But I like to remind white folks that white folks are far more worried about what black and brown people are doing than black and brown people give a fuck what you're doing. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): We don't care. We got bills. We got families. We got jobs to go to. We have jobs to find. We also have hopes and dreams. We also want to invent. We also want to create. We also want to flip rockets and shit like that. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Yes, yes, yes. Yeah, it's true. And that's, I think, I think that's a hard reality. And you can't underestimate the value of that, like mental real estate, right? So the amount of mental real estate that you give me. What could you be doing with that? Right? If you weren't worried about me, like stealing. So, ⁓ I was at a pickleball tournament, I told you, this weekend. And the way it was set up, it was weird, the courts, it's not meant for a tournament, so it's not meant for spectators. So you're kind of looking through the screen that keeps the wind block down, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: And so, and because the courts are so small, everyone's got their bags kind of outside the courts. And then they're, they're playing inside the courts with the screen. So I'm against the wall. I'm getting ready to play the next round and someone is, I, I feel it. I see it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And I know he's going to come and this bag that's here, that's open, you know, and it, like, he, he is, but it, and it's a different energy and people are going to say, like, she's full of shit or, know, you don't know. He was maybe just getting his bag, you know, but, but I do know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, because you know. Dr Nancy Dome: because I wasn't thinking about him until his energy came to me. And that's what people understand. It's like your body knows shit is going down before your brain can make any sense of it, right? So you know, all of a sudden you and I can be just talking and because we both know that energy shifts in the room and all of a sudden we ain't talking as much and we're paying attention to what's going on around us because there's been an energy shift. And I know like he was like, I could tell him Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: struggling to decide if he was going to come over and check on his bag or not check on his bag. You know what I mean? Like, that's exhausting. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Let me tell you this one. I love golfing. And I went golfing with a boomer from corner 103. And then we got paired up with a couple of people. And it was this hole where you had to leave your cart here and then you go up the little hill and you tee off. Dr Nancy Dome: Okay, okay. Okay. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And so I'm coming back from teeing off and there's someone like looking through my side of the cart. We had a foursome, two carts, but this dude was only looking through my side of the cart of the, of the four seats. He was only looking through my, and I walk up and I was like, yo, like, what, what are you doing? ⁓ I'm looking for my rangefinder. And I said, okay. No. Dr Nancy Dome: Uh-huh. What's up? Wait, was he part of your force? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): He was part of the group that was in front of us. And he goes, ⁓ cause maybe I left it here. I said, well, you didn't leave it in my fucking cart. Dr Nancy Dome: in my car? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): He's like, no, I was just looking for, for my, I said, then why are you looking at my stuff? I just got done telling you, I have my own showed it to him. I have my own. Why are you here? And then he'd like, starts to walk off, walk off. And I was like, fuck out of here, asshole. And then the old dude that wasn't, that was in the other cart in our foursome, but in the other cart, he had gotten to know me and stuff, you know, cause we're joking around and you know me. And when I said, get the fuck out of here, asshole. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): The old dude was like, yeah, you asshole. ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: Because you must be an asshole and this guy's calling you an asshole You must be an asshole. ⁓ that's funny That's funny. I Got I got one Quite the reverse. So I got my I got my golf clubs at a garage sale and It was the kind of ⁓ bag that Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You must be an asshole. Yeah, that's my life. That's my life. Hahaha Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: was like an old sock that didn't have any elastic. So he stood in the back. Okay, okay, the bag would fall, right? And then to insult to injury, it was when woods were woods, when they were really woods, know, my drivers were woods. So, but then the drivers all had ⁓ crochet covers with little Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, those are my first, that was my first set too. the head covers. So you're not looking like someone's grandpa. Dr Nancy Dome: little. So we're in this. So when I was on the board for dollars for scholars, and so one of the fundraising events we did was a scramble. And I'm part of this. I'm on the force. So I'm golfing. And I guess I left like my little cover, fell off or fell off the cart somewhere. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): The head cover? Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: And so this guy... And so I can't even get it out. I'm like literally one of the only black people on this course, right? And this guy goes running with shaking and shaking. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You Something tells me this is yours. ⁓ You Dr Nancy Dome: my god, And now I am laughing my ass off. And I think that my foursome is somewhere in between like mortified and like humorous. And the person who's coming up is not part of our scramble. And I was like, it is, I'm the only black person he comes and finds me. So one of the guys I'm golfing with though, ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hahaha! ⁓ my god. Dr Nancy Dome: works for ⁓ Taylor, TaylorMade, TaylorMade. And he was a volleyball player too. So I got him on my scramble because we were becoming friends. And so like the following weekend, I'm at the beach and he was like, I got something for you. So he has me walk to his car and he's got me a brand new set of golf clubs. He's like, never again. Will that happen? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Don't be bringing this. Dr Nancy Dome: You He was so embarrassed that he got me a set of golf clubs. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Ha ha ha. Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ my god, I haven't thought of that story in years. But yeah, it was funny. I was like, yes, I am the one. That was me. Those are mine. That's mine. It's mine. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I have so many good golf stories. Yeah, yeah. I have so many golf stories. Dr Nancy Dome: But how am going to spend money on some golf clubs? I ain't got no money and you know, and the money I do have, not, I play golf once a year. Why would I spend money on it? So I thought it was completely reasonable that I had these garage sale golf clubs. I did, but he didn't think it was reasonable. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You know? Yeah, I have quite a few golf stories. Anyway, I told you right before we started everybody, told Miss Nancy Dome, hey, look, ⁓ time flies when you're having a good time. Two hours is gonna rush up on you. She's like, I don't have two hours. We're almost at two and a half. ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: I know, look at that. I don't have two hours. don't have it. Yes, I know crazy. But you know what? I could talk to you all day though, Carlos, honestly, because I am so deep in this work that I do. And it's always very serious. And there needs to be some levity. There needs to be this, like this. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: This is the discourse that I want to have, even with my clients. Like I want us to laugh about the crazy stuff and then fix it. Right. Like instead of like, everything is so heavy all the time. So I am in gratitude to, to just be in the space and to, you know, talk about unrelated shit and tell crazy stories and, you know, talk about what's going on in the world and, ⁓ and maybe having, you know, have an impact on someone, you know, or if nothing else, bring a little humor because. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. Right. Dr Nancy Dome: I'm a cheap ass with some knitted. caps for my my woods and the sock falls down on my golf bag you know like if if i can give you a laugh i'm happy about it but i appreciate the space Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, of course. It's my pleasure. ⁓ It's one of my things. And I think it's the way that I grew up, you know, going to so many different schools and moving so many times. know, as a kid, you don't realize that there's a plan for you. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And that those things that you're going through are going to pay off in the end. So and I understand everything about feeling like there's no more moves to make and I'm stuck and I get that. I get that. But you need to understand that that if you just keep your legs moving, keep your feet pumping, man. You're going to turn around one day and you're going to say, wow, I had what a life. What a life, but. Dr Nancy Dome: That's right, that's right. Yeah. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): going through all those things has taught me how to laugh at myself and be able to use my big mouth to carve out a safe space for people to vent and you know. Dr Nancy Dome: Yep. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I like to think I'm physically big enough to where if I tell people to leave you the fuck alone, guess what they're gonna do? Dr Nancy Dome: That's right. No, hey, there's something to be said about that too, right? If you need to, right? Hopefully you don't have to, but you know, I always say that, yeah, I feel like, you know, when I talk to my people, I'm like, you know what? I can be vulnerable because like, so if I think about my communication style, I'm personal and intuitive, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. I don't want to, but I will, but I don't want to. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: But when I think about my affect, I am somewhere between a passive aggressive, aggressive and assertive. I don't do passive, passive don't live in me, right? And all those things are so very close, right? And so I can be vulnerable because if I need that aggression, it's there. If I need that passive aggression, that sarcasm, it's there. And assertive is always there, right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You Not even on accident. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: It's like knowing that you got that backup in your back pocket. Like if I need to, like I don't want to, but if I need to, and I'm not even talking about physical confrontations. Like I'm not fooling myself that I could take you on, right? But I will hurt you. You may finish me, but you go remember me. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You're think about me. ⁓ Dr Nancy Dome: Like, and I say that kind of joke a little bit kind of serious too. It's like, you know, like I am, if you know, if I think about a stress conflict reaction, that's kind of my go-to, it's fight, you know. I'll try to move out of the harm's way or out of, but if I can't, I mean, I'm definitely not the one who's gonna get down in the corner, right? And so, but I think having that as an option allows me to be, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dr Nancy Dome: far more open and vulnerable. And the beauty is, I have found that the majority of people meet me there, right? They respect and then they meet me there. And I rarely had to pull it out, right? And when I do, just like, hey, you know what? This is, you're barking at the wrong tree. So we'll see you, you I'm out of here, but I really have to do that. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, I agree. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I always tell them, hey, don't let the jungle out. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, you know, I thank my three, God gave me three older brothers for a reason. You know, he really did. And the crazy ass sister so that, you know, in our household, know, fisticuffs were normal. So, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Mm-hmm. Mama did raise an old punk. Dr Nancy Dome: Mm-mm. Mm-mm. Yeah, I remember my brother one time. I hit him and I don't know, I 14, 15. And I saw, and then I did this. Because I'm like, he's coming, he's coming. And then I did this. And he had this crazy look in his eyes, like his eyeballs were like looking at me. And he's got me pinned down. He's like, you've lost your fucking mind. And he got up and he's like, I'ma leave before I kill you. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Peace. Mm-hmm. Cause it's coming. Dr Nancy Dome: But hey, you know, I was like, but you know what? He never touched me again because he would have had to kill me. Like that's how crazy it is. know, like he would have had to hurt me because I was like, I'm done. I'm done with you. I'm done with you all putting hands on me. I'm done with, you know, you being pissed off and like taking it out on me. I'm done. Yep. And so I was like, and you raised us that way, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Enough is enough. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Dr Nancy Dome: You rate, and grandma raised us that way. You know what my grandmother's nickname was? I found out like 30 years after she died. Lady Joe Lewis. My mom found a letter. It's actually gonna be in the book. They found a letter. When my mom died, this woman wrote a letter because she couldn't attend the funeral. And she told the story of grandma going out in the street and tearing it up. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Damn. So she throws dukes. Dr Nancy Dome: because someone had laid a hand on one of my brothers. She's like, her nickname in the community was Lady Jo Lewis. You didn't fuck with her. know, grandma, didn't, and you didn't, we didn't. Grandma, even when grandma was old, even when she had had a stroke and was paralyzed halfway, you didn't, you still didn't say no. You're like, yes, ma'am. Can she find a way to get that fucking walker? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah, not today. Dr Nancy Dome: He's like, what'd say? Even if takes me a minute, you sit there while, like she make you sit and wait for her to come to you to beat you. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I'ma get you. Dr Nancy Dome: One time I was not gonna wait, so I crawled under the bunk bed and she got a broom and started stabbing me with it into the broom. She was like, she gonna get hers. She gonna get hers. So, you know, I channeled my grandma. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, shout out grandmas. Dr Nancy Dome: For sure, yeah, for sure. Yeah, this new book is a love letter to her, think, in the end, that's kind of what it turned out to be, you know? Yeah, fourth, third solo, fourth, yeah, one co-op, one. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, this is your third book? Yeah, fourth. Yeah. So this is more of a storybook. Dr Nancy Dome: Short stories, short stories tied to the work I do, but really my life, know, kind of just like evolution. Yeah, it's actually based on Sankofa. Yeah, the principles of Sankofa, of looking back in order to move forward. Yeah, it's Ghanaian imagery. Yeah. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): ⁓ cool. reflection kind of. I like that. Yeah. Beautiful. And you said there it's your the next step is happening next week. Dr Nancy Dome: It's released, we're hoping May. Yep, next week. So I got some reading to do tonight to finish. We've been in that final draft mode, just cleaning it up, make sure it reads. ⁓ yeah, then it goes off to the publisher on Monday, and we're actually trying a publisher out of the UK. She ⁓ is ⁓ kind of independent, does some beautiful books, has had some award winners. ⁓ a black woman, ⁓ British, just, she, you know, it's the first time like in ⁓ talking with her and I had worked with her before I thought about her publishing this book that like to talk to a publisher who gets you, right? Who understands why you're telling these stories and who your market should be and how to market you. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dr Nancy Dome: ⁓ instead of it being part of this machine and this algorithm that, know, of, know, that, you know, yeah, I was an Amazon bestseller, but, you know, at the end of the day, you know, I want, I'm looking for New York Times. I'm looking for, that's what I hope is, because that means that people are reading it, because I think the messages are good in the book. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I'm excited for your book. Congratulations. Dr Nancy Dome: Yeah, thank you. Yeah, thanks. Me too. Me too. Thank you. ⁓ yes, I got hours left, but I'm going to squeeze some sushi in the middle of that. So Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): We're at two and a half hours, so I'm gonna let you go get to your reading. So before we wrap up, ⁓ take a moment, let people know ⁓ whatever it is that you want them to know, and then let them know where they can find you online. Dr Nancy Dome: Okay, so I think if I think of what I want people to know right now, I think it really is about slowing down and remembering your humanity. Remembering that what's happening to our communities across this country is also happening to you. You're not removed from it. and ⁓ then figure out what it is that you can do. Like everyone doesn't need to be out there marching. Everyone doesn't need to be running for an office, but there is something that we can do. And for those people who at one point thought that they supported this, but are seeing the humanity in it, to give yourself grace, to know it's okay to change your mind. And that we always have every day as an opportunity for us to do better. And so that if I have any message, I mean, I know we've been having a lot of fun talking, but that's where my heart goes all the time. It's like, if we're going to have change, it is going to happen in the ground. It's going to be the individuals. not the system is going to change first. It's going to be us who changes the system. Right. ⁓ And we need to realize that life is not a pie. It's not like finite amount of pieces. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. We can grow the pie. Dr Nancy Dome: Like, yeah, yeah, the resources are infinite, right? There's no lack as long, know, literally. That's right. Right. So, ⁓ yeah, I just my message. And then if you want to find me, it's, you know, Epoch education, E.P.O.C.H. education.com. There's also my my website, which is drnancydome.com. ⁓ Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Literally everything we need is here. If you believe in God, everything you need is we need is here. Dr Nancy Dome: I'm always down for a conversation. I'm actually doing a free webinar next Thursday at four o'clock. Kind of just putting out, I'm trying to, again, the way I can give is like, here's a hour thing. I'm not trying to sell you anything. Just like, let's, let's learn how to have these conversations. Yeah. And not even listen to it. Cause it's completely participatory. Like don't, don't come sit and listen, come and expect that I'm going to push you to say something. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Come and listen and learn. ⁓ cool. Hahaha Dr Nancy Dome: Because if we don't practice having these, being in discomfort, if we don't practice having these conversations, when they happen, we're not ready. Right? So for me, I'm going to see how it goes, but if it goes well, I'll do them every month and people will come, honestly. And again, I'm not trying to sell anything because I think the bigger thing right now is ⁓ that we need to have a different conversation. So, yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Exactly. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I'm going to leave off by saying Nancy Dome, I love you so much. I purposely call you Doc so people can ask me why I call you Doc so I can brag about you. Dr Nancy Dome: I love you so much, Carlos Gomez. I do, yes. Aw, aw, thank you. Thank you. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, I love you. I love the work that you do. And I love that I'm able to help bring just a little bit of attention to your efforts. Because I do think, like, if you don't know Nancy, everything she does is through the heart. Everything. And she does really do care about people and making positive, good change for everyone. Dr Nancy Dome: Thanks. Yeah. Yep. Thank you. thank you for the time. Thank you for just creating the space and for being you and just, you know, I'll sit and talk to you for hours any day. So. You got it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): So thank you for everything. Thank you for being wonderful. Challenge accepted. ⁓ All right, everybody, and with that, we're out. Dr Nancy Dome: Okay, peace out.